Podcasts about experiential design

Paul Marden heads to the AVEA conference in front of a LIVE audience to find out why gift shops are such an important part of the attraction mix. Joining him is Jennifer Kennedy, Retail Consultant, JK Consulting and Michael Dolan, MD of Shamrock Gift Company. They discuss why your gift shop is an integral part of your brand and why it needs to be just as good as the experience you have on offer. This coinsides with the launch of our brand new playbook: ‘The Retail Ready Guide To Going Beyond The Gift Shop', where you can find out exactly how to improve your online offering to take your ecommerce to the next level. Download your FREE copy here:  https://pages.crowdconvert.co.uk/skip-the-queue-playbookBut that's not all. Paul walks the conference floor and speaks to:Susanne Reid, CEO of Christchurch Cathedral Dublin, on how they are celebrating their millennium anniversary - 1000 years!Charles Coyle, Managing Director, Emerald Park, on how they are bringing AI integrations to enhance their booking processesRay Dempsey, General Manager of The Old Jamerson Distillery on how they offering more accessible touring optionsIt's a mega episode and one you'll not want to miss. Skip the Queue is brought to you by Rubber Cheese, a digital agency that builds remarkable systems and websites for attractions that helps them increase their visitor numbers. Your host is Paul Marden.If you like what you hear, you can subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, and all the usual channels by searching Skip the Queue or visit our website SkiptheQueue.fm.If you've enjoyed this podcast, please leave us a five star review, it really helps others find us. And remember to follow us on LinkedIn. Show references:  Jennifer Kennedy — Founder, JK Consultinghttps://jkconsultingnyc.com/https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennifer-kennedy-aba75712/Michael Dolan — Managing Director, Shamrock Gift Companyhttps://www.shamrockgiftcompany.com/Catherine Toolan — Managing Director, Guinness Storehouse & Global Head of Brand Homes, Diageohttp://diageo.comhttps://www.linkedin.com/in/catherinetoolan/Máirín Walsh — Operations Manager, Waterford Museumhttps://www.waterfordtreasures.com/Dean Kelly — Photography & Visitor Experience Specialist https://www.wearephotoexperience.com/https://www.linkedin.com/in/dean-kelly-1259a316/Charles Coyle — Managing Director, Emerald Parkhttps://www.emeraldpark.ieSusanne Reid — CEO, Christ Church Cathedral Dublinhttp://www.christchurchcathedral.iehttps://www.linkedin.com/in/susannereid/Ray Dempsey — General Manager, Jameson Distilleryhttps://www.jamesonwhiskey.com/en-ie/visit-our-distilleries/jameson-bow-street-distillery-tour/https://www.linkedin.com/in/ray-dempsey-37a8665a/ Transcription: Paul Marden: Welcome to Skip the Queue, the podcast that tells the stories behind the world's best attractions and the amazing people that work in them. In today's episode, I'm at the AVEA 2025 conference in Waterford, Ireland, and we're talking about gift shop best practices. With Jennifer Kennedy from JK Consulting, a tourism and retail consultancy. And Jennifer led retail at Guinness Storehouse for more years than she would care to mention, I think. And we're also here with Michael Dolan, MD of Shamrock Gift Company, who has brought along the most amazing array of gift shop merchandise, which I'm sure we'll get into talking a little something about later on. And I've also got an amazing live audience. Say hello, everybody.Everyone: Hello.Paul Marden: There we go. So we always start with icebreaker that I don't prepare the two of you. Now this is probably a very unfair question for the pair of you, actually. What's the quirkiest souvenir you've ever bought? I can think of those little, the ones that you get in Spain are the little pooping santas.Jennifer  Kennedy: I have a thing for Christmas decorations when I go on travel, so for me, there always tends to be something around having a little decoration on my tree every year. That if I've had one or two holidays or I've been away, that has some little thing that comes back that ends up on the tree of Christmas. I have a lovely little lemon from Amalfi that's a Christmas decoration, and so you know, so a little kind of quirky things like that.Paul Marden: Michael, what about you? Michael  Dolan: One of our designers who will remain nameless? She has a thing about poo. So everyone brings her back to some poo relation. Paul Marden: Sadly, there's quite a lot of that around at the moment, isn't there? That's a bit disappointing. First question then, what's the point of a gift shop? If I put that in a more eloquent way, why are gift shops such an important part of the attraction mix?Jennifer  Kennedy: Okay, it was from my point of view, the gift shop in an attraction or a destination is the ultimate touch point that the brand has to leave a lasting memory when visitors go away. So for me, they're intrinsically important in the complete 360 of how your brand shows up— as a destination or an attraction. And without a really good gift shop and really good product to take away from it, you're letting your brand down. And it's an integral piece that people can share. From a marketing point of view, every piece of your own product that's been developed, that's taken away to any part of the world can sit in someone's kitchen. It can be in multiple forms. It can be a fridge magnet. It could be a tea towel. It could be anything. But it's a connection to your brand and the home that they visited when they chose to be wherever they're visiting. So for me, I'm very passionate about the fact that your gift shop should be as good as everything else your experience has to offer. So that's my view on it. Michael  Dolan: Sometimes it's neglected when people create a new visitor attraction. They don't put enough time into the retail element. I think that's changing, and a very good example of that would be Game of Thrones in Banbridge. We worked with them for two years developing the range, but also the shop. So the shop reflects the... I actually think the shop is the best part of the whole experience. But the shop reflects the actual whole experience.  Jennifer  Kennedy: The teaming.Michael  Dolan: The teaming. So you have banners throughout the shop, the music, the lighting, it looks like a dungeon. All the display stands have swords in them, reflecting the theme of the entrance.Jennifer  Kennedy: Yeah, it's a good example of how a brand like that has incorporated the full essence and theme of why they exist into their physical retail space.Paul Marden: They definitely loosened a few pounds out of my pocket. Michael  Dolan: Another good example is Titanic Belfast. So they spent 80 million on that visitor attraction, which was opened in 2012, but they forgot about the shop. So the architect who designed the building designed the shop that looked like something out of the Tate Gallery. Yeah, and we went and said, 'This shop is not functional; it won't work for our type of product.' They said, 'We don't have anything in the budget to redevelop the shop.' So we paid a Dublin architect to redesign the shop. So the shop you have today, that design was paid for by Shamrock Gift Company. And if you've been in the shop, it's all brass, wood, ropes. So it's an integral part of the overall experience. But unfortunately... you can miss the shop on the way out.Paul Marden: Yeah, it is very easy to walk out the building and not engage in the shop itself. It's a bit like a dessert for a meal, isn't it? The meal's not complete if you've not had a dessert. And I think the gift shop experience is a little bit like that. The trip to the experience isn't finished.  If you haven't exited through the gate. Michael  Dolan: But it's the lasting memories that people bring back to the office in New York, put the mug on the table to remind people of when they're in Belfast or Dublin to go to. You know, storehouse or Titanic. So those last impressions are indelibly, you know, set.Paul Marden: So we've already said the positioning of the shop then is super important, how it feels, but product is super important, isn't it? What product you fill into the shop is a make or break experience? How do you go about curating the right product? Michael  Dolan: Most important is authenticity. You know, it has to be relevant to the visitor attraction. So it's not a question of just banging out a few key rings and magnets. So I brought you along some samples there. So we're doing two new ranges, one for Titanic and one for the Royal Yacht Britannia, and they're totally different. But reflect the personality of each attraction.Paul Marden: Absolutely.Michael  Dolan: I mean, a good example, we worked together or collaborated together on many, many projects in Guinness. But we also worked in St. Patrick's Cathedral.Jennifer  Kennedy: Yeah.Michael  Dolan: You were the consultant.Jennifer  Kennedy: Yeah, yeah. So I suppose, again, from the product point of view. Yeah, if you can root product in why the experience exists. So in that example, a cathedral is a great example of how you can create really great product by utilising. Well, the main reason people are there is because this amazing building exists and the historic elements of it. So I suppose to make it real, some examples of products that connected with the audience in that environment are things like a little stone coaster. But the stone coaster is a replica of the floor you're standing on. So I suppose the other balance in attractions is realistic price points and realistic products. So there's no point in creating a range of products that's outside the price point of what your visitors are prepared to pay. So it's that fine balance of creating product that connects with them, which is, I'm using the cathedral as an example because you've got architraves, you've got stained glass windows, you've got stunning tiles. So all the elements of the fabric of that building. Can be utilised to create really beautiful products, but castles, you know, cathedrals, all of those sorts of spaces.Jennifer  Kennedy: When we start talking about product, always we go to, 'why are we here?' And also the storytelling elements. There's some beautiful stories that can, I can give you another really great example of a product that was created for another cathedral, which was... So in cathedral spaces, there's all these stunning doors that run the whole way through, like they're spectacular; they're like pieces of art in their own right. And every one of them has a very unique ornate key that unlocks each door. So one of the products that did one of the cathedrals was we wanted to create a ring of brass keys with replicas of all the keys in the cathedral. But as we were progressing, we forgot at the start— it was like we forgot to tell them to scale them down. They weren't the same size as all the keys in the cathedral. So it was a very intrinsically specific gift to this particular cathedral. And it's been used ever since as kind of the special gift they give to people who come to visit from all over the world. They get quite emotional about this particular gift because it's like this is the actual replica of all the keys to all the doors in the cathedral.Jennifer  Kennedy: So it's a product that's completely born. It can never be replicated anywhere else. And it's completely unique to that particular space. And I think that's the power of, for me, that's what authenticity feels and looks like in these environments. It has to be connected to the fabric of why you exist.Paul Marden: Yeah, so I was at Big Pit in Wales six months ago, I think it was. Museums Wales are redeveloping all of their gift shops and they are going through exactly that process that you're talking about, but bringing it back to the place itself because all, I think, it's six of their museums, the gift shops had much the same set of product. They described it as, you know, you were just walking into a generic Welsh gift shop with the dressed lady.Jennifer  Kennedy: And it's hard— like it really takes an awful lot of work— like it doesn't just happen, like you really have to put a lot of thought and planning into what our product should and could look like. And then, when you've aligned on with the team of people managing and running these businesses, that this is the direction you want to take, then it's the operational element of it. It's about sourcing, MOQs, and price, and all of that stuff that comes into it. Minimum order quantities.Michael  Dolan: That's where we come in. So, you know, we met Jennifer in St. Patrick's and we met Liz then, we met the Dean. So we really sat around and talked about what were the most important elements in the cathedral that we wanted to celebrate in product.Michael  Dolan: And St. Patrick obviously was the obvious number one element. Then they have a harp stained glass window. And then they have a shamrock version of that as well. So they were the three elements that we hit on. You know, it took a year to put those three ranges together. So we would have started out with our concept drawings, which we presented to the team in St. Patrick's. They would have approved them. Then we would have talked to them about the size of the range and what products we were looking at. So then we would have done the artwork for those separate ranges, brought them back in to get them approved, go to sampling, bring the samples back in, then sit down and talk about pricing, minimum order quantities, delivery times.Michael  Dolan: So the sample, you know, so that all goes out to order and then it arrives in about four or five months later into our warehouse. So we carry all the risk. We design everything, we source it, make sure that it's safely made, all the tests are confirmed that the products are good. In conformity with all EU legislation. It'll be in our warehouse and then it's called off the weekly basis. So we carry, we do everything.  So one stop shop. Paul Marden: So the traction isn't even sitting on stock that they've invested in. We know what we're doing and we're quite happy to carry the risk. So one of the things we were talking about just before we started the episode was the challenges of sourcing locally. It's really important, isn't it? But it can be challenging to do that.Jennifer  Kennedy: It can. And, you know, but I would say in recent years, there's a lot more creators and makers have come to the fore after COVID. So in kind of more... Specifically, kind of artisan kind of product types. So things like candles are a great example where, you know, now you can find great candle makers all over Ireland with, you know, small minimum quantity requirements. And also they can bespoke or tailor it to your brand. So if you're a museum or if you're a, again, whatever the nature of your brand is, a national store or whatever, you can have a small batch made. Which lets you have something that has provenance. And here it's Irish made, it's Irish owned. And then there's some, you know, it just it gives you an opportunity.Jennifer  Kennedy: Unfortunately, we're never going to be in a position where we can source everything we want in Ireland. It just isn't realistic. And commercially, it's not viable. As much as you can, you should try and connect with the makers and creators that they are available and see if small batches are available. And they're beautiful to have within your gift store, but they also have to be the balance of other commercial products that will have to be sourced outside of Ireland will also have to play a significant role as well.Máirín Walsh: I think there needs to be a good price point as well. Like, you know, we find that in our museum, that, you know, if something is above 20, 25 euro, the customer has to kind of really think about purchasing it, where if it's 20 euro or under, you know, it's...Michael  Dolan: More of an input item, yeah.Máirín Walsh: Yes, exactly, yeah.Paul Marden: And so when it's over that price point, that's when you need to be sourcing locally again. Máirín Walsh: It's a harder sell. You're kind of maybe explaining a bit more to them and trying to get them to purchase it. You know, they have to think about it.Jennifer  Kennedy: But it's also good for the storytelling elements as well because it helps you engage. So I've often found as well that even train the teams and the customer service. It's actually a lovely space to have, to be able to use it as part of storytelling that we have this locally made or it's made in Cork or wherever it's coming from, that it's Irish made.Máirín Walsh: We have, what have we got? We've kind of got scarves and that and we have local— we had candles a few years ago actually. I think they were made or... up the country or whatever. But anyway, it was at Reginald's Tower and there were different kinds of candles of different attractions around and they really connected with your audience.Michael  Dolan: So 20% of our turnover would be food and all that is made in Ireland. Virtually all of that is sourced locally here in Ireland. And that's a very important part of our overall product portfolio and growing as well.Paul Marden: Is it important to serve different audiences with the right product? So I'm thinking... Making sure that there's pocket money items in there for kids, because often when they come to a museum or attraction, it's their first time they ever get to spend their own money on a transaction. Yeah, that would be their first memory of shopping. So giving them what they need, but at the same time having that 25 euro and over price point. To have a real set piece item is?Jennifer  Kennedy: I would say that's very specific to the brand. Paul Marden: Really? Jennifer  Kennedy: Yes, because some brands can't actually sell products or shouldn't be selling products to children. Paul Marden: Really? I'm looking at the Guinness items at the end of the table.Jennifer  Kennedy: So it depends on the brand. So obviously, in many of the destinations around Ireland, some of them are quite heavily family-oriented. And absolutely in those environments where you've got gardens, playgrounds or theme parks. Absolutely. You have to have that range of product that's very much tailored to young families and children. In other environments, not necessarily. But you still need to have a range that appeals to the masses. Because you will have visitors from all walks of life and with all perspectives. So it's more about having something. I'm going to keep bringing it back to it. It's specific to why this brand is here. And if you can create product within a fair price point, and Mairin is absolutely right. The balance of how much your products cost to the consumer will make or break how your retail performs. And in most destinations, what you're actually aiming to do is basket size. You want them to go away with three, four, five products from you, not necessarily one.Jennifer  Kennedy: Because if you think about it, that's more beneficial for the brand. I mean, most people are buying for gifting purposes. They're bringing things back to multiple people. So, if I'm able to pick up a nice candle and it's eight or 10 euros, well, I might buy three of them if it's a beautiful candle in a nice package. Whereas, if I went in and the only option available to me was a 35-euro candle, I probably might buy that, but I'm only buying one product. And I'm only giving that to either myself or one other person. Whereas, if you can create a range that's a good price, but it's also appealing and very connected to why they came to visit you in the first place, then that's a much more powerful, for the brand point of view, that's a much more... Powerful purchasing options are available to have a basket size that's growing.Michael  Dolan: We worked together in the National Stud in Kildare, so we did a great kids range of stationery, which worked really well. We've just done a new range for the GAA museum, all stationery-related, because they get a lot of kids. Again, we would have collaborated on that.Jennifer  Kennedy: And actually, the natural studs are a really nice example as well, because from even a textile point of view, you can lean into equine as the, so you can do beautiful products with ponies and horses. Yeah. You know, so again, some brands make it very, it's easy to see the path that you can take with product. And then others are, you know, you have to think harder. It's a little bit more challenging. So, and particularly for cultural and heritage sites, then that really has to be grounded in what are the collections, what is on offer in these sites, in these museums, in these heritage sites, and really start to unravel the stories that you can turn into product.Paul Marden: But a product isn't enough, is it?Jennifer  Kennedy: Absolutely not.Paul Marden: Set making, merchandising, storytelling, they all engage the customer, don't they?Jennifer  Kennedy: 100%.Paul Marden: Where have you seen that being done well in Ireland?Michael  Dolan: Get a store is the preeminent example, I would think. I mean, it's a stunning shop. Have you met Catherine too? Paul Marden: No, not yet. Lovely to meet you, Catherine.  Michael  Dolan: Catherine is in charge of getting the stories. Paul Marden: Okay. Any other examples that aren't, maybe, sat at the table? Game of Thrones is a really good example and Titanic.Michael  Dolan: Game of Thrones.  I think Titanic's good. The new shop in Trinity College is very strong, I think. So it's a temporary digital exhibition while they're revamping the library. They've done an excellent job in creating a wonderful new shop, even on a temporary basis.Jennifer  Kennedy: I would say Crowe Park as well. The GAA museum there has undergone a full refurbishment and it's very tailored towards their audience. So they're very, it's high volume, very specific to their... And the look and feel is very much in keeping with the nature of the reason why people go to Crowe Park. I would say the Irish National Asteroid as well. And Colmar Abbey, Cliffs of Moher. We've got some really great offers all over the island of Ireland.Paul Marden: Yeah, absolutely. I was at W5 recently in Belfast and I think that is a brilliant example of what a Science Centre gift shop could be like. Because often there will be the kind of generic stuff that you'll see in any attraction— a notebook with rubber and a pencil— but they also had lots of, there were lots of science-led toys and engineering-led toys, so they had... big Lego section. It was like going into a proper toy shop. It was just a really impressive gift shop that you could imagine engaging a kid.Catherine Toolan: And if I could come in there for an example outside of Ireland, you've got the House of Lego in Billund. I don't know if anybody has been there, but they've got a customised range, which is only available. Really? Yes, and it's so special. They've got a really unique building, so the Lego set is in the shape of the building. They've got their original dock. But the retail store in that space, it's very geared towards children as Lego is, but also imagination play. So they've done a brilliant job on looking at, you know, the texture of their product, the colour of their product. And whilst it's usually geared to children, it's also geared to adult lovers of Lego. So it's beautiful. Huge tech as well. They've incredible RFID wristbands, which you get from your ticket at the beginning of the experience. So all of your photo ops and everything you can download from the RFID wristband. Very cool.Jennifer  Kennedy: Actually, I would say it's probably from a tech point of view, one of the best attractions I've been to in recent years. Like, it's phenomenal. I remember going there the year it opened first because it was fascinating. I have two boys who are absolutely Lego nuts. And I just— we went to the home of LEGO in Billund when it opened that year and I just was blown away. I had never experienced, and I go to experiences everywhere, but I've never, from a tech point of view and a brand engagement perspective, understood the nature, the type of product that they deliver. For me, it's, like I said, I tell everyone to go to Billund. Paul Marden: Really? We've got such amazing jobs, haven't we? However, as you're both talking, I'm thinking you're a bit like me. You don't get to go and enjoy the experience for the experience's own sake because you're looking at what everybody's doing.Jennifer  Kennedy: But can I actually just add to that? There's another one in the Swarovski Crystal in Austria.Paul Marden: Really?Jennifer  Kennedy: That is phenomenal. And in terms of their retail space, it's like, I like a bit of sparkle, so I'm not going to lie. It was like walking into heaven. And their retail offering there is world-class in that store. And the whole brand experience from start to finish, which is what you're always trying to achieve. It's the full 360 of full immersion. You're literally standing inside a giant crystal. It's like being in a dream. Right. A crystal, sparkly dream from start to finish. And then, every year, they partner and collaborate with whoever— designers, musicians, whoever's iconic or, you know, very... present in that year or whatever. And they do these wonderful collaborations and partnerships with artists, designers, you name it.Paul Marden: Sorry, Catherine, there you go.Catherine Toolan: Thank you very much. It's on my list of places to go, but I do know the team there and what they're also doing is looking at the premiumization. So they close their retail store for high net worth individuals to come in and buy unique and special pieces. You know, they use their core experience for the daytime. And we all talk about the challenges. I know, Tom, you talk about this, you know, how do you scale up visitor experience when you're at capacity and still make sure you've a brilliant net promoter score and that the experience of the customer is fantastic. So that is about sweating the acid and you know it's that good, better, best. You know they have something for everybody but they have that halo effect as well.  So it's really cool.Paul Marden: Wow. Thank you. I'm a bit of a geek. I love a bit of technology. What do you think technology is doing to the gift shop experience? Are there new technologies that are coming along that are going to fundamentally change the way the gift shop experience works?Jennifer  Kennedy: I think that's rooted in the overall experience. So I don't think it's a separate piece. I think there's loads of things out there now where you can, you know, virtual mirrors have been around for years and all these other really interesting. The whole gamification piece, if you're in an amazing experience and you're getting prompts and things to move an offer today, but so that's that's been around for quite some time. I'm not sure that it's been fully utilised yet across the board, especially in I would say there's a way to go in how it influences the stores in Ireland in attractions at the moment. There'll be only a handful who I'd say are using technology, mainly digital screens, is what I'm experiencing and seeing generally. And then, if there is a big attraction, some sort of prompts throughout that and how you're communicating digitally through the whole experience to get people back into the retail space. Paul Marden: Yeah, I can imagine using tech to be able to prompt somebody at the quiet times of the gift shop. Michael  Dolan: Yeah, also Guinness now you can order a pint glass with your own message on it in advance. It's ready for you when you finish your tour. You go to a locker and you just open the locker and you walk out with your glass. Catherine Toolan: Could I just say, though, that you just don't open a locker like it's actually lockers? There's a lot of customisation to the lockers because the idea came from the original Parcel Motel. So the locker is actually you key in a code and then when you open the customised locker, there's a Guinness quote inside it and your personalised glass is inside it. And the amount of customers and guests that we get to say, could we lock the door again? We want to actually open it and have that. whole experience so you know that's where I think in you know and one of the questions that would be really interesting to talk about is you know, what about self-scanning and you know, the idea of checkouts that are not having the human connection. Is that a thing that will work when you've got real experiences? I don't know. But we know that the personalisation of the engraved glasses and how we've custom designed the lockers— not to just be set of lockers— has made that difference. So they're very unique, they're colourful, they're very Guinnessified. And of course, the little personal quote that you get when you open the locker from our archives, make that a retail experience that's elevated. Paul Marden: Wow.Jennifer  Kennedy: But I would also say to your point on that, that the actual, the real magic is also in the people, in the destinations, because it's not like gift shops and destinations and experiences. They're not like high street and they shouldn't be. It should be a very different experience that people are having when they've paid to come and participate with you in your destination. So I actually think technology inevitably plays a role and it's a support and it will create lovely quirks and unusual little elements throughout the years.Paul Marden: I think personalisation is great.  Jennifer  Kennedy: And personalisation, absolutely. But the actual, like I would be quite against the idea of automating checkout and payouts in gift shops, in destinations, because for me... That takes away the whole essence of the final touch point is actually whoever's talked to you when you did that transaction and whoever said goodbye or asked how your experience was or did you enjoy yourself? So those you can't you can't replace that with without a human personal touch. So for me, that's intrinsically important, that it has to be retained, that the personal touch is always there for the goodbye.Dean Kelly: I'm very happy that you brought up the human touch. I'm a photo company, I do pictures. And all the time when we're talking to operators, they're like, 'Can we make it self-serve? Can we get rid of the staffing costs?' I'm like, 'I'm a photographer. Photographers take pictures of people. We need each other to engage, react, and put the groups together. No, we don't want the staff costs. But I'm like, it's not about the staff costs. It's about the customer's experience. So all day long, our challenge is, more so in the UK now, because we operate in the UK, and everybody over there is very, we don't want the staff.' And I think, if you lose the staff engagement, especially taking a picture, you lose the memory and you lose the moment. And photographers have a really good job to do, a very interesting job, is where to capture people together. And if you lose that person— touch point of getting the togetherness— You just have people touching the screen, which they might as well be on their phone.Paul Marden: And the photo won't look as good, will it? Anybody could take a photo, but it takes a photographer to make people look like they're engaged and happy and in the moment.Dean Kelly: Yeah, exactly, and a couple of other points that you mentioned— with the brand, personalisation, gamification, all that kind of cool, juicy stuff, all the retail stuff, people going home with the memory, the moment, all that stuff's cool, but nobody mentioned photos until Cashin, you mentioned photos. We've had a long conversation with photos for a long time, and we'll probably be still chatting for another long time as well. But photography is a super, super retail revenue stream. But it's not about the revenue, it's about the moment and the magic. Jennifer  Kennedy: Yeah, you're capturing the magic. Dean Kelly: Capturing it. And fair enough that what you guys do at Shamrock is very interesting because you talk to the operators. You kind of go, 'What gifts are going to work for your visitors?' And you turn that into a product. And that's exactly what we do with all the experiences. We take pictures.Dean Kelly: But what's your demographic saying? What's your price points? What's your brand? What's your message? And let's turn that into a personalised souvenir, put the people in the brand, and let them take it home and engage with it.Paul Marden: So... I think one of the most important things is how you blend the gift shop with the rest of the experience. You were giving a good example of exiting through the gift shop. It's a very important thing, isn't it? But if you put it in the wrong place, you don't get that. How do you blend the gift shop into the experience?Jennifer  Kennedy: Well, I would say I wouldn't call it a blend. For me, the retail element of the brand should be a wow. Like it should be as invaluable, as important as everything else. So my perspective would be get eyes on your retail offering sooner rather than later. Not necessarily that they will participate there and then.Jennifer  Kennedy: The visual and the impact it has on seeing a wow— this looks like an amazing space. This looks like with all these products, but it's also— I was always chasing the wow. I want you to go, wow, this looks amazing. Because, to me, that's when you've engaged someone that they're not leaving until they've gotten in there. It is important that people can potentially move through it at the end. And, you know, it depends on the building. It depends on the structure. You know, a lot of these things are taken out of your hands. You've got to work with what you've got. Jennifer  Kennedy: But you have to work with what you've got, not just to blend it, to make it stand out as exceptional. Because that's actually where the magic really starts. And it doesn't matter what brand that is. The aim should always be that your retail offering is exceptional from every touch point. And it shouldn't be obvious that we've spent millions in creating this wonderful experience. And now you're being shoehorned into the poor relation that was forgotten a little bit and now has ten years later looks a bit ramshackle. And we're trying to figure out why we don't get what we should out of it.Michael  Dolan: And it has to be an integral part of the whole experience.Jennifer  Kennedy: Yeah, and I think for new experiences that are in planning stages, I've seen that more and more in recent years. Now, where I was being called to retrofix or rip out things going, this doesn't work, I'm like, okay, well, we have to retro do this. Now, when people are doing new builds or new investments into new spaces, I'm getting those calls at the planning stages where it's like, we've allocated this amount of space to retail. Do you think that's enough? And I don't think I've ever said yes, ever. At every single turn, I'm like... No, it's not enough. And, you know, what's your anticipated football? Oh, that's the numbers start to play a role in it. But it's not just about that. It's about the future proofing. It's like what happens in five years, 10 years, 15? Because I've been very lucky to work in buildings where it's not easy to figure out where you're going to go next. And particularly heritage sites and cultural heritage. Like I can't go in and knock a hole in the crypt in Christchurch Cathedral. But I need a bigger retail space there.Jennifer  Kennedy: The earlier you start to put retail as a central commercial revenue stream in your business, the more eyes you have on it from the get-go, the more likely it is that it will be successful. Not now, not in five years, not in ten years, but that you're building blocks for this, what can become. Like it should be one of your strongest revenue streams after ticket sales because that's what it can become. But you have to go at it as this is going to be amazing.Catherine Toolan: I think it's important that it's not a hard sell and that's in your face. And, you know, that's where, when you think about the consumer journey, we always think about the behavioural science of the beginning, the middle, and the end. And people remember three things. You know, there's lots of other touch points. But if retail is a really hard sell throughout the experience, I don't think the net promoter score of your overall experience will, you know, come out, especially if you're, you know, and we're not a children's destination. An over 25 adult destination at the Guinness Storehouse and at our alcohol brand homes. But what's really important is that it's authentic, it's really good, and it's highly merchandised, and that it's unique. I think that uniqueness is it— something that you can get that you can't get anywhere else. You know, how do you actually, one of the things that we would have done if we had it again, we would be able to make our retail store available to the domestic audience, to the public without buying a ticket. So, you know, you've got that opportunity if your brand is the right brand that you can have walk-in off the high street, for example.Catherine Toolan: So, you know, there's so many other things that you can think about because that's an extension of your revenue opportunity where you don't have to come in to do the whole experience. And that is a way to connect the domestic audience, which is something I know a lot of the members of the Association, AVEA are trying to do. You know, how do we engage and connect and get repeat visits and and retail is a big opportunity to do that, especially at gifting season.Paul Marden: Yeah, yeah, sustainability is increasingly important to the narrative of the whole retail experience, isn't it? How do you make sure that we're not going about just selling plastic tat that nobody's going to look after?Michael  Dolan: We've made this a core value for Shamrock Gift Company, so we've engaged with a company called Clearstream Solutions, the same company that Guinness Store has. have worked with them. So it's a long-term partnership. So they've measured our carbon footprint from 2019 to 2023. So we've set ourselves the ambitious target of being carbon neutral by 2030.Michael  Dolan: So just some of the elements that we've engaged in. So we put 700 solar panels on our roof as of last summer. All our deliveries in Dublin are done with electric vans, which we've recently purchased. All the lights in the building now are LED. Motion-sensored as well. All the cars are electric or that we've purchased recently, and we've got a gas boiler. So we've also now our shipments from China we're looking at biodiesel. So that's fully sustainable. And we also, where we can't use biodiesel, we're doing carbon offsetting as well.Paul Marden: So a lot of work being done in terms of the cost of CO2 of the transport that you're doing. What about the product itself? How do you make sure that the product itself is inherently something that people are going to treasure and is not a throwaway item?Michael  Dolan: We're using more sustainable materials, so a lot more stone, a lot more wood. Paul Marden: Oh, really? Michael  Dolan: Yeah. Also, it begins with great design. Yeah. So, you know, and obviously working with our retail partners, make sure that the goods are very well designed, very well manufactured. So we're working with some wonderful, well, best in class manufacturers around the world. Absolutely.Jennifer  Kennedy: I think as well, if... you can, and it's becoming easier to do, if you can collaborate with some creators and makers that are actually within your location.Jennifer  Kennedy: Within Ireland, there's a lot more of that happening, which means sourcing is closer to home. But you also have this other economy that's like the underbelly of the craft makers market in Ireland, which is fabulous, which needs to be brought to the fore. So collaborations with brands can also form a very integral part of product development that's close to home and connected to people who are here—people who are actually creating product in Ireland.Paul Marden: This is just instinct, not knowledge at all. But I would imagine that when you're dealing with those local crafters and makers, that they are inherently more sustainable because they're creating things local to you. It's not just the distance that's...Jennifer  Kennedy: Absolutely, but in any instances that I'm aware of that I've been involved with, anyway, even the materials and their mythology, yeah, is all grounded in sustainability and which is fabulous to see. Like, there's more and there's more and more coming all the time.Michael  Dolan: We've got rid of 3 million bags a year. Key rings, mags used to be individually bagged. And now there are 12 key rings in a bag that's biodegradable. That alone is 2 million bags.Paul Marden: It's amazing, isn't it? When you look at something as innocuous as the bag itself that it's packaged in before it's shipped out. You can engineer out of the supply chain quite a lot of unnecessary packaging Michael  Dolan: And likewise, then for the retailer, they don't have to dispose of all that packaging. So it's a lot easier and cleaner to put the product on the shelf. Yes.Paul Marden: Something close to my heart, online retail. Have you seen examples where Irish attractions have extended their gift shop experience online, particularly well?Jennifer  Kennedy: For instance, there are a few examples, but what I was thinking more about on that particular thought was around the nature of the brand again and the product that, in my experience, the brands that can do that successfully tend to have something on offer that's very nostalgic or collectible. Or memorabilia and I think there are some examples in the UK potentially that are where they can be successful online because they have a brand or a product that people are collecting.Paul Marden: Yeah, so one of my clients is Jane Austen House, only about two miles away from where I live. And it blew me away the importance of their online shop to them. They're tiny. I mean, it is a little cottage in the middle of Hampshire, but they have an international audience for their gift shop. And it's because they've got this really, really committed audience of Jane Austen fans who want to buy something from the house. Then everybody talks about the Tank Museum in Dorset.Paul Marden: Who make a fortune selling fluffy tank slippers and all you could possibly imagine memorabilia related to tanks. Because again, it's that collection of highly curated products and this really, really committed audience of people worldwide. Catherine Toolan: The Tank were here last year presenting at the AVEA conference and it was such an incredible story about their success and, you know, how they went from a very small museum with a lot of support from government to COVID to having an incredible retail store, which is now driving their commercial success.Paul Marden: Yeah, absolutely. Nick has done a load of work. Yeah, that leads me nicely onto a note. So listeners, for a long time, Skip the Queue has been totally focused on the podcast. But today we have launched our first playbook. Which is hopefully the first of many. But the playbook that we're launching today is all about how attractions can focus on best practice for gift shop e-commerce. So we work with partners, Rubber Cheese, Navigate, and Stephen Spencer Associates. So Steve and his team has helped us to contribute to some sections to the guide around, how do you curate your product? How do you identify who the audience is? How do you create that collection? The team at Rubber Cheese talk about the mechanics of how do you put it online and then our friends at Navigate help you to figure out what the best way is to get bums on seats. So it was a crackpot idea of mine six months ago to put it together, and it is now huge.Paul Marden: It's packed full of advice, and that's gone live today. So you can go over to skipthequeue.fm and click on the Playbooks link there to go and download that. Thank you. So, Jennifer, Michael, it has been absolutely wonderful to talk to both of you. Thank you to my audience. You've also been fabulous. Well done. And what a packed episode that was. I get the feeling you two quite enjoy gift shops and retailing. You could talk quite a lot about it.Jennifer  Kennedy: I mean, I love it.  Paul Marden: That didn't come over at all. Jennifer  Kennedy: Well, I just think it's such a lovely way of connecting with people and keeping a connection, particularly from a brand point of view. It should be the icing on the cake, you know?Paul Marden: You're not just a market store salesperson, are you?Jennifer  Kennedy: And I thoroughly believe that the most successful ones are because the experiences that they're a part of sow the seeds. They plant the love, the emotion, the energy. All you're really doing is making sure that that magic stays with people when they go away. The brand experience is the piece that's actually got them there in the first place. Paul Marden: Now let's go over to the conference floor to hear from some Irish operators and suppliers.Charles  Coyle: I'm Charles Coyle. I'm the managing director of Emerald Park. We're Ireland's only theme park and zoo. We opened in November 2010, which shows you how naive and foolish we were that we opened a visitor attraction in the middle of winter. Fortunately, we survived it.Paul Marden: But you wouldn't open a visitor attraction in the middle of summer, so give yourself a little bit of a run-up to it. It's not a bad idea.Charles  Coyle: Well, that's true, actually. You know what? I'll say that from now on, that we had the genius to open in the winter. We're open 15 years now, and we have grown from very small, humble aspirations of maybe getting 150,000 people a year to we welcomed 810,000 last year. And we'll probably be in and around the same this year as well.  Paul Marden: Wowzers, that is really impressive. So we are here on the floor. We've already heard some really interesting talks. We've been talking about AI in the most recent one. What can we expect to happen for you in the season coming in?Charles  Coyle: Well, we are hopefully going to be integrating a lot of AI. There's possibly putting in a new booking system and things like that. A lot of that will have AI dynamic pricing, which has got a bad rap recently, but it has been done for years and years in hotels.Paul Marden: Human nature, if you ask people, should I be punished for travelling during the summer holidays and visiting in a park? No, that sounds terrible. Should I be rewarded for visiting during a quiet period? Oh, yes! Yes, I should definitely. It's all about perspective, isn't it? Very much so. And it is how much you don't want to price gouge people. You've got to be really careful. But I do think dynamic pricing has its place.Charles  Coyle: Oh, absolutely. I mean, a perfect example of it is right now, our top price is not going to go any higher, but it'll just be our lower price will be there more constantly, you know, and we'll... Be encouraging people to come in on the Tuesdays and Wednesdays, as you said, rewarding people for coming in at times in which we're not that busy and they're probably going to have a better day as a result.Susanne Reid: Hi, Suzanne Reid here. I'm the CEO at Christchurch Cathedral, Dublin. What are you here to get out of the conference? First and foremost, the conference is a great opportunity every year to... catch up with people that you may only see once a year from all corners of the country and it's also an opportunity to find out what's new and trending within tourism. We've just come from a really energising session on AI and also a very thought-provoking session on crisis management and the dangers of solar panels.Paul Marden: Yes, absolutely. Yeah, the story of We the Curious is definitely an interesting one. So we've just come off the back of the summer season. So how was that for you?Susanne Reid:Summer season started slower than we would have liked this year in 2025, but the two big American football matches were very strong for us in Dublin. Dublin had a reasonable season, I would say, and we're very pleased so far on the 13th of the month at how October is playing out. So hoping for a very strong finish to the year. So coming up to Christmas at Christchurch, we'll have a number of cathedral events. So typically our carol concerts, they tend to sell out throughout the season. Then we have our normal pattern of services and things as well.Paul Marden: I think it's really important, isn't it? You have to think back to this being a place of worship. Yes, it is a visitor attraction. Yes, that's an aside, isn't it? And the reason it is a place of worship.Susanne Reid: I think that's obviously back to what our earlier speaker was talking about today. That's our charitable purpose, the promotion of religion, Christianity. However, you know, Christchurch is one of the most visited attractions in the city.Susanne Reid: Primarily, people do come because it will be there a thousand years in 2028. So there is, you know, the stones speak really. And, you know, one of the sessions I've really benefited from this morning was around accessible tourism. And certainly that's a journey we're on at the cathedral because, you know, a medieval building never designed for access, really. Paul Marden: No, not hugely. Susanne Reid: Not at all. So that's part of our programming and our thinking and our commitment to the city and to those that come to it from our local communities. But also from further afield, that they can come and enjoy the splendour of this sacred space.Paul Marden: I've been thinking long and hard, and been interviewing people, especially people like We The Curious, where they're coming into their 25th anniversary. They were a Millennium Project. I hadn't even thought about interviewing an attraction that was a thousand years old. A genuine millennium project.Susanne Reid: Yeah, so we're working towards that, Paul. And, you know, obviously there's a committee in-house thinking of how we might celebrate that. One of the things that, you know, I know others may have seen elsewhere, but... We've commissioned a Lego builder to build a Lego model of the cathedral. There will obviously be some beautiful music commissioned to surround the celebration of a thousand years of Christchurch at the heart of the city. There'll be a conference. We're also commissioning a new audio tour called the ACE Tour, Adults, Children and Everyone, which will read the cathedral for people who have no sense of what they're looking at when they maybe see a baptismal font, for example. You know, we're really excited about this and we're hoping the city will be celebratory mood with us in 2028.Paul Marden: Well, maybe you can bring me back and I'll come and do an episode and focus on your thousand year anniversary.Susanne Reid: You'd be so welcome.Paul Marden: Oh, wonderful. Thank you, Suzanne.Paul Marden: I am back on the floor. We have wrapped up day one. And I am here with Ray Dempsey from Jameson Distillery. Ray, what's it been like today?Ray  Dempsey: Paul, it's been a great day. I have to say, I always loved the AVEA conference. It brings in such great insights into our industry and into our sector. And it's hosted here in Waterford, a city that I'm a native of. And, you know, seeing it through the eyes of a tourist is just amazing, actually, because normally I fly through here. And I don't have the chance to kind of stop and think, but the overall development of Waterford and the presentation from the Waterford County Council was really, really good. It's fantastic. They have a plan. A plan that really is driving tourism. Waterford, as a tourist destination, whereas before, you passed through Waterford. It was Waterford Crystal's stop and that was it. But they have put so much into the restoration of buildings, the introduction of lovely artisan products, very complimentary to people coming to here, whether it is for a day, a weekend, or a week. Fantastic.Paul Marden: What is it? We're in the middle of October and it's a bit grey and drizzly out there. But let's be fair, the town has been packed. The town has been packed.With coaches outside, so my hotel this morning full of tourists.Ray  Dempsey: Amazing, yeah it's a great hub, a great hub, and they've done so much with the city to enable that, and you see, as you pass down the keys, you know that new bridge there to enable extra traffic coming straight into the heart of the city, it's fantastic. We're all learning from it, and hopefully, bring it all back to our own hometowns.Paul Marden: I think it's been really interesting. We were talking earlier on, before I got the microphone out, saying how it's been a real mixed bag this year across the island of Ireland, hasn't it? So some people really, really busy, some people rubbish year.Ray  Dempsey: Yeah, I mean, I feel privileged the fact that, you know, we haven't seen that in Dublin. So, you know, there's a it's been a very strong year, a little bit after a little bit of a bumpy start in January, February. But, like, for the rest of the year onwards, it's been fantastic. It's been back to back festivals and lots of things, lots of reasons why people come to Dublin. And, of course, with the introduction of the NFL. That's new to us this year. And hopefully, we'll see it for a number of years to come. But they're great builders for organic growth for our visitor numbers. So I'm happy to say that I'm seeing a growth in both revenue and in visitor numbers in the Jameson Distillery. So I'm happy to see that. Now, naturally, I'm going to have to work harder to make sure it happens next year and the year after. But I'm happy to say that the tourism product in Dublin has definitely improved. And Dublin-based visitor attractions are doing well. Paul Marden: Exciting plans for summer 26? Ray  Dempsey: Yes, every year is exciting, Paul. And every year brings a challenge and everything else. But I'm delighted to say that our focus for 2026 really is on building inclusion. So we're looking at language tours.Ray  Dempsey: We're looking at tours for... you know, margins in society. And I think it's a really interesting way for us to be able to embrace accessibility to our story. And also, we have increased our experience repertoire to engage more high-end experiences, not private experiences. More demand for those. Okay. So we're delighted to say that we have the product in order to be able to do that. So that's exciting for us, you know, to be building into 2026. Great. Paul Marden: Thank you so much for joining us. I am the only thing standing in the way of you and a drink at the cocktail reception later on. So I think we should call it quits. Ray  Dempsey: And for sure. Paul Marden: If you enjoyed today's episode, then please like and comment in your podcast app. It really does help others to find us. Today's episode was written by me, Paul Marden, with help from Emily Burrows from Plaster. It was edited by Steve Folland and produced by Wenalyn Dionaldo. See you next week. The 2025 Visitor Attraction Website Survey is now LIVE! Dive into groundbreaking benchmarks for the industryGain a better understanding of how to achieve the highest conversion ratesExplore the "why" behind visitor attraction site performanceLearn the impact of website optimisation and visitor engagement on conversion ratesUncover key steps to enhance user experience for greater conversionsTake the Rubber Cheese Visitor Attraction Website Survey Report

This week on Skip the Queue, we're stepping into the turret and turning up the tension, as we explore one of the UK's most talked-about immersive experiences.Our guest is Neil Connolly, Creative Director at The Everywhere Group, who have brought The Traitors Live Experience to life. With over 10 million viewers watching every betrayal, backstab and banishment on the BBC show, expectations for the live version were nothing short of murderous.So, how do you even begin to transform a TV juggernaut into a thrilling, guest-led experience? Let's find out who's playing the game… and who's about to be banished…Skip the Queue is brought to you by Rubber Cheese, a digital agency that builds remarkable systems and websites for attractions that helps them increase their visitor numbers. Your host is Paul Marden.If you like what you hear, you can subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, and all the usual channels by searching Skip the Queue or visit our website SkiptheQueue.fm.If you've enjoyed this podcast, please leave us a five star review, it really helps others find us. And remember to follow us on LinkedIn. Show references: The Traitors Live website: https://www.thetraitorslive.co.uk/Neil's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/neil-connolly-499054110/Neil Connolly is a creative leader of design and production teams focused on development, production and installation of live theatre, entertainment, multi-media and attractions for the themed entertainment industry worldwide.Neil began his career as a performer, writer, producer & artist in Londons alternative theatre/art scene. It was during this time Neil developed a love and passion for story telling through the platform of interactive playable immersive theatre.Having been at the vanguard of playable & immersive theatre since 2007, Neil had a career defining opportunity in 2019 when he devised, wrote & directed an immersive experience as part of Sainsbury's 150th Birthday Celebrations. Making him the only immersive theatre & game maker in the world to have HRH Elizabeth Regina attend one of their experiences.In a distinguished career spanning 20 years, Neil has brought that passion to every facet of themed entertainment in the creative direction and production of attractions such as; Handels Messiah, Snowman & The Snowdog, Peppa Pig Surprise Party, Traitors Live, The Crystal Maze Live Experience, Tomb Raider Live Experience & Chaos Karts, an AR go-kart real life battle. Other clients and activations include: Harrods, Sainsbury's, Camelot/The National Lottery, Samsung, Blenheim Palace, Land Rover and Warner Brothers.Neil has worked across 4 continents for many years with private individuals; designing, producing and delivering live entertainment on land, sea & air. A world without boundaries requires freethinking.Neil is currently working with Immersive Everywhere on creative development of show and attraction content for projects across U.K, Europe, North America & Asia. Transcriptions:  Paul Marden: This week on Skip the Queue, we're stepping into the turret and turning up the tension as we explore one of the UK's most talked about immersive experiences.Paul Marden: Our guest is Neil Connolly, Creative Director at The Everywhere Group, who've brought The Traitor's live experience to life. With over 10 million viewers watching every betrayal, backstab and banishment on the BBC show, expectations for the live version were nothing short of murderous. So how do you even begin to transform a TV juggernaut into a thrilling guest-led experience? Let's find out who's playing the game and who's about to be banished.Paul Marden: So, we're underground. Lots of groups running currently, aren't they? How did you make that happenNeil Connolly: Yeah, so now we're two floors under us. There's a lower basement and some other basement. So the building that we are in, there's a family in the 1890s who owned all of the land around Covent Garden and specifically the Adelphi Theatre.Paul Marden: Right.Neil Connolly: And they wanted their theatre to be the first theatre in the UK to have its lights powered by electricity. So they built their own private power station in this building. Like, literally like, all this, this is a power station. But unfortunately for these the Savoy had taken to that moniker, so they quickly built their important institution. The family had this building until the 1980s when the establishment was assumed through the important UK network.Neil Connolly: And then it was sat there empty, doing nothing for 40 years. And so the landlord that is now started redeveloping the building 10 years ago, added two floors onto the top of the building. So now what we're in is an eight-storey structure and we've basically got the bottom four floors. Two of which are ground and mezzanine, which is our hospitality area. And the lower two floors, which are all in the basement, are our experience floors. What we're looking at right now is, if you look off down this way to the right, not you people on audio, but me here.Neil Connolly: Off this side is five of the round table rooms. There's another one behind me and there's two more upstairs. And then I've got some Tretters Towers off to the left and I've got my show control system down there.Neil Connolly: On the floor above me, we've got the lounges. So each lounge is connected to one of the round table rooms. Because when you get murdered or banished, one of the biggest challenges that I faced was what happens to people when they get murdered or banished? Because you get kicked out of the game. It's not a lot of fun, is it? Therefore, for me, you also get kicked out of the round table room. So this is a huge challenge I face. But I built these lounge concepts where you go— it's the lounge of the dead— and you can see and hear the round table room that you've just left. We'll go walk into the room in a while. There's lots of interactivity. But yeah, super fun. Neil Connolly: But unfortunately for these the Savoy had taken to that moniker, so they quickly built their important institution. The family had this establishment until the 1980s when the establishment was considered through the important UK network.Paul Marden: Yeah. So we've got 10 million people tuning in to Traitors per episode. So this must be a lot of pressure for you to get it right. Tell us about the experience and what challenges you faced along the way, from, you know, that initial text message through to the final creation that we're stood in now.Neil Connolly: So many challenges, but to quote Scroobius Pip on this, do you know Scroobius Pip? Paul Marden: No. Neil Connolly: Great, he's amazing. UK rapper from Essex.Neil Connolly: Some people see a mousetrap and think death. I see free cheese and a challenge.Neil Connolly: There's never any problems in my logic, in my thinking. There's always just challenges to overcome. So one of the biggest challenges was what happens to people when they get murdered or banished. The truth of the matter is I had to design a whole other show, which happens after this show. It is one big show. But you go to the Lounge of the Dead, there's more interactivity. And navigating that with the former controller, which is O3 Media and IDTV, who created the original format in the Netherlands, and basically designing a game that is in the world and follows the rules of their game with some reasonable adjustments, because TV and live are not the same thing.Neil Connolly: It takes 14 days to film 12 episodes of The Traitors. Paul Marden: Really? Okay. Neil Connolly: So I was like, how do I truncate 14 days of somebody's life down into a two-hour experience and still deliver that same impact, that same power, that same punch?Paul Marden: Yep.Neil Connolly: But I knew from the beginning of this that it wasn't about time. There is a magic triangle when it comes to the traitors, which is time, space, atmosphere. And time was the thing that I always struggled with. I don't have a Scottish cattle show, and I don't have two weeks. No. So I'm like, 'Cool, I've got to do it in two hours.' So our format follows exactly the same format. We do a breakfast scene, then a mission, then a roundtable banishment, then there's a conclave where the traitors meet and they murder somebody. And I do that in a seven-day structure, a seven-day cycle. But it all happens within two hours around this round table.Neil Connolly: I'm the creative director for Immersive Everywhere. We're a vertically integrated structure in the sense that we take on our own venues. So we're now standing in Shorts Gardens in the middle of Covent Garden. So we've leased this building. We've got a lease that is for a number of years and we have built the show into it. But we also identify the IP, go after that ourselves, we capitalise the projects ourselves. We seek strategic partners, promoters, other people to kind of come involved in that journey. But because we're also the team that are licensing the product, we are also the producers and I'm the creative director for that company. So I developed the creative in line with while also getting the deal done. This is incredibly unusual because other producers will be like, 'Hey, I've identified this IP and I've got it.' Now I'm going to approach a creative agency and I'm going to get them to develop the product. And now I've done all of that, I'm going to find someone else to operationally put it on, or I'm going to find a venue to put it on in, and then I'm going to find my ticketing partner.  But we don't do that. We have our own ticketing platform, and we have our own database, so we mark our own shoulders.Neil Connolly: As well as other experiences too. Back, we have our own creative industry, we are the producers, we are the female workers. So we cast it, we hire all the front of house team, we run the food and beverage, we run the bars. The operations team is our operations team because they run the venue as well as the show at the same time. So that's what I mean. We're a vertically integrated structure, which means we do it, which makes us a very unusual proposition within... certainly within the UK market, possibly the world. It makes us incredibly agile as a company and makes us to be able to be adaptive and proactive and reactive to the product, to the show, to the market that we're operating in, because it's all under one roof.Neil Connolly: This show started January 24th, 2023. Right. It's very specific because I was sitting on my sofa drinking a lovely glass of Merlot and I had just watched... UK Traitors, Season One. Yep. Because it came out that Christmas. Immediately I was like, 'Oh my God, this is insane.' And then I got a text message that particular night from our head of licensing, a guy named Tom Rowe, lovely man. And he was like, Neil, I'm at a licensing event with some friends of mine and everyone's talking about this thing called Traitors. I've not watched it. Have you watched it? Sounds like it might be a good thing. And so I sat back and drank my Merlot. And about five minutes later, I text him back and I was like, Tom, get us that license.Neil Connolly: And then I sent him a bunch of other details of how the show in my head would work, both from a commercial standpoint, but also from a creative standpoint, because I'm a commercially minded creative. Right. So I instantly took out my notebook and I started writing down exactly how I thought the show was going to do, the challenges that we would face and being able to translate this into a live thing. But I literally started writing it that night. And then he watched the first episode on the train on the way home. And then he texted me the next morning and he was like, 'I love it.' What do we need to do? And I was like, 'Get us in the room.' Two days later, we were in the room with all three media who own the format globally.Paul Marden: Okay.Neil Connolly: So we sat down and then they came to see one of our other shows and they were like, 'Okay, we get it now.' And then that was like two and a half years of just building the show, getting the deal done and facing the myriad of challenges. But yeah, sometimes it just starts with the text message.Paul Marden: So they get to experience all the key parts of the TV.Neil Connolly: All the key beats. Like right now, I'm holding one of the slates. They're not chalkboard slates. Again, this is... Oh, actually, this is a good challenge. So in the TV show, they've got a piece of slate and they write on it with a chalkboard pen. This seems so innocuous and I can't believe I'm talking about this on a podcast.Neil Connolly: Slategate was like six months of my life. Not in its entirety, but it was a six month long conversation about how we do the slates correctly. Because we do... 48 shows a day, six days a week. And those slates will crack. They will bash. And they're kind of a bit health and safety standards. I was like, can't have them. Also, they write on them with chalk pens, white ink chalk pens. But in the TV show, you only do it once a night. Yeah.Paul Marden: And then you have a producer and a runner.Neil Connolly: They just clean them very, very leisurely and set them back for the next day. And I was like, no, I've got to do a whole bunch of roundtable banishments in two hours. So we talked a lot about material, about style, literal viewership, because if you take a seat at the table. Yeah. If you're sitting at the table here, you'll notice that we've got a raised bit in the middle. If I turn mine around, the other person on the other side can't see it. So I was like, 'Okay, cool.' So we had to do a whole bunch of choreography. But also, the room's quite dark. Yes. At times, atmospheric. Yeah. In that magic triangle time-space atmosphere. So anything that was darker, or even that black slate, you just couldn't read it. And then there was, and then I had to— this is the level of detail that we have to go into when we're designing this kind of stuff. I was like, 'Yeah, but I can't clean off these slates with the white ink because everyone will have to have like a wet cloth chamois. Then I've just got loads of chamois around my venue that I just don't need.' And so then we're like, 'Oh, let's use real slates with real chalk.' And I was like, 'No, because dust will get everywhere.' I'll get chalk just all over my table. It'll just ruin everything. It'll ruin the technology that's inside the table because there's lots of hidden tricks inside of it. Paul Marden: Is there really? Yeah, yeah, yeah.  Neil Connolly: There's loads of hidden tricks inside the table. So after a while, going through many different permutations, I sat down with Christian Elenis, who's my set designer and my art director. And we were, the two of us were nearly in tears because we were like, 'We need,' and this only happened like.Neil Connolly: I would say two, three weeks before we opened. We still hadn't solved how to do the slate, which is a big thing in the show. Anybody who's seen the show and loves the show knows that they want to come in, they want to write somebody's name on the slate, and they want to spell the name incorrectly.Neil Connolly: Everyone does it on purpose. But I wanted to give people that opportunity. So then eventually we sat down and we were like, Christian, Neil. And the two of us in conversation went, why don't we just get a clear piece of Perspex, back it with a light coloured vinyl. And then Christian was like, 'Ooh,' and I'll make it nice and soft and put some felt on the back of it, which is what I'm holding. And then why don't we get a black pen? And we were like, 'Yeah,' like a whiteboard marker. And then we can just write on it. And then A, I can see it from the other side of the table. Thing one achieved. Two. Every marker pen's got an eraser on the top of it. I don't know why everyone thinks this is important, but it is. That you can just rub out like that, and I'm like, 'There's no dirt, there's no mess, and I can reuse this multiple times, like dozens of times in the same show.' And I know that sounds really weird, but that's the level of design I'm going to need.Paul Marden: I was just about to say, and that is just for the chalkboard. Yeah. Now you need to multiply that. How many decisions?Neil Connolly: How many decisions in each game. But also remember that there are eight round tables in this building. Each round table seats 14 people. And we do six sessions a day. So first ones at 10 a. m. Then we do 12, 2, 4, 6, and 8 p. m. So we do 48 shows a day, six days a week.Paul Marden: I love the concept that these are shows. This is not this is not visitor attraction. This is theater repeated multiple times a day for multi audience is concurrently.Neil Connolly: And I've just spent five minutes describing a slate to you. Yeah. But like, I haven't even got— it's like the sheer amount of technology that is in the show. And again, theatrical, like, look above our heads. Yeah. You've got this ring light above every seat. It's got a pin light. There's also microphones which are picking up all the audio in the room, which again is translating to the lounge of the dead. Every single one of the round table rooms has four CCTV cameras. Can you see that one in the corner? Each one of them is 4K resolution. It's quite high spec, which is aimed at the opposite side of the table to give you the resolution in the TV. In the other room. Then you've got these video contents. This is constantly displaying secret information through the course of the show to the traitors when they're in Conclave because everyone's in blindfolds and they took them off. They get secret instructions from that. There's also a live actor in the room. A live actor who is Claudia? They're not Claudia. They're not pastiches of Claudia. They are characters that we have created and they are the host of The Traitor's Game. Right. They only exist inside this building. We never have them portrayed outside of this building in any way whatsoever.Neil Connolly: They are characters, but they live, they breathe— the game of Traitors, the world of Traitors, and the building that we have designed and constructed here. And they facilitate the game for the people. And they facilitate the game for the people. One actor to 14 people. There are no plants, even though everyone tries to tell me. Members of the public will be convinced that they are the only person that's in that show and that everyone else is a plant. And I'm like, no, because that would be insane.Neil Connolly: The only actor in the room is the host.Paul Marden: 14 people that can sit around this table. How many of them are in the same group? Are you with your friends or is it put together where there are other people that you won't know in the room? If you book together, you play together.Neil Connolly: Yes. Okay, so if you don't book 14 people... Ah, we also capped the number of tickets that you can purchase to eight. Right. So you can only purchase a maximum of eight tickets unless you do want a full table of 14, at which point you have to then purchase a VIP package because you are booking out a whole table for yourselves. The game doesn't work if there's less than 10 people at the table. So there has to be 10, 11, 12, 13 or 14 people sat at a round table for the show to actually happen, for it to work. By capping the number of tickets that you book for eight, then that guarantees that strangers will be playing together. And that is the basis of strangers. Yeah, yeah. Like, you need to be sat around a table with people you know, you don't know, that you trust and you don't trust. Yeah. Fact of the matter. And do you see people turning on the others in their own group? Every single time. People think genuinely, and I love this from the public, you would think that if you're turning up as a group of eight and a group of four and a group of two, that the bigger group would just pick everybody off to make sure that someone in their group gets through to the end game.Neil Connolly: I'm sure they think that and they probably plot and plan that before they arrive on site. As soon as this game starts, gloves are off and everyone just starts going for each other. We've been open nearly two months now. I have seen, like, children murdered of their mothers.Neil Connolly: Husbands murder their wives, wives murder their husbands. I've seen, like, three generations—like, we get, because it's so intergenerational, like our lowest, the lowest age that you can play this is 12. Right. And then it's upwards. I've seen three generations of family come in and I've seen grandkids murder their own nan.Neil Connolly: Absolutely convinced that they're a traitor. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 100%. Or they banish them. Like, it's just mental. I've also seen nans, who are traitors, murder their grandkids.Neil Connolly: Like, and this is in a room full of strangers. They're just like, 'No, I'm not going to go for Barbara, who I met two hours ago in the bar. I'm going to go for my own grandson. It's mental.'Neil Connolly: The very, very first thing that I always think about whenever I'm creating an experience or whenever I'm designing a show is I put myself in the position of 'I'm a member of the public.' I have bought a ticketNeil Connolly: What's the coolest thing that I am going to do for my money? What is my perceived value of my ticket over actually what is the value of that ticket? I wanted to give people the experience of knowing what it was like to be sitting in one of these chairs at this table and feeling their heart. The pounding in their chest and I mean, the pounding in their chest, that rush of adrenaline from doing nothing— from sitting in a chair and all you were doing was sitting in a room talking to people and your heart is going.Neil Connolly: Because you're either being accused of being a liar. And trying to defend against it. And trying to defend against it. Or you actually are lying and you're trying to whittle your way out of it. And that feeling is the most alive that you will ever feel. Not ever. Like, I'm sure they're... No, no, no. But, like, give people that opportunity and that experience, as well as, like, access to the world of traitors and the law and everything else. But also, it's like any other theme park ride. People go on roller coasters because the imminent fear of death is always there. Yeah. And you feel alive. You're like, you've got such a buzz of adrenaline. Whereas, arguably, we do exactly the same thing as roller coasters, but in a much more longer-drawn format and multiple times. Yeah. And people do feel alive. When people walk out of the show, you see them go upstairs to the bar, and they are... Yeah.Paul Marden: You've said to me already that you don't use the word 'immersive,' but you know, I'm, I'm, I'm sat. The company is called 'immersive' everywhere. I'm sat behind the scenes. Okay. I'm sat in the room and the room is hugely convincing. It's like the highest fidelity escape room type experience that I've ever sat in. It feels like I'm on set, yeah, yeah. Um, I can totally believe that, in those two hours, you can slip. I sat on a game. It was only a two-minute game at iApple, but I was being filmed by one of the team. But within 30 seconds, I'd forgotten that they were there because I was completely immersed in the game. I can believe that, sitting in here right now, you could forget where you were and what you were doing, that you were completely submerged in the reality of the land that you're in.Neil Connolly: Yeah, 100%. Like, the world does not exist beyond these worlds. And for some people, like, I have my own definition. Everyone's got a different definition of what immersive is. I've got my own definition. But... I can tell you right now, as soon as people enter this building, they're in the bar, they're kind of slowly immersed in that world because the bar is a themed bar. It's done to the same, like we designed and built that bar as well. But as soon as they start descending that spiral staircase and coming into the gameplay floors, into the show floors, they just forget the rest of the world exists. And especially when they sit down at this table, it doesn't matter. I'm sat next to you here, but you could be sat at this table with your loved one, strangers, whatever. The gloves come off and just nothing exists apart from the game that you're about to go through.Paul Marden: You've been open now for a couple of months. More success than you were anticipating, I think. So pre-sales went through the roof? Yes. So you're very happy with the results?Neil Connolly: Yeah, yeah, we were. Yeah, well, we still are.Neil Connolly: We were very confident before we'd even started building the show, like the literal structural build, because we did very well. But then that set expectations quite high because I had a lot of people that had bought tickets and I was like, 'OK, I need to put on a good show for these people. And I need to make sure that they get satisfaction relative to the tickets that they bought.' But I don't feel pressure. I do feel anxiety quite a lot. Creatively? Yeah. I mean, I meditate every day.Paul Marden: But you've created this amazing world and you're inviting people into it. And as a creative, you're opening yourself up, aren't you? People are walking into the world that you've created.Neil Connolly: Yeah, this was said to me. This is not something that I came up with myself, and I do say this really humbly, but it was something that was said to me. It was on opening day, and a bunch of my friends came to playtest the show. And they were like, 'Oh, this is your brain in a building.'Neil Connolly: And I was like, 'Yeah, I hadn't thought about that.' But yeah, it is my brain in a building. But also that's terrifying, I think, for everybody else, because I know what happens inside my brain and it's really quite chaotic.Neil Connolly: But, you know, this I am. I'm so proud of this show. Like you could not believe how proud I am of this show. But also a huge part of my job is to find people that are smarter than me at the relative thing that they do, such as the rest of my creative team. They're all so much smarter than me. My job is vision and to be able to communicate that vision clearly and effectively so that they go, 'I understand.' The amount of times that people on the creative team turn around to me and go, 'Neil, that's a completely mental idea.' If people are saying to me, 'No one's ever done that before' or 'that's not the way things are done.'Neil Connolly: Or we can do that, but we're going to have to probably invent a whole new thing. If people are saying those things to me, I know I'm doing my job correctly. And I'm not doing that to challenge myself, but everything that I approach in terms of how I build shows is not about format. It's not about blueprints. It's not like, 'Hey, I've done this before, so I'm just going to do this again because I know that's a really neat trick.' I go back to, 'I made the show because I wanted people's heart to pound in their chest while they're sitting in a chair and make them feel alive.'Paul Marden: Is that the vision that you had in your head? So you're articulating that really, really clearly. Is that the vision that you sold to everybody on, not maybe day one, but within a couple of days of talking about this? No, it was day one.Neil Connolly: It was day one. Everyone went, that's a completely mental idea. But, you know, it's my job to try and communicate that as effectively and clearly as I can. But again, I am just one man. My job is vision. And, you know, there's lighting design, sound design, art direction, there's game logic. We haven't even gotten to the technology of how this show works yet, or how this room works.Neil Connolly: Actually, I'll wander down the corner. Yeah, let's do that. But, like, there's other, like, lots of hidden tricks. Like, this is one of the games, one of the missions. In the world and the lore of the show, the round table is sacrosanct.Paul Marden: Yes.Neil Connolly: Traitors is the game. The game is in other people. I can do so many missions and there's loads of missions and they're really fun in this show. But the game is in other people. It's in the people sat on the other side of the room. But also I wanted to do a thing where people could interact directly with the set. And so I designed one of the missions to be in the round table itself.Neil Connolly: So there's a course of these moon dials, which you basically have to align through the course of it. And there are sensors built into the table so that they know when they're in the correct position. How you find out the correct position is by solving a very, very simple puzzle and then communicating effectively to a bunch of strangers that you just met.Neil Connolly: And the sensors basically read it all. And when that all gets into position, the lights react, the sound reacts, the video content reacts, the whole room reacts to you. So I wanted to give people something tangible that they can touch and they make the room react to them. Yes, it's. I mean, I've designed, I've got background in escape rooms as well, right? Um, so I've done a lot of that kind of stuff as well. So I wanted people to feel in touch, same, but like, there's more tangible props over here. Um, yeah, that is a model box of the room that we are stood in, yeah. Also, there's an exact replica of it on the other side of it. There are very subtle differences between it, and that informs one of the missions. So that is two model boxes in this roundtable room. There's one of these in every single roundtable room. So there's 16 model boxes of the show that you're stood in on the set. And again, theatre. It's a show. But it's one of the missions, because I wanted people to kind of go, 'Oh, there's a live actor in front of me.' I'm having fun. Oh, look at all these lights and all the sound. Oh, there's a model box over here. That's in theatre land and blah, blah, blah. But that is also a really expensive joke. It's a really expensive joke. And there's other, like, lots of hidden tricks.Neil Connolly: Let's go look at backstage. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.Neil Connolly: I say backstage, like how we refer to it or how I always go. I use 'I' and 'we' very interchangeably. Like right now you're on the set. Like you're on the stage. Yes. We're just wandering around a long corridor. There are round table rooms off to either side. But like, you know, there's a green room upstairs where the actors get changed, where the front of house team are, where the bar team all are. But as soon as they go out onto the show floor, they're on stage—yes, completely. We'll very quickly have a look at the gallery—yes, show control. Hi, Robbo. Do you mind if I stand in your room for the purposes of the audio? I'm talking to the technical manager, Thomas Robson. We're recording a podcast.Paul Marden: Robbo, oh yeah, okay. My mind is absolutely blown. So you've got every single room up on screen.Neil Connolly: Yeah, so that's great. There's 164 cameras—something like that. But every roundtable room has four cameras in it. Each camera is 4K resolution. So we've got cameras on all of them. We've got audio into those rooms. That's two-way, so that if show control needs to talk directly to them, they just press a button here and they can talk directly to the room itself. Mainly just like, stop misbehaving, we're watching you.Neil Connolly: We've then got cameras into all of the lounges, all of the show spaces, all the front of house, all of the bar areas, the mezzanine and back of house. And then you've got QLab running across all of the different shows. We've got backups on all of these screens. So if one... of the computers goes down, we can very quickly swap it in for a backup that's already running. We've got show control, which is, there's a company called Clockwork Dog, who, they're an amazing company. What COGS, their show control system, is doing is pulling in all of the QLab from sound, all of the QLab from lighting, and also we built our own app. to be able to run the show. So there's a whole logic and decision tree based on the decisions that the public do through the course of the game. So yes, there is a beginning, a middle, and an end in terms of our narrative beats and the narrative story of the show that we're telling people. But also that narrative can go in. Hundreds of different directions depending on the actions and the gameplay that the people do during the course of the show. So, you haven't just learned one show— you have to learn like You have to learn a world, and you have to learn a whole game.Neil Connolly: Like, there's the server, stacks, which we had to build. You had to network and cable the entire building. So we have built an entire new attraction, which didn't exist before. And also we're pulling in information from the front of house system which is also going into the show itself because again, you put your name into the iPad when you arrive on site and then you tick a box very crucially to say, 'Do you want to be selected as a trader? Yes or No.' Because in the game, it's a fundamental rule. If you say no, you cannot be selected as a traitor by the host during traitor selection. That doesn't mean you can't be recruited.Paul Marden: By the traitors later on in the game. So you could come and do this multiple times and not experience the same story because there were so many different pathways that you could go down.Neil Connolly: But also, the game is in other people. Yes. The show is sat on the opposite side of the table to you because, like, Bob and Sandra don't know each other. They'll never see each other ever again. But Bob comes again and he's now playing against Laura. Who's Laura? She's an unknown quantity. That's a whole new game. That's a whole new show. There's a whole new dynamic. That's a whole new storyline that you have to develop. And so the actors are doing an incredible job of managing all of that.Paul Marden: Thanks, Robbo. Thank you. So you've worked with some really, really impressive leading IP, Traders, Peppa Pig, Doctor Who, Great Gatsby. What challenges do you face taking things from screen to the live experience?Paul Marden: Challenges do I face? We're wandering here.Neil Connolly: So we are in... Oh, we're in the tower.Neil Connolly: Excellent. Yep, so we're now in Traitor's Tower. Good time for you to ask me the question, what challenges do I face? Things like this. We're now stood in Traitor's Tower. Paul, let me ask you the question. Without the show lights being on, so we're just stood on a set under workers, what's your opinion of the room that we're stood in?Paul Marden: Oh, it's hugely impressive. It feels like, apart from the fact you've punched the fourth wall out of the telly, it does feel like you're on set.Neil Connolly: It's a really faithful reproduction of the set. So that's kind of one of the challenges is managing the public's expectations of what they see, do and feel on site. So that I don't change the show so that people come and play the game that they're expecting to play. But making reasonable adjustments within that, because TV and live are two very, very different things. So first and foremost was making sure that we get the format right. So the game that people play, which informs the narrative of the show and the narrative structure of the show. Breakfast, mission, round table, conclave. Breakfast, mission, round table, conclave. I've designed a whole bunch of new missions that are in this, taken some inspiration from missions that people know and love from the TV shows, whether that's the UK territory or other territories around the world. And also just other stuff is just clear out of my head. So there's original content in there. paying homage and respect to the world that they've built and allowing ourselves to also play and develop and build out that world at the same time. Other challenges.Neil Connolly: This is not a cheap project. No, no. I mean, the production quality of this is beautiful. Yeah, yeah, thank you. It is stunning. When people walk in here, they're like, 'Oh my God, this is... High end.' I am in a luxury event at a very affordable price.Paul Marden: Thank you. And then we're going back upstairs again. Yes. And in the stairwell, we've got the crossed out photos of all of those that have fallen before us.Neil Connolly: No, not quite. All of the people that are in this corridor, there's about 100 photos. These are all the people who built the show.Neil Connolly: So this is David Gregory. He's the sound designer. This is Kitty, who is Immersive Everywhere's office manager. She also works in ticketing. That is Tallulah and Alba, who work in the art department. Elliot, who's our lighting designer. So all of these people are the people who brought the show to life.Paul Marden: Amazing.Neil Connolly: And we wanted to pay homage to them because some of them gave years of their lives to building the show from literally the inception that I had in 2023. Through to now and others are the people who literally spent months of their life underground in these basements building hand-building this set and so we wanted to pay homage to them so we got all of their photos we did the iconic red cross through it yeah and we stuck them all up in the corridor just because we thought it'd be a nice thing to do.Paul Marden: You're in the business of trading and experiences and that ranges from art exhibitions to touring shows. There's always going to be a challenge of balancing innovation and profitability. What is the formula? What is the magic formula?Neil Connolly: I believe, first and foremost, going back to what I was telling you earlier about us being a collaborative organisation. We are not a creative crack that has been used for the show. We are also the producers of the show. And to make my point again, I'm a commercially minded creative. So I actually sit down with the producers and go, 'Okay, cool.' There are 112 seats in the show.Paul Marden: Yep.Neil Connolly: Therefore, how many shows do we need to do per day? How many shows do we need to do per week? How many shows do we need to do per year? Therefore, let's build out a P &L. And we build a whole business plan based around that.Paul Marden: By having everybody— that you need in the team— makes it much easier to talk about that sort of stuff. It makes it much easier for you to design things with the end result in mind. You don't have a creative in a creative agency going off— feeding their creative wants without really thinking about the practicalities of delivering on it.Neil Connolly: Exactly. So you've got to think like, literally, from the very, very beginning: you've got to think about guest flow. You've got to think about throughput. You've got to think about your capacities. Then you've got to basically build out a budget that you think— how much, hey, how much really is this going to cost? Yeah. Then you build out an entire business plan and then you go and start raising the money to try and put that on. And then you find a venue. I mean, like the other magic triangle, like the traitor's magic triangle is, you know, time, space, atmosphere. That's how you do a show. Like with my producer's hat on, the other magic triangle is show, money, venue.Neil Connolly: The truth of the matter, like I make no bones about it, I can design shows till the cows come home, but I'm always going to need money to put them on and a venue to put them in. Also, I want to stress this really important. I use the words 'I' and 'we' very interchangeably.Paul Marden: It's a team effort.Neil Connolly: You can see that in that corridor. I am not a one-man band. I am the creative director of a company. I am a cog that is in that machine, and everybody is doing... We are, as a team... I cannot stress this enough. Some of the best in the business are doing what we do. And everyone is so wildly talented. And that's just us on the producing side. That's immersive everywhere, limited. Then I've got a whole other creative team. Then we've got operations. Then we've got... It's just mad. It's just mad, isn't it? This is a job. Who would have thought, when you were at school, this was an opportunity? Not my principal or my maths teacher.Neil Connolly: So, sorry, just to balance the kind of economies of scale. That was the question, wasn't it?Paul Marden: Well, we were talking about what is the formula for making that an investment, but you know, the authority here is the effort you've put in to do this feels high, but at the same time, you have to find this thing. There is a lot of investment that goes into the front.Neil Connolly: But that comes back to creatives. Caring and I'm not saying the creatives don't, but I care. I care about building businesses. Yeah, not necessarily like building my own CV, like there's so many projects that across our desks. I'll be like, 'Yeah, that'd be really fun to work on.' But do I think that I can make that a touring product? Can it be a long-running location-based entertainment sit-down product? Can it be an art shop? Like you've kind of got a balance with what do you think is just creatively cool versus what can we do as a company that is a commercially viable and financially stable product? And so all that comes through in terms of the creative, but also in terms of the activities of how we run the building, how this model realizes. Because if you think about it, let's make Phantom of the Opera run in the West End. Yes. The show is very obvious, with many casts on a room, away, fruit team away, terrace, it's a big activity. If they haven't sold half that away, they have to use the whole show and play all those people.Neil Connolly: But if they haven't sold half that away from one of my shows... I only have to activate four of my rooms, not eight of them. Therefore, I don't have to call in four actors. I don't have to call in a bunch of the other front of house team and I can scale in the operations on the back. It's an entirely scalable process. Flexible, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, 100%. But also, like, we've got eight rooms here. If we decide to take this to another territory, and that territory demands a much higher throughput, then instead of eight rooms, I can do 20 rooms, 30 rooms. As long as we know that the market is there to be able to kind of get people through it.Neil Connolly: I love this show and I'm so proud of it. The main reason why I'm proud of it is when the show finishes, let's go into one of the lounges. Have you been into one of the lounges?Paul Marden: I've had a nose around a lounge.Neil Connolly: There are different shapes and sizes. We won't go into that one. We'll go into this one down here. That one, that one. It's always such a buzz when you're stood in the bar and the shows kick out, and you see tables and tables of 14 people going up into the bar.Neil Connolly: Area and before they've even gotten a drink, they will run straight over to their friends, families, strangers, whoever they were playing with in that table of 14, and instantly be like, 'Right, I need to know everything that was going on inside your head, your heart, and your soul over the last two hours of my life because this was my experience.'Neil Connolly: And they'll just go, and they'll be like, 'And this is what I was thinking.' And then I thought it was you because you did this and you touched your nose in a weird way. And then I thought you were sending secret signals. And then everyone's like, 'No, that's not what I was doing.' I was just trying to be a normal person. And they were like, 'Well, why did you say that thing?' It sounded super weird. And they're like, 'That's just what I do.' And it's just totally mental. And then they all get a drink from the bar. And we call it the bar tab chat.Neil Connolly: It's another revenue stream.Neil Connolly: I do talk about this like it's a show. And it is a show. You've walked around, do you think it's a show? Completely. I talk to established houses all the time. Like, you know, the big theatres of the land. Organisations that are national portfolio organisations who receive a lot of Arts Council funding. The thing that they want to talk to us about all the time is new audiences. They're like, 'How do I get new audiences through my door?' What can I do? And I'm like, 'Well, firstly, make a show that people want to go and see.'Neil Connolly: Again, they're like, 'But I've got this amazing writer and he's a really big name and everyone's going to come because it's that name.' And I'm like, 'Yeah, that's wicked. That's cool.' And they can all go pay reverence to that person. That's really wonderful. Whereas when you look at the attractions landscape or the immersive theatre landscape or like anything like... Squid Game, or The Elvis, Evolution, or War of the Worlds, which has also laid reality, or any of that kind of stuff, across the landscape, it is nothing but new audiences. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is nothing but actual ticket-buying audiences.Neil Connolly: And they come from all different walks of life. And what I love is that they do come in to this experience and we hit them with this like secret theatre.Neil Connolly: And they're like, 'Oh my God.' And often it's a gateway to them being like, 'Oh, I didn't realise that.' Maybe I'll go see a Western show or maybe I will go to the National Theatre and see something. Because that's the level of archery. Because those organisations, I love them and I've worked in a few of them, but those buildings can be quite austere, even though they're open and porous, but it's still very difficult to walk through that threshold and feel a part of it.Paul Marden: Whereas coming in here, coming into an event like this, can feel like a thing that they do.Neil Connolly: Because it's the same demographic as theme park junkies. People who love going to theme parks love going to stuff like this because it's an experience, it's an otherness, it's an other nature kind of thing. Because modern audiences want to play and do, not sit and watch. But we all exist in the kind of same ecosystem. I'm not taking on the National Theatre.Paul Marden: Gosh, no. I always talk about that. I think the reason why so many attractions work together in the collaborative way that they do is they recognise that they're not competing with each other. They're competing with sitting on your backside and watching Netflix.Paul Marden: Yeah, yeah.Paul Marden: Our job for all of us is to drag people away from their screens and drag people off of their sofas to do something. And then that's the biggest challenge that we all face.Neil Connolly: I think then that kind of answers the question that you asked me earlier, which I didn't answer. And I'm very sorry.Neil Connolly: is about identifying different pieces of IP. Like, yes, we largely exist in the world of licensing IP. And how do we identify that kind of IP to be able to translate? Not just how do we do it, but like, actually, how do we identify the right thing that's going to... How do you spot the winner? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And that is one of the biggest challenges to your point of we're talking directly to people who consume arts, culture and media and technology in a slightly more passive way, whether that's just at home and watching Netflix and then bringing that to life. In a very, very different way. If you have a very clear marketing campaign that tells people what it is that they're buying and what they're expected to see or do on their particular night out, because that's what modern people really care about, what they do with their money. Yeah. And they want to have a good night out. And I'm in the business of giving people a good night out. We also happen to be murdering a lot of people in the course of the show.Neil Connolly: Still a good night out. Still a good night out. But I'm in a place where the dead sit. Yeah, exactly. Lounge of the dead. And like, you know, this is a really cool space. Oh, it's just beautiful. You know, we've got the telephone really works. There's lots of information that comes through that. The radio works, that does different things. The TV screen on the wall, that has the actual live feed into the round table room that you've just left. And there's other little puzzles and hints and tricks in this room, which means that after you've been murdered or banished and you come to the Lounge of the Dead, you're still engaged with the game to a degree. You just don't directly influence the outcome of the game. But you're still involved in it. You're still involved in it. It's super fun. Oh, and you can have a drink in here.Paul Marden: I don't let people drink in the round table. Even more important. What's this?Neil Connolly: The dolls, the creepy dolls. What this is, this is the void. Creatively speaking, this is where all the gold goes when people win or lose it. And the creepy dolls are from the TV show. Ydyn nhw'r un gwirioneddol o'r sioe? Felly, gafodd studio Lambert, sy'n gwneud y sioe tebyg, llawer o brops o'r sioe tebyg i ni eu rhoi ar y ddispleiddio yma. Felly, mae gennych chi'r Dolls Creepy o'r lles 3 yno. Rydyn ni'n mynd i fyny. Yn ôl yma, mae'r peintiwch Deathmatch.Paul Marden: Which is from season three.Neil Connolly: And they get the quill and they write the names and got the quill upstairs. We've also got over here, the cards that they used to play the death match with. Excellent.Paul Marden: So you began your career in theatre. How did that evolve into the world of immersive live experiences?Neil Connolly: Life story. I am the son of a postman and a cook. And if you haven't noticed already, I'm from Ireland. There was no theatre in our lives, my life, when I was growing up. And I stumbled into a youth theatre. It's called Kildare Youth Theatre. And the reason why I joined that is because there was a girl that I really fancied.Neil Connolly: She had just joined this youth theatre and I was like, 'Oh, I'm gonna join that as well' and that kind of opened the world of theatre for me. At the same time, I then got spotted by this guy, his name's Vijay Baton, his real name's Om, but he converted to Hare Krishnanism in the 90s. And he set up a street theatre company in Ireland. He just taught me street theatre. So he taught me stilt walk, he taught me juggling, he taught me how to build puppets. And so I spent years building puppets with him and going around Ireland doing lots of different street theatre while I was a teenager. And doing street theatre and doing my youth theatre and then kind of all of that kind of came to a head when I had to decide what I was going to do with my life. I applied to go to drama school. And I applied to two drama schools. One was Radha. Didn't get in. Didn't even get an audition. And the other one was Rose Bruford. And they took me. And the reason why they took me— I probably wasn't even that good. But on the day that I was auditioning to get into Rose Bruford was the same day as my maths exam for my final exams at school. You call them your A-levels, we call them the leaving certificate.Neil Connolly: And while all of my friends were back in Ireland doing their maths exam, I was in an audition room pretending to be a tree or the colour black.Neil Connolly: Who knows? And they kind of went, 'Well, if I fail my maths exam, I don't get into university in Ireland.' Like, it's just a blanket thing. And so I was like, 'I literally sat across the panel' and I was like, 'eggs, basket.' And they were like, 'cool.' So they let me in based off of that. So I got a classical training. Then what happened is I came out of university. I was living with two of my friends, Natalie and Joe. And we had our own little production company called The Lab Collective. And we just started making shows. In weird ways, we joined a company called Theatre Delicatessen. Let's get away from this. Yeah, yeah, yeah.Neil Connolly: So Theatre Deli was a company set up to take over disused spaces in London and convert them into art spaces.Neil Connolly: Basically legalised squatting. It's the same as like a guardianship. But we weren't living in the buildings. We were just putting on shows and we put on art shows, we put on theatre shows. We did Shakespeare for a while. We wrote our own work and we just did lots of really, really cool stuff. And I worked in music festivals, classically trained actor. So I was trying to do shows. I did a lot of devising. I also joined an improvisation group. And kind of through all that mix, like those years at Delhi, which was making these weird shows in these weird buildings, were very, very formative years for us. The Arts Council wouldn't support the kind of work that we were making. We were like, 'Cool, how do we get space?Neil Connolly: How do we get or make money to support ourselves? And what are the shows? There's the magic triangle all over again. Space, show, money. And that's your apprenticeship, I guess, that brings you to here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And like, again, I make no bones about it. 10 years ago, I was selling programs on the door of the Royal Festival Hall while doing all of that stuff. So in one of the Theatre Daily buildings, we did a show called Heist, which is you break into a building and steal stuff. That's what the public do.Neil Connolly: And a bunch of us did that. I mean, it's so much fun— kind of doing it. And off the back of that, somebody else basically tried to chase down the crystal maze. And then they went away, and then they called me up and they were like, 'Hey, I've got the rights. Do you want to make the crystal maze?' And I was like, 'Yeah, sounds like fun.' So I got involved with that, did that for a while. And then, from there, this is the end of a very long story. I'm so apologised. Yeah, from there, all of those different things that I've done through the course of my life in terms of operations, designing experiences, being a creative, understanding business.Neil Connolly: Building a P&L, building a budget, talking to investors, trying to convince them to give you money. All of that stuff kind of basically came together. And over the last few years, like the wildest ride is that pre-2020.Neil Connolly: We were just a bunch of people doing a bunch of weird things, making weird shows and weird attractions in kind of different ways. And then that year happened. And I don't know what happened, but literally every single major studio, film, TV production, game designer, licensor in the world, suddenly just went— brand extensions, world extensions, and they all just started calling us. And they were like, 'Hi, I've got this thing.' Can you develop it into a thing? Because I need to extend my brand or I want to build a world and extend that for the public. And we were like, 'Yeah, okay, cool.' And we were just lucky, serendipitously, to be in the right place at the right time. To be those people that people can approach. And we're always, we're very approachable.Neil Connolly: As you can tell, I talk a lot. And, you know, so the last five years, it's just been a mad ride.Paul Marden: So look, Neil, it's been amazing. I have had the most fun. Last question for you. What's next? Are you putting your feet up now because you finished this? Or on to the next? Neil Connolly: Very much on to the next thing. So we're already in production with our new show, which is called Peppa Pig Surprise Party. And that is opening at the Metro Centre in Gateshead next year. Oh, how exciting is that? It's very exciting.Paul Marden: So quite a different demographic.Neil Connolly: The demographic for Peppa Pig is two to five year olds. It's been a really fun show to design and create. To go back to a question that you asked me very early on, there is no blueprint, there is no format. I have embraced the chaos tattooed on my arm. And always when I approach things, any new show or any new creative, I am thinking of it from a ticket buying perspective: 'I have paid my money.' What is the coolest thing that I can possibly do with that money? And so therefore, I'm now looking at families and, like, what's the coolest thing that they can do for that ticket price in the world of Peppa Pig?Paul Marden: Let's come back in the new year, once you've opened Peppa Pig, let's go to Gateshead and see that. That sounds pretty awesome to me. I reckon there's a whole new episode of Designing Worlds for two to five-year-olds that we could fill an hour on.Neil Connolly: Oh yeah, 100%. It's a totally different beast. And super fun to design.Paul Marden: Oh mate. Neil, it has been so wonderful having a wander around the inside of your crazy mind.Paul Marden: If you've enjoyed today's episode, please like it and leave a comment in your podcast app. It really does make it so much easier for other people to find us. This episode was written by Emily Burrows from Plaster, edited by Steve Folland, and produced by Sami Entwistle from Plaster and Wenalyn Dionaldo. Thanks very much. See you next week.  The 2025 Visitor Attraction Website Survey is now LIVE! Dive into groundbreaking benchmarks for the industryGain a better understanding of how to achieve the highest conversion ratesExplore the "why" behind visitor attraction site performanceLearn the impact of website optimisation and visitor engagement on conversion ratesUncover key steps to enhance user experience for greater conversionsTake the Rubber Cheese Visitor Attraction Website Survey Report

In this episode of Skip the Queue, host Paul Marden speaks with Andy Hadden, founder of the Lost Shore Surf Resort in Scotland. Andy shares the remarkable journey from his sporting background and early property career to discovering wave technology in the Basque Country, which inspired him to bring inland surfing to Scotland. Despite starting with no money and no land, Andy raised over £100 million and built one of the world's most advanced inland surf destinations. He explains how Lost Shore Surf Resort combines world-class waves with a strong community focus, sustainability initiatives, and partnerships with schools and universities to deliver real social and economic impact.Skip the Queue is brought to you by Rubber Cheese, a digital agency that builds remarkable systems and websites for attractions that helps them increase their visitor numbers. Your host is Paul Marden, with co host Andy Povey and roving reporter Claire Furnival.If you like what you hear, you can subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, and all the usual channels by searching Skip the Queue or visit our website SkiptheQueue.fm.If you've enjoyed this podcast, please leave us a five star review, it really helps others find us. And remember to follow us on LinkedIn. Show references:  Lost Shore Surf Resort website: https://www.lostshore.com/Andy Hadded on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andy-hadden-94989a67/Andy Hadden is the founder of Lost Shore Surf Resort, Scotland's first inland surf destination and home to Europe's largest wave pool. Opened in November 2024 near Edinburgh, Lost Shore is the country's largest sports infrastructure project since the Commonwealth Games and now attracts a truly international audience of surfers, families, and brands. With a background in insolvency and investment surveying, Andy led the venture from concept to completion - securing major institutional backing and building a multidisciplinary team to deliver a world-class destination. Long before 'ESG' was a buzzword, he embedded environmental and social value into Lost Shore's DNA, helping set new benchmarks for responsible development. As home to the Surf Lab with Edinburgh Napier University, Lost Shore also serves as a global hub for performance, product R&D, and surf therapy. Live from the show floor, we'll also be joined by:Bakit Baydaliev, CEO/ Cofounder of DOF Roboticshttps://dofrobotics.com/https://www.linkedin.com/in/bakitbaydaliev/Hamza Saber, Expert Engineer at TÜV SÜDhttps://www.tuvsud.com/enhttps://www.linkedin.com/in/hamzasaber/David Jungmann, Director of Business Development at Accessohttps://www.accesso.com/https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidjungmann/Kristof Van Hove, Tomorrowlandhttps://www.tomorrowland.com/home/https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristof-van-hove-2ba3b953/ Transcriptions:  Paul Marden: Welcome to Skip the Queue, the podcast about attractions and the amazing people who work with them. I'm your host, Paul Marden, and with my co-host Andy Povey and roving reporter Claire Furnival, we're coming to you from IAAPA Expo Europe. This is the first of three episodes from the show floor that will come to you over the next three days. Firstly, I'm joined today by Andy Hadden, the founder of Lost Shores Surf Resort.Paul Marden: Andy, tell us a little bit about your journey. You've opened this amazing attraction up there in Scotland where I was on holiday a couple of weeks ago. Tell us a little bit about that attraction. Why this and why in Scotland?Andy Hadden: Well, I grew up locally and I came from more of a sporting family than so much of a business family. My father was the international rugby coach for a while and I played a lot of sport. Paul Marden: Oh, really? Andy Hadden: Yeah, yeah. So we always had this thing about there wasn't enough facilities here in Scotland because Scotland is a place which doesn't necessarily have all the resources and the access to funds and everything else like that. But one thing we noted with, you know, if you created facilities, whether they be good tennis facilities, good 4G football pitches, whatever it was. It allowed the environment around it to prosper, the communities around it to prosper. And, of course, I was a charter surveyor by trade, so I worked in insolvency and then in investment. So I sold two sites to that market. Andy Hadden: But I always surfed. I always surfed. So whilst I was down in Birmingham in England, when I actually got an email in 2012 talking about some, you know, some surfy thing that might have been happening in Bristol, I called the head of destination consulting up and I said, 'this sounds like nonsense, to be honest', because I surf and you can't really be talking about real surfing waves here. It's got to be something, you know, different. He said, 'No, no, there's these guys in the Basque country.' So I took a flight over there and that day changed everything for me. Paul Marden: So what was it that you saw? Andy Hadden: I went to see what was back then a secret test facility in the mountains of the Basque Country. It was very cloak and dagger. I had to follow the guide and give me the email address. I found this all very exciting. When I went and actually saw this facility, I realised that for the decade before that, there'd been all these amazing minds, engineers and surfers working on what they believed could be, you know, a big future of not just the inland surfing movement that's now burgeoning into a multi-billion dollar global movement, but it could really affect surfing. And if it was going to affect surfing as a sport, and it's now an Olympic sport because of these facilities, they wanted to make sure that it was a very accessible piece of kit. So surfing, it could affect surfing if ran by the right people in the right ways and really communicate that stoke of the sport to the masses.Paul Marden: So what is it that you've built in Edinburgh then? Tell me a little bit about it.Andy Hadden: So we've delivered a wave garden cove, which is a 52-module wave garden, which is about the size of three football pitches, and it can run hundreds of waves an hour, touch of a button and it can run in skiing parlance anything from green runs right through to sort of black powder runs. And the beauty of it is you can have people that are the better surfers out the back and just like at the beach at the front you've got their kids and learning how to surf on the white water. So we're finding it to be a really amazing experience— not just for surfers who are obviously flocking to us, but already here in Scotland, eight months in, tens of thousands of new surfers are all coming back and just going, 'Wow, we've got this thing on our doorstep.' This is blowing our minds, you know. Paul Marden: Wowzers, wowzers. Look, I'm guessing that the infrastructure and the technology that you need to be able to create this kind of inland wave centre is key to what you're doing. That you've got to access some funds, I guess, to be able to do this. This is not a cheap thing for you to be able to put together, surely.Andy Hadden: Yeah, correct. I mean, you know, I have questioned my own sanity at times. But when I started 10 years ago, I had no money and no land. But I did have some property expertise and I wanted to do it in Edinburgh, a close-up place that I cared about. So we have excellent networks. For a few years, you know. Whilst we've ended up raising over  £100 million in structured finance from a standing start, it took me a couple of years just to raise £40,000. And then I used that to do some quite bizarre things like flying everyone that I cared about, you know, whether they were from the surf community or... Community stakeholders, politicians, and everyone over to the test facility to see themselves— what I could see to sort of—well, is it? Am I just getting carried away here? Or is there something in this? And then, on top of that, you know, we sponsored the world's first PhD in surf therapy with that first $5,000. So now we have a doctor in surf therapy who now takes me around the world to California and all these places. How does business actually really genuinely care about, you know, giving back? And I'm like, yeah, because we said we're going to do this once.Andy Hadden: We got to do it right. And it took us a decade. But yeah, we raised the money and we're very happy to be open.Paul Marden: So I mentioned a minute ago, I was holidaying in Scotland. I bookended Edinburgh— both sides of the holiday. And then I was in Sky for a few days as well. There's something about Edinburgh at the moment. There is a real energy. Coming up as a tourist, there was way too much for me to be able to do. It seems to be a real destination at the moment for people.Andy Hadden: Yeah, well, I think, coming from the background I came from, if I knew I was going to deliver a surfing park in the edge of Edinburgh, I then wanted to do it in the least risky way possible. So to do that, I felt land ownership was key and three business plans was also very key. Edinburgh's in need of accommodation regardless, and Edinburgh's also in need of good places, a good F&B for friends and family just to go and hang out on the weekends. And then, of course, you have the surfing, and we've got a big wellness aspect too. We also sit next to Europe's largest indoor climbing arena. And we're obviously very well connected in the centre of Scotland to both Edinburgh and Scotland. So, so many things to do. So, yeah, I mean, the Scottish tourism landscape has always been good, but it's just getting better and better as we see this as a future-proof marketplace up here. You know, we're not building ships anymore.Andy Hadden: Well, in fact, we got a contract the other week to build one, so maybe that's wrong. But the point is, we see it as a very future-proof place because the Americans are flagging, the Europeans are flagging, and they just want to feel like they're part of something very Scottish. And that's what we've tried to do in our own special way.Paul Marden: And when you think of coming to Scotland, of course, you think about surfing, don't you? Andy Hadden: Yes, who knows. Paul Marden: Exactly, exactly. Look, you had some recent high-profile support from Jason Connery, the son of the late James Bond actor Sean Connery. How did that come about?Andy Hadden: Well, I think we've got, there's a real Scottish spirit of entrepreneurialism that goes back, you know, probably right the way through to the Enlightenment where, you know, I'm sure. I'm sure a lot of you know how many inventions came from Scotland. And this is, you know, televisions, telephones, penicillin. I mean, just the list goes on.Andy Hadden: Of course, you know, that was a long, long time ago, but we still feel a lot of pride in that. But there seems to be a lot of people who've had success in our country, like someone like Sir Sean Connery. These guys are still very proud of that. So when they see something— very entrepreneurial— where we're using a lot of local businesses to create something bigger than the sum of its parts. And to do it truly— not just to be a profitable private business, which is what it is, but to give back 18 million into local economy every year, to work with schools in terms of getting into curriculums. We've got Surf Lab. We work with universities, charities, and so on. They really want to support this stuff. So we have over 50 shareholders, and they've each invested probably for slightly different reasons. They all have to know that their money is a good bet, but I think they all want to feel like they're part of creating a recipe. For a surf resort, which we believe there'll be hundreds of around the world in the next few years. And we can create that recipe here in Scotland. That's hopefully another example of Scottish innovation and entrepreneurialism.Paul Marden: So you've got the test bed that happened in the Basque Country. You've got Scotland now. Are there surf resorts like this elsewhere in the world?Andy Hadden: Yeah, there are eight other open in the world. There's actually, there's various technologies. So there's about 25 different surf parks open at the moment. But there's... doesn't under construction. Pharrell Williams has just opened one in Virginia Beach a few weeks ago there in America. And what the equity, I think, is looking at quite rightly, the big equity, you know, the type that go right, if this really is a, you know, kind of top golfing steroids in that property developers can look at them as.Andy Hadden: You know, excellent ways to get through their more standardised property place, residential, office, industrial. Usually they have to do that in a kind of loss-leading way. But if you look at this as a leisure attraction, which councils and cities actually want because of the benefits, and it makes you money, and it increases the prices of your residential around it. I think developers are starting to realise there's a sweet spot there. So the equity, the big equity, I think, is about to drop in this market over the next couple of years. And it's just waiting for the data set to enable them to do that.Paul Marden: Wow. I guess there's an environmental impact to the work that you do, trying to create any big... a big project like this is going to have some sort of environmental impact. You've put in place an environmental sustainability strategy before it was mainstream as it is now. Tell us some of the things that you've put in place to try to address that environmental impact of what you're doing.Andy Hadden: Well, we're in a disused quarry. So it was a brownfield site. So already just by building on it and creating an immunity, we're also adding to the biodiversity of that site. And we're obviously there's no escaping the fact that we're a user of energy. There's just no escaping that. So the reality is we've got as much sustainable energy use as we can from air source heat pumps to solar. And we're looking at a solar project. So it becomes completely self-sustaining. But we also, the electricity we do access from the grid is through a green tariff. But you'll see a lot of the resorts around the world, this is going to become the sort of, the main play is to become sort of sustainable in that sense. Where we really fly is with the S and ESG. And like you say, the reason we were the world's first institutionally backed wave park, of course, we like to think it was purely down to our financials. But the reality is, they started saying, 'Wow, you're as authentic an ESG company as we've come across.'Andy Hadden: And it's the same with our mission-based national bank. So, because we didn't really know what that meant, we just knew it was the right thing to do. So we fit squarely into that ESG category, which I know is a tick box for a lot of funds, let's face it. There's a lot of them that really want to do that. There's a lot of investors out there that want to do it. But let's understand our place in the system, which is we're really market leading in that area. And I think that's very attractive for a lot of funds out there. But the S in ESG is where we really fly with all the work we're doing socially around the site.Paul Marden: So talk to me a little bit about that. How are you addressing that kind of the social responsibility piece?Andy Hadden: Well, two examples would be we're not just looking at schools to come here to surf. That's an obvious one. They'll go to any attraction to surf if you could go to Laser Quest, go up to visit the castle, do whatever. But we reverse engineered it. We got schools coordinated to go around the headmasters and the schools and say, 'Well, Look, you're all teaching STEM, science, technology, engineering, maths, for 9 to 13-year-olds. And you're all looking for outdoor learning now, which is definitely a big part of the future in education in general. Can you allow us to create some modules here? So we've got six modules that actually fit into that STEM strategy. For instance, last week, there was a school in learning physics, but they were using surf wax on a surfboard friction.Paul Marden: Amazing.Andy Hadden: So these kids so it works for schools and headmasters which is very important and for parents and it obviously works for the kids and they love it and the reason we do that and we give that it's all at discounted low times and everything is because it's a numbers game they come back at the weekend and so on so that's example one and another would be we've created a surf lab with Napier University, a higher education. So we sponsored the world's first doctor. It got a PhD in surf therapy, but then the university was like, 'hold on a minute, you know, this is good marketing for us as well'.Andy Hadden: This surf lab, which has the infrastructure to host great competitions, but also PhD students can come down and learn engineering. They can learn sustainable energy. So we've got more PhD students working there. And this higher university collaboration has not only led to Alder kids coming down but other universities in the area are now what can we do with lost shore now that's cool and fun so we're working with the other universities in town too so that's a couple of examples alongside the standard, employing local people and actually having the economics of putting money into the local economy.Paul Marden: It's interesting, isn't it? Because... So for many people, ESG, and especially the social responsibility piece, feels a little bit worthy. It feels an altruistic move for the organisation to go and do those things. But you've hit on the quid pro quo what do you get back for doing all of this stuff well you're bringing in these kids you're enriching their learning, you're helping them to learn valuable skills but you're also giving them a taster of what life is like at the the resort and seeing the benefit of the return visits that flow from that is crazy.Andy Hadden: You know, I like to think we've fought as hard as anyone to ingrain this stuff in your DNA because we're year one. And of course, we have our cash flow difficulties like everyone does. You know, you don't know how to... run the place for the first three months or that's what it feels like even though you've done all this preparation and so on and so forth but at no point does anyone turn around and go let's get rid of the schools program let's get rid of the university partnership and that's why i think it's very important to build it into your dna because it doesn't have to be this zero-sum game that people attribute you know or we're giving here so that means we have to take over here it's like there's cute ways to do everything you can do the right thing but also drive traffic for your business and it's very good right. It's good reputation, because the people that stay there, when they see that we're doing this stuff, they feel like they're part of it, and then they want to book again. So I believe it doesn't have to be a zero-sum game, but it is a different way of creating a business— that's for sure.Paul Marden: For sure. So there's going to be a listener out there, I'm sure, with a crazy idea like you had a few years ago. What advice would you give for somebody just starting out thinking of opening a business in the leisure and attraction sector?Andy Hadden: I would just try your best to make it as simple as possible. I think it was Yves Chouinard, the founder of Patagonia, who said, 'One of the hardest things in life is to make it simple. It's so easy to make it complex.' And when you're dealing with a business plan, it's very exciting, right? Well, what if we get into this market? What if we do this? And splitting it all into those components. I think arm yourself with very good people around you. They don't even have to be part of the company. If you've been a good person in your life, I'm sure you've got friends who you can tap into. Everyone knows an architect. Everyone knows an accountant. Everyone knows a lawyer. You're a friend of a friend. Andy Hadden: And I think just overload yourself with as much information to get you to the point where you can be assertive with your own decisions. Because at the end of the day, it's going to come down to you making your own decisions. And if you've got a very clear path of what success and failure looks like, understanding that it ain't going to look like your business plan. As long as it's got the broad shapes of where you want to go, it can get you out of bed every day to try and make things happen. So, yeah, just go for it. Really, that's it.Paul Marden: See where it takes you. So look, in the world of themed entertainment, we talk a lot about IP and storytelling and creating magical experiences. Are any of these concepts relevant to a destination like yours?Andy Hadden: Yeah, well, you know, technically, from an IP perspective, you know, we're using the WaveGround Cove technology. You know, we've purchased that. So from a strictly business perspective, you know, we have access to their sort of IP in that sense and we deliver that. But I think for us, the IP is the destination. It's so unique, it's so big that it becomes defendable at scale. So it does sound like a bit of an all-in poker hand. But it would be more risky to go half in because these things are very hard to build. But when they are built, they're also very hard to compete with. So as long as your customer experience is good enough. You're going to maintain a kind of exclusivity in your locality for long into the future. So, yeah, there's obviously IP issues in terms of technologies. But for us, it was all about creating a destination with three business plans that's greater than the sum of its parts. And if we can do that in our location, then it's very hard to compete against, I would say.Paul Marden: Andy, it sounds like such an exciting journey that you've been on. And one year in, that journey has still got a long way to play out, doesn't it? You must be on quite the rollercoaster. Well, surfing quite a wave at the moment, if I don't mix my metaphors so badly.Andy Hadden: Yeah, we're just entering maybe the penultimate phase of the sort of 20-year plan. You know, we've gone through our early stages, our fundraising, our construction. We've gone through the very hard sort of like getting the team together and opening year one. And we're just starting to go, 'OK, we understand we've got data now'. We understand how to run this place now. So I think we now want to push through to stabilise the next two or three years. And then hopefully we've got a lot of irons in the fire globally as well. Hopefully we can go to the next phase, but we'll see what happens. Worst case scenario, I just surf a bit more and try and enjoy my lot.Paul Marden: Well, Andy, it's been lovely talking to you. I've been really interested to hear what you've been up to. This was only a short snippet of an interview. I reckon there's some more stories for you to tell once you're into year two. So I'd love for you to come back and we'll do a full-on interview once you've got year two under your belt. How's that sound to you?Andy Hadden: Absolutely, Paul, and thanks very much for the platform.Paul Marden: Next up, let's hear from some of the exhibitors on the floor. Bakit.Paul Marden: Introduce yourself for me, please, and tell me a little bit about where you're from.Bakit Baydaliev: We have two companies located in Turkey, Istanbul, and Los Angeles, USA. We develop attractions, equipment, but not just equipment— also software, AI, and content, games, and movies. Paul Marden: Oh, wow. So you're here at IAPA. This is my very first morning of my very first IAAPA. So it's all very overwhelming for me. Tell me, what is it that you're launching at IAAPA today?Bakit Baydaliev: Today we're launching our bestseller, Hurricane. It's a coaster simulator. In addition to that, we're also launching a special immersive tunnel, Mars Odyssey. We're sending people to Mars, we're sending people to space, and the story, of course, may change. After you install the attractions, you always can create different kinds of content for this attraction. It's completely immersive and what is very unique for this attraction is edutainment. Theme parks, science centres, space centres, and museums all benefit from it. It's not just to show and entertain, but also educate and provide a lot of useful information for people. Paul Marden: So what would you say is unique about this? Bakit Baydaliev: There are several factors. First of all, it's equipment. We have a very special software that amazingly synchronizes with the content and it doesn't create motion sickness at all. Paul Marden: Oh, really? Bakit Baydaliev: This is very important. Independently on the speeds, which is... We have very high speeds in our simulators. In addition to that, we have special effects, unusual effects, which feel like cold, heat, sounds.Paul Marden: So it is truly 4D, isn't it?Bakit Baydaliev: Completely. In addition to that, it's interactive content. It's not just the content which you can sit and... watch and entertain yourself and get a lot of useful information, but also you can interact. You can play games, you can shoot, you can interact. And of course, the most important thing which makes this attraction innovative is the educational aspect.Paul Marden: I find that really interesting that you could see this ride at a theme park, but similarly you can see it as an educational exhibit at a science centre or space centre. I think that's very interesting.Bakit Baydaliev: Very, very. Especially, you know, the standard experience for space centres, science centres, and especially museums, it's just walking around, touch some stuff. Some you may not even touch it. It's exponents which you can watch, you can read, it's very nice. But it's even better when you let people live it in real with a nice simulation atmosphere environment, like immersive tunnel.Paul Marden: Absolutely. Bekit, thank you so much for joining us on Skip the Queue, and I look forward to enjoying one of the rides.Bakit Baydaliev: Please ride, and you will be amazed.Hamza Saber: My name is Hamza. I work for TÜV SUD Germany. Our main job is to make sure attractions are safe, parks are safe. We do everything from design review to initial examination of rides, to yearly checks and making sure that we push the standards and the norm to the next level and cover everything that comes in new in the industry as well to make sure this industry stays safe and enjoyable for people. Paul Marden: It's so important though, isn't it? At an event like this, you don't have a sexy stand with lots of really cool rides to experience, but what you do is super important.Hamza Saber: Yes, I guess it's not one of the big colourful booths, but it's at the heart of this industry. It's in the background. If you look at the program for the education, there is a lot of safety talks. There is a lot of small groups talking about safety, trying to harmonise norms as well. Because if you look at the world right now, we have the EN standards. We have the American standards and we're working right now to try to bring them closer together so it's as easy and safe and clear for all manufacturers and operators to understand what they need to do to make sure that their guests are safe at the end of the day.Paul Marden: So Hamza, there's some really cool tech that you've got on the stand that's something new that you've brought to the stand today. So tell us a little bit about that.Hamza Saber: So as you can see, we have one of the drones right here and the video behind you. So we're trying to include new technologies to make it easier, faster, and more reliable to do checks on big structures like this or those massive buildings that you usually see. You can get really, really close with the new technologies, the drones with the 4K cameras, you can get very, very precise. We're also working on AI to train it to start getting the first round of inspections done using AI. And just our expert to focus on the most important and critical aspects. So we're just going to make it faster, more reliable.Paul Marden: So I guess if you've got the drone, that means you don't have to walk the entire ride and expect it by eye?Hamza Saber: No, we still have to climb. So what we do is more preventive using the drones. So the drones, especially with the operators, they can start using them. And if they notice something that does not fit there, we can go and look at it. But the actual yearly inspections that are accepted by the governments, you still need to climb, you still need to check it yourself. So the technology is not right there yet, but hopefully we're going to get there. Paul Marden: We're a long way away from the robots coming and taking the safety engineer's job then. Hamza Saber: Yes, exactly. And they don't think they're going to come take our jobs anytime soon. Using technology hands-in-hands with our expertise, that's the future.Paul Marden: It must be so exciting for you guys because you have to get involved in all of these projects. So you get to see the absolute tippy top trends as they're coming towards you.Hamza Saber: Yeah, for sure. Like we're always three years before the public knowledge. So it's exciting to be behind the scene a little bit and knowing what's going on. We're seeing some really fun and creative ideas using AI to push the attractions industry to the next level. So I'm excited to see any new rides that will be published or announced at some point this week.Paul Marden: Very cool. Look, Hamza, it's been lovely to meet you. Thanks for coming on Skip the Queue.Hamza Saber: Yeah, thank you so much.Kristof Van Hove: My name is Kristof. I live in Belgium. I'm working for the Tomorrowland group already now for three years, especially on the leisure part.Paul Marden: Tell listeners a little bit about Tomorrowland because many of our listeners are attraction owners and operators. They may not be familiar with Tomorrowland.Kristof Van Hove: Yeah, so Tomorrowland is already 20 years, I think, one of the number one festivals in the world. Actually, already for the last years, always the number one in the world. And what makes us special is that we are not just a festival, but we are a community. We create. special occasions for people and it starts from the moment that they buy their tickets till the festival we make a special feeling that people like and I think we create a world and each year we work very hard on new team that goes very deep so not only making a festival but we go very deep in our branding not only with our main stage but we also make a book about it we make gadgets about it so it's a completely.Paul Marden:  Wow. Help listeners to understand what it is that you're doing new here at the moment. You're blending that festival experience, aren't you, into attractions.Kristof Van Hove: Yeah, that's right. So because we are already 20 years on the market building IP, the more and more we really are able to create a complete experience, not only the IP as a brand, but also all the things around it. We have our own furniture. We have our own plates. We create actually all elements that are needed to build a leisure industry project. And that makes it magnificent. I think we are capable now, with everything that we do in-house, to set up and to facilitate water park and attraction park projects completely. Paul Marden: So, have you got any attractions that are open at the moment? Kristof Van Hove: Well, we have the Ride to Happiness, of course, the coaster that is built in Plopsaland three years ago. That is already now for five years the number one steel coaster in Europe and the fifth steel coaster in the world. So this is a project we are very proud of. Besides that, we have already a lot of immersive experiences. And we are constructing now a secret project that will be announced in the beginning of next year somewhere in Europe.Paul Marden: Give us a little sneak peek what that might look like.Kristof Van Hove: It's not that far from here. Okay, okay, excellent. So it's more an outdoor day project that we are constructing. That for sure will be something unique. Excellent.Paul Marden: So look, you're already planning into 2026. Help listeners to understand what the future might look like. What trends are you seeing in the sector for next year?Kristof Van Hove: Well, I think more and more the people expect that they get completely a deep dive into branding. I don't think that people still want to go to non-IP branded areas. They want to have the complete package from the moment that they enter. They want to be immersed. With everything around it, and they want a kind of a surrounding, and they want to have the feeling that they are a bit out of their normal life, and a deep dive in a new environment. And I think this is something that we try to accomplish. Paul Marden: Wow.David Jungmann: David Jungman, I'm the Director of Business Development here at Accesso, based in Germany. I'm super excited to be here at IAPA in Barcelona. We're exhibiting our whole range of solutions from ticketing to point of sale to virtual queuing to mobile apps. And one of the features we're calling out today is our Accesso Pay 3.0 checkout flow, which streamlines donations, ticket insurance, relevant payment types by region on a single simple one-click checkout page.Paul Marden: What impact does that have on customers when they're presented with that simple one-click checkout?David Jungmann: Well, as you guys know, conversion rate is super important. The number of clicks in an e-commerce environment is super important. And because we're at IAAPA Europe, we've got guests here from all over Europe. Different regions require different payment types. And it's important to not overload a checkout page with like eight different types for, let's say, German guests, Dutch guests, Belgium guests, is to be able to only offer what's relevant and to keep it short and sweet. And then rolling in additional features like donations, ticket insurance and gift cards, stuff like that.Paul Marden: Amazing. So get your crystal ball out and think about what the world in 2026 is going to be like.David Jungmann: I think this year was a little bit soft in terms of performance for the parks, certainly in Europe, what we've seen. I think what that will mean is that maybe some will consider, you know, really big capex investments. But what that also means is they will get creative. So I envision a world where, instead of buying new protocols for 20 million, maybe some operators will start thinking about how can we make more out of what we've got with less, right? How can we be really creative? And I think there's a lot to uncover next year for us to see.Paul Marden:  Sweating their assets maybe to be able to extend what they do without that big CapEx project.David Jungmann:  Yes, how can we keep innovating? How can we keep our experience fresh? Without just buying something very expensive straight away. And I think that's what we see.Paul Marden: What is going to be innovating for Xesso and the market that you serve?David Jungmann: Well, for us, it's really about that streamlined, consistent guest experience, but also tying into things like immersive experiences, right, where you could maybe change the overlay of an attraction and feed in personalised information that you have for your visitors and collect it during you know the booking flow when they enter the venue and feeding that into the actual experience i think that's something i'm excited about.Paul Marden: I think that there is a missed opportunity by so many attractions. There's so much data that we build and we collect the data, but oftentimes we don't bring it together into a central place and then figure out the ways in which we want to use it. There's so much more you can do with that rich data, isn't there?David Jungmann: 100% exactly. And I don't just mean from a marketing perspective. I mean from an actual experience perspective. Let's say you ride through Dark Ride and all of a sudden your name pops up or your favorite character pops up and waves hello to you. That's the type of stuff you want to do, not just market the hell out of it.Paul Marden: Absolutely. Look, David, it's been so good to meet you. Thank you ever so much. And yeah, thank you for joining Skip the Queue. David Jungmann: Thanks, Paul. Have a great day at the show. Paul Marden: Isn't it great? I mean, we have got such an amazing job, haven't we? To be able to come to a place like this and be able to call this work.David Jungmann: Absolute privilege. Yes, absolutely.Paul Marden: Now, before we wrap up, Andy and I wanted to have a little chat about what we've seen today and what we've enjoyed. Why don't we sit down? You have clearly returned to your tribe. Is there a person in this place that doesn't actually know you?Andy Povey: There's loads. I've been doing the same thing for 30 years. Paul Marden: Yeah, this ain't your first radio, is it? Andy Povey: I'm big and I'm loud, so I'd stand out in a crowd. I mean, there are all fantastic things that I should put on my CV. But this is really where I feel at home. This industry continues to blow me away. We're here, we're talking to competitors, we're talking to potential customers, we're talking to previous customers, we're talking to people that we've worked with, and it's just all so friendly and so personally connected. I love it.Paul Marden: It has been awesome. I've really enjoyed it. Although I'm beginning to get into the Barry White territory of my voice because it's quite loud on the show floor, isn't it? Andy Povey: It is. It's actually quieter than previous shows, so I don't know why, and I don't know whether... Maybe I'm just getting old and my hearing's not working quite so well, but... You used to walk out of the show and you could almost feel your ears relax as they just stopped hearing and being assaulted, I suppose, by machines pinging and blowing.Paul Marden: It really is an assault on the senses, but in the very best way possible. Andy Povey: Absolutely, absolutely. I feel like a child. You're walking around the show, you're going, 'Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow.' Paul Marden: So what has been your highlight? Andy Povey: Do you know, I don't think I could give you one. It really is all of the conversations, the connections, the people you didn't know that you hadn't spoken to for two years.Paul Marden: So for me, my highlight, there was a ride that I went on, Doff Robotics.Andy Povey: I've seen that, man.Paul Marden: So it was amazing. I thought I was going to be feeling really, really sick and that I wouldn't enjoy it, but it was amazing. So I had Emily with the camera in front of me. And within 10 seconds, I forgot that I was being recorded and that she was there. I was completely immersed in it. And I came off it afterwards feeling no motion sickness at all and just having had a real good giggle all the way through. I was grinning like, you know, the Cheshire Cat. Andy Povey: A grinning thing. Paul Marden: Yeah. So, tomorrow, what are you looking forward to?Andy Povey:  It's more of the same. It really is. There's going to be some sore heads after tonight's party at Tribodabo. We're all hoping the rain holds off long enough for it to be a great experience. But more of the same.Paul Marden: Well, let's meet back again tomorrow, shall we? Andy Povey: Completely. Paul Marden: Let's make a date.Paul Marden: Thanks for listening to today's episode from IAAPA Expo Europe. As always, if you've loved today's episode, like it and comment in your podcast app. If you didn't like it, let us know at hello@skipthequeue.fm. Show notes and links can also be found on our website, skipthequeue.fm. Thanks to our amazing team, Emily Burrows and Sami Entwistle from Plaster Creative Communications, Steve Folland from Folland Co., and our amazing podcast producer, Wenalyn Dionaldo. Come back again tomorrow for more show news. The 2025 Visitor Attraction Website Survey is now LIVE! Dive into groundbreaking benchmarks for the industryGain a better understanding of how to achieve the highest conversion ratesExplore the "why" behind visitor attraction site performanceLearn the impact of website optimisation and visitor engagement on conversion ratesUncover key steps to enhance user experience for greater conversionsTake the Rubber Cheese Visitor Attraction Website Survey Report

The old saying is “people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but they will never forget how you made them feel.” So when the time comes to design your office and build your brand, it's important to consider more than just your color scheme and furniture. You need a deep understanding of your customers and employees, how they will use the space, and what story you're telling them. And that's where the practice of experiential design comes into play. In this episode, we're speaking with Alicia Orlando, the director of experiential design at MA Design. With a background spanning advertising, marketing, and environmental graphics, she has worked with clients like Bed Bath & Beyond, the University of Georgia, and White Castle. She focuses on creating designs that resonate on a human level by crafting thoughtful, purposeful environments that inspire and leave lasting emotional connections. Together, we'll discuss things like: How is experiential design different from regular office design? How can small business owners utilize experiential design to create a strong first impression on customers? Why is the atmosphere of an office space crucial for employee morale and productivity? How can small business owners enhance their office's welcoming energy on a budget? What are some measurable impacts that small business owners can look for after implementing experiential design? Are you ready to take control of your future and start building your legacy? Visit getprovide.com. Provide is a division of Fifth Third Bank, National Association. All opinions expressed by the participant are solely their current opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Provide, its affiliates, or Fifth Third Bank. The participant's opinions are based on information they consider reliable, but neither Provide, its affiliates nor Fifth Third Bank warrant its completeness or accuracy and should not be relied upon as such. This content is for informational purposes and does not constitute the rendering of legal, accounting, tax, or investment advice, or other professional services by Provide or any of its affiliates. Please consult with appropriate professionals related to your individual circumstances. All lending is subject to review and approval.

Pauline is joined by two experts in experiential design: Ann Morrow Johnson, former Head of Creative Development for Walt Disney Imagineering, and Emilie Baltz, an award-winning artist and digitial design leader, both from the world's largest design firm, Gensler.Together, they discuss how human senses and emotions are impacted by space design and how businesses can leverage their own spaces to create immersive customer experiences and convey rich and memorable stories.

Curious how design can make a space unforgettable? Kelly Straka, founder of Lux Living, talks about her journey from rearranging her childhood bedroom to creating a successful staging and design business. Known for crafting spaces that resonate on a personal level, Kelly shares her approach to blending creativity with practical strategies that help her spaces stand out.Kelly dives into the ups and downs of starting a staging business, explaining how personal touches can make a property memorable for clients and buyers. She gives straightforward tips on creating unique Airbnb experiences that draw in guests and talks about the importance of knowing when to pivot in business and using storytelling to make properties shine.Kelly's insights on staging, home-flipping, and storytelling offer practical ideas for making properties truly memorable. Whether you're a designer or business owner, her journey provides a fresh look at creating spaces that connect with people and make a lasting impression.On The Underdog Podcast, Kelly's journey offers practical ideas for business owners, designers, and anyone in real estate looking to create spaces with impact.Key Takeaways:Real Estate Investment and Entrepreneurship: Kelly's first experience managing student housing sparked her journey into property investment and real estate.Challenges and Growth in Entrepreneurship: Kelly talks about knowing when to pivot, showing the importance of adaptability in business.Storytelling and Connection through Design: Kelly's designs aim to create emotional connections, making each space not just beautiful but meaningful.Her journey exemplifies the value of adaptability and innovation in the real estate and design industries, reminding us of the potential to create spaces that are not only functional but emotionally resonant.Listen to this exciting episode. Join us for the conversation! Listen to the full episode here:Apple iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/underdog/id1534385651Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6FbSDu0aNtuxAEiderUAfBWebsite: https://theunderdogshow.comIf you found this story worth your time and made changes in your life, we'd love to hear from you! Subscribe and leave a review ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐Follow and connect with Kelly Straka:Lux Living: https://lux-living.com/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kellystraka/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellystrakaThe Underdog Podcast host is none other than Pamela Bardhi. She's rocking the Real Estate Realm and has dedicated her life as a Life Coach. She is also in the Forbes Real Estate Council. To know more about Pam, check out the following:Website: https://pamelabardhi.comInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/pamela_bardhiTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@pamela_bardhiYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@elevatethroughrealestate

Today, I have the pleasure of introducing you to a client and a very talented Interior Designer, Marcus Syvertsen.   Marcus is the founder and principal designer of Little Road, Adelaide's leading interior practice for residential, commercial and hospitality spaces.   A once-trained Paramedic, Marcus changed his direction to pursue his first love of creativity and design in the Interior Design industry where he and his team, capture the beauty of the everyday.   In today's episode, Marcus shares his journey of a career transition from Paramedic to owning a design business and running a brick-and-mortar store, his unique approach to experiential design, his challenges with mental health, the importance of community, and creating a positive work culture.   As well as the power of collaboration and working with key people to help you elevate your business, setting solid foundations and having someone in your corner each step of the way.    Where you can find and connect with Marcus Syvertson:  Website: littleroad.com.au Instagram: @littleroad.studio   __________    Going it alone will only get you so far. If you're feeling overwhelmed and don't know whether to grow your business or scale it back, you've outgrown your brand, struggling with your process, finances, pricing, sales and how and when to hire, I'd love to connect and support you. Together, we will refine your business to support you, the woman behind the brand. It's time to Flourish

ILM Immersive & Marvel Studios is releasing What If...?: An Immersive Story exclusively on Apple Vision Pro tomorrow, and I had a chance to take an early look and speak with producer and executive producer Shereif Fattouh as well as technical art director Indira Guerrieri about the process of creating this experience. It's mostly an immersive story with light interactions, but you can't actually die and so it's more about immersing yourself into these worlds with first-person embodiment and exploring around 10 different gesture-based interactions in nearly 50 different interactive moments across the 40 to 45-minute experience. There's also some disembodied moments where you're watching 3D movie cinematics on shards of glass floating in the environment, and so they're also really leaning into how good 3D movies look on the Apple Vision Pro within this experience. Overall, it's blending lots of elements together that feels like something new and a new genre of immersive storytelling that's building upon existing IP, and giving new opportunities to engage with these character's stories as well as their worlds. This is also the first Unreal Engine experience releasing on the Apple Vision Pro store, and so Fattouh told me that ILM Immersive has been making private modifications to get things working. There are features like mixed reality passthrough that are not available yet in Unreal Engine 5.4 yet. Agile Lens' Alex Coulombe told me, "The Epic Games XR team is small so I would I err on the side of assuming no major Vision Pro updates coming soon from Epic. To have the current features working it still requires a source build of Unreal Engine 5.4 (the Epic Games Launcher doesn't work) and current features include fully immersive mode, hand tracking / gesture recognition, forward and deferred rendering." So hopefully we'll get more on this soon from Epic Games, but at least we know it's possible and we'll start to see more Unreal Engine experiences on the Apple Vision Pro soon. Be sure to check out the transcript below for more information, and also don't miss my episode featuring my talk on an Elemental Theory of Presence, Experiential Design, and Immersive Storytelling, as well as my previous 480+ episodes on the topic of immersive storytelling over the past decade including previous coverage on Cycles, Myth: A Frozen Tale, Star Wars: Tales from the Galaxy's Edge, and a conversation with John Gaeta about ILMxLab's The Holo-Cinema from Sundance New Frontier 2016. This is a listener-supported podcast through the Voices of VR Patreon. Music: Fatality

In the fifth show of series five of DESIGN POD, sponsored by EquipHotel, Hotel Designs Editor Sophie Harper catches up with Partner and Principal at Conran and Partners, Tina Norden, about the logistics of working on global projects and creating experiential hospitality design that appeals to tourists and locals alike. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

What is happening behind the scenes when sex/intimacy happens in film, television and porn? What us an "intimacy coordinator" and why do they play a pivotal roll in the on-set production? How do intimacy coordinators choreograph a scene, awnd hat makes CINTIMA's training important and unique? How does watching a show with intimate plots deepen a couple's relationship, and how does the quality of the content for intimate scenes - as well as what is happening behind the scenes - affect the consumer? And how can someone become an "intimacy coordinator"? Is it just a career move or can it change an individual's everyday life? About our guests: Jimanekia (she/her) is a Queer Media Consultant, Comprehensive Sex Educator, and Sexual Assault & Trauma Expert. She is the host of Trauma Queen - a podcast mini-series for survivors of assault and our allies. She is also the Founder of Tending The Garden, a nonprofit for sexual assault survivors that have been marginalized. Her work as a sex educator has been featured in Playboy, Cosmo, Nylon and MANY more. Jimanekia has worked with Intimacy Coordinators in creating content and teaching since 2021, and became one of the co-owners and co-founders of CINTIMA in 2023. Yehuda Duenyas (he/they) is a transdisciplinary artist creating at the intersections of Intimacy Coordination, Experiential Design, Performance, Film, and Sound. Proudly representing the LGBTQIA+ community, Yehuda brings an authentic and personal voice to their role. As a SAG-AFTRA accredited Intimacy Coordination trainer, Yehuda co-runs CINTIMA.CO, a pioneering training program tailored for marginalized identities entering the field. Notable Film & TV credits include projects such as "MONSTER: The Jeffrey Dahmer Story" (Ryan Murphy/NETFLIX), "Westworld Season 4" (HBO), "The Afterparty Season 2" (SONY/APPLE TV), and "American Gigolo" (Paramount+/Showtime). Intimacy for Performance credits include Faye Driscoll's Weathering (NY Live Arts; The Blackwood, Toronto), The Beautiful People (Rogue Machine, LA), and Tom Bradshaw's Fulfillment (The Flea, NYC; ATC, Chicago). Jaclyn Chantel (she/her) is Co-Founder at CINTIMA: Cinematic Intimacy Artists. She is a true multi-hyphenate and has been working in the entertainment industry for over 10 years. After earning her BFA in Acting from the University of Cincinnati's College-Conservatory of Music, she has worked in production, directing, casting, and acting. This body of work inspired Jaclyn to begin her work as an Intimacy Coordinator, filling her toolbox with experiences and skills from which to draw as she approaches this important work with actors. Using Alexander Technique, Alba Emoting, Viewpoints, and Labon, Jaclyn is a natural at fostering collaboration and personal agency in her work as an Intimacy Coordinator.  Want to become an Intimacy Coordinator? Go to https://www.cintima.co and use code SHAMELESS10 for 10% off! PORTLAND, CHICAGO, SEATTLE! Come see our LIVE Shameless Sex Unleashed sexy variety show! Get your tickets here ASAP: https://www.shamelesssex.com/events Do you love us? Do you REALLY love us? Then order our book now! Go to shamelesssex.com to snag your copy Support Shameless Sex by sending us gifts via our Amazon Wish List Other links: Get 10% off + free shipping with code SHAMELESS10 on Uberlube AKA our favorite lubricant at http://uberlube.com Get 10% off while mastering the art of pleasure at  http://OMGyes.com/shameless Get 15% off all of your sex toys with code SHAMELESSSEX at http://purepleasureshop.com

One of the most common ways to describe the experience of VR is through the lens of presence, and in this episode I'm going to do a deep dive into the existing academic literature of presence in order to more fully contextualize my approach to it. This is my Storycon 2022 keynote where I elaborate on my elemental approach to presence as well as my thoughts on experiential design and immersive storytelling. I use the four archetypal elements to break down presence into four primary components where fire represents active presence, air represents mental and social presence, water represents emotional presence, and earth represents embodied and environmental presence. And I use the lens of quality, context, character, and story to explore the fundamental components of experiential design. I started to develop my approach to presence through a number of Voices of VR podcast interviews in the fall and winter of 2016, and I was then introduced to the work of Dustin Chertoff, whose presence work from 2008-2010 draws upon the field of experiential marketing. He similarly boils presence down into the components of Active Presence, Cognitive Presence, Relational Presence, Affective Presence, and Sensory Presence. When I interviewed Chertoff in February 2017, we agreed that our approaches to presence were functionally identical. I then went on to present my preliminary ideas on presence at a Silicon Valley Virtual Reality conference keynote in March 2017, and I've continued to develop these ideas over the past 5-7 years. I gave this Storycon Keynote on May 5, 2022, which happened to be the 8th-year anniversary of the Voices of VR podcast. Now two years later, I'm celebrating my 10-year Voices of VR podcast anniversary in part by airing this talk as well as a few others. I consistently refer folks to it as one of my more fully-formed and rigorous elaborations that I've given of my elemental theory of presence. I not only contextualize it with Chertoff's work, but also with the broader body of academic presence research and it's history. I would often find there were would be different presence theories talking about some of the same concepts, but using different terminology. In this talk, I take an archetypal approach that synthesizes these different frameworks through an archetypal lens. At times it can be a bit laborious reciting an archetypal complex of keywords, and there are definitely sections of this talk that are probably better off read than spoken. So I'd highly recommend also checking out the video version as well as the PDF of the slides, and/or the fully-annotated transcript in the shownotes that includes the embedded slides and linked citations. That all being said, be warned that this is still probably way too dense for an hour-long talk, as it's more like an entire semester's worth of material. It's also probably closer to a Ph.D. defense than a synthesized book or practical handbook that's ready for prime time. As with many other aspects of XR, many theoretical aspects are still developing, emerging, boundaries being pushed, and rules being broken. So it's in that spirit that this is my latest fully-formed iteration of these ideas. This talk also leans more into the theoretical parts, and some of the more practical applications often come within the context of individual interviews where the context is a lot more bounded to a specific situation, experience, or story. Be sure to check out my 30+ hours of coverage from Venice 2023 as an example for how I've put these ideas into practice. It's been through many invited lectures and keynotes around the world where I've been able to develop these ideas by engaging with audiences and interviewing thousands of creators over the past decade. At some point, I'm still hoping to go through a more formal write-up of these ideas to give them even more rigor, and perhaps potentially even go through a more formalized peer-review process. But as of now,

I interviewed The Golden Key co-directors Matthew Niederhauser & Marc Da Costa remotely during SXSW XR Experience 2024. See more context in the rough transcript below. Here is all of my coverage of projects in and around SXSW XR Experience 2024: #1360: Sneak Peak of SXSW XR Experience Projects, Events, & Lounges with Programmer Blake Kammerdiener #1362: “The Tent” Tabletop AR Mixes Photogrammetry, Volumetric Capture, & Theatre in Modern-Day Fairytale about Unhoused Crisis #1363: DIY 360 Video for Perspective-Taking and Investigating Murder of Trans Woman in “Her Name Was Gisberta” #1364: Step into the Movies with “The Vortex Cinema” Blending Cinematic Storytelling, Gaming, & Escape Room Mechanics #1365: “We Speak Their Names in Hushed Tones” Explores Impact of Migration on Families Left Behind in Poetic Immersive Still Life & Audio Documentary #1366: Electric South's Ingrid Kopp on Increasing Access to Immersive Production Resources to African XR Creators + Tribeca 2019 Program #1367: “Escape to Shanghai” Immersive Doc Tells the Story of Jewish Refugees who Fled to China to Escape the Holocaust #1368: “Walk to Westerbork” Immersive Doc Shares Remarkable Story about a Dutch Jewish Holocaust Survivor Who Defied the Odds #1369: Interactive UN Doc “Dreaming of Lebanon” Blends Interactive Oral History, 360 Video, and Speculative Worldbuilding #1370: “Madame Pirate: Code of Conduct” Blends Spatial Representations to Tell the Story of Most Powerful Pirate in History #1371: “Pirate Queen: The Forgotten Legend” Fuses Escape Room Mechanics with Environmental Storytelling & Embodied Gameplay #1372: “Last We Left Off” 360 Video Plays Switches Between D&D Imaginal Realms with Physical Reality, & Exhibiting with Apple Vision Pro #1373: Interactive Biopic Doc on Opera Singer “Joseph Rouleau: Final Encore” that Mixes Modalities #1374: Telling Stories of Indigenous Leaders with OurWorlds.io's “Chief” on Apple Vision Pro #1375: Unique 2D Hand-Drawn Animation Technique with “Tadpole” Leads to a Provocative Immersive Story #1376: Indie Musician Roman Rappak's Annual Mixed Reality Performance Experiments & Expansion into “Detachment” Immersive Story #1377: Immersive Producer Katayoun Dibamehr's Journey to Becoming an Award-Winning Producer at Floréal #1378: Anagram's Mental Health Series Continues with Preview of “Impulse” Mixed Reality Story about ADHD #1379: “Maya: The Birth of a Superhero” Evolves Storytelling Grammar with Magical Realism, Dream Logic, & Interactive Embodiment #1380: “Reimagined Volume III: Young Thang” Adapts a Nigerian Folktale while Refining the Grammar of Spatial Storytelling #1381: “Soul Paint” Wins SXSW Special Jury Prize for Innovative Body Mapping Technique to Spatially Draw Your Emotions #1382: Interactive Generative AI Storytelling Installation “The Golden Key” Wins Top Prize at SXSW Leveraging Archetypal Folklore Motifs PREVIOUSLY COVERED PROJECTS [PART 1 from Tribeca Immersive 2023 – Part 1 + Part 2 debuts at SXSW] #1244: “Maya: The Birth” Animation Uses Mythic Symbols & Magical Realism to Explore Menstrual Taboos [from Venice Immersive 2023] #1272: Kickoff of Venice Immersive 2023 Coverage with Winner “Songs by a Passerby” and Atmospheric Storytelling [from Venice Immersive 2023] #1276: Beautiful “Emperor” Explores Aphasia Communication Gaps with Compelling Interactions [from Venice Immersive 2023] #1287: “Letters from Drancy” is an Incredibly Emotional and Powerful Story About the Holocaust [from Venice Immersive 2023] #1292: Pioneering the VR Essay with “Shadowtime” Critiquing Sci-Fi Dystopic Aspirations of VR [from Venice Immersive 2023] #1293: The Personalized AI-Driven “Tulpamancer” VR Sandpaintings with AI Text to Audio & VR Workflow [from Venice Immersive 2023] #1303: A Deep Dive into Breaking Down the Experiential Design of “The Imaginary Friend” [from DocLab 2023] #1331: Recreating Spatial Presence in Caves ...

Our guest this episode is Prof Gail Brager of UC Berkeley talking about built environmental design, the Center for the Built Environment and her new book, Experiential Design Schemas If you enjoy this episode, share it with friends and give us a review, it helps more than you know. In this episode, we discuss: Enhancing […]

Our guest this episode is Prof Gail Brager of UC Berkeley talking about built environmental design, the Center for the Built Environment and her new book, Experiential Design Schemas If you enjoy this episode, share it with friends and give us a review, it helps more than you know. In this episode, we discuss: Enhancing positives rather than reducing negatives Open source problem solving “T” shaped people Re-framing the climate crisis And much more……. More on Gail: On LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gail-brager/ Berkeley College of Environmental Design: https://ced.berkeley.edu/people/gail-brager Center for the Built Environment: https://cbe.berkeley.edu/ Get the Book here: https://www.amazon.com/Experiential-Design-Schemas-Mark-DeKay/dp/195718373X Bio Gail S. Brager, PhD, is Professor of Architecture at UC Berkeley. Gail is CBE's Associate Director, and leads research efforts in mixed-mode buildings, which combine natural and mechanical ventilation. Gail also leads CBE's research into dynamic comfort and worker performance in alternative office environments. Gail received PhD and MS degrees in Mechanical Engineering from UC Berkeley, and a B.S. in Mechanical and Environmental Engineering from UC Santa Barbara. Other research interests include thermal comfort and adaptive mechanisms, task/ambient conditioning systems, climate-responsive building design, and curriculum materials development. Prof. Brager currently serves as the Chair of the US Green Building Council's Research Committee. She is also an active member of ASHRAE, serving as Past-President of the S.F. Bay Area Golden Gate Chapter, and Past-Chair of TC 2.1 (Physiology and Human Comfort). She is also a member of ASES and SBSE.

Our guest today, Jill Shah, Production Designer at Future Colossal, shares how she capitalizes on her abilities as a generalist, asserts herself to create opportunities, and harnesses the power of storytelling in design.Highlights:Leverage spatial design skills from architecture in experience design by focusing on technology integration and storytelling instead of just function.As a generalist, talk confidently about your broad skillset and give examples of how you've tackled challenging, multidisciplinary projects.Be assertive in asking for opportunities to expand your role and prove yourself; people appreciate self-starters.Storytelling is key in experience design - use lighting, sound, sequence etc. to evoke emotions.Documentation is critical but often neglected - market your work by taking time to create a "package" about each project.Guest Bio: Jill is a New York-based experiential artist and creative technologist who leverages algorithms to (new)ance our physical environments. Driven by her passion for more humanized nuances in an increasingly mechanized world, her work allows users to touch, feel and ponder over the role that algorithms and technological advancements can play in pushing ‘craft' to newer boundaries.Jill received her MFA in Design and Technology from Parsons School of Design and since then has served as an Experiential Production Designer at Future Colossal, an award-winning innovation lab that designs and executes memorable interactive spaces. Motivated by the belief that skills and knowledge must be accessible, she is also a passionate educator who has taught design classes and facilitated several technical workshops at the New School.https://jillshahh.com/ ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Crafting unforgettable trade show experiences is both an art and science, and incorporating themes, experiential design, and storytelling is essential for engaging attendees. But, many brands struggle to make their booths stand out, often missing the mark on creating memorable interactions.That's why Matt Kleinrock and Mollie Stahl, Senior Account Executive at Rockway Exhibits + Events, team up again to offer unique insights and strategies for developing trade show experiences that are not just seen but REMEMBERED.By the end of the episode, you will learn:✅ How to design trade show booths that tell a story and engage attendees on multiple levels.✅ The importance of aligning booth design with brand narrative to create a cohesive and impactful experience.✅ Creative strategies for making your trade show presence memorable and effective in driving brand engagement.Tune in to transform your trade show strategy and presence from dull to dynamic!Connect with Mollie:On her LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/molliestahl/    Connect with Me:On my LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-kleinrock-9613b22b/  On my Company: https://rockwayexhibits.com/ 

>>> Watch our free Revenue Management training at https://www.getpaidforyourpad.com/cfm-replay>>> FREE E-Book: 5 Most Common Airbnb Revenue Management Mistakes>>> Click here to downloadIn today's episode of Get Paid for Your Pad, I had the pleasure to talk to Heather Loduca & Erin Donnelly, the founders of Pink Wall Designs, straight out of Canada. They are not only seasoned in interior design for short-term rentals and boutique hotels but also investors themselves, owning properties that stand as testaments to their expertise. The focus of our conversation revolved around the critical importance of interior design in the increasingly competitive Airbnb and short-term rental market. Design, as we explored, isn't just about aesthetics; it's crucial for marketing, creating memorable guest experiences, and ensuring your property stands out in a sea of options.Aaron and Heather shared insights on making properties Instagrammable, leveraging social media for direct bookings, and the significance of targeting your design to appeal to your ideal guest avatar. They emphasized the power of experiential design, suggesting features like selfie walls and thematic decor that resonate with your target audience and encourage social sharing. The conversation also delved into the strategic use of platforms like TikTok for market research and promotion, highlighting the platform's effectiveness in reaching potential guests quickly.Moreover, Aaron and Heather offered advice on collaborating with local businesses and influencers to enhance guest experiences and market your property more effectively. They underscored the importance of continually updating and refreshing your property's design to keep up with trends and guest expectations.For those interested in learning more about their work or seeking their services, Aaron and Heather can be found on Instagram at @PinkWallDesigns and TikTok under the same handle. They also have a website, Pink Wall Designs, Inc., for further information and contact details.This episode is a reminder that in the world of short-term rentals, creating an experience, not just a place to stay, is key to success. Designing with intention and focusing on the guest experience can set your property apart and ensure its success in the competitive market of 2024 and beyond. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This holiday we're celebrating our 25th episode of Zero to Start with a very special guest, Kent Bye, host of the Voices of VR podcast.Since May 2014, Kent has published over 1,300 Voices of VR podcast interviews featuring the pioneering artists, storytellers, and technologists driving the resurgence of virtual & augmented reality.Kent is an oral historian, experiential journalist, & philosopher, helping to define the patterns of immersive storytelling, experiential design, ethical frameworks, & the ultimate potential of XR. He travels the world to deliver in-depth coverage of the best from XR festivals, conferences and gatherings you can't find anywhere else. Check out the link to Kent's Patreon where you can support his groundbreaking work and gain access to the podcast's private Discord channel and more.  I've been a patron supporter of Voices of VR since 2021.How will you think about presence in 2024?Thanks for listening! Until next time, Peace on Earth! Goodwill to all.CONNECT WITH KENT:Voices of VR PodcastVoices of VR on PatreonKent on LinkedIn FEATURED LINKS:VIDEO: A Primer on Presence, Immersive Storytelling, & Experiential Design - Kent Bye's Storycon Keynote VIDEO: Sensemaking Frameworks for the Metaverse & XR EthicsVoices of VR  #1320:  Plans for VisionDevCamp, an Apple Vision Pro Hackathon after Q1 2024 LaunchMORE SOURCES:Place illusion and plausibility can lead to realistic behaviour in immersive virtual environments - Mel SlaterReality+  David ChalmersVIDEO: Top 20 Oculus Rift VR Experiences of 2013 - Cymatic BruceVIDEO: Descartes Meditation I - Of the things which may be brought into Doubt - Philosophy Vibe CONNECT WITH SICILIANA sicilianatrevino.com LinkedIn WHAT WE'RE PLAYING IN VRGorilla Tag - holiday update! Asgard's Wrath 2Black Pink a VR Encore - Meta Horizon Worlds (Dec. 26th)Wallace & Gromit in the Grand GetawayLiminal - Relax. Unwind. Engage. Explore.

Born in Laguna Beach, California, Maryellis Bunn, founder of the Museum of Ice Cream, was influenced by her artist mother, who shaped her creative mindset. Dubbed the Millennial Walt Disney, Bunn launched the original concept for the Museum of Ice Cream as a pop-up in New York in 2016, and has since transformed it into brick-and-mortar experiential spaces that invite people to slide into a pool made of biodegradable sprinkles or enjoy a cocktail at the pretty-in-pink bar. With standalone museums in New York, Chicago, Austin, and Singapore, Bunn continues to evolve the brand's mission to create spaces that inspire imagination and unite people around something “as simple and beautiful as ice cream,” she says,

Immersive environments pull from art while experimenting with technology. This balancing act brings design to the intersection of innovation and longevity. Staying mindful of all the elements involved lead to design choices that are impactful and integrated into a planet conscious approach. Welcome to the second season of Architecture 5 10 20! I'm your host, Guy Geier, Managing Partner of FXCollaborative Architects in New York. Guests from a wide range of backgrounds and experiences related to the built environment will come to share their thought leadership. Our conversations will start with understanding how they arrived at what they're doing now. More importantly, we will focus on discussing their vision for the future, looking out 5, 10, and 20 years. Today, we are joined by David Schwarz, creative leader and founding partner of HUSH. David integrates content, technology and physical spaces to create compelling experiences that cater to the spectrum of human senses and intuition. I look forward to discussing with David the multidisciplinary realm of immersive experiential design, and its opportunities and challenges, especially those pertaining to sustainability and the constantly changing landscape of technology. Listen as we discuss the balancing act of creativity, technology, and sustainability in experiential design. David shares how HUSH transforms client ideas into experiential spaces. We talk about developing sustainability storytelling to projects as we pursue thoughtful design. David's work integrates an artful combination of storytelling, data, visualization, and creative technologies to design experiences that inspire and inform. What sets David apart is not just his design prowess, but also his commitment to innovation and sustainability. David prioritizes low carbon materials and designs within energy budgets for the work he produces at HUSH.   Time stamps: [01:09] - David Schwarz explains how he entered the design field. [03:55] - What's the original thesis of HUSH? [05:54] - How does HUSH transform client ideas into experiential spaces? [08:48] - The balance between innovation and longevity. [10:35] - How does HUSH work with interior designers? PART 1 [13:20] - How does HUSH work with interior designers? PART 2 [15:13] - David talks about the art direction and the creative direction needed in design challenges. [17:03] - David explains the goal of adapting to and planning for technology as projects develop. PART 1 [19:38] - David explains the goal of adapting to and planning for technology as projects develop. PART 2 [22:12] - What is David excited about lately? [24:25] - David talks about tracking energy use in buildings and finding creative solutions for sustainable design. [26:36] - David recalls the sustainability storytelling added to projects when using thoughtful design. [29:24] - How does David approach sustainable projects with ESG goals? PART 1 [32:20] - How does David approach sustainable projects with ESG goals? PART 2 [33:50] - There are many roads that lead to the same outcome. [36:41] - “It does unlock something.” [38:51] - Thank you David for reminding us of design experiences that inspire and inform.   Links / Resources: Guy Geier Instagram | Twitter   David Schwarz HUSH

I interviewed The Imaginary Friend director Steye Hallema at Venice Immersive 2023 after passing along a recommendation to watch my Storycon keynote on Presence, Experiential Design, & Immersive Storytelling. We do a deep dive into applying some of these ideas around the different qualities of presence to his project. See more context in the rough transcript below. This is a listener-supported podcast through the Voices of VR Patreon. Music: Fatality

In this episode of Getting to Aha!, Darshan Mehta is joined by Xuan Xu, Managing Director of Xuan Xu Experiences.

Reimagined Vol II: Mahal is the second edition of the Reimagined VR series that premiered at Tribeca Immersive 2023 (see my interview about Volume I from Venice 2022). It's a Quill animation piece that has lots of stylized cinematography, deliberate environmental and character design, a personal story that's very well-told through the lens of mythology. The synopsis says, "Inspired by Philippine mythology, the story focuses on Apolaki, Mayari, Tala, and Hanan, the four immortal children of the recently passed creator god, Bathala. As each of these deities wrestle with the grief of losing Bathala, their all-powerful actions create ripples throughout the universe." I had a chance to catch up with the co-creators of the Reimagined series Michaela Ternasky-Holland (director of Volume II) and Julie Cavaliere (producer of Volume II) to unpack the experiential design process, their shared connections of grief, and innovations in visual and spatial storytelling. This is a listener-supported podcast through the Voices of VR Patreon. Music: Fatality

Join host Vandana as she interviews Maureen Carter, VP Design/UX, Digital Brands, Experiential Design at BET Networks, ( a subsidiary of Paramount). Maureen shares her fascinating journey from a family with deep artistic roots to becoming a trailblazer in the world of design. Her experiences in the music industry and digital advertising shaped her perspective on the ever-evolving landscape of design, technology, and creativity. Maureen's insights on the future of design, the impact of digital advancements, and the importance of staying connected to multiple industries are very insightful. This episode also gives valuable knowledge delving into the exciting possibilities of web 3.0, the metaverse, NFT and beyond.   

ABOUT MIRELLE PHILLIPS:Mirelle's LinkedIn Profile:linkedin.com/in/mirelle-phillips-52077b29Company Website:  https://www.studioelsewhere.co  BIO:Mirelle Phillips is the Founder and CEO of Studio Elsewhere, a design and technology company developing bio-experiential technology to promote behavioural, cognitive, and social health. Studio Elsewhere uses evidence-based and data-driven practices to develop virtual and physical interventions that promote brain health. We are pioneers of bio-experiential design - interactive, immersive environmental design using technology and physical design toward a healthier brain-body connection. Our embedded emerging technology solutions support the needs of healthcare professionals, researchers, patients and caregivers.​We use software and hardware development, emerging technology, immersive game design, and biophilic design to reimagine the experience of health, wellness, and care. ​Our model allows us to develop a first-of-its-kind technology and design practice that leads with compassion, imagination, and inclusivity.Studio Elsewhere was selected to represent the first ever New York City pavilion at the 2021 London Design Biennale and selected to design the United Nations Pavilion for the World Expo 2021. As a Latina Founder and innovator, Phillips is a passionate advocate for women in colour in STEM. She is a graduate of Dartmouth College and previously led Experiential Design in the video game industry.SHOW INTRO:Welcome to the NXTLVL Experience Design podcast. Over our 4 seasons we have focused on “Dialogues on DATA: Design Architecture, Technology and the Arts”. NXTLVL features provocateurs for whom disruption and transformation are a way of engaging in work and play every day.They include leading scientists, artists, musicians, architects, entertainers and story tellers whose research, exploration and built work brings new understanding of the impact and relevance of place-making to the world. On the show, we focus on what's now and what's next.*         *         *         *         *         *         *In this episode we talk about the power of design and its influence on well-being with the Founder and CEO of Studio Elsewhere, Mirelle Phillips. Mirelle and her team collaborate with various medical institutions to create environments that support patients, their families and healthcare workers in the journey to recovery and well-being.Most of us have had the experience of going to a doctor's office or dentist or hospital or some sort of medical facility and having to wait. Some of us may even have spent a night in a temporary bed hooked up to a machine reading out our vital statistics and a team of nurses, doctors and specialists busying around us trying to understand what was wrong and how to make it right. Some of us might have even spent time lying on that bed in a hallway before a room was available, staring up at a ceiling at a large rectangular fluorescent light, an acoustic tile ceiling and a rather drab overall interior.Some of us might have even been a patient with a long term stay in a medical facility or had to return regularly for treatments for our particular condition.Or some of us may have been caregivers or family members who accompanied our loved ones to the medical facility or care for them daily at home. And then there are the health care workers themselves who over the past few years have caried an extraordinary burden as frontline workers during the COVID pandemic that, during the early phases, put crushing pressure on the medical system worldwide. Whether we are a patient, a caregiver or healthcare worker, environments designed for supporting the care and recovery journey affect the experience along the path. The design of healthcare environments influence things like recovery time, they can mitigate stress, anxiety and fear and provide a sense of agency for those who feel like their bodies, and lives, are no longer in their control.Our minds and bodies can be deeply affected by buildings. Well maybe I need to refine that, not putting all the pressure on the built places. The environments we inhabit, natural or human made, affect us. A whole field of cognitive science has emerged that recognizes the influence hat the environment has on our mind-body state call neuroaesthetics.Neuroesthetics is a term coined by Semir Zeki in 1999[3]. A more formal definition was arrived at in the early 2000's as the scientific study of the neural bases for the contemplation and creation of a work of art.[4]It doesn't just apply to what is happening in the brain while looking at a piece of art. Among other things, it finds applications to music, dance, poetry, music, places and buildings. What neuroesthetics does is it uses neuroscience to explain and understand the aesthetic experiences at the neurological level and helps us understand the relationship to how we feel and what we experience through the arts and architecture.  Books like “Welcome to Your World: How the Built Environment Shapes Our Lives” by Sarah Williams Goldhagen and “Your Brain on Art” by Susan Magsamen and Ivy Ross are great examples of recent publications that help unpack how the environments we live in, and the art, music, dances, literature influences us.On the show I have talked about ontological design – the idea that what we design designs us back. Neural connections in our brains are formed, reinforced or dismantled through a process of neuroplasticity by the experiences we have. Our environments shape us on a neurological level. Research is quite definitive about the idea that the environment has the capacity to help us recover from illness faster or make us perhaps diminish well-being.And so the question arises…if we know that the environment has this profound effect on our minds and bodies, why is so much of what is built around us so banal?This question goes beyond thinking about sustainability in design and building practice – though this is a critical consideration of addressing issues of global warming. Sustainable design practice should be a baseline for anything we build or manufacture.What if places we built engaged the mind-body with a profound understanding of the impact of art, music, nature, and design, the study of neuroaesthetics?If we did, we would have many more of the projects that Mirelle Phillips and Studio Elsewhere have created over the past few years.Studio Elsewhere uses evidence-based and data-driven practices to develop virtual and physical interventions that promote brain health. They are pioneers of bio-experiential design - interactive, immersive environmental design using technology and physical design toward a healthier brain-body connection. Their embedded emerging technology solutions support the needs of healthcare professionals, researchers, patients and caregivers using software and hardware development, emerging technology, immersive game design, and biophilic design to reimagine the experience of health, wellness, and care. ​They have developed a model that allows for the development of a first-of-its-kind technology and design practice that leads with compassion, imagination, and inclusivity.Mirelle Phillips is the Founder and CEO of Studio Elsewhere. She leads a team of designers and digital technology mavens developing bio-experiential technology to promote behavioural, cognitive, and social health. While many of the application of Studio Elswhere's work supports the well-being of patients, caregivers and healthcare workers, I can imagine a day when these big ideas find enormously impactful applications in the built environment across education, corporate interiors, retail, hospitality and almost every other place where brains and buildings connect. ABOUT DAVID KEPRON:LinkedIn Profile: linkedin.com/in/david-kepron-9a1582bWebsites: https://www.davidkepron.com    (personal website)vmsd.com/taxonomy/term/8645  (Blog)Email: david.kepron@NXTLVLexperiencedesign.comTwitter: DavidKepronPersonal Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/davidkepron/NXTLVL Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nxtlvl_experience_design/Bio:David Kepron is a multifaceted creative professional with a deep curiosity to understand ‘why', ‘what's now' and ‘what's next'. He brings together his background as an architect, artist, educator, author, podcast host and builder to the making of meaningful and empathically-focused, community-centric customer connections at brand experience places around the globe. David is a former VP - Global Design Strategies at Marriott International. While at Marriott, his focus was on the creation of compelling customer experiences within Marriott's “Premium Distinctive” segment which included: Westin, Renaissance, Le Meridien, Autograph Collection, Tribute Portfolio, Design Hotels and Gaylord hotels. In 2020 Kepron founded NXTLVL Experience Design, a strategy and design consultancy, where he combines his multidisciplinary approach to the creation of relevant brand engagements with his passion for social and cultural anthropology, neuroscience and emerging digital technologies. As a frequently requested international speaker at corporate events and international conferences focusing on CX, digital transformation, retail, hospitality, emerging technology, David shares his expertise on subjects ranging from consumer behaviors and trends, brain science and buying behavior, store design and visual merchandising, hotel design and strategy as well as creativity and innovation. In his talks, David shares visionary ideas on how brand strategy, brain science and emerging technologies are changing guest expectations about relationships they want to have with brands and how companies can remain relevant in a digitally enabled marketplace. David currently shares his experience and insight on various industry boards including: VMSD magazine's Editorial Advisory Board, the Interactive Customer Experience Association, Sign Research Foundation's Program Committee as well as the Center For Retail Transformation at George Mason University.He has held teaching positions at New York's Fashion Institute of Technology (F.I.T.), the Department of Architecture & Interior Design of Drexel University in Philadelphia, the Laboratory Institute of Merchandising (L.I.M.) in New York, the International Academy of Merchandising and Design in Montreal and he served as the Director of the Visual Merchandising Department at LaSalle International Fashion School (L.I.F.S.) in Singapore.  In 2014 Kepron published his first book titled: “Retail (r)Evolution: Why Creating Right-Brain Stores Will Shape the Future of Shopping in a Digitally Driven World” and he is currently working on his second book to be published soon. David also writes a popular blog called “Brain Food” which is published monthly on vmsd.com. ************************************************************************************************************************************The next level experience design podcast is presented by VMSD magazine and Smartwork Media. It is hosted and executive produced by David Kepron. Our original music and audio production by Kano Sound. The content of this podcast is copywrite to David Kepron and NXTLVL Experience Design. Any publication or rebroadcast of the content is prohibited without the expressed written consent of David Kepron and NXTLVL Experience Design.Make sure to tune in for more NXTLVL “Dialogues on DATA: Design Architecture Technology and the Arts” wherever you find your favorite podcasts and make sure to visit vmsd.com and look for the tab for the NXTLVL Experience Design podcast there too.

Sometimes we just have to trust that all the dots in our life will connect. And for English major turned experiential marketer and founder/creative director of Crush Studio, Lacey Hoff, they definitely did. In this episode, Lacey shares how working as a technical editor who got in trouble for talking too much led first to a production assistant job at a museum-design firm and then a magical gig helping Universal Studios bring the Wizarding World of Harry Potter to life. Since then, Lacey has had an exciting and rewarding career crafting moments and creating spaces that allow corporate brands to emotionally connect with consumers and people to open up and enjoy themselves. From finding ways to marry real-life and digital inspiration to moving quickly when the universe gifts you a brilliant idea, Lacey offers insight into creating marketing experiences that surprise, delight and transport audiences. Buckle up for this educational yet highly entertaining episode!Key Takeaways: Have you ever wondered how brands like Zappos or Mike's Hard Lemonade create “Instagrammable” moments? Lacy tells us how! Lacey shares why simply asking team members “what's new?” can lead to big and bold creative ideas.We discuss why the best things in life are messy.Lacey reveals her predictions for the future of experiential design, including the roles that she expects AI and the metaverse to play.Guest Bio:Lacey Hoff is the Owner and Creative Director of Crush Studio, a design and production company that creates unique events and hospitality experiences for world-class brands. Crush brings brands to life by combining immersive spaces with engaging programming —all while making sure that content captured by guests or photographers is camera worthy. Lacey fell in love with the idea of transporting guests into other worlds during her first job as a production assistant with a museum-design firm. After gaining international marketing and branding experience through stints with both Universal Studios' Creative and Warner Bros., Lacey combined her skillsets in Experiential Design. She went on to spend six years as the Design Director for an event agency in LA and NYC, executing events for brands such as Harry Potter, Zappos and DC Comics. With an intense desire to be more hands-on and “in the studio,” Lacey founded Crush Studio in 2016 so that she could build a team focused on the design & production process.   After a major setback with the rest of the world in 2020, Crush has now rebuilt itself to a team of 12. Their brand client list includes Netflix, Disney, Chase Sapphire, Dropbox and Shutterstock. When Lacey isn't on an event site using coded walkie-talkie speak or working on a home remodeling project, you can find her practicing Spanish south of the border, preferably somewhere with salty air and big waves.  

Join us in this captivating episode where we dive deep into the world of strategic experiential design with our special guest, Paula Murray, a Brand Strategist and expert from Supertonic agency in Scotland. 

Andrew Kissel has been recreating moral dilemmas like the Trolley Problem in VR at his Virginia Philosophy Reality Lab at Old Dominion University. I had a chance to talk about his work in moral philosophy around catalyzed by Morgan Luck's paper “The gamer's dilemma: An analysis of the arguments for the moral distinction between virtual murder and virtual paedophilia” that tries to define the ethical threshold between different types of virtual wrongdoing. We may have an intuition for why virtual murder in video games is morally justifiable while virtual paedophilia is not, but we explore how the variety of ethical frameworks like Consequentialism, Virtue Ethics, or Deontology break down this problem. Kissel invited me to give a keynote talk at a Exploring the Humanities through VR Workshop held on December 10, 2021 where I presented on “Process Philosophy & VR: The Foundations of Experiential Design.” We debate process relational metaphysics vs substance metaphysics in the last part of this interview, and I'd recommend checking out my conversations with Whitehead scholar Matt Segall here and here as well as with Grant Maxell for more of a deep dive on the nuances of a process-relational perspective and why I think it's so useful for thinking about VR.

Kamil Tyebally is the founder of Early Spring NYC, a company that works at the crossroads between events, culture, connection and marketing, to create immersive brand events.Kamil's is an unusual story, and he starts by telling Anne how he went from Singapore to Myanmar to Thailand in his teens, and how he first discovered that life experience could match academic performance. His early passion for taking pictures led him to follow a path in photo-journalism in NYC at first, and Kamil explains about how his father sparked his adventurous spirit, which led him to meet his future self in Mexico City and develop two book projects that took him to Algiers (Algeria) and later to Baghdad (Iraq).Coming back to NYC, Kamil landed in marketing and business development. But, he tells Anne how he was set on getting a job at the innovative Fake Love company. This mission took him on a journey to explore culture, connection, technology and empathy — where, at the end, he found himself as the co-creative for immersive experiential events at Fake Love. Kamil's artistic leanings and his keenness to find what makes people tick is neatly encompassed when he talks with Anne about creating value beyond transaction and sparking moments of connections at his events. Kamil launched his company, Early Spring, just before the start of the pandemic with the objective (and the tagline) of ‘engineering serendipity' — which he describes as finding what people need before they even know they need it themselves. The two close the conversation by discussing vulnerability, instinct and finding a connection to their roots. A wide-ranging and fascinating interview with a thoughtful entrepreneur. Happy listening! ***Selected links from episode You can find Kamil on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kamiltyebally/on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/nyiskillingme/His company website is https://earlyspring.nyc/His personal website is - http://www.nyiskillingme.com/Fake Love - https://www.linkedin.com/company/fake-love/Refinery 29 - https://www.refinery29.com/29 Rooms by Refinery 29 - https://www.refinery29.com/en-us/29roomsThe Shwedagon Pagoda in Yangon - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shwedagon_PagodaThe School of Visual Arts in NYC - https://sva.edu/Algiers, the Algerian capital - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AlgiersL'Usage du monde, the book by Nicholas Bouvier - https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%27Usage_du_mondeand in English 'The Way of the World' The Stranger, book by Albert Camus - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stranger_(Camus_novel)The song New  York is Killing Me by Gill Scott Heron - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiuorrXsngMAmritsar in Punjab - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmritsarAn Era of Darkness, the book by Shashi Taroor - https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/32618967-an-era-of-darkness***If you enjoyed this episode, click subscribe for more, and consider writing a review of the show on Apple Podcasts, we really appreciate your support and feedback. And thank you  so much for listening! For all notes and transcripts, please visit Out Of The Clouds on Simplecast - https://out-of-the-clouds.simplecast.com/  Sign up for Anne's email newsletter for more from Out of the Clouds at https://annevmuhlethaler.com. Follow Anne: IG: @_outoftheclouds or  @annvi   

Being a strategist and designer means being able to think critically and creatively about how spaces and experiences can be designed to create positive emotions for audiences. It is important to have diverse skills when designing experiences, as the process is always evolving. The experience profiles created during the design process help event creators understand their audience's preferences and needs to create an enjoyable experience. But how can you create the latter? Tune in to this episode as we talk about experience design and event management with Naomi Clare Crellin. Highlights: (00:02) Experienced strategist and designer: Naomi Clare Crellin's Career Background (04:57) Pondering on the state of Design Education (07:07) The Joys of Experience Design (10:34) Connection between Marketing and Experiential Design (12:53) The impact in the practice of design with skill and academic background (16:40) Balancing between personal practice and people's opinions in the artmaking process (24:48) What are Experience Profiles? (27:10) Talking about the Design Process (29:17) Insights about the Return on Emotion (31:50) Book Recommendation on Curation and Event Management Links: Website: www.naomiclare.com LinkedIn: Naomi Clare Crellin - Founder, CEO - Storycraft Lab Connect with Yanique: Podcast www.facebook.com/groups/eventist365/ https://twitter.com/eventist365 https://www.instagram.com/eventist365/ Connect with Yanique: Podcast www.facebook.com/groups/eventist365/ https://twitter.com/eventist365 https://www.instagram.com/eventist365/ Host https://www.facebook.com/MissYaniDoesStuff/ https://twitter.com/YaniDoesStuff https://www.instagram.com/YaniDoesStuff/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/ydacosta/ Graphic Design Firm for Corporate Events: https://www.facebook.com/TheYKMD https://twitter.com/theYKMD https://instagram.com/theYKMD https://www.linkedin.com/company/ykmd/z Graphic Design Firm Websites: https://theykmd.com/ http://daily-designer.com/

What kinds of experiential designs can make the office more immersive and enticing for returning employees? See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

What kinds of experiential designs can make the office more immersive and enticing for returning employees?

What kinds of experiential designs can make the office more immersive and enticing for returning employees?

For our 4th episode of Step by Step Season 8, we're covering how you can take your brand from having an eCommerce project mindset to a program mindset. Jon Reily from bounteous is here to chat about the difficult parts of shifting mindsets, how we're rewriting the rules, and more! Tune in now!A North Star or a South Star?Currently, a lot of brands are struggling with how to move from having an eCommerce project mindset to a program mindset. The most difficult part is that brands need to break the stigma that eCommerce is this big scary thing when it's not.“We went from calling things just selling things online to eCommerce and then we went back to, well, maybe just selling things online again. Have we come full circle?” – Brian“It all comes back to the design and you have to ensure that the design is solid in order to make it work.” – Jon“The downside of all of these tools being out there and being ubiquitous and available to virtually everybody is it's like everything's a nail and we're walking around with hammers trying to find where to use them.” – JonIn some ways, the programs still need to be in place as you build the foundation, or else you'll be painting when you haven't finished the foundation.We are rewriting the rules of eCommerce every day because there is no set way to do things, we're all learning every day and channels are seeking out answers every day.“Every single piece of disruption that takes place in a sector, in the following sector, the disruption happens twice as fast.” — JonThe systems that we build have to be able to flex in the future.The simple fact is that everyone needs to agree on what the end state is, define the end goal, and have a long-term plan. Associated Links:Want to learn more about data? Download our free Step by Step guide!Get connected with Fabric!Learn more about Jon Reily and bounteousListen to our other Step by Step seasonsFind our other Future Commerce episodes on our websiteHave any questions or comments about the show? Let us know on Futurecommerce.fm, or reach out to us on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, or LinkedIn. We love hearing from our listeners!

As both a creative and a business owner, Estelle Bailey-Babenzien sits at the intersection of art and commerce. She's a partner in the clothing brand Noah with her husband Brendon, formerly of Supreme, and the owner of Dream Awake, an interior design studio whose clients have included Adrien Grenier. Born and raised in the UK, and of half Ghanaian descent, Estelle moved to New York in 1999 with a fashion degree from London's prestigious arts and design college Central St. Martins. Responsible for the interior architecture and spatial experiences of the brand's retail spaces in New York, LA, London and Tokyo, she puts sustainability and social conscience at the top of her brand ethos. Today, her company Dream Awake Inc. is a full service Interior Architecture and Experiential Design studio that embodies her philosophy of life and enables her to bring her unique perspective and sensibility to the table. We talk about New York in the early aughts, being inspired by travel, Supreme's incredible success, the travails of the music business – especially for women – and how she'd approach designing a cannabis lounge. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Learn what brand experience is and how to design it through experiential design, with Design Bridge ECD Tom Gilbert.

Ben LeDonni is the CEO of Creative MMS, a digital marketing agency based in Greater Philadelphia, that describes itself as no less than creative, analytical, and strategic. The agency was founded over fifteen years ago to create and deliver the best-performing B2B digital marketing services and is now a leading strategic digital marketing agency. Outside the career-guy character in suit and tie, Ben is also a loving husband and father of three wonderful children. He and his wife, Kelly, started a nongovernmental organization named the Gigi Project, that aimed to give back and provide support to families and others who needed help in health, education, income, and dignity. In this episode, Ben LeDonni delves into what kind of culture they were able to build inside the company and outside with their clients – a culture that was transparent, understanding, and most importantly, empowering. He shares how not only financial growth is the measure of success, but also expertise, or what the whole team was able to learn through the processes they encountered. It was important for them to be confident in their expertise and on what they believed as this would then dictate what their future actions were. Furthermore, he shares what it was like to be a leader of a company in the midst of the pandemic and how relationships or personal connection within and outside the company is what really matters.This Cast Covers:How Ben and Creative MMS have quickly adapted to COVID (04:55) The biggest challenge Ben faced as the CEO when COVID hit (05:13)What leadership in the company looked like for Ben for the past two years (06:53)How empathy is one of the most important characteristics of a leader in Ben's perspective (09:58)Ben's take on ‘The Great Resignation' and how the culture in their company greatly helped them handle it well (12:48)Finance and expertise as the two important aspects of the company that Ben uses as a gauge for growth (18:52)How Creative MMS has been growing from sixteen people (23:47)How Creative MMS finds opportunities to grow an account and practical strategies in executing them (28:56)The areas where Creative MMS are struggling/struggled with and how they addressed them (33:21)Additional Resources:The Sales Driven AgencyThe Best Damn Agency MastermindLinkedIn | Ben LeDonniThe Creative MMSCreative UniversityThe Gigi Project 

This is Convo By Design featuring an absolutely amazing creative whose zig-zagged creative journey took many turns in a path that found him in the envious position in which he sits today. Founder and CEO of his namesake multi-line showroom. This is Anderson Somerselle. As you might imagine, after hosting and producing this show for 8 years soon to be in our 9th, I speak to many creatives who each have their own personal and professional journey and you hear from them once they have arrived. I find the path fascinating and no two paths are alike. Some are similar, but none exactly the same. Anderson Somerselle is originally from the Virgin Islands. His path took what I like to call ‘pinballing through the biz' which so many of us, myself included seem to do on our way to where we feel we should be. Somerselle has worked luxury design retail on the floor, later running departments within luxury design showrooms. Anderson gathered the experience and started his own luxury showroom featuring an impressive collection of unique brands. His methods are different than traditional showrooms and because of this, he offers a unique showroom experience. You will learn all about it here. Thank you for listening and subscribing to Convo By Design, a podcast for the design and architecture trade. Inside stories and in depth conversations with those shaping the industry. If you are not already doing so, please subscribe to the podcast. You will find Convo By Design everywhere you find your favorite shows like Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts and Design Network dot org. Convo By Design is presented by Walker Zanger, an incredible partner in design. The show is also supported by ThermaSol, another design partner who is always looking to help designers and architects do their best work. For more information from both of these amazing partners, as well as this weeks guest, you will find direct links in the show notes. Thank you, Anderson. Love your story and really appreciate you sharing it. Thank you Walker Zanger for presenting Convo By Design. Thank you ThermaSol for your partnership. You are both remarkable partners and amazing allies for the trade. And, thank you for listening, remember why you do what you do and that the business of design is about making better the lives of those we serve. Until next week, be well and take today first.

On this episode of the podcast the trio sit down with the founder of Media Objectives at Valerio Dewalt Train Associates, Joey Lawton. They talk about Joey's path that led him to experiential branding instead of architecture. Joey explains what experiential branding is and how it connects to architecture. The trio also talk to Joey about the learning curve of getting into a career path he did not initially study in. Finally, they talk about the media company born out of Joey's interest in experiential branding, Media Objectives at Valeria Dewalt Associates.

Workplaces must adapt to the new realities of hybrid working, experiential design, and the post-COVID environment. During this podcast, we speak with Steve Quick, CEO of Unispace, and Tim Larson, Chief Designer at Downstream.

Ula Kaniuch is back on the show for her second appearance. She is an OG from year 1 and appeared for Episode 24 recorded on January 17, 2019. I highly recommend taking a scan of the guests between now and then and listening to her first appearance to get to know her better. You can follow her on Instagram @avibrantmind   Ula is an experienced Social Media and Design Specialist with a demonstrated history of working in the marketing and advertising industry. Skilled in Photography, Content Management, Art Direction, Experiential Design, Management, Marketing Strategy, Social Media, Influencer/Ambassador programs, and Community building. She is a creative that understands strategy and operations with a Bachelor of Design focused in Visual Communication Design from the University of Alberta. She is essentially someone you want to have in your corner.    In this episode we filled in the gaps of a few of the major things that have happened between now and her last appearance and we talked about forming quality connections and being a creative in an evolving world. We talked about the value in practicing and surrounding yourself with people who are better than you. In addition we highlighted the opportunity that building a library of content off of social media provides as well as how underrated Pinterest is.    There is a lot more to Ula than what we had time to talk about so I would encourage you to follow along on Instagram to see where her journey takes her. Head to @avibrantmind and go sign up for her email list we talked about.    You can follow your host, Chris Liddle on IG @christianliddle or follow the show @thelifestylechase.   All episodes are published on YouTube and on all audio platforms so to stay up to date please subscribe.    To help the show grow and reach new audiences, share a screenshot on social media and tag us or go back and listen to past interviews. There is a high chance you will see some familiar names.    Thanks for joining us and I'll see you for the next one. 

GUEST'S BIO Kate & Betsy are the co-founders. While both help with all aspects of the business, Kate's expertise and experience lies more in the Airbnb industry, while Betsy has an interior design background. Kate also operates a full-time Airbnb business called Riley and Besty co-owns an interior design business called The Estate of Things. Kate and Betsy have been best friends for a long time, but after Betsy was diagnosed with cancer for the second time, their relationship dynamic changed. Kate became a caretaker and a huge source of support for Betsy, using the experience she gained working in marketing for health and diet brands to assist Betsy in following a medically necessary, extremely strict diet. While Betsy was going through chemotherapy, the two friends began to view life differently and discovered a newfound sense of purpose and joy in one of their favorite hobbies--decorating and designing Kate's Airbnb rental houses. HIGHLIGHTS OF THE EPISODE 04:00 Kate Shaw and Betsy Moyer introduction and background 05:27 How Kate and Betsy started in the STR industry 09:46 Kate and Betsy's business dynamic 15:30 Kate and Betsy talk about their team 17:53 What is an experiential design 21:28 Kate and Betsy vision for their business 23:03 Kate talks about her STR business operation 26:33 Kate shares about her STR units 29:30 Target market in Joshua Tree 30:15 Acknowledgments to Kate and Betsy 30:57 Where can people connect with Kate and Betsy 31:39 Kate and Betsy's #1 secret to success with STR NOTABLE QUOTES "This is your business. Design it the way you want it to work for you." - Mike Sjogren "Our only goal is to have fun." - Kate Shaw CONNECT WITH THE GUEST Kate Shaw: Instagram | Linkedin Betsy Moyer: Instagram | Linkedin The Estate of Things https://theestateofthings.com/ Retreat Airbnb https://www.instagram.com/retreatairbnb/ https://byretreat.com/  CONNECT WITH THE HOSTS Michael Sjogren: Short Term Rental Secrets Facebook Group | Clubhouse | Instagram | Youtube | Facebook Page | Linkedin https://linktr.ee/the_airbnbguy Emanuele Pani: Clubhouse | Instagram | Facebook | Linkedin FREE MASTERCLASS TRAINING - https://www.strsecrets.com/masterclass Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

GUEST'S BIO Kate & Betsy are the co-founders. While both help with all aspects of the business, Kate's expertise and experience lies more in the Airbnb industry, while Betsy has an interior design background. Kate also operates a full-time Airbnb business called Riley and Besty co-owns an interior design business called The Estate of Things. Kate and Betsy have been best friends for a long time, but after Betsy was diagnosed with cancer for the second time, their relationship dynamic changed. Kate became a caretaker and a huge source of support for Betsy, using the experience she gained working in marketing for health and diet brands to assist Betsy in following a medically necessary, extremely strict diet. While Betsy was going through chemotherapy, the two friends began to view life differently and discovered a newfound sense of purpose and joy in one of their favorite hobbies--decorating and designing Kate's Airbnb rental houses. HIGHLIGHTS OF THE EPISODE 04:00 Kate Shaw and Betsy Moyer introduction and background 05:27 How Kate and Betsy started in the STR industry 09:46 Kate and Betsy's business dynamic 15:30 Kate and Betsy talk about their team 17:53 What is an experiential design 21:28 Kate and Betsy vision for their business 23:03 Kate talks about her STR business operation 26:33 Kate shares about her STR units 29:30 Target market in Joshua Tree 30:15 Acknowledgments to Kate and Betsy 30:57 Where can people connect with Kate and Betsy 31:39 Kate and Betsy's #1 secret to success with STR NOTABLE QUOTES "This is your business. Design it the way you want it to work for you." - Mike Sjogren "Our only goal is to have fun." - Kate Shaw CONNECT WITH THE GUEST Kate Shaw: Instagram | Linkedin Betsy Moyer: Instagram | Linkedin The Estate of Things https://theestateofthings.com/ Retreat Airbnb https://www.instagram.com/retreatairbnb/ https://byretreat.com/ CONNECT WITH THE HOSTS Michael Sjogren: Short Term Rental Secrets Facebook Group | Clubhouse | Instagram | Youtube | Facebook Page | Linkedin https://linktr.ee/the_airbnbguy Emanuele Pani: Clubhouse | Instagram | Facebook | Linkedin FREE MASTERCLASS TRAINING - https://www.strsecrets.com/masterclass

So, you're an Airbnb host in a saturated market. The investment blogs said it would be easy to build a thriving short-term rental business in your area, but you've got a lot of competition.How do you stand out? Can you use design to create a guest experience that sets you apart?Kate Shaw and Betsy Moyer are the cofounders of Retreat Experiential Design, an all-in-one Airbnb experiential design firm that transforms Airbnb properties into true retreats. Betsy is also the creator of the home décor and interior design brand, The Estate of Things, and Kate is an Airbnb Superhost with a portfolio of 10 units near Joshua Tree National Park.On this episode of Get Paid for Your Pad, Kate and Betsy join me to share the fundamentals of experiential design, explaining how they identify the unique value proposition of a new property and design with the with guest in mind.They discuss how to succeed in a saturated market like Joshua Tree and offer advice on creating a win-win between Airbnb hosts and the local community.Listen in for insight on creating a unique guest experience on a budget and learn to leverage experiential design to stand out on Airbnb!Topics CoveredHow Kate & Betsy define experiential designDesign as if hosting in own homeUtilize every inch of propertyHow Kate & Betsy approach a new propertyIdentify unique value prop of spaceConsider guest trying to attractHow to save money on experiential designLeverage local artisans and artistsUse thrift store + Craigslist findsHow to succeed in a saturated marketCreate unique experienceConsider visitor demographicsHow to create a win-win with the local communityProvide jobs to locals, pay living wageEncourage investors to build vs. buyKate's top tips for aspiring Airbnb hostsFocus on guest experience/happinessAct as if hosting friends and familyConnect with Kate & BetsyRetreat Experiential DesignRetreat Design on InstagramDesert Barn House on InstagramResourcesJoshua Tree National Park‘Odd Job: What's It Like to Own the Most-Visited Airbnb in the World' in VoxKate on AirbnbKate on InstagramThe Estate of ThingsThe Estate of Things on InstagramLegends X 90-Day STR AcceleratorGet Paid for Your Pad on YouTubeEmail jasper@getpaidforyourpad.comSponsorHostfully [Discount Code PAD] See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Experiential Design for Digital Signage EPISODE 63 | Host: Derek DeWitt, Communications Specialist for Visix, Inc. Immersive experiences are being pioneered in a number of fields using experiential design concepts. Though digital signage is mainly a visual medium, there are ways to engage the other four senses as well. Yes – hearing, touch, smell and even taste. The more ways you can get someone's attention, the better chance you have of attracting them and giving them an experience that they'll remember for a long time. And that means they'll remember your message and your brand longer. This is more than thinking outside the box, it's thinking outside the eye. - Learn how much each sense influences how we process information - Understand the importance of high-quality visuals and motion - Explore ways to use audio and music effectively - Consider using scent diffusers to add a smell element - Don't forget about haptics to engage the tactile sense - Surprise people by offering a way to engage their taste buds - Hear examples of how experiential design elements can work independently or together   See the full transcript HERE Get more content ideas in our Masterclass Guide 3: Digital Signage Content

In this episode, I sit down in Treehouse in the Shade in VRChat to discuss VR Philosophy with Kent Bye. Kent Bye is the host of the no #1 VR podcast: VoicesofVR, possibly the best resource available for anyone that is into the XR space. We discussed Ethics of VR, Experiential Design, the Process Philosophy of Alfred North Whitehead, Postphenomenology, phenomenology, consciousness, epistemology/knowledge, dialectics, pluralism and much, much more! This was a wonderful experience for me and it was really interesting to be able to "interview the interviewer" and hear Bye's broad strokes as he addresses the mereology of the Virtual Reality industry. Enjoy!

Branding is the ultimate goal of all marketing communications, right? Learning how to produce emotion and attachment to your brand develops into experience. Positive experiences get repeated. Repeated actions become habits. This is how you turn brands into habits. Wizard of Possibility, Dakota Ward is joined by Chris Reese from Atlanta Soundworks, Inc. Watch the first episode of The Underbrush as they get into what is involved in creating “transcendental branding”.      

What if your wedding was designed using a holistic approach focused on people and not things? How could you make sure that everyone at your wedding will feel like their presence is an integral part of the celebration? Listen in as Michelle interview's Experiential Designer, Julie Comfort, and learn how to do all this and more. As a destination wedding photographer for ten years, Julie Comfort attended over 250 weddings in 15 countries across 5 continents, covering a staggering number of cultures, traditions, and venues, yet often feeling a huge missed potential for more personalization and connection. Ready for a new adventure, she moved to Berlin in 2015 and studied experience design at Kaospilot, where she immediately recognized that a holistic design approach focused on people not things was the missing ingredient for truly meaningful and magical weddings. Julie founded Comfort Studio, an experience design consultancy dedicated to designing celebrations with intention, heart, and wild creativity. Julie designs weddings that elicit the desired emotion in your guests. Joy, happiness, peace, etc. This helps create weddings that are an entire experience. Big Takeaways * Think about how you want people to feel. Start with how you DON'T want them to feel and work from there. * If you don't want your guests to feel awkward at a table of strangers, have a table host for each table! Someone assigned to welcome people to the table, pour wine, make introductions, etc. Think of which of your friends, at each table, that would be great at doing this and reach out to them before hand. Tell them why you chose them. * People love to help in small and big ways. Having come from the world from destination weddings, Julie really recommends including the guests in meaningful ways. When they just feel like an audience, the wedding is less of an experience and more of a show, they won't feel as important to the big day. * In the future, it will be even more important to design around the people, and less on the spectacle of the big day. Think about a dinner party and how people are engaged. Connection is key. Links We Referenced comfortstudio.com (https://www.comfortstudio.com/) - Use code: BIGWEDDING for a 20% discount 15toasts.com (http://15toasts.com/) instagram.com/comfortstudioberlin Quotes “Connection doesn't happen automatically, you have to help people connect.” - Julie “One of the weird paradoxes about weddings is that the couple, that's getting married, they're both the hosts of the event and the guest of honor.” - Julie "I think it's really important that we don't just treat our guests like an audience. [...] How can we insure that everyone there feels like their presence is integral to what is happening?” - Julie “It's okay to have moments where nothing much is happening.[...] Then what happens after the boring moment will feel more exciting.” - Julie The Big Wedding Planning Podcast is... * Hosted and produced by Christy Matthews and Michelle Martinez. * Edited by Veronica Gruba. * Music by Steph Altman of Mophonics. * On Instagram @thebigweddingplanningpodcast and be sure to use #planthatwedding when posting, so you can get our attention! * Inviting you to become part of our Facebook Group! Join us and our amazing members. Just search for The Big Wedding Planning Podcast Community on Facebook. * Easy to get in touch with. Email us at thebigweddingplanningpodcast@gmail.com or Call and leave a message at 415-723-1625 and you might hear your voice on an episode * On Patreon. Become a member and with as little as $5 per month, you get bonuse episodes, special newsletters and Zoom Cocktail Hours with Christy & Michelle! Our Partners (https://www.thebigweddingplanningpodcast.com/partners) Special Deals for Listeners - TBWPP Enthusiastically Approved! Susan's Travel Services (https://susanstravelservices.com/ready-to-book/) FlowerMoxie (https://flowermoxie.com/pages/the-big-wedding-podcast) The Flashdance (https://www.theflashdance.com/virtual-party-the-big-wedding-planning-podcast) Cactus Collective (https://www.cactus-collective.com/the-big-wedding-planning-podcast/) Unboring Officiant (https://www.unboringofficiant.com/bigwedding/) Special Guest: Julie Comfort.

Jimmy Mistry is all about experiential design, experimenting with design & architecture and expanding his business empire every chance he gets! Hear out Meenakshi & Jimmy discuss this dynamic entrepreneurs inspiration, creativity and genesis of his brand on this M-Powering episode. Be prepared to be inspired through this motivational episode.

Virtual reality has the potential catalyze a paradigm shift around our concepts about the nature of reality, and one of the most influential philosophers on my thinking has been Alfred North Whitehead. His Process Philosophy emphases unfolding processes and relationships as the core metaphysical grounding rather than static, concrete objects. The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy entry contrasts some of the fundamental differences to Western philosophy:

Florian Idenburg, co-founder and partner of Brooklyn architecture firm SO-IL and author of the forthcoming book Human(s) Work, believes the office of the future will involve increased flexibility, autonomy, and imagination. On the episode, he considers the pandemic as a moment to rethink our relationship with the workplace and our jobs, the need for project-focused workrooms, and how workspace design might be best approached by focusing on experience instead of function.

Howard Rose has been working in medical VR for over 20 years now, and he's the co-founder and CEO of Firsthand Technology. He reached out to me after listening to the XR for Change panel on Ethics in order to talk about some of the specific ethical considerations of experiential design that he's learned from working on medical and educational VR experiences for over two decades.

What drones could potentially for AV from both utility and creating an experience.

What drones could potentially for AV from both utility and creating an experience. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

How museums can use AV to deliver an enhanced experience, the impact of virtual trade shows like InfoComm Connected, and LG's first LED cinema opens in Taiwan.

How museums can use AV to deliver an enhanced experience, the impact of virtual trade shows like InfoComm Connected, and LG's first LED cinema opens in Taiwan.

Robert Ross and Eddie Sotto jump right back into their discussion by delving into Eddie's Rolls Royce car design meant to accompany the Skyacht, the Regatta(0:33) and then detour into Eddie's time with Ed Roth (4:50). Then Robert introduces Eddie's concept of "Form Follows Fantastic!" and asks him to elaborate (8:18). Then they shift gears to talk about the cars that Eddie's owned and admired (14:04). After looking to the past, the two men consider the future--specifically what's next for Eddie (21:18), then pivot to discussing luxury interior and furniture design and Fornasetti's aesthetic (24:04), the 'feel of the ride' (29:50), and Eddie's trademarked equation: 'Fear-Death=Fun' (33:27).  Learn More: Cars That Matter And Follow Us: Facebook | Instagram | Twitter A CurtCo Media Production See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Robert Ross and Eddie Sotto begin by talking about their early memories of cars--such as Disneyland's Autopia and Eddie's early 'Bond' toys (1:50), before Eddie expounds on what exactly an immersive experience is to him (5:10). Eddie discusses effective experiential design (8:13), his time spent designing a new Main Street for Disney (10:53), and then muses on the future of car design (13:06). Robert transitions into talking about the founding of SottoStudios in 20014 (22:36) with special project for Aston Martin. After a break, they discuss Eddie's work with Ferrari (32:26) before moving into the auditory experiences Eddie works with (37:11). Before wrapping up this part of the conversation, Robert and Eddie talk about SottoStudios' foray into the private jet industry with Skyacht and Sky Ranch(38:38). Come back for the next episode as the two men wrap up their conversation. Additional music samples provided by Eddie Sotto Learn more: Cars That Matter And Follow Us: Facebook | Instagram | Twitter A CurtCo Media Production See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

AVIXA launches the AV Experience Awards, Netgear has a new design center, and HBSC standardizes Zoom across their entire company.

AVIXA launches the AV Experience Awards, Netgear has a new design center, and HBSC standardizes Zoom across their entire company.

AVIXA launches the AV Experience Awards, Netgear has a new design center, and HBSC standardizes Zoom across their entire company.

Tinsel started eight years ago, on a kitchen table in Brooklyn and since then has grown to a multimillion-dollar company. Tinsel is committed to redefining luxury events through the execution of imaginative, immersive experiences for private clients and for brands like Mercedes-Benz, Spotify, L'Oreal, and Condé Nast. Tinsel has proudly produced events at iconic institutions like The New York Public Library, The Guggenheim Museum, The Rainbow Room, and One World Observatory. The team's work has been featured in Vogue, WWD, Forbes, and Town & Country, with the company named recently as one of the Top 50 Event Designers in North America. Anthony sits down with Erica to chat about Tinsel's beginnings, experiential marketing, and unconventional approaches to event planning. Erica talks about the importance of pushing through, growing pains, and 'The Process' that goes into building a multimillion-dollar company. Eric and Anthony also discuss the importance of playing to your strengths and building a team around that, the exponential growth of responsibility, how social media has shaped the event landscape, and much more. You can find out more about Tinsel on their Website (http://tinseldesign.com) or Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/tinseldesignnyc).

Event managers are focusing more and more on event experiences. In order for them to achieve their event experience goals, their mindsets are shifting from event production to experiential design.

Event managers are focusing more and more on event experiences. In order for them to achieve their event experience goals, their mindsets are shifting from event production to experiential design.

Donate to The Permaculture Podcast Online: via PayPal Venmo: @permaculturepodcast Our guest today is Joshua Cubista, a permaculture practitioner from the American Southwest who teaches at Prescott College. Though the title for this episode is a bit of a mouthful, and what follows stays rather technical in how Joshua shares the message with us, the core of the conversation is fairly simple: how do we create better educational experiences for students by design, and build their abilities, talents, and skills to accomplish their personal goals inside and outside the classroom, and collaboratively in community. As we cover a lot of ground in less than a half hour, you will find copious links in the Resource section of the show notes, which include Joshua's website and how to connect with him. Before we begin, I want to say that this podcast is a lot like your local public radio station, dependent on listener support. Unlike public media, this podcast doesn't receive any government funding. Quite simply it continues to exist within the gift economy, which includes the sponsors you've heard on the show. Right now, there are 67 people, and four organizations, that help to bring permaculture to thousands and thousands of people every week. I'd like to see that number reach 200, or more, by the end of July. Can we do that together? Become a sustaining supporter atPatreon.com/permaculturepodcast or make a one-time donation via the PayPal.me link in the show notes, or the donate button on the side of the mainpage. The sponsor for this episode is The Fifth World, a role playing game initially created by Jason Godesky, but is now influenced by a growing community of authors, artists, designers, gamers, and dreamers. This open source game looks to explore a neotribal, ecotopian, animist future. What will your world look like in this feral future? Find out more and get involved at The Fifth World.com. Find out more about Joshua and his work, including information about Prototyping Our Future,Designing Labs for a Sustainable Future, and Permaculture for Systemic Change atJoshuaCubista.com. This conversation with Joshua is important to me because, and this isn't meant in a glib way, that the easy work of permaculture, the space we focus on in a Permaculture Design Course, the landscape is well known. There are academic and other libraries full of information on how to manage plants and animals for human use. The permanent agriculture side of permaculture is upon us. We can do that. We know how. Moving from the land and towards creating permanent culture is a completely different issue and set of, if you will, softer skills, that are not as tangible or direct. As teachers, that includes better pedagogical approaches to teaching permaculture that includes more conversations about the invisible structures and delving deep into design, not just on-the-ground techniques. Using that idea of experiential design, we must design and educational experience, including the classroom and curriculum, to meet the needs of the students so they have a larger tool box of skills. Then, through capacity building, help them find the skills they need along the way. Finally, at least for this conversation, when students complete a course and go back into the world, to offer ongoing support that also connect them with or helps to create the community they'll need for systemic change. It's a big picture, but I can't imagine us doing this if we weren't ready to  to tackle some incredibly complex issues. We can decide to use permaculture to homestead, and I appreciate everyone who does that, but there's also an imperative within the ethics that we do something more. By practicing permaculture, you are part of a larger community. By listening to this show, you are part of a portion of that group. If you are a part of my community. Thousands and thousands of people to call upon to help you. Regardless of where you are in the world, there is probably someone near you that I've talked to or traded email with. If not, then I can put out a call on the podcast if you are looking for someone. All you've got to do is get in touch. . Email: The Permaculture Podcast, or if you like, drop something in the mail. The Permaculture Podcast The Permaculture Podcast From here the next episode is a conversation with Linda Booth Sweeney about her new book The Climate Change Playbook, which contains 22 systems thinking games that help you more effectively communicate about climate change. Until then, spend each day creating the world you want to live in by taking care of Earth, your self, and each other. Resources Joshua Cubista Prototyping Our Future Designing Labs for a Sustainable Future Permaculture for Systemic Change Prescott College Evolution Lab Borderlands Restoration Global Education Futures Forum Prototopia Labs Alliance for Strategic Sustainable Development The Sustainability Laboratory Findhorn Ecovillage Human Potential Movement Esalen Institute A Pattern Language Barefoot Architect  (via Shelter Publications) Connect with the Podcast Make A Donation (PayPal.Me) On Patreon On Instagram On Facebook On Twitter