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Welcome to Cloudlandia
Ep153: Exploring the Crossroads of Health and Technology

Welcome to Cloudlandia

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 30, 2025 49:27


In this episode of Welcome to Cloudlandia, I chat with Dan about his recent journey to Buenos Aires for stem cell therapy on his knee. After living with an injury since 1975, he shares how advancements in medical technology are providing new solutions for pain and mobility. We discuss the challenges of recovery and the impressive potential of these therapies, along with vivid stories from his experience in this vibrant city. We also touch on the role of AI in our modern landscape, questioning its reliability and pondering whether it enhances creativity or simply recycles existing ideas. As we explore the implications of AI, we consider how it can assist in achieving desired outcomes without requiring individuals to develop new skills themselves. Sullivan emphasizes the importance of meaningful work and the balance between utilizing technology and fostering genuine human creativity. Our conversation wraps up by highlighting the ongoing journey of personal growth and the need for continuous improvement in an ever-evolving world. SHOW HIGHLIGHTS Dan shares his personal journey to Buenos Aires for stem cell therapy to rejuvenate his knee cartilage, highlighting advancements in medical technology and the promising future of these treatments. We explore the historical significance of technological revolutions, from steam power to the creation of the alphabet and Arabic numbers, and their impact on communication and societal progress. The discussion delves into the rapid advancements in AI technology, questioning its role in creativity and entrepreneurship, and examining its potential for convenience and efficiency. Dan and I consider the distinction between ability and capability, reflecting on how current technological advancements like AI have amplified capabilities while individual aspirations may lag. We discuss the integration of AI in creative processes, highlighting how it can enhance productivity and creativity without diminishing human input. The conversation touches on the importance of efficiency and prioritization in personal growth, exploring strategies for optimizing tasks and delegating effectively. We conclude by reflecting on the ongoing nature of personal and technological growth, emphasizing the value of continuous improvement and collaboration in achieving success. Links: WelcomeToCloudlandia.com StrategicCoach.com DeanJackson.com ListingAgentLifestyle.com TRANSCRIPT (AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors) Dean: Mr. Sullivan. Dan: Mr Jackson, it's been a while, it's been a while. Dean: And yet here we are. Like no time has passed. Dan: Yes. Dean: Because it's now. Dan: But I've put on a lot of bear miles since I saw you last. Dean: Yeah, tell me about your journeys. Dan: Yeah well, buenos Aires. Yep Just got back yesterday and am in considerable pain. Oh really what happened. Well, they give you new stem cells. So now, they're going after. They're going still on the knee, but now they're going after tendons and ligaments, yeah, and so this may seem contrarian, but if you're in pain, it means that they're working. Dean: Oh, okay. Dan: How's that? For a compelling offer If you feel really bad about this, it means that what I'm offering you is a great solution. Dean: Yeah, with a name like Smuckers, it's got to be good, right yeah? What was that cough syrup that was known to taste so bad? Buckley's, buckley's. Dan: Tastes so bad. Tastes awful Works great. Dean: Yeah, that's right. That's the perfect thing. Tastes awful, works great. So were they completely pleased with your progress. Dan: it's, yeah, I think that the from what I can tell from they. They show you pictures of other complete cartridges. You know, okay, with other people and my left this is my left knee an injury from 1975. 1975, uh-huh, so 50 years, and it progressively wore down. It was a meniscus tear and in those days they would remove the torn part of the meniscus, which they don't do anymore. They have new surgical glue and they just glue it back together again. But this is the. This is one of the cost of living in over a period of history where things get better and so, as a result, I have a cartilage today which is equal and capability as it was before I tore it in 1975. However, all the adjustments my left leg and my head to make, 50-year period of adjusting to a deteriorating capability in my left there was a lot of calcification and stresses and strains on the tendons. So now that they can see the complete cartilage back, they can know exactly what they have to do with the otherons. So now that they can see the complete cartilage back, they can know exactly what they have to do with the other things. So they still reinforce it. So I get new stem cells for the cartilage because it has to be reinforced and so it's a good thing. I'm planning to live another 75 years because I think every quarter over that period I'm going to be going to Argentina. Dean: Oh boy, this is great. Dan: Or Argentina, is coming to me. They're going through their FDA phases right now and he's getting the doctor scientist who created this is getting his permanent resident card in the United States. So I think probably five years five years it'll be available to others. You know they don't have to make the trip. Dean: Well, that's great so now you've got the knee cartilage of a preteen Swedish boy. We were bouncing around the mountains. Dan: Yeah, something like that, yeah, something like that, something like that it's interesting that it wasn't 1975 when the $6 million man started out. Dean: That's what you're going to end up as the $6 million man. We can rebuild. We'll see. Dan: Yeah, but I had. While we were there, we had a longtime client from Phoenix was down. He was working on knees and rotator cuffs in his shoulders. Dean: And. Dan: I was able to say does it hurt? And he says yes, it does, and I said that means it's working. Dean: That means it's working. Dan: Yeah, and I said. He said you didn't tell me about the pain part before you encouraged me to come down here and I said, well, why? You know? Why, pull around with a clear message. Dean: And I said well, why, you know why fool around with a clear message, Right, I remember when Dave Astry had he had, like you know, a hundred thousand dollars worth of all of it done, all the joints, all the like full body stuff, and he was just in such pain afterwards for a little while. But how long does the pain last? Dan: Imagine it's like getting well, if I go by the previous trips, which were not equal in intensity to this one, there was about three or four days. Three or four days and then you know, you're, you're up and around. Yeah, as a result of this, I'm not going to be able to make my Arizona trip, because this week for genius Right, because? I'm going to have to be in wheelchairs and everything. And if there's one place in the world you don't want to be not able to walk around, it's Phoenix. Because, it's all walking. That's the truth. Yeah, up and down. So we're calling that off for now, and yeah, so anyway, and anyway. But they're really thriving down there. They're building a new clinic in a different part of the city, which is a huge city. I never realized how big Buenos Aires is. It's along the same size as London, you know London. Dean: England. Yeah right, you know how big London is. How long are you go on each trip? How long are you there? Dan: We arrive on a Sunday morning and we leave on a Friday night. Okay, so the whole week. Yeah, yeah, it's about eight days, eight travel days, because on Saturday we have to go to Atlanta to catch the next plane. Dean: Yeah. Dan: That's either a dog or a monkey. Which do you have there? Dean: That was a dog, my neighbor's. I'm sitting out in my courtyard. That was my neighbor's dog. It's an absolutely beautiful Florida morning today, I mean it is room temperature with a slight breeze. It's just so peaceful out here in my courtyard aside from working out Well. Dan: you're close to the Fountain of Youth. That's exactly right. How many? 100 miles? 100 miles to the north, st Augustine, that's right. That's exactly right. Dean: Yeah, this whole. Just look at. Dan: The De Leon. That's right yeah. Dean: This whole just look at the day. Leon, yeah, I know my I think we're going to look back at this time. You know like what? You are on the leading edge of big advantage of these treatments. You know the things that are available medically, medical science wise to us, and you realize how. I was having a conversation with Charlotte this morning about the I want to layer in you know the benchmarks technologically around the things that we've been talking about in terms of text and pictures and audio and video and seeing them as capabilities where it all started. You know, and it's amazing that really all of it, aside from the printing press with gutenberg, is really less than 150 years old, all of it, because she asked about the benchmarks along the way and if you went from Gutenberg to different evolutions of the press, to the typewriter, to the word processors in personal computing and digital, you know PDFs and all of that stuff and distribution has really only started. You know full scale in 150 years, along with the phonograph in the mid-1800s, the, you know, photography and moving pictures all kind of happened in that one 1850 to 1900 period. You know, but the big change of course, yeah, 1900 to 1950. Dan: Well, you know it's interesting because it's built like the question of what are the tallest mountains on the planet, and the answer is not Mount Everest. The tallest mountains on the planet are the Hawaiian Islands. Dean: Oh, okay. Dan: You know, the big one, the big island, I think the top peak there, Mauna Loa. I think Mauna Loa is a name of it and it's about 30,. Everest is 20, 29,000 and change, but Mauna Loa is around 32,000. Dean: Is that right yeah? Dan: but it's. You know that's an island that goes right down to the ocean floor and I think the same thing with technology is that we look back and we just take it back to sea level. We take technology back but we don't see the massive, you know, the mass amount of growth that was. That was over tens of thousands of years. That was before you could actual changing technology. I think probably have the perception maybe you know 150 or 200 years where we can see changes in technology over a decade. You know it would be a tremendous thing. It's the perception of change that I think has suddenly appeared on the planet. You know, and I think that the big one, there were three right in a row it was steam power, it was electricity and it was internal combustion. You had those three multiplier technologies Steam 18, no 1770s, 17,. You know it was fully developed probably right at the time of the American Revolution 1776. You had really, dependably, certain steam power right around then. You had to have that multiplier. You had to have that multiplier for there to be significant, frequent technological jumps. You had to have this. Before that, it was slavery. It was animals and slavery that got you, and that didn't change. Dean: Yeah, I mean because the steam. That's what really was. The next big revolution in the printing press was the steam powered printing Steam powered presses. Dan: Yeah, steam presses. Dean: That allowed the newspapers to really take off then yeah. Dan: Yeah, it's fascinating. Dean: You know that you have Charlotte in my who knows all of that. Dan: You better explain that, you better explain that. Dean: I think all of our for the new listeners. Well, there may be new people. There may be new people today. Dan: You know, yes, I don't want my reputation. Dean: That's so funny. Well, even that you know having an AI that we have named Charlotte, my chat GPT buddy, to be able to bounce these ideas off and she gets it. I mean, she sees the thing, ideas off and she gets it. I mean, she sees the thing. But you know, it's really what you said about the islands. You know the sea floor right, the bedrock, the level all the way down is where that is. And I think if you look at, even before Gutenberg, the platform that was built on, for there to be movable type, there had to be type, that had to be the alphabet, the alphabet had to be. And it's just amazing when you think about what would have been the distribution method and the agreement that this was the alphabet. This is what this, this is what we're all gonna do and these are the words. Dan: And I'm fascinated by that whole, that whole development, because all that, yeah, yeah, it's really interesting because, as far as we can tell, it's it's roughly about 3 000 years ago. The alphabet eastern mediterranean is basically, but where it really took on that we notice a historical impact is with the Greeks. Their alphabet and ours isn't all that different. I think it's got a few letters different using our set of ABC. It's like 80%, 80%, 85% similarity between that and the. Greek alphabet. And the other thing is did the culture, or did the country, if you will, that? Had it, did they have any other powers? I mean, were they military powers, were they? Maritime powers and the Greeks had it. The Greeks were, they had military power. They had, you know, they were you know they weren't an island, but they had a lot of ports to the Mediterranean. And did they have ideas to go along with the alphabet? Did they have significant, significant ideas? Powerful because they were that's where the spotlight was for new thinking about things at the same time that the alphabet appeared. So they could, you know, they could get this out to a lot of different people and but it's not. It's not very old in terms of time on the planet. Right when you think about the big picture, yeah, yeah, and you could see how the countries that the civilizations, countries, cultures that did not have the alphabet, how they didn't make the same kind of progress. Dean: Yeah, that's. Dan: I mean, it's really and then the Arabic numbering system was huge, where you had zero, you had nine, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, and you had zero, and zero made all this. Nothing made all the difference in the world. Nothing made all the difference. Dean: oh, that's funny, I heard a comedian talking about the Greek salad. It was such a. It gave us so much so early. But really all we've gotten in the last few hundred years is the salad, the Greek salad they've kind of been resting on their laurels, you know. Dan: Yeah, don't forget souvlaki. Dean: Oh yes, souvlaki, Exactly. Dan: Souvlaki is a very big contribution to human progress. Dean: Uh-huh and baklava, Baklava yeah. Yes, that's so funny. I had an interesting thought the other day. I was talking with someone about where does this go? You start to see now the proliferation of AI being used in content creation poll. You know 82% of people don't trust any content that's created to be. You know whether it's authentic or whatever, or real compared to. Dan: AI created and yeah, of course I don't trust that poll. Dean: Right, exactly. Dan: None of that. How could you possibly get a poll? Dean: I know. Dan: I mean how you know your hundred closest friends. Dean: I mean, is that what I mean exactly? Dan: I think that whole thing 82 out of my hundred closest friends who's? Got a hundred close. Who's got a hundred closest friends? You know, like that yeah and you know I mean so. It's ridiculous. What we know is that it's pervasive and it's growing. Dean: Yes, that's true, I can tell. Dan: And you know I was really struck by it, like if I go back two years, let's say, you know the spring of 23. Dean: Yeah. Dan: And yeah, and I'm having my connector calls, especially with the raise owners, and you know so maybe there's 15 people on the call two years ago and maybe one of them is one of these lead scouts. He does things technological, you know, it could be Lior Weinstein or Chad Jenkins, like that, or Mike Koenigs might be Mike Koenigs, and of course they're into it and they're into it and they're making very confident predictions about where this is all going, and I go to three weeks ago, when I had two FreeZone podcasts day after each other, tuesday and Wednesday, and there might have been a combined 23 different people. A couple of people appeared twice, so 23 people and every one of them was involved in some way with AI. That had happened over a two-year period and there wasn't any, what I would say, wonder about this. There wasn't any sense. Of you know, this is amazing or anything. They're just talking about it as if it's a normal thing. So fundamental capability has gotten into the entrepreneurial marketplace and is now considered normal. Dean: Yeah, Just the way like yeah. And Wi-Fi is, you know, internet. We take that for granted. Yeah, I worry, though, that I think like, generationally, where does this head? I'm saying that it just seems like a proliferation of intellectual incest is where we're headed with that, that if all the new you know, generative ai are just regurgitating, assembling stuff that already exists, who's creating the new thoughts in there? Dan: you know, well you say you're worried I'm not worried. Dean: I don't, I mean you're not worried, I'm not worried, I'm just, you're like one of those people who says they're curious, but they actually don't care. I don't, I don't really care. You're right, they want to be seen as caring. Dan: You want to be seen as worrying. Dean: Yeah, thanks for calling me out. Dan: You're not worried at all. Dean: Yeah, that's it. I need you to keep me in check. Dan: Actually, you're luxuriating in your inequality. Dean: Yes, exactly Because I know I'm coming up with original ideas. That's right. Well, has it changed at all? No, I think that's the thing. I'm just observing it. I'm really starting to see. I think I mentioned years ago, probably when we first started the Joy of Procrastination podcast I read an article about the tyranny of convenience and I thought that was really interesting. Right, that convenience is kind of an unrated driver of things. We're like on the, you know, at the we're on the exponential curve of convenience now that there's very little need to do anything other than decide that's what you want, you know, and I think, riding on that level, I just see, like, where things are going now, like, if you think about it, the beginning of the 1900s we were, if you wanted to go anywhere, it was with a horse right. And we're at a situation now I've had it my the new tesla self-driving, they've got the full self-driving thing is, I was, I went to meet with Ilko in Vero Beach, which is about an hour and a half away, hour and 15 minutes away, and I pulled out of my driveway not even out of my driveway, I just pulled out of my garage and I said you know, navigate to the restaurant where we were meeting in Vero Beach, and then I, literally, dan, did not touch the wheel as we pulled into the restaurant All the way. The entire drive was done by Tesla and to me. You know, you see now that we're literally one step away from hopping in the backseat and just waking up when you get there, kind of thing. We're inches away from that now because functionally, it's already happening and I have 100% confidence in it. It's you, it's. It's an amazing advancement and I just think about every single thing, like you know, every possible thing that could be done for you is that's where we're moving towards. Do you know, dan Martell? Have you met dan? Dan: no, I heard his name, so he's a really cool guy. Dean: He wrote a book recently called buy back your time, but his, you know, he's made his name with sas companies, he had a sas academy and he's a investor and creates that. But he said the modern, the new modern definition is, you know, instead of software as a service, it's we're moving into success as a service, that it's delivering the result to people, as opposed to the tool that you can use to create the result. And I think that's where we're going with AI more than I don't think people learn how to use the tool as much as people organizing the tool to deliver popular results that people are going to want. And I think that that's really what you know. Electricity, if you go all the way back, like if you think about that's probably on the magnitude of the impact, right, but even way beyond that. But if you think about it, wasn't just electricity, it was what that capability, the capability of electricity, opened up, the possibility for the ability to have constant refrigeration. You know some of the application of that core capability and lighting, and lighting exactly. Dan: Lighting, lighting, yeah. Dean: So I think that's where we're yeah, looking back you know you know. Dan: The thing that strikes me, though, is it all depends on the aspirations of the individual who has these things available and my sense is, I don't see any increase, relatively speaking, in people's aspiration you don't see any increase in people's aspiration. I don't think people are any more ambitious now than when I started coaching, so they have I'll just quote you back a distinction which you made, which I think is an incredibly important distinction the ability, the difference between an ability and a capability. People have enormous capability, exponential capability, but I don't see their abilities getting any better. Right, I agree. Yes. So it doesn't mean that everybody can do anything. Actually only a very small few of people can do anything yeah. And so I think people's ability to be in the gap has gone up exponentially because they're not taking advantage of the capabilities that are there. So they feel actually, as things improve, they're getting worse. That's why the drug addiction is so high. Drug addiction is so high and addiction is so high is that people have a profound sense that, even though the world around them is getting better, they're not. Dean: Yeah, I just thought. As you're saying, all that you know is thinking about that capability and ability. That's a profound distinction. I think so, yeah. Dan: But also the the thing I'll write it down, and I'll write it down and send to you to know that. Dean: I'm serious about it, okay, but the thing people's desire for the things that ability can provide, you know, is I think there's a opportunity there in if you have the capability to, if you have the ability to apply a capability to get somebody a result that they want and value without having to go and develop the ability to create it, I think there's an opportunity there. That's kind of along the lines of that success as a service. Dan: No on an individual basis yes. But nothing's changed between the inequality of certain individuals and other individuals. Dean: Nothing's changed there. No, I think you're right, it's still distribution. Dan: Except that I think people are feeling it's still distribution, Except that the people who I think people are feeling more unequal. Dean: Yeah, yeah, but the ability to and I think AI gives people, you know, the ability to do create content at scale that they wouldn't have the ability to do otherwise. You know, even though it's mediocre, I think that's really the thing we're going to be able to have a, you know, an onslaught of no, I think it magnifies who you are to begin with. Dan: If you're mediocre, I think you get exponential mediocrity I guess. Dean: Thank you, I don't think. Dan: I don't think it takes a poor writer and makes them into a great writer. No, it does not. Dean: That's what I'm saying. Dan: Because they don't have the discernment between what's good writing and bad writing to start with. Well, how would they know when to get the AI back? I mean grammatically, I mean if they're bad at grammar, correct spelling, but that's not meaning, that doesn't have anything to do with meaning. So, yeah, so you know, I'm noticing. I mean I've normalized it already. I mean I put everything through perplexity. I read a whole paragraph and I run it through and then I'll add context to it, I'll add dimensions to it and I think but I'm the one coming up with the prompts, I doing the prompts, it's not prompting. It doesn't prompt me at all right you know, yeah, it doesn't impress me. Till the day I start in the morning, says Dan, while you were sleeping, while you were having, you know, reading and everything else. I've been doing some thinking on your behalf and I've thought this through. Now I'm impressed. Dean: I wonder how far we are away from that. Dan: I mean infinity away, uh-huh right, because that's not what it does. That's what we do. Yeah, yeah. Where do you think the desire comes from? Where do you think the desire because I see it almost as a desire is that we're completely replaceable? Where do you think that desire comes from? Dean: The desire for that people have. I think if you go down to the that technology can completely replace me. Dan: I mean, it seems to me to be an odd aspiration. Dean: I wonder what the I heard. I saw somebody let me see if I get the words right saying that I don't want to. I don't want AI to create art and writing so that I can do the dishes. I want AI to do the dishes and cook so that I can create art and music. Which is so yeah, I mean, when you look at the fundamental things like why does anybody do anything? What drives desire? I think, if you go back to the core thing, like the life that we live right now is so far removed from the life of ancestors. You know, in terms of the daily, you know, if you just look at what even going to Maslow's needs right of the if everybody we want to have a nice house, we want to have a car to drive around in, we want to have food, meals that are plentiful and delicious, and money to do the things that we want to do, but I think that most people would be content with those things. I think it's a very rarefied exception of people that are ambitious beyond their comfort requirements. Like you look at, why does somebody who you know you look at those things that once somebody reaches economic freedom kind of thing or whatever, it's very it's not uncommon that the people who don't need to continue doing stuff continue to do stuff. You know that can, like you're baked in ambition and I think score right if you look at the things that you're beyond, you don't need that at 80. Dan: I like being fully occupied with meaningful work. Dean: Right. Dan: In other words, I like working, I really do like working. Yeah, and there's no difference between the amount of time working at age. I am 80, almost 81. Dean: Yeah. Dan: At age. I am 80, almost 81. And there's no difference between the amount of hours. If you measure me by a day a week, there's no difference in the number of hours that I'm working which qualifies under work. You know it's a focus day kind of work. There's no difference now than when I was 50. How I'm going about it is very different. What I'm surrounded by in terms of other capabilities, other people's capabilities, is very different. I'm surrounded with it by. Technology is very different, okay, but it's still the same. I have sort of a measure of quality. You know that the work is. I like doing the work I'm good at. The work is meaningful. I like doing the work I'm good at. The work is meaningful, I find the work energizing, I find the work rewarding stays exactly the same and that's what I'm always. So when ai comes along, I said does it affect the amount of meaningful work that I do? And so far it hasn't changed anything and it's actually increased it. It's like I would say it. Actually I find and I can just measure it in projects that I'll start and continue work through until the project is completed. It's gone up considerably since I've had perplexity yeah, oh, that's interesting. Dean: So what would you say, like, what are the top few ways that you like? Integrate perplexity to an advantage like that for you, then? Because? Dan: you're basically, you're an observer of what you know and you're thinking about your thinking that hiring with Jeff Madoff and Jeff is working on the part of the book that involves interviews with people in show business and people who really understand the concept of casting rather than hiring, and the people who've built their businesses on a theater approach. So Jeff's doing that and we have our team supporting him. They're setting up the interviews, we're recording the interviews and we're putting them into print form for him. But the interesting thing about it is that I'm just working on the tool part of the book, the four-by-four casting tool, which is actually going to be five chapters. It's actually five chapters of the book Because the entire psychology of having people create their own roles inside your company is the essence of what casting, not hiring, really means is that you're not giving people job descriptions. You're what a completed project looks like, what a completed process looks like and everything else, but how they go about it they create for themselves. They actually create it. So they're not automatons. We're not creating robots here. We're creating people and we want them to be alert, curious, responsive and resourceful. What does? that mean we want things to happen faster, easier, bigger and better. What does that mean? We want them to create projects with a sense of commitment, courage and capability and confidence. So we're laying this out, so it's like a human being's brain manual, basically, as we're putting together that when you're involved in teamwork, what it looks like like. So what I'll do is I'll write a paragraph on my own time, just on word. I write in maybe a hundred word paragraph and what's going to be the context of this, and then I'll immediately go to perplexity and I said now I want you to take the this hundred word paragraph and I want you to come. I want you to divide it into three 50 word paragraphs and stressing these, and have one distinct idea for each paragraph. But I want the meaning of the three paragraphs to integrate with each other and reinforce each other. But there's a distinctly new thought. So I just give it all directions, I press the button and out it comes. So I said okay now looking at the essence of each of the three paragraphs, I'd like you to give each one of them a really great punchy subhead thing. I got my subheads, but I'm really engaged with, I'm sort of in real teamwork. I'm teamwork with this other intelligence and that feels yeah, really terrific, that feels really terrific. Dean: That feels really terrific, that's great. So you're using it to, you're the. You know I heard somebody talk about that the 10, 80, 10 situation where you're the beginning 10% of something, then let it create, expand that, create the 80%, and then you're the final 10 on weaving, yeah, together and except I would have about five, ten, eighty tens for the complete right. Dan: You know, yeah, and, like in perplexity, you just have the ask me line. I'll go through five or six of those and right in the course of producing what I you know, and I end up totally. I'll probably end up with about 200 words and you know it's broken down and some of them are bullet points and some of them are main paragraphs and everything, but I enjoy that. And then at the end I say now rewrite all of this in the concise, factual, axiomatic style of strategic coach Dan Sullivan. Use a maximum of Anglo-Saxon words, a maximum of active passive verbs, everything in the second person singular. You voice Helvetica and then Helvetica, please, Helvetica new standard Helvetica. Dean: New standard Exactly yes so funny, right, yeah I love that. Dan: But here's the thing, the whole question, I think, in all human experience, when you experience something new, how long is it that before amazing becomes normal and expected? Dean: yeah, yeah, and not long, no, not long. Once we get the hang of something, I think what you've had three expectations that's a good way to think about it. Actually, the way you're using it is very that's very useful yeah, and I don't keep my prompts either. Dan: I don't keep my prompts because then I'm becoming a bit of an automaton, right? So every time I start I go through the prompt, you know. And you know, I kind of have it in my head what the prompts are, but I want to see each time. Maybe I'll make a change this time and I don't want to cut myself out from the change, right, yeah, but my sense is that you went back and you could actually observe yourself learning the alphabet, you know first grade for me or learning the numbering system first grade for me. I bet the Dan who's going through this AI experience at 80 isn't much different from the. Dan at six years old, going through learning how to read and write and doing arithmetic. I bet I'm following pretty much the same pattern and that's a capability, that's a yeah, that is a really capability. Dean: Isn't that funny. It's like I remember I still remember like vividly being in kindergarten in january of 1972 and learning that something happened over the Christmas break there that we switched to, we had a new year and now it's not 1971, it's 1972. I remember just. I'm just. It's so funny how that made such an impression on me that now I knew something new. You know this is. Dan: I don't, you know how you just have total unawareness of something. Dean: And then all of a sudden now I know it's 1972, I know my place in time here yeah, yeah, I used to, I, when I was coaching. Dan: You know the first year of strategic coach program and I would talk about how long things took to get a result. You know. Dean: Yeah. Dan: So I said you know you know. I said the big difference that you're going to find being a coach is that you're essentially you're going from a time and effort economy to get a result just getting a result and shortening the amount of time it takes you to get a result. I said that's the big change that's going to take in the program. And I said, for example, I've noticed because I had a lot of really top life insurance agents in the program in the 1970s and 1980s insurance agents in the program in the 1970s and 1980s and they would talk about the big cases. You know the big cases, you know where they would get paid in those days. They get paid $100,000 for life insurance policy and they say you know those big cases, they can take two or three years. You know, take two or three years before them. And I said, actually, I said they were instantaneous. Actually, you got the sale instantaneously. And they said well, what do you mean? No, I put two. No, I said it took two or three years not getting Getting the case was actually instantaneous. It's just that you spend a lot of time not getting the case. What? if you just eliminated the amount of time not getting the case. What if you just eliminated the amount of time not getting the case and just got the case? Then the results would be instantaneous. I think that's really what we're after. Dean: Yes, I agree. I was just talking with somebody about that today. I didn't use those words, but the way you describe it is. You know that people spend a long time talking about realtors in specific. You know that they're getting the listing happens right away, but they do spend a lot of time not getting the listing here. Dan: Yeah, yeah, I remember. First I think it was certainly in the first five years I had a guy from Alberta who was apparently the top residential real estate. You know he was the top agent for the year. He had 240 sales in one year. And people say how does he do that? You can't do that number of presentations in a year, you just can't do that. I said, well, he doesn't do any presentations, he's got trained actors who do presentations. Right, he said a lot of actors spend 90% of their career unemployed. They've got to be waiters or they've got to do this and that. And he just found really great presenters who put on a great theatrical performance and they would do five or six of five or six of them a day, and he had a limousine driver. He had a limousine service that picked them up he would even have the limousine pick up the people to come for the presentation and they said yeah, but look at the cost. I said what cost? what cost indeed, but there you find the divide line between a mediocre person is the cost. He didn't think it was the cost at all. It was just an investment in him not doing presentations. And then he had an accountant who did all the you know he had a trained accountant who did all the. You know the paperwork. Dean: Yes, yeah, I think that's amazing Duplicating. Somebody has the capability to do a presentation, an actor. They're armed with the right script. They have the ability now to further somebody's goal. I meant to mention Dan. You've got a big day in Ohio this weekend. You got Shadur Sanders, went to the Browns in the NFL draft. Dan: I think they've made some bad moves, but I think that one's going to turn out to be one of their good ones. Dean: Yeah, I think so too. Dan: Especially for the coach he's getting. If you're a pocket quarterback, you do Stefanski, you know. I mean, yeah, he's a good coach. Dean: I forget whether are you a Browns or Bengals. Bengals. Cincinnati they're part of the Confederacy. Dan: They're part of the Confederacy, you know we don't yeah. They're a little bit too south. You know Cleveland. Actually, the first game I ever saw was with Jim Brown breaking the rushing record. His rookie year he broke one game rushing record. That was the first year. Dean: I ever saw a game. Dan: Yeah and yeah, yeah. It's in the blood, can't get rid of it. You know everything. Dean: Yeah, but anyway, but I rid of it, you know everything. Dan: Yeah, but anyway. But I think this is. You know we're zeroing in on something neat here. It's not getting anything you want. It's the result you want. How long does it take you to get it? I think that's really the issue. Dean: Yeah, yeah and people are vastly different in terms of the results that they were but I think that there's a difference too, that you mentioned that there's a lot of room for the gap, and I think there's a big gap between people's desires and what they're able to actually achieve. You know that I think people would love to have six-pack abs if they didn't have to go through the work of getting them. You know if there's a bypass to that, if you could just have somebody else do the sit-ups and you get the six-pack. That's what I think that AI and I mean the new, that amplified kind of capability multiplier is, but it requires vision to attach to it. It's almost like the software, yeah. Dan: Yeah, Meaning, making meaning, actually creating meaning. One of my quarterly books was you Are Not a Computer you know where. I just argue against the case that the human brain is just an information processor and therefore machines that can process information faster than human beings, then they're smarter. Dean: And. Dan: I said, if human beings were information processors. Actually I don't think we're very good information processors from the standpoint of accuracy and efficiency. I think we're terrible. Actually, I think we're terrible. We want to change things like repeat this sentence. It's got 10 words in it. We get about two words, seven or eight. We said yeah, I think I'm gonna go change one of the words right, you know very easy see what happens here, and I think what we're looking for is new, interesting combinations of experiences. I think we really like that. I think we like putting things together in a new way that gives us a little, gives us a little jolt of dopamine. Dean: I think that's true. That's like music, you know. It's like every. All the notes have already been created, but yet we still make new songs, some combination of the same eight notes in an octave, you know, yeah I think it would be. Dan: Uh, what was that song for that celine dion's name from the titanic? You know they were. The two lovers were in front of the boat and then yes, the wind blowing them in there. Seeing the sun interesting song the first time you heard it. But you're in a cell by yourself and there it plays every three minutes, 24 hours a day. You'd hang yourself. Dean: Absolutely yeah. Dan: That's the truth. Yeah, what'd you get? What's a pickup from the day. Dean: I like your approach of you know, of using the way you're using perplexity. I think that's a big planting for me to think about over the next week. Here is this using capabilities to create an ability bypass for people that they don't need to have the ability to get the result that they want. You know, because that's kind of the thing, even though people they would have the capability to create a result but they don't have an ability, comes in many different ways. You know, I think that the technical know-how, the creative ability, the executive function, the discipline, the patience, all those things are application things and if we can bypass all of that, I the that kind of blends with this idea of results but it's being in the process of constantly being in the action and the activity of making something faster and easier. Dan: I don't think. I think it's the activity of making things easier and faster, and bigger and better. I think that's what we love. We love that experience of doing that. And once we've done it once, we're not too interested in doing it the next time. Dean: We're looking for something else to do it with, I think who, not how, fits in that way right of doing you see what, you see what you want, and not having that awareness, even your, you know your checklist of can I get this without doing anything? Yeah, you know, or what's the least that I mean and the answer is never. Dan: No, right, almost never. Dean: Never, yes, right. Dan: Yeah, what happens is I identify just the one thing I have to do. I just have to do this one thing. Then the next question is what's the least I can do to get it? And I say this one thing Can I get it faster or easier? Okay, and then the third thing is then who's somebody else who can do that faster, easier thing for you? And then you're on to the next thing. But I think it's a continual activity. It isn't. It's never a being there you know, because then you're in the gap that's right yeah, yeah, anyway, always delightful dan another, uh, one hour of sunday morning well spent. Dean: Yeah, absolutely that's exactly right, always enjoyable. Are we on next week? Dan: yes, I believe yes, we are perfect, all right, okay here, okay, thank you thanks dan bye okay, bye.

Nach meiner Kenntnis ist das sofort!
S5, Folge 6: Nach meiner Kenntnis warnt die Geschichte mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Nach meiner Kenntnis ist das sofort!

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 16, 2025 63:12


Nejkow und Kießling wollen die Zukunft lesen und dafür mit jemandem in der Vergangenheit blättern, der die Geschichte einmal komplett durchgespielt hat. Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und für den Osten und das, was kommen könnte absolut der beste Ansprechpartner. Die Hobbypolitologen durften ihn im Podcast fragen und haben gelauscht - auch, wenn die Botschaft nicht leicht zu verdauen ist...

Natürliche Ausrede
234 mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über eine Zeit zwischen Russland und den USA

Natürliche Ausrede

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 10, 2025 119:49


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und Autor und zum fünften Mal zu Gast im Podcast.

Ein Gespräch über den Ausgang der Bundestagswahl, über USA und Russland als Gegner Europas und Rohstoffvorkommen in der Ukraine, über Donald Trumps Herablassung gegenüber Wolodymyr Selenskyj im Oval Office und die Live Übertragung ins russische Fernsehen, über den, sich in kriegerischen Gesellschaften ablagernden Hass und ob Pazifismus nicht mehr zeitgemäß ist.Infos & Links zur Folge⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Instagram⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Twitter / XWeitere Folgen mit Ilko-Sascha KowalczukFolge .217 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei SpotifyFolge .203 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei SpotifyFolge .179 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei SpotifyFolge .177 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei SpotifyInfos & Links zum Podcast⁠⁠

Eins zu Eins. Der Talk
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk, Historiker: Endspiel - Übernahme - Freiheitsschock

Eins zu Eins. Der Talk

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 13, 2025 46:30


Als er sich dem DDR-Regime verweigerte, wurde Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk mit 19 "in eine Pförtnerbude" gesetzt. Jetzt hat er mit "Freiheitsschock" einen Bestseller zur Geschichte Ostdeutschlands geschrieben.

Akuttjournalen
Evalueringsrapporten etter leteaksjon i Lindesnes

Akuttjournalen

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 12, 2025 59:01


Tirsdag 17. oktober 2023 ble 7 år gamle Torjus Seland funnet omkommet, etter å ha vært savnet i to dager i Lindesnes kommune. Hvorfor ble ikke gutten funnet når 1500 mennesker var ute å lette etter han? I dag skal vi snakke om hvordan redningskjeden jobbet disse to dagene og hva som er lærdommen fra en av de mest komplekse leteaksjonene i senere tid.Om episodenAksjonen involverte et bredt spekter av ressurser, inkludert nødetater, frivillige redningsorganisasjoner, luftressurser og uorganiserte frivillige. Agder politidistrikt anmodet i etterkant Hovedredningssentralen om å evaluere leteaksjonen. Formålet med evalueringen er å bidra til å forbedre redningstjenestens evne til å håndtere lignende situasjoner i fremtiden ved å identifisere læringspunkter og behov for endringer i systemperspektiv, leser vi i sammendraget av evalueringsrapporten, som kom i sommer. Leteaksjonen etter Torjus var både omfattende og kompleks. Rundt 300 profesjonelle frivillige, og anslagsvis 1200-1500 uorganiserte frivillige var involvert i søket etter syvåringen og la ned over 7000 timer i søk over de to døgnene leteaksjonen varte. Søkstimer fra de uorganiserte frivillige og nødetatene kommer i tillegg. På det meste var det fire helikoptre og opp mot åtte droner i lufta samtidig.I denne episoden snakker vi med personer som var sentrale både under, og i forbindelse med evalueringsarbeidet, om hensikten med evalueringsrapporten, hvilke læringspunkter den avdekket og hvordan disse skal forankres inn i hverdagen til alle som har sitt virke i redningskjeden.Gjestene våre i denne episoden:Kjetil Lussand er avdelingsdirektør ved Hovedredningssentralen - Sør, og har vært sentral i arbeidet med evalueringsrapporten.Vidar Arnesen er stabssjef i Agder politi og organiserte politiressursene under selve leteaksjonen, og har vært sentral i arbeidet med evalueringsrapporten.Per Kristian Askland er beredskapsansvarlig i Norske Redningshunder Agder, og satt i ILKO under leteaksjonen og koordinerte hunderessursene som ble bruk i søk etter Torjus.NyhetsbrevHold deg oppdatert om episodene våre og når vi slipper nye. Meld deg på nyhetsbrevet vårt her! eller send en sms til 09044 med kodeord FAG og din egen epostadresse.Fotokreditering: Wenche Alsand / Norske redningshunderKapittelinndeling(00:38) - Innledning til episoden (02:36) - Innledning til rapporten (06:10) - Bakgrunn for leteaksjonen (10:11) - Behovet for å evaluere leteaksjonen (13:55) - Evalueringsrapporten: Sen varsling av HRS (23:37) - Evalueringsrapporten: Bedre loggføring (28:02) - Evaluerignsrapporten: Stor arbeidsbelastning (32:17) - Evalueringsrapporten: Bruk av statusmøter (35:42) - Evalueringsrapporten: Bedre implementering av veiledere (43:14) - Evalueringsrapporten: Bedre luftkoordinering (50:49) - Oppsummering Link til evalueringsrapportenhttps://www.hovedredningssentralen.no/evaluering-etter-leteaksjon-i-lindesnes-er-klar/

Buchkritik - Deutschlandfunk Kultur
Buchkritik: "Freiheitsschock" von Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Buchkritik - Deutschlandfunk Kultur

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 24, 2024 6:32


Martin, Marko www.deutschlandfunkkultur.de, Lesart

Lesart - das Literaturmagazin - Deutschlandfunk Kultur
Buchkritik: "Freiheitsschock" von Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Lesart - das Literaturmagazin - Deutschlandfunk Kultur

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 24, 2024 6:32


Martin, Marko www.deutschlandfunkkultur.de, Lesart

Gin And Talk
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über Freiheit, Überforderung und den Osten

Gin And Talk

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 24, 2024 68:25


Die Wiedervereinigung brachte Freiheit, aber auch Überforderung. Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk beschreibt den “Freiheitsschock” vieler Ostdeutscher und warnt vor den autoritären Tendenzen, die daraus erwachsen. Die Freiheit muss täglich verteidigt werden, um zu verhindern, dass alte Wunden die Demokratie schwächen.

Lesart - das Literaturmagazin (ganze Sendung) - Deutschlandfunk Kultur
Buchkritik: "Freiheitsschock" von Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Lesart - das Literaturmagazin (ganze Sendung) - Deutschlandfunk Kultur

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 24, 2024 6:32


Martin, Marko www.deutschlandfunkkultur.de, Lesart

Andruck - Deutschlandfunk
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: "Freiheitsschock. Eine andere Geschichte Ostdeutschlands"

Andruck - Deutschlandfunk

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 21, 2024 22:08


Stövesand, Catrin www.deutschlandfunk.de, Andruck - Das Magazin für Politische Literatur

Natürliche Ausrede
217 mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über Freiheit, Faschismus und das Einmischen in die eigenen Angelegenheiten

Natürliche Ausrede

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 14, 2024 121:47


Mit dem Buch „Freiheitsschock“ hat es den Historiker und Autoren Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk auf die vorderen Plätze der Bestseller Listen und ins Zentrum der revitalisierten, innerdeutschen Ost-West-Debatte verschlagen. Ein Gespräch am Tag der deutsche Einheit über alternative Vorschläge zum Tag der deutschen Einheit, warum Frieden ohne Freiheit nichts wert ist, über das Playbook der Extremistenund die Diktatur der Mehrheit, eine Gegenwart ohne Zukunftsvorstellung und warum in der BRD Freiheit mit Wohlstandsversprechen und Demokratie mit wirtschaftlicher Stabilität verknüpft ist. Infos & Links zur Folge ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Instagram ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Twitter / X ⁠⁠Buch: Freiheitsschock Weitere Folgen mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk Folge .177 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei Spotify Folge .179 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei Spotify Folge .203 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts . ⁠⁠bei Spotify Infos & Links zum Podcast ⁠⁠

Geschichte Europas
T-008: Die Gründung der DDR (1949), mit Dr. Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Geschichte Europas

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 7, 2024 60:51


Mon, 07 Oct 2024 02:00:00 +0000 https://geschichteeuropas.podigee.io/391-391 ff63a2fe24b4e516868fd5595a040541 T: Kalter Krieg und Europäische Einigung Ressourcen Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk, Walter Ulbricht : Der deutsche Kommunist WRINT Podcast mit Herrn Kowalczuk über Walter Ulbricht Verknüpfte Folgen Der Parlamentarische Rat und das Grundgesetz (1948/49), mit Dr. Benedikt Wintgens (16.09.2024) Den Podcast unterstützen UNTERSTÜTZE DEN PODCAST BEI STEADY! Marlon unterstützt den Podcast seit März 2023 mit einem Betrag, der den monatlichen Hosting-Kosten entspricht. Dafür möchte ich ihm hier ganz besonders danken! EINZELSPENDE ÜBER PAYPAL SENDEN Ab dem 10. September 2024 nenne ich regelmäßig in der Anmoderation die Vornamen von neuen, den Podcast unterstützenden Personen. Widerspruch dagegen bitte ich im Zusammenhang mit dem Zusenden der Unterstützung anzuzeigen. Feedback und Kommentare! Podcast-Blog mit Kommentarfunktion #historytelling - Netzwerk unabhängiger Geschichtspodcasts Schick mir Kommentare und Feedback als Email! Der Podcast bei Fyyd Folge mir bei Mastodon! Frag mich nach deiner persönlichen Einladung ins schwarze0-Discord! Die Episoden werden thematisch und nicht nach Erscheinungsdatum nummeriert. Für einen chronologischen Durchgang zur europäischen Geschichte sollten die Episoden nach Namen sortiert werden. schwarze0fm hatte als Hobbyprojekt begonnen - inzwischen habe ich aber durch Auftragsproduktionen und Crowdfunding die Möglichkeit gewonnen, mehr und bessere Folgen für Geschichte Europas zu produzieren. Das Prinzip "schwarze Null" bleibt - die Einnahmen werden verwendet, für mich Rahmenbedingungen zu schaffen, den Podcast zu betreiben und weiterzuentwickeln. In dieser Folge habe ich das ausführlich erklärt. This episode of "Geschichte Europas" by schwarze0fm (Tobias Jakobi) first published 2024-10-07. CC-BY 4.0: You are free to share and adapt this work even for commercial use as long as you attribute the original creator and indicate changes to the original. Der Podcast ist Teil des Netzwerks #historytelling und von Wissenschaftspodcasts.de. 391 full T: Kalter Krieg und Europäische Einigung no Deutschland,Zeitgeschichte,DDR,Gründung,Walter Ulbricht,Deutsche Teilung,Kalter Krieg Tobias Jakobi

SWR2 Zeitgenossen
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: „Wir brauchen wieder positivere Erzählungen in diesem Land“

SWR2 Zeitgenossen

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 3, 2024 43:40


Mit dem Mauerfall erlitten die Menschen in Ostdeutschland einen „Freiheitsschock“ – meint der Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. Und nennt so sein neues Buch mit dem Untertitel „Eine andere Geschichte Ostdeutschlands von 1989 bis heute“. Den Beitritt der DDR zum Geltungsbereich des Grundgesetzes 1990 und die Transformation des sozialistischen Staats in eine Demokratie mit kapitalistischer Wirtschaft bezeichnet er als „Übernahme“ durch die Bundesrepublik. Mit sozialen Narben, Entwertungen von Biografien und antidemokratischen Ressentiments, die bis heute in Ostdeutschland nachwirken.

NDR Kultur - Das Gespräch
"Freiheitsschock" im Osten: Gespräch mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

NDR Kultur - Das Gespräch

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 3, 2024 25:53


1989/1990 bejubelten Viele im Osten den Gewinn der Freiheit - und erkannten nicht den Preis, den sie dafür bezahlten.

Die Wochendämmerung
Was ist los mit den Ostdeutschen? - ein Streitgespräch nach den Wahlen, mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und Andreas Kötzing

Die Wochendämmerung

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 27, 2024 49:05


Zwei Historiker mit unterschiedlichen Ansichten, was den Umgang mit Ostdeutschland und den Ostdeutschen angeht, diskutieren mit Holger und Katrin in dieser Sendung, was los ist in Ostdeutschland, was los ist mit den Ostdeutschen.

Apokalypse & Filterkaffee
Der Grünere gibt nach (mit Jagoda Marinić und Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk)

Apokalypse & Filterkaffee

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 26, 2024 42:13


Die Themen: Drogenmissbrauch: Münchner kassiert Anzeige wegen Kiffen auf Oktoberfest; Grünen-Spitze um Lang und Nouripour tritt zurück; Regierungsbildung in Sachsen, Brandenburg und Thüringen; Polizeigewerkschaft kritisiert Grenzkontrollen; Die neue Mitte in Österreich ist rechtsradikal und italienische Strafzettel werden nun doch wieder zugestellt Du möchtest mehr über unsere Werbepartner erfahren? Hier findest du alle Infos & Rabatte: https://linktr.ee/ApokalypseundFilterkaffee

Hauptausschuss der Salonkolumnisten
Wie autoritär wird Deutschland, Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk?

Hauptausschuss der Salonkolumnisten

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 26, 2024 67:36


Putins Armee rückt in der Ukraine Meter um Meter vor, parallel dazu gewinnen in Deutschland die Parteien mehr und mehr Einfuss, die die Ukraine in einen Diktatfrieden drängen wollen. Mit dem Historiker und Buchautor Ilko Sascha-Kowalczuk spricht Jan-Philipp Hein über die anstehenden Regierungsbildungen in Sachsen, Thüringen und Brandenburg, die teils schlicht falschen Grundannahmen über die friedliche Revolution 89/90 und den bis zur puren Verachtung reichenden deutschen Blick auf die Ukraine – auch im Westen.Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei TwittterUnterstützen Sie uns einmalig oder regelmäßig hier: bit.ly/haspendenModeration: Jan-Philipp HeinProducer: David HarnaschTiteltrack:"Gothamlicious" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 Licensehttp://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/

FREIHEIT DELUXE mit Jagoda Marinic
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk – Freiheitsschock

FREIHEIT DELUXE mit Jagoda Marinic

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 19, 2024 83:44


Manche nennen ihn den „Punk unter den deutschen Historikern“. Denn er war und ist unangepasst, fürs Gehorchen nicht gemacht, damals in der DDR ebenso wie heute im vereinten Deutschland. „1989 - das war meine Revolution“, sagt Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und meint damit: Die Mehrheit im Osten war eben nicht dabei, war sogar geschockt von der plötzlich errungenen Freiheit. Sein Bestseller „Freiheitsschock“ (C.H.Beck Verlag) ist ein Aufschrei gegen Rassismus, DDR-Verklärung und „Ostdeutschtümelei“. Eindringlich warnt er vor den neuen Gefahren für unsere Demokratie, unsere Freiheit. Bei FREIHEIT DELUXE erkunden Jagoda Marinic und Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk gemeinsam, was es bedeutet, sich die Freiheit zu „verdienen“ (Benjamin Franklin) und was es heißt, „diktaturgeschädigt“ zu sein. Sie debattieren, ob die Wahlerfolge von AfD und BSW im Osten eine andere Qualität haben als im Westen und ob es einen Weg gibt zwischen Ossi-Bashing und Ossi-Verteidigung. Sie erkunden, warum das Leben in Freiheit so schwierig ist und warum gerade im Westen so viele glauben, dass Freiheit gottgegeben sei. Und ganz zum Schluss erzählt Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk, welche einschneidende Lebenserfahrung aus ihm schon früh einen Fanatiker der Freiheit gemacht hat. Hier hört ihr, warum die Erzählung von der DDR als friedlicher Staat Kokolores ist (7:10) und dass auch im Freiluftgefängnis mal die Sonne scheint (9:15) was es heißt, diktaturgeschädigt zu sein (11:55) dass der Wahnsinn gerade überall aus dem Schoß kriecht (17:45) wie Ilko sein Verhältnis zum Autor Dirk Oschmann beschreibt (22:30) warum das Leben in der Diktatur viel einfacher ist als in der Freiheit (26:20) warum Hessen nicht Thüringen ist, zumindest noch nicht (42:45) wie Ilko im Westen die Freiheitsverachtung bei einigen Linken kennenlernte (46:20) wie ein demokratischer Umgang mit der Wut aussehen könnte (1:01:20) und was Ilko zu dem freiheitsliebenden Menschen gemacht hat, der er ist (1:14:00) FREIHEIT DELUXE mit Jagoda Marinic ist eine Produktion des Hessischen Rundfunks in Zusammenarbeit mit dem Börsenverein des deutschen Buchhandels. Redaktionsteam: Andrea Geißler und Christoph Scheffer Ihr erreicht uns per Mail: freiheitdeluxe@hr.de Und hier könnt ihr unseren NEWSLETTER abonnieren: https://www.hr2.de/podcasts/freiheit_deluxe/freiheit-deluxe-podcast---der-newsletter-v1,artikel_newsletter_freiheitdeluxe-100.html

SWR2 Kultur Info
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk – Freiheitsschock

SWR2 Kultur Info

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 19, 2024 4:12


Die meisten Ostdeutschen haben nie Gelegenheit bekommen, Demokratie zu lernen, meint der Autor Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. 1989/1990 kam der „Freiheitsschock“. Wie damit umgehen?  Kowalczuk plädiert für mehr aktive Eigenverantwortung und die Abkehr von der eigenen Opferrolle. Rezension von Michael Kuhlmann

Literatur - SWR2 lesenswert
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk – Freiheitsschock

Literatur - SWR2 lesenswert

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 19, 2024 4:12


Die meisten Ostdeutschen haben nie Gelegenheit bekommen, Demokratie zu lernen, meint der Autor Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. 1989/1990 kam der „Freiheitsschock“. Wie damit umgehen?  Kowalczuk plädiert für mehr aktive Eigenverantwortung und die Abkehr von der eigenen Opferrolle. Rezension von Michael Kuhlmann

WirKommunalen - nachgefragt
Freiheitsschock und Populismus – Nachgefragt bei Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

WirKommunalen - nachgefragt

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 19, 2024 55:56


Die FAZ nennt ihn den "Punk unter den deutschen Historikern“. In dieser Folge sprechen wir mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über sein neues Buch Freiheitsschock. Er erläutert, warum die liberale Demokratie in Ostdeutschland unter Druck steht, welche Spuren die DDR hinterlassen hat und welche Versäumnisse es in den 90er-Jahren bei der politischen Bildung gab. Wir diskutieren die Zukunft der Demokratie, die aktuellen Herausforderungen nach den Landtagswahlen in Sachsen und Thüringen und warum Ostdeutschland für ihn ein „Laboratorium der Moderne“ ist.

Jung & Naiv
#725 - Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über Ostdeutschland, AfD & BSW

Jung & Naiv

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 13, 2024 228:16


WRINT: Wer redet ist nicht tot
Freiheitsschock (Mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk)

WRINT: Wer redet ist nicht tot

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 2, 2024 80:20


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und wütend darüber, dass Menschen behaupten, wir würden in Deutschland nicht in Freiheit leben. Darum hat er ein Buch geschrieben. Es heißt “Freiheitsschock“* und ich habe es zum Anlass genommen, mal wieder mit ihm zu reden. *Affiliate-Link: Wer über diesen Link Amazon betritt, lässt mir bei allen Käufen der Session eine […]

WRINT: Zum Thema
Freiheitsschock (Mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk)

WRINT: Zum Thema

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 2, 2024 80:20


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und wütend darüber, dass Menschen behaupten, wir würden in Deutschland nicht in Freiheit leben. Darum hat er ein Buch geschrieben. Es heißt “Freiheitsschock“* und ich habe es zum Anlass genommen, mal wieder mit ihm zu reden. *Affiliate-Link: Wer über diesen Link Amazon betritt, lässt mir bei allen Käufen der Session eine […]

Lesestoff | rbbKultur
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: "Freiheitsschock"

Lesestoff | rbbKultur

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 26, 2024 7:53


Man kämpft ewig für etwas und plötzlich ist es da. Das kann einen dann überraschen, überfordern oder sogar schockieren. So erklärt zumindest der renommierte Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk das, was sich nach 1989/90 ereignete. Sein neues Buch trägt deshalb den Titel "Freiheitsschock". Darin beschreibt er den Kampf der Ostdeutschen um die Freiheit und fragt, wie die AfD gerade in Ostdeutschland so erfolgreich werden konnte, wo sich doch eigentlich gerade dort so lange nach Freiheit gesehnt wurde. Am kommenden Sonntag, dem Tag der Landtagswahlen in Sachsen und Thüringen, ist Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk beim House of Podcast zu Gast, im Rahmen des radio3-Debattenpodcasts "Der Zweite Gedanke" mit Natascha Freundel.

kulturWelt
DDR-Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: „Ich habe meine 89er Gewissheit verloren“

kulturWelt

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 25, 2024 22:10


Vor den Landtagswahlen in Thüringen und Sachsen - der Historiker llko-Sascha Kowalczuk über sein Debattenbuch "Freiheitsschock". Und: Cinderella-Musical-Uraufführung in Füssen / Rückblick auf das Jazzfest Saalfelden

Aktuelle Interviews
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk - vor den Wahlen in Ostdeutschland

Aktuelle Interviews

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 24, 2024 9:38


Vor den Landtagswahlen in Thüringen, Sachsen und Brandenburg sind viele Fragen offen. Der Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk diagnostiziert bei vielen Ostdeutschen einen "Freiheitsschock". Ein Erklärungsversuch!

MDR KULTUR Diskurs
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über den "Freiheitsschock" der Ostdeutschen nach 1989/90

MDR KULTUR Diskurs

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 23, 2024 36:31


Viele im Osten haben ein Problem mit der "Freiheit", erklärt der Buchautor und (Ost-)Berliner Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und warnt, die Freiheit, wie sie 89/90 erkämpft wurde, zu verraten. Gespräch mit Stefan Nölke

Der Zweite Gedanke
Der zweite Gedanke live am 1.9. mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und Marcus Bensmann

Der Zweite Gedanke

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 23, 2024 2:20


Natascha Freundel debattiert mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und Marcus Bensmann - live beim HOUSE OF PODCAST Festival im rbb am 01.09.2024, 11.00 Uhr. Freiheit, die Demokratie und die Zukunft Deutschlands - das sind Lebensthemen für den Zeithistoriker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und den Investigativreporter Marcus Bensmann von Correctiv, nicht nur am Tag der Landtagswahlen in Sachsen und Thüringen. Müssen wir nochmal neu über die DDR und ihre Folgen nachdenken? Wie ist der Erfolg der AfD gerade in den ostdeutschen Bundesländern zu erklären? "Freiheitsschock" von Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk und "Niemand kann sagen, er hätte es nicht gewusst" von Marcus Bensmann gehören zu den wichtigsten Büchern des Jahres. Der Buchladen "der divan" ist mit einem Büchertisch dabei, die Autoren signieren. Kommen Sie am 1.9. ins Haus des Rundfunks! Tickets 12 Euro (zzgl. Online-Gebühr Ticketanbieter): https://www.rbb-online-shop.de/rbb-ticketshop Alle Infos zum Festival: https://www.houseofpodcast.de

WDR 5 Neugier genügt - Redezeit
Freiheitsschock in Ostdeutschland – Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

WDR 5 Neugier genügt - Redezeit

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 14, 2024 27:55


Im Jahr 1989 erlebten viele Ostdeutsche einen "Freiheitsschock", und das hat Konsequenzen bis heute, sagt Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. Im Osten konzentriere sich im Moment der Kampf um die Deutungsmacht zu Demokratie und Freiheit. Der Historiker und Publizist warnt: "Wir stehen an einer Wegscheide." Von WDR 5.

Natürliche Ausrede
203 mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über Ostalgie, Freiheit und die Belastbarkeit der Demokratie

Natürliche Ausrede

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 3, 2024 109:16


Der, in der DDR aufgewachsene Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist einer der intimsten Kenner der Geschichte und aufmerksamsten Beobachter der gegenwärtigen Entwicklungen Ostdeutschlands. Seine, mehr als 2000 Seiten umfassende Biografie über Walter Ulbricht (Band 1: Der deutsche Kommunist; Band 2: Der kommunistische Diktator) gehört zu den umfangreichsten biografischen Werken überhaupt. Ein Gespräch über die chronische Multisystemerkrankung ME/CFS, über Ostalgie und Vergangenheitsvergessenheit, über Weinabende mit Helmut Kohl und Unvereinbarungsbeschlüsse gegen demokratisch rechtsstaatliche Parteien, über das Wesen der Freiheit, Tabubrüche und wohndurchdachte Tabus und über die Frage, ob wehrhafte Demokratie auch ein blaues Auge rechtfertigt oder sogar einfordert. Infos & Links zur Folge ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Instagram ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Twitter / X ⁠⁠Buch: Die Übernahme ⁠⁠Buch: Walter Ulbricht - Der Deutsche Kommunist ⁠⁠Buch: Walter Ulbricht - Der kommunistische Diktator Weitere Folgen mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk Folge .177 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts | ⁠⁠bei Spotify Folge .179 ⁠⁠bei Apple Podcasts | ⁠⁠bei Spotify Infos & Links zum Podcast ⁠⁠

Diwan - Das Büchermagazin
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: Walter Ulbricht. Der kommunistische Diktator

Diwan - Das Büchermagazin

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 15, 2024 59:43


George Saunders: Tag der Befreiung. Stories / Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: Walter Ulbricht. Der kommunistische Diktator / Ulinka Rublack: Dürer im Zeitalter der Wunder. Kunst und Gesellschaft an der Schwelle zur globalen Welt / Mirrianne Maan: Issa / Der Hörbuch-Tipp: Alia Trabucco Zerán: Mein Name ist Estela / Das literarische Rätsel

Diwan - Das Büchermagazin
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über seine Walter-Ulbricht-Biographie

Diwan - Das Büchermagazin

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 15, 2024 35:55


Der Historiker erzählt - gestützt auf einen riesigen Quellen-Fundes - die Lebensgeschichte des deutschen Kommunisten und kommunistischen Diktators. Ein Gespräch mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuck zum Erscheinen des zweiten und abschließenden Bandes.

WRINT: Wer redet ist nicht tot
WR1577 Walter Ulbricht

WRINT: Wer redet ist nicht tot

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 14, 2024 235:30


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und hat zwei dicke Bücher vorgelegt: Walter Ulbricht – Der deutsche Kommunist* und Walter Ulbricht – Der kommunistische Diktator*. Und weil ich Ilko stundenlang zuhören könnte, bin ich einfach zu ihm gefahren und habe ihm stundenlang zugehört. Wir reden über Ulbricht und alles was dazugehört, über das Biografieschreiben, und schweifen am […]

WRINT: Zum Thema
WR1577 Walter Ulbricht

WRINT: Zum Thema

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 14, 2024 235:30


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und hat zwei dicke Bücher vorgelegt: Walter Ulbricht – Der deutsche Kommunist* und Walter Ulbricht – Der kommunistische Diktator*. Und weil ich Ilko stundenlang zuhören könnte, bin ich einfach zu ihm gefahren und habe ihm stundenlang zugehört. Wir reden über Ulbricht und alles was dazugehört, über das Biografieschreiben, und schweifen am […]

WRINT: Geschichtsunterricht
WR1577 Walter Ulbricht

WRINT: Geschichtsunterricht

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 14, 2024 235:30


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist Historiker und hat zwei dicke Bücher vorgelegt: Walter Ulbricht – Der deutsche Kommunist* und Walter Ulbricht – Der kommunistische Diktator*. Und weil ich Ilko stundenlang zuhören könnte, bin ich einfach zu ihm gefahren und habe ihm stundenlang zugehört. Wir reden über Ulbricht und alles was dazugehört, über das Biografieschreiben, und schweifen am […]

Natürliche Ausrede
179 mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über Geschichte, Dystopien und offene Gesellschaften

Natürliche Ausrede

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 13, 2023 110:29


Der Historiker und Autor Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist (innerhalb weniger Wochen) zum zweiten Mal zu Gast im Podcast. Ein Gespräch über das Überangebot der Informationsgesellschaft, über Dystopien und die Totalitarismus Theorie, Transformationen von Gesellschaften vor dem Hintergrund einer um sich greifenden Transformationsmüdigkeit, über die politischen Gefahren künstlicher Intelligenz und wie Sachbücher Zuviel Informationen enthalten können. Infos & Links zur Folge ⁠⁠NATÜRLICHE AUSREDE .177 mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei BlueSky ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Instagram Bücher zur Folge ⁠⁠Die Geschichte der Welt in 6 Bänden ⁠⁠„Frühling der Revolution“ von Christopher Clark ⁠⁠„Schöne neue Welt“ von Aldous Huxley ⁠⁠„Wir“ von Jewgeni Samjatin ⁠⁠„Gewalt“ von Steven Pinker Infos & Links zum Podcast ⁠⁠✨Supporte Natürliche Ausrede ⁠⁠✉️ 5G Newsletter ⁠⁠

Natürliche Ausrede
177 mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über die DDR, die Wiedervereinigung und Ostdeutschland

Natürliche Ausrede

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 30, 2023 123:50


Auch 33 Jahren nach der Wiedervereinigung scheint noch nicht vollständig zusammengewachsen zu sein, „was zusammen gehört“. Zuletzt sorgten die steigenden  Umfragewerte der AfD für ein erneutes, mediales Auflodern der Debatte um Gemeinsamkeiten und Unterschiede zwischen Ost- und Westdeutschland. Für Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist die gegenwärtige Entwicklung zwar nicht überraschend aber dennoch beunruhigend. Aufgewachsen in der DDR gehört der Autor und Historiker zu den aufmerksamsten Beobachtern der Prozesse in Ostdeutschland, war Mitglied der Enquete Kommission und hat 2019 mit „Die Übernahme“ eines der wichtigsten Bücher zum innerdeutschen Diskurs beigetragen. Ein Gespräch über seine Arbeit an seiner großen Biografie über Walter Ulbricht, über Versprechungen und Realitäten der Wiedervereinigung, über überzeugt rechte Milieus und Emotionen in Politik, Gesellschaft und Demokratie, die Verantwortung von seriösem Journalismus und warum wir vergessen haben, wie schnell das 1990 alles ging. Infos & Links zur Folge ⁠⁠Buch: Die Übernahme ⁠⁠Buch: Walter Ulbricht - Der Deutsche Kommunist ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei BlueSky ⁠⁠Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk bei Instagram Infos & Links zum Podcast ⁠⁠✨Supporte Natürliche Ausrede ⁠⁠✉️ 5G Newsletter ⁠⁠

der Freitag Podcast
Wie rechts ist der Osten? Jakob Augstein im Gespräch mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

der Freitag Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 3, 2023 54:03


Ins Literaturhaus Berlin, wo dieses Gespräch aufgezeichnet wird, kommt Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk mit einem schwarzen T-Shirt, auf dem die blau-gelbe Flagge der Ukraine zu sehen ist. Freiheit – dieser Wert steht im Zentrum seines Denkens. Der 1967 in Ostberlin geborene Historiker beschäftigt sich seit Jahrzehnten mit der Aufarbeitung der SED-Diktatur, gerade erst ist der erste Teil einer großen Biografie über Walter Ulbricht erschienen (C. H. Beck, 1.006 S., 58 €). Der zweite Teil soll 2024 folgen. Jetzt, wo die AfD in Sachsen auf 35 Prozent in Umfragen kommt, hat „Freitag“-Verleger Jakob Augstein bei Kowalczuk nachgefragt: Wie rechts ist der Osten? Die Antwort wirft einen dunklen Schatten auf die Hoffnung, dass zumindest der Westen der Republik vom Rechtsruck verschont bleibt ... Das Gespräch wurde im Rahmen des „radioeins- und Freitag-Salon“ aufgezeichnet. Foto: © Ekko von Schwichow

MDR KULTUR Diskurs
Der Deutsche Kommunist: Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über Walter Ulbricht

MDR KULTUR Diskurs

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 22, 2023 79:43


Klug und gebildet, aber auch derart verschlagen und instinktsicher, dass er unter Stalins Terror zum Parteiführer aufstieg. Die neue Biografie korrigiert das gängige Bild des KPD- und SED-Führers Walter Ulbricht.

Geschichte Europas
T-003: Der Volksaufstand in der DDR am 17. Juni 1953, mit Dr. Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Geschichte Europas

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 12, 2023 86:08


Mon, 12 Jun 2023 02:00:00 +0000 https://geschichteeuropas.podigee.io/205-205 63afd2d7e80f0966acbacc5b18352179 T: Kalter Krieg und Europäische Einigung Kooperation Dr. Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk auf Twitter Verknüpfte Folgen Der ungarische Volksaufstand (1956), mit Prof. Dr. Michael Gehler (01.11.2021) Heinrich Lübke, Proklamation des 17. Juni zum Nationalen Gedenktag des deutschen Volkes (1963) (05.06.2023) Erklärung des Ausnahmezustands im Sowjetischen Sektor Berlins (1953) (22.07.2023) "Juni '53" - vom historischen Stoff zum historischen Roman, mit Frank Goldammer [Konrad-Adenauer-Stiftung] (29.07.2023) Zum Podcast UNTERSTÜTZE DEN PODCAST BEI STEADY! Marlon unterstützt den Podcast seit März 2023 mit einem Betrag, der den monatlichen Hosting-Kosten entspricht. Dafür möchte ich ihm hier ganz besonders danken! Podcast-Blog mit Kommentarfunktion #historytelling - Netzwerk unabhängiger Geschichtspodcasts Schick mir Kommentare und Feedback als Email! Der Podcast bei Fyyd Der Podcast auf Twitter schwarze0fm auf Twitter Frag mich nach deiner persönlichen Einladung ins schwarze0-Discord! Die Episoden werden thematisch und nicht nach Erscheinungsdatum nummeriert. Für einen chronologischen Durchgang zur europäischen Geschichte sollten die Episoden nach Namen sortiert werden. schwarze0fm hatte als Hobbyprojekt begonnen - inzwischen habe ich aber durch Auftragsproduktionen und Crowdfunding die Möglichkeit gewonnen, mehr und bessere Folgen für Geschichte Europas zu produzieren. Das Prinzip "schwarze Null" bleibt - die Einnahmen werden verwendet, für mich Rahmenbedingungen zu schaffen, den Podcast zu betreiben und weiterzuentwickeln. In dieser Folge habe ich das ausführlich erklärt. This episode of "Geschichte Europas" by schwarze0fm (Tobias Jakobi) first published 2023-06-12. CC-BY 4.0: You are free to share and adapt this work even for commercial use as long as you attribute the original creator and indicate changes to the original. 205 full T: Kalter Krieg und Europäische Einigung no Deutschland,Zeitgeschichte,Ostberlin,Berlin,20. Jahrhundert,Walter Ulbricht,BRD,SED,Erinnerungskultur,Volksaufstand in der DDR 1953

Unpacking Japan
Becoming a pro photographer in Japan with Ilko || Stories from Japan podcast Ep.12

Unpacking Japan

Play Episode Listen Later May 12, 2023 42:38


In this episode of Fish & Rice: Stories from Japan Tobi Fish and Andrii Rice are talking to Ilko a portrait photographer, who has been doing portrait photography professionally for more than 10 years. He shares his insight on challenges of finding your niche in photography business in Japan.https://www.facebook.com/ilko.allexandroff.photographyhttps://www.flickr.com/photos/ilkoallexandroff/https://www.instagram.com/ilkoallexandroff/https://twitter.com/ilkoallexandrofDo not forget to like this episode and subscribe to Fish & Rice channel to support us and our work.youtube.com/@unpackingjapan

Porsche Club Insider
Rennsport Reunion Site Visit and Luftgekühlt 8 Impressions

Porsche Club Insider

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 17, 2022 72:17


Join Vu, Manny, Damon and special guest, Ilko Nechev who is Porsche Panorama’s Advertising Director. Vu and Manny give an update on their recent site visit to Laguna Seca with Porsche. Damon tells us how many quarts of brake fluid he needed to use to get all the bubbles out. Ilko describes his Luft 8 experience in Los Angeles. Plus, there’s Porsche news, updates on unStock, LA Auto Show Member Preview and Tech Tactics West.

Podcast do PublishNews
Sabatina PublishNews #09 - Ilko Minev

Podcast do PublishNews

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 17, 2022 62:52


Presente nas listas dos livros mais vendidos do país com Nas Pegadas da Alemoa (Buzz), Ilko Minev é um búlgaro que se apaixonou pela Amazônia, mudou para Manaus e, nos últimos anos, se tornou um grande sucesso do mercado editorial, com romances ambientados na região e baseados em documentos reais. Ex-cônsul da Holanda, o escritor é dono de cultura vasta e memória afiada, que sempre rendem boas histórias, como a de quando passou dias perdido na floresta. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/podcast-do-publishnews/message

I Survived Theatre School
A 2nd Look at Dastmalchian and Hoogenakker

I Survived Theatre School

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 1, 2022 68:11


Interview: We talk to Dave Dastmalchian and John Hoogenakker about a special moment with F. Murray Abraham, finding friendship in a cutthroat environment, having substance abuse and authority issues, mind-f***ery, the cloistered nature of conservatories, using skills gained at TTS on set, taking an eclectic approach to acting, the tricky dance of teaching an art form, PR Casting, Does a Tiger Wear a Necktie, when William Burroughs discovered a copy of the Fledgling Press, a zine which Dave created.FULL TRANSCRIPT:Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:08):I'm Jen Bosworth Ramirez.Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:10):and I'm Gina Pulice.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:11):We went to theater school together. We survived it, but we didn't quite understand it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:15):20 years later, we're digging deep talking to our guests about their experiences and trying to make sense of it all.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:20):We survived theater school and you will too. Are we famous yet?Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:29):So they concocted this plan to make A shelf in our library, like right above the door frame, that goes all the way around the room. So I am not kidding you. So, soJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:00:49):Pictures, pictures, put them on the website. Okay.Dave Dastmalchian (00:00:53):Here's the deal though? My son, my, my middle child is so smart. He has never helped us with these type of projects before, because he doesn't really like, he traditionally hasn't really liked working with his hands, but this time he wanted to, it was really his idea. He wanted to do it. And he's such a math brain that he insisted on doing heavy. Pre-planning like he made us model, not a, he's calling it a model. It's not really a model. he's like got a piece of paper. He drew plans for it. He did all kinds of measurements. He used. Yeah, it was great. And he goes, listen, if we don't plan it out like this, then we get halfway through and we run into a snag and then we stop working on it, which is exactly what the oldest one. And I have done on a number of projects, including building a full-sized Playhouse on our back -Yes ma'am yes. Ma'am. I spent thousands of dollars on wood and nails and power tools so that we could have this joint project of building a Playhouse. And we didn't think it through one single bit. We, we found some plans on the internet and we went through and we made it. I got, we got all the way to the roof and the roof is what did us in? We couldn't, we couldn't get up high enough on the thing. We didn't have a high enough ladder and it's not in a great enough position. We couldn't put the roof on it, sat there for a year. And then it was time for the bar mitzvah, which we were having the party at our house. So we had to, and we had to take the whole thing down and we never finished it. So the other one goes, listen, we're I don't want to do that. I don't want to go through all this work and give it up. So he planned it and boy did he plan it with an inch of his life and it's going up and it's looking great. And I will send you picturesJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:02:44):That is done. Oh my gosh. Merry Christmas. [inaudible] freaking Christmas. That's fantastic.Dave Dastmalchian (00:02:51):I have one other cute little story to tell you.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:02:55):I took, well, I told her, um, I told C's, um, hummus story is Sasha and Chrissy and Tilly. Oh. Saw them from afar. Um, we saw them outside. Uh, they're amazing. And they laughed so hard. It was. Yeah. So it's for people that don't know. I mean, we've probably said, I'd probably made you tell it like four times, but you, but my version, this is how I tell it is that, um, your daughter says, mom, what, what kind of stuff do they have to eat in prison? Do they have like bad food? And you're like, yeah, it's probably not that great. She goes like hummus? They cracked up anyway.Dave Dastmalchian (00:03:37):She's she's hilarious. So, um, I was sick yesterday and she came home from the bus. Oh, earlier in the day she had -I was taking her to school and this little girl had these really cute boots on these little there's some, some, Ugg, type boots. She's like, Oh, I love those boots. And I S and she had said something to me about it before. And I said, yeah, you know, I looked for those, but I couldn't, I don't see where they are. I, I, you know, I can't, I can't find any of the information for it. So she comes home yesterday. Oh, this is so sweet. She brings me a plate with sliced up bananas, um, something else, and the little container of yogurt that she got in her lunch that she brought home. Cause this is kind of sugary yogurt that I never buy for her Trix yogurt. And she covered it in saran wrap. And she wrote me a note. I get, well, note, and it's a picture of the two of us. And it said, mom, get, well soon. I love you. And you, and it says at the bottom turnover, turnover, they have such, she goes, I got the information about the boots!Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:04:53):I'm telling you. She's genius.Dave Dastmalchian (00:04:56):She writes, You can get them at col that's Kohl's or you could get them at Kohl's or, um, uh, TRG I T get at targetJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:05:12):She's genius.Dave Dastmalchian (00:05:14):She followed up this morning. She goes, so did you, did you check out Kohl'sSpeaker 4 (00:05:31):[inaudible]?Dave Dastmalchian (00:05:38):Hm. We've moved a lot. I mean, not as much as you, but we've moved a lot in the time that we've been together. 20 whatever years we probably moved, I don't know, 15 times and, or maybe less than that, but, uh, between 10 and 15 times. And we, one of the things that we lug around from place to place is a lot of mementos. A box of mementos turned into two boxes, turned into two boxes each. Now we have kids, they have their boxes. So we're at the point where not only because of this for other reasons, but we have to store all the mementos in a storage facility. This is the dumbest possible thing. I mean, it also has furniture from, Oh, it has furniture. But like, anyway, we store boxes in boxes. Probably those plastic tubs, you know, the big plastic tubs would probably have like six plastic tubs that are of mementos.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:06:40):Wow.Dave Dastmalchian (00:06:41):Aaron has, you know, the, the little plaque he got when he won a tennis tournament in eighth grade is it's like a lot of things. Okay. I've gotten better at paring things down. But then when you have kids, you feel like you shouldn't throw anything away because they're the ones who are going to be going through your stuff one day and who are going to be mad. If you didn't save all of their stuff. Now, of course you cannot save all of their stuff, but like, what's your stance on mementos? What do you keep? What do you toss? What's -do you feel guilty about it, et cetera?Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:07:20):It's a great, that's a great topic. I, um, feel mixed. We have, so, yes, we've moved so much and we too have mementos. Um, there's the Marie Kondo, you know, that if it doesn't spark joy, but I don't really believe that. Um, I think people should, uh, do what they want to do for the most part. I don't subscribe to a minimalist thing, but I definitely feel like for everything you keep, you should throw out one thing. So, so, so that goes with clothes that goes, and it is really hard. Now, mementos are different because they have sentimental, they have sentimental value, but I'm remembering having to go through, uh, both dead parents' stuff. And most of it is garbage. Like most of them, most of it is like a lighter that my dad had that was engraved with someone's initials. That weren't his, why he probably stole it from somebody. But, um, but I was like, what, what, what? No. And it was a tremendous amount of emotional work to go through this stuff. And, um, yeah, I say get rid of, most of it. I get rid of most of it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:08:42):I mean, I think what it's about is, cause what, what I did with my dad is so when he died, I was right before I got married and he, so he didn't know that I got married or about any of my kids. So I think I really held onto stuff for kind of a long time, because it just felt like I didn't have time to grieve or process or whatever it is. So there are certain things that I, you know, you have your stages, like things you get rid of, like when Aaron's dad died, he came home wearing all of his father's clothes. He had his, and they were all too big pants and his shoes, well, that stuff has started to, it's been about a year, that stuff is starting to go away. So I remember the phases of getting rid of stuff. And it is something about like, you hold onto the, the stuff is like a placeholder for you doing your grieving. So it's like the more you do the work of going through the grieving that's then you, then you feel okay to get rid of the stuff. And the thing about what the kids is, I know something that they don't know, which is that it feels so precious to them now is not going to feel so precious to them. For example, when they go to college or move out and I say, we need to go through this stuff. Now we need to go through and figure out, you know, what you want. And I'm sure that they're going to want to get rid of a lot of stuff, but they also want to keep like, both boys did TaeKwonDo and went through their black belt. And the trophy for a black belt is like, as tall as a person, that's like five feet tall. Those are in storage. We went to storage to get out the Christmas stuff. And my oldest son, he picks up, he goes, this thing was really like a piece of junk. Like it's, you know, cause trophies are just made of plastic cheap metal. Yeah. So I, that was like, okay, you're going to want to get rid of this. That's a good thing. But with the smaller things, like really precious sentimental notes, I feel like keeping, but listen, not every kid or not, every person writes a card that's worth keeping, I'm sorry to say, butJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:10:58):Right. And what you don't and what, and I think what you're doing is by getting rid of the sub stuff is what you're actually doing is making your kids job easier when we all croak. So if you think about it that way, like I act, but they should be allowed maybe one tub each.Dave Dastmalchian (00:11:18):Right. And we shouldn't have to worry when it gets no, no, well, they don't, they only have one tub, but then they have things like the trophies or the other things that they don't want to get rid of. Yeah. I'm feeling like what we should do is it is a annual or at least every few years going through making sure this is still so, because it, it was only recently that the older two wanted to get rid of their schoolwork from kindergarten. Wow. Yeah. They really wanted to. And that's the other thing is like, if it is serving some emotional need, I cut it off. I don't want to cut off, but I also don't want to, I know how it is with the whole storage facility. We got a storage facility that's bigger than what we need. We're just going to fill it up like a goldfish, eating too much and filling up its bowlJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:12:05):And then their stomach explodes. Uh, but I was going to say something that you might do too, is if you're into any kind of ritual is w miles will burn. Um, we will burn stuff in a, in a, like a goodbye stuff. Like, um, if it's sentimental letters and stuff, now it, you know, there's not burning a kindergarten paper on, you know, aardvark, but, but if there's anything have some kind of ritual saying goodbye situation. Um, my sister and I, Oh my gosh. When we went to through the attic, there was a, like a 10 year period where everyone died. Right. And so we had 10 people's ashes. I'm not kidding you. My mother, my father, both three grandparents migrating at Ruth. It was crazy. So we didn't know what to do with all these ashes. We just dumped them in the garden. We are like, and we had a parade of ashes. We just had a ritual. We were like, goodbye, goodbye, aunt, Ruth goodbye. Then they all got mixed together, but we literally headed those cremations of like, not, it was like nine people, but I was like, so you don't want, you don't want stuff to accumulate that, that P that the kiddos are going to have to just go through and be like, I mean, the ashes were fine, but there was so much stuff that I was like, Oh my God, like pictures of people that you cannot name, those got to go. Yeah.Dave Dastmalchian (00:13:31):Right. What about though? Have you ever thrown something away? And then been like, Oh, I wish I hadn't got it.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:13:39):But you know what? They were, it was bigger items, actually. Wasn't sentimental stuff. It was like, my mom had this, a couple of chairs and furniture. It was more big stuff. And it doesn't sound like you have tons of big stuff. Um, it sounds like it's more sentimental stuff. Um, but I, I mostly felt like that chair, I should have hold it. It held onto the chair and some of her of dishes and stuff like that. But at the time I was like, no, it's gotta go. It's gotta go. Um, so the other thing that I would say is don't, um, for people is like, don't make any decisions when you're in a heightened, emotional state, because you will save weird and you will throw out stuff that you will. So like, it's good that you go through it once a year. Not in a crisis, not in a, not, you know, after a huge event, but at like when you like a regular checkup to the storage place,Dave Dastmalchian (00:14:36):I think too, I just had this thought what I should do, especially with papers, take pictures, just take pictures of papers. I can, I can even make a book for each of the kids. Like here is five images of all the crap you wanted me to save that I didn't, but I took a picture of it.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:14:58):Brilliant. You just thought of that. Brilliant. Yeah. You're a Marie Kondo in your own, right?Dave Dastmalchian (00:15:04):Aye. Aye. Listen, pursuant to our conversation about my home decor. I'm like, let's get rid of it. Let's get rid of it all. Like I have a China cabinet. I mean, come on. I, I, I mean, I have China. I have, I have tried, but I don't need to, it doesn't need to be displayed. Like, it's my prize possession. You know what I mean? It can just go to shelf.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:15:22):I guess that, that leads me to the question for you is, and it goes back to our other conversation, which is, um, do you think you just adopted that because it's what you thought you should do.Dave Dastmalchian (00:15:33):It's 100% that, because I, yeah, I, I learned at an early age, like I remember being on the younger side and, uh, going through something, I forget what it was, birthday, old birthday cards and throwing them away. And my mom being like, you're getting rid of them. You know, she keeps everything. She keeps her, yes, she keeps everything. But I, uh, my middle child is my, uh, icon in this way. At summer camp, you send cards, you know, you're in current and they like to receive mail. So I sent a lot of cards and he received a lot of cards. He comes home from camp. This is not this past summer. But the summary for her, I said, did you get all the cards I sent you? He said, yes, I did. And they were so great. And on my last day of camp, I looked through all the letters that you and Gran and I gave him a kiss through with the trash. And when he said it, I, I had this Pang of like, Oh, you throw them in the trash. But of course it served its purpose. The purpose was to give him something to remember us by while he was at camp it, then it was over. Then he was going to come home and be with us. He didn't need to hold onto it.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:16:53):It's not sentimental that way. No. What about clothing? Do you hold onto clothing?Dave Dastmalchian (00:16:58):No, no. I get rid of, I mean, I have my, I have my, I kept my wedding dress and I CA I kept like a few of the kids. Very first ones. These remember the onesies that you made, that you, you, we made at your house. I have the, I have not all of them, but I have some of those, but yeah, I don't get sentimental about clothing. Aaron does. Aaron has his high school, varsity jacket and his first pair of scrubs and his first doctor coat and all this kind of stuff. Oh, wow.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:17:30):Go through your clothing. And you're not a shopper. You don't like to shop for clothes.Dave Dastmalchian (00:17:36):Well, I like to have clothes. I just don't like to shop for them. Yeah, no, I go through, I, yeah, I'll have, did I forget if you were here, you saw my closet. We have, I've never seen your closet. It's technically a walk-in, but not really. It was a very small class. I have always had a very small closet. I've never, I know that if I had a huge closet, I would just collect a bunch of clothes. So it's kind of an and shoe. So it's kind of a good thing that I don't know. That's one thing we sort of keep under control. We, I throw out something maybe like once every week or once every two weeks I get rid of stuff. Really? It's the other stuff. It's the stuff that I feel like I'm supposed to have because I have kids or I'm supposed to have, because, because really a lot of the other people in my life are very sentimental errands. Very sentimental has. My mother is very sentimental. My kids are very sentimental. So I feel like I have to keep all this stuff for them. But I really don't.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:18:31):That was a China cabinet. Was that a purchase that you thought I should have this because I'm an adultDave Dastmalchian (00:18:36):Or did you inherit it? No, we were moving here from the city and we were just both like, well, we need a dining set. And we went to the furniture store was the first time I went to like a real furniture store and they had a matching dining table and chairs with the, with a China cabinet and a, uh, something else. We've got three big pieces. It's all crappy furniture. It was a waste. It was expensive. And it was a waste of money because all furniture that's made past bef you know, since 1950 is crappy furniture, um, dining table. Well, it's big, but it's, it's really like wobbly. It's crappy. It's crappy. So I, I think I'm going to, maybe after the holidays, get rid of the China cabinet, whole King thing. Like it doesn't give me any joy to look at it. It doesn't give, it's just like, here's where we put all the crap that we use on Thanksgiving.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:19:33):Right? It's more of a storage. It's not a showcase for anything special. What you need to do is get so many snow Globes that then you've got you put those in there, maybe, but that's a huge, you don't really need maybe a different kind of case for the snow Globes.Dave Dastmalchian (00:19:48):Something like that would give me joy, some little bauble, something like that. It's just plates and vases and, and somebody who is in my family has started a collection of something for me that I don't care for. But it's like, you know how it is, the person really wants to collect something for you. And they pick something. They, they have something that they collect and then they go, well, would you like a different version of this thing? I collect it. And you know, and I remember saying once, like, Oh, that's pretty. And next thing I know I've got my, what she considers to be my version of her thing. This is not my mother. I have to feel like I have to say this because this is not my mother. And it's, it's stuff that I feel that I have to make sure is out for when this person comes to my house.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:20:43):Understood, understood. I don't, you know, I think everyone like dead in my family. So I, I, I get free from some of that, like, but I do. There's a part of me that goes, Oh, someone is thinking about you that's collecting something for you. It just, maybe they would ask them if they could collect. You know, I don't knowDave Dastmalchian (00:21:05):To me that the collecting impulse, I don't relate to it. I mean, with the exception of maybe that I like these pretty snow gloves, I I'm not, I don't collect anything. And my mother collects everything. She does. She does. She collects, she has a China pattern. She does a crystal pattern. She collects, um, she's a big reader. So she collects books. She, yeah,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:21:35):I remember I remember the house on Wayne, right? And it was a duplex. It was a two floor. She had a lot of nice stuff. She had a lot of nice stuff.Dave Dastmalchian (00:21:44):It is, it's all very nice, but it's, it's stuff. It's a lot of stuff. And I'm just finding that. I'm not as into stuff. As I thought I was,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:21:53):Well, I think the pandemic has done that to people too. It has increased for me. Anyway. It has increased my awareness that like, all this stuff is not going to save us from certain things.Dave Dastmalchian (00:22:06):Not from nothing. It's not going to save you from anything and you have to clean it and you have to store it and you have to move it. And you have to, you feel, for some reason you have to replace it. If it gets broken, like it's just a yoke, it's a yoke. And Aaron and I fantasize. When the kids leave, we're going to get a studio apartment. We're going to have no possessions. And we're going to just do whatever we want. That doesn't have anything to do with buying, maintaining, or storing stuff of anything.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:22:38):That's brilliant. I think that is a great plan. D my only caveat is please do it in California. That's all I have to say. Yes, yes.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:22:58):Today on I Survived theater school. We have the fancy friends, Dave Dastmalchian and John Hoogenakker. I call them fancy friends because that's what they are. They are fancy. They work. And they work all the time and they're delightful human beings literally think,Dave Dastmalchian (00:23:13):and they have fancy last name. I was making the episode art. I'm like, Oh, this is, of course these two have to have the longest, last name so that they really do. I've ever had. We'll just call him Dave. You guys have seen. Yeah. And you guys have seen them. I mean, not necessarily together, but, um, uh, Dave was his first film role was in, uh, the dark night. So he, I would love to have him back Sometime and ask about Heath ledger, because I bet that he's got a lot to tell about that anyway. So Dave has a, mostly a film career. He's also a screenwriter. He has written a few films that are excellent, including, um, Animals and, uh, All Creatures Here Below two excellent films. And John is a lot on television.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:24:07):Gotcha. Uh, he was on Jack Ryan as one of the big, big leads. And he, and they're in an outstanding film called Teacher together. So that's somethingDave Dastmalchian (00:24:18):Right. And the two of them wanted to do the interview together because they're such close friends and they shared a lot of memories. And it was interesting to have as it's our first duo. It was interesting to explore their friendship as a way that they both survived theater school. So please enjoy Dave, the small shin and John who can anchor.Dave Dastmalchian (00:24:40):You got to call her up again and ask her to do all right.Dave Dastmalchian (00:24:44):I'm going to make a note of that right now. Anyway. Congratulations, John and Dave, you survived theater school. No, not barely. You guys. I think you both had excellent theater school careers, but I'd like to hear it from you.Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:25:06):Uh, w I'm so glad that you're our first duo that we've had on today. The fancy friends. And I wanted to know about your experience, like together as well as a part, but like my first question for you is, did you love each other right away?Dave Dastmalchian (00:25:22):I don't, I don't know. John, did youDave Dastmalchian (00:25:26):Well, for sure,Dave Dastmalchian (00:25:30):Gina the longest and by the way, so good to see you. It's only been 20 years like this. I mean, we've, we've messaged and emailed a lot, but Jesus, this is amazing. Oh my God. Uh, so I was roommates with Gina and we were very close and then I left school for a year. And so the school moves forward. Jen, you and Gita were in the same grade. You guys all moved forward. And when I came back, it was a whole new group of people to get to know. And John, um, was one of the first people that I knew when I got back. So I felt very out of place. And, um, it was hard to come into because it's such a competitive environment and it's such a, um, intense environment. And I was both competitive and intense. So to jump into the fire with a whole new group of people, to kind of, it's hard, cause you're posturing, you're sizing up, but at the same time, you're looking for connection.Dave Dastmalchian (00:26:27):You're looking for support and it's, it's such a conflict. And John, I'm not going to get emotional today. I swear to God, but it was like one of the first people that extended such, uh, a kind generous since he's got that, that, that inimitable,John Hoogenakker (00:26:46):I'm a cuddler.Dave Dastmalchian (00:26:47):sincerity, which is what makes him such a brilliant actor. But he had that like, look me in the eyes in class and like, Hey, he has a little bit of a draw. Like I'm really excited. You're here. And I want to get to know you and I hope we get to work together. And then we went and hung out at his apartment soon after that and maybe smoke something. This is recorded, sorry, John. And then we watched star Wars stuff together and that was our bond. So that's my version of this story.John Hoogenakker (00:27:16):Um, no, God, we, we had a lot of fun. I have old pictures of you and I, and Iyisha and, uh, snuggling ghanaba, um, you snuggling and which I'm going to send you guys. Um, but, uh, yeah, we, uh, jeez, I just remember, uh, I remember Dave's, um, it bullions from day one, his like drive in his, in his positive energy. And I think, um, that is the thing that ha that has, that has been such a, um, such a driving force in Dave's career, um, is that he just never stops. It comes down to energy and positivity, and he's constantly pumping that into the world. And I think Dave has known for many, many years that it, you know, that that kind of stuff comes back to you. Um, and I think I was drawn to that in Dave, uh, yeah, from the giddy-up, butGina Pulice (00:28:10):Also recognize somehow that he needed you to take on that stare you in the eye and tell him you want to get to know him vibe. Did you know that he felt overwhelmed coming back?John Hoogenakker (00:28:23):Uh, I D I think from my perspective, the thing that drew Dave and I, to one another was a sense that, you know, in the theater school at the time that we were all there was such a, um, there was so, uh, it was a lot of mind fuckery going on. And there was a lot of, um, I think a lot of us in the acting track, especially I know this was the case throughout the school wanted, um, positive reinforcement from teachers. And sometimes I think my perspective was that people were manufacturing emotions and things to achieve that positive reinforcement. And Dave, uh, just seemed to be Dave to me, which I really, really, uh, enjoyed and appreciated. And, um, yeah. And so I think that was, uh, that was, um, it was, it was Dave's, um, his, his sort of genuine vibe that I wasJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:29:20):Both of you when I've run into you. I mean, you know, I don't, I live in California now, but I've seen you like at PR and Dave ed ran into you, one set of Starbucks in Chicago, the genuineness is unbelievable. So I, I think you're both fancy and I'm sort of sorry, starstruck, I, but when I, but there is sort of, both of you have this sort of face to face, like, look you in the eye, I'm going to have an actual conversation with you. And I think that makes you not only great, great actors, but what's more important to me is great human beings. And I, um, I don't know. I'm just so glad you guys found each other and that you're friends. It's like, no, it's not. That's how I feel. Yeah. That's how I feelDave Dastmalchian (00:30:06):The work and outside of our mutual, passionate love for the theater acting film, um, storytelling, character creation, cinema history, literature, like John. And I did kick it off immediately with a lot of, of, um, you know, kindred kind of passions for things which we all shared because we all were in that, that, that, that vortex. Um, and obviously we were drawn there because we had a passion for this stuff, but, um, you know, I've been through, uh, the ringer in my life outside of my acting career as well. And, and, and John was always one of the first people to show up and be there for me when I needed someone as well, which was you, you're not taught that in the, again, this is about surviving the theater school you're taught, um, that you're in the ensemble family mode during rehearsal. And it felt like kind of, um, during a production, but then it was right back to, you know, this really intensely bizarre, like John there's no better, I guess, adverb than mind fuckery of, um, and, and it was, it was, um, I'm very grateful, um, and, uh, many great, true friendships came out of that time because when you go through something that intense and that trying, but we, um, we, we, I would love to tell a quick story if I can, because we were kind of, we, weren't kind of, we were absolutely ups. We were in trouble a lot, um, because it's no mystery that I had a pretty intense substance abuse problem in college. And John had a pretty serious attitude problem in college. And, uh, neither of us dealt well with authority, although we loved being directed, which has always been a paradox with us. Like we love great directors that get in and like help guide us and shape things. But at the same time, we are the first people to, you know, get our backs up sometimes. And I, um, and I remember John and I were so frustrated that some of the people like he, he, there was this, this feeling of like posturing or presentation that always felt in authentic to us. And we wanted, you know, Chicago, we want to rub real dirt on our faces and smashed glass, and we're going to get in there. And, and we were doing a scene together from, um, uh, Glen Gary, Glen Ross for, um, second year, uh, scene study work with Joe [inaudible]. And it was so intense. It was the Moss era now seen at the Chinese restaurant. John is just needling into me to like, you're gonna, you're gonna get in on this heist, or I'm going to ruin your life. And we loved, like, we got into that so much. It was all space work. And we're in generally John and I were in, I was either in rave clothes or John was in some tide by Bob Marley thing. And, um, and so we had to speak special guests coming to the theater school who was going to do a scene study, uh, workshop. And it was F Murray Abraham. And, um, I'll never forget. We were all so excited, big fans. We go, they did it at a separate location on campus.John Hoogenakker (00:33:07):And it was where it was history of dramatic lit I think,Dave Dastmalchian (00:33:12):where nobody cheated. And he, um, he Through the fees that he was working on so quickly, and he was getting frustrated, like stop with the, stop with the presentation, like w Let's work these.John Hoogenakker (00:33:28):And he was also, he was also like not giving, like he would give a really incisive note and then would be like, all right, now, fuck off and do better in life!Dave Dastmalchian (00:33:38):He didn't want over preparation. He wanted this to be like a malleable Play-Doh Eve kind of moment where we could, so we were not part of that event, John and I were just sitting in the back row, probably like, just like, Whoa, this is so cool, dude. Like "that's F Murray Abraham!"]. And he looked to the crowd. He's like, is that all you got? Cause they had prepared. I don't remember four or five scenes.John Hoogenakker (00:34:01):Yeah. It was like, it looks like, well, it was like two from each classroom. And, and then we had like a break and the teachers were kind of looking around at each other, like, well, that's all I had. And that's all I got Dave, you went toDave Dastmalchian (00:34:15):Slowik Turned to me and John and slowok. goes, "You guys!"Speaker 7 (00:34:18):You guys, can we do it, John? Can we do it here? And John's like, yeah, let's do it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:34:25):What else is in costumes that they've got their props that John and I hopped up with? Uh, we, we may do, right. We got a bottle that we brought from someone else's seen some cups. Um, and we jumped up there and we did this. We did the scene where F Murray had recently done the piece or he was familiar enough with it that he could kind of jump in and, and do with this. But IDave Dastmalchian (00:34:45):Was so proud that day, even Though I knew what F ups we were. And even though I knew that I was, I knew that the work we were putting into and the discipline and the, and the, and the love we were putting into building these characters together and how much we loved playing off one another was, I knew in that moment, this is something I'm going to do with this guy for the rest of my life. And sure enough, we've gone on to do films, two films together, outside of school, we continue to collaborate. Um, I knew in that moment though, I was like, this guy I'm holding onto him for the rest of my life.John Hoogenakker (00:35:18):Dude, I wanna, I want to jump in because that was such, that was, first of all, it was, it was an amazing experience that we were like, we were like greyhounds, just ready to run. And, and we were also, we didn't realize that. So I'm going to, we talk about surviving the theater school. I don't know where to start, but more importantly, I don't know where I should stop. So you guys got to shut me up. Um, so, so, uh, I ran, I got that bottle from my roommate who drank Jamison, like all the time. So I ran across because we were in Seton hall, not Seton hall, but a sanctuary. And I got the bottle and I came back and Dave and I were getting ready and we do the, we do the scene and I knew, we knew that F Murray was going to just like, give us a note and dismiss us. So he gave us this note. And the w the one thing was I had been breaking up this paragraph that I was giving to Dave, you know, kind of feeling my way through it. And she kind of schmacting him and he was like, you know, this David Mamet gives you all of the direction you need with the punctuation, like Shakespeare. And you need to just drive through without taking a break, because that's going to give you more pay off at the end of the, at the end of the scene. And Dave and I looked at each other and we just started doing the scene before he could dismiss us. So we jumped right into it. And he had gone through all the people in our class that had been put forward. He had gone through upperclassmen, and that was the first group, Dave and I were the first two that had the audacity. Did you jump, take the note and jump back in? And we'll when we finished, he was like, that is preparation.Dave Dastmalchian (00:37:01):[inaudible] mother.Gina Pulice (00:37:05):I love that. I love that because what you're telling me in that is you each made a decision where our company is called Undeniable. So you made it, you made a decision to be undeniable. You made a decision to not let him, I'm sure everybody would. I, I'm not sure anybody else in that situation would have been willing to get up and go on and not let him deny you, not let him interrupt you. And you were like 18, 19 years old, which is like even more. So you, you both mentioned mind fuckery, which is a very evergreen theme on our podcast. And I would love to hear a little bit more about as you look back at this time in your life now, uh, and you imagine, cause some of our professors were probably the age then that we are now, what do you make of some of this? How have you reconciled some of what you now consider to be mind. Great. Did it feel like a mind fuckery then, or does it just look that way in the rear view,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:38:09):I'm just going to add a caveat, a quick caveat in that I teach at the theater school. So, um, I, and, and I, um, I'm trying to change the culture there a little bit. And so, um, I, I just always am really hyper aware that like we want, um, say whatever you want, that's what I want to say, whateverDave Dastmalchian (00:38:36):The Vincentian Brotehrs called in the legal team, man, they're coming, you're talking to John and Hey, don't worry. You go first because I know.John Hoogenakker (00:38:52):Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, I have no idea what I'm going to say. We're on a journey of discovery. No. First of all, to your point, Jen, like I know John and I admire him greatly. I feel like there's gotta be five of him in the planet to achieve all this stuff that he's achieved. And the theater school of today bears little, if any, resemblance to the theater school that Dave and I and you guys, uh, attended. Um, and that said, I don't feel like, uh, the mind fuckery that I, um, felt I was, uh, that I received was the result of, uh, some jerk cadre of teachers sitting around in a circle and being like, who can we -? You know, who can we shit on today? I don't think that's how it was. I think the difference was there was a, a strong, a greater focus on academia. At that point. It was like just giving your life to an institution and, and a philosophy and an approach to doing theater that was, uh, at that time intensely cloistered. Um, didn't allow us to kind of step outside of the school. And we all, uh, to a certain extent kind of knew what we were signing up for. When we came on board, I had been in ROTC when I was in high school. Um, I had competed in debate, so I kind of dealt with a lot of that stuff at the beginning. And I just kind of felt like when I was at theater school, as Dave said, I had a real attitude problem because I was like, I had to take on a lot of debt to go to that school. Um, my family came together and did everything they could to help me, but I, I graduated with a lot of debt. Um, and I kind of felt like, you know what? This is, I'm paying you, but like, we get to have a conversation about this. I know you're the, I know you're the pro I know you've been doing this your entire adult life, but I have questions. And I feel like I'm due an answer and a considered answer. And you don't get to just shut me down because I asked a question and I'm 19 and you're 54. Um, cause I'm here taking on a lot of personal debt that I'm going to carry into my adult life. And you owe me answers. Um, th th that's just, let's just call that an opening, uh, Sally and Dave, you can share it for a little bit,Dave Dastmalchian (00:41:03):Like, you know, it was the perfect place for me to train. The culture was a utterly complicated, complex filled with nuance. Lots of gray area came from a tradition steeped in some really, uh, important and impressive theater movements that were more, um, militaristic and disciplinary and really, um, intense. I'll always be grateful for the tools that I picked up in the theater school to this day, saved me on an almost daily basis sets because the awareness it gave me of my body and my voice, and, you know, the depth of my psychology to be able to solve problems on the fly and repeat, you know, emotional recreations, um, was really important. I will say that there were conflicting philosophies and approaches, which is, I think very healthy. One of the things I loved was that nobody said this is the theater school way. It was like, here's the Joe Slowik way. Here's the Bella Itkin way. Here's the David Avcollie way, here's the Rick Murphy way. You go to these classes, you see what works for you. You see where you're doing the best work, and then you have to grow up quickly and you have to be prepared for this dog, eat dog world of the arts that you're going to be thrown into. Once you graduate here, there is no, you know, um, kind of kind or gentle or entirely psychologically easy way to prepare somebody for the, the, the, the meat grinder that is the show business. And so for all those reasons, I was incredibly grateful. I think there were, there was a lack of oversight when it came to, um, mental wellness with some of the faculty, and I'll always hold them responsible for the fact that they allowed sexual relationships between professors and students. I think it's entirely inappropriate for people in that kind of power, um, in there.John Hoogenakker (00:42:53):It's unbelievable when you look back on it.Dave Dastmalchian (00:42:57):When I think back on the fact that I knew there were teachers that we were meant to listen to and respect and regard and trust with our deepest parts of ourselves who were seduced and having sex with students that breaks my heart. And, and I, I would tell them that to their faces today, if I could see them, but I hope they'll watch. Um, and I also think that, uh, that there was some abusive behavior, um, that I'll never understand other than they were human beings who, um, you know, who were just people that, um, were, uh, that, that, that did, that did some things that may, I like to, I like to believe that they thought they might've been helping push us, or, but some of the things that were either said or done, I go, man, that was, I can remember sitting with Gina one time. And I mean, I I'm a pretty emotionally fragile guy, but I was like on the verge of, of tears, of, of something that had happened with one of the professors that we both really admired, but also we both really kind of feared and, um, and it was just like why, but, but in all, I'm grateful because I'm not one of those people I'll run into people from the theater school who are just carrying so much damage from that time. And I'm so grateful that when I look back on my time at the theater school, in all honesty, it's with a lot of positive, it is I really go, wow. That was an amazing experience. Yes. I have anger, frustration pains about certain things that happen that I can't believe, but I do feel, I feel like it really prepared me for the world in which I'm working now.John Hoogenakker (00:44:37):I totally agree. And I, I, you know, I look back on that time and I kind of feel like what, you know, when I look at things that had that I feel like have gone pear shaped and that I was a part of, I always try and think about what, what could I have done better? And for me, I look back on that period. And I think that I was not, uh, emotionally mature enough or perhaps mature enough in general, to take on board everything that I could have learned, uh, as an actor. And I'm talking about like, uh, technique wise in that program, because I was so emotionally just kind of bombarded with. So, so much of it is, is subjective in the, in the beginning. And we're going into a career where, um, you may go up against four other people in your type, or maybe not in your type who were phenomenal actors, and you may get that job, or you may not. Um, and there could be any number of reasons why you did or you didn't and kind of trying to prepare a child. And let's be honest, if you're not in the master's track, you're still a child, um, for the realities and the emotional rigors of, uh, of what could end up being a career in a full life, doing that stuff would be the greatest act of compassion that an educational center could impart to a child. And I feel like the theater school was like that wasn't even a thing. Um, and, um, you know, I mean, not understanding why, you know, everybody probably makes the case of like, Oh, gee whiz. I was so talented in my hometown. And then I went to the theater school and I was like, Oh my God, everybody's talented. What am I going to do? But you still in class with folks, uh, you know, all these hours a day, all these days a week. And some people are, uh, become darlings. Some people do not. Some people back then, um, were kept on after the first year, after the second year. And some people were not, and there were, there were there, there were like major head scratchers about that, like to go back and to have completed two years and to be respected in the eyes of your peers and presumably in the eyes of your teachers. And then to get that, that letter that, you know, maybe this isn't for you to be able to, to make that determination in another person's life. And in that way is just, it's, it's astounding. That that was what we signed up for. And I'll tell ya, uh, I remember I'll never forget. That was not really made clear. Um, prior to coming to the theater school, like actually sitting there on the first day, I remember sitting cross-legged on the floor and listening to kind of talking, this is the greatest city in the mind of God and His being like, you know, some of you will Graduate. Most of you will not. I remember like, wow, that's pretty intense. Like I was not so clear on the whole half of you are going to get cut the first year and then half the remaining are going to get cut. The second year, that to me was like deeply, uh, ingenuous disingenuous, because what was really happening. And again, the school is a completely different school. Now they've dealt with this stuff. What was happening was they were bringing in free labor that was actually paying them shitloads of money to be free labor, and then kicking them to the curb. They, I think had a pretty good idea at audition, which of these four kids were actually going to make it to graduation. And I think we had some idea of that, but we were literally pitted against one another. I'll give you one example and then I'll shut up and let Dave go again. Um, we did, uh, an intro in second year, lot called Laughing Wild, and it was by Christopher Durang and it's a two-person so two hander, it's a man and it's a woman. And what they did was they cast four males and something like nine females and the director never set the lines. So every night it was literally these kids who still had not been invited back for their third year and could still be cut in a fucking verbal knife fight everyJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:49:11):This is fucking crazy! Yeah.John Hoogenakker (00:49:13):And you know, it was the director. Like I still had really long hair at that point. Pier said Jason Pierce had really long hair. Uh, Bryan Sharp had really long hair. And I think it was Hunter, uh, Andre. Um, and it was kind of like Ilko didn't really like our long hair. So it was like, you guys all have to look the same. That's what I'm going for. So we all got our haircut and then we commenced to like fighting over these lines. And what we ultimately did was probably pretty cool to look at, but it was also a hot mess. Um, you know, cause he'sJen Bosworth-Ramirez (00:49:49):Totally, no, I mean, I, I think it begs the, so I guess the bigger question here for me and I don't know what you guys think, but, um, th 17, should we be doing this? I, I really, I mean, I know for me, I'm, I'm grateful as hell I went there. I was, I was cut and then asked back, it was a weird thing. I got a letter and then another letter. And then, um, so as a 17 year old or sick, I was 16. Like, this is so much mind fuckery inherent in the system. And w when we went there, I mean, we're all glad we went, but like man kids, I don't know that we should be, if I would, if I had a kid, I don't know that I want my kid to be engaged in a verbal knife fight at 17 with Hunter, Andre. I I'm just, I don't know, but that's, that's a big question.Dave Dastmalchian (00:50:41):I wouldn't put my kids though on the track right now to be actors because of that. But the reality, the harsh reality is that the business of theater and the business of film and television needs 20, 21, 22 year old actors. So to throw them into the best training you can at 18, 19, 20, 21, it sucks. But it's also like it's an exceptional calling to choose the path of the artist. And it's, it's a, it's a, it's more, you know, not to be, you know, uh, whatever ridiculous about it, but it, it, it, it, it is like it's, it's, so it's such an unfair, the world is so unfair. As we know, Jesus Christ turn on the news right now, the world is an unfair place, but the arts are so unfair. And it's like, if someone's going to it's, it's such a complicated question. Cause I do think like right at like 18, maybe that's the earliest. If my kid said, dad, I want to do what you do. I'd say you do as much community theater in high school theater and drama, as you can speech debate, blah, blah, blah. I'm not taking them to a Hollywood audition until they're 18. Um, and if they want to pursue it, I would want them to go study and train somewhere. Like what the theater school is now, you know, at 18. But yeah, it's really complicated. It is. Yeah.John Hoogenakker (00:52:09):I will say that, you know, I was, I was just going to throw this in. When, when I graduated, I got a job working at Chicago Shakespeare, which was started like a couple months after graduation. And I got on stage with, um, Kevin Goodall, Lisa Dodson, Greg Finkler, Brad Armacost, um, all these amazing, uh, classic classic Chicago actors, um, stalwart Chicago actors. And it was the first, uh, it was the first show in the, in their new space. Um, so they had all these great people in the cast. So I got so lucky to be, you know, a messenger in that play. Um, but that was when my personal education in the theater like really started. And that was when I saw like these Titans, uh, kind of dealing with the humdrum rejection of, yeah, I went for another one at PR I didn't get it. Yeah. But it went to blah, blah, blah. And he's a great dude, which is a thing I've always loved about Chicago. It's like, you know, you get to a certain age, it's always the same folks in the room and you kind of are cheering for everybody. You sit in that waiting room, especially PR and it's, it's always a reunion of friends. Um, but I, I, so when I talk to people, parents of child, actors on sets who want to know what I would advise them to do, if these were my kids like Dave, I mean, I kind of, I'm kind of like, you know, if they are still interested in this, when they're 18, I would take all the money that you've saved for college. If you've saved any and just fund their apartment in Los Angeles or Chicago or New York, like start them off when they're that early, because they're four years ahead of the rest of the pack when they graduate. And they will have spent that four years learning at the feet of actual working professionals.Gina Pulice (00:54:08):Yeah. Well, the truth is when somebody wants to be this from the time they're five years old, which probably all of us did, there's no stopping them. I mean, we've heard stories of parents saying, please don't call, study theater, please do something else. And they're going to do what they're going to do, but so let's bring it back to when you guys decided you wanted to go to a conservatory for college. Was that something you knew all along? Did you figure it out later? How did you pick DePaul?Dave Dastmalchian (00:54:37):For me, it was, it was, uh, it was the, it was fate. It was, um, you know, it was truly fate. I mean, it was, it was like a miracle of God. And to me, God works through teachers. It was the power of teachers. I, um, my parents were a mess throughout my, you know, junior high and high school years where I was very much on my own in a lot of regards. And I was a high functioning, um, academically, you know, in the, in the, in the, in a good tier. Um, but I was really, uh, excelling in both speech and football. Those were kind of my two strengths coming through high school. And I didn't see the path towards, um, the academic dreams that I had for college, um, in, in speech or acting or drama for God's sake, but I did through football. So my dream was going into my senior year of high school. I was going to be as yoked as possible, play the best game I could play, get us to state, get a scholarship to go to a better school than I could go to that I knew was at my hands with the amount of money that my mom and I had. And with that scholarship, I was going to try and become a high school football coach who, who ran the drama club. That was my dream for myself, two teachers, my speech coach and our drama teacher said to sat down with me separately and said, you have something you, we will help you if you're, if you're afraid of applying to like arts programs or theater or following a track and drama and hearing that was mindblowing. And they did, they helped me do the research. I looked at SMU, NYU and DePaul. I did a regional audition and then ultimately up to Chicago and my audition was in front of John Jenkins and John Watts. I'll never forget. I was there in cutoff, Jean shorts, a tie dye, Janis Joplin t-shirt and my football socks. And there was a bunch of kids in leotards and jazz shoes who knew what they meant when they were saying things. I did it, my, my monologue was completely wrong. They said, don't do a dialect that I did, uh, a scene from Equis. And then they, we said, don't do a dialect. And I luckily remembered does a tiger wear a neck tie? And I just threw that out there. And it was fate. It was God, it was whatever you choose to believe. But then I got a letter, uh, very soon after that, that, and I was miserable thinking about playing four years of college football. That's important to note, I did not want to do that, but I knew it was a means to an end. My brother was a collegiate athlete and I knew the demands of that and that, that was going to be my life for four years. But for me to get the education I wanted, it was worth it. Um, and I got this letter that not only had I been invited to participate in the theater school program, but I had also been given this, um, this, this huge scholarship, uh, called the Stanley andJohn Hoogenakker (00:57:35):Good for you, Dave, we're all happy for you.Dave Dastmalchian (00:57:39):That's my story. I'm done as John, just going into the story about the buckets. Hey, I left school with a massive amount of Debt as well because my scholarship did not cover living expenses. That's why I had to leave theater school for a year to goJohn Hoogenakker (00:57:58):Dave. Yeah. Dave wanted to live in a four bedroom, three bathroom.Dave Dastmalchian (00:58:03):Gina can tell you where we lived on Lill. What was Our landlord's name?Gina Pulice (00:58:11):Earl Pionke!John Hoogenakker (00:58:15):was Lill, the place. It was like right around the corner from healing earth resources? Like, yeah, that's the one where like a couple like, or an adjacent building had the, uh, the deck collapsed right there. Yeah.Dave Dastmalchian (00:58:31):And the tanks? remember the Space Time tanks, John. The floating tanks?John Hoogenakker (00:58:33):what's that?Dave Dastmalchian (00:58:33):Didn't we go do that together? The tanks, the, that the, the deprivation. The sensory deprivation ones?John Hoogenakker (00:58:38):Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, right there. One of the oldest ones in the city is right there. Yeah. Thanks for, thanks for a, no dude. I'm so happy. So that'd be for you for getting a scholarship to DePaul. That's great. Um, good for you. Um, I didn't get a scholarship. I, uh, no, we, no, I totally very similar story except I was not going to be an athlete, uh, ever. Um, I was in, uh, I was, uh, in speech and debate in high school. I had not done theater since I was a child, like a younger child, uh, because I got, um, braces and my dad who was a, a local actor in Charlotte, um, was like, there's no, there's no market for a kid with braces. So then I was, um, I think at about 10th grade, I started competing in humorous interpretation, which Dave? Yeah. Um, and, and I did really well in that. And so then when I got to, uh, senior year, the drama teacher and I'd never taken drama at the theater at the, uh, high school, you know, she would, uh, she would accompany the speech team on debate trips. She reached out and she was like, Hey, you know, if you want to take this class, you can take the senior level drama class. And she, and my speech coach, uh, Barbara Miller said, you know, you should, you should check out some theater schools, see where you can study. And we, I looked into like, uh, a Julliard I was really interested in because I knew that Robin Williams had gone there, but I think it was more expensive to audition there. And I somehow missed the whole boat on, you know, I think a lot of people, I know Kelly, my wife, um, auditioned at, uh, in Chicago, but for a bunch of schools all at once. Um, and I, uh, I came in like late January, early February, uh, and we stayed, it was going to be a big deal for my family. So we stayed at the Palmer house. Um, and I went and I, again like, like Dave, I was surrounded by all these kids that just seemed so focused. And so like tuned in to this world that all of a sudden seemed very foreign to me and completely unattainable. And like, I was just completely a fish out of water. And, um, and I did, uh, my, my drama teacher had given me a monologue that was, you know, gonna be probably like, does a tire tire wear a neck tie or something, you know, appropriate for the location for the venue. And I didn't, you know, I, we had done, um, a musical called runaways and there was a monologue and runaways that I thought, well, it just really spoke to me. It was about a, a young kid whose mother had passed away. And he was kind of like just mourning her. And I remembered my drama teacher being like, well, it's your life? Good luck. And, um, and I came, came to the school and we did the whole, like, they let us through warmups, which was bizarre. That was Patrice, I think. Um, and then I did my monologue for like Betsy, I believe, and maybe John and possibly bill Brown. Um, and, uh, and I left completely dejected and I told my dad, I was like, well, that's not going to happen. Um, you know,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (01:02:06):So I have to interrupt and say that everyone we talk to, I am not kidding you. Every single human I've talked to says, I left that place after my audition feeling like, well, I don't, I think I bombed, But no one I've talked to has been like, I nailed that.John Hoogenakker (01:02:26):Well, that's, you know, I that's so, uh, indicative of the way, like the vibe at the time, the teachers weren't like, they weren't there to coddle you and be able to good job. You've really nailed it. I think you're going to go Places said, no DePaul teacher ever. No, no, no. They certainly, certainly they do now. But, uh, but yeah, so we left and I had forgotten my watch. Cause, you know, you had to like all of a sudden, like I don't, I think I just barely remembered to bring sweat pants or something like that. Um, and, uh, so I forgot my watch. So my dad was like, I'm sure you did find bud. And so like the next day or whatever, he calls Melissa Meltzer and he's like, Hey Melissa, I'm wondering, did you guys find a watch? Um, cause John, he lost a watch. You didn't, you didn't find a watch. Huh? Okay. All right. Well, uh, thank you. And then she was like, so how does John feel like he did? And my dad was like, Oh, well, he bombed it. He did very well. I just wanted to make sure we got that watch before we Charlie. And, uh, and she was like, yeah, he's one of you we're sending out a couple, uh, a couple letters of admission right now or whatever acceptance right now. And he's one of them and I just could not believe it. And, um, yeah, it was, it was really, really great. But again, I had no idea what I was signing up for, because if it wasn't DePaul, it was going to be Appalachian state, um, or community college in Charlotte because I mean, I had, I had, uh, I was in AP classes and I had done well on my SATs, but I was not a focused student otherwise. And, uh, didn't have the scores to get into state or Carolina or any of the vaunted, uh, universities in my home state.Gina Pulice (01:04:18):According to my research, you guys did at least two shows together. Uh, uh, yeah, right. Um, I got the Blues and Peter pan, Peter pan,Dave Dastmalchian (01:04:33):The, uh, we did the, um, uh, uh, Glengarry Glen Ross scene together. And then our senior year when we were all very frustrated with the, with the, with the, with the plays that had been mostly, there was some really cool plays that were selected for our fourth year, but we were, we were frustrated collectively John, his wife, Kelly, our friend, Dennis Zack, a whole group of us got together. And we put on our own production of white check. Uh, we worked together, uh, doing that, uh, outside of school and performed at a coffee shop nearby because we were determined to do challenging work that was going to actually give us a chance to do something. So, yeah. But while we were those first four years, and then in the year, since we've done three things together probably or four, yeah,Jen Bosworth-Ramirez (01:05:25):teacher was amazing. Teacher was a good,Dave Dastmalchian (01:05:27):thank you. Thank you. I was so excited when, um, we got John, uh, it's just putting him into anything is going to elevate it. As you guys know you watch any TV show, any movie, any play, you name it. John comes into something he's going to elevate it. But I knew that that relationship I needed that character that I played in teacher had nobody else to ground him. He had nobody else to clean too. He had nobody else to like tu tu tu, tu, tu tu, you know, make me feel any sense of, of my, the characters, much needed humanity for the audience to get on board with him in those moments that John and I got. And John did a lot of stuff that magically woke up. It was a great script, but man, John took it to the, a much, a greater level, but just which is the magic he does. He did the same thing in animals. When I said, we've got to please be in my movie, please. I knew what he would do and sure as he did it, he walked in and everybody was just like, I mean, it's one of the best scenes of a movie that I'm very proud of. It's a 90 minute film filled with scenes that I love, but that is the scene I've probably gone back to, uh, more than any. And I go, God, really proud of the writing I did there, but what he did with little nuanced moments, I've, I've learned a lot watching my friend onstage and on, on, on set and I will continue to, I also watch everything he does obviously because he is my friend, but also because he gets to do a lot of really cool stuff. And, um, but I learned a lot. I learned a lot from, from you, John.John Hoogenakker (01:07:07):I feel the same way about you, man. You, I got to say, Dave has always been an inspiration to me because of, as I mentioned at the beginning of our talk because of the positivity that he puts out into the world. And Dave, you know, as he mentioned earlier, uh, went through the ringer with substance abuse. And, um, I think it's less than 7% of people, uh, who, who have been where you were, uh, ever come back. Um, and so to be one of those people who not just survived, but who thrived in an already incredibly challenging industry, um, is just absolutely astounding. And to, and to continually go back to the well and create, be a force of creativity and, you know, your own engine and guiding your own ship, um, while being, uh, you know, a partner and a father is, um, I, I feel so lucky that I've gotten to lean on you for inspiration and to call you for adviceDave Dastmalchian (01:08:17):Or, you know, it's wonderful. Like it's, I'm so grateful and that's another thing I'm so I'll always thank God for the theater school because of John Hoogenakker, and so many people that have been instrumental in my life. And I think it's important to note too, as far as the friendships that were forged in that time, um, you asked earlier too, there was some, obviously there were some teachers that taught me some wonderful techniques and skills, but also really hurt my heart in some certain ways. But that was it wouldn't be fair to, to neglect and not point out that like I'll never forget it. If there was one person who actually did take time to try, I felt like in her way to teach us ways of coping was Phyllis for me, she talked to me a lot about meditation. She introduced me to some books that were really instrumental to my journey, um, and like really wacky, like psychedelic stuff that I was really invested in thinking about at the time and really cool ways of trying to process depression. I didn't, I wasn't diagnosed at that time and I wasn't getting the proper help that I needed for my depression, but that was really, I I'm so grateful, uh, as well as, you know, the encouragement that someone like her showed, she was a needed angel at the time for me, um, in a dark place. Um, and bridges, I mean, I know he wasn't, um, you know, uh, faculty, he was staff, but that guy, um, recognized and saw some stuff that no one else was willing to address in my self-destruction. And he showed up for me way outside and above and beyond the, the, the roll call of whatever his payroll was or required of himJohn Hoogenakker (01:10:03):And his door was Always open. And as a side note, he attended your wedding. I bel

Cevheri Güven
Ruslar Yeşilköy'e Rus Anıtı diktirip, parasını II. Abdülhamid'e ödetti [M. Ahmet Karabay]-Sesli Köşe

Cevheri Güven

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 26, 2022 8:01


Ruslar Yeşilköy'e Rus Anıtı diktirip, parasını II. Abdülhamid'e ödetti [M. Ahmet Karabay]

kulturWelt
West-Umzug der Stasi-Akten? Falsch!, sagt Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

kulturWelt

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 17, 2021 22:13


Die Stasi-Unterlagen-Behörde wird aufgelöst - warum das die falsche Entscheidung ist, sagt Historiker Kowalczuk im Gespräch. Und: Bachmann-Wettbewerb / Sigi Zimmerschied mit neuem Programm / Ausstellung zur documenta-Geschichte

Friedrich-Ebert-Stiftung
03 Reingehört: Das politische Buch | Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über „Die Übernahme“

Friedrich-Ebert-Stiftung

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 19, 2021 16:37


Gut 30 Jahre ist die deutsche Wiedervereinigung jetzt her – und immer noch gibt es große Unterschiede zwischen Ost und West, sozial, wirtschaftlich, politisch, aber auch in den Köpfen vieler Menschen. Und dafür gibt es Gründe, die vor allem in der Wendezeit zu suchen sind. Warum das so ist und welche Folgen dies bis heute hat, diskutiert Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk im Gespräch über sein Buch „Die Übernahme. Wie Ostdeutschland ein Teil der Bundesrepublik wurde“. Mit: Dr. Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk, Moderation: Azadê Peşmen

DJ BURLAK
MH 162 - 100% Dj Burlak - Music Horizons @ November 2020

DJ BURLAK

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 5, 2020 67:30


Was sagen Sie dazu? – der Wissens-Podcast der wbg
Folge 14: Im Gespräch mit Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: „Was geschah nach 1990?"

Was sagen Sie dazu? – der Wissens-Podcast der wbg

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 8, 2020 35:51


In unserer neuen Podcast-Folge geht es um das Buch „Die Übernahme: Wie Ostdeutschland Teil der Bundesrepublik wurde“ von Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. Rebekka Reinhard und der Autor diskutieren über ostdeutsche Opfernarrative, traumatische Tapetenerinnerungen, das „Othering“ der selbst kaum benannten Westdeutschen und darüber, wie zufrieden Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk eigentlich mit dem Titel seines Buches ist. Was sagen Sie dazu? Schreiben Sie uns auf Facebook oder unserer Community-Seite, wo sie den Podcast auch als Video finden! Was sagen Sie dazu? Steigen Sie in die Diskussion mit ein! Wir freuen uns auf den Austausch mit Ihnen auf unserer wbg Community Plattform: https://wbg-community.de/was-sagen-sie-dazu

SWR2 Kultur Info
Wie der Westen den Osten übernahm: Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über 30 Jahre Deutsche Einheit

SWR2 Kultur Info

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 2, 2020 10:39


Auch 30 Jahre nach Vollzug der Deutschen Einheit erleben wir ein Fremdeln der ehemals Ostdeutschen mit der repräsentativen Demokratie. Und ein Fremdeln damit, Verantwortung und Freiheit für sich selbst zu organisieren und zu übernehmen. Darauf hat der Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk in SWR2 hingewiesen. Kowalczuk führt dieses Fremdeln auf eine Art "Identitätslücke" zurück. "Viele klagen bis heute über einen Phantomschmerz", so Kowalczuk. Die Menschen, die in der DDR gelebt haben, hätten nach der Wende millionenfach ihre Arbeit verloren. Aber nicht nur das. Darüber hinaus sei durch den Mauerfall ihre gesamte Existenz in Frage gestellt worden. "Um den Arbeitsplatz in der DDR gruppierte sich das gesamte soziale, gesellschaftliche und kulturelle Leben, in das fast alle Menschen in der DDR eingebunden waren." Und just diesen Kontext hätten sie durch die Deutsche Einheit verloren.

WDR 2 Jörg Thadeusz
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk, Historiker

WDR 2 Jörg Thadeusz

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 29, 2020 26:58


"Der 3. Oktober ist der falsche Feiertag für Deutschland", sagt der Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. Er war von 1995 bis 1998 Sachverständiger in der Enquete-Kommission "Aufarbeitung von Geschichte und Folgen der SED-Diktatur" des Deutschen Bundestages. Aktuell ist er vom Bundeskabinett in die Kommission "30 Jahre Einheit" berufen. Am Dienstag war er zu Gast bei WDR 2 Jörg Thadeusz.

WDR 2 Jörg Thadeusz
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk, Historiker

WDR 2 Jörg Thadeusz

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 29, 2020 26:58


"Der 3. Oktober ist der falsche Feiertag für Deutschland", sagt der Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk. Er war von 1995 bis 1998 Sachverständiger in der Enquete-Kommission "Aufarbeitung von Geschichte und Folgen der SED-Diktatur" des Deutschen Bundestages. Aktuell ist er vom Bundeskabinett in die Kommission "30 Jahre Einheit" berufen. Am Dienstag war er zu Gast bei WDR 2 Jörg Thadeusz.

Haji Warsame Academy - House of Wisdom
Nin Ilko waa weyn hadduu dhinto in uu qoslaayaa la moodaa

Haji Warsame Academy - House of Wisdom

Play Episode Listen Later May 16, 2020 0:17


Nin Ilko waa weyn hadduu dhinto in uu qoslaayaa la moodaa

Bor&Dejan in...?
Bor&Dejan in... Ilka Štuhec, gostja moderatorka na radiu City

Bor&Dejan in...?

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 27, 2020 21:59


Korona hara.Bor in Dejan (skupaj s Katjo in Ano seveda:)) v svojem jutranjem showu na radiu City gostita vsak dan zanimive goste. Tu je še en kolaž debat, direktno iz etra, tokrat z našo smučarsko šampionko Ilko Štuhec!

SWR2 Zeitgenossen
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: „Das größte Glücksgefühl, das ich je hatte”

SWR2 Zeitgenossen

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 14, 2020 43:51


„1989/90 war das tiefste Glücksgefühl, das ich je hatte, für mich zählten nur Freiheit, Freiheit, Freiheit”. So erinnert sich der 1967 geborene Ostberliner Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk an das Ende der DDR vor 30 Jahren. Als freier Historiker hat er sich seither der Erforschung der DDR-Geschichte verschrieben und gilt als einer der besten Kenner des SED-Regimes.

WDR 3 Gespräch am Samstag
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über 30 Jahre Mauerfall

WDR 3 Gespräch am Samstag

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 9, 2019 37:50


Heute vor 30 Jahren kollabierte die DDR. Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk ist selbst Zeitzeuge und analysiert als Historiker den Umbruch 1989/90 sowie die Folgen der SED-Diktatur und der Wiedervereinigung.

Literatur - SWR2 lesenswert
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk - Die Übernahme. Wie Ostdeutschland Teil der Bundesrepublik wurde

Literatur - SWR2 lesenswert

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 31, 2019 4:34


"Die durch die obrigkeitsstaatlichen Erfahrungen in einem langen historischen Prozess erfolgten Prägungen und Kulturen sind durch die Art und Weise der deutschen Vereinigung nicht nur nicht gebrochen worden - sie erwiesen sich sogar als förderlich für die Integration in das neue Gemeinwesen." Rezension von Conrad Lay. C.H.Beck Verlag ISBN 978-3-406-74020-6 319 Seiten 16,95 Euro

NRK Bok
Intervju: Ilko Sascha Kowalchuck

NRK Bok

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 31, 2019 16:29


Knut Hoem har møtt den tyske forfatteren og historikeren Ilko Sascha Kowalchuck , som i ny bok peker på hvordan Vest-Tyskland overtok Øst-Tyskland

tyskland intervju nrk ilko vest tyskland knut hoem
N99 – Der Podcast zur Frankfurter Buchmesse – detektor.fm
N99 | Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk über die Fehler der Wende - "Züge einer Übernahme"

N99 – Der Podcast zur Frankfurter Buchmesse – detektor.fm

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 16, 2019 10:47


Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk schreibt in seinem Buch „Die Übernahme“ von der Wende. Im Interview spricht er über die Fehler und deren Auswirkung für das heutige Deutschland.Der Artikel zum Nachlesen: https://detektor.fm/kultur/n99-ilko-sascha-kowalczuk-ueber-die-fehler-der-wende

Hörsaal - Deutschlandfunk Nova
Revolution, Einheit und dann? - Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk

Hörsaal - Deutschlandfunk Nova

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 5, 2019 48:50


Herbst 1989: Die DDR geht unter. Rund 30 Jahre ist das her – Geschichte ist die Wende aber längst nicht. Eine Erklärung hierfür sieht der Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk in der Art, wie die Vereinigung ablief. In seinem Vortrag fordert er Anerkennung für das, was Ostdeutschland geleistet hat – auch von den Ostdeutschen selbst.

History & Politics - Körber-Stiftung
Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk: 30 Jahre Mauerfall – und nun?

History & Politics - Körber-Stiftung

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 1, 2019 23:13


Vor 30 Jahren wurde die Mauer geöffnet und damit die Grenze, die Deutschland über 40 Jahre teilte. 1990 erfolgte die Wiedervereinigung. Doch wie geeint ist Deutschland? Welche imaginären Mauern sind geblieben? Welche verschwunden? Im Podcast zieht der Berliner Historiker Ilko-Sascha Kowalczuk eine (Zwischen-)Bilanz.

BAČIULIS IR RAMANAUSKAS
B&R S01E43 20190902 Politikų ir žurnalistų privatumo ribos | Boltonas Ukrainoje ir Baltarusijoje | Grenlandija ir Šiaurės Šilko Kelias | Šimašiaus mečetė

BAČIULIS IR RAMANAUSKAS

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 1, 2019 48:18


Politikų ir žurnalistų privatumo ribo Boltonas Ukrainoje ir Baltarusijoje 00:16:13 Grenlandija ir Šiaurės Šilko Kelias 00:31:21 Šimašiaus mečetė 00:41:44 Mes būsime labai dėkingi jei pranešite miestui ir pasauliui apie mūsų Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/baciulisirramanauskas Mūsų Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Ba%C4%8Diulis-ir-Ramanauskas-261379194566105/ Radioshow ir SSG platinami čia: https://www.youtube.com/user/whatlooksrightisrigh/videos Algis & Justas platinami čia: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj2SYwpifggjRONErb8Ws_g/videos?view_as=subscriber

Nedeljski gost Vala 202
dr. Tanja Kajtna

Nedeljski gost Vala 202

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 21, 2019 39:51


Športni psihologi niso vedeževalci in nimajo čarobne paličice, njihovo delo z vrhunskimi športniki je lahko uspešno le z dolgotrajni delom. Tega se slovenski športniki vse bolj zavedajo, čeprav je v naši kulturi še vedno prisotno tudi razmišljanje, da mora svoje težave vsak rešiti sam. Nedeljska gostja je dr. Tanja Kajtna, predsednica sekcije za psihologijo športa pri Društvu psihologov Slovenije, predava na Fakulteti za šport Univerze v Ljubljani in sodeluje s številnimi slovenskimi šampioni, tudi z Ilko Štuhec. Z njo se je pogovarjal Aleš Smrekar.

Voice Over Body Shop
VOBS EP. 120 With Ilko Drozdoski 4/23/2018

Voice Over Body Shop

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 24, 2018 93:57


Ilko Drozdoski came to Los Angeles from New York City the old fashioned way- he drove across the country in a car that could barely make it, but he did. And on January 1st 1994 when he was on the beach in Venice tanning himself, he knew he'd never go back. Hollywood was calling. He toiled as a PA, driver and set worker on several films, TV shows and music videos over the years until he got his first big break: a full time job working for Steve Tisherman as an Assistant Agent. He did so well with the scheduling of the talent, that Steve promoted him to Agent in one year. He was responsible for booking, recruiting and hand holding of many, many VO talent. He placed talent in every field of VO- network promotion, film trailer, animated series, Video Games, commercial campaigns, audiobook and voices for toys- and both in English and Spanish markets! Within six years of this he and his partners bought Steve's company and renamed it TGMD. His success in Hollywood as a voice agent makes him a popular speaker! If you are as confused about Agents as we are, join Dan and George as they welcome Ilko to the set at VOBS We'll also get the Voice Over Xtra/VOBS News and much more! A VOBS that could change your career!  Brought to you by Voiceoveressentials.com, Vo2Gogo.com,  Sourceelements.com, VoiceOverXtra.com, VOICEACTORWEBSITES.com and J. Michael Collins Demos  jmcvoiceover.com/demo-production/

Cars Yeah with Mark Greene
957: Ilko Nechev is the Advertising Director for the Porsche Club of America’s monthly magazine Panorama

Cars Yeah with Mark Greene

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 31, 2018 38:39


Ilko Nechev is the Advertising Director for the Porsche Club of America’s monthly magazine Panorama. Panorama serves over 80,000 members of the PCA in an award-winning format and has been published since 1955. Ilko was born in Sofia, Bulgaria and came to the United States when he was 18 years old. He settled in New York City and became infatuated with the car culture in the USA. He joined the Porsche Club of America and purchased his first Porsche over 15 years ago, a 944 Turbo and today he drives a 993 and 997 of the iconic 911. He’s heavily involved with the Club and has helped to more than double the PCA’s advertising revenues as part of the team. He joins a group of past Cars Yeah guest from the PCA including Robb Sass, the Panorama Editor and Vu Nguyen the Executive Director of the PCA.

Podrobnosti
Ilka Štuhec – Smučarji turisti

Podrobnosti

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 19, 2017 51:37


V 86. epizodi sta se Boki in Anže pogovarjala z našo smučarsko šampionko Ilko Štuhec. Debata je tekla o pretekli in prihodnji sezoni, prilagajanju na različna smučišča, (stopljenih) ledenikih, navijačih in o smučarskih turistih, ki imajo dostikrat premalo posluha za smučarske profesionalce. V prijetnem pogovoru Ilka pove, da se zaveda, da jo bodo v prihodnosti […]

VO Buzz Weekly
EP 119 Ilko Drozdoski: Talent Agent

VO Buzz Weekly

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 16, 2016 26:47


The benefits of having an agent and the importance of a great demo. Ilko Drozdoski, managing partner and co-owner of TGMD in Los Angeles, tells the story of how he started in the entertainment business and explains the role of a voiceover agent and the benefits of having one. He addresses what TGMD looks for in a potential talent to represent and discusses the best way to submit your demo to the agency. Ilko talks about the importance of having a great voiceover demo, what the content of the demo should be and things that he likes and dislikes about the demos he hears. He breaks down the process of what happens after you submit your demo to his agency and hear what you can expect when meeting with TGMD for possible representation. Watch more videos, get the latest voiceover news, advice and updates on contests and giveaways at http://vobuzzweekly.com

VO Buzz Weekly
EP 120 Ilko Drozdoski: Talent Agent

VO Buzz Weekly

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 16, 2016 28:29


Advice on having a successful VO business from top L.A. agent. The conversation continues with Ilko Drozdoski, managing partner and co-owner of TGMD voiceover agency in Los Angeles, as he talks about the ingredients for having a successful agent-client relationship, the things actors do that makes him crazy and what keeps him excited about being an agent. He offers advice to those wanting to be successful in the voiceover business and expresses more opinions about the ultra important voiceover demo. Ilko explains how he built up the Spanish division, under the guidance of Steve Tisherman, and shares what is happening in the Spanish VO market right now. He reflects on the privilege of knowing and working with TGMD client Don LaFontaine and other personal stories from early in his career, which included doing extra work in feature films and he ends the episode with what he feels have been the keys to his success. Watch more videos, get the latest voiceover news, advice and updates on contests and giveaways at http://vobuzzweekly.com

CompTIA UK Channel Community Podcast hosted by Richard Tubb

Richard Tubb interviews George Ilko of Vitesse