Every week we talk to Chief Human Resource Officers, Chief People Officers, and other Human Resources experts about the constantly evolving workplace — they share what's working, what's not, and how they've gotten to where they're at in their careers. Tu
The Modern People Leader podcast is a remarkable find for anyone interested in gaining insights into the world of high-level people leadership. Hosted by Daniel and Stephen, this podcast stands out for its down-to-earth and practical conversations that delve into timely and relevant topics. Whether you are considering a career in people leadership or looking to enhance your strategic approach in your current role, this podcast offers valuable insights from VPs of people who share their priorities and experiences.
One of the best aspects of The Modern People Leader podcast is the genuine and value-packed content it delivers. The hosts do an excellent job of sourcing progressive and open people leaders who generously share their insights, advice, opinions, and perspectives. The conversations challenge preconceived notions and encourage listeners to think critically about building a better future for their teams. With great guests and real discussions on human capital topics that impact business results, this podcast truly stands out for its authenticity.
While The Modern People Leader podcast offers immense value, one can argue that there may be room for improvement in terms of diversity. Although the conversations are insightful and engaging, it would benefit from featuring a broader range of perspectives from different industries, backgrounds, experiences, and demographics. This could help provide an even more comprehensive understanding of modern people leadership.
In conclusion, The Modern People Leader podcast is a must-listen for anyone interested in people leadership roles or wanting to stay up-to-date with the latest trends in the field. With its practical insights, timely topics, excellent hosts, engaging guests, and genuine conversations, this podcast stands out as one of the most valuable resources available for people leaders. Whether you listen during your morning routine or daily commute, you will undoubtedly gain inspiration and new perspectives from this exceptional podcast.
Angela Crossman, Hernan Chiosso, and Jean-Luc Charles joined us to debrief the “Yellow Pod” conversation from MPL Live NYC and what the group is actually doing with AI at work. We covered opportunities vs blockers, “AI as coach” guardrails, why HR should own enablement, actionable next steps, and predictions for the AI-powered workplace.---- Sponsor Links:
Joy Rothschild, Chief Human Resources Officer at Omni Hotels & Resorts, joined us on The Modern People Leader. ---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan joins MPL Build to show HR leaders how to craft business cases that CEOs actually approve, using BLUF, the So What test, and clear links to revenue and savings. We walk through conservative projections, objection handling, and a live role-play on adopting a performance platform in today's fiscally skeptical environment.---- Sponsor Links:
Kim Minnick, Founder of Code Traveller HR, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We dug into why performance reviews often fail, how companies can decouple performance from compensation, creative ways to reward employees beyond pay, and the importance of transparency, choice, and designing programs that reflect company values.---- Sponsor Links:
This episode of The Modern People Leader dives into the realities of leading through constant change, featuring guests Mita Mallick, Shelby Garrison, and Kelly Lohr. We discussed how HR leaders can navigate layoffs with transparency and humanity, the importance of supporting both exiting and remaining employees, and how to build resilience and adaptability into workplace culture.---- Sponsor Links:
Yemi Akisanya, Head of JEDI (Justice, Equity, Diversity, and Inclusion) at Axon, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about how the DEI conversation is evolving post-2020, why quotas are being replaced with performance-aligned strategies, and how Axon is making inclusion measurable and mission-critical.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan, Author of Built for People & COO at Talentful, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about AI adoption in HR, from policy design to hands-on building. We explored the “Wild West” of AI use, tool selection, overcoming the stigma of ‘cheating,' and practical frameworks like the 4Bs (Bot, Build, Borrow, Buy) to guide adoption and innovation.---- Sponsor Links:
Pilar Muner, VP of People & Talent at ChartHop, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We covered:- Why fractional work isn't always the burnout cure-all it's made out to be-How ChartHop is using AI to power HR workflows in-house- The AI vendor checklist every HR leader needs — what to ask, what to watch for, and how to cut through the hypeIf you're evaluating AI tools for your people team, this episode will give you a practical lens on security, data integrity, and what to prioritize in vendor selection.---- Sponsor Links:
JooBee Yeow joined us on The Modern People Leader to talk about why HR must stop overfunctioning and start diagnosing real business problems—especially when revenue is on the line. We discussed how HR leaders can step out of their silo, challenge assumptions, influence revenue growth, and flip the HR pyramid to prioritize high-impact, strategic work.---- Sponsor Links:
Tiffany Stevenson, former Chief People Officer at WeightWatchers and Patreon, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about this being the CHROs toughest chapter yet, how AI is reshaping HR, and what HR brings to the boardroom.---- Sponsor Links:
Priscila Bala, CEO of LifeLabs Learning, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We explored how AI is transforming learning, the enduring role of middle management, and why the most impactful leadership skills are more human than ever.---- Resources Mentioned:
Jenny Molyneaux, VP of People at Vercel, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about why AI is replacing HR tech spend before headcount, how Vercel's people team is building custom AI tools to replace expensive SaaS products, and what HR leaders can do to start building with AI today.---- Sponsor Links:
Geanne Weaver-Hepler (Director of EX, Charlie Health), Allison Vendt (VP, People Ops & Head of EX at Dropbox), Nick Freeman (Co-CEO, Marco), and Brian Elliott (CEO, Work Forward) joined us to talk about what's broken with employee connection—and how to fix it. We explored practical frameworks for offsites, hybrid team building, and creating meaningful connection moments across distributed workforces.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan, COO at Whereby, joined us again on The Modern People Leader for a deep dive into Employee Lifetime Value (ELTV). We explored how HR leaders can adapt marketing-style metrics like LTV to CAC for talent, the different ways to calculate it, and how the process itself can reshape how People teams think about value, cost, and impact.---- Sponsor Links:
Joanne Rodgers, CHRO of New York Life, joined us on The Modern People Leader to share how her 30-year journey at the company led her from securities regulation to the C-suite. We talked about the DNA of New York Life's culture, how they're rolling out AI tools company-wide, and why HR must lead the charge in this era of transformation.---- Sponsor Links:
Jennifer Henderson (CEO, Tilt), Jessica Winder (SVP People, CoLab Software), Allison Whalen (CEO, Parentaly), and Justin Clifford (CEO, Bereave) joined us to talk about what most companies get wrong when it comes to employee leave. We discussed parental and bereavement leave through a human lens—from compliance and continuity to return-to-work strategies and performance review pitfalls.----
Kahina Ouerdane, Chief People Officer at Workleap, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about her journey from international human rights law to tech, how software is the new workplace, why AI is forcing a rethinking of learning and org design, and more.---- Sponsor Links:
Alex Buder Shapiro, Chief People Officer at Jasper, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about how AI is reshaping organizational design, the shift from early-career jobs to early-career talent, and how HR teams can lead through experimentation and workflow innovation.---- Sponsor Links:
Eliza Jackson, Chief People and Administrative Officer at ButcherBox, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about how operational excellence can protect and scale company culture, how her team built a "work in service of" mindset, and how ButcherBox is using AI agents to unlock capacity—not replace people.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan and Joris Luijke joined us to break down the what, why, and how to create an employee journey map. We talked about why People teams should be designing for moments and not just processes, why journey mapping should start small, and why 80% of employee moments fall flat.---- Sponsor Links:
Thomas Forstner, VP of People and Talent at Juro, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about building an AI-native company, why HR should own workflows not just the workforce, and how people teams must evolve from playbook followers to visionary architects of the modern org.---- Sponsor Links:
Helen Russell, Chief People Officer at HubSpot, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about how HubSpot is fostering an AI-first culture, why belonging is so important right now, and what HR leaders can do to move fast without losing their humanity.---- Sponsor Links:
Lenke Taylor joined us on The Modern People Leader to talk about her path from engineering to HR, and what it means to be a true business partner. We discussed how HR can lead alongside CEOs and CFOs, building high-impact teams, and how working in Europe has shaped her leadership approach.---- Sponsor Links:
We were joined by people leaders from Glassdoor, Asana, and Upstart. We talked about the fragmented burnout and how it's hitting people differently, how performance expectations have shifted in the last 6-12 months, and more.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan joined us again to unpack the metrics that actually matter in HR today. We talked about the three buckets of metrics every People Leader should use, why the RANS test is a better way to measure engagement, and the one metric to rule them all (ELTV:CAC). ---- Sponsor Links:
Frieda Möcker, Head of People & Culture at Sastrify, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about the first steps she took to treat HR more like a product, how her team does sprint planning, and why she prefers “NCTs” over OKRs.---- Sponsor Links:
Tiffany Stevenson (Former CPO, WeightWatchers), Jennifer Rettig (CPO, Pendo.io), and Kelli Dragovich (4x CHRO & Co-host of HR Heretics), joined us for MPL Live in San Francisco.We talked about the pressure HR leaders are under, what CEOs are really thinking, and how we can reimagine performance with simpler systems, clearer expectations, and more human conversations.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan joined us again on The Modern People Leader to break down how to hire for a people ops as a product team.She shared the 5 core skillsets needed, the importance of t-shaped talent, and how to use case studies to spot product thinking in HR Candidates.---- Sponsor Links:
Matt McFarlane and Haris Ikram joined us for a live session to break down everything modern HR leaders need to know about compensation—from philosophy and strategy to pay transparency and AI tools. Together, they shared a forward-thinking playbook for tackling merit cycles, aligning job architecture, and driving better employee experiences through data and design.---- Sponsor Links:
Abby Brennan joined us on The Modern People Leader. We discussed the power of ONA as the “shadow org chart,” how it reveals hidden influencers, and why it may be key to building smarter, more connected teams in the age of AI.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan joined us again on The Modern People Leader to unpack how to structure a people ops as a product team. She shared four ways to build an HR squad, how to use a spider diagram for squad design, and why it's smart to pilot just one squad first.---- Sponsor Links:
Bryan Power, Head of People at Nextdoor, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about how the company is navigating its “third era” under the return of co-founder Nirav Tolia. We explored “The Founders Mentality”, embracing an owner's mindset, and Nextdoor's AI bootcamp.---- Sponsor Links:
Jessica Zwaan, COO at Talentful and author of Built for People, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about “human ops” versus “people ops”, the sprint planning process for her people team, and how nobody gets people ops as a product 100% right (and that's ok).---- Sponsor Links:
Taylor Bradley, VP of Talent Strategy and Success at Turing, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about why every HR team needs to create an AI “prompt pantry”, how Turing “AI'd” their way out of onboarding 800 employees in five days, and how to build AI workflows for HR.---- Sponsor Links:
Molly Sands, Head of the Teamwork Lab at Atlassian, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about Atlassian's latest research on the three things the best teams do differently, the power of unleashing collective knowledge, and why distributed teams have a headstart on AI adoption.----
Pat Wadors, CHRO at Intuitive, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about how to find and amplify the golden nuggets of your culture, the three layers of a great employee experience, why you need to “touch the elephant”, and what kids' stories can teach us about leadership.----
Jessica Zwaan returned to The Modern People Leader for a deep dive on how her PeopleOps as a Product philosophy came to life. We talked about the early days of the framework, writing her book, and the launch of MPL Build — a new collaboration between MPL and Jessica to bring the methodology to more teams.----
Shane Koller joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about adopting a product mindset in HR, how Ancestry's people team built their “product roadmap”, and why even great HR programs fall short when they're not connected.----
Michele Bousquet joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about her career journey, leading with heart, and why HR shouldn't be so complicated.----
Michael Walsh, CEO of Cariloop, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We discussed the caregiving challenges facing employees today, how companies can better support working caregivers, and the data-backed insights from Cariloop's Top Needs Report.----
Linda Aiello (CPO, DraftKings), Carmel Galvin (CPO, Klaviyo), and Stacey Richey (Global VP, People, Smartcat), joined us for MPL Live in Boston, Massachusetts.We talked about the current state of HR, how roles are shifting with AI, and how they're moving beyond traditional engagement metrics.----
Shlomit Gruman-Navot joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about her evolution as a people leader and how Miro is making AI learning a priority for employees. ----
Brandon Carson, Chief Learning Officer at Docebo, joined us on The Modern People Leader.We talked about the one thing holding companies back from adopting AI faster, why AI makes learning “scaled to one”, and why the future of work isn't about replacing humans - it's about amplifying them.----
Crystal Boysen, Chief People Officer at Sprout Social, joined us for a deep dive into People Debt. We discussed what it is, how to identify it, and specific areas where Sprout Social is focusing its efforts to address it.----
Brian Elliott, a leading expert on flexible work, joined us on the show.We talked about whether or not remote work is actually dead (looked at the actual data), the questions to ask when your CEO pushes for a RTO, and why a return to office won't fix bad management.---- Sign up for our upcoming webinar with ChartHop. Get Atlassian's free guide to AI-powered knowledge management Buy tickets for MPL Live Boston.---- (07:36) How Brian became a leading voice on the future of work(13:39) The origins of Slack's Future Forum and key findings(14:56) The media vs. reality: Is remote work really dead?(17:14) CEOs pushing RTO: Data-driven decision or gut feeling?(19:02) The role of real estate, stealth layoffs, and productivity concerns(23:27) The trust factor: Why some leaders struggle with hybrid models(26:35) Politics and workplace decisions: The hidden forces at play(28:34) The shift from central business districts to neighborhood economies(30:37) The future of work isn't fully remote or in-office—it's flexible(34:12) How HR leaders can push back on RTO mandates(38:19) The contradiction: CEOs demanding AI innovation while enforcing RTO(41:50) Performance management in a hybrid world: Why tracking outcomes matters(47:33) How leading companies successfully implement flexible work policies(49:30) The impact of return-to-office policies on women in the workforce(54:23) What cities will look like in a remote-first future(57:57) Five years from now: What will the workplace look like?(01:01:43) The economic realities of remote work and city tax structures----
Lucia Guillory, Chief People Officer at Virta Health, joined us on the show.We discussed how HR teams can adopt a product-driven mindset, the importance of leadership self-awareness, and how Virta Health fosters connection in a fully remote work environment.---- Submit the craziest request you've ever gotten in HR.Buy tickets for MPL Live Boston.---- (07:24) Lucia's career journey from psychology to HR leadership(08:52) The importance of authenticity and self-awareness in leadership(13:39) The process of unlearning leadership habits and self-doubt(21:05) What Virta Health does and its mission to reverse diabetes(23:57) Can you build community on a fully remote team(26:30) The challenges and successes of transitioning to remote-first(28:14) How remote work impacts employee meaning and connection(30:31) The role of culture in a distributed workforce(35:39) How Virta Health structures onboarding for remote employees(38:54) HR as a product: Building an employee experience life cycle(43:26) Why job leveling is the foundation of a strong HR function(47:01) How to identify when compensation structures aren't working(49:30) Rapid fire questions----
We talked about the growing backlash against DEI initiatives and why companies are scaling back their commitment, the potential hidden agendas behind RTO mandates, and the current frustrations with HR tech. ---- Submit the craziest request you've ever gotten in HR. Buy tickets for MPL Live Boston. ---- Timestamps: (08:11) The anti-DEI movement (14:23) Did DEI programs scale too quickly post-2020? (18:29) The role of activists in influencing corporate DEI rollbacks (26:07) Are RTO mandates being used to justify workforce reductions? (29:25) The impact of return-to-office policies (36:58) The growing frustration with HR tech—why is it failing? (45:42) Has AI-driven HR tech delivered on its promises? (50:17) Are legacy HR systems holding companies back? (57:00) The college admissions debate and perceptions of fairness in hiring (01:05:44) One-word close ----
Dave Scott, Chief People and Administration Officer at ADT, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We discussed ADT's evolution from a services to tech company, Dave's journey from Walmart to leading HR at ADT, and how to cut costs in HR without cutting value. ---- Submit the craziest request you've ever gotten in HR. Buy tickets for MPL Live Boston. ---- Timestamps: 06:39) Dave's professional journey: From Walmart to ADT (11:01) Dave's early career as a professional clown (12:33) ADT's mission and transition to a technology company (22:40) ADT's transformation: A product-focused mindset (27:51) Hiring strategies to attract tech talent at ADT (30:39) Transforming the HR function at ADT (35:24) Skills and organizational design for the future workforce (41:34) Cost management strategies for HR in 2024 and beyond (49:55) Rapid-fire questions ----
Sam Simmons, Chief People and Internal Operations Officer at the LPGA, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We talked about her transition from the San Antonio Spurs to the LPGA, 2025 HR predictions, and the LPGA People Team goals for the year. ---- Buy tickets for MPL Live Boston. ---- Timestamps: (03:21) Sam's journey to the LPGA (14:47) Challenges and learnings from 2024 (17:42) Leadership goals for 2025 (21:25) Mantras for 2025 (23:26) Predictions for HR in 2025: Challenges and opportunities (27:25) AI's role in HR: Optimizing work with tools (29:54) Addressing key challenges in DEI and organizational change (33:45) 2025 HR goals and Sam's strategic planning approach (40:33) The most critical HR goal for the LPGA in 2025 (46:16) HR tech stack considerations and streamlining processes ----
This is the 2024 MPL Awards Show. Each of us selected a winner for the four different awards: (8:14) Award #1: The CEO Whisperer (18:27) Award #2: The Best Hang (24:19) Award #3: The Data Hero (39:15) Award #4: The Innovator ---- MPL Links: Buy tickets for MPL Live Boston Fill out this survey to help us improve the podcast ---- Episodes referenced: Episode 148 - Hannah Yardley (Chief People Officer, Achievers) Episode 165 - Brandon Sammut (Chief People Officer, Zapier) Episode 186 - Hebba Youssef (Chief People Officer, Workweek) Episode 193 - Brené Brown Episode 149 - Annie Dean (VP of Team Anywhere, Atlassian) Episode 187 - Nick Bloom (Stanford Economist & Co-Founder of wfhresearch.com) Episode 167 - David Hanrahan (Chief People Officer, Flare) Episode 194 - Melanie Rosenwasser (Chief People Officer, Dropbox) ---- Interview referenced: Brian Chesky - Founder Mode interview ----
Brené Brown, professor, author, and podcast host, joined us on The Modern People Leader. We discussed her experience as a leader, the concept of metacognition, and the leadership skill of creating space between stimulus and response. ---- (1:35) Good news stories (3:45) Brené's story (19:49) Every day is leg day as a leader (25:47) Metacognition (28:25) Creating the space between stimulus and response (44:08) The challenges of implementing a four-day workweek (47:00) Rapid fire questions exploring leadership and the future of work ----
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