Podcasts about Frank Deford

“Operating in the world of what really is possible. What do I really think I can achieve? But then, once he had set his mind on it, yes, this is something doable. This is something I firmly believe I can do, then obviously, unexpected obstacles always arise. But he refused to be defeated by one.” Talmage Boston Top Five Tips For World Leaders1. Integrity/credibility 2. Consensus building to effectuate successful diplomacy3. Principled pragmatism/recognition of necessity for compromise to make a deal 4. Magnanimity needed for the long haul – stay above the fray by not taking antagonistic bait 5. Make promises carefully  TIME STAMP SUMMARY01:06 Operating with integrity and truth is a core principle all leaders should have07:05 The current turmoil in the world leaders13:20  Often compromising is important21:40  Keep your promises but be careful when making them Where to find Talmage?Website                         www.talmageboston.com. LinkedIn                        https://www.linkedin.com/in/talmageboston/ Talmage Boston Bio Talmage Boston is a recognized figure among leading historians, with endorsements from David McCullough, Jon Meacham, and others. His diverse background as a lawyer and historian uniquely qualifies him to explore the intersection of history, leadership, and contemporary relevance. Talmage Boston has practiced law as a commercial trial and appellate litigator in Dallas, Texas since 1978. He is now a partner at Shackelford, Bowen, McKinley & Norton, LLP. He has been board certified in civil trial law since 1988, as well as board certified in civil appellate law since 1990, by the Texas Board of Legal Specialization. Talmage has been recognized in Texas Monthly as a “Texas Super Lawyer” in Business Litigation since inception in 2003. Talmage has successfully represented clients in state and federal court lawsuits and arbitrations involving oil and gas, real estate, banking, intellectual property and partnership disputes. During his 40-year career, he has successfully tried jury trials throughout Texas and prevailed in appellate courts across the state, including the Texas Supreme Court and the United States Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit.A leader of both the State Bar of Texas and the Dallas Bar Association, Talmage has served as a State Bar of Texas director, as well as chair of the State Bar Litigation Section, Council of Chairs, and Annual Meeting planning committee. He has also served as the Dallas Bar Association advisory director and chair of the Dallas Bar's Business Litigation Section. For his service, he received Presidential Citations from State Bar of Texas presidents every year from 2005 to 2011 and 2018, and also from the Dallas Bar Association president in 2009.In addition to maintaining his full-time law practice, Talmage is the author of four books: (1) Cross-Examining History: A Lawyer Gets Answers From the Experts About Our Presidents (Bright Sky Press 2016, Foreword by Ken Burns); (2) Raising the Bar: The Crucial Role of the Lawyer in Society (TexasBarBooks 2012, Foreword by former U.S. Attorney General Dick Thornburgh); (3) Baseball and the Baby Boomer (Bright Sky Press 2009, Foreword by Frank Deford); (4) 1939: Baseball's Tipping Point (Bright Sky Press 2005, Foreword by John Grisham).

Frank Deford, the late author of "Over Time: My Life as a Sportswriter," tells a story about his stint with the 'lite beer all stars' and interactions with Rodney Dangerfield and Ben Davidson. The full interview from a 2012 episode of "Conversations On The Coast with Jim Foster" can be heard now wherever you get your podcasts.

Chris McCarron burst onto the scene in 1974... he won his first race in February of that year... and 546 more the rest of the year... setting an all-time record at the time. And he was just getting started. He would go on to be in the winner's circle an astonishing 7,141 times amassing over $264 million dollars in earnings... the most ever. Born in Boston, McCarron was introduced to America when Frank Deford wrote a feature on him in Sports Illustrated in January of '75... and from there, Chris rode into history. He won the Kentucky Derby in '87 on Alysheba, and again in '94 on Go For Gin. He won the Preakness twice as well as the Belmont twice. 5 times he won the Breeders Cup Classic. And in 1984, he rode John Henry for the final 14 times of the legendary horses career, when at the age of 9, he won horse of the year. In 1977, he took his talents to the West Coast and Santa Anita and was part of the greatest pack of jockeys ever to ride at the same time. Willie Shoemaker, Laffit Pincay, Jr., Eddie Delahoussaye, Gary Stevens, Kent Desormeaux, Sandy Hawley, Alex Solis, and Pat Valenzuela... and McCarron more than held his own, winning 21% of his races in his storied career. Now, 20+ years removed from the saddle, McCarron joins us on the Past Our Prime podcast to talk about that feature in SI... what Deford wrote about him that he didn't care for... how his older brother Gregg, also a jockey, called his parents and said Chris was too scared to ride horses... how it felt to win the Derby with Alysheba and how John Henry did the impossible at age 9. He's part of horse racing royalty. A king in the Sport of Kings. Join us for a trip around the track with an all-time great... Chris McCarron on the POP podcast. Please subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Doc opens talking about the art of writing in sports, art and surgery. Doc uses examples of Frank Deford in sports and Rod Serling in art. Injury of the week is the Sun's Dario Saric ACL injury. The Weekend Warrior Clinic opens for listeners.

From 2003 - a conversation with renowned sportswriter Frank DeFord, talking about his novel AN AMERICAN SUMMER. DeFord was a longtime writer for Sports Illustrated as well as a longtime sports commentator on NPR's Morning Edition. He passed away in 2017.

On writing a book with Digger Phelps and projecting the greatness of Clint Hurdle; on the golden era of print magazines; on Dan Jenkins and Frank Deford and Mark Kram; on watching his beloved publication morph and change; on the legendary editor who smelled of body odor.

On the anger of Bobby Knight and the love of Christian Laettner. On why John McEnroe was a brat and why Dean Smith only gave five minutes. On the magic of Sports Illustrated in the 1960s and the splendor of Frank Deford.

On the dispiriting demise (and end?) of his beloved magazine; on the curious case of Sidd Finch and the decision to tell Michael Jordan to bag baseball; on defending the Swimsuit Issue and a bitter divorce from Frank Deford; on Dan Jenkins and George Plimpton and William Nack and Pat Putnam and Rick Reilly and the world's greatest sports writers.

The industry of journalism in this country is under attack as never before. That's not news. What is news is when the onslaught comes from within, as in self-inflicted wounds. And while the division of journalism that extends to sports may not always be held in the highest of regards within the division, it is an essential and perhaps most visible part. So, when that necessary and noticeable wing of the Fourth Estate catches friendly fire, it's cause for concern. Twice, in recent weeks, sports journalism has taken hits, hits that were entirely avoidable and entirely of the making of those involved. In the first case, the wound should be superficial, but the shrapnel may hurt everyone, but the people directly responsible. During an airing of a podcast, Charissa Thompson, a former NFL sideline reporter, said she would make up reports, particularly if she couldn't reach a coach at halftime. Thompson made this admission to Erin Andrews, another sideline reporter, who copped to the idea that she had done the same thing, though in her case, Andrews said she made things up to protect a coach. Both Thompson, who now hosts NFL game programming on Amazon and Fox, and Andrews issued lukewarm clarifications for their admissions. Neither has been publicly reprimanded by their employers. Their conduct drew swift and, in some cases, furious condemnation from their colleagues who recognize the damage the admission of phony reporting can do to the institution of journalism, even if you don't equate asking a coach or player about their thoughts with Woodward and Bernstein during Watergate. Those sideline colleagues, almost exclusively women, further understand the harm that Andrews and Thompson have done to the cause of female sports reporters who already enter the fray at a credibility disadvantage from many simply because of their gender. That Thompson and Andrews appear poised to emerge unscathed is a cynical gambit from Fox and Amazon that viewers don't care what comes from their television sets. Meanwhile, the website Futurism reported that Sports Illustrated posted online pieces from fictitious writers whose headshots were generated by artificial intelligence. Officials at Arena, which owns SI, denied the allegations, but acknowledged that the magazine had carried material from a third-party provider that allowed writers to use pen names or pseudonyms. That material has been pulled, officials said, and an investigation is being conducted. Even if you take these officials at their word, the notion that Sports Illustrated, once home to some of the greatest names in sports journalism, giants like Jack McCallum, Leigh Montville, Gary Smith and Baltimore's own Frank DeFord, farmed out its space to what amounts to an advertising firm, is anathema. To be clear, organizations who fly reputable journalistic banners are already testing the limits of AI usage, up to and including posting stories generated by bots, rather than flesh and blood people, in the name of saving money. But the folks who run places like Fox, Amazon and Arena had better start considering what happens when the public can't trust what it hears or reads, even if it's just about silly games. And that's how I see it for this week. You can reach us via email with your questions and comments at Sports at Large at gmail.com. And follow me on Threads and Twitter at Sports at Large. Until next week, for all of us here, I'm Milton Kent. Thanks for listening and enjoy the games.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

A classic interview with the late legendary sports reporter Frank DeFord, Stan drops some class action buzzwords, Grab Bag, Local Beat, Roger's Entertainment Corner, Junior's segment, a game of Stan's Everybody Knows where listeners go up against the clock and try to answer easy questions, News Headlines, Fluffer, your emails, a classic Haney bit, News, Roots of Rock week continues, classic standup comedy, and more...

On a relatively lighter note, we welcome national baseball writer for the New York Times, Tyler Kepner, to talk about issues in the sports world in general but more specifically about his latest book “The Grandest Stage: A History Of The World Series.” Also joining the conversation will be friend of the program, Ken Reed, policy director of League of Fans, whose book “How to Save Sports: A Game Plan” has been updated. Plus, Ralph pays tribute to the late activist and entertainer, Harry Belafonte and has some choice words for Bernie Sanders' early endorsement of Joe Biden's 2024 presidential campaign.Tyler Kepner is national baseball writer for the New York Times, where he has covered every World Series Game of the last two decades. He's not just a sports reporter, he's a sports historian. He is the author of K: A History Of Baseball In Ten Pitches, and The Grandest Stage: A History Of The World Series.Certainly, it's the apex of the season— the thing that every fan ultimately looks forward to. The World Series as an event has had some challenges—certainly the Super Bowl has overtaken it in terms of eyeballs. But that's just one game. The World Series is a weeklong event. It's always fascinating to me the history behind it, the way it's managed within the games, the way certain players respond to that spotlight, the way momentum can turn so quickly.Tyler Kepner, author of "The Grandest Stage: A History of the World Series"Dr. Ken Reed is Sports Policy Director for the League of Fans and the author of How We Can Save Sports: A Game Plan, Ego vs. Soul in Sports: Essays on Sport at Its Best and Worst, and The Sports Reformers: Working to Make the World of Sports a Better Place. Ken's writing has been highly praised by legendary sports writers Robert Lipsyte and Frank Deford, and he is a long-time sports marketing consultant, sports studies instructor, sports issues analyst, columnist, and author.Some people ask me “Why do you hate sports?” or “Why are you so angry about sports?” Ironically, I'm probably one of the most passionate people there are about sports. But I think if you love sports, you have to be angry at some of these issues that we've talked about. I always go back to a RFK quote that I love— “The sharpest criticism often goes hand in hand with the deepest idealism and love of country.” And I think that applies to me with sports, and that's why we do what we do at League of Fans.Ken Reed policy director "League of Fans"Harry Belafonte was a great entertainer and a great social activist for justice, civil rights, and African Americans. He grew up in the Caribbean, and he never faltered. He never was co-opted. He never put ambition before his candid statements, again and again, on the violations on the civil rights of people who were powerless.Ralph NaderI think it was a strategic mistake. [Bernie Sanders] endorsed [Joe Biden] without any conditions. He didn't get any commitments from Joe Biden for his endorsement. And because of his leadership role among progressive politicians, he's undermined progressive legislators from holding out and pulling Biden and the corporate Democrats more into progressive territory. I was shocked.Ralph NaderIn Case You Haven't Heard with Francesco DeSantis1. Who is behind the recent campaign to deregulate child labor? A new Washington Post report finds that a Florida based right-wing think tank called the Foundation for Government Accountability, and its lobbying arm the Opportunity Solutions Project, have been the prime movers behind the laws passed in Arkansas and Iowa, as well as efforts to do the same in Minnesota, Ohio, and Georgia. This campaign goes beyond the pale even for some traditional conservative groups. Randy Zook, president of the Arkansas State Chamber of Commerce, said in an interview that his state's law was “a solution looking for a problem.”2. From the Intercept: The war in Yemen appears to be winding down, as Saudi Arabia and the Iranian-backed Houthi rebels have agreed to a long-term ceasefire brokered by China. Trita Parsi, executive vice president of the Quincy Institute for Responsible Statecraft, weighed in, saying “Biden promised to end the war in Yemen. Two years into his presidency, China may have delivered on that promise.” This breakthrough comes amid a broader Saudi-Iranian rapprochement – also driven by China – which has taken on the role of peacemaker both in the Middle East and in Ukraine in the absence of strong peace leadership from the US. Rep. Ro Khanna tweeted “It's past time for Saudis to end their brutal eight-year war and blockade on Yemen, as I've advocated for years. This will create the opportunity for the Yemeni people to decide their own political future.”3. Arizona activist Kai Newkirk reports that “By an overwhelming vote, the Arizona Democratic Party...passed a resolution calling on Democrats nationwide — from grassroots activists to party leaders — to pledge to support the winner of the Democratic primary to replace Kyrsten Sinema.” Moreover, Jezebel reports that a new Public Policy Polling survey shows that Ruben Gallego would pull 42 percent of the vote, in a three-way race, with election-denying Republican Kari Lake drawing 35 percent, and Sinema just 14 percent. Sinema also lags behind Gallego in terms of fundraising, bringing in just $2.1 million in the first quarter compared to Gallego's $3.7 million, with just 0.3 percent of her donations were from small dollar donors, per NBC News.4. From Reuters: Reinvigorated with new funding from the Inflation Reduction Act, the IRS was able to provide live support to 87% of customer calls this tax season, up from just 15% last year. The average time on hold decreased from 27 minutes to just four.5. A new article in the American Prospect covers the insidious new ways corporations are surveilling and targeting low-income consumers enrolled in the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, better known as SNAP. Since the pandemic, the Department of Agriculture has allowed SNAP recipients to order groceries online, but have not erected sufficient data privacy protections. The Center for Digital Democracy, which has monitored the program, finds that the lack of oversight results in this data being exploited by predatory advertisers hawking junk food and even financial products like payday loans.6. Socialist Seattle City Councilor Kshama Sawant announced via Twitter that Seattle has passed her bill to cap late rent fees at $10 per month. The national standard late rent fee is between 5 and 10 percent, meaning this could save renters a considerable chunk of change.7. From Rolling Stone: The film How to Blow Up a Pipeline, adapted from the book of the same name, is causing quite a stir among law enforcement. At least 23 separate federal and sate entities, including the FBI, have sent out at least 35 warnings about the film, which is a work of fiction. The film also holds a 95 percent fresh rating on Rotten Tomatoes.8. The Lever reports that on Monday, Former Speaker Nancy Pelosi received an award from the American Hospital Association or AHA, for “her incredible efforts in advancing health care.” The Lever alleges that she received this award for “blocking consideration of Medicare for All or any other major reforms to the insurance-based health care system.” The AHA, a top lobbying group for hospitals, raised $129 million in 2021 and represents large hospital chains like CommonSpirit Health, Ascension, and Tenet Healthcare.9. The Louisville Courier-Journal reports that Myles Cosgrove, the police officer who killed Breonna Taylor by mistake in a no-knock search, has been rehired by the Carroll County Sheriff's Department, about one hour northeast of Louisville. Cosgrove was fired by the Louisville Metro Police Department in January 2021.10.The Pentagon has requested an additional $36 million to fund research and treatment for “Havana Syndrome,” per the Intercept. Many doubt the very existence of Havana Syndrome, especially since a US Intelligence assessment in March found that the symptoms were “not caused by [an] energy weapon or foreign adversary,” as had long been alleged.11. According to the Washington Post, The brand-new Smithsonian American Women's History Museum announced last month that Nancy Yao will serve as its founding director. Yao currently runs the New York City-based Museum of Chinese in America and has been sued multiple times for wrongful termination, retaliation against whistleblowers, and protecting sexual harassers.12. Greenpeace USA announced that they have won the Strategic Lawsuits Against Public Participation, or SLAPP case, that they've been embroiled in. The suit was brought against Greenpeace by a Canadian logging company, who sued for $100 million dollars Canadian, in an attempt to “silence and bankrupt” the organization. Greenpeace added that they are “now able to turn our attention to what lays ahead in this continued fight: We can't allow corporate polluters to stand in the way of climate justice by manipulating our legal system and our democracy.” Get full access to Ralph Nader Radio Hour at www.ralphnaderradiohour.com/subscribe

TRUMP IS REALLY, REALLY, SCREWED A BLOCK (1:50) SPECIAL COMMENT: A Justice Department photo shows at least five bright yellow TOP SECRET/SCI files strewn on a gaudy carpet. Some pictures are worth a thousand words - this mind-blowing one looks like it's worth 10 to 20 in a Supermax for Trump. The DOJ answer to Trump's ill-conceived "Special Master" suit is released early Wednesday morning and in it, Trump destroys his own defense that he "declassified" all the documents, as government agents swear Trump did NOT assert Executive Privilege over any of the documents he turned over in June, nor did he claim any of them had been declassified. There are countless lesser Trump self-destructions in the DOJ filing that add up to Obstruction of Justice, Concealing Classified Documents, and Falsely Sworn Documents - and all this is BEFORE WE EVEN KNOW FOR SURE WHAT'S IN THE DOCUMENTS. (7:20) And this may not even be the worst news of the day for Trump. President Biden is clearly on offense, slamming Lindsey Graham for his "riots in the streets" promise. (8:06) Graham actually makes it worse: he goes back on Fox and flatly lies, and denies he said what he said on Fox two nights earlier (10:33) Biden's willingness to call out Republicans normalizes the terms he uses like "semi-fascism" and builds momentum for others to use them on a daily basis (14:20) To paraphrase "The Manchurian Candidate": "Are they saying ARE there any fascists in the Republican Party? Of course not! They're saying HOW MANY fascists are there in the Republican Party!" (14:20) Trump meanwhile goes full QAnon, posting direct messages from the imaginary figure and all but calling for another coup to be led by people who believe prophesy tells them to participate (17:15) But overarching all of it is that one photo: glowing TOP SECRET/SCI files on a carpet like so many baseball cards. B BLOCK (19:42) EVERY DOG HAS ITS DAY: Hadley (20:57) POSTSCRIPTS TO THE NEWS: Gorbachev dies just before Putin finishes undoing all his work. How will your town look under 10 inches of melted glacial water? How come the dirty words on the GOP headquarters were carefully sprayed AROUND the Republican logo? (23:32) IN SPORTS: Sweden warns its players: don't go to Russia. Why are we letting Russians play in the NHL? And sports blogger Clay Travis actually compares vaccine-refuseniks Aaron Rodgers, Kyrie Irving and Novak Djokovic to Muhammad Ali's refusal to be inducted into the military: "Covid is our modern era Vietnam," says the dumbest man on the planet (29:47) THE WORST PERSONS IN THE WORLD: Ted Cruz, Joe Rogan, and Herschel Walker - proudly insisting "My bike is not bent" compete for the honors. C BLOCK (34:43) THINGS I PROMISED NOT TO TELL: It's the birthday of the late Daniel Schorr, the last man hired by Ed Murrow at CBS News, a proud member of Richard Nixon's enemies list, and my colleague at CNN 40 years ago. The best story? The day I had to delay his interview with the CIA chief for breaking... College Football Rankings News!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

[A June 2017 archive re-release favorite with one of the true insiders behind the initial success of the legendary original 1970s/80s Major Indoor Soccer League!] This week, Tim Hanlon buckles up for a wild ride through the tumultuous early years of the original Major Indoor Soccer League with sports PR veteran Michael Menchel, in our longest and most anecdote-filled episode yet!  Menchel takes us on a head-spinning audio journey across some of the most memorable (and forgettable) franchises in professional indoor soccer history – including stops in Long Island, NY (the Arrows trade for Pete Rose!); New Jersey (scoring champ Fred Grgurev's unique approach to car maintenance!); Houston (the “Summit Soccer” borrows its name from the arena it plays in and its players from the NASL's Hurricane!); Baltimore (the marketing genius of Tim Leiweke!); and Hartford (what the hell is a “Hellion”?).   Plus, Menchel:  hits the road with Frank Deford;  spends a year outdoors among the Caribou(s?) of Colorado;  has a bad day in Rochester, NY;  and “settles down” in St. Louis wondering when and where the NFL football Cardinals will move next.

For more than half a century, Frank Deford wrote for Sports Illustrated magazine and for 37 of those years he was also heard regularly on NPR, and seen on HBO's Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel. Six times, Deford was voted national sports writer of the year by the National Sportscasters and Sports Writers Association. But after all those years it took him until 2012 to finally write his memoir, a book. He called Over Time. I had met Frank a couple of times before that, but it was nice to see him again to talk about his book as we sat and chatted in a Washington DC hotel lobby.

Javier Leiva from Pretend did a podcast with me!!!!  Like what you hear?  Become a patron of the arts for as little as $2 a month!   Or buy the book or some merch.   We teach each other about: 03:10 a pig in a poke 06:30 salting a mine 10:00 melon drop 14:50 vanity awards 21:55 Baltimore stock-broker 25:00 fake casting agents Plus learn the three most interesting things about me! Hang out with your fellow Brainiacs.  Reach out and touch Moxie on Facebook, Twitter,  or Instagram. Sponsors: Sly Fox Trivia, Sambucol Pig in a Poke (Cat in a bag) Have you ever heard the expression “a pig in a poke” or “don't let the cat out of the bag?” You might be surprised at the origins of this cliche. A pig in a poke is a thing that is bought without first being inspected, and thus of unknown authenticity or quality. The idiom is attested in 1555 in the writings of John Haywood: I wyll neuer bye the pyg in the poke, Thers many a foule pyg in a feyre cloke. A "poke," I should explain, is a bag, so you can't actually see the pig. How it would work… But the piglet would often turn out to be a bundle of rags or some inanimate object that gve the huckster away, so they shifted tack to stuffing stray cats in the poke so there were be movement. When the buyer opened the bag after the con man has absconded with their money, they would let hte cat out of the bag, which is where we get that expression which means to reveal a secret, though it's usually used in a positive context. Idioms in other cultures: Italian comprare a scatola chiusa to buy in a sealed box Catalan Donar/Prendre gat per llebre to give/to take cat instead of hare Chinese 隔山买老牛 buy a cow over there in another mountain Maltese xtara l-ħut fil-baħar to buy fish in the sea   Salting Salting a gold mine How do you make a worthless mine a little more valuable? Take a shotgun, stuff it with gold dust, blast the walls, and bedazzle it with gold. That's precisely what some Mine owners would do to turn a profit. But I can imagine that this confidence trick can only last for so long. Some buyers would ask to blast the mine before the sale's closing. The huckster seller would sometimes stuff gold in the stick of dynamite. After the explosion, the mine shimmered with gold. — Source 1871 was the year of the Great Diamond Hoax. Two cousins named Philip Arnold and John Slack returned to San Francisco with a bag full of diamonds. As a result, salivating investors wanted to know where they found the gems. So then, the cousins led the group of investors on a four-day goose chase through the wilderness until they finally arrived at a vast field with brilliant gems. Cha-ching! But when geologists studied the diamonds, they quickly discovered that this diamond-filled field was an elaborate con. It turns out the cousins purchased chat diamonds for about $35,000 and scattered them around the ground. Salting the tip jar Have you ever noticed the jar full of money at your favorite coffee shop or on the bar counter? Do you feel like a jerk when you don't drop in a few dollars or coins? This technique of "salting the tip jar" works almost every time. Psychologists call it "social proof." It turns out that humans want to mimic what other people do. For example, when someone claps, others clap too. And you even reluctantly stand during "the wave" at a baseball game. Social proof is used in advertising all the time. Nine out of ten dentists can't be wrong, right? Melon Drop Melon drop The mechanics of the melon drop scam are pretty simple, but it does require one specific thing: foreign tourists, specifically Japanese ones. This is because melons in Japan tend to be very expensive, sometimes costing upward of $60 USD, far more pricey than they are in the States. Presumably in the days before the internet put the sum of all human information in our pockets, hustling New York con men decided they could use this information to their advantage by pulling a fast one on Japanese visitors. According to Ask Men, the scam works like this: First, acquire a watermelon for the low price of a couple bucks here in the U.S. of A. Step two, carry the melon around until you find your mark. Then, bump into them, drop the watermelon, so it shatters, blame them for the collision, and finally demand they pay up to the exorbitant tune of up to $100 to compensate you for your broken, "expensive" produce. Although skeptics may say the melon drop scam might be a myth, at least some version of this scam is still alive and well in New York City. According to some Reddit users, NYC scammers are still pulling off the melon drop hustle, only the updated version involves expensive booze and targets anyone, not just foreign tourists. But the mechanics are pretty much the same. "That still happens in some parts of NYC with expensive liquor like Hennessy, for example. They bump into you and drop and break a bottle with water and try to guilt you into paying them back. You know when you're in the right or wrong. If you're in the right, just walk away fast," advised one Reddit user. Others shared stories of similar encounters, while still more people said they had experienced the same basic scam, only with expensive sunglasses instead of alcohol or fruit. So although some may say the melon drop is just a New York City myth, like the alligators in the sewers or the mole people, others are well aware that it is best to keep an eye out for any shifty looking strangers carrying fruit or fancy-looking bottles.   Baltimore stockbroker / Psychic Sports Picks The Baltimore stockbroker scam relies on mass-mailing or emailing. The scammer begins with a large pool of marks, numbering ideally a power of two such as 1024. The scammer divides the pool into two halves, and sends all the members of each half a prediction about the future outcome of an event with a binary outcome (such as a stock price rising or falling, or the win/loss outcome of a sporting event). One half receives a prediction that the stock price will rise (or a team will win, etc.), and the other half receives the opposite prediction. After the event occurs, the scammer repeats the process with the group that received a correct prediction, again dividing the group in half and sending each half new predictions. After several iterations, the "surviving" group of marks has received a remarkable sequence of correct predictions, whereupon the scammer then offers these marks another prediction, this time for a fee. The next prediction is, of course, no better than a random guess, but the previous record of success makes it seem to the mark to be a prediction worth great value. For gambling propositions with more than two outcomes, for example in horse racing, the scammer begins with a pool of marks with number equal to a power of the number of outcomes. The scam relies on selection bias (the selection of individuals, groups, or data for analysis in such a way that proper randomization is not achieved, thereby failing to ensure that the sample obtained is representative of the population intended to be analyzed), and more specifically survivorship bias (concentrating on the people or things that made it past some selection process and overlooking those that did not) and is similar to publication bias (a type of bias that occurs in published academic research. It occurs when the outcome of an experiment or research study influences the decision whether to publish or otherwise distribute it). This particular scam received its name as a result of Frank Deford's book "Cut N' Run", where a stockbroker in Baltimore goes to several different bars and predicts the outcome of the upcoming Johnny Unitas-era Baltimore Colts' next game. Several authors mention the scam: Daniel C. Dennett in Elbow Room (where he calls it the touting pyramid); David Hand in The Improbability Principle; and Jordan Ellenberg in How Not to Be Wrong. Ellenberg reports often hearing of the scam told as an illustrative parable, but he could not find a real-world example of anyone carrying it out as an actual scam. The closest he found was when illusionist Derren Brown presented it in his television special The System in 2008. Brown's intent was merely to convince his mark that he had a foolproof horse race betting system rather than to scam the mark out of money. However, Ellenberg goes on to describe how investment firms do something similar by starting many in-house investment funds, and closing the funds that show the lowest returns before offering the surviving funds (with their record of high returns) for sale to the public. The selection bias inherent in the surviving funds makes them unlikely to sustain their previous high returns.   Vanity publications and awards schemes Do you want to be famous and successful? It's easy. All you have to do is hand over your money. But unfortunately, scammers and con artists have cooked up schemes to pray on your vanity and need for acceptance and recognition throughout history. Vanity press Trying to get your book published can seem impossible. But there's a sure-fire way of getting your book out there. Scammers know that desperate writers will do almost anything to get their books printed. Vanity publishers make their money from publishers, not readers purchasing books. Therefore, they have no financial interest in promoting the book, leaving the author with a financial burden. 2022 Golden Globes controversy Vanity awards are pay-to-play awards given to the highest bidder. Did you know that NBC dropped the Golden Globes broadcast in 2022? Instead, the awards results were posted live on Twitter. Not only is the Hollywood Foreign Press Association accused of not having a single black voter, but they're also accused of taking bribes from studios, production companies, and publicists. Winning a Golden Globe award can equate millions of dollars in box office earnings and elevate an actor's career. Since the scandal broke out, the Hollywood Foreign Press Association announced new rules and added new members of color. — source Fake casting agent scam A well-connected casting director or agent can instantly make you a celebrity. However, one thing a casting agent will never do is charge you. Most casting agents make money only when you do—typically about 10%. A casting agent will never guarantee work, they make you take their classes, and they don't really care if you have prior modeling or acting experience. Finally, you should never feel rushed or pressured into doing something you don't feel comfortable with. Does your child want to be a Disney Channel Star? There is no fast track to Hollywood. If you hear or watch an ad that says, "Does your child want to be a Disney Channel Star? Auditions are being held this weekend. Call some number and book your slot."— It's a scam. Most of these so-called agencies charge an exorbitant amount of money and have no affiliation with Disney or Nickelodeon.  

Show Notes and Links to Dave Zirin's Work and Allusions/Texts from Episode 80         On Episode 80, Pete talks with Dave Zirin about his work as an activist and journalist, his early influences in reading and civic engagement, “ ‘Eureka' moments,” his fine work with The Nation and book publishing, and his 2021 release, the important book, The Kaepernick Effect: Taking a Knee and Changing the World. With discussion of the book comes conversation about some of the forces repressing change, but more importantly, famous people and not-so-famous people enacting change through educating others and through direct action.    Dave Zirin, The Nation's sports editor, is the author of ten books on the politics of sports, most recently, The Kaepernick Effect: Taking a Knee, Changing the World. Named one of UTNE Reader's “50 Visionaries Who Are Changing Our World,” Zirin is a frequent guest on ESPN, MSNBC, and Democracy Now! He also hosts The Nation's Edge of Sports podcast. You can find all his work or contact him through his website EdgeofSports.com. Follow him on twitter @EdgeofSports. Buy The Kaepernick Effect: Taking a Knee, Changing the World   Dave Zirin's Personal Website   Dave Zirin's Wikipedia Page   "Dave Zirin is The Kaepernick Whisperer" (The Ringer, 2018)   Support organization to which book proceeds go-Serve Your City DC   At about 2:00, Dave talks about his feelings as The Kaepernick Effect is a few days away from being published, and the mission he feels in publishing a book on such an important and underrepresented movement inspired by Colin Kaepernick; Dave highlights that proceeds from the book go to serveyourcitydc.org   At about 4:15, Pete asks Dave about his childhood relationship with the written word, including his love of sports and his older sister's outsized impact on him, especially with the fact that she was a heavy reader; he also mentions his love of books like Season on the Brink by John Feinstein   At about 7:00, Dave highlights James Baldwin as a writer who has thrilled him throughout his life, leading Dave to talk about his love for rereading great books like Baldwin's   At about 8:25, Dave talks about sportswriters like Frank DeFord, Leigh Montville, Selena Roberts, Ralph Wiley at Sports Illustrated and its power in his life, as well as his mother's providing the family access to local news   At about 10:40, Pete asks Dave about starting points for him as a journalist and an activist,    At about 12:30, Dave talks about turning points and how he came to write about sports and politics   At about 15:10, Pete asks Dave about his current reading, and Dave highlights David Maraniss and Howard Bryant, as well as Lindsey Adler At about 16:30, Howard and Pete talk about tennis and Howard Bryant's promotion of it and the text that Dave sent about playing on a tennis grass court At about 18:10, Pete asks Dave about connections between “older” athlete/activists and what he has seen in his years at The Nation regarding current activist-athletes  At about 20:45, Dave talks about the titanic changes that have come around regarding athlete/activism, due to  At about 23:20, Dave talks about The People's History of Sports in the United States and its genesis, as well as great interactions with his inspirations like Jim Bouton and Howard Zinn At about 26:20, Pete and Dave discuss his book, The Kaepernick Effect, and its genesis, and Dave's concern in summarizing and memorializing so much recent history; he talks about his inspiration by Howard Zinn's curating At about 30:15, Dave talks about how the largest protests in US history-regarding the police murder of George Floyd-changed the focus of his book At about 32:15, Pete asks Dave about the revisionist history of Colin Kaepernick as “simply not being a good quarterback” At about 34:20, Pete points to the juxtaposition of knees that starts off Dave's book At about 34:55, Dave talks about Steve Wyche's perspective five years after being the first to cover the Kaepernick kneeling At about 36:40, Dave and Pete discuss a few individual like April Parkerson and Rodney Axson who were the first athletes to follow Kaepernick's lead; Dave puts these courageous acts into context, including the fallout in Beaumont, Texas At about 39:50, Dave discusses the vitriol directed at Denby High School as discussed in the book At about 40:50, Dave highlights a coach in Minnesota, Marjaan Siddar, who educates his players and keeps them working for progressive causes At about 42:20, Pete asks Dave how he weighs and balances the future of the high school generation and their activism, as laid out in the book At about 44:30, Dave discusses the book's section about college player activists, as Pete and he highlight Alexis Bazen and the message that dave says “pays it forward”   At about 48:15, Dave is asked about the idea of an “ally” and how one acts in solidarity, and its connection to Megan Rapinoe and others discussed in his book who  At about 50:00, Pete asks Dave his thoughts on recent NCAA bylaws changing regarding selling one's likeness and how this affects the rights of college athletes At about 51:00, Pete and Dave highlight and discuss changemakers in the NFL and other pro sports, as outlined in the last chapter of the book, including Gwen Berry, Eric Reid, Kenny Stills, and Bruce Maxwell At about 53:15, Dave points to Howard Bryant's book, The Heritage: Black Athletes, a Divided America, and the Politics of Patriotism, in explaining the expanded conflation of patriotism and sports, especially since 9/11 At about 55:00, Dave talks about Michael Bennett's worldview and work for change At about 56:00, Pete and Dave highlight Dr. John Carlos' inspiring words from the Epilogue, as well as his inspiring work for justice You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Spotify, Stitcher,  and on Amazon Music. Follow me on IG, where I'm @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where I'm @chillsatwillpo1. You can watch this episode and other episodes on YouTube-you can watch and subscribe on The Chills at Will Podcast Channel. This is a passion project of mine, a DIY operation, and I'd love for your help in promoting what I'm convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form. The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.   Please tune in for the next episode, Episode 81 with Cerise Castle, who has written for NPR, LAMag, and Vice News, among others, and has recently written an incredibly well-done history of the Los Angeles Sheriff's Department gangs and cliques. The episode will air on September 28.

There's a place where sports and data meet, and it's as powerful a collision as on any football field!  Jeff Sagarin has been a figurehead in the sports analytics realm for decades, and we're thrilled to have had the chance to have him on to talk about his data journey!  There's a fair mix of math AND sports geek out time in this episode.  And, did we mention that Dr. Wayne Winston is sitting in on this episode as well? References in this Episode: 2 Frictionless Colliding Boxes Video Scorigami Episode Transcript: Rob Collie (00:00:00): Hello, friends. Today's guest is Jeff Sagarin. Is that name familiar to you? It's very familiar to me. In my life, Jeff's work might very well be my first brush with the concept of using data for any sort of advantage. His Power Ranking Columns, first appeared in USA Today in 1985, when I was 11 years old. And what a fascinating concept that was. Rob Collie (00:00:29): It probably won't surprise you if I confess that 11-year-old me was not particularly good at sports, but I was still fascinated and captivated by them. 11-year-old kids in my neighborhood were especially prone to associating sports with their tribal identity. Everyone had their favorite teams, their favorite sports stars. And invariably, this led to arguments about which sports star was better than the other sports star, who was going to win this game coming up and who would win a tournament amongst all of these teams and things of that sort. Rob Collie (00:01:01): Now that I've explained it that way though, I guess being an adult sports fan isn't too terribly different, is it? Those arguments, of course, aren't the sorts of arguments where there's anything resembling a clear winner. But in practice, the person who won was usually the one with the loudest voice or the sickest burn that they could deliver to their friends. And then in 1985, the idea was planted in my head by Jeff Sagarin's column in USA Today, that there actually was a relatively objective way to evaluate teams that had never played against one another and likely never would. Rob Collie (00:01:33): I wasn't into computers at the time. I certainly wasn't into the concept of data. I didn't know what a database was. I didn't know what a spreadsheet was. And yet, this was still an incredibly captivating and powerful idea. So in my life, Jeff Sagarin is the first public figure that I encountered in the sports analytics industry long before it was cool. And because it was sports, a topic that was relevant to 11-year-old me, he's really also my first brush with analytics at all. Rob Collie (00:02:07): It's not surprising then, that to me, Jeff is absolutely a celebrity. As a guest, in insider podcasting lingo, Jeff is what we call a good get. We owe that pleasure, of course, to him being close friends with Wayne Winston, a former guest on the show, who also joined us today as co-guest. Rob Collie (00:02:28): Now, if none of that speaks to you, let's try this alternate description. He's probably also the world's most famous active FORTRAN programmer. I admit that I was so starstruck by this that I didn't even really push as hard as I normally would, in terms of getting into the techniques that he uses. I didn't want to run afoul of asking him for trade secrets. At times, this conversation did devolve into four dudes sitting around talking about sports. Rob Collie (00:02:59): But setting that aside, there are some really, really interesting and heartwarming things happening in this conversation as well. Again, the accidental path to where he is today, the intersection of persistence and good fortune that's required really for success in anything. Bottom line, this is the story of a national and highly influential figure at the intersection of the sports industry and the analytics industry for more than three decades. It's not every day you get to hear that story. So let's get into it. Announcer (00:03:34): Ladies and gentlemen, may I have your attention, please? Announcer (00:03:39): This is the Raw Data by P3 Adaptive podcast with your host, Rob Colley and your co-host, Thomas LaRock. Find out what the experts at P3 Adaptive can do for your business. Just go to p3adaptive.com. Raw Data by P3 Adaptive is data with the human element. Rob Collie (00:04:02): Welcome to the show, Jeff Sagarin. And welcome back to the show. Wayne Winston. So thrilled to have the two of you with us today. This is awesome. We've been looking forward to this for a long time. So thank you very much gentlemen, for being here. Jeff Sagarin (00:04:16): You're welcome. Rob Collie (00:04:18): Jeff, usually we kick these things off with, "Hey, tell us a little about yourself, your background, blah, blah, blah." Let's start off with me telling you about you. It's a story about you that you wouldn't know. I remember for a very long time being aware of you. Rob Collie (00:04:35): So I'm 47 years old, born in 1974. My father had participated for many years in this shady off-the-books college football pick'em pool that was run out of the high school in a small town in Florida. Like the sheets with everybody's entries would show up. They were run on ditto paper, like that blue ink. It was done in the school ditto room and he did this every year. This was like the most fascinating thing that happened in the entire year to me. Like these things showing up at our house, this packet of all these picks, believe it or not, they were handwritten. These grids were handwritten with everyone's picks. It was ridiculous. Rob Collie (00:05:17): He got eliminated every year. There were a couple of hundred entries every year and he just got his butt kicked every year. But then one year, he did his homework. He researched common opponents and things like that or that kind of stuff. I seem to recall this having something to do timing wise with you. So I looked it up. Your column first appeared in USA Today in 1985. Is that correct? Jeff Sagarin (00:05:40): Yeah. Tuesday, January 8th 1985. Rob Collie (00:05:44): I remember my dad winning this pool that year and using the funds to buy a telescope to look at Halley's Comet when it showed up. And so I looked up Halley's Comet. What do you know? '86. So it would have been like the January ballgames of 1986, where he won this pool. And in '85, were you power ranking college football teams or was that other sports? Jeff Sagarin (00:06:11): Yes. Rob Collie (00:06:12): Okay. So when my dad said that he did his research that year, what he really did was read your stuff. You bought my dad a telescope in 1986 so that we could go have one of the worst family vacations of all time. It was just awful. Thank you. Jeff Sagarin (00:06:31): You're very welcome. Rob Collie (00:06:39): I kind of think of you as the first publicly known figure in sports analytics. You probably weren't the first person to apply math and computers to sports analytics, but you're the first person I heard of. Jeff Sagarin (00:06:51): There is a guy that people don't even talk about very much. Now a guy named Earnshaw Cook, who first inspired me when I was a sophomore in high school in the '63-'64 school year, there was an article by Frank Deford in Sports Illustrated about Earnshaw Cook publishing a book called Percentage Baseball. So I convinced my mom to let me have $10 to order it by mail and I got it. I started playing around with his various ideas in it. He was the first guy I ever heard of and that was in March of 1964. Rob Collie (00:07:28): All right, so everyone's got an origin story. Jeff Sagarin (00:07:31): The Dunkel family started doing the Dunkel ratings back I believe in 1929. Then there was a professor, I think he was at Vanderbilt, named [Lipkin House 00:07:41], he was I think at Vanderbilt. And for years, he did the high school ratings in states like maybe Tennessee and Kentucky. I think he gave Kentucky that Louisville courier his methodology before he died. But I don't know if they continue his work or not. But there were people way before me. Rob Collie (00:08:03): But they weren't in USA Today. Jeff Sagarin (00:08:04): That's true. Rob Collie (00:08:06): They weren't nationally distributed, like on a very regular basis. I've been hearing your name longer than I've even been working with computers. That's pretty crazy. How did you even get hooked up with USA Today? Jeff Sagarin (00:08:23): People might say, "You got lucky." My answer, as you'll see as well, I'd worked for 12 years to be in a position to get lucky. I started getting paid for doing this in September of 1972 with an in-house publication of pro football weekly called Insider's Pro Football Newsletter. Jeff Sagarin (00:08:45): In the Spring of '72, I'd written letters to like 100 newspapers saying because I had started by hand doing my own rating system for pro football in the fall of 1971. Just by hand, every Sunday night, I'd get the scores and add in the Monday night. I did it as a hobby. I wasn't doing it for a living. I did it week by week and charted the teams. It was all done with some charts I'd made up with a normal distribution and a slide rule. So I sent out letters in the spring of '72 to about 100 papers saying, "Hey, would you be interested in running my stuff?" Jeff Sagarin (00:09:19): They either didn't answer me or all said, "No, not interested." But I got a call right before I left to go to California when an old college friend that spring. It was from William Wallace, who was a big time football correspondent for The New York Times. That anecdote may be in that article by Andy Glockner. He called me up, he was at the New York Times, but he said also, "I write articles for extra money for pro football weekly. I wanted to just kind of talk to you." Jeff Sagarin (00:09:49): He wrote an article that appeared in Pro Quarterback magazine in September of '72. But during the middle of that summer, I got a phone call from Pro Football weekly, the publisher, a guy named [inaudible 00:10:04] said, "Hey Jeff. Have you seen our ad in street and Smith's?" It didn't matter. It could have been their pro magazine or college. I said, "Yeah, I did." And he said, "Do you notice it said we've got a world famous handicapper to do our predictions for us?" I said, "Yeah, I did see that." He said, "How would you like to be that world famous handicapper? We don't have anybody." Jeff Sagarin (00:10:25): We just said that because he said William Wallace told us to call you. So I said, "Okay, I'll be your world famous handicapper." I didn't start off that well and they had this customer, it was a paid newsletter and there was a customer from Hawaii. He had a great name, Charles Fujiwara. He'd send letters every week saying, "Sagarin's terrible, but he's winning a fortune for me. I just reverse his picks every week." So finally, finally, my numbers turn the tide and I had this one great week, where I went 8-0. He sent another letter saying, "I'm bankrupt. The kid destroyed me." Because he was reversing all my picks. That's a true story. Rob Collie (00:11:07): At least he had a sense of humor. It sounds like a pretty interesting fellow on the other end of that letter. Jeff Sagarin (00:11:13): He sounds like he could have been like the guy, if you've ever seen reruns of the old show, '77 Sunset Strip. In it, there this guy who's kind of a racetrack trout gambler named Roscoe. He sounds like he could have been Roscoe. Rob Collie (00:11:26): We have to look that one up. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:11:27): It's before your time. Rob Collie (00:11:28): I don't think I saw that show. Jeff Sagarin (00:11:29): Yeah. Wayne's seen it though. Rob Collie (00:11:31): Yes. I love that. There are things that are both before my time and I have like old man knees. So I've heard this kind of thing before, by the way. It's called the 10-year overnight success. Jeff Sagarin (00:11:47): I forgot. How did I get with USA Today? I started with Pro Football weekly and continued with them. I was with them until actually why don't we say sometime in the fall of '82. I ended up in other newspapers, little by little: The Boston Globe, Louisville Courier Journal. And then in the spring of '81, I got into a conversation over the phone with Jim van Valkenburg, who is the stat guy at the NCAA. I happened to mention that going into the tournament, I had Indiana to win the tournament. They were rated like 10th in the conventional polls. Jeff Sagarin (00:12:23): And so he remembered that and he kept talking behind the scenes to people in the NCAA about that. And so years later, in 1988, they called me out to talk to them. But anyhow, I had developed a good reputation and I gave him as a reference. Wayne called me up excitedly in let's say, early September of 1984. He said, "Hey, Jeff. You've got to buy a copy of today's USA Today and turn to the end of the sports section. You're going to be sick." Jeff Sagarin (00:12:53): I said, "Really? Okay." So I opened to where he said and I was sick. They had computer ratings by some guy. He was a good guy named Thomas Jech, J-E-C-H. And I said, "Damn, that should be me. I've been doing this for all these years and I didn't even know they were looking for this." So I call up on the phone. Sometimes there's a lot of luck involved. I got to talk to a guy named Bob Barbara who I believe is retired now there. He had on the phone this gruff sounding voice out of like a Grade B movie from the film, The War. "What's going on Kitty?" It sounds like he had a cigar in his mouth. Jeff Sagarin (00:13:30): I said, "Well, I do these computer ratings." [inaudible 00:13:33] Said "Well, really? That's interesting. We've already got somebody." He said, "But how would you even send it to us?" I said, "Well, I dictate over the phone." He said, "Dictate? We don't take dictation at USA Today, kid. Have you ever heard of personal computers and a modem?" I said, "Well, I have but I just do it on a mainframe at IU and I dictate over the phone to the Louisville Courier and the local..." Jeff Sagarin (00:13:58): Well, the local paper here, I gave them a printout. He said, "Kid, you need to buy yourself a PC and learn how to use a modem." So I kind of was embarrassed. I said, "Well, I'll see." So about 10 days later, I called him up and said, "Hey, what's the phone number for your modem?" He said, "Crap. You again, kid? I thought I got rid of you." He says, "All right. I'll give you the phone number." So I sent him a sample printout. He says, "Yeah, yeah, we got it. Keep in touch. We're not going to change for football. But this other guy, he may not want to do basketball. So keep in touch. Who knows what will happen for basketball?" Jeff Sagarin (00:14:31): So every month I'd call up saying, "It's me again, keeping touch." He said, "I can't get rid of you. You're like a bad penny that keeps turning up." So finally he says look, after about five of these calls, spreading out until maybe late November, "Look kid, why don't you wait... Call me up the first Sunday of the new year," which would have been like Sunday, January 6 of 1985 I believe. So I waited. I called him up. Sure enough, he said, "You again?" I said, "You told me you wanted to do college basketball." Jeff Sagarin (00:15:04): He said, "Yeah, you're kind of right. The other guy doesn't want to do it." So he said, "Well, do you mind if we call it the USA Today computer ratings? We kind of like to put our own name on everything." I said, "Well, wait a minute. During the World Series, you had Pete Rose as your guest columnist, you want not only gave his name, but you had a picture of him." He said, "God damn it." He said, "I can't..." He said, "You win again kid. Give us a bio." Jeff Sagarin (00:15:32): An old friend of both me and Wayne was on a business trip. He lived in California, but one of the companies he did work for was Magnavox, which at the time had a presence in Fort Wayne. So he had stopped off in Bloomington so we could say hi. We hadn't seen each other for many years. So he wrote my bio for me, which is still used in the agate in the USA Today. So it's the same bio all these years. Jeff Sagarin (00:15:56): So they started printing me on Tuesday, January 8 of 1985. On the front page that day and I got my editor of a couple years ago, he found an old physical copy of that paper and sent it to me and I thought that's pretty cool. And on the front page, they said, "Well, this would be the 50th birthday of Elvis Presley." I get, they did not have a banner headline at the top, "Turn to the sports and see Jeff Sagarin's debut." That was not what they did. It was all about Elvis Presley. And so people will tell me, "Wow! You got really lucky." Jeff Sagarin (00:16:30): Yeah, but I was in a position. I'd worked for 12 years since the fall of '72 to get in position to then get lucky. They told me I had some good recommendations from people. Rob Collie (00:16:42): Well, even that persistence to keep calling in the face of relatively discouraging feedback. So that conversation took place, and then two days later, you're in the paper. Jeff Sagarin (00:16:54): Well, yeah. He said, "Send us the ratings." They might have needed a time lag. So if I sent the ratings in on a Sunday night or Monday morning, they'd print them on Tuesday. They're not as instant. Now, I update every day on their website. For the paper, they take whatever the most recent ones they can access off their website, depending on I've sent it in, which is I always send them in early in the morning like when I get up. So they print on a Tuesday there'll be taking the ratings that they would have had in their hands Monday, which would be through Sunday's games. Rob Collie (00:17:26): That Tuesday, was that just college basketball? Jeff Sagarin (00:17:28): Then it was. Then in the fall of 85. They began using me for college football, not that they thought I was better or worse one way or the other than Thomas Jech who was a smart guy, he was a math professor at the time at Penn State. He just got tired of doing it. He had more important things to do. Serious, I don't mean that sarcastically. That was just like a fun hobby for him from what I understand. Rob Collie (00:17:50): I was going to ask you if you hadn't already gone and answered the question ahead of time. I was going to ask you well, what happened to the other guy? Did you go like all Tonya Harding on him or whatever? Did you take out your rival? No, sounds like Nancy Kerrigan just went ahead and retired. Although I hate to make you Tonya Harding in this analogy and I just realized I just Hardinged you. Jeff Sagarin (00:18:10): He was just evidently a really good math professor. It was just something he did for fun to do the ratings. Rob Collie (00:18:17): Opportunity and preparation right where they intersect. That's "luck". Jeff Sagarin (00:18:22): It would be as if Wally Pipp had retired and Lou Gehrig got to replace him in the analogy, Lou Gehrig gets the first base job but actually Wally Pipp in real life did not retire. He had the bad luck to get a cold or something or an injury and he never got back in the starting lineup after that. Rob Collie (00:18:38): What about Drew Bledsoe? I think he did get hurt. Did we ever see him again? Thomas LaRock (00:18:43): The very next season, he was in Buffalo and then he went to Dallas. Rob Collie (00:18:46): I don't remember this at all. Thomas LaRock (00:18:47): And not only that, but when he went to Dallas, he got hurt again and Tony Romo came on to take over. Rob Collie (00:18:53): Oh my god! So Drew Bledsoe is Wally Pipp X2. Thomas LaRock (00:18:58): Yeah, X2. Rob Collie (00:19:02): I just need to go find wherever Drew Bledsoe is right now and go get in line behind him. Thomas LaRock (00:19:08): He's making wine in Walla Walla, Washington. I know exactly where he is. Rob Collie (00:19:12): I'm about to inherit a vineyard gentlemen. Okay, so Wayne's already factored into this story. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:19:23): A little bit. Rob Collie (00:19:23): A bit part but an important one. We would call you Mr. Narrative Hook in the movie. Like you'd be the guy that's like, "Jeff, you've got to get a copy of USA Today and turn to page 10. You're going to be sick." Jeff Sagarin (00:19:37): Well, I was I'm glad Wayne told me to do it. If I'd never known that, who knows what I'd be doing right now? Rob Collie (00:19:44): Yeah. So you guys are longtime friends, right? Dr. Wayne Winston (00:19:47): Yeah. Jeff, should take this. Jeff Sagarin (00:19:49): September 1967 in the TV room at Ashdown Graduate's House across from the dorm we lived, because the graduate students there had rigged up, we call it a full screen TV that was actually quite huge. It's simply projected from a regular TV onto a maybe a 10 foot by 10 foot old fashioned movie projector screen. We'd go there to watch ballgames. Okay, because better than watching on a 10 inch diagonal black and white TV in the dorm. And it turned out we both had a love for baseball and football games. Thomas LaRock (00:20:26): So just to be clear, though, this was no ordinary school. This is MIT. Because this is what people at MIT would do is take some weird tech thing and go, "We can make this even better, make a big screen TV." Jeff Sagarin (00:20:38): We didn't know how to do it, which leads into Wayne's favorite story about our joint science escapades at MIT. If Wayne wants to start it off, you might like this. I was a junior and Wayne was a sophomore at the time. I'll set Wayne up for it, there was a requirement that MIT no matter what your major, one of the sort of distribution courses you had to take was a laboratory class. Why don't we let Wayne take the ball for a while on this? Dr. Wayne Winston (00:21:05): I'm not very mechanically inclined. I got a D in wood shop and a D in metal shop. Jeff's not very mechanically inclined either. We took this lab class and we were trying to figure out identifying a coin based on the sound waves it would produce under the Scylla scope. And so the first week, we couldn't get the machine to work. And the professor said, "Turn it on." And so we figured that step out and the next week, the machine didn't work. He said, "Plug it in." Jeff can take it from there. Jeff Sagarin (00:21:46): It didn't really fit the mathematical narrative exactly of what metals we knew were in the coin. But then I noticed, nowadays we'd probably figure out this a reason. If we multiplied our answers by something like 100 pi, we got the right numbers. So they were correctly proportional. So we just multiplied our answers by 100 pi and said, "As you can see, it's perfectly deducible." Rob Collie (00:22:14): There's a YouTube video that we should probably link that is crazy. It shows that two boxes on a frictionless surface a simulation and the number of times that they collide, when you slide them towards a wall together, when they're like at 10X ratio of mass, the number of times that they impact each other starts to become the digits of pi. Jeff Sagarin (00:22:34): Wow. Rob Collie (00:22:35): Before they separate. Jeff Sagarin (00:22:36): That's interesting. Rob Collie (00:22:36): It's just bizarre. And then they go through explaining like why it is pi and you understand it while the video is playing. And then the video ends and you've completely lost it. Jeff Sagarin (00:22:49): I'm just asking now, are they saying if you do that experiment an infinite amount of times, the average number of times they collide will be pi? Rob Collie (00:22:57): That's a really good question. I think it's like the number of collisions as you increase the ratios of the weight or something like that start to become. It's like you'll get 314 collisions, for instance, in a certain weight ratio, because that's the only three digits of pi that I remember. It's 3.14. It's a fascinating little watch. So the 100 pi thing, you said that, I'm like, "Yeah, that just... Of course it's 100 pi." Even boxes colliding on a frictionless surface do pi things apparently. Jeff Sagarin (00:23:29): Maybe it's a universal constant in everything we do. Rob Collie (00:23:29): You just don't expect pi to surface itself. It has nothing to do with waves, no wavelength, no arcs of circles, nothing like that. But that sneaky video, they do show you that it actually has something to do with circles and angles and stuff. Jeff Sagarin (00:23:44): Mutual friend of me and Wayne, this guy named Robin. He loves Fibonacci. And so every time I see a particular game end by a certain score, I'll just say, "Hey, Robin. Research the score of..." I think it was blooming to North against some other team. And he did. It turned out Bloomington North had won 155-34, which are the two adjacent Fibonacci, the two particular adjacent Fibonacci. Robin loves that stuff. You'll find a lot of that actually. It's hard to double Fibonacci a team though. That would be like 89-34. Rob Collie (00:24:18): I know about the Fibonacci sequence. But I can't pick Fibonacci sequence numbers out of the wild. Are you familiar with Scorigami? Jeff Sagarin (00:24:26): Who? I'd never heard of it obviously. Rob Collie (00:24:29): I think a Scorigami is a score in the NFL that's never happened. Jeff Sagarin (00:24:32): There was one like that about 10 years ago, 11-10, I believe. Pittsburgh was involved in the game or 12-11, something like that. Rob Collie (00:24:40): I think there was a Scorigami in last season. With scoring going up, the chances of Scorigami is increasing. There's just more variance at the higher end of the spectrum of numbers, right? Jeff Sagarin (00:24:50): I've always thought about this. In Canada, Canadian football, they have this extra rule that I think is kind of cool because it would probably make more scores happen. If a punter kicks the ball into the end zone, it can't roll there. Like if he kicks it on the fly into the end zone and the other team can't run it out, it's called a rouge and the kicking team gets one point for it. That's kind of cool. Because once you add the concept of scoring one point, you make a lot more scores more probable of happening. Rob Collie (00:25:21): Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. You can win 1-0. Thomas LaRock (00:25:25): So the end zone is also... It's 20 yards deep. So the field's longer, it's 110 yards. But the end zone's deeper and part of it is that it's too far to kick for a field goal. But you know what? If I can punt it into the end zone and if I get a cover team down there, we can get one point out. I'm in favor of it. I think that'd be great. Jeff Sagarin (00:25:43): I think you have to kick out on the fly into the end zone. It's not like if it rolls into it. Thomas LaRock (00:25:47): No, no, no. It's like a pop flop. Jeff Sagarin (00:25:50): Yeah. Okay. Rob Collie (00:25:50): If you punt it out of the end zone, is it also a point? Thomas LaRock (00:25:52): It's a touch back. No, touch back. Jeff Sagarin (00:25:54): That'd be too easy of a way to get a point. Rob Collie (00:25:57): You've had a 20 yard deep target to land in. In Canadian fantasy football, if there was such a thing, maybe there is, punters, you actually could have punters as a position because they can score points. That would be a really sad and un-fun way to play. Rob Collie (00:26:14): But so we're amateur sports analytics people here on the show. We're not professionals. We're probably not even very good at it. But that doesn't mean that we aren't fascinated by it. We're business analytics people here for sure. Business and sports, they might share some techniques, but it's just very, very, very different, the things that are valuable in the two spaces. I mean, they're sort of spiritually linked but they're not really tools or methods that provide value. Rob Collie (00:26:39): Not that you would give them. But we're not looking for any of your secrets here today. But you're not just writing for USA Today, there's a number of places where your skills are used these days, right? Jeff Sagarin (00:26:51): Well, not as much as that. But I want to make a favorable analogy for Wayne. In the world of sports analytics, whatever the phrases are, I consider myself to be maybe an experimental applied physicist. Wayne is an advanced theoretical physicist. I do the grunt work of collecting data and doing stuff with it. But Wayne has a large over-viewing of things. He's like a theoretical physicist. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:27:17): Jeff is too modest because he's experimented for years on the best parameters for his models. Rob Collie (00:27:27): It's again that 10-year, 20-year overnight success type of thing. You've just got to keep grinding at it. Do the two of you collaborate at all? Jeff Sagarin (00:27:35): Well, we did on two things, the Hoops computer game and Win Val. I forgot. How could I forget? It was actually my favorite thing that we did even though we've made no money doing the randomization using Game Theory of play calling for football. And we based it actually and it turned out that I got great numerical results that jive with empirical stuff that Virgil Carter had gotten and our economist, named Romer, had gotten and we had more detailed results than them. Jeff Sagarin (00:28:06): But in the areas that we intersected, we had the same as them. We used a game called Pro Quarterback and we modeled it. We had actually, a fellow, I wasn't a professor but a fellow professor of Wayne's, a great guy, just a great guy named Vic Cabot, who wrote a particular routine to insert the FORTRAN program that solved that particular linear programming problem that would constantly reoccur or else we couldn't do it. That was the favorite thing and we got to show it once to Sam White, who we really liked. And White said, "I like this guy. I may have played this particular game," we told him what we based it on, "when I was a teenager." Jeff Sagarin (00:28:46): He said, "I know exactly what you want to do." You don't make the same call in the same situation all the time. You have a random, but there's an optimal mix Game Theory, as you probably know for both offense and defense. White said, "The problem is this is my first year here. It was the summer of '83." And he said, "I don't really have the security." Said, "Imagine it's third and one, we're on our own 15 yard line. And it's third and one. And the random number generator says, 'Throw the bomb on this play with a 10% chance of calling up but it'll still be in the mix. And it happens to come up.'" Jeff Sagarin (00:29:23): He said, "It was my eight year here. I used to play these games myself. I know exactly." But then he patted his hip. He said, "It's mine on the line this first year." He said, "It's kind of nerve wracking to do that when you're a rookie coach somewhere, to call the bomb when it's third and one on your own 15. If it's incomplete, you'll be booed out of the stadium." Rob Collie (00:29:46): Yeah, I mean, it's similar to there's the general reluctance in coaches for so long to go for it on fourth and one. When the analytics were very, very, very clear that this was a plus expected value, +EV, move to go for it on fourth and one. But the thing is, you've got to consider the bigger picture. Right? The incentives, the coaches number one goal is actually don't get fired. Jeff Sagarin (00:30:14): You were right. That's what White was telling us. Rob Collie (00:30:14): Yeah. Winning a Super Bowl is a great thing to do. Because it helps you not get fired. It's actually weird. Like, if your goal is to win as many games as possible, yes, go for it on fourth and one. But if your goal is to not get fired, maybe. So it takes a bit more courage even to follow the numbers. And for good reason, because the incentives aren't really aligned the way that we think they are when you first glance at a situation. Jeff Sagarin (00:30:41): Well, there's a human factor that there's no way unless you're making a guess how to take it into account. It may be demoralizing to your defense if you go for it on fourth and one and you're on your own 15. I've seen the numbers, we used to do this. It's a good mathematical move to go for it. Because you could say, "Well, if you're forced to punt, the other team is going to start on the 50. So what's so good about that? But psychologically, your defense may be kind of pissed off and demoralized when they have to come out on the field and defend from their own 15 after you've not made it and the numbers don't take that into account. Rob Collie (00:31:19): Again, it's that judgment thing. Like the coach hung out to dry. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:31:22): Can I say a word about Vic Cabot, that Jeff mentioned? Jeff Sagarin (00:31:26): Yeah, He's great. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:31:27): Yeah. So Vic was the greatest guy any of us in the business school ever knew. He was a fantastic person. He died of throat cancer in 1994, actually 27 years ago this week or last week. Jeff Sagarin (00:31:43): Last week. It was right around Labor Day. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:31:46): Right. But I want to mention, basically, when he died, his daughter was working in the NYU housing office. After he died, she wrote a little book called The Princess Diaries. She's worth how many millions of dollars now? But he never got to see it. Jeff Sagarin (00:32:06): He had a son, a big kid named Matt Cabot, who played at Bloomington South High School. I got a nice story about Matthew. I believe the last time I know of him, he was a state trooper in the state of Colorado. I used to tell him when I was still young enough and Spry enough, we'd play a little pickup or something. I'd say, "Matthew, forget about points. The most important thing, a real man gets rebounds." Jeff Sagarin (00:32:32): They played in the semi state is when it was just one class. In '88, me and Wayne and a couple of Wayne's professor buddies, we all... Of course, Vic would have been there but we didn't go in the same car. It was me, Wayne and maybe [inaudible 00:32:48] and somebody else, Wayne? Jeff Sagarin (00:32:49): They played against Chandler Thompson's great team from Muncie Central. In the first three minutes, Chris Lawson, who was the star of the team went up for his patented turn around jumper from six feet away in the lane and Chandler Thompson spiked it like a volleyball and on the run of Muncie Central player took it with no one near him and laid it in and the game essentially ended but Matt Cabot had the game of his life. Jeff Sagarin (00:33:21): I think he may have led the game of anyone, the most rebounds in the game. I compliment him. He was proud of that. And he's played, he said many a pickup game with Chandler Thompson, he said the greatest jumper he's ever been on the court within his entire life. You guys look up because I don't know if you know who Chandler Thompson. Is he played at Ball State. Look up on YouTube his put back dunk against UNLV in the 90 tournaments, the year UNLV won it at all. Look up Chandler Thompson's put back dunk. Rob Collie (00:33:52): Yeah, I was just getting into basketball then, I think. Like in the Loyola Marymount days. Yeah, Jerry Tarkanian. Does college basketball have the same amount of personalities it used to like in the coaching figures. I kind of doubt that it does. Rob Collie (00:34:06): With Tark gone, and of course, Bob Knight, it'll be hard to replace personalities like that. I don't know. I don't really watch college basketball anymore, so I wouldn't really know. But I get invited into those pick'em pools for the tournament March Madness every year and I never had the stamina to fill them out. And they offer those sheets where they'll fill it out for you. But why would I do that? Jeff Sagarin (00:34:28): I've got to tell you a story involving Wayne and I. Rob Collie (00:34:31): Okay. Jeff Sagarin (00:34:31): In the 80 tournament, I had gotten a program running that would to simulate the tournament if you fed in the power ratings. It understood who'd play who and you simulate it a zillion times, come up with the odds. So going into the tournament, we had Purdue maybe the true odds against him should have been let's say, I'll make it up seven to one. Purdue and Iowa, they had Ronnie Lester, I remember. Jeff Sagarin (00:34:57): The true odds against them should have been about 7-1. The bookmakers were giving odds of 40-1. So Wayne and I looked at each other and said, "That seems like a big edge." In theory, well, odds are still against them. Let's bet $25 apiece on both Purdue and Iowa. The two of them made the final four. Jeff Sagarin (00:35:20): In Indianapolis, I'll put it this way, their consolation game gave us no consolation. Rob Collie (00:35:30): Man. Jeff Sagarin (00:35:31): And then one of the games, Joe Barry Carroll of Purdue, they're down by one they UCLA. I'm sure he was being contested. I don't mean he was all by himself. It's always easy for the fan who can't play to mock the player. I don't mean... He was being fiercely contested by UCLA. The net result was he missed with fierce contesting one foot layup that would have won the game for Purdue, that would have put them into the championship game and Iowa could have beaten Louisville, except their best player, Ronnie Lester had to leave the game because he had aggravated a bad knee injury that he just couldn't play well on. Jeff Sagarin (00:36:11): But as I said, no consolation, right Wayne? Dr. Wayne Winston (00:36:14): Right. Jeff Sagarin (00:36:15): That was the next to the last year they ever had a consolation game. The last one was in '81 between LSU and Virginia. Rob Collie (00:36:23): Was it the '81 tournament that you said that you liked Indiana to win it? Jeff Sagarin (00:36:28): Wait, I'm going to show you how you get punished for hubris. I learned my lesson. The next year in '82, I had gotten a lot of notoriety, good kind of notoriety for having them to win in '81. People thought, "Wow! This is like the Oracle." So now as the tournament's about to begin in '82, I started getting a lot of calls, which I never used to do like from the media, "Who do you got Jeff?" I said confidently, "Oregon State." I had them number one, I think they'd only lost one game the whole year and they had a guy named Charlie Sitting, a 6'8 guy who was there all American forward. Jeff Sagarin (00:37:06): He was the star and I was pretty confident and to be honest, probably obnoxious when I'd be talking to the press. So they make the regional final against Georgetown and it was being held out west. I'm sort of confidently waiting for the game to be played and I'm sure there'll be advancing to the final four. And they were playing against freshmen, Patrick Ewing. Jeff Sagarin (00:37:29): In the first 10 seconds of the game, maybe you can find the video, there was a lob pass into Ewing, his back was to the basket, he's like three feet from the basket without even looking, he dunks backwards over his head over Charlie Sitton. And you should see the expression on Charlie Sitton's face. I said, "Oh my god! This game is over." The final score was 68-43 in Georgetown's favor. It was a massacre. It taught me the lesson, never be cocky, at least in public because you get slapped down, you get slapped down when you do that. Rob Collie (00:38:05): I don't want to get into this yet again on this show. But you should call up Nate Silver and maybe talk to him a little bit about the same sort of thing. Makes very big public calls that haven't been necessarily so great lately. Just for everyone's benefit, because even though I'd live in the state of Indiana, I didn't grow up here. Let's just be clear. Who won the NCAA tournament in 1981? Jeff Sagarin (00:38:29): Indiana. Rob Collie (00:38:30): Okay. All right, so there you go. Right. Jeff Sagarin (00:38:33): But who didn't win it in 1982? Oregon State. Rob Collie (00:38:38): Yeah. Did you see The Hunt for Red October where Jack Ryan's character, there's a point where he guesses. He says, "Ramy, as always, goes to port in the bottom half of the hour with his crazy Ivan maneuvers and he turns out to be right." And that's how he ends up getting the captain of the American sub to trust him as Jack Ryan knew this Captain so well, even knew which direction he would turn in the crazy Ivan. But it turns out he was just bluffing. He knew he needed a break and it was 50/50. Rob Collie (00:39:08): So it's a good thing that they were talking to you in the Indiana year, originally. Not the Oregon State year. That wouldn't be a good first impression. If you had to have it go one way or the other in those two years, the order in which it happened was the right order. Jeff Sagarin (00:39:22): Yeah, nobody would have listened to me. They would have said, "You got lucky." They said, "You still were terrible in the Oregon State year." Rob Collie (00:39:28): But you just pick the 10th rated team and be right. The chances of that being just luck are pretty low. I like it. That's a good story. So the two of you have never collaborated like on the Mark Cuban stuff? On the Mavs or any of that? Jeff Sagarin (00:39:43): We've done three things together. The Hoops computer game, which we did from '86-'95. And then we did the Game Theory thing for football, but we never got a client. But we did get White to kind of follow it. There's an interesting anecdote, I won't I mentioned the guy who kind of screwed it up. But he assigned a particular grad assistant to fill and we needed a matrix filled in each week with a bunch of numbers with regarding various things like turnovers. Jeff Sagarin (00:40:13): If play A is called against defense B, what would happen type of thing? The grad assistant hated doing it. And one week, he gave us numbers such that the computer came back with when Indiana had the ball, it should quick kick on first down every time it got the ball. We figured it out what was going on, the guy had given Indiana a 15% chance of a turnover, no matter what play they called in any situation against any defense. Jeff Sagarin (00:40:44): So the computer correctly surmised it were better to punt the ball. This is like playing Russian roulette with the ball. Let's just kick it away. So we ended up losing the game in real life 10-0. White told us then when we next saw him, we used to see him on Monday or Tuesday mornings, real early in the day, like seven o'clock, but that's when you could catch him. And he kind of looked at us and said, "You know what? We couldn't have done any worse said had we kicked [inaudible 00:41:14]." Rob Collie (00:41:13): That's nice. Jeff Sagarin (00:41:14): And then we did Mark Cuban. That was the last thing. We did that with Cuban from basically 2000-2011 with a couple of random projects in the summer for him, but really on a day to day basis during a season from 2000-2011. Rob Collie (00:41:30): And during that era is when I met Wayne at Microsoft. That was very much an active, ongoing project when Wayne was there in Redmond a couple of times that we crossed paths. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:41:43): And we worked for the Knicks one year, and they won 54 games. Jeff Sagarin (00:41:47): Here with Glen Grunwald. So they won more games than they'd ever won in a whole bunch of years. And like three weeks before the season starts or so in mid September, the next fire, Glen Grunwald. Let's put it this way, it didn't bother us that the Knicks never made the playoffs again until this past season. Rob Collie (00:42:10): That's great. You were doing, was it lineup optimization for those teams? Jeff Sagarin (00:42:15): Wayne knows more about this than I do. Because I would create the raw data, well, I call it output, but it needed refinement. That was Wayne's department. So you do all the talking now, Wayne. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:42:26): Yeah. Jeff wrote an amazing FORTRAN program. So basically, Jeff rated teams and we figured out we could rate players based on how the score of the game moved during the game. We could evaluate lineups and figure out head to head how certain players did against each other. Now, every team does this stuff and ESPN has Real Plus-Minus and Nate Silver has Raptor. But we started this. Jeff Sagarin (00:42:58): I mean, everybody years ago knew about Plus-Minus. Well, intuitively, let's say you're a gym rat, you first come to a gym, you don't know anyone there and you start getting in the crowd of guys that show up every afternoon to play pickup. You start sensing, you don't even have to know their names. Hey, when that guy is on the court, no matter who his teammates are, they seem to win. Jeff Sagarin (00:43:20): Or when this guy's on the court, they always seem to lose. Intuitively since it matters, who's on the court with you and who your opponents are. Like to make an example for Rob, let's say you happen to be in a pickup game. You've snuck into Pauley Pavilion during the summer and you end up with like four NBA current playing professionals on your team and let's say an aging Michael Jordan now shows up. He ends up with four guys who are graduate students in philosophy because they have to exercise. You're going to have a better plus-minus than Michael Jordan. But when you take into account who your teammates were and who's his were, if you knew enough about the players, he'd have a better rating than you, new Michael Jordan would. Jeff Sagarin (00:44:08): But you'd have a better raw plus-minus than he would. You have to know who the people on the court were. That was Wayne's insight. Tell them how it all started, how you met ran into Mark Cuban, Wayne, when you were in Dallas? Dr. Wayne Winston (00:44:20): Well, Mark was in my class in 1981, statistics class and I guess the year 1999, we went to a Pacers Maverick game in Dallas. Jeff Sagarin (00:44:31): March of 2000. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:44:33): March of 2000, because our son really liked the Pacers. Mark saw me in the stands. He said, "I remember you from class and I remember you for being on Jeopardy." He had just bought the team. And he said, "If you can do anything to help the Mavericks, let me know." And then I was swimming in the pool one day and I said, "If Jeff rates teams, we should rate players." And so we worked on this and Jeff wrote this amazing FORTRAN program, which I'm sure he could not rewrite today. Jeff Sagarin (00:45:04): Oh, God. Well, I was motivated then. Willingness to work hard for many hours at a time, for days at a time to get something to work when you could use the money that would result from it. I don't have that in me anymore. I'm amazed when I look at the source code. I say, "Man, I couldn't do that now." I like to think I could. Necessity is the mother of invention. Rob Collie (00:45:28): I've many, many, many times said and this is still true to this day, like a previous version of me that made something amazing like built a model or something like that, I look back and go, "Whoo, I was really smart back then." Well, at the same time I know I'm improving. I know that I'm more capable today than I was a year ago. Even just accrued wisdom makes a big difference. When you really get lasered in on something and are very, very focused on it, you're suddenly able to execute at just a higher level than what you're typically used to. Jeff Sagarin (00:46:01): As time went on, we realized what Cuban wanted and other teams like the next would want. Nobody really wanted to wade through the monster set of files that the FORTRAN would create. I call that the raw output that nobody wanted to read, but it was needed. Wayne wrote these amazing routines in Excel that became understandable and usable by the clients. Jeff Sagarin (00:46:26): The way Wayne wrote the Excel, they could basically say, "Tell us what happens when these three guys are in the lineup, but these two guys are not in the lineup." It was amazing the stuff that he wrote. Wayne doesn't give himself the credit that otherwise after a while, nobody would have wanted what we were doing because what I did was this sort of monstrous and to some extent boring. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:46:48): This is what Rob's company does basically. They try and distill data into understandable form that basically helps the company make decisions. Rob Collie (00:46:58): It is a heck of a discipline, right? Because if you have the technical and sort of mental skills to execute on something that's that complex, and it starts down in the weeds and just raw inputs, it's actually really, really, really easy to hand it off in a form that isn't yet quite actionable for the intended audience. It's really fascinating to you, the person that created it. Rob Collie (00:47:23): It's not digestible or actionable yet for the consumer crowd, whoever the target consumer is. I've been there. I've handed off a lot of things back in the day and said, "The professional equivalent of..." And it turned out to not be... It turned out to be, "Go back and actually make it useful, Rob." So I'm familiar with that. For sure. I think I've gotten better at that over the years. As a journey, you're never really complete with. Something I wanted to throw in here before I forget, which is, Jeff, you have an amazing command of certain dates. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:47:56): Oh, yeah. Jeff Sagarin (00:47:57): Give me some date that you know the answer about what day of the week it was, and I'll tell you, but I'll tell you how I did it. Rob Collie (00:48:04): Okay, how about June 6, 1974? Jeff Sagarin (00:48:08): That'd be a Thursday. Rob Collie (00:48:10): Holy cow. Okay. How do you do that? Jeff Sagarin (00:48:11): June 11th of 1974 would be a Tuesday, so five days earlier would be a Thursday. Rob Collie (00:48:19): How do you know June 11? Jeff Sagarin (00:48:19): I just do. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:48:23): It's his birthday. Rob Collie (00:48:24): No, it's not. He wasn't born in '74. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:48:27): No, but June 11th. Jeff Sagarin (00:48:29): I happen to know that June 11 was a Tuesday in 1974, that's all. Rob Collie (00:48:34): I'm still sitting here waiting what passes for an explanation. Is one coming? Jeff Sagarin (00:48:39): I'll tell you another way I could have done it, but I didn't. In 1963, John Kennedy gave his famous speech in Berlin, Ich bin ein Berliner, on Wednesday, June 26th. That means that three weeks earlier was June 5, the Wednesday. So Thursday would have been June 6th. You're going to say, "Well, why is that relevant?" Well, 1963 is congruent to 1974 days of the week was. Rob Collie (00:49:07): Okay. This is really, really impressive. Jeff, you seem so normal up until now. Thomas LaRock (00:49:16): You want throw him off? Just ask for any date before 1759? Jeff Sagarin (00:49:20): No, I can do that. It'll take me a little longer though. Thomas LaRock (00:49:22): Because once they switch from Gregorian- Jeff Sagarin (00:49:25): No, well, I'll give it a Gregorian style, all right. I'm assuming that it's a Gregorian date. The calendar totally, totally repeats every possible cycle every 400 years. For example, if you happen to say, "What was September 10, of 1621?" I would quickly say, "It's a Friday." Because 1621 is exactly the same as 2021 says. Rob Collie (00:49:52): Does this translate into other domains as well? Do you have sort of other things that you can sort of get this quick, intuitive mastery over or is it very, very specific to this date arithmetic? Jeff Sagarin (00:50:02): Probably specific. In other words, I think Wayne's a bit quicker than me. I'm certain does mental arithmetic stuff, but to put everybody in their place, I don't think you ever met him, Wayne. Remember the soccer player, John Swan? Dr. Wayne Winston (00:50:14): Yeah. Jeff Sagarin (00:50:15): He had a friend from high school, they went to Brownsburg High School. I forgot the kid's name. He was like a regular student at IU. He was not a well scholar, but he was a smart kid. I'd say he was slightly faster than me at most mental arithmetic things. So you should never get cocky and think that other people, "Oh, they don't have the pedigree." Some people are really good at stuff you don't expect them to be good at, really good. This kid was really good. Rob Collie (00:50:45): As humans, we need to hyper simplify things in order to have a mental model we can use to navigate a very, very complicated world. That's a bit of a strength. But it's also a weakness in many ways. We tend to try to reduce intelligence down to this single linear number line, when it's really like a vast multi dimensional coordinate space. There are so many dimensions of intelligence. Rob Collie (00:51:11): I grew up with the trope in my head that athletes weren't very bright. Until the first time that I had to try to run a pick and roll versus pick and pop. I discovered that my brain has a clock speed that's too slow to run the pick and roll versus pick and pop. It's not that I'm not smart enough to know if this, than that. I can't process it fast enough to react. You look at like an NFL receiver or an NFL linebacker or whatever, has to process on every single snap. Rob Collie (00:51:45): It's amazing how much information they have the processor. Set aside the physical skill that they have, which I also don't have and never did. On top of that, I don't have the brain at all to do these sorts of things. It's crazy. Jeff Sagarin (00:52:00): With the first few years, I was in Bloomington from, let's say, '77 to '81, I needed the money, so I tutored for the athletic department. They tutored math. And I remember once I was given an assignment, it was a defensive end, real nice kid. He was having trouble with the kind of math we would find really easy. But you could tell he had a mental block. These guys had had bad experiences and they just, "I can't do this. I can't do this." Jeff Sagarin (00:52:25): I asked this defensive end, "Tell me what happens when the ball snap, what do you have to do?" I said, "In real time, you're being physically pulverized, the other guy's putting a forearm or more right into your face. And your brain has to be checking about five different things going on in the backfield, other linemen." I said, "What you're doing with somebody else trying to hurt you physically is much more intellectually difficult, at least to my mind than this problem in the book in front of you and the book is not punching you in the face." Jeff Sagarin (00:52:57): He relaxed and he can do the problems in the room. I'd make sure. I picked not a problem that I had solved. I'd give him another one that I hadn't solved and he could do it. I realized, my God, what these guys they're doing takes actually very quick reacting brainpower and my own personal experience in elementary school, let's say in sixth grade after school, we'd be playing street football, just touch football. When I'd be quarterback, I'd start running towards the line of scrimmage. Jeff Sagarin (00:53:26): If the other team came after me, they'd leave a receiver wide open. I said, "This is easy." So I throw for touchdown. Well, in seventh grade, we go to junior high. We have squads in gym class, and on a particular day, I got to be quarterback. Now, instead of guys sort of leisurely counting one Mississippi, two Mississippi, they are pouring in. It's not that you're going to get hurt, but you're going to get tagged and the play would be over. It says touch football, and I'd be frantically looking for receivers to get open. Let's just say it was not a good experience. I realized there's a lot more to be in quarterback than playing in the street. It's so simple. Jeff Sagarin (00:54:08): They come after you and they leave the receivers wide open. That's what evidently sets apart. Let's say the Tom Brady's from the guys who don't even make it after one year in the NFL. If you gave them a contest throwing the ball, seeing who could throw it through a tire at 50 yards, maybe the young kid is better than Tom Brady but his brain can't process what's happening on the field fast enough. Thomas LaRock (00:54:32): As someone who likes to you know, test things thoroughly, that student of yours who was having trouble on the test, you said the book wasn't hitting him physically. Did you try possibly? Jeff Sagarin (00:54:45): I should have shoved it in his face. Thomas LaRock (00:54:49): Physically, just [crosstalk 00:54:50]. Rob Collie (00:54:50): Just throw things at him. Yeah. Thomas LaRock (00:54:52): Throw an eraser, a piece of chalk. Just something. Jeff Sagarin (00:54:56): I'll tell you now, I don't want to name him. He's a real nice guy. I'll tell you a funny anecdote about him. I had hurt my knuckle in a pickup basketball game. I had a cast on it and I was talking to my friend. And he had just missed making a pro football team the previous summer and he was on the last cut. He'd made it to the final four guys. Jeff Sagarin (00:55:18): He was trying to become a linebacker I think. They told him, "You're just not mean enough." That was in my mind. I thought, "Well, I don't know about that." He said, "Yeah, I had the same kind of fractured knuckle you got." I said, "How'd you get it?" "Pick up [inaudible 00:55:32]. Punching a guy in the face." But he wasn't mean enough for the NFL. And I heard a story from a friend of mine who I witnessed it, this guy was at one point working security at a local holiday inn that would have these dances. Jeff Sagarin (00:55:47): There was some guy who was like from the Hells Angels who was causing trouble. He's a big guy, 6'5, 300 whatever. And he actually got into an argument with my friend who was the security guy. Angel guy throws a punch at this guy who's not mean enough for the NFL. With one punch the Jeff Sagarin tutoree knocked the Hell's Angels guy flat unconscious. He was a comatose on the floor. But he wasn't mean enough for the NFL. Rob Collie (00:56:17): Tom if I told my plus minus story about my 1992 dream team on this show, I think maybe I have. I don't remember. Thomas LaRock (00:56:24): You might have but this seems like a perfect episode for that. Rob Collie (00:56:27): I think Jeff and Wayne, if I have told it before, it was probably with Wayne. Dr. Wayne Winston (00:56:31): I don't remember. Rob Collie (00:56:32): Perfect. It'll be new to everyone that matters. Tom remembers. So, in 1992, the Orlando Magic were a recent expansion team in the NBA. Sometime in that summer, the same summer where the 1992 Dream Team Olympic team went and dominated, there was a friend of our family who ran a like a luxury automotive accessories store downtown and he basically hit the jackpot. He'd been there forever. There was like right next to like the magic practice facility. Rob Collie (00:57:09): And so all the magic players started frequenting his shop. That was where they tricked out all their cars and added all the... So his business was just booming as a result of magic coming to town. I don't know this guy ever had ever been necessarily terribly athletic at any point in his life. He had this bright idea to assemble a YMCA team that would play in the local YMCA league in Orlando, the city league. Rob Collie (00:57:35): He had secured the commitment of multiple magic players to be on our team as well as like Jack Givens, who was the radio commentator for The Magic and had been a longtime NBA star with his loaded team. And then it was like, this guy, we'll call this guy Bill. It's not his real name. So it was Bill and the NBA players and me and my dad, a couple of younger guys that actually I didn't know, but were pretty good but they weren't even like college level players. Rob Collie (00:58:07): And so we signed up for the A league, the most competitive league that Orlando had to offer. And then none of the NBA players ever showed up. I said never, but they did show up one time. But we were getting blown out. Some of the people who were playing against us were clearly ex college players. We couldn't even get the ball across half court. Jeff Sagarin (00:58:33): Wayne, does this sound familiar to you? Dr. Wayne Winston (00:58:35): Yes, tell this story. Jeff Sagarin (00:58:38): Wayne, when he was a grad student at Yale, and I'm living in the White Irish neighborhood called Dorchester in Boston, I was young and spry. At that time, I would think I could play. Wayne as a grad student at Yale had entered a team with a really intimidating name of administration science in the New Haven City League, which was played I believe at Hill House high school at night. So Wayne said, "Hey Jeff, why don't you take a Greyhound bus down. We're going to play against this team called the New Haven All Stars. It ought to be interesting." Rob Collie (00:59:14): Wayne's voice in that story sound a little bit like the guy at USA Today for a moment. It was the same voice, the cigar chomping. Anyway, continue. Jeff Sagarin (00:59:25): They edged this out 75-31. I thought I was lined up against the guy... I thought it was Paul Silas who was may be sort of having a bus man's holiday playing for the New Haven all-stars. So a couple weeks later, Paul Silas was my favorite player on the Celtics. He could rebound, that's all I could do. I was pitiful at anything else. But I worked at that and I was pretty strong and I worked at jumping, etc. Jeff Sagarin (00:59:53): So a few weeks later, Wayne calls me up and says, "Hey Jeff, we're playing the New Haven All-Stars again. Why don't you come down again and we'll get revenge against them this time?" Let's just say it didn't work out that way. And I remember one time I had Paul Silas completely boxed out. It was perfect textbook and I could jump. If my hands were maybe at rim level and I could see a pair of pants a foot over mine from behind, he didn't tell me and he got the rebound and I'm at rim level. Jeff Sagarin (01:00:24): We were edged out by a score so monstrous, I won't repeat it here. I'm not a guard at all. But I ended up with the ball... They full court pressed the whole game. Rob Collie (01:00:34): Of course, once they figure out- Jeff Sagarin (01:00:36): That we can't play and I'm not even a guard. It was ludicrous. My four teammates left me in terror. They just said, "We're going down court." So I'm all alone, they have four guys on me and my computer like my thought, "Well, they've got four guys on me. That must mean my four teammates are being guarded by one guy down court. This should be easy." I look, I look. They didn't steal the ball out of my hands or nothing. I'm still holding on to it. They're pecking away but they didn't foul me. I give them credit for that. I was like, "Where the hell are my teammates?" Jeff Sagarin (01:01:08): They were in terror hiding in single file behind the one guy and I basically... I don't care if you bleeping or not, I said, "Fuck it." And I just threw the ball. Good two overhand pass, long pass. I had my four teammates down there and they had one guy and you can guess who got the ball. After the game I asked them, I said, "You guys seem fairly good. Are you anybody?" The guy said, "Yeah, we're the former Fairfield varsity we were in the NIT about two years ago." Jeff Sagarin (01:01:39): I looked it up once. Fairfield did make the NIT, I think in '72. And this took place in like February of '74. It taught me a lesson because I looked up what my computer rating for Fairfield would have been compared that to, let's say, UCLA and NC State and figured at a minimum, we'd be at least a 100-200 point underdog against them in a real game, but it would have been worse because we would never get the ball pass mid-court. Rob Collie (01:02:10): Yeah, I mean, those games that I'm talking about in that YMCA League, I mean, the scores were far worse. We were losing like 130-11. Jeff Sagarin (01:02:19): Hey, good that's worse than New Haven all-stars beat us but not quite that bad. Rob Collie (01:02:24): I remember one time actually managing to get the ball across half court and pulling up for a three-point shot off of the break. And then having the guy that had assembled the team, take me aside at the next time out and tell me that I needed to pass that. I'm just like, "No. You got us into this embarrassment. If I get to the point where like, there's actually a shot we can take like a shot, we could take a shot. I'm not going to dump it off to you." Thomas LaRock (01:02:57): Not just a shot, but the shot of gold. Rob Collie (01:03:00): The one time we did get those guys to show up, we were still kind of losing because those guys didn't want to get hurt. It didn't make any sense for them to be there. There was no upside for them to be in this game. I'm sure that they just sort of been guilted into showing up. But then this Christian Laettner lookalike on the other team. He was as big as Laettner. Rob Collie (01:03:25): This is the kind of teams we were playing against. There was a long rebound and that Laettner lookalike got that long rebound and basically launched from the free throw line and dunked over Terry Catledge, the power forward for the Magic at the time. And at that moment, Terry Catledge scored the next 45 points in the game himself. That was all it was. Rob Collie (01:03:50): He'd just be standing there waiting for me to inbound the ball to him, he would take it coast to coast and score. He'd backpedal on defense and he would somehow steal the ball and he'd go down and score again. He just sent a message. And if that guy hadn't dunked over Catledge, we would have never seen what Catledge was capable of. So remember, this is a team th

Remember ESPN the Magazine?  NEXT athlete, the Body Issue – for me, the Mag was appointment reading.  Maybe I'm a little different, but I grew up addicted to the sports magazine scene. Sports Illustrated, Sport, The Sporting News. Every year my grandmother would get me a subscription to these mags for Christmas, she didn't have to think about it, just renew the subscription each year and I'd be happy as could be.  SI covers adorned my walls. In my mind's eye I can still picture the SI cover with Bernie Kosar in his Browns jersey and mini fro, with the headline “Banking on Bernie”. I see it clearly because it was the cover that grabbed your eye as you walked into my bedroom.  I didn't particularly like the Browns or Bernie, it just so happened to be in your line of sight, and I remember it vividly.  Growing up, these mags were all I read. Cover-to-cover.  My mom tried to get me to read more novels, more classics, but I loved the storytelling that came through on those pages. Frank Deford, Leigh Montville, Alexander Wolff.   ESPN the Magazine raised the bar.  The pictures were better, content was faster paced, the branding, the stats, the data visualizations and the storytelling were just awe inspiring. I worked at a competing sports network and yet read ESPN the Magazine for inspiration.   NEXT athlete, the Body Issue, Athlete X, The Biz, Two Way – it was amazing.   But magazines, well, they died, and it wasn't climate change that killed them, it was audience change. TL;DR became a thing. Everything we needed was on our phones. Information was right here all the time.   September 2019 ESPN published their last magazine.  They said the demise was caused by the “rapid evolution of consumer habits” which means, people were no longer buying paper publications.  Get this in December of 2018, just 9 months before shuttering, The Association of Magazine Media, ranked ESPN The Magazine No. 1 in total audience. It ranked No. 1 among magazines in web and mobile web audiences and was top ranked in video.  And that wasn't enough. It still didn't work.   Remember magazines, those were great.  Today's guest Gary Belsky worked at ESPN the Magazine for almost 14 years, culminating in being Editor in Chief 2007-2011, in fact the Body Issue was one of his brain children. He's written 8 books, is an accomplished speaker and is the Chief Content Officer for Elland Road Partners.    As former guest Joan Lynch told me, Gary Belsky is one of the smartest people I've ever had the pleasure of speaking with. After my conversation with Gary which, you are about to hear, I concur.   Listen to Gary Belsky on the latest Work In Sports podcast... 

Doc opens talking about the art of writing in sports, art and medicine. Doc uses examples of Frank Deford in sports and Rod Serling in art. Injury of the week is the Sun's Dario Saric ACL injury. The Weekend Warrior Clinic opens for listeners.

Doc opens talking about the art of writing in sports, art and medicine. Doc uses examples of Frank Deford in sports and Rod Serling in art. Injury of the week is the Sun's Dario Saric ACL injury. The Weekend Warrior Clinic opens for listeners. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Steve interviews L. Jon Wertheim (00:08:59) from Sports Illustrated and 60 Minutes to talk about his new book, Glory Days. First, Steve and Jon catch up talking about the reaction to the column that Jon wrote about The Sports-Casters. Next, Jon talks about writing Glory Days, the Karate Kid, Cyndi Lauper, Vince McMahon and more from the summer of 1984. Finally, Jon tries to explain the controversy at the French Open surrounding Naomi Osaka. Also, Brett Martin (01:01:24) joins us for the first time since 2014. Brett explains why it has been so long since he has appeared on the podcast. Brett also talks about The Sopranos, watching television and food. Steve starts the show with a very special guest. The book club has books by Pete Croatto. The show ends with a selection out of Frank Deford's NPR book about the difference between golf and tennis players. For more information follow the podcast on twitter @sports_casters Email: thesportscasters@gmail.com

Steve interviews Jon Champion (00:05:16) from ESPN and the Euro2020. Jon joins the show to preview the Euro 2020 that he will be calling from Bristol with Taylor Twellman. Steve and Jon talk about the Italy side and why it will look different this year. Also, a preview of the favorites to win, Jon picks a dark-horse, and Steve keeps asking him about Italy. Jon also talks about how Covid will effect the tournament, how the delay of the tournament will effect the players, and how he hopes to call the last few games live from inside the stadium. Also, Jon recalls his memories from Italy's dramatic victory over Germany at the 2006 World Cup. Also, Page Hamilton (00:43:54) from the rock band, Helmet makes his debut on the podcast. Page and Steve recorded this a few months back and Steve held it for the perfect moment. Page talks about his career with Helmet, being a music during the pandemic, and the wackiness of Fleetwood Mac. Steve asks Page about writing Unsung, working with his old bandmates, the future of the group. Page also talks about loving The Beatles, his favorite Helmet song, and more. Steve starts with a quick update before getting to the first interview. The book club has a new book by Jon Wertheim and two others. The show ends with a new segment dedicated to the late, great Frank Deford. For more information follow the podcast on twitter @sports_casters Email: thesportscasters@gmail.com

Show Notes and Links to Keegan Hamilton's Work and Allusions/Texts from Episode         On Episode 45, Pete talks with Keegan Hamilton about his reporting for Vice News. The conversation focuses on his work for three thorough, shocking, engrossing, and nuanced multimedia pieces about the trial of El Chapo, fentanyl's explosive growth in the US and abroad, and recent developments and fighting in Micoachan, México's “Tierra Caliente,” fifteen years after Felipe Calderón declared “war” on the cartels.   Keegan Hamilton is a senior reporter, podcast host, and Emmy-nominated producer at VICE News, where he covers organized crime, prisons, and the drug trade.  Keegan Hamilton's Personal Website with Links to His Work   Vice News Article: "On the Front Line of Mexico's Forever War Against the Cartels" by Keegan Hamilton and Miguel Fernández-Flores   YouTube trailer for “Painkiller: America's Fentanyl Crisis,” a Spotify podcast series, found here   Chapo: Kingpin on Trial Podcast At around 2:00, Keegan talks about his role as a “senior editor” at Vice News   At around 2:40, Keegan talks about his beginnings of journalism, and his love for Jack McCallum and Frank DeFord and other great writers for his beloved Sports Illustrated At around 4:20 (coincidentally!), Keegan talks about his work at alt-weeklies and how they have informed his own writing and local alt-weeklies' role in advancing narrative nonfiction and long-form, nuanced pieces    At around 7:00, Keegan talks about writers who have inspired him and continue to inspire him, including Charles Bowden, Terrence Papá, Ioan Grillo, and Sam Quinones   At around 11:40, Keegan talks about his view of himself as what it means to be a “writer” and “journalist,” particularly with the acceleration of multimedia in recent years   At around 14:00, Keegan talks about his writing work during the pandemic   At around 16:00, Keegan talks about Vice and their target audience(s)   At around 17:00, Keegan talks about his podcasting techniques and what's he's learned about the mechanics of the medium   At around 19:45, Keegan and Pete discuss the romanticization of organized crime figures, including “El Chapo,” whose U.S. trial Keegan covered in a recent Vice podcast series, as well as common misconceptions about the drug trade and its participants   At around 25:20, Keegan discusses the importance of speaking Spanish pretty well and his valuable and helpful translators, including producer Miguel Fernandez   At around 27:00, Keegan describes the thesis/pitch for the Vice News podcast/article/project chronicling 15 years of the “drug war” in Michoacán, México    At around 29:35, Pete and Keegan talk about some rays of hope in the story of the drug war, and a well-written scene at the end of Keegan's article on Michoacán that shows a possible more tranquil future in La Tierra Caliente   At around 30:35, Pete and Keegan talk about the Michoacán autodefensas and the role of indigenous communities in forming strong groups for security and self-sufficiency   At around 32:40, Pete and Keegan discuss the role and responsibility of The United States in the “drug war,” as the users of the illicit drugs are overwhelmingly in the US   At around 34:50, Pete and Keegan toss around ideas for Keegan's next project(s) You can now subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts, and leave me a five-star review. You can also ask for the podcast by name using Alexa, and find the pod on Spotify and on Amazon Music. Follow me on IG, where I'm @chillsatwillpodcast, or on Twitter, where I'm @chillsatwillpo1. This is a passion project of mine, a DIY operation, and I'd love for your help in promoting what I'm convinced is a unique and spirited look at an often-ignored art form. The intro song for The Chills at Will Podcast is “Wind Down” (Instrumental Version), and the other song played on this episode was “Hoops” (Instrumental)” by Matt Weidauer, and both songs are used through ArchesAudio.com.  

Sports is everywhere in America, as we all know: the Super Bowl, the Masters, the World Series, the Stanley Cup, the Olympics, the NBA, MLB, NFL, youth travel sports, and the list goes on and on. So if we understand sports, we may understand America. For us on the podcast series, the question is “does religion factor into sports”? It seems the answer is a loud “yes.”   In 1976 Sports Illustrated published a three-part essay by the famed sports commentator Frank DeFord titled “Religion in Sport” in which he analyzed the cozy relationship between Christianity and sports in the United States, and it was in this article that he coined the term “sportianity”, writing this: it is almost as if a new denomination had been created: Sportianity. While Christian churches struggle with problems of declining attendance, falling contributions and now even reduction in membership, Sportianity appears to be taking off.” That same year Michael Novak published The Joy of Sports, articulating the religiosity embedded in the playing and cheering of sports.   This discussion will help us better understand what religion has done to America, and what America has done to religion, and we trust that as a result, listeners will see how indispensable the idea of religious freedom as a governing principle, is, to the United States and its ability to fulfill its purposes in the world.   Today to talk about religion and sports we have with us Jeffrey Scholes, associate professor in the Department of Philosophy at the University of Colorado – Colorado Springs, and author of the book Christianity, Race and Sport, to be published next year by Routledge Press. Professor Scholes' research interests center on the relationship between religion and sports, and American political theology. He is the author of Vocation and the Politics of Work: Popular Theology in a Consumer Culture and co-author of Religion and Sports in American Culture.   Join us in building The National Museum of American Religion in the nation's capital, to open in 2026, on the 240th anniversary of Thomas Jefferson's immortal words "Almighty God hath created the mind free", by donating at storyofamericanreligion.org/contribute.   For a contribution of $200 or more you will receive a free copy of the book When Sorrow Comes: The Power of Sermons from Pearl Harbor to Black Lives Matter, by Melissa Matthes, professor of government at The United States Coast Guard Academy. Her forthcoming book reminds us that in the face of national crisis, faith leaders have incredible power to help Americans endure, even flourish, and further the work of improving the imperfect yet noble American experiment in self-government.

Kris & David are joined by Joe Gagne (@joegagne) to discuss the partial week that was January 25th - January 30th, 1995. We talk about the NATPE bTV syndication convention taking place in Las Vegas, which featured a live WCW Clash of the Champions at Caesars Palace capped off by Hulk Hogan & Vader having their first physical angle, plus all the other wrestling news involving NATPE and who had booths there. We also talk about the return of Big Bubba Rogers, the evolution of Brian Pillman, Japanese wrestling magazines fighting amongst themselves, a tragic death in New Japan, the birth of the Triple Threat in ECW, Eddie Gilbert's last TV appearance in SMW, the early hype for Bam Bam Bigelow vs. Lawrence Taylor at WrestleMania, the WWF flirting with shoot angles, and much more. Joe is always a great guest, and this was a blast, so check it out!!!!! Timestamps: 0:00:00 WCW 1:20:49 NATPE 1:37:32 Japan: AJPW, NJPW, Heisei Ishingun vs. WAR, IWA Japan, SPWF, W*ING, Pancrase, RINGS, & AJW 2:20:46 Classic Commercial Break 2:26:03 Housekeeping/The Amazon Game 2:52:14 Latin America: AAA, CMLL, UWA, & AWF 3:11:11 Other USA: USofA, ECW, WWWA, SMW, USWA, Circle City, CAPW, NWA Dallas/JCP, Lone Star, & PWA 4:42:30 WWF 5:39:37 Patreon Preview: Vince McMahon sends Basil DeVito after Dave Meltzer, Frank Deford, and The National Sports Daily To support the show and get access to exclusive rewards like special members-only monthly themed shows, go to our Patreon page at Patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets ( http://patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets ) and become an ongoing Patron. Becoming a Between the Sheets Patron will also get you exclusive access to not only the monthly themed episode of Between the Sheets, but also access to our new mailbag segment, a Patron-only chat room on Slack, and anything else we do outside of the main shows! Shop at Amazon via our link ( https://www.amazon.com/?tag=betweenthesheets-20 ) (go here ( https://www.amazon.co.uk/?_encoding=UTF8&tag=btsheets-21 ) for Amazon UK if you’re in Europe)— Nothing extra comes out of your pocket; for you, it’s the same experience you’d get going to Amazon the usual way. For the best in both current and classic indie wrestling streaming, make sure to check out IndependentWrestling.tv ( http://independentwrestling.tv/ ) and use coupon code BTSPOD for a free 5 day trial! (You can also go directly to TinyURL.com/IWTVsheets ( http://tinyurl.com/IWTVsheets ) to sign up that way.) If you convert to a paid subscriber, we get a kickback for referring you, allowing you to support both the show and the indie scene. To subscribe, you can find us on iTunes, Google Play, and just about every other podcast app's directory, or you can also paste Feeds.FeedBurner.com/BTSheets ( http://feeds.feedburner.com/BTSheets ) into your favorite podcast app using whatever “add feed manually” option it has. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/between-the-sheets/donations Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

From 2003- Frank DeFord, author of "An American Summer," a novel set in the summer of 1954 against the backdrop of the polio epidemic (a year before the announcement that Jonas Salk had overseen the development of a desperately-needed vaccine for the dreaded disease.)

Craig Calcaterra joins us this week for a very sports-movie-y sports movie: Everybody's All-American, a "one wedding and one long funeral" look at a college gridiron star's early peak and interminable fall that doesn't know which set of Quarterback Agonistes clichés it wants to use, and recycled Sophie's Choice's Stingo as Timothy Hutton's Cake, with merkinacious results. The three of us had a lot of questions -- why the hot cousin is A Thing in the Quaidverse, why the movie isn't about Jessica Lange's Babs and Carl Lumbly's Blue, and how Wayne Knight feels about that "Fraternity Pisser" credit, just for starters. At least Craig was a good sport about watching this dud, even Overall score: 3 QQQ score: 3 SHOW NOTES Get EVEN MORE Qontent (...sorry) at our Patreon page (https://www.patreon.com/quaidinfull) Can YOU get past the first 27 seconds of The Dennissance (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-dennissance/id1503394153)? Roger Ebert's review (https://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/everybodys-all-american-1988) Janet Maslin's review (https://www.nytimes.com/1988/11/04/movies/review-film-the-glory-fades-in-everybody-s-all-american.html) John Cheever, "O Youth and Beauty!" (https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1953/08/22/o-youth-and-beauty) Special Guest: Craig Calcaterra.

Jerry Izenberg might not be a recognizable name to most sport’s fans, but it’s one that will be eternally remembered when it comes to all sports. You see, Jerry Izenberg is one of the greatest writers to ever put pen to paper when it comes to covering the games we love to watch. Jerry spent time at several newspapers, most notably though, he spent most of his career writing for a paper that so few know (unless you live in or near New Jersey), the Newark Star-Ledger. Jerry also wrote, produced and directed sport’s specials and documentaries and authored several books including: “Once There Were Giants” … “The Greatest Game Ever Played” … “No Medals for Trying” … “Rozelle: A Biography”. While Jerry might not be as well-known as some of his contemporaries who wrote for larger newspapers, guys like Dave Anderson, Red Smith, Jim Murray, Jimmy Cannon, Shirley Povich or Frank Deford, doesn’t mean he was every bit as good – or better. So many couldn’t wait to get a copy of the paper every morning to read Jerry. But Jerry was even more! He found stories where no one dared to go before him. To make a stand and cover issues that others thought had no business being in the sport’s pages; and his work to raise money through sport’s endeavors has gone unnoticed by so many. Well, writer and author Ed Odeven recently sat down with Jerry and many of his fellow writers to put together a new book, “Going 15-Round with Jerry Izenberg,” and joins me on this special edition of Sports’ Forgotten Heroes where we don’t discuss a hero on the field, rather we focus on a hero who helped make the game more interesting for all of us. Links: Sports' Forgotten Heroes website Sports' Forgotten Heroes Patreon Page Sports' Forgotten Heroes twitter © 2020 Sports' Forgotten Heroes

An early 200's interview from Indians Spring Training in Winterhaven with the one and only Bob Feller, and long time writer for Sports Illustrated Frank Deford. That's on this episode of the Mike Trivisonno Show Flashback Podcast.

Kris & David are joined by Al Getz (@AlGetzWrestling) & Beau James (@kingofkingsport) to discuss the week that was December 18-24, 1993. We talk about Jim Cornette's long letter to the Torch about Wade Keller’s coverage of the “race riot” at an SMW show in Wise, Virginia, but we also play some great clips from SMW, especially a Dick Murdoch promo that you can't miss. We also discuss Bobby Heenan coming to WCW, Jesse Ventura staying in WCW, and Davey Boy Smith leaving WCW, including how he was buried on TV to make way for the debut of the Big Bossman as “The Boss." We also talk about all of the news from Japan, Mexico, and Europe, including Otto Wanz running his big year-end show just days after the tragic in-ring death of Larry Cameron. We also have the WWF running some egregious 900 number polls, the debuts of Sparky Plugg & Double J, the return of Randy Savage to WWF Mania, Frank Deford writing to the Observer, and much more. Beau & Al also tell some amazing stories from their time in the business, to boot, and this show is AMAZING, so LISTEN NOW!!!!Timestamps:0:00:00 SMW1:43:52 WCW3:02:48 Classic Commercial Break3:07:29 Housekeeping/The Amazon Game3:44:53 Int’l: Tokyo Sports & AJW awards, NJPW, Korakuen Hall Christmas week shows, CWA, AAA, CMLL, UWA, & Acapulco4:42:54 Other USA: Joe Pedicino, ECW, USWL, AAWF, USWA, CWI, Big D, UWA, Eddie Sharkey, & CWUSA5:36:15 WWFTo support the show and get access to exclusive rewards like special members-only monthly themed shows, go to our Patreon page at Patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets and become an ongoing Patron. Becoming a Between the Sheets Patron will also get you exclusive access to not only the monthly themed episode of Between the Sheets, but also access to our new mailbag segment, a Patron-only chat room on Slack, and anything else we do outside of the main shows!Shop at Amazon via our link (go here for Amazon UK if you’re in Europe)— Nothing extra comes out of your pocket; for you, it’s the same experience you’d get going to Amazon the usual way.For the best in both current and classic indie wrestling streaming, make sure to check out IndependentWrestling.tv and use coupon code BTSPOD for a free 20 day trial! (You can also go directly to TinyURL.com/IWTVsheets to sign up that way.)To subscribe, you can find us on iTunes, Google Play, and just about every other podcast app's directory, or you can also paste Feeds.FeedBurner.com/BTSheets into your favorite podcast app using whatever “add feed manually” option it has.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/between-the-sheets/donations

Steve Delsohn, Founder and President of Delsohn Strategies Public Relations firm and former Investigative Reporter for ESPN's Outside the Lines joins us on the Work in Sports Podcast!Hey It's Brian --- today on the WorkinSports podcast Steve Delsohn former investigative reporter for ESPN's Outside the Lines and current owner operator of a sports PR firm representing clients all across the sports landscape… but before Steve, let's talk about the Work in Sports Academy.Everyone listening to this show is trying to learn things that will help them in their sports career, right? Maybe you're looking for that first job, maybe you dream of getting hired by ESPN like Steve, or maybe you're in college trying to find your way through the sports career options. Well, we've created a series of online courses that will teach you the strategies and tactics necessary to get hired in sports. You don't want to just blend in with a bunch of other resumes applying for jobs, you want to stand out, and our courses are there to help. Extremely affordable, each course is just $39 or you can buy all four courses for a massive cost savings. Check it out today - WorkinSports.com/gameplan Alright let's start the countdown...  Hi everybody, I'm Brian Clapp Vice President of Content and Engaged learning at WorkinSports.com and this is the Work in Sports podcast…When I first started in the sports industry back in 1996 as a production assistant at CNN/Sports Illustrated, I was a sports fan. I loved watching games, debating players, arguing strategies and playing as often as I could in my spare time.Sure, I had some skills for the job or else I wouldn't have been hired, I could edit video and audio, operate a camera and things of that nature. But I lived for the events.I grew up with a subscription to Sports Illustrated, and while my grandmother, who got me the yearly subscription, thought I was really engaging with all the longform storytelling, truth is I was lazy. I'd read the opening 20 pages of short stories based on what happened with the teams I know and loved… and then when it came to the langer articles with meaning, from Frank Deford, Leigh Montville, Tim Layden and Sally Jenkins… I'd skip through and look at the pictures.It wasn't until March 14th, 2000 -- four years into my career at CNN Sports Illustrated that I truly grasped the power of journalism, reporting and storytelling.Our investigative reporting team toiled for months and month on a story about Bob Knight, the bombastic coach of Indiana University. A man feared for his temper tantrums, but admired for his winning. He was a God to many in Indiana, but not everyone. I won't rehash the story - I can link to some old articles if you arte interested in reading more - but suffice it to say our reporters blew open a monumental story into events that happened behind the scenes of his empire that would have made your head spin. I'll tell you, as someone who had nothing to do with the story, but had access to the reporting, there were dozens of horrifying stories that didn't make the final cut….and that final cut was still a full 30 minute story that left people with their jaw dropped.Bobby Knight was fired shortly after our programming aired.I remember talking to one of the people who worked on it closely, he was being pressed on what it meant to be part of a story that got the great bobby knight fired… and he consistently said - the job of the journalist is to present the story as reported, not to strive or reach for any result, he wasn't trying to get Bobby Knight fired, he was trying to present the truth. I admired this approach -- this idea that now people know what happens there. You can still decide to go to Indiana, or later Texas Tech and play for knight, but if he strangles you on the sidelines, or does some other horrific thing, you have to accept it because the truth has been presented to you. This was when I first became obsessed with the art and craft of story telling.

Frank Deford, legendary sportswriter, chats with me on this week's Thursday Talk edition of the Red Ticket Blues podcast.  He  discusses his latest book, I'd Know That Voice Anywhere. My Favorite NPR Commentaries  We discuss the recent NBA Finals and the transformation of LeBron James's popularity. Frank  discusses the long term health of the NFL game, football in general, and if it is destined to go the way of boxing. Deford talks the game of soccer in the United States as compared to globally and if it will ever be one of the big sports here. Should steroid abusers be in the baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown?  Frank weighs in. Plus,he talks how Muhammad Ali went from villain to loved. Follow on Twitter @brianbuck13 and @redticketblues Listen on iTunes, Stitcher, TuneIn, Podbean, Google Play, Spotify and other fine podcasting venues

Phil Bolsta is the author of "Through God's Eyes: Finding Peace and Purpose in a Troubled World," a comprehensive guide to living a spiritual life. If you have more confusion than clarity about how to live your beliefs, the ancient wisdom permeating "Through God's Eyes" offers the hope and promise that you can escape from the prison of human perception, welcome peace, love, and joy as the dearest of friends, and become a more positive and powerful force for good in the world. Learn more at GodsEyesBook.com.Phil is also the author of the eBook, "The Logic of Living a Spiritual Life: Supporting a Life of Faith Through Logic and Reason." Those who worship logic instead of God are only half right. Not only is it logical to believe in God and to live a faith-based life, the existence of a loving, benevolent God that governs all creation is perhaps the only systematic worldview that explains every aspect of life. Learn more at GodIsLogical.com.Phil is also the author of "Sixty Seconds: One Moment Changes Everything," a collection of 45 inspiring, life-changing stories from prominent people he interviewed. The roster of storytellers includes Deepak Chopra, geneticist Dr. Francis Collins, Frank Deford, Dr. Larry Dossey, Wayne Dyer, Dan Millman, Caroline Myss, Dr. Christiane Northrup, Dr. Dean Ornish, Dr. Rachel Naomi Remen, Dr. Bernie Siegel, James Van Praagh, singer Billy Vera, Neale Donald Walsch and bassist Victor Wooten. Learn more at SixtySecondsBook.com.

Phil Bolsta is the author of "Through God's Eyes: Finding Peace and Purpose in a Troubled World," a comprehensive guide to living a spiritual life. If you have more confusion than clarity about how to live your beliefs, the ancient wisdom permeating "Through God's Eyes" offers the hope and promise that you can escape from the prison of human perception, welcome peace, love, and joy as the dearest of friends, and become a more positive and powerful force for good in the world. Learn more at GodsEyesBook.com.Phil is also the author of the eBook, "The Logic of Living a Spiritual Life: Supporting a Life of Faith Through Logic and Reason." Those who worship logic instead of God are only half right. Not only is it logical to believe in God and to live a faith-based life, the existence of a loving, benevolent God that governs all creation is perhaps the only systematic worldview that explains every aspect of life. Learn more at GodIsLogical.com.Phil is also the author of "Sixty Seconds: One Moment Changes Everything," a collection of 45 inspiring, life-changing stories from prominent people he interviewed. The roster of storytellers includes Deepak Chopra, geneticist Dr. Francis Collins, Frank Deford, Dr. Larry Dossey, Wayne Dyer, Dan Millman, Caroline Myss, Dr. Christiane Northrup, Dr. Dean Ornish, Dr. Rachel Naomi Remen, Dr. Bernie Siegel, James Van Praagh, singer Billy Vera, Neale Donald Walsch and bassist Victor Wooten. Learn more at SixtySecondsBook.com.

In his 50 years in the business, sportswriter Frank Deford evolved from the "not very bright" kid to one of the most gifted, respected and versatile writers of our time. Deford died in 2017 at the age of 78. In this 2012 conversation with Growing Bolder, he revealed the two athletes he thought were the most compelling of all time.

ICYMI: Jon and I discuss how on earth Nadal and Federer are No. 1 and No. 2 in the world 10 years removed from their historic 2008 Wimbledon final, Serena's 2018 ranking debate, a cool story about career advice Jon received from the late Frank Deford when he first arrived at Sports Illustrated, and much more!

Pete Peterson has produced essays and commentaries for WSIU Radio for more than 13 years now.

This week, Tim Hanlon buckles up for a wild ride through the tumultuous early years of the original Major Indoor Soccer League with sports PR veteran Michael Menchel, in our longest and most anecdote-filled episode yet!  Menchel takes us on a head-spinning audio journey across some of the most memorable (and forgettable) franchises in professional indoor soccer history – including stops in Long Island, NY (the Arrows trade for Pete Rose!), New Jersey (scoring champ Fred Grgurev’s unique approach to car maintenance!), Houston (the “Summit Soccer” borrows its name from the arena it plays in and its players from the NASL’s Hurricane!), Baltimore (the marketing genius of Tim Leiweke!), and Hartford (what the hell is a “Hellion”?).  Plus, Menchel: hits the road with Frank Deford; spends a year outdoors among the Caribou(s?) of Colorado; has a bad day in Rochester, NY; and “settles down” in St. Louis wondering when and where the NFL football Cardinals will move next.  Thanks to Audible for sponsoring this week’s episode!

Biking from Parma to Verona. Lots to tell.  Back home, remembering Frank Deford, Jim Piersall and Glenne Headly.  From Fast Food to Fast Fine Food. Can a Museum of Failure succeed?  Tamsen is ready for a glass of Spanish Rosé.  Here's to the Understudies! Credits: Talent:  Tamsen Granger and Dan Abuhoff Engineer:  Ellie Suttmeier Art:  Zeke Abuhoff

A never before heard interview with the late Frank Deford from 2013. Topics ranged from personal interactions with legendary athletes such as Muhammad Ali, Billie Jean King, and Bill Russell to Deford's perspective on the state of sports journalism today.  Frank Deford's Wicked Gracehttps://www.thenation.com/article/frank-defords-wicked-grace/—http://www.edgeofsportspodcast.com/ | http://twitter.com/EdgeOfSportsPod | http://fb.com/edgeofsportspod | https://www.instagram.com/edgeofsportspod | email us: edgeofsports@gmail.com | Edge of Sports hotline: 401-426-3343 (EDGE)—Music:  Eye Examination - Del the Funky Homosapien | Frontin' - Jay-Z feat. Pharrell | Brain - Jungle Brothers | Still Fly - Big Tymers | Don't Sweat the Technique - Eric B & Rakim | The Wire Outro

After a week off, we take a look at the news. This week that means talking about the NBA finals, the Champions League Final and Tiger Woods. Lastly, we pay homage to Frank Deford. Then we move into a discussion of legitimacy in cycling and cricket and where it comes from. For our main topic, … Continue reading Episode 51: Toxic Masculinity in Sports

Mike Randle @FtsyWarriorMike and Gus Kearns @Ckearns12 make their NBA Finals Picks, remember Frank Deford, and preview the incredible PK80 tournament!2:00 The boys make their NBA Finals picks!13:40 NBA Draft Six Pack:  Who's Back? 14:05 Angel Delgado returns to Seton Hall17:55 Andrew Jones returns to Texas21:20 Rawle Alkins returns to Arizona24:20 Tacko Fall returns to UCF27:00 Svi Mykhailiuk returns to Kansas28:35  Deng Adel returns to Louisville31:40  Hamidou Diallo returns to Kentucky41:05 Gus & Mike preview the PK80 Tourament45:25  Another #DraftJakeWiley Tidbit49:00 Tribute to Frank Deford53:00 The Debut of the Screen the Screener OUTTAKES! Follow us @STheSPodcast on Twitter.  Rate and subscribe on Itunes, Stitcher, and TuneIn Radio!Listen to short clips from the podcast on you tube at:  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0r14k3YJBdOaT9Lz6RJTEw/videosEmail the show StheSPodcast@gmail.com 

Showrunner supreme Damon Lindelof (“Lost,” “The Leftovers”) hops into Rico’s hot tub time machine, then considers the paradoxes of fandom… The band Phoenix toasts a purring Bryan Ferry, video games in Japan, and the sounds of le cinema… We pay tribute to late great sportswriter Frank DeFord, who throws us some etiquette curveballs… Musician Lynn […]

Though they started off rocky, Gator Baseball has proven that they know how to finish by stacking up wins down the stretch and claiming the #3 seed in the NCAA Tournament. On this week's show, host Adam Schick welcomes FloridaGators.com Senior Writers Scott Carter and Chris Harry to break down Softball at the WCWS (1:15), Baseball hosting NCAA Regionals (6:27), Men's Basketball's schedule taking shape (10:01), Football news from SEC Spring Meetings (12:47), Tim Tebow's All-Star push (16:44), and legendary sportswriter Frank DeFord's legacy (19:04). Also, Gator Baseball Junior Mike Rivera talks about his life as a catcher, how a family scare has impacted his college career and more (20:55). Please leave a review if you like what you hear and for more information, head to FloridaGators.com/GatorTales.

Episode 122 of the Sports Illustrated Media podcast features a tribute to the life and work of Frank Deford, the longtime Sports Illustrated writer who died on May 28 at his home in Key West, Fla. He was 78. Writers Alex Wolff (SI), Wright Thompson (ESPN), Jack McCallum (SI), Sally Jenkins (Washington Post), Tim Layden (SI) and Michael Farber (SI and TSN) joined the podcast (for separate segments) to offer thoughts on their favorite Deford pieces, his impact on sports journalism, personal stories of interacting with Deford, how he approached stories, why he matters in 2017, and much more. You can subscribe to the podcast on iTunes, Google Play and Stitcher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Nathan Stacken talks the Stanley Cup Finals, Pittsburgh vs. Nashville, with Travis Kriens. An NBA Finals preview. The latest in MLB news. Bryce Harper and Hunter Strickland suspended and the Twins bullpen implodes. Also thought on the death of Frank DeFord.Marcus Traxler joins Nathan to give his thought on the Stanley Cup Finals.

Dwight Jaynes sat down with the late Frank Deford for an episode of Posting Up.

Murph and Andy talk basebrawls and revisit their conversation with the late legend Frank Deford.

Topics: Pens take Stanley Cup Final Game 1, Tiger Woods, Frank Deford plus this day in sports history. Guest: Rowan University Men’s Basketball Head Coach and former Nittany Lion player Joe Crispin.

Topics: Pens take Stanley Cup Final Game 1, Tiger Woods, Frank Deford plus this day in sports history. Guest: Rowan University Men’s Basketball Head Coach and former Nittany Lion player Joe Crispin.

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Joe House and Bryan Curtis to talk about Tiger Woods's latest media frenzy (01:30) and make NBA Finals predictions (23:00). Finally, Bill and Bryan take time to remember the late Frank Deford (44:00).

This edition of the best of show includes everything non-NBA Finals from Memorial Day Weekend. That includes a chat with Bryan Curtis of The Ringer about Frank Deford, the story of Wilmeth Sidat-Singh, Redskins beat reporter Brian McNally and baseball players being cowardly stupid.Support the show (http://HoffmanShow.com)

Stefan Fatsis and Josh Levin are joined by Ethan Sherwood Strauss to preview the NBA Finals. They also talk with Charles P. Pierce about the legacy of writer Frank Deford, and Daniel Engber joins for a conversation about our favorite non-famous athletes. NBA Finals (1:54): A conversation with Ethan Strauss about what to look out for in the third consecutive finals matchup between the Warriors and Cavs. What will Golden State do in crunch time? Will Draymond Green kick anyone? Frank Deford (21:25): Charles P. Pierce, who worked with Deford at Sports Illustrated and The National, talks about what made him a great writer and reminisces about his favorite Deford stories. Non-famous athletes (40:10): Daniel Engber discusses his obsession with Mets utility player Keith Miller, and we talk about our listeners’ favorite non-superstars. Afterballs (56:50) More information at slate.com/hangup Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

1- Thank you, Veterans. 2- BMW’s in a red state, stupid. 3- Obama’s Navy 4- Portland heroes: the silence was deafening. 5- Lets talk TREASON where’s that hangin rope 6- Nance’s Law 7- FBI means don’t fuck with them. 8- "Trump a complete Disaster," says the other orange guy. 9- Body slam to a win. 10- Racisms mixed with racists mixed with racists' history. 11- Tiger, you need Jesus. 12- R.I.P., Frank Deford. Thank you, Sir.

Mark Carman (WGN Radio), Chris Hine (Chicago Tribune) and Seth Gruen (Bleacher Report) join Mark Schanowski on the panel. Chris Sale is back. So do the White Sox miss their old ace? Meanwhile, Jake Arrieta’s agent defends his client’s velocity drop. Does he have a point? Plus LeBron James talks about his legacy, Tiger Woods’ fall from grace continues and the panel remembers legendary sportswriter Frank Deford.

Yep, the Bandwagon lineup is taking a breather for much of the summer. But before we go: We muse on quantifying team chemistry with a scientist who's actually studying it, the work of sportswriter/commentator Frank Deford (who recently retired from NPR), and our pal Travis Tate comes in for the episode to talk about the NBA basketball playoffs and lots more.

1. FSU Baseball - where the hell is Drew Carlton 2. Frank Deford retires, tip of the cap 3. Jeff would (not) be able to shoot a turkey

Just because the world is experiencing the hottest weather since scientist became keeping track, #GlobalWarming must be a hoax I will miss Frank Deford and Ringling Brothers and Barnum and Bailey Circus 66 years old cannot be considered middle aged, unless you are expecting to live to 132.  One good thing about getting older is I am better at math. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Deford   #TheGoodNews- Another journal entry in an ongoing series of sometime comedic reflections of life as recorded by Jan Landy for Jan Landy on 05/03/2017 while driving in my car from where I am to where I am going or wherever I happen to be when inspiration hits me to record another podcast. These are my #thoughts that I am documenting for #myself so that if I ever find the time in the future to go back into the past to remember what I was thinking at the time, I will be able to listen to them.   This constantly changing #podcast usually short and to the point produced and recorded by #JanLandy presents @JanLandy's thoughts and ramblings at the time of the recording. Ever changing, #humorous, thought provoking, inspiring and sometimes informative. It is a mixture of #comedy, positive thoughts and, on rare occasions will offer #information on where #SoundBroker has been and where it is going. If you like to #laugh, stay #motivated and keep abreast of the latest adventures of Jan Landy and SoundBroker.com, this podcast is worth a listen. Links: Petition the WhiteHouse: https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/#signapetition Follow me on Social Media: http://www.janlandy.com Live Video Stream: https://livestream.com/JanLandy FaceBook: http://tinyurl.com/mfgxhk Google+: http://gplus.to/SoundBroker My PodCast: http://tinyurl.com/ktao52 Twitter: http://tinyurl.com/ld9bt7 Make a donation: http://bit.ly/2jgTzX9  

Steve and Don interview Chris Burke (00:05:10) from Sports Illustrated about the NFL Draft and Justin Barrasso (00:35:45) from Sports Illustrated talks about the WWE. Steve starts the show on his own, talks about "Over Time" by Frank Deford, and ends the show with one last thing about Paula and Colston's relationship.

  Phil Bolsta is the author of Through God’s Eyes: Finding Peace and Purpose in a Troubled World, a comprehensive guide to living a spiritual life www.GodsEyesBook.com Phil established himself as a credible source of spiritual insight and wisdom with the 2008 publication of Sixty Seconds: One Moment Changes Everything. Translated into four languages, Sixty Seconds is a collection of forty-five uplifting, life-changing stories from prominent spiritual authors and thought leaders he interviewed. The roster of storytellers includes Joan Borysenko, Deepak Chopra, geneticist Dr. Francis Collins, acclaimed sportswriter Frank Deford, Dr. Larry Dossey, Wayne Dyer, Dan Millman, Caroline Myss, Dr. Christiane Northrup, Dr. Dean Ornish, Dr. Rachel Naomi Remen, Dr. Bernie Siegel, James Van Praagh, singer Billy Vera, Doreen Virtue, Neale Donald Walsch, and bassist Victor Wooten www.SixtySecondsBook.com   ________________________ Awakenings With Michele Meiche is Your place for tips and insight to live a more fulfilling life, and your relationships. Learn how to attract healthy relationships, and how to create a life you really love. Awakenings broadcasts live every Wed. 12pm -1:30 pm PT   Call in for Intuitive Readings #347-539-5122 Michele answers questions about Awakening, Spirituality, Metaphysics and Self/Soul Development. Michele also answers listener questions from email, twitter and facebook On Air. Email awakeningspodcast@gmail.com to have your questions answered or to share your insights On Air.  

On the eighteenth episode of the sixth season of The Sports-Casters hosts Steve Bennett and Don Russ welcome Jason Concepcion (The Ringer, After The Thrones) and Steven Hyden UPROXX, Celebration Rock Podcast). Starting the show with 3Things, Steve and Don look back at the NHL Draft, talk about two huge trades to kick off NHL free agency, update the two huge soccer tournaments, and doubt the retirement of Lionel Messi. The book club says goodbye to Steve Hyden's, "Your Favorite Band is Killing Me" and focusses on the new Frank Deford book. The show ends with Don talking about Orange is the New Black, and Steve talks about Bill Simmons new show on HBO. -Jason Concepcion is making his first appearance (0:28:37) on the podcast. Jason talks about attending the Berklee College of Music, underrated guitar players, and finding talent in the subway. Jason also talks about Game of Thrones, appearing on the After the Thrones show on HBO, and clears up some of Steve's confusion about the show. Jason also talks about the NBA, isn't crazy about Buddy Hield being in New Orleans, and as a Knicks fan is ominous about their decision to acquire Derrick Rose. -Steven Hyden is making his fourth appearance (01:06:42) on the podcast. Hyden joins us to talk about his book "Your Favorite Band is Killing Me." Steve and Hyden skip over the Pearl Jam vs. Nirvana rivalry to instead focus on Cyndi Lauper vs. Madonna, Kanye West being a jerk, and the 1992 MTV Video Music Awards.

On the seventeenth episode of the sixth season of The Sports-Casters hosts Steve Bennett and Don Russ welcome Tas Melas (The Starters, NBATV) and Adrian Dater (Bleacher Report). Starting the show with 3Things, Steve and Don talk about the conclusion of the NHL and NBA seasons, LeBron James and Sindey Corsby's legacy, and the exciting soccer being played in the Copa America and European Championship. The book club covers the last few chapters of Steve Hyden's, "Your Favorite Band is Killing Me" and introduces a new book by the great Frank Deford. The show ends with Don talking about his daughter playing soccer and Steve talks about an embarrassing weekend for the USGA. -Tas Melas is making his eighth appearance (00:33:30) on the podcast. Melas stops by to help try and put the Cleveland Cavaliers championship into perspective. Tas talks about LeBron's legacy, the Warriors decision to go for 73, and explains how the series changed after game 4. Melas also explains what the loss means for Steph Curry, talks about some of his favorite picks at the NBA Draft, and looks ahead to the summer for The Starters. -Adrian Dater is making his fourth appearance (01:09:51) on the podcast. Adrian looks back at the Stanley Cup Final and talks about the Pittsburgh Penguins dominance, the play of Sidney Crosby, and the team's overall improvement since January. Dater also looks back on the 2016 playoffs, shakes his head at the St. Louis Blues, and comments on the rabid fan support the Penguins had. Dater also talks about expansion into Las Vegas, the NHL Awards, and speculates as to what might happen in Buffalo during the NHL Draft.

The Ringer's Bryan Curtis is joined by legendary Sports Illustrated writer Frank Deford to discuss the current sports scene, the coverage of Muhammad Ali's death, and his renowned NPR commentaries.

Jun 2nd - Slow News Day, Blind Drive Thrus, WRCR, Cars, Zika Virus, Ticks, Emily Paster, Howie Kahn, Sadie Robertson, Duck Dynasty, Frank Deford, Vicki Lawrence

Jun 2nd - Slow News Day, Blind Drive Thrus, WRCR, Cars, Zika Virus, Ticks, Emily Paster, Howie Kahn, Sadie Robertson, Duck Dynasty, Frank Deford, Vicki Lawrence

It's an Old School Howard Stern Show Tribute episode. Lots of talk about Cookie Puss, Larry Fine Marge Schott, the jetty, apologies, Ham Hands Bill and more. We put the explicit tag on just to be safe, so if you might be offended, we won't mind if you sit this one out. 1:20 - Richard Deitsch (@RichardDeitsch) from Sports Illustrated talk Stern Show and sports media including co-hosting Prime Time Sports in Toronto with Bob McCown (@fadoobobcat), PTS without Stephen Brunt, is John Shannon polarizing to listeners?, US vs Canada sports talk philosophies, calls vs no calls on sports talk. We also talk about his SI Media Podcast interview with Paul Heyman, his eras of wrestling fandom, wrestling journalism, Dave Meltzer (@davemeltzerWON), Frank Deford and the National, the death of Grantland, Blazer Con and love for the Men in Blazers (@meninblazers) and more. 36:12 - Leonard F Chikarason (@LFCHikarason) talks old school Stern, when he started listening, the Negligee and Underpants Party video tape, Jackie era vs Artie era and we list some of our favorite bits. Note: We ran long with Leonard, so the rest of his interview, talking comics, wrestling, Marvel Puzzle Quest and the Longbox Heroes (@Longboxheroes) podcast will be in the next episode, posting in a few days.

On The Gist, one question with Frank Deford.  Then, are the core issues of traditional social conservatism on the wane? Slate’s Reihan Salam explains why some Republicans may change their focus from gay marriage to the economy, and some won’t. Plus, is there any good mechanism for fighting drug cartels? We ask Vanda Felbab-Brown from the Brookings Institution what the escape of El Chapo tells us about U.S./Mexico relations. For the Spiel, Mike’s reaction to the uproar over Harper Lee’s Go Set a Watchman. Today’s sponsor: Stamps.com, where you can buy and print official U.S. postage right from your desk using your own computer and printer. Use the promo code THEGIST to get a no-risk trial and a $110 bonus offer. Join Slate Plus! Members get bonus segments, exclusive member-only podcasts, and more. Sign up for a free trial today at slate.com/gistplus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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In a recently unearthed and reconstructed interview, writer Frank Deford talks about his 2010 novel, Bliss, Remembered, Leni Riefenstahl, the various pleasures of writing, and the general state of sports.Listen to PN Unscripted on StitcherListen to PN Unscripted on iTunesPermalink for PN Unscripted - Frank DefordBliss, RememberedDeford's page at NPRDeford's page at Sports Illustrated

Today’s Gist is a special New Haven hotel room dispatch. Mike shares an excerpt from the New Haven ideas festival event “Thinking About Sports.” He was a panelist there alongside legendary sportswriter and NPR commentator Frank Deford, poet Elizabeth Alexander, and author Nicholas Dawidoff. Also in today’s show, we ask Dartmouth professor of pediatrics James D. Sargent about McDonald’s new happy meal branding, and how other countries limit marketing to young children. In today’s Spiel, some ideas about ideas festivals.  Get The Gist by email as soon as it’s available: slate.com/GistEmail Subscribe to the podcast in iTunes: itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/slate…id873667927?mt=2 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When you cover sports for more than fifty years, you see a lot of changes. It's that experience that's given Emmy award and Peabody award winning Frank Deford a perspective on sports that can be duplicated by none other. This one-one-one conversation with the Sports Illustrated writer, NPR commentator and HBO Real Sports with Bryant Gumble contributor is informational, entertaining and intriguing with stories about sports greats Arthur Ashe and Wilt Chamberlain as well as insight into the future of journalism and interestingly enough, the recent tattoo craze.

Legendary sports writer Frank Deford explains the best way to meet (and marry) a fashion model.

Larry Scott, Pac-12 Commissioner stops by to discuss the conference and its new TV network, changes to the postseason basketball tournament and potential changes to the college football postseason. Pullitzer Prize winning author Buzz Bissinger (Friday Night Lights) joins the show to discuss his new book "Father's Day" which focuses on his cross country trip with his special needs son Zach. Legendary sports writer Frank Deford discusses his new book "Overtime - My Life as a Sportswriter" and how the job of being a reporter has changed over the course of his career. read more

This week: Director Michael Apted on “56 Up” — the new installment of one of the greatest film series ever… Sportswriting legend Frank Deford tackles your etiquette questions… Guitar master Buddy Guy revisits his Louisiana roots… author Leigh Bardugo lists her favorite fictional worlds… A filmmaking duo plug in to the world of indie video games… and a sweet roll gets a savory twist on Manhattan’s High Line. Plus: We fear the food world’s revolutionary new robot, and spin a Bad Thing from Vermont rocker King Tuff.

Over Time is as unconventional and wide-ranging as Frank Deford's remarkable career. Fresh out of Princeton in 1962, Deford joined Sports Illustrated. They called him "the Kid," and he made his reputation with dumb luck, discovering fellow Princetonian Bill Bradley and a Canadian teenager named Bobby Orr. In this charming memoir, Deford traces the entire arc of American sports writing and gives us a tour of great American sports literature.A Baltimore native, Frank Deford has written 18 books, won a Peabody and an Emmy, and read more than 1,500 commentaries on NPR's Morning Edition. He is senior contributing writer at Sports Illustrated and is a regular correspondent on Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel on HBO. Among his many honors: he has been elected to the Hall of Fame of the National Association of Sportscasters and Sportswriters; has been voted U.S. Sportswriter of the Year six times; and was twice voted Magazine Writer of the Year by the Washington Journalism Review. Recorded On: Wednesday, May 9, 2012

In 2004 when she knows she's dying, Sydney Stringfellow finally reveals to her son what happened long ago during World War II. At the 1936 Olympics, Sydney had fallen in love with a handsome young German. After returning home, she married Jimmy, a kind young Marine who was shipped out to the Pacific theater. Horst, the German, showed up in America, a defector from the Nazis, creating a major dilemma that Sydney would face the rest of her life.Frank Deford is senior contributing writer for Sports Illustrated, commentator for National Public Radio, and correspondent for Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel on HBO. He is the author of 16 books, including the bestseller Alex: The Life of a Child. Deford is a member of the National Association of Sportscasters and Sportswriters Hall of Fame and a six-time winner of the Sportswriter of the Year Award. He has won a Peabody, an Emmy, and countless other awards. Frank Deford served as chairman of the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation for 16 years and remains chairman emeritus. Born in Baltimore, he now lives in Connecticut. Recorded On: Wednesday, August 18, 2010

Kris & David are joined by Al Getz (@AlGetzWrestling) & Beau James (@kingofkingsport) to discuss the week that was December 18-24, 1993. We talk about Jim Cornette's long letter to the Torch about Wade Keller’s coverage of the “race riot” at an SMW show in Wise, Virginia, but we also play some great clips from SMW, especially a Dick Murdoch promo that you can't miss. We also discuss Bobby Heenan coming to WCW, Jesse Ventura staying in WCW, and Davey Boy Smith leaving WCW, including how he was buried on TV to make way for the debut of the Big Bossman as “The Boss." We also talk about all of the news from Japan, Mexico, and Europe, including Otto Wanz running his big year-end show just days after the tragic in-ring death of Larry Cameron. We also have the WWF running some egregious 900 number polls, the debuts of Sparky Plugg & Double J, the return of Randy Savage to WWF Mania, Frank Deford writing to the Observer, and much more. Beau & Al also tell some amazing stories from their time in the business, to boot, and this show is AMAZING, so LISTEN NOW!!!! Timestamps: 0:00:00 SMW 1:43:52 WCW 3:02:48 Classic Commercial Break 3:07:29 Housekeeping/The Amazon Game 3:44:53 Int’l: Tokyo Sports & AJW awards, NJPW, Korakuen Hall Christmas week shows, CWA, AAA, CMLL, UWA, & Acapulco 4:42:54 Other USA: Joe Pedicino, ECW, USWL, AAWF, USWA, CWI, Big D, UWA, Eddie Sharkey, & CWUSA 5:36:15 WWF To support the show and get access to exclusive rewards like special members-only monthly themed shows, go to our Patreon page at Patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets ( http://patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets ) and become an ongoing Patron. Becoming a Between the Sheets Patron will also get you exclusive access to not only the monthly themed episode of Between the Sheets, but also access to our new mailbag segment, a Patron-only chat room on Slack, and anything else we do outside of the main shows! Shop at Amazon via our link ( https://www.amazon.com/?tag=betweenthesheets-20 ) (go here ( https://www.amazon.co.uk/?&_encoding=UTF8&tag=btsheets-21 ) for Amazon UK if you’re in Europe)— Nothing extra comes out of your pocket; for you, it’s the same experience you’d get going to Amazon the usual way. For the best in both current and classic indie wrestling streaming, make sure to check out IndependentWrestling.tv ( http://independentwrestling.tv/ ) and use coupon code BTSPOD for a free 20 day trial! (You can also go directly to TinyURL.com/IWTVsheets ( http://tinyurl.com/IWTVsheets ) to sign up that way.) To subscribe, you can find us on iTunes, Google Play, and just about every other podcast app's directory, or you can also paste Feeds.FeedBurner.com/BTSheets ( http://feeds.feedburner.com/BTSheets ) into your favorite podcast app using whatever “add feed manually” option it has. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/between-the-sheets/donations Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Kris & David are joined by Joe Gagne (@joegagne) to discuss the partial week that was January 25th - January 30th, 1995. We talk about the NATPE bTV syndication convention taking place in Las Vegas, which featured a live WCW Clash of the Champions at Caesars Palace capped off by Hulk Hogan & Vader having their first physical angle, plus all the other wrestling news involving NATPE and who had booths there. We also talk about the return of Big Bubba Rogers, the evolution of Brian Pillman, Japanese wrestling magazines fighting amongst themselves, a tragic death in New Japan, the birth of the Triple Threat in ECW, Eddie Gilbert's last TV appearance in SMW, the early hype for Bam Bam Bigelow vs. Lawrence Taylor at WrestleMania, the WWF flirting with shoot angles, and much more. Joe is always a great guest, and this was a blast, so check it out!!!!! Timestamps: 0:00:00 WCW 1:20:49 NATPE 1:37:32 Japan: AJPW, NJPW, Heisei Ishingun vs. WAR, IWA Japan, SPWF, W*ING, Pancrase, RINGS, & AJW 2:20:46 Classic Commercial Break 2:26:03 Housekeeping/The Amazon Game 2:52:14 Latin America: AAA, CMLL, UWA, & AWF 3:11:11 Other USA: USofA, ECW, WWWA, SMW, USWA, Circle City, CAPW, NWA Dallas/JCP, Lone Star, & PWA 4:42:30 WWF 5:39:37 Patreon Preview: Vince McMahon sends Basil DeVito after Dave Meltzer, Frank Deford, and The National Sports Daily To support the show and get access to exclusive rewards like special members-only monthly themed shows, go to our Patreon page at Patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets ( http://patreon.com/BetweenTheSheets ) and become an ongoing Patron. Becoming a Between the Sheets Patron will also get you exclusive access to not only the monthly themed episode of Between the Sheets, but also access to our new mailbag segment, a Patron-only chat room on Slack, and anything else we do outside of the main shows! Shop at Amazon via our link ( https://www.amazon.com/?tag=betweenthesheets-20 ) (go here ( https://www.amazon.co.uk/?_encoding=UTF8&tag=btsheets-21 ) for Amazon UK if you’re in Europe)— Nothing extra comes out of your pocket; for you, it’s the same experience you’d get going to Amazon the usual way. For the best in both current and classic indie wrestling streaming, make sure to check out IndependentWrestling.tv ( http://independentwrestling.tv/ ) and use coupon code BTSPOD for a free 5 day trial! (You can also go directly to TinyURL.com/IWTVsheets ( http://tinyurl.com/IWTVsheets ) to sign up that way.) If you convert to a paid subscriber, we get a kickback for referring you, allowing you to support both the show and the indie scene. To subscribe, you can find us on iTunes, Google Play, and just about every other podcast app's directory, or you can also paste Feeds.FeedBurner.com/BTSheets ( http://feeds.feedburner.com/BTSheets ) into your favorite podcast app using whatever “add feed manually” option it has. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/between-the-sheets/donations Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands