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Quaranteam – Book 1: Part 14 Andy reconnects with his past, and Emily explores. Based on a post by CorruptingPower, in 25 parts. Listen to the Podcast at Explicit Novels. And, after two weeks of trying to subtly discern it from her, Andy eventually just asked Taylor what she did for a living, and Taylor informed Andy that she'd been a phlebotomist before moving into the Rook household, and once she was done with her time in the penalty box, she would go back to it. It was the first step she had taken towards eventually becoming an anesthetist, which was her long term goal. She'd met Lauren when the Aussie had needed someone to come in and blood test a few of the 49ers she was training. Taylor insisted that if Andy ever wanted her to stay in his bed for a night, she would without reservation, but that otherwise, she would be sleeping in the same bed with Lauren, who had set up her own bedroom now, so as to not wake Andy when she left early in the morning for practice.               Piper and Sheridan had also set up their own bedrooms, for similar reasons. Piper insisted her workout routine begin at the butt crack of dawn, and she also had a tendency to go to bed almost immediately after dinner, and Sheridan had started joining her in those hours, although the two women had very different work out routines in the morning. Andy had never been awake for any of them, but both of the women had filmed themselves working out, so he could see what they were up to in the wretched early hours. Aisling, Niko, Emily and Sarah had flatly refused to sleep away from Andy, although the order they laid against one another in the bed at night varied quite regularly. At various points over the last few days, he'd woken up in the night to find Emily quietly making out with each of the other three. He was a little surprised that Emily and Sarah didn't want another bedroom for times when the two of them wanted to fool around with just each other. He'd asked them about it, but Sarah had just teased him and insisted that when they did, he should be nearby in case he wanted to watch or join in. The craziest part of the day, however, was when Emily came to track him down in his office just before dinner with a rather baffling request. He'd spent most of the day writing, knowing that tomorrow there would be new women joining the household, and that he'd likely get very little work done on that day. He felt like he was very close to considering the draft for what he was now calling "The Doppleganger's Identity," the next book in the Druid Gunslinger series, ready for his first pass readers to take a look at, and hoped to wrap it up today. It would certainly stop Sarah from asking him yet again when she could read it, since she had insisted she get a spot on that esteemed small council. He kept the door to his office open most of the time, but Emily insisted on knocking before entering the room anyway. "Andrew, love, I know you're writing right now, but might I bother you for just a skosh?" she said, smiling at him in that disarmingly charming English way of hers. "It's never a bother, Em," he said, closing up his laptop. "You know, you're the only one of my partners I'm okay with calling me 'Andrew?' Anyone else does it, and I know I'm in trouble, but you somehow make me not hate the sound of my full name. C'mon in. Sit down, talk to me." The blonde Englishwoman sashayed into the room before lifting one of his legs so she could sit down on the footstool in front of his writing chair. She was wearing a billowy floral print dress that hung down past her knees, loose fitting but still draped enticingly well. Andy wondered if maybe it was tailor made for her, but before he could think to ask, she launched into the reason she'd come to see him. "My agent received a rather odd request today, and I wanted to come and talk to you about it before I answered it. If you're not comfortable with it, I would completely understand that, but I personally think that it would be an excellent thing for us to do, so I hoped we might talk a bit about it before you came to any decision, and perhaps I could bring you around to my way of thinking." Andy set his laptop on the coffee table to the side of his writing chair and shifted to sit up a little bit. "Who's the request from, and what is it that you think I might be uncomfortable with?" "It came from the office of the president, if you can believe it. My agent said President Pelosi didn't call personally, but a member of her staff did." Emily took his large hands in her small ones, holding onto them softly as she kept his gaze focused on her sapphire blue eyes. Clearly whatever they were going to discuss was of great importance. "When the announcement hits next week, they're expecting much of the nation to be in rather dire shock. Such massive casualties means the American way of life going forward is going to have to be something extremely different than what it once was, something radical and new." She licked her lips, a touch of nervousness Andy wasn't sure he'd seen from the usually confident young woman before. "Something like us. To sort of help assert the new norms in the minds of the general public, they want a handful of celebrities to do talk show appearances, with the hosts who are still alive anyway, and most of them seem to have made it out okay, and talk about their new family units, how polyamory is going to be the lay of the land, and how the laws are immediately being changed so that a single man can have multiple wives, to help repopulate the country after the severe losses." Andy laughed a little bit. "If you want to go on television, Em, you certainly don't need my permission. What makes you think I'd be against that?" She smiled at him kindly, and he realized immediately he'd missed what she'd been specifically asking him. "I don't just want to go on television by myself, Andrew. I want to go on television with you and with Sarah and maybe with a couple of the other girls, Niko in particular. I think it's important that we get out there as a new family unit, on The Daily Show, The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, Late Night With Seth Meyers, Jimmy Kimmel Live!, The Tonight Show, Good Morning America, anyone who wants to talk to us, so that we can help put the country a little more at ease that we are going to get through this. Normally, I would be most in favor of shielding all of you from the horror that is the paparazzi, just to keep my personal life simply that,  personal. But this is a very strange new world we find ourselves in, Andrew, and we need to help our fellow humans become comfortable with their new reality." "You sound pretty committed to the whole idea," he said, trying to keep his voice as non committal as possible, but Emily had gotten very good at reading him in the short time they'd been together, so he knew she could tell he wasn't entirely opposed to it, simply gauging how it would all work. The particulars of opening his private life to the entire world seemed a little daunting at first blush, but certainly not insurmountable. "We wouldn't be the only ones, I think it's important to stress that, love," she said, squeezing his hands a little bit. "And Sarah and I would also be coming out about our relationship with each other, so you wouldn't have to field a lot of questions if you didn't want to. We could take on the brunt of the questions if that makes it any easier. But I just know many people in this adopted homeland of mine are going to be frightened, and I think the idea to show them the way through would be a step in the right direction." She leaned her head down and kiss the tops of his hands before looking up at him. "Oh! And you could also use it to promote your books, if that might sweeten the pot a smidge. It might help, having twenty minutes of prime mental real estate for your face and your writing?" He chuckled, nodding his head. "You know as well as I do that my agent would string me up by my toes if I had a chance to get this much free publicity for my next novel and didn't take it, so how can I say no? I'm not going to hide from journalists. I'll do my fair share. Tell me how all this is going to work." She smiled, leaned in and kissed him, soft and tender, but for what felt like a delicious eternity. "We will set up the camera and microphones in Sarah and I's little studio, and then we'll just take an hour or so a day for a few weeks to record segments with whoever asks. The president's office wants us to do a 60 Minutes interview even before the announcement is made, as our sort of grand unveiling. For that, they're actually going to send Katie Couric here with a camera woman to do the interview in a few days. They're likely to want to do that in a larger room, or maybe out on the back deck, by the pool. They're going to do an entire show all about the deaths, the vaccine and the new post pandemic world we're starting to grow into. The ten to twenty minute interview with us will just be part of the larger package. They were hoping to have us for a day on the 14th. They're going to be filming at the base on the 13th and doing interviews with President Pelosi on the 15th. The president's representative seemed to think Niko might be a good link between the two segments, if she was one of the people helping to give the tour of the base, and the vaccination process. I asked Niko about it, and she said she wouldn't mind if you didn't, but that I had to ask you first. The whole episode of the show is going to air immediately after the President's speech on the 20th." "Good lord, sounds like they've got all this planned out. I'm surprised I didn't hear from the Office of the President personally." Emily offered him another smile, and considered her next words carefully. It wasn't that she worried about bruising his ego, because Andy had never come across that way, but she also didn't want to seem too full of herself. "Love, I've been a very well known movie star for a decade now, so I think they figured out where I was first and went from there. That's no slight against you! I'm just saying that you aren't a household name that millions of people recognize, and, for better or worse, I am. The Dagger Academy movies were everywhere, as were the books. Simon, my costar in the movies, he's still living in England, so he's in an entirely different world than we are here in the States." Andy grinned. "Oh, I know, I know. All I'm saying is that it wouldn't hurt for the President to have called me herself, y'know. But that's fine. It's fine." "Well, when the paparazzi are struggling to get topless photos of you in Ibiza, then we'll have a conversation about how you aren't being taken seriously as an artist, alright darling?" She giggled a little. "It was fun, teasing them, knowing they so desperately wanted to get images of my tits to sell, and that a bidding war would erupt for the image." "They are excellent tits, Em." "Bless you, love. But you're never going to convince me they're as nice as, say, Sarah's or Hannah's. And all those tits, theirs and mine, are exclusively the purview of this family now and forever more, so the paparazzo can fuck right off. So, the interview? You'll do it? You'll dance for the media circus with us, for the good of the nation?" "I'll do almost all of it, sure." She tilted her head slightly in confused amusement, that coy smile on her pink lips, as her tender fingers squeezed his thigh. "Almost all of it? Which part of it am I going to have to have to convince you for?" He rolled his eyes a little, a playful smirk on his lips. "I'll do all the evening shows, magazines, newspapers and website interviews you want me to, but doing Good Morning America might be a hill too far, simply because of how goddamn early I'd have to get up for it." "Or we could simply stay up very late and do it before bed," she said, moving to slide off the footstool so she could climb into his lap. "I'm sure we could find some way to keep you awake and alert that far into the night. Four thirty in the morning our time could give us the opportunity to go on live television with sex hair," she said, waggling her eyebrows at him lasciviously. "Oh, and I'm not gonna do Fox News." "Christ, love, haven't you heard? They're barely running a skeleton crew over there. Most of their on air talent died over the last few months, and now that the women are in charge over there, they're losing some of that ridiculous bullshit they used to be spouting." Andy chuckled, shaking his head a little bit. "All it took was most of the men dying." "It's pretty hard to pretend the plague isn't a real thing when it keeps killing people off left and right, dear," she said. "The rescheduled Presidential election next month is going to be between Senators Kamala Harris and Susan Collins, two women. That's never happened before in the history of this country. The vast majority of people voting in the election are going to be women. This is all completely unprecedented, so all those women who have felt powerless for so many years, this is their chance to shine. But the old tribal lines are still going to be there, even if the genders of the people leading those parties has changed. Republicans will still be Republicans and Democrats will still be Democrats. But there's too many dead people for everyone to go on pretending like the plague isn't real, or that it's not better to not get a grip on the new reality. One side was already telling their people that the plague wasn't real, so more of their men died than the on the other side. They can't afford to do that any more. So the new Fox News agenda is to go back to simple fiscal conservatism, pro military and pro old school Christianity stances. They're just going to drop all the anti woman bullshit that they've been poisoning their own wells with for so long." "And all it took was most of their men dying." Andy rolled his eyes. "Fine. I'll leave it up to you on whether or not you want to do any of the Fox News shit." "Oh heavens no," Emily laughed, shaking her head. "No, you couldn't pay me enough to appear in front of those horrid people. They've been trying to tell me they have the right to regulate my body for decades but that I should keep my mouth shut when it comes to how they spend the money I pay in taxes. At least a few of their remaining hosts have called me horrible things for daring to disagree with them. 'Entertainers should be sit down and be quiet when it comes to politics,' they've said about me for far too long. Fuck that, darling. I'm having none of it." "Well, on that we can agree." "Now, I do believe I have some convincing to be doing," she said, licking her lips playfully, as she slid off his lap and down onto her knees before him, pushing his legs apart. "That's really not necessary, Em," he said, reaching forward to put a hand on her shoulder, but her delicate fingers moved to grab his wrists, lifting them so that one of his hands was along the back of her neck, and the other was sliding up into that radiant cascade of blonde hair. "It might not be necessary, Andrew, but that isn't to say I wouldn't enjoy it anyway," she said, her hands moving to unbutton his jeans, slowly drawing the zipper down. "Because sometimes a girl just needs to get her fix, you know?" She leaned down and kissed part of his exposed stomach. "You wouldn't deny me that, would you, love? Not innocent little me?" "I don't know that I could deny you anything, Emily," he chuckled. She licked her lips, those inescapable blue eyes of hers looking up at him. "That's what I like to hear. Because it's time for me to do something before Sarah does." She fished out his cock, tucking his balls over his boxers to protect them from accidentally getting caught in the zipper of the jeans, because she wasn't willing to wait long enough to pull his jeans off. "I let her have first go at you, but I'm entitled to have some firsts with you before she gets a chance. That's fair, isn't it?" She leaned down and pressed her pink lips against the head of his cock, covering it in tiny kisses. "I think we can both agree that's only fair." "I seem to recall you and Sarah taking turns blowing me at the same time," he said, tilting his head a little. "I wouldn't say she got there first." "She got to fuck you first though, Andrew," she sighed, stroking his cock tenderly. "And I understand why. She's madly in love with you because of your writing, although she's very much fallen in love with the man behind that writing as well." Her tongue slipped out and dragged a long trail across the bottom of his cock, from the base up to the tip, teasing the slit with the tip of her tongue for only a split second. "Me, on the other hand, I fell in love with the man first, when I heard all the lengths you'd gone to in protecting the women who'd chosen to hitch their wagons to your train. Niko painted such a wonderful portrait of you, and you haven't failed to live up to that yet." "I'm always going to put my family's needs above my own, Em," he said, shivering as he felt her pursing her lips around the mushroom tip of his circumcised cock for a long moment. "So what is you want to do before Sarah, hmm?" "Oh, bless, Andrew, I would've thought it would've been obvious," she giggled, blowing air along his cock, teasing his balls with her finely manicured fingernails. "I want you up the serviceman's entrance. I want you in my ass, before Sarah thinks to ask you to do it to her. We've had fingers and small toys up both hers and my asshole before, naturally, but never the real thing, and I'm afraid I simply cannot risk the chance that she get the opportunity to convince you to do it to her before you do it to me. I want to have at least one first of my very own with you before she does, and while I'm a little nervous, I must confess I am also rather excited. First times are always so exhilarating." Andy licked his own lips, swallowing a breath of air. "First times can also be quite intense, Em. Even overwhelming." "Yes yes yes Andrew, that's why I'm going to ask you if you can remember a color code when you're worked up. I know those kinds of sensations can be, distracting to self control, but you've always struck me as level headed." Her tongue took a long swirling path around the underside of the head of his cock, and his fingers tightened in her sandy hair a moment, clenching a fistful of it, which evoked a clear quiver of delight from the girl. "What do you mean a color code?" "You see, when Sarah and I are adventuring into, shall we say, uncharted sexual waters between the two of us, we use a color code. If one of us says 'green,' then things are wonderful, enjoyable and the other should carry on full steam ahead. If one of us says 'yellow,' then perhaps a bit of caution or easing back is needed. If one of us says 'red,' then a moment's rest is needed, or second thoughts are being had, and it's best to stop, until the other is ready to go again. Like a stoplight. We strike the use of those colors for any other uses when we're on the code." She looked up at him with those tender azure orbs again, soft and warm, as her fingertips stroked his shaft and juggled his balls. "Would that be alright, Andrew?" He leaned forward and kissed her again, and this time he found her not only pliant but a touch more eagerly wanton than she'd been moments ago. "Of course, love," he said to her. "But just be careful and remember you can't use those words for anything else while we're in color code mode." She titled her head to the side, a curious expression of amusement on her face. "Oh? Do you anticipate me slipping? I'm quite bright, you know," she teased, winking at him. "I have a degree in feminist studies from Cambridge and everything." He smirked a little bit. "I simply thought you might ask me to paddle your ass red, and then I'd have been more than a little conflicted from the mixed signals." She began to giggle fiercely, having even to take one of her hands from his cock up to cover her mouth, as she nodded furiously, her blonde curls falling in front of her face before her hand lifted from lips and pushed it from her eyes. "You're right! You're right you're right you are absolutely right, I most certainly would have done that, said that without even thinking about it, and what a right git I would've looked, while you would've been standing there frozen in fear that you'd gone too far." "You think you can keep that in mind, then?" She nodded once more, this time more slow and deliberate, before she pressed her hands on the tops of her thighs, moving to stand herself up. "I had Nicolette conceal a couple of bottles of lube in nearly every room of the house, in case this particular stripe of lust struck one of us. She seemed to think it was an excellent idea." Andy couldn't help but snicker a little bit. "I'm sure she did. She seemed to enjoy the hell out of it when she got her turn at it a couple of days ago." Emily giggled again as she reached behind the couch in the corner of his writing studio, her fingers reemerging with a small bottle of lube in them. "I did notice her walking a little funny yesterday, but she wouldn't tell me when I asked her about it. She simply blushed a wonderful shade of crimson and walked away from me. So I take it you gave her the ol' heave ho?" He tried to keep that ain't I a stinker smile from spreading on his face, but in the end, he just couldn't help it. "She told me she likes to be a bit bratty and put into her place, so I stuffed her panties in her mouth while I had a go at her ass. She seemed to like that quite a bit." While Emily approached him, he stood up and tugged off his jeans and boxers, not wanting to get any of the lube on them, setting them on his writing chair. For the hell of it, he pulled off his shirt as well. The idea of resembling Donald Duck appalled him. Emily's eyes widened in amusement and delight, shaking her head frantically. "You didn't! You absolutely didn't! Tell me that you didn't, Andrew!" "I surely and truly did, and she loved it. She even made a point to tell me that it was exactly how I should have a go at her moving forward." "Well, not this time, but I might like to try something like that at some point in the future," she said, as she walked over to him, lifting her dress up and over her head, tossing it aside, revealing she was completely naked beneath it. "Mostly because it wouldn't let me speak the color code if need be, but also because I'm simply not wearing any panties today." She flashed him another saucy wink, as she moved to set up her cell phone to point at the couch. Andy suspected she might be filming it to show to Sarah later, or perhaps just for her own personal edification. "Now let me pour some of this lube on your cock, and you can tell me what position I should be in for my first time at this." He shivered a little as she drizzled clear fluid onto his prick, her slender fingers stroking his shaft again, making sure to get every inch of his thick cock slicked up as much as possible. "If you want total control, you could climb on for a ride, but some women think the sensations are just too intense, and tend to seize up, so they prefer to have the man controlling things. If that's more your speed, then you probably want to get on your knees on the couch, laying your arms down on the top of it, your head resting on your arms, or with your arms behind you, so you can grab at your legs, or rub on your clit. Lauren rubbed her cunt her entire first time, saying it helped the nerve endings get all tangled up in one another." She licked her lips, that tiny hint of reticence fading away the moment he saw it, as she nodded. "I do think it will all be simply too much for me to keep my head clear, so I think I will try the position on the couch, and you can be in the driver's seat." She handed him the small bottle of lube. "Make sure you get me slicked up before you go rampaging in, however." "You sure you  " His sentence was interrupted by her grabbing the back of his head, smearing lube on his skull while she pulled him into a feral, almost delirious kiss, her tongue rampaging into his mouth with a carnal frenzy that he didn't normally associate with his more restrained and reserved partner. When she pulled back, she didn't let her face move more than an inch away from his, her blue eyes peering directly into his greens. "I have been a posh prig my entire life, Andrew," she cooed at him in a sing song fashion. "Now it's time for you to take that stick out of my prim ass and jam this wicked cock up it instead. If you don't, I may well go mad, and that wouldn't be ideal for either of us, I somehow think. Now let's get to it." "As the lady requests," he said, watching her sashay away from him. She slid one knee up on the couch demurely, followed by the other, bending forward at the waist, leaning down until she was resting on her hands and knees on the plush sofa. God, she was gorgeous, he thought to himself. Almost criminally so. She held pose there as he walked over towards her, but as he got closer, she lowered her shoulders down towards the top of the couch, sliding her hands back behind her, to cup her perky porcelain white ass. "This is all yours, Andrew," she moaned. "Virginal. Unspoiled. Unsullied. Uncharted territory." She shivered and he could see goosebumps run across her skin as the lube started to drizzle down the cleft of her ass, smearing over that rosy pucker. "God, I feel so wanton and exposed like this, ready to be debauched and debased, your eager whore, giddy for you to introduce her to these new delights, to expand her horizons and blow her mind." Andy set the bottle on the table next to the couch, then moved to use two of his fingers to smear the clear liquid along her anus, seeing her body twitch and wriggle just a little bit, as he smeared the substance around, pushing his index finger inside of her, hearing her gasp sharply following by a tiny, high pitched yelp, as she clamped down on that digit. "How are we doing, Em?" She drew in a long breath that sounded like it took some effort before she exhaled, a slow controlled push of air over her lips, as that sphincter muscle relaxed around his fingertip. "Green! We're green, Andrew. I just, I simply needed a moment to compose myself once more. Your fingers are quick thicker than Sarah's," she said with a nervous laugh. "You're going to be getting something much bigger than that in a moment," he said. "If you still want it, that is. Not too late to change your mind." "I have come too far to back out now, Andrew." "You haven't cum at all, I don't think," he teased. "Shows what you know," she giggled once more, looking over her shoulder at him to stick her tongue out in his direction. "I definitely came when you pushed your finger in. The pre fuck jitters, one might think. Like a bloody schoolgirl, I am, right now." "Alright then," he said, as he slipped his fingertip out, her asshole closing up immediately. "Remember, you merely have to say what you want, and I'm going to listen." She nodded again, one hand reaching between her legs to rub her fingertips against her cunt, stroking her finely manicured digits against her cunt, as her other hand reached up and over behind her, grabbing one of her asscheeks, pulling it aside, as if to make sure she was open and exposed for him. "Let me feel it, Andrew, but go slow. Just a bit at first." Andy nodded, as he moved his hips, settling the tip of his cock against her asshole, which he felt spasm just a little when the mushroom head of his cock made contact with it. He gave her half a second to relax once more, then began to push forward. He leaned his body against hers, feeling some initial resistance, but after a few moments, the head of his cock popped through that ring of muscle, and a guttural, almost primitive moan erupted from her throat, loud and carnal. "Fuck that's big that's so fucking big yellow yellow Andy, yellow,” she rambled, and immediately Andy held perfectly still. "Too much?" he said, feeling her ass clinging onto the head of his cock with an intense amount of pressure. "Stop? Pull out? Just wait?" "Don't pull out! Are you fucking crazy?" she said, a borderline delirious laugh cackling from her lips. "I just, I just, just give me a moment, please, you're fucking big, you know that? You and your fat fucking cock feel like you've shoved a telephone pole up my tight young virgin ass, so I'm going to need a god damned moment, thank you very much, but don't you dare fucking slip out, or I will beat you bloody senseless with a cricket bat!" Andy blushed a little bit, a wry smile on his lips, as he held perfectly still. "In your own time, Em." The tiny blonde Brit drew in a long breath, then slowly exhaled it, like she was doing some form of yoga and trying to center her chi. She did it again, and Andrew started to get worried that maybe she simply wasn't ready for this, but just about the time that thought started to roll around in his head, he felt her starting to lean back against him just a little bit. "Green, Andrew, but,” she said, shifting her body just enough so that she could look back at him, "please, for heaven's sake, take it slowly." He nodded to her, and began to lean forward, feeling her body almost being pried apart as his cock worked his way inside of her virginal asshole. Her fingertips were rubbing down firmly on her clit, and while he tried to keep the forward momentum as slow as possible, when he was nearly half way into her ass, she suddenly pushed back into him, engulfing the rest of his cock in her back door, as a wash of goosebumps rolled across her flesh, starting at the small of her back and blossoming outwards in an instant flare, followed by a hard tremble intermingled with a high pitched whine that started racing upwards in octaves and volumes until it crested, breaking and dissolving into a frantic, almost demented giggle, as his balls rested against her fingers which hadn't stopped stroking at her cunt. "You alright, Em?" he asked. "Alright? Alright? Are you asking if I'm alright now, Andrew?" she hissed, although the tone was giddy and excited. "I am green, super green, all the greens! I am awesome, fucking brilliant. That felt,” she drew in a long breath, "So fucking good, and I came So fucking hard." Her head whipped to look directly at her cellphone camera. "Sares, it's like it builds and builds and builds, and you're getting more and more and more tense and then,” she said, pulling her hips forward, sliding his cock mostly back out of her ass before, "Wham!" she said as she slammed her ass back onto his cock hilt deep once more, and let out another unearthly moan. "Holy fuck, that feels so good. Your cock just jammed up right my ass, your balls resting right on my cunt." Her head snapped again to look back at him, and her soft and kind blue eyes had gone more than a little crazy. "Go on then, in for a penny, in for a pound. Pound your little penny. Go on, you dirty wanker. Do it to me! Fuck my ass!" At this point, he was pretty sure that if he had said 'red,' she would've ignored him and just played on through. The kind of wild lust in her eyes would've been completely unfamiliar to him if he hadn't seen it before, briefly, with both Piper and Sheridan, though those had been chemically induced. Later in the evening, he'd consider whether maybe she'd tapped into that same mental state that being deprived of his semen developed in women, but in that particular moment, the only thing he could do was to fuck Emily Stevens, film sweetheart of a generation, within an inch of her sanity. His hips drew back and then thrust forward, a solid grind on his first real pump, which was met by a hard squeeze of her ass around his cock and a burbling, uncorked moan oozing from her lips. He drew back again, but this time his forward thrust was met by the snap of her hips pushing her ass back into him, making her toned asscheeks ripple just a tiny amount. "Oh fuck, Andrew," she babbled, "I want more, but I know I'm going to cum soon, and once I start again, it's not going to stop, so I need it, I need you, I love you, I need you to fucking cum inside of my ass, fill it up with that hot spunk for the first time. Mark your territory with your seed! Please Andrew, I'm fucking begging you, let me have it, show my ass you love it, teach me this final thing. Fucking cum in my ass!" The entire time, she was doing more of the thrusting than he was, although he was trying to keep pace with her. And just towards the end, he knew that he wouldn't be able to stave off the impending orgasm for long, so at her insistence, he let loose a hot jet of jizz right into her ass. The minute he felt the first spurt escape him, it felt as though she clamped down on him in a fist like grasp, and then he felt a heavy rush of liquid against his balls, her cunt gushing all over them and down the inside of his thighs. The very sensation of it made him splattered a handful more blasts of cum into her ass before he stopped, one of his hands holding onto the back of the couch for dear life, as he felt her fingertips fall away from her cunt as her arm slumped downwards. He'd gone soft almost right away, but her ass was still trying to milk any last remaining droplets of cum from his cock with gentle squeezes, even as he finally slid out of her. Her body was mostly propped up by her knees, although her face was buried into the couch cushions. He waited a minute or so before he finally said, "You alright, Em?" She began giggling, slowly moving to roll onto her side, so he could see her face had turned bright red, the color of Sarah or Aisling's hair, and she was clutching one hand to her mouth, trying to contain the infectious laugh that would not be suppressed. "Holy fucking Christ, Andrew, I am so so so embarrassed by that," she whimpered. "I've, fuck, I've never done that before. I didn't know I could fucking do that, Christ, I'm made such a mess, how awful of me. I'm horrible." Andy knelt down alongside the couch, and leaned in to press his lips against hers. She struggled for half a moment, still caught up in her own awkwardness of the moment, before she gave in and simply returned the kiss, which he held for an endlessly long time. "Did you enjoy it?" he said, when he finally gave her a moment to breathe again. "Fuckin' 'ell, Andrew," she stumbled, "I think that would've been bloody obvious." "Then who the fuck cares about the mess?" He kissed her again, one hand stroking her sweaty hair from her face, the energy cooling down a little, as they both came down from the orgasmic plateaus they'd just been dancing in. "Besides, I'd have thought you'd enjoy the idea of telling Nicolette to come and clean my office without giving her any explanation into why." Emily face almost hurt from smiling so much as she nodded. "Thank you for this, Andrew, and for making me feel at home in my own body as it learns new things about itself." She looked down then looked up at him, almost a touch of fear in her eyes. "I know I've said it before, but it's important to me that you know this, Andrew. I well and truly love you, like no other man I've known before." "I love you too, Emily," he said, making sure he was looking directly into her eyes when he said it, so she would understand there were no reservations. "And I'm very glad you agreed to marry me. You've been not only good for me, you've been good for the whole house." "Oh shush, now my heart's all aflutter," she said, moving to stand up, pausing to wince for a second. "Well, I'll jolly well feel that for the next few days. It's sore and it's still tingling in pleasure. Both, together, at the same time. What an odd delight." He laughed, grabbing her dress for her, holding it out. "Go on, get dressed and bring Nicolette in here to see the mess that you've made for her to clean up. I'll bet she's not at all embarrassed, and more than a little jealous." "You know, I suspect you might well be correct, Andrew. Brilliant." A cast list intermission for Quaranteam The House of Rook Andy Rook,  A 38 year old content writer for Netflix, who also lives a double life as semi successful urban fantasy writer Blake Conrad, known for his Druid Gunslinger books. Shaved head, neatly trimmed brown beard, 5'11", hazel eyes, tattooed on the chest with a griffon, could stand to lose a few pounds. Originally from Ohio, has lived in the Bay Area for over a decade. Our protagonist, such as he is. Still reaping the benefits from one random act of kindness to a stranger named Dave. Aisling (Ash) Blake,  A 27 year old graphic design contractor for Google. Originally from Dublin, she's lived in the States for 4 years. Red hair, freckles, short (5'4"), fit. Outgoing and charming, but also protective of Andy. Aisling showed up first (at the same time as Lily) and has helped keep Andy level headed and sane throughout the entire ordeal. Pregnant with Andy's child. Engaged to Andy. Lauren White,  A 35 year old personal trainer for the San Francisco 49ers. Originally from Australia, she's lived in the States for 2 years. Very tall (6'6"), very tan, blonde, athletic, emotionally involved with Taylor as much as (if not more so) Andy. Lauren is big and boisterous, but has a tendency to not think things fully through. 2nd Lieutenant Niko RedWolf,  A 22 year old Air Force Security Forces officer (military police). Originally from South Dakota. Half Lakota, one quarter Mexican and one quarter Japanese. Long black hair, toned and slender. 5'4". Sarcastic, wry and witty, Niko has basically become Andy's right hand woman, along with Ash, whom she considers her best friend. She's helped provide endless insight to the vaccine program being managed at the local Air Force base, where she works. Also pregnant with Andy's child and engaged to him. Nicolette (Yvette) Seydeaux (staff),  The 22 year old maid of Rook Manor. Blonde, with long curly hair. Extremely buxom. 5'9" or 6'1" (in heels). Second generation French American. Enjoys wearing classic maids outfits and being a bratty submissive. Pretended to be named Yvette at first, at the suggestion of Phil. Katie Rodriguez (staff),  The 32 year old gardener of Rook Manor. Hispanic, butch, 5'8", with short black hair cut in a bob, almost always seen in overalls and a button up shirt. Lesbian and wife of Jenny Peters. Had reservations about the program, but wanted to ensure safety for her and her wife, so they took the deal and came to join the House of Rook. Jenny Peters (staff),  The 31 year old cook of Rook Manor. Midwestern and plump, 5'8", with brown bushy hair. Wears large circular glasses. Tends to be overly motherly. Bisexual and wife of Katie Rodriguez. Taylor Morrison,  The 25 year old ex ex girlfriend of Lauren White. Platinum blonde, stacked, short (5'2"). Currently still in the doghouse for cheating on Lauren almost a year ago, but close to working her way out of her trouble. As part of her current punishment (dictated by Lauren), she is not allowed to wear clothes. Piper Brown,  A 26 year old Olympic Volleyball player. Brunette, tall (6'2"), muscular but lean, blue eyed. Went viral for a video of her pre game warm up dance. Still slightly recovering from abusive treatment at Andrew Covington's home. Asha Varma,  An 18 year old college student and daughter of Dr. Charlotte Varma. Half Indian, half French, raised in London until last year. Brown skin, black hair, pierced navel, wild child attitude. 5'6". Party girl and socialite, Asha tends to enjoy causing trouble, as it gets her attention. Has some growing up to do. Sarah (Sares) Washington,  A 31 year old actress. 6'2", redheaded, quirky, clumsy and a bit dorky. Originally from New Jersey. Swears like breathing. Very girl next door. Huge fan of the Druid Gunslinger books, and had a crush on Andy before she even met him. Big lover of Broadway theater and musicals, both attending and performing in. Partner of Emily Stevens. Engaged to Andy. Emily (Em) Stevens,  A 30 year old actress, 5'1", blonde, blue eyed, pale, slender, very posh, British. Left London for L A just a few years ago. Incredibly charming and witty, with an almost supernatural social sense. Grew up as a child actress in a wildly popular series of movies called "The Dagger Academy" series, but has since struggled to establish a successful acting career outside that role. Partner of Sarah Washington. Engaged to Andy. Sheridan Smith,  A 32 year old acrobat and performer for Cirque Du Soleil. 5'7" Blonde, frizzy hair, slender and extremely flexible. Very laid back and go with the flow. Has been teaching the girls of the house yoga in her spare time. Hannah Nakamura,  And 18 year old college student and former cheerleader. Half Hawaiian, half Japanese. Short (5'1"), Asian, with long black hair with blonde stripes in it. Curvy, very well endowed (44G) and a firecracker of energy. Originally supposed to be joining the House of Watkins, she is much happier being part of the House of Rook. The House of Yang Eric Yang,  A 39 year old engineer, and Andy's former roommate. Second generation Japanese American. Short (5'5") but athletic, if a bit shy and bookish. Piggybacked on Andy's one good deed into a complete life change he wasn't expecting. Andy and Eric are friends, but not overly close ones, despite having shared a condo for most of a decade. Lily Wu,  a 25 year old coder for Door Dash. Second generation Japanese American. Dyed purple hair, short (5'2"), punkish. Eric's first partner, who expected to be his only partner only for life to get majorly in the way. Lily is the iron fist that runs the House of Yang, sometimes making decisions for Eric so he doesn't spend too long dwelling on them. Jenny Carnero,  a 28 year old meteorologist for the local Fox News channel. Statuesque brunette (5'10") who always remains overly tanned. Lily's ex roommate who had to be rescued after fleeing from the person she was supposed to be paired up with, before getting paired up with Eric. Threatened to tell her story to the reporters at the station she worked at, but Lily convinced her that doing so would be bad for all involved. Phil cleaned the mess up. Sarah Wilson,  a 26 year old HR specialist with Adobe Systems. Short (5'3"), blonde, Nordic and curvy. Originally from Kansas. The House of Marcos Phil Marcos,  a 34 year old Filipino project manager for Boeing, working in conjunction with the Air Force to manage the vaccine development/distribution program trying counter the epidemic. Probably involved in a sizable amount of heavily classified shit. Tall (5'11"), slender and usually exhausted. Has a deep love of fighting games and mischief. Phil always knows more than he can talk about. Audrey Percy,  a 29 year old Hispanic psychologist. Short (5'1"), very curvy. Also a big fighting games fan. Has been doing her best to keep Phil sane throughout the apocalypse. One of the first successful recipients of the current vaccine. Pregnant with Phil's child and engaged to him. Captain Linda Hayes,  a 35 year old Caucasian captain in the Air Force. Blonde, fit, lethal. Also doubling at Phil's bodyguard most days. Tamika Jefferson,  an 18 year old African American college student. Short (5'2"), curvy, disaffected and disinterested in most things. Yuko Takahashi,  a 22 year old first generation Japanese immigrant and video game engineer. Very short (4'10"), very slender but extremely agile. The most sarcastic of Phil's partners. Dr. Charlotte Varma,  a 44 year old French infectious disease researcher working with the Air Force and Boeing. Lead developer on the current vaccine. Average height (5'7"), blonde, matronly but also a bit bougie. Originally from Paris, she moved to London and married Dev Varma, before they emigrated to the US earlier this year with their teenage daughter, Asha (now part of the House of Rook). Was rescued by Andy but chose to go with Phil. The House of Covington Arthur Robert Covington IV,  a 63 year old investment banker. Considers himself the most important person in New Eden. Certainly is the richest. A horrible prick with a rumored proclivity for making his partners do awful things. Runs a regular poker game where people are used as stakes. The person Andy hates the most. Lisa Davis,  a 25 year old graphic design contractor for Google. Ex colleague of Aisling. Partner for Covington, who does not allow her to speak in public. Ash has been trying to find ways to talk to her on the side. Rachel DeMarco,  a 28 year old infectious disease researcher working with the Air Force and Boeing. Has only been spoken of, not actually see in the story thusfar. Veronica DeLaCruz (deceased),  a 27 year old Hispanic card dealer for the House of Covington privately, as well as professionally over at a local casino. Cheated on her partner (Arthur) with a man named Brian Morrison, and the sexual encounter resulted in her death. The first fatality in New Eden, her death is being used to remind women the dangers involved in being unfaithful in the new world. The House of Vikovic Gregor Vikovic,  a 52 year old business owner. Russian, huge (6'2", 275lbs), mucular, with a big braided silver beard and a fondness for expensive things, particular food and drink. One of the more elite members of New Eden. The House of Watkins Nathaniel Watkins,  a 41 year old investor and insanely rich self made gadfly. Tall (6'1"), lean and Waspy, Nathaniel tends to look more like an out of work yoga instructor than the forty first richest man in the world. His brown beard is always somewhat disheveled, and seems to relish always walking around in socks and Birkenstocks. Has a friendly relationship with Andy, whom he gave a shitload of money to, seemingly to punish his son. Benny Watkins,  an 18 year old high school student. Benny is Nathaniel's biggest failure, spoiled and thoughtless, entitled and arrogant. His claiming of Deborah Barnes resulted in his punishment by his father, and the reassignment of Hannah to Andy. Deborah Barnes,  a 34 year old veterinarian from Los Gatos, originally from Kansas. She was originally assigned to Nathaniel, who used her as a stake in one of Covington's poker games. She was won by Andy, but Benny claimed her before she could be relocated. As part of Benny's punishment, Deborah's been assigned control of Benny. Erin Donegal,  a 36 year old pharmaceutical representative. Dated and lived with Andy about a decade ago until she gave him an ultimatum “ "either your friends go, or I do." Andy gave her the boot, and she stalked him on and off since then. Second generation Irish American. Blonde (but dyes her hair brown), curvy. Andy refused to bring her into his house, and she was reassigned to the House of Watkins. The House Of Haunton Mayor James Haunton,  the 54 year old mayor of New Eden. Portly and short tempered. Has a mustache that whole bowls of soup could get lost in. Major Monica Peters,  the 36 year old wife of the mayor, who doubles as the greeter and tour guide of New Eden for the most recent arrivals. The House of Jacobson Jake Jacobson,  the 49 year old owner of the AllStore chain of department stores. Jet black hair with a pencil thin mustache. More reptilian than human, with beady eyes and a perpetual sneer on his face. Hot tempered, petty and vindictive.. The House of Baker Xander Baker,  a 38 year old auto mechanic and car restorer from Ohio. Andy's oldest and best friend. Being relocated to New Eden to get paired up with Captain Betsy Ross. Covered in tattoos, ridiculously muscular, Xander is a gentle giant. Not to be allowed near karaoke machines under peril of death. Captain Betsy Ross,  a 34 year old Air Force officer, working on the reconstruction program, rebuilding America's heavily damaged infrastructure. Soon to be Xander's first partner. Brooke Maloney,  a 24 year old Olympic swimmer, and friend of Piper. Second generation Swedish American. Blonde, short (5'4") and extremely athletic. Originally, Piper was trying to convince Andy to bring Brooke into the House of Rook, but Andy immediately recognized her personality would be a better fit for Xander, and asked Phil to help redirect her. The House of, Dave? Dave, something or other?,  a thirty(ish) something(?) quarantine management engineer for the CDC, who came to test Andy and Eric, and found out that Andy was secretly Dave's favorite author. In exchange for an advance copy of the newest unpublished Druid Gunslinger book, he put Andy and Eric into the system as Top Level V I P, which has changed their life forever. Nice dude, but Dave's just this guy, you know? Chapter 29 The next day, Andy and Ash met up with Eric and Lily for lunch in a restaurant, something they still weren't accustomed to, even though they'd done it a couple of times since moving into New Eden. They'd been in quarantine so long that the basic things like eating out felt alien. They'd found a nice little BBQ joint that someone had opened within the walls of New Eden, and Andy was ecstatic. Andy's hope was that they were going to keep getting more varieties of food in their new home town. The little 1950s dinner was nice, but the village needed things like a Mexican joint, a Chinese restaurant, a ramen house, a place where he could get a banh mi, Andy realized he really just needed the place to be less exclusively white. The guy who owned and ran the BBQ was a big black guy named Bryant Walters who'd apparently played football for the 49ers a couple of decades ago. He'd settled in the Bay after his football career ended, and he had brought his love of southern BBQ to opening his own restaurant, called "Smoke On The Water." He had a dozen of his own BBQ sauces, brisket that he smoked for at least twelve hours and some of the best damn ribs Andy had ever tasted. It didn't hurt that Bryant was also massively friendly, making sure to come out and talk to patrons of the place. The wait staff was comprised of his partners, five women in all, at least one a former 49ers cheerleader. Over lunch, Andy made sure to tell Bryant that he should have delivery service for the community, and the big burly man told him that was an excellent idea, and that he'd start working on a website for online orders. The meal was the first chance that Andy and Eric had really been able to sit down and catch up one on one since they'd gotten to New Eden. Sure, they'd seen each other at parties and big gatherings, but with just Ash and Lily there, it felt like a throwback to the first days of the whole adventure when they'd been a pair of new couples sharing a tiny little condo. "So yeah, what with all the casualties on my team, I've been promoted up the food chain to be director of the division," Eric said, poking at his brisket with his fork. "I like the responsibility and the increase in pay, but it's also incredibly depressing to think about all the former coworkers that died, none of whose funerals I can attend, because nobody's allowing funerals." "Yeah," Andy sighed, "Phil told me they're moving to mass cremations now, since so many people died. They'll probably build some sort of memorial after we're through all of this, like the Vietnam Wall or Ground Zero for 9/11." "It's so strange, seeing all the names on Slack that aren't lighting up any more," Eric sighed. "At some point, the death toll crossed from a number I can understand to a number I can't." "Kill one person and it's murder; kill a hundred thousand and it's a statistic. Good ol' Stalin," Lily joked, squeezing his hand reassuringly. "Don't try and think about it, dear. You're only going to get angry or depressed again, and we're having a nice lunch here, with everyone getting a chance to see one another. I mean, I love Niko to death, but if Andy shows up with his entire tribe, it takes over the whole room. How many are there now, fifty?" Ash giggled, rolling her eyes. "It really isn't tha' bad, Lily. How many're over there?" "Seven, including Lily," Eric said. "I refuse to let them send any more," Lily growled. "Each of the girls gets one day a week to spend with him, and he gets Sundays off." "Then when do ya get time with him?" "Any time I fucking want to," Lily laughed, waggling her beer in Eric's direction. "We're trying to have a kid now, and I'm refusing to let any of those other bitches get a go at getting knocked up until I'm well and truly swollen. Once I'm half way through my second trimester, then I'll let'em get off their birth control, and not a minute fucking sooner." "Still got Eric under your thumb, huh, Lil?" Andy teased. "Thumb, palm, e

Quaranteam – Book 1: Part 6 Andrew Rook continues to grow his family. Based on a post by CorruptingPower, in 25 parts. Listen to the Podcast at Explicit Novels.   Chapter 17 The morning after any good party is generally a challenge to get up and out of bed, but thankfully, they hadn't gone too late into the evening, and so, everyone had gotten to bed at a reasonable hour. And the wonderful smell of a good, late brunch was the clincher to get everyone out of the bed. Jenny had prepared an excellent morning feast for them, but timed it so that it was just before noon when she had it ready, drawing everyone downstairs, although most of the girls were in pajamas still, and Andy stuck to sweats himself. Over a combination of huevos rancheros and breakfast burritos, Niko and Andy explained to the rest of the girls about Andy's upcoming day at poker. Their reactions were much like Andy's initial impressions. Shock at first, followed by concern for the women who were supposed to be showing up on Andy's doorstep tomorrow. "I mean," Andy said, in between bites of his burrito, "it's never come up before, but I technically do have the right to refuse any woman who shows up on my doorstep. Like, for example, if had been too much of a hassle for Lauren, I could've just sent Taylor away." "Which reminds me," Lauren said, bringing a mimosa to her lips, "you need to imprint her today, especially if you're going to be coming home tomorrow night with a whole stable of new women." "I think you girls have a lot more faith in my poker skills than I do," Andy sighed. "And I think you're just being modest to set expectations," Niko said. "I watched you confidently take apart those poor boys last night." "I've known those guys for over a decade, Niko. They've got tells and I've had time to learn them, but you're talking about cold reading a room worth of men, most of whom I've never met." "If Rachel's to be believed, most of them are crap, Andy, so the only person you've really got to worry about is Covington himself." "You mean, I've only got to worry about the one guy I have to beat. Sure, no problem." "Do your best, baby," Niko said to him, squeezing his hand. "That's all I'm asking." That hung in the air for a couple of minutes before Lauren started giggling, and Andy turned to look at her, raising an eyebrow. "What's all that about?" "I was just thinking about you saying you had the right to refuse a woman delivered to you, and was trying to imagine you refusing Niko when she showed up." "You know, I still don't remember showing up at all?" Niko said. "I'm serious. The first thing I remember is waking up in the morning sucking your cock. I mean, I remember picking your picture out, and I sort of remember the start of the drive over to the old condo, but showing up on your doorstep? Me fucking myself on top of him in the goddamn dining room? I know you told me I did all that, but I don't remember any of it." "You were pretty out of it," Aisling said. "But it was kinda hot, watching you just pin him down and fucking use him. He wanted to take you upstairs first, but you were too wound up to let him do that, so he had to carry you naked upstairs after he'd filled you up with your first load." "I feel a little robbed that I don't get to remember that first super intense orgasm, though." "If you really want to get something equivalent," Lauren said, "you just need to fast from his cum for a couple of weeks. Right around the point you're starting to break, you'll get that high again, but the pain of waiting that long isn't worth if you ask me." "I agree," Aisling said, "but it's probably worth trying at least once, just so you can know." Niko shook her head. "I remember you telling me about how it felt waiting that long, Lauren, and I don't think I have any need to inflict that much need on myself." "You wait any longer to imprint Taylor," Aisling said, "and she's going to be there herself. She's already having trouble keeping her head clear enough to follow the rules." Niko nodded over at Lauren. "I get that you want to punish her, but she needs to get imprinted, otherwise she's not even going to remember the punishment." Lauren giggled a little. "I know, I know. Let's sic Andy on her after we finish brunch." "I like how much my opinion is being consulted on this," Andy grumbled. "Oh you know you're itching to have a go at her," Lauren smirked, waggling a fork in his direction. "Just remember, one of the three holes is off limits until she's passed the month, and frankly, I don't want you firing that sex bomb of yours down her throat for her first time either." "You've made it pretty clear what you want out of this, Lauren," Andy said. "I won't forget." After they finished brunch, the foursome headed upstairs. Taylor had been given brunch in a bowl while they'd been eating, and she had finished all of it. When they entered the room, she looked up, but didn't move over, as she was trying to take all of her cues from them and not initiate anything on her own. "Alright Taylor," Lauren said, "it's time. Andy's going to imprint you now, so I hope you've internalized all the lessons you've witnessed over the last several days." "Yes Mistress," Taylor said. "May I go and make a few small preparations? Not for myself, but for the Master." Lauren seemed to consider this for a moment, then nodded. "Five minutes in the bathroom. We'll be out here waiting." Taylor moved to head into the bathroom, closing the door behind her. "Wonder what she's doing in there," Aisling said, as she moved to sit in one of the big plush chairs scattered around the room. Niko grinned impishly, as she moved to recline on the couch against the wall. "Oh, she told me she's been trying to plan as best as she can to make both Andy and Lauren happy." "I'm not sure I even want to know what that means," Andy said, moving to sit down on the edge of the massive bed. "I'm not sure I'd let her tell you, even if she wanted to," Lauren said. "Oh, you want to try and tell me what to do, Lauren," Niko said, a playful smile on her lips, "and we can see which one of us paid more attention in hand to hand combat classes." "That sounds like fighting words," Lauren giggled, miming rolling up her sleeves. Andy narrowed his eyes at them. "Don't make me bend you both over my knee and paddle your asses red." "Promises promises," Lauren said, blowing him a kiss. Just then, Taylor opened the door and walked in from the bathroom before moving to get down on her knees in front of Andy. She had put on dark, heavy mascara and pulled her platinum blonde hair back into a solid ponytail, held with a scrunchy that looked like it could handle a bit of force. She'd also put on thigh high white stockings that looked like extra long sport socks with red rings around her thighs. It made her look sportier, and also a little bit younger. "Your slut is ready for you to use her, Master, if you are ready." Andy slid from the bed and crouched down, brushing a hand along her face. "This is your last chance to back out, Taylor." Taylor leaned in and whispered into his ear. "I want this, Andy. I want to be part of your family. But my safeword is 'yeti,' if you're really worried." She'd said it quietly enough that he was certain none of the other girls had heard any of it. "I like the mascara," Lauren said, reaching to brush a fingertip along Taylor's cheek. "It's going to run nicely when he's skullfucking your face." "Yes Mistress. I thought you might enjoy seeing that, proof that he's making me cry." "Tears of joy, I hope." Taylor nodded. "Joy, yes. But also from being unable to breathe. I want Master to really use his slut, to make her gag and choke and gasp for air." "Good," Lauren said. "I want you to get him so wound up that he can't think straight, Taylor. I want to see him actively fucking use you, until you're a quivering, brainless heap of well used flesh, lying there in a goddamn puddle on the floor. You think you can handle that?" "For you, Mistress? I can handle anything." Her chin was lifted proudly, displaying that leather collar she'd been forced to wear since her arrival. "Please, Master, may your worthless slut finally taste your cock?" Lauren put her hand on Andy's shoulder, leaning in to whisper into her mouth. "Remember, I don't want you cumming in her mouth. Just in her ass, okay?" There was a tiny amount of trepidation to her voice, as if she wanted to be sure she wasn't overstepping her boundaries, so Andy simply nodded. He felt hands on his waist, and it was clear Taylor had taken the nod to be to her and not to Lauren, but Andy didn't feel the need to correct her. Taylor pulled his sweatpants and boxers down to his ankles, lifting one of his feet for him and then the other, to help him step out of them, before she finally looked at his thick cock before her bright blue eyes. "Your little whore has been thinking about this nonstop since she got here, Master. About how she watches your girls when their eyes roll back in their heads, when their legs twitch and spasm when you fill them up. And even though she knows it's unbecoming of her," she said, looking down as one of her hands stroked his thick cock, "she's been getting more and more jealous of them, of those intense feelings you evoke in them. She knows she needs to be patient and wait her turn, but sometimes, even thinking about it gets her cunt all wet, Master. May she at long last have a taste and begin her process of officially becoming yours? Please, Master? This worthless slut aspires to be better, to be more, to be, yours." They'd been particularly careful not to let her taste any precum of his because even so much as a droplet would prime the imprinting process. It wouldn't fully start until she got her first full load of his jism, but the amount in precum was enough to get the process ready to burst. Taylor had gotten particularly close to the girls when they were playing with Andy, usually at Lauren's insistence, but in her eagerness to rub Taylor's face in it, she'd come dangerously near starting the process early. Andy was about to say that she could when Lauren reached her hand along the back of Taylor's head, grabbing the ponytail, shoving Taylor's face down onto his cock until he could feel the head of it pressing against the back of her throat, forcing its way in, even as her eyes looked up at him with adoration in them, her body literally vibrating at it, as the precum oozed from his mushroom tip into her mouth. Her eyes were fluttering, almost like they were threatening to roll back into her skull, and while she was doing her best to maintain control of herself, he could feel a bit of drool dripping down onto his balls. After what felt like an eternity of keeping his cock buried inside of her mouth, Lauren finally pulled Taylor back, and she gasped hungrily for air, slobbering even as her eyes were starting to water, her chest rising and falling quickly. "Are you  " Before Andy could even continue the sentence, Taylor grabbed onto his hips with both hands and pulled her face back onto his cock until her nose was buried in the thatch of brown hairs at the base of his cock. "Don't just leave her on, Andy," Lauren hissed at him. "Give the little whore what she wants. Fuck that little cheating face of hers until she's a sloppy mess." Andy's hands grabbed onto the side of Taylor's head and pulled her face back, but just when the head of his cock was at the ring of her lips and she was inhaling another lungful of air, he shoved his cock back into her face, pushing it back against her throat once more, evoking a gurgling cough from her, as those eyes started to water hard, a single black tear running down her right cheek. He pulled her back back and off his cock, letting her drink in another swallow of air, a wide smile on her messy lips, precum and spit dangling from them, as her tongue lashed out to try and lap it up before Andy shoved her face down once more. Taylor was doing her best to lean into Andy, but Lauren was mostly controlling the depth she could reach, using her ponytail as a leash, although Lauren seemed to be letting Andy do most of the driving for the moment, partially because Andy had been told not to cum in Taylor's mouth, and it was starting to take some effort to keep himself cooled off. She had a talented tongue, and there was something primal and carnal about seeing his precum smeared all over the blonde's chin, drooling on herself when she had half a moment without Andy's cock in her throat. "Whose whore are you?" Lauren said, reaching forward to slap Taylor across the face, making that mascara run even more. "Yours, Mistress." "Wrong answer!" Lauren shouted, slapping Taylor's other cheek, hard enough to make Andy a little nervous. "Try again. Whose whore are you?" Taylor swallowed a breath of air, looking up with those heavily watered icy blue eyes of hers, realizing her mistake immediately. "His whore, Mistress. The Master's whore." "That's right, you cuntrag," Lauren sneered. "I'm your Mistress, but this man fucking owns you, if you want to live under this roof. You will deny him nothing. You will do whatever he asks of you, and you will do it gladly." "Yes Mistress. Sorry Mistress." "Don't apologize to me, you dumb bimbo! Apologize to him." "Your worthless slut is sorry, Master. She belongs to you, and only you, and will never forget that again." "You know what I think?" Lauren said, her face a wicked angry snarl. "I think you ought to spit into that bitch's mouth, so she knows who fucking owns her." Taylor visibly flinched, but leaned her head back, opening her mouth wide. "That's it, Andy," Lauren goaded. "Get a big mouthful of spit and give it to that vapid cunt." Spitting had never much turned Andy on, and if he was honest, he found it excessive and unneeded, but all of this was about giving Lauren some closure, so he pursed his lips together and started to summon a big mouthful of spit. Just as he was about to spit into Taylor's mouth, she turned her head suddenly and said, "Yeti! God, I'm sorry, yeti!" Andy turned his head and spit onto the floor, as his mind raced, trying to figure out a way to disarm the situation he knew he was about to be in. The imprinting process was already primed, so it was too late to pass Taylor off to someone else, or to send her away, but he suspected the explosion of temper that was about to erupt from Lauren was going to make all their lives living hell for a time. He turned to look at her as he started to speak, "Now look Lauren, there's limits, to,” The look on Lauren's face wasn't one of anger. It was one of, amusement? He frowned and she started to giggle, and pretty soon, all the girls in the room were giggling, including Taylor at his feet. "Sorry, Andy," Lauren finally said, through fits of laughter. "I told you he'd stop if she said to," Aisling said. "No matter how wronged you felt, Lauren, he wasn't gonna lose control." "Damn," Lauren said, "and here I figured I could get him worked up enough to push past it. Guess I owe you twenty." "Excuse me, were, were you gambling over whether or not I'd take a woman against her will?" Now Andy felt like he was the one starting to get angry. "It was just a game, love," Lauren said. Andy stepped away from Taylor and over to Lauren and picked her up, no easy feat considering her height compared to his, moving over to the bed, putting her down and bending her over it before yanking down her pajama bottoms. "What are you going to do, spank me?" Andy welled up his rage into his right hand and brought it down onto Lauren's ass with the hardest spank he could muster. "Ow! Jesus, Andy, that rightly stung!" Wham! His hand clapped down again, just as hard, and he heard her groan, a weird blend of pain and excitement, her whole body shaking. "Strewth, that hurts!" Wham! His hand spanked down once more, the cheek of her ass starting to redden quickly under the power of his slaps. "Fuck Andy!" Wham! "I'm sorry!" Wham! "Bugger, Master, I'm fucking sorry, awlright?" At that, Andy held his hand in the air, not slapping again, but brought his hand down softly to slowly press his fingernails against the edge of the reddened flesh, and then dragged them firmly across that handprint he'd left there, making Lauren quiver, lost somewhere between lust and fear. "You're right you're right, okay, it was a shitty thing to do, and I'm sorry, I'm very fucking sorry. I shouldn't have made her do it." Andy looked back at Taylor. "And you. I ought to just leave you like this." Taylor's face reddened as much as Lauren's ass. "I'm sorry, Master. She told me to do it, and I didn't want to upset her. I do have an actual safeword, but it isn't yeti. I told Lauren what it was, though, and how I didn't think she would need to use it." "And if you're punishing Lauren, Daddy, you probably need to punish all of us," Aisling sighed. "I mean, I took her bet." "Speak for yourself, Red," Niko said. "I told you I thought it was a bad idea." "Well, now we know, I guess," Aisling said. "You okay, Lauren?" Lauren lifted her head up, and there was a strange look on her face. After a moment, it registered to Andy that she was more turned on that he'd ever seen her before in his life, and that included the moment when she'd been in a complete fuck daze after her sex fasting. "That was the hottest thing that's ever happened to me," she moaned, struggling to not drool on herself. "I've been trying to get you to lay into me for months, Andy, and I don't think it's much of a punishment." She grinned, all crazy eyed and wild. "I'm a bad girl." "Well then, you know how I'm going to punish you, Lauren?" Andy sighed. "I'm gonna put you away wet. You can go without a dose until the end of the week now that you're all wound up." "Oh god, that's cruel, you delicious bastard," she purred. "I fucking love it. But that's okay, I've earned this. And now that you're all wound up, it's time you take it out on Taylor." Andy looked from Lauren over to Taylor, who nodded enthusiastically. "This is what I want, Andy. I want my first time to be hard, rough, fucking brutal. I don't want to be treated like 'one of the girls,' because I haven't earned that, not yet." She started crawling over on all fours towards him, doing her best to keep her head raised, so she could see her face while she talked. "After the month, we can do the soft stuff. We can cuddle and lay together gently in bed and I can fall asleep in your arms, or in Lauren's. But I need to pay for my misdeeds." Niko and Aisling both sat up a little bit, although Andy could see that Niko had her hand down the front of her pajama bottoms, clearly rubbing her own cunt. "This time, I'm not one of your girls, not a partner or a girlfriend or a wife or whatever you're calling them, because I'm not there yet." Lauren was looking over her shoulder at Taylor, not moving from her spot bend over the edge of the bed. "You're already doing me a favor by imprinting me, when you don't know if you should yet. But I love Lauren. I love her so much it hurts to know how badly I fucked everything up. So until I can make that right, I'm a worthless fuckhole, a filthy bitch you should batter and plow and fuck within an inch of her life. I want you to drill me so hard that I can't sit down for a week." Taylor turned around and waggled her ass in his direction, leaning her shoulders down to make sure it was upturned, so he could get a good look at her asshole, as well as her cunt that was drenched with fuck cream. "It's yours, Master. I'm yours. Your fuckdoll, your bitch, your worthless whore to pump full of spunk and leave, sore and drenched. I know you aren't going to have my cunt until after my month's punishment, but just look at that tight little asshole I have just for you." "Just for you now," Lauren corrected. "That's true, Master. You won't be my first, but you will absolutely be my last. I will be a good slut for you, loyal in every possible way. You own all of me, from my toes to my head, and you may do whatever you want with any of it." "She talks a big game, doesn't she?" Niko said with a smile. "Whatever you want, Master, I will do. If you'd wanted to parade me naked in front of all your guests last night, I would've gladly done it. I'm not ashamed of how I screwed up before; I'm proud you're letting me make it right. You've had every chance this last week to treat me horribly, and you've never done it. So now I'm asking you, no, I'm begging you. Punish me. Fuck me. Claim me. Mark your territory. Make me your property. Own me. Use me, harder than you have any of your girls, because I need to learn to be better, to be worth better. But you have to accept me first." Taylor placed her face and shoulders down on the floor, and reached behind her to grab the well toned cheeks of her ass, pulling them apart. "I'm all yours, sir, but you need to imprint me. Fucking take me already." "You'll do anything I say, Taylor? Anything?" "Speak and it will be done, Master." Andy finally felt like he was actually in control for the first time today. "Stand up." "Sir?" "Don't make me say it twice," he growled, mostly for effect, but he could've sworn he heard Aisling moan wantonly in response to it. "Yes sir," she said, placing her hands on the ground, moving onto all fours before standing up. "Sorry sir." She kept her hands folded together in front of her, her eyes lowered to the floor. "Here's what's going to happen." Andy saw Lauren was starting to try and shift, so he slapped her ass once more, and her hips shoved forward into the bed once more, groaning, making it clear she now understood she wasn't to move without his say so. "Words are great and all, and I'm glad to hear you've learned how I'm turned on by dirty talk, but I'm going to give you a harder challenge. You need to convince me that you belong to me with a kiss, just one kiss." Taylor started to move towards him, but he raised his hand and she immediately stopped in her place. "Is there more, sir?" "There is. After you convince me with a kiss, you're going to convince Lauren as well, in the same way. But you're going to put all of that sadness, all of that embarrassment, all of that shame, all of that is going to go into your kiss with her, to convince her that you understand how badly you hurt her, and how much you want to make it up to her." "Now Andy  " Lauren started to say, but as soon as he turned to look at her, the expression on his face cowed her into silence. "After that, I'm going to fulfill my promise to Lauren, and I am going to fuck your ass so hard, it'll be sore for a week. I am going to sodomize you so hard, you'll think you've gone to prison, and you're going to have to come to terms with the fact that as soon as I cum in your ass, you are going to feel your mind being blown into a billion fragments, and every single fucking one of them will have my name stamped onto it." Taylor was shivering now, but Andy was almost certain it was with pure excitement. "You are going to wake up tomorrow and feel like a completely new woman. Ash?" "Every single sense you have is going to be on overload tomorrow," Aisling said to Taylor. "It'll be like the volume on your life is turned up to 11. Smells, sights, sounds, tastes, and touches, they'll all be in full overdrive, which means your ass is going to hurt like you didn't even believe is possible. I'm talking the kind of pain that feels like it goes down to your very soul." "And you won't be able to take any drugs for it to mute the pain," Niko said. "No aspirin, no ibuprofen, not even a stiff drink. That pain'll linger for a full day, and there's not a goddamn thing anyone can do to make it go away before it's ready." "By Tuesday, it'll be sore, but it won't feel like it's threatening to overwhelm your body. But for all of tomorrow, you are going to fucking hurt in a way that you can't even begin to imagine. And this is your last chance to walk away from it." Andy knew he was actually lying at this point. Sure, he had to imprint Taylor, but he didn't have to listen to Lauren and go at her as roughly as she wanted. If he didn't, though, there would always be a rift between the two women, and that was something he didn't want either of them to suffer through, so he was doing his best to navigate down this narrow street the two women had built for him together. "So what's your decision?" he said to her. Taylor looked up, a steely resolve to her face, one he'd seen mirrored in Lauren's face more than once before. She stepped forward and wrapped her arms around him, pulling him down so that she could press her lips against his, and in the kiss that followed, he could feel all of those conflicting emotions battling inside of her. It was the first time they'd kissed, but it was almost like it was a new first kiss for him, like he was a young man again in his parents' basement, kissing some girl in the dark while a scary movie played on the tv. She held the kiss for a long moment, the heat of the kiss turning up in the middle before backing down a little, so at the end he felt like she was trying to convey her shame at having cheated on Lauren. "Was, Is that good enough, sir?" Andy smiled a little. "And now the other half." Taylor mouthed the words "thank you" to him, out of sight of all the others, before she turned to the bed. Lauren was starting to try and turn around again, but Andy took the palm of his hand and pushed it hard on the small of her back, keeping her pinned there, and Taylor immediately understood what he was doing. She crawled up onto the bed, her pose mimicking Lauren's, bent over the edge of the bed, although to get in line with Lauren, she had to be much further up the bed. She looked painfully nervous, but reached and turned Lauren's face to look at her. Lauren's eyes were still pinched in anger at Taylor, up until their lips met, and Taylor kissed Lauren with everything she'd wanted to say to her for months now, holding onto her, even as Lauren tried to remain impassive and stonefaced at first, but melted shortly to the intensity of desperation that Taylor was giving to her. As the kiss continued, Andy started to position the players the way he wanted to, pushing Taylor as he pulled on Lauren, making Lauren roll onto her back on the bed, and bringing Taylor to straddle her, the two a tangled mess of lips and tongues, Lauren's hand against the back of Taylor's head now, keeping her face mashed against her own. Aisling could see he was maneuvering them, and hopped up, grabbing a couple of pillows, sliding them beneath Lauren's head, propping her up a bit, so that when Andy pulled Taylor down some to get her in position, she could still continue making out with her. Once he had her in place, Andy sawed his cock back and forth across Taylor's feverishly dripping snatch, feeling her ooze cream onto his thick shaft, even as she was trying to shift her hips, making it clear she still wanted to follow Lauren's rules, even now, her mind a dizzying chaos of fucknoise and lust. She reached one of her hands behind her to pull on her asscheek, forcing that pink pucker to expose itself even further. Andy lined the head of his cock up against her asshole, but then paused for a moment. That pause made Taylor break from the kiss long enough to plead with him once more. "Please, oh god please do it, Master. I've always been yours, your wanton fucking whore, I just didn't know it. Show me. Teach me. Fuck my ass and claim what's always been yours. Fucking take your bitch. Claim her. Own me!" That was good enough for him. He pushed his hips forward, feeling her asshole give a little more easily than his other girls had on their first time with him, and he suspected it wasn't Taylor's first time taking a man's cock in her ass. He felt no particular need to be exploring virgin territory, so it didn't bother him. As soon as he was most of the way inside of her ass, he could feel Taylor tense up, both of her hands clutching to Lauren's face, moaning into the other woman's mouth in a loud, muffled shriek, as her body clenched up, and suddenly Andy could feel liquid splashing back off Lauren's thighs up against his balls, as Taylor began to squirt all over the Aussie. He was tempted to ease off a bit, but Lauren had made it quite clear that the one thing he absolutely positively wasn't to do was to go easy on her, so he pushed forward until he was as deep as he could get, then pulled back only to punch forward again with a rough slam. Lauren broke from the kiss this time so that Andy could get an earful of Taylor's whorish moans, her body covered in goosebumps. "I think I'm fucking blind!" Taylor whimpered. "I've never cum so fucking hard in my fucking life oh my fucking god what the fuuuuuuck!" The Australain slapped Taylor across the face again, certainly less hard than before. "What do you say, you useless fuckhole?" "Oh god," Taylor said, as Andy drew back. "Thank you, Master! Fuck me! Fuck your needy bitch in her tight young ass until it's fucking carved in the shape of your cock! You're so fucking thick, it hurts, but your bitch loves how it hurts, so fucking rail her! Plow this bitch, your bitch, until she's cumming her brains out her fucking ears!" Lauren kissed her again, as Andy started to really rail her, shoving his cock hilt deep each and every time, making his balls slap against Lauren's sloppy twat that was still dripping girljizz onto his nuts. But Andy decided if they wanted him to get rough, he would oblige them. His hand grabbed onto Taylor's ponytail and yanked her head back hard, making her spine curve back, a strangled howl of pleasure shredding the air. He couldn't see it, but he was certain each time he drilled into Taylor, her tits were making Lauren's jiggle with them. "What are you?" he shouted at Taylor. "Ohgod," she whimpered, "I'm yours, Master. Your bitch, your whore, your slut, your worthless fuckhole to dump cum into and leave a sodden mess on the fucking floor if you want. I'm whatever you fucking tell me I am, because that's what I fucking what to be, sir." Her words were mostly squealed in between brutally hard shoves of his cock into her asshole, which continued to spasm and clench around his shaft. "Please, Daddy, let me be worthy of your cum. Your bad little bitch needs it, more than she's needed anything in her wasted life. Let her ass receive you. Oh god, your bitch wants your cum so bad it's fucking eating her away from inside! Please, Master, please, give your bitch your cum. Claim what's yours. You own this ass, this cunt, this mouth, these tits,” "I require more," Andy said, as he picked up the pace. He wasn't sure how many times Taylor had cum, but he was fairly certain it had been at least three or four. "Name it, Master, and it's yours." "I want to own that mind and that heart. Prove they belong to me. Confess." "Fuck," Taylor whined, her mascara having smeared all across her face, turning her a hideous mess, before she kissed Lauren once more, hard and fierce, before pulling her face back, looking down into the Aussie's eyes. "I love you, Lauren." Lauren's eyes instantly welled up and she kissed Taylor again before pushing her back, a look of satisfaction on her face, as she kept Taylor looking at her, saying only a single word. "And?" "And,” Taylor said, trying to trail off, a wild spike of nervousness running through her veins, before she muscled up the courage to speak again. "And I love you, Andy. Mind, body and soul, you own it all. I fucking love you, you bastard. Now please, let me, for the love of fucking god, have my fucking cum!" On that last word, one which Taylor was nearly shouting, Andy slotted his cock in nice and deep and finally let loose, a monster of an orgasm blasting a hot sticky load of spunk into her ass, and it was as though Taylor had just touched the face of God, a rapturous moan erupting from her until she forcibly locked lips with Lauren, the sound not stopping, only muffling some, as Taylor's sweat stained body quivered like it was having its own personal earthquake before slumping, almost deathly still, atop Lauren's form, the Aussie wrapping her arms around Taylor, stroking her hair, as the pint sized creature began to burble the word "imprinting" over and over again. Andy's cock had softened and slipped from her ass, as he pulled away from them, pushing them up onto the bed, grabbing a sheet, slowly pulling it up and over the two of them. "I don't have to stay here, Andy," Lauren started to say, before he waggled a finger at her. "You're exactly where you need to be right now, Lauren. Keep our newest family member safe, while the process runs its course." Lauren smiled at him, as if she was seeing him in a new light for the first time. "Yes Master." Chapter 18 The next morning, Andy woke up before anyone else. Taylor had been allowed to remain on the bed, in Lauren's arms, all night, and the two were still intertwined when Andy awoke. He suspected Niko would be up shortly, Lauren not long after that, although she might sleep a bit longer what with Taylor pressed up against her. Aisling wouldn't be up for hours. Andy had gotten decent at extracting himself from the bed, but this morning, it didn't take almost any effort at all. He grabbed some sweatpants and a t shirt, pulled them on and then moved out of the bedroom and onto the balcony, looking out onto his driveway, just as the morning sprinklers turned on, down below him. He sighed, leaning against the railing, shaking his head. "You're still worried," Niko said as she moved out onto the balcony with him. "Worrying's not going to change anything." She leaned her head against his shoulder. "Anything I can do to lighten the load?" "Nah," Andy said. "By this time tomorrow, it'll all be done one way or another. So I'm trying not to think about it." They stood together quietly for a moment, before she laughed. "Not working, is it?" "Nah," he said, joining in the laugh with her. "But I'll make it work." Niko decided to take a couple of personal days, and called in to the base, telling them she needed a few days to deal with some private matters. She didn't know when the dropoff was going to be arriving, but she figured that Andy might need some help, and wanted to be around to help him through any chaos. A few hours later, Taylor awoke and was truly in agony, her ass hurting like she'd ripped it open, so Lauren also decided to take the day off and tend to her. She wasn't actually wounded in any serious way, but as predicted, the high sensitivity of her nerves post imprinting process had all the sensations cranked up to a hundred. Andy could even see a little hint of regret in Lauren's expression before she steeled herself back up, to not let Taylor see even a moment of weakness. Aisling offered to help Lauren, but Lauren insisted that Aisling just go about her normal day, so the redhead had gone down into one of the living rooms to work for the day, although she told Andy that she'd come help once the women arrived. All the girls seemed to think Andy was walking on pins and needles, but at this point, Andy was less worried about the women arriving and more worried about the upcoming card game. He spent most of the morning watching poker videos with the hole cards covered, practicing trying to read people's expressions. He hoped it would keep his mind off things, and it mostly worked. It was just after two o'clock in the afternoon when the military truck rolled up his driveway. "Here they come," he said, watching from the balcony as they started to help the two women from the back of the truck. "Oh fuck. Shit. Shit shit shit shitshitshit!" "What's the problem?" Niko asked him. She'd come to join him on the balcony when the truck had been buzzed in at the gate. The first woman to get out of the back was the blonde Nico had described to him earlier, Sheridan, a lithe woman dressed in yoga pants and a sports bra. She stretched as she got out, folding one of her arms behind her blonde mane of hair, bending like he'd never seen before. She looked to be in her mid thirties, and certainly she was a very attractive woman. But she wasn't the problem. No, it was the woman who got out right after her that had sent him into a tizzy. "Shit, I thought you said the other one's name was Teri." "It is," Niko said. "At least that's what she told everyone. Why?" "Back when I dated her, she was going by Erin," he sighed. Sure enough, the second woman looked much like she had when Andy had dated her nearly a decade ago, with a handful of notable changes. She looked older, certainly, but she'd also dyed her hair a dark chestnut brown, hiding those golden locks of hers. She also had a large tattoo on her right shoulder, which he could see through the sleeveless dress she was wearing. It was a stylized bird of paradise, and it appeared that the wings curved back under the dress along her skin. She was a little curvy, but a bit less curvy than she'd been when they'd been together. "You dated her?" Niko blanched visibly. "I'm sorry, Andy, if I'd have known,” "No, I know you didn't know, Niko. But let's just say I won't feel bad at all about passing her on to one of the other men." They walked into the bedroom and headed out into the hallway, starting to head downstairs. "I hadn't been out here long when Erin and I started dating, and we were together for a little over two years, while I was just getting started out here, working in corporate communications for eBay while I was writing the first few Druid Gunslinger novels. She hated them so much, constantly told me I was wasting my time, and that I should just focus on climbing the corporate ladder at eBay." "You're fucking kidding." "I wish," Andy said, as they walked down the stairwell. "After that she started telling me she didn't like the way my friends treated her, which is to say they wouldn't do everything she said without question. I finally got to the point where I was so sick of her bitching at me about how I wasn't living up to her expectations that I broke up with her a week before Valentine's Day. Packed up all her shit for her and threw her out of the apartment." "That's uncharacteristically cold of you, Andy." "Oh yeah?" he said, stopping walking. "She had it coming. The place was entirely in my name, and I'd spent the better part of half a year trying to convince her to put her name down as a co renter on the lease, and she wouldn't do it. I moved out of that apartment at the end of next month and didn't leave a forwarding address, just so the bitch couldn't find me, because she kept harassing me. I didn't just move apartments,  I moved cities. Hell, I moved whole regions of the goddamn Bay. Back when I was dating her, I was living up in El Cerrito, so I moved fifty miles south and hoped I was fucking done with her." "What do you mean by harassing?" The doorbell rang, and it made Andy wince. "She showed up drunk at least a dozen times. Broke into my car a few times. Broke into the old apartment once. Tried threatening my friends to find out from them where I moved to. After that failed, she tried tailing me home from work for a while, until after about a year or so, she finally left me alone." "What a hot mess." "That's an understatement," he said as they headed down the stairs. "Yeah, let me tell you, Erin Teresa Donegal and I are over and done with, and there is no way in hell I am letting that deranged terror into this family." "Ah Andy, love! There you are!" Erin said as they reached the bottom of the stairs. "I see you've moved up in the world since the last time we talked. I'm so excited to be joining this little family you've been given." "Don't unpack, Erin," Andy said. "You aren't staying." "The hell I'm not!" she said, her voice level raising to an uncomfortable volume. "I was given the option of what man I wanted as a partner, and I chose you, so it's a done deal. No more running away from your problems anymore." "I don't have to accept anyone sent to me, Erin, and I'm certainly not going to bring someone into my family who hates my friends and trashed my car." "Oh my god, are you still upset about that? It happened in the past. When are you going to let it go?" "Considering you never paid me back for the car window or the car stereo you destroyed, I wouldn't hold your breath any time soon." "Uh, are you sending me back too?" Sheridan asked, a confused look on her face, as if she realized she was caught in the midst of a deep historical squabble. "We haven't even met." At this point, Andy remembered what he'd been told to do in the instructions from Covington, and went into the rehearsed speech. "Look, there's a meeting in a few hours, and I can go and see what's going on. Maybe there was some kind of mixup about who was sent to who, so you can stay here for the night, but please don't unpack, at least until tomorrow when we get all this figured out. I should be back before midnight with some kind of clarity over all of this." While he was talking to the two women, Aisling had been using his cellphone to photograph the two for the sake of the poker game. Covington had made it clear that all the players needed to know what the "prizes" were, and so each woman was to be photographed in advance. "There's no mistake, Andrew," Erin said. "I'm exactly where I want to be." "Erin, I'm not the same guy you dated a decade ago," he said, as Aisling handed him his phone back. "You would not be happy here, and I certainly don't think the rest of my family would take to you very kindly." "No kidding," Aisling said as she scowled at the woman, shaking her head. "How could you not like his writing?" Erin sniffed in contempt at the Irish redhead. "They're juvenile, childlike stories, and nobody's ever going to want to read them." "Funny how I've sold half a million books across the series, Erin." "Children have disposable income, Andrew, and while I'm sure your little stories are fleeting distractions for them, nobody remembers them after they're done with them. They don't affect anyone. They're not literature. They don't mean anything." "Jesus," Niko growled, "I'm glad he's not letting you in, otherwise I'd probably have to beat your ass until you were begging me to stop." "I would like to see you try, young lady," Erin sneered back. She was about a decade older than Niko, but Andy would've bet on his partner over his ex."I've been taking self defense classes since I was a child." Aisling smirked and shrugged. "Niko's in the Air Force. My money's on her." Erin shook her head. "I have so much work to do here, Andrew, in teaching these girls respect and  " "Shut up! For fuck's sake, will you shut up and listen for one minute in your goddamn life, you vacuous socialite? This is my house! These are my partners, and they belong here, which is more than I can say for you!" "Andrew! How dare you  " "Stop talking! Oh my god, do you ever shut up, or are you so enthralled with the sound of your own voice that the words have lost all fucking meaning? You never wanted me, you wanted what you thought you could make me into, but whatever docile, kowtowing toady that is, that's not me, and it's never going to be me! I'm done getting pushed around by you. So don't get fucking comfortable!" At that, Andy stormed off, leaving Aisling and Niko to apologize to Sheridan and/or deal with Erin. Andy headed downstairs and into his office, closing the door behind him, moving to settle down at his desk, as his two cats, both of whom had been in his office, moved to claim his lap, demonstrating their affection, trying to soothe the temper of their angered master. As it usually did, the cats cleared his head and cooled him off. He wanted to not think about it, so for the next few hours, he just focused on his writing, getting a few chapters into the next Druid Gunslinger novel, that he was currently calling "The Dryad Always Sings Twice," although he wasn't in love with the title. Some time later, there was a knock at his door, and he sighed. "It's unlocked," he said, hoping it wouldn't be Erin. Niko moved to enter the room, closing the door behind her as she moved in. "You weren't kidding about that girl being a piece of work," she said. "How'd you two even hook up in the first place?" "I mean, she's attractive, and she took an interest in me at a time when I didn't have a whole lot of self confidence. And she wasn't entirely like this back then. The longer we were together, the more her intense desire to have complete and total control in our relationship came out." "Yeah, but pretty girls make graves," Niko said to him, moving to wrap her arms around him from behind. "None of you three have killed me yet. Maybe I've just gotten lucky." "Or maybe you've gotten more refined in your taste since your mishap." She kissed him tenderly. "Anyway, I thought I'd let you stew a bit, but it's getting time for you to head over to Covington's for the poker game. Are you ready?" He chuckled a little. "Not really, but there's no time like the present." He saved his file and shut down his computer. "Is she still being a pain in the ass?" "Nah, Ash basically quarantined them in the pool house out back after Erin demanded to see where the master bedroom was, so she could get unpacked." "Like you said, quite a piece of work." He helped the cats off of his lap and moved to stand up before giving Niko another kiss. "Thanks for keeping her away from me. You can imagine the hard memories seeing her brought up." "No kidding. I mean, the fucking gumption on that bitch." She pet Muninn for a second before Andy opened the door, and she moved to walk with him. "Anyway, I'm coming with you." "Are your sure you want to? There's a chance I won't come back with your friend." She nodded, as they headed down the hall, heading towards the garage. "If you don't, I want to be with you so you know that I'm not mad at you." Niko pushed one of the buttons and the garage door in front of the Tesla roadster. "Hop in, I'll drive." The drive over to Covington's mansion was only about ten minutes, and at least a couple of those minutes were spent waiting at the gate for Covington's security team to let them in. There was a full checkpoint, with a couple of women in military fatigues, each of whom had a M16 at the ready. Covington's mansion was far more decadent than Andy's, and as they drove up the driveway, Andy suspected that Covington might even be the founder of the enclave that preceded New Eden, when it was just a bunch of rich fat cats living in a gated community of their own devising. The house itself was some weird hybrid of European colonial tradition and hyper post modern industrialism, with a statue of Covington himself in the center of the circular driveway in front of the home. The statue portrayed him as a pioneer, with a child on one shoulder, and a dozen women laying around him, each reaching up to him like he was their savior. "Oh. My. God." Niko muttered. "This is extra extra." "Even if I have to cheat," Andy mumbled, "I am going to run this asshole into the ground." Niko immediately turned and shook her head at him. "Don't cheat. Don't. He's caught cheaters before, and they get thrown out and lose everything." "Relax," Andy said, "I don't even know how I could cheat here, even if I wanted to, which I don't. We'll play a nice, fair game of poker. Any tips from your friend?" "The only thing she could tell me is that he has a hard time getting untilted if things start going against him." Andy nodded. "That's good to know. Let's go meet the competition." The two exited the car and headed up the stairs, where a blonde in a French maid's outfit opened the door for them. It was similar to the outfit Nicolette chose to wear, except here the blonde's tits were completely exposed, and the skirt was significantly shorter. Andy was certain the girl wasn't allowed to wear panties either. "You are here for the game?" the woman asked him, her voice accented in heavy French tones. "I am. Andrew Rook." The woman nodded. "Staff and colleagues need to remain away from the card room, so I will escort your woman to join the rest of the chauffeurs." She snapped her finger and another woman, this one in a butler's outfit, except that she wore no shirt beneath the black overcoat, which left most of her tits exposed. "Amber will take you to meet up with the other players." Andy could feel Niko tense up next to him, and took her hand in his. "I'll see you in a bit, okay?" Niko sighed, exhaling the breath, then nodded. "I'm just sad I won't get a chance to see your face when you see all the other stakes in play tonight," a sly smile on her face. "That's a shame, but let me tell ya, I think you're gonna play your absolute best when you see what's up for grabs." She winked as she started to stroll away with the butler. "This way, sir?" the butler said to him and led him down a series of stairs. It felt a little like walking into a lair. The hallways were lined with expensive art, but there was no rhyme or reason to it, no sense of what was important or what had personal meaning. It all felt, well, dumped. Like someone was showing off what they'd acquired, but didn't really care for. In fact, the whole home felt like that. Like the owner didn't enjoy any of what he'd acquired if he wasn't rubbing it in everybody's faces. It made Andy hate him even more. Eventually, the butler brought him to a lounge room with a massive LCD wall filling one entire side of the lounge. But Andy didn't look at it for more than a second, because it was time to size up the competition. "Ah, Andrew!" Covington said. "There you are. I was starting to wonder when you were going to show up. I was afraid that you had chickened out." Andy scrunched his eyes. "You don't know me very well, Mr. Covington  " "Please, Andrew, call me Artie!" he laughed. "Arthur then," Andy started. "You don't know me very well, Arthur, but one thing you should learn early on about me is that I don't spook easily, and I certainly don't back away from a challenge if there's a reason to try and win." "Well, there's definitely prizes worth winning in tonight's pool. Here, Airdrop me the pictures of your stakes and we'll look over all the possible winnings together." Andy paused for a moment, then pulled up his phone, sending the images over to Covington's phone. A few seconds later, the images of Sheridan and Erin joined the others on the wall, like trophies on a wall. The very presentation of it all made him sick, but he needed to look at the faces, to establish some sort of foundation to the stakes in play. He immediately saw why Niko had been teasing him. The wall of faces was full of beautiful women, twelve in total, and both Doctor Charlotte Varma and her daughter Asha Varma were up there, although they didn't look at all how he'd imagined them. Charlotte looked European, and Asha's features were an interesting blend of European and Indian. Asha thankfully looked a little older than the 18 Andy knew she was. Both women were stunning. But they weren't the ones who caught his attention at the onset. There were two faces on the board that he recognized immediately. One of them was Emily Stevens, a British actress who'd co starred in a series of films as a teenager before becoming an L A celebrity in a bunch of well received indie

Wish We Never Met wasps? WHO DOESN'T?! Here's what's on the agenda for this episode of WWNM:JUNO-Award-winning jazz pianist and vocalist Michael Kaeshammer joins Amy and Dan to chat about the new season of his music-meets-food TV series Kaeshammer's Kitchen, touring around the world, and why there's much to love about living on Vancouver Island.The co-hosts also discuss the world's collective hatred for wasps (and waspy people!), and ponder why wasps were so bad in Canada these past few weeks. (Amy even got stung while performing at Calgary Pride. Seriously!Looking back on the CCMA Awards, Amy and Dan also talk about how exciting it was to see k.d. lang inducted into the Canadian Country Music Hall of Fame, and how her stage presence is truly unparalleled. Icon status!THANK YOU for listening to this episode of Wish We Never Met! New episodes are released every Thursday afternoon.Give this new podcast some love by clicking "follow" on Spotify or Apple, and consider leaving a five-star review too!FOLLOW the podcast on social media - @wishwenevermetpodcastDo YOU have someone you wish you never met? Something you wish you never said? A place you wish you never went?Email your story to wishwenevermetpodcast@gmail.com and Amy and Dan might just have you on an upcoming episode!

Rachel Khong joins Eric Newman to discuss her latest novel, Real Americans. Divided into three parts that each trace the experiences of different generations of a Chinese American family, the book delves into the thickets of identity, exploring how cultural strictures and the chaos of love shape our reality. The first section, set in 1999, recounts the romance between Lily, a second generation Chinese American media intern in New York, and Matthew, the WASPy private equity investor of the company where she struggles to eke out a living. The second section transports us to Seattle in 2021, where Lily's son, Nick, is navigating the end of high school and early college years with his father, Matthew, conspicuously absent. When Nick reconnects with Matthew through a DNA ancestry test, old wounds heal even as new ones are opened up in the wake of long-buried family secrets. In the final section, Nick's grandmother reflects on her experience fleeing Mao Zedong's China to make a new life in the United States, while trying to reconcile with a tattered and scattered family in present-day San Francisco. As these three lives are woven together and torn apart, Real Americans moves propulsively through questions of race, class, and gender as its characters work to understand their relationship to inheritance, variously conceived, around the tripwires of silence, desire, and pain. Also, Erik Davis, author of Blotter: The Untold Story of an Acid Medium, returns to recommend Dale Pendell's Pharmako Trilogy.

Rachel Khong joins Eric Newman to discuss her latest novel, Real Americans. Divided into three parts that each trace the experiences of different generations of a Chinese American family, the book delves into the thickets of identity, exploring how cultural strictures and the chaos of love shape our reality. The first section, set in 1999, recounts the romance between Lily, a second generation Chinese American media intern in New York, and Matthew, the WASPy private equity investor of the company where she struggles to eke out a living. The second section transports us to Seattle in 2021, where Lily's son, Nick, is navigating the end of high school and early college years with his father, Matthew, conspicuously absent. When Nick reconnects with Matthew through a DNA ancestry test, old wounds heal even as new ones are opened up in the wake of long-buried family secrets. In the final section, Nick's grandmother reflects on her experience fleeing Mao Zedong's China to make a new life in the United States, while trying to reconcile with a tattered and scattered family in present-day San Francisco. As these three lives are woven together and torn apart, Real Americans moves propulsively through questions of race, class, and gender as its characters work to understand their relationship to inheritance, variously conceived, around the tripwires of silence, desire, and pain. Also, Erik Davis, author of Blotter: The Untold Story of an Acid Medium, returns to recommend Dale Pendell's Pharmako Trilogy.

In this world, where everything is available all the time and everywhere, those who know know shops and goods that are only available in one place. These companies don't sell wholesale, they don't make masses of products, they are exclusive and unique, and they have a loyal following and recognition beyond their immediate area. They represent taste and style. They are iconic and recognizable… sort of like Hermes used to be…. I am referring here to the ones you can only purchase at the source and have become cult classics… those brands you see around and immediately think… “That person knows…” There are many others that I am so looking forward to discovering, especially some in the menswear area, but this is the list of some of my favorites: Things: Belgian Shoes. New York, NY. They started as evening slippers to wear at home; they are so comfortable that they soon became the prepiest of all shoes. You can only purchase them in their store; they will not take phone orders. In this same category, I would add Fosters & Sons in London and their bespoke velvet slippers. Peter Beaton. Nantucket, RI. Open only during summer months, their straw hats are so elegant and wearable… the wide ribbon is always perfection. Jar Jewelry Paris. is made by Joel Rosenthal in Paris. Practically entering his boutique by appointment only and with a recommendation of an existing client. Now, collectible pieces are only available through high-end auction houses. T. Anthony, New York, NY. Their luggage is instantly recognizable and super Waspy, but I only use their tote bags. The suitcases, rollers, and all the other leather and canvas goods practically fall apart on your first trip to the airport. More Things: Casa Gusto, Palm Beach, FL. Frankly, anything from Casa Gusto will elevate any room in your house, but the collections of plates, prints, and small accessories are just dreamy. Vladimir, You'll know it when you see one of his truly divine ceramic flowers. Beautiful collectibles. El Tenderete, Sevilla Spain. Handmade ceramics by a mother-son duo are unique, collectible, and oh-so-charming—even Carolina Irving orders from them. This is it for today. Sincerely,The Serial Hostess Thank you for subscribing. Leave a comment or share this episode.

In this world, where everything is available all the time and everywhere, those who know know shops and goods that are only available in one place. These companies don't sell wholesale, they don't make masses of products, they are exclusive and unique, and they have a loyal following and recognition beyond their immediate area. They represent taste and style. They are iconic and recognizable… sort of like Hermes used to be…. I am referring here to the ones you can only purchase at the source and have become cult classics… those brands you see around and immediately think… “That person knows…” There are many others that I am so looking forward to discovering, especially some in the menswear area, but this is the list of some of my favorites: Things: Belgian Shoes. New York, NY. They started as evening slippers to wear at home; they are so comfortable that they soon became the prepiest of all shoes. You can only purchase them in their store; they will not take phone orders. In this same category, I would add Fosters & Sons in London and their bespoke velvet slippers. Peter Beaton. Nantucket, RI. Open only during summer months, their straw hats are so elegant and wearable… the wide ribbon is always perfection. Jar Jewelry Paris. is made by Joel Rosenthal in Paris. Practically entering his boutique by appointment only and with a recommendation of an existing client. Now, collectible pieces are only available through high-end auction houses. T. Anthony, New York, NY. Their luggage is instantly recognizable and super Waspy, but I only use their tote bags. The suitcases, rollers, and all the other leather and canvas goods practically fall apart on your first trip to the airport. More Things: Casa Gusto, Palm Beach, FL. Frankly, anything from Casa Gusto will elevate any room in your house, but the collections of plates, prints, and small accessories are just dreamy. Vladimir, You'll know it when you see one of his truly divine ceramic flowers. Beautiful collectibles. El Tenderete, Sevilla Spain. Handmade ceramics by a mother-son duo are unique, collectible, and oh-so-charming—even Carolina Irving orders from them. This is it for today. Sincerely,The Serial Hostess Thank you for subscribing. Leave a comment or share this episode.

In this world, where everything is available all the time and everywhere, those who know know shops and goods that are only available in one place. These companies don't sell wholesale, they don't make masses of products, they are exclusive and unique, and they have a loyal following and recognition beyond their immediate area. They represent taste and style. They are iconic and recognizable… sort of like Hermes used to be…. I am referring here to the ones you can only purchase at the source and have become cult classics… those brands you see around and immediately think… “That person knows…” There are many others that I am so looking forward to discovering, especially some in the menswear area, but this is the list of some of my favorites: Things: Belgian Shoes. New York, NY. They started as evening slippers to wear at home; they are so comfortable that they soon became the prepiest of all shoes. You can only purchase them in their store; they will not take phone orders. In this same category, I would add Fosters & Sons in London and their bespoke velvet slippers. Peter Beaton. Nantucket, RI. Open only during summer months, their straw hats are so elegant and wearable… the wide ribbon is always perfection. Jar Jewelry Paris. is made by Joel Rosenthal in Paris. Practically entering his boutique by appointment only and with a recommendation of an existing client. Now, collectible pieces are only available through high-end auction houses. T. Anthony, New York, NY. Their luggage is instantly recognizable and super Waspy, but I only use their tote bags. The suitcases, rollers, and all the other leather and canvas goods practically fall apart on your first trip to the airport. More Things: Casa Gusto, Palm Beach, FL. Frankly, anything from Casa Gusto will elevate any room in your house, but the collections of plates, prints, and small accessories are just dreamy. Vladimir, You'll know it when you see one of his truly divine ceramic flowers. Beautiful collectibles. El Tenderete, Sevilla Spain. Handmade ceramics by a mother-son duo are unique, collectible, and oh-so-charming—even Carolina Irving orders from them. This is it for today. Sincerely,The Serial Hostess Thank you for subscribing. Leave a comment or share this episode.

In the final episode of their special “Rom Com Road-Trip” series, Madison invites everyone to join her corn cult while Chelsea spins a sapphic tale fit for the new year: Two suburban households, both alike in WASPy sensibility, and their queer middle children on the precipice of tearing their mothers' New Year's letters to shreds is where we lay our scene. These gays do nothing but gab, and our leading ladies (Dianna Agron and Daisy Ridley) may just kick the infamous rom-com miscommunication trope to the curb as the clock strikes midnight. Connect With Us - Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/loveatfirstscreening/ - Email: loveatfirstscreening@gmail.com Production - Hosts: Chelsea Ciccone and Madison Hill - Music: Madison Hill - Artwork: Chelsea Ciccone --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/loveatfirstscreening/message

Growing up in South Louisiana, all I wanted was a White Christmas and WASPy cut out sugar cookies with a perfect presentation. But, we were usually wearing shorts and t-shirts on Christmas Day and because my Momma is 110% Rajun Cajun, we never did those cute little holiday cookies. We made Cajun candy (pralines and gold brick fudge) which tasted great but looked like alligator poop. After years of fighting my heritage and wanting something that looked like magazine perfection, I've finally learned to embrace it and share the candy (and love) with my "Yankee" boyfriend and friends here in New York and New Jersey. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/whosdatphatgirl/support

This week, we go way back to revisit the original Scooby-Doo! Scooby-Doo Where Are You debuted in 1969 to answer a call for Saturday morning cartoons with less violence and more humor. The Hanna-Barbera production spawned dozens of TV shows and movies.  Before our full review of the original animated TV series, we have our non-sponsored snack, Sixlets: a candy that tried to be better than M&Ms! We talk about our memories of Scooby-Doo, and Steve calls Megan "pretentious" and Megan calls herself, "kind of WASPy."  Was Megan being pretentious? Did we appreciate the nuances of the mystery as much as we did as kids? Were the Sixlets better than M&Ms? Listen to find out! Links to listen can be found at www.stopruiningmychildhood.com    #1970sTV #1970s #ScoobyDoo #ScrappyDoo #CaseyKasum #Cartoons #Sixlets #Shaggy #Velma #Daphne #Fred #MysteryMachine #stopruiningmychildhood #80s #1980s #1980smovies #1980sCartoons #SaturdayMorning #TBT #ThrowbackThursday #tbthursday

This week, we go way back to revisit the original Scooby-Doo! Scooby-Doo Where Are You debuted in 1969 to answer a call for Saturday morning cartoons with less violence and more humor. The Hanna-Barbera production spawned dozens of TV shows and movies.  Before our full review of the original animated TV series, we have our non-sponsored snack, Sixlets: a candy that tried to be better than M&Ms! We talk about our memories of Scooby-Doo, and Steve calls Megan "pretentious" and Megan calls herself, "kind of WASPy."  Was Megan being pretentious? Did we appreciate the nuances of the mystery as much as we did as kids? Were the Sixlets better than M&Ms? Listen to find out! Links to listen can be found at www.stopruiningmychildhood.com    #1970sTV #1970s #ScoobyDoo #ScrappyDoo #CaseyKasum #Cartoons #Sixlets #Shaggy #Velma #Daphne #Fred #MysteryMachine #stopruiningmychildhood #80s #1980s #1980smovies #1980sCartoons #SaturdayMorning #TBT #ThrowbackThursday #tbthursday

Hey Closeteers! This week is a throwback to a classic episode: Part 1 of our two part event with Matteo's cousins Megan and Kelly, and the LEGENDARY Aunt Cindy! Emma gets a chance to compare notes on her WASPy upbringing to the Lane Family's Italian everything. Plus, stories about Matteo's childhood!  Remember to rate and subscribe, follow us on Instagram, and subscribe to our Youtube channel for the full video of the podcast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

WASPy witness Cassidy Hutchinson testified that President Trump threw his lunch and threw down with the secret service. Also, parents in Colchester, CT want their kids to see a sexy man so they can make it to the Tolerance Hall of Fame. Find us at burnbarrelpodcast.com Email us: burnbarrelpodcast@gmail.com Follow on Parler: @burnbarrelpodcast On Gab: @burnbarrelpodcast Facebook: facebook.com/burnbarrelpodcast And Twitter: @burnbarrelpod Rumble: rumble.com/c/burnbarrelpodcast YouTube: youtube.com/channel/UCWhLuhtutKdCmbHaWuGg_YQ Follow Tom on Twitter: @tomshattuck You can follow Alice too: @aliceshattuck More Tom stuff at tomshattuck.com Tom's "Insta" as the zoomers say: instagram.com/tomwshattuck Join us at Locals: burnbarrel.locals.com (subscriber based) Join us at Patreon: patreon.com/burnbarrel (subscriber based) The opening theme music is called Divine Intervention by Matthew Sweet. The closing theme music to this podcast C'est La Vie by Derek Clegg. Excelsior

Veteran Democratic media consultant Neil Oxman is one of the most interesting people working in politics. In addition to his years helping elect Democrats at all levels, he caddies on the PGA tour for golfing legends including Tom Watson. In this discussion, Neil talks the history of political ad-making from the 1950s to today and goes deep inside several of his own high-profile races including PA Governor Ed Rendell, Philadelphia's first Black mayor Wilson Goode, Al Gore's 1988 presidential campaign, and more throughout his career that show the ways TV can help win (and lose) political campaigns. Neil's full presentation on the history of campaign ads was recorded by C-Span in 2016 and can be found here. IN THIS EPISODE…Neil's Philly roots and unusual law school experience at Villanova…Neil gets his foot in the door in politics in the summer of 1976…What leads to Neil opening his own media firm in 1980…Neil talks the roots of television advertising in political campaigns…The 1969 television ad that Neil believes kicked off the rise of political ads in non-presidential campaigns…Neil compares ads from the 70s/80s to political ads of today…The races on which Neil starts to come into his own as a media consultant…Neil helps Wilson Goode beat Frank Rizzo to become Philadelphia's first Black mayor…Neil's role on the Kentucky Senate race in 1984 and the strategic mistake that led to Mitch McConnell's first win…Neil's role as ad-maker on the Al Gore 1988 presidential campaign…Neil's connection to then-mayor of Cincinnati Jerry Springer…Neil helps Ed Rendell become Philly Mayor and Governor of Pennsylvania…The last ad that Neil thinks actually mattered in a presidential race…Neil talks his habit of watching 100s of movies a year…Neil talks moonlighting as a caddy on the PGA tour for greats like Tom Watson…Who's the best golfer in politics?Neil's advice for those who want to get into political media…Neil's recommendation for the best political movies…AND 215 media markets, Roger Ailes, Altoona, Doug Bailey, Birch Bayh, Abe Beame, Homero Blancas, Ed Brooke, Pat Caddell, Frank Capra, Hugh Carey, Bob Casey Jr, Bob Casey Sr, Frank Church, Citizens United, cocktail parties, the Columbus Dispatch, Bob Colville, the Daisy ad, John Dierdorf, David Doak, Mike Dukakis, Dwight Eisenhower, Mike Ford, David Garth, gerontocracy, gigantic piles of polls, Wilson Goode, Bob Goodman, Bill Green, Michael Harrington, Anita Hill, Richard Holbrooke, Dee Huddleston, HUT levels, Andi Johnson, Lyndon Johnson, Julian Kanter, Robert Kennedy, Ed Koch, John Lindsay, the Louisville Courier Journal, Willie Maples, McDonalds, George McGovern, Jack McGregor, Mark Moskowitz, Ralph Nader, Jack Nicklaus, Dan Quayle, process questions, Mark Putnam, Robert Redford, regional agoraphobia, Rosser Reeves, Jim Rhodes, Frank Rizzo, Nelson Rockefeller, Buddy Roemer, Nolan Ryan, Rick Santorum, Mike Schmidt, Allyson Schwartz, Joe Sestak, Bob Shrum, Mark Singel, Arlen Specter, Bob Squier, Clarence Thomas, Danny Thomas, Lee Trevino, troglodytes, Harry Truman, Paul Tsongas, Paul Tully, WASPy establishments, Doug Wilder, Tiger Woods, Tom Wolf, Lynn Yeakel & more!

KMac & Yek, everyone's favorite hop-heads of haute couture, are swiggin' away at suds and swingin' at fashion again. This time it's a team tussle on the catwalk with everybody's favorite B-Squad super teams strutting with the West Coast Avengers vs. the Justice League Europe. Listen in to hear us breakdown who wore it better in the both teams' initial 1980s kickoff arcs. You know there will be some sweet Daisy Duke's action, but did you expect it to be on those stunning Wonderman ionic thighs?   Categories:Leaders: The stick shooter takes it. AWC: HawkeyeJLE: Captain AtomInitial Line-Up: JLE gots too much flava!AWC: Mocking Bird, Tigra, Wonderman, Ironman (Rhodes & Stark), Wildcard: The Shroud?JLE: Elongated Man (Sue Dinby coming along), Animal Man, Power Girl, Rocket Red, Metamorpho, the Flash (WW), Wildcard: Where's Wonder Woman?Base: Grillin' & chillin', West Coast 4 Life.AWC: LA Beachfront CompoundJLE: Parisian Embassy that cannot keep out smelly Frenchmen.  Best Married Couple: WashoutAWC: Hank & Bobbi Barton, super spies!JLE: Ralph & Sue Dinby, crime solvers!Da Man: JLE's sponsor is actually evil, not just playin'.AWC: Janet Van Dyne, acting all Waspy.JLE: Max Lord IV, bringing that big Hollywood production hate switcheroo.  Ladies Man: Wonderman ain't play, he just crush alto.AWC: Ironman / WondermanJLE: The Flash / MetamorphoVillains: Even villains like LaLa land.AWC: Graviton! Ultron! Grim Reaper!JLE: Queen Bee & the Global Guardians (Even Captain Planet is hatin')Costumes: More skin, more shiny for the win!AWC: Silver & Red armor! Cat thong bikini! Expedition jacket! Jorts!JLE: Metamorpho looks kinda of fun. Nuthin' wrong with Power Girl's costume Winner:AWC look so much finer at 5, 2, & 1 over JLE! Beers: KMAC: Nothing Lasts Forever, deBine Brewing Co., Palm Harbor, FLStyle: Berliner Weisse, 4.1% ABV, 5 IBURating: Lemon sharp like Captain Atom, Blackberry flava like Tigra & Power Girl Yek: That New New, Solace Brewing Company, Sterling, VAStyle: IPA, 6.2% ABVRating: Sunny smooth as a Wonderman in jorts! Not Beers:KMAC: Bud Light Lemon Lime Seltzer, Anheuser-Busch, St. Louis, MOStyle: Hard Seltzer 6.0% ABV, 0 IBU Yek: Strange Beast, Sierra Nevada Brewing Co., Chico, CAStyle: Hard Kombucha, 7.0% ABV

Tara Palmeri joins Peter to discuss D.C.'s lingering media challenge, which lies beneath its WASPy, white-teeth clenched smile culture. And ace marketing whiz Alex Bigler swings by to share some exclusive reader feedback.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This month's bonus episode is on the ways that middle- and upper-class churches often function in ways that exclude poor people and reinforce classist structures. We also talk about how to operate congregations more in line with God's vision for the Church. Jonathan couldn't make this one, but we have Gabrielle Apollon back on the show as a guest host. We have a lot of really helpful tips and personal stories in this one. Enjoy! Shake the Dust is a podcast of KTF Press. Follow us on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. Find transcripts of this show at KTFPress.com. Hosts  Suzie Lahoud – follow her on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter.  Sy Hoekstra – follow him on Twitter. Gabrielle Apollon — follow her on Twitter. Our theme song is “Citizens” by Jon Guerra – listen to the whole song on Spotify. Our podcast art is by Jacqueline Tam – follow her and see her other work on Instagram.  Production and editing by Sy Hoekstra. Transcript by Joyce Ambale and Sy Hoekstra. Questions about anything you heard on the show? Write to shakethedust@ktfpress.com and we may answer your question on a future episode. TranscriptSuzie Lahoud: Can we also just throw out this heretical lie that people suffer financially, chronically because they're lazy? Because they don't work hard and are therefore less righteous. That is such a lie. In fact, I feel like the people I know who are the most hardworking, who deal with levels of stress and exhaustion, unlike anything I've seen any of my middle-class or upper-middle-class friends struggle with, those are people who come from low-income backgrounds. [The song “Citizens” by Jon Guerra fades in. Lyrics: “I need to know there is justice/That it will roll in abundance/ And that you're building a city/ Where we arrive as immigrants/ And you call us citizens/ And you welcome us as children home.” The song fades out.] Sy Hoekstra: Welcome to Shake the Dust: leaving colonized faith for the Kingdom of God. A podcast of KTF Press. My name is Sy Hoekstra. I am here as usual with Suzie Lahoud. Jonathan could not make it because of just some scheduling issues that came up. So today we have with us a guest host, and previous guest of the show. Welcome back Gabrielle Apollon. Gabrielle Apollon: Hello.  Sy Hoekstra: We are so happy to have you back. For those of you who don't remember, Gabrielle is, A, my wife [laughter]. And B, a human rights attorney who works at NYU Law in the Global Justice Clinic, former immigration attorney, all-around boss. And today we are going to be talking about classism in the church. So before we get started, real quick, as always, thank you for subscribing. This is a subscriber only bonus episode. Please remember, if you don't, do follow us on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter @KTFPress. It is very helpful when you do that. When you show other people, when people look at our little profile and they see that you follow it and they're your friend, it's good for us. That makes us look good, and we really appreciate your support in that way. Follow us on your podcast player, give us a rating and review, and I think those are all of my usual entreaties to you. So let's just get started and jump right into the conversation. So let's just talk some basic ways that churches exclude low-income people from daily operations or make it difficult for poor people to participate in church community. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. So I guess I'll just jump right in. And full disclosure, I feel like the two contexts that I'm most familiar with and will be sort of speaking from, are one, having spent my college years in the Bible Belt in the South. So that context of church where I feel like one of the major cultural barriers that I saw, was even just this basic idea of Sunday best, and people getting dressed up. I remember going to one church and it was like everyone was just wearing J. Crew or Lilly Pulitzer [laughter]. And just wondering, if someone just wandered into this church or didn't have the means to dress in that specific way, I felt self-conscious coming over as a missionary kid who had no sense of fashion.  And how would that make someone who didn't come from that same socioeconomic background, even that same culture, how would they feel walking through the doors of that church? Would that be a barrier to entry? I think it would be, again, even speaking for myself, I felt less comfortable in that space. It felt like there was a uniform that you had to wear that I didn't have access to. So that, it's a very simple thing, and sort of more on the surface.  But then the second context that I'm familiar with, is having lived in Lebanon for seven and a half years and my husband and I were a part of, and actually still technically are members of a church in Lebanon. I have to say, the Lebanese church as a whole is an amazing case study for this in the way that a number of churches, there was sort of a movement of responding to refugees coming across the border from Syria and watching churches struggle with this idea of wanting to incorporate or not wanting to incorporate Syrians into their congregations. One of the tensions there was just, to be honest, when you have folks who are living in tents in the Beqaa Valley, or living in unfinished apartment buildings or living in attics or basements, these are folks who also don't have access to regular running water. They can't afford to spend a lot of money on personal hygiene items. So honestly, one of the complaints that we would get a lot from folks is, “I don't want them in my church, in my pews because they smell. They don't smell good.” And that was just a very simple, real thing, but it just made me so sad. Like we shouldn't even be talking about that. That shouldn't even be an issue. Why would we keep people out of church for that reason?  Also, it upset me because the assumption was that that was a problem because they had poor hygiene habits, when really it was a problem because these people all are fighting for their lives every single day. They are struggling to feed their kids. They're struggling to literally have a roof over their heads, and for them taking a shower is not an easy, simple thing like it is for you and me. They're living practically outdoors in these tents. So I think just the lack of understanding and sort of compassion and empathy that a question like that, or a barrier like that, that we've created, I think it shows a really ugly side of us that is not in keeping with the teachings of Christ.  One thing that one of my mentors in Lebanon used to remind us a lot, his name is Rupen Das. He wrote an amazing book called Compassion and the Mission of God. He would always remind us that when Christ was preaching, if you imagine Jesus teaching the Sermon on the Mount, he's speaking to a population that 90 percent of them were most likely, based on historical records, living in poverty at the time. So I think the final point that I want to sort of touch on, is that another barrier we see in the church is not just who do you allow through the doors? Who do you allow to participate in your community? What are the expectations in terms of how they dress, how they smell? But also, are there barriers to them being in leadership?  Because I think if we understand the context in which Christ preached the kingdom and carried out his ministry and the people who were involved in his ministry, I think we need to understand that a lot of times it is folks who come from low-income backgrounds, who are actually experiencing real levels of poverty, who are most equipped and qualified to understand the teachings of Christ and to understand the kingdom of God, and to allow us to understand it. And how many of those folks, if you look at your church, are actually in leadership? How many of those folks are you asking to lead Bible studies?  And if you're not doing that, if you're not realizing that they actually have more to give than even receive, I think a lot of times when we welcome them into our church, we're like, “Oh, well, this is a charity case.” Sy Hoekstra: Look at us and how great we are. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. We're going to let them in and be nice to them because we're good Christians and we want other people to see that we're good Christians and we can help them. And that, I think that's such a wrong model because again, it's the upside-down model of the kingdom that shows that actually those are the folks that are going to understand what this is really all about on levels that you, in your middle-class comfortable lifestyle, cannot even grasp. So you need to be willing to sit at their feet and listen to the things that they have to teach you and watch them live out their faith.  I think that when you're not willing to do that, when you don't see that representation, again, even in your leadership, in terms of who is teaching the word and shaping your understanding of the gospel, I think that's actually a form of prosperity gospel. Because I think the subtle assumption there is that if you were a real follower of Christ, you would be living a comfortable middle-class lifestyle or even an upper middle-class or wealthy lifestyle. And again, I don't, I think that's heresy.  Gabrielle Apollon: I appreciate what you mentioned, just so much of it, but especially what you just said about the prosperity gospel, because I think that we often just talk about just how the prosperity gospel kind of, in it's most explicit forms, exploits poor people and capitalizes on the very real needs and manipulates it by incorporating all sorts of stuff related to faith, and what it means to believe and what it means to give. All of those things, but I think that there are so many different subtle versions of the prosperity gospel, or really ways that we exploit poor people or exclude them, that I think should also be talked about.  I think that if we don't talk about issues of class and make a space, a safe space, for people of different classes, then you are actually harming people. It becomes like a potential place of harm because as you mentioned, there's this like air that we breathe, and there's the stigma about poverty that is kind of in all of our, I think, world and all of our cultures, and it winds up in church. And if, unless we're discipled out of that, as I think we have to be discipled out of white supremacy and other things, then we remain steeped in that and we perpetuate it in our churches in various ways. So we either often look the same as the world in this way or sometimes we look worse in our kind of homogenized bubbles and left to our own devices.  I think, you mentioned these issues and when people were actually in the door. When refugees were in the churches in Lebanon, but I think there are so many things we do that stops people from even thinking that these people can come into these spaces. Or I'll just speak for myself and just share a little bit of the context that I come from. So I grew up with very little money, I guess comparatively, in terms of, our family was undocumented for quite some time as I've mentioned in the other podcast. So money was a very real struggle for a long time.  Then I, but I went to a private school and so I was very much kind of in between different worlds in high school, and then went to Columbia for college. So very different world there [laughter] to put it lightly, but also in the churches. The churches that I started going to in New York City and on the Upper West Side, the vast majority of the people who went there are well-to-do. And knowing kind of my background and knowing, you know, we were homeless for a little bit and bouncing from home to home, and having that context and hearing the messages and hearing the assumptions that were made in a lot of spaces, but even in sermons, really made me, I think, think twice sometimes about who can I invite into the space.  Sy and I have a few examples of sometimes we would invite homeless people there and sometimes it was like really embarrassing, the types of examples and…  Sy Hoekstra: Should we talk about that video? Gabrielle Apollon: Yeah, go ahead.  Sy Hoekstra: Oh, okay. I'll do it. Yeah, sure. There was one homeless man in particular, he came to church with us and the moment we sat down, we were a little bit late, so we missed the first couple of worship songs or whatever. The moment we sat down, we had a video come on the big screen, and it's a couple from the church talking about how they actually had moved to New York City in order to be a part of this church that we were in. And they just kept going on about how big and lovely their apartment or house was in wherever they came from before they moved to New York City, and how they had sacrificed so much to come and live in this somewhat smaller apartment in New York City [laughs].  That was the first thing that happened when we walked in with this man. He actually liked the service overall and the message from the pastor and everything. But it was just an immediate like, “Hi, hello. Welcome here sir, this church is not for you.” That isn't to say that we shouldn't talk about sacrifices that people make. I just think we need to put them in their proper context and not sort of glorify the relatively small sacrifices that people who have enough money for food and shelter and everything make, and put… you know like Jesus did with the widow who puts the two coins into the offering, instead of the rich person who puts way more in, and Jesus makes it very clear, that person is the sacrifice that I care about.  They've sacrificed more. You need to take that context into account. And if you don't, I think you are missing the way that Jesus sees things. Suzie, in light of what you said, I was just thinking camel through the eye of a needle [laughs] it's going to be one of the main texts you're looking at if you're thinking about how Jesus actually thinks about these issues.  Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. Gabrielle Apollon: Yeah. It just, I think it's a good example of like what does either the invisibilization of someone's experience, or just not even crossing people's minds, what does that communicate to people who are in very, very different situations. And how is that harmful or not? And the verse that came to mind was, in 1 Corinthians 11, we often hear the verse about communion and whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. And that's something people are like, “Oh, examine your heart before you take communion” and whatnot. But the context of that story I think is, one, I think it's quite telling that we don't ever… Sy Hoekstra: Talk about the context of that story? Yeah. Gabrielle Apollon: …use this context when we discuss this. But the context is, Paul is critiquing the church because they are having the Lord's Supper, celebrating the Lord's Supper, and rich people are coming in with all their yummy food and alcohol, and the poor people are watching them eat because they didn't have anything to bring. And he is chastising them. He's saying, he literally says, “Your meetings do more harm than good,” and is calling people to examine themselves in light of this disparity. He, I think he literally says, making people feel like they are nothing and humiliating them, and that's obviously, some people are like, “Oh, that's kind of a strong example, we would never do that.”  But what do we do when we aren't acknowledging these differences and we're not acknowledging… and acknowledging or differentiating people's responses to the gospel? Like I often was like, “Wow, why can't we just acknowledge this illustration or something is related to a certain context, and just make that explicit and acknowledge that might not actually align with your context or whatnot?” And it always felt like, am I asking for too much? Am I asking people to consider all these people who might not even be in the pews? But one, I think we, again are discipling people as to how to think about issues of class, even if they're middle-class or upper-middle class.  But two, I've seen it done well. I've seen people, and actually this church we're checking out, I've just appreciated Renaissance because even as they do a sermon series about money, it's not just like, “Yeah, everybody, you need to give,” but they're actually like, “Okay, if you are struggling financially, here's what we, we have a Deacons' Fund. Please use it.” They're recognizing that not everybody is in the same place, and it just feels like, oh, I'm seen, I'm heard. And it doesn't mean that none of the other stuff could apply to you, but it means that you're acknowledging that this is a reality that matters.  It's a reality that deserves to be talked about and not just in a separate announcement. Because we often do that, where it's like outside of the sermon and you're like, “Oh yeah, if you need money let us know.” But we don't integrate it in our discipleship or in our teachings. And I think that that really does matter. Sy Hoekstra: Yeah. Shout out to pastor Jordan Rice and Renaissance Church, doing a good job talking about money.  Suzie Lahoud: Love that. Sy Hoekstra: I was going to say, I think like when Gabrielle, when you and I were talking a little bit about this beforehand, we talked about that verse in James, where James says not to show favoritism to the wealthy people in a congregation. And I think the example he gives, he mentions like reserving good seats for them in the… is that true? Am I wrong about that [laughs]?  Gabrielle Apollon: Yeah. I think it's like letting them be up front or giving them some prominent space.  Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. Sy Hoekstra: I probably should have looked this up [laughs], but that's not the point I'm making. The point I'm making is, I think we want to think about classism a little bit like the way that white people often think about racism. Like it has to be this overt thing. It has to be, oh, you rich people come sit up here in the places of honor, and you poor people go and sit in the back, like segregation. And that's what classism is. And we don't as often think about it in terms of, Suzie, like you were saying, saying I don't want people in my congregation because I don't like the way they smell, that is, that's the same thing. That's showing favoritism to people who live indoors and have running water and can afford deodorant. You know what I mean? It's the same thing, it's just done in a more roundabout way.  In a similar way, what you were just saying about the verses about communion Gabrielle, the incredible thing that I think so many churches have done, is allowed kind of the world around them to segregate for us so that we don't have to do it directly. So many of those churches are just, they just live in wealthy neighborhoods. They just, the sermon illustrations they give are all about, are from a perspective of somebody who has money, and the services and the community gatherings they offer are for people with money. They go on expensive retreats and they, maybe they provide scholarships, but maybe they're not enough. Or maybe the ways of getting it are a little opaque. Or maybe the people you have to talk to aren't the safest people to talk to about your financial circumstances or whatever. I think we just do all of those little subtle things, and then manage to pull that verse out of context and make it about sitting there and contemplating whether or not you got angry at your coworker. Like that's the thing that you have to repent of before you go and take communion and not whether or not you are doing an injustice in your community in the eyes of the Lord. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. Gabrielle Apollon: Suzie, I mean, I think this feels like an extreme response and I don't think you can, or extreme example, and I don't think you can completely chalk all of this to colonialism and this culture that we export through missionary culture. But I do think that it is connected. I recall, so my family is from Haiti. I had gone to Haiti after the earthquake and was there with kind of a, like a Cru, a mission trip like thing, which, plenty to say about that, but that's okay [laughs]. And we're talking, we were inviting people to this church that was run by Haitians in this particular area that had been hit by the earthquake.  And this woman was sharing with us, she didn't feel like she could go to church because she didn't have, she had lost all of her things and had none of her good clothes to go to church with. And it was one of those things where you're like, well, that's definitely not what the gospel should look like. As a Haitian, I can say there's plenty, there's so much class stuff also just within our country and our communities. But I do think there's something about the religious kind of culture that we export that says people have to look a certain way, and like you mentioned Suzie, Sunday's best, right?  But what does that look like when you are in extraordinarily dire situations also, and there are these huge barriers that come up that logically should be like, okay, of course you should, even if you've lost everything, God definitely wants you to go to church and it doesn't matter what you… or meet him in one way or another, and it doesn't matter what you wear, but it's a very different thing when that has been inculcated for decades or sometimes centuries within your community. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. And what I didn't even realize at the time, again, going to, so dropping little missionary kid, Suzie from Uzbekistan into the Bible Belt. And I didn't realize there's an actual theology around it, that you're right, absolutely gets exported. Because again, I did experience similar strains of theology in Lebanon that you are dishonoring God if you can't dress nicely on Sunday, if you can't show up clean. So I sort of laughed it off before, but I didn't realize that really it's become a theological understanding that then you can judge other people by. To go back to those barriers, so again, that's just one that is so horrific. But it's, back to your point to Sy about location, I think thinking about the location of your church, if it's in a suburb, especially in the US where we have red lining and all of these things, and like you said, society has done a lot of this dividing for us in a really ugly way. But also, do people have access to your church through public transportation? Because that's a thing too. And again something I saw in the US and in Lebanon, can people get to your meetings if they don't have a car? Like, that's a very basic thing that I think creates a barrier. So I just wanted to circle back to that, just because I think these are really practical things that churches should be thinking through. Sy Hoekstra: Yeah. I appreciate that. We talked about, Gabrielle and I, this one group we were in, where it was a bunch of relatively wealthy people and then there was one poor homeless woman in it. And they just kept, when we would do worship, telling people, “I emailed you all the song lyrics, bring them up on your phones.” It's like, and she didn't have a smartphone. So we kept trying to get people to print out lyrics and people just wouldn't do it. It was weird, but that's the kind of thing, like access to technology is a big thing. Like if everything about your church service or the, I don't know, the ways that you register for things, all your processes, if you're different kinds of like online video calls or whatever.  If all that stuff just requires someone to have some expensive piece of technology and internet access, you need to provide those things. And I'm not saying don't use technology. The same as you're not saying, don't use cars. Just, like, carpool. You have to figure out a way to normalize helping people out and to not make, to make your community safe enough that people aren't afraid to ask for those things, that it's not weird when you offer those things. All that kind of stuff has to be taken into account. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah.  Gabrielle Apollon: Yeah. Well, and the reality is oftentimes it can be less convenient, right? Like speaking of the car situation, like growing up, we didn't have a car for a long time and it was truly only because people from church would come and pick us up and take us to church. And sometimes we didn't live… Sy Hoekstra: And school. Gabrielle Apollon: Yeah. Oh yeah, and school. And sometimes we didn't live in convenient areas and that required somebody to get up even earlier on a Sunday morning and come get us. That stuff's not always, obviously, I feel like it's stating the obvious, that's not always fun. That's not always easy, but it enabled us to have access to these communities and this space that we wouldn't have had otherwise.  Yeah, I think I've definitely seen this stuff not go well, like Sy mentioned, or not work out in the best ways, but I've also seen, like I have this just very distinct memory. So we talked about what happened when we brought, we invited a homeless guy to church, kind of here in New York. I studied abroad in Paris for a little bit and was part of a church there. And I did not expect this I think, but I just invited this guy who I saw on the street on my way to church to come to church with me. I was like, “Oh, there's coffee.” So I'm pretty sure he came mostly for the coffee [laughs] and food. But the way that I saw that church kind of wrap themselves around him and like it wasn't, once he got there and… you know, I left after a few months because I was in study abroad, but I was able to see through social media and just staying in touch how they continued to support him. And he actually became an integral part of that community. It's sad that I actually don't think I expected that.  Often you're like, “Okay, well, I've got to figure this out. I've got to figure out if I'm going to invite him to lunch afterwards. And that, a lot of that onus kind of feels on you sometimes, but to see a whole community gather together and actually embrace somebody in when it's not the easiest thing sometimes. And like you said, when there are challenges or they're not coming from the same place as you, is so cool and such an example I think, of God's love in an incredibly powerful way.  I think what you said before, Suzie, is also really important just to keep in mind, that like yeah, not everybody's a project. But to see what people can do when they do actually bring somebody in and treat them as part of the community and not different, or like you said, a charity case, is really cool. Sy Hoekstra: Can we talk a little bit about specifically the issue of sharing money? So you've mentioned the Deacons' Fund, Gabrielle. But there are obviously many verses and stories in the Bible about the people of God sharing resources in all kinds of ways that are pretty foreign to a lot of wealthy Western churches nowadays. How does the process of sharing resources and sharing money, even though it's ostensibly for the benefit of anyone in the congregation who needs it, how do we do that in ways that are harmful and exclusive?  Gabrielle Apollon: I mean, I think one thing that comes to mind, and it's really the Deacons' Fund, but it's also related to other ministries, like financial counseling, which is ostensibly good and important, but there are lots of, I would say maybe sometimes non-biblical, but lots of kind of white middle-class norms that people are also exporting through that. So I know for me, like I actually, I've had good financial counselors and I also had someone who yelled at me when I was basically explaining how it was a non-negotiable that I had to send money to my family in light of their circumstances. And that just didn't make sense or compute to them in what they thought was financially responsible. Yes, there were other financial needs, but there was also like, my family needed to have money to pay rent. That was something that a lot of people aren't used to, whether it's children of, like adult children or people they're like, “Oh, you shouldn't be responsible for that.” It's like, all right, well, I'm glad you can say that.  Sy Hoekstra: But I am though. Gabrielle Apollon: [laughs] It's just, yeah, this was just my reality. And what does it mean for, whether it's like family support or even support to you, if people restrict that because they're like, “No, that's not exactly what this is for,” and you're like, “Okay, well then I guess I'll have to figure this out myself,” even though there's definitely money there.  Sy Hoekstra: I think another way that that particular issue manifests itself is like, there are restrictions on how you can, how the church can give money. So saying like I can give money to members of the church, people who attend the church or whatever, but if the families of the members who live somewhere else, or aren't a part of the church need money, that's not who this money is for. Which ignores that same reality. It's like, okay, but I as a member of the church, I'm responsible for these people, even though it's my aunt or my grandmother or my cousin or my mom or whatever.  Those things, those are people who in my community and from my background, I am responsible for and I'm going to pay for this thing for them, whether or not you reimburse me or I have to use a credit card or whatever. So if you want to help me with this, you can, and then a lot of churches just say, “No, that's not what this is for.” You know what I mean? Like that kind of tight demarcating of the boundaries of where your money that you're giving out as a church can go, really runs along lines of white middle-class ideas of who people should and shouldn't be responsible for and how we should be using our money to, as little island individuals, make sure that we are not ever a financial burden upon anyone else or the system or whatever.  Then I also think, like I was at a church, I lived in Chicago for a year and I went to this church that had mostly middle-class and wealthy people in it, except for this one guy who my roommate and I were friends with, who was pretty low-income and was living in a shelter. He would show up really consistently and he would always be super helpful with helping set up and tear down, and was a kind of integral part of the Sunday mornings. He was, I don't know what he was involved in more broadly in the church, but he was always around and he needed help because he was poor, but he didn't just need help one time.  Like he, I think a lot of times when we run these Deacons' Funds or whatever, we expect to help somebody one time with a rent check they can't pay or whatever. But he had ongoing needs because he was not a middle-class person. That's just how it is. And the people who ran the Deacons' Fund just didn't understand this. Like did not know how to deal with somebody who kept coming back and asking for the church to meet his needs over and over again. And they couldn't deal with just dismissing him I think, as irresponsible, or somebody who hadn't taken advantages of the meritocracy of America or whatever it was that they believed.  And they just, they were frustrated with him all the time. He in turn then got frustrated with them. They wouldn't understand sometimes the urgency of some of his needs. They would promise him some money, but they wouldn't give it when they said they would, or somebody who needed to give him a check wasn't at church one Sunday, and I saw him get really frustrated about that. And it just created so much tension, because this was an entire church of people who had never seriously interacted with anyone poor for any long amount of time and didn't know how to handle their needs. I think that is, it was just this really interesting case for me of somebody making that reality so plain, just by continuing to show up in a place where I think a lot of people thought he didn't belong. Suzie Lahoud: Gosh. Yeah. Sorry, as you're sharing that story Sy, I just can imagine what maybe some of those conversations looked like. And it just reminds me of even doing relief work in Lebanon, something that comes up a lot is this idea of dependency, and you don't want people to become dependent. And that just makes me so angry [laughs], because I feel like it shows such a fundamental lack of understanding for the fact that… I mean one, as human beings, none of us is completely independent. Even as a middle-class person, you are dependent on someone, and if you're not dependent on someone, you're dependent on systems that you take for granted that prop you up.  And I think just the lack of compassion and just basic understanding for folks who do have ongoing needs, and that doesn't mean that they're taking advantage of your generosity. That doesn't mean that they're lazy and not doing the work. Sy, I feel like that maybe provided a segue to a point that I just want to make sure it gets hammered home which is, can we also just throw out this heretical lie that people suffer financially, chronically because they're lazy. Because they don't work hard and are therefore less righteous. Like that is such a lie. In fact, I feel like the people I know who are the most hardworking, who deal with levels of stress and exhaustion unlike anything I've seen any of my middle-class or upper-middle-class friends struggle with, those are people who come from low-income backgrounds.  Sy Hoekstra: Yeah, absolutely. Suzie Lahoud: You don't even understand the levels of like working multiple jobs and not having a car. Having to take care of your kids and work at the same time. Like all of these struggles that people face, and then we call them lazy? In the church? That just, that's outrageous to me. So all that to say, and I think it goes back to this point that I think you brought up earlier Gabrielle, but I know it's something that we also wanted to bring up in this conversation, which is, and I think I was touching on this a little bit earlier as well, representation in your church leadership of folks from low-income backgrounds and different cultural backgrounds.  Because I think socioeconomic cultures are real, so class cultures are real, but then also different cultural backgrounds of, Gabrielle, you mentioned coming from a Haitian family. And then with my husband's Lebanese family, we talked before about how I've struggled with finding good marriage books. Because yes, money is a part of marriage, and the expectations around where your money goes, it's not going to always follow these WASPy models and norms that you were just touching on Sy. So all that to say, you need to have folks represented in your leadership from these different backgrounds who understand those dynamics so you don't fall into the pitfalls that Sy, you were just alluding to.  Because you need to admit the limits of your own understanding if you don't come from that background. If you've never had those struggles before you probably are going to miss it, and that's going to do damage and do harm. So the best thing you can do is have people on your staff who do understand that. I think that also gets to some of the favoritism you were touching on Sy, that obviously the book of James talks about. Where a lot of times I feel like elders are appointed also based on how much money they can give to the church. I feel like I've seen this happen in a lot of churches, that you are seen as a “pillar in the church,” and not just because of your moral disposition or the model that you are of faith, but also I think sometimes based on the size of a check you can write to support the church budget. Sy Hoekstra: You're a financial pillar. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah, exactly.  Sy Hoekstra: You're a giant stack of money pillar [laughter]. Suzie Lahoud: And I'm sorry, that is favoritism. That is favoritism. Just because you can write a bigger check, God bless you for doing that. God bless you for investing your money in the church, but that doesn't always mean that you should have the biggest say in where the money from that check goes. And you need to be okay with that as the giver and the church needs to be okay with that and to understand that. Sorry, go ahead Sy.  Sy Hoekstra: No, I was just going to say, I think that implies that people who do have a lot of money and are giving a lot of money to the church, because the default culture is to sort of honor you, it's kind of on you to say, to understand that you're wielding a lot of power and to not use it on your own behalf. It is up to you to then leverage, like we were talking about with Dominique DuBois Gilliard, talking about leveraging privilege. That's something that you should be doing on behalf of other people, and it's not something you should be doing for yourself. You should be making that clear to the staff, I do not want you kind of bending to my whims because I'm somebody who pays your salary and your rent and whatever.  On that track, can we talk a little bit before we end, about how churches can do better in this area? We've given some examples, but any more final thoughts?  Gabrielle Apollon: I do have one thing just to say about something Suzie mentioned earlier. Which you mentioned the systems of injustice and inequality that have affected how much people have. It's amazing to me, I don't know how many years I've been in church now. I think, well, yeah, I basically grew up in the church, but this recent sermon series about money that Renaissance did, I think was the first time that in a series about money, I ever heard a pastor say, yes, the realities of inequality and injustice and racism actually do impact who has the money and who doesn't. I was like, huh, it's amazing that this is the first time I've ever heard that. And that was not hard to do. It's just acknowledging these realities and making things more plain, I think in speaking truth to the situation. As opposed to being like, okay, what do I need to say just to make sure everyone is more generous and not thinking about people's very stark experiences with whether it's discrimination or racism or inequality that really matter and that really have impacts on people's lives. So yes, we should go to examples of things that are good, but that one I was just encouraged by was like, oh yes, you can do this. This is not hard to actually just make plain to people.  Sy Hoekstra: Well, I mean, that is one example. That's great.  Suzie Lahoud: Yeah. I mean, I think I should go back and say too because I, by the way, Gabrielle, I love that you always come with the positive examples. I think that's so good and so beautiful and so helpful. Because I feel like I tend to hammer home like the critique and the negative examples [laughs].  Gabrielle Apollon: They're both real. Suzie Lahoud: No, but I just think that's so beautiful. So thank you for bringing that piece consistently. I should say, going back to the example of churches in Lebanon, I learned so much from watching Lebanese churches grapple with the struggles of trying to incorporate a population that comes from a different socioeconomic background, a different cultural background, coming from traumatic experiences of war, that also I should say, a lot of Lebanese folks could also relate to from their own past. But watching that struggle, I learned so much and I think there is beauty in the struggle. I think one of the things I want to get across is, it's worth diving into the messiness of this. Sy Hoekstra: Because it will be messy. Suzie Lahoud: Yeah, it will get messy. And I think that's also one, that needs to be one of the things that you're willing to do, is to allow it to get messy. To allow it to loosen your grip on quote-unquote “church order,” that really is just WASPy norms that we've wrapped the church in. Even around, again as you were saying Sy, like how we manage our finances as a church, all these things, you need to allow it to get messy, and you need to… Okay, I hesitate to say this because I don't want people to hear this the wrong way. But you will make mistakes and you need to be okay with that, and you need to know how to learn from your mistakes in a healthy way. Sy Hoekstra: Which doesn't mean ignore the ramifications of your mistakes or don't go back and apologize and fix things. Yeah. Gabrielle Apollon: Right. Suzie Lahoud: Exactly. Yes. Because what I don't want to do is justify the harm that churches cause, but I think, and I say this because our church and churches that we partnered with made mistakes. And a lot of it came from not understanding people's situations. Even basic things like having meals together as a church and people coming and hoarding food, and all of a sudden it becomes like a free-for-all. Having close to riots breaking out at one of our first distributions of trying to provide assistance to people, people that we also wanted to feel free to come and be a part of the church.  There were just different dynamics and we made mistakes and had to learn, but at the same time, we got to have fellowship with folks that we wouldn't have had fellowship with otherwise. One thing that I really loved that we were able to do, was do just Bible studies in our homes. And the way we did it was, some of you all may be familiar with the Discovery Bible Study method, but basically you're not allowed to use any previous knowledge or understanding of the Bible. You just look at the passage and you ask three basic questions: What does this passage teach us about God? What does it teach us about man? And what is something that we can apply to our lives from this passage?  And it was so beautiful because when I said earlier I feel like folks who have experienced want and need, that they have a deeper understanding of the teachings of Christ and the gospel than oftentimes I do, I really mean that, and I've seen that. So it was so powerful, just not having a Bible study where it's like one person from the church is leading these other people from different… It was everyone sharing from what they gleaned from the scripture, and also just put things in perspective. Like one of you talked about this point of things that I look at in my life as struggle and sacrifice, pale in comparison to what other folks are struggling with. But also the fact that they were willing to share their struggles with me meant so much to me.  And so just, there's so much richness that happens and so much faith stretching that happens. I don't know, so yeah, there is beauty in the struggle and the messiness. And also we as, I will say for myself, I know that I have so much to learn from people who have walks of life that look very different from my own. And I want the church to be purged of these ugly expressions of classism that have become so inculcated, as you were saying Gabrielle. Sy Hoekstra: The thing that I was going to talk about was also like proximity and humility. Those are kind of some of the main points for me. Then like the messiness that you were talking about that you're going to have to work through is just another one of the million applications of why, as we've talked about on this podcast before, emotional health is so important in a church context. And why not being someone who is easily overwhelmed by conditions that you're not used to, or someone who knows how to deal with those feelings of being overwhelmed and uncomfortable in a healthy way is just crucial to this work. Gabrielle Apollon: Suzie, I really appreciate you going back to this, I think, truism of people who have been affected in this way and are directly affected whether it's by poverty or whatnot, have so much to teach us. I just remember that growing up, the people who watched out for us the most in our church and watched out, and dropped stuff off even when we didn't ask for it, were people who knew what the struggle was like. Were often not the people who just like had so much overflow to give, but it was other people who had been poor or were still poor and are like sharing out of what little they had. I think that just really, I think, speaks to that which you said. Like that's where, that's actually what leadership and that's what discipleship — where I learned this is what you do. You give back even if you just have even a little more. Then to be honest, to answer your question Sy, I think sometimes, and this is obviously not just when it comes to class issues, but what I have seen is that sometimes even, it's non-church communities that sometimes do a better job at this than our churches. And not all the time, like there obviously, as Suzie you mentioned, there are some great examples of churches living out like loving our neighbors as ourselves.  But for me, just thinking about even in school, academic environments that I was in, so I'm now like a little jealous because I've seen like a lot more kind of first-generation student groups pop up post me being in college, and I'm like, man, that would have been nice. It would have been really nice to be able to talk to other people about the survivor's guilt that I felt and navigating how much money to send home and how much to keep for myself and… Sy Hoekstra: Sorry, just for clarity. When you say first-generation, you don't mean first-generation immigrant, you mean first-generation college student. Gabrielle Apollon: That's true. Yeah. I mean, both would be great, but yes. Sy Hoekstra: And you happen to be both, but here we're talking about college students, yes. Gabrielle Apollon: Exactly. But, and especially this, and I just want to kind of name some of these things, because I don't think we talk about this stuff enough in our church communities. But I really had the strong pressure, feeling that I had to compartmentalize everything that was going on at home so that I could get my schoolwork done and whatnot. And those are just things that have been really nice to have a community or space to process those things in. And I had a wonderful Christian fellowship. I had amazing people, I went to a church, but there wasn't, we didn't talk about that kind of stuff at the end of the day.  Or if you did, you were the only one that was bringing that up because most of the people were not having those similar experiences, which is a certain level of vulnerability too. So I didn't necessarily have that in college, but I did do like, in law school, I got a scholarship that was for first-generation grad students. And seeing how they, the type of community and the type of resources that they provided, I think really gave me a glimpse of like, oh, you can actually do this. As I was mentioning, not constraining resources to these very concise, discreet topics. Like you can pay rent for this and whatnot.  And they were like, we know that you guys have needs that don't fit in traditional molds, and like just come to us and we'll see what we can do. And those needs sometimes looked like trying to figure out whose criminal defense fees that I needed to pay or things like that. Things that were going to be the things that stopped me from doing my schoolwork, but weren't necessarily like, oh, you need a laptop or whatnot. Then they made space for community where you could talk about that stuff. And it would be amazing if one, there were enough people from diverse socioeconomic backgrounds and more churches that that space was possible. That community, that people could find that community and be comfortable enough to talk about those kinds of issues within our faith communities. Sy Hoekstra: Yeah. And that program really was great. By the way, shout-out. This is the AnBryce Program at NYU. They're incredible. Gabrielle Apollon: Thank you for giving a real shout-out. Sy Hoekstra: Yeah. But one of the things was you got full tuition from this program, but that doesn't mean that you have money to eat or pay rent. And like they were serious when they told you to come to them with other needs that you had because you went there and they helped you find a truly incredible loan to pay for those things. I don't know, it's just putting in that kind of work and making, leaving the door that open for people to come is super important. The other people, Suzie, I think we should shout-out who are doing this well for the church, is Sub:Culture Incorporated, which is — the author of our next book, Tamice Spencer, it's her organization, she and Robert Monson.  She, Tamice's story is kind of that she was a campus minister for a long time and the only thing that she was ever allowed to raise money for students, was for them to go to a retreat or something. And she's like, “but all the Black students that I have, they need money because their car broke down” or whatever, and that wasn't something that the campus ministry wanted to pay for. So she started her own ministry where they do pay for that stuff, and that's incredible. Gabrielle Apollon: Truly incredible, but also not something you can't do. Suzie Lahoud: These things are not hard [laughs]. Sy Hoekstra: Yeah. Immediate action step for listeners. Go donate money to Sub:Culture Incorporated [laughs].  Suzie Lahoud: As you were speaking, Gabrielle, it also made me think just as a small side note, one, yes, absolutely, check out Sub:Culture Incorporated and the work that they're doing, and the resources that they have around this. But also as a church, maybe recognize that sometimes the best resources, because I know I shared, I gave a sneak peek into some of the mistakes and things that my husband and I have learned over the years, but also not to, I also don't want to bless ignorance [laughs]. So do the work in the sense of go do research and read helpful resources and recognize that unfortunately, sometimes the best resources will not be explicitly Christian resources.  So they may not be books that are written for churches trying to do this, but they may just be resources on this period. I think that churches would be better resourced if they would look into those things. So, yeah, again, Sub:Culture Incorporated is amazing because they are doing this through a Christ-like lens. But also just try to just find the best of what's out there on supporting folks from these backgrounds and creating communities that address socioeconomic injustice and are aware of the challenges and the disparities and all that. Sy Hoekstra: Gabrielle, did you have any thoughts before we finish?  Gabrielle Apollon: I mean, I do think, I just want to kind of reiterate maybe the need for our pastors and our leaders to help disciple people out of this classism that is so, it permeates everything we do. I can't think of a subject or an issue that doesn't have a class component, but we're not usually talking about this. And as Suzie mentioned though, that takes them, discipling them, like getting discipleship themselves so that they're not, leaders aren't saying ignorant things that make the situation worse, which is definitely a risk also when people bring up these types of issues. But I think that that's critical, because again, yeah, this is the air we breathe. This will be what seeps into every aspect of our church communities, unless we're fighting this stuff. It's the whole, what are you discipled in six days out of the week and then you only have a day to try to maybe undo that stuff? Like you actually need to talk about this stuff. It's not just everybody, as you mentioned Sy, that everybody is the same or, because we know that inherently, but our culture is discipling us. Or we know that in our faith, I should say, but our culture is discipling us very differently the rest of the week. Sy Hoekstra: Yeah. I think you will not be able to get away from being discipled that way if you take seriously the real unfiltered words of Jesus. Meaning unfiltered through all this stuff that you've heard about what Jesus thinks about money. In the Sermon on the Mount in Luke, Jesus straight up says give to those who beg of you. There's no qualification whatsoever. How many times have you heard Christians try and qualify why they shouldn't give money to that person on the street? You know what I mean? There's just stuff like that where if you really take Jesus' words seriously, you're going to start to change. It just takes a lot because you're going to have to be really different unfortunately, than a lot of the Christians around you.  Suzie Lahoud: So yeah, I'll just say this because I know Gabrielle, you're also from a somewhat Pentecostal background. But when you start to take Jesus' words seriously and directly and unfiltered, you will also see miracles happen. I really believe that God provides in miraculous ways. When churches step up to the plate and dive into the messiness and hit up against their own limitations, and then you see God provide in incredible, miraculous ways. That's another blessing that you receive. You're so right Gabrielle, that this is integral to the mission of the church, and there is so much more that we need to dig into, not just as a side topic or side ministry. This can really, I think, transform churches when they're willing to dive into this and experience the fullness of all that Christ has to offer on this.  Gabrielle Apollon: I know we are, Sy wants to cut us off. And I'm only a guest and so I shouldn't take over, but I promised Sy I needed to make a joke about nepotism since this is my second time on here [laughter]. As your wife, I feel like I'm just going to take the liberties and say, Suzie, I would love, because I feel like you have direct experiences about that particular point you made, and I think it's worthwhile if you don't mind, like sharing an example. Because I think when people haven't seen that happen, they're like, “Yeah okay, maybe. I don't really know what that means.” So if you do have an example, and Sy won't literally turn off the recording, then I'd love to hear it. Sy Hoekstra: You're making me sound like a real authoritarian host right now. I'm perfectly fine with this question.  [laughter] Suzie Lahoud: Oh man. Yeah. Just, well, like I shared, so for I guess two years, we had this weekly Bible study that would meet in our home and it was my husband and I and this community of folks that they had fled to Lebanon from Syria and were interested in getting involved in the life of our church. We were really careful to try to not provide assistance with strings attached, not make folks feel like they had to be involved in the church if they were receiving assistance, but there was a community that really wanted to, they said they wanted to study the Bible with us. So that's what we were doing. And there would be weekly prayer requests, and there were regularly things that came up. But what stand out to me are examples of, honestly just like physical healings when folks couldn't pay for medical care and when hospitals were overloaded. So like a guy who had completely thrown out his back at work doing construction work. I remember we laid hands on this one guy who had damaged his back and he came back the next week and he was fine. There were different cases like that.  Yeah, so just, and then there was one that I shared in the article in our book, that's probably still the one that most powerfully stands out to me, which was a young girl who had a brain tumor and we laid hands on her and prayed for her. And I have to say with like, from my end very little faith, that God could heal her, and he did. This is a family that the UN didn't have money to provide assistance. There's no way the family could have covered the medical bills because there were other cases where we would have to sit down with families and be like, “You can't afford this chemo, and that's not your fault.” So, but in this case, God healed this baby girl. So yeah, I mean, and again, it's that the messiness and the hardness of it, because you also lose people and you also see people go through difficult things, but God is real in the midst of all that. I'm sorry, I didn't have one specific example to share [laughs]. Gabrielle Apollon: No, no, no. Those are, you had lots of examples. Right. I think that it just comes to mind obviously like different scales sometimes. But for me, I just distinctly remember there were days, I mean, one, there was, my mom literally would get up like three hours before I had to go to school and start praying that somebody would be able to take me to school that day and reach out to however many people to try to get someone. And the Lord would really provide in that way.  But I remember, and I was, I actually had recently come to faith in a real way, but we would have to pray for my, we'd have to like drop my brother off to see his dad and there was no, like we didn't have a ride to do that, and my mom would get in trouble with the courts if it didn't happen. So we were just praying that miraculously, somebody would be willing and available to do it and it would happen. But it would happen often in the nick of time, but it would be people from church oftentimes who's like, “Oh, you were just on my mind and I called and checked to see if there's anything you needed.” And things like that, that I was like, well, the Lord is somehow making this work because I don't have any other reasons to identify as this happening week in and week out. But yeah, seeing communities and people of God stand up and do things is such a testament to the Lord's work, for sure.  Sy Hoekstra: I think that is as good a place as any to end, on that positive note. Gabrielle Apollon: I'll allow it.  Sy Hoekstra: You'll allow me to finish? Gabrielle Apollon: Your own podcast. [laughter] Sy Hoekstra: Thank you, Gabrielle.  Suzie Lahoud: I like having Gabrielle on. I think we should do this more often [laughter]. Sy Hoekstra: I mostly do also. Thank you. No, I'm kidding [laughter]. So thank you so much Gabrielle for being on and joining us today. We really appreciate it. Gabrielle Apollon: Thank you guys. Sy Hoekstra: Thank you all so much for listening. Just as a reminder, please do follow us on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter @KTFPress. Follow this podcast on your app. Subscribe, follow, whatever the button says in your particular player. Leave us a rating and review, and thank you so much again for being subscribers and listening to this bonus episode. We will have, by the way, information on season two coming soon. So stay tuned for that. You will not have to wait another month. And this may actually be the last monthly bonus episode for awhile because we might start, I think we probably will start that up next month, but we will have more definitive information on that coming soon. Our theme song is “Citizens” by Jon Guerra. Our podcast art is by Jacqueline Tam and we will see you all very soon.  [The song “Citizens” by Jon Guerra fades in. Lyrics: “And that you're building a city/ Where we arrive as immigrants/ And you call us citizens/ And you welcome us as children home/ Where we arrive as immigrants/ And you call us citizens/ And you welcome us as children home.” The song fades out.] Sy Hoekstra: I think for me… [siren noises in the background] Oh, there's a siren coming. Suzie, do you want to talk?  Suzie Lahoud: Oh sure. By the way, I have some church bells going in the distance that, you all aren't picking up on that? Okay. Sy Hoekstra: Nope. Suzie Lahoud: It would be nice except that I'm on a podcast.  This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.ktfpress.com

Serena is back and less medicated than ever to revive Let Me Ruin Your Life! She explains why she will be in attendance at Bitcoin Miami, illustrates her adoration for Julia Fox, and recaps Caroline Calloway's going-away dinner parties. Advice includes finding love in a hopeless place (dating apps), breaking the news to your WASPy lover that you go to a state school, and dealing with a friend spreading rumors about you all around town! You can find Serena on TikTok, Instagram, and Twitter at @glamdemon2004, and you can follow the podcast Instagram at @letmeruinyourlifepod. DM for questions and requests or send them along to letmeruinyourlifepod@gmail.com! XOXO --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/let-me-ruin-your-life/support

New episode of the podcast. I'm back with fan-favorite Rebekah Panepinto. We cover: Scientology why I'm intimidated by Waspy people naked skydiving skiing Dominique Strauss-Kahn The Tinder Swindler Creating a cult Britney Spears IQ testing Ukraine Much more --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/theleeshow/support

In this episode we get amongst a few cracking tunes, cover wasp bites, more camp drama, a bit of news and sport and the carry on call line has produced some quality content, enjoy.Get 20% OFF @manscaped + Free Shipping with promo code ALPHABLOKES at MANSCAPED.com! #ad #manscapedpod

Michelle Pfeiffer and Harrison Ford are an affluent WASPy couple experiencing empty nest syndrome and… a haunting? Join Pace and special guest co-host Allyson Waldon as we talk about the 2000 film What Lies Beneath as we take a deep dive into memory and revenge beyond the grave. Also, what's with all the beige clothing? Find out all of this and more in this episode of Horror Nerds at Church! Content warnings: sanist language and discussion of domestic violence relating to the film Books mentioned: -The Witches of Eastwick by John Updike -The Yellow Wallpaper by Charlotte Perkins Gilman Support us on Patreon! Buy some merch! Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter for all the latest updates about upcoming films, news, and other announcements. And don't forget to comment, rate, and subscribe to us on your favorite podcast provider!

Caitlin has soared to TikTok fame with her comedy videos making fun of all the people you hate AKA fitness influencers, WASPY moms, the girl who bullied you in high school, the coworker you hate on zoom, and even the precocious child in a British rom com because kids can be assholes too. She cracks me up and we learn a lot more about what makes her "tik" on this episode in hell. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/berninginhell/support

James and Jon tuck in and take a bite out of the hot potato that is Covid Passports.   What are they?  How do we feel about it?  How do we think it is going to impact our Industry and are they here to stay?    As you have come to expect, the boys have an opinion and also how all of this could impact on their own businesses.  Further toppings were added with the appearance of a very large Mr Waspy,  who brought a small amount of excitement into the mix.As always, the SurveYOUR podcast is a joy to produce, and this episode is a brilliant opportunity for James and Jon to do what they do best… have a jolly good chat! Please leave us your comments and don't forget to subscribe.    Enjoy    Links  www.survpod.com  www.twitter.com/survpod  www.instagram.com/survpod

Kevin & Chris kick off Girls with Ghost Month with the supernatural domestic-thriller, What Lies Beneath (2000). The 'mos talk Michelle Pfeiffer & Harrison Ford's marital distress, Hitchock homages galore, empty nest syndrome and WASPy dinner parties, an Ouija Board-induced séance (with wine), red herring jewelry, an iconic bathtub sequence and more. Bonus topics include favorite after-they-were-famous horror performances, millennium era horror trends, and hints about the rest of this month's spooky film line-up. Connect with us on Patreon and social media for updates! Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/homosonhauntedhill Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/homosonhauntedhill Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/hohhpodcast Twitter: https://twitter.com/hohhpodcast

This expletive filled episode  features Australian love, high flying heroines, and a sex doll turned children's toy! First, Emily tells the story of Hazel Ying Lee, a daring pilot who became the first Asian American Woman to fly for the U.S. Army (even if they wouldn't acknowledge her veteran status and that of thousands of other women.) Then, Kelley shares the origin story of childhood favorite, Barbie and Ruth Handler who invented her! Place your seats in the upright position and get ready for some mommy words, because we're wining about herstory!Support the show (https://www.patreon.com/winingaboutherstory/overview)

Welcome to the WASPy 90s nightmare world of Swans Crossing.

Canned tamales and the mysteries of Reese Witherspoon (ham parties?) with journalist and cookbook author Paula Forbes. And hey: just how WASPy are community cookbooks? You can listen to Smart Mouth on iTunes, on Stitcher, on Spotify. Check out all our episodes so far here. If you like, pledge a buck or two on Patreon. This episode brought to you by Wünder, makers of European-style quark. Go to Wünder Creamery and enter code SMARTMOUTH for 15% off on your first order. Smart Mouth newsletter Smart Mouth merch  Paula Twitter  Stained Page News  Smart Mouth IG Katherine Twitter Related Episodes: Pimento Cheese with Andrew Knowlton  Christmas Cookies with Kim-Joy  Links: Whiskey in a Teacup  White Gloves and Party Manners  Ask a Clean Person  Vietnamese Home Cooking  Emily Nunn's Spice Cake  H-E-B Cookbook  Sources: NPR  Gutenberg Project  What America Ate  The Church Ladies Divine Desserts  Favorite Recipes of Home Economics Teachers: Casseroles, Including Breads  The Gasparilla Cookbook  Oxford Research Encyclopedia of Anthropology  Community Foundation of Middle Tennessee 

Speaker 1: From his first job flipping burgers at McDonald’s and delivering The Washington Post, Craig Willett counts only one and a half years of his adult life working for someone else. Welcome to The Biz Sherpa podcast with your host, Craig Willett. Founder of several multimillion-dollar businesses and trusted advisor to other business owners, he’s giving back to help business owners and aspiring entrepreneurs achieve fulfillment, enhance their lives, and create enduring wealth. The Biz Sherpa. Craig Willett: This is Craig Willett, The Biz Sherpa. Welcome to today’s episode. I’m excited for today’s episode because I think we’re going to learn from a different perspective. I have a special guest today and he’s going to help us understand accidental success. He’s trained in Chinese medicine and acupuncture, Robert Koagedal—a good friend. Welcome Robert. Robert Koagedal: Hi, thanks Craig, thanks for having me. Craig Willett: Glad to have you today. I’m excited to hear a little bit of your story. Maybe you can tell us a little bit, your training and your background, and then how you ended up in Scottsdale, Arizona with a Chinese medicine and acupuncture practice. Robert Koagedal: Training and background, pretty straightforward; went to school for Chinese medicine in 1995, so I’ve been doing it half my life, went straight from college into graduate school. That part of it led me into all of the things that I do now at my office, practicing acupuncture, all the various therapies associated with Chinese medicine. Craig Willett: Great, and if you had a specialty in acupuncture—I know you do some treatment of some people who are in stage IV cancer—but you also have some other specialties? Robert Koagedal: Yeah, so, well, maybe I can jump a little bit to before all of that came to be, as far as my specialty goes. I jokingly answer that question with, I started my career actually working for the mafia. And this is maybe a little unusual, and I say it tongue in cheek, but after I finished school, there’s not a lot of gigs waiting for you as an acupuncturist. If this is anything for your audience to maybe take home, and when we use the term accidental success—which actually, I like that a lot—this is an antidote to what we would call the business structure. I’m not a business major, I didn’t learn anything about business. I’m a philosopher by training, that’s what my bachelor’s degree is in. So Chinese medicine fell into my lap for a variety of other longer stories, following a bachelor’s degree— Craig Willett: You mean you didn’t intend for that to happen? Robert Koagedal: Yeah, all of this on some level is not based on some genius that I have for structuring a business with the vision of how you’re going to make a lot of money and building into that. This was really taking the way that the waves of life would come at you, and being able to adapt to all the different ups and downs that came. And to the degree that you want to go down those ups and downs and all the fun I’ve had, I’m happy to share those stories too. Craig Willett: Well, I’m excited, and I think that’s of great value to a lot of people because I think we have a philosophy that you come up with a business plan, and you take that business plan to a banker, and the banker blesses it—or an investment group—and they invest in a business to help you start up, and that you’re going to follow this well planned out method. My experience as a CPA, as I’ve talked to a lot of clients, that’s not how it always has worked out. People have an idea. So you’ve got your education and training, and what led you— Robert Koagedal: I did have an idea, so there was an idea there. Then remember—and if I had known this information when I actually went to school for Chinese medicine, I probably would not be sitting here—but at the time of my graduation in 1998, ’99, 5% of acupuncturists went on to have a successful business. Craig Willett: Wow, only 5%? Robert Koagedal: And I didn’t know that at the time, only 5%. So, you can imagine— Craig Willett: Well, they don’t tell you that or you wouldn’t— Robert Koagedal: They do not inform you of that when you call the school and you’re like, “Hey, I’m interested in this acupuncture gig, and it sounds really interesting, there’s a lot of things that are really meaningful, I think this is very interesting.” But they don’t advertise that portion of it, so— Craig Willett: So how did you find your way though? When you did learn that 5%—I mean, it’s quite a statement that you’re— Robert Koagedal: Well, I learned that afterwards, and not knowing something is sometimes better than knowing something. And maybe that’s part of this story is from that—there’s not like there’s a job waiting for you. When you finish school, you hope you hang your shingle, you hope that people actually enjoy your services, they appreciate what you do, they get better and they come back. I mean, that’s a pretty basic business model on that front, but most people, when you go in and you take out loans and you have a nice chunk of change you’re going to be paying back, you’ve got to make some money. But the only place you could get a gig back in 1999 was in New York, and that’s why I jokingly—and not so much—say I got a job working at a pain clinic, basically, in the Bronx in New York City. Packed Mary up—we had kind of befuddled around, and lingered, and didn’t know what to do—and ended up in New York City where I was seeing 50 patients a day. I mean, it was a total factory, but I got it straight out of school, I was getting— Craig Willett: A lot of experience. Robert Koagedal: I was getting $50 an hour and a lot of experience, and one day when the FBI showed up, I said, “See you later.” And that was the end of that. Craig Willett: Let’s hear about that, the FBI, yeah. Robert Koagedal: So that was a little intimidating at that point, but long story short, I went into—and that was one of the next best moves that happened to me, which gets me back to where we got into the specialty, which is that I mostly do—primarily for the last 18, 19 years—I’ve done reproductive health. I’ve seen really thousands of people, and couples looking to start or grow their families, and that’s kind of my niche as it’s been here in Scottsdale. Then as you initially started, there is an area of where I see patients who are going through cancer treatment and we do treatments specifically to help them through portions of the treatment that they are getting. Craig Willett: So that’s a pretty scary start to a career—to have these great ambitions to help people, but to see the FBI show up. Robert Koagedal: Well, exactly, and so the funny part of it is as this WASPy kid from California who imagines he’s a do-gooder and he’s going to fix everyone, and you find out that by the time you see this one guy for the third time, but he has a different name, and you go, “Oh, okay, this isn’t right. He’s not really here to heal anyway.” But it was an interesting adventure, nonetheless. Craig Willett: I think all of our experiences help us. Robert Koagedal: Absolutely, yep. Craig Willett: So I have a question—and against this maybe anti-business plan idea—but I can’t help but ask someone from California, what was your approach to marketing when you came to Scottsdale? Robert Koagedal: So, I got here and funny enough, again, not with any kind of business background, with some basic stuff, I happened to meet—and many of this is again, accidental stuff where I met this gentleman who—this is 2002. And I don’t know if everyone had a website then, you know? Craig Willett: Yeah. Robert Koagedal: I don’t know if anyone was walking around with a website, but I met this guy at Starbucks in Fountain Hills when we first finally landed here. And when we got here I ran into this gentleman and he was a really sharp guy, and he was very kind. He built me a website, and we just became friends. He built me a website and that in and of itself kind of started things going, but— Craig Willett: And that was under the name AcuHealth AZ, right? Robert Koagedal: You got it, exactly, because AcuHealth had been taken, so we had to add the AZ onto it even back then. But more to your point then, how I have built my business from a practical standpoint was I knew on some level that physicians were going to be my friends—and physicians who had moved beyond the only way of thinking of how they’ve learned medicine, but had some understanding that wellness was something they wanted their patients to experience, and that drug therapy isn’t the only answer to a number of the things that we have. So, I went out after getting my new office—had you ever been to my old office? Craig Willett: Yes, yeah. Robert Koagedal: Oh, I’ve known you that long? Craig Willett: Yeah, it’s been a long time. Robert Koagedal: Okay, so you remember that one, and I’m sitting there—this is literally the first or second day—I’m sitting there, and I’m like, “Oh, the phone’s not ringing and I don’t have any patients, I have to come up with $7400 a month for this fancy spot, I better get out here and do something.” So I went out and I just started introducing myself. I literally went office to office, I went to chiropractors’ office, physicians’ office, I started going—this is a long time pre-COVID, so you could just walk in and say hello, and do all that kind of stuff. Literally the next day, I had my first patient, which was a referral, and that guy came and he sent me his aunt, and then it literally just started to grow from there. Craig Willett: That’s interesting because I think so often we think there’s some magic formula to marketing, but I think it’s more about awareness, and then you have to be good because you have to deliver on the expectations that are there. Robert Koagedal: Absolutely. Well, I learned from New York, because after I had to leave the criminal organization and actually go start my practice in New York—which I had for two years before 9/11 and we had to hightail it out and decided to come to Scottsdale—I had had the experience of paying for marketing, paying for guys handing out fliers on the street. I had paid for some other advertisement in some magazine. Nothing, zero, nada, and then after I’d paid this guy—I think I paid him cash and he was handing out fliers and stuff—I went into a bar and I was having a beer after that and this guy was sitting next to me, we started talking, he told me about his back and the next thing I know, that guy became a patient. I knew that this was one-on-one, this was, “I know you.” People are not driving around going, “Gee, who am I going to go see?” It’s because they know you, and they know somebody who knows you, and they were referred and, “Oh, I had that problem, and this person helped me.” That’s how all of this got started. Craig Willett: Right, in fact, that’s how I found you, I had some friends in the horse industry and we were around at a dinner party, and I had moved to Arizona from Utah, and I had been being treated in Utah through acupuncture. I asked, “Does anybody know?” And someone who you treated for something other than what my ailment was, but I was a firm believer. But I came across it in a different way, I was in an accident in France, and I ended up injuring my arm and I was treated in the emergency room with acupuncture. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, how about that? Craig Willett: Who would imagine that that would be mainstream? You wouldn’t see that necessarily in the United States. Robert Koagedal: No, you wouldn’t, not yet anyways, but things are continuing to progress. Craig Willett: And I remember as he was treating me, I was asking him how it works, and he’s kind of looking at me— Robert Koagedal: “Well, you know—” Craig Willett: No, he just said, “You’ll never understand, even though you speak some French.” Robert Koagedal: He didn’t say, “You American.”? Craig Willett: No, he didn’t do that, but you know what? I thought maybe I’d broken my arm, they took an X-ray, no, and then he treated me with acupuncture and I noticed later that day, the swelling went down. I could move my hand again, so my arm was fine. Robert Koagedal: So the French through Vietnam became associated and they picked up acupuncture through that area, yeah. Craig Willett: Yeah, and I thought, “Well, if it’s good enough, they have a good healthcare system.” If it’s good enough to use in the emergency room there, I wasn’t as afraid of it here. But once you become aware of the benefits, then it’s a matter of trusting who you go to as well, because if there’s a reason there’s only 5% that succeed, how do you overcome that? There’s got to be a way that you intentionally make sure you educate your clients. Robert Koagedal: And by succeed, I mean support a family, and support a mortgage, and support—Right, not a hobby, not out of the side of your house, not that there’s anything wrong with that, but where it was the professional practice of Chinese medicine applied across all disciplines of health and was something that was respected and people would come to and pay for. Craig Willett: Yeah, speaking of that—paying for—one of the premises of one of my businesses that I had was that you can own for less than rent and that a professional like you, who spent a lot of time and effort getting an education, should have more to show for it at the end of the day than just a good practice that pays you that you can build a retirement by owning your building. I know you own yours, you didn’t buy it from me because I didn’t develop in Scottsdale. Robert Koagedal: I looked at some of yours. Craig Willett: You did?. Robert Koagedal: I looked at a second clinic down there, yep. Craig Willett: But how did you go about that? What went into your mind to even look? Robert Koagedal: Well, at some level, I knew that Scottsdale was home and I was going to stake my claim here, so to speak, and make my business grow, and have my family here, get it going. Once that had been kind of like, “This is the direction.” Then I knew that I had to build in some type of thing that would allow me to build some equity into something so that I had something at the end of 25 years of doing this to show for it. But again, back to the accidental success part of that, that was, again with some chagrin and maybe a bit of embarrassment, I tell these stories because these aren’t things that you want to necessarily do, but they actually happened— Craig Willett: Well, you may not admit to them either, but the nice thing is they happened, they happen to all of us. Robert Koagedal: They did, and at one point, someone had came to work on my credit card machine, and then somehow, the neighbor, for three months, got all my American Express money, and I was so not cognizant of my ins and outs in this— Craig Willett: You weren’t missing those deposits, apparently. Robert Koagedal: I was, but it was more like I was so focused on other things that those went by the wayside, but there was a point where I went, “What the heck happened here?” And because probably, I’m not the greatest saver and the greatest “how to use structure and do all these things the right way,” that was almost put in a bank account for me, I had no way to— Craig Willett: The forced savings. Robert Koagedal: The forced savings so to speak, and literally, that became the deposit I was able to get an SBA loan for in 2008. Well, one thing, I had a client who like you, was a CPA and a very successful man, and he had come in and six months before the crash in 2008, he told me what was going to happen. He worked in the building industry and knew Pulte Homes, and on the board of all these things, and he’s like, “Robert, I like you, you’re a good guy, I like what you do, but you have a cash business and when the shit hits the fan, you better get yourself ready.” And I was like, “What?” Craig Willett: “What do you mean?” Robert Koagedal: Yeah, and he says, “Basically, in January, this is what’s going to happen.” And for all the reasons we now know that the stuff happened, and so I just wanted to build in something that secured something, and in 2008, I found a property that was the perfect location, perfect size, and I was able to get into that, so it’s been real fortunate. Craig Willett: I think it’s one of those things that you build a retirement because you can’t necessarily plan on selling your practice. There are some businesses that are easily sold, but— Robert Koagedal: No, and you’re right on point there because I’ve discovered, acupuncture businesses are not exactly sellable—saleable?—in the way that you imagine some other successful, like medical doctors sell, a lot of money, this doesn’t translate that way. You don’t get out of 20, 25 years, you don’t get what you put into it. So you better have something else planned. Craig Willett: Right, so there’s got to be more than just earning your living and supporting a family, there has to be assets that are growing. Robert Koagedal: Exactly. Yeah, so on some level, I mean, maybe it was even you on some level that got me thinking on those things, and I can’t go directly to my memory bank. Craig Willett: It was subliminal. Robert Koagedal: Subliminal, yeah. Craig Willett: I don’t know, I doubt it, I doubt it, I think you probably had a good mind and I think sometimes we just have instinct, and sometimes our instincts may serve us. We may be embarrassed sometimes with the things we do, but we have to look at what our strengths are and you have to play to your strengths. I think that’s one thing that you mentioned that you do when you market. You have to instill the confidence of your patients in you, and that’s what generates the referrals. Robert Koagedal: Totally, yeah, mm-hmm (affirmative). Craig Willett: So tell me a little bit about the reproductive—I mean, you’ve got doctors referring you, what types of doctors and what have your experiences been? Because there’s a certain balance to life where we can get out of balance, and I look at Chinese medicine, or acupuncture as a balance issue—balancing out energy, balancing out flow. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, well, I think you’re right on that the principles of Chinese medicine are built around, obviously, those polarities of yin and yang, and that translated also to me—which maybe was a part of what I was thinking about—was always thinking about the balance between running a business and having family life. I think that’s a part of your podcast’s theme is on how do you do that? Maybe as an example, a friend of mine who started and runs two very busy clinics in LA, he decided that working on Saturdays was going to be good for business. But when you have kids that want to play baseball on Saturdays, it’s not so easy to take that time off when you’re seeing 30 patients a day and the income that brings to your business. So I on some level said, “I’m going to be here at these hours, and I’m going to structure it.” I’ve found that people respect those areas if they really want to come in, and they’ll find a way to do it. Craig Willett: I found the same thing, especially for me as a CPA during tax season. People want to come in after-hours late into the night, and I always managed that, “No, not on Saturdays or weekends, and only till a certain time in the evening.” Because I wanted to be home, be with the family. Robert Koagedal: Right, those aren’t easy things to do either. I could be open on Saturdays. Craig Willett: No, because you think, “Oh, I can get more people.” Robert Koagedal: Absolutely, yeah. Craig Willett: But the real secret is, you don’t. You don’t necessarily succeed any more by working more hours, you tend to burn out and you tend to have other things. So isn’t that part of the secret, as you help people get their lives back in order and achieve some of their dreams, if they want to have a family and aren’t having success in conceiving children, how are you able to help them? Robert Koagedal: Well, on some level, that is where the rubber meets the road in the decisions that you make. For example, if I come in at noon on Tuesdays and Thursdays, that means that on some level, I’m doing those health and wellness practices for myself that I would suggest to my patients if they’re stressed out, or not sleeping well, or have whatever issues. Being able to build that in has also, I think, helped me a lot in being able to avoid burnout and all those issues that come up with it. But on the side of the reproductive medicine component, that was really on some level, like a lot of these things, found me and maybe I can tie this back to the— Craig Willett: Accident theory? Robert Koagedal: —the accidental part of it, and maybe it’s not so accidental if you want to get more metaphysical but— Craig Willett: There’s the philosopher coming through. Robert Koagedal: The part of it where I had said, “Okay, no more mafia acupuncture clinics for me.” And I was in New York City, I was crossing the street in Union Square, and I just finished a chapter in the Huangdi Neijing, which is the Yellow Emperor’s Classic of Internal Medicine, it’s the oldest medical book in the world. In the chapter I had just finished was an outline of the conversation between his chief physician, the Yellow Emperor’s physician, Qibo, and the Yellow Emperor, and in that conversation, they outline the seven-year life cycle transformation. So, women go through seven-year hormonal life cycle transformations. 7, 14—14, the dew of heaven arises—21, the wisdom come in, 28’s the height of your—So I’m standing in Union Square, I had just finished this chapter on seven-year life cycles and I’m standing there, this bus pulls right up in front of me and I read the sign on the side and the Public Health Department had done a public health announcement that says, “Past 35, a woman’s fertility drops by 50%.” And I’m like, “35? 7, 14, 21, 28, 35.” Well, that’s statistically the mean average when endogenous sex hormones begin to drop, and we think of in this culture as 35 is reasonably young, but biologically speaking in terms of your reproduction, they are no longer at the same level as they were even a few years earlier. So there are these tipping points—and the Chinese observed this 3,000 years ago—and so I was there having just finished that chapter, and then I’m looking at that, and then as all this comes to be as per your—I met a guy not long ago— Craig Willett: How many times has this happened to you? Robert Koagedal: This has happened a few times. Craig Willett: Okay, one was in a bar, one was in Starbucks, and— Robert Koagedal: Yep, exactly, one was in Starbucks—well, I mean, yeah, so how do we account for these things, right? Craig Willett: Right. Robert Koagedal: If you’re planning everything, you know? Craig Willett: Right. Robert Koagedal: That guy started probably—I think he even says it on his website, “I have been doing it for 24 years specializing in reproductive medicine.” I met that guy who started a practice specializing in reproductive medicine. Craig Willett: In New York? Robert Koagedal: In New York, and at that same time, that same weekend, there was a woman. Her name’s Dr. Angela Wu, she runs probably the busiest acupuncture clinics on the West Coast for reproductive medicine. I went and took her class and I’m not kidding you, it wasn’t six months later, a study came out on the use of acupuncture in reproductive medicine where then my phone was ringing off the hook. That’s how I got Juicy going in New York, and I had that all kind of going, and Mary and I were even looking at staying there and getting a house somewhere, or going to Brooklyn or whatever. Then 9/11 happened, and 9/11, after that, we were like, “You know what? I think we need to head back, we’re not East Coast folks.” That wasn’t our place— Craig Willett: Right, you’re from California, it’s a whole different lifestyle. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, it’s a different lifestyle, different everything, and we had a great time in New York, but then we were looking for the place, “Where is the Shangri-La of starting a family, building a business?” And I went back to North Carolina, we did a car trip from San Diego to Vancouver, we looked at Oregon, we really looked, we knocked. And we’re sitting at my family’s home in Lake Tahoe, and a website, on realtor.com, and I saw a house and I was like, this is after looking at pieces of junk in the Bay Area that were $700,000, and I was like, “Wow, you get that house for that much?” We drove down the next day, we’ve basically been here ever since. Craig Willett: Wow, that’s amazing. I think what I love about what you’re sharing with us is that really, you can’t plan this stuff, and you have to go with what you know, you have to go with the opportunities that come your way, and I’ve always said this—in fact, I wrote a book, I never published it—“Opportunity Knocks”—and I think you have to look at— Robert Koagedal: I like that title. Craig Willett: You have to be able to look at where those opportunities are coming from and spot them, but you have to be looking and that’s what you did, they hit you on the side of the head— Robert Koagedal: How do you take that, Craig? What is the meaning of that, if we’re not planning, what is it inside of us that intuits, feels, senses, cognizes, and is able to move on and act on that? Craig Willett: It’s a need, right? Robert Koagedal: Yeah. Craig Willett: You were without, you were kicked out of the clinic by the FBI, and you’re trying to figure out, “I’m trying to make it in this world of not very many people succeed in my profession, so how am I going to specialize?” I think you become aware of that, you were reading, you were doing what you always do to advance yourself, and ideas come. Some stand out, and that’s what I believe. I think there’s a certain intuitive nature to us that—we can call it inspiration, and that inspiration comes in many different ways. Why did that chapter stand out to you over—I don’t know how thick that book is—and how did that coincide with meeting the people you met? Robert Koagedal: But I mean, as far as business stuff, how do we listen to that, hear that, and then act on it irrespective of, “I have my plan, here’s the plan.” Craig Willett: Well, the plan gets in the way, I can tell you that. Robert Koagedal: Exactly, and you go left instead of right. Craig Willett: The plan or we live in a world where I think we spell business the same way you could spell busyness, and that is we get so busy, we block that out. I think part of your philosophical background may have led you to that, but I think for our audience if there are those of us who tend to want to check things off on our planner and on our list, but sometimes there’s a benefit to stepping back and being able to observe what’s going on around you, and I think you’ve done that well, which is one of the reasons you’re sitting in the chair you’re sitting in today. Robert Koagedal: Well, yeah, well maybe yeah, that may be an instinct in me, but for your listeners then, yeah, what does that mean for them to step back? What is the stepping back move, psychologically? What does that mean to simply witness, and maybe relax a little, as opposed to trying to put—what is it? A square in a round hole, you know? Craig Willett: Yeah, well, that’s true, but I think part of it is, we have a Biz Sherpa scorecard, and part of it, I try to get people that I consult with to look back and say, “Where am I spending my time, and am I spending time at the things—at least 80% of my time—at the things that make the biggest difference and impact on the lives of my customers or my patients?” If I can do that, then all the other busyness stuff, the other day-to-day really falls by the wayside. I’m able to focus on those things that make the biggest difference and changes in lives because I’m sure your success stories are great motivation to you, more than what you can charge someone for your procedures, it’s got to bring a lot of joy because I’ve been in your office. I see the pictures in the book of the people who got treated by you and now are having families. What’s that feel like to you? Because to answer your question, I’d like you to answer it because I think there’s a satisfaction that comes. Robert Koagedal: Well, there is indeed, and I’d say what your intention is, that is what you want to create—what you’re looking to create, and if that is that on some level, someone who comes in who’s suffering and you are able to provide information that allows them to move forward to move to the highest level of their function, that ties together the key principle within Chinese medicine which when I heard it, I said, “I’m in the right place.” Because it’s a really interesting concept, but the number one thing for—what the practitioner of acupuncture, Chinese medicine is to do is what’s called nourishing destiny. That is if on some level, people don’t feel an alignment with what they are doing in this world, they’ll suffer, they’ll have some type of block, whatever you want to put it. So the highest practice of Chinese medicine is on some level, helping them become aligned with that so that they feel simpatico with something natural inside of them that they want to move forward on. Craig Willett: That’s interesting. So, I think that’s great advice, I think you just gave it right there, we have to step back and feel what’s natural. What are my talents? What are my skills? If I’m not an accountant, why am I trying to do the books in my business? If I’m good at sales, I should be selling, I should be meeting with my customers, not sitting in the back accounting for what came in and what’s going out the door. I think that’s that alignment we all have to find, and I think that takes getting to know what your strengths are. So how do you recommend to business owners, being one, to keep that healthy life balance? Robert Koagedal: Well, a lot of it is you’ve got to play around to see what’s going to work for you, and maybe some people are more ambitious in ways that they do better by going crazy and working it out and doing it, and this is nothing against that, it’s only to the degree that then you’re getting feedback that you’re getting high blood pressure, or you’re not sleeping well and all of those things. Those are pretty clear cut signals that that’s out of balance. Craig Willett: I think I heard at one time from Carol. In addition to my CPA practice and doing real estate development, I was asked to testify in Congress in Washington DC, and was put on a number of boards and Carol said to me, “Our kids are going to grow up really quickly, and they’re not going to know who their dad is.” I think that comment right there made me step back. It caused me to step back and look, “Where am I spending my time? And where does this lead?” It may give me some kudos professionally, but at some point, we have to define our own success, not what the world or other people would define us as. Robert Koagedal: Absolutely, you literally just pulled the quote out of the thing I was thinking about, I have to pull this one out because this is a patient of mine who sent this to me this morning. Craig Willett: Really? Robert Koagedal: I wrote it down just because I was like, “Oh, it was really, really good.” Craig Willett: Oh, I want to hear that then. Robert Koagedal: “The most destructive thing I’ve ever done is believing someone else’s opinion of me.” Craig Willett: Wow, and I think that’s right, we have to know and we have to set our boundaries, and it’s the same thing. How do we define success? You asked the question how do you know if you’re on track, and I think you have to set a number. You had a friend you gave the example of in California, running two clinics and working on nights and weekends. Sometimes I think it’s this matter of saying, “All right, I can control my expenses, and I can, to some degree, control my income, and so I just need to figure out what’s the formula that brings me what I need sufficient for what my needs are and allow me to build a retirement and experience success or happiness.” Robert Koagedal: Where’s the sweet spot? Yep. Craig Willett: Yeah, and I think sometimes, we get clouded because the world would define success as more. Robert Koagedal: Absolutely. Well, again, then you have to, on some level, know what your values are and if you accept the world’s values, that might be not a great idea. Craig Willett: Right because what is more? There’s always somebody who will have more. I always say there’s somebody who’s smarter, somebody who’s brighter, somebody with more money, if you’re measuring against somebody else, there’s always going to be somebody with more than you. I think it’s one of the problems we have in society today, we report earnings and it has to be an increase in sales, are they growing the business? What’s wrong with maintaining the business to some degree? Robert Koagedal: Well, yeah, you’re not going to get hired with that if you’re looking for a corporate job, but— Craig Willett: No, definitely not. Robert Koagedal: But yeah, that would be sanity, yeah, uh-huh (affirmative). Craig Willett: Now, you also mentioned that people need to find the way to take away the destructive, or the blocking in their lives. What role does acupuncture play in helping stress relief and helping find energy? Robert Koagedal: That’s a good question. First, let’s start so that your guests listening don’t think this is any kind of woo-woo way of understanding when we use the term energy, because what do we call a body with no energy? Craig Willett: Dead. Robert Koagedal: It’s called a cadaver, yeah, exactly. So, when you understand biologically that you as an animated living being—what I fancifully called a biodegradable space-time suit—that you have 17 trillion batteries, which we call your mitochondria. It moves through the electricity through the fascial matrix within your body, and acupuncture is a tool—and I think specifically to your question you’re asking about kind of balancing out the nervous system, is that what you’re asking about? Craig Willett: Yeah, yeah. Robert Koagedal: With energy, right? Craig Willett: Energy, yeah, depression, or lack of energy or stress, overload. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, so when you look at this from the point of really physics and evaluate that when we say we have lots of energy, we feel good, we have clear thinking, good appetite, all the different things that we call having energy, those generally translate into quality of health and quality of life. When that starts to become depleted—and especially you could say that one of the places that uncorks how much you can hold a charge in your cells is stress. So the perception of threat on some level, when people walk around with that—either due to a variety of issues, perceived or real, the majority of them are in this case, perceived. They’re kind of structures in the mind in which we perceive and anticipate events that are threatening— Craig Willett: Right, I’m my own worst enemy, I project into the future bad things and so— Robert Koagedal: All the anticipatory fear thinking, and I’d say that’s a habit that on some level is built-in in how we literally train our children, and how we go through the education system. So I think acupuncture then is a fantastic tool that helps do two things. Both as I appreciate and bring to the experience of an acupuncture visit, is really teaching people how to learn how to not follow the habit of anticipatory or fear thinking, and how to learn to have more meditative capacity for surrendering to the unknown and being capable of being in the present moment to the degree that they can really move from there into their life’s experience, as opposed to being in the spinning of their fear thinking. Acupuncture as a physical tool helps facilitate greater communication throughout all systems, but acts on a system called the pregnenolone steal effect, does that sound familiar? Craig Willett: That’s a long statement, help describe that. Robert Koagedal: The conversion of basically adrenaline and cortisol. If you run on adrenaline and cortisol, you systematically shrink blood vessels throughout the entire venous system and obviously, this organ right here requires a lot of oxygen. Now, you do that long enough and you will end up going to see the cardiovascular physician. And so for people who are running on chronic stress, acupuncture acts as a tool to mitigate that so that you actually convert your adrenaline and cortisol to become your endogenous sex hormones. So this is another avenue through which both the stress of infertility affects these things, but overall, quality of life is depleted dramatically when people are in a constant state of anxiety and perceived threat. Craig Willett: I think we all have moments like that in our life, and so it’s being able to identify those moments to either call and get help, or find ways to be able to turn that off and become more present— Robert Koagedal: What’s the point if you have more and you’re stressed out and not sleeping? I mean, so, to be successful then ultimately is finding the mindset that can appreciate the beauty of what’s right in front of you, and if that’s not available to you, I can guarantee you, it’s not going to happen because you have more. Craig Willett: Yeah, so I’m curious as to this whole idea of depletion and being stressed out. If you’re treating patients with stage IV cancer, for instance, what do you learn from them? Because I’m sure they’re going to be spending some time with you, and some of them—you have a good manner about you—I’m sure they start talking about things that are important to them? Robert Koagedal: You bet, yeah. Craig Willett: What are some of the things you’ve learned from some of your patients? Because I admire you, you’re in a key position to hear some really insightful moments. I had a friend that had cancer and he was able to be brutally honest with me about a lot of things in his life, and I learned a lot. It was one of the most educational processes, I became his friend for the year and a half that he had left in his life. Robert Koagedal: Yep. Well, the first thing that you learn is everyone has a story and appreciating that they aren’t cancer in that sense, that they are a living being with a story, and when you behave and respond to them in that moment like that, cancer doesn’t exist. It’s there, obviously, and we’re there to help biologically and help to treat that and do all those things, but when you’re just in conversation with someone and you get to hear their fears or their worries, or concerns, or even get to hear their amazing story of their life, of the things they’ve done in organic farming from people who have been in Vietnam— Craig Willett: Oh really? Robert Koagedal: Oh yeah, just memories pop up and I can tell you of just people who tell me, and you get to be privileged to actually hear their story, and again, with all the hope that I have that what we do is going to be helpful in the context of the treatments they are receiving for them to live healthier, longer, or get the benefit from those things. This isn’t just about them telling me their story, but in that sense, it’s a privilege. And I think I’ve learned to listen more than anything else to just anything that they want to tell me that they find. You get to see some amazing people, and some people that struggle, some people that are afraid or in pain, and all that stuff. Craig Willett: Right, so how do you do that? I mean, I think one of the successes for business owners is building relationships, whether that’s your referral network right at the beginning with your patients or your clients. But how do you establish that rapport? Robert Koagedal: I think the first part of it is listening, and the rapport that someone recognizes that I’m not thinking about something else when I’m about to do acupuncture with them, you know? Craig Willett: That’s interesting, my wife always tells stories about—she can tell whether she’s going to have an interaction with someone or not if they’re reaching out to shake her hand and they’re looking for the next person to talk to. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, “Oh, hi.” Politician style, or whatever it is. Craig Willett: Right. Robert Koagedal: On some level, the only thing we have that’s free as human beings is our attention, and can you place your attention in the moment in a way that you welcome the other person’s presence? And if you can do that, on some level that’s a mutuality, it’s an exchange where people instantly know, “Okay, I’m here.” As opposed to, “I have to be here, I have to do that, I’ve got other things to do.” I’m not saying I don’t get busy and get distracted on occasion, but if you can deliver on that in terms of just—if this is for acupuncture students listening out there—that can be one tool you can use is learn how to not be addicted to your thinking, but just practice being in your body and learning how to use your breath as a way to enter into the present moment so you can just be there. Craig Willett: But I think that’s with anybody in any business. Robert Koagedal: Absolutely, across the board. Craig Willett: Yeah, I think if you sense that someone’s more concerned about what they’re getting out of it, you’re less likely to do business with them. So when you’re genuine and you’re real, they can be genuine and real too, then you understand the need and then you can fulfill that need. Because that’s the basis of exchange. Somebody comes to you when you have a business, whether your business is healthcare or your business is selling suits, if they have a need they come to you to fulfill that need, and if you’re better able to understand that need, you’re going to find something that delivers greater satisfaction to them. Then it doesn’t become about price, it doesn’t become about the transaction, it becomes about the interaction. Robert Koagedal: Sorry, you triggered a memory, now you’ve drawn me back to the Bronx there and it just made me laugh. When I was in the Bronx, this guy would come by, literally, a truck would pull up, in the back this guy would hop off, he’d go, “Suits, we got suits for sale.” This guy would come into the middle of the clinic with the suits and they’re like, “Where’d those come from?”, “They fell off a truck somewhere, we’ve got suits.” I bought one, I bought one. Craig Willett: You bought one, do you still have it. Robert Koagedal: I was Trump for Halloween last night with that suit. Craig Willett: With that suit? Robert Koagedal: Yeah, I was a good 20, 25 pounds heavier back in New York, eating lots of bagels. So yeah, I still have that suit that I bought off the rack of the back of a truck in the Bronx. Craig Willett: That’s pretty funny, I think that’s great. Hey, I’m interested to know because I know you personally and I think this is kind of part of this. What I’ve seen as I’ve interviewed people on this podcast is that a lot of them come back to becoming friends with the people they do business with and their patients, and their clients. While that has its boundaries, you practice something in your personal life and I think it translates to doing that and that is I’ve noticed that you take family vacations, and what role does that play in keeping balance? Robert Koagedal: Oh, well, one, you need to go on vacation, and two, you can’t leave the kids behind to take care of themselves. Craig Willett: “Hey, watch the dog, we’ll be back.” Robert Koagedal: Exactly, “Watch the dog, and try not to get in trouble.” Yeah, I mean, it’s fun, we’ve come up with some good family vacations that we’ve enjoyed over the years, some of them have become traditions, and I’d say planning for those are things I look forward to, the fall break here in Arizona to get out and go to California is one of our favorites because the weather’s so beautiful. So we have a good time finding time to go share some time with the kids and stuff. Craig Willett: I also noticed—I mean, as we’ve visited through the years, as you’ve treated me you’ve talked about golfing with your son, the different sports, basketball, what’s that like? How important is that and what role does that play for you? Robert Koagedal: Craig, I think on some level I don’t fully appreciate that I have it pretty good in terms of when you point these things back out to me I go, “Yeah, that’s pretty good that I can go on a Wednesday if I’m done at 2:00 and we can go play the back nine at the TPC.” Or that those things are available to us, and I hope I don’t take it for granted but those are things that I’ve tried to build in to being able to make that my priority. Craig Willett: I think that’s important because a lot of times, people say, “Hey, I started a business so I can have all this free time.” Robert Koagedal: Well, yeah, exactly and, “I’m going to spend 20 years struggling to get to where I have enough money so I can have the free time.” Craig Willett: Exactly right, but you have to build that in because you can’t— Robert Koagedal: I think so. I think it is kind of—you have to on some level—and again, people sometimes, they can’t leave their office, so I get it, I don’t want to sound like some ignorant acupuncturist. Craig Willett: Right, but maybe there’s some things they can change so they can leave their office. Robert Koagedal: Maybe, and again, I’ve never worked in corporate life so maybe I can’t even comment on how— Craig Willett: No, no, no, this is about entrepreneurship, and so I’m trying to get the people out of corporate life to be able to accidentally succeed. Robert Koagedal: Then to hell with the corporate, if you work at a corporation, get the hell out of there because you ain’t going anywhere, and if you think your money at the end of the golden rainbow is going to save you—no, you’ve got to enjoy it now. If you’re not able to enjoy it now, you’re not going to enjoy it then. Again, building in those things are really reflections of your values, and if you can start to put those into practice—it’s not practice, it’s just life. I want to play golf on 2:00 on a Wednesday with my son. Craig Willett: Right, and look forward to that. Robert Koagedal: Or 3:00 I guess, school ends at 2:35 or something. Craig Willett: Right, but do you see, those things you have to build in and I think that’s part of the balance, and you have to be intentional— Robert Koagedal: I might not have done that when I was starting out. Craig Willett: No, the first two or three years, probably not. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, exactly, and you use your house as a bank account so you can pay your rent. Craig Willett: Right, yeah, there you go. Robert Koagedal: Also, not good business practices. Craig Willett: But I had a guy tell me when I was working for another CPA firm, I went to deliver his tax return to him and when I came out to talk to him—I don’t know why he shared this story—he goes, “I used to be a CPA.” I gave him his tax return and he said, “When I started my practice 30 years ago, 35 years ago,” he said, “I went to get a loan to get a line of credit so that I could make sure I had enough to cover the expenses in the first couple of years. So I gave my pro forma business plan to the banker and the banker a few days later, I stopped in,” and he said, “the banker told me, ‘No, I’m not going to approve your loan.'” And he said, “Do you mind if I ask why?” He goes, ‘Yeah, I don’t see anything budgeted for vacation. I am not going to lend to you if you’re going to burn out.'” Robert Koagedal: That’s pretty good, wow. Craig Willett: Yeah, and so for me, that stuck in my mind, and so I think you’re right, you have to plan for that and you have to allow for that, you allow for it in your pricing, you allow for it in your hours, you allow for it in other ways that can afford you those opportunities, because it does. Business ownership offers great freedom. But you don’t have one boss, you have how many patients? 3,000 patients are all of a sudden your boss, and so you have to be responsive to that. Well, what are some of the things that you do that help you sharpen your focus? Robert Koagedal: Some of the things that help me—well, the last year has not been the greatest with all this stuff going on. Craig Willett: A lot of distraction. Robert Koagedal: A lot of distractions, and a lot of things that again, when this all kind of came about, and I got an email from my brother that, “2.5 million people are going to be dead and you better close your practice, and you can’t see anybody.” When the Oxford epidemiologist came out with all of that, I’m like, “Oh my god, this might be the end of my business.” I mean, I’m a cash business and I’m one-on-one with people, and if that’s not going to be allowable, and if I’m considered to be non-essential,” which I wasn’t, fortunately, “this could put at risk everything I’ve built.” And another point at which— Craig Willett: That’s an awakening moment. Robert Koagedal: Awakening moment, and—I’m sorry, tell me again, what was your question? Craig Willett: Well, I’m just trying to say how do you sharpen your focus? Robert Koagedal: Oh, sharpen your focus. Well, I think sometimes you just double down and work with what was succeeding, but I mean, on some level, there’s luck involved too— Craig Willett: Plus the whole accidental success. Robert Koagedal: I mean, what if I had been deemed non-essential, they close your business, you can’t be open at that point, you put yourself in legal positions, and the fact that I was able to stay open, even though it slowed down—I was probably 60, 70% down—I guess you just go back to maintaining that sense of being hungry and wanting to keep building something and not going to let go of it. So there’s a degree of tenacity I guess in that, and I feel on some level I’m still as hungry as when I jumped into this, maybe even more so, and— Craig Willett: And what is that hunger for? Is that hunger for financial success or is there something more to it? Robert Koagedal: No, again, I think you and I have mentioned this, you can’t put the cart in front of the horse, and if your motivation is that you want to make money, you can only be successful, in my opinion, relative to being interested in what it is you’re doing— Craig Willett: Right, which is making money. Robert Koagedal: —that then leads to that coming in. And in our culture, we teach kids that they need to get a job that allows them to make lots of money even if it’s some crappy job that you’re not suited for and isn’t really something that you enjoy. I don’t know about you, but maybe death is a good teacher, maybe death is a good focuser. Maybe it’s that I remember that this biodegradable space-time suit isn’t going to be here. If you want to be around stage IV cancer patients, they certainly do teach you that. That they were perfectly fine at 46 years old, guy coming in and this is now four months later who had stomach pain, he has three kids, living his life, went into urgent care, they said, “You have cancer everywhere in your body.” He’s already passed, so that’s one way to sharpen your focus. Craig Willett: Yeah, my mother was killed in a car accident at a fairly young age and so, you don’t know when that’s going to come, so I guess that helps sharpen your focus. But I think one thing that you said is it can’t be all in the financial results, there has to be an exchange on a personal level that takes place, that gives you some emotional reward for what you’re doing. I think it’s fair to say in healthcare, maybe that’s more realizable, but I think it’s translatable totally across the board in any business. I think that’s what we should be shooting for, and as we do that, and I think you embody that, I think that’s one of the great strengths to being in business is you get to have that emotional reward for owning that business that made a difference in somebody’s life. Robert Koagedal: It’s a great lesson. Craig Willett: You can do that as an employee too, so I’m not going to totally knock the whole corporate world. Robert Koagedal: You can, you can, and how you’re being of service in ways above and beyond what you do for work, necessarily, but in ways that are in your community and other things too. I have amazing patients that show me things all the time and they do really cool stuff. Craig Willett: Oh, that’s pretty neat. Well, great, well, you can’t come to the Sherpa’s Cave and not leave without having answered one really important question with a follow-up and that is, what is your greatest failure? Robert Koagedal: Greatest failure? Well, I’ve had lots of small failures, but I’d say one that was challenging was after finishing school, I made a concerted effort to try to make it back to California. And part of what was unique in California is you actually had to take a separate test from the national test, which gave you access to practicing basically anywhere in the US. But California had its own licensing exam, and for me to go back to— Craig Willett: Not surprising. Robert Koagedal: Exactly. For me to make it back to California, I had to go take that, and did my thing and studied for it, and went in and failed the first one and missed it by two questions. Craig Willett: Oh, wow, painful. Robert Koagedal: This is after having spent $80,000 and now I have loans coming up and now I’m supposed to be a practicing master acupuncturist and now I’m waiting tables again just trying to make a living, living at my in-law’s house, and really then gearing up to go do it again. I go back again, and I failed it again by two questions, and then at that point, I was like, “I don’t know what I’m going to do here.” Craig Willett: Sometimes there’s divine destiny, but I’m not saying going to work for the mafia is the answer. Robert Koagedal: There you go, so it felt like putting, again, what is it? The square peg into the circle, and banging my head against it where then I had to surrender that that wasn’t maybe in my future in ways that were kind of difficult because my kids haven’t grown up with their grandparents and that sort of thing. So there were definitely sacrifices that came with that, but on some level, that was definitely a struggle for a while until something kind of came on and I saw—this was in the newspapers when people read newspapers, a thing where, “Come work for the mafia at this clinic and we’ll pay you $50 an hour.” “Shut case, I’m out of here.” So yeah, and my best friend had moved there so a lot of things worked out afterwards. Craig Willett: So what did you learn from that? Robert Koagedal: I think on some level—you can take it kind of two ways, there are other ways where sometimes you’ve got to keep banging, sometimes you’ve got to go take it a third time, and sometimes maybe that is part of your—if you felt that and if you were into that, and you go take it a third time until you damn well conquer that thing. Maybe I feel like I still, I just didn’t do it or I gave up, but on some level— Craig Willett: But you can’t second guess that. Robert Koagedal: I can’t second guess that now, but it worked out. But I’m blessed that some of these things that have been failures on the surface turned out to be things that played out for me in ways that I’m grateful for. Craig Willett: There we go. There it is, the true lesson of life, the accidental success. Robert Koagedal: Yeah, absolutely. Craig Willett: Your career, you ended up in an area—I would say Scottsdale’s a great area for what you do. Robert Koagedal: Fantastic, yeah. Craig Willett: And great for family time compared to California, maybe the grandparents might be a little farther away. Robert Koagedal: All our friends there, they generally work two jobs, they both come home at 6:00. It’s one of those things, to build a life here, we’ve been very blessed, Arizona is our home and Scottsdale’s been a real blessing for us too. Craig Willett: That’s great. Well, I love your stories, I think they’re great and I think it’s a great demonstration that if you care about people and you have a passion for what you do, that no matter how many times we may stumble, that we kind of find our way and that there is a destiny for us and we just need to find that. Sometimes, we fight against it, but oftentimes if we go with the flow, the accidents lead to greater success, and I appreciate you being here today, Robert. Thanks for taking the time to come in and be our guest. Robert Koagedal: My pleasure, I really enjoyed it, nice talking to you. Craig Willett: This has been great. This is Craig Willett, The Biz Sherpa, thanks for joining us today. Speaker 1: Be sure to go to our website to access the resources related to this episode at www.BizSherpa.co. If you enjoyed this show, tell your friends about us, and be sure to rate ou podcast. Craig would like to hear from you, so share your thoughts in the Facebook community at Biz Sherpa.co. Follow us on Twitter @BizSherpa_co, and on Instagram @BizSherpa.co.

In this episode, Kaleigh and Christian review two Hallmark-esque Christmas movies and one tear jerker that was actually good. This episode is filled with Christmas princes, angsty country music stars and all the WASPy stereotypes you can think of. CHECK OUT OUR FALL AND WINTER PLAYLIST: Cronchy Leafs, Wool Socks and Birks Find us on Patreon: Bangs and Beard Our Socials: @bangsandbeardpod @kaleighbasso @christian.avery --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Break out your “Schizos and Serial Killers” trading cards, we watched Addams Family Values (1993) with our friend Andy Ur and we’re all Graceful, Delicate Ballerinas!  As Thanksgiving movies go, this is… really the only one we could think of.  This movie is full of more queer subtext than you can shake a stick at.  Joan Cusack as murderous “Black Widow” Debbie Jellinsky is nothing short of iconic.  Anjelica Huston is service face, face, body, face in Morticia drag and Christina Ricci very nearly steals the show as a pre-teen Wednesday revolting against her WASPy fellow campers.  Keep an eye out for cameos by queer or queer-adjacent celebs like Christine Baranski, Nathan Lane, David Hyde Pierce, Cynthia Nixon and Charles Busch. Hey its Thanksgiving Day!  Eat us, we make a nice buffet! Thanks for listening and don't forget to subscribe, rate and review us on iTunes! www.patreon.com/moviesthatmadeusgay Facebook/Instagram: @moviesthatmadeusgay Twitter: @MTMUGPod Scott Youngbauer: Twitter @oscarscott / Instagram @scottyoungballer Peter Lozano: Twitter/Instagram @peterlasagna

Wasp --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/hearsay-c/support

Wasps, sprinting, florida, mosquitos all dealt with. Sound if Joels Starts and his disdain for books. Wind was string so apologies for that.

Bob gets caught in the youtube algorithm while Miles kinda saves the day, in a small but meaningful way. COVID-19 messages at https://coco.mediashower.com Call us 314-827-6399  

WASPY churchboys never liked me. #wasp #christianwoman #marriageminded ♡ Need a mentor? I offer 1:1 videochat mentorship sessions. Ask about my fabulous programs, as well! Email: herfablife1@gmail.com Socials - ♛ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/HerFabLife ♛ iTunes Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/her-fab-life-podcast/id1443437685 ♛ Stitcher Podcast: https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/her-fab-life-podcast ♛ FB Group (women only): https://www.facebook.com/groups/herfablife ♛ Jenny's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/singjennygirl

While last week’s Wheel Within a Wheel may have been a logistical nightmare, it did result in the fortuitous, yet statistically unlikely combination of The Piano (1993) and The Ice Storm (1997). One is a haunting, hole-filled period polarizer with a brilliant score. The other is a frigid cast-tastic snapshot of WASPy, 70’s Connecticut. What do these films have in common? Why they’re both formative movies from podpal Darren Dewes’ early years! He joins us this week to yack about pee scenes, chunky necklaces, and every imaginable iteration of the Titanic tragedy, this week on Ex Rated Movies!

Your favourite covidiots are back for another round of Covid-eo Killed the Radio Star! On this week's episode, we discuss the perils of going head to head with the Download Festival, explain why anchovies and kippers belong on pizza and provide the usual antics in This is Happening and Covidiot of the Week. Like, subscribe, review! Warning: Explicit content from the outset

The ethical quagmire of the existence of the billionaire gets a bit easier when you're confronted with the reality of Bruce Wayne. Guest Andy Michaels (from our episode on the X-MEN in season one, @StopThatAndy) is here to talk about white, WASPy privilege and, possibly, the need for super-hero therapists. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/fuckboisoflit/message

In this episode, Chris Gassler & Alexandra Izzi, our favorite couple call in and try (unsuccessfully)to take over the show. They fall into place when they realize they are dealing with a PODCAST MASTER. Is there such thing as a SOUL mate?? How many pictures of your dog(s) should you REALLY take in one day?? Is Giant Calamari the only way to satisfy Anthony Quinn's hunger for FOLKLORE?? Have you ever had VICTORY sex after watching Maury?? Do you know any Bigfoot HUNTERS personally?? These not so WASPY questions will be considered on this episode of QUINNSPIRACY.

:35 Krista teases about the “journey” she has been on:55 Katherine announces that the gals will be changing their name in order to get their message out more fluidly.1:30 Their website will be twogalssoulschool.com but they will continue to keep their podcast name as The Holy Fuck Podcast.2:09 Posts can be shared with friends more easily under the name of Two Gals Soul School2:50 The gals also announce they are going to take a few weeks off for Spring Break.3:55 Shamanic Journeys and Plant Based Medicine4:15 Katherine's experience was more natural while Krista's has been more induced.4:44 Krista discusses her judgments about people being able to drink a drink and have a spiritual experience when she had to work so hard to have hers naturally. She decides to do what she's been judging as a way of getting over her ego side.5:37 Krista thought she was going to be able to take a summer vacation and have some Plant Based experiences.6:00 Krista's summer travel plans have been postponed so she finds a way to go on a “trip” in her own bedroom7:25 Krista discusses how female lineage came through in her plant based experience8:00 Missy Eliot appears in Krista's trip8:41 An English, protestant woman appears in Krista's trip9:12 Krista has an awareness of how the angry, rigid old woman has been a part of her decision making.9:43 Krista's Korean daughter “appears” in her trip with a disapproving energy.10:40 An old crone appears in the mirror11:22 Mr. Right Here Right Now performs a clearing on Krista to rid her of the women from her past11:55 Krista puts a necklace on that transforms her into an Egyptian Queen. Her empowered “Self” came through.12:34 Her empowered Queen was here all along but she was buried underneath all the “old” women.13:15 Mr. Right Here Right Now's face continues to morph, showing Krista all of the different personas of his past. Past lives of them together or just his past lives.14:45 The Egyptian Queen represents that life is meant to be enjoyed.15:00 The “old” ladies have been making decisions for Krista's life that feel repressed and rigid.16:22 Krista releases the guilt she feels around enjoying her life during this challenging Covid time.16:54 Katherine reflects that both gals are bringing the Queen energy into themselves and expressing it out to the world through the HF podcast.17:33 Katherine shares her shamanic experience and how grounding it felt.18:30 Katherine has an ancestral experience guided by an Ojai Shaman.19:24 A Scottish Queen appears in Katherine's experience and she has an understanding that it is was war time and the Queen feels helpless. She feels the grief but also stands firm against the forces of darkness20:42 Katherine has lived in war torn places before.21:53 Native American medicine woman appears.22:39 Katherine realizes that the medicine woman represents her deceased, twin sister and the Scottish Queen represents Katherine.23:30 The medicine women had a lot of similarities to Katherine's sister.24:45 Katherine remembers that her lineage includes her family from Oklahoma which might represent the Native American energy that has crept into her DNA.25:37 Katherine laughs that someone in her Waspy family must have been with a Native American woman.26:15 The gals discuss how we create our identities from what we think is our ancestral background.26:40 Krista discusses the difference in her DNA and her sister's DNA even though they share the same parents.28:10 The Scottish Queen felt like Katherine but the medicine woman only felt like a piece of her.28:58 Altered states allow for healing29:25 Katherine discusses the awareness of how the empowered women live inside her whereas Krista's experience was more about letting go of the “repressed women.”30:35 Katherine decides to become a minister after her sister died.31:20 Krista talks about how the repressed energies have stopped her from allowing herself to be sexy and free in the world.31:55 The gals discuss taking their clients through past life healing processes.32:25 Healing happens past, present and future helping us heal our family lineage.33:14 Krista shares how her daughter is unknowingly experiencing the same repressed lineage through her Asian roots.33:48 What can Krista do to help her daughter clear the lineage without having to take the next 20 years to do it.34:23 As Krista heals her daughter can too.34:50 Krista realizes that the Asian lineage and repression caused issues in her marriage.36:36 Family belief systems get passed down through the generations and can be healed and cleared through forgiveness.37:28 Krista didn't want to take off her necklace because she felt so powerful with it.38:00 The gifts of shamanic and plant based experiences and stories.39:14 Krista realizes that she needs to move into forgiveness with the “Old” ladies instead of remaining in judgment towards those aspects of herself. She wants to invite them in with acceptance and embrace them.40:33 Now that the ”journey” is over, the real work begins.41:15 Krista realizes that the African American women in her trip represent the fun, lively side of herself.41:52 The gals go on Spring break and look forward to the mischief they can get into.42:20 Two Gals Soul SchoolAnd of course Subscribe to our podcast at www.holyf*ckpodcast.comFollow us on IG at @holyf*ckpodcast.Spread the love.

Malarie Howard is a Los Angeles-based screenwriter and musician who grew up as the only Black girl in various WASPY communities, listening to Christian screamo rock, singing opera, and writing fan-fiction. She graduated from Silicon Valley’s Santa Clara University, where she majored in “not engineering like she should have.” These days, she's working on the CW show "In The Dark". She's also the creator of the dark comedy SPIRALING, which is inspired by her experiences of managing her mental health while working in the tech industry. She tells us about how her mother inspired her love for writing, why she needed to follow her Hollywood dreams.

Like yesterday’s interview of Jim Henderson, today we feature a Christian leader who shoulders responsibility for justice — especially the poor, the widow, and the immigrant alien. Discover the amazing journey of Carl Ruby, pastor and advocate for social justice and refugee rights, when you listen to Bibdig episode 5. Carl tells the story of his efforts to teach principles of truth-telling, fact-checking, and civil conversation within the Christian community.Here are Owen's personal observations of the arc of Carl's spiritual journey:Carl Ruby started as a farm boy in Michigan, born into a conservative Evangelical family. He attended Cedarville as an undergrad, and fit right into the WASPy culture during those years when it had morphed into a "regular Baptist" Ohio college. He enjoyed being involved in his student life leadership program, and when he graduated the college offered him a job. By the time I met him in the mid-80s, Carl was a bright young leader studying for his Ph.D. in Educational Administration. I had the pleasure as a slightly older outside consultant to interview Carl every two years for the Cedarville admissions video. I began to observe something happening to his world-view during the next few years. Perhaps it grew out of his travels with students to help hurricane victims wherever they were needed. Perhaps it came from his efforts to bring contemporary, more culturally diverse Christian voices to student chapel and co-curricular programs. Or maybe it was that appreciation for human freedom which the Apostle Paul observed to be a companion of true disciples of Jesus at the beginning of the Christian enterprise. I can speak from first-hand experience that when Carl accompanied over a hundred CU students each year for a Civil Rights tour across the South, that love of freedom and sadness over American slavery also reached deeper and deeper into Carl's soul. Before I completed my 25-year stint as the Cedarville admissions video producer, Carl became the VP of Student Life. And then I "graduated" and moved to Seattle and then Sitka, and I lost track of Carl.When I finally caught up with him again in February for this interview, we hadn't seen each other for almost a decade. But in that intervening time Carl had left Cedarville, and had spent three years working to bring immigration reform to the United States. I guess he failed at that... :-) Now Carl is Senior Pastor at the Central Christian church in Springfield, Ohio. He is living proof of how a human being’s heart can change profoundly, no matter where we work or worship, and what our circumstances may be. For me, another old white guy who doesn't fit the stereotypes that naturally flow from our upbringing, Carl and I are exceptions that prove spirituality can and often does get transformed by reality.New York Times article on Carl's sudden departure from Cedarville: https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/16/us/a-christian-college-struggles-to-define-itself.htmlCarl's church website is ccspringfield.org

I'm finding it helpful to be consistent, and I'm not great at talking things out. My family is a bunch of wasps lol no one talks about anything (good, bad, or indifferent). No need to "unpack" feelings or unpleasantness - the key is to move forward. Wrong. Let's chat, connect and listen

This week Marlon and Jake delve into the very real lives of very dead writers. From Gore Vidal to Frank McCourt, Ulysses S. Grant to Gabriel García Márquez, they discuss how memory compares to history and whether the trustworthiness of a memoir really matters if the book is a compelling read. Their discussion about WASPy realism leads them to debate whether John Cheever or John Updike is the better writer, and Marlon poses the scandalous question of whether Jane Austen lacked passion (gasp!). Whether they're talking about philandering playwrights or humorous newspaper columnists, Marlon and Jake prove that truth really can be stranger than fiction. Select titles mentioned in this episode: Personal Memoirs by Ulysses Grant Palimpsest by Gore Vidal The Night of the Gun by David Carr Act One by Moss Hart Once in a Lifetime by Moss Hart and George S. Kaufman The Man Who Came to Dinner by Moss Hart and George S. Kaufman Angela’s Ashes by Frank McCourt Living to Tell the Tale by Gabriel García Márquez Rabbit Series (Rabbit, Run, Rabbit Redux, Rabbit Is Rich and Rabbit At Rest) by John Updike The Maples Stories by John Updike The Stories of John Cheever by John Cheever Jane Eyre by Charlotte Brontë Pride and Prejudice by Jane Austen At Wit’s End by Erma Bombeck If Life is a Bowl of Cherries by Erma Bombeck

When one of Alison's never-seen co-workers gets bounced for dating a client (and losing the agency the business when the relationship went sour), Alison gets a promotion to assistant account executive! She's going to be working with an art director named Amanda Woodward on Maximum Advantage, a men's underwear brand. None of the agency's usual photographers is available, so Alison takes a flyer on Jo, who decides to go in a bold direction with her artistic concept and hang out with the tennis-star model afterward -- at Shooters, so why she is then astonished to piss off Jake in the process is a real mystery because obviously he is also there. Billy agrees to let Michael fix him up on a blind date with Lydia, a nurse at the hospital. He's not into her, and she's not into him either, but they're both so WASPy that somehow they end up on a crappy second date together. And Rhonda is, once again, doubting that she's ready to commit to Terrence -- but this time, she might not let Matt talk her out of fleeing. We discuss it all in our podcast on "Picture Imperfect"! JOIN THE AWT CLUB

When one of Alison's never-seen co-workers gets bounced for dating a client (and losing the agency the business when the relationship went sour), Alison gets a promotion to assistant account executive! She's going to be working with an art director named Amanda Woodward on Maximum Advantage, a men's underwear brand. None of the agency's usual photographers is available, so Alison takes a flyer on Jo, who decides to go in a bold direction with her artistic concept and hang out with the tennis-star model afterward -- at Shooters, so why she is then astonished to piss off Jake in the process is a real mystery because obviously he is also there. Billy agrees to let Michael fix him up on a blind date with Lydia, a nurse at the hospital. He's not into her, and she's not into him either, but they're both so WASPy that somehow they end up on a crappy second date together. And Rhonda is, once again, doubting that she's ready to commit to Terrence -- but this time, she might not let Matt talk her out of fleeing. We discuss it all in our podcast on "Picture Imperfect"! VISUAL AIDSVisual Aids S01.E21DISCUSSION & SHOW NOTESDiscussion and show notes for this episode can be viewed on this episode's page on AgainWithThisPodcast.com.SUPPORT AWT ON PATREONThank you to all our supporters! You can support the podcast directly on Patreon and get access to bonus episodes of “Again With Again With This” as a thank you from us! Check out AWT’s Patreon page today.SUPPORT AWT WITH A PERSONAL MESSAGEWish your friend a happy birthday or just call them a squeef with a AWT Personal Message. It's $50 and helps keep us going. Start on our ad page now! See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Morphosis 'Beating The Crates' in a Hong Kong Ping Pong Styleeeeee in association with www.ghettofunk.co.uk with the last show of 2019 featuring some of his favourite tunes of the past 12 months! http://www.facebook.com/hongkongpingpong http://hongkongpingpong.co.uk/ https://www.instagram.com/hongkongpingpong/ http://ghettofunk.co.uk https://nsbradio.co.uk The 'Best Alternative NSB Show' broadcast live on the Breakspoll Award Winning www.nsbradio.co.uk For all booking enquiries please contact: info@hongkongpingpong.co.uk Tracklist: 01 Ben Cocks & Sid Narbom - Unforgettable 02 Padcore - Bird Up In The Sky 03 Max RubaDub - Stop Pressure ft Rocker T & Jamalski (Bluntskull Remix) 04 Koka Mass Jazz - Play The Game (Timewarp Inc instrumental remix) 05 Daytoner - Bebo's Beat 06 Jstar feat Blackout JA - All I Have 07 Sampa The Great - Final Form 08 X-Ray Ted - Get Into It 09 Aldo Vanucci feat Kylie Auldist - Get A Hold On This (Dr Rubberfunk Remix) 10 Stickybuds - The Firestarter feat. Blackout JA (A.Skillz Remix) 11 MKSHFT - Ajeeb Dastan Shftd 12 Balkan Bump feat Gift og Gab - Can U Hear It (explicit) 13 Innereyefull - Night Of The Living Bass Bins 14 Rafael Fernandez - I Don't Know (But This Is Funk) 15 Maha Quest - You Can Try 16 Gramatik & DeFunk - Funk It VIP 17 Krafty Kuts - Right There 18 Youthstar - Middle Finger (feat Taiwan MC) 19 Padcore - Se Peisma 20 A.Skillz - Track Pant Thing 21 The Funk Hunters - Revolution feat. WANZ Def3 SugarBeats (Fort Knox Five Remix) 22 Clozee - Koto (Lazy Syrup Orchestra & Waspy remix) 23 The Fritz - Les Frites 24 Timewarp Inc - Blessed 25 Royal Blood - Bronx Doctor 26 Krafty Kuts - You're The Reason 27 Mr Stabalina & WBBL - To The Ceiling 28 Dillon Francis - Still Not Butter 29 The Funk Hunters & A.Skillz - Body Move 30 Furious 5 - The Message (WBBL Rekt Remix) 31 Slynk & Mr Stabalina - Keep The Party Jumping 32 Shaka Loves You - Disco Weapon 33 Electrogorilla - Renegade Master 34 Prosper & Stabfinger - Boogie Bugi 35 Beat Le Juice - The Power (Scour Records Freemix) 36 ALLTTA feat 20SYL - Under The Water (fg IV) 37 DJ Fresh - Gold Dust (Dephicit Gonna' Keep You Sweatin' Remix) 38 ElectroGorilla - Love Me 39 Mooqee & Beatvandals - Player (2019 Disco Rework) 40 Tuxedo Junction - Mr Business 41 Mo' Horizons - Rhythm Is A Dancer (Bogota Club version) 42 Joluca - Act Right feat. Mz 007 (Smalltown DJs Remix) 43 Hook N Sling Feat The Loose Cannons - Superstars (extended mix) 44 DJ Zinc - Let's Get Together 45 Shade K - Faulty Brain 46 WBBL - Garth Merengue

Show Notes: edmprod.com/112 This week, Waspy from the dance-R&B group Dirty Radio sat down to chat on the EDM Prodcast. They've released three full length albums and a ton of successful singles on labels such as Spinnin', Mad Decent, and Majestic Casual. Dirty Radio has been releasing music for over a decade, so Waspy has a lot to share on what he's learned over that time and looking back, how he would have done things differently. There are three core members of Dirty Radio, so we talk about how they came together, what their roles are, and how those roles have developed over time. Dirty Radio is a songwriting forward project, so we focus in on how they start and develop ideas. A lot of producers open the DAW and wait for inspiration to strike, and Waspy talks about why this is often a bad idea and what he does to start tracks off the right way. Overall, he offers a ton of valuable advice on production, marketing, and networking, especially for those of you that haven't really stepped out of the electronic scene Connect with Dirty Radio: Dirty Radio - Nobody Does It Better: https://lnk.to/nobodydoesitbetter Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/dirtyradiomusic Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/DiRTYRADiOMUSIC/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/dirtyradiomusic Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dirtyradiomusic/

Morphosis 'Beating The Crates' in a Hong Kong Ping Pong Styleeeeee in association with www.ghettofunk.co.uk http://www.facebook.com/hongkongpingpong http://hongkongpingpong.co.uk/ https://www.instagram.com/hongkongpingpong/ http://ghettofunk.co.uk https://nsbradio.co.uk The 'Best Alternative NSB Show' broadcast live on the Breakspoll Award Winning www.nsbradio.co.uk For all booking enquiries please contact: info@hongkongpingpong.co.uk Tracklist: 01 FunkStatik - Reflections 02 Chinese Man - I've Got That Tune 03 N'Fa Jones - Life Is Just A Game (Tom Showtime Re-Dub) 04 Koka Mass Jazz - Play The Game (Timewarp Inc instrumental remix) 05 Sampa The Great - Final Form 06 X-Ray Ted - Get Into It 07 Chali 2na - Change The World 08 MKSHFT - Ajeeb Dastan Shftd 09 Balkan Bump feat Gift og Gab - Can U Hear It (explicit) 10 AK Sediki & Tack - Funky Swag 11 The Rebel - The Sculptor (feat Illspokin) 12 Mr Bristow - My Life feat Benny Silver (Tom Showtime Remix) 13 Clozee - Koto (Lazy Syrup Orchestra & Waspy remix) 14 Padcore - Se Peisma 15 discObeta - Rare Formz (Jack & Jointz Remix) 16 Calagad 13 - Sajan Christmas Jam (Xtra version) 17 The Swing Bot - Get Up 18 X-Ray Ted - Never Gonna Let em Say 19 Waldeck feat Joy Malcolm - Freedom (Italo Disco dub) 20 Padcore - Intergalactic 21 Roast Beatz ft Kurnel MC - Reach Out 22 Pecoe - Nothing But A Party 23 Alltta ft 20Syl - Under The Water (fg IV) 24 Parov Stelar - Gringo 25 Anna Lunoe - 303 (Jay Robinson remix) 26 Jack Beats - Keep On 27 Joluca - Act Right feat. Mz 007 (Smalltown DJs Remix) 28 Fedde Le Grand - Skank 29 Deibeat - Go For It 30 The Colonel & Rubi Dan - Thunder (Explicit) 31 Digital Base/Andy Vibes - Nightmare In The Club 32 Foals - Sunday (Alex Metric remix) 33 Aries - Herbsmoke (Benny Page remix) 34 Origin One ft Gardna & Nanci Correia - Nice & Easy (T-Kay remix) 35 JFB - Shake 36 Freek & Kit - Calm 37 Dr Meaker - Baddest DJ 38 Serum - Heavy & Dark ft MC Bassman (Serum's VIP) 39 Benny Page - Turn Down The Lights (Benny Page VIP mix)

Pete and Scott are joined by longtime friend and resident mom Moranne Klassen to talk about Baby Boom (1987) - the pearl of mid 80’s baby-movie mania. We clock the first instances of chunky turtlenecks, rustic kitchens and WASPy diatribes that come to be touchstones in a long line of Diane Keaton/Nancy Myers collaborations.  We’re also joined by a real live baby who adds a little bit of credibility to our musings on the working moms of the 1980s.  Grab some homemade Country Baby Applesauce and green clay face mask, sit back and relax as we walk you through Baby Boom - it's Episode 9 and these are the Movie That Made Us Gay! Thanks for listening and don’t forget to subscribe, rate and review us on iTunes! Facebook/Instagram: @moviesthatmadeusgay Twitter: @MTMUGPod Scott Youngbauer: Twitter @oscarcott / Instagram @scottyoungballer Peter Lozano: Twitter/Instagram @peterlasagna

I would like to talk about.... Mary. Fisher. In SHE-DEVIL, Streep gets her first attempt to do comedy. And like all first attempts, we have to accept that failing is sometimes inevitable.  As a proto-Madeline Ashton, Streep gets to indulge her worst WASPy tendencies: pretty, privileged, tall and blonde. A formidable contrast to Roseanne Barr's dumpy, put-upon wife, right? Well... SHE-DEVIL is not so much a comedy as it is the idea of a comedy. Who knew a story of MS stealing Roseanne’s husband could be so flat? Meryl is bad, but it's not her fault. Seán is grinding his teeth from the moment it begins. Surely expert Merylologist Michael Schulman can't like this movie, can he? Can he??!??!!! This truly is Meryl at her BADDEST. Clips from the film presented according to fair use policy. Podcast Theme: "Pipeline" by CyberSDF (https://soundcloud.com/cybersdf/tracks).

#InsideTheCloset is happy to announce our first ever two part event! You've heard about them before, but Matteo finally brought in his cousins Megan and Kelly, and the LEGENDARY Aunt Cindy! Emma gets a chance to compare notes on her WASPy upbringing to the Lane Family's Italian everything. Plus, stories about Matteo's childhood!   Follow Emma - @EmmaWillmann http://www.emmacomedy.com/     Follow Matteo - @MatteoLane https://www.matteolanecomedy.com/   Follow Kelly - @k10neb   Follow Megan - @mbrowley and @Megan Brownley   Follow Princess Cupcake Warrior - @PCupcakeWarrior   Become a Patron - https://www.patreon.com/ITC   Follow us on Facebook at Inside The Closet Podcast, and send your questions to Insidetheclosetpodcast@gmail.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week we welcome the rakish and talented John Coons (aka Johnny Coonami, aka John the Dog) to help us unravel the baffling fiasco that is Mother’s Boys (1994). Sporting a Clueless-meets-Cruella de Vil wardrobe, Jamie Lee Curtis stars as a WASPy, ranine sociopath who just wants her family back. Like Vanessa Redgrave throwing herself into the role, we tumble headfirst down the stairs of confusion as we sort through a mess of C-section scars, architecture emergencies, and road groceries. One man’s erotic thriller is another man’s sexy shocker this week on Ex Rated Movies!

We watch "The Unicorn and the Wasp" (Series 4, Episode 7) where the Doctor and Donna travel back to 1920's to play a live-action game of "Clue". Arriving at an English country manor, the Doctor plays "Watson" to Agatha Christie's "Poirot" and the WASPy Reverend Golightly turns all Waspy driving Donna on an all out bug hunt. All whilst the British upper crust enact a wacky pantomime involving bastard children, "confirmed" bachelors and a non-magical Unicorn.

Show notes: https://bit.ly/2wsDgC8 Two Week Catch-Up: Robert discovers Kroger Fuel Rewards-- "If you stack up all of the digital coupons right, you can pump gas for as cheap as four cents a gallon!" Nerdy News: Facebook's Mark Zuckerberg Gets Grilled by Congress Over Privacy Issues Robert: "Assuming Facebook doesn't reveal my personal details to outsiders, I'm totally okay with them tracking and reselling all of my internet traffic data. It's not your data! It's Facebook's! You agreed to the million-page-long Terms of Service. You're not the customer; you're the product-- be prepared for your data to be sold and resold ad infinitum." Jermaine: "I'm not fine with my data being resold to third-parties I don't know about! At what point does one single company have too much power, information, and control?" Jenny: "Your personal information's all already out there. Folks sign the privacy statement-- what are you expecting? I have a 'trash-email' I use to sign up for websites. The websites get nothing!" Trailer Talk: Ant-Man & the Wasp Jenny: "When they shrink the building, wouldn't all the pipes underneath explode with water? How about all of the electrical and plumbing? 3.5 stars." Robert: "I'm with Jenny! Being a silly, superhero movie doesn't exonerate you from having to be internally consistent with the laws of your own universe! Three stars." Jermaine: "I think you guys are thinking too hard about this. The movie's about a guy who can shrink. I'm excited for this! This is Marvel's version of a heist movie and I love that genre. Paul Rudd and Michael Pena are hilarious. Four stars!" Review: Avengers: Infinity War Jermaine: "This a Thanos-movie, not an Avengers-movie. There are 71 characters in this movie! This movie accomplished something for me that hasn't happened since The Empire Strikes Back. Despite all the negative things that happened at the end, it gave me the hope I needed. Brilliantly crafted. Also, think of Thor's people-- only 12.5% of them remain at this point! Recommend." Robert: "I agree as a technical achievement, Infinity War is unprecedented. But there are no stakes! We know Black Panther and Spiderman are returning alive. C'mon-- they've got sequels in the works! No way Disney's leaving billions of dollars on the table! I begrudgingly recommend watching this movie." Jenny: "I don't want to watch movies with you! You're heartless! You've gotta use character knowledge-- not meta-knowledge! With so many stars, I was worried with everything coming together. Also, would there be enough time to highlight all the individual characters? I love this movie; go see this movie. I totally recommend." Recommendations: Jermaine plays A Way Out with Chris-- "It's a great, innovative co-op game that allows you to really create a bond with your partner. We blew through this game in two days!" Robert reads Last Year by Robert Charles Wilson-- "A time travel'ish novel where people from the future can travel back in time to the Civil War era. Lots of compelling ideas and I love RCW!" Jenny watches Sword Art Online-- "A little dated in its animation but it's just fabulous, especially for people who play MMOs. Terrific writing and easy to watch; I totally recommend it." Credits: "Evacuate the city. Engage our defenses. And get this man a shield."

Emily Witt is a freelance writer and the author of Future Sex. “I think I had always thought that—maybe this is coming from a WASPy, protestant background—if I presented myself as overtly sexual in any way, it would be a huge turnoff. That they would see me as a certain type of person. They wouldn’t have respect for me. And I thought this both professionally—I thought maybe writing this book was going to be really bad for my career, that nobody would take me seriously anymore—and also that nobody would want to date me if I was too honest. In both counts the opposite happened.” Thanks to MailChimp, Audible, and Wunder Capital for sponsoring this week's episode. @embot emilywitt.net Witt on Longform [02:45] Future Sex (Farrar, Straus & Giroux • 2016) [03:00] "Online Dating Diary" (London Review of Books • Oct 2012) [03:15] Witt’s Archive at The Observer [05:30] Witt’s Archive at Miami New Times [05:45] "Cinema é Luxo" (n+1 • Oct 2009) [sub req’d] [06:15] "Miami Party Boom" (n+1 • Mar 2010) [sub req’d] [06:30] Gus Garcia-Roberts on Longform [09:30] Thy Neighbor’s Wife (Gay Talese • Harper Perennial • 2009) [10:00] "An Evening in the Nude with Gay Talese" (Aaron Latham • New York • Jul 1973) [11:15] "That Room in Cambridge" (n+1 • Mar 2011) [sub req’d] [19:15] "What Do You Desire?" (n+1 • Mar 2013) [38:45] "The Trip Planners" (New Yorker • Nov 2015) [48:00] How Music Got Free: A Story of Obsession and Invention (Stephen Witt • Penguin Books • 2015) [48:15] Minnesota Monthly [50:45] "Burning Man Diary" (London Review of Books • Jul 2014)

Sigourney Weaver and Holly Hunter: one's tall, one's short; one's WASPy, one's got a Texan twang; neither is Jodie Foster - but both are in COPYCAT (1995). Released in the shadow of SILENCE OF THE LAMBS, this movie features two prestige actresses in a trashy procedural, part of the 1990s vogue for serial killer thrillers. Seán remembers a film about "sisterhood"...or does he? Brian is dubious about it from the start. Join us again on the mean misogynistic streets of San Francisco. All clips from the film presented according to fair use policy. Podcast Theme: "Pipeline" by CyberSDF (https://soundcloud.com/cybersdf/tracks)

This week on Unorthodox: kosher marijuana, the great bagel scooping debate, and one very WASPy cardigan. Our Jewish guest is Bethany Mandel, author of the Convert's Bill of Rights, which she wrote after learning she was one of the women videotaped by Rabbi Barry Freundel while using the mikveh, or Jewish ritual bath. (The Orthodox rabbi was sentenced in May 2015 to 6 1/2 years in prison for filming more than 150 women, many of them converts, using the ritual bath.) Our Gentile of the Week is writer Rand Cooper, who asks the panel the ever-important question, "Is Jewdar real?" We love to hear from you! Email us at Unorthodox@tabletmag.com. Sign up for our weekly newsletter at http://bit.ly/UnorthodoxPodcast.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A Chance Encounter: Reality? Ben's the last in line at the convenience store across the street. He appears to be conversing with someone, but no one is speaking to him. These people find better deals here, across the way from that 1-2-3-4-5 star hotel. Better deals on both coffee and cigarettes, Georgie announces. “Shhh. Shut up, Georgie. Get out of my head.” Hotel gift shops are for those in a hurry and for those who don't care much for variety or value. “I never shop there. Guests shouldn't either.” Ben gets a medium coffee and a pack of smokes, along with his change, from the clerk. He tears open the fresh pack of smokes, juggling the medium coffee in his other hand. He steps out the door, glancing at the profile of a woman sitting on the bench outside. She is heartbreakingly beautiful. Suddenly, Ben fumbles. He drops two quarters on the pavement. “What are the chances of that?” she chuckles. You're almost completely blind and deaf. Almost completely, Georgie points out. “I know. Why?” Because, Ben. Because. We're in the presence of a naturally beautiful older woman. It's destiny. Fate. She's the One. “This always happens to me, especially if she's wearing open-toed shoes.” “Excuse me?” the lady murmurs. As she is. “I'd lose my senses completely.” As you have. As you do. “As I am. Oh God, I hope she hasn't got the slightest imperfection of either character or . . . what's the word?” Physique. She is just gorgeous, Ben. Isn't she? Shoot. Here she is coming ‘round the mountain. Here she comes. The lady stands, approaching cautiously. “Are you okay?” she asks. Listen, Ben. Can you hear her? She's got that Plain Jane style, that quietly rapturous voice you crave. Ben suddenly finds himself thrown backwards. I wake up early for once. By 8:30 am, I've already walked the ocean shoreline and am on my way to the convenience store to buy a cup of coffee and a pack of smokes. It is windy. I am almost blown away. I hold onto my bright blue lampshade hat with my left hand for about a block, until I step behind the local hotel and it screens the big ocean breeze. The Sea Port Hotel is right on the water. Some hotel guests are in line before me at the convenience store across the street. They would find better deals there on both coffee and cigarettes. Hotel gift shops are for those in a hurry and for those who don't care much for variety or value. I never shop there. Guests shouldn't either. I get my change and tear open the fresh pack of smokes with a medium coffee in my other hand. Then I fumble the smokes, the coffee, and the change. I drop 50 cents on the pavement. “What are the chances of that?” I hear. I become almost completely blind and deaf. I know I am in the presence of a naturally beautiful older woman. This whole blackout/flashback kick is usual, especially if the beautiful older woman is wearing open-toed shoes. I'd lose my senses altogether if she had the slightest imperfection of either character or physique. “What are the chances of what?” I answer. My own voice echoes strangely in the darkness of my mind. “You were just singing ‘Hotel California',” she says. “I heard you.” It must've been playing on the radio while I showered this morning. She was humming the melody, too. I shut up. I look down. She scrapes something off her heel against the steps. “Aw! I stepped in somebody's gum,” she moans. I pull out a fresh smoke. “I think it's a Lifesaver,” I tell her. She discovers that I am right. “But you were singing the same song as me, weren't you?” she persists. “I don't know,” I explain. “I don't remember.” And here she is. She's brought such a Perplexity into my world. My senses collect every drop of her data. Right then, the bright lights of her jewelry flashes bury themselves in the nostalgic depths of my imagination and memory. “Well, don't be embarrassed,” she suggests. “That's amazing!” “Yeah,” I say. A vintage black Ferrari pulls out of the lot with its top down. Heidi gives it no attention. The male driver (in his 50s) probably suffers from the same premature ejaculation that the car does, backfiring. I grunt at the thought. “Hey, you live down the corner of the next block. You're always smoking cigarettes out front,” she says. I confess, “Yeah. Probably. Maybe.” “I waved to you the other day,” she recalls, “and you just turned away.” She must have recognized the big blue hat. “I'm really groggy in the mornings,” I admit. She smiles. “You're really anti-social.” I correct her. “Not anti-social. Non-social, maybe.” Her face lights up. She starts playing with her hair. “I was just on my way to get my nails done. I've been over at the Sea Port for the past week. God, it's this convention for work. It's so boring.” “What's your name?” I ask. “Heidi Berillo.” Heidi has a nametag on. She must've forgotten. “What's yours?” she asks. “Ben Schreiber,” I say, pointing to her nametag. “I was just checking to see if you were a liar.” I stick my hand out. “You've got a firm grip, Mr Schreiber,” she says. She laughs. Later that afternoon, we are hitting it off like we've known each other for years. “I can't believe you've never given a girl a pedicure,” she scoffs. “Really?” I reply. (I do like feet.) I want to tell her that I am a virgin at making love to feet and toes. Hers are perfect. Heidi's hotel room is strewn with papers and folders. And felt-tip pens. After she lights a joint, she gets a little feisty. Her hair is frizzy and red, and she is wild like my imagination. Like I imagine her imagination. I puff away on my cigarette. I try to read what she is thinking through her huge green eyes. Which eye cries for good things? Which one doesn't? I am simply in the moment. I become an observer of myself, observing myself. I'm not my mind. My mind just works for me. Not the other way around. I am enlightened. For once, normal thoughts slip in, one after another. It becomes easier to focus. I'm not busy judging, analyzing, and making decisions. I am completely focused on Heidi. I think, who's her dealer? Where's this woman from? What does she tell herself about herself? I get the impression from Heidi's eyes that she is experiencing something profoundly empty. Somehow, she is dramatically unfulfilled. She is left with voided hope—perhaps a little like me. She looks me right in the eyes. We have a perfect moment, a true connection. Unfortunately, it ends abruptly. I try not to pry into her life, but I am curious to know more about her. I know I'm not always the best at personal interaction. I'm not sure what is appropriate, sometimes. She asks a lot about me, but I don't say much back. Heidi asks me about all my confusion, about what I want out of my time here on earth. Big philosophical stuff. I tell her all of my needs are already met. I tell her I've already lived my life. “I've had enough experiences with myself. All that crap.” And I tell her about my Pops, who always worked hard and always provided my family with wealth. I tell her about my Pops, who meant the world to me. She calls my ‘I've-lived-my-life-already' bit bullshite, and takes a drag off my cigarette. “Are you happy?” she finally asks. “I'm not sure if happiness is what I'm really after,” I say. I tell her I am trying to actualize myself as “a writer,” a concept that is still completely muddy to me. I have idealized this image of myself in my mind, over the past 10 years, but the image keeps changing. In reality, I am writing mostly in my head, right at that moment. My friends and family want me to put something on paper, to complete something, to achieve something. I don't think it matters anymore. “Why not?” asks Heidi. “It's like I'm too far away, in time, from when I was actively participating in things and enjoying them while they were happening.” “How old are you, Ben?” “Thirty.” Heidi is under the veil of drugs, but she's not paranoid or tripped-out or anything. Inside Heidi, there is somebody genuine, and I can see inside her, just barely make her out. There is somebody real in there. Funny, that's always good to know. The alarm clock radio is tuned to Billy Joel's “An Innocent Man.” Heidi says she has only recently figured out her life, at age 40. I don't believe her, and I tell her so. “I don't believe you,” I say. She says she takes things very seriously. She says that every encounter happens for a reason. “Every situation, every consequence. Everything,” she adds. I wonder what my role in her life really is. Somehow, this woman, whom I've just met, knows me so well already. I've really missed that. People usually take very little interest in other people. But with Heidi, I feel honored and appreciated. Still, I feel like I don't really deserve the luxury. Heidi finishes her joint and pockets the roach. She slips off her open-toed leather shoes and stretches her toes. Her light blue polish has peeled off her nails, like an adolescent girl's. “I need a pedicure,” Heidi says, smiling playfully. “Now!” Toto's “Africa” airs next on the bedside radio: “Frightened of this thing that I've become,” somebody sings. I paint her toes with New Blue toenail polish and she falls asleep. I write a note: “Thank you. Ben.” I watch her sleep for half an hour. Then I write my home phone number below the note in my usual kiddie-print handwriting and walk out, not really knowing what else to do. Heidi has a lecture to attend later on. Later, I sit in my bedroom, still listening to the radio. “Hurry, boy, she's waiting there for you.” The phone rings. The machine picks up. Click. “Hey, Ben, I was just thinking of you.” It's all about me now, isn't it? I can't help it. I take a carefree stroll on the beach, remembering the best parts of growing up. They flood my mind with nostalgia. I try to remain in the present, but I am stuck in the past. The moonshine lights up the sand, and the whitecaps, that break 20 feet out. The tide is low, the rolling is a little choppy, but the wave sounds are soothing. I remember how rich and full my life was before. Before. Before what? I wonder what went wrong. I walk along the water's edge to find some inner peace. I have always enjoyed wandering around, not doing much. I'm comfortable in my imagination, or I'm comfortable nowhere. I think: Has love ever made one whole year of your life miserable? I wonder if my year of misery is approaching. It is nighttime. I start to dream. Heidi and I are lost in our thoughts; we take in all that surrounds us. We are walking the neighborhood sidewalks, holding hands, until we come to the beach where the whitecaps crash right at our feet. Huge seagulls with wide-open wingspans swoop in for their final feast of the day. The next morning, the beach is empty. The sky is gray, flat and still, surreal. The gulls fly low in flocks as the long Pacific rollers wash in and out. We revisit the past. But whose past? Oh my God! The Living Colorful Beauty is so intense. I just can't stand it. I speak on the phone with Heidi. “I was downstairs at one of the lectures. It was sooo boring,” Heidi says. “Boring, huh?” “But I got several compliments on my new pedicure,” she teases. “Thank God,” I say, letting out a sigh of relief. I stand in the empty hotel room that weekend, bewildered. It had been quickly vacated—I could tell. In the bathroom, there is a wet towel lying on the floor, crumpled up from wet feet with a woman's footprints embedded. Empty single-serving soap bottles make a mess on the corner shelf. A Mexican housekeeper readies the room for its next guests. Back at my place, I play the message player back again. “So I thought you might like to know what a great job you did, and on such short notice, too. You were just in time for the only panel discussion I really came here for in the first place.” Her telephone had sat on the unmade bed with a box of tissues beside it. Across the street from me is a fishing pier. A middle-aged couple walks hand in hand to the end of the pier. They stare out at the freight barges sailing into port. There is a snack and bait stand nearby, but it hasn't opened yet. At the base of the pier, a pay phone dangles off its hook. There is some litter rolling around the streets. Not much, though. “I'm meeting some cool people here, but a lot of them are really boring. This whole convention thing is really dull.” The night before, Heidi and I shared a cherry Slush Puppie on the pier. She popped a few Tylenols because, she said, her head was still throbbing slightly from all the boredom and ennui lingering over her past week at the psych conference. I declined the Tylenol. I was still awe-struck by the whirling seagulls and the shooting stars. Only a few fishermen are out with their gear; it's still pretty early. An Asian man pulls up a small fish. The thing must be contaminated—the seawater down below is brown and slimy—but his boy grabs the bucket anyway. That small radioactive fish is a keeper. “So, some of my friends and I wanted to hang out by the bar and talk medicine, but I was hoping we could finish our conversation from last night. I really enjoyed walking the town with you.” After the Slushie, we stopped by my place and shared a Winston. I invited her in, but she declined. We took a drive down the coast under the moon instead. My house is empty; nobody is up yet. The whole neighborhood is still asleep. A white van drives by. A newspaper is tossed on the manicured lawn out front. “At least before I leave tomorrow,” she said. “Oh, and the weather is so much nicer out here.” Sunlight bleeds horizontally through the closed blinds in my bedroom. Pretty soon I am sound asleep. “I was thinking about how brilliant you are,” Heidi told me on the answering machine. “And, jeez, you have so much talent. People look at you and they see big things.” Expect big things. That's what she meant. Big things, little things. It doesn't matter. It's a stress I can't handle, people expecting things. Anything. Not from me. I live in my head. Alone. I buy porno, coffee, and smokes from the snack and bait shop next door, and come home. Jerk off. Alone. I'm okay with that. The clock on Georgie's nightstand reads 10:30 am. I wake up and glance at Georgie. I don't wake him. I crawl out of bed. The sky has cleared up a bit over the beach, and the beach is packed with kite-fliers. A dozen kites glide over the blue-fogged coast, bright with color and wonder. The hotel room next door is clean by now. Ready for new guests. Downstairs, a conference is just letting out. The checkout line is already out the door. Most of the guests wear nametags on their blazers. The bellboys are busier than hell. There are dozens of fishermen on the pier. More men than fish. “What would you do if you knew you couldn't fail?” Heidi had asked. “I love that question.” I walk the beach, having no clue how to answer. Most of the neighborhood seems to be outdoors. Most people wear light jackets or hooded sweatshirts. They walk their dogs. (Parenthetical Pet Peeve) Tiny white dogs with brown runny stuff around their eyes. They walk their children. Alley cats run loose on the sidewalks, and slide underneath the cars parked on one-way streets. A few cars pass by slowly, going maybe 10 miles an hour. Pest control trucks park outside at least one house per block, it seems like. There is hardly any crime, violence, or vandalism in this part of the city. Maybe some drugs, some domestics; you know, whatever goes down inside people's private residences—the stuff we never know about. “Grab hold of just one project and get in there with your teeth and see what happens,” she had said. “Why not? If somebody wants a story about you and you're the only one who knows it well enough, then go for it! You would do the world a favor. Hell, do it for me! I'd love to hear about all that crap, as you call it.” A small gate leads to my front door. It is a charming little pad, perfect for a loner like me. “So what if your dad is some big, well-to-do asshole? This is your chance to shine,” she coaxed. “Just go for it!” It was really nice to have some woman cheering me on. It was the closest thing I'd ever known to true love. Heidi mentioned that she'd found the perfect little gift in the hotel gift shop. She wanted me to call her later. The orange sunset flashes between two buildings downtown. I sprawl out on the beach. The sun is setting earlier than usual, I think. Why did I just leave like that? What about going back? Somehow, I just couldn't change my mind about Heidi. Reality hit me really hard, and I was scared to go after her, like a real man. Time stops for just a few exquisite seconds, maybe five or six, until I can't take it much longer. I am self-aware in my newly discovered growth spurt. I am happy, I guess. I'm so happy, I start to cry—just because I am feeling good. Just because I can. Just until I need to stop. I start to really appreciate having met Heidi. Maybe I'm still working through the obsession with Claudia. From the beach, I head back home. I'm already starting to have conversations with Heidi in my head without her being there or being able to answer me. How lucky she is! Is this love? Beep. “Hey, Ben, I was just thinking of you. I was downstairs at one of the lectures.” Beep. “Hey, Ben, ugh . . .I'm just calling. I'm sorry. It's this stupid conference. I'm not going to go to this class I have in 10 minutes. I'm getting so sick of the same thing over and over again. I'm just in my room taking a bath. Anyway, I'm sorry to bother you. Thanks for letting me vent.” Were we just two shattered souls who ended up trying to save each other in some doomed fashion? The door swings shut from inside the house. I never get calls. And when I do, I always miss them. “Hello?” I answer. “Ben?” “You must look so beautiful in that bathtub,” I say. “That's one of the nicest things a guy has ever said to me.” Back at her place, her lovely feet await my attention. She doesn't refuse when I administer an oral foot massage while she is still in the bath. “Right on the arches, Ben,” she cries. I love every minute of it. Her feet quiver with delight. Her toes stretch awkwardly. “I'm . . . sick . . . I'm dizzy,” she moans. “And you're incredible.” Oh, the gibberish we speak in ecstasy, moaning meaningless words. “Sick-dizzy,” she giggles intensely. She giggles her orgasm, gibbers and moans her pleasure. I understand her, in some fucked-up way. Afterwards, Heidi lies quietly asleep, on top of the white bed covers. She is wearing men's pajamas. I head back home. We hadn't made love. She must think of me as the friendly type, like most other women do. But that is fine. I'm used to that. Heidi is a little nutty, but I like that, too. She is a mess. She is so innocently a disaster. She is the little Perplexity in my head. I get home at 3 am. I've always loved the night, when everyone else is asleep and the world is all mine. It's quiet and dark—the perfect time for creativity. All of a sudden, inspiration comes. Things are clearer. My ideas make more sense. I can finally start to type out, with a little passion, some interesting letters on the screen. I'll have to begin the story from here, with me, as ridiculous as that sounds. It's been forever since I actually sat down to write again. Does this mean my writer's block has broken? Or am I just fooling myself again? “I never meant to be such a narcissist,” I cry. “I just can't get away from myself.” I've always wanted somebody like Heidi to love. But I still don't know what I need. Maybe I just need one tiny success, one simple thing. Maybe I just need something in this life that will work out in the long run. Maybe I just need to complete something, to get over some things. Maybe I just need something good to last. God probably took delight in orchestrating me, that day. I'll call it a day of personal growth. I never hear from Heidi or see her again. And now my mind runs wild with quiet confusion. The little affair we had felt so soothing to the senses. I'll wake up tomorrow, thinking about today. The next day I'll wake up thinking about tomorrow. Am I really just a perverted sex addict, like maybe I think I am? Or is this really some kind of love? (You tell me, Dr C. Please.)Dear Diary:I think we are all good souls, all of us, even me, even if only deep down inside.The Emperor Concerto, Second Movement He slaps the snooze button. Half hit. Half miss. It's all gross. He's sweaty and ashamed. He can't even get up. Another fucking horrible day in the life of . . . me. Georgie Gust. And then laziness creeps in. Georgie starts hating himself. He starts to laugh. “Snooze, damn it!” he tells the alarm clock. He always thought a snooze was a good 9, 10 minutes. Georgie actually timed the motherfucker several times. This piece of crap mostly gives him 9 or 10 minutes of extra sleep time. This day, that day, though, the thing can't even give him two. Cheap, damn thing. It's 1:30 pm. Even at this hour, so far into the day, he hesitates to open the shades. He hopes it is not all dismal and gloomy outside. He's trying to picture himself somewhere out there, in the world. But he just can't picture it. Maybe if he just stays in bed someone else will open the shades, and save Georgie the trouble of discovering the day. He closes his eyes, falling half asleep. He finds himself in a non-smoking room at the local three-star hotel. He's hotel-hopping. He needs to get away again. We always need to get away, Georgie and me, even if it's only in our head. Geographical change is the easiest fix. Georgie opens his eyes. He can't figure out where that three-star hotel has gone. He's already forgotten—he's still at home. The next day, our place now clean, Georgie still can't get out of his head. He thinks how much he dreads, how much he resents, the effort it takes to take another shower, brush his teeth, and clean himself up, again and again. He just did that yesterday—he shouldn't have to do it again today. Once should be enough. Once and forever. Now Georgie craves something different. He's desperate for something new. He would kill for something new. We both would. (But who?) This particular morning, the razor burn on Georgie's neck looks like a leper's chafed jock-itch. He can't wait the couple of days for the skin on his neck to heal, but at least he won't have to spend the time and effort to shave again—and that's comforting. After all, the longer he lets his facial hair grow out, the easier it is to shave. After all these years, Georgie still can't find the right shaving method. Currently, he's on a Panasonic electric for the first layer, then a straight edge without lotion for the second part. Back to a smaller electric beard trimmer, level one, for his goatee shadow. No lotion. No cream. No soap. With so much nausea, angst, worry, anxiety, and despair welling up inside him, Georgie is suffocating in life. His pathetic and abused gut keeps getting filled with an extra load of explosive anxiety. It's worse than tickle torture. He hasn't taken any risks for some time now. The rut where he's been trapped has felt so safe. He's had no view; the walls were high, the rut was deep. All Georgie could see was up and out. Up and away. (But away from what? Away where? More unanswerable questions, huh?) Most things and events really don't have much meaning for him anymore. Georgie needs meaning more than anything else. But meaning is exactly what Georgie hasn't got. And he probably won't get it, either. Georgie really doesn't know what the day will bring. The only thing he knows is his sloppy routine of rituals: smoking, shiting, showering, shaving, fixing his hair, flossing, brushing his teeth, taking his meds, and organizing. He uses a ton of paper creating lists of things to do, things to accomplish, so he can feel productive. His father tells him it's important to be productive. So he tries. He really does. He looks at the bathroom mirror with the sticker in the corner that reads: JUST TRUST ME. Right. Like Georgie's going to trust any of the shitey-assed people he calls friends. Georgie's pathetic reflection looks back at him from the empty mirror. He has this huge ego blowing up his head, like an untied condom, until it screwballs up and away. He guesses he looks all right these days. No, really. He looks good. He just doesn't know what to do about it. He's so glam rock; he's so smart. It's like he has Asperger's, or some kind of artistic autism. But he's not sick. His doctor knows that. (Doesn't she, Dr C?) He can't deal with a label like depression or stress. He feels much worse than that. He feels like shite. (Do you have a Latin name for shite, Dr C?) When he shaves, the razor makes love to Georgie's skin. When he pees, he aims for the silent section on the toilet's water edge. Afterwards, he usually farts, shites, and pees again, while he's sitting a little too long on the toilet. Georgie melts into the quality time he takes, thinking on the porcelain tank. His thoughts are trivial. They seem important, but they're nothing he would ever act on. He is on good behavior. It's just a lot of theory. A CD is usually skipping while Georgie's in the shower. In the shower, he strips down to his naked self. He comes into his true element. He can't see a thing without his glasses, and he can't tell you how many wristwatches he's lost because they don't have waterproofing. But that's okay. Waterproof watches are never appealing to the eye.(Parenthetical Pet Peeve) Smudged eyeglasses. There's no washcloth. He washes himself by hand with shampoo—not soap. Shampoo works better because Georgie is hairy, like me. But I don't wash with shampoo. I use hand-milled, organic soap from Northern California—Sunset Cedar, from a shop called Patti's Organics. Georgie smiles in the shower because he was born a man. The shower is the one place where he's rarely sexually charged. He thinks of himself as a connoisseur, a connoisseur of filth (so soap does not appeal). Women's dirty fingernails, their smelly anal fetishes, anything nasty—her already-smoked cigarettes for the shrine, the smell of gasoline and melted hair follicles. Filth. Georgie hates dropping the soap. He hates all the bottles in the shower. They confuse him and make him think these products are really useful when he knows they're not.(Parenthetical Pet Peeve) Long fingernails. Worse, long toenails. He hates falling in the shower. God, what else? What else can they do to mess up his day? (What else is there to complain about?) They should have a soap dispenser that mixes soap with water, like at a car wash. It would be a time-saving convenience. It would save energy. What an idea! He should patent that, and make a million bucks. Yeah, right, Georgie. Drying off, towels are so coarse and unfitting. Georgie gets water scars in between his toes sometimes.(Parenthetical Pet Peeve) Hangnails. Every day, all this, all that. Everything is still the same. Georgie doesn't change. Nothing does. Neither do I. Same shite, different day, we say. Georgie and me. His feet are a size 12. He wears shoes all the time because his feet embarrass him. He wears blue shoes. That way, he doesn't have to think of how disgusting his own feet are. His legs are still in shape but he wears long pants, no matter how hot the weather gets. His legs embarrass him, too. Otherwise, he is your generic, overweight pumpkin. His plump belly sticks out over his belt. Maybe it's cute and huggie-bearish to some single sex addicts, but to hell if Georgie thinks so. He weighs in around 268. His driver's license says he's 168. The driver's license picture doesn't even look like him, but the photo came out pretty nice. He used to be in shape. Now he just recites affirmations. Now he just tells himself he loves himself just the way he is. It's all bullshite, but it works for him. His passport picture is pleasing. He enjoys looking at himself. Georgie dresses up and blow-dries his hair, and then he primps and curls it. He has these highlights. He has a kind of WASPy, honk-Afro look going on. At least his hair is cool; at least his hair is always having a good day. My hair, now my hair is dark and thick with a bit of a permanent wave. My mother always said it was my best feature. And here I always thought it was my cuddly personality. Georgie should've picked out his clothes the night before. All his full-size shirts and comfortable pants are at the cleaners, and he doesn't fit into the 32s anymore. He went from a “large” to an “extra large” in shirts. Georgie's just started leaving the shirttails out of his pants. He used to tuck them in, neatly, and wear a belt. But no longer. Still, he'll keep the smaller stuff in the closet—the shirts and pants don't fit, but some of the clothes remind him of the past. They have a nostalgic meaning for Georgie. In Georgie's case, too, clothes make the man. (But make him what? I want to know.) An hour later, he's finally dressed. Now for the breakfast order. Like everything else in Georgie's world, breakfast is a chore. He washes the dishes by hand to get his mind off everything else. He can't help feeling like things are falling apart in slow motion. Doing things like that, little things, trivial things, reminds him of being hypnotized. Strolling down the supermarket aisles at midnight with the trippy supermarket music and the paradox of choice everywhere around him. In the grocery store, somehow, time feels different. Georgie's out of orange juice, and the milk will give him gas, but milk goes best with microwave pancakes. Georgie likes his food a little cold, and he dislikes cooking. He presses the “cancel/stop” button twice on the microwave when it's down to two seconds. It's not like he's in any rush. He has all day.(Parenthetical Pet Peeve) Fat free = taste free. His keys are in place. He locks the door without really checking. Georgie's sick and tired of always lock-checking, lock-checking, and then remembering I forget important things after he's already out the door.(Parenthetical Pet Peeve) If I return home, I suddenly get the feeling I didn't lock the door, then find that I did after all. Georgie, I think, could very well be a loser, but what's that say about me? That I'd be a loser of a literary character, too? What's wrong with a whiner? A complainer? An agoraphobic with OCD? Is that me? I catch Georgie out of the corner of my eye and wonder what I've done, giving him all these issues. He swears he's not going to check that lock—but he does, anyway, even though he's just going out for coffee and coming right back. It's not like he's going to plan his whole life, sitting at the counter, sipping his cup of Joe. It's not like he is some romantic poet at the Café Paris. Finally, Georgie lights his first cigarette of the day—a Marlboro Light—and he worries about cancer, like everything else. And puffs away. After his first cigarette comes another cup of coffee, and then another smoke—and a couple of more smokes, after that. He brings along his laptop computer, a pad and pen, and a couple of self-help books with the covers torn off, just in case. Just in case something strikes. He rarely uses any of these things in public. Sometimes he drives to the convenience store and sits in the parking lot. He watches people. He likes people-watching. But he doesn't like people. Go figure. Georgie rarely looks forward to actually dealing with people. But he'll end up running into somebody every time. People get in his way, and they are unavoidable—like signs on the sidewalks, or spills in the elevator. Or sometimes Georgie gets caught in some really important check-in with somebody who really shouldn't care what's up with him. (And neither should Georgie.) All this whining and baby shite gets him nowhere, he knows—but he just keeps bitching. He dreads being in line at the coffee shop again. He gets self-conscious and self-critical around the perfect advertisement-model-types in line ahead of him. They pretend they're holding their noses and standing clear of the stench coming off Georgie's stale, smelly sweater. It reeks of the toxic fumes of tobacco pollution. And they're all so nice and friendly, and trivial, and guarded. Now that's a challenge. Dealing with these people, I mean, without freaking out or throwing a temper tantrum. Still, he's half asleep. Georgie's always half asleep. No matter what I do. Except, of course, when he's thinking of Claudia. She's the only goddamn thing that really makes him feel alive. Georgie is next in line at the coffee shop. Tabitha's working the counter, but Georgie's not paying much attention to her. He's thinking of Claudia. What else?Dear Diary:I just let others say and do what they want—I just keep being me. Well, sort of.

This week on "A Way with Words": You pick up what you think a glass of water and take a sip, but it turns out to be Sprite. What's the word for that sensation when you're expecting one thing and taste something else? Also, slang from college campuses, like "ratchet" and "dime piece." And the story of a writer who published her first novel at age 73, then went on to win a National Book Award. Plus, the origins of bluebloods, Melungeons, Calcutta bets, Vermont Cree-mees, and a handy phrase used to help buck someone up: Mr. Can't died in a cornfield.FULL DETAILSIs it a good thing to be ratchet? This slang term can refer to a bumpin' party or a girl who's a hot mess. There's nothing like a refreshing gulp of water, unless what you thought was water turns out to be vodka or Sprite. When the expectation of what you'll taste gives way to surprise, shock, and offense, you've experienced what one listener calls cephalus offendo. You might also call it anticipointment. The phrase I see you, meaning I acknowledge what you're doing, comes from performance, and pops up often in African-American performance rhetoric.A listener from Charlottesville, Virginia, is dating a professional golfer who often plays a Calcutta with other tour members. Calcutta, a betting game going back over 200 years, involves every player betting before the tournament on who they think will finish with the lowest score. It was first picked up by the British in and around—you guessed it—Kolkata, also known as Calcutta.When a term paper is due in 24 hours, there's no better tactic than to break open the Milano cookies and procrastineat.Our Quiz Guy John Chaneski has a game for the Mamas and the Papas, with two-word phrases beginning with the letters M-A- M-A- or P-A- P-A-If you say you're not up to this or that challenge, someone might push you harder with the reminder Mr. Can't died in a cornfield. This old saying is particularly evocative if you've ever been stuck in a corn field, because it's easy to think you won't make it out. Another version of this phrase is can't died in the poorhouse.Blue blood, a term often used to refer to WASPy or patrician folks, goes back to the 1700s and the Spanish term sangre azul. It described the class of people who never had to work outside or expose themselves to the sun, so blue veins would show through their ivory, marble-like skin. If someone's a dime piece or a dime, they're mighty attractive -- as in, a perfect 10.What's the difference between drunk and drunken? If you dig through the linguistic corpora, or collections of texts, you'll find that we celebrate in drunken revelry and break into drunken brawls, but individuals drive drunk and or get visibly drunk. Typically, drunken is used for a situation, and drunk refers to a person.Ever seen someone repeatedly around town and made up an elaborate life story for them without actually ever meeting them? In slang terms, that sort of person in your life is called a unicorn.Harriet Doerr published her first novel, the National Book Award-winning Stones for Ibarra, at the age of 73. Don't think about ordering a soft serve ice cream in Vermont—there, it's a Creemee. The term has stuck around the Green Mountain State by the sheer force of Vermonter pride.The term Melungeon, applied to a group of people in Southeastern Appalachia marked by swarthy skin and dark eyes, has been used disparagingly in the past. But Melungeons themselves reclaimed that name in the 1960s. The Melungeon Heritage website details some of the mystery behind their origin. The name comes from the French term melange, meaning "mixture."The initialism LLAS, meaning love you like a sister, isn't a texting phenomenon—it goes back 30 or 40 years to when girls would write each other letters.Diminutive suffixes, Donnie for Don, change the meaning of a name to something smaller, cuter, or sweeter. This episode was hosted by Martha Barnette and Grant Barrett.....Support for A Way with Words comes from Common Ground, the new word game for nimble and knowledgeable minds. More information about how language lovers can find Common Ground at commongroundthegame.com.--A Way with Words is funded by its listeners: http://waywordradio.org/donateGet your language question answered on the air! Call or write with your questions at any time:Email: words@waywordradio.orgPhone: United States and Canada toll-free (877) WAY-WORD/(877) 929-9673London +44 20 7193 2113Mexico City +52 55 8421 9771Donate: http://waywordradio.org/donateSite: http://waywordradio.org/Podcast: http://waywordradio.org/podcast/Forums: http://waywordradio.org/discussion/Newsletter: http://waywordradio.org/newsletter/Twitter: http://twitter.com/wayword/Skype: skype://waywordradio Copyright 2014, Wayword LLC.

IT'S OUR 20TH EPISODE BITCH! Celebrate with Rag and Sponge in typical fashion as Sponge cleans for an aformentioned not-so-hot WASPy guy and Rag looks back on his first summer in the service industry in Provincetown. 

This week on "A Way with Words": You pick up what you think a glass of water and take a sip, but it turns out to be Sprite. What's the word for that sensation when you're expecting one thing and taste something else? Also, slang from college campuses, like "ratchet" and "dime piece." And the story of a writer who published her first novel at age 73, then went on to win a National Book Award. Plus, the origins of bluebloods, Melungeons, Calcutta bets, Vermont Cree-mees, and a handy phrase used to help buck someone up: Mr. Can't died in a cornfield.FULL DETAILSIs it a good thing to be ratchet? This slang term can refer to a bumpin' party or a girl who's a hot mess. There's nothing like a refreshing gulp of water, unless what you thought was water turns out to be vodka or Sprite. When the expectation of what you'll taste gives way to surprise, shock, and offense, you've experienced what one listener calls cephalus offendo. You might also call it anticipointment. The phrase I see you, meaning I acknowledge what you're doing, comes from performance, and pops up often in African-American performance rhetoric.A listener from Charlottesville, Virginia, is dating a professional golfer who often plays a Calcutta with other tour members. Calcutta, a betting game going back over 200 years, involves every player betting before the tournament on who they think will finish with the lowest score. It was first picked up by the British in and around—you guessed it—Kolkata, also known as Calcutta.When a term paper is due in 24 hours, there's no better tactic than to break open the Milano cookies and procrastineat.Our Quiz Guy John Chaneski has a game for the Mamas and the Papas, with two-word phrases beginning with the letters M-A- M-A- or P-A- P-A-If you say you're not up to this or that challenge, someone might push you harder with the reminder Mr. Can't died in a cornfield. This old saying is particularly evocative if you've ever been stuck in a corn field, because it's easy to think you won't make it out. Another version of this phrase is can't died in the poorhouse.Blue blood, a term often used to refer to WASPy or patrician folks, goes back to the 1700s and the Spanish term sangre azul. It described the class of people who never had to work outside or expose themselves to the sun, so blue veins would show through their ivory, marble-like skin. If someone's a dime piece or a dime, they're mighty attractive -- as in, a perfect 10.What's the difference between drunk and drunken? If you dig through the linguistic corpora, or collections of texts, you'll find that we celebrate in drunken revelry and break into drunken brawls, but individuals drive drunk and or get visibly drunk. Typically, drunken is used for a situation, and drunk refers to a person.Ever seen someone repeatedly around town and made up an elaborate life story for them without actually ever meeting them? In slang terms, that sort of person in your life is called a unicorn.Harriet Doerr published her first novel, the National Book Award-winning Stones for Ibarra, at the age of 73. Don't think about ordering a soft serve ice cream in Vermont—there, it's a Creemee. The term has stuck around the Green Mountain State by the sheer force of Vermonter pride.The term Melungeon, applied to a group of people in Southeastern Appalachia marked by swarthy skin and dark eyes, has been used disparagingly in the past. But Melungeons themselves reclaimed that name in the 1960s. The Melungeon Heritage website details some of the mystery behind their origin. The name comes from the French term melange, meaning "mixture."The initialism LLAS, meaning love you like a sister, isn't a texting phenomenon—it goes back 30 or 40 years to when girls would write each other letters.Diminutive suffixes, Donnie for Don, change the meaning of a name to something smaller, cuter, or sweeter. This episode was hosted by Martha Barnette and Grant Barrett.--A Way with Words is funded by its listeners: http://waywordradio.org/donateGet your language question answered on the air! Call or write with your questions at any time:Email: words@waywordradio.orgPhone: United States and Canada toll-free (877) WAY-WORD/(877) 929-9673London +44 20 7193 2113Mexico City +52 55 8421 9771Donate: http://waywordradio.org/donateSite: http://waywordradio.org/Podcast: http://waywordradio.org/podcast/Forums: http://waywordradio.org/discussion/Newsletter: http://waywordradio.org/newsletter/Twitter: http://twitter.com/wayword/Skype: skype://waywordradio Copyright 2013, Wayword LLC.