Podcasts about reformers

In this revisited episode, I'm returning to a conversation with Caroline Simpson. Caroline is currently Deputy Chief of Staff to the Prime Minister, with a particular responsibility in Number 10 North. At the time of recording Caroline was the Group Chief Executive of Greater Manchester Combined Authority, Transport for Greater Manchester and Greater Manchester Fire and Rescue Service. This episode is worth hearing again because it gets beneath the structures of devolution and explores what it really takes to make it work. Caroline talks about the relationship between economic growth and public service reform, and why progress must ultimately be felt in people's lives, not just seen in new buildings or stronger economic stats. She also makes a compelling case for moving investment towards prevention and designing services around the whole person, rather than expecting people to navigate a collection of disconnected systems. All themes we are familiar with here at MV. But at the heart of the conversation is leadership. Caroline explains how Greater Manchester's progress has been built on trust, strong relationships and a willingness to have constructive disagreements. These are themes which were strongly supported in my subsequent Manchesterism conversations with Eve holt, Thomas Johnson and Warren Heppolette. There is a lot here for anyone leading change in a complex system. Above all, Caroline brings remarkable energy, humility and determination and a leadership philosophy that can be summed up in two words: “all in”.

In episode 506 of the Reformed Brotherhood, Tony Arsenal and Jesse Schwamb wade deep into one of Luke's most arresting parables — the Parable of the Rich Fool (Luke 12:13–21). What begins as a story about a man with a bumper crop and an ambitious barn-building plan quickly unfolds into a penetrating diagnosis of the human heart. The hosts argue that this parable is not primarily about financial planning or the dangers of wealth per se, but about the fundamental theological posture of the creature before the Creator. Framed by two parallel warnings — against covetousness and against anxiety — the parable exposes what happens when a soul tries to find its ultimate rest in the abundance of earthly things rather than in God himself. Rich in biblical theology, literary analysis, and pastoral application, this episode rewards careful listening. Key Takeaways The parable is framed by an inclusio — the warning against covetousness (v. 15) and the command against anxiety (v. 22) are parallel statements that reveal the parable's true subject: the misplacement of ultimate trust, whether in abundance or in the lack of it. The man's sin is not his wealth or his planning — Scripture commends prudence and does not condemn the accumulation of resources. What condemns this man is his complete failure to acknowledge God as the giver of the harvest or to consider any obligation beyond self-satisfaction. The soul-talk is theologically and culturally shocking — In the ancient world, deliberating entirely within oneself, speaking to one's own soul, would have registered as a form of insanity. The Greek construction itself strains to articulate the concept, underscoring how deeply abnormal it is to reason about life without God. The repetition of first-person pronouns is not incidental — "My crops, my barns, my grain, my goods" — five times in three verses. This is not poor stewardship; it is the theological posture of self-ownership, a categorical denial of creaturely dependence on the Creator. God's interruption in verse 20 is itself a theological statement — No private counsel is truly private. God, the judge of all the earth, hears every deliberation of the heart. His use of the word "fool" invokes the full weight of biblical wisdom literature: the one who says in his heart, "There is no God." The contrast is not wealth versus poverty, but two objects of trust — To be rich toward God means holding earthly goods with an open hand, whether one is wealthy or poor. Both the covetous rich and the anxiety-ridden poor are addressed by this parable, and both are called to the same posture of dependence on God. True productivity, like true wealth, is impossible without God — Drawing a thread to Jesse's affirmation of Redeeming Your Time by Jordan Raynor, the hosts note that one cannot rightly use wealth, time, or any other gift without first knowing and trusting the Giver. Key Concepts The Inclusio: Covetousness and Anxiety Are the Same Disease One of the most illuminating structural observations in this episode is Tony's identification of the literary inclusio surrounding the parable. Before the parable, Christ warns: "Take care, and be on your guard against all covetousness, for one's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions" (Luke 12:15). After the parable, he turns to his disciples and says: "Do not be anxious about your life, what you will eat, nor about your body, what you will put on. For life is more than food, and the body more than clothing" (Luke 12:22–23). These are not two separate concerns — they are the same spiritual disease expressed at opposite ends of the economic spectrum. The man who grasps for more and the man who lies awake worrying about having enough are both making the same fundamental error: they are finding, or attempting to find, their life's ultimate security in the material rather than in God. Autonomous Inner Counsel: The Insanity of Reasoning Without God When the rich man in the parable "reasoned to himself" and then spoke directly to his own soul, Jesus was not simply describing a man thinking through a logistical problem. He was depicting, in vivid and culturally jarring terms, the posture of the natural man before God — a man who, in the moment of his greatest blessing, seals himself off from the Creator entirely. The hosts note that in the ancient world, this kind of internal, autonomous deliberation would have registered as strange, even mad. The man does not consult Scripture, neighbor, elder, or God. He speaks only to himself. This is, as Jesse frames it, "the soliloquy of a completely autonomous man" — the pattern of Adam and Eve in the garden, reasoning about the world as though they were its own final authority. The folly is not that he thought about what to do with his harvest. The folly is that God was nowhere in the deliberation. Rich Toward God: The Gospel Punchline of the Parable The parable's final line — "So is the one who lays up treasure for himself and is not rich toward God" — is not merely a moral verdict. It is a gospel invitation. Tony is careful to point out that verse 21 does not condemn the act of storing up treasure in itself; it condemns storing up treasure for oneself and not being rich toward God. The contrast is between two orientations of the whole person. To be rich toward God is not primarily about giving money to the church, though generosity is surely implied. It is about recognizing that in Christ, the believer already possesses the only treasure that cannot corrode, be stolen, or be left behind at death. The soul that has been given Christ has been given everything. The soul that has only its barns has nothing — and one night, God will make that plain. Memorable Quotes He speaks to his own soul as though the soul — which is like the very seat of a person's relationship with God — could be satisfied by grain. — Jesse Schwamb Life does not consist in the abundance of possessions. That's the thesis statement of this parable. So the contrast is: what does life consist in? It consists in richness toward God. — Tony Arsenal This parable confronts every hearer, regardless of net worth, with a single diagnostic question: where has my soul quietly gone to find its rest? — Jesse Schwamb Full Transcript [00:00:57] Welcome to episode [00:01:00] 506 of the Reformed Brotherhood. I'm Jesse.  [00:01:04] Tony Arsenal: And I'm Tony, and this is the podcast with ears to hear. Hey, brother.  [00:01:09] Jesse Schwamb: Hey, brother. So on this episode, we're diving right back into the parables. We're gonna be in Luke chapter 12, and it's the parable of the rich fool, which is the story basically of a guy who has a bumper harvest, looks at his overflowing barns, and then thinks, "You know what this situation calls for? [00:01:28] More barns." Not a single thought given to his neighbors, to worship, to God who sent the rain in the first place, just barns. Bigger, better, badder barns  [00:01:38] Tony Arsenal: Battlestar Galactica. That's a lot of Bs. That's some good alliteration, though.  [00:01:44] Jesse Schwamb: I thought you'd enjoy that. And Jesus has something to say about this. It's for all of us, actually, and it might not be the thing you expect, but we're gonna talk about all that stuff. [00:01:52] Affirmations and Denials Setup [00:01:52] Jesse Schwamb: But of course, first, here's what everybody needs to do. Gather your loved ones around, get your hearts and your snacks together, 'cause it's [00:02:00] once again time to set forth in an orderly and confessional manner our considered judgments on the things of this world. It's time for affirmations and denials, that part of our conversation where we either affirm something by saying we like it, we enjoy it, it's great, or in contrast, we deny against something that just isn't so good. [00:02:18] So Tony, it's time for your doctrinal statements. Are you affirming with something or denying against something on our episode?  [00:02:26] Tony Arsenal: I don't know about a, I don't know about a doctrinal statement, but I'm affirming with something.  [00:02:29] Jesse Schwamb: Okay.  [00:02:29] Tony's Baked Pasta Win [00:02:29] Tony Arsenal: So you and I have talked before about how much we love the slow cooker meals. [00:02:33] Yes. And, uh, this isn't a slow cooker meal, uh, affirmation, but it is a food recommendation. Um, I've been making this baked pasta, this baked spaghetti dish, that is just so delicious. And the reason it works really well for our family is first, the kids love it, which is, uh, r- rare these days. We- With a two and a, a two-year-old and a four-and-a-half-year-old, they can be very, very selective about what they eat. [00:02:57] This is a consistent winner. Um, but also, like, [00:03:00] the amount that the recipe makes will do lunches and leftover dinners for all four of us for several days. So it's a super simple recipe. I'm actually, this might be a Reformed Brotherhood first, but I'm gonna put it in the show notes. I'm gonna put the recipe in the show notes. [00:03:13] Mm-hmm. And, uh, it's super simple. You just cook up 16 ounces of, you know, pasta. I did, uh, it's calls for spaghetti, but with toddlers it's a little easier if you do something like, um, like elbow noodles or I did bow ties tonight 'cause it was kinda fun and I could be like, "Hey, look, it's bow ties." Uh, it's, it's just some sort of, uh, macaroni product, you know, like a, a spaghetti, angel hair pasta, whatever you wanna use. [00:03:40] You put in two 24-ounce jars of marinara sauce or a pasta sauce. Uh, it calls for a bunch of spices, but you can also just get a pasta sauce that is already spiced. If you want a pasta sauce that has, like, mushrooms or extra basil or something, like, you can buy, like, a more flavored style of pasta sauce, and that'll add [00:04:00] some, uh, some texture to it. [00:04:02] You do two pounds of ground beef, which will cost you, like, $1,000 these days- ... but it's, it's worth it. You could replace it with ground turkey if you wanted to do something- Nice ... uh, a little bit less expensive or maybe something a little bit healthier. Um- You put in like two eight-ounce things of sour cream. [00:04:18] I think it calls- Ooh ... for 12 ounces, but I did, uh, I did 16 ounces today and it was extra creamy. And then just a mess of mozzarella, and you know, a mess of... You, you top it with mozzarella cheese- Nice. Nice ... and, uh, Parmesan. And then you just cover it with foil and bake it for a half hour, and then take the foil off and bake that, uh, for another 15 minutes to make sure that surface cheese is nice and crisp and, like, gooey and perfect. [00:04:42] Mm-hmm. Uh, and it's just, it's just good. It's getting to be that time of year where things are a little colder. Right. And, uh, we... Our, our home is heated by propane, which is expensive, and this time of year, like, I don't actually wanna turn the furnace on, but cooking a nice meal in the, in the stove just sort of takes the, [00:05:00] takes the, uh, edge out of the air a little bit. [00:05:02] So every element of it is great. And like I said, I'll, I'll eat this dish for lunch for the next, like, four days and I'll love every bit of it. So I'll put the recipe in the show notes. It's very easy to make. It's very, very good. If you got kids, it's a winner 'cause it's cheesy and gooey and it's fun. Um, and then you put a side of veggies with it, mixed veggies or spinach or whatever you want. [00:05:25] Uh, and it's just, it's just delicious. It's so, so good, Jesse. I can't even describe how good it is. Um, but it's, it's just really, really delicious. I've made it twice now and, uh, it's just easy. I'm not a very good cook. Your wife is a phenomenal cook, so she's probably able to, like- This is true ... she could probably tweak this recipe and make it, like, a real culinary masterpiece. [00:05:43] But you don't have to be a great cook to put this together. Right. You just boil the pasta, brown the beef, and then mix it all together and bake it for a little while and it's, it's really, really easy and good.  [00:05:52] Jesse Schwamb: I can at least vouch for how delicious it looks. You sent us a picture and it's exactly what you'd expect. [00:05:58] Like, it, it's [00:06:00] a big casserole dish of pasta, which I didn't know the recipe, so I can see it's elevated pasta, really. Got some things that- Yeah ... kinda just take it from, like, just out of the box stuff to something that's a little bit more decadent, and that's what you want.  [00:06:12] Cheese Talk and Recipe Tweaks [00:06:12] Jesse Schwamb: But I was immediately overcome by just the beautiful cascading... [00:06:17] A- as if covered by covenant itself, this pasta was just smothered- ... in this delici- like, not... A- and I don't wanna say, like, not, not too much cheese, like just the right amount. And I could tell it had been baked so that it was not just melted but got the crispiness. Here's what, this is the reason why I make such a big deal about the picture is because my wife is lactose intolerant, and I've learned you can, you can fall into a kind of version of Romans 1 with lactose intolerance. [00:06:44] If there's somebody who's a loved one- ... in particular, and by that I mean I, because we haven't had real cheese in a while, I thought, "I don't need real cheese. Like, we can get this fake stuff. It's, it's really good. It's, it's so delicious." And then you see a picture like that and I immediately thought, "I've exchanged the truth for a lie.[00:07:00] [00:07:00] I want cheese." "I want it so bad."  [00:07:03] Tony Arsenal: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, the cheese really is the... I mean, the, the secret to this is the sour cream. Um, I feel like that's really what, what sort of pushes it over the edge. Last time that I made it, the first time I made it, I didn't tell Ashley what was in it. She just knew it was like a baked p- pasta dish, and she was like, "This is so good and creamy, and I... [00:07:23] It's, like, it's really delicious." Um, the sour cream really kicks it over the edge. If, if anything, I would add a little more cheese than I used tonight. Um, it calls for a cup of cheese, which is a lot of cheese. That's eight ounces of cheese. A lot of cheese. Um, it's four ounces of cheese. Um, but I use a little bit more, and I actually think it could u- it could've used a little more mozzarella and make that inner, like, the in- middle gooey part a even more gooey and cohesive. [00:07:48] But it's good. It's really... It's a recipe that's hard to screw up. And even if you did it without cheese, if you just added sour cream or, um, even if you didn't do that, you just added something to sort of give it a little bit of an edge. You probably could do it with yogurt if you were [00:08:00] looking to save, uh, do something a little bit more healthy than sour cream. [00:08:03] Um, and it's one of those dishes, like, you can play with it. You can kinda mess around with it and change it up. Um- I saw one person online who was talking about this recipe who, uh, they, they sprinkled a little bit of cheddar cheese on top of it along with the mozzarella and it gave it a little bit of that sharpness. [00:08:17] So check it out. I'll post the recipe. It's very easy. Um, it was actually in a list of like easy meal plan. Ashley has this packet of like easy meals for busy moms kind of thing. Uh, and it, it takes a bit of time. This one is not one that you would wanna try to do, you know, after a work night trying to get the kids ready. [00:08:38] But again, it's one of those ones kind of like the slow cooker stuff we talk about. Like- Right ... once you get it set and you do it, then like you have leftovers for the week and it heats up real well. It reheats really well. Um, probably don't want to eat it cold because of the ground beef. Could, could get a, you know, get some food poisoning kind of stuff going on there, but it microwaves real well. [00:08:58] Uh, it's very delicious. [00:09:00] You, you know like sometimes when you microwave something, like it's, it dries out. Because this has like the sour cream and the, the marinara sauce, this doesn't really dry out. Um, and it, it stores really well in the refrigerator. You could probably freeze it if you really wanted to. [00:09:14] Uh, it's just really a versatile, easy to make dish. So I'll post the recipe.  [00:09:18] Telegram Tastings and Oreo Chaos [00:09:18] Tony Arsenal: Uh, this is one of those things we, we sometimes forget to talk about our Telegram chat until the very end of the episode, which is like the worst possible time to do a call to action- I know ... for a podcast. How dare we? Uh, we actually have a whole channel in our Telegram chat which you can access by going to t.me/reformedbrotherhood. [00:09:36] We have a whole channel just for tastings, and usually people will do things like hot wing tasting or this time of year sometimes like seasonal Oreos or seasonal candy bars come out or maybe someone gets a new beer or something like that. I would love to see some people make this recipe and do some tastings because maybe I'm overselling it. [00:09:53] Maybe I just love this and it's only so-so, but, uh, I'd love to see what the rest of the community thinks. So [00:10:00] t.me/reformedbrotherhood, make the baked pasta. Tell me what you think. I think it would be awesome.  [00:10:05] Jesse Schwamb: Yeah, there you go. There's all kinds of great things taking place out there, and this is that time of year. [00:10:09] Oreo won't stop. I mean, this could be our, the whole topic- I know ... of our conversation tonight, so I'm just gonna avoid it for the most part, but somebody needs to stop Oreo. I tried the Chicken and Waffles Oreo, and It was not good. Uh, maybe that should be my denial- No ... but it's not my denial, but it's not great. [00:10:26] It, well, it's complicated, guys. It's, it's kind of good because it tastes mostly, at least when I ate it... Okay, somebody be the judge. Go, go get some. Grab them from a friend. Do not go buy them yourself unless, like, you think- No ... this is something you're really gonna love. But, uh, and I'm gonna warn you, you probably won't. [00:10:43] But it, it'll taste delicious 'cause you'll be like, "Oh, this is like maple syrupy, and it tastes waffle-y." And then there was, like, something that happened in the back of my throat that was unnatural. It was like a spiciness or a clinginess or, like, a weird spice that I think was supposed to be an analog for chicken.[00:11:00] [00:11:00] Instead, all it was making me do was kinda just make this weird, like, phlegm-like sound as I was at work trying to recover quickly in front of people after eating this Oreo that sniped me. So I don't know where I was going with that except, uh, come hang out at the Telegram chat, everybody, because we've got all kinds of fun tastings there. [00:11:16] Somebody should grab those Oreos. We know you, you got these Oreos out there somewhere, loved ones. Post a little- Yeah ... uh, s- video of, uh, us, or for us, of you trying them  [00:11:26] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, I, I find that anything that is trying to emulate a savory flavor that doesn't actually include that savory flavor is usually pretty gross. [00:11:38] And I think it's- Dangerous ... 'cause it's like, it's not like they're putting real chicken into the Oreos. Oh, please no. It's- Yes ... it's like they just have some sort of chemical that tricks your brain, tries to trick your brain into thinking it tastes like chicken. Which with as many things that taste like chicken as there are, you would think that'd be a pretty easy one to nail, but, uh, I'm not even gonna try the Oreo waffles- It's weird [00:11:57] or Chicken waffle. It's weird. May- maybe somebody will like it That sounds [00:12:00] disgusting and-  [00:12:01] Jesse Schwamb: Yes. Yes. I agree. I agree. All right, I'll take-  [00:12:04] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, it was actually, it was actually a, a Coke Oreo, uh, uh, partnership that originally spawned our tasting channel, wasn't it? Yes. I think it was like the... I don't remember what flavor it was, but it was like a Dr. [00:12:17] Pepper flavored Oreo or an Oreo flavored Coke or something like that- Yes ... that was just a, just a total outcome of the fall. It was just disgusting.  [00:12:26] Jesse Schwamb: It is.  [00:12:26] Tony Arsenal: So-  [00:12:26] Jesse Schwamb: Here, so- But ... I don't wanna be too conspiratorial, but I have a theory about this. My theory is that Oreo knows that all they have to do is entice people enough for every person to buy one package of these things, knowing that they may never buy them again, and they'll still make a, a, like bandits. [00:12:41] And maybe it's even better because everything is more expensive these days. So you can't just go with what's normal. So you've gotta like really say, "Well, I'll just, I'll get this one package of Chicken & Waffles Oreos 'cause I'll never get it again. I'm willing to splurge on it." And the joke's on us, loved ones. [00:12:55] Like, we're all out here just throwing Oreos into the trash because ... [00:13:00] that tastes so funky. Maybe not. Somebody go tell me if I'm wrong. Somebody s- go out there and say, "Yes. Listen, these, these are the best Oreos I've, I've ever had."  [00:13:11] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, this reminds me back, way back in my, my Reformed pub days, which I don't like to admit how long ago that was 'cause it makes me feel really old. [00:13:19] But, um, there was a, a long time when, uh, Not Your Father's Root Beer or Not Your Dad's Root Beer, whatever it was, I don't remember what the specific, uh, brand was, but there was a, like a brand of, um, of like alcohol root beer. I think it was like Not Your Father's Root Beer or Not Your Dad's Root Beer or something like that. [00:13:39] It was  [00:13:39] Jesse Schwamb: horrible.  [00:13:40] Tony Arsenal: And it was so awful that it was actually a trend for a while. Man, this, these were the good old days where people had enough money to do stupid stuff like this. But it was a trend for a while where people would buy it just to film themselves dumping it down the drain. And it's like, it's like, yeah, nobody has money for that anymore, but- Yeah [00:13:59] uh, some things are [00:14:00] just so terrible that it's almost... I think you might be right. Like, it's so bad that people buy it to just try it to see how bad it is. Yes. And Oreo s- someone has calculated that, like, they can get enough people to buy it just on the reputation of how terrible it is that they'll still turn a profit on this limited edition run, uh, terrible Oreo Fusion thing. [00:14:23] Um, yeah. Anyway, we could talk about terrible Oreo Fusions- Yeah ... all night, every night, 'cause there's a lot of them and they're gross. But we don't wanna do that, 'cause that's probably not great podcasting. So Jesse, what are you affirming or denying? And I'm gonna be really embarrassed if what you're denying is Oreo Fusion- [00:14:39] cookies. But, uh, what are you affirming or denying tonight?  [00:14:43] Jesse Schwamb: It's not.  [00:14:44] Jesse's Productivity Book Pick [00:14:44] Jesse Schwamb: I think you and I are somewhat, we're interested in productivity, are we not? Mm-hmm. We've actually talked about that a great deal on this podcast. And so I'm hesitant to bring this up because there are so many books, there are so many podcasts. [00:14:56] What more could possibly be said? And so when I came across this book called [00:15:00] Redeeming Your Time by Jordan Rainer with the subtitle Seven Biblical Principles for Being Purposeful, Present, and Wildly Productive, I thought, "Come on. Um, do we really need this book?" And I read it, and I'm really glad that I did. [00:15:13] And my affirmation is exactly his work here. Because it's a little bit like presuppositional apologetics meets Cal Newport and David Allen. He, in fact, one of the things I love is if you're interested in just being more productive or maybe you don't even know what that is, I do recommend you get this book because he basically has synthesized, and he says this, a lot of that writing into one place. [00:15:37] He gives you really practical things. But this is by far the most Christian perspective, I would say that the most Reformed perspective I have ever read on productivity, and I took way more from this book than I ever anticipated I would. To that end, just to give a taste, I wanna read just a couple sentences that are part of his introduction. [00:15:55] This is what Jordan Rainer writes, "Jesus offers you peace before you do anything." [00:16:00] Nearly every time management expert says that the path to peace and productivity is found in implementing his or her system. This is what we might call work space productivity, which claims that if you do exercises X, Y, and Z, then you'll find peace. [00:16:12] This book begins with the opposite premise in what we might call grace-based productivity, which says that through Jesus Christ, we already have peace, and we do time management exercises of X, Y, and Z as a response to worship. And basically, the whole premise of his book is that the most unproductive thing you can do in life is live it without God. [00:16:32] So this is missional. It's intensely practical. Like, he's gonna take you through his own strategy, which really he says, and he gives attribution to so many other authors and experts in the field, that he is synthesizing some of their ideas, but he's doing it under the auspice of the gospel. And this is the first book I've ever found that has this type of final chapter. [00:16:53] There's a whole section on being sure not to make productivity an idol. So this is, like, a really [00:17:00]lovely book. It's incredibly challenging. It's so thoughtful, but it's filled with doxological kind of content that leads me to want to be more productive, not because we have to do productive to, or pr- be productive to, of course, earn anything before God. [00:17:13] Not even that we should feel guilty if we're not, but out of God's grace, He gives us tools, and this feeds our desire to serve and then do so effectively. And so I think that if you have any interest in what it might look like for you, if you're feeling burned out, tired, distracted from things in life, uh, you really should read this. [00:17:32] It'll be worth your time. So wherever books are sold, we're not getting, uh, any kind of commission on this. Just go find Redeeming Your Time by Jordan Rainer. And again, go to the Telegram group. Let us know what you think about it.  [00:17:46] Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  [00:17:47] Grace Based Productivity Discussion [00:17:47] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, you know, I think, um, there was a time period where hustle culture or productivity culture was really, really in for Christians. [00:17:57] Jesse Schwamb: Right.  [00:17:57] Tony Arsenal: And, um, I, I think even [00:18:00] in secular, secular domains, non-Christian domains where productivity, hustle culture is kind of, um, is a, a focus, even in those circles and even in those circumstances, the literature and the, the people who are doing blogs and, and YouTube channels, even those people are starting to recognize that we did put hustle culture and, like, being, like, hustling, we, we put that on a pedestal and made it, like, the goal- Right [00:18:31] instead of recognizing, like, the whole point behind, um, behind productivity is it's actually to keep your priorities straight. Right. It's, you know, it's, it's you, you work hard to get things done so that you have time to do the things you wanna do, or so that you are actually able to accomplish the goals you want to accomplish. [00:18:53] And a lot of people have commented, both in Christian circles and non-Christian circles, that we made getting a lot [00:19:00] of things done... And I, like, I don't wanna blame David Allen for this, but, like, this is the name of his book, right? Getting things done was the goal, not the vehicle to the goal. Right. I don't think David Allen would take that approach. [00:19:10] I think actually he's, he's much more grounded than a lot of his sorta, like, successors. But the, the, the switch to turn productivity into an end in itself has really just caused people to burn out. Like, you can only hustle for so long before you need a rest. So it's really refreshing to hear that there's a good Christian work out there that's latching onto that and is actually bringing God's truth and the gospel to bear on it. [00:19:34] That's, that's a book that I, um, I should definitely check out.  [00:19:37] Jesse Schwamb: I highly recommend it. I'm actually going to ... I'm grabbing a copy for a friend of mine who is, I would say, like a nominal Christian. We've had lots of conversations, and he's admitted that he grew up kind of in the Christian faith, has walked away from it, and just, he's one of these guys who knows so much about it, has all the head knowledge, and says things like, "I'll, you know, I'll come back to God eventually." [00:19:56] And it just so happens, he's big into productivity, and he's always [00:20:00] finding that whatever he's reading is really falling short. And so I'm just gonna get this as a gift for him and just say, "Here you go, man." 'Cause I, 'cause the one thing I can say about this book for anybody who's read a lot of productivity stuff, is this is something unlike you've read before when it comes to productivity. [00:20:13] Yeah. Because it is so gospel-centered. The first opening, the whole opening gambit is, like, you can't ... How can you be pr- productive if you don't know the, the or- the origin or, like, the father of time himself? And I'm like, wow. Yeah. Okay, here we go. Let's talk about it. And then you'll be halfway through, and he's given you all of this, uh, format, framework, and structure for how to set your calendar, how to modify your time. [00:20:34] Like, so it's the best of both worlds. You, you get a lot, but what I love is it's very presuppositional. It's like you cannot be productive in life, you cannot find your missional purpose, dist- to understand your calling, and then from there break down your quarterly goals and then your tasks. It's really a lovely way of tying everything back to the gospel, and he goes hard by saying, "Listen, you can, you have a say in directing your calling. [00:20:57] You do not have a say in your mission. That comes [00:21:00] from God himself, who defines who you are and what it means to be human and what it's like to relate to him." And I found that to be just overwhelmingly refreshing, like you said. So I hope that people will pick this up and read it for themselves, but I could see this being, like, a really lovely introduction to the gospel to many who are just interested in how to tackle life better. [00:21:20] And the beautiful thing about the, the Bible is it tells us the truth about the way things are. And so, like you and I have talked about before so many times, Tony, like, there's so much common grace that, of course, all these studies are just f- are kind of, are directly connected to this gospel truth of what it means to do good work and to do it as an act of worship before God. [00:21:38] That's where we find our fulfillment, of course, is in worshiping him, and part of our productivity is that part of worship. So there's a lot of good things to, that could be said there. But I think it's, this has, like, book club written all over it, guys. Get, just get it. Get a bunch of people together. Just book club this bad boy all over the place. [00:21:57] That's, that's my-  [00:21:58] Tony Arsenal: Yeah ...  [00:21:58] Jesse Schwamb: my full affirmation. [00:22:00] [00:22:01] Tony Arsenal: Yeah. And, and one last thing I'll say in response to that, I love the idea of giving this book to someone almost as, like, an evangelistic tool. Yeah. Because I think there are a lot of people who, um, life is so busy and everybody is trying to get things done that especially people who already kinda operate in productivity circles, productivity mindsets, they're always looking for the next system that can fix the problem. [00:22:27] Jesse Schwamb: Yes.  [00:22:28] Tony Arsenal: And, like, no system can fix the problem. That's probably part of the point of this book. But, like, everybody's looking for, like, the next system that will give them that, like, 2% efficiency boost or, like, that 5% efficiency boost or whatever it is. And so even though they may never pick up a book that is theological and it's about the gospel, if you give them this book and be like, "This guy's got a really unique perspective on it, man. [00:22:48] I really think it can help you really, you know, I think he- there's some useful insight for your productivity system"- Right ... they'll read that book. They'll put it in their calendar- Yes, I agree ... they'll time block it out. I agree. And they'll read it, and they'll [00:23:00] read it to completion, 'cause that's how people who operate in these circles tend to be. [00:23:04] Uh, so you'll get the gospel in there. So I think that's a really great, uh, a really great tool that people could think about using.  [00:23:10] Jesse Schwamb: Yeah. It's like their productivity, or it's like the gospel Trojan horse through productivity. But it's, it's the truth. Yeah, yeah. This is the truth. And that's what I loved about it. [00:23:18] It was unashamed in that this is the way life works, and God is over all, and you've gotta understand these things if, if you wanna be productive. If you wanna know the truth, you've gotta understand the truth. It's gotta be presented to you. And in point of fact, I mean, that's what we're talking about in this whole conversation. [00:23:35] Luke 12 Rich Fool Reading [00:23:35] Jesse Schwamb: In fact, everybody- Yeah ... at Love Ones, drop what you're doing, come find us in Luke chapter 12. That's where we are. And we're getting this thing kicked off because Jesus tells this whole parable about a rich fool in response to a man in the crowd demanding that he settle an inheritance dispute. And as Jesus often does, he refuses to be a judge or an arbiter over earthly po- property, and instead he turns this whole thing to warn against [00:24:00]covetousness, the insatiable grasping after more. [00:24:03] Which, in some ways, is maybe more directly tied into this whole discussion about productivity than I thought. But the parable then follows... It's really not about money management, and that's, you... I've heard this talked about in various ways. Instead, it's about the human heart's naive trust in itself rather than in God. [00:24:22] So I'm going to read for us a couple verses in Luke chapter 12 to start us off, and I'm gonna start in, I'm gonna say verse 13. And, uh, this is from Luke's gospel. "And someone from the crowd said to him, 'Teacher, tell my brother to divide the family inheritance with me.' But Jesus said to him, 'Man, who appointed me a judge or an arbiter over you?' [00:24:45] Then he said to them, 'Watch out and be on your guard against every form of greed. For not even when one has an abundance does his life consist of his possessions.' And he told them a parable, saying, 'The land of a rich man was very productive. [00:25:00] And he began reasoning to himself, saying, 'What shall I do, since I have no place to store my crops?' [00:25:05] Then he said, 'This is what I will do. I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have so many goods laid up for so many years to come. Take your ease. Eat, drink, and be merry."' But God said to him, 'You fool. This very night your soul is required of you. [00:25:27] And now who will own what you prepared?' So is the one who stores up treasure for himself and is not rich toward God."  [00:25:38] Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  [00:25:39] How to Misread This Parable [00:25:41] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, this is, um, this is one of those parables, again, maybe we'll put this in the category of parable with quotation marks. Um, this doesn't always even appear on lists of parables because it doesn't necessarily follow the same format, although he calls it a parable in the, the text here itself. [00:25:58] But in so- some sort [00:26:00] of, like, lists of parables would even say this isn't even in the same category. But, um, this one here is, is another one of those parables that if we, um, w- we talked about this, uh, last week and I think a, a couple, or last time and a couple times before that. The, the parables of Matthew, or in Matthew, the, the parables that Matthew collects of Christ's overall parabolic, you know, figurative speech ministry, almost all of them are very much oriented towards explaining the nature of the Kingdom of God, explaining the nature of, of how the Kingdom of God functions, how the Kingdom of God is currently breaking into the world, how the Kingdom o- of God will definitively and finally break into the world in the, in the eschaton. [00:26:43] Um, w- we can sometimes fall into a dangerous interpretive error if we assume that because Matthew's parables, which the bulk of the parables are in Matthew, right? Matthew has more parables than the rest of the Gospels, um, especially if you're talking about [00:27:00] unique parables. Um- Luke's parables, as we've seen them so far, at least the ones that don't overlap with Matthew, they're not necessarily oriented towards that same Kingdom of God understanding in the strictest sense. [00:27:14] So this parable is not, um... I've heard some that, some people who interpret this in light of the same kind of like, "Stay awake you foolish virgins" kind of theology- Right ... that we saw in, in, in Matthew. Um, this parable is not teaching that same message, at least not in the same way, right? Th- And again, this is not a parable about money management necessarily. [00:27:37] It's not a parable about, um, you know, I think we could fall into error on one side that this is like, "You fool, how dare you ever be concerned about your wealth and your finances and advancing your own wealth?"  [00:27:48] Jesse Schwamb: Right.  [00:27:48] Tony Arsenal: Versus the other side where it's like, uh, you know, people are like, "Well, the foolish part of this is A, B, or C." [00:27:56] This is really a parable about a lot of other things that we're [00:28:00] gonna unpack. But if we read it as a sort of like eschatological parable, which it sort of feels that way, it feels a little bit like it's a sort of final eschatology or a personal eschatology parable. Uh, again, it's not to say there's not elements that speak to that, but if we read this as like some sort of, um, if you don't give away all your resources, if you don't give away all your money, if you're not thinking in terms of a life of poverty, then you're condemned. [00:28:23] If we read it in light of that, that's not right. Right. If we read it in light of sort of like wealth planning strategies, which, you know, this is kind of like the financial version of the Daniel diet, like just taking it totally out of its context, we really can sort of run aground on some bad, some bad interpretive strategies. [00:28:41] Jesse Schwamb: I'm with you on that.  [00:28:42] First Observations and Themes [00:28:42] Jesse Schwamb: All those alternatives seem to really denigrate it, don't they? They cheapen what's here because it's not about what's on the face, and I think that's why it's worth talking about, because there's so much underneath. Which we always say, but I think it becomes more and more plain the more we really try to understand what's at stake, what the commentary is really being produced. [00:29:00] And this, I think, is maybe Jesus could have taken any number of situations or circumstances. He just happens to use this one of property in particular, especially 'cause he was given the entry point, to emphasize something about the sovereignty and responsibility of God, but also our relationship towards him. [00:29:17] I suppose what it means, of course, to be rich in God, which is the pun sign. What I notice like immediately in this is that Luke tells us something like before the man even ever speaks, and that is like the whole point of his wealth, everything he has, is because the ground produced- Like the increase is not attributed to this guy's skill or his labor or even his shrewdness. [00:29:39] And like you said, Tony, we've, we've been in other parables where there's been a lot more commentary about the characters involved, that's been a part of this. All of that- Yeah ... is, is just given.  [00:29:46] Providence And Ingratitude [00:29:46] Jesse Schwamb: Like everything he has is just gi- literally given to him. It's given in the t- passage, it's given to him in this circumstance. [00:29:52] And there is like, I think, a doctrine, even from the start here, I'm seeing like this flavor of like this doctrine of providence like in miniature. Like [00:30:00] every harvest, every dividend, every windfall is, in the biblical worldview, the fruit of God's sustaining and governing hand. And so I love that like that's how I think Jesus opens this up. [00:30:10] And so we're gonna see like the tragedy of the parable is that the man who receives this gift will never once acknowledge the giver. And there's all of this ingratitude, which I think often is like the root beneath every sin. And in this story we see the man enjoys God's bounty while essentially erasing God from the picture entirely, and that's how we start  [00:30:32] Tony Arsenal: Yeah. [00:30:32] Parable Framed By Warnings [00:30:32] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, and there's this other... A- and, um, maybe to, not to bury the lead and maybe, I don't know, maybe this is a spoiler warning for the rest of our episode, but it's, if you read this parable, um, you know, what, what do we always say when a, when a passage is a little bit confusing or it's unclear? Read a little bit more, right? [00:30:48] Read a little in front, read a little after, and it usually is pretty clear what's getting said here. So when we look at in front of this, Christ tells you what the point of this parable is. Like, He's using this [00:31:00] parable to explain a previous statement, and that statement is, "Take care and be on your guard against all covetousness, for one's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions." [00:31:10] Right? Right. So the parable explains that statement in parable form. And if we read just a little bit after, and I'm sure we'll, we'll get to it more in depth, but He says to His disciples in verse 22, "And He said to His disciples, 'Therefore I tell you, do not be anxious about your life, what you will eat, nor about your body, and what you will put on. [00:31:29] For life is more than food, and the body is more than clothing.'" Right? So those two statements, right? Life does not consist in the abundance of possession, in the front, and life is more than food, and the body more than clothing. Those are parallel statements. And usually we look at, this is a, a literary technique called an inclusio, right? [00:31:49] What an inclusio is, is you have a statement at the beginning of a passage or a beginning of a text, and then a similar or sometimes identical or parallel statement after the text [00:32:00] that sort of shows you, it's almost like a chapter break, right? Sometimes, um, that's used to show you where the chapter is. [00:32:07] Sometimes it actually helps us to clarify these statements by recognizing them as inclusios. We see that the pre- the statement before the parable and the statement after the parable are essentially the same statement because they're being used to form this inclusio. Uh-huh. So the fact that we need to be aware, be on guard against covetousness, and the fact that we should not be anxious about our possessions, about our life, about our material things, the not being anxious and the be- being aware of covetousness, those are the same thing. [00:32:36] Or they're s- they're largely similar, largely substantially the same things. Which we did an episode when we were going through our, like, five-year-long systematic theology, um, series. Um, we did a s- we did a, a handful of episodes on, um, on the Ten Commandments, and so I would encourage you to go back and listen to the episode on covetousness because we covered all this, [00:33:00] right? [00:33:00] Whether it's being anxious in terms of, um, being insecure in your material wealth, being insecure in what God has provided for you and not being thankful, you know, kind of almost resenting God because of your lack, that's a form of covetousness. Or whether- Right ... covetousness is taking more of a traditional format of wanting something that someone else has. [00:33:20] Um, both of those things represent a violation of the ninth commandment. And so this parable here is... And I think this will get to where you're, where you've been sort of leading us. This parable here is designed to help his listeners, and primarily hi- like, this guy, right? He's trying to teach this guy, but also he turns to his disciples after this and launches into another section and a further explanation of this concept. [00:33:47] It's here to help us understand not just, you know, the fact that, like, my material we- my material, uh, wealth doesn't really help me after I die. Like, yeah, you can't take it with you. Okay, [00:34:00] maybe that's part of this. Right. Maybe it's kind of the, you know, 1 Corinthians 6, "Don't build on s- don't build out of straw," you know, like, things are gonna burn away, just what you build on a s- on foundation will stay. [00:34:11] Not Wealth But Trust [00:34:11] Tony Arsenal: But more so this is about understanding satisfaction and contentment in whatever it is that God has blessed us with, right? That's right. So this is not a con- condemnation of those who are wealthy. This guy's not condemned because he had a bumper crop and because he's wealthy. Right. He's not even condemned explicitly because he's trying to plan for the future, right? [00:34:30] There's lots of things, to kind of go to the productivity thing. There's nothing wrong with planning for the future. Right. There's nothing wrong with saying, "I had a really good harvest year, and I'm gonna need bigger barns to store all this stuff, to, like, keep all this stuff." It's, it's as I think you're leading us to, it's this seemingly total unawareness that the, the bumper crop comes with certain kinds of, like, obligations and entailments- Right [00:34:56] beyond just I'm gonna celebrate and enjoy my [00:35:00] own wealth for wealth's sake.  [00:35:02] Jesse Schwamb: Right. It's what all of this circumstance reveals about this man, his heart, where he finds his assurance and confidence. So I like where we're going with this. So you're right, if you look at the passage immediately preceding and subsequent, what you'll find is that beautiful... [00:35:16] Well, this is an Oreo sandwich. Unfortunately, we're back to where we started, because we've got- ... w- one cookie is the warning, avoid covetousness. The other cookie is the don't be worried, and the cream in the filling here is assurance or confidence. That is, like, where does our true wealth lie? But more and bey- beyond that, like, where can we hang our hats, so to speak? [00:35:36] Like, what is it that we can be confident that we, we can rest secured in?  [00:35:41] Autonomous Inner Counsel [00:35:41] Jesse Schwamb: And so we get some of the betrayal of the fact that this man is looking at the wrong things, even from that first verse. And then by the time, like, this interesting, this whole internal mon- monologue begins, I think again, like, it's, it's telling to me that he deliberates, like, entirely by himself. [00:35:56] And I think, like, this is kind of this interesting posture of the [00:36:00] natural man that is described in Romans, like, 1, where there's, like, kind of functional, practical atheism. You know? He doesn't ask, like you were saying, Tony, like, "What does the Lord require of me with this abundance?" He doesn't consult scripture, neighbor, or God. [00:36:13] He consults only himself. Which honestly I think is a temptation for us all. Like, that can be our defa- default mode in situations similar to this, where we first start to reason among and with ourselves. And this is, like, the soliloquy of a completely autonomous man who thinks he has his own agency. It's like the very pattern of Adam and Eve in the garden reasoning about the world as though they were its final authority. [00:36:37] So here, you're right. We're, we're getting set up with it's not the circumstances that condemn this man. It's essentially how he behaves, where he puts his trust within those circumstances.  [00:36:48] Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  [00:36:49] Soul Talk As Insanity [00:36:49] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, and, you know, I've, I've heard, um, and I, I have not validated this myself, so take it with a little bit of a grain of salt. [00:36:56] But there's, there's something, um... I've heard it from [00:37:00] multiple sources, multiple reliable resources that I trust, that this sort of phrase in the middle where it's like he says to his soul or he says to- Yes ... himself, there's something about that that is sort of almost like a form... Uh, I've heard it said, like, that would've been f- viewed as, like, a form of insanity- Mm [00:37:18] in the ancient world. And we've commented this, on this before. Like, um- A large portion of the population doesn't have an internal monologue. And I think, um, i- if I remember right, it's actually, like, a larger portion, it's like a majority portion of the world doesn't have an internal monologue. And what that means is... [00:37:39] A- and hopefully there's some people in our audience that are like, "Oh, yeah, I don't, I, I don't even know what you're talking about when you say an internal monologue." And it's hard for people who are in one side of this to even conceptualize what it would be like to be on the other side of this. But there are people who, um, when they think, they're essentially speaking to themselves. [00:37:59] And then there's people [00:38:00] who, when they think, a- and I, again, I don't even know how to describe this, they don't have an internal monologue. They're not, they're not speaking to themselves in their minds I think, um, probably part of the reason that this was so, is, was seen as so crazy in the ancient world is in the ancient world, uh, the... [00:38:18] I'm getting really far afield here. I'll try to bring it back. Um, in the ancient world, because people didn't read as much, they don't have that internal monologue. The prominence of people being able to read, and especially being able to read to themselves, which is something that even as early as 100, 200 years ago just wasn't common to be able to read to yourself. [00:38:37] If you wanted to read, you would have to read out loud. To be able to just read in your mind, because when we read in our mind, we're speaking words to ourselves, I think our, our, um, culture has trained itself where more, more and more people have this internal monologue. But in the ancient world, this idea that someone would say to themselves or, like, speak to their own selves or sort of [00:39:00] ponder this internally was, has... [00:39:03] Like I said, I haven't validated this independently. I haven't done the research myself, but enough resources that I've read that I trust to have done that have said this. That was itself seen as a little bit of a, of a anomaly and sort of almost a form of insanity. Right. And so I think we've commented that a lot of times the parables have this point in them or this turning point where somebody does something that is sorta crazy. [00:39:29] Like, it's a little bit- Right ... out there, right? You think of the parable of the prodigal son, prodigal father, whatever, however you wanna call it. The idea that, like, the father sort of debases himself and runs out to greet the son, or even the fact that, like, when this, when this selfish son asks for his inheritance, that his father just gave it to him before he died, that is uncharacteristic and would've been seen as a little bit weird or a lot a bit weird. [00:39:55] This idea that this guy stops to sort of self-reflect [00:40:00] by himself entirely internally, right? The little- Right ... literal Greek, and so some translations say this, "So I said to my soul." Even- Right ... um, even that language of, um, almost having to externalize your internal thoughts. He's not... It doesn't say, "So he thought about it himself." [00:40:21] He had to say to his soul. He had to speak to himself. Even the language shows you that the Greek language doesn't have good construction to even be able to articulate what it would be like to think to yourself or to just mull it over internally. That is a strange function here, and it gets at what you've been saying. [00:40:41] He doesn't pause to pray about it. He doesn't pause to go to the gates of the city and speak with the elders. He doesn't connect with his wife. He doesn't ask anybody. He doesn't consult anybody. He does this sort of insane thing that even the Greek language doesn't have words for and has to sort of create this new [00:41:00] construction. [00:41:00] Right. He just stops. He thinks to himself. He speaks to his own soul. And, and then it, like, sort of paints this picture of him saying it out loud. "I said to my soul, 'Soul-  [00:41:10] Jesse Schwamb: Right. ...  [00:41:11] Tony Arsenal: what should I do?'" Like, it's, it's this sort of, like, weird sort of- Weird ... insane, strange feature that we don't pause to think about because we have this internal monologue. [00:41:21] We have this internal dialogue with ourselves, and so we don't think that that's unusual. But that's actually probably one of the main points of the parable is there is this strange feature where this guy doesn't pause to consult with anyone or anything about what he should do with this bumper crop. [00:41:39] He just Acts on his own behalf, thinks through his own behalf. And that should be the key to us that like, hmm, we really should think about what is the point here.  [00:41:49] Jesse Schwamb: Yeah. You, you stole what I was gonna say. The soul thing is the super weird thing. I'm glad you already brought it up because when I read this, you can get through most of it and say, "Okay, that's interesting. [00:41:58] Interesting story." And then you get to him [00:42:00] being like, "Hey, soul." And you're like, "Say what?" Yeah. Like, "Who are you talking to? Why are you talking that way? Why are you being so weird about this?"  [00:42:06] Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  [00:42:06] My Barns My Goods [00:42:06] Jesse Schwamb: So, like, there's the ju- the just sheer, like, selfishness, and then there's this... It gets escalated, elevated to this, like, soul self-talk, which is super weird, and deliberate, I think, in Jesus' telling of this. [00:42:18] So, like, you're right. You got this repetition of all these, in Greek, like, first person pronouns: my crops, my barns, my grain, my goods. I just counted here five times in three verses we've got either I or my. So it's not simply, like, poor stewardship. It's the theological posture of self-ownership. It's like t- complete denial of the creature's fundamental dependence on the creator. [00:42:38] And then, as if that's not enough, you get this whole verse 19, "Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years. Relax, eat, drink, and be merry." And you wanna say, "Who are you talking to, man?" So, like, here I think this folly reaches a full and fatal expression to me because he speaks to his own, his own soul as though the soul, which is like the [00:43:00] very seat of a person's relationship with God, could be satisfied by grain. [00:43:05] And so I think this is, like, the fundamental conclusion that Reformers labored to expose. It's really like mistaking the gifts of common grace for the substance of ultimate security. He's trying to create this cookie with all this cream in the middle, but he has nothing there. There's, there's nothing to fill it. [00:43:20] It's like, it's like Augustine's dictum stands over this entire verse like a judgment. The heart is restless until it finds rest in God. And guess what? No barn, however large, can hold whatever only God can give. And so, like, the man's error is not that he planned for the future, like we've been saying. [00:43:36] Scripture commends some prudence. But that he planned as though there were no God to whom he must give account and no eternity beyond the granary, and then beyond that, he takes responsibility for his own soul and tries to self-soothe that soul. My word, I could barely say that. He tries to soothe his own soul in a way to give it confidence merely by the things he owns, separating himself from the [00:44:00] creator, the one who has given him all these things. [00:44:02] It is, I think, Tony, like you said, absolute insanity. It's certainly like insanity raised up against the spiritual man, and yet to the natural man, this seems like... Even in our modern day, in a contemporary context, this seems like the reasonable thing to do, the reasonable thing, to take charge of yourself and to be happy with yourself and to be content with what you provided and to have security in that, and yet this is the great- greatest kind of foolishness that possibly there ever is. [00:44:28] Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  [00:44:30] Enjoy Gifts Not Idols [00:44:30] Tony Arsenal: Yeah, and I think too, um, you know, the, this, um This is sometimes taught as though, like we've alluded to and said a couple times, it's taught as though the act of saving or, like, investing or even in this case, like, sort of taking a strange risk to try to propel your wealth forward, this is sometimes taught as though the point of this is that you shouldn't do those things. [00:44:56] Right. Like, the act of saving your wealth is [00:45:00] somehow... Like, saving things up or investing or taking a risk is somehow contrary to biblical wisdom and biblical prudence, and I don't, I don't think that's at all the point of the parable, right? And we've, we've pointed out that this parable is sandwiched or Oreo cookied by, you know, beware of covetousness, life does not exist in your possessions, or the satisfaction of life does not exist in your possessions, and then do not be anxious, life is more than food, the body more than clothing. [00:45:28] And the, the, the key phrase here in terms of where this guy's mistake is, not only is the mistake in the idea that, like, he's not c- thinking about what should I do with this in reference to my neighbor or what should I do with this in reference to God. There seems to be no consideration of that at all. [00:45:44] But what he intends to do with it in relation to those statements is entirely self-focused. And it's not, it's not the case at all. Please don't hear me saying it's not okay to enjoy the [00:46:00] fruit of your labor, right? There's all sorts of things in the Bible, lots of teaching in the Bible, um, about the fact that when we work hard and we reap a financial benefit, whether it's in, in this sort of like ancient culture, it's a, you know, a concrete financial benefit, or whether it's in our more modern culture where, like, we just, we gather more money which is sort of like a, I don't know, it's like a social contract of m- evaluating our labor. [00:46:25] Whatever it is, w- it's okay to use your wealth in ways that drives satisfaction. It's okay to enjoy wealth. Like, go buy a nice steak. Go get a nice bottle of wine. Take your wife out for dinner. Go on vac- Like, those things are fine. Buy a nice car. Go on vacation. Those things are fine, provided you're not finding your enjoyment and your satisfaction and, and ultimately that you are not doing those things as the final end of existence. [00:46:53] Right. Right? The, the point that he's making to this young man who says, "Tell my brother to divide the inheritance with me," [00:47:00] is, like, you are finding or trying to find your life's ultimate satisfaction in your wealth or in this, like in the wealth that you think you deserve. The flip side of the disciples is, like, your entire life seems to be driven by the fact that you feel like you don't have enough food or you don't have the right clothing. [00:47:21] So the idea that, like, our satisfaction or our security is found in the abundance of our possessions, that is what this parable is railing against Right With a little bit of, I think a little bit of a gospel call here, right? Yeah. There's, there's this element, and this is, maybe this is unique. I don't, I don't, I can't think off the top of my head another parable where God himself is actually in the parable. [00:47:49] I think this is somewhat unique, if not entirely unique- Right ... where God himself now is in the parable saying, "Fool, this night your soul is required of you, and the things you've [00:48:00] prepared, whose will they be?" So this idea that on the one side, those who have abundance are warned against finding their sat- their ultimate satisfaction in the abundance of their possessions, and on the flip side, those who lack abundance are warned against, uh, an utter sense of insecurity in the lack of their abundance. [00:48:22] Jesse Schwamb: Right.  [00:48:23] Tony Arsenal: In the middle there is this chastisement for both of those groups, basically saying your life and your satisfaction and security should be found in the fact that you belong to God and that God is your God. I think that's probably the ultimate payout of this parable, is this idea that like, yeah, whether you have a lot, whether you have a little, whether you have enough, whether you don't have enough, whether you are able to be sort of like enjoying luxury items versus just scraping by or not even scraping by, those [00:49:00] are two realities, and there are Christians who exist in both of those realities. [00:49:04] And some people might push back on this a little bit, but those realities are, are neutral morally, right? You can be rich and, uh, and still be a faithful Christian. You can be poor and still be a faithful Christian. I guess we can probably have some conversation at some point about which of those states it's easier to be a faithful Christian in. [00:49:25] But the fact is, like, you can be in either of those states and still be a faithful follower of God.  [00:49:30] Jesse Schwamb: Right.  [00:49:31] Tony Arsenal: As long as you're not finding your satisfaction or being overwhelmed by insecurity in either of those states, I think, uh, I think you, you, you, you can do both of them. And it's actually funny because... [00:49:44] Maybe not funny. It's interesting. Um, it's also possible to be satisfied in the lack of your possessions, if I can even put it that way, right? There are those who have sort of like placed their security and their ultimate satisfaction in sort of [00:50:00] their poverty or their minimalism, and there are those who are, like, anxious about the fact that they're wealthy. [00:50:06] This parable speaks to all of those things on every level saying, "No, no, no, no, no," like, your relationship to your possessions is not the point. Right. The point is your relation to God and whether you are his children and whether he is your God.  [00:50:21] Jesse Schwamb: Right.  [00:50:21] God Interrupts The Fool [00:50:21] Jesse Schwamb: Yeah, there's multi-factor foolishness at play here for sure. [00:50:24] It starts with this idea that he's not crediting, he's not giving attribution, he doesn't understand that he's actually a contingent being and that God provides all these things. Then, like we said, there's this elevation, like you've just talked about, where it moves. That would be- Really foolish enough. [00:50:41] But what's even more foolish is to say to one's own soul, "You know what? Sit back, chill, be confident because you've done all the things. You have all the right stuff. You don't need to worry about anything." Almost implying, like, you can live forever. Just hang out. You have everything that you need, and you did it all yourself. [00:50:58] And so in verse 20, where God [00:51:00] interrupts and speaks to him directly, is amazing because He goes right into, first of all, right into the man's private counsel. So it's a good reminder that no soliloquy is ever truly private. We have the judge of all the earth. He hears every deliberation of the heart, and then He addresses him by this word fool, which, of course, you and I have talked about. [00:51:18] Like, in the Bibl- vocabulary, it's not just, like, an insult abo

Send us Fan MailIn this episode, Jesse Schreck revisits a foundational teaching from the Practical Missions Cohort archives: the indispensable role of the biblical church in the work of missions. Following a recent ministry trip to Switzerland—where Jesse reflected on the history of the Reformation and the sacrifice of believers who stood for the truth of adult baptism—this discussion cuts to the heart of what genuine gospel ministry looks like.Many modern mission efforts operate independently of the local church or prioritize humanitarian aid over the Great Commission. Jesse argues that without a correct, robust ecclesiology, mission work risks becoming unbiblical or ineffective.In this episode, you will learn:How the Reformers defined a true church: Exploring the mark of the Word of God purely preached and the ordinances rightly administered.The "Nine Marks" of a healthy church: Why preaching, biblical theology, conversion, and discipline are not just institutional preferences, but vital components of a healthy body of Christ.The danger of weak foundations: Why a church that lacks a clear biblical structure at home cannot hope to plant a healthy, thriving church abroad.The centrality of the local body: How missions, from beginning to end, must be centered on gathering the lost into covenant communities that reflect the glory of God.If you have ever wondered why some mission efforts seem to yield little fruit or why the "how" of church planting matters as much as the "what," this episode provides the necessary biblical correction.Resources mentioned in this episode:Nine Marks of a Healthy Church Practical Missions CohortMissions Academia Recommended Talk: The Work of a Sending Church (Feed My Sheep Podcast)More Links:Ask a MissionaryThe PracticumSupport Practical Missions Cohort or PartnerGet some PMc MerchLearn about Biblical Missions at the PMc Missions AcademiaRead about Biblical Missions at the PMc Missions BlogJesse's SubstackBecome a PMc AmbassadorJoin a PMc Short-term CohortFund the Mission FacilityPlan a Vision Trip to ItalyLearn about Long-Term Missions in ItalyConsider a Missionary InternshipJoin PMc's online Discord community - The Italian CohortFreely join the online Discord group of PMc! The Italian CohortSupport the showDo you love God, Italians, Italy, and the church of Jesus Christ? Do you want to play a more personal role in missions work abroad? Do you want to get all our content and updates (plus bonus material no one else sees) before anyone else? We invite you to join The Italian Cohort - our online community group on Discord - and gain inside access to the work going on in Italy. 

DID THE HOLY SPIRIT RETIRE? THE PROBLEM WITH CESSATIONISM Ryan Denton on Charismania, Cessationism, Impressions, Miracles, and the Leading of the Holy Spirit Fake healings. Phony prophecies. Televangelists demanding seed money. Reformed Christians have plenty of good reasons to reject charismania. But have we reacted so strongly that we have driven into the ditch on the other side? In this episode, Pastor Joseph Spurgeon and Zach Krugler sit down with Presbyterian pastor and evangelist Ryan Denton to examine cessationism, what Denton calls “hyper-cessationism,” and the ongoing work of the Holy Spirit. Did the closing of the canon mean God stopped leading His people through extraordinary providence, impressions, dreams, remarkable answers to prayer, or miracles? Can a Christian ever say, “I believe the Lord led me to do this”? How do we distinguish the Spirit’s leading from emotion, imagination, or indigestion? And what did the Reformers, Puritans, Scottish Covenanters, and Westminster divines actually believe? Denton argues that some modern Reformed Christians have adopted a form of cessationism stricter than the historic Reformed position. The conversation tackles the difference between canonical revelation and other forms of divine guidance, the danger of binding another Christian’s conscience with “God told me,” and the need for an experiential Christianity rooted firmly in Scripture. The goal is neither charismania nor cold rationalism. Christians have the completed, sufficient Word of God, and they also have the living Holy Spirit dwelling within them. CHAPTERS 00:00 Speaking in Tongues and $777 Seed Money00:47 Has Reformed Theology Overreacted to Charismania?03:00 Did the Holy Spirit Retire?03:54 Ephesians 1 and the Promised Holy Spirit05:21 The Important Taco/Sandwich Debate06:07 Introducing Ryan Denton07:35 What Is Classical Reformed Cessationism?10:14 Hyper-Cessationism and the Westminster Tradition12:28 The Spectrum from Charismania to Hyper-Cessationism16:54 The Biblical Case for Cessationism21:37 Spiritual Warfare and the Holy Spirit in Ephesians25:05 Where Did Hyper-Cessationism Come From?28:19 Materialism and Modern Reformed Theology30:44 Can Christians Say, “The Lord Told Me”?31:27 John Flavel’s Remarkable Dream36:31 The King’s Council38:39 “God Told Me I’m Going to Marry You”40:23 Fallible Christians and Divine Impressions41:30 How Does the Holy Spirit Lead Christians?45:40 Does Divine Guidance Mean New Scripture? About the Show The Patriarchy Podcast features in-depth conversations on faith, culture, theology, and leadership. Each episode equips Christians to live boldly and biblically in an age of compromise—exploring the challenges and opportunities of standing firm for truth in the modern world. Support the Mission We’re still raising funds to expand Sovereign King Academy and keep tuition affordable for families. Want to invest in the future of Christ’s Kingdom?Give here: https://sovereignkingacademy.com Connect with The Patriarchy Podcast YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThePatriarchyPodcastSpotify: https://tinyurl.com/58tm5zjzApple Podcasts: https://tinyurl.com/f3ruzrsaWebsite & All Links: https://linktr.ee/thepatriarchypodcast Follow Joseph Spurgeon:Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ThePatriarchyPodcastX/Twitter: https://x.com/PatriarchyPodInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepatriarchypodcastGab: https://gab.com/thepatriarchypodcast Sponsored By Steadfast Cigars – For men who reject passivity and take dominionOrder: https://steadfastcigars.com/ Fit Father Project – Dr. Balduzzi built the Fit Father Project to help men stop drifting, reclaim discipline, and get strong for life. If you're ready to take ownership of your health, don’t wait. This is the first real step toward lasting strength—for your body, your family, and your legacy. Start: https://secure.fitfatherproject.com/a/transformation/4539 Books by Joseph Spurgeon:It’s Good to Be a Boy – https://a.co/d/7zpEh5DIt’s Good to Be a Girl – https://a.co/d/6VlBTzS Final Call to Action Subscribe for more conversations that sharpen men for battle.Turn on notifications so you never miss an episode.Like and share to support biblical masculinity. cessationism, Holy Spirit, hyper cessationism, Reformed theology, Ryan Denton, spiritual gifts, miracles, charismania, charismatic movement, continuationism, Reformed cessationism, biblical cessationism, leading of the Holy Spirit, Holy Spirit guidance, impressions from God, God told me, hearing from God, dreams and visions, prophecy, gift of prophecy, gift of healing, speaking in tongues, miraculous gifts, sign gifts, apostolic gifts, Westminster Confession, Westminster divines, Puritans, Reformers, Scottish Covenanters, John Knox, John Flavel, BB Warfield, John MacArthur, Strange Fire, charismatic theology, Pentecostalism, experiential Christianity, extraordinary providence, providence of God, answers to prayer, spiritual warfare, Ephesians, sufficiency of Scripture, canon of Scripture, revelation, Reformed Christianity, Presbyterian theology, pneumatology, work of the Holy Spirit, grieving the Holy Spirit, quenching the Holy Spirit, The Patriarchy Podcast, Joseph Spurgeon

A year on, this Radical Reformers episode with Gary Wallace, Plymouth City Council, is just as relevant now as it was then and serves as a powerful reminder that change sometimes it starts with a conversation, a relationship or a different way of working. As local government and public services continue to grapple with rising demand, shrinking budgets and increasing complexity, we're seeing more debate about the limitations of traditional performance-driven models and growing interest in prevention, place-based approaches and relational working. Gary sat down with Andrew Laird and challenged the principles of New Public Management and shared why he believes better outcomes come from creating healthier systems. Systems where people, organisations and communities work together. We could all do with a bit of practical optimism right now. Gary's message isn't that we need to wait for wholesale system reform. It's that change starts with how we work every day. And as he says, 'Even if you can't change the way your service works, you can change the way you work as an individual.'"

Who are the Church Fathers and how should Christians view them? Pastor Adriel discusses how Christians should read the Church Fathers and understand the confessions in light of the Reformers and Scripture. DOWNLOAD IS GOD FAIR? A classic essay from the late J.I. Packer on whether God is really fair. FOLLOW US YouTube | Instagram | X/Twitter | Facebook | Newsletter WHO WE ARE Sola Media serves today's global church by producing resources for reformation grounded in the historic Christian faith. For over thirty-five years, Sola has walked alongside Christians in their faith, pointing away from novelty and ourselves, and toward Christ and his gospel as proclaimed in the Scriptures, articulated in the ancient Christian Creeds, and summarized in the confessions of the Protestant Reformation. Learn more: https://solamedia.org/

The war that nearly killed Rome wasn't fought against foreigners. It was fought against the men Rome refused to call Romans.For 100 years, Rome took the sons of its Italian allies for its legions, sent them to fight in Roman armies, buried them when it went badly — and denied them citizenship. Rome could see the problem. Reformers proposed fixing it for decades. Every one of them was killed. Then in 91 BC, Marcus Livius Drusus was assassinated at his own front door for putting Italian citizenship on the table, and the Italian allies stopped asking.They built a country. They renamed a town called Corfinium to "Italica" and made it a capital. They set up a senate of 500. They elected two consuls. They minted a coin with an Italian bull goring the Roman wolf.And they nearly destroyed Rome inside a single year.This is Episode 121 of The Fall of the Republic series on The Roman Pattern — the story of how a century of refused citizenship became a secession, how war forced Rome to grant peacefully what it had refused violently, and how the poisoned victory that ended the Social War set the fuse for Sulla to march on Rome itself.Chapters:00:00 The war that nearly killed Rome01:50 Where we are in the series03:45 The arithmetic — 100 years of coalition without citizenship06:10 Rome could see the problem06:38 Marcus Livius Drusus the Younger07:25 Three reformers, three deaths07:49 The allies build a country08:40 The Italia coin — the bull goring the wolf09:36 Not rebellion — secession09:59 Rome starts losing (90 BC)10:49 Rome capitulates — the Lex Julia12:00 The Lex Plautia Papiria — 60 days to enroll12:43 Rome resents the concession13:06 The tribal dilution mechanism13:33 Publius Sulpicius Rufus and the new citizens14:33 Sulla vs. Marius — two men each correct14:56 Sulla at Nola with his legions15:24 The march on Rome16:12 Setup for next week: Sulla16:36 The full pattern17:24 What this means beyond Rome17:43 When you force under fire what you refused in peaceSources referenced in this episode:— Appian, The Civil Wars, Book 1— Diodorus Siculus (Italian confederation constitutional details)— Cicero, Pro Archia (Lex Plautia Papiria specifics)— Velleius Paterculus, Roman History— Plutarch, Life of Sulla— Livy, Periochae 71-76— Emilio Gabba, Republican Rome, The Army and the Allies— H.H. Scullard, From the Gracchi to Nero— Ronald Syme, The Roman Revolution (1939)Sulla marches on Rome next Sunday.

The speaker—Joan Breibart—only did "Classical" Pilates until 1994. She knows GRATZ and BB and STOTT and PEAK. She asked Patti Kreiner for details: Gratz springs are heavier and provide more resistance. They give immediate, honest feedback if your form is wrong. The leather straps in frame system is non forgiving and heavier than ropes. The carriage has a drag, Feels less fluid than Balanced Body or Stott reformers.This is why most teachers opt to buy these other contemporary brands of Reformers. Easier for the instructors to use in group classes and for the clients bodies of today.Gratz keeps dimensions fixed to original specifications. Strap lengths, heavy handles pully system, foot-bar positions, and frame sizes do not have extra modern adjustments. You must adapt your body to the machine. _____Follow PhysicalMind Institute on Instagram or Facebook and subscribe to our newsletter.Visit the PhysicalMind Institute shop.

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This week, progressive challengers seeking to take control of the Brooklyn Democratic Party suffered a setback after embattled party chair Rodneyse Bichotte Hermelyn won enough votes to change the organization's rules. Reformers say the changes stack the vote to keep Bichotte Hermelyn in power despite widespread criticism from prominent Democrats. NY1 investigative reporter Courtney Gross, political reporter Bobby Cuza and statehouse reporter Bernadette Hogan weigh in on the latest Kings County clash over control of the Brooklyn Democratic Party. After that, Meta, the parent company of Facebook and Instagram, has agreed to a landmark legal settlement that includes a payout of up to $18 billion and new restrictions on how children can use its social media platforms. The settlement, announced this week, stems from a lawsuit first brought in 2023 by attorneys general across the country, including New York. The "Off Topic" team discusses what the settlement could mean for social media companies and young users.

Progressive pastor Caleb Lines claims religious people didn't care about abortion until 1978, when it was picked up as cover for segregation — so abortion, he says, is "really about racism." Scott Klusendorf names the genetic fallacy driving that whole argument, grants the pastor his premise to show it still refutes nothing, then corrects the history of the church's witness on abortion from the Didache through the Reformers to Bonhoeffer. Learn to spot the move the next time someone swaps your argument for your alleged motives, on this episode of The Case for Life.

The Reformers do not reform everything that Rome created. And a century by century record of those who kept the seventh day.

Matthew Becklo, Publishing Director for Word on Fire and author of The Way of Heaven and Earth, joins the Son Rise Morning Show to explore the Protestant Reformation's famous five “solas” and the Catholic “both/and” approach to questions of faith, works, grace, Scripture, Tradition, and the Church. Becklo explains why Catholics can affirm the importance of the truths emphasized by the Reformers while rejecting the idea that they must stand alone or in opposition to other dimensions of Christian faith. His central theme is that Catholicism holds together realities that can mistakenly be treated as either/or choices.Support the show: https://www.sacredheartradio.com/donate-now/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In episode 502 of The Reformed Brotherhood, Tony and Jesse begin what promises to be a multi-part deep dive into the Parable of the Good Samaritan — one of the most culturally embedded and theologically rich stories Jesus ever told. But before a single character hits the Jericho road, the hosts ground listeners in something easily overlooked: the charged context in which this parable is told. A lawyer — trained, confident, adversarial — steps forward not to learn but to test. What follows is a masterclass in how Jesus turns the law back on those who wield it as a weapon. This episode covers Luke 10:21–36, explores the covenant of works and covenant of grace, the noetic effects of sin, and why the Good Samaritan is far more than a lesson in being a helpful neighbor. Buckle up. Key Takeaways The lawyer's question is self-contradictory from the start. Asking "what must I do to inherit eternal life?" smuggles a works-righteousness assumption into the very grammar of the question. Inheritance by definition is received, not earned. Jesus does not give the lawyer a new paradigm — He reorients him to the true one. The covenant of grace is not a New Testament innovation. It runs through every Old Testament covenant administration. The lawyer should have already known this. "Do this and you will live" is not a Pelagian concession. Christ is holding out the law's own terms — perfect, total, unrelenting obedience — not to suggest it is achievable, but to expose its impossibility and drive the lawyer (and us) to the only alternative: mercy. "Desiring to justify himself" is more complex than it first appears. Tony argues that the desire to fulfill the covenant of works is not inherently wicked — it is the misguided belief that one can which is the problem. This distinction creates room for reading Christ's response as genuinely merciful instruction, not merely rebuke. The noetic effects of sin mean accurate theology can be deployed in service of self. The lawyer knows the right answers and still uses them to avoid repentance. Correct doctrine alone does not save. The fundamental human problem is not ignorance — it is the will's bondage and the heart's self-love. The parable is primarily Christological, not merely ethical. Jesus is the Good Samaritan. The story is not first about mercy ministry; it is about who binds up our wounds when we are left for dead on the road, unable to save ourselves. The priest and the Levite are not exonerated by their ritual obligations. Considerable ink has been spilled trying to justify their passing by on grounds of Levitical purity concerns. The parable refuses that exit. Everyone in the story — and everyone listening — already knows what the right thing to do was. Key Concepts The Covenant of Works Is Not a Black Box One of the more quietly important arguments Tony makes in this episode is that the covenant of works was never meant to be mysterious or inaccessible. When Jesus responds to the lawyer's question by asking, "What is written in the law? How do you read it?" — He does so with a visible assumption: there is a clear, knowable answer, and the lawyer should be able to give it. And he does. Love God completely, love your neighbor as yourself. The covenant of works was always coherent and comprehensible. The problem has never been that its demands were obscure. The problem is that no one — save the Mediator — has ever kept them. Jesus is not introducing a new ethical framework. He is forcing the lawyer to confront a standard he has always known and has never met. The Lawyer as a Warning to Reformed Christians Jesse closes the episode's first movement with a pointed and personal application that cuts across theological self-satisfaction. The lawyer is not a caricature of ignorance — he is a portrait of someone with accurate, affirmed theological knowledge who instinctively deploys it in the service of self-justification the moment he senses conviction. Jesse names this directly as a danger particularly acute in Reformed circles, where doctrinal precision can become a subtle mechanism of self-defense rather than an occasion for repentance. The Reformation's great recovery of grace must not become a new form of the very disease it diagnosed. Knowing the right words about total depravity, the covenant of grace, and the mediator does not exempt anyone from the need to actually be humbled by them. Theology is not armor against repentance — it is, rightly received, the road toward it. Context Is Not Just Setup — It Is Part of the Lesson Tony and Jesse both emphasize that Luke 10:21–24 is not merely throat-clearing before the real content begins. The theological statement embedded there — that the Father has hidden these things from the wise and revealed them to little children, that no one knows the Son except the Father or the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him — is the hermeneutical key to everything that follows. The lawyer approaches Jesus as one rabbi testing another. But Luke has already told his readers that this is not a conversation between equals debating interpretive options. It is the Lawgiver being questioned by someone who does not recognize Him. The parable that follows is not just an answer to a legal question. It is a revelation — the kind that only happens when the Son chooses to give it. Memorable Quotes You do not want to pit the law against the one who has given the law, the one whose character is represented in the law — because you're always going to get owned, and you'll get owned before you realize you've just gotten owned on multiple levels. - Jesse Schwamb Jesus is trying to sort of reorient them back to the true paradigm of grace that is present under all of the Old Covenant administrations. It's not so much a matter of developing a new framework and imposing it on this guy. It's really trying to say, 'Listen — think about this for a second. Think about the fact that, yes, you know you have to love the Lord your God with your whole heart, your whole soul, your whole strength, your whole mind, and you have to love your neighbor as yourself. You've answered correctly. If you can do those things, you will live.' — with the subtext: and of course you cannot possibly do those things. - Tony Arsenal The fundamental human problem is not primarily ignorance, but the will's bondage and the heart's self-love. It's a problem no amount of correct discipline or doctrine alone can fix apart from some kind of regenerating grace — which is exactly what Jesus is going to illustrate for us in the mercy he's about to display in this parable. - Jesse Schwamb Full Transcript Tony Arsenal: [00:00:00] This parable is not primarily about us figuring out how to do mercy ministry. Like, that's important. It's probably an outcome of this. It's probably something for us to think about. But really, this is actually Christ saying, like, "Hold on a second here, dude." Like, "Let's just think about this." Do you need someone who is going to tell you to pick yourself up off your bootstraps and cross to the other side of the street and leave you to your own devices? Or do you need someone who's gonna throw you on their donkey, who's gonna bind up your wounds, who's gonna pay the innkeeper, and is gonna pledge to pay everything that is owed for your salvation? Right? That's not too on the nose here, I think. Welcome to episode 502 of The Reformed Brotherhood. I'm [00:01:00] Jesse  And I'm Tony, and this is the podcast with ears to hear. Hey, brother.  Jesse Schwamb: Hey, brother. Well, we've got a big one to talk about on this episode. We're marching further and further into all of the glorious parables Jesus told as part of His teaching. And as you and I kind of joked before we began, I mean, what did you call it? Did you say this is, uh, the big daddy?  Tony Arsenal: It's the big daddy, one of the big daddy parables.  Jesse Schwamb: It's one of the big daddy parables. Now, this one is probably second maybe only to the prodigal son. Yeah But in terms of its ubiquity and its kind of just common knowledge in culture, this one ranks right up there. And before I reveal what it is, which you may already know, I was thinking how so many times we look at the Beatitudes as expression of a master class in Jesus teaching the law, and I think that's true. But as I was reading and thinking about this particular parable, I thought, "I don't know. I think this one is, uh, right up there," because [00:02:00] this is like law on law. It's double law. Yeah It's law coming back at the law giver who's trying to use the law to test Jesus, and then Jesus tests him with the law that He himself gave His people. It's... I'm already getting too excited- ... and we've got something to do before we get there. But we're talking about the parable of the Good Samaritan. And so I can't imagine, can I just make a prediction up front? I, you know where I'm going with this, and probably everybody else does. Uh, this is gonna be like two conversations-  Tony Arsenal: At least ...  Jesse Schwamb: probably.  Tony Arsenal: Yeah, at least two.  Jesse Schwamb: Is that fair? Because I realize we, of course, wanna get to the parable itself, and oh, my goodness, how much ink has been spilled. Even going back to, like, if you read, like, Augustine or, like, the early church, like the Patristics, the Church Fathers, there are so much that could be said, and maybe some stuff that just shouldn't be said about all the allegorical potential intent here about these characters. But [00:03:00] there's so much amazing stuff that happens in the opening of this, that's not just the setup, but it is its own lesson, and I'm real excited actually to talk about that with you before we even get into, like, all the good stuff that everybody expects that you wanna talk about. So we're gonna do it all. Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  Jesse Schwamb: We're gonna do it all, but it'll take time.  Tony Arsenal: Yeah. I'm interested to see if we're even on the same page about where to start reading, 'cause I, I think we might not be, and that's gonna be fun. So we'll, we'll let it fly and see what happens. It'll be our own little, uh, podcast game.  Jesse Schwamb: But, uh, I think- Well, I mean, we're gonna be in Luke chapter 10, but I guess to your point, we should be starting in Luke chapter one to get to this. Yeah.  Tony Arsenal: Exactly. But  Jesse Schwamb: we, we do have to back up quite a bit, and I was gonna ask you about that. Yeah. But I, apparently we're just gonna play that on the fly and see where we go.  Affirmations Denials Segment Jesse Schwamb: But of course, the Reformers had their five solos. Chalcedon had its, what, seven withouts. We've got opinions, and we're just as confident about ours, so of course it's time for affirmations, denials, where we affirm something that we think is good or awesome or [00:04:00] we wanna recommend, and we deny, again, something that is not so great or maybe just plain annoying. So before we talk about the Parable of the Good Samaritan, Tony, what do you got for us on this episode? Are you affirming with something, or are you gonna come in with a denial?  Tony Arsenal: Well, I've got two affirmations. That's fine. One is just- I will allow it ... a declaration of joy, and one is, like, a real affirmation. I, I just can't... It would be remiss of me not to share with our podcasting family that my son August and my daughter Adeline, uh, joined the visible church today as- Hear, hear ... uh, non-communicant members. Uh, Augie and Addie were baptized on the 16th of August of 2026, uh, into the visible church, into the name of Jesus Christ. Uh, was, it was just a great service. Um, it's funny because I've been- been talking with Augie. One of the thing with toddlers when you're doing something big like this is you kinda have to talk about it and practice and rehearse, rehearse it and, and get them ready for it. And up until maybe, like, I don't know, three days [00:05:00] ago, every time it would come up he would be saying, "I don't wanna be baptized. I don't wanna be baptized." And, um, you know, I, I, I, you know, I don't wanna force him to do something, but also, like, I make him eat vegetables. But, um- ... he, I, I think it was nerves, and I think something clicked in his head and all of a sudden he was very excited to be baptized. So, um, it was great. We've been talking about, you know, what baptism is, God's promise to you that if you trust him he'll save you. And so today he- Right ... he was like, "God's gonna make a promise to me to save me." So he was very excited. Nice. And he did a great job just standing quietly and listening to the pastor talk. Uh, and Addie was, was, was just a beautiful little girl, and she, um, she loved it as well. So that's just a bonus affirmation. I don't know that I could get through a podcast without gushing over that.  Glorify App and Devotionals Tony Arsenal: Uh, but the, the affirmation I have, uh, this is an, an app that I think some of our listeners may have heard of. Um, some may roll their eyes at it, to be honest with you. Um, I stumbled on this because, uh, you have an Oura Ring, don't you, Jesse? Jesse Schwamb: I do.  Tony Arsenal: You [00:06:00] do, yeah. So for those who don't know, an Oura Ring is like a little wearable ring that's like a, almost like a fitness tracker, but it tracks biometrics, pulse rate, temperature, all these different things, sleep. Um, there's a startup, uh, that has been doing a GoFundMe or a funding kind of thing for, uh, what they're calling like a Christian version of an Oura Ring. So it does a lot of the same things, sleep tracking, basic biometric tracking. Hmm. But it also has like alerts built in, and it's tied into an app that they use for devotionals. So it'll, it'll remind you to pray. It'll remind you, you know, bring you to an app to do a devotion. But the app it uses is a standalone app that I looked up, and it's called Glorify. Have you ever heard of this app before this evening? I have heard of  Jesse Schwamb: this, yeah.  Tony Arsenal: So Glorify is just a small devotional app. Uh, it's not much different than you would expect based on the name. It is connected to this, uh, to this Glorify ring, which again is, is sort of like an Oura Ring tied into this app. But this app basically is, is [00:07:00] designed to help you complete short daily devotional exercises, and they're usually very brief. They're based on a very brief, um, a very brief passage of scripture. Today's passage, uh, c- there's a quote. So today's quote is from Dietrich Bonhoeffer. It says, "True love does not consist in finding the perfect person, but in faithfully loving an imperfect one." Not sure why this devotional app is using a romance, uh, quote from Bonhoeffer of all people. But that was today's. Um, and the passage is Proverbs 5:15-17. So it's a, it's a devotional based on two verses, which is fine. So you read the passage. There's a very brief devotional on that passage, and then sort of a guided prayer, and they have both premium and free models. The premium model includes like you can listen to the devotional, you can listen to the prayer. Um, but just for example, today's prayer, it, it's very simple. "Loving Father, thank you for, uh, thank you because you're faithful and unchanging. In a world [00:08:00] marked by broken promises, disposable relationships, you remain the same. Teach me to reflect that faithfulness in my relationships. Help me to love with perseverance, grace, and commitment following the example of Christ. Protect marriages, strengthen families, restore what needs healing. May every relationship be marked by respect, truth, and genuine love. Shape in me a heart of integrity that honors you in both the small and significant choices of life. In Jesus' name, amen." So I think what I love about this, and this, I mentioned last week that there was, this is kind of like, sort of like the fluffy evangelical devotions. Like- Right ... there's not a ton of like solid doctrinal meat- But like, it's still nourishing. And sometimes we need a little bit of help. Sometimes we don't know what to pray, we don't know what to read, we're not sure. Sometimes in, I think in our Reformed circles, we feel like if we're not reading large portions of scripture and reading deep theological treaties or long, complex devotionals, that we're really not doing anything, and that's just not the [00:09:00] truth. So I've been using this in addition to other devotional studies I'm doing. I don't do it every day. I mean, there's some like streak functionality, kinda like habit tracking type stuff that's built into it. Um, but it's nice. It's nice to be able to pick it up, read a very short scripture, a brief devotional thought, and then have some guided prayer. I know one of the reasons I don't pray as often as I ought to is because I struggle to know what and how to pray. So even having some written prayers, I mean, this is why the Psalms are good, things like the Valley of Visions are good. Um, having some pre-written prayers that you genuinely pray but you're not having to come up with in the moment can really help. Right. So the app is called Glorify. I know it's available on iPhone. I'm not sure about Android. I'm sure it probably is. I'm sure they wanna have a pretty broad ecosystem. Um, and, and it's good. Again, it's, it's not anything fancy. It's not anything like super technical. Uh, and as I kind of alluded, like some of it's a little weird. Um, I, I didn't read the proverb. I think maybe the proverb is about romantic relationships, why they're, why they're tying in that, um, Bonhoeffer quote in, in the prayer. [00:10:00] But, um, even that, like it's pretty innocuous. And the quotes, like you don't have to read the quotes. It's not like you have to have to do that. Um, you could jump in, just read the scripture or just read the devotion and just do the prayer and you would be fine. So check it out. It's called Glorify, available on iPhone for sure. I'm pretty sure it's on, on Android. And maybe it's something you add daily, you know, this kinda thing like you do when you're on the bus or you're waiting at the grocery store, something quick you can do when you might be wasting that time just sorta sitting around or scrolling Twitter. Again, Twitter's fine. You can use your leisure time as you see fit. But if you wanna fill it with something like this, something that is more spiritual, then this would be a good option to just add a little bit of, uh, a little bit of nourishment to your diet where you might not otherwise be getting it  Jesse Schwamb: I have no proof of this, but I just keep saying it anyway. It might be that we're living in the golden age of really great- ... daily worship resources. Like, something to actually cultivate, not just, like, a devotional nugget, but something that actually leads you into a pattern and a habit of [00:11:00]worship, giving your attentive focus on Jesus. And I love that. So, uh, uh, 'cause I was just thinking, like, I was trying to look back on some of our past affirmations here. We've talked about the book Walking in Faith. I just gave everybody Awake My Soul last week. You're coming in with the Glorify app. I- we've talked about Dwell, if not recently, we've talked about that for some time. It's like a great Bible reading app, and there's lots and lots of new features, by the way, coming out on that- Yeah that are fantastic. And then, yes, all these other great prayers. I, I see, like, these books on prayer, like, actually, I'm sorry, like, prayer books, I guess, as, like, a great way to kinda... It's like a jumper for your car. You know what I mean? Like, just gets you started. What a, what a lovely thing to come into a place and have a launching pad. And I've been using a lot of Into His Presence, which is a collection of Puritan prayers, sometimes because, for instance, this just happened, where I wanted to pray for someone who was just going through a rough time, a good friend of mine. And I went to that place to kinda start and frame, knowing that I was gonna sit down with him and pray, how I might be able to do that well and [00:12:00] effectively. And these things are just, like, really phenomenal resources. It's just an amazing time to have all these things at our disposal. So that's another great option. It's, it's really more about, like you and I have talked about, Tony, like, whatever gets us into that pattern, whatever gets us, like, authentically experiencing under our own volition, coming in the discipline of sitting before God in daily worship with that expression being pretty broad in its representation- Yeah is to really include something of devotional time in the scriptures, memorization, metabolation, metabolizing. Metabolation, I'm just gonna make that up as, like- ... what happens when you, when you take the scripture and metabolize it into your own life. Meditating on it and, you know, again, maybe looking through the confessions and creeds that have shaped our distilled understanding of what the scripture teaches so that we're enhancing and edifying our mind. We're also engaging the heart, and then we're engaging God and ourselves in communication with Him through prayer. I'm all for anything [00:13:00] that gets us into those rhythms, reminds us of the importance of them, and like we talked about last week, makes it so that when we think about what it means to be married to Christ, so to speak, it's not just about whipping out some kind of marriage certificate to prove that, but that we actually have a frame and a behavioral pattern that fits a married person, that- Yeah how they act, how they think, how they behave, how they communicate, they're never too far away from their lovely spouse in some way or another. And so I think that these tools are great ways to get us exactly into that kind of mindset and practice.  Tony Arsenal: Yeah, absolutely. And like I said, like, I think- In our Reformed circles, we can, you know, we, we tend to be maybe a little eggheaded, and we, we tend to be a little more intellectual and, and a little more, I don't know, studious. And there's nothing wrong with that. Um, but I think sometimes it can breed a sort of, uh, elitism and arrogance. Sure. Uh, this is a perfectly valid devotional tool. Yes. Mm-hmm. And, and I think, [00:14:00] you know, kinda like the old adage, like, well, what's the best translation of scripture? Well, whichever one you're gonna read. Exactly. Like, what's the best devotional tool? Whichever one you're gonna use, whichever one's actually gonna bring you into the Word, uh, on a, on a regular basis. Um, and again, like, two verses of the scripture is two verses of the scripture that you might- Right ... not have other spent time, otherwise spent time reading. And it really is short enough, and it saves your progress. Like, you can do, you can do the quote in the morning, and then you can check the scripture on the way to the, you know, the word work, on a stoplight or whatever. Um, if you have the, the paid subscription, you can listen to this stuff, you know, on the, the bus or whatever. Um, so check it out. Glorify app, they have a ring they're making. It's in funding, I guess, if you wanna check it out, you can check that out too. I am neither affirming nor denying whatever this Glory ring is, Glorify ring. But, um, but yeah, the app is great. The, the app is free, and it's, it's worth even just checking out and adding once in a while to your day  Jesse Schwamb: The glory ring or the glorify ring sounds like almost too Tolkien, even for me  Tony Arsenal: Yeah. Yeah. It's the one ring to rule all of your devotions. [00:15:00] Uh, and in the, and in the morning bind them. Jesse, save me from the trail I was about to go on, and, and I was gonna speak in the language of Mordor, I think, on accident. Uh, save us from this. What are you affirming or denying?  Jesse Schwamb: That's  Tony Arsenal: beautiful. Please tell me it's the language of Mordor. Elvish AI and Music Pick Jesse Schwamb: Uh, no, but can I just say at the risk of really taking us really far afield so early on, which is not necessarily off-brand for us, I have done this... I, I don't know if I should be ashamed by this or I should be excited by this. But- ... um, the Elvish tongue in the Tolkien universe-  Tony Arsenal: Oh, no. ...  Jesse Schwamb: is like, there's several... If you're super nerdy, you'll know there's like several different kind of iterations or formulas of it, and there's no, like, official language like Klingon, but there ha- it has been studied, and basically, like, it's kind of like the Eugene Peterson of the language. Like, there's, like, just kind of a dynamic equivalent or an expression of words. Anyway, all that to say- ... there's several languages that, uh, Microsoft Copilot will just not [00:16:00] translate because it says, like, "This one, this language doesn't actually exist. There's not enough for me to do anything." Let me tell you something. Tolkien Elvish is not one of those languages, and I actually built an agent, because I have a coworker who can, uh, who can appreciate all this stuff, that takes a text, translates it into this kind of academic high-level Elvish from Tolkien, and then translates it back to English. That makes anything you're saying way better and far more poetic and just absolutely amazing. So if you wanna have some fun, go and do that with whatever your favorite AI model is. Anyway, that's free of charge. Real quick, my affirmation is more music. It just turns out I've found this band, and I've been listening to them a lot. The band's name is Thronebreaker, which is just a phenomenal name, I think, for any group. Uh, it's amazing. Uh, th- this is... I'm gonna read you their description from Spotify. It just says, "Thronebreaker is Christian metalcore built for the bruised, the doubting, and the ones still fighting their way home." And what I've really been [00:17:00] loving about them is it is kind of like Wolves at the Gate adjacent. It's really lovely music. It is melodic, so it's, there's not just that there's that kind of hard edge, but that is present in it. But, uh, the music is really lovely and beautiful, and in part that's because they're going through this, like, drip of releasing music where they're taking, like, old hymns or maybe songs if you're of a certain age like I am of kind of childhood Sunday school- And they're taking the lyrics, not the melody, and they're reimagining them. So they have two versions of Jesus Loves Me that they just released. They have the old We're Gonna Cross, a song called Glory to the King Most High. These songs are just saturated with gospel. Like, they're just all power, all encouragement, and all authority represented in Jesus Christ. They're incredible, and I've j- where I've, what I've been really blessed by is these two versions of Jesus Love Me are just fantastic. Like, they're orchestral. There is a children's kind of chorus at one point, and it got me [00:18:00] singing that song again, and really, maybe to what you were saying before, Tony, like sitting in those three words, which are really phenomenal words to hear. And so I have been surprised at how moved I've been by what really I, I first understood, of course, as a children's song with simple truth that seems, you know, depending on how long you've known some part of the gospel, obvious. And yet I found them all new again, and a, a really lovely way of just sitting in the truth of God in music that I didn't expect to find. So if you're interested in any of that or maybe just curious of what it would sound like if a Christian metalcore band took Jesus Loves Me and turned it into their genre, then honestly you should just go check out Throne Breaker. I mean, you pretty much have to at this point.  Tony Arsenal: I, I don't ever have anything to add to your musical affirmations or denials, 'cause I, I just don't. What I do have to add is that Throne Breaker actually sounds like some sort of really [00:19:00] amazing, like, mace-type weapon in Lord of the Rings. Yes.  Jesse Schwamb: Yes,  Tony Arsenal: it does. Or like a big hammer that a dwarf carries. And I would also like to say that if you ask Google Gemini to translate something into Tolkien English, it not only will do it, it will tell you how to pronounce it.  Google Elf: A ava aini Ilai amel i trona se.  Tony Arsenal: What do you think that was, Jesse?  Jesse Schwamb: No idea.  Tony Arsenal: First of all, that was elevated Quenya, a Quenya. Yes.  Jesse Schwamb: Yes, that's  Tony Arsenal: the one. Classic Quenya.  Jesse Schwamb: Yes.  Google Elf: A leta Ilai amel aima.  Tony Arsenal: I would be willing to bet... Actually, let's do this.  Jesse Schwamb: Ugh.  Tony Arsenal: Uh, we don't give out prizes very often. Uh, I will say to anyone who can tell me what that is, the first person that emails, uh, or, or goes into the Telegram chat, we'll do this. We'll be professional podcasters and drive people to one of our channels. Here we  Jesse Schwamb: go.  Tony Arsenal: The first person who goes to our telephone, our Telegram chat and tells me what that [00:20:00] means, what that, uh, Elvish means, will get a Reformed Brotherhood T-shirt.  Jesse Schwamb: Oh, that is big.  Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  Jesse Schwamb: That-  Tony Arsenal: So I'm gonna, I'm gonna play it one more time.  Jesse Schwamb: Okay, here we go. Everybody listen. Every- All right, pull over. Stop your vehicles. Here we go.  Google Elf: A leta Ilai amel aima.  Tony Arsenal: There it is, everybody.  Jesse Schwamb: I'm not being a cry- I have a guess, but I, I, I wanna try to win the T-shirt, so I'm gonna- Yes ... wi- withhold. All right. Uh, yeah, that's, that's super fun. Did it, um... Did you also translate it back into English from that  Tony Arsenal: just to see- No, I'll do that later, 'cause that would give away the, that would  Jesse Schwamb: give away the prize. Yeah, it's, it's... We'll have to save that for next week, because that, that is the fun. It creates, like, what I was doing to, to have fun with this coworker is take very technical, like, work-related emails, and I would send it through. It would go through that iterative process, and I actually loved how it, it was talking. Like, it wa- this was an email about risk, and it, it gave, like, these beautiful grand metaphors that didn't sound corny or cheesy. That's the beautiful thing. That's amazing. It [00:21:00] was like true Elvish. Like, you were just like, "I wish I spoke that way all the time about, about risk." And it, like I said, it wasn't just like... You could, you could obviously throw something in and be like, "Make this Shakespearean," or, you know, "Make this, you know, sound like, you know, Milton." This is way better. This is way better, because it's not, like, actually trying to manipulate what you're saying. It's takes, like, the dynamic equivalent of what you said, then translates it back with way more kind of poetic infrastructure while maintaining, like, the essential meaning that you have. I'm, I'm selling this too hard. Everybody just has to go out and try it. So, all right, you know what's at stake here, but here's how you have to win this. If you want a chance, if you want a chance at winning this, you gotta go to t.me/reformedbrotherhood, t.me/reformedbrotherhood, and that link will take you to the Telegram app and our little corner of it, and you're gonna find there's a bunch of chats there. You gotta go to the affirmations or denials chat, and then you gotta put in what is the translation of what Tony just played.[00:22:00] I just love... Isn't it amazing, though, that, like, y- as you discovered, there's more than one version of Elvish available? Yeah. And they do differentiate between the various kinds. This is a big deal. I learned there are actually scholars who have, like, again, filled in kind of like the details of the language- Oh, yeah taking as a basis what Tolkien had there. Yeah. So I think that this is the best. We couldn't have conceived of this if we'd actually tried and planned for it, so-  Tony Arsenal: It's true ...  Jesse Schwamb: it's just better that it all happened in, in real time. It's true. And, and speaking of which, I think now we get to have the fun of figuring out, uh, where in Luke chapter 10 are we gonna begin? Or should we just start in Luke 1 and just let's see how far we can get reading  Tony Arsenal: in this- I could have, I could have Google Gemini read it in elevated Kenya, Quenya I did try to get it to put it in Sindarin, and it wouldn't do it for some reason. I'm not sure. Maybe this anti-Sindarin bias in Gemini,  Jesse Schwamb: man. Disappointing.  Tony Arsenal: It's disappointing.  Jesse Schwamb: Dis- disappointing. So let's kick off some Good Samaritan talk, which again, I think is gonna take us [00:23:00] through maybe in the next couple of conversations, in part because, like I said, we're not even gonna start at, uh, verse 25 because there is so much more that needs to be said, I think, before that. Tony Arsenal: Yeah. Yeah. I, I think actually the proper place to start this, and I, I'm guessing Jesse probably, whether he was there or not, he probably figured out where I was going, uh, over the course of the last 20 minutes or whatever. Um, I actually think the proper place to start, at least one of the proper places to start, is in verse 21. Yeah. Um, and I- we'll talk about why that is. And I'll... I'm gonna read here, um, 21, uh, through the end of the parable. Uh, and this is Jesus talking. He says in this, uh... Well, it, this is, um... Yes, uh, I'll just read it here. "In the same hour He rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, 'I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for such was Your gracious will. All things have been handed over to Me by My Father, and no one who knows who the Son is except... No, no one knows who the Son is [00:24:00] except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal Himself.'" Then turning to the disciples, he said privately, "Blessed are the eyes that see what you see. For I tell you that many prophets and kings desired to see what you see and did not see it, and hear what you hear and did not hear it." And behold, a lawyer stood up to put him to the test, saying, "Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?" He said to him, "What is written in the Law? How do you read it?" And he answered, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength, and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself." And he said to him, "You have answered correctly. Do this and you will live." But he, desiring to justify himself, said to Jesus, "And who is my neighbor?" Jesus replied, "A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and he fell among robbers who stripped him and beat him and departed, leaving him half dead. Now by chance a priest was going down that road, and he saw him and passed on the other side. So likewise a Levite, [00:25:00] when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. But a Samaritan, as he journeyed, came to where he was, and when he saw him he had compassion. He went to him and bound up his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. And he set him on his own animal and brought him to an inn and took care of him. The next day he took out two denarii, gave them to the innkeeper, saying, 'Take good care of him. Whatever you, whatever more you spend I will repay you when I come back.' Which of these three do you think proved to be a neighbor to the man who fell among the robbers?" And he said, "The one who showed him mercy." Jesus said to him, "You go and do likewise."  Jesse Schwamb: I think you're right, of course, to back us up into verse 21 because I don't want to keep saying it's always a setup, but Jesus is certainly giving us like the right context in which... Well, Luke of course is the author here and as he's explaining the teaching of Jesus, he does so well to start out with some irony that we don't realize is gonna be ironic until we get to the, to verse 25 [00:26:00] when we realize who's testing Jesus, who's setting this all up. So this idea that the Holy Spirit, everybody rejoicing in the Holy Spirit and the knowledge and the wisdom, the intelligence that's revealed through the Holy Spirit to all of these lesser people and in particular here emblematic the infants That here we have kings and rulers, and in this case, this beloved scholar of the law, who all have this adventure in missing the point. They think, in fact, they're looking for the one who is to set them free, and they can't even see that it's Him who is before him. And yet, incidentally, God has already revealed all these things to the lowest, to the ones who are the most humble, the meek, the mild, the down and outs, the ones who are weak by the view of everybody else. And so it's amazing that if we just kinda, again, like blow past it into, like, just all the characters, we don't see that the teaching starts actually well above this, that even everything we're about to understand, that unfolds in our lives, ev- every spiritual incarnation and insight that we have [00:27:00] first starts with God himself in his revealing it to us both in his general revelation, but of course, in the specific revelation of his teaching. So I like that you started us there, because I, I'm with you. That's where this whole thing launches off, right?  Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  Parables Reveal and Conceal Tony Arsenal: Yeah, and as we come into when we very, like very start of this, uh, series, the, the parable series, Jesus sort of embeds a theology of parables into this introduction, right? Or I should say Luke does. But this, uh, this is written a- as though all of this is occurring as sort of one event. Right. And likely it was, right? So sometimes, uh, in the Gospels, events are kind of, like, moved next to each other for thematic reasons. It's possible that that's the case. It seems like this may have actually just been one, one teaching, and I'll, I'll talk about why that is in a second here. Um, but at the very least, this is placed next to each other in the Gospel almost as, like a, "Here's the theology of parables. Now, here's actually that happening in real [00:28:00] time."  Jesse Schwamb: Yes.  Tony Arsenal: And then also, like, a parable kinda demonstrating it, right? So the theology of the parable here is that there are many prophets, kings who desire to see what it is that, that, uh, uh, the disciples are seeing, right? And all things have been handed over to the Father or to, to the Son, by the Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father. No one who knows who the Father is except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal, right? So the, the theology of parables here presented in Luke is that the parable itself is being used as a way to reveal the Father and the Son to those whom the Son chooses to reveal it to. The Lawyer as the Fool Tony Arsenal: And that leaves us with this lawyer, um, sort of playing, playing the fool in almost like a dramatic sense, right? In a lot of drama, there's kind of like the fool character who's sort of like the foil or the idiot of the thing who's, who's unaware and is almost like made an example of, right? Um, I, I can't think of any examples off the top of my head, but there's often a character in a play who's like, uh, it's [00:29:00] almost like the opposite of the everyman, right? The everyman in a, in a play- Right ... or in a movie is sort of like the outsider who things gets explained to, and he's sort of the proxy for, for the audience. Um, I think like, um, Hawkeye in Avengers is kind of the everyman. He's sort of just like this regular dude swept up in this thing, and oftentimes he's the one that, uh, the big characters are explaining things to. And really what that is is the big characters are explaining that to the audience through this proxy. There's also this concept of the fool in a lot of these plays or movies who's sort of like the dummy, the idiot of the play, who things are explained to, and it's still a way to explain it to the audience, but the character doesn't get it. And so that's kind of, kind of the role that this lawyer is playing in this, this narrative here. He, he steps forward. He's like, "What must I do to inherit eternal life?" Jesus answers his question, and then in this like sort of like stunning moment of, like unawareness, he's trying to justify himself. He says, "Well, who is my neighbor?"[00:30:00] As though that's a question that needed to be asked, right? I think, like, we sort of think of it as like, "Oh, yeah, that's a valid question." I actually don't think it is. Like, it's pretty obvious, in the Old Testament at least, who your neighbor is. It's the people who live immediately with you. It's the other people of Israel. It's the people in your immediate concentric circles, the people you have direct access to. Um, and so then Jesus explains it through this parable, and whether or not he gets it at the end, I guess is maybe a little bit unclear. We can talk about that as we get there. But at least in the beginning, he's portrayed as this sort of, like, fool who doesn't understand what Jesus is saying, and then this parable is taught. So it's this theology of, um, revelation to those whom it is intended to, and further obscuring from those it's intended not to, not to illuminate, which is identical. Uh, maybe it's a different flavor of the same thing, but it's the same thing as what Matthew had and what Jesus taught- Right ... in Matthew with the parables. Jesse Schwamb: Right. It definitely is, again, illustrating, again, God's divine prerogative. I think you really have to do a lot of theological gymnastics [00:31:00] to try to work yourself out of a place here that says, like, "Well, this, this knowledge is accessible to all people."  Tony Arsenal: Right.  Jesse Schwamb: That if somehow we just work hard enough, study hard enough, come even before God with the right attitude or do the right things, that somehow all this will be made plain to us, and that's certainly not the truth here. In fact, again, the ironic setup is you have this lawyer asking this question, which creates this strange contrast because here's a man trained in the law, and he approaches the very wisdom of God to test him while the little children already perceive what this fool cannot. So it's irony upon irony, and then I, I like what you're saying. I think, and we'll get to this to anticipate a bit, I'm reading this as he's hoping that the answer to whom is my neighbor, just like he- he's received the affirmative from Jesus saying, "Yes, you understand. Go and do these things. This is life," and we'll get to all of what that means, I think, as well in terms of the covenant of works and the covenant of grace. But I think he's hoping that the definition of neighbor is gonna mean that he has [00:32:00] already accomplished the thing then, so that if there's somehow- Yeah ... he could just set the right boundaries. He could say, "Ah, yeah, I'm already good then, Jesus. I already, already did all that stuff." So- It's wild to me that it, it all starts with, of course, like some kind of scribal specialist in the Torah, of course, likely some kind of Pharisee by theological alignment. And as I'm looking at the notes here, what I find particularly stunning as we start this out is that Luke, of course, is able to speak several times in this parable to the intent. And so he says right away with great kind of fanfare and description that the intent here from this scribal Torah person was to test or to tempt, which is the same verb used of Satan's temptation of Christ and of Israel's testing of God in Deuteronomy 6, which of course Jesus is gonna quote here later on. So it's not, of course, like sincere inquiry, like you're saying. It, it is like adversarial probing. It is like really profound setup. It is dripping with like [00:33:00] ulterior motive. It's seeking to expose Jesus as either like heterodox or as diminishing the law's demands. And I think we've talked about this before, so Tony, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure in one of the previous parables we talked about sometimes how these get set up with this kind of weird like oxymoronic setting. Inherit Eternal Life Debate Jesse Schwamb: So like this question of se- uh, uh, itself, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?  Tony Arsenal: Yeah.  Jesse Schwamb: It's like more than just theologically revealing. Biblically it's self-contradictory, 'cause of course like we talked about inheritance, I think actually when we went through the, the parable of the prodigal. By definition, that's received, of course, on the ba- basis of relationship or promise. It's not earned by performance. And if the inheritance comes by a law, it no longer comes by promise, right? I think that's like Galatians. So the lawyer's question already portray- portrays like some kind of weird works righteous paradigm. E- even if you think he's really after trying to understand the true intent of God's heart [00:34:00] behind the law, he is assuming at least in this question that eternal life is some kind of wage that he can earn rather than a gift to be received by grace through faith. And that's a fundamental error that the entire subsequent exchange, including the parable, is designed to expose. It's both, like you're saying, Tony, he has not learned yet what it means to be in the kingdom of God. He's outside of that, and so he's trying... Now Jesus is bringing in this corrective action, as it were, set up in a story, but he's gonna turn the law on him, which, which I don't wanna get too excited about that yet. But he's... But essentially, here we have somebody who's the expert in the law trying to leverage the law by way of force against the one who he does not understand has all leverage and authority over him, and is in fact the law giver himself So he's gonna, Jesus is gonna drive him to see his own ability to keep the law that he claims to honor, and that's more than just brilliant. This is what the law does. You do not wanna pit the law against the one who has given the law, the [00:35:00] one whose character is represented in the law, because you're always going to get owned, and you'll get owned before you realize you've just gotten owned on multiple levels, and I think that's what basically unfolds here. Tony Arsenal: Yeah. Yeah, I, I have a little bit of a different take on the, the word inherit here. Um, I don't think what you're saying is wrong, um, but I think there's a little different flavor here, and actually, I, I think it, it still sort of propels us forward to the conversation we have to have, um, about the law and the gospel and the covenant of works, the covenant of grace. The, the Greek that lays under this word is, uh, it's a compound word of the word for, like, lot or portion and the word for law. And so, so the, this force of the word is more along the lines of, like, what shall I do to have a legal right to eternal life? Like- Right ... inherit, I think we hear inherit, and we think of, like, um, like what you get when someone dies, and so, like, obviously there's nothing you do to earn it, and that's certainly an element of the way this [00:36:00] word is used in some instances. I think reading this and kind of how, how the rest of the text plays out, this lawyer is coming forward and he's like, "What do I need to do to have a rightful legal claim to eternal life?" Right? We might even be able, and this is where it comes into the covenant of grace, covenant of works k- kind of paradigm. We might even be able to say that what this lawyer or this person comes forward to ask Jesus is, how do I gain, how do I gain the benefits of the covenant of works, right?  Jesse Schwamb: Right.  Tony Arsenal: Yep. That's language that was developed later that's not, not, like, biblical language in terms of, like, the actual language within the text, but that's the force of what he's saying. What must I do to be a rightful legal... Uh, what must I do to have a rightful legal claim on all of the blessings of the covenant of works, is really the question that's here. And so Jesus' answer is so instructive- Right ... 'cause what he says is, "Well, what's written in the law?" Like, he, he basically says, like, "Well, you should be able to tell me, teacher- Exactly of [00:37:00] the law, like, what, what needs to happen there." And there's an assumption on Christ's part that, like, there is an answer. I think sometimes, sometimes we, we, uh, we make an error in thinking that the covenant of works was never attainable, that it's somehow this, like, um, it's almost like a black box. Like, nobody could know what we have to do to, like, obtain eternal life. That's absolutely not the assumption Jesus makes. Jesus not only knows that there's an answer, it's such a straightforward answer that he expects this scribe to be able to answer it, right? And the scribe can, right? The scribe says, "Well, you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, your soul, your mind, your strength, and your neighbor as yourself," right? The summary of the law. Just good old classic Westminster larger, shorter catechism. Where's the law summarily comprehended? Summarily comprehended in the Ten Commandments. And then, then again, I don't know the questions exactly, but then it also, like, says, like, "Where does Christ summarize this?" Well, you should love the Lord your God, and you should love your [00:38:00] neighbor as yourself, right? Covenant Works and Grace Tony Arsenal: So the, the lawyer comes forward and says, "What do I need to do to have a legal right to all of the blessings of the covenant of works?" Christ says, "Well, what do you think?" He says, "Well, you obey the entirety of the law." And he says, "You've answered correctly. Do this. Obey the entirety of the law and you will live." So the parable itself doesn't necessarily speak to this law, gospel, covenant of works, covenant of grace paradigm. The, the parable is used to show that not only does this lawyer know what is required of him, but that he won't do it.  Jesse Schwamb: Right.  Tony Arsenal: And I think that's really key, because even in the parable, within the parable itself, there are these figures that know what they should do, right? I, I think, um, we'll get into it, but there's a lot of ink spilled on almost like, um, explaining [00:39:00] why the priest and the Phar- phar- and the, the Levite almost like did the right thing by going to the other side of the room, and it points to like, well, their priestly and Levitical responsibilities, if they touch a dead body, like they can't do those things, and those things are so important. Like, there's a lot of ink spilled trying to almost explain why what they did is right, when the point of the parable is that actually we all know what the right thing to do in that sense was. And even the most righteous people in the mind of the hearers, the Levites and the priests, the most righteous people, even they don't do what they're supposed to do. Jesse Schwamb: Right.  Tony Arsenal: This, this paradigm, this gospel law paradigm, law gospel paradigm, this covenant of works, covenant of grace paradigm, is so baked into the very like fabric of, of human thought that it's just there. And Christ takes this time to point out to this lawyer, like, "You know what's expected of you." And so that's why the phrase desiring to justify himself is so key [00:40:00] here. I actually think that the, the, the I don't wanna go so far as to say, like, that this person was regenerated in the midst of this conversation, 'cause I don't know that. But I actually think that there's a forward movement of this lawyer as he interacts with Christ that is optimistic. I'm optimistic about it, right? Right. He starts out trying to test Jesus, then he star- then he moves to having a desire to justify himself. I think we hear that, we read that, desiring to justify himself, we automatically think that that's a negative thing. But if we think about justifying himself in terms of what he's talking about, how do I fulfill the obligations of the covenant of works, that's not a bad thing to wanna do. Right. It's not bad to wanna obey God's law and to lay claim to His promises. It's a misguided notion of something we can't accomplish, but in itself, desiring to justify himself is to desire to fulfill the obligations of the covenant of works. That's not necessarily a bad thing. And so I think this is a merciful, a merciful [00:41:00] teaching on Christ's part. He's trying to instruct this guy to say, "Look, you can't do it. And even if you could do it, you wouldn't do it. So let's, let's talk about mercy instead and what that looks like." And that's where we get to kind of the end of the, uh, the end of the parable.  Jesse Schwamb: And again, we have to remember that we know that the intent here is actually to test or try Jesus, so He's certainly being merciful by using this opportunity not to just put him on blast, but to actually provide true instruction. And of course, like, that was, to some degree, this turning the question back would've been, like, a rabbinic pedagogical technique, but theologically, this is what floors me, is from the jump, Jesus refuses to let this man treat Him merely as one more voice among competing rabbis. Yeah. Instead, He holds that lawyer to the standard of God's own revealed word by, like you said, asking not just what does it say, but how do you read it? Mm-hmm. He's pressing not just for, like, some kind of recitation, but for the lawyer's own understanding and application, and Jesus is gonna hold him [00:42:00] accountable to his own hermeneutic. So by, by the time we get the answer, we know as readers, and all those present would've understood, he already knows the right answer, and he's not ignorant to God's requirements. He already summarizes the whole moral law correctly, encompassing both tables of the Decalogue. And so I think that does lead us then to this statement that we probably should spend a little time on, like, do this and you will live, like you introduced for us. Like, what does that even mean? Because i- it's not, like, in my view It's not like a Pelagian or Arminian concession that law keeping actually saves. I mean, it is the covenant of works principle stated truly inexorably that the law as law does promise life to perfect obedience. But that's the exact problem. I, I like what you said that it's not as if we can't understand what it would be to comprehend or contemplate this perfect law and what it means to fall under the covenant of works. It's just that he also presents for us at the same time this covenant of grace in which life is [00:43:00] granted freely through faith in the mediator who alone fulfills all of these laws' demands. So it's wild in this back and forth that's happening here where it's... I don't even know if it's fair to say this is like the most incredible subtext ever. I'm imagining trying to process this in real time and realizing everything that's being said, not just listening to what's being said and like the technical answers going back and forth. But I think like you said, that the Spirit even here is at work, I would like to believe, in the life and at the heart and the mind of this lawyer who's bringing forward this question with nefarious intent first to test and to undermine, and then is being drawn in almost inexorably into this debate to more profound understanding about a covenant based on works that cannot be accomplished, uh, in perfect obedience except through the mediator who organizes and distributes liberally this covenant of grace to his children for whom he has accomplished at least passively and then actively in his obedience in life and death. And so Jesus' reply is, I [00:44:00] think, thus a very genuine like if that functions to expose an impossibility. I, I don't think he's teaching salvation by works here, of course. He is holding out the law's own terms so that the lawyer and everybody else listening, and even us as well, can discover through this narrative which is about to happen the impossibility of self-produced righteousness, which again is what this gentleman is theologically all about. He's trying to justify himself. And that is precisely the pedagogical strategy like Paul uses later when he systemizes all of this by saying that the law was our guardian or school master until Christ came in order that we might be justified by faith. I think- Yeah ... and it's only because God is good to us and we might sit in some of this teaching, I think this is all in play. So, so I ask you, like, have I gone too far with all this? Like, how much do you think in the real time was being processed? And maybe that's a horrible question to ask because we know the Spirit does this work of illumination and enlightenment, and we're on the other [00:45:00] side of this and have this time to sit and to kind of parse and to really kind of just be pickled in all of this. But there's so much happening here, right?  Tony Arsenal: Yeah. Yeah. Uh, maybe I'll answer the question a, a little bit of a different way. I think, um- We often can think about Old Testament religion, if we wanna kinda call it that. We think about Old Testament religion as though it was totally uniform and, um, entirely legalistic. Right. Uh, my- the, the listener is gonna panic a little bit when I say this, so please don't freak out, but I, I think N.T. Wright, uh, and some of the new perspective on Paul stuff is a, a little bit helpful in this, in that it gives us a foil to sorta push against. Yes. The new perspective on Paul is this idea that, um- Paul was not saying that Judaism was legalistic and Christianity is a grace-based religion, right? He, m- [00:46:00] um, N- NPP is not, is saying, um, Paul was not correcting New or Old Testament religion. And where they go wrong is that they say that Paul actually retains this concept of covenantal faithfulness, covenantal nomism fidelity. Uh, where I think, where I think they're right is that this idea that, like, the Old Testament religion is entirely legalistic and Paul was just sort of correcting that, I think that's way too simplistic. And the reason I say that is that the Mosaic Covenant for, you know, w- and predominantly this podcast is coming from a sort of Westminster Confession of Faith Presbyterian perspective, give or take, right? The, the broad Reformed tradition would say that the, the Mosaic, uh, covenant, the Davidic Covenant, all of the covenants of the Old Testament, and we can break them up in all sorts of different ways, but all of the covenants of the Old Testament, [00:47:00] um, with maybe the exception of the Noahic Covenant, and there's some debate about that, all of those are They're not just, like, supporting structures for the covenant of grace, but they actually are the covenant of grace in various administrations. If that's true, and of course we believe that it is, if that's true, then the people of those covenants understood that on some level. Right. Right? So to think that, like, people under the administration of the covenant of grace somehow thought that they were operating under a legalistic framework doesn't make any sense. Jesse Schwamb: Yeah,  Tony Arsenal: that's true. So, so where I think that applies here is I think this person coming forward, it's not as though the concept of the covenant of grace... Again, that's language that we would develop later, but the concept that God graciously saves His people by the counsel of His own will, apart from their works of righteousness, apart from their meritorious effort, that God [00:48:00] simply extends His grace and conveys the cov- the blessings of the covenant of works to those who trust in the mediator, those who trust in the one to come, the, the forthcoming serpent-crushing seed, right, if you wanna use- Right language from Genesis 3. The, the idea that God simply graciously conveys the blessings of the covenant of works to those people Um, that's not something that's alien to the Old Testament, right? It's not alien to the, even to the Mosaic economy. The most law-based of all of the Old Testament, um, covenants, even that starts with the concept that these people are God's people who he redeemed out of Egypt, right? Right. The redemption out of Egypt comes before the giving of the law, and the giving of the law is a result of the redemption out of Egypt. So to think that this lawyer comes forward, and again, this had been sort of corrupted and distorted and had become a very works-based, uh, [00:49:00] meritorious-based understanding. But the idea that this framework of a covenant of grace is totally alien to this guy just doesn't, it just doesn't, I think it doesn't play. And so I think rather than us read this as I think sometimes we do, of Christ as kind of like giving this guy, trying to give this guy an entirely new paradigm, or like the rich young ruler is very much a parallel kind of situation. We read this, this guy comes forward, he's like, "What do I gotta do to earn eternal life?" Christ is like, kinda basically says like, "Well, you dum-dum, you can't. And I'm gonna demonstrate for you that you can't by- Right ... taking sort of like this situation that you can't possibly believe that you fulfilled and telling you to fulfill it." That's the outcome of this. We'll get to that when we get to the end of the parable. Um, he's not trying to give them a new paradigm. He's trying, in my opinion, he's trying to sort of reorient them back to the true paradigm of grace that is present under all of the Old Covenant administrations. So it's not so much a matter of like [00:50:00] developing a new framework and impli- like imposing this new framework on this guy. It's really trying to say like, "Listen- Think about this for a second, dude. Think about this, right? Think about the fact that, yes, you know you have to love the Lord your God with your whole heart, your whole soul, your whole strength, your whole mind, and you have to love your neighbor as yourself, right? You've answered correctly. If you can do those things, you will live. With the subtext, which I think is what you're getting at, the subtext of, like, and of course you cannot possibly do those things. Right. Right. So what's the alternative, my friend? The alternative is not justifying yourself by somehow identifying who the person is that you have to love the most. The, the, the, um, the... Well, we'll get this when we get to the parable itself, but the, the alternative is... This will be interesting, 'cause I'm not sure that we... I don't know where you are on this, but, um, the alternative is that there's someone out there who shows us mercy. [00:51:00] Right. There's someone out there who takes care of our need despite our total inability to do so. Jesse Schwamb: That's right.  Tony Arsenal: That's the alternative to the covenant of works, is the covenant of grace. I m- maybe I'm, like, hinting at it too much, so I'll just say it. Like, Jesus is the Good Samaritan, right? Like, there's something for us to learn about our own justification here and our own- Right ... like, um, our own need to be merciful, to treat people as our neighbors. But just like we talked about when we talked about, like, what does the least of these mean, this parable, uh, I'm totally, like, burying the lede for next, next week, but that's fine. This parable is not primarily about us figuring out how to do mercy ministry. Right. Like, that's important. It's probably an outcome of this. It's probably something for us to think about. But really, this is actually Christ saying, like, "Hold on a second here, dude." Like, "Let's just think about this." Do you need someone who is going to tell you to pick yourself up off your bootstraps and cross to the other side of the street and leave you to [00:52:00] your own devices? Or do you need someone who's gonna throw you on their donkey, who's gonna bind up your wounds, who's gonna pay the innkeeper, and is gonna pledge to play- pay everything that is owed for your salvation? Right? That's not too on the nose here, I think. Right. And, and I really look forward to, like, unpacking that, although maybe we don't need to now, but I think, like, this parable is so much more about how salvation works than it is about, like, what it means to have a good neighbor and to be a good neighbor. I think we get bogged down in that, and I just am really excited to talk more about, like, what I think this parable actually gets at.  Jesse Schwamb: I agree, and it's happening in the contex

This week, Mayor Zohran Mamdani took a weeklong vacation with his family in upstate New York, though City Hall didn't specify the area. The mayor leaving town hasn't always gone smoothly, but so far there has been little drama. First Deputy Mayor Dean Fuleihan is overseeing daily operations until Mamdani returns. There were, however, a couple of potential headaches back at City Hall, including a lawsuit over bonuses for paraprofessionals and a City Council oversight hearing on the bumpy rollout of the pied-à-terre tax, which administration officials did not attend amid ongoing litigation. NY1 investigative reporter Courtney Gross, political reporter Kelly Mena and statehouse reporter Bernadette Hogan weighed in on the mayor's trip and looked back at some of the issues travel has caused past mayors. After that, the battle is heating up for control of the Brooklyn Democratic Party — one of the largest county parties in the country. Reformers with the New Kings Democrats claim they have the votes to oust current party chair, State Assembly Member Rodneyse Bichotte Hermelyn. In response, Bichotte Hermelyn is proposing a new rule change that could upend those plans. The "Off Topic" team digs into the fight between Brooklyn Democrats.

The road to Concord was neither straight nor smooth. Although the Peace of Augsburg granted legal status to the faith confessed in the Augsburg Confession, doctrinal differences among the Reformers soon came to light. Many controversies took decades to resolve through patient study of the Word and faithful care by theologians such as Jakob Andrea, Martin Chemnitz, and David Chytraeus. Their work provides a faithful approach to any issue in the Church: identify the status of the controversy, clarify points of agreement, and address points of disagreement. By God's grace, we see how He brought the Church to unity, and we seek His help to remain united in Christ and His Word. Rev. Andy Wright, pastor of St. John Lutheran Church, Topeka, KS, joins Rev. Brady Finnern to discuss the development of the Formula of Concord. To learn more about St. John in Topeka, visit stjohnlcmstopeka.org. Find your copy of the Book of Concord - Concordia Reader's Edition at cph.org or read online at bookofconcord.org. Study the Lutheran Confession of Faith found in the Book of Concord with lively discussions led by host Rev. Brady Finnern, President of the LCMS Minnesota North District, and guest LCMS pastors. Join us as these Christ-confessing Concordians read through and discuss our Lutheran doctrine in the Book of Concord in order to gain a deeper understanding of our Lutheran faith and practical application for our vocations. Submit comments or questions to: listener@kfuo.org.

The ABC's head of religion, Noel Debien, has been watching the proceedings at ICAC and is here with an update.In New South Wales, the Independent Commission Against Corruption is investigating claims that the head office of Catholic schools – but not the schools themselves -- employed some staff to work primarily on factional activities for the Liberal Party. There've also been allegations that the organisation paid a consultant who then funnelled his money to a faction known as the Reformers. How have socially conservative Catholics found a home for themselves in the Liberal Party, especially considering its early history as a bastion of Australia's protestant establishment? It's due in large part to the end of long romance between the Catholic Church and the Labor Party. GUESTS:Noel Debien is a religion expert and broadcaster, and heads the Religion and Ethics unit at ABC Radio NationalDr Jeff Kildea is the author of the new book Iron Law No More: The Rise and Demise of the Catholic-Labor Alliance in Australia.Anne Benjamin is a respected educator, who was Director of Schools for the Parramatta diocese. This program is recorded on the lands of the Gadigal People of the Eora Nation

In New South Wales, the Independent Commission Against Corruption is investigating claims that the head office of Catholic schools – but not the schools themselves -- employed some staff to work primarily on factional activities for the Liberal Party. There've also been allegations that the organisation paid a consultant who then funnelled his money to a faction known as the Reformers. But first, the ABC's head of religion, Noel Debien, has been watching the proceedings at ICAC and is here with an update.GUESTS:Noel Debien is a religion expert and broadcaster, and heads the Religion and Ethics unit at ABC Radio NationalAnne Benjamin is a respected educator, who was Director of Schools for the Parramatta diocese. 

Bret Weinstein speaks with Peter Boghossian on the subject of the Jason Arday scandal and what it reveals about DEI, meritocracy, institutional failure, and the erosion of trust in academia.Find Peter Boghossian on X at https://x.com/peterboghossian and on Youtube at https://www.youtube.com/@drpeterboghossian. *****Sponsors:Sundays For Dogs: Dog food so tasty and healthy, even husbands swear by it. Go to http://www.sundaysfordogs.com/DARKHORSE to receive 50% off your first order.Vanman: Go to https://vanman.shop/darkhorse26 and use code DARKHORSE26 for 15%  off your first order.Branch Basics: Get 15% off Branch Basics with the code darkhorse at https://branchbasics.com/darkhorse #branchbasicspodSundays For Dogs: Dog food so tasty and healthy, even husbands swear by it. Go to http://www.sundaysfordogs.com/DARKHORSE to receive 50% off your first order.*****Join DarkHorse on Locals! Get access to our Discord server, exclusive live streams, live chats for all streams, and early access to many podcasts: https://darkhorse.locals.comCheck out the DHP store! Epic tabby, digital book burning, saddle up the dire wolves, and more: https://www.darkhorsestore.orgMusic: "Marble Machine" by WintergatanThis track can be downloaded for free at www.wintergatan.netFree License to use this track in your video can be downloaded at www.wintergatan.net*****Mentioned on this episode:Michael Nayna: The Reformers https://www.michaelnayna.com/p/trailer-launch-the-reformers-2023Evergreen Documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FH2WeWgcSMk&list=PLLHyNSlsz44_GceBMuwAyflt3lDWMEjTG Senate HELP Committee: HHS/CDC Confirmation Hearing https://www.help.senate.gov/rep/newsroom/press/chairman-cassidy-delivers-remarks-during-confirmation-hearing-on-nominations-for-hhs-cdcThe Death of Expertise: Tom Nichols https://amzn.to/4xm1RCc (commission earned)Legitimation Crisis: Jürgen Habermas https://amzn.to/3RUrRG0 (commission earned)Public Statement on the Hunter Biden Emails https://www.congress.gov/event/118th-congress/house-event/LC73760/text Black Intellectual Roundtable: DarkHorse https://youtu.be/pHGt733yw3g The Tragedy of the Commons: Garrett Hardin https://doi.org/10.1126/science.162.3859.1243 National Progress Alliance: What We Do https://www.nationalprogressalliance.org/work/ National Progress Alliance: Stop Donating to Your Alma Mater https://www.nationalprogressalliance.org/work/stop-donating-to-your-alma-mater/ Is the occasional massacre of gay people worth it to have more Muslims in your society?  https://boghossian.substack.com/p/is-the-occasional-massacre-of-gay Peter Boghossian Links https://linktr.ee/peterboghossian The Reformers https://www.michaelnayna.com/p/the-reformers-recommended-viewing Support the show

If we get the doctrine of justification wrong, we get the gospel wrong. Today, R.C. Sproul explains what it means to be justified, revealing where the Reformers and the Roman Catholic Church differed on this essential doctrine. Get R.C. Sproul's video teaching series Justified by Faith Alone on DVD with your donation. You'll also receive the companion digital study guide to enhance your learning: https://gift.renewingyourmind.org/   Live outside the U.S. and Canada? Request the digital study guide with your donation: https://www.renewingyourmind.org/global   Meet Today's Teacher:   R.C. Sproul (1939–2017) was founder of Ligonier Ministries, first minister of preaching and teaching at Saint Andrew's Chapel, first president of Reformation Bible College, and executive editor of Tabletalk magazine. Renewing Your Mind is a donor-supported outreach of Ligonier Ministries. Explore all of our podcasts: https://www.ligonier.org/podcasts

Three leaders of the reform movement in Brooklyn Democratic politics — Julio Peña III, Caitlin Kawaguchi, and Tony Melone — joined the show to discuss the future of the Brooklyn Democratic Party. In June, the “Brooklyn Can't Wait" coalition won enough District Leader positions to elect a new county party chair, and that majority announced its intention to back Peña III for the powerful post. He outlined his vision as Brooklyn Democratic Party chair during this wide-ranging conversation. (Ep 609)

We experienced some audio difficulties during the first half of today's message. Thank you for your patience and understanding as you listen. Enjoy this replay from July 26, 2026 with Senior Leader Joaquin Evans as he shares revelation from the books of Ezra and Nehemiah – that God's heart is always for restoration and that reformation does not happen apart from prayer.

In this episode, cold-case detective and Christian apologist J. Warner Wallace reopens "the Judas file" and asks a blunt question: Was Judas ever truly saved, or was he an unsaved insider from the start? Drawing on a detective's methodology, J. Warner walks verse by verse through every major Judas passage, examines Judass remorse in Matthew 27, and weighs historic voices—from the Church Fathers to the Reformers—before offering a cautious but clear verdict. Along the way, he shows how Judas became a trusted ministry insider, a treasurer, and a preacher, yet still serves as a chilling warning that you can be close to Jesus, busy in ministry, and never actually belong to Him. This episode is designed to help believers, leaders, and skeptics think more carefully about salvation, apostasy, secret sin, and the danger of mere proximity to the truth. If this conversation is helpful, please subscribe, rate, and review the podcast—then share it with a friend. Your reviews on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, and all your favorite podcast platforms help more people discover and engage with this content.

Season 2, Episode 126In this episode, Michael and Zach conclude their series on government and their two-part discussion of the PCA's 2026 Ad Interim Committee Report on Christian Nationalism by examining the report's treatment of the historic Reformed tradition, the American revisions to the Westminster Confession, and the proper relationship between Christianity and civil government. The conversation explores the committee's argument that while the original Westminster Confession reflected the establishmentarian views common among the Reformers, American Presbyterians intentionally revised those sections without embracing a secular vision of government. Along the way, Michael and Zach discuss the report's affirmation of Christian political engagement, patriotism, ordered loves (ordo amoris), nations, peoples, and cultural inheritance, while also examining its firm rejection of kinism, race realism, antisemitism, ethnic hierarchy, and coercive state involvement in matters of religion. The episode also considers the report's critique of modern liberalism and its insistence that rejecting the label "Christian Nationalism" does not require embracing a secular or anti-Christian public square. Throughout the discussion, Michael and Zach seek to fairly represent the committee's conclusions while helping listeners think biblically and historically about Christian influence in society, the limits of civil government, and Christ's lordship over every area of life.Find our videocast here: https://youtu.be/FFpScLPs_MwMerch here: https://take-2-podcast.printify.me/Music from #Uppbeat (free for Creators!):⁠https://uppbeat.io/t/reakt-music/deep-stone⁠License code: 2QZOZ2YHZ5UTE7C8Find more Take 2 Theology content at http://www.take2theology.com

SUBSCRIBE TO THE CHANNEL: https://www.youtube.com/@TheCombatChristian The Early Church Fathers and Reformers, whom so many Christians venerate, were evil antisemites who Satan used to spread the evil of antisemitism for numerous centuries. We must STOP idolizing them.SUPPORT THE MINISTRY AND YOURSELVES WITH TRIVITA: Use my TRIVITA link to get started on your wellness journey: ⁠https://bit.ly/HealthyChristian⁠  ✅Other ways for you to support the ministry:

July 13th, 2026 - We welcome back Mike Koeniger to react to the sudden death of Senator Lindsey Graham. Then, we welcome back Mark Lambert to discuss Pope Leo's promotion of Bishop Christian Wurtz. Links, Show Notes & More - https://thestationofthecross.com/act Email Us! ACT@TheStationOfTheCross.com

Last week, the Priestly Society of Saint Pius X consecrated four bishops without papal mandate, and 24 hours later, the Vatican pronounced that the SSPX clergy had incurred excommunication and warned that laypeople who formally adhere to the SSPX could be guilty of excommunication as well. It was major news, but at first, I thought I'd just leave it to the Catholics and SSPX to sort this out. However, as I was tracking the discourse on this, I became intrigued by one particular thread of the conversation: the comparisons between the SSPX and the Reformation. As a Protestant, this interested me. It also put me in an odd situation. I disagree with the SSPX on a number of things, not least of which is their assessment of the theological emphases of Vatican 2. However, much of the structure of their argument, especially the idea of the state of necessity felt familiar. Indeed, it has interesting overlaps with the Reformation. And it's those overlaps that I decided to explore in this video. Join Me on the Camino!: https://www.gospelsimplicity.com/pilgrimagePre-order my novel, The Long Road to Holy Island: https://amzn.to/4sISAC9Get access to my book club, one-on-one office hours, show notes, and more:  https://patreon.com/gospelsimplicity Make a one-time donation: https://paypal.me/gospelsimplicityBook a meeting: https://calendly.com/gospelsimplicity/meet-with-austinRead my writings: https://austinsuggs.substack.comSSPX Quotes referenced came from the following article: https://sspx.org/en/state-necessity-3046400:00 The News01:20 The SSPX02:38 The State of Necessity05:53 Reformation Similarities07:40 Dissent from a Council09:25 Rejecting Innovations13:18 Appealing to a Higher Authority15:39 The Crux of the IssueDisclaimer: Links in the description may contain affiliate links, from which I receive a small percentage of the purchase.Support the show

Plenty of Pilates studios look successful from the outside. The numbers tell a different story. In this episode, Lesley Logan sits down in person with Julian Barnes, co-founder and CEO of the BFS Network, the boutique fitness industry's market intelligence company behind the annual State of the Industry report. Julian brings the data from 500-plus studios across 46 states. Lesley brings the how. Together they break down the five numbers that separate a real business from an expensive hobby, and what it actually takes to keep clients for years instead of weeks. If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co mailto:beit@lesleylogan.co. And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/#follow-subscribe-free.In this episode you will learn about:The five KPIs that profitable studios track every month.Why referrals still beat social media for new leads.How to structure an intro offer that converts.The objection scripts that turn a maybe into a yes.Why holding clients accountable is what kills churn.Episode References/Links:BFS Network – bfsnetwork.comBFS Pilates Studio Benchmarks Report - BFSreport.com or BFSpilatesreport.comFacebook https://beitpod.com/thebfsnetwork https://www.facebook.com/thebfsnetwork?mibextid=wwXIfr&mibextid=wwXIfrSubmit your wins or questions - https://beitpod.com/questionsGuest Bio:Julian Barnes is Co-Founder and CEO of the BFS Network, the premier growth accelerator and market intelligence company in the beauty, fitness, and self-care industry. He leads BFS' CEO Network — the premier peer-to-peer leadership network for multi-location, multimillion-dollar operators who are building to scale — and serves as Managing Director of the Global Leadership Council, whose members collectively operate more than 10,000 locations worldwide. He also serves as an Outside Director for a global fitness brand. Barnes created NYU's Institute in Entrepreneurship & Small Business Management and served on the US Tennis Association's Investment Committee, which managed a $200M portfolio. He holds a BA from Tufts and a JD from UNC Chapel Hill.If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox. https://lovethepodcast.com/BITYSIDEALS! DEALS! DEALS! DEALS! https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/memberships/perks/#equipmentCheck out all our Preferred Vendors & Special Deals from Clair Sparrow, Sensate, Lyfefuel BeeKeeper's Naturals, Sauna Space, HigherDose, AG1 and ToeSox https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/memberships/perks/#equipmentBe in the know with all the workshops at OPC https://workshops.onlinepilatesclasses.com/lp-workshop-waitlistBe It Till You See It Podcast Survey https://pod.lesleylogan.co/be-it-podcasts-surveyBe a part of Lesley's Pilates Mentorship https://lesleylogan.co/elevate/FREE Ditching Busy Webinar https://ditchingbusy.com/Resources:Watch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq08HES7xLMvVa3Fy5DR8-gLesley Logan website https://lesleylogan.co/Be It Till You See It Podcast https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/Online Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/Online Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjogqXLnfyhS5VlU4rdzlnQProfitable Pilates https://profitablepilates.com/about/Follow Us on Social Media:Instagram https://www.instagram.com/lesley.logan/The Be It Till You See It Podcast YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq08HES7xLMvVa3Fy5DR8-gFacebook https://www.facebook.com/llogan.pilatesLinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesley-logan/The OPC YouTube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@OnlinePilatesClasses Episode Transcript:Julian Barnes 0:00  You have to be confident enough, both in your own abilities and that the universe will provide for you the right way. You have to be confident enough to say no to the wrong person, so you keep space open for the right person, as you said, and you have to be confident that the universe is going to bring that right person to you.Lesley Logan 0:24  Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started. Lesley Logan 1:05  All right, Be It babe. This is really for my Pilates studio owners and teachers out there, people who want to open a Pilates studio. We are going to get deep in numbers, and you're hearing me talk a lot about my thoughts about the Pilates industry and how you are going to have a profitable Pilates business. So it's kind of fun. If you've never heard me talk Pilates business, and you want to hear my thoughts, you can. For those of you who are Profitable Pilates members, you're going to hear some of my favorite things to say, and I think you're going to be really impressed with how amazing your studios are doing compared to others. But also, I think it's really important to know what the stats are. What is going on in the Pilates history? It is changing. There are a lot of studios, but are these studios actually as successful as they look? Lesley Logan 1:28  So, I think this report is really fun. If you watch it on YouTube, you're gonna see the visuals of these numbers. If you're like me and need to see them, you can watch it there. We'll also have everything in the show notes and in the blog as well. You guys are awesome. Here is Julian from the BFS Network. Lesley Logan 1:43  All right, loves, this is gonna be fun. You guys get to hear me in my own element, probably a little more behind the scenes of what we do with other businesses, but we have an incredible guest here. We'll talk a lot of numbers, so if you're a visual person, you might want to watch this on our YouTube channel. Julian from the BFS Network, you are here. Hello, tell everyone who you are and what you rock at, because they're going to want to know.Julian Barnes 2:18  Lesley, I am here in your home studio in Las Vegas. This is not Zoom. This is.. I could touch your high five. Here we go. There we go. Awesome. Hello, everyone. My name is Julian Barnes. I am the co-founder and CEO of the BFS Network. I am based in New York City, here in Vegas to hang out with my good friend Lesley and Brad. We are the BFS Network. For today's conversation, the most important thing I'm going to share is we are known as the premier market intelligence company in the boutique fitness industry. We publish the State of the Industry report, which is the annual report, which is the most comprehensive report in our industry. A lot of data, a lot of KPIs, a lot of metrics, all focused on showing what profitable studios do. So I'm here today with Lesley, and I'm going to share some of the numbers, and she's going to tell us how to achieve those numbers.Lesley Logan 3:13  Yeah, I'm excited. Let's go, let's do it. I'm a visual person, so I'm glad you got a visual for us.Julian Barnes 3:18  So the first thing I want to just talk about is who participated in the survey. In addition to the Profitable Pilates community, this survey has been conducted over the last 18 months, 500-plus studios worldwide. Most importantly, it is the overwhelming majority, 89% of the studios that participated in the survey have three or fewer locations, and most of them have one location, individually owned, self-financed, no private equity, no investor. So we're talking about just the regular studio owner who bootstrapped and saved, and maybe borrowed from the bank to open, that's who's in here. There's no Solidcore in here, there's no Barry's, there's no SoulCycle. And if there are some independent Club Pilates franchisees, they're individually owned, they're not big corporate, so that's.Lesley Logan 4:17  Not one of those people who owns 75 or 100 sharing. Yeah, yeah.Julian Barnes 4:21  Exactly. All right, so that's who's in it. Also, there's broad geographical distribution of the survey, meaning 45% of the responses came from cities with a population of half a million or more, 45% came from cities 50,000 to half a million, another 10% are rural areas less than 50,000, 46 out of 50 states, so we have geographic representation, we have market size representation, one, two, and three locations, no PE, no investors, so we're talking about the average mom-and-pop small studio everywhere in this country.Lesley Logan 4:57  Okay, you know I'm gonna want to have dinner where the four states are, so we got a find studio close to. Julian Barnes 5:01  It's like three S's. No, three N's. So it's North Dakota, Nebraska, and I forget the other two.Lesley Logan 5:08  Okay, I have a really great city for you, Nebraska solo owner, really pretty incredible, open for over 20 years. Julian Barnes 5:13  That's what we need. Okay. So that's who we're talking about. The way we're going to rock today is talk about the BFS scorecard, which is six KPIs. I'm going to share with the listeners, all of you, the six KPIs that profitable studios track, and I'm going to tell you what those KPIs are. And then we're going to come back, and I'm going to ask Lesley how and what a studio should do to achieve those KPIs. So, I am the "what" today; Lesley is going to be the "how."Lesley Logan 5:49  Yeah. So, for those of you, this is how it was explained to me, and I think this is a lot of fun for my peeps to listen. He's gonna be that Steve Kornacki at the big board, and I'm gonna come in as Rachel Maddow or Chris Hayes. I mean, obviously I watch a news channel, so there we go. So I'm gonna come in with my opinion and my punditry.Julian Barnes 6:07  You don't have blonde hair, so you're not that other channel.Lesley Logan 6:09  I'm not. Also, these are still my cheeks, my lips, my eyes.Julian Barnes 6:18  All real, keeping it real. Okay, so KPI number one is number of leads per month, and Profitable Pilates studios generally are generating somewhere between 10 to 50 leads per month. The number one response is more than 50 leads, so 30% of the respondents generated more than 50 leads, and then the tie for second was less than 10 leads per month and 10 to 25. Less than 10 was 20%, 10 to 25 is 21%, so that's basically a tie. I don't know for sure, but if I had to guess, the studios that are generating more than 50 leads a month are probably mat Pilates with larger class sizes, and yeah, they need more leads.Lesley Logan 7:09  I think anytime you need more leads, it's probably better having more class-based classes. Yeah.Julian Barnes 7:13  Exactly. And so the studios with less than 10 or 10 to 25 are probably more of the Reformer.Lesley Logan 7:19  Yeah.Julian Barnes 7:19  So number of leads per month is the first metric to track. I'm going to run through these quickly, and then we're going to come back. Okay, so the first KPI is number of leads per month, and the highest response was more than 50 leads per month. 30% of the Profitable Pilates studios that we surveyed generate more than 50 leads per month, and I would imagine that the majority of those are Pilates mat classes, where they have more people in seats and bigger studios, and they need to fill classes. Tied for second was less than 10 leads per month and 10 to 25 leads per month, and that is between 20 and 21% of the people who completed this assessment selected less than 10 and 10 to 25. So number of leads per month is the first KPI that we're going to talk about. Second KPI is the conversion rate, and let's see if I can do this, because I'm not an idiot, is what I told you, right?Lesley Logan 8:19  You're doing great. So there we go.Julian Barnes 8:22  Conversion rate of leads to first-time visitors. I can't wait for Lesley to break this down, but it's one thing for someone to email you, to DM you, to IM you to say, "I'm interested, send me more information about your studio." It's another thing for that person to actually walk in the door, and so conversion rate of lead to first-time visitor, Profitable Pilates studios are converting at more than 30%. 54% of the Profitable Pilates studios are converting at more than 30%. So think about that: for every 10 leads, the best studios are getting three of those 10 emails to walk in the door, right? So, conversion rate of leads to first-time visitors. Now they came, they took a class, they bought the intro offer. The question is, what percentage of those people made a second, bigger purchase? They already purchased the intro offer. I like to think about it like this: you go to a restaurant the first time and you have a nice meal. My question is always, am I going to come back? And especially if you bring a friend with you, maybe it's your favorite restaurant, and you bring a friend with you to your favorite restaurant, and you pay for the dinner. The question for your friend is, did you enjoy your dinner, and did you enjoy your dinner enough that you would come back and pay for it? That second purchase, same thing applies with studios, so they bought the intro offer. Did they come back? And Profitable studios, 55% of Profitable Pilates studios convert to a second, bigger purchase more than 30% of the time. So see how small these numbers get: for every 10 leads, three walk in the door, and of those three that walk in the door, only one is making a next purchase. So Lesley's gonna break that down. She is chomping up the bits, waiting for me. Lesley Logan 10:13  I can't wait. Julian Barnes 10:13  All right, so those are the first three KPIs. Okay, so the last two KPIs we'll talk about are average member lifetime value, which is how long they stay, and so the largest category for Profitable Pilates studios, 28% of Profitable Pilates studios have a lifetime value greater than two years. The good news is, hence the name of Profitable Pilates, that 71% of the Profitable Pilates studios that completed this assessment have an LTV of more than two years, and that's really important. I'll let Lesley weigh in on why that's important, but the number is more than two years. You want to be an LTV more than two years. Julian Barnes 10:56  And finally, the last KPI we're going to talk about today is churn, and churn means how often your members leave and you have to go refill that spot. You can't grow if you're constantly replacing someone in your studio. So Profitable Pilates studios, 43% of profitable Pilates studios minimize churn to less than 5%, but here again, the Profitable Pilates community that Lesley runs, 71% of the people who completed this assessment have a churn less than 5%.Julian Barnes 11:31  So let's recap. The five KPIs are number of leads per month, converting those leads from lead to first visit, converting the first visit to a second purchase, assuming the first visit is an intro offer, second purchase, then how long do they stay, and do you retain them by minimizing churn? Those are the five KPIs. That's what Profitable studios do in the Pilates sector. Lesley, now tell the people.Lesley Logan 12:02  Oh my gosh.Julian Barnes 12:03  Tell the people, Lesley, what they're supposed to do to achieve these numbers. How do they get these number of leads per month?Lesley Logan 12:11  Okay, so here's a really great... I just want to say I'm really proud of the people who filled this out, because my goal has always been for the people we coach for the long term. I'm like, your business should get really boring, like it should get really predictable. My goal is that some of our people need one lead a month because they actually don't have room, and they're actually referring out to other businesses in the area. That obviously is more of a smaller studio that doesn't have large group classes, but that is the absolute goal, because it's better to be entertained in your life, your business should not be so entertaining. Lesley Logan 12:39  So what I would say is, for studios to have a really great conversion, if you don't know how many leads you're getting a month, that's important. You got to start there, and you want to know where they're coming from, because that really does help you understand where you're spending your time marketing. Everyone tries to sell you to the moon and back that you should be on social media. You might not need to be, depends on your community, right? Depends on how many people are there, and depends on how many leads you need. I know that sounds crazy in 2026 that I would tell someone that it's not about social media, but it's not, more and more people are not necessarily trusting what they're seeing on socials because of AI and things like that. So, you really want to have an amazing network of clients who love you, who refer people out, so you're getting strong, solid leads, because those are gonna be the ones that actually come in over just reaching out to see what's going on.Julian Barnes 13:22  You just said something I want to jump on. I didn't mention it, but we also asked studio owners what was their most effective lead gen tactic. You want to guess what that answer is, Lesley?Lesley Logan 13:33  Referral.Julian Barnes 13:34  By far, in every modality.Lesley Logan 13:39  Yes. And here's what people.Julian Barnes 13:40  It's two to one, like it wasn't close. And again, these are profit, not just Pilates, all modalities. The number one lead gen tactic is referrals. So when you said people don't trust what's on the social and socials, what do people trust?Lesley Logan 13:56  They trust their friends.Julian Barnes 13:57  They trust people they know, people who they know, like, and trust.Lesley Logan 14:00  So here's the thing: if you are a new business right now, or you need people right now, if you're spending all of your time marketing yourself through stuff online and buying ads, that's one way to do it. And you will get people. I'm not saying that doesn't work, but you will get more people quicker if you actually tell the people who know, like, and trust you, whether they're clients or not, "Here's what my studio does, here's who we help, here's how we help them. Who do you know?" If you say, "Who do you know?" it opens a loop. You open a loop, people aren't likely to say, "I don't know anyone," because they'd have to think about that. But if you say, "Who do you know?" it opens this loop, and they start being aware of it. And if their friend's like, "Oh, my shoulder hurts," they go, "Oh, I just heard about the studio down the street." People will refer you people, and those are the people who actually come in, more likely than not, than someone who's just cruising the internet and filling out the contact form. Whoever fills out the contact form, honestly, it's whoever gets to them first and doesn't bug them.Julian Barnes 14:49  Let's take the people behind the scenes for a second. Before this call, we were chilling out in your backyard, and is it safe to say that we have some fundamental disagreements about how studios actually operate some things, right?Lesley Logan 15:27  I think that's okay, though.Julian Barnes 15:36  I wanted them to know that the things you and I agree on are the most important fundamental aspects of running a business. The things we disagree on, I say they're on the fringe, they're just a matter of choice. But this, having referrals, know, like, and trust that, it is tested over time.Lesley Logan 15:26  Yeah, I mean, it's so true. And also, it just makes it a lot easier on you if you need clients today. You opened the studio recently, or you hired a new teacher, or you opened some new classes, you need people to fill those seats today, you will always have a faster rate of transitioning them into clients if you're going to your community and the people who trust you, because they will talk about you, they will have a trust transference. If you are waiting for people to fill out your contact form, then it's like, well, they wanted you at 11:00 PM last night while they were watching someone on some TV show doing what they thought was Pilates, so they reached out, but now it's 8:00 AM or 9:00 AM in the morning and they're at work. Then it's like, "Well, I'm too busy this weekend," so you got to get people when they're excited. Lesley Logan 16:07  If you have a 30% conversion rate from the lead into coming in, that's great. I actually don't think that that's a terrible... I think if you have higher than that, you are doing great, but if you have lower than that, that's where I have concern. I feel like 30% feels very fair. Where I want you to really look at is from that, when they come in, if you have a lower than 30% conversion rate, you really do have an issue, because the numbers just get so small, and you're actually just wasting a lot of time. You're working really hard. And so I think this is where you, as an owner, need to look at what your onboarding experience is. How are you setting people up? Are you getting them with the right teacher? Are you the only person who's teaching them? Then it really is on you, what's going on?Lesley Logan 16:47  And this is where I think a lot of people make mistakes, because they try to sell Pilates, or whatever the modality is. People actually don't want to buy process; they want to buy the transformation, they want to buy the passion from you. And so this is where, if you're a studio owner and you're not the one who's doing these intro offers, they're going into a class, or they're going into another teacher's experience. You need someone who's got passion and actually can read the person, because you have to take what their goal is and what you offer and show how they get there. Nobody wants to hear, "Oh, you're going to buy the four-session-a-week package," because that's, no, that's a process. They want to buy in on the belief that you have that you can get them to where they want to go.Julian Barnes 17:24  You just said the magic word, and I don't know if people really heard you or want to go back. You said they want to buy the what, starting with the letter T?Lesley Logan 17:34  Oh, the transformation.Julian Barnes 17:35  Say that again.Lesley Logan 17:36  The transformation. They want the transformation, they want the end result.Julian Barnes 17:38  I like to say that there is no transformation without the transaction. There is no transformation without the transaction. So you have to ask the question, why are you here, and you have to actively listen to what they say, and then be prescriptive in your answer to the question. Okay, so you want X, Y, or Z. Great. Here's how you're going to get that: two times a week, three times a week. You're going to take this class, that class, this class, etc. You're going to give them a prescription, just like a doctor would give you a prescription, and tell them when they ask what does it cost, you reframe it. The investment for you to achieve your desired goal is going to be one of time and money. The time is twice a week or three times a week, and the monthly investment for that is going to be X.Lesley Logan 18:29  I agree so much, because if you can actually get them to understand that this is a tool to the transformation, and they can make that transaction, and you break it down, you can also be honest with them, and this is where trust is really built. Some people are going to come to you with goals that are not in alignment with what you do. If you actually tell them... for example, in Pilates in LA, every single person wants to lose five pounds, and it's like, "Well, here's what we know about science. Science would say, if you want to lose weight, it's a few different factors, and any fitness is part of the journey, but it's not the tool." The actual tool, especially if you're serving women, is: what are your hormones like? What are you eating? And then you can go from there. But if all you do is work out to lose weight, you might lose a couple pounds, you might change the metabolism you've got, but it's actually not going to get you to the goal. Lesley Logan 19:20  And so this is where it's really cool for people, and this is what I coach people on their first-time sessions, is find out what they're there for, and then tell them you can or can't help them. So I would always say, "Here's how Pilates is going to be part of your journey, here's what we can't do, but here's what we can do." First of all, most people are lied to so much, or sold a bunch of smoke and mirrors, that they actually will like that you told them that. They might not buy from you, they might go to someone else, or they might try something else and come back, because they actually believe and trust you. I really do believe in being authentic here. And then when you're teaching the sessions, you need to actually tell them, "Here's why I've chosen this exercise for you, here's why this exercise is going to hit your goals." That's what people don't do, they just keep talking about Pilates this, Pilates that. Pilates is now on every corner, so maybe that worked in the 1990s or might have worked in the early 2000s, but it doesn't work today. You actually have to say, "With my eye, I'm seeing your shoulder is doing this, and you have back pain, and so what I'm seeing is because of this imbalance, you're gonna have back pain until we get this balanced. So, here's these three exercises we're going to do, and they're going to help you with this." You have to actually tell them, take them behind the scenes. I like to say that their first sessions, their intro sessions, are like going to a buffet. They get to see all the different options, and you're going to talk about all the different options, and then you're going to prescribe them, like Julian said, like, "Hey, okay." First of all, I never say, "Did you like that?" You got to just go with confidence. You're like, "Thank you for letting me teach you," because that gives gratitude, it lets them know the session's over, and then you go into, "You said you wanted this. Here's how we're going to get there. Here's the process." Julian Barnes 19:20  Here's the roadmap.Lesley Logan 19:20  Yes. And then if they're like, "Whoa, that's too much for me." If you go through all the investment and all the time, and they're like, "That's more than I can spend right now," you can say, "I understand. We can take a little longer; instead of coming three times a week, we can do two times a week, or we can do this and this," but you have to actually help them find a way. I get it, some people don't work out, so that's not even the money, it's the actual going from zero times at the gym to coming three times. You're asking a lot, so this is where you have to be honest, and this is where I think our industry really needs a little kick in the pants, and a nice one. People that are with me a long time have heard me say this: if you aren't going to hold people accountable to their goals, you're going to become a to-do that they move around all the time.Julian Barnes 21:28  1,000%. And remember, they came to you. You didn't go find them.Lesley Logan 21:34  Yeah.Julian Barnes 21:35  Even if you did, even if you went to the local farmers market, you didn't force them to give you their email. Lesley Logan 21:40  Yeah.Julian Barnes 21:40  They gave you their email. They walked into the door. You have to ask them why they walked in, and you have to actually listen, so you can connect what they said with what you're going to say. You know what you're going to say, you know what your packages are. The question is, can you connect your packages to the goal they told you they want to achieve? It is not about giving permission, you are the person in the position of authority.Lesley Logan 22:09  Well, that's the thing. You just said you are the person in the position of authority, and that's where people don't see themselves.Julian Barnes 22:15  Retain your power.Lesley Logan 22:16  And so when people come to us, I have to constantly remind them that you're so worthy. If you have people who are late canceling and you're not charging them, I promise you, you're losing that client. That's not a client you want, by the way, but it's also you're losing that client because when push comes to shove. Julian Barnes 22:31  They're not committed. Lesley Logan 22:33  Right. When their budget has an issue, when something comes up, they're like, "Oh, I'm going to cancel my Pilates," because they're not actually seeing results, because you didn't hold them accountable to get results. I think this is where people really have to actually remember there is such a thing as you being in relation to them, and there is a camaraderie, but you're also the expert. They came to you, and the only way that they can exchange the energy is to pay you that worth, but you have to hold them accountable so that they get those results. And when you get them the results, that's why you don't have churn, that's why your churn is so low, and that's why you'll have clients for life. And by the way.Julian Barnes 23:05  We're gonna come back to that. Lesley Logan 23:05  Okay I just want to say, I think a lot of people go, "Oh, this person came to me, I hope they like me." You can't be like that if you want a business that actually works and doesn't stress you out at the end of the day. You have to actually have the authority, because you are the expert. They don't know.Julian Barnes 23:21  You have to be a little bit like Steve Jobs. Steve Jobs said you don't ask the customer what they want; you tell the customer what they need. None of us raised our hand and said we want a phone, remember the Blackberries and the Treos, and we want a contact management thing, we want to surf the web. No one said, "I want that." He presented it to us and said, "Here, isn't this cool?"Lesley Logan 23:45  Yeah, right. I think that's where, I understand some people's first-time sessions are in a group class. I would argue that that's a harder way to sell things. I would absolutely say, if you are a class-based studio and you want to have clients for life, you should have some sort of onboarding that allows them to be either on their own or in a very small group of other people who are also on an intro, so that you can actually find out why they're there and actually tell them how these exercises on whatever equipment you're teaching them actually help them reach their goal. Because if you just put them in a class with a bunch of other people, first of all, they get lost, and the experienced people get annoyed if the teacher keeps teaching to the newbie. You're going to lose people; they're going to start going, "I'm not getting challenged here, I'm going to this studio over here." So, I really do believe in an onboarding journey. And, of course, people are going to say, "Oh, this studio over here will let me in." Great, you should go to that studio that doesn't have any worries about you getting hurt and doesn't want your sessions to be personalized. No problem. I understand you want to get started. I actually believe in villainizing a little bit of the thing that you are not doing, so that you can actually tell people, "Here's why you wanted to work with me. Here's why you want to trust me, because I actually care about why you're here, and you're not just a number on my Reformer, you're actually a person whose impact I want. I want you to have the transformation you wanted." But I also think when they're in that first session, whatever it is, a week or a session, I really do think if you don't tell them what you're seeing in their body that's keeping them from the goal they want to have, you are missing out on an opportunity for them to understand how smart you are and how much of an expert you are. If you tell me that you want to have better posture and I'm seeing that your hip is up to one side, you have to tell people, "Oh, I noticed this, no wonder your posture is having problems. So here we're going to do these exercises." I always said this, but I think it's really where people miss out. This is where teachers keep it to themselves and they actually don't tell the client what they're seeing; they just pick exercises, but the person doesn't know why you're picking that. So, you have to peel back the curtain, so that they can see that you're in there with them, you're a partner in this journey, and you're gonna hold them accountable to hitting the goals they want, and then when they hit those, you're gonna set new ones.Julian Barnes 25:40  Right. All right, so let's talk about KPI number three: percentage of new visitors who purchase a membership or a bigger package. So we're talking specifically about people who purchase the intro offer, they finish the one week or the two week or the one month, whatever the intro offer is, they finished that. Did they pull out their credit card and make a second purchase? What should studios do, owners, and instructors do to increase the probability of a yes?Lesley Logan 26:11  I love this question so much. I'm going to take us back a little bit. So I want to go back to the intro offer. You need to pick an intro offer that actually fits the goals you need. If you need a lot of clients, the intro offer needs to be very simple, very easy. I wouldn't even give people two weeks, I think that is crazy nonsense. I also don't like free; I think you have to charge. It's very hard to go from zero to whatever you're charging. So, I would say if you need clients yesterday, you're doing a single-session intro offer with a very much hands-on experience, where someone is told, you find out what they need in an interview style, and then a concierge style at the end about what's going on. That's what you need. If you don't need a ton of clients, then your intro offer can be a little longer, and can actually be a higher need to say yes, meaning instead of doing a private session and the intro offer is $60 for one session, it might be $180 for three. That obviously is going to get rejected more, because it's a bit more. "I don't know if I want to spend $180 on you, I just met you, I don't even know you." But you don't need a lot of people, so you're like, "I only want the best to come through," right? So you really want to make sure you're picking that. Now, obviously, the higher the intro offer's time and money commitment is, the more likely you're actually going to have a second purchase if they do it in a condensed form of time. That's why I disagree with two weeks or one month, I really do, especially for in-person. I think you want to keep things quick, because when that dopamine high is happening, that's when they're more likely to buy. If it's three sessions that they can take over three weeks, good luck, because they only felt the high in the moment when they drove their car home, they actually didn't get the benefits. But if it's three sessions in one week, you're more likely to get that second purchase. You want people to feel the benefits, because let's be really honest: Joe Pilates has a quote that everyone likes to use, but they don't finish the sentence. "In 10 Pilates sessions, you feel different. In 20 sessions, you look different. In 30 sessions, you have a whole new body." But they don't finish it: "If you come three to four times a week, or your money back." That's what Joe said, that's what his ad said. If you're just coming to Pilates once a week, it'd be like trying to study Spanish once a week. I can recognize words, but I'm not going to be able to understand Bad Bunny, that's not happening. I have to do it multiple times a week, and science is there, no matter the modality. Unless you're doing something three or four times a week, you're actually not making a change.Julian Barnes 26:58  Well, that's the key, right? Earlier you said you're here for the transformation. The first step, I would argue, in the transformation is transforming your daily routine. What you just said is people need to adopt a new routine that says, "I'm coming on Tuesday morning, Thursday after work, Saturday morning." I'm committed to that change. See, hear these terms: commitment, investment, transformation. They need to commit. You need to present them with a prescription. You are more likely to be successful if you present a prescription that gives them the opportunity to adopt a new routine from day one.Lesley Logan 28:10  Here's the thing: you will sound more confident when you're talking with them if you're making them rise up to the occasion. It is understanding their intake forms.Julian Barnes 29:12  You're leading them to rise to the occasion.Lesley Logan 29:18  Yes. Here's the thing: are you more likely to come to the person who says, "When do you want to come in?" If you're someone who's listening who says, "When do you want to come in? Do you want to come in next week?" I'm going to tell you right now, your business is a hobby, and eventually the IRS is going to audit you, so that's not going to be good for you. You're not gonna be profitable. If you're telling people, "Hey, you should come, you're gonna come two times a week. I have 10:00 AM on Tuesdays and Thursdays, does that work for you?" That is me telling you. You're going, "Hmm, does it work for me?" But you're not, you're more likely to look at your calendar like, "When do I want to come in? Oh, next week actually feels really full. Now I can't come in," right? You want to actually tell people and prescribe people and have the confidence in what you're doing, and this is where I think a lot of people have a lot of fear. "Oh my god, they'll think I'm being rude." No, they won't. They're going to think that you're in control. This is a business. It's a business. Lesley Logan 30:06  And also, I don't want to waste people's money, so you can even say that. Look, here's the deal: if you're only going to come once every other week, this is kind of a waste of money. You shouldn't really do this; you could probably do something at home on YouTube. If you really want the transformation, you have to commit to it, and the commitment looks like this. That's where I would say, whether you do memberships or packages, I don't like unlimited, because that is craziness, you also can't prescribe people the times to come in. "If you want to hit this goal in the next three months, I recommend our three-time-a-week commitment. If that's too much for you, there's a two-time..." You have these things that people can choose, a journey, a path. If you're only gonna have one time a week, here's the deal: you can never miss, and I'm gonna need you to do homework, because the reality is, one time a week, if that's all you can afford time or money-wise, I get that something is better than nothing, but you gotta do something at home. Otherwise, it is a waste of your time and money, and I don't wanna waste your money. And when you talk like that with people, they're like, "Oh, this person really knows what they're talking about." When you ask them, "When do you want to come in?" a broken clock is right two times a day. You're going to get some people, but those are the type-A people who happen to be near you or close to you, and they kind of like you. You're not going to have a business where it's easy to predict how much money you're going to make month after month.Julian Barnes 31:15  Would you say that transformation requires the three C's? You need to change your routine, you need to be consistent about the changes you're making in routine, and you have to be willing to get rid of your comfort zone, get out of your comfort zone. Very little change occurs when you're comfortable.Lesley Logan 31:37  Oh, you know what happens: if you don't change, the world does, and you just actually get further behind. So I do think that... I love all those three C's, and I think that's really helpful for people. Here's the thing, the objections you're going to get are three. There might be some other ones, but these are the three I've heard teaching for a really long time, and I used to run nine studios for a high-end fitness company, so I have heard them all, which are: "I don't have the money." Guess what, everyone says that when they actually don't really want to tell you why they can't do it, or they didn't like it. It's an easier thing. You're not going to go show me your wallet, right? So, "I don't have the money," and "I don't have the time." This is one for people who want change, but they're afraid of leaving their comfort zone. So, this is where you actually have to have a speech ready in hand. "I get that. I'm a very busy person. Here's what we're going to do: we are going to pre-schedule your sessions for the next month, so you can schedule your whole life around it. How about we start two weeks out, because it's a little easier? Two weeks out, it's not overwhelming. We're going to schedule your whole life around it, and because of our cancellation policy, you're going to cancel your friends over this, and you're actually going to get the transformation." Or they have to "think about it." If they have to think about it, there's a couple things going on. You weren't good enough at making sure they understood how what you're doing is going to help them with their transformation. You didn't get an honest goal out of them, or you actually didn't tell them how you're going to get there, so they're kind of in, but they're not sure. Or you have way too many offers. If you have too many offers, "I don't know what to do. If I see we have these packages, and we have these packages, we have this class over here, we have this class over here..." It's too confusing for me, and I have to think about it. You want things to be very easy for people to make a yes. And so, if they have to say, "Oh, I have to talk to my husband," that is also a way of saying, "I don't have the money," or "I'm not sure," because most women have the ability to spend the money on what they want. The first time I ever heard this as a brand new teacher, I said, "No problem. If your husband has any questions, here is my number. Remember, these are the goals we talked about, here's how we're going to get there." And if you want me to chat with him about how this is going to work out, I'm happy to do that. Guess what? He came up to my studio the next day and he said, "My wife can come as much as she wants, whatever she wants, she can come as much as she wants. I just want her to be happy," right? Most of the time it's not the husband; it's that she was not sure if she was worthy of the commitment, and we have to hold space for that. But if you can actually think of the objections you have, and then come up with your responses ahead of time, you're gonna come off more confident when they have those. And then guess what, they can go think about it. Okay, great. "I'm gonna reach out next week, I'm gonna reach out tomorrow, I'm gonna call back on the follow-up. Is that okay with you?" You'd be surprised how many people come in if you follow up.Julian Barnes 34:04  Now, here's one of the areas where we may disagree. I agree with everything you just said. Sometimes it's okay to say, "We may not be for you."Lesley Logan 34:13  Oh, we're not going to disagree on that. I love that.Julian Barnes 34:17  I hear you. The three objections: don't have time, can't afford it, not sure. Okay, I hear you. We may not be the right place for you. We are the place for people who are willing to make a commitment to the transformation they seek. We work with people who are committed. We work with... and then whatever's in your community, you know, describe them. They might be business owners, executives, presidents of corporations, whatever is in your tribe, in your community. We work with the best of the best. If you want to be part of that, we'd love to have you, but I get it, we may not be for you, and that's okay. Lesley Logan 34:56  That's okay. Julian, I love this, because I just coached someone today, and she was talking about, "Oh, they got sick and they couldn't do this, and now they're good there." I said, "You should fire them as clients, they're not good clients." In fact, I would call that dirty money. Every single teacher out there who's taking clients who just come in willy-nilly, that is dirty money. It's actually never going to get you good referrals. There's certainly not gonna be a walking billboard. The best advice I ever got when I first started teaching Pilates, best advice, a teacher took me aside on my first day, and he goes, "Get one client and make them obsessed with you. You focus every energy and everything you have on that one client, and you will have clients for life." And he's not wrong. I was gifted a duet session from a teacher who was moving, and I took that to heart. They're like, "We can't come next week." I'm like, "Oh, well, I'll see you... let's go with an extra one this week. Gotta make it up."Julian Barnes 35:43  Exactly right.Lesley Logan 35:44  And they're like, "What? We don't do two in a week." I'm like, "Well, you're missing next week. I'm not gonna wait two weeks to see you. What change are we gonna have? We gotta do this." They never miss a session. Guess what? Within two weeks, I had two of their friends from their building, right? Because I was like, "If you want to work with me, this is how often you have to do this." And here's the thing: when you tell people, "We might not be for you," one, some people will rise to the occasion because they don't like to be rejected, and two, you're leaving space for someone who's going to actually add to the community and make your business successful. And, by the way, more importantly, you're going to make an impact on them, because it's not fun to teach people who are not committed it's, actually exhausting.Julian Barnes 36:18  I know you believe in karma.Lesley Logan 36:19  I do. Julian Barnes 36:20  Right, as we sit in a room full of crystals everywhere.Lesley Logan 36:24  Some people, I'm wondering when their karma is coming. I'm just gonna say.Julian Barnes 36:28  So you have to be confident enough that the universe will present you what you need when you need it, and that confidence is really tested when you have some financial needs and the wrong client walks in. You have to be confident enough, both in your own abilities and that the universe will provide for you the right way. You have to be confident enough to say no to the wrong person, so you keep space open for the right person, as you said, and you have to be confident that the universe is going to bring that right person to you.Lesley Logan 37:12  Yes. Well, and.Julian Barnes 37:13  But it's not going to always be on your schedule.Lesley Logan 37:15  No. And that... well, that's here's the thing, we've been talking about these different leads, you actually don't get to decide when people are going to finally come in the door. So you have to make sure that whatever you're doing is making sure it's put in front of them and reminded in front of them, and they're reminded again until they're like, "Oh, I'm finally ready." We actually don't get to decide when they come in the door, but once they're there, we absolutely can say, "You're in my house, and in my house, this is how we do things," right? Like my house, you can leave your shoes on, we got a dog, he goes in and out, this is a desert, we're fine, but some people's houses, the shoes go off. I was just at a friend's house who's in the Pilates industry, and he's like, "Yeah, you take your shoes off," and we went upstairs, and he's like, "Oh, there's a deck, put these slippers on," and I'm like, "Oh my god, there's so many rules!" But guess what, it's his house. Those are the rules of participating in his world, and so I would just say it's okay to have these rules. It really helps people understand the boundaries, and it will make for better clients who are more consistent, and guess what, they will go back to the best way to get clients: refer you better clients.Julian Barnes 38:15  Great. So now, how do we keep them? How do you recommend that your clients act in such a way as to increase lifetime value? First of all, what is lifetime value? Second, why is it important? Third, how do you increase it? What is it? Why is it important? How do you increase it?Lesley Logan 38:34  So you can correct me. I'm going to do a simple lifetime value with clients: like if you have clients for two years, how much money do you often make off them? And getting an average of a lifetime value really helps you understand how many clients you really kind of need for your business to predict or project what you want to make. You want to make a million dollars for your studio, and your average lifetime client is X. Then you need 25 of those clients to get there, right? So it really helps you understand the business you're going to have. And our businesses, we have a really amazing lifetime value of a lot of our clients. It's kind of insane for our membership bases that are online, what they are, and so once we know those, it really helps us understand how much money are we going to spend marketing, right? Especially if you're an on-demand business or membership basis.Julian Barnes 39:12  How much you're willing to invest in marketing.Lesley Logan 39:14  Yes.Julian Barnes 39:14  If you know that your member is paying you 100 bucks a month, which is 1,200 bucks a year, and they have an average tenure of two years, then you know that you have about $2,400 for every client.Lesley Logan 39:27  Yeah.Julian Barnes 39:28  So now you back, that's not even that's before profit.Lesley Logan 39:30  Yep. Okay. Yep.Julian Barnes 39:32  Now you back that down and back that out and say, "Well, how much am I willing to invest by an acquisition cost? Am I willing to invest $100 to make $2,400? Sure. Am I willing to invest $2,000 to make $2,400? Not so much."Lesley Logan 39:32  There are people who will do that, and I think they're crazy.Julian Barnes 39:33  So you know that number because you want to know how much you want to invest.Lesley Logan 39:37  Yes, and it's really important, and it really does take time to get that value if you're a brand new studio. This is going to be something. Julian Barnes 40:00  6 to 18 months, minimum. Lesley Logan 40:02  So it's really important. What was the second two questions?Julian Barnes 40:06  That's what it is. How do you keep your members with you for two, three, four years? How?Lesley Logan 40:14  Okay, so first of all, this is going to sound crazy. If your value system doesn't include commitment and consistency, you've already started your business off on the wrong foot for a long-term lifetime value of a client. You have to actually have in your value of your business, "We want committed or consistent clients." What are we going to do? It's part of our value system to make sure that happens. Maybe that comes from communication, maybe that comes from transparency, maybe that comes from responsibility, maybe that comes from community, but you have to decide in your value system how you're going to get there from the get-go. Because everything in your value system dictates how you make decisions on who you hire, what services you offer, what days you're open, all that stuff, right? Second thing is, if you're not making sure your clients are consistent, if you're just letting them cancel and there's no fees, they're not committed. Guess what, they're going to eventually go somewhere else, because no one's making sure they show up.Julian Barnes 41:11  The word there you're looking for, I think, is accountable.Lesley Logan 41:14  Yes.Julian Barnes 41:15  Accountable. You have to hold your clients accountable to the prescription for the transformation that they said they want. You didn't tell them what they wanted; they told you what they wanted. You told them how to get it.Lesley Logan 41:29  Yeah, exactly. So, I think this is where people are afraid they'll lose clients if they uphold a cancellation policy. Nope, you'll lose them because you didn't. Now, you might lose them in the beginning, like, "This is too harsh." Great, this is not the studio for you. That studio on the street is in charge, go there. I don't know if you'll get your goals, but you won't be charged for not showing up here. You said you wanted to do this; I held a space for you, right? It's really important. And you'll say it in your own words, but I promise you, I promise you, I had clients when I was in LA... I taught in LA for 12 years. I was there for 14, taught 12 years in LA, and when COVID hit, I still had more than half of my clients from the first year I started teaching.Julian Barnes 42:08  How? What did you do to maintain that LTV?Lesley Logan 42:12  Aside from my boundaries, if I traveled, there was a teacher coming into their space at their exact same time, so their schedule didn't change just because my schedule changed. I think this is really important: no matter the size of your space, you've got to have backups or a backup policy in place, so that you can get sick, have to travel, or have a baby, and make sure that they're taken care of at the schedule that they committed to, because it's really hard for them to move their schedule, right? Second thing, if you're not reinstating what they're getting from you, you think that they're mind readers, they're not, right? So, you have to remind them how far they've come, how close they are to their goal. "Oh, you've hit this goal, where are we at now?" You also need to actually... they talk so much, they are nonstop, they think you're their therapist. If you're not listening to the things they're saying they're going to go do with their family, "Oh, you're going to go hike such and such volcano in Europe? Okay, we're going to add some exercises in to make sure you can do that. Oh, you want to start running a marathon? Okay, we got to do these things to help keep your hips open, otherwise your back's going to hurt." You need to hear the things that they're saying they want to do with their kids, their family. You have to insert yourself. Julian Barnes 43:15  You have to listen. I'm hearing you say, 'Listen, listen.'Lesley Logan 43:17  And what do most teachers do? This is the thing, I say this, the industry is having an amazing moment right now, but I promise you, right now, because all the teachers are focused on cues, and all the students are focused on how many people are in the class, you are going to see the pendulum swing the other way. Because people are not there for your cues; they're there for the transformation. And if you're not looking with your eyes at what their body is doing, you don't know what cue you need. You have to see what they're doing, and then give them the correction that they need in that moment. And because we have different learning styles and things like that, you can't... I'm sorry, you can't have memorized cues. You have to learn how to be present, and be present to listen to what they're saying when they're leaving. What are they saying? "Oh, you know, my sister's coming to town next week." Guess what I'm saying: "Oh, is your sister coming with you to class? Do we need to reschedule your sessions?" Because if you can start to train them, then they're never missing, they're getting the consistency. But you have to know that their goals are going to change with their life. My clients, 12 years long, I mean, it's amazing what height we got out of them, and they're older. So I think it's really important for people to actually remember that the impact you want to make is there if you listen, and they'll stay because you keep reminding them how Pilates is part of their life.Julian Barnes 44:32  And so churn, to wrap it up, LTV and churn are related. You want your LTV to be high so they stay with you for many years, and you want to reduce your churn, which is the percentage of clients or members who leave your studio. What are some of the best practices that studio owners can implement to minimize churn?Lesley Logan 44:53  So, I think this is where, if your business is based off waitlists and 12-hour things, and hoping people cancel so they will get off the waitlist, you're actually going to have churn. I actually think this is where we have to really think about who we're trying to serve and how we're serving them. And I would really make sure that your clients are able to be part of the journey of the growth of your business. They should be part of it, celebrated, reminded that they're there. They always need to have a name. Every single person, whoever you hire, no matter how big you get, if they are not saying people's first names, and also following up, "Oh, you've been gone for two weeks because of X surgery. How are you doing? Yes, we paused your membership, but..." actually check on them. "Oh, I don't want to bother them." Oh my god, they won't respond if you're bothering them! We have to actually stick around and be in people's lives, and follow up and remind them that they matter and that they're missed. And if you have any teachers who are not remembering people's names and not remembering that they've been gone, you're going to have a churn problem. I think the reason why my businesses have grown, even in coaching people, and that we have people who've been with us since day one, is because we constantly remind everybody who the OG people were. These people are here; they've been with us for the long haul. They remembered us when it was small, but they're being introduced to the new people when it's bigger, and they're feeling that they're part of a community. I think people forget that people, at the base of everything, just want to belong. And if you're not able to look them in the eye and remember their name and introduce them to somebody else, they're going to feel unseen at some point. So I really do think that churn is reduced when you see people as a human being.Julian Barnes 46:27  So, I have a bonus question for you which is, right in your wheelhouse as a veteran instructor, more like a comment for you to reply to, from the very beginning of this conversation, you haven't used this word, but it's my takeaway of what you've been saying: impact. We talk about how people want transformation. Talk about how do you convert from lead to first-time visitor? How do you convert from first-time visitor to second purchase? How do you keep them a long time? How do you minimize churn? To me, the answer is impact, and what we, at BFS, don't focus on front of house, we're not Pilates instructors, but you obviously are. And so what I like to remind people, and I'm going to ask you to elaborate, I like to remind people none of the processes, none of the systems, none of the messaging, none of the stuff matters if you're not delivering fire classes each and every time. Agree, disagree, assess?Lesley Logan 47:29  Oh, I agree. I also think it's really interesting because I come from this as a classical Pilates instructor, but I coach a lot of contemporary-based Pilates. So my fire classes on the Reformer always start with footwork and probably end with the same exercise. So, when you say fire classes, I think it's really important that I say.Julian Barnes 47:47  I want to say impact. The classes have to deliver impact.Lesley Logan 47:50  Yeah, they have to. Well, I'm saying I'm agreeing with you. I'm also saying you don't have to be someone who's recreating the wheel every time, but people have to feel so different than when they walked in the door, because if they feel the same, then they're not coming back. This is a nice hobby that they have, you fit the thing, but as soon as road construction's up or their job goes across town, you're out of it. Here's what I know about being a teacher for so long in LA: people would drive across freeways to stay with the same teacher because of the impact. Why would they do that when there's a studio... it's LA! There are, and by the way, it's LA, like New York, the best Pilates instructors in the world are in these places, and they're going across town. Why? It is because of the impact. And I think this is where people lose their confidence: they see other people doing things and go, "Oh, I should do that, too. Everyone's Reformers are beige now; I should do beige. Everything is this." No. What is it that you said you would give people, and what is it that they want? And if you can stay clear on that and keep understanding what their new wants are, you will have them for life.Julian Barnes 48:59  This goes back to something you said earlier today: take one client and give everything to, say that again, you said?Lesley Logan 49:07  Take one client and you make them obsessed with you, and then you'll have clients for life.Julian Barnes 49:11  Okay, so unpack that, because I think you're talking about how do you make them obsessed. To me, that sounds like you're saying give them 110%, teach the best class every time, you are the best.Lesley Logan 49:38  It goes back to accountability. I'm going to give 110% in every session, but you have to show up for the sessions, and it's a two-way street, I'm not in your body, right? So you got to make sure that they feel like they can trust you to tell you what's going on, but they have to show up

Can democracies become more resilient by being bolder? In this episode of How to Fix Democracy, Andrew Keen speaks with journalist, author and foreign affairs commentator John Kampfner about his new book Brave New World. Drawing on research from countries as diverse as Finland, Estonia, Taiwan, Morocco, Canada and Romania, Kampfner argues that democracy's greatest challenge is not a lack of ideas but a lack of political courage. Together, they explore why resilience, imagination, and courageous leadership are essential to tackling today's biggest challenges, from housing and healthcare to digital government, education, and climate policy. Rather than dwelling on democratic decline, this conversation offers practical examples of governments that are daring to think differently, and asks what other democracies can learn from them.

In preparation for the 250th anniversary of America's founding, it would be wise to look back at the ancient thinkers and writers who helped inspire its early leaders. Perhaps the preeminent role model was the Roman statesman and orator, Marcus Tullius Cicero. So here in Episode 11 of Season 5, I interview Michael C. Hawley to talk about the political philosophy of Cicero and his influence on the American Republic. Michael Hawley is an assistant professor in the School of Civic Life and Leadership at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. A 2025-2026 Visiting Fellow with the James Madison Program, he wrote the book, Natural Law Republicanism: Cicero's Liberal Legacy (2022). Now, he's working on a new one, Preaching to the Choir: The Rhetoric of Prophets, Reformers, and Demagogues. Hosted by Ryan Shinkel, Madison's Notes is the podcast of Princeton University's James Madison Program in American Ideals and Institutions. The transcript for this interview is available on the JMP substack page, “Madison's Footnotes.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/new-books-network

In preparation for the 250th anniversary of America's founding, it would be wise to look back at the ancient thinkers and writers who helped inspire its early leaders. Perhaps the preeminent role model was the Roman statesman and orator, Marcus Tullius Cicero. So here in Episode 11 of Season 5, I interview Michael C. Hawley to talk about the political philosophy of Cicero and his influence on the American Republic. Michael Hawley is an assistant professor in the School of Civic Life and Leadership at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. A 2025-2026 Visiting Fellow with the James Madison Program, he wrote the book, Natural Law Republicanism: Cicero's Liberal Legacy (2022). Now, he's working on a new one, Preaching to the Choir: The Rhetoric of Prophets, Reformers, and Demagogues. Hosted by Ryan Shinkel, Madison's Notes is the podcast of Princeton University's James Madison Program in American Ideals and Institutions. The transcript for this interview is available on the JMP substack page, “Madison's Footnotes.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/political-science

In preparation for the 250th anniversary of America's founding, it would be wise to look back at the ancient thinkers and writers who helped inspire its early leaders. Perhaps the preeminent role model was the Roman statesman and orator, Marcus Tullius Cicero. So here in Episode 11 of Season 5, I interview Michael C. Hawley to talk about the political philosophy of Cicero and his influence on the American Republic. Michael Hawley is an assistant professor in the School of Civic Life and Leadership at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. A 2025-2026 Visiting Fellow with the James Madison Program, he wrote the book, Natural Law Republicanism: Cicero's Liberal Legacy (2022). Now, he's working on a new one, Preaching to the Choir: The Rhetoric of Prophets, Reformers, and Demagogues. Hosted by Ryan Shinkel, Madison's Notes is the podcast of Princeton University's James Madison Program in American Ideals and Institutions. The transcript for this interview is available on the JMP substack page, “Madison's Footnotes.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/critical-theory

In preparation for the 250th anniversary of America's founding, it would be wise to look back at the ancient thinkers and writers who helped inspire its early leaders. Perhaps the preeminent role model was the Roman statesman and orator, Marcus Tullius Cicero. So here in Episode 11 of Season 5, I interview Michael C. Hawley to talk about the political philosophy of Cicero and his influence on the American Republic. Michael Hawley is an assistant professor in the School of Civic Life and Leadership at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. A 2025-2026 Visiting Fellow with the James Madison Program, he wrote the book, Natural Law Republicanism: Cicero's Liberal Legacy (2022). Now, he's working on a new one, Preaching to the Choir: The Rhetoric of Prophets, Reformers, and Demagogues. Hosted by Ryan Shinkel, Madison's Notes is the podcast of Princeton University's James Madison Program in American Ideals and Institutions. The transcript for this interview is available on the JMP substack page, “Madison's Footnotes.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/intellectual-history

In preparation for the 250th anniversary of America's founding, it would be wise to look back at the ancient thinkers and writers who helped inspire its early leaders. Perhaps the preeminent role model was the Roman statesman and orator, Marcus Tullius Cicero. So here in Episode 11 of Season 5, I interview Michael C. Hawley to talk about the political philosophy of Cicero and his influence on the American Republic. Michael Hawley is an assistant professor in the School of Civic Life and Leadership at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. A 2025-2026 Visiting Fellow with the James Madison Program, he wrote the book, Natural Law Republicanism: Cicero's Liberal Legacy (2022). Now, he's working on a new one, Preaching to the Choir: The Rhetoric of Prophets, Reformers, and Demagogues. Hosted by Ryan Shinkel, Madison's Notes is the podcast of Princeton University's James Madison Program in American Ideals and Institutions. The transcript for this interview is available on the JMP substack page, “Madison's Footnotes.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/american-studies

Many Christians today recognize that all is not well. There are problems in our communities, our culture and even our churches. But what can biblical Christians do in the face of these challenges?Douglas Wilson - pastor, theologian, author, serial ministry founder and cultural commentator - joins the Christian Emergency Alliance to answer these questions and more. He shares his thoughts on the most pressing needs for Christians today, and offers sage advice on how to begin thinking holistically. The ability to think in wholes, not parts, is what allows him to often spot trends before others perceive them.  He opens up about how you can develop your own capacity for worldview thinking, so you can do the same.What does Pastor Wilson think is on the horizon for Christians? How will this affect the type of pressures or persecutions Christians can anticipate? What traps lie on the path for biblical Christians, and how can we avoid falling into them? Listen in to this encore episode of the Christian Emergency Podcast to find out.If you find this material helpful, please share it with your friends and leave us a five star rating wherever you listen to your podcasts. Also, don't forget to subscribe to the show, so you'll never miss out when new episodes drop.To learn more about resources mentioned in this episode, see the following.Blog and Mablog (Blog by Douglas Wilson): https://dougwils.com/Swords and Shovels (Video for New Saint Andrews College): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHz3qXuxy6AFuture Men: Raising Boys to Fight Giants, by Douglas Wilson (Book): https://canonpress.com/products/future-men-raising-boys-to-fight-giants/Rules for Reformers, by Douglas Wilson (Book): https://canonpress.com/products/rules-for-reformers/Canon Press (Christian Publishing House): https://canonpress.com/Association of Classical Christian Schools: https://classicalchristian.org/How Should We Then Live?, by Francis A. Shaeffer (Book): https://www.christianbook.com/should-live-labri-50th-anniversary-edition/francis-schaeffer/9781581345360/pd/345364?event=ESRCNChristian Emergency Alliance: https://www.christianemergency.com/Follow the Christian Emergency Alliance on Twitter: @ChristianEmerg1Follow the Christian Emergency Alliance on Facebook: @ChristianEmergencyThe Christian Emergency Podcast is a production of the Christian Emergency Alliance.Soli Deo Gloria

Season 2, Episode 119In this episode, Michael and Zach continue their series on sin, desire, identity, and holiness by examining the biblical doctrine of concupiscence and the ongoing struggle against indwelling sin. Building on the previous discussion of original sin and fallen human nature, the conversation addresses a difficult question: What should Christians think about sinful desires that seem to arise without conscious choice? Drawing from passages such as James 1, Romans 7, Galatians 5, Hebrews 4, and the Tenth Commandment, the episode explores the distinction between external temptation and inward corruption, the historic debate over whether sinful desire is itself sin, and why the Reformers insisted that disordered desires must be taken seriously as part of humanity's fallenness. Along the way, Michael and Zach discuss the sinlessness of Christ, the doctrine of impeccability, the reality of remaining corruption in the believer, and the Spirit-empowered battle of sanctification. The episode concludes with a message of both honesty and hope: the presence of sinful desire is not proof that grace is absent, but neither is it something to celebrate. Rather, the Christian life is a real war against sin in which God progressively transforms His people through the gospel, His Spirit, and the ordinary means of grace.Find our videocast here: https://youtu.be/M9nVPTdYieUMerch here: https://take-2-podcast.printify.me/Music from #Uppbeat (free for Creators!):⁠https://uppbeat.io/t/reakt-music/deep-stone⁠License code: 2QZOZ2YHZ5UTE7C8Find more Take 2 Theology content at http://www.take2theology.com

Adrian Wooldridge discusses how the 19th-century search for talent was shaped by utilitarianism and liberal reforms. Reformers like John Stuart Mill remained suspicious of the masses, seeking to replace the landed aristocracy with an "aristocracy of talent." This led to the development of psychometrics and standardized IQ testing, exemplified by the 11-plus examination in Britain, designed to allocate educational opportunities based on general mental ability. While intended to remove nepotism, the system faced early criticism for potentially favoring those from wealthy backgrounds who could purchase better education. 31680

Adrian Wooldridge highlights the historical blindness toward women's talent among 19th-century reformers who excluded them from competitive examinations. However, the meritocratic logic of objective measurement eventually provided women with the tools to challenge these exclusions. A pivotal moment occurred when Philippa Fawcettoutperformed the top male mathematicians at Cambridge. The World Wars further eroded these barriers, as the state was forced to utilize all available intellectual talent, including thousands of female codebreakers at Bletchley Park, proving that vast amounts of hidden talent existed within the general population. 41680 CHARLES II

The meeting in Old Slaughter's Coffee House formalised the organisation's structure and objectives. Early activities included bringing prosecutions against individuals accused of mistreating animals, distributing pamphlets, and encouraging more humane standards in markets, transport, and ...

SBC Reformers Just Scored Their Biggest Win in Decades. Here's What It Really Means.   On the heels of the 2026 Southern Baptist Convention in Orlando, Executive Director William Wolfe and attorney Jon Whitehead break down two massive victories for conservative reformers: Willie Rice elected SBC President Al Mohler's Truth & Unity Amendment passes with 74%   In this episode, we unpack: How laymen and first-time messengers helped deliver a “clean sweep” Why Willy's win is the first true reform victory in 35+ years How the SBC abuse narrative was weaponized—and why that era just ended The battle of issues vs. tone and why the “tone police” lost Why Mohler stepped down from the platform to the floor mic—and why it worked What conservatives MUST do before Indianapolis 2027 to secure these gains   If you care about Baptist polity, confessional integrity, and conservative reform inside the SBC, this is your strategy briefing.   Timestamps: 0:00 – Intro: SBC Reformers Win Big in Orlando 1:45 – How the CBL Podcast Mobilized Messengers 4:40 – Laymen Showed Up: Many First-Time SBC Attendees 10:15 – How Did Willy Rice Win? 18:10 – “Reform Candidate Wins for First Time in 35 Years” 23:20 – Weaponized Empathy, False Sex Abuse Narrative vs. SBC Reality 30:05 – Issues vs Tone: Why the “Tone Police” Lost 39:45 – Mohler's Truth & Unity Amendment: Why 74% Said Yes 49:25 – Can Conservative Reformers Win Long-Term? 56:40 – Call to Action: See You in Indianapolis 2027   ––––––   Follow Center for Baptist Leadership across Social Media: X / Twitter – https://twitter.com/BaptistLeaders Facebook – https://www.facebook.com/people/Center-For-Baptist-Leadership/61556762144277/ Rumble – https://rumble.com/c/c-6157089 YouTube – https://www.youtube.com/@CenterforBaptistLeadership Website – https://centerforbaptistleadership.org/   To book William for media appearances or speaking engagements, please contact him at media@centerfor­baptistleadership.org.   Follow Us on Twitter: William Wolfe - https://twitter.com/William_E_Wolfe Richard Henry - https://twitter.com/RThenry83   Renew the SBC from within and defend the SBC from those who seek its destruction, donate today: https://centerforbaptistleadership.org/donate/   The Center for Baptist Leadership Podcast is powered by American Reformer, recorded remotely in the United States by William Wolfe, and edited by Jared Cummings.   Subscribe to the Center for Baptist Leadership Podcast: Distribute our RSS Feed – https://centerforbaptistleadership.podbean.com/ Apple Podcasts – https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/center-for-baptist-leadership/id1743074575 Spotify – https://open.spotify.com/show/0npXohTYKWYmWLsHkalF9t Amazon Music // Audible – https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/9ababbdd-6c6b-4ab9-b21a-eed951e1e67b

The Office of the Keys, the power to forgive and retain sins, has been given to the Church. This is why the Church has the right to elect and ordain qualified ministers. When one decides that the Church no longer has this authority, no matter their position, they are outside of the Lord's calling and are not to be followed. The Reformers began to elect and ordain their own ministers to assure that the pure Gospel was preached and souls received a clear conscience in Christ. Rev. David Boisclair, pastor of Our Redeemer Lutheran Church, Overland, MO, joins Rev. Brady Finnern to continue our study of the Power and Primacy of the Pope. To learn more about Our Redeemer Lutheran, visit ourredeemerstl.org. Find your copy of the Book of Concord - Concordia Reader's Edition at cph.org or read online at bookofconcord.org. Study the Lutheran Confession of Faith found in the Book of Concord with lively discussions led by host Rev. Brady Finnern, President of the LCMS Minnesota North District, and guest LCMS pastors. Join us as these Christ-confessing Concordians read through and discuss our Lutheran doctrine in the Book of Concord in order to gain a deeper understanding of our Lutheran faith and practical application for our vocations. Submit comments or questions to: listener@kfuo.org.

Segment 1 • Dr. Jason Lisle argues that the strongest case for creation isn't fossils or geology—it's something far more fundamental. • If information always comes from a mind, where did the instructions inside DNA originate? • Carbon-14 findings in diamonds and dinosaur remains continue raising uncomfortable questions for deep-time assumptions. Segment 2 • A secular psychotherapist asks a startling question: What if therapy is actually tearing people apart? • Why does every difficult relationship now seem to involve someone who is "toxic," "narcissistic," or "traumatized"? • Todd examines whether modern therapy culture is helping people heal—or teaching them how to stay offended. Segment 3 • Young evangelicals aren't abandoning religion—they're searching for something they believe is missing. • Incense, liturgy, church history, and ancient traditions are attracting a generation raised on seeker-sensitive Christianity. • Were churches so focused on relevance that they accidentally stripped away transcendence? Segment 4 • The answer isn't copying Rome or importing Eastern Orthodoxy into Protestant churches. • What did the Reformers understand about worship, discipleship, and church life that many churches have forgotten? • From catechesis to church history to reverent worship, Todd outlines what may be needed to rebuild depth before more young people leave. ___ Thanks for listening! Wretched Radio would not be possible without the financial support of our Gospel Partners. If you would like to support Wretched Radio we would be extremely grateful. VISIT https://fortisinstitute.org/donate/ If you are already a Gospel Partner we couldn't be more thankful for you if we tried!

Segment 1 • Why do churches split over doctrine when everyone claims to follow the same Bible? • Todd traces modern church confusion back to a little-known Jewish revolt that changed Christian history forever. • Could the loss of a “plain sense” reading of Scripture be why Christians can't agree on basic truths anymore? Segment 2 • The Bar Kokhba revolt didn't just crush Jerusalem — Todd argues it reshaped the entire trajectory of biblical interpretation. • Jewish Christians were squeezed out from both sides, leaving Gentile leadership to redefine how Scripture was read. • What happens when “hidden meanings” become more important than what the Bible actually says? Segment 3 • Todd explains how allegorical interpretation opened the door to wildly different doctrines and endless theological confusion. • Did replacement theology grow out of bad hermeneutics instead of sound biblical interpretation? • Early church leaders began treating the “literal” meaning of Scripture as inferior — and the consequences still linger today. Segment 4 • The Reformers fought to recover a grammatical-historical reading of Scripture after centuries of allegorical dominance. • Todd compares ancient allegorical methods to modern deconstruction: “It's not what the text says — it's what it doesn't say.” • If your church doesn't share the same hermeneutic, are division and doctrinal chaos inevitable? ___ Thanks for listening! Wretched Radio would not be possible without the financial support of our Gospel Partners. If you would like to support Wretched Radio we would be extremely grateful. VISIT https://fortisinstitute.org/donate/ If you are already a Gospel Partner we couldn't be more thankful for you if we tried!

Are you building with conviction and clarity or are you running on pride, impatience, and ego?   In this episode, we break down one of the most important distinctions in business and leadership: the difference between a Reformer and a Rebel. The side you're operating from will determine whether you build something lasting or blow it up.   3 Key Takeaways Meekness is not weakness. Reformers are submitted, coachable, and spirit-led. Rebels resist correction the moment it challenges their ego. Your fuel source is revealed under pressure, not in the highlight reel. Check what's actually driving your conviction and calling, or pride and proving people wrong. If you can't be examined, you can't be trusted with what you're trying to build. Reformers invite scrutiny. Rebels deflect it. Make sure your notepad is ready. This one hits differently. Keep taking action, pursuing personal excellence, and impacting lives!   In This Episode, We Discuss: The Reformer vs. The Rebel Two types of leaders. Two very different outcomes. Nehemiah was called to rebuild the wall of Jerusalem; he faced opposition, ridicule, and threats, and never reacted in anger. He kept building. King Saul was given a kingdom and lost it through pride, impatience, and self-will. Same pressure. Completely different response. Which one are you? The Reformer: Meek, spirit-led, purposeful, and submitted. The Rebel: Arrogant, self-willed, flesh-driven, prideful, stubborn, and impatient. Reformation is not about tearing down it's about restoration, repentance, renewal, and alignment. In business, it means aligning your work with your calling, your values, and a vision bigger than yourself.   5 Keys To Becoming a Reformer In Business Key #1  Know Your Sphere (Don't Fight Outside Your Lane) Nehemiah didn't try to reform everything he was called to one wall, one city. Rebels scatter their energy fighting battles they were never assigned to. When you work on your actual assignment, you become unstoppable.   Key #2  Meekness Is Not Weakness (Submit Before You Lead) Meekness is strength under control. Reformers are submitted to God, to mentors, to a process. Rebels are coachable until the coach challenges their ego. In business, are you building under authority or building around it?   Key #3  Check Your Fuel Source (What's Driving You?) Both reformers and rebels work hard. The difference is why. Rebel fuel is anger at the system, pride in proving people wrong, and impatience with the pace. Reformer fuel is conviction, calling, and the people they're serving.   Key #4  Patience Is a Strategy (The Long Game Wins) King Saul couldn't wait; he moved before he was supposed to and it cost him everything. Nehemiah faced 52 days of opposition and ridicule. He didn't quit. He didn't retaliate. He built. Rebels mistake urgency for anointing. Just because you feel it strongly doesn't mean it's time.   Key #5  Reformers Invite Scrutiny, Rebels Deflect It Nehemiah was transparent to the king, to the people, to God. Rebels hide from accountability, feedback, and the full picture. Do you have real financial accountability? A coach, a mastermind, a mentor who sees your actual numbers and decisions?   Follow Us: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chrisandericmartinez/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/Dynamicduotraining Website: https://www.liveadynamiclifestyle.com/     Attention Nutrition & Fitness Coaches: "Join our Free Dynamic Fit Pros Community Skool Group Where we help you Discover, Develop, & Deploy your skills, gifts, and greatness to help others."  See HERE   Attention Nutrition & Fitness Coaches: "Enrollment is Open for our Accelerator Mentorship to build a 6-Figure Online Fitness Coaching Business"  See HERE     See the full Show Notes to this episode here: https://www.liveadynamiclifestyle.com/podcast/the-reformer-vs-the-rebel-the-nehemiah-standard-for-business/  

Church discipline is one of the most neglected—and misunderstood—teachings in modern Christianity. But what if avoiding it is actually harming the church? In this episode of Take Heart, Cory Wing walks through the biblical case for church discipline and why it has always been considered essential to a healthy church. Drawing from Scripture and the Reformers, this teaching revisits the three historic marks of a true church—and the one many churches quietly ignore. You’ll see how church discipline is not about control or punishment, but about love, restoration, and faithfulness to Christ. This episode covers: • What church discipline actually is (and isn’t) • Why so many churches avoid it today • The three marks of a true church • How discipline protects both the sinner and the church Key passages: Matthew 16 & 18 Acts 5 (Ananias and Sapphira) 1 Corinthians 5 Revelation 2–3 If you’ve struggled with this topic—or seen it misused—this episode brings clarity rooted in Scripture and hope grounded in the gospel.