Podcasts about chicago shakespeare

Joe Chvala (Artistic Director/Flying Foot Forum) is the founder and artistic director of the highly-acclaimed percussive dance company, the Flying Foot Forum. In addition to the Flying Foot Forum, Chvala has directed, choreographed, and been commissioned to create new works for a variety of theater and dance companies including the Guthrie Theater, the Walker Art Center, the Ordway Music Theater, the Minnesota Opera, Chicago Shakespeare, Children's Theater Company, Arkansas  Repertory, Theater Mu, Heart of the Beast Puppet and Mask Theatre, the History Theater, The Alpine Theater Project, Park Square Theatre, and The Boston Conservatory.  He has been the recipient of both Ivey and Sage awards for theater and dance as well as numerous “Best of the Year” honors from various US newspapers and periodicals and numerous choreographic and interdisciplinary awards, fellowships, and grants from such organizations as the National Endowment for the Arts, the Minnesota State Arts Board, and the McKnight Foundation. His recent film work as a director/writer has been featured in a number of European and American film festivals.Description of WorkFootfall—Choreographed by Joe Chvala, “Footfall” features a mixture of Flying Foot Forum's signature hybrid percussive dances with traditional clogging, folk music and dance to celebrate the passing of time, the ephemeral quality of life and the joys, struggles, strengths, longings, passions, and melancholy that are a part of it all. This piece will appear in its entirety in our upcoming concert May 8-18 at Park Square Theater. NOTE: The a cappella clogging duet “One Hundred Dead Dollars” was choreographed by founding company member, Clayton Schanilec.

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek catches up with the multi-talented filmmaker and musician Haroula Rose. Her new movie, ALL HAPPY FAMILIES, opened in theaters this weekend. Gary sits down with Chicago Shakespeare Theatre artistic director Edward Hall to talk about his new interpretation of HENRY V. Later in the show, theater critic Kelly Kleiman joins Gary to review Drury Lane's new production of THE AUDIENCE. And Gary highlights the work of a local non-profit theater company that's been presenting Gilbert and Sullivan operettas for the past 60 years.

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek catches up with acclaimed theater artist Terry Guest to talk about his upcoming project, an adapted children's book that deals with the impact on families with an incarcerated parent. Guest won a Joyce Award this week for adapting MILO IMAGINES THE WORLD. The Dueling Critics, Kelly Kleiman and Jonathan Abarbanel, join Gary to review Chicago Shakespeare's much anticipated musical version of Lord of the Rings. And Gary revisits his interview with Lyric Opera's outgoing general director, who is retiring after 30 years in the arts.

First of all, check out Cory's website at www.corygoodrich.com.   We discuss the visual art of Cory Goodrich on this podcast, and how her discovery of "a family secret" led her to creating art as a means of expressing her inner feelings.  Born in Wilmington, Delaware and raised in Clarkston, Michigan, Cory Goodrich is a Jeff Award winning actress for her roles as Mother in Drury Lane Oakbrook's acclaimed production of Ragtime, and as June Carter Cash in the Jeff nominated Johnny Cash revue, Ring of Fire at Mercury Theater Chicago, where she was also seen as Alice in The Addams Family, and Alma in The Christmas Schooner, and Carol Brady in the hilarious war between the Partridges and the Brady's in The Bardy Bunch.  Most recently, Cory has been seen at Drury Lane as the onstage accordion player in Evita, and at the newly renovated Studebaker Theatre in the premiere of Skates, a New Musical, starring American Idol's Diana DeGarmo and Ace Young. A five-time Jeff nominee, Cory has performed in productions at the Marriott Theatre in Lincolnshire, Chicago Shakespeare, Theatre at the Center, Ravinia, Candlelight and Drury Lane. A Graduate of Michigan State University, she is also a singer/songwriter, producer, writer, and mother of two, children's composer with her two award winning CDs, Hush and Wiggly Toes, and three solo folk albums: W.O.M.A.N, Wildwood Flower,  a collection of traditional and original folk songs featuring the autoharp, and her latest project, Long Way Around,  produced by Ethan Deppe of The Quiet Regret. She is co-producer of six Season of Carols CDs (Season of Carols, Holiday Music to Benefit Season of Concern, which garnered over $200K for the charity.) and The Second City Divas, Live at Mercury Theater CD with Eugene Dizon. Her memoir, Folksong: A Ballad of Death, Discovery, and DNA is available on Amazon.Support the Show.We are always grateful to have you listening to STRUNG OUT. Here are some important links:SUPPORT THE SHOW:https://www.buymeacoffee.com/MartyfineaKMARTIN'S WEBSITE:http://www.MARTINMcCORMACK.COM (note---you can get my weekly bulletin when you sign up on the list!)MARTIN'S MUSIC: Music | Martin Laurence McCormack (bandcamp.com)Martin McCormack | SpotifyMARTIN'S YOUTUBE CHANNELMartin McCormack - YouTubeFACEBOOKFacebook...

First of all, check out Cory's website at www.corygoodrich.com.Born in Wilmington, Delaware and raised in Clarkston, Michigan, Cory Goodrich is a Jeff Award winning actress for her roles as Mother in Drury Lane Oakbrook's acclaimed production of Ragtime, and as June Carter Cash in the Jeff nominated Johnny Cash revue, Ring of Fire at Mercury Theater Chicago, where she was also seen as Alice in The Addams Family, and Alma in The Christmas Schooner, and Carol Brady in the hilarious war between the Partridges and the Bradys in The Bardy Bunch.  Most recently, Cory has been seen at Drury Lane as the onstage accordion player in Evita, and at the newly renovated Studebaker Theatre in the premiere of Skates, a New Musical, starring American Idol's Diana DeGarmo and Ace Young. A five-time Jeff nominee, Cory has performed in productions at the Marriott Theatre in Lincolnshire, Chicago Shakespeare, Theatre at the Center, Ravinia, Candlelight and Drury Lane. A Graduate of Michigan State University, she is also a singer/songwriter, producer, writer, and mother of two, children's composer with her two award winning CDs, Hush and Wiggly Toes, and three solo folk albums: W.O.M.A.N, Wildwood Flower,  a collection of traditional and original folk songs featuring the autoharp, and her latest project, Long Way Around,  produced by Ethan Deppe of The Quiet Regret. She is co-producer of six Season of Carols CDs (Season of Carols, Holiday Music to Benefit Season of Concern, which garnered over $200K for the charity.) and The Second City Divas, Live at Mercury Theater CD with Eugene Dizon. Her memoir, Folksong: A Ballad of Death, Discovery, and DNA is available on Amazon.Support the Show.We are always grateful to have you listening to STRUNG OUT. Here are some important links:SUPPORT THE SHOW:https://www.buymeacoffee.com/MartyfineaKMARTIN'S WEBSITE:http://www.MARTINMcCORMACK.COM (note---you can get my weekly bulletin when you sign up on the list!)MARTIN'S MUSIC: Music | Martin Laurence McCormack (bandcamp.com)Martin McCormack | SpotifyMARTIN'S YOUTUBE CHANNELMartin McCormack - YouTubeFACEBOOKFacebook...

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek catches up with Chicago Shakespeare Theater's new artistic director Edward Hall. He's taken the creative reigns after the company's founder Barbara Gaines stepped down last year. Gary checks in with local jazz musician Shawn Maxwell to talk about his new Joliet-inspired album. Later in the show, the Dueling Critics, Kerry Reid and Jonathan Abarbanel, review a new interpretation of Shakespeare's RICHARD III. And Gary previews a new contemporary art exhibit at the Driehaus Museum that was inspired by Greek mythology.

In this episode we will discuss if its better to lean into something you are passionate about or what you are good at with James Earl Jones II. We talk about his career and what led him going into his career...................................................James Earl Jones II (Harry) National tour: 1st Nat'l Come from Away, 1st Nat'l Gershwin's Porgy & Bess. Regional: Porchlight Music, Goodman, Marriott, Court, Chicago Shakespeare, Writers, Lookingglass, Lyric Opera Chicago, SF Opera, Chicago Symphony Orchestra, Ravinia. TV/film credits: Maybe I do, Pokerhouse, Chicago Med, Chicago Fire, Sherman's Showcase, 4400 & South Side. Thanks to friends, family, Stewart Talent, Tara Rubin Casting and the Company Team. Mom, Dad, J…always........................................Other topics in this episode is about Keke Palmer backlash, Diddy terrorizing folks-(allegedly) who is shocked, Thanksgiving tips to decrease anxiety while cooking or preparing for the big day, and don't forget to get tickets to Company coming November 28-December 10th at the Kimmel Cultural Campus......................................Follow me on the blog as well as on social media as ToitimeblogHoliday and stress helpHoliday GuideThanksgiving Podcast includes therapy session

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek catches up with a Chicagoan working to improve accessibility to the arts. Charlotte Gruman is also one of ten new 3Arts Award recipients. Theater critic Kerry Reid joins Gary to review Chicago Shakespeare's new production of TWELFTH NIGHT. Later, we'll hear about a local big band that's taking things to new levels. And Gary talks to Chicago-based author Emma Noyes about the inspiration for her very personal new novel, GUY'S GIRL.

Today on What's My Frame I'm joined by award-winning composer and sound designer Lindsay Jones. Lindsay's resume is extensive spanning mediums, genres and decades. He not only is a Tony nominee, a respected professor but an extremely passionate advocate for the arts and safe working conditions. Lindsay's Broadway credits include Slave Play, The Nap, Bronx Bombers and A Time To Kill; and a nomination for a Tony for Best Score and Best Sound Design of a Play. His off-Broadway work has been heard at Playwrights Horizons, The Public Theater, MCC, Primary Stages, and many others. International credits include works at Royal Shakespeare Festival (UK), Stratford Festival (Canada), and many others. Lindsay has created music and sound for over 500 productions in regional theatres across the US. Awards include seven Joseph Jefferson Awards and twenty-four nominations, 2 ASCAP Plus Awards, two Ovation Awards and three nominations, a Los Angeles Drama Critics Circle Award, a San Diego Theatre Critics Circle Award and two nominations, as well as multiple nominations for Drama Desk Awards, Helen Hayes Awards, Barrymore Awards, and many others. In film/television, he has created original score for over 35 projects, including HBO Films' A Note Of Triumph: The Golden Age of Norman Corwin, which won the 2006 Academy Award for Best Documentary, Short Subject. His work encompasses features like The View From Tall, Ash, and The Brass Teapot; TV shows such as Sony Pictures' series Family Practice for Lifetime Television, shorts such as The Follower, House Of Stairs, and Grace; and full-length documentaries such as Hearing Voices and Cleveland. In podcasts, Lindsay is the in-house composer/sound designer for the weekly podcast The Imagine Neighborhood, produced by the Committee For Children, and for the ongoing Play On series for Next Chapter Podcasts. Other podcast and audio drama work includes A Streetcar Named Desire (starring Audra McDonald) for Audible, Team Up (starring Susan Sarandon and Timothy Busfield) for Marvel, Wormwood (featuring Kevin Kline) for Real Jetpacks Productions, Hamlet for KPBS/The Old Globe, Soundstage for Playwrights Horizons, Twelfth Night and Measure For Measure for Chicago Shakespeare, and The Intersect for Micromass. In education and advocacy Lindsay is an adjunct professor of sound design at University of North Carolina School Of The Arts. Other universities where he's taught include Yale, Juilliard, Northwestern, Purdue, Depaul, NYU, UCLA, UCSD, UC Irvine, Rutgers, University of Illinois, and Chapman. He is a founding member and the co-chair of the executive board of Theatrical Sound Designers and Composers Association (TSDCA), and co-founded The Collaborator Party with John Gromada. He is also a founding member of NO MORE 10 Out Of 12's, an advocacy group dedicated to safe working environments in theatre. Now let's get to the conversation!! To learn more about Lindsay's work visit his site, here To get plugged in with TSDCA --- Hosted by Laura Linda Bradley Join the WMF creative community now! Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠@whatsmyframe⁠⁠⁠ TikTok: ⁠⁠⁠@whatsmyframe⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠IMDb⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠What's My Frame? official site ⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠Join our monthly newsletter!⁠⁠⁠ What's My Frame? merch⁠⁠⁠⁠ Proceeds will be donated to the SAG-AFTRA Foundation to support actors affected by the strikes. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/whats-my-frame/support

Mayor Brandon Johnson and his allies in City Council want to put the Bring Chicago Home ordinance on the March 2024 ballot. The measure would increase Chicago's real estate transfer tax, a one-time tax paid when a property is sold, on properties over $1 million to fund efforts to fight homelessness. Lead producer Simone Alicea and host Jacoby Cochran break down the yearslong push to get Bring Chicago Home passed. Plus, we hear your tips and tricks for airport pickup and we've got thoughts on Chicago's hip-hop GOAT.  Some news: This is the last week to enjoy Chicago Shakespeare in the Park! Want some more City Cast Chicago news? Then make sure to sign up for our Hey Chicago newsletter.  Follow us @citycastchicago You can also text us or leave a voicemail at: 773 780-0246 Interested in advertising with City Cast? Find more info HERE  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek talks to two of the artists behind a new jazz album that takes a new approach to some David Bowie's songs. Vocalist Paul Marinaro and Metropolitan Jazz Octet saxophonist John Kornegay join Gary in-studio to talk about the new project. The Dueling Critics, Kerry Reid and Jonathan Abarbanel, stop by to review Chicago Shakespeare's latest production, a new adaptation of WUTHERING HEIGHTS. Later in the show, Gary catches up with New York Times Bestselling author Grady Hendrix to talk about his new book, HOW TO SELL A HAUNTED HOUSE.

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek talks to one of the authors of a new book that looks back at HBO's 50-year history and the cable channel's impact on pop culture. The Dueling Critics, Kerry Reid and Jonathan Abarbanel, stop by to talk about Chicago Shakespeare's new verison of MEASURE FOR MEASURE. Later in the show, Gary catches up with the playwright behind a world premiere play that shines a light on the creation of the iconic Batman character. And Gary checks in with the executive director of 3Arts to talk about the organization's ongoing efforts to help underrepresented artists.

Jon Beal (he/him) has been acting, performing and fight directing in Chicago for over 10 years. Acting credits include Victory Gardens, Chicago Shakespeare, Trap Door, The House Theatre, The Hypocrites, Strawdog Theatre, and Raven Theater. Jon is also an artist associate at The Lyric Opera of Chicago, where he has appeared in over 20 productions. Fight and blood credits include Cardboard Piano at TimeLine Theatre (Equity Jeff Award), Theatre Wit, Paramount, Black Button Eyes, The Hypocrites, BoHo Theater, Silk Road Rising, Goodman, Victory Gardens, Steep Theatre, Muse of Fire, and Jackalope. For more, visit jonbeal.com.

On this edition of The Arts Section, host Gary Zidek takes a closer at the Joyce Foundation, the Chicago-based organization just handed out 5 awards to support artists of color in the Great Lakes region. He'll catc-hup with one of the winners, a Chicago-based playwright who is partnering with the National Museum of Mexican Art on a new project. The Dueling Critics, Kerry Reid and Jonathan Abarbanel, will join me to review Chicago Shakespeare's premiere IT CAME FROM OUTER SPACE. Later, Gary talks to the curator behind a new immersive experience that pays homage to the Lourve. And we'll hear about an exhibition at the Elmhurst Art Museum that highlight's nature's influence on contemporary design.

Intro: Final Draft is conspiring against us, Beastie Boys' Adam Horowitz, Doris the dog loves the vet, Jim Croce, The Cure. Let Me Run This By You: storytelling, Risk Podcast, The MothInterview: We talk to the creator and producer of You're Being Ridiculous, Jeremy Owens, about offending people, porn, Samantha Irby, Roosevelt University, University of Arkansas, The URTAs, King Lear, Greg Vinkler, Barbara Gaines, Plautus' The Rope, P.F. Changs, Kyogen, Threepenny Opera, Steppenwolf, Brene Brown, Marianne Williamson.FULL TRANSCRIPT (unedited): 2 (10s):And I'm Gina Pulice.1 (11s):We went to theater school together. We survived it, but we didn't quite understand.3 (15s):At 20 years later, we're digging deep talking to our guests about their experiences and trying to make sense of it all.1 (21s):We survived theater school and you will too. Are we famous yet?2 (34s):Yeah.1 (35s):It was one of these things where it's like, final draft will not let you restart your computer. I'm like, fuck you. Final draft. What did you ever do for me? Final draft writer, duet. They're all, they're all plotting against me,2 (47s):But what is, what is, what does final draft have to do with your camera working on this?1 (53s):So in order to, to be okay, the bottom line is I need a new computer. Okay. Let's start there second. Okay. That's the first level of problems. It's like the deepest level. And then we, if we go up a little bit into the level of problems, it is that final draft that I might camera in order to use my camera. Sometimes I have to restart my computer because it's so old. Right. So I need to restart,2 (1m 19s):You know, I want to do any one thing in the morning I got, are really rev my engine.1 (1m 26s):So like, I'm like, okay, well, in order to restart the computer, it's like not letting me restart it because final draft is this because probably final draft is so advanced and my computer is so Jack.2 (1m 39s):Totally. And that's how they get you mad. I feel like they all conspired to be like, okay, well let's make it. So this will work on this version. So then,1 (1m 49s):So anyway, I see you, you look great. I look like shit. So it's probably better my camera's up.2 (1m 57s):So a couple of things I keep forgetting to ask you on here, about how, how did it come to be that you were chatting in the parking lot with Adam Horowitz about your dogs, Volvo.1 (2m 12s):We never talked about that.2 (2m 14s):We did not.1 (2m 15s):Okay. So I rule up, so my dog, Doris, who everyone knows that listens to the podcast and by everyone, I mean, whoever listens to the podcast, you know what I mean? So hopefully it's growing and growing, listen and rate the podcast. Anyway, the point is I roll up to the vet, which I do oh about every other week, because my dog is a very high maintenance. And so she's just so she of course had an ear infection. Cause she has these huge ears that collect all this bacteria. So I roll up and there's an eye and because it's COVID and everything, you have to park outside and wait, but because it's LA all the windows are down and everyone's car and there's this dude sitting in his Kia has electric Kia.1 (2m 59s):Well,2 (2m 59s):My key.1 (3m 0s):Yeah, I know. I know. I did not recognize this human being. He looked like my husband, like fifties gray, maybe had glasses on.2 (3m 13s):Why would you like all our knowledge of them is when they were so, so young. Right,1 (3m 18s):Right. So young. And I like didn't, you know, keep up with the beast. So it was like, I had other things to do, you know? So I was doing other things. So I'm, I'm like trying to corral Doris out of the car. She's crazy. She's trying to get out. She loves the vet. The backdrop is my dog2 (3m 35s):Loves the,1 (3m 36s):Oh my God. She races towards the vet with a fury that is unmatched, loves it. I2 (3m 43s):Never once heard of this in my entire life. So1 (3m 45s):She's really, really excited about the bet. So she's an extra crazy. And I get her out of the carrier to let her sniff around in the parking lot. And I see this gentleman who is the interesting thing about him is that his leg is out the window. Like he's like resting his leg. And I'm like, well, that's kind of weird for like an older dude, but whatever, it's, it's LA like, you know2 (4m 8s):That sound's going to say, I imagine that kind of thing happens in LA.1 (4m 11s):Yeah. And plus he's probably weighed been waiting and waiting for his dog forever. And so, cause you, you have to wait out there, like they don't want you to leave in case they need you and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay, fine. So I, and I say, and he says, oh, a cute dog. And I'm like, oh, she's a pain in the ass. And then he's like, what's her name? And I'm like, oh, her name is Doris. And he's like, oh, that was my mom's name. And I was like, oh, that's interesting. And then we talked about the origin of Doris, cause it's from a Jim Croce song. And Jim Croce is someone, my husband adores the singer. The folks there yeah. Died when he was 29. Looked like he was about 60. When he died.2 (4m 47s):He was 29.1 (4m 49s):Yes. You know, he looks like David Abbott, Holly, if you ever look at me2 (4m 56s):Like a hole, I see it.1 (4m 59s):But just bringing it back to the old theater school. So, so yeah. And so he's like, we talked about Jim Croce and he's like, Jim Croce is the first person I remember dying. I had that album. And I said, yeah. And he said, that's in a Jim Croce song. And I said, yes, Leroy brown, Friday about a week ago, Leroy shooting dice. And at the end of the bar sat a girl named Doris and who that girl looked nice. And that's why we named Doris Doris. He was like, I don't remember Doris being in that song. So we get into that. Right. Okay. And then he's like, I'm like, oh, is your dog okay? And he's like, well, she, she, she got a cut on her neck and I'm like, oh shit. And I'm like, is that2 (5m 38s):A knife fight in a bar?1 (5m 39s):I was like, how did that happen? And he goes, I don't know. But like, you know, since I'm not a doctor, I figured I'd take, bring her to the vet. I'm like good plan, my friend, good plan. So he's like, I'm waiting for him and waiting for her. And I'm like, oh, okay. And then he said, what's wrong with your dog? And I said, oh my God, what? Isn't wrong with my dog? And I said, my dog has a dermatitis of the vulva and an ear infection. And he's like, wait, what? And I'm like, yes, she just she's out. She's got a lot of allergies because she's a friend. She and I did this to myself by getting a friendship. But like, yeah, she's got, and he said that his dog was really licking her butthole and he had dermatitis of the bottle. And I was like, it's the same I heard of my friend, Morgan has a Frenchie who has dermatitis of the butthole because all Frenchie owners talk about these things.1 (6m 26s):And he's like, oh, well, my dog has dermatitis of the bottle. I'm like, well, mine's got dermatitis of the Volvo. They both have, they both have like private parts itching. Right. And so then we started talking and we talked about a lot of things. Cause you have to wait forever. And then right. And so we talk and talk and talk and no clue who this person is. And he's like,2 (6m 47s):Did you say cut? There's something about that voice?1 (6m 52s):No.2 (6m 52s):No. Okay.1 (6m 54s):'cause he was kinda mumbly and also just looked so natural.2 (6m 60s):Aiming, sabotage.1 (7m 1s):No, not screaming and also not jumping around with his other two cohort. And then I just, I felt like, anyway, it just didn't cross my mind. And his shoelaces were untied. I don't know. It was like a real casual situation.2 (7m 15s):Yeah. Honestly, I would never assume somebody in a key is famous. That's my snobbery, but I wouldn't.1 (7m 21s):Yeah. I mean, I, it was a very, very, very nice camp, but it still, it was a key I said to you like, oh, that was her talking about cars. I mean, we talked about kids, cars, Manhattan. Then he said, I'm from it. I said, oh, I'm from Chicago. And he said, I'm from Manhattan. And I said, oh, I said, oh my God. I launched into this thing about how I could never live in New York because I was like to own like the most unhip like fat and ugly human and like, not in a bad way, but just like, kind of like I'm. So I just feel like, I didn't know what the fuck was going on ever in New York. Like, I didn't know which way to go, who to talk to, where to turn I was lost. And he's like, yeah. Do you know what I like about LA is like, nothing ever happens here.1 (8m 2s):That's not2 (8m 2s):True.1 (8m 3s):No. But I was like, what do you mean? He's like, I need to just like New York, like you have like a million things are always happening at any given time. Right?2 (8m 11s):Sure. It's a lot too. Like you have to do a lot of processing living in New York, you're taking your, you know, you're just taking in so much information1 (8m 19s):And that does not happen in LA and LA you're like sometimes starved for like,2 (8m 25s):Right.1 (8m 26s):But we talked about that. And then, and then by like end of conversation almost. I was like, oh, I'm Jen. I'm so sorry. And he was like, oh, I'm Adam. And I was like, okay, still, no, I had no2 (8m 40s):Adam common name,1 (8m 41s):Common name, whatever. And mom named Doris, whatever. Like, okay. And then we started talking, he said, his wife, what did he say? Oh, he bought a house in south custody. Anyway, all this stuff. He has a kid. And at the end I say, he was talking about what we, what we do. And I'm like, oh, I'm a, I'm a writer. And I'm like trying to write TV, but I also consult, I just started this business, but I wasn't, you know, I was a therapist and for felons and like, and then he got really into that. And then I said, oh, what are you doing? And he's like, oh, I was, I think he said I was in the I'm in the music business. I said, oh, that's cool. I thought he was like a producer, like maybe a classical composer or something. I don't know. That's where my mind went. And I'm like, oh, like, what do you do?1 (9m 22s):And then he said, I was in and I said, oh, what kind of music? He's like, I was in a rap trio. And I was like, wait a minute, a rap tree endorsed by this. By this time it was like, biting me. You know, it's like a whole, I'm like, oh, a rap trio. And I couldn't the only rap trio I could think of was run DMC. And I'm like, oh, he's not in that. You know, he's a white dude. There's no way. And I'm like, oh crap trio. And I was like, house of pain, Cypress hill. Like I couldn't get it together. And then I was like, and then it dawned on me. And I said, oh, and he said something, like I said, I don't remember how it came up. And he's like, oh, I'm Adam Horwitz. And I was like, oh, I was like, of course.1 (10m 2s):I said, oh my God. And then I didn't know what to say. So I just said, cause he just moved. He actually, he moved to south Pasadena, wait before I moved to Pasadena. But I said welcome to Pasadena.2 (10m 16s):Right. Because the minute, you know, it's a celebrity. It's like, it changes the ions. Wait. Yes.1 (10m 21s):Thank you. You welcome to you too.2 (10m 24s):So what I think is so interesting and must be so well, I don't know. I don't know if it's annoying or whatever it is, celebrities. You, they must have to always be in a process of deciding with when they're interacting with people, they don't know what are we going to do with this fact, like, do you know who I am? Do you not know who I am? If you know who I am, just, what does that mean? Is that why you're talking to me? And then, but he opened one of the first things you said that he said was that his mom's name was, I mean, I guess that's not unusual, but I was thinking to myself when you said that I was thinking, oh, was he hoping That would confirm not that his dad is famous.2 (11m 10s):His dad is1 (11m 10s):Trail horo. Israel.2 (11m 12s):Yeah. He's a kind of a terrible guy though.1 (11m 16s):I heard is there. I think they're both dead. I mean, from what I got, I don't know. I know he has a sister. I don't know. But like he seemed like the kind, yes, you're right. Like it must be so weird. And also I literally was so into my own world. It's like, so Los Angeles, like I, when I found out that he was, I was super excited because I wanted to say, oh, I saw you at the Metro in Chicago and stuff like that. But then I was like, oh, I can't. And so I got excited, but I also, it was literally like talking to your husband or my husband in that they're old people. Like I wanted to be more excited about the, the youthful version.2 (11m 56s):Right? You want it to be 19 year old, you eating Israel, horrible1 (12m 2s):Adam Harz and being like, let's go on a date or something. But that is not what I, that was not my inclination this time. And also his he's married to this amazing punk hero, Kathleen Hanna from bikini kill who I adore. And I know that, but I didn't bring that up either. But anyway, the point is we exchanged information because we were like, let's walk our dogs. His dog is Terry. It really hairy dog, little girl, dog named Terry. And I said, well, what kind of dog is Terry? And he goes, I don't know, very hairy. And I was like, okay, well, okay. So we may go on a dog-walking adventure. I have no idea, but lovely human, but just like soup. We are super middle age.1 (12m 43s):This is what the moral of this thing was actually not the celebrity. Part of it was the, what hit me the most Gina was the middle age in this of it all. So the other thing is like, nobody gives a shit now about the things that we give a shit about. So the BC boys, I was talking to my niece, she didn't know who that was. And so I was like, oh right. Meaning I still care who they are, but2 (13m 16s):Right. Yeah.1 (13m 17s):Time moves on timeframe.2 (13m 20s):Yeah. Periodically we have kids periodically, they'll come up to you and they'll be like, have you ever heard of this bay? Or like, my son was listening to something and I'm like, and I go, he goes, oh, I've got to play this song for you. It's this band. This is like obscure band or something like that. It was the cure. I go, are you kidding me, dude? I put white face makeup on and wore black and tried to hang my two years in junior high. I knew the cure is okay. So that was one thing. And the other thing was last time.1 (13m 52s):It super nice though. I got to say, if anybody cares, he was not a Dick head.2 (13m 56s):I care. Yeah. That's nice. I'm happy to hear that. But just one last thing about that whole, like being a celebrity, you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't, because on the one hand you, you could have somebody say, oh, it's like pretentious to not say who you are. And on the other hand, people would say, you know, you can't win. You can't, you1 (14m 14s):Can't win. That is the bottom line. Yeah. Yeah.2 (14m 17s):So the other thing was last time we talked, you said, oh, I want to save it for the podcast, but about showcase. So you were talking about getting your kids ready for showcase.1 (14m 28s):Okay. So here's the deal with that. So I, because of this podcast, I'm like, okay, is there a way to make a showcase? Not the shit show that I feel it was now, there may not be, it might be inherent in the thing. Okay. But so I'm teaching fourth year. I like, basically don't even, I don't know what I'm teaching at this point, but not even teaching anymore. I'm done. And my, my, my, my co-teacher took over, but I started noticing as I always do that, that, that the students are like, you know, crazy nervous about the showcase and also crazy nervous about agents and managers and all the things.1 (15m 9s):Now, there is no showcase in LA. There was only a quote meet and greet. There is no showcase in New York. There was only quote, a meet and greet. Look, it gets weirder in Chicago. There was a live showcase and a meet and greet. Now, I don't know what went down, but the bottom line is the ball has been dropped so many times about this showcase and about graduation and about launching that at this point, the ball is just dead in a heap deflated. Okay. So I said, okay, well, what can I do to make this fucking situation better? Because I know what it's like to be there and be like, oh my God, I'm falling behind. What if so then I'm like, okay, everybody, here's what we're going to do.1 (15m 52s):I am going to email everyone I know in LA and everywhere and say, come to this showcase and watch your digital link. They have a virtual showcase. But the problem with that is nobody. If nobody gets sees it, it doesn't matter. And so it was made in a form beans where it looked like spam. So it went to everybody's spam. So no casting directors and no agents got the fucking link. And I realized that because I told a student of mine, I said, listen, you want to be repped by this one agency, let's create a letter to them. Let's pitch them. And so then I get a call from the agent saying, we loved this letter.1 (16m 33s):Also, thank you for including, we didn't think there was a showcase.4 (16m 37s):Oh my gosh.1 (16m 39s):And I said, what's,2 (16m 41s):This has to do with just the fact that like, there's been all this administrative,1 (16m 45s):I think it's, COVID meets the problem with conservatories, which is that they do not think that launching their students is an important part part of their job. Right? Right. So it falls to nobody. And so the person in charge bless her heart is one marketing person that knows nothing. I don't believe about acting or the entertainment industry at all. There is no Jane alderman. There, there is no, at least. So I stepped in to be like the proxy, Jane alderman with another adjunct. And we were like, okay, well, how do we do this? So I am happy to say that after literally making maybe 43 phone calls, everyone has the link.1 (17m 26s):People are coming to the showcases. Now my thing is to do the meet and greet in LA to try to get people there because these, these kiddos are coming to LA, there is no showcase. I'm like, well, we, what are we doing? Like we have to have something like, so, and I also just, you know, and I know these kids, like these are my students. So like, I want to meet them. And then, so now I'm getting everyone I know to come to the meet, greet in the business and2 (17m 51s):The money thing. Like, they're like, oh, well we have, we can do it online. And so we don't have to pay for, to rent the space for,1 (17m 59s):So they wouldn't even tell me, they wouldn't even tell me. They didn't even want to give me the invite to the LA thing. I had to like fight to get the, I don't understand what is going on. But I was like, listen, all right,2 (18m 11s):DePaul, I'm going to tell you something right now in DePaul. You want to be well-regarded you want to be number one. You want to always talk about your, your alum or even not your alum. People who, who went and got kicked out about their great successes. And you don't, but you don't want to do anything to get there. And that is not how it works, how it works is you put a lot of energy and I'm not saying at the expense of teachers or whatever, but you put a lot of energy and effort into not just hyping your students, but hyping your school.2 (18m 51s):Like it should be that your school is saying, have we got a crew for you? Yeah.1 (18m 56s):And which is what I then stepped in and had to do and be like, these kids are dope. Come see this, look at this link and then come to the thing. And so all the casting and agents in Chicago are now coming. Thank God, because guess who, there was one person RSVP2 (19m 14s):Girl, and you need a bonus1 (19m 16s):Stroke. Here's what we're doing. So then I said, okay, because I'm always thinking, I'm like, okay, well, here's what I'm doing. I'm developing a launching curriculum, which I think I told you about, like, I'm developing a day, one BFA for day one of the fourth year. Here's what we're going to do to launch you. And it's not just about the showcase. It's about mentorship. It's about how can we hook you up with somebody that's in what you want to do? How can we do that? And I'm going to pitch it. I'm going to say, here you pay me $120,000. And I will sell you this program and, and hook you up with teachers and people. I know that can step in and do this with me. Like you like people in the business, like people who are on different coasts, like duh, and then we will.1 (19m 58s):So, and if you don't want to buy it, DePaul theater school, we're selling it to Northwestern or NYU or any anyone.2 (20m 4s):Well, I was going to ask, do you know, if other conservatories are doing showcases and doing,1 (20m 9s):And they are, and they are doing it and they are, they are doing it. I, from what I can see, Gina, they're doing it better. I don't know if it's, you know, how good it is. But I do know that like other showcases released their digital showcase because of the pandemic on actors, accessing and town and casting networks, which DePaul did not do. Oh2 (20m 30s):My God.1 (20m 32s):So here's, so that is not okay with me because I went there and I, I do care about it because of this podcast. I also know that these kids having watched them at, you know, 21 year olds, 22 year olds, max, they're busting their ass, just like you. And I we're busting our ass. Like, look, they're busting their ass more than we were, but you and I busted her ass too. And I feel like we didn't get what we needed from the launch process. And what, what will happen is no one will people and people stopped going to theater school. Is that what you want? Or do you want to upgrade like level?1 (21m 13s):Let me run this by. There's a lot of people I hate.2 (21m 24s):Exactly, exactly. Okay. So the thing I wanted to run by you is about storytelling. I signed up for this workshop in my town. We have a little community theater and they sometimes have little workshops and I did improv there one time. And actually by the way, doing improv there, I I'm, I still am terrified of it. And I still don't feel like I'm I do well, but add it. But I reduced my fear somewhat by just aging within, and then we had a performance and my whole family came and yeah, it was, yeah.1 (22m 3s):Why don't we talk about what2 (22m 5s):She like two years ago or three years ago, actually. Yeah. Three or maybe even four years ago now. But anyway, on Sunday I went to, they ha they had a workshop led by a storyteller from the moth and she taught us, you know, how to, so there was only five of us there. One person, only one person absolutely knew when he came in. Exactly what story he wanted to tell. The rest of us were like, I have certain things that are coming to mind. Of course my thing. And I said, I was, I just owned it from the beginning was I've written essays. And I've, you know, written a lot about my life.2 (22m 46s):And yet I somehow feel like I don't have a story to tell. And she said, that's so common. She was telling this great story about somebody. Cause she does corporate stuff too. She was telling the story about somebody in a workshop, in a corporate workshop who just kept saying, I just, I don't have a story. I don't have a story. The day goes on. And he goes, well, I might have something, my family and I fled Vietnam right before this. And she goes, yeah, that's a story. That's a, that's a story you could tell. Anyway, point being, we're putting these stories together and we're going to perform them on Friday.2 (23m 34s):And the I'll say there is something about the process of working on it. That has been, it's not exactly healing, cause this is not a, for me at all. It's something I'm telling a story about when I lived in that apartment on Lil and Libby got me this job at the bakery and while we were, and she was very assiduous about being to work on time. And1 (24m 9s):I remember the, was it the red hen? Oh, we shouldn't say it out loud.2 (24m 12s):I actually, I really don't remember the name. I think it might have been called great Plains. I don't know. Okay. I don't think it's there anymore. And one of the things that was our task was to deal with the mice that inevitably came into the, in the flour sacks and stuff like that in the back. And, but I never she'd said to me, we have to deal with the mice, but I somehow, I hadn't really, really thought that through. And the way we were meant to deal with the mice was hit them over the head with a shovel.1 (24m 47s):Oh. So, so murder of the mice2 (24m 50s):Were into the mice. And so my story is about watching this five foot tall, gorgeous little, just, I mean, she looks like a bird, this girl, woman now, but she was a girl. Then I'm just swinging the shovel over her head and bringing it down. And then just very like with, with zero expression, taking paper towels and picking it up and throw it in the trash, washing her hands and making it back to the register in time for the next customer who came in. And my point of it, of the story is that's. That was one of my most important lessons about the difference between being poor and being broke because I was broke, you know, and always looking for jobs and always working through school.2 (25m 35s):But if it came to smashing a mouse over the head with a shovel, I'm just going to quit that job and go find another job, selling clothes at express. But Libby did not have such luxuries. She had to take the jobs that she could get. And she had to guard them with her life because as even, even with the amount of time she worked, there was a period of time where she would tell me, like, I'm going to bed hungry a lot of nights. And I couldn't help her, you know, because I was broke. I just, I didn't have we bought ramen. I mean, we right. Like six days a week.2 (26m 16s):And so it's about that. And so there's something about, but, but the fact that it's about this epoch in my life yeah. Which I haven't really written that much about, I've written about my childhood and I've written about things that are more contemporary, but you have a lot of experience with storytelling. And I'm curious to know what role that has played in sort of, you know, for one thing, the ability to string together, kind of the, of your life into a cohesive narrative. If, if1 (26m 47s):That's2 (26m 47s):Something that has been helpful or if maybe you have healed in some way, maybe from your one person show,1 (26m 53s):I am Gina. What comes to mind? Like what first came to mind when you were talking about your experience with this storytelling thing? Is it, what, what is the coolest thing to me about storytelling? Like this live lit as we like to call it in Chicago, just because I, storytelling people think it's like, we started calling it live live because people thought it was like, you know, Renaissance fair storytelling. Right. We had like a cheese ball, it's it doesn't matter. It's storytelling. So storytelling, bridges the gap for me. And maybe you have acting and writing. So it is both performance and writing, which I think is brilliant. I think acting is for the birds.1 (27m 35s):Like I just do. I think acting is really hard. I'm not very good at it. Not because I'm not a good person, but that's what I'm saying. I'm not very good at it because I don't like it as much as I like telling a story. That's my story. That also has a performance aspect to it. And it heals the acting thing for me. So you are acting, you are acting, you're not like you in your kitchen, just like when we do a podcast where there's a part of us, that's acting, it's not, you know, it just is what it is. So I think that that is extremely healing. And what, I wonder if it's extremely healing for you, because I feel like in terms of the acting thing, I know that post-graduation from an acting conservatory, you talk about just completely shutting down, completely not shutting down to the acting part of yourself.1 (28m 25s):And I think like through your son and then through this podcast and through writing television and now through storytelling and like your dip into improv, you're, you're healing, the actor part of yourself.2 (28m 37s):That's right. That's right. It1 (28m 38s):Wouldn't surprise me. If you went on to do acting like started acting in plays and stuff. Again,2 (28m 44s):I'm not going to lie. I'm really thinking about it at this point in time. I still feel like it's a bridge too far, just because I have nobody to spell me at home. You know, I can't ask my husband to leave his job so I can go to a play. But at some point, I mean, you know, they're not going to be this age forever. At some point I will be able to do that. And I do have designs on doing that actually.1 (29m 8s):Yeah. And I think, and I think you, I think this storytelling is brilliant because I think the cool thing about storytelling, as well as like you could go to New York city and do them off one night. It's not a, it's not a commitment like the play. In fact, you could do the risk thing that I did in New York. Like the rest of the podcast is live performances in New York. So all this to say that I think storytelling is a fantastic way to heal the part of ourselves that wants to be a performer, but definitely doesn't want, is not ready to take all the trappings and bullshit. That is a professional acting career, which is garbage. Like I got to say, like I just tell my students is to like the part of the business, which is why this is so fraught because it's garbage.1 (29m 55s):That's why you don't like it. But that doesn't mean it's not worth it to you. If you can find a way to make it worth it to you, the competition, the rejection, the then go for it. But what if that is bothersome? And like, you don't want to deal, like what about live lit? Like what about improv? What if there's so many other things? And so like, wouldn't it have been awesome. Gina. If someone had come to us fourth year and been like, Hey, you know what, maybe you get really nervous and that panic attacks when you have to audition. But what about like writing this thing and telling your story on, you know, on a stage somewhere where you get to hold the piece of paper2 (30m 34s):Today on the podcast, we are talking to Jeremy Owen. Jeremy is a storyteller and the creator of a storytelling show called George being ridiculous, which is premiering ask Stephanie, I think tomorrow or the next day, check it out. Please enjoy our conversation with Jeremy Owens. Wow. Congratulations. Jeremy Owens. You survive theater school. I want to hear this fabulous story. I missed the beat.1 (31m 11s):Yeah. So Gina, miss the beginning. So I was just basically saying that everyone's rusty and it's really good. We're talking about this because also Gina's performing storytelling this weekend and we were just talking about rusty. It was, everyone was after two years of not doing live lit stuff. And then Jeremy tells me that he did a show and of course we can, you don't have to use names and all that, but like did a show and it went south and by south, he's going to tell us what that means. It really went south. So7 (31m 41s):It really, when up it's like so complicated. Okay. So I was doing a fundraiser first off. I was like, I there's no way, like, who wants to watch me talk on zoom? Like we're doing that all the time. Like who even cares? How can this benefit anyone? But it's a fundraiser. My sister-in-law asked me amazing. I love it. Amen. Let's go. Let's do it. So we're doing it. And I, okay. I was not as cautious. And as careful as I should have been the show, I mean, you done the show, you did a show. I don't know if I can talk about your story, but you like got your tooth knocked out. That's1 (32m 22s):Oh, I believe me. I did. I gave a blow job and my back lower fell out. Yeah.7 (32m 28s):That's a story2 (32m 28s):Story. I7 (32m 31s):Share that story, but That's good. That's the, but that's like kind of the fuel it's like, you don't know what's going to happen. Some things are like, you know, super lovey Dubby. Sometimes somebody tells a story about a blow job and their tooth gets knocked out. It's like not a big deal. Like this is the world we live in. But I mean, if you're doing a corporate fundraiser for someone and I just, Alex, if you're listening, I love you. I just was not clued in. And that's my fault. That's not her fault. It's my fault. I accept responsibility for all those things. This is my disclaimer for my, for my sister-in-law. I accept all the responsibility for that. I just should have been more cautious.7 (33m 11s):Right. So if you're up for doing show or tea, fall out from low jobs, it's not that maybe not the best for like a board. Like those are the stories that people,1 (33m 20s):I7 (33m 20s):Didn't know1 (33m 21s):It is. If I'm on the fucking board, I'd probably not get,7 (33m 24s):I know, same for me. I mean, we went to theater school and I've decided like, as that has passed me by that we're not the same as like Bob down the street who is like wildly offended by anything, you know, sexual or1 (33m 42s):Anything2 (33m 42s):You ever get used to that, by the way, I, I I'm always like, oh really? We have to do this thing where I have to pretend like I'm talking to my grandma. Like you're a full grown adult standing in front of me. What's that?1 (33m 53s):What's your story about, please tell me something amazing. Gross, please.7 (33m 56s):I didn't even get to my story. That's the thing. Okay. So It wasn't even me. I wish it were me. It was like six or seven people. And I think we got like three or four in. And so as they're happening, I'm like, oh wow. That person said, fuck, oh no, this person's talking about porn. Oh, wow. Like things that like, just don't register for me. Right. Because I guess theater school. It's like, none of that registers for me. I'm not offended by anything other than like racist, white assholes.7 (34m 38s):Anything else? It doesn't register me. I don't. I know. I just don't care. I'm not bothered. So2 (34m 45s):Charity though. I mean,1 (34m 47s):It was like, there was it like the nuns of like a sister.7 (34m 50s):Oh, I don't want to say there. I don't want to say their name. I'll tell you1 (34m 54s):What Sater7 (34m 56s):Well, they're like1 (34m 58s):Healthcare, charity. He doesn't want7 (35m 1s):. Yes. I mean, it's a great charity. They do wonderful things. It's awesome. Right. But they weren't ready for1 (35m 12s):Me. So what happened? It just went blank.7 (35m 15s):Like we're just plopping along and I'm like so excited. Cause it's like July 20, 20. I have only been like talking to my dog and my husband. Right. So this is happening and I'm listening to stories. I'm having a great time. This is like amazing loving life porn who cares, you know, whatever. And then all of a sudden it stops working. Like I don't see anything. And I'm like, oh my God, this is my brother-in-law. I was like running the tech. I'm like, oh no,1 (35m 44s):He thought it was a tech thing. Of course.7 (35m 46s):I was like, well, this happened to me. I was taking this class online this weekend and the internet I had and I was like, oh shit. Like in the middle of class, I'm like, great. So now they think I'm an asshole. I just left class early. So I'm just like, this is dead. Right. Then they come, my sister-in-law calls me and tells me what's happening. And they're all furious. And they just, instead of like a conversation or something, or like this is coming or we're so disappointed, it was just like, this is over now. Like just totally dead. The bad part about that is that none of us knew. And there was no communication with me. Other if it hadn't been my sister-in-law, I don't know if I would, I would still be here on my computer.7 (36m 31s):Probably.1 (36m 32s):That's hilarious right there. Like, are you there yet?7 (36m 36s):Hello? Hi. Hi. They just didn't communicate at1 (36m 40s):All.2 (36m 43s):We're like, really? I'm getting irritated about this. Listen to the story is like, I don't know any of the players, but I feel like, I feel like we're the people we're pretending people are pretending that they don't watch porn or that they don't swear or, you know, like, why do I have to do this? Pretending I just love unless there was children in the audience and maybe there were,7 (37m 4s):I don't think so. Like, you know, it's like, I had like friends who1 (37m 8s):I curated it. Where you did you7 (37m 10s):Find, I mean, it's all, basically this entire thing is my fault. But like1 (37m 15s):You, you found everybody.7 (37m 17s):I found everybody, I got everybody. This was like a great in my mind was this is like a greatest hits. This is like, awesome.1 (37m 24s):It's the one time I'm so grateful. I was not asked to do anything. Like7 (37m 29s):It was just so weird. And there's like, I don't know it. Yeah, it was. But again,1 (37m 37s):I do the story for the ages. I love it. All of a sudden, it just goes blank.7 (37m 41s):I'm in the home. This is a story I'm going to, I just went blank. I didn't know what to do. Everything was gone. Just talking about those things. It doesn't, I don't find that if, when I say porn, I'm not like, this is the butthole. Like it wasn't like, you know what?2 (37m 59s):I7 (37m 59s):Watched porn. Right. That's not offensive to me.1 (38m 5s):I'm not sure. I'm not sure. Yeah. Like Gina was saying like we're okay. So that went south. Like if did you feel I'm really concerned? Like, cause I would have probably had to check in somewhere because I would have been like, I curated this motherfucker and now I caused this whole fucking7 (38m 23s):I'm still like T like we have a show coming up in like a week at Steppenwolf. And I had one of the storytellers from that show sent me a is doing the show at Steppenwolf. And I like had a moment because his story is like, because of that. And because I'm like wildly triggered, I was like, Hey, maybe you could do this story about tennis or whatever. And he's like, do you need a PG story? Like what's going on? And then I was like, and then I re-read a story. And I was like, I do not his stories about sex.7 (39m 5s):I do not find this offensive. This is okay. I'm person totally traumatized. And then I had to go back and be like, oh God, remember that thing that happened in 2020, I'm just totally melted from that. And your story is great and everything's fine. I'm just having a moment. I'm going to calm down2 (39m 24s):And see what happens to me though. When I hear w whenever my antenna go up, whenever I hear like, oh, that's offensive to me. That just automatically means you're doing behavior that you feel really ashamed of. And so you want to shame me instead of just own the truth of whatever it is you're doing. This is exactly what happens on the Handmaid's tale. You know, it's all about the Bible, but then they're just like holding people down and raping them. So I just think it's a little bit of a soft sign for you've got trouble. If adults are saying that referencing the fact that there is porn is7 (39m 58s):Troublesome. Yeah.1 (40m 2s):Oh my God. I can just, okay. I would have been so traumatized. So I hear you. And I also think that, like, it's interesting, I've had a similar thing where like, on this podcast, I've mentioned my husband's job. I have mentioned. And so Gina and I always talk about, well, we will not always, but we've had to talk about this of like, what is the, and it's like a bigger thing in our society right. In the world. Like, where do I draw the line of like, can I stand behind this? I guess that's what it is. It's like, can I stand? If I'm called to the carpet, whoever God, the board, whoever, and say, stand behind this show. These words can.1 (40m 43s):And that's when, if I can stand behind it and I am willing to answer for it. And I'm like, I'm all in. If I feel like I'm wishy washy, then I feel like it's going to go south. And then I it's weird. It's a weird thing. It's like when to cut, when to not cut, now, you didn't have the ability I'm fucking lives to do7 (41m 6s):That. What1 (41m 7s):Happens in live television, right? When someone who goes bonkers or has a stroke, God forbid, or it's like, you don't know what to do. So live is a different thing. Like it's different with a podcast. We can cut. We can, but like a live show, whether zoom or on stage, there is this moment. So when I did my solo show, Samantha Irby, Sam Irby opened for me. Right. Ramus. Now wasn't famous then. But it was always a Reverend and a bad-ass right. But data story at my show and my uncle were there about SAC,7 (41m 38s):Right.1 (41m 38s):Eight leakage and fluids. And I was like, oh. And then I thought, oh, I wanted to run on stage and be like, ah, this is too much. But then I thought you invited this person. This is their jam. This7 (41m 54s):We love. Right.1 (41m 58s):What, what, okay, sit, sit, and just deal with it. And if my uncle and my uncle was really offended and like, fuck that. Okay. So, but it's hard to do. I was squirming. So you must've been squirming when you, when your, when your person called you and was like, cause you, you found these people. But I think sometimes we squirm, right? Sometimes we squirm,7 (42m 21s):Oh my God, I was dying. Cause it's like, I don't, I don't want to disappoint any of, either of you, this computer, this desk. And I just want to make everyone so happy all the time. And I don't want anyone upset with me or like, I don't want to cause any problems, nothing. I want you all happy.1 (42m 42s):And sometimes despite our best people, pleasing efforts, like shit goes south. Like that is the story of shit going south. Despite Being a good person, having gone to college, go to it, shit still goes south. So7 (42m 55s):I vote like1 (42m 58s):You're very active, like socially.2 (43m 2s):So let's, let's talk about you and your experiences. Did you go to DePaul?7 (43m 7s):I wish I had gone to DePaul, but I, from listening to this podcast, I get that. I don't know. I went to Roosevelt university for grad school.2 (43m 17s):Cool. Tell us everything. Tell us, like, when you decided you wanted to be an actor and when you decided you wanted to go to theater school, tell us everything.7 (43m 25s):Well, for me, I grew up in Arkansas. So I went to the university of Arkansas and I started out as like a journalism and a political science major. But then they, the department, the journalism department had us take a speech class. Like how does speak in theater class, you know, to get rid of your accent basically. Cause we're all Arkansans. We sound like, you know, we're in God, but the wind or whatever. So we took this class and I had growing up and like my small town, I always loved theater. I'd done community theater and the whole thing. So when I took that class and like, everyone in there is like, you know, so alive and so like interesting and like, like real, I was like, well, this is going to be a problem.7 (44m 17s):So then I, like, I signed up for, you know, the second semester of the class. And then I was like, oh, I'm gonna audition for these one acts. And then so slowly I just migrated into the theater department and completely dropped journalism, political science, all of it. And disappointed my parents ruined their lives, you know, the whole thing. So I didn't really understand, like by the, by the end of my time in undergrad, I was like, I don't really, it's like, you're young. It's like, I don't understand grad school. I don't know. But that seems to be thing that I, there was a grad program that had just started there, like, like near the end of my time there.7 (44m 59s):And I was like, I guess that's what I'm supposed to do. And so everyone told me to go to Chicago. I hadn't ever been to Chicago. I knew nothing about it. Never even visited, but I was like, okay. They're like funny people should go to Chicago. And I'm like, oh, I'm funny. So I guess that's where I'll go.1 (45m 15s):You are funny. So it's good. You went there.7 (45m 17s):Thanks. So, so I auditioned at IRDAs and did that whole thing. And then I got a call back from them and I, it was like weird. Like I thought there was going to be like some like bigger process or something. Like, am I going to, I was like, ready, you know, with like my other, like, do you want 16 bars? Do you need other other monologues? Like, well, what's the deal? And it was just kind of like a done thing. So I was like, Yeah, it's like at the callback, there was like, it was an IRDAs. And it's like, you'd go to the person's hotel room, which now seems really creepy what, with a couple other people.7 (45m 57s):And it just seemed like I liked the person who did the interview and I was like, they're in Chicago. This seems great. I2 (46m 7s):Like to act in a hotel room. I've never7 (46m 9s):Done. Like, the audition was in, like, I don't even know where it was like the ballroom. It was like, there was like a black box sort of like made up situation. So you audition and then like the next day or a few hours later, you get like a sheet with a little list of the schools that want to like talk to you or whatever. And we have been like through the ringer with my undergrad teacher and she's like, okay, you need to have, like, you had like your folder with your monologues. And like, if someone wanted a song, like your whole thing, it's like bootcamp and you're ready. So I'm like prepared for somebody to ask me to do anything. And I don't know, I got called back to like a lot of places, which I was like, oh my God, none of them asked me for anything.7 (46m 54s):Which maybe looking back, maybe that was like, not a great situation. I don't know what that means.2 (46m 60s):They were just the, and the call back. They were just meeting you. Right. They were just wanting to know if you were like,7 (47m 4s):Yeah, I guess1 (47m 6s):You're acting probably wow. Like really? They probably would have if they were on the fence, but that probably wasn't that they probably wanted to do what, you know, they, they, a chemistry breed or whatever the fuck they call it. Right.7 (47m 18s):Yeah. I guess. But this meaning with the person at Roosevelt, it's like, she was nice. It was great. It felt good. So I was like, all right, maybe that's where I'm going. And I knew I wanted to get Chicago. So like, that was, that was the deal.2 (47m 36s):It's an undergrad. You were not thinking this at all. I'm guessing you don't come from a performing family or you, you weren't doing this in high school.7 (47m 44s):Oh my God. Well, there was like the junior play or whatever that like pays for the prom, you know, like that kind of a situation. But otherwise, like I did community theater and I'm from a town of like 10,000 people. So there wasn't like really a community theater. I did Annie and Mike, I don't know, 10th grade or something.1 (48m 3s):Amazing.7 (48m 4s):Really upset. I couldn't be Annie. I was like a Senator. And like the apple salesman. I was like that guy I'm like running around doing whatever anybody wanted me to do.1 (48m 20s):Funny. That's why he could do a lot funny.2 (48m 23s):Yeah. Interchangeable. Okay. So day one, you're at Roosevelt. Is this the education that you thought you were going to get7 (48m 32s):Funny? You should ask. So this, when I went, which was, this was 2000 yes. 2000. So it was their first year of their MFA program.1 (48m 44s):Oh shit.7 (48m 46s):Oh shit is right. They accepted 30 people take that in verse1 (48m 54s):307 (48m 55s):MFA. Oh yeah.1 (48m 57s):It's too many people that just like five.7 (49m 0s):Thank you. I think that if I'm being kind, I think they accepted a huge amount of people thinking that, you know, with everything going on that like maybe 10, which is still too many would accept. So there were 30 of us. So we're there on the first day. And I'm just like, this seems , I don't know anything about what this experience is supposed to be, but 30 people that's like, that's like an entire MFA program, you know, that's like three years of people or more So immediately.7 (49m 44s):I was just like,1 (49m 45s):Hmm,7 (49m 47s):This doesn't seem right. But you know, I was like 24. So I'm like so happy to be there. I'm living in my friend's base. My friend's mom's basement until I find an apartment just like, you know, desperate twenties times. So immediately. I was like, I, this is hi. All right.1 (50m 11s):I think I should get off this rollercoaster right now, but it's already going, right?7 (50m 16s):Yeah, totally. I just like was on. And because I didn't have like necessarily the support of my parents where this entire thing, I was like, fight or flight. Like I will do this. If I have to hang on to the side of the building and sleep like that, or like, whatever it is, I'm gonna do this. So I did it.2 (50m 49s):And is it a typical curriculum, voice and speech and movement and all that stuff?7 (50m 54s):Yeah. I was sort of surprised by all of it. The program that I did in undergrad, I felt, I don't know. I guess everyone in undergrad, if you're doing theater stuff there, you think that like, what you're doing is like enough and great. And that's how everything's going to go. So to spend like three hours a day in a movement class, suddenly when you're like, God damn it, let me do a monologue or a scene or sing a song. Like let me work. You know, I understand that that is also work and it's fundamental, but it was really shocking to me.1 (51m 37s):You know, what's interesting is like, and you're not the first person that I've, I felt this, that we've had on the show is like, what I would eat. Like you should have maybe gone right to second city and just done that call that five-year conservatives And gotten the fuck out, but it's not accredited. It's not like a real university that would probably make your parents even more like unhappy. And so, but like you needed like a professional program, like there's conservatory training for actors and then there's professional programs. And I wish I had done, so. Okay. But you're in this. How long was the Roosevelt MFA program?7 (52m 15s):Three years. Oh,1 (52m 16s):Fuck. Right.2 (52m 18s):And was it the thing where you can't perform the first year, but then you do and you're in the casting pool with VFS.7 (52m 26s):Yeah, I, we couldn't perform in the first year though, at the end of the first semester, they opened up an audition to be an intern at Chicago Shakespeare, which was like super exciting. So I auditioned and then I was doing the second semester, I got to be an intern and be on stage and do king Lear, Chicago, Shakespeare. I mean, I was like, you know, a dude, a homeless person running around. Oh, we got it. Yeah. So then I was like, oh no, this is great. I'm like with like these amazing people that I don't know who they are yet, but I will.7 (53m 9s):And there, those people are amazing2 (53m 12s):In that7 (53m 13s):Greg VIN CLER.1 (53m 15s):Oh yeah. was Barbara Gaines directing7 (53m 18s):Barbara Gaines director.1 (53m 20s):Yeah. She's amazing. She's she's famous for, for me, for my one audition I had there, she yawned during my whole model to be fair, but to be fair, it was really boring. Like, it was really boring. She was basically doing what I wish I could have done. It was boring. My shit was boring. She was like this. Can't see. But yeah, she was rude, but apropos I sucked anyway. Okay. So you were, you got to work at shakes and so you were like, okay, but did you make friends? What was the vibe like? BFA was the BFA program established at that time?7 (54m 2s):I think so. Oh, and that part. Okay. Like whatever I'll say about Roosevelt, which I don't have, I don't know necessarily great things to say about the program. It doesn't even exist anymore, PS, by the way. But the BFA program, the program for undergrads, I thought that was like, excellent. Like, I was like happy for those kids. Like that seemed like good. And they were having a good time, but for us it was just, I don't know. It just felt kind of sad and different.2 (54m 26s):So your parents were psyched about the idea of you being a journalist. That's what they thought you were going to.7 (54m 32s):I think the imaginary plan was that I would, or what I sold them at the time was I'm gonna get this journalism degree and then I'm gonna go to law school.1 (54m 43s):Oh,2 (54m 45s):Right. That's everybody's, catch-all hilarious.7 (54m 48s):So that's what I'm going to do. But then I was like, but these plays, these people, it's really the people that are purchased more fun.2 (54m 57s):I actually got dressed so many people in for exactly that reason. It's just something that's like tribal feeling that you don't know that you don't have it until you find it. And then you go, oh my God.7 (55m 8s):Yeah. It was really, it was really all encompassing. I was like, well, I can't not be with these people.2 (55m 15s):What kind of shows did you do there at Roosevelt?7 (55m 18s):I all right. So, so there was that first year experience. And then I don't know. I let's see, I did my last year.1 (55m 30s):Yeah. It just sticks out in your brain7 (55m 33s):Threepenny opera. And then there was this weird Asian adoptation of the rope by whatever old Greek guy,2 (55m 47s):Asian adaptation.7 (55m 48s):So here's one of the weird things about the program. So there were a couple of classes that made zero sense that we were taking as actors. One was, we all had to take a stage management management course. I don't know. Did you guys have to know1 (56m 5s):I7 (56m 5s):Was like1 (56m 5s):Crew, but I don't even know. No.7 (56m 8s):Well, yeah, like working on a cruise, like that's normal, but in an entire semester demo devoted to stage management just seems kind of rude.2 (56m 18s):It sounds like they needed stage managers for their shows1 (56m 22s):Teachers. Yeah.7 (56m 25s):And then there is a professor there who white lady who loved Asian theater. And so, yeah. Pause for that1 (56m 37s):PF chains of, she was trying to be the PF Chang's PF J7 (56m 44s):God lover. I mean, yes. I'm interested in Asian theater too, but everyone was required as part of the MFA program to take an Asian theater class. So, which is interesting. I'm not knocking like any of that, but the PA I don't know the possibility of me being in an Asian.2 (57m 7s):Yeah. Like what's the really,1 (57m 11s):It just sounds like she had a thing for her thing was Asian theater and she wanted everyone else's thing.7 (57m 16s):Total your thing. She had studied in, I don't know, Japan, I think, and had done this whole program and it was like her, she may even have like a PhD on it. I don't really know, but that was her thing and good for her. Awesome.1 (57m 31s):Why are you teaching? But it's7 (57m 33s):Not practical. Yeah. It just seems like weird. So the play I did, I did the, the rope, which is like a Greek play. Never2 (57m 42s):Heard of it.1 (57m 43s):I wish you had done the rain anyway.7 (57m 48s):So she translated the play into a Kyogen style thing, which is a very specific Asian theater style play. Not only that, not only that, but like, I have always been openly unapologetically sort of who I am, which means, hello, I'm a homosexual and it's clear and I'm not like afraid of that as an actor or a person. So I played the, yeah, get ready. I played the, I don't want to call it like the evil sister, but I played like the villain in the play, which was like an older, which type woman in the play.7 (58m 40s):And that was supposed to be hilarious.1 (58m 48s):That's really where we're headed in the arts. I'm also saying the arts in the logs shit went down. Not that7 (58m 56s):Some weird shipments out. Yeah. So it's like thinking about that now you would like wants to like light all of Chicago on fire. Right? Correct. But at the time, this I guess was like, cool, cool. And inventive to make the one gay guy that you were Sure was gay play a woman Asian drag. Oh my gosh. The whole thing is like Asian themed rides. and the whole thing I don't, I can't say for sure, but I don't think1 (59m 39s):So. What the fuck?7 (59m 42s):So just a bunch of white people running around and kimonos speaking in a very like, you know, meter to style Asian thing. And I'm a woman also.2 (59m 53s):I wish we had a video. I really want to watch this play. I mean, just like for a snippet, because you know, when you think of yourself and how seriously you took a role when you were young and you and you, and you just in your mind's eye, even if there's no video and you just imagine, like, what does this actually look like? And that's always looks funny, no matter what or sad. If it's a comedy, it looks sad. And if it's True. So that was one. Did you have any roles that you liked?7 (1h 0m 29s):I mean, kind of, well, there was like a, a directing project that one of my friends did. It was like a Steve Martin one act. And I was like, yeah, right. Like it was like a legit play that was like funny and good. And I had like the lead and I was like, it was like us, like a straight man that I was playing. And I like felt excited because it felt like I was like reaching. I'm not reaching, but you know what I mean? You're like, oh, this is a play. I'm like, yeah. I was like, do a thing. And I like am working for this goal to do. And I felt like I was successful in it and it felt good.7 (1h 1m 9s):But like, that was probably the one, even in my thesis role, which was like, I was like a random chorus person in Threepenny opera, literally it's my third year. I'm like, Hmm. I have to write 30 pages now on yeah. That's, it's like that.1 (1h 1m 27s):The thing like that, I just, and maybe you guys could chime in. And in terms of the curriculum, there doesn't seem to be an actual curriculum for these programs. Like now that I'm teaching, I'm like, wait, what, what is the7 (1h 1m 42s):Tactical?1 (1h 1m 43s):And what is the piece of paper that you can point to, to say, this is the mission of these three years for these MFA actors. There is no plan. What is the plan? That's what I feel about a lot of this is, and it's still to this day in, in conservatories, what is the fucking plan? Because there doesn't seem to be one and there's not a plan. We shouldn't be charging dollars to these people. I just, I, it should be, then it should be camp, a freak out where we go when we, I don't know. Anyway. So2 (1h 2m 15s):I mean, honestly, like it's, it needs to be treated a little bit more like a school and pass fail, right?7 (1h 2m 23s):Yeah. Like the goal it's like, if you're a journalist, like, can you do these things? Can you write a bituaries? Can you write a news story? Can you do the, you know what I mean? So it's like, when I leave this place, am I going to be able to get a job? And I know that like, everyone's like, theater's like, oh gosh, you're never going to work or whatever, but that, it's just not true. It's like, everything is the same. There are basic skills. Do you have them,1 (1h 2m 50s):There are milestones to meet along the way. And if you, I mean, anyway, I it's just, the more we interview folks, the more I'm like, oh, this whole higher ed situation, fine arts needs a whole overhaul. I don't know what it's going to take, but we'll probably be extinct on the planet before it happened. So I just feel like maybe that's the way it's going to go and okay. But like, okay, so you graduate, you then are like, okay, I have this MFA. Then what happens to you7 (1h 3m 21s):By the end of the program? I was really like, I don't know. I feel like it kind of, it kind of broke me because things like that were happening, which in a way is like, I mean, at the time we didn't have the language for like, you know, playing an Asian woman in a play, like it's offensive. And it's like, not furthering me. It's racist. It's not furthering me as an actor. I'm not going to leave here and like run around and Komodo and place for the rest of my life. It just kind of broke me. And a lot of the, I would say some of the teachers, the whole situation just didn't make me feel good.7 (1h 4m 4s):So at the end, I was like, you know what, maybe? Hm. I don't know. I need, I needed a break from that whole world. I mean, I did audition for awhile, but the shortest while1 (1h 4m 21s):How short,7 (1h 4m 26s):Maybe it was a couple years1 (1h 4m 28s):Because we have Gina's trajectory and mine, mine too. Like I stopped after I stopped after three.7 (1h 4m 35s):Yeah. I was probably three years. Like slowly, just petered out. I mean, I got to the point where I'm like going. So I went on a few theater auditions in the beginning and then I had an agent and I would go on these, like on camera calls. And I would just be like, oh my God, I'm in this giant room with a hundred people that are dressed and look just like me. This is the most pressing thing. Like, I just was like, I can't, this isn't, this doesn't feel good either.2 (1h 5m 6s):I want to hear how eventually, how we get to storytelling. But before we do, I just, I didn't want to leave the whole Roosevelt thing without, I don't think I've really asked anybody this before, but you're not the first person who basically says to us, like, I'm gay. They didn't know what to do with me in theater school. Right.7 (1h 5m 30s):So2 (1h 5m 32s):I don't know if this is a question or a comment or what, or like just a prompt for discussion, but what is the barrier there? I mean, it seems like what you're saying about this role that you got cast, it's like, you're gay. So you'd like to wear drag. Is that what the thinking was?7 (1h 5m 47s):I don't know. For me, it's two things. It's like, there's the gay thing for sure. But also I'm funny. So if you're in a serious theater program, please understand I'm doing some heavy air quotes because every theater program thinks they're a serious theater program. They really do not know what to do with people who are fitting into the definition of serious. And so I think yes, there is like me, the stereotypical gay person or whatever, if I am so there's that person, but that's usually a funny person.7 (1h 6m 28s):And so then they don't like it totally. This is serious. We're doing real serious work here. How can this work?1 (1h 6m 38s):It makes that, that makes me, it makes sense. And it also makes me so angry, just Raging, also like fucking pick different motherfucking material. You've that fits your mother fucking class. You dumb fucks. That is what we're supposed to be doing is picking material that highlight our students and help them grow in a way and not the pick different place.7 (1h 7m 3s):Well, that's really where in that and the whole situation, I feel like that's, that's what sort of killed me is that there wasn't a place for me. No one cared to create one and you are, I already felt like I don't fit here. I don't belong. And so it's just like that slowly, just really like sinks in. So you've got that going on. You've got your there with 30 actors and it was kind of, honestly, it was sort of like easy to just like hide, you know, unless I'm being called to play the Asian lady on the play. So it's just like a kind of just was like, eh,1 (1h 7m 43s):Yeah, you gave up. But they gave up on at first.7 (1h 7m 48s):It is honestly,1 (1h 7m 50s):We give up when people give up on us first, especially as young people.2 (1h 7m 53s):That's true. That's true. So you're in audition rooms after school. You're, you're feeling like this is depressing. There's 5,000 mess and we all look the same. How, how did, how did you evolve from that to what you're currently doing, which I'm going to go on a limb and say is fulfilling to you artistically fulfilling to you what you're doing?7 (1h 8m 13s):I would say yes. Okay. How did that happen? I mean, after, you know, just deciding I'm not going to go on these calls anymore. I just, like, I was like, okay, then I'll, I'm working in a restaurant. So that's what I'm, I'm gonna work in. I work in restaurants now. That's what I do. And I did that for a while. And then I was just like, okay, but wow, this can't be it. Like, even if you, as an actor, like whatever level you achieve as an actor, I think there's always that part of you. Who's like, yeah, but like, can I talk somewhere?7 (1h 8m 54s):And people just like to listen to me or just let me tell, you know, just get really enthusiastic with storytelling at a party. Or like, whatever. I, I didn't know about the moth or a storytelling or any of that stuff. I really was just like this theater experience, grad school was so bad for me. And I'm too afraid to go to second city to do improv because I had sat through, you know, the first year of friends doing that. And I was like, well, I'm not doing this terrifying. So I thought, Hey, what if I get some actors together?7 (1h 9m 37s):And we will write monologues, which is how I thought of it at the beginning, it'll be like loosely based on a theme and we'll do a monologue show. I think I had just seen Nora Ephron's play love loss and what I wore. And so there's all these women on stage telling this like, story. And I was like, oh my God, I'm not a playwright. I can never like, make this happen necessarily. But like, if there are people on a stage and then they're just like one by one, like telling a story based on a theme, like, oh my gosh, this is revolutionary. I've just invented this whole new thing. So that is sort of where I started.1 (1h 10m 14s):When was that? I

Adrian Danzig is a performer, circus clown, and teacher.  He was the founder of 500 Clown performance company and a co-founder of the Redmoon theater in Chicago.  His credits include Comedy of Errors at California Shakespeare Festival, The Feast: an intimate Tempest at Chicago Shakespeare, The Seagull at Lake Lucille, Orlando at The Court Theater and The Better Half with Lucky Plush Productions. He has led workshops in physical theater all around the country and internationally for the past 10 years.If you want to hear more from Adrian, and all of our wonderful guests, head over  to our Patreon page to become a supporter where you will have access to all of our amazingly insightful unedited episodes!Support the show

Interview: We talk to Dave Dastmalchian and John Hoogenakker about a special moment with F. Murray Abraham, finding friendship in a cutthroat environment, having substance abuse and authority issues, mind-f***ery, the cloistered nature of conservatories, using skills gained at TTS on set, taking an eclectic approach to acting, the tricky dance of teaching an art form, PR Casting, Does a Tiger Wear a Necktie, when William Burroughs discovered a copy of the Fledgling Press, a zine which Dave created.FULL TRANSCRIPT:Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:08):I'm Jen Bosworth Ramirez.Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:10):and I'm Gina Pulice.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:11):We went to theater school together. We survived it, but we didn't quite understand it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:15):20 years later, we're digging deep talking to our guests about their experiences and trying to make sense of it all.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:20):We survived theater school and you will too. Are we famous yet?Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:29):So they concocted this plan to make A shelf in our library, like right above the door frame, that goes all the way around the room. So I am not kidding you. So, soJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:49):Pictures, pictures, put them on the website. Okay.Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:53):Here's the deal though? My son, my, my middle child is so smart. He has never helped us with these type of projects before, because he doesn't really like, he traditionally hasn't really liked working with his hands, but this time he wanted to, it was really his idea. He wanted to do it. And he's such a math brain that he insisted on doing heavy. Pre-planning like he made us model, not a, he's calling it a model. It's not really a model. he's like got a piece of paper. He drew plans for it. He did all kinds of measurements. He used. Yeah, it was great. And he goes, listen, if we don't plan it out like this, then we get halfway through and we run into a snag and then we stop working on it, which is exactly what the oldest one. And I have done on a number of projects, including building a full-sized Playhouse on our back -Yes ma'am yes. Ma'am. I spent thousands of dollars on wood and nails and power tools so that we could have this joint project of building a Playhouse. And we didn't think it through one single bit. We, we found some plans on the internet and we went through and we made it. I got, we got all the way to the roof and the roof is what did us in? We couldn't, we couldn't get up high enough on the thing. We didn't have a high enough ladder and it's not in a great enough position. We couldn't put the roof on it, sat there for a year. And then it was time for the bar mitzvah, which we were having the party at our house. So we had to, and we had to take the whole thing down and we never finished it. So the other one goes, listen, we're I don't want to do that. I don't want to go through all this work and give it up. So he planned it and boy did he plan it with an inch of his life and it's going up and it's looking great. And I will send you picturesJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:02:44):That is done. Oh my gosh. Merry Christmas. [inaudible] freaking Christmas. That's fantastic.Dave Dastmalchian (00:02:51):I have one other cute little story to tell you.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:02:55):I took, well, I told her, um, I told C's, um, hummus story is Sasha and Chrissy and Tilly. Oh. Saw them from afar. Um, we saw them outside. Uh, they're amazing. And they laughed so hard. It was. Yeah. So it's for people that don't know. I mean, we've probably said, I'd probably made you tell it like four times, but you, but my version, this is how I tell it is that, um, your daughter says, mom, what, what kind of stuff do they have to eat in prison? Do they have like bad food? And you're like, yeah, it's probably not that great. She goes like hummus? They cracked up anyway.Dave Dastmalchian (00:03:37):She's she's hilarious. So, um, I was sick yesterday and she came home from the bus. Oh, earlier in the day she had -I was taking her to school and this little girl had these really cute boots on these little there's some, some, Ugg, type boots. She's like, Oh, I love those boots. And I S and she had said something to me about it before. And I said, yeah, you know, I looked for those, but I couldn't, I don't see where they are. I, I, you know, I can't, I can't find any of the information for it. So she comes home yesterday. Oh, this is so sweet. She brings me a plate with sliced up bananas, um, something else, and the little container of yogurt that she got in her lunch that she brought home. Cause this is kind of sugary yogurt that I never buy for her Trix yogurt. And she covered it in saran wrap. And she wrote me a note. I get, well, note, and it's a picture of the two of us. And it said, mom, get, well soon. I love you. And you, and it says at the bottom turnover, turnover, they have such, she goes, I got the information about the boots!Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:04:53):I'm telling you. She's genius.Dave Dastmalchian (00:04:56):She writes, You can get them at col that's Kohl's or you could get them at Kohl's or, um, uh, TRG I T get at targetJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:05:12):She's genius.Dave Dastmalchian (00:05:14):She followed up this morning. She goes, so did you, did you check out Kohl'sSpeaker 4 (00:05:31):[inaudible]?Dave Dastmalchian (00:05:38):Hm. We've moved a lot. I mean, not as much as you, but we've moved a lot in the time that we've been together. 20 whatever years we probably moved, I don't know, 15 times and, or maybe less than that, but, uh, between 10 and 15 times. And we, one of the things that we lug around from place to place is a lot of mementos. A box of mementos turned into two boxes, turned into two boxes each. Now we have kids, they have their boxes. So we're at the point where not only because of this for other reasons, but we have to store all the mementos in a storage facility. This is the dumbest possible thing. I mean, it also has furniture from, Oh, it has furniture. But like, anyway, we store boxes in boxes. Probably those plastic tubs, you know, the big plastic tubs would probably have like six plastic tubs that are of mementos.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:06:40):Wow.Dave Dastmalchian (00:06:41):Aaron has, you know, the, the little plaque he got when he won a tennis tournament in eighth grade is it's like a lot of things. Okay. I've gotten better at paring things down. But then when you have kids, you feel like you shouldn't throw anything away because they're the ones who are going to be going through your stuff one day and who are going to be mad. If you didn't save all of their stuff. Now, of course you cannot save all of their stuff, but like, what's your stance on mementos? What do you keep? What do you toss? What's -do you feel guilty about it, et cetera?Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:07:20):It's a great, that's a great topic. I, um, feel mixed. We have, so, yes, we've moved so much and we too have mementos. Um, there's the Marie Kondo, you know, that if it doesn't spark joy, but I don't really believe that. Um, I think people should, uh, do what they want to do for the most part. I don't subscribe to a minimalist thing, but I definitely feel like for everything you keep, you should throw out one thing. So, so, so that goes with clothes that goes, and it is really hard. Now, mementos are different because they have sentimental, they have sentimental value, but I'm remembering having to go through, uh, both dead parents' stuff. And most of it is garbage. Like most of them, most of it is like a lighter that my dad had that was engraved with someone's initials. That weren't his, why he probably stole it from somebody. But, um, but I was like, what, what, what? No. And it was a tremendous amount of emotional work to go through this stuff. And, um, yeah, I say get rid of, most of it. I get rid of most of it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:08:42):I mean, I think what it's about is, cause what, what I did with my dad is so when he died, I was right before I got married and he, so he didn't know that I got married or about any of my kids. So I think I really held onto stuff for kind of a long time, because it just felt like I didn't have time to grieve or process or whatever it is. So there are certain things that I, you know, you have your stages, like things you get rid of, like when Aaron's dad died, he came home wearing all of his father's clothes. He had his, and they were all too big pants and his shoes, well, that stuff has started to, it's been about a year, that stuff is starting to go away. So I remember the phases of getting rid of stuff. And it is something about like, you hold onto the, the stuff is like a placeholder for you doing your grieving. So it's like the more you do the work of going through the grieving that's then you, then you feel okay to get rid of the stuff. And the thing about what the kids is, I know something that they don't know, which is that it feels so precious to them now is not going to feel so precious to them. For example, when they go to college or move out and I say, we need to go through this stuff. Now we need to go through and figure out, you know, what you want. And I'm sure that they're going to want to get rid of a lot of stuff, but they also want to keep like, both boys did TaeKwonDo and went through their black belt. And the trophy for a black belt is like, as tall as a person, that's like five feet tall. Those are in storage. We went to storage to get out the Christmas stuff. And my oldest son, he picks up, he goes, this thing was really like a piece of junk. Like it's, you know, cause trophies are just made of plastic cheap metal. Yeah. So I, that was like, okay, you're going to want to get rid of this. That's a good thing. But with the smaller things, like really precious sentimental notes, I feel like keeping, but listen, not every kid or not, every person writes a card that's worth keeping, I'm sorry to say, butJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:10:58):Right. And what you don't and what, and I think what you're doing is by getting rid of the sub stuff is what you're actually doing is making your kids job easier when we all croak. So if you think about it that way, like I act, but they should be allowed maybe one tub each.Dave Dastmalchian (00:11:18):Right. And we shouldn't have to worry when it gets no, no, well, they don't, they only have one tub, but then they have things like the trophies or the other things that they don't want to get rid of. Yeah. I'm feeling like what we should do is it is a annual or at least every few years going through making sure this is still so, because it, it was only recently that the older two wanted to get rid of their schoolwork from kindergarten. Wow. Yeah. They really wanted to. And that's the other thing is like, if it is serving some emotional need, I cut it off. I don't want to cut off, but I also don't want to, I know how it is with the whole storage facility. We got a storage facility that's bigger than what we need. We're just going to fill it up like a goldfish, eating too much and filling up its bowlJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:12:05):And then their stomach explodes. Uh, but I was going to say something that you might do too, is if you're into any kind of ritual is w miles will burn. Um, we will burn stuff in a, in a, like a goodbye stuff. Like, um, if it's sentimental letters and stuff, now it, you know, there's not burning a kindergarten paper on, you know, aardvark, but, but if there's anything have some kind of ritual saying goodbye situation. Um, my sister and I, Oh my gosh. When we went to through the attic, there was a, like a 10 year period where everyone died. Right. And so we had 10 people's ashes. I'm not kidding you. My mother, my father, both three grandparents migrating at Ruth. It was crazy. So we didn't know what to do with all these ashes. We just dumped them in the garden. We are like, and we had a parade of ashes. We just had a ritual. We were like, goodbye, goodbye, aunt, Ruth goodbye. Then they all got mixed together, but we literally headed those cremations of like, not, it was like nine people, but I was like, so you don't want, you don't want stuff to accumulate that, that P that the kiddos are going to have to just go through and be like, I mean, the ashes were fine, but there was so much stuff that I was like, Oh my God, like pictures of people that you cannot name, those got to go. Yeah.Dave Dastmalchian (00:13:31):Right. What about though? Have you ever thrown something away? And then been like, Oh, I wish I hadn't got it.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:13:39):But you know what? They were, it was bigger items, actually. Wasn't sentimental stuff. It was like, my mom had this, a couple of chairs and furniture. It was more big stuff. And it doesn't sound like you have tons of big stuff. Um, it sounds like it's more sentimental stuff. Um, but I, I mostly felt like that chair, I should have hold it. It held onto the chair and some of her of dishes and stuff like that. But at the time I was like, no, it's gotta go. It's gotta go. Um, so the other thing that I would say is don't, um, for people is like, don't make any decisions when you're in a heightened, emotional state, because you will save weird and you will throw out stuff that you will. So like, it's good that you go through it once a year. Not in a crisis, not in a, not, you know, after a huge event, but at like when you like a regular checkup to the storage place,Dave Dastmalchian (00:14:36):I think too, I just had this thought what I should do, especially with papers, take pictures, just take pictures of papers. I can, I can even make a book for each of the kids. Like here is five images of all the crap you wanted me to save that I didn't, but I took a picture of it.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:14:58):Brilliant. You just thought of that. Brilliant. Yeah. You're a Marie Kondo in your own, right?Dave Dastmalchian (00:15:04):Aye. Aye. Listen, pursuant to our conversation about my home decor. I'm like, let's get rid of it. Let's get rid of it all. Like I have a China cabinet. I mean, come on. I, I, I mean, I have China. I have, I have tried, but I don't need to, it doesn't need to be displayed. Like, it's my prize possession. You know what I mean? It can just go to shelf.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:15:22):I guess that, that leads me to the question for you is, and it goes back to our other conversation, which is, um, do you think you just adopted that because it's what you thought you should do.Dave Dastmalchian (00:15:33):It's 100% that, because I, yeah, I, I learned at an early age, like I remember being on the younger side and, uh, going through something, I forget what it was, birthday, old birthday cards and throwing them away. And my mom being like, you're getting rid of them. You know, she keeps everything. She keeps her, yes, she keeps everything. But I, uh, my middle child is my, uh, icon in this way. At summer camp, you send cards, you know, you're in current and they like to receive mail. So I sent a lot of cards and he received a lot of cards. He comes home from camp. This is not this past summer. But the summary for her, I said, did you get all the cards I sent you? He said, yes, I did. And they were so great. And on my last day of camp, I looked through all the letters that you and Gran and I gave him a kiss through with the trash. And when he said it, I, I had this Pang of like, Oh, you throw them in the trash. But of course it served its purpose. The purpose was to give him something to remember us by while he was at camp it, then it was over. Then he was going to come home and be with us. He didn't need to hold onto it.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:16:53):It's not sentimental that way. No. What about clothing? Do you hold onto clothing?Dave Dastmalchian (00:16:58):No, no. I get rid of, I mean, I have my, I have my, I kept my wedding dress and I CA I kept like a few of the kids. Very first ones. These remember the onesies that you made, that you, you, we made at your house. I have the, I have not all of them, but I have some of those, but yeah, I don't get sentimental about clothing. Aaron does. Aaron has his high school, varsity jacket and his first pair of scrubs and his first doctor coat and all this kind of stuff. Oh, wow.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:17:30):Go through your clothing. And you're not a shopper. You don't like to shop for clothes.Dave Dastmalchian (00:17:36):Well, I like to have clothes. I just don't like to shop for them. Yeah, no, I go through, I, yeah, I'll have, did I forget if you were here, you saw my closet. We have, I've never seen your closet. It's technically a walk-in, but not really. It was a very small class. I have always had a very small closet. I've never, I know that if I had a huge closet, I would just collect a bunch of clothes. So it's kind of an and shoe. So it's kind of a good thing that I don't know. That's one thing we sort of keep under control. We, I throw out something maybe like once every week or once every two weeks I get rid of stuff. Really? It's the other stuff. It's the stuff that I feel like I'm supposed to have because I have kids or I'm supposed to have, because, because really a lot of the other people in my life are very sentimental errands. Very sentimental has. My mother is very sentimental. My kids are very sentimental. So I feel like I have to keep all this stuff for them. But I really don't.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:18:31):That was a China cabinet. Was that a purchase that you thought I should have this because I'm an adultDave Dastmalchian (00:18:36):Or did you inherit it? No, we were moving here from the city and we were just both like, well, we need a dining set. And we went to the furniture store was the first time I went to like a real furniture store and they had a matching dining table and chairs with the, with a China cabinet and a, uh, something else. We've got three big pieces. It's all crappy furniture. It was a waste. It was expensive. And it was a waste of money because all furniture that's made past bef you know, since 1950 is crappy furniture, um, dining table. Well, it's big, but it's, it's really like wobbly. It's crappy. It's crappy. So I, I think I'm going to, maybe after the holidays, get rid of the China cabinet, whole King thing. Like it doesn't give me any joy to look at it. It doesn't give, it's just like, here's where we put all the crap that we use on Thanksgiving.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:19:33):Right? It's more of a storage. It's not a showcase for anything special. What you need to do is get so many snow Globes that then you've got you put those in there, maybe, but that's a huge, you don't really need maybe a different kind of case for the snow Globes.Dave Dastmalchian (00:19:48):Something like that would give me joy, some little bauble, something like that. It's just plates and vases and, and somebody who is in my family has started a collection of something for me that I don't care for. But it's like, you know how it is, the person really wants to collect something for you. And they pick something. They, they have something that they collect and then they go, well, would you like a different version of this thing? I collect it. And you know, and I remember saying once, like, Oh, that's pretty. And next thing I know I've got my, what she considers to be my version of her thing. This is not my mother. I have to feel like I have to say this because this is not my mother. And it's, it's stuff that I feel that I have to make sure is out for when this person comes to my house.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:20:43):Understood, understood. I don't, you know, I think everyone like dead in my family. So I, I, I get free from some of that, like, but I do. There's a part of me that goes, Oh, someone is thinking about you that's collecting something for you. It just, maybe they would ask them if they could collect. You know, I don't knowDave Dastmalchian (00:21:05):To me that the collecting impulse, I don't relate to it. I mean, with the exception of maybe that I like these pretty snow gloves, I I'm not, I don't collect anything. And my mother collects everything. She does. She does. She collects, she has a China pattern. She does a crystal pattern. She collects, um, she's a big reader. So she collects books. She, yeah,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:21:35):I remember I remember the house on Wayne, right? And it was a duplex. It was a two floor. She had a lot of nice stuff. She had a lot of nice stuff.Dave Dastmalchian (00:21:44):It is, it's all very nice, but it's, it's stuff. It's a lot of stuff. And I'm just finding that. I'm not as into stuff. As I thought I was,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:21:53):Well, I think the pandemic has done that to people too. It has increased for me. Anyway. It has increased my awareness that like, all this stuff is not going to save us from certain things.Dave Dastmalchian (00:22:06):Not from nothing. It's not going to save you from anything and you have to clean it and you have to store it and you have to move it. And you have to, you feel, for some reason you have to replace it. If it gets broken, like it's just a yoke, it's a yoke. And Aaron and I fantasize. When the kids leave, we're going to get a studio apartment. We're going to have no possessions. And we're going to just do whatever we want. That doesn't have anything to do with buying, maintaining, or storing stuff of anything.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:22:38):That's brilliant. I think that is a great plan. D my only caveat is please do it in California. That's all I have to say. Yes, yes.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:22:58):Today on I Survived theater school. We have the fancy friends, Dave Dastmalchian and John Hoogenakker. I call them fancy friends because that's what they are. They are fancy. They work. And they work all the time and they're delightful human beings literally think,Dave Dastmalchian (00:23:13):and they have fancy last name. I was making the episode art. I'm like, Oh, this is, of course these two have to have the longest, last name so that they really do. I've ever had. We'll just call him Dave. You guys have seen. Yeah. And you guys have seen them. I mean, not necessarily together, but, um, uh, Dave was his first film role was in, uh, the dark night. So he, I would love to have him back Sometime and ask about Heath ledger, because I bet that he's got a lot to tell about that anyway. So Dave has a, mostly a film career. He's also a screenwriter. He has written a few films that are excellent, including, um, Animals and, uh, All Creatures Here Below two excellent films. And John is a lot on television.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:24:07):Gotcha. Uh, he was on Jack Ryan as one of the big, big leads. And he, and they're in an outstanding film called Teacher together. So that's somethingDave Dastmalchian (00:24:18):Right. And the two of them wanted to do the interview together because they're such close friends and they shared a lot of memories. And it was interesting to have as it's our first duo. It was interesting to explore their friendship as a way that they both survived theater school. So please enjoy Dave, the small shin and John who can anchor.Dave Dastmalchian (00:24:40):You got to call her up again and ask her to do all right.Dave Dastmalchian (00:24:44):I'm going to make a note of that right now. Anyway. Congratulations, John and Dave, you survived theater school. No, not barely. You guys. I think you both had excellent theater school careers, but I'd like to hear it from you.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:25:06):Uh, w I'm so glad that you're our first duo that we've had on today. The fancy friends. And I wanted to know about your experience, like together as well as a part, but like my first question for you is, did you love each other right away?Dave Dastmalchian (00:25:22):I don't, I don't know. John, did youDave Dastmalchian (00:25:26):Well, for sure,Dave Dastmalchian (00:25:30):Gina the longest and by the way, so good to see you. It's only been 20 years like this. I mean, we've, we've messaged and emailed a lot, but Jesus, this is amazing. Oh my God. Uh, so I was roommates with Gina and we were very close and then I left school for a year. And so the school moves forward. Jen, you and Gita were in the same grade. You guys all moved forward. And when I came back, it was a whole new group of people to get to know. And John, um, was one of the first people that I knew when I got back. So I felt very out of place. And, um, it was hard to come into because it's such a competitive environment and it's such a, um, intense environment. And I was both competitive and intense. So to jump into the fire with a whole new group of people, to kind of, it's hard, cause you're posturing, you're sizing up, but at the same time, you're looking for connection.Dave Dastmalchian (00:26:27):You're looking for support and it's, it's such a conflict. And John, I'm not going to get emotional today. I swear to God, but it was like one of the first people that extended such, uh, a kind generous since he's got that, that, that inimitable,John Hoogenakker (00:26:46):I'm a cuddler.Dave Dastmalchian (00:26:47):sincerity, which is what makes him such a brilliant actor. But he had that like, look me in the eyes in class and like, Hey, he has a little bit of a draw. Like I'm really excited. You're here. And I want to get to know you and I hope we get to work together. And then we went and hung out at his apartment soon after that and maybe smoke something. This is recorded, sorry, John. And then we watched star Wars stuff together and that was our bond. So that's my version of this story.John Hoogenakker (00:27:16):Um, no, God, we, we had a lot of fun. I have old pictures of you and I, and Iyisha and, uh, snuggling ghanaba, um, you snuggling and which I'm going to send you guys. Um, but, uh, yeah, we, uh, jeez, I just remember, uh, I remember Dave's, um, it bullions from day one, his like drive in his, in his positive energy. And I think, um, that is the thing that ha that has, that has been such a, um, such a driving force in Dave's career, um, is that he just never stops. It comes down to energy and positivity, and he's constantly pumping that into the world. And I think Dave has known for many, many years that it, you know, that that kind of stuff comes back to you. Um, and I think I was drawn to that in Dave, uh, yeah, from the giddy-up, butGina Pulice (00:28:10):Also recognize somehow that he needed you to take on that stare you in the eye and tell him you want to get to know him vibe. Did you know that he felt overwhelmed coming back?John Hoogenakker (00:28:23):Uh, I D I think from my perspective, the thing that drew Dave and I, to one another was a sense that, you know, in the theater school at the time that we were all there was such a, um, there was so, uh, it was a lot of mind fuckery going on. And there was a lot of, um, I think a lot of us in the acting track, especially I know this was the case throughout the school wanted, um, positive reinforcement from teachers. And sometimes I think my perspective was that people were manufacturing emotions and things to achieve that positive reinforcement. And Dave, uh, just seemed to be Dave to me, which I really, really, uh, enjoyed and appreciated. And, um, yeah. And so I think that was, uh, that was, um, it was, it was Dave's, um, his, his sort of genuine vibe that I wasJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:29:20):Both of you when I've run into you. I mean, you know, I don't, I live in California now, but I've seen you like at PR and Dave ed ran into you, one set of Starbucks in Chicago, the genuineness is unbelievable. So I, I think you're both fancy and I'm sort of sorry, starstruck, I, but when I, but there is sort of, both of you have this sort of face to face, like, look you in the eye, I'm going to have an actual conversation with you. And I think that makes you not only great, great actors, but what's more important to me is great human beings. And I, um, I don't know. I'm just so glad you guys found each other and that you're friends. It's like, no, it's not. That's how I feel. Yeah. That's how I feelDave Dastmalchian (00:30:06):The work and outside of our mutual, passionate love for the theater acting film, um, storytelling, character creation, cinema history, literature, like John. And I did kick it off immediately with a lot of, of, um, you know, kindred kind of passions for things which we all shared because we all were in that, that, that, that vortex. Um, and obviously we were drawn there because we had a passion for this stuff, but, um, you know, I've been through, uh, the ringer in my life outside of my acting career as well. And, and, and John was always one of the first people to show up and be there for me when I needed someone as well, which was you, you're not taught that in the, again, this is about surviving the theater school you're taught, um, that you're in the ensemble family mode during rehearsal. And it felt like kind of, um, during a production, but then it was right back to, you know, this really intensely bizarre, like John there's no better, I guess, adverb than mind fuckery of, um, and, and it was, it was, um, I'm very grateful, um, and, uh, many great, true friendships came out of that time because when you go through something that intense and that trying, but we, um, we, we, I would love to tell a quick story if I can, because we were kind of, we, weren't kind of, we were absolutely ups. We were in trouble a lot, um, because it's no mystery that I had a pretty intense substance abuse problem in college. And John had a pretty serious attitude problem in college. And, uh, neither of us dealt well with authority, although we loved being directed, which has always been a paradox with us. Like we love great directors that get in and like help guide us and shape things. But at the same time, we are the first people to, you know, get our backs up sometimes. And I, um, and I remember John and I were so frustrated that some of the people like he, he, there was this, this feeling of like posturing or presentation that always felt in authentic to us. And we wanted, you know, Chicago, we want to rub real dirt on our faces and smashed glass, and we're going to get in there. And, and we were doing a scene together from, um, uh, Glen Gary, Glen Ross for, um, second year, uh, scene study work with Joe [inaudible]. And it was so intense. It was the Moss era now seen at the Chinese restaurant. John is just needling into me to like, you're gonna, you're gonna get in on this heist, or I'm going to ruin your life. And we loved, like, we got into that so much. It was all space work. And we're in generally John and I were in, I was either in rave clothes or John was in some tide by Bob Marley thing. And, um, and so we had to speak special guests coming to the theater school who was going to do a scene study, uh, workshop. And it was F Murray Abraham. And, um, I'll never forget. We were all so excited, big fans. We go, they did it at a separate location on campus.John Hoogenakker (00:33:07):And it was where it was history of dramatic lit I think,Dave Dastmalchian (00:33:12):where nobody cheated. And he, um, he Through the fees that he was working on so quickly, and he was getting frustrated, like stop with the, stop with the presentation, like w Let's work these.John Hoogenakker (00:33:28):And he was also, he was also like not giving, like he would give a really incisive note and then would be like, all right, now, fuck off and do better in life!Dave Dastmalchian (00:33:38):He didn't want over preparation. He wanted this to be like a malleable Play-Doh Eve kind of moment where we could, so we were not part of that event, John and I were just sitting in the back row, probably like, just like, Whoa, this is so cool, dude. Like "that's F Murray Abraham!"]. And he looked to the crowd. He's like, is that all you got? Cause they had prepared. I don't remember four or five scenes.John Hoogenakker (00:34:01):Yeah. It was like, it looks like, well, it was like two from each classroom. And, and then we had like a break and the teachers were kind of looking around at each other, like, well, that's all I had. And that's all I got Dave, you went toDave Dastmalchian (00:34:15):Slowik Turned to me and John and slowok. goes, "You guys!"Speaker 7 (00:34:18):You guys, can we do it, John? Can we do it here? And John's like, yeah, let's do it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:34:25):What else is in costumes that they've got their props that John and I hopped up with? Uh, we, we may do, right. We got a bottle that we brought from someone else's seen some cups. Um, and we jumped up there and we did this. We did the scene where F Murray had recently done the piece or he was familiar enough with it that he could kind of jump in and, and do with this. But IDave Dastmalchian (00:34:45):Was so proud that day, even Though I knew what F ups we were. And even though I knew that I was, I knew that the work we were putting into and the discipline and the, and the, and the love we were putting into building these characters together and how much we loved playing off one another was, I knew in that moment, this is something I'm going to do with this guy for the rest of my life. And sure enough, we've gone on to do films, two films together, outside of school, we continue to collaborate. Um, I knew in that moment though, I was like, this guy I'm holding onto him for the rest of my life.John Hoogenakker (00:35:18):Dude, I wanna, I want to jump in because that was such, that was, first of all, it was, it was an amazing experience that we were like, we were like greyhounds, just ready to run. And, and we were also, we didn't realize that. So I'm going to, we talk about surviving the theater school. I don't know where to start, but more importantly, I don't know where I should stop. So you guys got to shut me up. Um, so, so, uh, I ran, I got that bottle from my roommate who drank Jamison, like all the time. So I ran across because we were in Seton hall, not Seton hall, but a sanctuary. And I got the bottle and I came back and Dave and I were getting ready and we do the, we do the scene and I knew, we knew that F Murray was going to just like, give us a note and dismiss us. So he gave us this note. And the w the one thing was I had been breaking up this paragraph that I was giving to Dave, you know, kind of feeling my way through it. And she kind of schmacting him and he was like, you know, this David Mamet gives you all of the direction you need with the punctuation, like Shakespeare. And you need to just drive through without taking a break, because that's going to give you more pay off at the end of the, at the end of the scene. And Dave and I looked at each other and we just started doing the scene before he could dismiss us. So we jumped right into it. And he had gone through all the people in our class that had been put forward. He had gone through upperclassmen, and that was the first group, Dave and I were the first two that had the audacity. Did you jump, take the note and jump back in? And we'll when we finished, he was like, that is preparation.Dave Dastmalchian (00:37:01):[inaudible] mother.Gina Pulice (00:37:05):I love that. I love that because what you're telling me in that is you each made a decision where our company is called Undeniable. So you made it, you made a decision to be undeniable. You made a decision to not let him, I'm sure everybody would. I, I'm not sure anybody else in that situation would have been willing to get up and go on and not let him deny you, not let him interrupt you. And you were like 18, 19 years old, which is like even more. So you, you both mentioned mind fuckery, which is a very evergreen theme on our podcast. And I would love to hear a little bit more about as you look back at this time in your life now, uh, and you imagine, cause some of our professors were probably the age then that we are now, what do you make of some of this? How have you reconciled some of what you now consider to be mind. Great. Did it feel like a mind fuckery then, or does it just look that way in the rear view,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:38:09):I'm just going to add a caveat, a quick caveat in that I teach at the theater school. So, um, I, and, and I, um, I'm trying to change the culture there a little bit. And so, um, I, I just always am really hyper aware that like we want, um, say whatever you want, that's what I want to say, whateverDave Dastmalchian (00:38:36):The Vincentian Brotehrs called in the legal team, man, they're coming, you're talking to John and Hey, don't worry. You go first because I know.John Hoogenakker (00:38:52):Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, I have no idea what I'm going to say. We're on a journey of discovery. No. First of all, to your point, Jen, like I know John and I admire him greatly. I feel like there's gotta be five of him in the planet to achieve all this stuff that he's achieved. And the theater school of today bears little, if any, resemblance to the theater school that Dave and I and you guys, uh, attended. Um, and that said, I don't feel like, uh, the mind fuckery that I, um, felt I was, uh, that I received was the result of, uh, some jerk cadre of teachers sitting around in a circle and being like, who can we -? You know, who can we shit on today? I don't think that's how it was. I think the difference was there was a, a strong, a greater focus on academia. At that point. It was like just giving your life to an institution and, and a philosophy and an approach to doing theater that was, uh, at that time intensely cloistered. Um, didn't allow us to kind of step outside of the school. And we all, uh, to a certain extent kind of knew what we were signing up for. When we came on board, I had been in ROTC when I was in high school. Um, I had competed in debate, so I kind of dealt with a lot of that stuff at the beginning. And I just kind of felt like when I was at theater school, as Dave said, I had a real attitude problem because I was like, I had to take on a lot of debt to go to that school. Um, my family came together and did everything they could to help me, but I, I graduated with a lot of debt. Um, and I kind of felt like, you know what? This is, I'm paying you, but like, we get to have a conversation about this. I know you're the, I know you're the pro I know you've been doing this your entire adult life, but I have questions. And I feel like I'm due an answer and a considered answer. And you don't get to just shut me down because I asked a question and I'm 19 and you're 54. Um, cause I'm here taking on a lot of personal debt that I'm going to carry into my adult life. And you owe me answers. Um, th th that's just, let's just call that an opening, uh, Sally and Dave, you can share it for a little bit,Dave Dastmalchian (00:41:03):Like, you know, it was the perfect place for me to train. The culture was a utterly complicated, complex filled with nuance. Lots of gray area came from a tradition steeped in some really, uh, important and impressive theater movements that were more, um, militaristic and disciplinary and really, um, intense. I'll always be grateful for the tools that I picked up in the theater school to this day, saved me on an almost daily basis sets because the awareness it gave me of my body and my voice, and, you know, the depth of my psychology to be able to solve problems on the fly and repeat, you know, emotional recreations, um, was really important. I will say that there were conflicting philosophies and approaches, which is, I think very healthy. One of the things I loved was that nobody said this is the theater school way. It was like, here's the Joe Slowik way. Here's the Bella Itkin way. Here's the David Avcollie way, here's the Rick Murphy way. You go to these classes, you see what works for you. You see where you're doing the best work, and then you have to grow up quickly and you have to be prepared for this dog, eat dog world of the arts that you're going to be thrown into. Once you graduate here, there is no, you know, um, kind of kind or gentle or entirely psychologically easy way to prepare somebody for the, the, the, the meat grinder that is the show business. And so for all those reasons, I was incredibly grateful. I think there were, there was a lack of oversight when it came to, um, mental wellness with some of the faculty, and I'll always hold them responsible for the fact that they allowed sexual relationships between professors and students. I think it's entirely inappropriate for people in that kind of power, um, in there.John Hoogenakker (00:42:53):It's unbelievable when you look back on it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:42:57):When I think back on the fact that I knew there were teachers that we were meant to listen to and respect and regard and trust with our deepest parts of ourselves who were seduced and having sex with students that breaks my heart. And, and I, I would tell them that to their faces today, if I could see them, but I hope they'll watch. Um, and I also think that, uh, that there was some abusive behavior, um, that I'll never understand other than they were human beings who, um, you know, who were just people that, um, were, uh, that, that, that did, that did some things that may, I like to, I like to believe that they thought they might've been helping push us, or, but some of the things that were either said or done, I go, man, that was, I can remember sitting with Gina one time. And I mean, I I'm a pretty emotionally fragile guy, but I was like on the verge of, of tears, of, of something that had happened with one of the professors that we both really admired, but also we both really kind of feared and, um, and it was just like why, but, but in all, I'm grateful because I'm not one of those people I'll run into people from the theater school who are just carrying so much damage from that time. And I'm so grateful that when I look back on my time at the theater school, in all honesty, it's with a lot of positive, it is I really go, wow. That was an amazing experience. Yes. I have anger, frustration pains about certain things that happen that I can't believe, but I do feel, I feel like it really prepared me for the world in which I'm working now.John Hoogenakker (00:44:37):I totally agree. And I, I, you know, I look back on that time and I kind of feel like what, you know, when I look at things that had that I feel like have gone pear shaped and that I was a part of, I always try and think about what, what could I have done better? And for me, I look back on that period. And I think that I was not, uh, emotionally mature enough or perhaps mature enough in general, to take on board everything that I could have learned, uh, as an actor. And I'm talking about like, uh, technique wise in that program, because I was so emotionally just kind of bombarded with. So, so much of it is, is subjective in the, in the beginning. And we're going into a career where, um, you may go up against four other people in your type, or maybe not in your type who were phenomenal actors, and you may get that job, or you may not. Um, and there could be any number of reasons why you did or you didn't and kind of trying to prepare a child. And let's be honest, if you're not in the master's track, you're still a child, um, for the realities and the emotional rigors of, uh, of what could end up being a career in a full life, doing that stuff would be the greatest act of compassion that an educational center could impart to a child. And I feel like the theater school was like that wasn't even a thing. Um, and, um, you know, I mean, not understanding why, you know, everybody probably makes the case of like, Oh, gee whiz. I was so talented in my hometown. And then I went to the theater school and I was like, Oh my God, everybody's talented. What am I going to do? But you still in class with folks, uh, you know, all these hours a day, all these days a week. And some people are, uh, become darlings. Some people do not. Some people back then, um, were kept on after the first year, after the second year. And some people were not, and there were, there were there, there were like major head scratchers about that, like to go back and to have completed two years and to be respected in the eyes of your peers and presumably in the eyes of your teachers. And then to get that, that letter that, you know, maybe this isn't for you to be able to, to make that determination in another person's life. And in that way is just, it's, it's astounding. That that was what we signed up for. And I'll tell ya, uh, I remember I'll never forget. That was not really made clear. Um, prior to coming to the theater school, like actually sitting there on the first day, I remember sitting cross-legged on the floor and listening to kind of talking, this is the greatest city in the mind of God and His being like, you know, some of you will Graduate. Most of you will not. I remember like, wow, that's pretty intense. Like I was not so clear on the whole half of you are going to get cut the first year and then half the remaining are going to get cut. The second year, that to me was like deeply, uh, ingenuous disingenuous, because what was really happening. And again, the school is a completely different school. Now they've dealt with this stuff. What was happening was they were bringing in free labor that was actually paying them shitloads of money to be free labor, and then kicking them to the curb. They, I think had a pretty good idea at audition, which of these four kids were actually going to make it to graduation. And I think we had some idea of that, but we were literally pitted against one another. I'll give you one example and then I'll shut up and let Dave go again. Um, we did, uh, an intro in second year, lot called Laughing Wild, and it was by Christopher Durang and it's a two-person so two hander, it's a man and it's a woman. And what they did was they cast four males and something like nine females and the director never set the lines. So every night it was literally these kids who still had not been invited back for their third year and could still be cut in a fucking verbal knife fight everyJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:49:11):This is fucking crazy! Yeah.John Hoogenakker (00:49:13):And you know, it was the director. Like I still had really long hair at that point. Pier said Jason Pierce had really long hair. Uh, Bryan Sharp had really long hair. And I think it was Hunter, uh, Andre. Um, and it was kind of like Ilko didn't really like our long hair. So it was like, you guys all have to look the same. That's what I'm going for. So we all got our haircut and then we commenced to like fighting over these lines. And what we ultimately did was probably pretty cool to look at, but it was also a hot mess. Um, you know, cause he'sJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:49:49):Totally, no, I mean, I, I think it begs the, so I guess the bigger question here for me and I don't know what you guys think, but, um, th 17, should we be doing this? I, I really, I mean, I know for me, I'm, I'm grateful as hell I went there. I was, I was cut and then asked back, it was a weird thing. I got a letter and then another letter. And then, um, so as a 17 year old or sick, I was 16. Like, this is so much mind fuckery inherent in the system. And w when we went there, I mean, we're all glad we went, but like man kids, I don't know that we should be, if I would, if I had a kid, I don't know that I want my kid to be engaged in a verbal knife fight at 17 with Hunter, Andre. I I'm just, I don't know, but that's, that's a big question.Dave Dastmalchian (00:50:41):I wouldn't put my kids though on the track right now to be actors because of that. But the reality, the harsh reality is that the business of theater and the business of film and television needs 20, 21, 22 year old actors. So to throw them into the best training you can at 18, 19, 20, 21, it sucks. But it's also like it's an exceptional calling to choose the path of the artist. And it's, it's a, it's a, it's more, you know, not to be, you know, uh, whatever ridiculous about it, but it, it, it, it, it is like it's, it's, so it's such an unfair, the world is so unfair. As we know, Jesus Christ turn on the news right now, the world is an unfair place, but the arts are so unfair. And it's like, if someone's going to it's, it's such a complicated question. Cause I do think like right at like 18, maybe that's the earliest. If my kid said, dad, I want to do what you do. I'd say you do as much community theater in high school theater and drama, as you can speech debate, blah, blah, blah. I'm not taking them to a Hollywood audition until they're 18. Um, and if they want to pursue it, I would want them to go study and train somewhere. Like what the theater school is now, you know, at 18. But yeah, it's really complicated. It is. Yeah.John Hoogenakker (00:52:09):I will say that, you know, I was, I was just going to throw this in. When, when I graduated, I got a job working at Chicago Shakespeare, which was started like a couple months after graduation. And I got on stage with, um, Kevin Goodall, Lisa Dodson, Greg Finkler, Brad Armacost, um, all these amazing, uh, classic classic Chicago actors, um, stalwart Chicago actors. And it was the first, uh, it was the first show in the, in their new space. Um, so they had all these great people in the cast. So I got so lucky to be, you know, a messenger in that play. Um, but that was when my personal education in the theater like really started. And that was when I saw like these Titans, uh, kind of dealing with the humdrum rejection of, yeah, I went for another one at PR I didn't get it. Yeah. But it went to blah, blah, blah. And he's a great dude, which is a thing I've always loved about Chicago. It's like, you know, you get to a certain age, it's always the same folks in the room and you kind of are cheering for everybody. You sit in that waiting room, especially PR and it's, it's always a reunion of friends. Um, but I, I, so when I talk to people, parents of child, actors on sets who want to know what I would advise them to do, if these were my kids like Dave, I mean, I kind of, I'm kind of like, you know, if they are still interested in this, when they're 18, I would take all the money that you've saved for college. If you've saved any and just fund their apartment in Los Angeles or Chicago or New York, like start them off when they're that early, because they're four years ahead of the rest of the pack when they graduate. And they will have spent that four years learning at the feet of actual working professionals.Gina Pulice (00:54:08):Yeah. Well, the truth is when somebody wants to be this from the time they're five years old, which probably all of us did, there's no stopping them. I mean, we've heard stories of parents saying, please don't call, study theater, please do something else. And they're going to do what they're going to do, but so let's bring it back to when you guys decided you wanted to go to a conservatory for college. Was that something you knew all along? Did you figure it out later? How did you pick DePaul?Dave Dastmalchian (00:54:37):For me, it was, it was, uh, it was the, it was fate. It was, um, you know, it was truly fate. I mean, it was, it was like a miracle of God. And to me, God works through teachers. It was the power of teachers. I, um, my parents were a mess throughout my, you know, junior high and high school years where I was very much on my own in a lot of regards. And I was a high functioning, um, academically, you know, in the, in the, in the, in a good tier. Um, but I was really, uh, excelling in both speech and football. Those were kind of my two strengths coming through high school. And I didn't see the path towards, um, the academic dreams that I had for college, um, in, in speech or acting or drama for God's sake, but I did through football. So my dream was going into my senior year of high school. I was going to be as yoked as possible, play the best game I could play, get us to state, get a scholarship to go to a better school than I could go to that I knew was at my hands with the amount of money that my mom and I had. And with that scholarship, I was going to try and become a high school football coach who, who ran the drama club. That was my dream for myself, two teachers, my speech coach and our drama teacher said to sat down with me separately and said, you have something you, we will help you if you're, if you're afraid of applying to like arts programs or theater or following a track and drama and hearing that was mindblowing. And they did, they helped me do the research. I looked at SMU, NYU and DePaul. I did a regional audition and then ultimately up to Chicago and my audition was in front of John Jenkins and John Watts. I'll never forget. I was there in cutoff, Jean shorts, a tie dye, Janis Joplin t-shirt and my football socks. And there was a bunch of kids in leotards and jazz shoes who knew what they meant when they were saying things. I did it, my, my monologue was completely wrong. They said, don't do a dialect that I did, uh, a scene from Equis. And then they, we said, don't do a dialect. And I luckily remembered does a tiger wear a neck tie? And I just threw that out there. And it was fate. It was God, it was whatever you choose to believe. But then I got a letter, uh, very soon after that, that, and I was miserable thinking about playing four years of college football. That's important to note, I did not want to do that, but I knew it was a means to an end. My brother was a collegiate athlete and I knew the demands of that and that, that was going to be my life for four years. But for me to get the education I wanted, it was worth it. Um, and I got this letter that not only had I been invited to participate in the theater school program, but I had also been given this, um, this, this huge scholarship, uh, called the Stanley andJohn Hoogenakker (00:57:35):Good for you, Dave, we're all happy for you.Dave Dastmalchian (00:57:39):That's my story. I'm done as John, just going into the story about the buckets. Hey, I left school with a massive amount of Debt as well because my scholarship did not cover living expenses. That's why I had to leave theater school for a year to goJohn Hoogenakker (00:57:58):Dave. Yeah. Dave wanted to live in a four bedroom, three bathroom.Dave Dastmalchian (00:58:03):Gina can tell you where we lived on Lill. What was Our landlord's name?Gina Pulice (00:58:11):Earl Pionke!John Hoogenakker (00:58:15):was Lill, the place. It was like right around the corner from healing earth resources? Like, yeah, that's the one where like a couple like, or an adjacent building had the, uh, the deck collapsed right there. Yeah.Dave Dastmalchian (00:58:31):And the tanks? remember the Space Time tanks, John. The floating tanks?John Hoogenakker (00:58:33):what's that?Dave Dastmalchian (00:58:33):Didn't we go do that together? The tanks, the, that the, the deprivation. The sensory deprivation ones?John Hoogenakker (00:58:38):Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, right there. One of the oldest ones in the city is right there. Yeah. Thanks for, thanks for a, no dude. I'm so happy. So that'd be for you for getting a scholarship to DePaul. That's great. Um, good for you. Um, I didn't get a scholarship. I, uh, no, we, no, I totally very similar story except I was not going to be an athlete, uh, ever. Um, I was in, uh, I was, uh, in speech and debate in high school. I had not done theater since I was a child, like a younger child, uh, because I got, um, braces and my dad who was a, a local actor in Charlotte, um, was like, there's no, there's no market for a kid with braces. So then I was, um, I think at about 10th grade, I started competing in humorous interpretation, which Dave? Yeah. Um, and, and I did really well in that. And so then when I got to, uh, senior year, the drama teacher and I'd never taken drama at the theater at the, uh, high school, you know, she would, uh, she would accompany the speech team on debate trips. She reached out and she was like, Hey, you know, if you want to take this class, you can take the senior level drama class. And she, and my speech coach, uh, Barbara Miller said, you know, you should, you should check out some theater schools, see where you can study. And we, I looked into like, uh, a Julliard I was really interested in because I knew that Robin Williams had gone there, but I think it was more expensive to audition there. And I somehow missed the whole boat on, you know, I think a lot of people, I know Kelly, my wife, um, auditioned at, uh, in Chicago, but for a bunch of schools all at once. Um, and I, uh, I came in like late January, early February, uh, and we stayed, it was going to be a big deal for my family. So we stayed at the Palmer house. Um, and I went and I, again like, like Dave, I was surrounded by all these kids that just seemed so focused. And so like tuned in to this world that all of a sudden seemed very foreign to me and completely unattainable. And like, I was just completely a fish out of water. And, um, and I did, uh, my, my drama teacher had given me a monologue that was, you know, gonna be probably like, does a tire tire wear a neck tie or something, you know, appropriate for the location for the venue. And I didn't, you know, I, we had done, um, a musical called runaways and there was a monologue and runaways that I thought, well, it just really spoke to me. It was about a, a young kid whose mother had passed away. And he was kind of like just mourning her. And I remembered my drama teacher being like, well, it's your life? Good luck. And, um, and I came, came to the school and we did the whole, like, they let us through warmups, which was bizarre. That was Patrice, I think. Um, and then I did my monologue for like Betsy, I believe, and maybe John and possibly bill Brown. Um, and, uh, and I left completely dejected and I told my dad, I was like, well, that's not going to happen. Um, you know,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (01:02:06):So I have to interrupt and say that everyone we talk to, I am not kidding you. Every single human I've talked to says, I left that place after my audition feeling like, well, I don't, I think I bombed, But no one I've talked to has been like, I nailed that.John Hoogenakker (01:02:26):Well, that's, you know, I that's so, uh, indicative of the way, like the vibe at the time, the teachers weren't like, they weren't there to coddle you and be able to good job. You've really nailed it. I think you're going to go Places said, no DePaul teacher ever. No, no, no. They certainly, certainly they do now. But, uh, but yeah, so we left and I had forgotten my watch. Cause, you know, you had to like all of a sudden, like I don't, I think I just barely remembered to bring sweat pants or something like that. Um, and, uh, so I forgot my watch. So my dad was like, I'm sure you did find bud. And so like the next day or whatever, he calls Melissa Meltzer and he's like, Hey Melissa, I'm wondering, did you guys find a watch? Um, cause John, he lost a watch. You didn't, you didn't find a watch. Huh? Okay. All right. Well, uh, thank you. And then she was like, so how does John feel like he did? And my dad was like, Oh, well, he bombed it. He did very well. I just wanted to make sure we got that watch before we Charlie. And, uh, and she was like, yeah, he's one of you we're sending out a couple, uh, a couple letters of admission right now or whatever acceptance right now. And he's one of them and I just could not believe it. And, um, yeah, it was, it was really, really great. But again, I had no idea what I was signing up for, because if it wasn't DePaul, it was going to be Appalachian state, um, or community college in Charlotte because I mean, I had, I had, uh, I was in AP classes and I had done well on my SATs, but I was not a focused student otherwise. And, uh, didn't have the scores to get into state or Carolina or any of the vaunted, uh, universities in my home state.Gina Pulice (01:04:18):According to my research, you guys did at least two shows together. Uh, uh, yeah, right. Um, I got the Blues and Peter pan, Peter pan,Dave Dastmalchian (01:04:33):The, uh, we did the, um, uh, uh, Glengarry Glen Ross scene together. And then our senior year when we were all very frustrated with the, with the, with the, with the plays that had been mostly, there was some really cool plays that were selected for our fourth year, but we were, we were frustrated collectively John, his wife, Kelly, our friend, Dennis Zack, a whole group of us got together. And we put on our own production of white check. Uh, we worked together, uh, doing that, uh, outside of school and performed at a coffee shop nearby because we were determined to do challenging work that was going to actually give us a chance to do something. So, yeah. But while we were those first four years, and then in the year, since we've done three things together probably or four, yeah,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (01:05:25):teacher was amazing. Teacher was a good,Dave Dastmalchian (01:05:27):thank you. Thank you. I was so excited when, um, we got John, uh, it's just putting him into anything is going to elevate it. As you guys know you watch any TV show, any movie, any play, you name it. John comes into something he's going to elevate it. But I knew that that relationship I needed that character that I played in teacher had nobody else to ground him. He had nobody else to clean too. He had nobody else to like tu tu tu, tu, tu tu, you know, make me feel any sense of, of my, the characters, much needed humanity for the audience to get on board with him in those moments that John and I got. And John did a lot of stuff that magically woke up. It was a great script, but man, John took it to the, a much, a greater level, but just which is the magic he does. He did the same thing in animals. When I said, we've got to please be in my movie, please. I knew what he would do and sure as he did it, he walked in and everybody was just like, I mean, it's one of the best scenes of a movie that I'm very proud of. It's a 90 minute film filled with scenes that I love, but that is the scene I've probably gone back to, uh, more than any. And I go, God, really proud of the writing I did there, but what he did with little nuanced moments, I've, I've learned a lot watching my friend onstage and on, on, on set and I will continue to, I also watch everything he does obviously because he is my friend, but also because he gets to do a lot of really cool stuff. And, um, but I learned a lot. I learned a lot from, from you, John.John Hoogenakker (01:07:07):I feel the same way about you, man. You, I got to say, Dave has always been an inspiration to me because of, as I mentioned at the beginning of our talk because of the positivity that he puts out into the world. And Dave, you know, as he mentioned earlier, uh, went through the ringer with substance abuse. And, um, I think it's less than 7% of people, uh, who, who have been where you were, uh, ever come back. Um, and so to be one of those people who not just survived, but who thrived in an already incredibly challenging industry, um, is just absolutely astounding. And to, and to continually go back to the well and create, be a force of creativity and, you know, your own engine and guiding your own ship, um, while being, uh, you know, a partner and a father is, um, I, I feel so lucky that I've gotten to lean on you for inspiration and to call you for adviceDave Dastmalchian (01:08:17):Or, you know, it's wonderful. Like it's, I'm so grateful and that's another thing I'm so I'll always thank God for the theater school because of John Hoogenakker, and so many people that have been instrumental in my life. And I think it's important to note too, as far as the friendships that were forged in that time, um, you asked earlier too, there was some, obviously there were some teachers that taught me some wonderful techniques and skills, but also really hurt my heart in some certain ways. But that was it wouldn't be fair to, to neglect and not point out that like I'll never forget it. If there was one person who actually did take time to try, I felt like in her way to teach us ways of coping was Phyllis for me, she talked to me a lot about meditation. She introduced me to some books that were really instrumental to my journey, um, and like really wacky, like psychedelic stuff that I was really invested in thinking about at the time and really cool ways of trying to process depression. I didn't, I wasn't diagnosed at that time and I wasn't getting the proper help that I needed for my depression, but that was really, I I'm so grateful, uh, as well as, you know, the encouragement that someone like her showed, she was a needed angel at the time for me, um, in a dark place. Um, and bridges, I mean, I know he wasn't, um, you know, uh, faculty, he was staff, but that guy, um, recognized and saw some stuff that no one else was willing to address in my self-destruction. And he showed up for me way outside and above and beyond the, the, the roll call of whatever his payroll was or required of himJohn Hoogenakker (01:10:03):And his door was Always open. And as a side note, he attended your wedding. I bel

Tyrone, Dujon, and the rest of the Definition Theatre ensemble are working hard to bring more underrepresented stories to the forefront in Chicago’s theatres. Established in 2012, Definition Theatre has not only been successful in creating and sharing these stories but recently received a $1.6 million seed grant from the City of Chicago to build their own theater and community center on the South Side. In this episode, you’ll hear insights on how they navigated this journey, while currently holding full time jobs and careers outside of Definition Theatre. Tyrone is the founding Artistic Director of Chicago’s Definition Theatre, he is a graduate of the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign and has studied abroad at Shakespeare’s Globe. As a first generation Jamaican-American, Tyrone is passionate about equity and inclusion in the fine arts and has completed advanced anti-racism training to lead change in our community. Select theater credits on and off stage include: Definition Theatre, Chicago Shakespeare, Goodman, Steppenwolf, Writers, Old Globe, Berkeley Rep, Milwaukee Rep, and Stage 42 (off-broadway). Tyrone is currently adjunct faculty at DePaul University and the University of Illinois - Chicago while also serving on the Board of Directors for the League of Chicago Theaters. He is also a proud member of the NAACP, SAG-AFTRA, SDC, and represented by Grossman & Jack Talent. Dujon is the Director of Development for Definition. In addition, he serves as the Global Program Manager for Accenture's Black Founder's Development Program. Led by Accenture Ventures, the new initiative will help improve Black communities’ ability to create wealth for those who previously did not have a seat at the table and enable the next generation of innovation. Dujon has traveled, worked, and studied in 50 countries and is passionate about connecting technology, culture, and education within communities. Find Definition Theatre Online: Definition Theatre's Website – Make certain you donate towards the building fund! Definition Theatre's Instagram News Articles Chicago Tribune – Definition Theatre gets $1.6 million for new home on South Side University of Illinois Urbana-Champaign – Definition Theatre expected to Break Ground 2023 Cool stuff discussed during the episode that you should further explore: How to Start a Nonprofit – Tyrone spent time talking about ALL the paperwork, check out this resource that has the basics Black Enterprise – Dujon loves checking this outlet as a source for staying informed on Black excellence American Theatre – Tyrone taps into this resource to stay current on the latest in American Theatre Theatre in Chicago – Tyrone ensures he keeps a finger on the pulse in his backyard as well Donor Perfect – Website that Definition Theatre uses to stay engaged with their donor community Google Workspace – The Definition Theatre team stays connected and can collaborate using this resource

Intro: Boz's brain hurts, Ozark, the ordinariness of crime, drug running in Tijuana, Molly, Jerry Harris and Season 2 of Cheer, unpleasant surprisesLet Me Run This By You: I didn't do anything wrong.Interview: We talk to Carolyn Hoerdemann about Steppenwolf's From The Page to The Stage, John C. Reilly, tenacity, hyper-empaths, Oscar Wilde's fairy tales, Tarrell Alvin McCraney, feminist theatre, Pump Boys and Dinettes, Faith Wilding, Rob Chambers' Bagdad Cafe, Ominous Clam, Zak Orth, Good Person of Szechwan, European Repertory's production of Agamemnon, Danny Mastrogiorgio, Michael Moore's Roger & Me, Chicago Shakespeare Theater, the anti-memoir memoir, and Ann Dowd.FULL TRANSCRIPT (unedited):1 (8s):And Jen Bosworth from me this and I'm Gina Polizzi. We went to theater school together. We survived it, but we didn't quite understand it. 20 years later, we're digging deep talking to our guests about their experiences and trying to make sense of it all. We survived theater school and you will too. Are we famous yet? I have a place to go to do with, it's not my one bedroom with my dog and my husband, but it's still a lot of work, like an and so, and then on top of that, I mean, I just feel like literally, you know what, I texted you yesterday and you said you knew the feeling like my brain is hurting me, but not in a bad way.1 (50s):I don't have a headache. Like I don't, I just was, you know, telling our couple surface, like, I feel like I can literally hear my brain turning and growing and groaning and like working. I've never had that feeling before in my life, which is weird. But like that, that feeling of, oh, I'm doing or knowing that what it was, what it was like, I'm doing a lot of work, you know, like my brain is doing so ridiculous, but that's how I feel, but it's all like, it, it doesn't feel, you know, what it is. I'm used to doing a lot of physical work.1 (1m 32s):Like I'm used to my body doing a lot of work. Like whether it's, you know, like the jobs I've had, like even the jobs that I, when I was a therapist account, you know, a counselor at social services, like I spent a lot of my time, like moving cases of diet Coke and cause we were in like a halfway house. So like I did a lot of manual labor and lot and case management and case management management is a lot of manual labor, like taking clients to appointments. And like, so when using my brain now in this different way, like literally I wished I would have been a camera on me when I was redoing my resume and cover letter specifically for the ad industry, because it is like making something out of nothing and also using words to like basically, you know, trick people, not trick people, but you know, get them to think what you want them to think.1 (2m 27s):And you think, oh, well she's, you know, television writing. The thing about that is like, you can make up anything like television writing really. You can really say, and then pigs flew out of his asshole and then people are like, oh, that's a weird show. But when you're trying to sell yourself to a particular industry with a particular set of skills, trying to make your skills meld into the skills they want, I was like, I couldn't see. After a while I was like, I don't even know what this, like using words like in this space, you leave space is a big word now.2 (2m 59s):So Metta that you are selling yourself to an advertising1 (3m 8s):Up girl.2 (3m 10s):So the PR how I understand it is there is somebody affiliated with this that is an advocate of yours, a champion of yours. And she wants, she wants you in that industry.1 (3m 23s):Okay. Yes, you are understanding. And there's like multiple things here. So she's, she's a screenwriter that I met and she continued on with the master's program. But her big job is her. Her day job is she's like a creative director at an ad agency in the, in the copy department. Right? So she's a big wig and she edits, she's like, she's the big editor there right at this. And I guess they hop around from agency to agency. Look, I don't know how it works, but so she started this new job and she's like, I want you to come work in the copyright. She also gets a very large bonus for every person that comes on that she refers, which I good look, do what you need to do.1 (4m 6s):But I think it's like five grand per person that she brings. I that's what I'm led to believe from the website. So anyway, there's like a, and so she literally Gina. So I sent her my updated resume and cover letter letter looked great. And then she applied me for 30 jobs. So then I have two.2 (4m 27s):Wow.1 (4m 29s):So which sounds great, which is awesome. Copywriting, all different kinds of copywriting. But for each of those jobs, I have to fill out demographic form. So last night I literally was up after myself tapes one self-tape last night clicking. I am not a veteran. Yes, I am Latina. No, I'm not disabled2 (4m 53s):Online. I was going to say, why don't they have one form, but it's1 (4m 58s):Yeah. It's a different job number. Right? So like every time, oh my God. So then, and sign, you have to sign every, so I literally was like, by the time I went to that, my brain, I was like, what? I'm not a veteran. I'm not a veteran like that. I was like mumbling to myself. And so, so, but I have to say like, you know, it's a good skill to build for. Like, I think that thing about, we only use 5% of our brain. They they've like debunked that right. They've said like that. You can't, but I'm telling you my brain, just like the Grinch's heart grew three sizes that day. My brain is like literally growing three side.1 (5m 41s):I don't know if it's three sizes, but it's, I can feel my, my, my like pathways changing in terms of the skills that I'm using. So that's great. You know,2 (5m 51s):I don't know. I mean, it can't be bad. Nothing. The good news is all of this work you're doing can't lead to anything bad to something. Yeah. Not illegal, You know, honestly, it's really saying something. I finally started watching Ozark. Oh God. And I, what strikes me about it is like, oh, this is not, it's not that this could happen to anybody, but you just think about like how ordinary crime really can be, you know, and how criminals aren't all in a layer or living in a way it's just, it's just moms and dads and, and people who need it, who need money in and who needs to run around and get it right quick.2 (6m 40s):Yeah. And I don't know, I will, I'm only one, not even the full first season in, so there may be a lot of stuff that I don't know, but like, it seems to me that this Jason Bateman guy was just a regular guy who got kind of wrapped up in this criminal enterprise1 (6m 58s):Didn't happen. You, I can see like most of my clients that I saw like were knowingly doing, you know, they were like, oh, I'm going to be a drug dealer and a gang member now. And no, but there were occasionally people that got involved in like scams, you know, financial fraud that you could see how it would start off and, and, and case in point miles. And I have a friend, an older guy, friend, we won't name because this is so illegal was like, Hey, what are you guys doing over Christmas break? And we're like, we're going, doing whatever. And he's like, Hey, do you want to, I shit, you not do you, if you'd let me know if you want to make some money, driving a camper from here to Tijuana.1 (7m 41s):And I, why like, what are you talking about? He's like, yeah, we'll give you like each $5,000 of it. And I said, well, what do you mean? Why do you need the, the, the, the camper and Tijuana? And he was like, oh, there's drugs in it. There's marijuana. And I was like, no. And miles was like, absolutely not. I'm like, have you met miles? Are you boy?2 (8m 3s):Oh, not, not marijuana, I guess,1 (8m 5s):Because it's marijuana. I don't, I don't2 (8m 7s):Think it's legal. Why do they have to do1 (8m 9s):That? I don't know. I think it was like a mass quantity or something like that. I don't know. Like, you're not allowed to like traffic, like large amounts of marijuana from different countries to over the border. Like, but so, especially in Mexico, like what? So I don't know. And we were like, Myles was like, absolutely not. I mean, miles is a lawyer. Like, what are you talking about?2 (8m 34s):Well, it's funny how just one casual aside a reference can really change your whole perspective on somebody you've known for a long time. Like I thought I've been in that situation before, you know, you think, you know, somebody and then they just casually say like, well, you know, we're swingers or1 (8m 55s):The other, the other, the other day I was meeting with somebody. Totally. And this actually didn't make me think less of him, but it was just like, he's like a totally looks like a total straight laced guy. If you're going to look at him, you know, white dude, thirties, balding, whatever. And he's like, yeah, I met him like the first time I, he was talking and he was like, oh yeah, the first time we met, we did Molly. And I was like, wait, what? At first I thought, Tina that's crystal meth. And I thought, but that wasn't, that it's Molly is whatever, HBM,2 (9m 25s):Whatever,1 (9m 26s):MTMA Molly. And I, like, I was so weird and we're like old people, what is happening? It's sitting in a cafe and you're talking about Molly. I don't know. I just it's, it totally rocked my world, which is, I think why I like to write too is because I do like to write those things in where you're like, wait, what? You know? Like, like,2 (9m 53s):Yeah, I have to say just, just the thought of learning, something like that, about somebody that I know is scary to me. And it, it just made me remember that I, after you mentioned season two of cheer, I started watching it. And I forgotten about the whole thing about that guy, Jerry Harris. And it was so heartbreaking to me when that happened. Not that it's worse or better if the person is well-known, it's just, you know, he, he seemed like a person who has such a hard life and it seemed like he was finally getting some, you know, something that he really deserved.2 (10m 38s):And then, and of course, I understand that when I hurt that hurt people, hurt people. And that he was probably doing this because this has been done to him. I don't know, man, I don't, these are surprises. I don't care for, I wanted it to stand for the rug and like for these kids to go on and being abused, that's not it at all. It's just, it's so disheartening. Well, it's really1 (11m 5s):It's. So there is, so yeah, it goes beyond grief. It's like goes beyond disappointment. It's like grief. And it's also, I think for me anyway, and I don't know about for you recreates the feeling of which is what I felt all the time with my parents, which is, oh, I know these people. I can trust these people. Oh God, I'm not safe around these2 (11m 30s):People. Okay. Thank you. That's exactly what it is.1 (11m 33s):I have that experience in Los Angeles, 40 times a day. Right. We're like, I want to like someone and then they'll say some fucking shit. And you're like, okay, well this is, you're a psychopath. Okay. Right. Like I'm talking to this. There's like, I meet them all the time at co-working because you know, co-working attracts like everybody, you just have to have money to have an office here. It's not like they, you know, vet people and some I'll be having a conversation with someone who seems relatively normal. And then they'll be like, oh yeah. You know, I was like, I really admire this Japanese porn star that like really knew what she wanted in life.1 (12m 13s):And it's not that there's anything wrong with being a Japanese porn star. It's that this guy like casually dropping, you know, and then talking about the kind of porn she does in a coworking setting. I I'm like, dude, I gotta go. I gotta make a fucking resume over here. Like I don't need to, but it's it's that in with him. It's just, I was just more like, oh, you're that you're going to bring this up to a stranger. Then I'm getting better about like, what's safe and not safe. But I do think that when you invest in something like Jerry or the cheer or a parent, and then they fucking do some shit, you're like, oh great. I'm not safe with you. That's,2 (12m 50s):It's what it is. It makes the feeling of own. And then, because I tend towards misanthropy, I'm like, okay, nobody's say if you can't trust anybody, everybody's out to get you, which is not true either. But it becomes, that is my defensive posture that I immediately tack back to, you know, I could go away thinking like, oh, there's goodness in the world. And some people and humans are inherently good. And then boom, something happens and I fail. And instead of, and I don't do the opposite when somebody does something good. I don't say yes, it's P you know what I mean? I don't, I don't have the same positive connotation that when somebody does something bad, it makes me say everybody's terrible.1 (13m 34s):It's really interesting because I'm having the experience of having to, what is it? So having to have a little more caution with people, I tend to really, really, really love everybody at first. Like really like I'm like, that person is awesome, but then they start talking crazy shit. And in the past I would have dismissed it and been like, no, I'm just sensitive. Right. Or I'm just so I'm trying now to be like, no, I wasn't there. When I was in therapy yesterday, I was like, no, no. Like in that moment I felt like this is not good for me.1 (14m 16s):And if I am not going to stand up for myself and take care of myself, nobody else is. So I have to mix a little more of the caution in with my, what can be Pollyanna kind of stuff. I have to be mindful of what my instincts are telling me about somebody, because I then will end up, you know, talking about very explicit Japanese porn techniques for half an hour and then walk away feeling violated and fucked up.2 (14m 49s):Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. You know, I knew this. I ha I know somebody who's exceedingly reserved. She doesn't, I like her I'm we're friends, but she doesn't tell you anything about herself. Like, or it takes a long time. And it's just this little snip, like, as an example, I don't know how old she is. And I bring up my age all the time and I, and I think she's younger than I am, but somebody recently said, oh, actually I don't think she's. I think she's more like your age, but that's, but she's never chimed in whenever I've said anything about how old I am.2 (15m 31s):She, she, she won't tell she's, she's a mystery. And on the one hand, I think, oh, she's just, she's just protecting herself for the reason that you just said. I mean, you know, she, she knows me kind of, but it's not like she really, really knows me. Some people really wait until some people don't just give out their confidence to anybody for some people you really, and I, you know, I guess like good for her. Maybe that's the way to go. I don't know. I, I tend to be more like you, not that I love everybody, but that I assume, I assume everybody has good intentions.2 (16m 13s):And, and then it's very surprising and sad and shocking to me when they don't like the thing that happened to me last week, this fricking guy, I was at the, I was picking my son up from tennis and where I've been, where I've been. Yes. And the place has bad vibes. I, I w I don't like the place. The parking is annoying, but yeah, the parking is annoying anyway. So you're, you're not supposed to wait by the curb. The parents aren't supposed to wait by the curb and align for their kids to come out, but everybody does. Right. It's just how it goes. Cause there's nowhere to go. Right. And it's, and it's been really icy here. So even sometimes I will park whatever, but this time I'm thinking, well, it's really icy.2 (16m 57s):And I just don't want him to, it's not lit up really in the parking lot. I just don't want him to fall. So I'm waiting in line and the guy in the car behind me hunks, and I, I assume he's not honking at me. Why would he behind me? Me? I'm just, my car is just sitting there honks again. Hong's a third time. And I put my arm out, like, go, go around. I just thought maybe he didn't think he could go around me. I still honking. So I just kind of opened the door a little bit. I look behind me and I'm like, what's the deal? And he's just yelling something. So I think, okay, whatever, I'll just loop around, pull over, go through the parking lot, turn to come back. And the guy I had the right of way.2 (17m 39s):And he just zoomed in, in front of me made so that I had to slam on the same guy. So I had to slam on my brakes, but then he gets out of the car and walks up, walks over to me. Of course, I lock my doors and he's like just screaming obscenities at me. Now later on, I had the thought this of course had nothing to do with me. Of course, this is how, you know, I didn't do anything wrong. This is about a person who really wanted to kick the dog. And he found that he found somebody to, to do that with absolutely. But I tend to go through my life in kind of this bubble of like, everybody's got everybody's well-intended and maybe even he was well-intended it just, it just didn't come across in the, in this experience.2 (18m 30s):And1 (18m 32s):Did he walk away?2 (18m 34s):I said, get the fuck away from me. Get the fuck away from me. By the way, my dog was in the back of my dog, who barks at literally every leaf like Wallace.1 (18m 54s):What kind of wing man are you? You fucker anyway. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I think those experiences are very particularly about driving and cars and obviously there's a whole road rage. Like there's literally a television show about road rage, right? Like the truth really? Oh my God. Yeah. It's a horrible it's so triggering. Don't watch it, but okay. I mean, yeah, it's ridiculous. But that being said it's very, to me, what happens to me in that situation? I'm sorry, that happened to you is yeah. Like what you mentioned on social media, which is feeling completely powerless and like, it's scary.1 (19m 38s):It's out of control. It's traumatizing. It's I, it's not good. It's not good. And it is also to me that what the feeling is being ambushed, right? Like you're being ambushed by, by a fucking crazy ass and you didn't do anything wrong. See, the thing is, I get into this thing of like, I didn't do anything wrong. And again, if I can get to the core of it, which is as a kid, I literally didn't do anything wrong. And all this shit rained down upon me, this trauma and this and this in this bullying and this whatever. And it triggers that in me. Like, wait a minute.1 (20m 19s):I, all I'm trying to do is do good, protect my son, pick up my thing, do this merge into the fucking freeway. It doesn't matter. And then I get like, this is not fair. Like I get really hurt is what it is. I get hurt. I'm shocked and hurt. And then the person, there is no, there is no resolution, right? Like the guy doesn't then call you later and say, I'm so sorry I acted a Dick. Or you can't even call the police and be like, this guy acted like a Dick. We're like, they're like, well, did he threaten you? No. Did he? Then they're like, fuck yourself.2 (21m 5s):Right. To say that it's, it is linked to, you know, growing up in a dysfunctional family. I'm for myself, looking a little bit more deeply into that. And because I, and I'm not saying this is the case for you, but for me, I think that I have said that I think that I have convinced myself that I'm never doing anything wrong, you know? And, and not just say that I was doing something necessarily wrong in the situation with the sky, although actually, you know, if I could have crafted it better, I would have paid attention to the flag from really from the first time they honk, which is like, there's something wrong with this person.2 (21m 51s):Do you know what I mean? Like, and yes,1 (21m 55s):Like get away, let me remove2 (21m 57s):My instinct. My instinct is to want to fight back. In fact, I remember this time that the some concert or something like that with Aaron, it was early in our relationship. So I was in my early twenties and this guy kept whatever. He kept stepping too close to me something. And I, I pushed him and pushed him. He, and of course, what did he do? He looked at Aaron like, are you gonna like, don't do that to me. I don't want to, you know, and it's, but it's not fair. He's encroaching on my space. He's like fair. Who, who told you the thing that we're going to be fair? Like it's, you know, so I guess that's the thing is I sometimes go out in the world thinking like, I'm an, a student and therefore, you know, nothing.2 (22m 42s):I don't, I shouldn't be getting any demerits. And if I get into merit, it's not my fault. I do that a lot.1 (22m 50s):I have the same thing. Yeah. I mean, I, I do it where it's like, I, yeah, I have my version of that is like, I'm a nice person. Like I do good. I'm nice. How dare you do bad or do wrong or treat me bad. Yeah. I mean, he it's, all this stuff is so layered. And2 (23m 10s):As far back, like it takes a lot. Yeah. Yeah. It's so far back. If it took this many years for us to form this way, imagine how long it's going to take us to On the podcast we are talking to Carolyn. Carolyn has a BFA from a theater school and imitate from the school of the art Institute of3 (23m 45s):Chicago. Carolyn is a performer and a professor and a lovely and pathic, amazing human. So please enjoy our conversation with Carolyn Bournemouth.4 (24m 8s):We're not here to talk about cancer. I've got no theaters because the Rick Murphy shirt Murphy's now this is actually made by Kevin Foster, who was my, that student. But I guess so I directed a workshop that he was in. He's a wonderful man. He ended up moving to Alaska, teaching people how to climb ice mountains. And now has a wife and a baby and never left Alaska. So we had that weird connection. Cause I lived in Alaska for the summer in between my first and second year of school, which I guess is it's like another theater school story in a way. I forgot about that one.2 (24m 47s):We're here. So Carolyn Hornimann, congratulations. You survived theater school. Yes you do.4 (24m 56s):You survived it. I know. That's why I bought this very expensive mix. So I would get lots of voiceover work that I never get.2 (25m 2s):Hey, maybe this is going to be your open Amy4 (25m 4s):Visit shit. This is it. This is my ticket. This is my ticket. I love podcasts.2 (25m 10s):So you survived as a student and you teach4 (25m 13s):DePaul. I teach there. I mainly teach the non-majors, which I love, but I have directed a couple of a workshop, intro type things. But many years ago, I keep putting in proposals. They don't ask me to do again, supposedly next year, maybe I will be, which would be awesome because I have this idea to do a version of Bernhardt Hamlet with all genders and just like totally gender fluid. So2 (25m 42s):You have to submit a proposal4 (25m 44s):For a show. That's a whole nother story. I'm probably another podcast, but I have submitted proposals. But oddly enough, a couple of times I did direct. I was just asked to, and that, I guess we're going backwards to go forwards. Are we always bad and make it go forward? Right. Which is that amazing? I think it's David Ball. The book that they made us read called backwards and forwards. Do you guys think I read In HDL, you had to read this book called backwards and forwards. Anyway, I used it in my master's thesis too. Cause it's brilliant. But anyway, backwards and forwards, I was in graduate school.4 (26m 24s):Rick Murphy was like kind of very interested in what I was doing. I was doing work on performing new feminisms and he was like, what the fuck is that? What's going on at the white cards? You can curse. Oh, no podcast. And, and that's a whole nother story because actually Rick Murphy was not my teacher. I had David AVD, Collie, and I went into to Rick Murphy's office. Like I guess it was probably my senior year to ask him advice about wanting to go to London, to study his full cereals. Right. As if I hadn't already been studying for serious. Right. Cause I wanted to go to Europe and be a fancy pants, real actor. And he was like, why are you going to do that? Why don't you just stay here and find a company that does European work.4 (27m 7s):So then I was in the European repertory company for 12 years. Oh,1 (27m 10s):Oh, that's a, that's a nice long run. Is that, is that company still around?4 (27m 14s):No, that's another story.1 (27m 16s):You have so many stories4 (27m 18s):We need to have, like, I have too many stories, too many stories. I don't even1 (27m 21s):Know where to start. Well, here's where I'll start. Did you just let's get the facts? So you went to BFA at the theater school, but you got to be MFA somewhere.4 (27m 32s):Oddly enough. No, I got, what is an M a E a masters of art and art education from the art Institute of Chicago, which is funny. Cause the Goodman started at the art Institute. So I guess I'm like super Chicago already.1 (27m 45s):You did that. Okay. I wanted to get the facts down. That is why. So then I would like to start when you were a child, were you always this awesome where you just like, fuck it. I'm going to4 (27m 59s):Just be crunchy. I have cool glasses, like YouTube,1 (28m 2s):There's serial killer glasses that we have just FYI.4 (28m 7s):I am from a small town down south. And I guess in a way I knew somehow that I wanted to be an actor from like watching old Betty Davis movies with my mom,1 (28m 17s):Her like Betty Davis.4 (28m 20s):And then I, my dad died when I was a sophomore in high school unexpectedly. And I was with my English teacher who taught us Shakespeare. He was fabulous. Mr. Beaver, very eccentric man who was probably gay and was not able to be out in our little small town. And Mr. Beaver took us to another small farm town school bus to all in, to see the show that was coming in from Chicago. And it was from the page to the stage Shakespeare by step and1 (28m 55s):Walk, a little company called4 (28m 59s):John C. Riley was one of the two count of two actors. There was a man and a woman. I wish I knew who she was. I went on deep dive search last night to find out and I can't find it anywhere on the internet. Was that my computer making a noise? Oh,1 (29m 15s):I didn't hear, I didn't hear it either. So something, well, here's the thing I'm sort of in touch with John C. Riley for various weird reasons. So I might ask him,4 (29m 27s):Please ask him, oh, he's the only one that will know. It's not anywhere on the internet. And I don't talk to him, although he's very close with Rick Murphy, oddly enough. They're like buds. But so, so anyway, we're in this, you know, school editorial, I'm watching this Shakespeare show with Jonsi rally and this woman that was also amazing. I hate that. I only know the guy, right. But they had a trunk and they would pull out costumes and props from the trunk. And they went through several scenes of Shakespeare. It was, you know, like devised, wonderful, amazing theater traveling the country, like the old frickin work progress association do used to do with the federal theater, which we should still have. Thank you very much.4 (30m 7s):And I, you know, had the PR I remember holding the program to like, with like, who are these people? What did they do? Where did they go to school? Oh, theater school, DePaul university. That's one question. Okay. How old were you? Like 15 amazing. Maybe 16. Cause I looked and it said it was 86. My dad died in 85. I was 15. I was 16. So I then also had, I was the president of the thespians of Lincoln community high school in Lincoln, Illinois. And I had, we, one of the things that we got was I forgot what it was. Oh, I wish I remembered it was a fabulous name. Like it wasn't forensics theater or something.4 (30m 49s):The, the title of the magazine you would get, it was like a high school theater magazine. And you got a free subscription of that for a year. Cause you, you know, you were the president of the Philippines and it also of course had a wonderful little spread about the theater school. So then I decided it was either going to be NYU theater school. My mom wanted me to go to ISU and kept saying, John Malcovich went there. John Malcovich went there because that was only 45 minutes away from me. So she really wanted me to go there, you know, cause my dad had just fucking died and she and I had moved from the country into the town and she wanted me to stay close, but she wasn't going to say that. But I know that now that that's what she wanted. Plus it was a lot cheaper and also Webster, which is in St. Louis. I think so somehow I got into, I think ISU in Webster, but I don't remember auditioning.4 (31m 33s):I think I just like had to write an essay and say I wanted to go Tish. I didn't even, I don't think pursue it because I couldn't afford to go to New York to audition. I only auditioned at the theater school. I addition to in my junior year I got in and my junior year, I knew where I was going for my senior year of high school. That's awesome. My brother drove me there and his, he had this old convertible. I remember driving down lake shore drive with my brother. It's my brother who now has cancer. And he took me to this audition. I don't know where he went or what he did with his big, long, old, like 67 do you know, muscle car that he had. But I went in and I did the audition and I did the voice and I did the weird movement and I did my two monologues and I don't remember exactly who was there.4 (32m 16s):I think it was maybe Phyllis Gemma stuff. Maybe it was his Carol Delk person who was a movement teacher who then I never really had. But anyway, yeah, I got, I got in, I remember getting the letter. I remember standing on my stairs in my house in Lincoln, Illinois, because then, you know, you've got to actually better in the mail. There's no emails or anything. And I was standing on the stairs is my, mom's stood at the foot of the stairs and opening it and being like, and then she's like, well, you know, we'll figure it out2 (32m 47s):Time out for one second. Do you think that kids think about us opening letters? The way that we think about people opening scrolls1 (32m 55s):Or telegrams? Yeah.4 (32m 59s):I have to explain to my students with snail mail is because at the end of every quarter I send everyone a little card, just a little thank you card. I've been doing it for like 15, 16 years now. So I can't stop now that I started this tradition and I'll ask them for their snail mail and they'll be like, what's that? And then I'll have to explain to them what it is and then they'll give it to me and they'll leave off like there's zip code or the town on her. I'm like, no, you have to put everything.1 (33m 19s):So there is a, I met someone at my coworking space who is like, I think 25 and they didn't know to put stamps on letters. So he just4 (33m 34s):Imagined that he1 (33m 34s):Was going to the post box and I said, oh, you're going to the postbox. I said, oh, you forgot your stamp. He goes, what? I was like, oh my God. Anyway.2 (33m 46s):And also I have to backtrack about one of the things that John C. Reilly thing was that a DePaul production or Novus Devin4 (33m 54s):Oh seven2 (33m 55s):Will forever. Right? Okay.4 (33m 57s):It must've been one of his first jobs out of school cause it was 1986. And I was also looking because there was this amazing picture of him from Gardenia, I think in the brochure. So then not only are in the magazine that I had, I don't think I ever got a brochure in the mail. It was this magazine. I'm going to find out the name of it. Cause it was just a cool little magazine that the theater kids, theater nerd, Scott, and we, and I got it for free when I was the president of, at that speeds. And so there was this wonderful picture that was some of the, you know, lovely glorious lady like grabbing, holding onto his leg or something was very dramatic. And this story goes further because then I'm at the theater school is my freshman year and there was the God squad party.4 (34m 39s):Nobody's really talked about the gods squad a little2 (34m 41s):Bit.4 (34m 43s):So the God squad party, I don't remember who my God parent was. I don't even, I must not been very good cause I have no idea who it was, but I was at this party and John C. Riley was there.2 (34m 56s):You must've been levitating.4 (34m 59s):And Don Elko was there. There was teachers therapy for smoking and drinking with the teachers. I was like, mind blonde, what's going on? And I said, I want it to John C. Riley in the kitchen, leaning up against the kitchen sink with like a beer or something. And I was like, excuse me. I need to tell you it's still on me about why I'm here. You know? Like I got tell him2 (35m 22s):That he's4 (35m 23s):A nice guy. Remember what he said? I don't remember anything. I was just like, that's1 (35m 27s):So good that,4 (35m 29s):And this is before yeah, it was famous. Right. And he might not have even ended up being famous. This is like, I thought he was that famous from skiing. That fricking page, the stage new person traveling around tiny little rural towns of Illinois.1 (35m 45s):That's amazing.4 (35m 47s):So I would love to know what he thinks of that, that show. If he has memories of doing it, who the other,1 (35m 53s):This podcast. I mean like you'll listen, you'll listen to, if you listen to some of the podcasts, you'll hear my John C. Riley story. It's pretty, it's pretty funny.4 (36m 1s):Oh, you have one too. Okay. I've been, I went this way. I have bags. I went down deep dive last night.2 (36m 9s):I love that. A lot of people do that. A lot of people when they find the podcast go and listen to a bunch of. So what was the experience like for you? You were walking down memory lane. What was it making you feel?4 (36m 21s):Ooh, I don't know. Now it's making me want to cry. It was, you know, I was 17 and I started there. I had no idea what I'd got myself into and a lot of it, you know, really broke my heart, but I also think it may, you know, like everyone else has said it made me who I am, made me kind of a tough skinned bad-ass, but I'm also a hyper empath and have trauma. And so now I have to deal with, you know, all of that in my old age. But I did have experiences there in classes with certain teachers, with certain instructors, certain directors, I lived with five girls in a two bedroom apartment on the corner of Sheffield and Belden.4 (37m 13s):We were all poor. Nobody could afford anything else I could barely afford to go to showcase. It was only in New York that year was when they went back and forth between New York and LA I guess, or I don't think we'd even started doing LA. It was the only New York and yeah, I don't know. I mean the whole casting pool process, the whole cutting process. I mean, obviously it didn't get cut, but that was, you know, traumatic. I've heard other people talk about how they didn't really think about it or this and that. Like Eric Slater was like, I don't really think about it. And I was like, I have to say,2 (37m 45s):I hope that isn't over the wrong way. A lot of men didn't really4 (37m 47s):Think about it. I was going to say, it goes a little bit ago and I know him, I'm friends with him and sat there for a little bit of privilege there.2 (37m 55s):Just like, it's just, it's like how a fish doesn't know it's in water. Like you just don't know.1 (38m 1s):Yeah. I mean, they just are doing their set dance. Right. And everyone's dancing around them, but we sort of had to do our own thing. What do you think the tears are about? Like when you, when is it just raw motion or is there like tears for young, a young version of you? Or like it's just a lot.4 (38m 22s):I'm a very teary person. I think. I don't know exactly what it is. I'm in therapy. It's I know. I just,1 (38m 29s):I am the same way. Like I,4 (38m 32s):I get, I get overwhelmed. I get really moved just by kind of yeah. And that sort of strange and weird that I'm still there in some weird way. Like I'm an adjunct, I teach the non-majors, but I'm there. And I went back actually, Rick Murphy directed a show that I adapted for the children's theater called the selfish giant and other wild tales. W I L D E all the Oscar Wilde's fairytales and Alvin McCraney was in it. First of all, Oscar Wilde wrote, wrote, he wrote fairytales and I had actually adapted another book that somebody else ended up having the rights to.4 (39m 13s):And so Rick was like, well, you know, I know you really wanted to do that one, but if you find something else, I'll still direct it. And so I was like, okay, let's do this. And so I adapted us, grows fairytales. Awesome. For me to read, love, to read that I can find it somewhere. Might actually be a hard copy of it and I'd have to like scale or something. I don't know where it is. That was like 2002. I think there's also pictures of that. I also found which I didn't know the production history of the theater school online. You get the pictures for almost everything and they're almost all taken by John Bridges, right. Bridges, which is amazing. Cause these, I don't know why I only have these two printed out of the old whore and the sister-in-law from the good person of such one, which actually is like a happy, sad, weird story because I auditioned to be course and I was called back for it and I really wanted it.4 (40m 8s):And it was that awful time where they would post on our side of the theater school, glass doors that casting it like midnight. So we would come there while we waited and we went to the door and not only did I not get it, but one of my friends got it, of course. Cause how were, how was it not going to be your friend gets it? And, and then I see old whore and sister-in-law, and I just, I had heels on and I took them off and I started running and I like cut my feet up, running in the street crying and like old 18 years old. And your sister-in-law told her, well, that's another thing, you know, because of my voice and my larger frame, I've always been cast older.4 (40m 53s):Even in high school. I have a very traumatic story actually being in high school. And my father dying when we were doing cheaper by the dozen, which if you know the story, the dad leaves at the end and doesn't come back cause he dies and we're doing this play. And it was must have been like the end of the rehearsals right before we opened. And my director who was one of the English teachers at my high school, I remember being on the phone with her because I remember exactly where I was standing in my house. And instead of being like really sympathetic about my dad dying, she was talking about how I was the younger of three of the sisters and the girl that got the older sister, which is the part I wanted, who was the daughter of another English teacher who was always getting all the parts I wanted.4 (41m 34s):She didn't have as big of breasts. And my English teacher was like, maybe we can, you know, tape you down. And I thought, why didn't you just cast me as the older sister plus I was wearing this like beautiful, old, like 40 suit. That was my mom's was vintage suit that I loved. So it was kind of tight and probably did really show my frame. I was 15 and my dad had just died. This woman's telling me to tape my breasts down.2 (42m 7s):So yeah,4 (42m 7s):I always, I always got cast older and I can see what2 (42m 10s):He went down the road of wanting to do feminist theater. I mean, it sounds like from an early age, you were, you were made aware of double standards and beauty standards and all that kind of stuff.4 (42m 21s):1994, I think it was, I had graduated. I was auditioning. And it was when you had to look in like this paper for the auditions and there was like a line you called, oh God, I wish I could remember it. It was, you had to call this line and stay on hold forever and listen to all the audition notices. And there was an audition for pump boys and dynamics, which I was excited about. Cause I'd seen it when I was younger with my mom and I thought, oh, that's fun. And it literally said the men will be paid. And I got a fucking article in the Chicago Tribune about that.2 (42m 55s):You did. Oh, tell us about it. You just wrote about,4 (42m 60s):You know, they they're, they're like backpedaling about, it was like, well it's because the musicians they're going to get paid and the musicians are mad at first of all, now I'm thinking back like, why did the musicians have to be men? And you literally still wrote, the men will be paid. He didn't write, the musicians will be pay. So yeah. I don't know how I did it now. Now it's all kind of a blur. I just started calling places and I got a reporter from the Tribune to like talk to me and do a whole article about it.2 (43m 25s):Oh. So you're really tenacious. That's what I'm getting. I'm getting that. You get something, whether it's a goal or you're trying to write an injustice and you attach yourself to it,4 (43m 36s):Right. I'm an Aquarius moon. I know this. Isn't an astrology podcast, but I've looked at your side. I've learned in the last couple of years, I'm Scorpio, sun cancer, rising, thus the tears and then Aquarius moon, thus the righteous justice for all.2 (43m 52s):I love that. I love that you4 (43m 54s):Did tons of work after school ended up doing tons of work like in, in schools, after-school programs, writing and drama programs and things like that, which ended up taking me to go back to graduate school and get the Mae and education. But then that was like a lot of solo performance work I did too, with this woman, faith wilding, who was like, look her up. She likes started women house it, I think Cal arts and like the seventies, she has this famous piece where she rocks in a rocking chair and says, I'll, I'll wait until I'm old enough. I'll wait till I fall in the I'll wait until I'm married. I'll wait. You know, just incredible woman who taught this class called new feminisms. She taught one called body skin sensation.4 (44m 37s):I mean just, and so I was doing all this incredible work again, looking at myself and being a woman and being an actor and what the trauma that I'd been through. And then my thesis was doing a performance experiment with a bunch of young women from all over Chicago, like high school age women talking about their mothers and feminism and teaching them about feminism and1 (45m 1s):Well what, okay, so, so a question for you, first of all, I tidbit I have to share that we ha we spoke with, I think it was Joel Butler who was a stage manager and said that they would come out and walk to tease us. When we were waiting for the list to come home, they would pretend that they had news and go like the people who weren't involved. Anyway, I just have to say the whole thing was a setup. Like the whole thing was a fucking setup. So all it was like the hunger games and it was also that in itself was a play like a theatrical experience of man.4 (45m 41s):I don't really know how they do it now. It's all online.1 (45m 44s):It's all online. Yeah. They sent you an email with your casting, but I'm just saying like, when I look back, my little corner of the world was walk, walk, walk, look at the list. Feel like shit, walk, walk, walk. But there was a whole play happening around us of everyone knew what the fuck was going on. And it was part of the thing to have this sort of, yeah, it was, it was a production, it was a fucking production, a tragedy for most of us. Right? Like, and anyway, it just was interesting to hear the perspective, like everyone knew what was going on and everyone played a part is what I'm saying is what I get from the theater school. Like it was all back in the day. Anyway, it was all part of a thing.1 (46m 24s):And like, you get the idea2 (46m 26s):We're working through for some of the faculty who, you know, themselves couldn't realize their professional dreams. And you know,4 (46m 35s):That makes me so sad. I hope that it's really not1 (46m 40s):Okay. I mean, like it's not okay, but it's like, they, we, a lot of times we talk on this podcast, right. About the psychology of never fixing what you needed to fix in the first place inside of yourself gets fucking played out all over everywhere.4 (46m 54s):We are living in a new time of awakening and people being able to talk about their trauma. That was not that time. And that was also the time, like I said, where the teachers were coming to parties with us and drinking and somebody else was mentioned, somebody else was mentioning, you know, relationships between faculty and students. I only knew a couple of those instances, but yeah, the fact that they happen at all and yeah, yeah. I've found that like in my own teaching, like even, even in the last couple of years and I've been doing it for a long time, I just I've become so much more transparent. Like I talk about my own mental health issues or what's going on with me or I, I check in and check out with them every day. And it's like, what's something beautiful you saw today.4 (47m 35s):What, what are you going to do good for yourself when you leave this zoom glass, whatever, you know, like, so I think that as a culture we're evolving as facilitators instructors teachers, but yeah, we were there at a really hard, whoa time. I, for sure. I mean, you were there pretty shortly after that, but also I had some amazing experiences. I loved Betsy Hamilton. I loved John Jenkins. Jim. I still laugh. I actually had for two years cause Adam second year and fourth year, which nobody did because he randomly taught second year acting one year for some reason. And everybody had him for fourth year for what that was called, like ensemble or exit or whatever the hell it was called.4 (48m 19s):So I had him second and fourth year. He actually told me at one point, heard him out, what you're doing, why are you an actor? You should be a singer. And so then I sang in the, oh no, it was after I sang in this, it was Rob chambers thesis show Baghdad cafe. And I sang backstage live for just a couple parts of the show. Just Rob asked me to do this. I don't even remember how that all came about. And, and you know, Jim being the jazz and music aficionado called me to his office and was like, what are you doing? You should be a singer. Shouldn't be the act. But was that ever a, a w dream of yours to be a singer? I was in rock band called dominance clam I did say I did sing a lot that there was a summer.4 (49m 7s):I wasn't even 21. So I would go, I've sang it like the Metro and I wasn't really supposed to be in there and, and Zach wards and Steve Sal and all these people from my class came to see me. And yeah, I wanted to do that and I would audition for musicals and stuff after I graduated, but just like Marriott Lincoln Shire and all those like fancy places would never hire me. And I would always end up in shows where I sent, but they weren't musicals, you know? And I also think I have a little bit of trauma around singing. I started singing in my church after my dad died. I was the song leader in Catholic church. Believe it or not. And I would go out the night before and be like smoking and drinking with my friends and then sitting on the alter with like the breeze and like, like Christ, what the hell are we doing?4 (49m 55s):I would say at funerals, I sang at my mom's second wedding. I sang at my brother's wedding, my sister's wedding, my other brothers. But yeah, I say I sang a lot. I haven't really been singing recently cause I, I usually end up crying when I sing. I had a very traumatic audition, 2008. I think it was where I cried when I was singing the song. And the song was about the girl's dad a little bit on the high note and it cracked and the casting director will remain nameless called my agent and told them that they thought I had mental problems and needed help. Okay. Again, this is something that would never happen today.4 (50m 37s):Right. But it wasn't that long ago, 2008, she also said that I was dressed in appropriately. I wore a forties style suit and a pillbox hat, because that was the period of the show. How is that inappropriate? That's someone who's. And why you calling my agent how intrusive to call my agent and tell them that you think I'm. And then the funny thing about it was I had just gone through a huge breakup and had moved and gotten a new job and all this other stuff was going on, but that had nothing to do with it. And that's nobody's business and I was moved by the song. And don't you want somebody, that's just somebody who, who is scared of their own emotions, like, correct. That's all that is. Yeah. So anyway, I digressed cause that's like post theater, school drama,2 (51m 20s):But I've had auditioning. Okay. So you arrived at the theater school at a tender young age. You4 (51m 28s):17. I was 17 because I have a November birthday, 17.2 (51m 32s):And you did your whole BFA there. Tell us about some of your show experiences.4 (51m 41s):Well, the one that I was going to talk about was the good person of such one. Cause oddly enough, it's the only one that I have printed pictures of. And I don't even remember when or how I acquired them. I think I got them from John Bridges cause he took all these pictures and that one of me is the sister-in-law. I don't know that that one was like a production photo. I think that was him coming up. And he saw me in this moment and like had to get this shot. So not only was I not cast as Shantay, which I want it to be now I'm the, the sister-in-law on the old whore. So I'm like, I'm going to kill this. I had 16 lines between the two characters, my old whore. If you look at that picture, I have a blonde wig. I didn't wear a bra. I have a tube, top, a pleather red skirt. I had these hoes that had a dragon up the side.4 (52m 22s):So it looked like I had a dragon tattoo on my leg and high, high red pumps that I think were mine actually from when I was in a beauty contest in high school anyway, and I got these earrings, oh my God. I think I found those earrings too. They were Chinese lanterns like that opened up, but they were earrings and they were huge. And I smoked a cigar. Oh. And I, I don't know if you remember this or if they did this when you were there, but after shows closed, mainly the main stage shows they had like this post mortem, postpartum, whatever you call it in the lobby and everybody and they would critique. I probably blacked that right out while you sat there and just took it.4 (53m 7s):And, but I don't know if it was during that or like after that, I would just be like walking in the halls and all these teachers, some that I had and some that I hadn't yet even had made a point of coming to tell me how excellent I wasn't that. Sure. And it was not false. It was not put on. But I mean, come on. Those people did not give compliments unless they really felt1 (53m 29s):Whatever. Yeah, yeah,4 (53m 30s):No. And I was like, yeah, cause I freaking killed it. Cause I took it so seriously. I was like, I'm going to make these roles so deep and so real. And if you, if you look on the production photos, they have this screen and, and, and, and people would make shadow play on the screen at the beginning of the show to show like the street life of the pool or the Sichuan and stuff. And I got to ride a bike and I rode a bike across and you see the shadow of the girl on the bike and I'm like, I still look at that. And I'm like that.1 (53m 57s):So do you think that's, I love hearing that. That's a great story for me to hear. For some reason, it just really warm, but warms my heart, but also talks about Gina's calling you on being tenacious. But do you think that that sort of set a tone for, cause what I'm getting from you is that like you're simultaneously a, bad-ass a bit of an outsider never given your chance. Never really given the chance to maybe in terms of outside casting, do what you could really do. So then you take what you get and then you fucking kill it. Does that ring a bell4 (54m 37s):Kind of? I think so. And I think I've always been that way really. And that also being in that show, Joe sloth directed, it was Bertolt Brecht. And really got me thinking about political theater and theater for social movement and theater for change. And I really believe when I graduated and I started doing work at the European repertory company, I believed that doing theater could change the world. You don't think that anymore change sometimes, you know, it beats you down pretty hard when you, when you work and work and work and work and you have to have three other jobs. Cause you're in a theater company that doesn't pay you any money.4 (55m 17s):And I, I still like the best work of my life was at that place. I was client of Nestor and Agamemnon for three years. I mean, I, Y you know, yeah, the best work of my life, but was it going to say that there's a different, and I think it's good. There's a different culture, a different mindset. Now students now would never graduate and say, yes, I'm going to be in a school or I'm going to be in a theater company for 12 years that never pays me and I'm going to have three or four jobs. And it was nice to kind of almost like a martyr, poor theater, Jersey, Petoskey board theater mindset of like, I'm an artist. Well, of course I'm, I'm struggling and I'm poor and I'm, you know, but I'm for the oppressed. And so I must experience that.4 (55m 59s):I don't, I dunno, like it just, I wonder how much I manifested that, right. Because I, I would have auditions for TV and film stuff that I would get close to and just not get, or it took me. I was, I think, 30 when I finally gotten a show at the Goodman or no, wait, I was 30 when I got at apt in Wisconsin. I think I was even older when I got in the show at the Goodman. But anyway, yeah. You know, eventually I have done shows larger theaters, but I still will say, I mean, people that saw the stuff I did at the European rep and I was like 24, 25, but I played clouded minister and it was Steven Berkoff's choir master. So it was like the most rockstar frickin, you know, I made my own costume.4 (56m 41s):It was, it was all like fishnet. And I just like punched my hands through fish nets to make sleeves and high heels and crazy Kabuki makeup. And I stood at the top of this ladder Agamemnon. And I came out at the end with like Hershey's syrup on my hands after I'd feel them. And I was like, I mean, if you saw that as hit, you were blown away, this was three years while we did it, like in a regular run. And then it was so popular. It was so popular that we did it on Friday, Saturday nights, like late night. And then we were doing, cause we want it to be a real repertory. So at the time we were doing Agamemnon Electra, uncle Vanya, and this show called all of them are just, yes.4 (57m 32s):And we would also change this. You remind me, okay, this is what I think Steven Davis was talking about when he said he was in four shows at the same time he, he was in, he was in all those shows and yeah. So, oh my God,2 (57m 51s):That's super intense4 (57m 53s):Looking at my notes2 (57m 54s):That like, though, while you're looking at your notes, I mean, was that draining, not just the number of shows you did4 (58m 4s):The physical training. Well, also I was, yeah, I was like a waitress during the day. I mean, I had a job I had to live and I was a waitress where I could only work lunches because all the shows were at nights. So lunches weren't as busy. And if it was really slow at lunch, I mean, so I would find myself every day while I was working calculating in my head, how many tables I had to have, how many tips I had to get just to make enough for that week to pay the rent, you know? And at the time I was living with two British guys, actually, they're the ones that brought me into the European rep, my friend, Charlie, Charlie Sherman, who is a actor and director in and out of Chicago for years. I met him when I was 18.4 (58m 44s):And I worked at cafe Roma, which was down the street from the school. That was my job. Cause I also worked when I was in school. And so when other people were like, we're going to the dead show. You want to come? I was like, you get, not only do I not have money for that, but I got to work all weekend. Right. So anyway, he, he knew that I wanted to do the play Caligula and he called me up one day and he's like, oh my God, this company is already doing it. Maybe you should audition. And this was right when I got out of school. So I auditioned and I got in the chorus and like the first week, the girl that was supposed to place, Zonea had gotten a movie and left and they were like, okay, now you're the lead. And I was like, okay. And that, and that was the company that I ended up being with for 12 years.4 (59m 27s):But it was exhausting as it was. I know we did. We were also all like drinking and smoking and going to the bar every night after the show is2 (59m 35s):You is a powerful force. I was just thinking the other day, remember when you used to wake up in the morning and no matter what had happened to you the night before, and you're like, okay, well, but anyway, it's time to do it today. I haven't had that feeling in years. I haven't had that. Like I can even when some we've once a day, I'm super excited about, I don't ha I don't wake up with this body, like readiness that I remember feeling in my twenties and thirties. Okay. So look at your notes. What are you, what are some of, some of the points that you wanted to get to?1 (1h 0m 7s):So if a showcase question, I have a showcase. Cause I'm obsessed. Since I live in Los Angeles, now I'm obsessed.4 (1h 0m 12s):Oh my God, are you guys going to try to avoid? No, no, no, no, no,1 (1h 0m 15s):No, no, no. I'm obsessed with the idea of the showcase because I made such an ass out of myself at my showcase that I, we went to LA, but I know you were in New York, but what was that? I'm obsessed with the showcase experience because I think it is really one interesting, but two where DePaul lacked in so many ways to getting people to the showcase and then after the showcase.4 (1h 0m 42s):Okay, great. This was before stars and all that. So nobody was collecting money for us. You just had to, you either had the money or you didn't. And so I was able to get enough money to buy a plane ticket, but then I wasn't going to have anywhere to stay. So my friend, Sarah Wilkinson, who was also at the school, but a couple of years behind me, her boyfriend, Daniel master Giorgio, who's also been in a lot of TV shows and on, on, you know, Lincoln stage and public theater, like this dude that went to Juilliard, actually I stayed in his dorm at Juilliard on the floor cause I didn't have money to stay anywhere. And I also could only stay for like a couple of days where like other people were like staying the rest of the week or going out and partying.4 (1h 1m 23s):And I remember having like just enough money to do one of the things people were doing, which was go to a jazz club with Frick and Jim Osstell Hoff, which I did. And that was really cool. The other part of that, that was kind of messed up was in the, in the, you know, audition class that Jane alderman, God rest her soul. And I love her dearly and became closer to her. I probably more after school than during school, but in our audition class where you brought, you know, monologues, I had brought this monologue and then she loved it and wanted me to do it and was just like, that's the, when you're doing. And then I had this total panic about it and was like, I don't think this is right. I don't think this shows me in a good light.4 (1h 2m 3s):I'm going to pick something else. And I don't remember what my other second or third choice was. I did, I did have something else. And I remember calling her on the phone. I don't know if I called her office or at home. And again, before cell phones. So I remember the little window I was sitting in my apartment on the corner of Sheffield and Belden on our little phone, talking to Jane alderman, all nervous. Cause I was going to tell her I'm not doing that when it's not right for me. And she still talked me into it and I did this monologue from Roger and me, the film. Did you see it?2 (1h 2m 34s):The Michael Moore movie4 (1h 2m 36s):About the Michael Moore movie, Roger,2 (1h 2m 40s):The documentary about the auto industry. I mean, yeah.4 (1h 2m 44s):Yes. And it was the poor woman, poor white woman who sold rabbits. Pets are mate. Right? Pets are me. Got it.2 (1h 2m 55s):That's what I did. Wait a minute though. I have a feeling.4 (1h 2m 60s):So I actually became, I probably did, but I actually came from where they had tried to, to suppress and to change and to mold me into anything. But this hit girl from Southern Illinois. And then I did that. Right. And that's what I, I wore my boots. I wear my cowboy boots. I think I had my friend's jacket on my long hair. And I came out and I was like pets for me. Oh my God, mortified, mortified. And I only got, I got like a couple of calls, like one was from like a soap opera. And then another one, I don't remember. That was another weird thing. Like the same thing with the casting call we waited in, I was in somebody else's hotel room.4 (1h 3m 42s):Cause remember I didn't have a hotel. I was staying on the other side of town and the dorm room of somebody who went to Julliard. And so we're in somebody's hotel room waiting for Jim Mostel Hoff. And whoever else was with us to come in with like this list, it was literal. It was like my notes here. There was just like tiny pieces of paper with like telling us who got what calls. Some people were like, got nothing, got 10 that too, about whatever. Yeah. And, and mine were not meetings. Mine were just like, these people want you to call them or send your resume. I was like, they already got my resume. Everybody got what, what? So, you know, like I wanted to move to New York. I wanted to be a New York fancy actor, you know? So that was like really devastating too.4 (1h 4m 23s):But then I was like, well, if I don't get that, I'm going to be an amazing Chicago theater actor. And I'm going to show everybody that Chicago theater is actually better anyway.2 (1h 4m 31s):Yeah. I don't to remember VAs if I've told this on the podcast before, but remember how I did that thing or if I didn't get any meetings. And so then I snuck into administrative office at DePaul after showcase and I found a list of all of our names and everybody had gotten, everybody had agencies or agents names written next to theirs, but not everybody was told that. Yeah. Yeah. So,4 (1h 5m 5s):Oh, podcasts, then couldn't see my face gaping. Now what, what did you do? Did you tell, did you, what?2 (1h 5m 12s):I swallowed it and carried it around resentfully for the next 20 years. Yes ma'am I did my God. And you know, who knows? Maybe there was an important reason for that. Maybe it was, these are shady characters. I don't know what it would have been, but I, I know that I would have4 (1h 5m 36s):That you didn't feel. Yeah. I feel so bad for you that you didn't feel like you could, you know, go further, ask more. I don't know. Probably2 (1h 5m 44s):Carolyn it probably didn't occur to me. I'm sure it did. I'm sure. The way I thought about it was, well, this has happened now. It is over, this is the thing that it is forever such. I just, I would have never thought that way. I would have never thought to advocate for myself. I mean, I fought to find out,4 (1h 6m 4s):Snuck in there. You thought, well, enough of yourself to sneak in there,2 (1h 6m 9s):You know, whatever. That's that's for me to figure out because I, I, I that's what, but that's what I did with it. I, I took it. I took a carried it around like a shame instead of, oh, by the way, I didn't mean to blow anybody up. I just needed to say like, what's the deal? Like what happened happened, right. Yeah.1 (1h 6m 29s):I feel like it's interesting. It is. It is. It is just really, now that we have this podcast, we spend a lot of our time being like, well, yeah, what's the deal. Why did that happen? And, and what,4 (1h 6m 41s):I wonder what John Bridges or somebody like that would say about that.2 (1h 6m 46s):I I'm sure. John Bridges, who is a theater school loyalist to the end when say that, that I, that I misunderstood. He tells them he doesn't tell the truth. I'm saying, listen. And, and by that I've said a thousand times we understand that we couldn't possibly know all of the factors that went into any decisions like casting and stuff like that. And that there are certain things that happened. That felt terrible. That were for my own good, you know, but Yeah, because getting back to that whole thing about casting, I mean, I'm sure that the guiding principle in their minds was, this is what it's like, you know, you want to move to New York.2 (1h 7m 33s):I mean, Don, we had another person on here who told us living in New York. You, you you'd have to go wait in line in the morning at a theater so that you could get your audition later. And if you wanted to have, it had to be a lunchtime thing, so you could leave work. And those sl

In Out Chicago's 400th episode Scott and Ellen talk with Ken Mejia-Beal of Naperville Pride Fest 2021. Dr. Meida Teresa McNeal of Hot Honey Performance. And Micah Figueroa of Chicago Shakespeare's DREAM.

In this episode in our SIX the Musical series, we are chatting with the casting director of Chicago Shakespeare and original US casting director of SIX, Bob Mason! We chat all about his process casting the original US queens who would eventually reign in the Broadway production of SIX as well as a few pre-Broadway pit stops! We talk about what Bob and the creative team were looking for, how they searched far and wide in their casting process and much more! If you are listening to this on Apple Podcast, we'd love it if you could share your love in a review! ABOUT BOB MASON Broadway: debut. Off-Broadway: Ride the Cyclone (MCC); Rose Rage (The Duke on 42nd St); Marionette Macbeth (New Victory). Chicago Shakespeare: over 125 productions since 2000. Regional: Goodman Theatre; Asolo Repertory Theatre; Arena Stage; Ride the Cyclone (5th Avenue/A.C.T., Alliance Theatre); SIX (A.R.T., Citadel Theatre, Ordway Center). International: Pacific Overtures (Donmar Warehouse, Olivier Award for Best Musical); Henry IV, Parts 1 and 2 (CST at the Royal Shakespeare Company); Othello: The Remix (Shakespeare's Globe, Melbourne, Dubai). For Neil. MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE: SIX on Instagram: www.instagram.com/sixonbroadway SIX on Facebook: www.facebook.com/sixbroadway Get Your Tickets: www.sixonbroadway.com --- Come say hi to us! Facebook: @PageToStagePodcast @BroadwayPodcastNetwork Instagram: @PageToStagePodcast @TheMaryDina @BrianSedita @BroadwayPodcastNetwork Twitter: @TheMaryDina @BwayPodNetwork YouTube: @PageToStagePodcast @BroadwayPodcastNetwork #PageToStagePodcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Intro: the coolest thing about crows, Bexley, fear of flying, Inattentive-type ADD Let Me Run This By You: Avoidance, becoming conflict-curiousInterview: We talk to Jason Denuszek about Pinnacle Performance Company, theatrevolution, TimeLine Theatre, Grotowski and Poor Theatre, Woyzeck, Northwestern Cherubs, ComedySportz, Pirandello, Piven Theatre Workshop, Laughing Wild, Diary of Anne Frank, The Seagull, The Search for Delicious, Chicago Shakespeare, Rose Rage, The Actor's Gang, 

Abercrumbie, a stalwart of the Chicago stage, is known more widely for her television roles on “The Chi” created by awarding wining, Chicago native, Lena Waithe. The Chi entering it's forth season. Set to begin May 23, 2021. Abercrumbie plays Nina Williams, mother of two teenagers played by Birgundi Baker (Kiesha) and Alex Hibert (Kevin), together they face more than their fair share of challenges as residents of Chicago's south side. Abercrumbie has regularly appeared in programs over the past several years including, Proven Innocent, Easy, ChicagoPD, ChicagoMed, Girlfriend Experience, Shrink, Unexpected, The Animator - to name a few.She has acted at Court, Goodman, Northlight, Victory Gardens and Chicago Shakespeare, among other regional theaters. A talented writer, Director, she is the inaugural recipient of The North Side's Raven Theater $25,000 new-play initiative. Her play “Relentless” formally scheduled to open at Timeline Theatre last May before the pandemic shutdown is currently in negotiations for a winter date this season. She is also slated to direct a postponed world premiere “The Last Pair of Earlies” at Raven, this fall. Her favorite quote to live by - “I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own abhorrence.” - Frederick Douglass --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/theactorslounge/support

The hosts welcome Elana's United Flight 232 co-star Echaka Agba to You're On In Five!  We talk about understudying at Steppenwolf, Chicago Shakespeare, and Pegasus Players, dive into the controversial Method acting technique, and discuss how to take care of ourselves better.  Enjoy this very intimate, giggly, and loving conversation!

Abercrumbie, a stalwart of the Chicago stage, is known more widely for her television roles on “The Chi” created by awarding winning, Chicago native,  Lena Waithe. The Chi entering it’s forth season. Set to begin May 23, 2021. Abercrumbie plays Nina Williams, mother of two teenagers played by Birgundi Baker (Kiesha) and Alex Hibert (Kevin), together they face more than their fair share of challenges as residents of Chicago’s south side. Abercrumbie has regularly appeared in programs over the past several years including, Proven Innocent, Easy, ChicagoPD, ChicagoMed, Girlfriend Experience, Shrink, Unexpected, The Animator - to name a few.She has acted at Court, Goodman, Northlight, Victory Gardens and Chicago Shakespeare, among other regional theaters.  A talented writer, Director,  she is the inaugural  recipient  of The North Side’s Raven Theater $25,000 new-play initiative. Her  play “Relentless” formally scheduled to open at Timeline Theatre last May before the pandemic shutdown is currently in negotiations for a winter date this season. She is also slated to direct a postponed world premiere “The Last Pair of Earlies” at Raven, this fall. Her favorite quote to live by - “I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own abhorrence.” -  Frederick  Douglass

Sondheim’s 1994 musical “Passion” is the focus of this week’s “Sondheim @ 90 Roundtable with Michael Weber.” “Passion” tells the story of a love triangle and is adapted from Ettore Scola's 1981 film “Passione d'Amore” and its source material, Iginio Ugo Tarchetti's 1869 novel "Fosca.” Weber’s guests this week, discussing what many consider Sondheim’s most personal work, are John Doyle (Tony Award-winning director; Artistic Director of Classic Stage Company), Judy Kuhn (multiple Tony, Olivier and Grammy Award nominee; "Passion" at the Kennedy Center Sondheim Festival) and Kathy Voytko, (Broadway's "The Frogs" and "Passion" at Chicago Shakespeare). Edited by Remington Cleve New episodes every Saturday at 7pm CT!

The Whole Artist with Courtney Rioux: Conversations with artists about acting, purpose, and the journey to finding wholeness. You are so much more than the last job you booked. Today Courtney sits down with performer and positive psychology practitioner, Erica Elam, to discuss how principles from improv and positive psychology can change an actor's (or anyone's) sense of well-being. Erica Elam is an actor, improviser, director, and positive psychology practitioner based in Chicago. She has performed at The Goodman (in the world premiere of Sarah Ruhl's Stage Kiss), Steppenwolf, Northlight, Court, Remy Bumppo, Peninsula Players, Chicago Shakespeare, and with The Second City at The KennedyCenter in Washington, D.C. She is an ensemble member with the critically acclaimed improv troupes BabyWants Candy and The Improvised Shakespeare Company (with whom she was the first woman ever to perform). Erica earned her Masters in Applied Positive Psychology at The University of Pennsylvania, and graduated from The University of Georgia, The Second City Conservatory, and The School at Steppenwolf. Find Erica on Social Media Instagram: instagram.com/ericaelam Follow Courtney Rioux online: Sign up for V.I.P. updates and free gifts at www.courtneyrioux.com instagram.com/courtneyrioux twitter.com/courtneyrioux facebook.com/CourtneyRiouxOfficial/ Other links: Character Strengths: https://www.viacharacter.org/survey/account/register Shared History Pod: https://arcadeaudio.net/shared-history/2020/10/7/037-happy-healthy-history-feat-courtney-rioux Zoom Fatigue: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/29/sunday-review/zoom-video-conference.html ### Special thanks to: Tommy Martin for editing and mixing this episode. Mandy Work Wetzel for all of your hard work. Photography by Joe Mazza, Brave Lux. For more information, go to http://bravelux.com/ Music by Blythe Martin Productions. For more info, please contact Jamie and Erik at erik@SoundAnswer.com Co-Edited by Courtney Rioux --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/courtneyrioux/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/courtneyrioux/support

Today’s episode focuses on actor safety - with an emphasis on the pandemic. We’re talking with talent agent and actor Duane Sharp. More about Duane  Duane Sharp founded Chicago Talent Network, a full service non-union talent agency, in the spring of 2018 with his business partner Renee Ertl. One year later they started Milwaukee Talent Network and formed the Talent Networks Co. Duane has been a non-union talent agent in the Chicago/Milwaukee market for over 25 years. Duane is lucky enough to be the husband of photographer and sound engineer Jenn Udoni-Sharp and father of 6 year old Joe’Ann. As an actor Duane moved to Chicago in the late 1980’s after graduating from the University of Kansas and studied improvisation at The Second City and with the late Del Close. He has worked with Steppenwolf, Goodman, Chicago Shakespeare and Court as well as many off loop theaters. He is a founding member of Shaw Chicago. Film & TV credits include Spike Lee’s Chi-Raq, Chicago Fire, Public Enemies, Road to Perdition and Stir of Echoes. Duane is an active brown belt in Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu under Carlson Gracie Jr, a black belt in Shidokan Bareknuckle Karate and a veteran of 60 amateur boxing matches.   Stay connected with Duane and the Talent Networks Co.    Chicago Talent Network: https://www.thetalentnetworks.com/ctn Milwaukee Talent Network: https://www.thetalentnetworks.com/mtn   More on Duane:  Website: http://duanesharp.com/ IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0789036/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1   What we talk about this episode:  The difference between a non union agency and a SAG franchised agency An overview of filming guidelines for Illinois       What boxing taught Duane that’s helpful for performers How to come up with your own non negotiables to help determine whether or not you’ll accept work How to turn down a project What isn’t okay to do when turning down a project Why actors are always afraid of being blacklisted The problems that come with identifying yourself as an actor Why *not* to stand out as an actor What to do set conditions are unsafe How to handle the uncertainty our industry is currently facing    OVERVIEW OF THE ILLINOIS FILMING GUIDELINES  Check out the guidelines for yourself here: https://dceocovid19resources.com/restore-illinois/restore-illinois-phase-4/film-production Join us!    Free Facebook Group: www.facebook.com/groups/actorproblems Join the actor self-care newsletter!  Head on over to www.tonyrossicoaching.com to sign up for the free actor self-care newsletter. I’ll share tips, tricks, and stories (that I don’t post anywhere else) every week, just for us actors.  Plus gain access to my free video series - “Why You Think You Suck (Even Though You Really Don’t)”     Interested in coaching?  Schedule a free call with me here!  Don’t see a slot that fits your schedule? Shoot me an email - tony.rossi@gmail.com   For Sponsorship Inquiries Shoot an email to tony.rossi@gmail.com and put “Actor Problems Sponsor” in the subject line. Wanna just support the podcast? You’re the best. Head to patreon.com/tonyrossi for donation options, starting at $1/month.   Are we connected? (We totally should be….) Instagram: @tony.rossi Twitter: @_tonyrossi TikTok: @tony.rossi Facebook: www.facebook.com/tonyrossicoaching    Remember - we can be messy and still get the things that we want #notperfect #stillenough

Telly Leung, (Roundabout Theatre’s "Pacific Overtures," Chicago’s "Wicked," TV’s “Glee"), Richard Manera (Lyric Opera’s "Das Rheingold," Marriott Theatre’s "The King & I," Chicago Shakespeare and London's Donmar Warehouse productions of "Pacific Overtures") and Amanda Green (Tony Award, Two Drama Desk Awards (music, lyrics) and an Outer Critics Circle Award nominee, "Hands on a Hardbody" and co-lyricist "Bring It On!") join Weber for this edition of Sondheim @ 90 to talk about "Pacific Overtures," music and lyrics by Stephen Sondheim and book by John Weidman. Considered by many to be the artistic pinnacle of the legendary Sondheim/Hal Prince collaborations, this exploration of culture and imperialism pushed the boundaries of musical theatre further than ever before. Edited by Austin Packard Originally premiered Saturday, June 20, 2020 at Facebook.com/PorchlightMusicTheatre ( https://app.redcircle.com/shows/b5ad8de4-802f-4e56-974c-413004ccc672/ep/Facebook.com/PorchlightMusicTheatre ). New episodes every Saturday at 7pm CT! Watch with video at YouTube.com/PorchlightMusicTheatre ( https://app.redcircle.com/shows/b5ad8de4-802f-4e56-974c-413004ccc672/ep/YouTube.com/PorchlightMusicTheatre )

Jess and Nate talk about The Liar at Writers Theatre designed by Rachel Healy and Heir Apparent at Chicago Shakespeare designed by David Woolard. Finally breaking the Ana Kuzmanic streak (although Nate has never been in a show designed by her soooo). Also they discuss a bunch of junk unrelated to costumes but related to their friendship. And Life. and whatever.

Dr. Regina Buccola takes a closer look at the true stories of Henry VIII’s six wives, the subjects of the pop-musical sensation SIX by Toby Marlow and Lucy Moss. In this final episode of ASIDES season one, you’ll hear clips from the North American premiere of SIX at Chicago Shakespeare Theater in 2019. This talk was recorded on May 21, 2019 as the Theater’s annual Scholar Luncheon. Gina Buccola is Chicago Shakespeare’s Scholar-in-Residence and Professor of English and Chair of Humanities at Roosevelt University in Chicago, where she specializes in Shakespeare, non-Shakespearean early modern drama, and Women's and Gender Studies. She is a published poet and a scholar who has written several works on early modern English drama and culture, most recently Haunting History on Stage: Shakespeare in the USA and Canada. To see photos and video from CST’s production of SIX, or to learn more about the cast, crew, and creative team visit www.chicagoshakes.com/six. Have a question about something you heard in this episode? Want to tell us about your favorite moments at CST? Email us at asides@chicagoshakes.com or call us at 312-667-5631 and we’ll respond in a future episode. And don’t forget to subscribe to get all of the latest updates from ASIDES. This episode was produced by Sara B.T. Thiel, Margaret McCall, Forrest Williams, and Aaron Roberts, with editing by Joe Disbrow and additional support from Krissi McEachern. You can find our episode transcriptions at www.chicagoshakes.com/asides. As you enjoy this episode, we hope you’ll consider making a gift to support other programs like this through our Brave New World Campaign. Together, we can serve artists, audiences, students, and our community in this time of great need. Please visit www.chicagoshakes.com/BraveNewWorld.

Hey listeners! We had the amazing opportunity to chat with the one and only Paul Michael Thomson. He is an actor, playwright, and co-artistic director of The Story Theatre. He had so much to say about playwriting, theater, and what it means to be an artist. We also got a chance to talk about his hilarious and page-turning play "The G.O.A.T., or Who Is Ximone?". Be sure to look out for it on New Play Exchange! Paul Michael Thomson is an actor, playwright, and co-artistic director of The Story Theatre in Chicago, IL. As an actor, he has worked with Steppenwolf Theatre, Chicago Shakespeare, and Windy City Playhouse, among others. His plays have been produced by Avalanche Theatre, The Impostors Theatre Company, Other Theatre, Arc Theatre, and The Story Theatre, of which he is a founding ensemble member. He holds a BFA in Acting and a BA in Africana Studies from The University of Arizona and is passionate about new work, intersectional feminism, and rereading the same books over and over and over again. To learn more about Paul Michael Thomson, be sure to visit his website www.paulmichaelthomson.com To learn about the amazing work The Story Theatre is doing, check out the website www.thestorytheatre.org ________________________ Please support Beckett's Babies by reviewing, sharing an episode to your friends, or follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter: @beckettsbabies And as always, we would love to hear from you! Send us your questions or thoughts on playwriting and we might discuss it in our next episode. Email: contact@beckettsbabies.com For more info, visit our website: www.beckettsbabies.com --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/beckettsbabies/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/beckettsbabies/support

Hey listeners! We had the amazing opportunity to chat with the one and only Paul Michael Thomson. He is an actor, playwright, and co-artistic director of The Story Theatre. He had so much to say about playwriting, theater, and what it means to be an artist. We also got a chance to talk about his hilarious and page-turning play "The G.O.A.T., or Who Is Ximone?". Be sure to look out for it on New Play Exchange! Paul Michael Thomson is an actor, playwright, and co-artistic director of The Story Theatre in Chicago, IL. As an actor, he has worked with Steppenwolf Theatre, Chicago Shakespeare, and Windy City Playhouse, among others. His plays have been produced by Avalanche Theatre, The Impostors Theatre Company, Other Theatre, Arc Theatre, and The Story Theatre, of which he is a founding ensemble member. He holds a BFA in Acting and a BA in Africana Studies from The University of Arizona and is passionate about new work, intersectional feminism, and rereading the same books over and over and over again. To learn more about Paul Michael Thomson, be sure to visit his website www.paulmichaelthomson.com To learn about the amazing work The Story Theatre is doing, check out the website www.thestorytheatre.org ________________________ Please support Beckett's Babies by reviewing, sharing an episode to your friends, or follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter: @beckettsbabies And as always, we would love to hear from you! Send us your questions or thoughts on playwriting and we might discuss it in our next episode. Email: contact@beckettsbabies.com For more info, visit our website: www.beckettsbabies.com

Inspired by Shakespeare’s "asides"—moments when characters speak directly to the audience and pull them into the story—this podcast shares the world of theater making from our home on Chicago’s Navy Pier. ASIDES shares valuable insights from our team of scholars, conversations with artists, and questions from our listeners to dive deeper into work happening at Chicago Shakespeare. Send us your questions, comments, and favorite memories from CST. Email us at asides@chicagoshakes.com or call us at 312-667-5631 and we’ll respond in a future episode. And don’t forget to subscribe to get all of the latest updates from ASIDES. This episode was produced by Sara B.T. Thiel, Margaret McCall, Forrest Williams, and Aaron Roberts, with editing by Forrest Williams. As you enjoy this podcast, we hope you’ll consider making a gift to support other programs like this through our Brave New World Campaign. Together, we can serve artists, audiences, students, and our community in this time of great need. Please visit www.chicagoshakes.com/BraveNewWorld.

Coming to the Durham Performing Arts Center from January 14th-19th is the national tour of COME FROM AWAY. I recently had the great pleasure of interviewing actor James Earl Jones II, who is currently in the production playing Bob & others. James previously appeared in the national tour of The Gershwin's PORGY & BESS. He has also been seen regionally in productions Porchlight Music; Goodman; Marriott; Court; Chicago Shakespeare; Writers; Lookingglass; Lyric Opera Chicago; SF Opera; Ravinia; and Broadway in Chicago. His TV/film credits include POKERHOUSE, HALF-BAD, and CHICAGO MED. To those wondering, yes, he is related to the legendary actor, James Earl Jones, as they are both distant cousins. Be sure to catch the national tour of COME FROM AWAY. It will be playing at the Durham Performing Arts Center from January 14th-19th. For more information, please visit: www.dpacnc.com/events/detail/come-from-away www.comefromaway.com/tickets.php?content=tixtour Follow Kare Reviews at www.karereviews.net and on Twitter: @KareReviews Follow Jeffrey Kare on Twitter: @JeffreyKare If you like what you've heard here, please subscribe to any one of the following places where the Kare Reviews Podcast is available. Anchor: https://anchor.fm/jeffrey-kare Apple: itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/kare-reviews-podcast/id1453846013 Google: www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9hbmNob3IuZm0vcy85NWFhZDFjL3BvZGNhc3QvcnNz Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/6GL69s4zoDQmBcZf3NALTG Breaker: www.breaker.audio/kare-reviews-podcast Overcast: overcast.fm/itunes1453846013/kare-reviews-podcast Pocket Casts: pca.st/47Vw RadioPublic: radiopublic.com/kare-reviews-podcast-6rMdXk --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/jeffrey-kare/support

Cage Sebastian Pierre, one of Chicago’s top young actors and fight choreographers, joins the CONVERSATION to talk about fight choreography in Barbara Gaines new production of Romeo and Juliet at Chicago Shakespeare Theater. Season 4 - Episode 14 Originally posted October 31, 2019

When it comes to climate change, much of the world is sitting up, taking notice, and pledging to do something, while the Trump administration rolls back environmental regulations and denies there’s even a problem. We talk about the recent UN Climate Action Summit with Karen Weigert.Plus we hear from actor Harry Hadden-Paton about his role as England’s King George VI, and how the king overcame a stutter to lead his nation through WWII with the help of his speech therapist.

Chicago is lousy with Hamlets this spring/summer of 2019! Friend of the pod Samuel Taylor was involved with two of them - at Chicago Shakespeare Theatre and with the Back Room Shakespeare Project, the latter of which Sam co-founded - and he discusses how all this activity supports and complements both companies and the Chicago theatre community. Featuring the beauty of electricity, fruitful studies in contrasts, asserting control over the laughs, being invested in turtle races, celebrating America’s Mike Nussbaum as the First Gravedigger, hearing about Hamlet being put on trial and Quicksilver Shakespeare actors pulling Hamlet's characters out of a hat, continuing work on Hamlet's Big Adventure (a prequel), the best possible scheduling of Titus Andronicus, the fascination of watching somebody doing something very difficult, and the wonder of understanding both the history of Shakespeare in Chicago and of Chicago Shakespeare. (Length 24:24) (Pictured: Mike Nussbaum as the First Gravedigger, in the Chicago Shakespeare Theatre production of Hamlet, directed by Barbara Gaines. Photo by Liz Lauren. Old Style Hamlet logo courtesy of the Back Room Shakespeare Project.) The post Dueling Chicago Hamlets appeared first on Reduced Shakespeare Company.

Recent projects include: Born Yesterday for Ford’s Theatre; MacBeth for Chicago Shakespeare Theatre; Penn and Teller on Broadway, directed by John Rando; the premiere of Queens for a Year, directed by Lucie Tiberghien for Hartford Stage; The Tempest for American Repertory Theatre, Chicago Shakespeare, and South Coast Repertory theatres directed by long time collaborators, Aaron Posner and Teller.The Scottsboro Boys directed by Joe Calarco for The Signature Theatre.At Wit’s End, Love in Afghanistan, Vanya, Sonia, Masha and Spike for Arena Stage; the premiere of American Song, directed by Mark Clements for Milwaukee Rep; The Games Afoot for the Cleveland Playhouse; Company, Hairspray, Chess, and Sunset Boulevard for The Signature Theatre directed by Eric Schaeffer; Sabrina Fair for The Ford’s Theatre and The Merry Wives of Windsor for The Shakespeare Theater; Hand to God, directed by Joanie Schultz for The Studio Theatre; Jelly’s Last Jam for Signature Theatre, directed by Matt Gardiner; District Merchant for South Coast Repertory, directed by Michael Michetti; At Wit’s End, for Cincinnati Playhouse, directed by David Esbjornsen; Three Sisters for The Studio Theatre directed by Jackson Gay; and the premiere of No Sisters for The Studio Theatre written and directed by Aaron Posner.Nominated for Washington, D.C’s Helen Hayes Award for Outstanding Set Design fourteen times, he received the award in 2000, 2009, 2015 and most recently in 2017 for Stunning, for Woolly Mammoth Theatre, directed by Anne Kaufmann.Inclusion of materials for The Chicago Shakespeare production of Macbeth was funded in part by The University of Maryland International Program for Creative Collaboration and Research where Mr. Conway is a Professor of Design.

Todd Rosenthal (Set Designer) is a Chicago based set designer. Broadway: August Osage County (Tony Award), The Motherfucker with the Hat (Tony and Outer Critics Circle Nomination), Who’s Afraid of Virginia Woolf (Tony Award Best revival), Of Mice and Men, This is Our Youth, Fish in the Dark, Straight White Men, and the upcoming Linda Vista. Select Off Broadway premieres: Red Light Winter, Barrow Street Theater; Domesticated, Lincoln Center; Qualms, Playwrights Horizons; Close Up Space, Manhattan Theatre Club; Nice Fish, St. Ann’s Warehouse. Set designer for 6 years for the Big Apple Circus. International: August Osage County (National Theatre, London, Sydney Theater, Australia); The Beauty Queen of Leenane (Theatre Royal, Ireland); Nice Fish, (Harold Pinter Theatre, West End, London); Madama Butterfly, Dublin, Ireland; and the upcoming Downstate at the National Theatre in London. Regional: Steppenwolf (33 productions), Goodman (artistic partner), Chicago Shakespeare, Guthrie, Mark Taper Forum, ART, La Jolla Playhouse, Arena Stage, Berkeley Rep, Alley Theater, Lyric Opera of Chicago, Oregon Shakespeare Festival and many others. Select Museum Exhibitions: Mythbusters: The Explosive Exhibition and The International Exhibition of Sherlock Holmes. Other select awards: 2019 Distinguished Achievement Award (United States Institute for Theatre Technology (USITT), Laurence Olivier, Helen Hayes, Ovation, Bay Area Theater Critics Circle, Joseph Jefferson, Suzi Bass, and the Michael Merritt Award for Excellence in Design and Collaboration. Full Professor, Northwestern University. Graduate, Yale Drama.

Ron West is a writer, director, and actor. He is the Roe Green Visiting Director for 2018-2019 and his "Any Resemblance" is being fully staged for the first time at Kent Theatre in April, 2019. Last year he directed Twist Your Dickens for Portland Center Stage and his musical deLEARious for the Open Fist Theater in Los Angeles. He is the author or co-author of The People vs Friar Laurence , deLEARious , Neil Simon's Musical Fools , Sex and the Second City , Disgruntled Employee Handbook , Welcome to Your Alternative Reality , among other titles. He adapted The Comedy of Errors and Taming of the Shrew for Chicago Shakespeare. He has directed many shows for The Second City, including the award winning Curious George Goes to War . He is a member of AEA, SAG-AFTRA, SDC, WGA, Dramatists Guild, and ASCAP. He appeared on Whose Line Is It, Anyway? , Third Rock from the Sun and many other TV shows . He is a 1982 graduate of KSU and a Porthouse Alumnus 1980 and 1981. He bats right and throws

The Chicago Int. Latino Theater Festival is back for its second year, and is currently running until Nov. 4th across several marquee theaters including Chicago Shakespeare, Goodman, Victory Gardens, Steppenwolf and many others. The festival features cutting-edge artists and companies from Chicago, Dallas, Los Angeles, Argentina, Colombia, Costa Rica, Mexico and Puerto Rico Sara Carranza and Christine Perez, from the Chicago Latino Theater Alliance (CLATA), and Oscar Gonzalez, cast member from "El Patio". from Abya Yala, Costa Rica join Jill Hopkins on The Morning AMp to talk about the varying productions taking place this year. For more information, visit http://www.clata.org/destinos-main

01:21 - "Bad Date" at Leapfest with Stage Left Theatre. http://stagelefttheatre.com 07:46 - Another role of Shariba's, Mother Wit, in "Insurrection." http://stagelefttheatre.com/season-35/season-36/ 10:17 - What it's like to be an Instructional Coach at Betty Shabazz International Charter Schools. 15:17 - An amazing lesson plan witnessed by Shariba. 18:44 - About Betty Shabazz International Charter Schools. http://www.bsics.org 23:41 - There are stupid questions. 28:15 - Being a casting director with MPAACT. http://www.mpaact.org 37:00 - How does being a director affect Shariba as an actress? 41:39 - Shariba has a lot coming up: Understudying Lady Capulet with "Romeo and Juliet" with Chicago Shakespeare w/Shakespeare in the Park She will be going up on August 19th at Ridge Park https://www.chicagoshakes.com Chicago Theatre Marathon "Long Canoe" https://www.chicagotheatremarathon.com Erasing the Distance "Breathe With Me." in September http://erasingthedistance.org "Starting Over" at Governor's State http://www.mpaact.org MPAACT at October 21st and 22nd, 2017 City Lit http://www.citylit.org J.B. in Fall 2017 "Insurrection: Holding History" with Stage Left - Winter 2017/2018. http://stagelefttheatre.com/season-35/season-36/ "Dontrell Who Kissed the Sea" directed by Chika Ike with First Floor Theater - Spring 2018 http://www.firstfloortheater.com (re)discover theatre http://www.rediscovertheatre.com "For One" A Series of plays built for an audience of one Aug. 30th - Sept. 30th Black Lives, Black Words https://www.facebook.com/blklivesblkwrd/ "Our America Project" Aug. 14th, 21st and 22nd "Black Lives, Black Words" was founded by previous podcast guest, Reggie Edmund. http://areyoufamousyet.libsyn.com/webpage/entreponegroes-blaculas-and-the-mind-of-reginald-edmund-episode-92 Follow us on Twitter or Facebook Intro Music: "Are You Famous, Yet?" - Laura Scruggs. Outro Music: "AYFY 1" - Christopher Kriz

Mayor Emanuel sits down with Barbara Gaines, Artistic Director of Chicago Shakespeare Theater, on the eve of the opening of "The Yard."

Booth One welcomes the amazing Rachel Rockwell to our studios amidst her action-packed schedule. Her beautiful production of Shakespeare in Love has just opened at Chicago Shakespeare Theatre, and she has about a million other irons in the fire. As a choreographer, Rachel was nominated for Joseph Jefferson Awards for The King & I (2007) and A Chorus Line (2011). As a director, she received Jeff Award nominations for Miss Saigon (2009); The 25th Annual Putnam County Spelling Bee—Best Musical (2009); Ragtime (2010) and 42nd Street (2011). For her acclaimed Drury Lane Oakbrook Theatre production of Ragtime (11 Jeff nominations and seven awards), she received the Joseph Jefferson Award as Best Director of a musical. As Director, Jeff Award nominations (2012) for Best Director and Best Musical: The Sound of Music and Sweeney Todd at Drury Lane Oakbrook Theatre; and Best Play: Enron at Timeline Theatre Company. In 2013, her production of Oliver! received a Jeff nomination for Best Musical. In 2014, she received Jeff Award nominations (Director, Choreography and Best Musical) for the revival of Brigadoon at The Goodman Theatre and Les Miserables at Drury Lane Oakbrook. Her production of Brigadoon was named Best Musical and she was named Best Choreographer for that production. She won the Jeff Award for Best Choreography for her production of Billy Eliot in 2015. In 2016, she won the Jeff Award as Best Director for her production of Ride The Cyclone at Chicago Shakespeare Theatre.[22] She has directed notable Children's Theatre productions at Chicago Shakespeare Theater. At CST, she also choreographed productions of The Merry Wives of Windsor, Romeo and Juliet, and Measure For Measure. Since the mid-nineties, Rockwell has directed and choreographed dozens of productions for such theaters as: Steppenwolf, Chicago Shakespeare Theatre, Drury Lane Theatre Oakbrook, Marriott Theatre Lincolnshire, Paramount Theatre, Noble Fool Theatricals, Fox Valley Repertory, Apple Tree, The Little Theatre on the Square, SIU Summer Theatre and McCleod Summer Playhouse. Rachel is also working on writing and developing new musicals. Look out world!!! Booth One has a couple of ideas we may be passing by her desk. Rachel is the third musical genius to come on our show who hails from Indiana. Beckie Menzie and Danni Smith, both past guests and friends of the show, cultivated their talents in the Hoosier State. We're wondering what's in the water over there!? Rachel credits her success to a long line of mentors and teachers, including Buzz Miller, who danced Bob Fosse's brilliant choreography in the seminal "Steam Heat" on Broadway and in the film of The Pajama Game. Rachel was Dance Captain in Mamma Mia on Broadway and the National Tour, and she gives us some backstage insight about what a difficult and important job this is. She choreographs in her car(!) and counter-clockwise in her living room to avoid the coffee table. So yeah, kind of a genius. Deb Acker, the production stage manager at Chicago Shakespeare, says Rachel is the most prepared director she's ever worked with. Rachel tells us why she prepares so thoroughly. Gary and Rachel talk the 2017 Tony Award nominations and Rachel particularly recommends Come From Away. Martha Lavey,  a mentor to us all and a huge force in the Chicago theater community, is our Kiss of Death segment this week. There are no words. But these journalists come close: Hedy Weiss for the Chicago Sun Times Chris Jone for the Chicago Tribune New York Times        

(http://www.advanceyourart.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/imgres.jpg) Kevin Depinet (http://www.kevindepinetstudio.com/) is a Chicago based Set designer. He has designed shows for Steppenwolf, The Goodman Theatre, Chicago Shakespeare, The National Theatre of Great Britain, The Royal George Theatre, Brooklyn Academy of Music, The McCarter Theatre, The Court Theatre, The Arden Theatre, Milwaukee Repertory, Denver Theatre Center, Writers Theatre, Drury Lane, Yale Repertory, Indiana Repertory, American Players Theatre, Chicago Children’s Theatre, The Mark Taper Forum, Glimmer Glass Opera, Cincinnati Playhouse in the Park, The Paramount Theatre, Victory Gardens, Chicago Dramatists, and Saint Louis Repertory Theatre. He also designed scenery for Michael Mann’s Film Public Enemies (Universal Studios). He was the Associate designer for the original tony award winning August: Osage County and recently Mother Fucker with a Hat, and Of Mice and Men on Broadway. Kevin Will be designing Bob Falls Iceman Cometh at the Brooklyn Academy of Music this winter and Recently designed Detroit at London's National Theatre. He is also an adjunct professor of design at DePaul University. He studied at Ball State University and the Yale School of Drama. Kevin Depinet has numerous upcoming productions lined up this year including La Boheme at Glimmerglass Opera Co. in June, Ragtime National tour in October, and many more. To learn more, visit his personal website at www.kevindepinetstudio.com (http://www.kevindepinetstudio.com/) . http://xlscenic.com (http://xlscenic.com/) / XL Scenic is a Chicago based stage design production company founded by two award winning theatrical scenic designers, Kevin Depinet and Todd Rosenthal, to create unique, immersive theatrical environments that enthrall and teach. Kevin Depinet's successful examples Les Miserables at Paramount Theatre directed by Jim Corti "This is mostly due to a truly breathtaking setting from Kevin Depinet — who treats the ever-willing Paramount like it's Peter Gelb's Metropolitan Opera" - Chris Jones, Chicago Tribune "The production’s staggeringly grand and complex set, the work of Kevin Depinet and Jeffrey D. Kmiec (wonderfully lit by Jesse Klug), sets the tone. With a turntable sage, a sweeping staircase that at moments rotates into a massive city wall, and a giant “halo” suspended from the rafters that serves as a revolving catwalk, it suggests the nine circles of Hell as described by Dante." - Hedy Weiss, Chicago Sun-Times http://www.kevindepinetstudio.com/#/les-miserables/ (http://www.kevindepinetstudio.com/#/les-miserables/) MythBusters Exhibition Behind the Scenes: Design and Graphics Accustomed to working with theater sets, Todd Rosenthal, John Dalton and Kevin Depinet describe the particular challenges -- and advantages -- of designing MythBusters: The Explosive Exhibition. https://youtu.be/2Yri5TkYbpo (https://youtu.be/2Yri5TkYbpo) MARY POPPINS | KEVIN DEPINET INTERVIEW Kevin Depinet talks about the creative process and how he managed many renowned shows at the Paramount Theatre in Chicago, including Marry Poppins, Cats, . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8m-Bo58H9A0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8m-Bo58H9A0) Podcast file Show Notes How Kevin Depinet would introduce himself in a party [00:00] Kevin Depinet's advice on how to pull a successful networking [00:55] The story behind how Kevin Depinet became a set designer [01:57] Inspirations from education guidance [03:18] Interest in business aside from theatre training [04:50] Influences to get in to business [05:13] Entrepreneurial skills he learned [05:59] The power of people management [06:13] Experiential Learning after finishing school [07:20] How Kevin Depinet established his personal and professional growth with great opportunities [08:00] Suggested practices for overcoming fears [09:46] Kevin...

Gary and Roscoe welcome Chicago Shakepeare Theatre's Creative Producer Rick Boynton to the show! First a recap of those Republican candidates who have dropped from the race in the wake of the Iowa caucuses - Huckabee, Santorum and Paul. Gary's "girlfriend" Carly Fiorina has nary a pulse and the smart money is on her taking a dive after New Hampshire. We'll know by the time this episode airs. Rick Boynton read full bio is currently Creative Producer at the world-famous Chicago Shakespeare Theatre on Navy Pier in Chicago Learn More. Which means he oversees all the amazing art that appears on stage there. Rick began his career as a performer after graduating from Northwestern University. He has also worked as an agent, a casting director (at Jane Alderman  & Chicago Shakes) and as the Artistic Director at Marriott Lincolnshire Theatre. Rick talks about his years as an actor in such shows as 1776 and Shear Madness. And about his time at Marriott Lincolnshire and the incredible creative minds and spirits he encountered during those years, including a vivid and thrilling description of their production of Miss Saigon on a budget. As well as their staging of new musicals, including Honk! We discuss at length the original musical Sense and Sensibility by Paul Gordon read about the show, which CST mounted on their main stage, and how that project first got started and then came to fruition in a gorgeously produced production. It's a unique inside look at how a theatrical idea is born, nurtured and finally blossoms into a full blown work of art. Another CST project is the recently lauded production of Ride the Cyclone read more, an off-beat, quirky and altogether insightful musical about a group of young choir singers who meet an untimely demise when a roller coaster jumps the track. The kids are left in a kind of purgatory, where a mysterious mechanical wizard promises one of them the opportunity to return to life by telling their story - but they all get to vote. This musical should see plenty of afterlife in New York and regionally. Rick gives us a glimpse into what's in store in terms of new works at CST for the coming season.  Gravedigger's Hamlet read about the show by Michael Mahler, Alan Schmuckler and Laura Schellhardt is scheduled for the fall of 2016 in conjunction with the Shakespeare 400 Chicago Festival about the festival. Shakespeare 400 Chicago is a yearlong international arts festival in 2016 celebrating the vibrancy, relevance and reach of Shakespeare. It involves theatres, museums, music, dance, opera, exhibits, lectures, film, and radio. They'll even be restaurant chefs, creating menus reflective of the themes of a Shakespeare play or sonnet, curated by Rick working with friend of Booth One Alpana Singh read bio. Don't miss some of these amazing events happening around the city all year long! Roscoe and Rick discuss the brilliant production of Follies which played at CST in 2011, and Rick relates a moving anecdote of Stephen Sondheim's visit to see the show. Truly a Booth One Experience! Gary asks Rick about his favorite places in all the world as he travels the globe in search of new and exciting theatrical works. His answers may surprise you. Rick gamely plays a little Chat Pack with Gary and Roscoe, and the conversation quickly leads to their mutual excitement over the news that Bette Midler will star in a 2017 production of Hello, Dolly! on Broadway see more at Playbill.com. Gary's never seen Roscoe so excited! Kiss of Death Lois Weisberg was an influential and energetic champion of the Chicago arts/cultural/entertainment scene. As head of the Department of Cultural Affairs, for the City, Lois was responsible for creating some of the most well-known and long-lasting events in Chicago. A few of her accomplishments: championing the World Music Festival and SummerDance programs; starting Chicago Blues Festival, the largest blues festival in the world; pushing forward C...

Rob Riley is an alum of The Second City, a Joseph Jefferson Award-nominated actor, and a former writer on Saturday Night Live. Rob’s been in “Groundhog Day,” “Chicago Fire,” the 2010 version of “A Nightmare on Elm Street,” and co-wrote, directed and performed in the legendary show “Wild Men!” at Chicago’s Body Politic and The West Side in New York. Rob has performed at The Goodman Theatre, Victory Gardens, Chicago Shakespeare, Northlight, and Steppenwolf Theatre Company.

Steve performed at a variety of theatres including Chicago Shakespeare theatre, The Canadian Stage and the Neptune Theatre. But Steve began acting later in life, after dropping out of Western University, and Sheridan College's sports medicine programs. He would study at Brock University and the National Theatre School of Canada before finally choosing a life on the stage. Steve was an actor on the verbatim theatre piece “London Road” at the Canadian Stage. We discuss how it felt rehearsing with an ear piece….listening to the real voice of the character he played, in his ear.

This week's podcast focuses on Chicago Shakespeare Theatre's new initative to take their production of The Taming of the Shrew into Chicago's neighborhood parks. Director of Production Chris Plevin and cast members Ericka Ratcliff (Kate) and Matt Mueller (Petruchio) join Anne Nicholson Weber to talk about the challeges and rewards of producing Shakespeare outside in broad daylight for audiences in neighborhoods around the city.

Stephen Ouimette, who plays Bejart in the current Broadway revival of "La Bête", talks about what it takes to hold the stage, with little dialogue, throughout the show's fabled 30 minute opening monologue -- especially after having played the voluble role of Valere himself almost 20 years ago in his native Canada. He also discusses his acting training at the University of Windsor; joining The Young Company at the Grand Theatre in London, Ontario immediately after graduation; his 17 (soon to be 18) seasons with Canada's famed Stratford Festival, where his roles have included Mozart in "Amadeus", Hamlet and Richard III; how he has kept himself fresh by alternating work at Stratford with work at many of Canada's major companies; his prior forays to the U.S., including plays at Chicago Shakespeare and a run at City Center in New York in 1998; how he feels about Stratford's "The Importance of Being Earnest", in which he played Rev. Chasuble, coming to New York without him; his rare forays into musicals, notably "Oliver!" in Edmonton and "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum" in Stratford; what it has been like to make his Broadway and West End debuts in a single year; his anticipation of appearing with Brian Dennehy in both "Twelfth Night" and "The Homecoming" in summer 2011 at Stratford; and the singular experience of playing Oliver Welles in the television series "Slings and Arrows", which afforded him the opportunity to work one last time with his early mentor, legendary Canadian actor William Hutt. Original air date - December 8, 2010.

Stephen Ouimette, who plays Bejart in the current Broadway revival of "La Bête", talks about what it takes to hold the stage, with little dialogue, throughout the show's fabled 30 minute opening monologue -- especially after having played the voluble role of Valere himself almost 20 years ago in his native Canada. He also discusses his acting training at the University of Windsor; joining The Young Company at the Grand Theatre in London, Ontario immediately after graduation; his 17 (soon to be 18) seasons with Canada's famed Stratford Festival, where his roles have included Mozart in "Amadeus", Hamlet and Richard III; how he has kept himself fresh by alternating work at Stratford with work at many of Canada's major companies; his prior forays to the U.S., including plays at Chicago Shakespeare and a run at City Center in New York in 1998; how he feels about Stratford's "The Importance of Being Earnest", in which he played Rev. Chasuble, coming to New York without him; his rare forays into musicals, notably "Oliver!" in Edmonton and "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum" in Stratford; what it has been like to make his Broadway and West End debuts in a single year; his anticipation of appearing with Brian Dennehy in both "Twelfth Night" and "The Homecoming" in summer 2011 at Stratford; and the singular experience of playing Oliver Welles in the television series "Slings and Arrows", which afforded him the opportunity to work one last time with his early mentor, legendary Canadian actor William Hutt. Original air date - December 8, 2010.

The artistic directors of four prominent, Midwestern not-for-profit theaters - The Guthrie, Steppenwolf, Chicago Shakespeare and The Children's Theatre - discuss how the economic downturn will affect the vitality of America's resident theater movement.

Barbara Gaines, founder and artistic director of the newly Tony-recognized Chicago Shakespeare Theater, talks about the company's evolution from a classical acting workshop to a major institution with an impressive home on Chicago's Navy Pier. She discusses her own background, including training at Northwestern University and an acting stint in NYC, alongside her approach to classical theatre, the expanding repertoire of the company (including why their next production features Willy Wonka), the nature of the Chicago theatre community, the development of Chicago Shakespeare's international work, and her plans for the company's future -- including a 1,000 proscenium theatre to complement their current 500 seat thrust stage. Original air date - June 20, 2008.

Barbara Gaines, founder and artistic director of the newly Tony-recognized Chicago Shakespeare Theater, talks about the company's evolution from a classical acting workshop to a major institution with an impressive home on Chicago's Navy Pier. She discusses her own background, including training at Northwestern University and an acting stint in NYC, alongside her approach to classical theatre, the expanding repertoire of the company (including why their next production features Willy Wonka), the nature of the Chicago theatre community, the development of Chicago Shakespeare's international work, and her plans for the company's future -- including a 1,000 proscenium theatre to complement their current 500 seat thrust stage. Original air date - June 20, 2008.