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Diligent Teacher with Lisa Earl A Bible podcast for ladies Ep266 - Faith Like Sarah

Join host Carol Pankow in this thought-provoking episode of Manager Minute as she sits down with VR fiscal powerhouses Katie Marchesano, Chris Merritt, Allison Flanagan, and Sarah Clardy. Together, they unpack the pressing fiscal issues shaping the vocational rehabilitation (VR) landscape, including: ·  Navigating fiscal forecasting challenges · Addressing technology gaps · Strengthening collaboration between program and fiscal teams The conversation highlights the vital role of policies, training, and institutional knowledge in sustaining VR programs while anticipating future shifts, such as technological advancements, fiscal constraints, and potential WIOA reauthorization. Don't miss this episode, packed with actionable insights and expert reflections to keep VR programs thriving!   Listen Here   Full Transcript:   {Music} Katie: I'm really excited for that tool to be shared, and I think it's going to be a really helpful tool for the agencies.   Carol: This job takes constant attention to detail in what is happening. It is always going to be work.   Chris: More people are going to be reaching out asking for fiscal forecasting and understanding how to look at this program in the future.   Allison: One of the things that pops in my mind that might happen over the next three years is reauthorization of WIOA.   Sarah: I think we're going to see some new resources, hopefully in the technology world develop, that will assist our agencies so that their focus can remain on the customers where it belongs.   Intro Voice: Manager Minute brought to you by the VRTAC for Quality Management, Conversations powered by VR, one manager at a time, one minute at a time. Here is your host Carol Pankow.   Carol: Well, welcome to the manager minute. Joining me in the studio today are my colleagues Katie Marchesano, Chris Merritt, Allison Flanagan and Sarah Clardy. So this might be a little bit of calamity for our listeners, but we're going to do it. So how y'all doing today?   Sarah: Great   Chris: Great.   Allison: Good.   Katie: Wonderful.   Carol: Awesome to hear it. Well, we have had quite a journey on the QM for the past four years. The fiscal focus was a new aspect of the grant, and we are so grateful to then Commissioner Mark Schultz for realizing that TA in this area was an essential element to the work. And since we're in this final year of the grant, we wanted to have a chance to visit together, share our insights with the listeners into the whole fiscal picture across the VR program, and discuss our perceptions and perspectives. So buckle up, folks, and we're going to dig in. So I want to start with how you each found your way to VR. And I'm going to start with Chris to talk about your journey into VR.   Chris: Well thanks, Carol. Mine's a little bit different than most people. I did not start in VR. I have a very different background. All fiscal for the most part. But I came to work at a fiscal state unit and learned about VR there. Loved it, loved it, loved it. And then was kind of asked to be part of this Ta team and couldn't say no because it's just an incredible program and it's a little complicated. So being able to help the states understand it better is what brought me to this team.   Carol: Well, not you, and you're being modest now. Tell them about like a little bit more of your background because you have an interesting educational background and all of that.   Chris: Yeah, I do. So I'm an environmental engineer by trade. Worked in that field for a while. Learned that sampling sludge was not a cool thing to be doing. So went to work for a small business that was just starting on Department of Defense World. Loved all the fiscal part of that. Went back to school and got my MBA and have been doing fiscal stuff ever since. So yeah, it's a long road that brought me here, but I'm happy I took it.   Carol: Yeah, we're glad you're here. How about you, Miss Allison?   Allison: Well, it's kind of hard to believe that I have over 30 years in this VR journey, and it actually started out in the field as a VR technician, and I just fell in love with the mission and purpose of VR. So I quickly changed my direction to be a VR counselor, and then that evolved to other promotions and positions throughout the year, where I ended up being director of both Kentucky Blind Agency and then moved to Florida as the General Agency Director. And when the VR TKM opportunity came about, I was ready for a change, especially after being a director through the pandemic and through the implementation of WIOA. I was looking forward to just a new opportunity, new learning areas, so this has been a great jump for me. I've enjoyed it very much.   Carol: Why don't you tell them too about your other gig with NRLI a little bit. We'll make a plug there.   Allison: Yeah. So part of the VRTAC-QM is the National Rehabilitation Leadership Institute through San Diego State University. I have the honor of continuing Fred McFarland's legacy, who began this program about 25 years ago. And it is a program that is building the future leaders in the vocational rehabilitation field. And it's been a joy to see these leaders be promoted throughout their careers. Being stepping up, having an interest at that national level, the issues that are facing VR. So it is definitely a part of my job with QM that I hold near and dear to my heart.   Carol: Yeah, it's good stuff, I love it NRLI of our favorite things to participate in when we get to do training. So Katie, over to you next.   Katie: Well, my journey with VR started when my brother was receiving VR services, and he actually is who inspired me to go and get my bachelor's degree in psychology and work in social services. That led me to Department of Workforce Services, where I spent 13 years in various roles and capacities, which ultimately led me back to VR.   Carol: Awesome sauce. And last but not least, Sarah Clardy.   Sarah: So I started out about 24 years ago out of college. I was working in banking full time and going to school full time, and had an opportunity to come on with a state and Missouri vocational rehabilitation, had an opening for an assistant director of accounting and procurement. They had some systems and processes that were a little out of whack and needed some help with reorganizing pretty much the whole accounting structure. So I came over at that time and started in with Missouri, and then spent 20 years there and got to spend half of that time in the field directly with our field staff and counselors and really take this program to heart, and then had an opportunity four years ago to join the VRTAC-QM. I had said for a long time we needed technical assistance in the fiscal realm for years and years. I was thrilled that Mark Schultz saw the vision and made it happen.   Carol: Good stuff. Well, now we're going to enter the danger zone because I have some questions for you all. Not exactly sure how this is going to go, but we are going to do our best. So y'all jump in when you want. So what has been your biggest realization or aha moment since you started with the QM. And Allison, I'm going to have you kick us off and then other folks can jump in.   Allison: Honestly, Carol, there's been a lot of those aha moments for me over the last, you know, almost three years with the Technical Assistance Center since my experience in VR started in the field and I was a counselor, kind of the program side is where my comfort level is or my knowledge and experience. So when I joined the fiscal team there, definitely there was a lot of those aha moments, mainly a lot of the things that I did not know or did not realize even as a director when I came over. So one of those aha's is the director. Even though I received these beautiful monthly budget reports for my fiscal staff, even though I had a leadership team that we reviewed budgets with, understanding the fiscal requirements in and out, the uniform grant guidance and all the regulations. And, EDGAR, all of that, I think, is critical for any director or their leadership team to have knowledge of. And that was definitely one of my aha moments. And one of those things I go back, wow, if I could go back and be a director, I would be a lot smarter after being on the technical assistance side. And like I said, there's been a lot of those aha moments. I could share tons of them, but a couple other ones that jump out is just that critical need for that program side of the House and the fiscal side of the House, to always be communicating and always making sure they're checking with each other. On whether it's a new implementation, whether it's expenses, contracts, doesn't matter. There needs to be that collaboration happening at that level. And then probably the technology challenges is another one of those constant aha moments in the year that we're in and how reliant we are on technology. I am still amazed that there is not technology out there that will do what VR needs it to do, right off the shelf.   Carol: Amen, sister. You said it all. No, but I'm sure there's people that want to say some more.   Chris: I found it interesting when I came over that not every single, not a single state has it right. I thought that there would be more that are fully knowledgeable and are running with it and doing all the great things they are doing, the great things. They just don't have 100% right.   Carol: You are making me laugh with this because I'm just going to say I have to jump in on that. Sarah and I right away, in the beginning, anytime we had met with RSA we learned something new, we're like, uh, I gotta call back to Minnesota, tell them, because we realized, like, hey, we thought we were sort of doing it right, but we all realized things. We went, uh, yeah, we had a little slight misstep on that.   Katie: I would agree with that. Like, we came from a state that was in an intensive agreement. And, you know, I was like, man, we really got it wrong. But then, you know, it's a huge learning curve and there's a lot of people that are putting in their best effort, and they're still just a few things that aren't quite right.   Chris: Absolutely.   Katie: Another realization that I had was we have this table of contents for a grant management manual that we send out to agencies. And when I received it in Wyoming, I was intimidated by all the things that needed to be included. But my aha moment was when you break that down into individual items and you really look at it, it's things that are already in place, the policies and procedures that you're already working on. It's just finding a way to get that on paper and put it into some sort of policy and procedure and internal control. So realizing that states have the capacity to do that, just figuring out how was an aha moment for me.   Sarah: You know, when I came in, I was thinking back to 2017 and RSA came out with guidance on, I'm going to say it, Period of Performance. And it dominated our whole agency for a good nine months, trying to understand the guidance, looking at systems. We had to do a whole overhaul with the way we looked at obligations, just we spent a massive amount of time and effort to right size our systems, internal controls and all of that because prior to performance sets the beat for all of financial within a VR program. So coming into the QM, I really assumed that more agencies knew of Period of Performance and had gone through at least similar steps, or at least had internal conversations. And what I found was completely the opposite. Somehow a lot of folks missed the memo and that work hadn't been done. And of course, we've been running Fred Flintstone style, trying to help agencies get up to snuff. So that's the piece. I think that's been the most interesting. I think for me.   Carol: I think along that same vein for me was really that realization states are more different than I thought because I figured we all had the same information. We all kind of operated sort of the same. You might have your own internal systems, but I remember, Sarah, you and I talking that first year just going like, oh my gosh, everybody is organized so completely differently. They approach their work so completely differently. There isn't just one size fits all. Like, hey, you should do it this way. And like, everybody can do that. Uh uh, it is like having an IPE for how the fiscal is managed. Individualized we need to give very individualized TA. So what do you guys view as the number one challenge facing our programs nationwide? And Sarah, I'm going to have you start us with that.   Sarah: Okay? I'm going to say it I think Allison said it earlier. We are lacking in the technology space. I think a couple of things we have, the pendulum has swung to the other direction and before it was spend, spend, spend, a lot of agencies made adjustments so that they were increasing their spending. The large carryover balances weren't so large. Now my concern is how are we looking at our finances to see if we can still sustain that. And in order to get accurate projections and for leadership teams to have the conversations about where they stand financially, we have to have technology systems in place that are reliable, are tracking period of performance, can provide those fiscal calculations in terms of where we stand on all of the different requirements, so that we have a constant pulse on where do we stand as an agency. And I liken it to being in private industry and a CEO knowing at all times how much does it cost to make the widget? How many widgets are we making and what amount of time? All of those kinds of things. And I feel like in that space right now, we have agencies that are trying to figure that out, and we have some that are in a very delicate position, and it can cause a lot of catastrophe and crisis if that's not solidified. So really, it goes back to having reliable technology that will take care of all of that. And that includes our CMS, our Case Management Systems space. A lot of our vendors are struggling in that Period of Performance area, and we're not there yet. We have a lot more work to do.   Carol: Well, it's like a $4 billion industry, you know, and I feel like we're still using an abacus or something in some cases for tracking the money. It is the most insane thing I have ever seen.   Allison: And, you know, related to that technology challenge, though, is knowing that, that challenge is there, knowing that the technology is not correct. I think what adds to the complexity of that is the fiscal staff or the just the staff within the VR agency. They lack the fiscal knowledge enough to know if their system is working correctly or not, or know how to go in and make the adaptations needed to assist them. And that's a challenge within itself.   Chris: And I will piggyback right on that, because the thing I think that we've struggled with is we have lost so much institutional knowledge that people don't stay in jobs like they used to. And so if these policies and procedures are not written down, you get new people coming in, they don't know what they don't know. And if the technology is not working right, they don't know that that's not something that they can handle. So it's a lack of that long time knowledge that used to be in this program.   Katie: Yeah, Chris, that is exactly where I was going as well, is the loss of staff and institutional knowledge is huge, and it really highlights the importance of getting policies and procedures in place and not waiting till that person has their foot out the door and is ready to head out to make sure that you're getting that in writing. You know, succession planning and really building up success in the team.   Carol: I think for me, one of the things I see, because I love that whole organizational structure and non-delegable responsibilities, I love that area. I think one of the biggest challenges facing the program is the whole shift in how things are organized between if you're in a designated state unit within a designated state agency, and that centralization we have seen of all the fiscal functions along with IT and HR and all of it, but I feel like VR has lost control. And so as these services are centralized, and not that they can't be, but that they get centralized to a point that the VR program has lost complete input control direction. I mean, you've got directors being told you can't spend anything over $5. It has to go through 40 layers. You can't hire anybody. Staff cannot travel to go see customers like all of that. If we can't fix this structure of how things are put into play in each of these states, I really see kind of the demise of the program. As we see things get buried, the program gets buried down within these big agencies. The lack of control ends up leading to problems with them and being able to carry out the mission. And it's really hard to get a handle on that. And I know Congress has given, you know, this leeway so that states can organize like they want. But boy, the way they're organized right now, it's pretty tough.   Allison: It's a double edged sword when you think about it, because you're probably like me Carol, as former directors, we wanted more money going into the consumer services. We wanted it going to support our customers. We wanted to find ways to reduce any kind of administrative type expenses so that that money can go there when the centralized functions were really being pushed at the state levels. In my mind at first, I will say this, at first I saw, yes, this is a benefit because we're going to have these shared services, we're going to be able to spend more of our funds on our customers. And I still somewhat agree with that approach because it is a cost savings. But what has to happen, though, is that balance, what you talked about, the balance where VR still has control over the decisions or they are included in those decisions and the restrictions that have been put in place has to be lifted. But I do see the benefits of those shared services as long as the structure gets set up right.   Carol: Right. And that's been few and far between.   Allison: That needs a national model.   Carol: It does. And that's been a problem. I mean, if there's anything anyone can work on, little congressional assistance in that or whatever, you know, getting some of that rewritten, how that looks.   Sarah: Well, and I came from an agency that was able to retain an entire unit of 13-ish folks when all of those consolidations were occurring because within our Department of Education, our commissioner understood the complexities of our award and knew that if all of those positions rolled up to a department level, they weren't going to be able to support the program and were able to coordinate with our state leadership. And it served the program very, very well. So I think we have a little bit to be desired still in that space to get agencies the support that they need 100%.   Carol: So what has been your favorite thing to work on or accomplishment in your role? And Katie, I'm going to kick that to you to start us off.   Katie: Well, I've really enjoyed my role here with the QM. There's a lot of things that I enjoy, but the task that I've enjoyed the most is really having the ability to dig into the new uniform grant guidance that went into effect October 1st of 2020. For one of the things that I did while doing that was I took the old uniform grant guidance and the new ones and did a side by side where all of the things that were taken out were redlined and all of the things that were added were highlighted, and I'm really excited for that tool to be shared with the agencies right now. That's with RSA to get the stamp of approval, but I've used that tool already to help update all of our things on the website and all the tools that we're sharing with everyone, and I think it's going to be a really helpful tool for the agencies.   Carol: I love that tool, Katie, so much because even when we were down doing to last week and some of the just the nuance pieces that came out, when you're reading it and you go, okay, that language did change. Like there is a slightly nuanced variance to this that I hadn't completely grasped until you see it in the red and the yellow, and it all highlighted up. I mean, it was pretty nice.   Katie: Yeah, they did a lot of plain language changes, which is really evident when you look at the side by side.   Chris: I'll jump in here and tell you what my favorite thing is. And it's when we were working with a state intensively and, you know, we've been working with them for a long time, and you get to know them really well and you understand their environment and how things work, and they come to you and say something really profound, like, I was watching this training the other day and they got this wrong, and they got this wrong and they got this wrong. It is like a proud parent moment. When you go, they understand what the program is supposed to be doing, and they understand when other people not necessarily are getting it wrong, but mostly they're able to recognize what's not absolutely correct. And it just makes you feel like, oh, we have come so far.   Carol: It's like fly, little bird, you're flying.   Chris: Yes.   Allison: That's probably one of my favorite parts too, Chris, is the state work that we've done and how you get to know these state people. There's so many amazing VR staff across the country, and their hearts are all in the right place, and they want to do good. That's what I've enjoyed is getting to know these people better, broadening my network as well because I learn from them. But just being that resource I do like, I'm one of those weird people that likes digging into the laws and regs and finding where is that gray, vague area that we can interpret a little better. So part of the TA work, you know, really digging into some of the laws and some regulatory guidance I've enjoyed as well.   Carol: I have a story I love to share. I was having a breakdown probably a year ago, Sarah's laughing at me, I had a breakdown. You know, you're providing TA to state you're so ingrained with them, especially when they have a corrective action plan, you feel like you're part of them. I always say we, you know, when we're talking because I feel like I'm part of their team and we've been working on a particular piece of it, and nothing that we sent in was anything RSA wanted. All I knew was that this was not what they wanted, but we couldn't exactly figure out what they wanted. And it was driving me crazy. And I'd called Sarah and I said, I think I have to quit being a TA provider because I suck at this. I'm not able to help them. I haven't been able to figure this out. I am done, and I went to bed that night. I actually was on site with another state and I woke up at two in the morning and I do my best thinking as I'm sleeping. It's so weird. I've done it my whole career. I wake up in the middle of the night and have an idea. I woke up at two in the morning. I'm like, oh, I know what they're talking about. And I got up and I typed, I typed for like three hours and then got up for the day and got ready for the other state. But exactly what was needed was that, I mean, when we ended up meeting with the state and then they met with RSA, and that was the thing. It was the thing that was needed to get accomplished. And I felt super proud that we could kind of like, figure it out. It took a while. I almost quit, but, we got there in the end.   Sarah: You know, being in the final year of the grant, everybody's asking the question, what comes next? And of course we don't know what comes next. But I think my favorite part is looking back and building the relationships. So kind of touching on what all of you all have said. Relationships are important to me. Building the trust we are learning alongside of them just like they are. I always say there's no top of the mountain that any of us are ever going to reach when we've arrived. It's a daily learning process, but the program financially is so complex and trying to take those federal requirements And each of the state's requirements, which we've acknowledged already are all different, and bring that together in the center. And there's never been a resource to help agencies get down in the weeds, look at their systems, look at their processes, and help them navigate through that. And so just having something to offer and having directors send an SOS text at 9:00 at night, or we've talked to directors who have been in tears or excited because something really great has happened, and they want to share the success. It's all of that. Just being able to provide that valuable resource and support them along the way has been very rewarding for me. I know, and you all, but especially I think for the States.   Carol: So if you had a crystal ball, what would you predict regarding the financial state of the VR program over the next three years? And Chris, you get to start us on that lovely prediction.   Chris: Okay. Well, since I don't have a crystal ball, I think Sarah touched on this a little bit earlier. So for several years, the message from RSA and from Congress has been to spend, spend, spend. And so there's been a lot of changes in all the agencies to be able to spend more, to spend quicker, to do everything quicker and faster. And I think the spending is catching up. And I think that it might go too far. Like Sarah mentioned, the pendulum is going the other way, and I don't think the fiscal forecasting is robust enough to be able to predict when it's going to get hard. And since most directors do not come from a fiscal background, most directors come with the VR heart that you know is what a counselor has, paying attention to that. Fiscal forecasting is going to be a critical, critical point. And I know that most states are not doing it right. So that's my prediction. More people are going to be reaching out asking for fiscal forecasting and understanding how to look at this program in the future.   Sarah: And I think to tack on to that, I think we're going to see new technology and new resources emerge that will assist our agencies. Again, like Carol said earlier, some days it feels like we have our big chief tablet out and we're still doing things old school. And I think the only direction to go is up. So I think we're going to see some new resources, hopefully in the technology world develop, that will assist our agencies so that their focus can remain on the customers where it belongs.   Allison: And I would have to say ditto to both of that, especially the fiscal forecasting and the pendulum swinging the other way. And a lot of states considering order selection or going into order selection. But one of the things that pops in my mind that might happen over the next three years is reauthorization of WIOA. I know the discussions are happening with Congress right now, and if that implementation happens, you know, what's it going to look like? Because ten years ago when WIOA was passed, it was a huge impact on VR. And it still is. I mean, we're still challenged with trying to get everything implemented, trying to spend the minimum of our 15% on Pre-ETS. There's just so many things that we're still working on through. So very interested to see where that's going to go.   Carol: And I definitely think like nothing ever stays the same. So we always think like we're going to get to the place and it's just going to be even flow, like it's all going to be cool. We don't really have to pay a lot of attention, and I don't think that's ever going to be the state of the VR program. Like it's going to constantly need people paying attention. Whether the pendulum is one way and we have loads of money or it's the other way and we have no money now, like we have to somehow try to like even this out with the fiscal forecasting and all the things you're doing. But if you think you're going to get to the place where like, oh, I've reached it, Nirvana, it's all great. That's never going to be like this job takes constant attention to detail and what is happening. And so it is always going to be work. It's going to take a lot of effort from a lot of people. And as all the new people keep coming and going, figuring that out for the team so that you can sustain the practices and things that you have that help you to understand what's going on.   Katie: Yeah, I would just agree with everything that everyone already said. One of the big pushes that was brought up at CSAVR, is technology, and I think it is going to be interesting to see what kind of technology is introduced in the next three years that's going to help assist our programs.   Carol: So what is your best piece of advice for our listeners? And I'll let anybody open that one up.   Allison: I'm going to say you need to have a deep bench of leaders who are adverse in the financial requirements, maybe incorporating fiscal training for all staff on an annual basis, whether that's just refreshers or making sure new folks being hired understand all the requirements. But fiscal needs to be part of your ongoing training with staff. It's just critical.   Carol: I'd say, for directors coming in, I know the tendency is to want to be like, I have to know everything. I'm the director, I need to know all things. And even when you don't know the things, you pretend, you know the things. Don't pretend you know the things you don't know. Like you need to be humble and figure it out and learn and be willing to learn. For a lot of folks that are growing up in the VR system, having that sort of physical part of your brain, it may not be completely there. You're like, I went into VR because I didn't want to do math, and now you're in charge of, you know, $300 million in a program. And so you've got to just continue to learn and chip away and figure out how you can gain that really strong understanding, because you cannot just hand that off to some other group and think someone's managing that for you, because the buck really does stop with you in the end. As far as the responsibility over the control and allocation of the VR funds. So please keep learning, as Allison said, and be open and be humble when you don't know things and ask.   Sarah: There's a song by the Beatles called With a Little Help from My Friends. Everybody needs a Little help from time to time. And I know over the years we've worked with most of the agencies, but there are some that we haven't, and I've always assumed they're good. They don't need us. They're fine. It's not always necessarily the case. So acknowledging if I pick up a phone and call a peer or a fellow director, or hopefully the TAC continued to exist beyond this grant cycle. Reaching out and asking for help is okay, and it's encouraged.   Katie: Yeah, mine will be through the lens of policy and procedure. That's where I keep hitting. That's my passion on this QM team. We have a ton of resources available, and if you're struggling, you're looking at that table of contents saying, I can't do this. Reach out, give us a call. We can help you with prompting questions just to get the thought process going. And you can do it. It's going to be okay.   Chris: Ok, my piece of advice is to make connections. And I think everybody has kind of said that in their own way. But make those connections so that you have people you can reach out to and ask questions of whether it's us at the TA center, other states, other fiscal people. You need to be able to ask, how do you do this? What do you think of this idea that I have? How would you handle this? I mean, being able to have that connection and that type of conversation is critical 100%.   Carol: Well, I sure appreciate you all. And while we're still around, all our listeners can still connect with us. And we do have a QM fiscal email address. I will spell out for you. It is QM f I s c a l at v r t a c-qm.org. So qmfiscal@vrtac-qm.org. So please do reach out. We still are around for a little while and we can be your phone a friend. So thanks for joining me today guys I really appreciate it.   Chris: Thank you Carol. This was great.   Allison: Thanks for having Us.   Sarah: Thank you.   Katie: Thanks.   {Music} Outro Voice: Conversations powered by VR, one manager at a time, one minute at a time, brought to you by the VR TAC for Quality Management. Catch all of our podcast episodes by subscribing on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. Thanks for listening!

Hiring and training new employees is a big commitment - and getting it right will have a lasting impact on your agency.Kicking off The Big Agency Club series, we chat with Sarah Brougham, VP of Operations at GenFlow. Sarah's helped multiple agencies go from start-up to established, having a big hand to play in their growth and maturity journies. Sarah has spent the past six years at GenFlow, helping grow revenue there by 5x and headcount 16x.Sarah gives us her best tips on:Hiring the right people for your agencyCreating onboarding programs that new hires love and gets them off to a running startHow offboarding goes beyond formalities and systems removals, and includes decisions on retentionHow to decide whether to fight to keep an employee that's thinking of leavingFollow Sarah on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahbrougham/Follow Harv on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/harvnagra/Agency8x: https://www.agency8x.com/ Stay up to date with regular ops insights. Subscribe to The Handbook: The Operations Newsletter.This podcast is brought to you by Scoro, where you can manage your projects, resources and finances in a single system.

A lot of the property managers we talk to who want to grow say the same thing, “I just need more leads.” In this episode of the #DoorGrowShow, property management growth experts Jason and Sarah Hull discuss the 6 major leaks that property managers can have in their sales pipeline and why they don't just “need more leads.” You'll Learn [06:22] 1. Positioning [10:14] 2. Perception [11:19] 3. Presence [15:30] 4. Pricing [18:18] 5. Purpose [20:24] 6. Pitch Tweetables “Does it make sense to turn on the hose full blast if there's all these leaks?” “People want to work with a specialist. They don't want to turn over their biggest assets ever and their financial future to somebody that's dabbling in property management.” “If your reviews are good, it backs up everything that you say in your sales pitch.” “Are you clear on your personal motivations for why you have this business beyond just getting money?” Resources DoorGrow and Scale Mastermind DoorGrow Academy DoorGrow on YouTube DoorGrowClub DoorGrowLive TalkRoute Referral Link Transcript [00:00:00] Jason: Get these things dialed in and shored up and what you'll find is: you may not need nearly as many leads. [00:00:05] You won't have to spend nearly as much money on advertising or any money.  [00:00:12] Welcome DoorGrow property managers to the DoorGrow show. If you are a property management entrepreneur that wants to add doors, make a difference, increase revenue, help others, impact lives, and you are interested in growing in business and life, and you're open to doing things a bit differently than you are a DoorGrow property manager. [00:00:32] DoorGrow property managers love the opportunities, daily variety, unique challenges, and freedom that property management brings. Many in real estate think you're crazy for doing it. You think they're crazy for not, because you realize that property management is the ultimate high trust gateway to real estate deals, relationships, and residual income. [00:00:54] At DoorGrow, we are on a mission to transform property management business owners and their businesses. We want to transform the industry, eliminate the BS, build awareness, change perception, expand the market, and help the best property management entrepreneurs win. We're your hosts, property management growth experts, Jason and Sarah Hull, the owners of DoorGroww, and now let's get into the show. [00:01:19] Sarah: We wore DoorGrow colors today.  [00:01:20] Jason: Oh, we did. For those  [00:01:22] that can see us. We're wearing DoorGrow colors. It's not on purpose. Yeah. Green and blue. All right.  [00:01:27] Sarah: I wanted something easy. It was like, let me get a comfortable dress that looks nice, but it's comfortable. Ladies know what I'm talking about. [00:01:34] They're like, "yeah, those are awesome. That's this." [00:01:37] Jason: Okay. It's good to know. So we were talking about what we should talk about today. And one of the things that I've been doing on sales calls in conversations with potential clients is taking them through a diagnosis and diagnosing the front end sales pipeline of their business. [00:01:56] The challenge is a lot of people come to us that want to grow. We're called DoorGrow. So we certainly can help with that. We've been doing that for a long time. One of the things we've noticed though, is that a lot of times people think, "I just need more leads." They just think they need more leads. And some of you are just going to be listening to this, so I'm not going to do a drawing, I'm going to explain what I would usually draw, but I usually draw like a spigot, or a faucet, or whatever you call it, and a hose attached to this, and this long hose, and then a like a plant pot at the end of this hose that you're trying to water a little tree or something. [00:02:30] And I usually put fruit on it because that's your business and you want to get something from it. Like you want it to bear fruit, like make you money or something. Right. And so we've got this tree we want to grow and we've got this pipeline. This is our sales pipeline, this hose. And we think we just need to turn on more water. [00:02:46] Right. It seems to make sense. What I've realized though, over time is we used to do lead generation for property managers. Like that was like a offering that we had, a core offering that we had for our clients. So we would help them just turn on the hose, like full blast. We'd help them turn that on and they wouldn't be able to get business. [00:03:05] They wouldn't be able to get enough water to grow their business. Like it wasn't working and it wasn't the leads. It wasn't the lead generation necessarily. It was the hose. They had like all these major leaks that were preventing it. So over time, I started to see like, they'd be like, "well, it's not working." [00:03:19] I'm like, "well, you're not even answering your phone," or "you're waiting 24 hours before responding to a lead. And it's only good for like 15 minutes." And there was just all these leaks and problems. And there were some bigger, more macro level problems in their sales pipeline. [00:03:32] Like their pricing was terrible, so it was off. Or their branding was off. And so people were like, "well, yeah, but they look like a real estate company," or their website was awful and it would send traffic to their website and it was just leaking money. And so the fluid, if you will, that flows through the pipeline. [00:03:51] Is five currencies, time, energy, focus, cash, and effort. These are what you have to invest. And if you're shelling out a bunch of money, time, energy, focus, all of these things, right into the pipeline because you're just turning it on full blast, it's just going to leak out and you're just wasting all of that. [00:04:09] You're wasting time. You're wasting money. You're wasting your energy. Right. And it, and a lot of businesses are like, "I just need more leads." So I call this the leads myth. And so we found it to be effective is to start looking at the business and if they come to us saying, "Hey, we want to grow." [00:04:24] "Okay. How would you like us to help?" They're like, "we need more leads." [00:04:27] "okay, you may need more leads, but first, does it make sense to turn on the hose full blast if there's all these leaks?" [00:04:34] "What leaks?" Right?  [00:04:35] "Okay, well, let's take a look at your business and see if you have any of these." So we thought today we would get into some of these leaks so you can self assess and figure out, all right, how's my business doing? [00:04:43] We're going to do the quick, super fast version of this. And I recommend you set up a longer call with our team so we can go through this. Okay?  [00:04:52] Sarah: Oh, or if you want the short, shorter version and you're like, "Hey, I want to see it. It's visual." then go to YouTube on our YouTube channel. We have a video that we created about this and our hose just died and like, I think it froze over the winter and we went to go turn it on and everything was leaking. So then we were like, "Oh, Well, before we throw the hose away let's make a video because this is what we talk about all the time." [00:05:16] Yeah. So we did make a video. So if you want to visually see this and watch Jason get water everywhere and make a big mess, then watch a video.  [00:05:25] Jason: It's pretty goofy. So if you wanna laugh at me or make fun of me, that'd be a good one to watch. So just go to youtube.com/doorgrow and go to the playlists that we have and then go to funny videos and I'm sure you'll enjoy laughing at me and Sarah laugh at ourselves, especially. [00:05:44] All right. So let's chat about this, these leaks. So these are some of the things that may be preventing you from closing as many deals, and you may have plenty of leads, but you may not be closing as many as you could be. And so these are some of the leaks. So, there's six major leaks that we focus on in our Rapid Revamp class, and if you're interested in this class where we help you shore up all of these leaks so that you can more easily grow more quickly without even changing whatever lead generation stuff that you're already doing or what's working, this will increase the output of what makes it through the hose and to grow your business Okay, so the first leak at the very beginning, and these are all blind spots the most businesses have is Positioning and so in positioning, we focus on the brand branding And so what are some of the things related to branding? [00:06:37] Sarah: Well, the big one that we see a lot, and we did a video about this too is what is the name of your company? Is it something "real estate, realty, properties, investments, assets, solutions," things like that. So if any of those is how your brand name ends. then that could be a very potential big issue in your branding. [00:07:05] And you could be turning people off before they even decide to have a conversation with you.  [00:07:10] Jason: Yeah. People want to work with a specialist. They don't want to turn over their biggest assets ever and their financial future to somebody that's dabbling in property management but is primarily focused on real estate. [00:07:21] So if you have realty real estate in your name, for example, you have a significant leak here. So if a hundred percent flow through would be the ideal, you have maybe a 50% right at this stage. There's this there's loss. Is your name generic to the location? For example, you're Phoenix Property Management in Phoenix. [00:07:39] Or is it generic to the industry like property management inc? Sorry guys. Or real property management, right? These things are really difficult to remember right generic names. And that hurts word of mouth and it hurts people telling people about your business and all that kind of stuff, right? [00:07:55] So is it unclear that it's property management? Like Sarah mentioned, like maybe we're "Prestige Properties or Radiant Rentals." Radient Rentals, "oh, do you do bouncy houses and like chairs and stuff for weddings?" Right. So there might be confusion there in the marketplace, or do you have a overly common name? Could be a problem. Like lighthouse, just Google lighthouse property management, and there's like a bazillion companies all over the place that want to be a lighthouse. [00:08:19] And so they all get mixed up and confused, right? Because property management is a kind of a global competition. Even if it's only focused on a local market, right? You're getting investors from overseas sometimes you're getting investors from out of state. And so if they're trying to find you, "Oh, well, they said their name's light- oh man. There's a lot of lighthouse. I don't know." Right. And these are just some of the challenges with branding that we teach in our branding secrets and helping clean that up.  [00:08:45] Sarah: Yeah. And one of the worst things is if they're looking for you and then they find a competitor instead, or they find the same or a very similar named company, but they're nowhere near your market. [00:08:59] Because then what happens is you're now connected to this other company. Even if you're like, "well, I'm in Tennessee and this other company, yeah, but they're in like Nevada." Well, Oh, okay. You would think the distance alone would be enough to separate the two, however, we have to remember that sometimes people make mistakes and sometimes people don't read, right? [00:09:22] So if an angry tenant from that other company is like so fuming and they get on and they're like, "I am leaving a horrible review" and it hits your company just because you have a similar name and they didn't bother to read. Now we have issues.  [00:09:36] Jason: And there's lots of other challenges. You could have your name, like some clever misspelled name, like a barbershop called haircutz with a Z. [00:09:43] Sarah: Like my biggest pet peeve.  [00:09:44] Jason: Like there's lots of ways you can screw up branding.  [00:09:47] Sarah: Spell things correctly. Don't get cute.  [00:09:49] Jason: Or acronyms. Acronyms aren't super effective. Like PMI. Sorry guys. All right. So let's go to the second leak. So give yourself a rating on that. Like just a quick judgment, like on a scale of zero to a hundred, how effective is your brand in being memorable and in word of mouth and whatnot? [00:10:07] So maybe it's 50%. Maybe it's totally off in the category. Maybe it's worse. Maybe it's like 20, 30%. Next perception. This is reputation. How are you perceived online? What are your ratings maybe on Yelp, on Google, on Facebook? How many reviews do you have in relation to your competition? And what is your rating? So quantity diversity, do you have reviews on lots of channels? How do you compare to your competition in your local market? Because people are going to check you out. They're going to judge you. And if your reviews are bad, even if everything else you do is amazing, this can put, be a significant clamp in the hose. [00:10:45] And if your reviews are good, it backs up everything that you say in your sales pitch.  [00:10:50] Sarah: And if you have no reviews at all, this is also an issue. Yeah. So sometimes people go, "Oh, well, like I'm brand new. I don't have any reviews, so I don't have that problem yet." It's still a problem. It's just a problem in a different way. [00:11:02] Jason: So let's go to number three. So give yourself a rating on that. Zero to a hundred. Where are you at in relation to your competition? Are you the best reviewed company in your market? Are you like somewhere in the middle? Are you the worst, right? Or do you have no reputation, right? How are you perceived? [00:11:17] All right. So you have a number there. All right. Number three, presence. This is the website, right? Your online presence. So there's a lot of different roles related to the website. I'll, I can throw out a couple, a few real quick. If you really want to grade your website, and not just like how much does Google like it? [00:11:36] Not that if you want to grade your website, how much people like it, how effective it is for capturing business, right? How big of a leak do you have in the hose? Go to doorgrow.com/quiz and take our website quiz and grade your website. Do this, you might have a brand new, beautiful, amazing website and it's like just hemorrhaging and leaking money. [00:11:59] All traffic feeds to the website, right? Your reviews feed to the website. Everything goes there. Your ads feed to the website. Take a look at this leak and get your grade and see what it is. And we're happy to then get on a call with you and tell you why your website sucks, help you figure out like how to make it better. [00:12:16] So, couple of quick things. It should answer three core questions like above the fold when they first land on the page, what you visibly can see in on the screen should answer that there are three core questions, which is, "do you do what I need in the place I need it? What do you do and where?" And second, "why should I choose you to do it over your competition?" And then third is "what do you want me to do?" There should be some sort of call to action. Most websites don't even have those three really basic things, three basic questions that people have. So that's a great starting point And then there's other things like how many menu items do you have? [00:12:54] If you have too many menu items, it actually decreases conversion rates. Do you have like distractions like social media icons and different things trying to send people away from your website which can decrease conversion rates and getting business and leads. Do you have trust symbols and social proof and testimonials and things that increase conversion rates? [00:13:14] Do you have a lead capture form on the page? We've studied this for well over a decade. We've studied this the top website companies that target and focus on property management try to copy our stuff without understanding the psychology behind it and try and copy our designs. [00:13:33] I believe we build the most effective and the most beautiful websites in the industry. And so if this is an issue, DoorGrow can help you with this. So, talk to us and get a new website.  [00:13:44] Sarah: Before we move on, I just learned this yesterday, I think yesterday or the day before. So if your website was once amazing. [00:13:51] And you're like, "no, my website is great. It's so awesome." But it's old. Then it's not doing you the good that you think it is. And maybe at one point it was, maybe it was so fantastic. But now all of a sudden, if things seem like they dried up a little bit, it could be that it needs a little bit of a refresh. [00:14:10] And apparently the shelf life on a website is about two to three years and then it needs. To be redone.  [00:14:17] Jason: Yeah, this is true. I've forgotten about this. I'm totally aware of this, but I just, I forgot that other people don't realize this. And so websites have a shelf life just like fashion does, just like anything else does. [00:14:30] And so websites start to look stale or out of date or old and create the perception of being old too. So a lot of people don't perceive that their website is actually looking stale and looking old and causing issues for them, right? [00:14:45] And people will perceive you, "Oh, this company's more modern and we're up to date or fresh or is with it or gets it, and this company it looks like they've been in business forever, maybe. They're using old techniques and they don't know what they're doing, right? So make sure your business is no older than maybe two to three years. [00:15:03] It's probably time.  [00:15:04] Sarah: Not your business. Your website.  [00:15:05] Jason: Yeah, sorry.  [00:15:06] Sarah: If your business is three years...  [00:15:09] Jason: just get rid of it. So if your website, usually people will go until about five years. By five years, it's usually visibly painful, and this is usually where business owners reach out to us for a new website. [00:15:22] If your website is five years old or older, it's due. And you know it, like you can look at it and go, "this doesn't look fresh." All right. So good point. All right, next is pricing.  [00:15:32] Sarah: I love the pricing calls that we do. They're so good.  [00:15:35] Jason: It's such a magic trick. [00:15:35] Sarah: And also people get stuck here for a really long time.  [00:15:39] Jason: Yeah, so most pricing, just to be clear, is set by companies focusing on the worst people in the market. They're focused on the cheapos and they're focused on what they can capture through internet marketing, which are the worst leads. And so the cheapos are really price sensitive. [00:15:56] So it creates this sort of downward race to the bottom in terms of price. So, most people typically do a 10 percent in most markets. Maybe a little less than that in really high rent markets, or they'll do some sort of flat fee. So, Most pricing is not good and it's probably similar to what everyone else in your market is doing, and so you look the same as everybody else. [00:16:17] So there's unique methodology in doing pricing. And so we focus on our unique blend of what we call a three tier hybrid pricing model, which focuses on three different types of buyers psychologically and creates a proper incentive to get more high rent properties, less lower end properties and it lowers your operational costs, right? [00:16:41] Because the higher rent properties generally have a lower operational costs and they make you more money. Right. And so your pricing model is probably unknowingly incentivizing you getting on some of the worst clients and the worst properties and not helping you to set yourself apart from the competition. [00:16:58] So we've never had anyone really come to us with good pricing, never. And so we've always helped people clean this up. And then they close more deals more easily at a higher price point. And you might think that's crazy, but that's what we do.  [00:17:11] Sarah: And they tell us that!  [00:17:12] Jason: Yeah. [00:17:12] Sarah: We're not just saying it. [00:17:14] Like our clients tell us that they're like, "Oh, I didn't think I was going to do this and I didn't want to and I didn't even think it was going to work, so I figured I'd try it and then i'll just change it back when it doesn't work," And every time, they are so surprised and they love it and they're like "man I really wish I did this sooner." [00:17:30] That would have been so much better if I did this.  [00:17:32] Jason: They usually get a significant number of their clients upgrading to a premium tier so they're making more money off their existing portfolio right away. And so usually pricing's this magic trick we can pull out of our hat that we can immediately pay for if they have a decent number of clients. [00:17:47] We can immediately pay for our program and our program's now basically free, right? So let's get into the next one. So rate your pricing, if it's typical of everybody else then maybe you give yourself, if you want you can give yourself a 60 70 percent or something like that, but I would say it's a 50 percent because the profit margin difference can be pretty significant, right? [00:18:08] But give yourself some sort of rating if you're cheaper than most of your competitors give yourself below a 50 percent Like you're worse than everybody else. So give yourself a number there. What's your leak? All right next:  [00:18:18] Purpose. This is the most important thing that we take clients through. This causes not just a leak in your sales pipeline, but it causes a leak with your team and a leak with financials. It's one of the greatest profitability hacks. [00:18:30] It's one of our greatest. Sales hacks, and it sounds like woo fluffy BS, but purpose is the most significant thing that we do in companies. And our clients tell us this was the most significant thing that we did. So what do you want to say about purpose?  [00:18:45] Sarah: Yeah. So this is usually where we start in our rapid revamp and then, and only then can we then continue on with the rest of the class because everything stems from this. So if you're trying to fix your pricing and you don't understand your company culture yet, it's not going to make sense because you're going to have to redo your pricing. If you're trying to fix your website and your branding and your online perception, but you haven't figured out. the foundation of where all of these other things come from, then it doesn't matter because you're going to have to go back and fix it anyway, because you don't really have clarity on that. But once you get clarity on that, everything else becomes so much easier now.  [00:19:23] Jason: Yeah. So the way to score this is, some questions you might ask are do you have maybe three or four core values defined? [00:19:31] If you have a lot more than that, then give yourself a lower score because that means really, it means nothing. Do you have a clearly defined mission for the business? Are you clear on who you're targeting and is it clearly defined and written down? Like, how do they know what a good client looks like versus a bad one? [00:19:46] Right. Are you clear on your personal motivations for why you have this business beyond just getting money? That in a way that you could relate it clearly your personal why? Are you clear on the business's purpose or your team? Right? So do you have a ceo decision making guide so others know how you think on your team, right? [00:20:03] There's a lot of different things that deliverables in the purpose Weeks in our rapid revamp that we help businesses define, and it changes the profitability. It changes everything in the business. So based on these questions, give yourself a rating on zero to 100 percent and figure out where you're at. [00:20:19] And if you don't have a lot of these things defined, then give yourself a pretty low grade, right? Next is pitch. So purpose feeds into the pitch and so you need those things defined. But what's your sales pitch like? Is it basically just answer questions and then hope they sign up? [00:20:35] Which is bad. That's pretty weak, right? Or do you, for example, like us have a four phase process that's systematically like getting clear on what they need and breaking things down and then figuring out like how to deal with objections and et cetera. Right. What's your sales pitch? How effective is it? [00:20:53] Do you have visuals that maybe facilitate that, et cetera? Right. So if you feel like you have a high close rate, right. But it's just warm leads like a referral. You're you have a really high close rate, that doesn't mean you have a good pitch. That doesn't mean you're good at selling. That just means they were a warm lead, right? [00:21:09] So in dealing with colder leads or where it's competitive or they're looking at you and several other competitors, how good are you at convincing them to use you over everybody else? May help you see how effective your pitch is right on colder leads or more lukewarm leads, right? So give yourself a rating on pitch. [00:21:25] Anything else related to pitch  [00:21:27] Sarah: So I'll just one more time reiterate the company culture, you can't have a good sales pitch if you don't first know your company culture. Yeah. So if you're like, "Oh wait, like my pitch is so good. I can close anybody." You're missing your company culture and you do not have that piece defined, there is no way that you can have a great sales pitch, at least in the way that we teach it. So we have the golden bridge formula. You can not do the golden bridge formula if you do not first understand your why and your business why. You don't have those two pieces? You're not doing the golden bridge. And without the golden bridge, sales just gets hard. It just gets hard. And then it's like, "well, like I don't want to be pushy, but also I want to close deals and I have to sell people and like, I don't know, I'm in this loop I don't understand why I can't close things and like, this should be easier." And then people go and they take a bunch of courses to learn how to do sales better. [00:22:23] You can just have a better sales pitch.  [00:22:25] Jason: Yeah. Good point. So to sum all this up, all of these leaks are leaks in trust. And if in your pitch, for example, you are trying to sell property management, you're selling the wrong product. Nobody really cares about property management. That's not what they want to buy. [00:22:42] And so what they really want to buy is peace of mind or safety and certainty. They want to buy, they're buying their trust in you. They want trust. And so all of these leaks in the pipeline relate to trust. They're all trust leaks, sales and deals happen. You could write this down, tattoo it on your forehead. [00:22:59] Don't do that. Put it up on your wall. Sales and deals happen at the speed of trust. And so if you have any of these major trust leaks, you are just wasting time, energy, money, focus, cash effort. Right. And so let's get these leaks all shored up. It doesn't make sense to keep putting blood transfusions into somebody when they have their arm chopped off and they're just hemorrhaging blood. [00:23:22] That's pretty gruesome, but  [00:23:24] Sarah: yeah  [00:23:24] Jason: Stop the bleeding first. And then, "Hey, it makes sense now. Now that we've stopped this major bleeding, let's now take care of things. Right?" And so get these things dialed in and shored up and what you'll find is: you may not need nearly as many leads. [00:23:39] You won't have to spend nearly as much money on advertising or any money. Our clients don't, most of them don't spend any money on ads or lead generation, and they actually had doors faster than their competitors that are. And so this is the starting point. Get this stuff cleaned up. It's like sharpening the ax first, before you go and chop down trees, do the smart thing first and everything else becomes easier. [00:23:59] And this really is lubricating your entire sales process. Everything flows through a lot easier. And so you could double your deals flowing through without changing any of your lead sources that you've already got going right now, just by shoring these up. And so get these blind spots dialed in and reach out to us at DoorGrow. [00:24:15] And we'll tell you about a rapid revamp program where we tackle each of these leaks in two weeks, two weeks for each leak. And so it's a 90 day program. It's really rapid and it will transform the front end of your business forever. Okay. That's it. So you can find us at DoorGrow. com and until next time to our mutual growth. [00:24:35] Bye everyone. [00:24:36] you just listened to the #DoorGrowShow. We are building a community of the savviest property management entrepreneurs on the planet in the DoorGrowClub. Join your fellow DoorGrow Hackers at doorgrowclub.com. Listen, everyone is doing the same stuff. SEO, PPC, pay-per-lead content, social direct mail, and they still struggle to grow!  [00:25:03] At DoorGrow, we solve your biggest challenge: getting deals and growing your business. Find out more at doorgrow.com. Find any show notes or links from today's episode on our blog doorgrow.com, and to get notified of future events and news subscribe to our newsletter at doorgrow.com/subscribe. Until next time, take what you learn and start DoorGrow Hacking your business and your life.

As property managers you likely know a little bit about mortgages. But do you know about non-QM loan strategies and how your clients and investors can utilize them? In this episode of the #DoorGrowShow, property management growth experts Jason and Sarah Hull sit down with Matt from Nexa Mortgage to talk about using non-QM strategies to unlock your portfolio's potential. You'll Learn [05:46] QM loans VS non-QM loans [16:14] Why Jason and Sarah went with non-QM [22:07] Which one should you choose? [26:46] Why should property managers know this? [32:23] What about long-term rentals Tweetables “If you have a great manager, it makes sense to get as many properties as you possibly can, knowing that they are in good hands and they are being taken care of because all you're doing is printing money.” “If you have a way that you can help your investor clients get what they want, which is more deals, it's a win.” “If you are a property manager, you should also be an investor in real estate.” “It's great to manage properties and let's do that and build wealth ourselves.” Resources DoorGrow and Scale Mastermind DoorGrow Academy DoorGrow on YouTube DoorGrowClub DoorGrowLive TalkRoute Referral Link Transcript [00:00:00] Sarah: He said, "I am not joking. I had to submit over 100 documents to the company in order to just see if I'm qualified to get this additional loan. And he's like, I just feel like there has to be an easier way." And there is, but sometimes people don't know about that.   [00:00:20] Jason: Welcome DoorGrow property managers to the DoorGrow show. If you are a property management entrepreneur that wants to add doors, make a difference, increase revenue, help others, impact lives, and you are interested in growing in business and life, and you're open to doing things a bit differently, then you are a DoorGrow property manager. [00:00:39] DoorGrow property managers love the opportunities, daily variety, unique challenges, and freedom that property management brings. Many in real estate think you're crazy for doing it. You think they're crazy for not because you realize that property management is the ultimate high trust gateway to real estate deals, relationships, and residual income. At DoorGrow we are on a mission to transform property management business owners and their businesses. We want to transform the industry, eliminate the BS, build awareness, change perception, expand the market, and help the best property management entrepreneurs win. We're your hosts, property management, growth experts, Jason and Sarah Hull, the CEO and COO of DoorGrow. Now let's get into the show.  [00:01:23] All right. And today we're hanging out with Matt Dean of Nexa Mortgage, and we're going to have an interesting conversation about financing and loans and I don't know, and some other stuff, but Matt welcome to the show.  [00:01:36] Matthew: Good morning. [00:01:37] Good morning. Thanks for having me.  [00:01:38] Jason: It's good to have you. So give us a little bit of background of how you got into the whole real estate industry and give people a little bit of background on you.  [00:01:49] Matthew: Sure. So, after I graduated from college, which I went to college in Missouri, I ended up moving to Austin, Texas, and one of the first jobs I got was with a commercial finance company and that landed me in Lakeway, which is where I reside now, and have been for over 15 years. But the commercial finance company that I worked with was was a fairly new company that came in from California. The owners Had a mortgage background and had gotten into this commercial finance division. [00:02:15] They had sold off a couple of mortgage companies opened up this division and Lakeway. They were also land developers and commercial finance guys. So they saw a lot of opportunity out here and opened up this company. So anyway, I got in on the ground floor. They were relocating the company here and had a couple year run with that. [00:02:31] And then in early 2000, the .Com kind of came in and blew up that whole industry. So what we were doing was commercial finance, equipment finance really, and at the time it was a lot of computer equipment and I was working with a lot of Dell sales reps that were taking over some of their overflow that Dell didn't want to finance. [00:02:49] So, when all that happened, and it blew up the owners who had the mortgage background really saw that "hey, we're going to see a refinance run here. The market's going to crash rates are going to come down. There's going to be a run." And so they immediately just flip. They had a mortgage company here, but it wasn't early. It was dormant. Yeah. And they flipped it open and and just started building that company out. And so that's ultimately how I got into the mortgage business. And, right after that, we had this really big refinance run. We grew that company very quickly to about 35 employees where we were doing 300 to 400 loans a month with a fairly small company. [00:03:27] And that just, jump straight in and learn the business. And so then in about 2007 ish, 2006 ish, I really got exposed to the investment world, so to speak. I got partnered up with a real estate brokerage here in Austin that focused on investment properties and primarily what they were focusing on was duplexes. [00:03:47] And so that year in 2006, I believe it closed 152 duplex transactions, and it was mainly California investors coming into Austin. And it really just changed my whole perspective of the mortgage industry as opposed to first time buyers or veterans, which I enjoy working with all those folks, but the commercial or the investment world, it's a different animal in that it's less emotion and more about business. And so I really just gravitated more to working with investors, started buying properties myself managed a few properties myself and then, evolved from there. But I worked with that same group and Lakeway for about 12 years and then moved around a couple of places and work for a builder and and a couple other companies. [00:04:29] But anyway, that's how I got in it, got started.  [00:04:31] Jason: Yeah, so you've seen it from a few different angles than the whole real estate investment industry, sounds like. [00:04:37] Matthew: Yeah, I've been through a few of these cycles of ups and downs. Obviously the refinance run early on was, really interesting, but a lot of good, easy money on the table, so to speak, but then we had the crash, which was a very difficult time for a couple of years, although, Austin weathered that storm pretty well relative to a lot of other areas of the country. [00:04:56] So, even though our volumes were down, our real estate didn't see as big of an equity loss and the job market here in Austin's always been really strong. So, it pulled us back out of it fairly quickly. We're in a situation now where rates are high and property values have gone up. [00:05:11] And it's a challenge for some folks here to purchase. A lot of folks are just priced out of the market and can't afford it. And property taxes aren't helping that situation.  [00:05:19] Jason: Yeah,  [00:05:20] Sarah: It's so pricey here. So pricey.  [00:05:22] Matthew: But we're starting to see a little bit of pull back on the values and the houses. It's a little bit more of a buyer's market now, but it still needs to come down a little bit, I think in my opinion, it's to balance the market again.  [00:05:34] Jason: Interesting. So the topic today is unlock your portfolio potential, non QM strategies for real estate investors. And for those that don't know what QM is, which I don't. So educate me. What's QM?  [00:05:47] Sarah: So I handled all of this stuff and Jason got to the closing table and he's like, "I'm an owner in the LLC, right?"  [00:05:54] Matthew: It's like, yeah, I barely talked to you along the way, but anyway, yeah, so let's talk a little bit about QM and how that all started. So, after the real estate crash in the 2006, 2007, eight ish area the CFPB was formed a consumer finance protection bureau, which took over the regulation with the mortgage industry. [00:06:12] It took them a few years, but in 2014 they implemented what was called TRID, which you may have heard that word, but it was where we got rid of the good faith estimate and integrated the new loan estimate and closing disclosure took over. And at that same point in time, the regulations came out and then classified conventional loans or reclassified them as qualified mortgages. [00:06:35] What that means really is the CFPB was trying to put protections in place to protect consumers and also strengthen guidelines to make sure that people or buyers had the ability to repay. So what that really meant was additional restrictions on ability to repay, debt ratio requirements, reserve assets, et cetera. [00:06:55] So, if you do a conventional loan, which is Fannie, Freddie. Those are considered qualified mortgages. They have additional protections in that you're maxed at the amount of fees you can charge a buyer. The APR has to be within guidelines within a maximum. So all those things are really for consumer protection, right? [00:07:14] At the same time, what caused the market crash before was what subprime mortgages. And so at the time, subprime mortgages initially had a place in the market. They really were good for investors because investors were putting money down, they had good credit typically, and they had reserve assets. [00:07:35] When the market shifted, and they started using subprime loans to qualify buyers for primary residences that really had no business buying homes is where it got in trouble. So after QM was announced or came out with CFPB, then they also had non QM loans. What that means is any loan that falls outside of the qualified mortgage guidelines, for whatever reason, can still be funded or it would fall within non QM. [00:07:59] Non QM just meant if you're a lender who does those type of loans, you're now required to hold additional reserve assets in your bank or your mortgage company per loan to cover for the potential higher risk and default.  [00:08:12] Jason: Okay.  [00:08:13] Matthew: And it took a few years from 2014. The market started to come out with products in 2015. [00:08:18] The industry was really not sure how to handle it. A lot of banks didn't want to even dive into it. And then it started to evolve. And "okay, there's a big market here." So now it's one of the fastest growing segments of the market and banks have realize or figured out how to meet the ability to repay guidelines with alternative methods, right? [00:08:41] So you don't have to have W2s and tax returns and pay stubs, which a conventional QM loan would require. Now, they look at different factor, like, 12 months business bank statements. I can look at a CPA prepared profit and loss statement, I can look at just the rent income on the property and that's what's classified or called DSCR. [00:09:03] And then also it's asset based loans where we just look at the asset and we turn the asset into a revenue stream. So that's really how non QM started and really what it is. It's just an alternative way of qualifying the mortgages that falls outside of the Fannie Freddie conventional type of loans. [00:09:21] Jason: Got it.  [00:09:21] Sarah: So what does that mean for investors? Because we have some investors that listen to us and we have some property managers who work with investors. So what would that mean for an investor that is looking to get into more investment properties?  [00:09:39] Matthew: Yeah, absolutely. So, the challenge that a lot of investors run into is a lot of them are self employed and a lot of them start accumulating property. [00:09:48] So if they fall into either one of those categories, either they're self employed. Or they've accumulated a lot of properties or both, right? The challenge becomes with qualified mortgages is from an income perspective, right? So good CPAs are going to try and shelter income for self employed borrowers and for investors by showing, minimal profits or minimal or losses on their properties. [00:10:11] And so, as investors start to accumulate more properties, it becomes more challenging to qualify for conventional loans, because for every property on a conventional loan, Fannie and Freddie want additional reserve assets. So that means you start getting 6 properties, you need assets for each one of those properties on top of down payment funds for the purchase property and the reserves on that property. [00:10:33] So, from two perspectives, either an income perspective, where we have a challenge again, a self employed borrower shows losses on his tax returns for the last 5 years by design, because he doesn't want to pay taxes, or we've got multiple properties also showing losses when I'm looking at income on a conventional loan basis, I have to use the income from the tax return. [00:10:52] So losses can be a problem. Also, the reserve requirements, so, taking into those two scenarios, you've got a self employed borrower that, let's say they, they have gross revenue of half a million dollars, but they're showing losses of, 50-60-70,000 dollars. We're just looking at 12 months bank statements in that case, which gives us gross revenue and then we back out of a factor of say, 25 to 30 percent for taxes and we use that as revenue or income to qualify. If we have an investor that, let's say, not necessarily self employed they have multiple rental properties that are basically just, showing losses and now their income is diminished to where they can't qualify. [00:11:32] Then we have the debt service coverage ratio programs. Like, we utilize with your property where we're looking at just the rent on the property. Right? So the rent the market rent or the short term rental just needs to cover the principal interest, taxes, insurance and fees. And so those are 2 products that we use and that's really how, I would say it helps investors in those scenarios. [00:11:54] The other products that we could look at are P& L products meaning that ACPA provides a P& L statement, and then we can use that income, or if they have significant assets just in investment funds and whatnot, we can turn that into a revenue stream. But the bottom line is it just eliminates the need for W 2s, tax returns, or pay stubs, and we look at other alternative income sources to qualify. [00:12:18] Sarah: It's funny. I was actually on Instagram the last week, I think. And there's this guy, he has a very large account and I can't remember his name. And he's very big on investing in real estate. And he said, "guys, like, I just need some help. I like I'm going through this whole process and you jumped through 10, 000 hoops." and he said, "I am not joking. I had to submit over 100 documents to the company in order to just see if I'm qualified to get this additional loan. And he's like, I just feel like there has to be an easier way." And there is, but sometimes people don't know about that. I still talk to investors and property managers and they don't know. [00:13:02] They're like, "I'm just too conventional. That's like what you do. That's like the normal thing that we're all trained and used to doing." So just knowing that there are other options that don't require all of these crazy hoops to jump through and all of this documentation and lots of red tape and underwriting. [00:13:22] It's not that it's eliminated. It's just that it's a lot easier of a process and especially if you're a savvy investor that takes a loss on your taxes, just because your tax return shows a loss, it doesn't actually mean that you're losing money, right? So there's a big difference there. So that plays a big part too. [00:13:43] Matthew: Yeah, there are investors. Sorry. I didn't mean to jump in there, but there are definitely investors that lean on that from a documentation standpoint. Right? They've been down this road. They have multiple properties and more properties, you have the more documentation you need to provide to try and qualify for those conventional loans and it just becomes more and more challenging. [00:14:00] And, even more so if you have a loan officer on the front end of that's trying to originate a loan, that isn't really versed in investment properties and doesn't know how to underwrite the tax returns, they can get in trouble. They look, "oh, I got good credit. I've got down payments." But when you try and pull together tax returns and the income from multiple properties and business losses and this and that, it becomes very complex. And it's honestly, a lot of loan officers don't even know how to look at that correctly. And so they just throw the file up. It goes to underwriting. And then 2 weeks later, they've got a problem. But I just closed a deal actually yesterday and it was ended up going non QM short term rental. And the gentleman is great credit owns his own businesses, owns multiple properties and schools here, but the documentation, because he owns, like, 8 companies and probably 7 or 8 rental properties, and he had a partner in this particular property that, It became so complicated with trying to pull some of that stuff together and also with the partner who wasn't necessarily as strong as him where it just made sense for us to go short term rental and move on. [00:15:07] And that's what we did. So we just made it easy. He was happy that he didn't have to continue to jump through all those hoops. And we were able to get the property done and close in about two and a half weeks.  [00:15:17] Jason: You said it made sense to go short term rental. You meant to go non QM. Is that what you meant? [00:15:21] Matthew: To go non QM. Yeah. We went short term rental income, which is non QM to qualify the income on the property. This happens to be a short term rental down on the Comal River and it's got great income. It just he had a private money loan on it when he purchased it needed to refinance the note was coming due and he just has a very complex financial situation. [00:15:43] And he got involved with a partner on this property that also created some challenges with that particular situation and just made it a lot easier to use him and go non QM short term rental income only and just get it done.  [00:15:54] Jason: So, would that be a DSCR loan going on the short term rental income? [00:15:59] Or is that different?  [00:15:59] Matthew: Yes, it is technically a DSCR loan, which means debt service coverage ratio. And this is what we utilize with your property as well, by the way. we're looking at either long term rents.  [00:16:10] Jason: We should tell that story, by the way, everyone listening has no clue. [00:16:13] Sarah: I know, right?  [00:16:14] Jason: Why don't we have Sarah explain like why we went this route, how we ended up talking with Matt and like how this all worked out.  [00:16:21] Sarah: Okay, let's do that. So, Jason, oddly proudly, he's like, "I've never owned a rental property and I've never managed a rental property. And I do this now." And I said, "this is nothing to be proud of. Like you're 46, you should own things. You should have assets." So like I, on the other hand, like I had, in my twenties, I started investing in real estate. So, Jason and I for a while have been saying like, "when are we going to get one together?" [00:16:48] Because we didn't have one yet and he never had one.  [00:16:51] Then also our circumstances in life have changed a little bit. And we thought " we need an additional property at this point." And we were in a unique situation where right now in Austin, I'll just start by saying long term rental is hard to make it make sense financially. [00:17:10] You're probably not going to cashflow.  [00:17:13] Jason: Yeah.  [00:17:13] Sarah: Not right now. Anyway, it's just, it's really hard because prices are high. And interest rates are also high. This is where we are. So we couldn't have possibly done a long term rental anyway, because we needed the property to have some personal use on it. [00:17:28] And we decided, "Hey, let's also use it for some of our DoorGrow events." Because every time that we do an event, We pay somebody else.  [00:17:37] So let's pay ourselves through that. So for that reason, it only can really be used as a short term rental property. So we decided, "Hey, there's these kind of three components." [00:17:48] And I'm really big on asset protection, meaning I need the property to be owned and deeded and financed in an LLC. So originally I was working with another agent. We've worked with him before on our primary home. He's a really great agent. I had asked him about, "can we fund it in the name of an LLC?" [00:18:09] And he said, "no you can't do that. It doesn't really work that way." And it seemed like he was just trying to talk us out of it. I even talked with that he typically uses and that we used on our, Home that we live in. And he said, "Oh no, yeah, we don't do properties in the LLC. It'll be in your name. And then after closing, we could do a quick claim and then like change the deed and put the deed in the LLC name." And I said, "okay, what about the mortgage?" And he said, "no. The mortgage stays in your name." And I said, "I'm out." Like that is where I'm out. You're piercing the veil. [00:18:44] All of my personal assets would now be exposed and on the line. And that completely defeats the purpose of having an LLC. And he was like, yeah, we just don't do that. I really don't think that's going to be a problem. So I said, "okay, do you know anybody now he's been in this business for like 20 or 30 years?" [00:19:02] "Do you know anybody that can do that?" And he said, "Oh, not really." So that was time to start looking for somebody else because I know that it can be done. I've done it in Pennsylvania. So there's no way that Texas can't do this. Texas is far ahead of Pennsylvania in a lot of different ways.  [00:19:19] Jason: So we found another agent. [00:19:20] Sarah: So we found another agent who then referred us to Matt and he said, "Hey, I know a guy. He's really great. And I'm pretty sure he can do what you need." So I said, "great. What's his information?" I had a conversation with Matt and he's like, "Oh, well, yeah, we can do that." And I said, "so you can put the loan in the LLC. Not my name, the LLC. He said yeah, we can do that." Like it was easy. So it can be done. Sometimes you just have to look around a little bit. So that was how our deal was structured. So we went non QM and we ended up doing, since it is a short term rental, we went DSCR so that the rents would cover essentially your PITI. [00:20:00] And this is how we made our deal work. So we closed PITI. [00:20:06] Jason: PITI for the listeners is...  [00:20:07] Sarah: principal interest taxes insurance. [00:20:11] Matthew: Yeah, so, I know that was how our conversation started was, " can we do this in the LLC?" And we walked through that and the pros and cons a little bit, I think, and that's one thing that conventional QM loans don't really not really, they don't allow that. You cannot fund in an LLC. [00:20:25] Now, what happens is a lot of people like you were advised, "hey, fund it in your name, slip it to the LLC later." That can cause some problems because Fannie Mae does have due on sale clauses in their loan documents. So, technically, if there's an ownership change, that note can be called due. Typically, you can just flip it back into your name and stop that process, but it becomes a cat and mouse game back and forth if you have a servicer that's trying to, exercise that for some reason, it doesn't happen very often. It's not a very high risk, but it's definitely something you need to be aware of. On the non QM side, the lenders want these, or most of them prefer them to be funded into LLCs because non QM as a whole is considered business purpose lending. [00:21:11] It falls outside of the consumer protection, finance protection Bureau oversight. So, it's considered or classified more of like a commercial loan. And so most of them require, or want you to fund into an LLC. There are some that will do them in their personal names. It's interesting. They follow more of a conventional loan program, which I'm not really sure I understand, because they issue a closing disclosure and they look at loan estimates, even though it's considered a non loan. So they just handle a little bit differently. Those companies will allow you to do it in your name and some of them are doing a lot of those companies are also doing primary residences under a non QM basis. So bank statement products for somebody who may be self employed also trying to buy a primary residence. That's where I see it more. Most of the the LLC stuff is for investors and those lenders are going to. Really prefer or require it to be in an LLC. [00:22:07] Jason: Got it. Okay, cool. So what should investors know in order to make the decision as to which way they should go? Like, how do you make the deciding factor? Like, what are some of the things that kind of weigh into this?  [00:22:20] Matthew: Yeah, I think really it's a conversation initially of can they qualify for a conventional loan? Do they understand what non QM loans have to offer? A lot of investors aren't familiar with the details of non QM loans, how they work, how they can help them. So it's really an education conversation of, what options we may have available. Right? I would always start with the conventional loans typically and, see if we can qualify. If you can go that route and you're putting 25 percent down you're going to get a little bit better interest rates. And then you don't have some of the other key factors that come with non QM loans. So most non QM loans do have some sort of prepayment penalty because they're selling these to a secondary hedge fund investor that wants a minimum return. So, in most cases, you're going to have a prepayment penalty in a conventional loan. Stay out of point. A QM loan legally cannot have a prepayment penalty. [00:23:14] So there's a big difference there. But as far as qualifying them, it's a really, like I said, an education and a conversation about what their profile looks like. Right? They self employed. Do they own multiple properties? Are they showing losses or profits on those properties? And then, really documenting that, 9 times out of 10, what I'm told on a verbal conversation doesn't match what I get on the documentation that way. [00:23:38] "Oh, my business makes this," but they're talking about gross revenue, not net income. They're talking about gross rent amounts, not the net income they're showing on their tax returns. So it needs to go the next level. But that initial conversation may determine quite quickly that, hey, we need to go non for what reason or, because they want to fund it in an LLC, because the property is really a short term rental, but it doesn't but they don't have any history of short term rental management. [00:24:07] And let's talk just a little bit about, how you look at the short term rental. I know that's what we were talking a little bit about before we talked about your loan, right? So there's 2 ways to look at that short term rental and it's either from well, the rental income short term or long term can either come from an appraiser. [00:24:23] Or from a software program that some lenders are now using. So a lot of lenders will lean on a typical, appraisal to an appraiser to come up with whatever that market rent may be. And like, like, you said, it's difficult to cash flow properties in Austin or in Texas. On long term rents simply because the property taxes have escalated and now with higher interest rates. [00:24:48] So a lot of times, the short term rental is really from a lending perspective an easier way to qualify the property for 1. But we do have the ability to look at it from two different perspectives and this is what we utilized on your loan. So I'll just talk about a little bit. So I have a couple lenders that will look at the short term rental from a software perspective. [00:25:05] Right? So in your case. When we had the discussion, it was really a matter of, yeah, "I really want to put 20 percent down. I don't want to put additional money down. That would be more important to me than a little bit higher interest rate. Right?" And so, when we look at different lenders that may be leaning on an appraisal. [00:25:21] I don't know what that number is for 2 weeks and me personally I feel like appraisers, especially in the short term rental market. Are a little bit lazy and sometimes they just don't have the data. So what happens is I submitted to the lender based on an 80 percent loan to value. And then all of a sudden, my short term rental income comes back low or lower than what we may have expected. [00:25:42] And now that's requiring you to put an additional 5 percent down to meet their guidelines of a debt service coverage ratio less than one or go no ratio, right? We still have an option, but the option is going to require you to put a little bit more money down. And so. Again, we have two ways to look at it either an appraisals given us that number or with some investors. [00:26:00] And this is why I like working with some of those in that case. Like I said, your most important factor is 20 percent down. so I took it to a lender that gave me that short term rental number within 48 hours. They ran it through their system. They gave it to me immediately and said, "this is where we should be." As soon as we submitted the loan to underwriting within 2 days, we had an approval and this was confirmed short term rental amount. We didn't have to wait on the appraiser and it didn't matter what the appraiser's opinion was. They already confirmed what we were going to use, which confirmed that I could get your loan approved with just 20 percent down. So, that's a preferred method in a lot of ways, especially if we're trying to keep that 20 percent down number. [00:26:38] If we have somebody that's putting 25-30 percent down, then it's. A little bit less relevant and we can, decide what option might be best for them at that point.  [00:26:46] Jason: Got it. So why should property managers who are constantly wanting to do more deals, help more investors, why should they have somebody like Matt in their back pocket? [00:26:57] Sarah: Oh, that's such a good question. Well, I want to think of it kind of twofold. One, I feel like if you are a property manager, you should also be an investor in real estate. Real estate agents just by having access to the MLS. No, that's not where all deals come from. I know that, but just by having access to the MLS and the connections that you have as a real estate agent and property manager, there's no chance that you don't come across amazing deals all the time. [00:27:23] There's no chance. So capitalize on that.  [00:27:26] You should also be an investor yourself. It's great to manage properties and let's do that and build wealth ourselves. Yeah. So that's number one. But number two is if you're like, "well, I like, I don't know, I'm unsure, or maybe I have one property or two properties and I don't know if I'm ready to continue to build a portfolio." [00:27:46] Or you're like, "Hey, I have X many properties and I'm happy right here. I don't want any more." I don't know why, but maybe you are. So if that's the case and you have investor clients that very likely would love to get into more deals themselves. And it would be great for you because now if you have an investor and they manage five doors, but that same investor can now manage 10, 20, 38. [00:28:11] That's fantastic because now your business is growing. So if you have a way that you can help your investor clients get what they want, which is more deals, it's a win because yes, the savvy investors, they're always looking for more deals. Jason's hooked now. He said to me, we closed and he was like, "how do we do another one? like, how do we do another one?" He's like, "how fast can we do another one? Like Sarah, is it possible if we do like one property a year," right? And he did. Yeah, he did. There's a lot of investors like that because once you get it. Once you really get to see all of the benefits and just how freaking beautiful it is to be a real estate investor and make money and get all of the tax benefits that you don't get in almost any other sector. [00:28:54] It's amazing. So why would you not want more of that? So if you're a property manager, it would make so much sense for you to just be able to educate your investor clients. "Hey, have you ever thought of picking up more properties?" The answer probably is going to be "yes," especially if you're doing a great job for them as a property manager. [00:29:14] Because that's a tricky part is, "well, I could buy a bunch of properties, but who's going to manage them?" If you have a great manager, it makes sense to get as many properties as you possibly can, knowing that they are in good hands and they are being taken care of because all you're doing is printing money. [00:29:30] So if you want to grow your portfolio by adding additional deals to the clients that you already have. It's like so simple, right? Why would we not do that? So having options. that not everybody knows about. It's fantastic.  [00:29:47] Jason: So in short, this just gives them a lot more options to work with because investors want to invest, and they may think, "Oh, well, I've only got this much down or I can only do a conventional, I can only do it this way. I need to meet certain criteria" or "I've just declared all these losses."  [00:30:04] Sarah: "Like I have too much debt." Maybe their like debt to income is a little maxed out because we're, keeping up with the Joneses. This is so normal, right? So that and Matt's laughing. He sees it all the time. [00:30:15] I bet he's like, "Oh, we went a little too high on that one." [00:30:18] there's good debt and bad debt though as well, right?  [00:30:21] Correct. However, if you own five properties or six properties or seven properties, every additional property that you have that is leveraged, meaning that you have a mortgage on it, that's counting against you and your debt to income ratio. [00:30:35] Jason: Right. So it gets harder and harder using conventional to get into more property.  [00:30:40] Sarah: Unless you're the Fed and you can just print money.  [00:30:42] Jason: Well, I don't know if they're buying  [00:30:44] Matthew: a lot of money.  [00:30:44] But you bring up a good point and just to clarify when we do a debt service coverage ratio program, I'm not looking at any of your debt. [00:30:52] I'm not looking at a debt ratio calculation at all. And if you own multiple properties, I'm not even looking at any of those other properties for any sort of rent, income, verification, mortgage, anything. This one is a business, right? Correct. It's it. Well, it's just debt service coverage on that subject property, right? [00:31:10] Does the rent cover the note? And do we have enough money for down payment and reserves on that property alone? We don't look at reserves for those additional properties like you would a conventional. So you got five properties. I don't care about reserves on those. I'm only looking at the subject property. [00:31:24] So, yes, debt to income is a big factor and I think, if we're talking to property management companies, it's really just an education or a knowledge of what potentially could be out there. Right? Like you said, they have opportunities to buy all the time. I would think that the savvy property manager is going to scoop those up if they can, but are they aware of these programs? [00:31:44] Or do they think that? "Oh, my debt to income is too high or I have losses on my tax returns that I'm going to have trouble qualifying." And then you also have your network of investors that you manage those properties for that potentially are looking for additional doors, but they're not aware of these programs in some cases. [00:32:00] So, yeah, it's just a matter of, I think, education and just getting the information out there. So that some of these people know what options are available.  [00:32:09] Jason: Well, it sounds like it shifts the conversation from, "can we?" Yeah. Maybe it's a no, in their thought, in their mind to "how can we?" Like, there's other creative ways that things could be done instead of saying, "Oh, it's gotta be this one way we've always done it. That's the only way." So, what about for long term rentals? Which like some of the investors listening and a lot of our clients listening may not do a short term.  [00:32:32] Sarah: You can still do a non QM on a long term, especially in Austin. Now, other markets, you might find a cashflow. Like I have a cashflow property in Pennsylvania. [00:32:40] It's a rare gem guys, but in Austin, it's hard to get something to cashflow, especially right now.  [00:32:47] Matthew: Okay, so there's two ways to look at it again. There's, or I guess, multiple ways to look at it. Not just two, but bank statements if I'm looking at it. So, if they're self employed, and they have a business that we can lean on the bank statements, right? [00:32:59] That's my income qualifier and no longer care about that negative potential cash flow on the property in the rent. Right? So that's one way. If I'm doing debt service coverage and I'm looking at long term rental, I have a client that wants to long term rented. They're not going to be comfortable stating short term rental on the application. [00:33:17] They really have no desire to do that. Then I have to look at the short term rent. Now, what that's typically going to end up, at least in Austin, what's typically going to end up happening is that property is going to have a problem cash flowing at 20 percent down or 80 percent equity. Right? So what happens is it now pushes us to. [00:33:34] A bigger down payment, a larger down payment, 25 percent 30%. And then we have the options with those lower loan values to do either no ratio or lower debt coverage ratio loan programs. Right? So. If it falls below 100%, meaning 100 percent rent coverage with PITI coverage which principal interest taxes, insurance and HOA fees all come into that play. But let's just say it's a little bit short. I've got a PITI of 2000 dollars of my rent's 1800. well, the lender is going to do one or two things. Are you going to say, "well, we need more down to get that to 100%." Or "we're going to reclassify it as a higher risk and we'll do, some of them will go down to 75 percent debt coverage, but it's a little bit higher rate." [00:34:18] Or "we have to go to a little bit larger down payment and go no ratio, right?" No ratio means we just eliminate that altogether. And it's typically 30 percent down. So, we have options to look at but it is definitely a little bit harder if we're looking at long term rents simply because it's harder to cash flows at 20%, unless again, unless we have larger down payments or larger equity positions, for refinances to soak. [00:34:42] A lot of these let's talk about that too, you have some of your property management clients that may want to purchase more properties where they could extract equity out of these homes to use to purchase more property. So there's a lot of the refinance going on with those properties to under a non QM basis, because they again, they can't qualify for a full doc for whatever reasons. [00:35:03] Right? But there are options to pull cash out under a non QM basis and utilize those funds to reinvest.  [00:35:09] Jason: Got it. So say they've got five, 10 properties, it's getting really difficult for them to qualify for a QM loan. They could maybe pull some equity out of their existing properties, do like a cash out refi, and then use that money to fund a bigger down payment to do a non QM scenario. [00:35:28] Matthew: Absolutely. Absolutely. The challenge right now in the market with refinances in general is a lot of these people have really good rates on those properties. And so they don't necessarily want to refinance and lose that low rate understandably. Right? So. In other states, you have a the ability to do HELOCs or he loans, which are second liens, Texas, it's a little bit limited. [00:35:47] There's not as many products available, especially on the investment side. There are ways to extract some of that equity and reposition it to be reinvested in other investment opportunities. And I will say that we do have the ability to do the same type of loans on small commercial properties. [00:36:04] Like, up to I've got one lender that kind of specializes in that small commercial that goes up to 24 units. So, between 5 and 24 unit apartment buildings, we're also looking at a non QM type debt service coverage loan, which is what commercial loans look at in general anyway. Commercial loans are based on cash flow, right? [00:36:23] It's all debt service coverage based on that. But in that small apartment complex arena, you've got a lot of these kind of more residential lenders that are focusing and specializing in it. Because it's a piece of the market that's left out, right? Your commercial lenders don't want to touch something that's a few 100, 000 dollars. They have minimums of 5Million dollars, 3Million dollars. And so you have these smaller properties that are great investments in some cases that also have challenges getting loans, not because of the property, but because of the size of the loan.  [00:36:55] Jason: It's just not big enough for him. [00:36:56] So Matt what areas do you cover personally? And then how do people find somebody like you, how did they find somebody like you? Like, this was a challenge we had to ask around what do people look for to find somebody that can help them with some more creative options?  [00:37:11] Matthew: That's a good question. I wish more people would know how to find me. So maybe you can help me with that. But yeah, it's just, it's interesting. There's a lot of loan officers that just don't, I guess maybe they're scared of the non QM space. They don't understand it. They're scared of change, so to speak, and so they just go, "I've never done that. And I don't know anything about it and they don't want to learn about it." it's the fastest growing segment of the market right now. Fannie Mae is pushing a lot of the paper towards non QM from a risk perspective. They want to get away from it. They're making investment rates in terms unattractive, so to speak, so they're offloading it that way. But, I think it's really through the real estate agents is probably the best way to get in touch with somebody like me, if they're familiar with it. But what's interesting is even your agent from McLean that I work a lot with Brett. [00:38:00] He wasn't 100 percent versed in these products either. So. Fortunately, he got me, right?  [00:38:05] Sarah: Yeah. Thank you, Brett.  [00:38:07] Matthew: But, yeah, as far as if you have somebody that's questions, I'm always available to potentially educate people in regards to these programs. As far as where I do business, I'm legally licensed in Texas and Arizona, meaning national mortgage licensing, which is the, the CFPB license. [00:38:22] Now, with non QM loans about 35 states don't require you to have a license within that state. So I can do non QM debt service coverage all these type of loans that we talked about in about 34 different states. Just with my national license and because they consider a business purpose use, it's classified as a commercial loan in those states, and they don't have these overbearing laws like California does or Nevada. So there are some states that it's difficult unless you want to jump through a bunch of hoops to do it. And unless there's enough volume, there hasn't made sense for me to do it. [00:38:55] I just focus on the ones that I can, which is a big piece of the country and we can help folks in those 30 some states, 34 states, whatever it is.  [00:39:03] Jason: So there's maybe 15, 16 states that you can't cover.  [00:39:06] Matthew: It's the New York the Pacific Northwest and California, most of the middle of the country around Texas we can do. [00:39:14] I know you, you referred me to somebody in Utah the other day, they happen to be a state that requires licensing, but their licensing is pretty reasonable. So, if there was an opportunity or a reason, for some volume to come out of there, I could get licensed fairly quickly. [00:39:28] And some of these states, because I already hold a national license within them. I passed the test for that, which means you just have to take the state piece of that exam to then get licensed. Be able to do loans there, which is fairly simple. And as long as you're not in New York or California or somebody that has these crazy laws,  [00:39:44] Sarah: What's to invest there anyway, come on, like squatters and all this, like? [00:39:48] Matthew: I know, right? [00:39:49] I don't know how everybody does loans in New York. I hear it takes 90 days to close a loan.  [00:39:54] Jason: There's plenty of investors in those markets. I'm sure people listening. All right. Cool. Well, Matt, it's been great having you here on the DoorGrow show. Appreciate you being our guest. How can people find you or get in touch with you? [00:40:06] If they're wanting to reach out and find out if they're one of those 34 states.  [00:40:10] Matthew: Well, my number if you want my phone number is 512 415 6142. You can Google Nexa my name. I think if you Google my name and Nexa mortgage that come up quite a bit on the Google nexahomelending.Com is my personal website. [00:40:27] That's probably the two best ways to reach out to me just text or email and I'm more than happy to help you in any way that I can.  [00:40:34] Jason: Perfect. Well, it sounds like this is at least a key or just a tool or an idea that every property manager listening should probably have in their back pocket. [00:40:44] You should have some sort of connection to a more creative lender than you may have currently. And so, connect with Matt or maybe, I don't know, start Googling non QM lenders in your market. I don't know, but find somebody or ask around to some real estate agents, but see if you can get somebody that can help with getting some of these deals because investors, they have money, they have equity and, but they're not doing deals and they want to probably do more deals and they just need somebody creative enough to help them find some solutions or interesting ways to make it happen. [00:41:13] So, all right. Well, again, Matt, thanks for being on the show. Appreciate you.  [00:41:17] Matthew: My pleasure. Thank you very much for having me.  [00:41:19] Jason: All right. Well, everybody, if you are interested in growing your business, your property management business, reach out to us, you can check us out at doorgrow.Com. And until next time, everybody to our mutual growth. Bye everyone.  [00:41:30] Matthew: Great. Thank you. Talk to you guys soon. Bye. [00:41:32] Jason: you just listened to the #DoorGrowShow. We are building a community of the savviest property management entrepreneurs on the planet in the DoorGrowClub. Join your fellow DoorGrow Hackers at doorgrowclub.com. Listen, everyone is doing the same stuff. SEO, PPC, pay-per-lead content, social direct mail, and they still struggle to grow!  [00:41:59] At DoorGrow, we solve your biggest challenge: getting deals and growing your business. Find out more at doorgrow.com. Find any show notes or links from today's episode on our blog doorgrow.com, and to get notified of future events and news subscribe to our newsletter at doorgrow.com/subscribe. Until next time, take what you learn and start DoorGrow Hacking your business and your life.

Welcome! and Thank you for listening.   I was fortunate to go to Blue Ridge and Blairsville Georgia this past weekend to toe the line at the Cruel Jewel 50 mile ultra race.  The ultra running community are my people.  Tenacious, positive, and tremendous athletes all humble at the same time.  It did not goes as I would have wished for, but it did go for how I was trained.  I got to see where I was at a fitness level and experience some of the most beautiful and peaceful forests.  That area crosses the Appalachian trail.   People on the trail give other hikers trail names.  I had a trail angel this weekend.  I gave him the name of Russ Angel because of time he gave to rescue me and others after we pulled the white flag.  I hope you enjoy my trail tails.  It was a great weekend despite coming up short. Ultra running and life are so much alike.  You need a plan and you need to work the plan.  When it does not work, you need to adjust the plan.  The bottom line is forward progress.  Maybe not that day, but the next day it is time to get back on the journey whether it is trail or health.  If you would like some help with your health journey, visit our website to fine out how you can join our practice.  Thank you to Russ Marlowe and Sandy Geisel for your support.  Shout out to Rich and Tony and the swanky red pick-up.  Thank you to Sarah Snyder and her staff as the race director.  Like Sarah says, poor decisions make for better stories.  She is most famous for saying, try not to be an asshole.  Words to live by.  Thank you.  https://doctordulaney.com/services/pcp-cardiology-nutrition/#pricing https://mypurewater.com/?sld=jdulaney https://www.amazon.com/Plant-based-Wellness-Cookbook-Generations-Cooking/dp/1733967702/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1U4J4U0SZUXUF&dchild=1&keywords=plant+based+wellness+cookbook&qid=1621083696&sprefix=plant+based+well%2Caps%2C173&sr=8-3 

Listen in as we dive into the timeless wisdom of Esther, Sarah, and Ruth. Through these narratives, along with Carey's own testimony, we hope you are inspired to embrace grit in adversity, grace in uncertainty, and unwavering faith in your journey with Christ. Join us as we celebrate the strength, resilience, and faith of women on this special Mother's Day episode.   Sermon Notes:  "For if you remain silent at this time, relief and deliverance for the Jews will arise from another place, but you and your father's family will perish. And who knows but that you have come to your royal position for such a time as this?  - Esther 4:14   "On the third day, Esther put on her royal robes and stood in the inner court of the palace, in front of the king's hall. The king was sitting on his royal throne in the hall, facing the entrance. When he saw Queen Esther standing in the court, he was pleased with her and held out to her the gold scepter that was in his hand." - Esther 5:1-2   "All the king's officials and the people of the royal provinces know that for any man or woman who approaches the king in the inner court without being summoned the king has but one law: that they be put to death unless the king extends the gold scepter to them and spares their lives. But thirty days have passed since I was called to go to the king." - Esther 4:11    "And if I perish, I perish." - Esther 4:16   Is anything too hard for the LORD? I will return to you at the appointed time next year, and Sarah will have a son. - Genesis 18:14   And by faith even Sarah, who was past childbearing age, was enabled to bear children because she considered him faithful who had made the promise. - Hebrews 11:11   I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. - Philippians 4:13   And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God. - Ruth 1:16   "She is clothed with strength and dignity, and she laughs without fear of the future.” - Proverbs 31:25  

Episode Summary: In this episode, Kelly and Alix delve deeper into the Sarah J. Maas phenomenon and share books like ACOTAR to help remedy your bookish hangover! Check out all the LitJoy Special Edition BooksTopics Discussed:[2:11] Books to Read if You Have a "Maas-ive" Book Hangover[7:10] Blood and Ash Series by Jennifer L. Armentrout[17:21] Crescent City Series by Sarah J. Maas[26:25] The Serpent and the Wings of Night by Carissa Broadbent[30:29] Stacey McEwan Creates Fantasy in Real-Life TikToks[32:32] Ledge by Stacey McEwan[36:28] Kingdom of the Wicked Series by Kerri Maniscalco[43:22] Fourth Wing and Iron Flame by Rebecca YarrosOther Books MentionedThrone of Glass Series by Sarah J. MaasA Court of Thorns and Roses Series by Sarah J. MaasObsidian by Jennifer L. ArmentroutLord of the Rings by J.R.R.The Witcher Series by Andrzej SapkowskiTwilight by Stephenie MeyerThe Cruel Prince by Holly BlackIvory and Bone by Julie EshbaughNeon Gods by Katee RobertWhat's New at LitJoy?ACOTAR Bat Boy EarringsKingdom of the Wicked CollectionFollow LitJoy!Make sure to RATE & REVIEW The LitJoy Podcast wherever you listen.Join our Lunacorns private membership group at https://litjoycrate.com/podcast-lunacornsFollow us on Instagram @litjoycrateFollow us on TikTok @litjoycrateCheck out LitJoy's officially licensed author collections!Use the code PODCAST10 for a 10% discount! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Andrew Huberman, a renowned neuroscientist, popular podcaster, and influential health guru based at Stanford University, has recently been embroiled in a controversy surrounding his personal life. A scathing report by New York magazine has shed light on allegations of womanizing and sexually irresponsible behavior, including claims that he dated five women simultaneously and may have even transmitted a sexually transmitted infection (STI) to one of them. Huberman, who boasts an impressive following of six million on Instagram and 5.2 million subscribers on his YouTube channel, Huberman Lab, is well-known for his macho attitude and self-improvement videos tailored to a male audience. He is considered one of the leading 'bro science' influencers, a category of science-themed social media content aimed at men. However, the recent revelations about his personal life have cast a shadow over his public persona. The New York magazine investigation features testimonies from five women who paint a disturbing picture of Huberman as a promiscuous 'serial dater' who subjected his romantic partners to aggressive outbursts, betrayal, and infidelity. The victims eventually discovered each other's existence and formed an unlikely friendship, confronting Huberman about his actions. One of the most damning accounts comes from Huberman's former partner of five years, referred to as "Sarah" (not her real name). Sarah claims that Huberman had affairs with multiple women, sometimes even arranging dates with different women on the same day. She also alleges that he made derogatory comments about her, including likening dating her to "bobbing for apples in feces," an accusation that Huberman has denied. According to Sarah, she caught Huberman cheating on her with five other women and allegedly contracted human papillomavirus (HPV), a cancer-causing STI, as a result of his infidelity. "I experienced his rage," Sarah told New York magazine, describing Huberman's behavior as "two to three days of yelling in a row" and claiming that he would continue his verbal abuse late into the night and sometimes start again in the early hours of the morning. Huberman, 48, an associate professor of neurology and ophthalmology at the Stanford University School of Medicine, rose to prominence due to his obsession with optimizing one's health. He became involved with Sarah after the pair began messaging on Instagram in February 2018, before his rise to fame. As their relationship progressed, Sarah claims that Huberman became "obsessed" with her past, particularly the two children she had from a previous relationship. In 2021, Sarah tested positive for a high-risk form of HPV, which is most commonly contracted through sexual activity and is linked to 99 percent of cervical cancers. Despite getting tested regularly for ten years, Sarah says she had never tested positive for the STI before her relationship with Huberman. The web of deception unraveled further when, in 2022, Sarah discovered romantic texts on Huberman's phone from a woman named Eve (not her real name), an actress. Like Sarah, Eve was also under the impression that Huberman was not seeing anyone else, and the pair had engaged in unprotected sex. However, Eve became suspicious after noticing Sarah liking and commenting on her Instagram posts. The two women spoke over the phone and realized they had both been deceived by Huberman. The investigation revealed that there were other women involved, including Mary from Texas, whom Huberman had been seeing for years, and Alex from New York, who had also been having sex with him without realizing he had a girlfriend. The women formed a group chat and corroborated the extent of Huberman's deceitful behavior using time-stamped text messages. The messages revealed a disturbing pattern of Huberman's infidelity and manipulation. On one occasion, while Sarah was in Berkeley, Huberman had flown Mary from Texas to LA to stay with him. While Mary was there, he left her to look after his dog, Costello, while he drove to a coffee shop to meet Eve and discuss their relationship. He later texted Mary, who was waiting for him, claiming that his phone had died. That same day, he sent Eve a message saying, "Thank you … For being so next, next, level gorgeous and sexy," and later texted Sarah, "Sleep well beautiful." The irony of Huberman's actions was highlighted during a November 2021 episode of his podcast entitled "How Humans Select & Keep Romantic Partners in Short & Long Term." In the episode, Huberman discussed similarities in mate preferences with evolutionary psychologist David Buss. Huberman asked Buss about how men and women leverage deception versus truth-telling in mate choice selection, to which Buss replied, "Effective tactics for men are often displaying cues to long-term interest… men tend to exaggerate the depths of their feelings for a woman." When the topic of infidelity in committed relationships came up, Huberman chuckled and said, "I'm guessing it does happen." Buss responded, "Men who have affairs tend to have affairs with a larger number of affair partners. And so... then by definition can't be long-lasting. You can't have the long-term affairs with six different partners." Huberman's reply was telling: "Yeah, unless he's, um, juggling multiple, uh, phone accounts or something of that sort." According to one of the women involved, Huberman allegedly explained that he was not a sex addict, but rather a love addict. Ironically, Huberman himself has previously stated that "addiction is a progressive narrowing of the things that bring you pleasure." In response to the allegations, a spokesperson for Huberman told New York magazine that he did not become exclusive with Sarah until late 2021 and denied Sarah's account of their fights, stating, "Dr. Huberman is very much in control of his emotions." The spokesperson declined to comment further when contacted by DailyMail.com. The revelations about Andrew Huberman's personal life have sent shockwaves through his large and devoted fan base. Many are grappling with the stark contrast between his public image as a health and self-improvement guru and the allegations of manipulative and sexually irresponsible behavior in his private life. The women involved in the investigation have shown remarkable courage in coming forward with their stories, shedding light on the devastating impact of Huberman's actions on their lives. Their accounts serve as a reminder that even those in positions of influence and authority are capable of causing harm and betraying trust. As the fallout from the New York magazine investigation continues, questions are being raised about the responsibility of public figures like Huberman, who have built their careers on offering advice and guidance to others. Many are calling for greater accountability and transparency from influencers, particularly those who claim expertise in fields related to health and well-being. The allegations against Huberman also highlight the need for more open and honest conversations about consent, sexual health, and the importance of treating romantic partners with respect and integrity. In a society where 'bro culture' and toxic masculinity are still pervasive, it is crucial that we challenge the notion that manipulative and sexually irresponsible behavior is acceptable or excusable. As the story continues to unfold, it remains to be seen how Huberman will address the allegations and what impact they will have on his career and reputation. However, one thing is clear: the women who have come forward have shown immense bravery in sharing their experiences and holding Huberman accountable for his actions. Their stories serve as a powerful reminder that no one, regardless of their fame or influence, is above the basic principles of honesty, respect, and consent in relationships. It is our collective responsibility to create a society where such behavior is not tolerated and where those who have been harmed are supported and believed. As we reflect on the revelations about Andrew Huberman's personal life, let us also recommit ourselves to building a world where all people, regardless of gender, are treated with the dignity and respect they deserve. Only by working together can we hope to create a future where stories like these are a thing of the past. Thanks for listening to Quiet Please. Remember to like and share wherever you get your podcasts.

Disappointment is inevitable, but discouragement is a choice.People love to look into the future. We all have hopes, and dreams, and expectations about what we want our life to be. So, we make plans. Plans to save, serve, build a family, work, travel, learn, grow…you name it. Planning is part of what it takes to make our dreams come true. And there's nothing wrong with planning. Planning is an important part of being a good steward of whatever God has entrusted to you.But here's the problem. Our plans don't always succeed. Dreams fail. Expectations go unmet. And then, disappointment happens…maybe more than we want to admit.Perhaps you invested your savings…but now inflation is killing your returns.Or you worked hard to start a business, but it still isn't making a profit.You planned for your marriage to last…only to experience an expensive divorce.Maybe you've been working towards that promotion…but someone else got the job.Or, you planned to have a big nest egg when you retire…but health issues have reduced your savings.And then there's always the disappointment of finding your adult child living in your basement when you thought they were going to be financially independent.How Do You Handle the Disappointments and Unmet Expectations You Face?Financial disappointments can cause some people to shake their fist at God and lose faith.  Others might become discouraged, depressed or apathetic. Sometimes, disappointment leads to broken relationships. Stress and anxiety are common responses when our plans fail. In fact, the more important we think something is, the more upset we are when our expectations aren't met.It's not sinful to feel disappointed. But your reaction to disappointments can become sin if you're not careful.  According to God's word, discouragement, anger, unforgiveness, bitterness, and fear are all sinful attitudes. Ephesians 4:31 warns about them: “Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you.”So, you can respond to disappointment with discouragement, anger, fear, or apathy…or you can take a more positive approach…realizing that unmet expectations are often God's way of leading you in a new direction. Just look at how many disappointed people there are in the Bible, and see how God worked in their lives.Like Sarah and Hannah, who couldn't have children. Or Joseph, whose brothers sold him into slavery. Or imagine how Jesus must have felt when Judas betrayed him. But the Lord had amazing plans for these unmet expectations: Sarah and Hannah ultimately had children who changed the world. Joseph saved his people. Jesus saved us all.Here's another thought: Your response to the disappointments in your own life can be a powerful witness to those around you. Maybe this isn't the way you thought your life would turn out…but God can use your unmet expectations…for your good and his glory.A Godly Approach To Financial DisappointmentsWhen life doesn't go your way, it's common to look for someone to blame.  Instead, ask God to help you forgive the people who've hurt you. Begin to pray for the strength to live through your difficult circumstances. In addition, recognize that it may be time to let go of your expectations, and ask God to show you his plans. People and circumstances are unreliable, but Hebrews 13:8 reminds us that Jesus is the same yesterday and today and forever. The Lord is always loving, faithful, and just.The bottom line? God never fails. You can trust him, even in the midst of your deepest disappointments, when big expectations come to nothing, and people let you down.  God will make a way for you every time.  It might not be what you expect, but it will be good. Hold on to what's true, from Romans 8:28: we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.The late Charles Stanley, a faithful preacher of God's truth for many years, said this about disappointment: “Disappointment is inevitable. But to become discouraged, there's a choice I make. God would never discourage me. He would always point me to himself to trust him.”On Today's Program, Rob Answers Listener Questions:I am 75 and my husband is 76 and we are retired. Recently we went to one of the marketplaces for our supplemental health insurance coverage and while there, the agent recommended that we get this hospital benefit that would pay extra money should we ever be hospitalized. It sounded good at first but now as I'm second guessing it, I'm not sure if it was timely or wise. Any thoughts? I'm calling on behalf of my brother who is in about $40,000 in credit card debt with about a 30% interest rate. He makes about $900 a week and his minimum payments are about $1300 a month. He's looked at bankruptcy as well as national debt relief programs, do you have any ideas on how he can realistically pay down this debt? I'm 65 years old and financially secure. I want to do something for my grandson who will be two years old in August. However, I want this to be as hands-free as possible since my daughter isn't the most astute when it comes to taxes and I don't know how much longer I'll be around. What's the best investment tool I can put the money in to accomplish this goal? If I have a mortgage with a small loan and I make extra payments toward it throughout the year, does that really make that much of a difference? What is the difference between a living trust and a will and which is better? Resources Mentioned:Christian Credit CounselorsFind a Certified Kingdom Advisor (CKA)FaithFi App Remember, you can call in to ask your questions most days at (800) 525-7000. Faith & Finance is also available on the Moody Radio Network and American Family Radio. Visit our website at FaithFi.com where you can join the FaithFi Community and give as we expand our outreach.

Property management entrepreneurs… how many hats are you currently wearing? It's easy for business owners to get stuck doing things they don't actually enjoy doing. Property management growth experts Jason and Sarah Hull talk about how to get out of the roles you don't enjoy and into the roles you do. You'll Learn [03:17] The myth of wanting to clone yourself [07:51] The pros of a great hiring system [13:46] Which hat do you take off first? [17:58] Next steps Tweetables “That you need 10 people to clone yourself as an entrepreneur.” “A generalist that's good at everything is never the best.” “For every role that exists, there's always a person to fill it who actually really love doing that role.” “If you have office politics, you've got a culture problem.” Resources DoorGrow and Scale Mastermind DoorGrow Academy DoorGrow on YouTube DoorGrowClub DoorGrowLive TalkRoute Referral Link Transcript [00:00:00] Sarah: For every role that exists, there's always a person to fill it who actually really love doing that role.  [00:00:09] Jason: Welcome DoorGrowers, to the DoorGrowShow. If you are a property management entrepreneur that wants to add doors, make a difference, increase revenue, help others, impact lives, and you are interested in growing in business and life, and you're open to doing things a bit differently, then you are a DoorGrower. DoorGrower property managers love the opportunities, daily variety, unique challenges, and freedom that property management brings. Many in real estate think you're crazy for doing it. You think they're crazy for not because you realize that property management is the ultimate, high trust gateway to real estate deals, relationships, and residual income. At DoorGrow, we are on a mission to transform property management business owners and their businesses. We want to transform the industry, eliminate the BS, build awareness, change perception, expand the market, and help the best property management entrepreneurs win. We're your hosts, property management growth experts, Jason Hull and Sarah Hull, the owners of DoorGrow. [00:01:03] Now let's get into the show. All right, so we released a funny video. So if you have not seen any of our funny videos, we put out quite a few of these. We have a whole playlist of them on YouTube. You can go to youtube.com/doorgrow and go to our playlist and look for our playlist of funny videos. Our newest funny video that we released is all about hats. [00:01:28] It's got a whole bunch of hats and it's silly, and I'm putting on different hats, and so if you want to laugh at me. Go check that out. we thought we would talk about this idea today. So what's the idea?  [00:01:40] Sarah: So the idea is are you wearing too many hats, aka are you filling too many roles in your property management business?  [00:01:50] Jason: All right, so when you first start out, you have to wear every hat, right? [00:01:55] You do everything in the business because it's all on you. You're like, "Oh, let me send that over to my maintenance coordinator... who's me. And let me get that over to my bookkeeper... who is also me. And Oh, my receptionist will answer my calls for me today because that's me." What are some of the hats that property managers are wearing. [00:02:15] Sarah: There's so many of them. Let's see. There's maintenance coordinator, a leasing agent, there's usually the bookkeeper, whoever's going to handle finances, there's of course the CEO who's going to set the vision of the company, there's the operator who's going to do things on the backend, there's the salesperson or the BDM, there's usually like a property manager, there's sometimes assistant property managers... As companies grow, they sometimes get tenant coordinators or client coordinators like just to handle like tenant or client communications. But when you start out, like all of this is usually you. [00:02:55] Jason: One of the things that I hear a lot from early stage entrepreneurs, people that are just getting started is they're like, "I just need to clone myself. I just need to find somebody else. Just like me." And so this is the big mistake that everybody makes initially in hiring. It's everybody does it like we all go and try and find somebody like ourselves. [00:03:15] That's what we think hiring is. We think hiring is cloning ourselves. The challenge with that is that the clone myth, as I call it, the reality is that you need 10 people to clone yourself as an entrepreneur. You need a different person for each hat. [00:03:32] Because if you find somebody that is as adaptable as you and that can do everything like you and is driven like you, guess what they're going to do? They're going to do what you did and they're going to leave and go start their own company. I've seen this over and over again where people hire a clone and the clone does exactly what a clone would do. They become like you and they leave and sometimes take your clients and start their own business and become your competition. And so we don't want to fall prey to the clone myth. We want to find specialists that we can give pieces of what we do or hats to that are really good at that particular hat and a generalist that's good at everything is never the best. [00:04:17] You are not the best at every role. You probably think, "nobody else could do it as good as me." This is the other belief that early stage entrepreneurs say. "Nobody else can do it as well as me. I might as well do it myself." And that's a trap. It's a trap that keeps you doing everything forever. And if you believe that, then that means you will by default be comfortable getting crappy team members that are worse than you at these hats. [00:04:42] Because if you believe that you're the best and nobody else could be better than you, then you will go hire people and you will tolerate people that are worse than you at these particular roles. And then you'll be frustrated and I have a team of people that are better at their particular roles than I would be and this gives me a lot of confidence being able to let go of stuff. Like Sarah is way better at the details way better operations way better at putting things together. Like you've significantly improved the business and she's better at all of those things than I am and there's things that I'm better at than Sarah, but that allows me to stay in those areas I get to stay in those areas where I am better at those things than Sarah and then we have different team members Adam, and Mar, and they're all better at their particular tasks than I would be. [00:05:31] Sarah: Or I would be. Yeah.  [00:05:33] Absolutely. And that's what you want, is you want someone who is better at whatever this is than you are, especially if you don't enjoy it. So if you've got things in your business that you're holding on to and you think, "oh, I'll just never find somebody who loves maintenance coordination. Like who on the world would love to do that job because it's horrible?" Somebody will love it. [00:05:59] Somebody who likes details and organization and they like having a plan and a structure and a system. There are people who function that way and they really enjoy that. And it's so funny because Jason was like, "for every role that exists, there's always a person to fill it who actually really love doing that role." And it's true. It's really true.  [00:06:22] Jason: That's a good point because early stage entrepreneurs also believe that because they hate doing something like if you hate maintenance coordination, you're like, "man, if I never have to do another maintenance escalation or talk to a tenant again, I'd be so happy." [00:06:37] A lot of times entrepreneurs believe that means nobody else would like it either. It's really a self centered, self centric view to believe that the rest of the world are like you. They're not. Like one of my mentors would say, there are people out there that like changing bedpans, you know? [00:06:52] And I've said that to some people that were nurses or something like that. And they're like, "yeah, I do. I feel like I'm helping them."  [00:06:58] And I'm like, "that's great. I wouldn't want to do that.  [00:07:00] Sarah: Like Evelyn, she says, "I don't like the changing of the bedpans, but I do like that when I do that, I know that I'm helping somebody who can't do it for themselves." [00:07:07] Jason: Yeah. And so she's happy to do it.  [00:07:10] Sarah: You can't pay me enough money in this world to change a bedpan.  [00:07:13] Jason: There is not enough money in this entire universe. That's my sister in law. And yeah that's wild. And so I want everyone listening to believe that there are people out there that can do the things that are your minus signs. [00:07:26] You can find people that's their plus signs and they will do it better than you. If you believe there are people out there that can do it better than you, there's a lot of dinosaur bosses. This is how you know you're a dinosaur boss. If you're the person that just believes everybody in the younger generation is terrible and there's no good hires out there available and nobody wants to work, then guess what you're going to find and attract when you go onto your job search? [00:07:51] There are great people out there. And if you build a really good hiring process, you can find and attract them. But the great people don't want to work for a dinosaur boss, like somebody that just believes that 'if I pay you, you should just do it and you should just like it and just suck it up.' [00:08:06] Because that's not very inspiring and people have options nowadays. They don't have to stay at a job very long. They can go work elsewhere. And the way that we retain team members is we create a culture of people that all share the same vision, same mission to transform property management, business owners. [00:08:23] And because we hire specialists and hire people that are really dialed in personality wise for that particular role that we know they can be great at it. And because each of our team members are great, it creates this sense of mutual respect on the team. Everybody on our team likes each other. Yeah. And they respect each other. [00:08:42] And in our daily huddles, they're like celebrating each other and sharing, like pointing out how awesome different team members were because they can see that these team members are really good at the things they do and it's things they're not good at or wouldn't want to have to do.  [00:08:57] Sarah: Morgan just said, I think, when she came back from leave, I was catching up with her. And then she was on some coaching calls with clients and she shared part of it with me. And I just had this conversation with one of our clients, and she said, "everybody on our team. I love them. Like I really like these people. I work with them every day, but I really enjoy working with them." And she said, "if anybody on the team came to me with any task and said, 'Hey, like I could really use your help on this.'" She says, "I would do it in a heartbeat. I wouldn't even flinch. I would do it in a heartbeat and I would want to do it because I care about these people and I want to help them."  [00:09:34] Jason: And that's because we've created a culture initially entirely around what I want. Like I as the visionary gets to set the culture of the company and I created values and everything. [00:09:47] Now, when Sarah became an owner, we took a fresh look at them. And we revisit them and then I don't think we really changed much.  [00:09:55] Sarah: No, we didn't. I gave her an opportunity to have input, but... [00:09:59] would you, if I wasn't a value match, would you have brought me into the company? You wouldn't have hired me, but nevermind ownership of the company. You don't give ownership of a company to somebody that's like not a culture.  [00:10:10] Jason: If you weren't a value match, we probably wouldn't be married. And so this is the thing. There's a lot of couples in property management. I've noticed we get a lot of couple clients, husband and wife teams. [00:10:21] And it's very typical that the husband is more visionary, sales, wild, cowboy, entrepreneur and that the wife is like stable, crusher of all hopes and dreams, just kidding, grounded, practical, make sure everything works operator personality type. Yeah.  [00:10:38] Sarah: Sometimes we do see, they're like, "we're going to do this crazy big thing!" [00:10:41] And operators were like, "we can't afford that. Cool, but that sounds really insane. So what can we actually do and how can we actually make it happen?" So like we are the ones who make sure that things happen instead of just,  [00:10:57] Jason: yeah.  [00:10:57] Sarah: We're not the crusher of the dreams. [00:10:58] We're the dream makers.  [00:11:00] Jason: They're the dream. Yeah. They bring it into reality. The "maker-happeners". ,  [00:11:04] That's good. That's really good.  [00:11:05] Sarah: It's so good. Madi's going to laugh so hard when she's editing this. She's going to go, "that's not a word."  [00:11:10] Jason: Maker-happeners.  [00:11:11] Sarah: The word now, Madi.  [00:11:13] Jason: This is my Maker-happener. [00:11:15] And yeah, we've got this mutual respect that exists on the team, and if you don't like your team, be honest. If your team increases your pressure and noise, if they stress you out, if you are frustrated at your team members, you have the wrong team and it's your fault. You created it, you allowed it, and you kept these people because you probably thought that's just how business works or that's what's available.  [00:11:40] Sarah: Even if you're like, "Oh no, I like everybody," but does everybody like everybody else? Because if your team doesn't like each other, how quick do you think they're going to be to really jump in and help the other one? Because everybody needs help at some point. [00:11:52] Like deadlines come and things happen or whatever. Like summer happens and we're like, "Oh my God! I thought like I had more time on this and all these leases are due. Can somebody help me?" There is going to be a point in which someone on your team needs help from somebody else that doesn't usually do that thing. [00:12:07] And if they don't like each other, they're not going to help each other. They're going to go, "Oh yeah, look at Susie. She can't even do her own job."  [00:12:14] Jason: Yeah. If you have office politics, you've got a culture problem. If you've got you may have team members that secretly don't even like you and you may not know it, but you can tell. You can feel it. [00:12:25] Most employees probably here in the U. S., that standard American employee doesn't really like their job. They just want safety and certainty. They want stability. They're not there because it's giving them a sense of fulfillment, freedom, contribution, support. It's like the best thing and they love it. [00:12:41] So that means they're B players. A players are what we have on our team at DoorGrow. B players are what one of my mentors called hiders. Their secret goal if they were really honest would be to do as little work as possible, get paid as much as possible, and then they go and complain about you and live for the weekend. [00:13:02] And so if they love the weekend way more than they love their day-to-day, there's probably a problem. Like you want team members that are like, "man, I'm really excited. I love getting to do what I get to do." If I didn't have the role that I have or get to do what I get to do, I would feel probably lost, depressed, and bored out of my mind. [00:13:23] I love getting to do what I get to do. And my guess is that most of the people on my team would probably feel that same way. If they just had nothing to do. So I don't know, maybe there's some that would love to just not work ever a day in their life. I don't know. But for me, that would be crazy. [00:13:39] Sarah: Not anymore.  [00:13:40] Jason: So what else can we talk about related to getting rid of these hats? Because in the beginning they're wearing every hat. How did they decide which had to get off first?  [00:13:49] Sarah: What are the things that you like? Because those are the things you should keep. [00:13:54] And not just "Oh, that's annoying," or like "it's okay, but I don't love it." The things that you really don't like, the things where, like for me it was talking to tenants, that was what it was for me, and sales. I hated sales. I hated doing sales. I was really good at it, but I just, I hated it. Look at, the things that you do and the things that you like, you tend to get them done pretty quickly. Yeah, if you like going through emails. You're going to do that and there's going to be very little friction there. [00:14:23] No one's going to have to say "Oh, did you check your email?" But if you hate going through emails and you're like, "oh my god. Like why is email even a thing? I don't even know why we have to do this," You're going to procrastinate. Yeah. It's going to build up and you're probably not the right person to be doing it. [00:14:41] Jason: Yeah. If there's anything that's been on your to do list for more than a month, it's probably because you are not the person that should be doing it. That's a pretty big clue. One of the big mistakes I see people make when getting their initial hire is they try and find team members to wear multiple hats. [00:14:57] They're like, "I'm going to get an appointment setter slash assistant."  [00:15:02] Sarah: My favorite is, "my operator is also going to do sales for me."  [00:15:05] Jason: Oh yeah.  [00:15:06] Sarah: No, they're not.  [00:15:08] Jason: And why that's a problem is these are opposite personality types. If we're picking people that are two different personality types. If we're giving them a role that's two different personality types, then we are setting them up for some sort of failure. [00:15:21] And they're not going to really do well at the one that is not their personality type. And so we need to make sure we're not throwing multiple hats onto a person. We're trying to offload multiple hats that are different personality types. It's not going to work. We need specialists that are the right personality for the role. [00:15:39] So at DoorGrow, we are experts on matching the right personality types, knowing the personality types that you need for particular roles. There's a certain personality type for a BDM, for an operator, for a receptionist, for maintenance coordinator, property manager, leasing agent. [00:15:54] There's certain personality types that are good at these. And if you hire based on skill, you will miss the personality. And so hiring based on personality and based on culture are more important for the team and for the role. So usually the first person that we recommend in our DoorGrow code that most entrepreneurs get initially to get the most leverage would be an assistant. [00:16:19] Like maybe around 50 units, you should have your own assistant. But we've got clients that come to us with hundreds of doors and they still don't even have an assistant for themselves. They just keep hiring to take care of the business while not taking care of themselves. So they're not really taking hats off or giving up stuff. [00:16:35] They're just helping the business out. And so they end up more and more stressed the bigger the team gets. So a big piece of this is you need to make sure that you are taking care of yourself and the way we help our clients get clarity on themselves in clarity on what are their minus signs versus their plus signs, what they, what drains them versus what gives them energy is by doing a time study. [00:16:57] And this gives them a lot of clarity on how do I get to the next level? How do I offload the negative things so that I can spend more time in my area of genius and wearing the hats that I want to wear? And then we build out job descriptions and et cetera. So we have this whole process for taking entrepreneurs through to give them a lot of clarity. [00:17:14] Then later. Maybe around 200 plus the most important hire that you will ever make in the business will be to get an operator. If your spouse is already an operator, then you already have the most important person that you will ever bring into the business on your team, which is amazing and awesome. This person needs to be very intelligent. [00:17:34] They need to be sharp. They need to be driven to getting systems and processes dialed in. They want to see the business succeed. They handle all the details. They make everything work and they make sure that the team makes everything work. And this allows you to spend more time in the visionary role or in the sales role or whatever it is as a visionary entrepreneur that you really enjoy. [00:17:55] All right. Anything else related to hats?  [00:17:58] Sarah: So I think if you're listening to this and you're going, "yeah, but I'm still doing all this stuff and I would like to offload that, but I don't think I have the money to offload that," because this is what we hear next is, "yeah, that would be great, but I can't afford it. I can't afford to hire, two or three or eight people."  [00:18:18] Jason: So we have processes for this, but we have to back you out of the corner. You've painted yourself into, so first we do need to get you clarity on what you do enjoy and what would make you more money because it doesn't make sense to go get somebody if you could create more leverage, right? And so sometimes it's about creating more leverage related to time right now. So we have processes for helping you get even more done. Like one of my clients did a time study and recently and said that he had found that he was spending an hour after three o'clock, he was spending an hour to get things done that took him 10 minutes in the morning. [00:18:56] And so part of it is just clarity on your circadian rhythm, your time, like your energy, whether you're getting good enough sleep. So we worked on some hacks to increase his brain's bandwidth so that he could do more later in the day and get a lot more done. This may triple the output of what he can accomplish. [00:19:15] Then we have processes like daily planning time studies. We have these different things that help you get more yield from your day. We have a training called the priorities training. It talks about how Sarah was able to run her business with over 60 percent profit margin with only one part time person up to 260 units. [00:19:34] Which is crazy. They add units too.  [00:19:36] Yeah. C class properties. Yeah. In a rough area. Yeah. And she was able to reduce a lot of the communication, a lot of the friction and systematize the business so that it could run very efficiently. And so we train clients on how to do that. We get people come to us and they're like, "I'm burnt out at 50 units." [00:19:55] Sometimes they're like, "I'm stuck at a hundred units. Like I just can't handle anymore." And you can. There's ways of making this easier.  [00:20:04] Sarah: But you can't give nothing changes, right? So if everything stays the same, you're right. You can't, but you need to make some changes probably to yourself and in your business. [00:20:15] And then all of a sudden it will allow more space and you'll be able to add on more units.  [00:20:21] Jason: This is where good coaching comes in is we can help you get more yield from your day, create more bandwidth so that you can spend more time growing the business. We give you the strategies to grow. You make more money. [00:20:32] So a lot of times clients come to us in that scenario. I'm like, "let's create some space and then let's get you focusing on revenue generating stuff. Let's get you making a lot more money. And then let's make sure we hire what you actually need most. So you can spend more time making more money because then you're making smart, strategic moves when you hire. Instead of just hiring what the business needs, which can be really expensive if you make mistakes. And if you get any bad hires, we have a really great hiring system called DoorGrow hiring. One bad hire is going to cost you minimum 10 grand because you're going to spend probably at least three months on them of pay, there's a certain amount of money they're going to cost you and you're going to lose out on because they weren't generating revenue or helping to keep revenue. So there's a lot like bad hires are one of the most expensive and costly things you can do and it eats up your time, which is the most valuable resource in the business. [00:21:24] When you're onboarding and training somebody that's never going to be good at it. And so we can help with that as well, helping you get really good team members and collapse time on hiring. We've helped companies replace entire teams, cut their staffing costs in half like overnight, she does this stuff and and build out really good hiring systems and processes so that you can get people quickly and scale quickly as you're adding doors. [00:21:49] We have the stuff to help with all of that.  [00:21:51] Sarah: We do. Cool. If you're hearing this and you're like, "man, that would be really nice, then you should reach out. Contact us. Get on a call. Go to doorgrow.Com. You can see what we're all about, what we do. You can book a call. If you're like, "hey, this is for me and I'm ready to go right now," cool. [00:22:06] Sign up. Join our mastermind and you'll have some awesome coaches to support you.  [00:22:10] Jason: Yeah. Some of you listening are feeling really stressed out. Every business owner has been there. Some of you listening have felt really stuck. [00:22:19] It's just things aren't moving forward. You can't figure out why the marketing stuff isn't working. You're not really adding doors. You're not getting ahead. You're getting stressed. You're getting burnt out. You probably cannot see yourself doing this for five more years. And you need to reach out for help. [00:22:36] One of the most difficult things for entrepreneurs to do in especially early stage entrepreneurs is to humble ourselves. To be humble and to realize we could use some help and ask for help. We just we always think we can handle it all ourselves, like we've got it. "If I just watch enough youtube videos or try and get enough free stuff I can figure out." Or "if I just work hard enough I can save a dollar and do it myself or if I read enough books..." and so our goal at DoorGrow is to help you collapse time and make a lot more money. You can probably figure it all out, and I've seen people work really hard at doing this, but it will probably take you a decade to figure it all out. Whereas we could probably help you figure it out in a small fraction of the time. We've done it over and over again. So if you're feeling stuck or frustrated, reach out to us, let us help you make it make sense financially. We will help you justify the financial expense of working with us because really, a good coaching program should be making you money, not costing you money. [00:23:40] And if you do what we tell you to do, you will be making more money. Our program pays for itself. This is why we have probably the lowest churn rate in the entire industry. We keep clients because they're winning. [00:23:52] So reach out to us at DoorGrow. We would love to help you get going.  [00:23:55] Sarah: Be open, just be open to do things a little differently. [00:23:59] And if that's the case, if you are interested at all in having your company and your business and your life, just be better and different than this might be for you.  [00:24:11] Jason: The slowest path to growth is to do it all yourself or to think you can do it all yourself. That is it for today. So until next time to our mutual growth. Make sure you join our facebook group at doorgrowclub.Com. We have a bunch of free stuff in there and reach out to us at DoorGrow at doorgrow.Com We would love to help you grow your business. Bye everyone [00:24:30] you just listened to the #DoorGrowShow. We are building a community of the savviest property management entrepreneurs on the planet in the DoorGrowClub. Join your fellow DoorGrow Hackers at doorgrowclub.com. Listen, everyone is doing the same stuff. SEO, PPC, pay-per-lead content, social direct mail, and they still struggle to grow!  [00:24:57] At DoorGrow, we solve your biggest challenge: getting deals and growing your business. Find out more at doorgrow.com. Find any show notes or links from today's episode on our blog doorgrow.com, and to get notified of future events and news subscribe to our newsletter at doorgrow.com/subscribe. Until next time, take what you learn and start DoorGrow Hacking your business and your life.

As we close our series, Abraham: Journey of Faith, we come to Genesis 25:1-11, Abraham's death. Like Sarah's death, it feels kind of sudden after so much story and time together. There are some interesting details in the passage that we will look into. Most of our time, though, will be spent looking at Abraham's life. We will look at his importance and place in Redemptive History, God's plan for redeeming humanity and renewing and restoring all things. And we will see how Abraham points us to Advent, the longing, waiting, and anticipation of what God would ultimately accomplish in the coming of Christ.

Today we're studying 1 Thessalonians 5:17 in just one minute! Grab your scriptures and let's dive into them together!   Get our 365-day New Testament daily devotional book: https://amzn.to/3BTEQfA (affiliate link)   Get your free copy of the simplified New Testament outline here: https://kristenwalkersmith.com/new-testament-simplified/    And grab Cali's scripture study guide here: https://comefollowmestudy.com/shop/ Discount code: OMSS Or for a physical copy:  https://amzn.to/48nGrsL (affiliate link)

1. Peter's Wisdom for WivesA. Men and women are equal but have different roles- Submission is never forced!B. Don't be defined by what you wear, but by your heart!C. Like Sarah, be willing to walk with your husband as you follow God's call2. Peter's Wisdom for HusbandsA. Seek to understand and serve your wifeB. Honor and serve her!- Weaker? - not in terms of intelligence or capacity for leadership or wisdom- It just means physically weakerC. Co-heirs of grace – again showing equality3. The Results of Living This WayA. Peter gives us two reasons for having a Christ-centered marriage- So our prayers won't be hindered- It's a powerful way to share the gospelB. This extends beyond just marriage – how we conduct ourselves in any relationship shows people what is inside our hearts!

Dr. Eric Smith who is Tammy Slaton and her brother Chris' doctor is on the show to chat Tammy, her weight loss journey, her wedding, and more. Here the full episode: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-sarah-fraser-show/id1064651383?i=1000596399438 Show is sponsored by:  Carawayhome.com use code TSFS for 10% OFF your order at check out Cosmetic Plastics and Dr. Magge Book Dr. Magge for your mommy makeover, breast implants, botox and more. New patients mention The Sarah Fraser Show or code Podcast for 10% OFF ALL SERVICES  Camposfinancialgroup.com Doesn't matter if you have $500 or $5,000,000 Dan Campos is your financial advisor. Call him today: 240-207-3618 David Ruben Family Lawyer David is a lawyer practicing in Maryland who specializes in difficult divorces and narcissists, call for a FREE consultation 301-587-8900  Financialgym.com/TSFS use code TSFS to get 20% your first year of membership Horizonfibroids.com - Get rid of those nasty fibroids!    Nutrafol.com: use code TSFS for FREE shipping and $15 off Plantoeat.com/tsfs: Get 25% off a yearly subscription by using my link Thirdlove.com/tsfs Use this link to get 20% OFF your first order  Zocdoc.com/tsfs - Download the Zocdoc App for FREE   Advertise on The Sarah Fraser Show: Contact Laila Kalantari at True Native Media campaigns@truenativemedia.com Got at TIP on 90 Day Fiance, a TLC Show, Welcome To Plathville? Email: thesarahfrasershow@gmail.com Follow me on Tiktok: @thesarahfrasershow Book me on Cameo: cameo.com/sarahfraser Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Sarah Frei is an inspirational young woman who had to have both legs amputated above the knee and was left paralyzed after a drunk driver crashed into her car on the night of July 30, 2020. Sarah, just 17 at the time, was on her way home with three friends when the incident happened. She suffered paralysis below the waist, a broken back, injuries to her spine, a broken ankle and injuries to her face. She has undergone 20 surgeries but needed to have both of her legs amputated. Less than three months after the incident, Sarah was released from hospital and has gone on to do some amazing things, from wake-boarding, skydiving and touring Europe. Posting photos of her life on social media has inspired thousands of her followers. Sarah was hurt physically, but her spirit continues to shine.Links: Sarah's InstagramStrong Like SarahFacebookSecond Chance Podcast Links:WebsiteBuzzsproutApple PodcastAudibleFacebookDonation Support:https://www.buymeacoffee.com/secondchance1https://www.raphaelrowefoundation.org/get-involvedSupport the show

June 18, 2022 Daily Devotion: "The God of Impossibilities... " Genesis 18:13-14 New International Version 13 Then the Lord said to Abraham, “Why did Sarah laugh and say, ‘Will I really have a child, now that I am old?' 14 Is anything too hard for the Lord? I will return to you at the appointed time next year, and Sarah will have a son.” Wouldn't you think that a God who created the entire universe from nothing has the power to make anything happen that he sets his mind to? So why do you think Sarah laughed at the possibility of having a child at her advanced age? Even when she knew full well that God-not just some strange visitor-had made such a promise, Sarah thought it was up to her to make it happen through Hagar. Like Sarah, most of us tend to assume we must make things happen through our own effort. Even when God promises to take care of us, we don't always take him seriously. Will he really destroy a city full of wicked people? Will he really provide children against all odds? Where is our belief? There is reason to believe that God has a sense of humor, but he is never joking when he makes promises. Nor does he lack the power to accomplish whatever is necessary to bring about either his will or our best interests. Has God promised us something? He will do it! Has God warned us about something? We'd be well-advised to take that warning seriously! We would be equally foolish to think that God has promised us things he has never actually promised, whether it be having children or perhaps restoring an alienated child's love. But if what we hope for never happens, it won't be because God lacks the power to make it happen. Whenever God thinks something is best for us, impossibility is not a word in his vocabulary. The only question to be asked is: Is there something I've desperately tried to make happen on my own without thinking that if God wants it to happen, he has the power to make it happen? --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/gerzon-etino/message

You either drinking or you're not. Spoiler alert. Jessie is drinking and Sarah is picking up light bulbs because she has to pick her daughter up at daycare. How are you celebrating St. Patrick's Day?

Sarah's new year got off to a slow start because she needed a yearly habit tracker printable. You see Sarah knew that the key reason that she failed at achieving her goals is that she couldn't track them visibly. Like many entrepreneurs, Sarah had big plans for her life. She wanted to develop a successful business that would support the dream lifestyle that she mapped out on her vision board. Sarah started to doubt if vision boards, yearly plans and long term goals would really work for her. Let me know if these sound familiar. Like Sarah, you're an entrepreneur with big dreams for your life too. However, it feels as if you are part of that famous statistic that states 90% of startups fail in the first 3 years. You believe that you've tried everything to become successful. SMART goal planning is a technique that you've used in the pastYou've started journaling as a way to track your doubts and fearsInspirational quotes keep you going each and every dayDeveloping new habits is hard and you're prepared to try them for 3 months If only there was a way to finally make the progress and see the results that you are hoping for in your life and business this year. In this post, you'll learn the best-kept secrets of why some entrepreneurs seem to speed past everyone else in the pack. You'll also be able to get your hands on the best and simplest free printable habit trackers for entrepreneurs. Entrepreneur + StartUp Statistics In case you're wondering why it is important to track or develop habits as an entrepreneur let's look at a few statistics. According to Small Biz Genius, 46% of small business entrepreneurs are between the ages of 41 and 56. On the flip side of that 20% of businesses fail in their first year. Their research also showed that middle-aged men start the most successful businesses (come on ladies we can do this too). The folks at FindStack said that 69% of US entrepreneurs started their businesses at home. Did you know that only 50% of businesses will survive until their 5th year in business? According to Statista, the main challenge faced by startups is generating new business. This may surprise you but the number one reason why startups fail is that they misread market demand. The 2nd largest reason why they fail is that they run out of funding and personal money. Therefore it would make sense to develop and track habits that help you read market demand, generate new business and bring in more income. Habit Statistics + Tips How does one develop a new habit anyway? Let's spend some time looking at the reality of forming a new habit. In his article about forming new habits, James Clear says that it takes an average of 66 days to develop a new habit. Did you know that about 92% of people fail to keep their new year's resolutions? This is according to the folks at Nik. Also, 45% of our daily behaviours are automatic because our brain is constantly finding ways to conserve energy. James Clear also talks about the ultimate productivity hack which is saying no. Why? Because when you say no to a few things it means that you're ultimately saying yes to other important options. He also goes on to outline 3 simple questions to improve your productivity each day. What am I optimizing for?What's the best small thing I can do right now?Did I do my best? If you keep these questions top of mind during the day forming a new habit becomes a breeze. Gary Keller in his book, The One Thing, outlines a clever energy plan for anyone who wants to be highly productive. Mediate or pray for spiritual energyEat right, exercise, sleep sufficientlySet goals, plan and put things in the calendar for mental energyTime block your 'One Thing' Let's face it you need a plan to execute those new daily habits. N.B. You can use this to form new good habits and to get rid of bad habits too. Setting Up a Habit Tracker

Proverbs 31 Devotionals- 365 Daily Devotions For God's Daughters by Christian App Empire- Like Sarah --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/tinarenea/support

In this episode, Danielle is joined by Amy Frei, mother of Sarah of "Strong Like Sarah," who has captured the hearts of everyone Sarah meets. Listen in to learn how their family has dealt with the difficult circumstance of Sarah being hit by a drunk driver and her road to recovery after the accident. Chronicling the events that have occurred a little over a year ago, Amy shares insights into Sarah's resilience, the remarkable attitude she has adopted, and the way she thinks as Sarah builds a new life for herself. You'll learn more about how Sarah captured the heart of Nashville country singer and superstar, Russell Dickerson and received a standing ovation at the Country Music Awards, the miracles that have been a part of Sarah's healing journey, how the Frei family supports Sarah's independence in college, and the role of forgiveness in Sarah's ability to move forward.  Perhaps most amazing of all, Amy helps us believe in miracles. You're sure to fall in love with this beautiful family. Enjoy!  

“If we want God's will, we have to wait for God's when.” In this message we look at Sarah's struggle with patience. Like Sarah, we need to trust that God's timing is perfect! Pastor Matt walks us through Sarah's journey of waiting for God and how we can wait for God. While we wait we can be worshiping, working, and witnessing. Remember that God is faithful to us, even in our times of struggle.

“If we want God's will, we have to wait for God's when.” In this message we look at Sarah's struggle with patience. Like Sarah, we need to trust that God's timing is perfect! Pastor Matt walks us through Sarah's journey of waiting for God and how we can wait for God. While we wait we can be worshiping, working, and witnessing. Remember that God is faithful to us, even in our times of struggle.

“If we want God's will, we have to wait for God's when.” In this message we look at Sarah's struggle with patience. Like Sarah, we need to trust that God's timing is perfect! Pastor Matt walks us through Sarah's journey of waiting for God and how we can wait for God. While we wait we can be worshiping, working, and witnessing. Remember that God is faithful to us, even in our times of struggle.

laugh like sarah by St. James Chicago

On July 30, 2020 Sarah Frei was on her way home from Bear Lake with friends when a drunk driver hit the car she was in. She spent two and a half weeks in the ICU and went through 20 surgeries, including a double leg amputation. After 75 days in the hospital and over 70 hours of therapy, she remained positive. This is her story. Follow her on instagram at strong.like.sarah

Audio Transcript:This media has been made available by Mosaic Boston Church. If you like to check out more resources, learn about Mosaic Boston and our neighborhood churches, or donate to this ministry, please visit mosaicboston.com.Good morning. Welcome to Mosaic Church. My name is Jan, one of the pastors here at Mosaic, along with Pastor Shane, Pastor Andy. If you're new or visiting, we love to connect with you. If you'd like to connect with us, do that through a connection card, either the physical one that you can get in the back, and also, you can leave it there after you fill it out, or the virtual one in the app or on the website.For all the moms in the house, happy Mother's Day. Happy Mother's Day. Round of applause. We love you. Thank you. Congratulations, one of the toughest jobs in the world. Happy Mother's Day to my mom, if she's tuning in. She lives in Rhode Island, but every once in a while, she tunes in and then calls me to correct my theology. Then happy Mother's Day to my wife, mother of four daughters. Great time.We're going to pray a special prayer of blessing upon our moms. We also know for some people, it's a difficult day in that they want to be a mom or some have lost their moms. We'll pray for the Lord to comfort us. Would you pray with me?Heavenly Father, we thank you that you are a Father. You're a good Father. We thank you that you are a Father who leads us in ways of blessing. Sometimes those ways of blessing don't feel like blessing. Make us a people who build our lives not on feelings but on the facts of reality of who you are, of what you said, of what you've promised. Make us a people who interpret our circumstances, how we feel about our circumstances through your promises, not vice versa, not interpret your promises through our circumstances, through our feelings.Lord, we thank you for the moms in the congregation. I pray that you bless them abundantly. What a job they have, the hardest job in the world. I pray that you bless them, that you fill them with the Holy Spirit. Would you fill them with supernatural, both physical and spiritual, strength? Protect them from the evil one, from sin, from folly. Bless them abundantly. Make us children who do honor our parents, our father and our mother.Lord, for those who long to be moms, I pray today, satisfy them deeply. Give them an assurance that you're with them. Like Sarah, perhaps they long to be moms. Perhaps it's not time, or perhaps you have something greater. Remind us that children are a blessing. Physical children are a blessing, but you also call us to make disciples of all nations, to have spiritual children whom we disciple in the same way that Jesus didn't have children and St. Paul didn't have children, but they have thousands, and millions, and billions of spiritual children. Bless them. For those who've lost their moms, I pray you do comfort them profoundly in this day and be close to them.Lord, bless our time in the holy scriptures. We thank you for this time you've given us in the book of Genesis. We thank you for the example of Abraham. Thank you for calling him. We thank you for his faith. We thank you for the honesty of scripture, that there are times where his faith was shaken. It vacillated. There are times where he didn't see clearly. He walked by sight, not by faith, and sinned. Sinned against you. Sinned against people.We thank you, Lord, that you didn't leave him in that sin, that you came as a redeemer. You met him. You met Sarah. You met Hagar in one of the lowest points in scripture. You pointed them to the redemption found at the cross. We pray that you bless our time in the holy scriptures. We pray this in Jesus name. Amen.The title of my sermon is Don't Listen to Your Wife When She Suggests You Get a Girlfriend. No, that's the secondary title. The title is God's Work Our Way. God's Work Our Way. We're going through a sermon series that we're calling Jesus in Genesis, in which we see the gospel of Jesus Christ in the first book of the Bible where you see it over and over on every single page.We see the story of a gentleman named Abram, who then becomes Abraham of his wife, Sarai, who becomes Sarah. God calls Abram out of paganism, out of idolatry into a land of Canaan. He promises him, "Hey, Abraham, I'm going to give you myself, the greatest blessing that there is. I'm starting a relationship with you. I'm going to give you this land. I'm going to give you a great name. I'm going to give you a son. Through your son will come blessings for all people."As soon as Abraham moves to Canaan, he's expecting God to make good on His promise immediately. Years begin to go by. We find him in a text where he's 10 to 11 years since that initial promise. He's getting older and older. He was 75 when God called him initially. Now he's around 86 years old.God promised him a son. The assumption of the text is the son will come through Sarah. This is where Abraham shakes. He shakes in his faith. God, maybe it's not through Sarah. Maybe it's my servant, Eliezer. That's last week's text.God comes, and He says, "I'm going to give you a son. It's going to come through you. It will be your son." The assumption there is it's through you and your wife because from Genesis 2, we see that when marriage happens, a covenant happens, two become one. The promise made to the husband is a promise made to the wife as well.We see Abraham over and over through the text. Through the stories, we see him believing, and then we see him shaking in unbelief, believing, and shaking. Today is the third episode in the series of doubt. Abraham now begins to grow impatient. God, where's my son? Where's my son? Sarah begins to grow impatient. Where's my son?They attempt to circumvent God's timing. They attempt to do God's work in their own way. They attempt to force God's hand. There's where we find ourselves in Genesis, chapter 16. Would you look at the text with me?"Now Sarai, Abram's wife, had borne him no children. She had a female Egyptian servant whose name was Hagar. Sarai said to Abram, 'Behold now, the Lord has prevented me from bearing children. Go into my servant. It may be that I shall obtain children by her.' Abram listened to the voice of Sarai. After Abram had lived 10 years in the land of Canaan, Sarai, Abram's wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her servant, and gave her to Abram her husband as a wife.""He went into Hagar, and she conceived. When she saw that she had conceived, she looked with contempt on her mistress. Sarai said to Abram, 'May the wrong done to me be on you! I gave my servant to your embrace. When she saw that she had conceived, she looked on me with contempt. May the Lord judge between you and me!' Abram said to Sarai, 'Behold, your servant is in your power. Do to her as you please.' Then Sarai dealt harshly with her, and she fled from her.""The angel of the Lord found her by a spring of water in the wilderness, the spring on the way to Shur. He said, 'Hagar, servant of Sarai, where have you come from and where are you going?' She said, 'I am fleeing from my mistress Sarai.' The angel of the Lord said to her, 'Return to your mistress and submit to her.' The angel of the Lord also said to her, 'I will surely multiply your offspring so that they cannot be numbered for multitude.'""The angel of the Lord said to her, 'Behold, you are pregnant and shall bear a son. You shall call his name Ishmael because the Lord has listened to your affliction. He shall be a wild donkey of a man, his hand against everyone and everyone's hand against him. He shall dwell over all his kinsmen.' She called the name of the Lord who spoke to her, 'You are a God of seeing,' for she said, 'Truly here I have seen him who looks after me.'""Therefore the well was called Beer-lahai-roi. It lies between Kadesh and Bered. Hagar bore Abram a son. Abram called the name of his son, whom Hagar bore, Ishmael. Abram was 86 years old when Hagar bore Ishmael to Abram." This is the reading of God's holy, inerrant, infallible, authoritative word. May He write these eternal truths upon our hearts.Three points to frame our time: myopic vision leads to mess, vision of God entering mess, and redeemed mess and vision. First of all, myopic vision leads to mess. What a doozy of a text we have before us. One of the reasons this text is here is because this happened. If you were inventing the Bible, if you were inventing a religion, you would not say, "This is the Father of my faith. The Father of my faith did this."This is what's going on in the text. It's a commentary on a reality that happened. The scripture is true. Therefore, it's honest. In Genesis 16:1, "Sarai, Abraham's wife, had borne him no children. She had a female Egyptian servant whose name was Hagar."The backstory here... You got to understand this culture, an honor, shame culture. One of the most important things, roles of a woman, that time was to have children. We saw Sarah... Her eyes are locked on her womb. This is where the culture says a woman's worth came from children who were a sign that you were legitimate, certified you as a person.From a spiritual perspective, this is a sign that God approves of you. We see here, in particular with Abraham and Sarai, God promised them a child, promised them a son of the promise. He hasn't come. It's been 10 to 11 years since that promise, 120 months of anticipating, 120 months of ovulating. He's not coming.Where is the servant from? Hagar. Hagar was an Egyptian. How did she end up in Abraham's household? We're told in chapter 12 that Abraham does leave his own town. He does go to Canaan, the promised land. God told him to stay there. He sets up an altar, starts worshiping God, telling people about God. What we see is a famine in the land shakes Abraham's faith. He says, "We might die."He goes down to Egypt. In Egypt, he sins. He sins against his wife by giving her over to Pharaoh and basically prostituting her to Pharaoh, giving her up in order to save himself. God intervenes at the last moment and saves both of them. Then Pharaoh gives possessions and servants to Abram.At this point, Abram should have rejected the servants. He should have said, "No, thank you. These are people made in the image of God. No, thank you. I'm not going to take them on as my property," in the same way that he said to the king of Sodom, yet he doesn't. He receives them. This wealth then becomes a stumbling block to him.There's Abram. There's Sarai. They can't have a child. Then there's Hagar, the younger servant. Now Sarai said to him, "Behold now, the Lord has prevented me from bearing children." He's prevented me from bearing children. We see a tone of accusation. She knows that God is sovereign. She's just not happy with His sovereignty.God, you're not good at being God. You're not doing your job right. You promised to bless us. Our current situation, our predicament does not feel like blessing. God, you're preventing me. You're not giving me what I want. You're preventing me. It's not just a sadness. It's a bitterness against God.This is a very dangerous place to be when you're bitter against God because then, God's rules don't seem as important. God, you're not giving me what I want. Therefore, even if I have to break a commandment or break one of your decrees, I can because what's more important to me is my happiness, blessing as I understand it, than to fulfill your will.She's blaming God. She comes up with a plan, and the plan is a plan that culturally is acceptable, that a woman who could not bear a child... One recourse that she had was a kind of adoption where she allows her servant to become a wife of her husband as a lower level wife. Then children borne to that surrogate mother would be adopted by the head wife. Very messy, but socially acceptable.The Code of Hammurabi, which is a code followed by the pagan culture of that day... They endorsed it. Sarah looks around and says, "Everybody is doing this." Everybody who doesn't have a child, they allow for this... There's a second wife, second relationship. Scripture says Abram listened to his wife. This is an understatement. She says, "Go into my servant. It may be that I shall obtain children by her." Abraham listened to the voice of Sarai.It doesn't get into the emotional commentary of what's going on. The text... It's not there. I will tell you that Abram is not doing his job. How do I know that? Because the same language that's used to say, "Abram listened to his wife," is the same exact phrase that God uses when He comes to Adam, Adam who sinned against God, rebelled against God, ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, being led by his wife.God comes and uses the same exact language. This is Genesis 3:17. To Adam, He said, "Because you've listened to the voice of your wife and eaten of the tree of which I commanded you shall not eat of it, cursed is the ground because of you. In pain, you shall eat of it all the days of your life."In the same way that Adam passively followed his wife, in the same way that Adam did not lead himself to follow God, to obey God, and because he didn't follow himself, he didn't lead his... Because he didn't lead himself, he didn't lead his wife to follow God in obedience. We see this passivity in Abraham where he's at a point in his life where Sarah comes to him with an idea.I submit to you that Sarah doesn't really want Abraham to do this. How do I know this? I know this because later on, she blames him for following her. I know this, also, because I grew up with three sisters. I have four daughters. I'm married. I know that women don't always mean what they say, and they don't always say what they mean."Baby, you want the last piece of cake?" "Oh, no. No, I'm not hungry. You have it." Okay. Then she's mad the rest of the evening. "Honey, what do you want for your birthday?" "Oh, nothing. What can you give me? I have you. I don't need a birthday present.""Oh, that girl's so pretty. Do you think she's pretty?" Proper response is, "What girl? Didn't notice. Had no idea. Oh, that one. Oh, yes. She's a 1. You're an 11. All right, baby." Conversation's over. That's how you get out of that. Do you think Sarah really wanted Abraham to go get another wife, this younger, pretty Egyptian servant? No, she did not, not deep down inside.Perhaps maybe this will be the son, et cetera, et cetera. Later on, we see no, no, no, no, no, no, this is a terrible idea. She wanted Abraham at this moment to say, "No, honey. I am faithful to you. We worship a God who loves us with a covenantal love. He loves us faithfully, unconditionally, eternally, in the same way I'm going to love you. No, God is going to keep His promise. Let's keep trusting God. Your identity, your worth, your value are not in a child like the culture tells you. Your identity, your value, your worth is in God."He should have done that. He did not. We see here, Abraham, a shell of himself, spiritually speaking, passively allows Sarah to take the spiritual lead in the family. This is a word to every single husband in the room.Husbands, we have a word from God that we are the head of the household. Spiritually speaking, we are to lead our wives spiritually, to disciple them, to know God's word better than them, and to speak it over them, pray with them and over them, and lead them away from folly, away from sin as we lead ourselves.Fathers, our job is to train our children. We're the spiritual leaders. You are the pastors of the household. You're the spiritual leaders to teach God's word, to obey God's word yourself, repent when you sin, and lead children in the same way. Wives, you are to allow your husband to lead as Ephesians 5 says.Abraham should have guided Sarah. He did not. She listened to the wrong voice. She listened to the voice of the serpent just like Eve did. He listened to her voice just like Adam listened to Eve. We see this pattern over and over in scripture. Aaron listened to the voice of the people instead of the voice of God. Reuben listened to his brothers about Joseph. Israel listened to the spies. Israel didn't listen to their judges. Israel listened to the other nations. Solomon allows his wives to lead him into idolatry, et cetera, et cetera.Abraham should have said, "Honey, I see you have an idea. Let's take this idea to the Lord. Let's pray about this." The more important an idea, the more important a choice, the decision, you got to pray. The more important the prayer and fasting is, let's go to the Lord. They did not. If they had gone to the Lord, you know what God would have told him?He would have said, "No, Abraham. Polygamy is against my will. It's against the design of creation." In the Garden of Eden, God didn't create Adam, and Eve, and Hagar. You have one wife. Jesus Christ comes, and He dies not for multiple brides, for one bride. God is a God who loves with a covenantal love. It's two become one, and not three become one.That's what God would have said. This is sin. This is scripture commenting on what's going on. We see the Apostle Paul interpreting what's going on in this text. He interprets it in this text in Galatians, in chapter 4 and 5, where he talks about the dichotomy in the Christian life between the flesh and the spirit, that when you become a Christian, it doesn't mean you're perfect. You're justified by grace through faith. Now begins a process of sanctification, but there are times in your life when you are carnal. You are living in the flesh.He gives a whole list of fruits of the flesh, one of which is sexual immorality, and that's what's happening in this text, and then there's fruits of the Spirit. St. Paul looks at this text before chapter 5, in which he talks about that dichotomy. He looks at Galatians 4: 21 and 25. "Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law? For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman, one by a free woman, but the son of the slave was born according to the," what? According to the flesh."While the son of the free woman was born through promise. Now this may be interpreted allegorically. These women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery. She is Hagar. Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia. She corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children."St. Paul says Ishmael is born as design of the flesh, as a result of the design of the flesh. Isaac was born as a design of the spirit. In terms of practically speaking, do you make your decisions out of the flesh or out of the spirit? How do you know which is which? Well, is it done with prayer? Is it done with seeking wise counsel? Is it done with looking at God's word and seeing, do I contradict any of God's laws, any of God's teaching?Genesis 16:3 through 4, "After Abram had lived 10 years in the land of Canaan, Sarai, Abraham's wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her servant, and gave her to Abram, her husband, as a wife. He went into Hagar, and she conceived. When she saw that she had conceived, she looked with contempt on her mistress."Sarah comes up with a plan, sinful plan. Abraham goes along with the plan because he's tempted by his own flesh. Honey, you want me to do what? You want me to sleep with her? He's tempted, gives into that temptation. Then the rest of the text is a commentary on the consequences of him giving into that sin.It was a terrible idea. Surrogate motherhood was a common practice at that time, but right away, we're given hints that this is a terrible idea. Sarah took Hagar and gave her to Abraham. It's an ominous callback to Genesis, chapter 3, where Eve takes of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. She eats and gives to her husband who is with her, passively. Doesn't protect her from the temptation of the evil one.Sarah, the same way, takes Hagar as if she's an object and gives her as an object of temptation to her husband. In the Garden of Eden, we had two trees: the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and the tree of life. Those two trees... Here, we have two women. One, you can eat from. The other one, you can't.Abraham sins. He's deceived by his flesh and then what happens with Hagar. In a sense, she's sinned against. Did she choose to go along with this plan? We're not told because if a person is in a position of power, has power over the servant. We're not told how she's responded to any of this, but we are told that she herself isn't blameless either since Sarai has sinned.Then what we see is Hagar looks down with contempt on Sarai. The important word, she despises Sarai. She sees her boss, so to speak, who can't have a child, and she has a child. This child is growing inside now. The baby is showing perhaps, kicking. Now she's looking at Sarah with contempt.The word is despised her. It's the same word that she uses to curse in Genesis 12:3, where God says, "Abraham, whoever curses you will be cursed by me." She curses in a sense because she understands. From the perspective of culture, she has everything that Sarah wanted. She has the affection of Abraham. She has the embrace of Abraham. She has access to his wealth and finally has a child.As far as anyone knows, Hagar is carrying the promised child. What we see is now the family descends into misery. That sin leads to dysfunction that leads to misery. It says if two women with kids have one husband they both share, if a husband and wife divorced, and they're still living in the same house as the husband remarries, there's just bitterness, and spite, and heartache, and heartbreak.Sarah perceives Hagar as a threat against her place in the household. In verse 5, Sarai said to Abram, “May the wrong done to me be on you!" She feels sinned against, although it was her idea. "I gave my servant to your embrace, and when she saw that she had conceived, she looked on me with contempt. May the Lord judge between you and me!"What she's saying is, you should have known better. You know what? She's right. Abraham should have known better. Abraham is the guy that's talking to God, that's praying to God, that has access to God, that knows God's word. Sarah blames him. What we see here is this is how sin works. Sin makes these great promises that always over-promises and it under-delivers. Sin never comes to you with a whole list of consequences that will come after the sin. No, it comes with the promises.Sin is like a medication commercial. You know those medication commercials, those drug commercials on TV? where it's like, this is your issue, whatever your issue is. Now this is the solution. This drug will absolutely make everything better. There's always sunlight. There's always green grass. There's nice music. There's always a bathtub. I don't know. Just in the middle of the field, there's a bathtub of someone just really enjoying themselves.It's like, this will solve all of your problems, not all of your pain will go away. That's for two minutes, and then it'll last 10 seconds. A guy comes in with rapidfire 3x. He's like, "By the way, here's the side effects. You might have vertigo and nausea. You might get warts growing on your nose, little hairs. You might grow a tail. You might grow grass out of your ears, et cetera. You're going to die. You might die. You can't sue us. Sorry, but buy this thing."Sin is like that except it doesn't give you the last 10 seconds. It just over-promises, and it under-delivers every time, in particular when it comes to sexual sin. That's why this is at the heart of the story of a man of faith named Abraham.Verse 6, "Abram said to Sarai, 'Behold, your servant is in your power. Do to her as you please.' Then Sarai dealt harshly with her, and she fled from her." It was Abram's sin that led to this situation. His passivity allowed for it. He didn't take responsibility, not then, not here. He listened to Sarai's sinful advice. Now he allows Sarah to do whatever she wants. You just see a pathetic shell of himself, spiritual speaking, the callous response, "Do to her as you please."What does Sarah do? She deals harshly with Hagar. Hagar is pregnant. They're living in tents. We don't know what she did. Maybe verbal abuse, physical abuse, maybe demands on her that were just impossible, ultimately so cruel that Hagar just decides to leave, to flee, to go back to Egypt.Here, what the text is teaching is, it's always a terrible idea to try to accomplish God's plan our own way in our own timing. There's examples of this over and over in scripture. God allows for situations like this in the life of His most faithful in order to grow them in reliance and dependence on God.Case in point, Moses. Moses knew from a young age, he had a burning desire, the call on his life that he will be part of the liberation movement of the people of Israel from Egypt. He grew up as a Jewish person in Pharaoh's household, got the education, got the training, and then finally says, "Now it's time for me to be the great liberator."Sees an Egyptian master abusing a Jewish slave. He meddles and kills the Egyptian master with his own hands, buries the body in the sand. When that's found out, he flees. What's going on? He tried to rush God's plan. God's work has to happen God's way. God's plans come complete with His methods, with His timing.Hudson Taylor said, "God's work done in God's way will never lack God's supply." Our tinkering only messes things up. Case in point, King Saul, the first king of Israel... Samuel the priest tells him, "Hey, before you go to paddle, you need to understand. We need to sacrifice an animal to get the Lord's blessing. We need to worship God. Don't do anything. Don't go into battle until I come, and I will lead that process as the priest of God."Saul waits one day, waits another day, waits a week. Samuel's not coming. Samuel's not coming. Saul takes an animal, and he takes upon himself the role of a priest, which he should not have. He sins. Samuel says, "Because you have sinned against God, trying to force God's plan, you will have the throne taken away from you."Now that's the mess that's created by losing of vision of God's plan, a myopic vision, shortsighted vision. Thanks be to God that God doesn't leave them on their own in this mess. This is point two of vision of God entering the mess.Now you see Hagar pregnant, no resources, cast out by Abraham, the father of her child and her husband, cast out by Sarah. She's by herself, fleeing 100 miles away from Abraham's camp in Hebron. In the next scene, we see that God doesn't leave her in this forsaken place. He comes to her when she is most broken, most desperate, most heartbroken. He doesn't just come to her. He doesn't just meet her. He calls her by name.This right here is one of the most shocking parts of the text. This is the only instance, not just in the Old Testament, but in all of Eastern literature, where a deity calls a woman by name. God doesn't even call Eve by name, doesn't call Sarah by name, doesn't call Deborah by name, but He engages Hagar in conversation. Calls her by name as He meets her in the wilderness.This is verse 7. "The angel of the Lord found her by a spring of water in the wilderness, the spring on the way to Shur." She's on her way to Egypt, stops at a spring of water on the way to Shur. Shur... You have to pass through to get to Egypt. The word, Shur, means wall that hardly anyone passes through. It was that forbidding. It was just unending road of yellow sand and gravel.She's at this place where she wants to get a little water before she treks on. She knows that her chances of getting through are minuscule. She knows that she needs supernatural help. The Lord meets her. The angel of the Lord found her. The angel of the Lord says in verse 8. He said, "'Hagar, servant of Sarai, where have you come from and where are you going?' She said, 'I am fleeing from my mistress Sarai.'" She answers the first question. Doesn't answer the second question.Where did you come from? I'm fleeing Sarai. Where are you going? I don't know. I want to go back to Egypt. That's the only other place I've known." Is she going to be accepted in Egypt? Probably not. She's single. She's not a virgin. She's having a child. Who's child is it? It's probably a biracial child. She's going to go there and probably be outcast, if not killed.God intervenes, stops her. He calls her by name, Hagar, servant of Sarah. Hagar is stunned. The gods of Egypt, where gods didn't care about slaves... They didn't care about slave girls. To be noticed by Egyptian gods, you got to be high up on the priest's ladder. You have to coax them, feed them, flatter them.Here we see the angel of the Lord showing up, speaking to Hagar gently by name. No one's spoken to her by name thus far. Sarai calls her, "My maid," in verse 2 and 5. Abraham calls her, "My maid," in verse 6. Abraham and Sarah... They think of her as a slave, as a foreigner, as a possession, something to be used, abused, as someone to be mistreated, neglected, expendable.The angel speaks to her and calls her by name. The angel of the Lord speaking to a woman who's not Jewish, at a well, speaking to her tenderly. This sounds like someone else. Then angel of the Lord... Who is that? Who is the angel of the Lord? The angel of the Lord, definite article. It's not an angel of the Lord.He comes, and He speaks in first person. He doesn't say, "Thus say the Lord. I have a message to you from God." No, he speaks in first person. He speaks on behalf of God as if He is God. Well, the word, angel, in Hebrew just means messenger. This is a messenger of the Lord. Who else is a messenger of the Lord? Jesus Christ is the word of God.Four times in this text: the angel of the Lord, angel of the Lord, angel of the Lord, angel of the Lord... Whenever that phrase is used with a definite article, this is the only angel, the primary angel of the Lord. This is a Christophany. This is Jesus Christ appearing. In verse 7, 9, 10, 11, it says, "The angel of the Lord."It's Jesus Christ speaking to her. She knows exactly who's before her. She's in the presence of deity. That's why in verse 13, she says, "I have seen the Lord. The Lord has seen me. I'm spoken to the Lord." Jesus Christ meets her, and the angel of the Lord, Jesus, says to her, "Return to your mistress and submit to her."Why is He doing that? He's doing that for two reasons. Number one, this is the only place she's going to have safety as a pregnant woman. Second of all, this son that you have, Ishmael, he's going to be a difficult son. He needs his dad. Every child needs their dad. You got to bring the child back to his daddy. Return and submit to Sarai. Promises her that much of the same blessing that was given to Abraham, that both offspring will be so great they can't be counted.Verse 11, "The angel of the Lord said to her, 'Behold, you are pregnant and shall bear a son. You shall call his name Ishmael because the Lord has listened to your affliction.'" Ishmael means God hears. God heard your pain, your affliction. Verse 12, "He shall be a wild donkey of a man, his hand against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he shall dwell over against all his kinsmen.”Just as Abraham's offspring is promised suffering in Genesis 15, God says to Abraham, "Your children will suffer for 400 years." In the same way, he's saying Hagar's offspring will suffer. The hands of many will be against him and his hand will be against everyone. He's going to go his own way. A wild donkey is a metaphor for a proud individualist. There will be perpetual conflict in his life.Herman Melville who wrote Moby Dick starts the novel, the narrative, saying, "Call me Ishmael," same name. Call me a man who is alone, who is alienated from others. This isn't as much of a blessing as much of a prophecy. This is what's going to happen. Perhaps this is because of the family situation, because of the two wives situation where perhaps Ishmael didn't feel as if he was truly loved in the household, et cetera, because he didn't feel like he was the son of the promise, et cetera.We know that he was going to live a very difficult life. We see descendants of Ishmael, not just physical descendants, but he has spiritual descendants just like Isaac has descendants, not just physical but spiritual. The Muslim people claim that God actually promised the land of Israel to Ishmael, and that the Jewish people stole it, and that the Bible is a big Jewish lie. That's why there's still struggle in the Middle East. It all stems from this.If we ever have a picture of the longevity of sin, we see it here. This is what the text teaches us, that we are to look at our decisions not just from our perspective or perspective even of our lifetime, but generationally speaking, will this decision lead to blessing to people and will leave a legacy of blessing, leave a legacy of pain?God continues to minister to Hagar. This is point three: redeemed mess and vision. God brings in redemption into a situation. Verse 13, "She called the name of the Lord who spoke to her, 'You are a God of seeing.'" She knows this is God who spoke to her, right? She calls on the name of the Lord who spoke to her through the angel of the Lord. That's how we know that this is Jesus. "'You are God of seeing,' for she said, 'Truly I have seen him who looks after me.'"What floors Hagar more than anything isn't just the blessing or the promise. It's the fact that God sees, that God has seen this whole situation. He's seen every blow that Sarah has inflicted. He's seen every single blind eye that Abraham turned. He's seen every injustice. She's blown away that God cares for those who are outside this people, hears their cry, sees their tears.She realizes that she was viewed as expendable. God views her as a daughter. He speaks over her, calls her by name. She's beloved by the Lord. She says, "You are God of seeing." What's fascinating is she is the only person, all of scripture, male or female, that gets the name God. She looks at him, and she said, "You are God El Roi. You are the God of seeing. You see me."Abraham lost sight of God. Sarai lost sight of God. Hagar lost sight of God as well, but God did not lose sight of them. Even when they are faithless, He is faithful. God comes to them.In Genesis 16:14, "Therefore the well was called Beer-lahai-roi. It lies between Kadesh and Bered." That verse doesn't mean anything to us except we see the word, beer, there. Then we're like, beer, a well beer. Wow. That's amazing. It's not about beer, obviously.There's an incredible theological significance in what's going on here. This is the well of the seeing God and et cetera. It's between Kadesh and Bered, Kadesh and Bered. Kadesh means holiness or holy. Bered means judgment. Between the holiness of God and the judgment of God is a well of a God who sees, a well of the living one who sees.Hagar begins the journey to the wall, Shur. She ends up at the well. At the well is where she is met with her beloved. This isn't the biblical pattern that we see. The biblical pattern is every time a woman is at a well in scripture, in the stories, in the narratives, she encounters her beloved.We see this with Rebekah. She was proposed to at a well. Rachel meets Jacob by a well. Zipporah meets Moses by a well. There's another story, of course, of Jesus Christ meeting a woman at the well, the Samaritan woman. He goes, and He meets with her. He asks her for some water. They have a conversation. Then finally, He says, "You know what? I don't need your physical water. I have spiritual water, water that wells up to eternal life. I am offering you a water that truly satisfies."Then He explains to her who He is, that He is the Messiah. He explains to her that she's been living a life where she's been seeking waters of satisfaction in relationships with men, five husbands. She was living with a guy at the time that was not her husband.He explains to her, "You're seeking something that can never be satisfied physically. You're seeking a spiritual satisfaction. You're seeking to be fully known and fully loved, that only God can do that."We see Abraham, and Sarah, and Hagar... All of them were seeking this deep satisfaction. They couldn't find it. Finally, Hagar meets Jesus Christ at a well. She realizes, "You are God who sees everything. You still meet with me, and speak to me, and call me by name. You see everything," which sounds great when we do great things. How about when we don't?It sounds great when we are sinned against. God, you see everything, but it doesn't sound great when we sin against others. Hagar realizes, "You see everything. You saw when I was being sinned against. You saw how I responded with sin against Sarah. You see everything, and you still call me by name?"How can God do that? God can do that because He meets us at the intersection between two wells. He meets us at the well of grace between holiness and judgment. Where else do we see holiness and judgment coming together? We see at the cross of Jesus Christ. At the cross of Jesus Christ, we see the holiness of God poured out on his Son, in terms of wrath for taking our sin upon Himself. It's the holiness of God that leads to the judgment of our sin.We see Jesus Christ forsaken from the Father's House, and we see that Jesus Christ goes. Though He is forsaken by the Father on the cross, He says, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Why was Jesus Christ forsaken on the cross? So that we would never have to be, so that we could be sought, seen, wooed, embraced by God, so that we could have a vision of God that satisfies us like nothing else.St. Thomas Aquinas is called one of the top three Christian minds to have ever lived. Called the Doctor of the Church for centuries, wrote over 80 books, all massive. It was beginner's theology. It was about 3,500 pages. When he was writing his masterpiece, his magnum opus, writing his masterpiece, he had a vision of God in prayer. In that vision, God says, "You've been faithful. You've been faithful to me. What do you want?" All he said was, "I just want some more of God." Then he died not long after that.After the vision, his stenographer with whom he wrote said, "Why did you stop writing?" He said, "After what I've seen, all that I have written is straw." He saw a vision from God. He understood who God is. He understood that God proves that He does care for us, that He does loves us, that He does want to bless us, and He proved it on the cross of Jesus Christ.Hagar returns. How couldn't she? She got a new vision from God. Because of this new vision, she continues to obey the Lord. Abram changes as well. We see him finally taking responsibility. In this text, he took his son, and he names him. Verse 15, "Hagar bore Abram a son, and Abram called the name of his son, whom Hagar bore, Ishmael. Abram was eighty-six years old when Hagar bore Ishmael to Abram."Abram repents of his sin. In 1 John 1:8 through 10, it says, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."Do you have sins? Do I have sins? We do. We need to confess our sins, ask for forgiveness, repent of our sins, and believe that at the cross of Jesus Christ, our sins are paid for when the judgment of God is poured out on Jesus Christ. When we repent, God does forgive.How do we know that Abraham repented? Because we see a pattern of changed life afterwards, that he continues to wait on God. He names his son, and he continues to raise his son. He loves his son. How do we know that Abraham loved Ishmael? Because later on, when God comes to him, he says, "Hey, I'm going to send you the son of the promise now, Isaac." Abraham says, "Could you make him the son of the promise? I really love Ishmael."We see a change of heart in this man who finally takes responsibility for his actions. What we see at the end of the chapter is, and beginning of the next chapter, we see a gap of another 13 years. Now in these 13 years, yes, there was strife, and disagreement, and bitterness, and jealousy, and heartache. More than any of this, what we see is that Abraham continued to grow in his reliance and dependence on God. That's where true faith is grown in this area where we understand we could do nothing apart from Jesus Christ.Every single one of us, we need to constantly reassert our dependence on God. God, I need you. God, I need a new vision, a fresh vision of who you are, a fresh vision of what you've called me to do. Give me the power of the Holy Spirit to do that, to live according to the Spirit and not according to the flesh. Let's pray.Lord Jesus, we thank you for this text. We thank you for the honesty of the text and showing us an episode in Abraham's life where he did sin. There was a sin of passivity and not leading himself spiritually, not leading his wife spiritually, Lord.For those of us men who are in this room, if we struggle with the sin of passivity, I pray today, give us the gift of repentance, that you make us a people who boldly lead in following you on a daily basis, lead ourselves, lead our wives, lead our children. Lord, continue to fill each one of us with the Holy Spirit so that we don't make decisions out of the flesh but make decisions out of the Holy Spirit and continue to bear the fruit of the Spirit. We pray this in Jesus name. Amen.

Pastor Bob continues our #FAITH series this week. He preaches on the Faith of Sarah. Through her he shows us that God stretches our faith, shapes our faith and sustains our faith. Check it out!

Pastor Bob continues our #FAITH series this week. He preaches on the Faith of Sarah. Through her he shows us that God stretches our faith, shapes our faith and sustains our faith. Check it out!

Our letter this week is N, which is not for nappies, nursery or nipples, it's for Nanny and the nanny of the moment, Nanny Louenna. Like Sarah, Louenna is a Norland Nanny, (the nannies the royal family use) and she has developed a brilliant app, nicknamed Nanny in My Pocket, that has been a lifesaver for many parents, particularly in the last year. She is really passionate about supporting parents to enjoy their parenting journey, sharing all that she knows and helping babies and children to thrive. She also has the most wonderful laugh!                    In this brand-new episode, we talk to Louenna about her app, how parenting and nannying has changed since she graduated from the world-famous Norland College and her number one piece of advice, when it comes to babies.

The journey is just beginning for a remarkable young woman from northern Utah -- almost six months to the day since a she was involved in a terrible accident. Sarah Frei  is on the way to a new future as she helps advocate on Utah’s Capitol Hill. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

It turns out the family trait of not being able to wait runs deep and wide in the family of God. We do foolish things while we wait for promises to be fulfilled.  

This week, Kayla and Joshua recap Sarah Fuller making history over the weekend, becoming the first woman to kick in a Power Five football game. They also discuss if Ohio State is in trouble after another cancelled game due to COVID-19, and this week's "Get To Know The Coach" segment features Pat Fitzgerald.

On July 30th Sarah was hit head on by a drunk driver. She had severe injuries that have resulted in a double leg amputation and paralysis. Today we are going to hear part 2 of Sarah Frei’s experience. To help raise money for Sarah’s extensive medical needs, Sarah’s aunt Amanda, was inspired and divinely helped to organize a benefit concert for the Frei family. Amanda is a member of the a cappella singing group Vocalocity who sang at this concert along with Mat & Savanna Shaw, and Alex Boye. The concert was beautiful and miraculous throughout the whole night. You can watch the concert on YouTube:  Virtual Sarah Frei Benefit Concert Resources: Places to donate to Sarah Frei’s new medical needs: Go Fund Me: Sarah Frei Care Fund American First Credit Union: Sarah Frei Family Care Fund IG: strong.like.sarah (has more information for donations) Season 1 Wonders and Miracles: Stories of Miraculous Moments in Everyday Lives Hearts of the Fathers by Sheldon Lawrence, Support our sponsors www.meditationsonthemount.com  & www.bibledice.com   Visit www.wondersandmiracles.com for more stories or to submit a story.  Follow me on Facebook and Instagram @wondersandmiracles

Who is ready to swim with the Sharks? Check out this epic podcast episode with entrepreneur, Army veteran, Iraqi war veteran, All American Rugby player at Princeton, mom, and Mastermind member and friend Sarah Apgar who just appeared on Shark Tank on ABC a few days ago. Listen in as Sarah pitches her FitFighter brand on Shark Tank, and I ask her all the “behind-the-scenes” questions that you will love hearing about.    Hop into the Tank now with Sarah as she faces Sharks Mark Cuban, Robert Herjavec, Kevin O’Leary, Lori Greiner, and guest Shark Daniel Lubetzky. Sarah shares her feelings walking through the doors of Shark Tank, entering the doors to the stage full of light onto the set... man, I had goosebumps as she described the feeling inside of her and which Shark she was going after. Sarah also shares the inside scoop on the decision making moments and brain chaos that led her to the new FitFighter Co-Captain.     Sarah spent a ton of preparation time, over 30 days prior rehearsing every day, meditating, and making sure her formula of Preparation + a Little Fortune + Gumption + Commitment would meet in the end result!   Hop in the Tank, start swimming and choose your Sharks carefully. Be sure to share this episode on your social media, and please tag me on. IG/Twitter:  @ToddDurkin @sarah.apgar  @fitfighter  Facebook:  @ToddDurkinFQ10   TIMESTAMPS:  2:26 - Welcome Sarah Apgar...From the Shark Tank to the IMPACT Show! 4:42 - Confronting the Sharks 7:40 - The Shark Sarah Was Going After 9:55 - A Guest Shark…? 11:25 - Who is the lucky Shark...now co-captain of FitFighter? 13:00 - Sarah shares a little on what her relationship is with her new co-captain. 15:07 - Sarah shares her new Co-Captain’s Super Power. 17:05 - Lori looked like she was going to make an offer 19:50 - Sarah shares some great moments and thoughts now that the show has aired. 25:51 - Decision Making Moments 31:57 - What’s next for FitFighter?  37:00 - Gratitude and the power of the community! 41:50 - Wisdom and Motivation from Sarah - The FitFighter core values: 53:15 - Final Wrap up - Keep the crack in the door open!   ---   Like Sarah, would you like to swim with a “good” shark in your business and life? If so, check out the TD Mastermind Group or the IMPACT Coaching Certification below… If you are a Trainer, Coach, or Fitness Business Owner seeking to make a more significant IMPACT, I invite you to join the Todd Durkin Mastermind Program.   My Mastermind Program is for those seeking “best in class” content & coaching in personal development, leadership, business, marketing & coaching.   Exclusively for my podcast listeners, and for a limited time, you can receive a FREE fitness business assessment and a complimentary (60 min) coaching call.   Simply visit https://todddurkinmastermind.com/free-vna-coaching-call.   ---   Are you ready to be a Certified “Todd Durkin I.M.P.A.C.T. Coach”?  Get Certified VIRTUALLY this Saturday, Nov 21st, 2020!!   Do you dream of building your career or adding skills to your current business and personal life? Are you looking to clarify your purpose, goals, and direction within the life coaching domain and expand your coaching toolkit to increase revenues?   If you want to be a “life-coach” to help people create more IMPACT in people’s lives, please join me Saturday, November 21st, to be part of the elite first group to become a Certified “Todd Durkin I.M.P.A.C.T. Coach.”  For all information and to sign-up for my new I.M.P.A.C.T. Coaching Certification program, go to https://impactcertification.todddurkin.com/.   ---   About Sarah: Sarah Apgar is the Founder of FitFighter, a complete strength training system that makes you ready for your everyday mission. She is an Iraq War Veteran, All-American Athlete, Fitness Professional, Volunteer Firefighter, and mom of 2 little girls. Sarah and FitFighter have been featured on ABC News, USA Sports Radio, Armed Forces Network, and Oxygen Magazine, and performed for clients the likes of ESPN, FDNY, and the Tuck School of Business at Dartmouth College. Sarah promotes and celebrates the power of teams, women leaders, and public service, contributing a portion of sales to the Stephen Siller Tunnel to Tower Foundation. Sarah has an MBA from the Tuck School of Business at Dartmouth College and a BA from Princeton University, and is a graduate of the Princeton Army ROTC Program. She lives in Port Washington NY with her husband, Ben Smith, a plastic and reconstructive surgeon, and her two young daughters, Emory and Arlyn. Follow Sarah Apgar:  IG & Twitter @sarah.apgar  @fitfighter Website: www.sarahapagar.com & www.FitFighter.com ---   Please keep your questions coming so I can highlight you on the podcast!! If you have a burning question and want to be featured on the IMPACT show, go to www.todddurkin.com/podcast, fill out the form, and submit your questions!    ---   Follow Todd… → Instagram & Twitter: @ToddDurkin → Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/user/ToddDurkinFQ10 → FB: @ToddDurkinFQ10   Don't forget that if you want more keys to unlock your potential and propel your success, you can order my book GET YOUR MIND RIGHT at www.todddurkin.com/getyourmindright or anywhere books are sold.   ---   ABOUT: Todd Durkin is one of the leading coaches, trainers, and motivators in the world. It’s no secret why some of the world’s top athletes have trained with him for nearly two decades. He’s a best-selling author, a motivational speaker, and owns the legendary Fitness Quest 10 in San Diego, CA, where he leads an amazing team of 42 teammates.   Todd is a coach on the Netflix show “STRONG” that is must-watch TV. He is a previous Jack LaLanne Award winner, a 2-time Trainer of the Year, and he runs his Todd Durkin Mastermind group of top trainers and fitness pros around the globe, coaching them with business, leadership, marketing, training, and personal growth mentorship.   Todd and his wife Melanie head up the Durkin IMPACT Foundation (501-c-3) that has raised over $250,000 since it started in 2013. 100% of all proceeds go back to kids and families in need. To learn more about Todd, visit www.ToddDurkin.com and www.FitnessQuest10.com.   Join his fire-breathing dragons’ community and receive regular motivational and inspirational emails. Visit www.ToddDurkin.com and opt-in to receive his value-rich content.   Connect with Todd online in the following places: You can listen to Todd’s podcast, The IMPACT Show, by going to www.todddurkin.com/podcast.

Episode 91 Strong Like Sarah Frei Part 1 Today I had the honor of interviewing Sarah Frei along with her parents Greg and Amy. On July 30th Sarah was hit head on by a drunk driver. She had severe injuries that have resulted in a double leg amputation and paralysis. Listen as they share her experiences as well as there hopeful and inspiring outlook on their new unexpected changes in life. I hope you can feel the sweet spirit of this amazing family as much as I did while interviewing them. Resources: Places to donate to Sarah Frei’s new medical needs: Go Fund Me: Sarah Frei Care Fund American First Credit Union: Sarah Frei Family Care Fund IG: strong.like.sarah (has more information for donations) Season 1 Wonders and Miracles: Stories of Miraculous Moments in Everyday Lives Hearts of the Fathers by Sheldon Lawrence, Support our sponsors www.meditationsonthemount.com  & www.bibledice.com   Visit www.wondersandmiracles.com for more stories or to submit a story.  Follow me on Facebook and Instagram @wondersandmiracles

Ancient views on the opening verses of Torah reading חיי שרה Chayei Sarah ("Sarah's life," Gen. 23:1–25:18) about the funeral for the pivotal matriarch of Israel remind us that we all go through phases of our lives. Like Sarah, Abraham and other key leaders of the people of God, we get a new name — character, reputation and legacy — when we are delivered from our old life of bondage to things that keep us separated from the Kingdom of Heaven. In this study, we explore why embracing our “new name” as a “new creation” of Heaven is essential to this transformation.

This message is for you! Psalm 128:3 Your wife will be like a fruitful vine within your house; your children will be like olive plants around your table. Your shame is taken away and replaced with the Beautification of Children in the Supreme and matchless name of Jesus. Amen Akirisore is Lord

“You can have it all… you just cannot have it all at once” ~Sarah’s NannyWhat great and wise advice from a kind soul. Sarah Lowder comes from a line of amazing, beautiful, and kind women. She is as gracious and she sounds, and as sweet as the treats behind their glass display cases. I’ve had the privilege of watching Sarah and her husband, Preston’s, dream become reality. From selling King Cakes out of their home kitchen to opening a booming bakery that continues to exceed expectations, their story of success is an inspiring one! Like Sarah mentions… even when it may not make sense to others, find your passion, put the blinders on, and go for it! You can find Lowder’s Baking Company at…https://www.lowderbaking.com/https://www.facebook.com/LowderBakingCohttps://www.instagram.com/lowderbakingco/Please join our online community page at https://www.facebook.com/groups/277309686634356And follow me on insta @amykathleen.akhttps://www.instagram.com/amykathleen.ak/This week's Mindful Minute: Dr. Kristen Racehttps://kristenrace.com/https://www.instagram.com/drkristenrace/

TABLE TALK A dinner table discussion guide for your family and friends. Discussion: What about Sunday's message impacted you the most? Scripture Engagement: Genesis 18Isaiah 51Hebrews 11 Main Points: Disappointment tempts us to try and “fix” the problem ourselves. “People will never be perfect, even if we think they should be or hope they will be. And not saying He wants us to sit around and let people treat us badly. But God rights injustices like nobody else. If a leader or someone you look up to has failed, you do the right thing. God will take that disrespect and turn it into honor, like He did for Sarah.”“Like Sarah's, our story is one tiny piece of a huge one. Important enough that He'd show up at our tent door and call us by name, but way too vast for us to see how it all fits together. If God's hand in Sarah's life can take her from where she was to where she ended up, then yes, I want to be like Sarah.” Questions for Discussion: Is there any disappointment in your life you need to acknowledge? In what ways do you feel inadequate? How can you take steps to trust God in that area of your life? Do you believe that God is still writing your story? What are you hoping in Him for? Praying Together: Thank Him. What can we thank Him for? Praise Him. What is one thing about who Jesus is that we can praise Him about?Ask Him. What is a need we have or an area in which we would like to see God break through. Listen to Him: What is on God's heart about your need. What is He saying to you?

Welcome back to the Whole View, episode 412. (0:27) Stacy was just talking to Sarah about how discussing covid again is not mentally what she wants to do because she is ready to move past this. In America, covid is not trending in our favor. We do have a couple of questions that we are going to get to, but before we jump into that, Stacy has some exciting, positive news to share. As mentioned previously, Stacy's family has been going through foster training. Early this week, they officially received approval to be resource parents for foster care. It is such a light among all of the darkness 2020 has brought. They started this journey in November 2019. This has been something that has brought Stacy hope and makes her feel like she can make a difference. It is one of those things that Stacy felt called to do, and she is glad she followed her instincts. The process was drawn out because of covid, but they have finally been able to move forward with everything. They hope to welcome some youngsters in need of a safe, stable home in the near future. Stacy will not be sharing anything about the kids moving forward, but she shares this announcement in the hope to inspire others to participate in foster care. It feels as if there is a stigma around fostering, and this is a time in the world where people who live in less than ideal situations are more than ever in need of safe, stable homes. If foster care is something that resonates with you, please look into it as there are so many different ways you can do it to fit your abilities and lifestyle. You are welcome to email Stacy at stacy@realeverything.com and she can share her experience with you and answer questions. Stacy genuinely feels like there is such a need for this right now.   Covid-19 Q & A Series We have a series of questions that will touch at different aspects of covid and our response to it, and our way forward. (5:02) Sarah will also share the latest science available. She hopes that this is a show that answers some of the common lingering questions that have been floating out there. Thank you to everyone who sent questions and for utilizing this show as a trusted resource! They take this role very seriously and put a lot of effort into the research that goes into this show. We hope that you continue to come to us with your questions, and understand that sometimes the answer to your question is 'we don't know'. Sarah wants to start this episode with an email that we received from Cathy. This email encapsulates our experiences in many ways. "Thank you so much for your podcast! Living in Wisconsin where the cases are going up but everything is open my husband and I have chosen to stay isolated. I have not been in a store since March 13, except for two medical appointments and that is it, and I wore a mask for those.  I am 59 years old but feel I am at a higher risk because I am on Humira for RA, have fatty liver disease even though I have never been overweight, have heart and kidney issues both related to birth defects. My diet is AIP, and with a few introductions, I have been in remission for over 2 years.  I have been feeling pretty down the past few days as I had to miss our youngest grandsons 1st birthday party. While I did attend virtually, my adult children and 6 grandchildren are not practicing social distancing, so missing them has been heartbreaking. We do play in the yard together occasionally but maintain our distance. It is so hard not hugging. I do get out for a walk daily, do many crafts so I have been sewing, painting, etc.  I just wanted to thank you for giving the information to continue believing that my husband and I are on the right course."   Stick With It Stacy has such empathy for Cathy. (7:56) We commend Cathy for sticking with it. Stacy knows it is difficult and has been there personally. It is so painful to turn down family gatherings. Stacy is happy to hear that Cathy is getting outside, and engaging as much as she can because this will not end anytime soon. We have to find ways to physical distance. However, we are social beings and our emotional well-being is so dependant on our emotional connection with others. Stacy hopes we can continue to find ways to do this. If you are at risk, it is so hard And while we are grateful for all that technology gives us access to, it still sucks to have to miss out on opportunities. Sarah felt it was important to start this episode with Cathy's comment. It is important to understand how common this experience is. This feeling of stress around being someone who is taking precautions, and feeling like we are missing out, these are real challenges. It is hard to be physically isolated in our homes, and then we have these doubts wondering if we are doing too much. This self-doubt magnifies our feelings of missing out. Sarah wants to emphasize that these feelings are common and it doesn't take away from how important it is to continue to stay at home, social distance, use our mask, and wash our hands. Know that we are together in our aloneness. Help yourself focus on the positives. No matter your circumstances, we can all relate and know that you are not alone.   Germ Exposure Let's start with Jeanie's questions for our Q & A! (16:04) Jeanie writes, "Dear Stacy and Sarah, thank you for your most recent podcast on covid. I know you must be tired of talking about this, but it was so helpful to me, mostly to know that I'm not the only one still concerned about this virus. I live in Missouri where cases are increasing and officials are not taking the virus seriously. Although my hometown of St Louis was mostly following science at the beginning, now that our local cases have fallen, half the population has gone back to life as normal. Like Sarah, I feel so much dismay that science is being disregarded and that this could all be done so much better! I'm so frustrated that we are living in a time where experts are demonized and people make up their own truth, facts, and reality. Masks should not be political, but that is exactly what's going on in Missouri. Except for Trader Joe's, most local stores have too many unmasked individuals, and as Sarah experienced, they do not respect "turns" or personal space. I only have one child, a 10-year-old daughter and she is so lonely from not having any playmates, but like Stacy, my neighbors are not taking the virus seriously enough for her to play with them. It breaks my heart to watch my daughter watch them all play together in the cul-de-sac in front of my house. It will be such a hard decision about whether she will return to school in the fall or be socially isolated indefinitely. A neighborhood mom told me she was going to tell our school board that she won't send back her kids if they require masks--because she believes masks are dangerous to her kids. My Facebook friends that live in the suburban county next to St Louis are posting pictures of their kids at dance competitions, ball games, and swim parties. Even those who were so worried about the virus a month ago! My family is looking around at all this and have begun to question me that we need to be so careful. I was really starting to feel gaslit, especially when we saw the chiropractor. She spent the entire hour trying to convince me that we shouldn't wear masks. I didn't believe most of what she said but I didn't know up from down when I left her office. She really had me questioning myself and my decisions. Your podcast brought me relief and validation.  The chiropractor did say one thing that has been bothering me that Sarah may be able to answer. She says that it's very bad for our immune systems to be socially distancing, that when we all come back together it will be disastrous. I know that historically native tribes have been killed off by the arrival of European diseases they've been isolated from for tens of thousands of years, but are you concerned that you haven't shared any germs with someone outside your family for 3 months? What about if this goes on for a year? Also, I wanted to say that I appreciated the science on how protesters are not spreading the virus and how you have come out in support of Black Lives Matters. It was the right thing to do.  Thank you!"   Being a Parent During a Pandemic Stacy adores Jeanie, and Sarah for not taking any breaths while reading about what the chiropractor told her. (19:17) This has been an issue in Stacy's neighborhood and it is fascinating. Virginia is kind of in the middle. Masks are required legally everywhere in public. This is not being respected by everyone. Matt and Stacy have had to sit down with their kids as a family to discuss this, especially because Matt has the risk of continued exposure. We don't know enough about the virus to know if people could potentially get it twice, and what that impact is. So they have made it clear as a family that they are not returning to life as normal. Stacy was very nervous about going glamping, but they followed certain rules that they set for themselves. They carefully discussed their travel plans and knew the risks, but they did not want to extend that to additional gatherings. It makes it harder to be a parent. Being a parent during this has escalated this to such a higher extent. What will this generation be on the outcome from this all? If you establish what the rules are for you and your family upfront, it makes it that much easier to define what you can and can't do and why. Stacy shared on their experience with birthdays in quarantine, video game virtual socialization, and ways they can connect kids that are not physical. Sarah has been doing the same. All of the topics related to the masks myth that Jeanie referred to in her question were covered in this podcast episode. Please also refer to this post from Sarah on mask use.   Dawn's Question What isolation is doing to our immune systems is something that Sarah wants to address. (27:02) We received a similar question from Dawn, so Sarah wants to read that question and then address both questions together. Dawn says, "wondering if you’re concerned about isolation and how that is affecting all our microbiomes? Gut health has always been so huge for you, so do you have any articles or podcasts on gut immune health related to surviving Covid-19? And do you expect a surge of illnesses related to suppressed immune systems after isolation?" All of this is linked.   Hygiene Hypothesis This ties into the original version of the hygiene hypothesis. (27:38) As originally proposed in the '90s, we needed to have this exposure to pathogens, especially early in life, to help educate and shape the immune system. What has changed about this hypothesis in recent years is the understanding of the gut microbiome. So this entire hypothesis has blended with something called the Old Friends Hypothesis. That actually the thing that we need exposure to is not pathogens, but rather this diverse range of microbial exposure to seed our microbiomes. The Old Friends Hypothesis even recognizes that there are some parasites that our immune systems have coevolved with over millennia. It is not just that we need that exposure, it is that our immune systems actually require the continued presence of these microorganisms in order to fully develop. What we really need is this acquisition of a diverse microbiome and where hygiene has steered us wrong is our overuse of cleaners and disinfectants. This has made our environments so sterile from probiotic organisms, especially environmental probiotics. When we overclean our environments and we are not getting exposed to a diverse species of microbes, this lack of seeding in our microbiomes can result in an overactive immune system. This is one piece of this puzzle. There are a lot of studies showing that social isolation and loneliness can impact immune function. That mechanism is not related to the gut microbiome. The studies show that this is a neuroendocrine mechanism.  We talked about this in TPV Podcast Episode 382: Social Media and see The Health Benefits of Connection. So we do see that social isolation and loneliness can impact immune function. Sarah thinks that the heart of this question is touching on physical isolation's impact on immune function.   Suppressed Immune Systems We have talked about ways we can try to stay socially connected while physically isolated. (31:19) However, there are not many studies about what happens to humans when they live in a sterile environment. This is because there are so few, truly sterile environments in the world. On Earth, there is no such evidence, but the astronauts on the space station do have a suppression of their immune systems. Studies showed that after about 90 days on the space station, especially first-timers, they have about a 50% reduction in the activity of natural killer cell activity. These are a type of cell that go around and find cancer type cells and virally infected cells. They then force these cells to basically commit cell suicide. These are very important cell types for our immune systems, especially in terms of cancer risk and viral infections. For the astronauts, there are three proposed mechanisms: stress, microgravity, radiation (not, lack of infections). The big risk to astronauts, besides cancer, is persistent infections. We are never actually not exposed to pathogens because we carry them with us. There’s no evidence that hermit living on Earth causes immune dysfunction. Although once you re-emerge and have contact with people, you wouldn’t have immunity to viruses that circulated while you were cloistered. So exposure is what would increase the likelihood of infection, not immune suppression. The good thing is that we are currently suppressing the circulation of all those other viruses and bacteria right now. What can we learn to take beyond this pandemic into our normal cold and flu season? If we can physically isolate at the first sign of symptoms, rather than our current societal norm, we could be preventing a lot of regular viral illness, including death from the seasonal flu. By also adopting more of us handwashing as a lifelong habit, we could evolve our norm. Yes, when we get back together there could be some other viruses that we start sharing. However, it is likely to be fairly slow build since we have taken ourselves out of circulation for all of these different viruses.   Gut Health If we are physically isolated, is it impacting our gut microbiomes? (39:34) The most important determinants of the gut microbiome are diet, nutrient status, and hormones, which are a reflection of your lifestyle choices. So these are the most important thing. There is an effective exposure, which we see in studies of family groups. We know that baboons, the closer their relationships are, the more physical interactions they have, the more common their microbiomes are. This is seen in humans too. Married couples who report having a close relationship, will have more similar gut microbiomes to each other than siblings will. This is a reflection of the fact that whenever we touch a person, we are sharing our microbiome. There is potentially an effect if kids are not getting exposed to some bacteria by not being at school. However, this is a very small effect on the gut microbiome compared to the most important thing of a healthy diet, no nutritional deficiencies, and a healthy lifestyle. All and all, Sarah's process for looking after her gut microbiome through physical isolation is no different than at any other time. Work on social connection even with physical isolation. Get Sarah’s new Gut Health Guidebook for optimal diet and lifestyle information. Incorporate probiotics like Just Thrive Probiotic and/or fermented foods And incorporate nature time if you can get is safely. There is no evidence that our immune systems are going to be suppressed by a year of living in our homes. And there is no evidence that our gut microbiomes are going to suffer. The things that are more problematic are the impacts of feeling lonely and socially isolated. This part can suppress our immune systems and can reduce the diversity of our gut microbiome. Stacy and Sarah took a moment to discuss examples that show that no one lives in a sterile environment.   Jessica's Question Jessica's question is a really good follow up to diet and lifestyle is still important. (52:25) She writes, "I know you both said you don't want to do COVID episodes every week buuuutttt, I have a COVID question. I've seen this article passed around along with the general idea that if we pushed real food, metabolic balancing, and immune support, the death toll from COVID would be much lower. In conjunction, there's been criticism of the messaging from media the only pushes vaccines, drugs, and basic immune support. I know this is an oversimplification, but in the spirit of science literacy, I'd love to hear your more nuanced view of why this is or isn't a feasible solution. I'm sure you get lots of questions, but thank you for your science-based approach to whole living! I'm an academic librarian (aka info junkie) recently diagnosed with early-stage Hashimoto's (no medication but high antibodies) so you and Stacy are a god-send!" Stacy thinks that this gets to the root of what we discussed on our last covid show regarding the mixed messaging in the community. Sarah has some science to jump into, but Stacy wants to state that you don't have to pick and choose. Covid can infect anybody in any health situation. Stacy strongly feels that the things we talk about with gut microbiome, sleep, lower stress, healthy eating, and anti-inflammatory lifestyle choices, that this is good for you and your immune system. However, this still doesn't make you immune from covid. There is no diet or healthy lifestyle that would prevent us from getting covid or even guarantee that we wouldn't have a severe course of the disease. We need to figure out a way of communicating healthy choices that don't take away from the messaging around the importance of social distancing, masks, physical isolation, and a safe and effective vaccine. There are so many barriers to adopting a healthy diet and lifestyle, broadly across our entire society, that we faced before this pandemic. It is a multi-dimensional challenge that needs to be overcome.   Nutrition & Covid Risk There is now data showing some nutrient deficiencies are problematic. (1:00:24) Very low selenium intake increases death rate from COVID-19 by 5X. The science behind this can be found here. There is some initial research being done on the impact of supplementation on covid. A combination of B12, D, and magnesium was administered in older COVID-19 patients. This was associated with a significant reduction in the proportion of patients with clinical deterioration requiring oxygen support and/or intensive care support. This is a small preliminary study and has yet to be peer-reviewed. There’s also an ongoing study looking at combo vitamin C and zinc. This is an area of active research with a lot to still learn. However, vitamin D is probably the most relevant nutrient and something that could be incorporated very simply into a national message.   Amanda's Question Amanda writes, "Love all your recent podcasts on covid. (1:02:54) I’m so glad Stacy and her family are doing well. Sarah your research is the topic of many conversations with my family and friends. Recently I read an article talking about a link between low vitamin D levels and covid. Just wondering your thoughts on this. What science have you found to supposition or dispute this if any?" Sarah wants to first provide some context to this question. There is a very well known blogger who came out in early March with an eBook that made a case for avoiding vitamin D supplementation. They said that it increases the ACE2 receptor, which is the receptor that the novel coronavirus is binding to, to enter our cells. Sarah has received a ton of questions on this research. Recently there has actually been a huge increase in studies linking low vitamin D levels with an increase in severity of covid. The first few studies were done at the population level, which means it was hard to identify cause and effect. So they were correlating country/territory latitude or average vitamin D deficiency rates with mortality rate, varying results, from null to double mortality rate. The results were varied, which you can read more about here. Now, there are studies where individuals have vitamin D levels measured. It is showing that there is quite a large effect.   Vitamin D & Covid-19 There have been quite a few studies that have looked at this. (1:05:38) One analysis that is just being published now, shows that this might be as much as a factor of 2. So having an adequate vitamin D status halves the mortality rate, compared to having vitamin D deficiency. There have been studies that have actually looked at vitamin D deficiency versus insufficiency. Backman said, "It will not prevent a patient from contracting the virus, but it may reduce complications and prevent death in those who are infected." For more on this, see here and here. Testing positive for COVID-19 was associated with increasing age and being likely vitamin D deficient, as compared to likely vitamin D sufficient.  Sarah shared the data from this study. Please also refer to this study and this study for more information on the statistical analysis that was carried out using Mann-Whitney. When you look at this collection of studies, it has just in the last month become really clear that low vitamin D is a risk for severe covid and death. Even these studies are suggesting these really high-level doses of vitamin D to address this prevalent deficiency. There have been some studies showing that perhaps one of the reasons why the rates have been lower in the northern hemisphere in the summer is related to the fact that when people are outside their vitamin D levels go up.   The ACE2 Receptor ACE2 is an enzyme that is membrane-bound.  (1:10:46) When a respiratory droplet containing SARS-CoV-2 enters your mouth or nose, it’s easily inhaled into your airway where it encounters pulmonary cells that have ACE2 enzymes embedded within their surface membranes. ACE2 is a type I transmembrane metallocarboxypeptidase that degrades angiotensin-2, thereby negatively regulating the renin-angiotensin system to lower blood pressure. ACE2’s role in regulating blood pressure is why hypertension is such a major risk factor for a more severe course of covid-19 illness. It is also found in arteries, heart, kidney, and intestines. The now infamous spike proteins on the outside of SARS-CoV-2 bind with ACE2, releasing the fusion machinery that the virus uses to dump its RNA and viral proteins into the target cell, where it hijacks the cells organelles to produce viral replicas instead of all of the various proteins that the cell needs to survive. It’s true that vitamin D increases ACE2 in various models of pulmonary injury, hypertension (see here and here). So the simplistic view spreading across the internet is to reduce ACE2 with vitamin d deficiency and you can’t get infected. WRONG!  Not only is vitamin D critical for the immune function to help fight off the virus BUT increasing ACE2 in covid is a REALLY GOOD THING! The truth is the complete opposite. It is very very important to test vitamin D levels, and supplement to bring your levels up to normal. Researchers are suggesting at least 60 nanograms per milliliter as a target. This is a discussion to have with your doctor. The whole argument of avoiding vitamin D because it increases ACE2 is completely backward. You are not going to reduce ACE2 with vitamin D deficiency to a point where the virus can't get in. It can get in no matter what. Covid-19 normalizing ACE2 levels in the context of lung injury is very very beneficial. For more information on this, be sure to also reference this article and this one and this one. This is a reminder about the importance of making sure your information is correct before putting it out into the world.   Covid-19 & Minority Groups There have been some comments online that the reason why the Black community has been so much more affected by covid is that they have a higher likelihood of being vitamin D insufficient. (1:20:50) This is due to the higher levels of melanin in their skin. You can read about this here. In this study, sex and ethnicity differential pattern of COVID-19 was not adequately explained by variations in cardiometabolic factors, 25(OH)-vitamin D levels or socio-economic factors.   Mary's Question Mary asks, "I have a question about covid19. (1:22:55)  I was sick March 9-29 with fever and other wonderful symptoms! Doc told me I probably had covid19. Thankfully I wasn’t sick enough to be hospitalized  (or tested here in GA) and I’m finally feeling much better. Still tired and having more RA pain but trying to ease AIP with reintros! Hubby and I (both 62 yrs old) got tested for the antibodies, and we’ve both tested positive. Everything on the web is saying they don’t know if that means we’re immune to the disease or can get it again. My in-laws (95&94) live in KY and we’d love to go see them and the rest of the fam. Should we just continue to live our face masked life (we still wear them inside the grocery in consideration of others) and not visit? We are interacting with a small group of neighbors in the hood, playing pickleball, but washing hands and wiping down paddles and balls, etc... no hugging, no high fiving, somewhat social distancing (not perfect). We don’t know anybody else that has had covid19 or had symptoms. Wondering if you’ve found any research concerning immunity and contagion if immune?"   Immunity The science part of this question is that we don't really have a good sense for how long you might be able to shed virus after your symptoms go away. (1:25:35) There is some research showing that people can shed virus for at least 24-days, and more public health officials are trying to talk about this. The suggested 14-day quarantine period is likely insufficient. Based on what officials are recommending, you should quarantine for 14-days after symptoms end. Even that might not be enough. There have been cases where people have tested positive for months. Some of these people have been sick for this whole period of time, and this is another thing that we don't yet understand. We don't know how long you are contagious for, and we don't know how long immunity lasts. This piece of the question is unfortunately something we can't answer at this time. We don't know if having antibodies (or what level of antibodies) is enough to protect you from reintroduction. And we don't how long after your symptoms end before you are no risk to the people around you. This makes making a decision on how to handle life post covid really hard to navigate. Stacy thinks the hardest part for them was sending Matt back to work. As Matt and Stacy returned to life after they were sick, they did have to have dialogues with people about how they were handling things given the unknown. Communication is essential. Matt and Stacy did their best to clean their house after they were sick, but it is not a personal skill of Stacy's. More than 30-days after Matt and Stacy were symptom-free, they decided to ask their long-time house cleaner to return after having a conversation with her to determine her comfort level with returning. If you have had the virus, there is no stigma with it, but you need to let people know. It is only fair that others know your information so that they can be careful. Stacy's takeaways after being sick were to quarantine for as long as possible and to communicate with people. Sarah applauds Mary for still wearing a mask to both be considerate and be a role model.   Closing Thoughts It has been a doozy of a show! Stacy and Sarah want to thank all of our listeners for submitting questions. And a huge thank you to Sarah for pulling all of the science together. As mentioned last week, we do have something coming for you in the very near future. Make sure to stay tuned, join our email lists, and we will be connecting with you more on this very shortly. We will be back again next week. Thank you again for listening, we know this was a long show. We appreciate those who have stuck with us! (1:38:25)

Paul says Abraham's 2 wives are a picture of the 2 covenants. Let's look at how these 2 women show us the differences between the old and new covenants.

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Season 2! And we are starting off with an awesome episode with Sarah Lee, an old Comedy Sportz Sacramento improvisor, who now does improv at Csz Seattle. In this episode Sarah and Charlie talk about acting, dance and learning Japanese! クレイジー！Then after a brief break, the two do an improv scene that will make you laugh your socks off. All of this and more in your new episode of Running Joke! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/charlie-charm/support

In today's episode, we check off something off our bucket list. Our guest, Sarah Spain is an Emmy and Peabody Award-winning radio host, TV personality and writer. She is the host of “Spain and Company,” airing weeknights on national ESPN radio, host of ESPN’s “That’s What She Said” podcast, a writer for espnW.com, a regular panelist on “Around The Horn” and “Highly Questionable” and a “SportsCenter” reporter. When she’s not watching, talking about or writing about sports, Sarah loves live music, great food and wine, improv comedy, board game parties, spending time with her husband, family and rescue pups, charity work and dominating rec league softball, volleyball, basketball and football games.---We talked about how Sarah deals with the multitude of trolls on social media especially on Twitter, how that has translated into her work life over the course of her career, and how she deals with them and much more.It also becomes clear what Sarah thinks about Colin Kaepernick's workout, the impact it will have over the rest of this saga and how it really feels to have Mitchell Trubisky as her quarterback.Finally, we also had a whole 4 minute argument about which candy is better and who would save her from a sinking boat. I hope you enjoy listening to this episode as I did recording it!----Enjoy the episode today!!----Sarah Spain's Bundle:Instagram: @spain2323Twitter: @SarahSpainPodcast: What She Said With Sarah Spain ----To share your thoughts:Leave a comment on Twitter, Instagram or Facebook. Links below.Share this show and Ask Anything on Twitter, Facebook, or Instagram.Visit our website for the last information and news: statmanpodcast.comVisit our STORE for sick merch!To help out the show:Leave an honest review on iTunes. Your ratings and reviews really help!Subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, TuneIn, and now Google PodcastSupport the show (https://www.gofundme.com/statmanpodcast)

In this video I look at the three things that Matthew does with women in his genealogy in Matthew chapter 1.The Bible is the greatest work of literary genius. And The Bible is Art is a YouTube Channel devoted to explaining this literary art in all its sophistication, elegance, and design.Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/thebibleisartwebsite: https://www.thebibleisart.comemail: thisdivineart@gmail.comtwitter: @johnbhigginsmusic: Kai Engel, "Coelum" (https://www.kai-engel.com)| Transcription |In a previous video we saw how there are two steps to understanding genealogies. First, find the pattern of the genealogy. And second, look for how the author breaks the pattern.The pattern that Matthew creates is that he follows the family by the male head of the household. So you have a man who fathered another man who fathered another man. That's the pattern. But in four places Matthew will break that pattern. That is, he will include four women.But the break in the pattern is even more unexpected because he doesn't include the women we are expecting. Matthew does include many of the males we were expecting from reading the story up to this point in the Bible. So we have David and Judah and Abraham, famous people. And if that pattern continued we would expect all of the great matriarchs to be included when he decides to include women. Like Sarah or Abigail. But none of them are included.Now this is very strange. Imagine if you were reading your family tree and when it came time to list the wives, all the most popular ones were missing and other less popular family members were included instead. You would either think there was a mistake or whoever composed the family tree had a reason, a purpose for doing this.So what is Matthew's purpose? Who does Matthew include and why? Well, Matthew includes: Tamar, Rahab, Ruth, and Bathsheba.Now, before we talk about why Matthew does this we have to remember what the purpose of this genealogy is. And that is it's designed to characterize, to teach us who Jesus is and what his kingdom is like that he is bringing. The genealogy is not here to tell us about these people listed in the genealogy. So what is it about these women that tell us about Jesus. There are three important things.First, three of these women were gentiles and one was married to a gentile. Tamar and Rahab were canaanites, Ruth a moabite, and Bathsheba was married to a Hittite. So Jesus is both Jew and GentileSecond, they're women. Women were not typically included in genealogies. Not because women were unimportant or not included in Israel, but Jesus and his kingdom will somehow reach out and include women in a different or fuller sort of way.And third, and most fascinating, these women are all connected to some sort of sexually questionable behavior. Tamar disguises herself and tricks Judah into sleeping with her, thus impregnating her. Rahab was a prostitute. Ruth snuck into bed with a man and told him to do whatever he liked. And Bathsheba slept with David while she was married.

Dan Kachikis spoke on September 15, 2019 explaining that the return of Christ is built into Peter's writing on the man-woman relationship (1 Peter 3:1-7)

“It sounds crazy, but I’m experiencing trauma. From going into an office.”   Welcome loves! On this week’s episode of In My Truth with Sarah Riegelhuth, we’re chatting with the gorgeous Jessica Ann. Today we’re picking up somewhere through an entire weekend of talking about truths, stories and feelings at Sarah’s home in Colorado, and you guessed it, we’re sitting on the living room floor!   Jessica and Sarah met recently at Jeff’s Camp in Turks and Caicos and the two knew from the get go they are soul sisters.   Jess is a writer, poet, philosopher, yogi and world traveller. Like Sarah, her core value is freedom, and she love to write, create and travel. Listen in for another deep conversation about the untruths Sarah and Jessica have been telling themselves.   Join Sarah Riegelhuth and Jessica Ann in this episode of In My Truth as they talk about sharing themselves with the world, how relationships influence their work, and how they have been betraying themselves.   -   Disclaimer: What we talk about on In My Truth tends to be very raw and can be triggering. In this episode we dive into relationships and divorce, among other things. Resources for support and help are included at the end of show notes - scroll down for more information.   -   “I realised my abandonment wounding lead me to a life of betraying myself. I didn’t want to be abandoned so I tried to fit in with what everybody else needed and wanted, only to discover I was actually abandoning myself.”   Like last week, we’re exploring feelings of shame (link), this time around divorce and relationship issues, along with truth and honour, transcendence, and how we’ve been betraying ourselves.   Where have you been experiencing shame in your life, and how is that serving you?   -   “I found joy by getting here, but now that I’m here it’s like… I’m not joyful.”   Jess and Sarah also share the stories they’re telling themselves around:   Not putting ourselves out there in the world The different versions of ourselves we show up as Shame around problems with our marriages Using depression and feelings of sadness to be creative How we express our truth externally How we express ourselves behind closed doors Taking the easy way out by getting a job Being miserable for the first time as an entrepreneur Loss of freedom and loss of our core values Being in alignment with other people’s needs instead of our own Being an empath and not letting others’ energy get to us How to be in flow without being your own boss Abandonment wounds How we have been betraying ourselves Shame about struggling to move on from relationships Feeling like we ‘should’ be able to get past things How we reason and justify to ourselves   -   Remember you’re not alone, and there is hope, even though it may not feel that way at times. Talk to someone, a friend or family member and let them support you. Reach out to a professional. Do whatever you need to do to start your journey back to feeling good. Here are some resources I found on Google (because I am not a professional, these are not recommendations, just suggestions with love and empathy from me to you): Lifeline (Australia): 13-11-14 is a confidential telephone crisis support service available 24/7 from a landline, payphone or mobile. Beyond Blue (Australia): 1-300-22-4636 OR chat online between 3pm & 12am 7 days a week No Shame On You (USA): 1-800-273-(TALK) 8255 OR text 741741 for a 24/7 crisis text line (a live, trained crisis counsellor receives the text and responds quickly) OR visit I’m Alive for 24/7 online crisis chat National Suicide Prevention Lifeline (USA): 1-800-273-8255  Crisis Services (Canada): 1-833-456-4566 OR text 45645 between 4pm and 12am daily   To never miss an episode, subscribe to In My Truth with Sarah Riegelhuth. Share it with your network and start having more raw conversations.   If you’d like to be a guest on the show, find out more here: https://www.sarahriegelhuth.com/inmytruthpodcast   Follow Sarah Riegelhuth on Instagram: @sarahriegelhuth @inmytruthpodcast

Pastor Joe McGarry preaches at Prince of Peace Lutheran Church in Kensington, CT. The text is on Sarah and Abraham laughing when God tells them they will conceive a child. September 8, 2019 This is a part of a sermon series on the 180 Day Bible Reading Challenge. http://www.popkensington.org http://www.pastorjoemcgarry.com  

Pastor Joe McGarry preaches at Prince of Peace Lutheran Church in Kensington, CT. The text is on Sarah and Abraham laughing when God tells them they will conceive a child. September 8, 2019 This is a part of a sermon series on the 180 Day Bible Reading Challenge. http://www.popkensington.org http://www.pastorjoemcgarry.com

We can’t reverse the slow march of time, but thanks to the wonders of technology and modern medicine, we have a lot more of it in our lives. But as people live longer, and the birth rate declines, how are we going to manage a world with an ageing population?That one of the questions Sarah Harper, Professor of Gerontology at the University of Oxford, has been trying to find an answer for.She talks to BBC Science Focus editorial assistant Helen Glenny about how we cope with dramatic shifts in population, what effect it has on natural resources and climate change, and a quirk in our retirement age that suggests we should start drawing our pension aged 103.How Population Change Will Transform Our World by Sarah Harper is available now (£9.99, OUP)Listen to more episodes of the Science Focus Podcast which we think you will find interesting:Can we slow down the ageing process? – Sue ArmstrongHow can we save our planet? – Sir David AttenboroughIs religion compatible with science? – John LennoxWhat does it mean to be happy? – Helen RussellThere is no Plan B for planet Earth – Lord Martin ReesHow emotions are made – Lisa Feldman BarrettFollow Science Focus on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram and Flipboard See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Audiobook narrator and pitbull trainer: two careers, one person. How'd that happen?Sarah Mollo-Christensen is unique. She is a vocal performer in a way many people are familiar, but know very little about. She narrates audiobooks - all genres. It's an art, an acting performance, and Sarah tells us all about it. She even mentions her work in some more risqué books and what it's like to act under a pseudonym. If you've ever listened to a book on Audible or even the old-fashioned way on CDs (no, I will not mention audiotape), wouldn't it be interesting to take a peek behind the curtain to see what's really going on?Now, if that isn't unique enough, consider Sarah's other career: her work as a professional trainer - specializing in pitbulls, no less - for some of New York City's wealthiest dog owners. It's probably a career you barely knew existed, isn't it? An engaging personality, at once thoughtful and dynamic, Sarah discusses her time in the world of dogs and how she's blended this work with narrating books. On the Sydcast we interview unique and inspiring people. Like Sarah.

Sarah Huckabee Sanders quits the white house after how long? Some food based delights from Dan. The Snopes Game! Did a trapeze artist have a little accident? Donald Trump gives us a lesson on the moon/mars and space and stuff. Sir Michael. The Bunker - what has Florida man been up to this week?

Live and Travel Like a Local in Rome, Italy: Podcast Show Notes I interviewed Sarah Mikutel from the Postcard Academy Podcast about living like a local in Rome. When we say live like a local, we mean staying in Rome for an extended period, a month or two, or more. I've never been to Italy (it's on my bucket list), but Sarah gave the complete rundown of top places to eat, stay, and culture tips. Listen to the episode above to experience Rome (at least in your headphones). While you're thinking about it, also subscribe to Experiences You Should Have on iTunes, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Get to Know Sarah from Postcard Academy Podcast Sarah hosts the Postcard Academy podcast, a weekly travel show sharing the best food and culture tips from expats living abroad.     She got the travel itch at 18 when she spent a summer in England’s Lake District working as a waitress/chambermaid. She wanted to stay in Europe forever, but it seemed impossible for Americans. Years went by. Finally at some point, while living in New York City, she realized she might be eligible for Italian citizenship due to her Sicilian ancestry.   She started gathering all the documents she needed to apply for Italian citizenship while she lived in New York. But then the American woman translating her documents suggested another route: move to Italy and apply there. Like Sarah, she had the right to apply for dual citizenship thanks to jus sanguinis — the right of blood — and she received her Italian passport a month or two after applying there.   So, on this advice of a stranger she met on the internet, Sarah left New York, moved to Italy, became a citizen, and has had the time of her life living and working abroad, traveling around Europe, and forming amazing friendships with fellow citizens of the world.   Why Should You Travel to Rome? Rome is so beautiful and it is especially great if you love history. There's something about walking through the ancient sites of Rome; it feels like you're living in a museum. You add that to the food scene, it's a match made in heaven.   Let's Talk Food: What to Eat and Where to Find the Best Pasta & Pizza in Rome.   Pizza! Naples is famous for its pizza, but Sarah actually prefers the Roman version, which is thinner. Everyone orders their own pizza in Italy and they eat the entire thing in one sitting. At first, this seemed crazy to Sarah, but now she eats pizza like a local. Go order your pizza from Ivo a Trastevere, which is in the very popular Trastevere neighborhood by the river. Cacio e Pepe is another must-try. It’s a simple pasta dish made with black pepper, pecorino, and tonnarelli (like spaghetti). Try it at Velavevodetto.     What is Italian Dining Etiquette?   Spaghetti and meatballs do not exist in Italy, so don't bother trying to order it. They also use a lot less cheese in their pasta dishes — they like to experience the true flavor of their foods without mixing a bunch of extras into it. Even though there are public fountains all over Rome where you can fill up bottles with quality water, tap water is not a thing in restaurants. Be prepared to order still or sparkling. You’ll get bread on your table and will likely be charged a cover charge for this, about 1-3 euro a person.   Drinks during the meal are usually water or wine and sometimes beer if pizza is involved. Never coffee during a meal. In fact, cappuccino is considered a drink for breakfast and Italians don’t drink it after noon. Sarah does, though, because she loves cappuccino and they haven’t run her out of town yet. Sarah's Favorite Day in Rome But one of Sarah's favorite memories was what they in the U.K. call a ‘city break,’ a 3- or 4-day weekend. Sarah had been working long hours in London and flew to Rome to take a break and reunite with an Italian friend. Her friend was from the north and had never been to Rome,

How do you decide when to take a huge leap in your career? What happens when your therapist thinks leaving your cushy tech job is a terrible idea—but you do it anyway? Googler-turned-comedian Sarah Cooper joins us to talk about writing satire, redefining success, and making men mad along the way. Sarah’s latest book is called How to Be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings: Non-Threatening Leadership Strategies for Women, and it’s out today (we got a preview copy, and it’s so great). She also runs The Cooper Review, a wildly popular satirical blog about business culture, and in 2016, her first book, 100 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings, was a bestseller. We love Sarah because she’s funny as hell, and also incredibly open about what it’s like to trade a career in tech for the sometimes lonely—but also wildly satisfying—world of comedy. > I have so many outlets to discover myself and who I really am, which is something that I think is just really important for a life, you know? To know you left everything on the table and you told every story that you wanted to tell and you let everyone know who you are—and you didn’t leave this world without telling everybody that. > > —Sarah Cooper, comedian and author of How to Be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings She tells us about: Leaving a career at Google to perform standup and write satire all day What happens when people think your satire is serious How being a Jamaican immigrant taught her to observe people so she could fit in The pros and cons of being a “people-pleaser”—and how to let go of that when it stops serving you How keeping a “best self journal” helps her stay focused while working alone Also in this episode Sara and Katel talk about the big career choices they’ve made, and how they’ve built structures and support systems to make those careers work for them. Deets: Sara celebrates seven whole years without a traditional “jobby-job,” and thinks back on Cindy Gallop’s advice that working for yourself is the least risky thing you can do Katel tells us why she took a pay cut to run A Book Apart—and how she handles the lonely parts of working, well, alone We both definitely wear fancy blazers at all times > I remember being so excited to work with a much smaller team and fewer people… I was like, “oh my gosh, this is going to be so great, it’s going to be just a few people, it’s going to be really nimble.” And then I realized that most of the time it was really just going to be me working kind of by myself. And it was a lot harder than I expected because there was essentially no structure unless I made it, and it took me at least a good year to kind of figure out how I was going to work, how I was going to be productive, whether I even liked that way of working enough to keep doing it. > > — Katel on trading corporate life for running an indie publishing company Plus: Our friends at Harvest want to make sure you know about Graywolf Press and 826 National. Fuck yeah for rock ‘n’ roll, women musicians, mental health, and our fave live show in fooooorever: Courtney Barnett. Sponsors This episode of NYG is brought to you by: Shopify, a leading global commerce platform that’s building a world-class team to define the future of entrepreneurship. Visit shopify.com/careers for more. Harvest, makers of awesome software to help you track your time, manage your projects, and get paid. Try it free, then use code NOYOUGO to get 50% off your first paid month. Transcript Sara Wachter-Boettcher [Ad spot] Thanks for Harvest to being our sponsor today—and for making awesome project management and time tracking tools that I rely on to keep my business running. I think you’ll love them too. They offer all kinds of reports that help you shine a light on the health of your projects, and they make it easy to track invoices and payments. Try it free at getharvest.com, and when you sign up for a paid account, you can use the code “noyougo” to save 50% off your first month. That’s getharvest.com, offer code “noyougo.” [intro music plays for 12 seconds] SWB Hey everyone, I’m Sara! Katel LeDû And I’m Katel. SWB And you’re listening to No, You Go, the show about building satisfying careers and businesses— KL —getting free of toxic bullshit— SWB —and living your best feminist life at work. KL “How to Be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings” is the title of our new favorite book, and it’s out today. It’s written by our guest, Sarah Cooper, and we are so pumped to talk with her today. Okay, along with some extremely funny, satirical advice for getting by in the workforce, Sarah gets real about why she wrote the book, and what happens when people don’t understand that it’s satire. And how she managed a massive change in her own work life, going from being a manager at Google to a full-time comedian and writer. SWB Yes, I was super interested in that, and I was hoping we could talk more about that transition piece. Because companies like Google are so designed to really keep you there in a lot of ways, right? You don’t just get fed at work, you also get dry cleaning and haircuts. KL So weird. SWB It’s super weird. [KL laughs] But they’re very—you know—once you’re in them, they can be very cushy places to be— KL Yeah. SWB —and they also oftentimes will feel like you’re doing exciting work, and you’re paid really well, and so there’s a lot of stuff that kind of keeps people there. I have a friend who recently mentioned that—you know—she’s been at Google a long time and the idea of leaving is really hard for her. So, it’s interesting to hear Sarah talk about leaving somewhere like Google to do something that was so uncertain and so risky, right? Like a career in comedy and writing? That’s such a dramatic pivot. KL Yeah, I know. It is—it’s so fascinating and I loved listening to her story. But, Sara, you’ve been working for yourself for as long as I’ve known you, but that wasn’t always the case. That hasn’t been your whole career, you made a big moving from working at a traditional—you know—jobby-job to go out on your own in 2011, right? SWB Yeah, actually October has been my seven-year working-for-myself anniversary! KL Congrats! [2:27] SWB Thank you. It has been pretty great for me. I think that it’s definitely something that has suited me. But—you know—what’s really different about it compared to somebody like Sarah is that I don’t feel like I’ve taken such massive shifts. I feel like my changes have been a little more bit by bit over time. I wasn’t in a big, fancy, fully catered office with free haircuts and massages; [KL laughs] I was working at an agency with 40 people, which means I was working a lot with clients. And so my shift from working with clients at an agency to working for myself with clients was smaller. And the kind of work was similar. But I do think that over the past seven years, I’ve made more and more of those little incremental shifts, or kind of mini-pivots or whatever you want to call them, where I do feel like at this point my work has evolved so much—both in the kinds of clients I work with, the complexity of the projects, I definitely charge more [KL laughs]—lots of—lots of good stuff. KL [laughing] Yep! SWB But also just the makeup of my days. My day is not mostly clients, it’s—maybe that’s a third of my time. And a lot of my time is spent on things like speaking at events, writing books, doing workshops and more facilitation versus sitting down and doing the work for clients. And—you know—also running this podcast, which does take a bunch of time. And maybe someday we’ll make a bunch of money. And so I feel like on the one hand, I have quote-unquote the same business I had seven years ago, and then on the other hand, on a day-to-day basis it looks really different. And my goals have changed too. That’s one of the things I think is really interesting talking to somebody like Sarah is hearing a really different perspective on leaving a traditional kind of job and moving into something else. KL Yeah, completely. And I mean to me, and I think a lot of people, the idea of going solo and leaving the perceived—you know—quote unquote safety of a traditional job, has seemed kind of scary. I mean, when you initially did that, what did that sort of first leap look like? Did you do anything specific to prepare—you know—financially, [laughs] emotionally, mentally? SWB Yeah, so—you know—I think about something Cindy Gallop said to us in her interview a couple of episodes ago where she said that in—in a lot of ways, relying on another company to take care of you is the riskiest thing you can do, and that relying on yourself, in some ways, is less risky. And I think that that was something I kind of had come to on my own back then, because I felt like the company I was at—you know—didn’t value me for the reasons that I wanted to be valued. I mean I think that they did try to value me because I was doing a lot for them and they did recognize that, but it wasn’t in the way that I wanted and it wasn’t for the kind of work I wanted necessarily. And so I felt like looking out for myself was in some ways going to be better for me. What I did, though, to prepare for leaving, I did—you know—I had some savings, which was great. At the time, one of the things that was really helpful was that my expenses were very low. My husband was in graduate school, which means that he made almost no money. He was a teaching assistant while he was in graduate school, so he had a very small stipend. So it wasn’t as if I could rely on his income, but what it did mean is that we had chosen to rent a little mini-house behind a house in a neighborhood that was affordable near the university. And so we had a low rent and we didn’t have a lot of financial commitments—we didn’t have kids, we didn’t have new cars with payments or anything like that, because we had been kind of set up to live a lifestyle that made sense for a graduate student, even though I had a real job with a substantial income. So, that made it so that the—it wasn’t that I had this huge—you know—amount of financial cushion, but it did mean that the amount of money I needed to not get evicted and to keep the lights on wasn’t that high. So, one of the things that I did was I set some goals around finances. I really wanted to—I wanted to meet or exceed the income I had been making at the agency, not just because I wanted to have the same amount of money, but also because I wanted to feel like it was a way of proving to myself and maybe to the world that what I wanted to do was a real and legitimate thing that was worth paying for, and that I didn’t have to do it on somebody else’s terms. But I also thought about, “what is the minimum amount of money that I need on a monthly basis to not have life fall apart?” And when I realized that it just wasn’t that much, I thought, you know, I can scrape that together. If things are lean here and there, I can scrape that together. And that gave me a lot of confidence, so that was helpful. The other thing that I did is I knew that the company I was leaving really relied on me and so—they were going through a time of flux also, so I knew that they could really use my help for longer. So, what I did was I proposed to them that I would contract with them for a couple of months—I think three months or so I contracted with them—and so that gave me some time to kind of wean off of having that salary. And it gave them some time to get over me leaving and to have a—you know—different plan in place. And during that time I had that consistent money coming in from them, I did more of that reaching out to people in my network. And I knew people who worked at different agencies or different companies who I had maybe worked with in the past, and so they knew that it was helpful to work with somebody like me. And none of their companies had content strategy teams at the time, and so they would often bring me in and I was like the first content strategist they’d worked with on a project [laughing]. All of them now have whole content strategy departments, so I feel like they’ve kind of gotten the memo—and I don’t want to take sole credit for that by any means, that’s something that’s sort of shifted in a lot of people’s industries in general. But I think what that was really helpful, too, was that I looked at, “who do I know who is out there working in other companies I’d like to work with who has experience and can speak to the fact that if you have somebody with this skillset working on a project, you can do much better work, you can get things done much more effectively?” [8:12] KL Yeah. That’s so smart that you did that. And just when you think about leaving something and trying something new, it’s—you know—I think you are focused on, what does that actual moment look like when I stop doing the old thing and start doing the new thing? And the smart thing is to actually do a lot of prep work before that and kind of take stock of where you’re working, who you’re working with, and figure out where those avenues can lead to, where they can develop into something for your new project and, I don’t know, I think that… you know, that’s really helpful to hear. SWB Yeah, I mean I don’t know that I was that planned about it, [laughs & KL laughs] but I definitely did try to do that. And I also—I’m trying to be, you know, pretty honest about some of the financial pieces of it. Because I talk to people who are often, you know, wanting to take a risk like this and the risks for them might look totally different. And I never want to, you know, lie about that, or make it seem like that’s not a big financial risk. I didn’t—like I said—I didn’t have this big cushion, but I did have relatively low risk at the time, and that’s not going to be true if somebody has, let’s say, small kids at home, or already has a mortgage, and all of your calculations have to look different. And I think that one of the things that I hear a lot of is this sort of idea that, “just jump in, do what you love, take the leap!” without talking about how often people who do that successfully had like—I don’t know—family money or a spouse with a high, stable income or whatever, right? All of these other things that made that possible for them. And so I just think it’s a disservice to not be honest about those things. KL Yeah, it totally is. And I’ve talked about this before—I took a pay cut when I left National Geographic to come to A Book Apart, and I wouldn’t have been able to do that if I hadn’t already been established in my career, if I hadn’t already—you know—moved up the management ladder and was making a certain salary that had allowed me to save. I was also partnered with someone who had a full-time job and who we had a little bit of a buffer, so I could do that and make a change. SWB So, what was it about that opportunity at A Book Apart that made you want it so badly you were willing to take a pay cut for it? Because working at a small company, it is riskier—you know—you said you got paid substantially less, there are not fancy offices, there are no free haircuts at A Book Apart. [10:38] KL [laughing] No, not yet. SWB What made that feel worth it for you? KL I mean, I knew it was going to be a huge opportunity and—you know—I was looking for a new challenge and that it certainly was. I knew I was going to be able to work with a whole new community of people and, you know, people doing work that I really admired and that I really wanted to be involved in. And I knew I’d be able to grow in a way that I hadn’t really been able to grow before. I was going to be able to grow my skill set, which was exciting, but also scary. SWB What do you mean? What were some of the things that you feel like you saw in that role that you were like “ooh yeah, I want to be able to do that”? KL I saw a chance to be a part of building something that was more or less kind of in its—you know—beginning phases. And that was super exciting. But there was also an opening to basically develop the role as I grew into it, and I’d never experienced that before. You know, I think I’d always gone into a job being like, “here is the list of responsibilities and this is more or less it.” It’s cut and dry. And this was an opportunity that I hadn’t had before where I was making it what it was, which was super cool. SWB So, was that ever hard though? Because I think one of the big shifts there you’re describing is going from a pretty structured environment to a really unstructured environment without, you know, having like, “here’s the boundaries of what your job is and here’s, you know, who is on your team.” And you don’t have a set of colleagues that work full-time with you, it’s like people juggling multiple kind of side gigs, and A Book Apart is often one of their side gigs. Was that hard? KL Yeah! I remember being so excited to work with a much smaller team and fewer people, because I think I was so used to working with such large teams and so many people that it felt like it was hard to really move things forward. So all of a sudden I was like, “oh my gosh, this is going to be so great, it’s going to be—you know—just a few people, it’s going to be really nimble.” And then I realized that most of the time it was really just going to be me [SWB laughs] working kind of by myself. And it was a lot harder than I expected because there was essentially no structure unless I made it, and it took me at least a good year to kind of figure out how I was going to work, how I was going to be productive, whether I even liked that way of working enough to keep doing it. And I think now it would be really hard for me to go back to a traditional office environment at least. I mean, I have a friend who has been freelancing for almost five years and they’re just realizing that it does not work for them. They need—they are realizing that they need to go to a place and do the work and then leave that place. And I very much understand that. [13:23] SWB Totally, yeah. I can relate to that feeling, but I’ve never quite sunk into it. I guess I’ve had moments where I feel like that, and then I’m like, “no, okay, I need to add some structure, I need to shift how I, you know, how I do things.” You know like people who talk about how they need to get dressed for the day or whatever before they start work? I’m not one of those people, but there are things that—you know—that I think about. I don’t do client work at nights or on the weekends. I do end up doing work at night or on the weekends, if I’m going to be honest with you. People sometimes ask me, “how do you do all the things that you do?” And I’m like, “I like to work and I don’t mind doing it in the odd hours.” But I don’t do client work then. I work on the podcast maybe. KL Right. SWB But to me, setting some of those boundaries like not doing client work and not replying to client emails late—that’s important and that’s something where I feel like it keeps it on my terms. KL Yeah, totally. It’s like you sort of—you have to have a little bit of a sense of office hours for there to be some kind of structure. Even if it’s only in your head and—because people, a lot of people don’t know that you aren’t—in a quote, unquote office every day doing that work. SWB I’m in a very fancy office at all times. [KL laughs] KL You are. SWB And I am definitely dressed up in a very fancy business outfit and I’m wearing a blazer. KL At all times. SWB At all times. KL Yeah. SWB Literally always. [KL laughs] KL I mean, I think about that idea of sort of working from wherever and at first again, how that idea was so exciting, but how it can become such a slippery slope. For example, on one hand I was able to plan and host that bachelorette weekend that we talked about a little while back because I could handle all the logistics leading up to it—you know—in and around my daily schedule. But when the weekend came, I also worked a little during that weekend because I could and I had a lot I need and want to get done. And to your point, it’s sort of like I love a lot of the work that I do and that’s—that’s okay, that’s part of my life, but I do need to remember that I want to set some boundaries. So, it’s great to have a lot of flexibility and freedom, as long as you kind of keep an eye on where the lines are. [15:30] SWB Yeah! And I let myself redraw the lines. They don’t have to be consistent all the time. But to always be thinking about “okay, I am redrawing this line right now and doing a lot of work stuff during a different—a weird time, but that might not be forever, I don’t want that being normal.” I like it though. You know, I get to do things like add a few days of vacation time when I’m taking a business trip, right? So, I go to the West Coast to go to a conference and I tack on a few days and I go see my nieces in Oregon. That’s awesome, I love being able to do that and I just have to juggle other things around it, right? I don’t have to take PTO, I don’t have to budget for it that way, I just have to juggle everything else around. I also love that I can do things like schedule appointments or run errands at like 2pm on a Tuesday and that again, I just have to be able to juggle everything else around it, which is why sometimes—you know—I do stuff in the evening that I would otherwise get done during the work day, but it means that I was able to do stuff during the work day that otherwise would be a nightmare like going to IKEA on a weekend! KL [laughing] Yes! SWB You know? And I feel like those are good tradeoffs for me, but I always want to take stock of what those things are. KL Yeah. Something Sarah mentioned was that work can be lonely. Were you lonely at first when you started this—you know—this endeavor, what you’re doing now? Or do you get lonely now ever? SWB So, I don’t tend to get lonely most of the time. Sometimes in small moments, but never in a bigger way. And I think one of the reasons for that is that I know that I’m pretty social and early on, I connected with a lot of people who were doing some of the same stuff that I did. So I remember in 2011 when I first left my job, a friend started a really small little Google group for people who were doing freelance or consultancy type work in content strategy. And it was only five or six people—eight people, I can’t remember. But that was really helpful at the beginning where I felt like “oh okay, I can chat with people who are sort of facing some of the same stuff as me or I can ask questions—what do your contracts even look like? What am I doing? What’s going on?” Very basic questions. [laughs] And that group kind of petered out—sometimes those kinds of groups peter out, but it was valuable to me in the moment. And then in 2013, I helped plan a little retreat with fifteen or twenty people running small consultancies and we came out of that and started a Slack group a little while later—I think actually a year later we turned it into a Slack group—and that’s still going and that’s—it’s a place I can bounce ideas off of, ask questions. And it’s also people I just really trust, which has been helpful. The other thing that I think has really prevented me from being lonely is that I do partner with people on projects a lot and I partner with you on a ton of stuff now, Katel. So, one thing that I’ve noticed is that I don’t work on A Book Apart and you don’t work on my client projects or come with me when I speak at conferences usually, but I feel like I have kind of a work partner where you kind of know what’s going on with my work and I know what’s going on with your work and we have enough work we’re doing together that—I don’t know—it feels like a colleague! [18:29] KL Ahhh, I love that so much! I agree, I feel the same way and it’s been such a cool thing to have developed where it’s like all of a sudden if we want to have a co-working day, we could do that. SWB Totally! Plus we get to talk to so many fucking awesome people together, which is something that I really, really love. So, why don’t we do that? KL Let’s do it. [music fades in, plays for five seconds, and fades out] Sponsor: Harvest KL [Ad spot] So, before we talk to Sarah, we’ve got to talk about something actually pretty related to her work—reading, writing, and creativity. Our friends at Harvest told us those things are super important to them, especially when it comes to making sure more diverse voices have a chance to share their ideas. So, Harvest has pledged to spend 4% of its profits each year to causes that help more people from all backgrounds read, write, and get creative. Two groups they support that you might want to check out are 826 National, which supports seven writing and tutoring centers for youth across the country, helping them write with confidence and originality. Check them out at 826national.org. And Graywolf Press, a nonprofit literary publisher that champions books from underrepresented voices. They’re at graywolfpress.org. SWB I love this so much because I think about all the incredible writers we’ve had on the show so far. Like Sarah, of course, you’re going to hear from her in just a second, or Keah Brown from last week, or Nichole Chung a few weeks ago. And then, of course, Carmen Maria Machado back in the spring—you know—her book was actually published by Graywolf Press! And I think about how—you know—the world just needs more writers like them and organizations like 826 and Graywolf are really crucial to making that happen. So I love that we’re able to spotlight them and—you know—writing and creativity are so important for everyone. So, even if you’re not going to be a capital-W writer, Harvest has noted that as a remote company with people in a lot of different time zones, they rely on written words to get things done and collaborate and that reading and writing skills make it possible for them to do that and make them successful. So, they want to support more people in gaining them and so do we. So thanks, Harvest, for caring about literacy and creativity and check out 826 National and Graywolf Press for more. [music fades in, plays for five seconds, and fades out] Interview: Sarah Cooper SWB Sarah Cooper is a comedian, writer, and self-proclaimed trash-talker based in New York City. She runs thecooperreview.com, a wildly popular satirical blog about business culture, and her first book, 100 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings, was a bestseller. Now she has a new book. It’s called How to Be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings and I am laugh-crying already. Sarah, welcome to No, You Go. [21:02] Sarah Cooper Thank you so much. SWB So, Sarah, we were reading your new book—Katel and I were actually just talking about it—and we really were laugh-crying. In chapter one, already I was losing it. I was reading the section where you—you started having all these illustrations of hairstyles to avoid and let me just describe this for readers who haven’t been able to read the book yet. It’s this illustration series where it’s like okay—long, flowing hair is too sexy and then there’s the hair that’s up in a bun is too boring, there’s the hair that’s too old, and then the last two are where I just lost it. It’s the one that’s like “too black”—natural hair, right? And then “way too black,” which is braids. Okay, so the book is full of illustrations like this and activities and basically advice for women to be successful, but don’t be too successful. How did you get to this place where you decided to write a satirical book of “non-threatening leadership strategies for women”? SC Well, it started as a blog post called “9 Non-Threatening Leadership Strategies for Women” and I wrote it two years ago—and it was sort of based on my experience kind of making myself more passive and trying to be more pleasing in the office and sort of getting called out on being a little too aggressive with my opinions and seeing other women get called out on the same things. And so this idea of being threatening when, in fact, we’re actually just being direct or straightforward or saying the same thing that a man would say made me think it would—it’s kind of like the perfect thing for satire where you’re trying to tell women “this is how you be less threatening,” but really the way you were going to act in the first place was already not threatening. So, that led to that first comic, which I almost didn’t publish because I have a group of friends and family that I sort of run things by before I publish anything. And I did get the feedback that this might be construed as offensive and people might take it too seriously and I might see [laughs]—I might be seen as someone who is anti-woman for giving this advice. And so, I really worked on it to try and make it as obvious as possible that it was a joke, so the advice sort of gets more silly towards the end of the post where the very last thing is “wear a mustache so that people will think you are a man and that way you won’t even have to be less threatening.” After that, I published it and it just sort of went viral in the same way that “10 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings” went viral and really hit a nerve and people still did think that I was serious and didn’t realize that I was not actually telling people to put on a fake mustache. But I think a lot of people just sort of saw themselves in a lot of the advice. And so that was kind of the initial spark of the idea for this book and I started writing a different book actually, last year—and I wasn’t going to write this book, especially after the election. I thought that there was just a sense of hopelessness that all women sort of felt and I didn’t know if there was a way to create something that would be funny, but also kind of not dismissive of how women were feeling. And so it—it did take me a little while to figure out how I could do it and I think what happened was I started to get angry and I think—you know—women started to go from sad to pissed and I think when I became pissed I was like, “you know what? This ridiculous. We have all of these rules everyone is trying to tell us to follow, they’re contradictory and we actually can’t win because no matter what we do, it’s not good enough and it’s not right.” And I think that that was especially how I felt with Hillary Clinton’s campaign. It was like she didn’t smile too much or she smiled too much or she was “too prepared,” I think was something that someone said, which just made me so livid. I was like, “wait a second. [laughs] If you’re too prepared, that’s not good enough?” So, it just got me so frustrated and so that’s when I was like, “you know what? I can make fun of this and I can kind of do it in a way that’s funny, but also kind of speak to how frustrating a lot of these rules are and this situation is and a lot of how women are feeling in the workplace in terms of how we should present ourselves when really we just want to be ourselves without being judged for all of these little things. [25:28] SWB Yes. I mean, there is so much kind of what I would say is shitty advice for women at work that is basically giving them these pointers for how to like “hey, here are some tips to suppress how you really feel all the time and act more like a man,” right? That’s kind of what they boil down to— SC Yeah. SWB —and so it’s interesting that you had that much of a problem of people not realizing what you were doing was satire. It seems very obvious to me. SC [laughs] Well, I think some women were like, “you know what? I’’—they are actually on my side without realizing that they’re on my side. I think that’s the funniest part because they’ll be like, “you shouldn’t be telling women to do this, women should just act the way that they want to act and if men are offended, then screw them.” And I’m like, “yeah, exactly, that’s the point of what I’m trying to say, [KL & SWB laugh] thank you for pointing that out.” So it’s more people not—you know—it’s more people that are kind of on my side that just kind of don’t realize that I’m not actually telling people to act like this, I’m saying that we shouldn’t be telling people to act like this and that’s kind of a running thread throughout a lot of the stuff that I do—it’s bad advice. Don’t take my advice, do the opposite of the thing that I’m telling you to do and that’s a—a lot of what this is as well. But yeah, people still take it seriously and I’ve got to laugh sometimes at that. SWB So, I’m curious—you’ve touched on this a little bit. Do you ever find yourself feeling frustrated or getting into some awkward space where you’re trying to write comedy about actual awful things that happen to real women all the time? Does that ever sort of get you down? Or does it feel like a positive outlet for you? I guess at some level it must since you [laughing] are writing a lot of comedy about it! SC [laughs] You know what? When you take something seriously and it feels kind of sacred, you are like “I don’t want to make fun of that because I really feel strongly about that” and so it did feel like a bit of a stretch and that’s why I wasn’t going to write it at first. And then especially with the harassment chapter—that chapter almost didn’t make it in there just because I—but it had to because then I was so angry about all of these things that women have to deal with. This idea that if we get harassed by someone who is a high performer and is a really incredible contributor to the company, that somehow makes it so that they can’t do anything about it because they need that person. [laughs] It’s just this idea that companies—a lot of companies—don’t seem to care about how they’re getting to their goals, they just care that they get to their goals and so they—there’s a lot of people who kind of get trampled on in that process. And so I think that what ends up happening is I’m a little scared to make fun of something or it’s a little bit too raw to make fun of it, but then the sort of frustration makes it so that I can’t help but make fun of it because I really, really need to point this out and I really—this is just something that I really want to say about it. [28:14] SWB So, I know that a lot of your work sort of stemmed from your experience in kind of a past life working at Google for a number of years, kind of working in the tech industry. You’ve said that it has given you plenty of material, and I’m wondering if we can go back to that a bit. Can you tell us a little bit about sort of both how you got started in comedy and in tech and how the two kind of intertwined? SC Yeah, it’s kind of a messy story. I always wanted to do something with performance and theatre and acting, and I kind of did it on and off while I was working. And I found stand-up because I wanted to be a better actress, and I kind of wanted to be more myself on stage and on camera. And so I decided to just get on stage at an open mic. And I drank a lot and got very drunk and got up on stage and told this story about dating and it was—it was very nerve-racking. But then I got up there and I felt very comfortable and I realized that I really liked writing for myself and I really liked being myself more than pretending to be—a character? That’s kind of—that was something that I was doing sort of in between working for Yahoo and Google and then I continued to do stand-up while I was working at Google and I would get my coworkers to come to my shows and I started to write a little bit more about what it was like to work with them and sort of making fun of the software engineers there and they—you know—loved that. They’re some of the funniest people I’ve ever met. I didn’t really realize that there was this sort of opening for satire in the corporate world before I wrote “10 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings,” which is really based on observation from sitting in meetings and—while I was supposed to be paying attention and contributing, I was making observations about what my coworkers were doing and especially the things that people were doing to make it seem like they knew what they were talking about when really most people weren’t paying attention at all. And I just always found it fascinating that certain people were seen as the smart ones. To me, almost everything is a sort of performance. And it’s also… I’m an immigrant. I was born in Jamaica. And so I think I’ve always kind of been like, “well, what’s the thing that I can do in this situation to make it look like I can fit in here and I’m part of it?” And so I was always sort of watching. And so I think a lot of it was just I really like observing all of those things and the first time I put that together was in “10 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings” and it really just resonated with people and that’s kind of what started my writing career that—as it is right now because that took off so much that I ended up leaving Google and—and writing my first book about it. [31:02] SWB Yeah, I think from that original post my favorite tip was maybe number six, which was “ask ‘will this scale?’ no matter what.” [KL laughs] SC Yeah. SWB Because, obviously, that’s the kind of thing I’ve heard a lot and it’s the kind of thing that is just said when you don’t know what else to say. And I think that that’s something that you really pinpointed so well is the way that people will sort of come up with these so called smart, insightful questions that are really just stock questions that they use to sound like they know what they’re talking about. SC Yeah. SWB Something that I want to touch on though—that you mentioned a minute ago that I think is really interesting, is you mentioned sort of being an immigrant and moving to this country from Jamaica and feeling like that gave you more of a sense of observing what other people are doing and figuring out what is the norm here. Sounds like maybe from a young age you became really attuned to needing to code switch and sort of trained yourself to always be identifying what the code is that’s happening, so you can flip on your “okay, I’m working at Google now” script and kind of blend. Is that something you feel like is a strong piece of your experience? SC That’s funny, I’ve never thought of it as code switching, I’ve always thought of it as people pleasing. [laughs] I’ve always been a huge just people pleaser, which is part of myself that I absolutely hate and I did it with—you know—sort of my parents, I did it with my friends, and I did it at work. I did it in relationships. And it took me a long time to realize that a lot of times I was doing and saying things that I didn’t actually think or feel just because I thought that’s what was wanted or needed by other people in that situation. So yeah, I mean I think that I developed that from a very young age. I have [laughs]—I have this memory of being very young, and I couldn’t read yet, and I was sitting at a breakfast table with my dad and he was reading the paper and he got to the comics section and he slides me the comics section and he says, “read this, it’s funny, you’ll laugh.” And he didn’t realize that I couldn’t read yet. And so I didn’t want to say, “Dad, I can’t read” [laughs] so [KL & SWB laugh] I looked at the comics and I just started laughing—I just started pretending to enjoy myself so that my dad would think that I was doing what he wanted me to do. And I feel like that was my earliest memory of just being like, “oh, they think that I should do this, so I’ll do this”—you know? But it took a long time for me to step outside myself and realize I don’t have to do that. I can say and do what I feel. [33:31] SWB And so I’m curious—as you were sort of starting your career working in tech and sort of going in with that people pleaser mentality, what was that experience like for you? SC Very successful, I have to say. I joined Google and was within a few years promoted to manage the team. And I did very well there, people loved working with me, [laughs] people loved having me in their meetings. You know, I think people pleasing is—it will get you to middle management. I don’t know if it will get you to be like a VP, but definitely as a woman especially, if you’re a people pleaser, I think that it can get you pretty far. The only thing is, you’re going to get something that you might not want, which is what I had. [laughs] You know, I became a manager and I was in a lot of meetings and I think that’s when I started to realize that I wasn’t being as creative as I wanted to be, so I guess it was kind of a blessing in disguise that I came to a point where I was more passionate about writing and stand-up and all the things I was doing outside of work than I was about the things I was doing at work. But I just find it fascinating how—you know—there’s so much imitation going on in the corporate world. I mean, that’s what people are doing in terms of how they figure out “well, this is how I need to get ahead, I need to—obviously this VP is talking so passionately about this product and all these features, and so I need to talk passionately about all these products and all these features.” Now, that VP might actually be feeling those things, but then the middle manager is just sort of imitating that passion. And so, I think that that to me was a lot of the things that I was doing as well. And it’s just kind of a strange situation, because they’re like, “oh, you have to be authentic—you know—you have to be really yourself,” but then a lot of it is just a performance in a lot of ways. SWB You mentioned how much of a people pleaser you always were, but it seems like almost flipping when you started writing the satirical posts because they’re fundamentally making waves. And I’m wondering if that was ever sort of a scary decision for you to make. SC It was. I mean, even as innocuous as “10 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings” was, I was so scared to post it because I didn’t want my coworkers to think I was making fun of them, because I was making fun of them. And I didn’t know if they would read it and I would ruin some relationships. So, that was really scary, but then a crazy thing happened. It came out, everybody read it, everybody loved it, they all started asking me if they could be featured in my next posts and they do this thing in a meeting and maybe that’s another trick I could put in there. And so that was kind of the first stepping stone of like “oh, this is okay!” And I will say that comedy for me definitely is sort of a defense mechanism. I can kind of hide behind the satire of it a little bit in order to say what I really feel. I feel like this is part of my growth is to say it in a satirical funny way, and then kind of get up the courage to say what I really feel and what I really think and be really committed to that. But it is really scary to put myself out there even a little bit, and even setting up a newsletter and sending out emails, and even when I had just forty people, I felt terrified to just send out my newsletter. It was just—it took a long time, but it’s been really great. You know, I think it’s been exactly what I needed in order to become more of who I am instead of this person that I think everyone wants me to be. [37:08] SWB I’m curious too, you talked about your newsletter. We mentioned at the top of the show The Cooper Review, which is the satirical blog that you run and I’m curious how and when did that get started and how did that build its audience? SC So, I posted “10 Tricks to Appear Smart in Meetings” on Medium at first because I didn’t have a blog. And then when it got—it was starting to get millions of views, I was like, “wait a second, I should be getting some of that traffic,” so I created thecooperreview.com about—I want to say—a month or so, or maybe six to eight weeks after that blog post came out. And then I started using the post on Medium to sort of drive people to my website and get people to sign up for my newsletter and started to grow my audience that way. SWB And so you also mentioned a lot about feeling a lot of fear about posting it and then getting a lot of positive feedback, but did you also get negative feedback? Have you received much criticism or, you know, trolls or kind of angry folks? SC Not from my coworkers, but from—yeah, random strangers. People get very angry, especially on LinkedIn [laughs] when you think that you’re trying to tell people how to—how to look smart in meetings because they take their meetings very seriously. So, I get people saying, “well, you shouldn’t—you shouldn’t try to look smart, you should just be smart” and I’m like “okay, thank you.” [SWB laughs] Yeah, so that’s kind of funny, but then I also get—you know—I wrote a post about gaslighting, which also made it to the book as well, and I got a woman who wrote to me and said that her boss did this to her and it was very painful and—and how she usually finds my things very funny, but this was just very painful for her and she didn’t appreciate it. She didn’t think it was great for me to write this. And I was very sensitive to that, so I wrote her back and said “you know, part of the reason that I write this stuff is because I want people to be more aware of it and I think that—you know—like G.I. Joe says, “knowing is half the battle.” And so when you are aware that these things are happening, then you can do something about it, then you can say, “hey, this is what’s happening. I’m not crazy, you’re making me feel like I’m crazy.” And she wrote back and it was really nice. She was like, “yeah, that is true, that is a good point. If I had known that that was what was happening at the time, that might have helped me.” So, I have situations like that, I have, I’ve gotten some hate mail about this book. It’s not even out yet, no one can read it yet, but just the title is making people upset. A man wrote and said he would definitely not be buying my book [laughs] because it was offensive to men. It’s really, really funny actually. The subject of the email is “blatant sexism.” It says, “I won’t be buying your How to Be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings. If I wrote a book called ‘How to Be Successful Without Hurting Women’s Feelings,’ no publisher would touch it and I would be lambasted for writing it in the first place, even when calling it satire. What appalls me the most is not that you wrote it, but that most men will ignore the blatant sexism, uncomfortably laugh it off, and pretend it doesn’t hurt because that is somehow more manly. I’m man enough to call you out on it, Sarah Cooper. [laughs and KL and SWB laugh loudly with her] [40:13] SWB Is it too late to get that as a back cover blurb? [all laugh] SC I know, I know. It was so perfect because I just love that—I love that “oh, most men are just going to laugh it off and just—and hide their pain” and I’m like, “welcome to our world. This is what we do all the time.” So, when I first got that, I was like, “oh my god, this is—I’m offending people, I’m offending people” and then the second I sort of shared it with a few friends, they were like, “oh my gosh, this is hysterical, you have to share this with everybody.” SWB It is quite funny and it’s also it’s like oh my gosh, you couldn’t even have the title of your book about not hurting men’s feelings out [ KL laughs] without hurting this man’s feelings. SC Exactly, exactly. SWB He’s so sensitive! You know, sometimes I just think men are too sensitive. SC I think they’re too sensitive, I think they’re too emotional. [all laugh loudly] SWB Exactly, exactly. When I read your work, I feel like it comes from a perspective that I relate to a lot and obviously all of the content about—you know—being harassed at work or being looked over for promotions, all that kind of stuff, I’m like, “okay, this really resonates for somebody who’s a woman.” But I know that you have male readers and I’m curious if you get a different kind of feedback from men who read your work? SC I think there’s just a range. I mean, I think there’s men who—god bless them—they feel like men and women should be equal and so we shouldn’t treat them differently. And it’s really hard for them to just accept the fact that yeah, we would like to be treated differently, but we haven’t been. And that’s the point. The other thing that frustrates me is that—and this happens with men and women too—it’s just like, “well, why didn’t you write a book about this?” Like this guy. “Why didn’t you write a book about women’s feelings?” It’s like there’s a specific audience and there’s a specific thing I’m trying to say and I’m sorry I couldn’t write a book for everybody, but that’s not how books work, I can’t do that. And so I think that there’s men in that camp—I think there’s men in the camp of “oh this is going to be great for my—my wife, or my girlfriend, or—you know—a friend of mine who is in the working world” and they probably don’t think that—that it will help them that much and I think that that’s fine, too. Maybe some of it will sort of—I appreciate that and I obviously it will be great that they want to share it with their female friends, but I think that the men who actually say, “I want to read this, I want to know what this perspective is like”—those are the men that just—they make me so happy. I always think about after the election; my husband is a straight white man and I was really upset after the election and he said to me, “you know, Sarah, I understand this is different for you.” And that’s all he had to say. You know, all he had to say was just appreciate the fact that this is different for me than it is for him and that’s all I want men to do is just say, “hey, this is an experience.” This is an experience that we have and these are things that we have to deal with that you don’t have to deal with and yes, we appreciate that there are things you deal with that we don’t have to, but can we just talk about us just one second? So, I think those are the men that I’m hoping to get to more of and I definitely see that. I have a great—a good deal of men who really support me and really support my work and are not even remotely offended by this title and actually see how they can learn something from it too. [43:25] KL Yeah. It’s so funny hearing you say all of this and then at the end of the day, it’s still—just to underscore it—we’re really not—it’s not a lot that [laughing] men would have to do. It’s like just paying attention— SC Right. KL —and being a little more self aware and—you know—leaving that channel open. Thinking a little bit more about your career and your work as a comedian and an author, was it scary to leave the perks and stability of a giant company like Google? Is there anything that you miss from that? SC It was terrifying and it took me a long time [laughs nervously] and no—everybody was pretty sure that I was making a mistake. Even my therapist was like, “you know, you should stay there at Google.” [laughs] My family, my fiancé at the time—now husband. Because the thing is, I met my husband at work and he’d see me at work and I was happy, you know? I really liked those people and I really enjoyed being there, and Google is such a comfortable place to be. Everything you could possibly want is there. I probably took advantage of the nap pods too many times, [KL & SWB laugh] but it was great—it was great. And so the thing that I tell you I would miss the most is having a place to go and be comfortable and being around people that I just really respect and admire and make me laugh. I miss that very much because I didn’t realize how lonely writing was going to be, I didn’t realize how much I would enjoy sometimes being alone, but then really, really, really need to talk to people and—so now it just takes an extra effort that I didn’t have to do before, to talk to people and go outside and go do things and in order to get that stimulation and find that new material and all of that stuff. So, it took me a while and I was panicking for at least the first six months after I left, but I realized that it was a bigger risk not to leave than it was to stay because I could always go back. And once I told my boss I was leaving and he said I could always come back if I wanted to, that made me feel like, “okay, I can do this.” KL That’s great. I’m glad that you had that and I completely get that apprehension about making such a big change—you know—not just like this is a big career change, but this is a big change in how I operate on a day to day basis. That’s huge. So—you know—today, these days, what does a typical week look like? [45:57] SC Well, it’s kind of crazy right now because I’m in this—you know—the last four weeks before the book comes out, so it’s a lot of working with PR. But usually it’s writing, it’s working on my blog, it’s—I have contributors who write and submit things and so looking at that stuff, it’s writing new material for stand-up, it’s going to an open mic maybe in the afternoon, maybe one or two open mics in the afternoon. Maybe I’ll have a show at night. And I am meeting a lot more people, I haven’t really found collaborators that I work with regularly yet, but that is something that I want to work on. I’d love to start a podcast like you ladies! That is something I have been thinking about, but I can’t get past coming up with a name! So, I would like to do something like a podcast or more regular content because for me, I’ve realized I love having a schedule and that’s been the hardest thing for me is just to have a consistent schedule. KL Yeah, I appreciate that. Especially being in a field that is—you know—very much creative, I think people often underestimate how much it helps to have a schedule, how much it helps to have stability, however you can make that happen. So what is great about working as a full time comedian and working the way that you work right now and maybe what’s kind of harder about it? SC I think what’s great about it is kind of what I was saying before is that I have so many outlets to discover myself and who I really am, which is something that I think is just really important for a life, you know? To know you left everything on the table and you told every story that you wanted to tell and you let everyone know who you are—and you didn’t leave this world without telling everybody that. And I think that’s really important. And then using that to inspire other people and—when I get people writing me that they are starting to draw or are starting to write satire or they are doing something else, that’s really exciting for me, and I hope that I can do more of that, which is create more things to inspire more people to create things. That’s the thing that’s great about it, it’s kind of this journey for me as a person that I get to be on and I don’t have to dedicate the majority of my day to being at a job that I am not that excited about. I can devote most of my day to doing things that get me closer to who I want to be as a person. And the thing that’s hard is staying motivated and, you know, getting out of bed, not getting frustrated to the point where I just feel like I don’t want to do anything because nothing’s working. You know, it’s really hard just when there’s nobody telling you, “hey, there’s a deadline.” You make the deadlines, sometimes you just don’t want to do that thing or you just don’t feel motivated to do that thing and so it’s—I think that’s the hardest thing is finding that consistency and that motivation for me so that I can keep going without having any external people telling me what to do. [49:00] SWB Do you have any techniques that you’ve found work for you when you’re having those moments where you’re like, “well what if I just got back under the covers?” SC Yeah. I have a journal called the “Best Self Journal” and it it has kind of changed my life and if—sometimes I use it and sometimes I don’t. If I don’t use it, it’s very bad. If I use it, it changes my day. And basically what I do is the night before, I will write down every hour of how I’m going to spend the next day and doing that makes me—first of all, it makes me realize, “hey, there are—there are enough hours in the day to get done what you want to do” and also it just is this thing that I keep referring back to throughout the day to kind of stay on track. And so if I have that, it really helps me keep going because I have this plan and I can kind of follow that plan. If there’s nothing, if my day is just an open blue sky, then I will just piss it away on Twitter—and that’s—that’s what I’ll do. So, that has really helped me. SWB I love the “Best Self Journal.” I know that I’m not going to be my best self necessarily every day, [SC laughs quietly] but thinking about what would I be doing if I was really being my best version of myself in this moment is like—that sounds like a pretty cool exercise. SC Yeah. SWB Sarah, this has been really great and we are about out of time, so I have one last question for you, which is just, where can folks follow your work? SC So, my personal website is sarahcpr.com. s-a-r-a-h-c-p-r.com—c-p-r is just short for Cooper, it doesn’t mean I know CPR or anything like that. And you can see all my events on there and all my press and all that stuff. If you want to check out thecooperreview.com, that has all of the blog posts and hopefully we will return to a regular publishing schedule there as well, once we get out of the book craziness. SWB Well, that’s awesome. So, everybody, you heard her—follow Sarah and also How to Be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings is going to be on sale by the time you’re listening to this. And even though I’m personally pretty okay with hurting some men’s feelings, I definitely loved it. So, pick it up! And Sarah, thank you so much for being here. SC Thank you. And the book has mustaches in the back that you can actually wear, so another reason to buy it. [laughs & KL & SWB join in] KL Perfect. [music fades in, plays for five seconds, and fades out] [51:20] Sponsor: Shopify SWB [Ad spot] Hey, it’s time for a quick career check with Shopify. This week we have Zeina Naboulsi on the line. She’s the executive assistant to Shopify’s CEO, Tobi Lütke, and she’s here to talk about the interview process. Zeina, tell us what you’ve learned! Zeina Naboulsi Well, one of the pieces of advice we constantly give to candidates is “just be yourself.” And it sounds so clichéd, but it’s true. Three years ago, when I interviewed at Shopify—or even when I recently sat down with Tobi about my new role—I just remember giving myself permission to be authentically me. This alleviated so much pressure. This is a new challenge for me, but going forward, I can look at it from a lens that’s really mine. Interviewing is nerve-wracking enough as it is. Imagine spending the whole time trying to be someone else. Just think, if you can approach an interview being your authentic self, you know that you’re going to show up on day one and every day after that as you. SWB Thanks, Zeina! That might sound hard to do, but it’s so true. And if you want to work with folks like Zeina, then you should check out Shopify. They’ve got roles in offices around the world, all at shopify.com/careers. [music fades in, plays for five seconds, and fades out] Fuck Yeah of the Week SWB Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. My fuck yeah today. It’s very important. KL Yeah? What is it? SWB Rock and roll. KL I love rock and roll! SWB I think there was a song like that… KL Was there? [laughs] SWB Probably. Okay, so specifically, tonight me and Katel are going to go and see Courtney Barnett— KL Ughh! SWB —and I just love her so much! Her album from earlier this year, “Tell Me How You Really Feel,” has been on repeat for me over and over and over again for the past few months. KL Me too, I love Courtney Barnett and I remember when she came out with the song “Avant Gardener,” which is essentially a song about her having a full-on public panic attack. And it’s such a great song, I identified with it so much. I really appreciate that she sings about anxiety [laughs] and depression and brings it into her art and she’s just so fucking good, I can not wait. SWB Yes. You know, there’s just something about her songwriting that really gets me because it’s like it’s quirky and fun, but it’s also often really open about things that are sad or difficult. And so I like that kind of juxtaposition and it feels really honest and kind of disarming, right? Because it feels like—it feels like you’re kind of really getting to know her. And so it makes me happy hearing her voice and it makes me feel like we don’t have to pretend that things are fine when they’re not, but that also, things are going to be okay and it’s okay even if you’re sad. KL Yeah. Plus I love any opportunity to hang out with you solo, obviously, but we are taking our partners with us tonight, so that’s a bonus. We’re doing a double date! And we’re so cool, we’re doing it on a school night. [laughs][54:01] SWB I totally still feel like, “oh my god, we’re going out on a school night.” I used to go to a lot of shows in my twenties—all through my twenties I went to shows constantly and I feel like the past few years, I really haven’t made it to as much as I would like. And—you know—part of it is getting older and it gets late and I get tired and I’m not going to lie, that happens and I’m okay with that. I’m actually pretty okay with that. But part of it I think has been because my work life has resulted in a lot of travel—I’m in and out of town, I’m at conferences, it’s sort of like going to a concert can sometimes feel just like a lot. And it’s also just hard to keep up with bands and when they’re going to be in town and am I going to be in town? So, I feel like that’s been less of my life than I’d like it to be, but I’m trying to kind of bring a little bit more balance back around that. So, we saw Sweet Spirit a few months ago. And then just recently me and Will, we went to go and see Liz Phair and relive some awesome nineties vibes, that was also excellent. KL I’m so sad I missed that. SWB Yeah, I felt like I was one of the youngs at the show—[KL laughs] KL Yeah. SWB —which is also a pretty interesting feeling because I don’t feel like that that often anymore. And so—I don’t know—I like that I feel like I’m kind of coming to terms with where I am in life, which is that I can’t go to everything and I’m also—I’m not going to go out for a drink with you after the show. KL No. SWB I’m going home! KL Going to bed. SWB I’m definitely going to bed. And—you know—I don’t really want to go to a festival. KL Yeah, no. Those are over for me. SWB But I still fucking love a good, live show and I am so fucking excited to be out there tonight seeing Courtney Barnett. So, fuck yeah to getting out and seeing artists you love! KL And fuck yeah to badass women musicians. SWB Fuck yeah! Well, that is it for this week’s episode of No, You Go. NYG is recorded in our home city of Philadelphia and it is produced by Steph Colbourn. Our theme music is by The Diaphone. Thanks to Sarah Cooper for being our guest today. KL Thanks for listening. And hey, if you like our show, don’t forget to subscribe and rate it wherever you listen to podcasts. Oh, and tell a friend or two. See you again next week! SWB Bye! [music fades in, plays alone for 32 seconds, and fades out]

Summary: Sarah Stremming, founder of The Cognitive Canine and host of Cog-Dog Raido and her partner, Dr. Leslie Eide, join me to talk about their latest addition: Watson, a 6-month-old Border Collie puppy. Next Episode:  To be released 9/21/2018. TRANSCRIPTION: Melissa Breau: This is Melissa Breau and you're listening to the Fenzi Dog Sports Podcast brought to you by the Fenzi Dog Sports Academy, an online school dedicated to providing high-quality instruction for competitive dog sports using only the most current and progressive training methods. Today we have two guests joining us, for the first time ever: Sarah Stremming, of Cog-Dog Radio and the Cognitive Canine, and Leslie Eide. Longtime listeners are undoubtedly are already familiar with Sarah, but let me share a little about Leslie. Leslie graduated from Colorado State University’s Veterinary School in 2006. She completed a rotating internship in small animal medicine in Albuquerque, N.M., and then became certified in canine rehabilitation with a focus in sports medicine. She is now a resident with the American College of Veterinary Sports Medicine and Rehabilitation. Dr. Eide also helped to create and teaches some of the classes to become a Certified Canine Fitness Trainer (CCFT) through the University of Tennessee's NorthEast Seminars. Like Sarah, Dr. Eide is involved in the agility world. She has trained two dogs to their ADCH Agility Dog Champion title and one to ADCH Bronze, an Agility Trial Champion title and a Master Agility Champion title. Three of her dogs have qualified and competed at USDAA Nationals with multiple Grand Prix Semi-final runs. And today, these two lovely ladies are here to talk to us about puppies, especially one in particular … . But we’ll get to that. Welcome back to the podcast, Sarah — and hi Leslie! Pleasure to “meet” you. Sarah Stremming: Hi Melissa. Leslie Eide: Hi Melissa. Melissa Breau: To start us out, Sarah, can you just remind listeners how many dogs you have now and who they are? Sarah Stremming: I have two Border Collies. Idgie is 9 years old and she’s my main competition dog right now. And Felix is 3 years old, and he’s in training and just keeping me on my toes. Melissa Breau: Leslie, would you mind sharing the same intro for your dogs, including the newest addition? Leslie Eide: My oldest is Brink, a 12-year-old Border Collie, and he right now is champion of holding the couch down. Next would be Stig, my 7-year-old Border Collie, who’s the main competition dog right now and who most of my online training videos have in them. Next is Ghost, my 5-year-old Australian Shepherd, and she is quickly trying to surpass Stig as the main competition dog. And then finally the puppy, Watson, is 6 months old and 1 day, and he is a new Border Collie. Melissa Breau: So, it’s Watson I really wanted to talk about today. Leslie, would you mind sharing a little on how you wound up with him? And why him … even though that meant bringing him over from Japan? Leslie Eide: It just kind of happened. I didn’t go out looking for a Border Collie and saying, “Japan is the place to get him!” I actually met Miki, who is sort of his breeder but not really, a couple of years ago at Cynosport, which is the USDA agility national competition, or international competition, but it’s always held in the U.S. One of her dogs had something happen to him, and I worked on him at the event and he did really well, and we became Facebook friends and stayed in contact. Last year, she won Grand Prix with her dog Soledea. And Soledea, the weird part about it, actually belongs to someone else. She just competes with her. She announced that Soledea was having a litter, and I had been looking for, I don’t know, probably had my feelers out for about a year, looking for a Border Collie puppy. I really liked Soledea, so through Facebook I was like, “Hey, I’m sort of interested,” and she was really excited about it. When the puppies were born, I many times thought it was too much trying to get a puppy from Japan, and everything you have to go through, and blah, blah, blah, blah. I kept saying, “No, no, no, no,” and finally she said, “I’m getting the puppy to L.A. Make sure you’re there to go pick him up.” And I was like, “OK.” So that’s how it ended up getting a puppy from Japan. It all comes back to the world of sports medicine, and that’s how you find puppies. So a little bit of fate in a way of it was just meant to be, despite all the odds. Melissa Breau: Sometimes, when it’s meant to happen, it’s just meant to happen, and it doesn’t matter how many times you say, “Well, that’s pretty complicated.” You end up with the puppy. Leslie Eide: Yeah. Melissa Breau: I know Sarah has talked a bit about him on her podcast and you’ve both blogged about him a little bit. My understanding is that you guys are doing things a little … for lack of a better word … differently than other agility handlers or even dog trainers might with a new puppy. Can you share a little bit about your approach thus far with him? What are you working on, what have you worked on? Leslie Eide: For me, it’s not much different than I would say I’ve raised my other puppies. I’m maybe what you would think of as a lazy trainer. I’m more about building a relationship than necessarily having a list of things I have to accomplish — “He’s this old, he must be able to do these ten things.” I just let everything happen in a more organic manner of he shows me he can do it, and then I say, “OK, I’m going to reinforce that.” An example is I had him at the agility trial this weekend. He hopped on the measuring table and … we’ve never worked on “stay” a day in his life, and because he was willing to stand on the table, I took the opportunity to say, “Hey, I can reinforce this,” and got some really good training in when it was again more organic of him telling me he knew he was ready for it, rather than saying, “He has to know how to stay by a certain age,” or “He has to be able to know how to wrap a wing jump by a certain age,” that kind of thing. Sarah Stremming: For me, more what I do with Watson is teaching him how to be a dog in this house, and how to go out on off-leash walks — as everybody knows I’m pretty into — and providing him with lots of environmental enrichment. I just want to make sure that he maintains this delightfully optimistic personality that he has. I know that you had Julie Daniels, I think just last week, and she talked about optimism. I loved it. I like that word for describing what he is, because it’s not like he doesn’t have any fears, because they all do. That’s not real. That’s not realistic. It’s more that when he encounters something novel, his first guess is that it’s going to be good for him, and I just want that to stay there, because if that stays there, then agility training is a piece of cake. If you’re not trying to overcome fear of other dogs, or fear of strangers, or fear of loud noises or weird substrates or anything like that, agility training is not that hard, especially for a pretty seasoned competitor like Leslie. I think both of us feel pretty confident in training agility skills and also handling. Not that we can’t improve and that we’re always trying to improve, but for me, I want him to maintain that really optimistic outlook on when something new is happening, he’s game to try it. Leslie Eide: I guess I would add, goes along with what Sarah was saying, is I also want him to learn what it’s like to be a dog in my life. So, like she said, being able to live in a household with lots of dogs, but it’s also about getting used to our schedule. I’m a busy person and usually work 12-hour days, and while he may get to come with me to work, he also has to realize there’s going to be some really boring time at work where he just has to sit and chill. And that happens at home too. So that’s really important to me that he doesn’t necessarily get upset or get stir-crazy or all upset when he doesn’t have something to constantly do. Border Collies are definitely busy, smart dogs, and so learning what our life is like, and not necessarily doing things out of the ordinary while he’s a puppy, and then suddenly, when he’s grown up, being like, “OK, now you’re an adult, and you just have to live with how our life is,” but rather teaching him how to handle it when he’s young. Sarah Stremming: You said, “How are you guys doing stuff differently?” I think that is the primary component, because most sport people that I know, especially in the agility world, really, really want their puppy to have tons and tons of drive to work with the handler. I’m not saying that’s bad. We want that too. But they tend to go about it in a way that seems really imbalanced to me, and the dog experiences isolation/boring-ness or super-exciting training time. That’s not how we live. I guess if your dogs all live in kennels and they come out to train multiple times a day, then you could pull that off. But we both want our dogs to be free for 90 percent of their time. We just don’t want them to be crated, kenneled, etc., for large portions of their lives, so they have to learn how to just hang out early on. Melissa Breau: I don’t remember if it was the blog or the podcast, but I feel like I remember something one of you at one point put out about planning to hold off on teaching certain skills until he’s a bit older. I was hoping you could talk a little bit about that too. What skills are you holding off on, maybe, and sharing a little bit of the reasoning. I know we’ve talked about it a little bit already. Leslie Eide: I think mostly the blog was relating to agility skills, and that a lot of times we start teaching the foundation movements right away with a puppy, like wrapping a wing, groundwork. You’re not necessarily putting them on equipment or doing anything like that, but everything that you are teaching them in some way relates to eventually an agility skill, including convincing them to tug with you. That’s a big thing of “They have to tug,” and it goes from there. Those things I think will come. I’m not going to push for them too soon. That’s kind of going back to the story of working on a stay on the table this past weekend. If he shows me he’s ready for something, then I’ll take advantage of it, but I’m not going to push him ahead of his comfort level. I’d rather him be comfortable with everything, be happy with playing with me, and know that good things come from me and that we’re going to do fun things, rather than taking it straight to an agility focus. Melissa Breau: I’d assume the two of you have had a pretty big influence on each other, and your approach to dogs and all that good stuff, over the years. From the outside, at least, it seems like you’re essentially taking all Sarah’s developed with her Whole Picture approach and applying it to Watson. Sarah, is that accurate? And for those not as familiar with your approach, can you give us the down and dirty version of what I’m talking about? Sarah Stremming: I would say that’s accurate. The Four Steps to Behavioral Wellness is what we’re talking about. That would be communication, nutrition, exercise, and enrichment. The communication front — that’s just training. That’s just having a positive-reinforcement-based training relationship with the dog, where you give the dog a lot of good positive feedback all the time. Nutrition is kind of self-explanatory, and Leslie’s a vet, so I pretty much defer to her in that regard with him. Exercise — I like free exercise. He certainly goes on leash walks, but the leash walks are more about learning how to walk on a leash than exercise. Again, I defer to Leslie in the exercise department because her field is sports medicine. You definitely don’t want to be overdoing it with a puppy at all, and he would like to be completely wild and run and run and run all day long, so we have to talk about that. The enrichment piece is really big for me. We do lots of things for him to shred. You should see our house. There’s cardboard shreds everywhere. So just giving him things to shred, feeding him his meals out of a slow bowl, we have all kinds of little kibble-dispensing toys around, lots of chew bones, things like that. So just making sure that his brain is exercised, his body is exercised, he is not confused, he is communicated with appropriately, and that he is fed well. That’s what we’re trying to do. Melissa Breau: Leslie, I’d guess your background’s had a pretty big influence on your general approach, right? How has your experience as a vet and a canine rehab specialist influenced your views on this stuff and led you to take this approach? Leslie Eide: It’s maybe changed it a little bit, but not much. I’ve always been a little bit more laid back with my approach with puppies. I’ve always had this belief that puppies should get to be puppies and experience their puppyhood, and not just be thrown into intensive sport training right from Day 1. Maybe that’s a little bit of backlash from my own experience of being thrown into competitive swimming as a 5-year-old and doing that for most of my young life, and everything was about training and being really serious. I also would say, from the vet side of things, I think there’s a lot of injuries that can happen when they’re young, and by pushing things and doing stuff repetitively that causes problems at a young age, or maybe they’re not as visible at a young age, but then they show up a little later in life and can definitely cut their careers short. I want to be successful, but I also want to do it for a long time, and not just a year or two and then have to give it up because they’re hurt for some reason. Melissa Breau: We’ve talked quite a bit about what you’re NOT doing. So I’d love to hear … I know you mentioned a little bit of leash walking. I’d imagine you’re doing some other training with him. What ARE you focusing on as far as training goes with Watson right now? Leslie Eide: Well, Sarah’s trying to teach me how to teach him marker cues. We’ll see how that goes. So we definitely have that going on. He gets the basics of “sit” and “down,” and again, most of it is capturing offered behavior, rather than setting out as a training session of “OK, we’re going to learn this behavior.” We do fitness exercises, so I have my building blocks that I use to make all my canine fitness exercises. So starting to work on ones that are appropriate for him, like learning targeting, front paw targeting, rear paw targeting, being comfortable getting in an object or on an object, like a box or a disc or something like that. And then a lot of new experiences still. Most recently, over the past couple of weeks I’d say, I worked to introduce him to the underwater treadmill so he can start getting some exercise in that, since that’s a really easy way for me to exercise him at work. Melissa Breau: That’s so cool. Leslie Eide: Going places, we went to the beach for the first time, he goes to shops and meets people, he goes to agility trials and hangs out. Like I said, at agility trial learned how to do a stand-stay on the measuring table. So I’m the anti-planner. I don’t set out with “We’re going to learn this.” It’s more see what happens and go from there. Sarah Stremming: For me, the things that I need to teach him are things that make him easier for me to manage in a house with six dogs. We’ve recently started working hard on all the dogs are trained to release out the door by name, and so I want Watson also to know that with everybody else. So we’ve been working on some very early iterations of that. And things like the best stuff for puppies is not on the counter or the kitchen table. The best stuff for puppies is on the ground. And body handling, so handling your feet, and looking in your mouth, and accepting passive restraint, as is so important for all of them to learn. Things like that are more my focus with him. Leslie Eide: I would say something that’s really big is playtime, too. That’s not necessarily something like a skill we’re teaching, but just making sure that playtime happens every day in some form. Melissa Breau: Are there skills that you think get overlooked that you’re making sure to cover right from the start? You mentioned handling, you mentioned play skills. Anything else on that list for you? Sarah Stremming: I do think body handling gets overlooked, but for me, especially within the sport of dog agility, I think a lot of people start out with puppies ringside, watching agility, trying to “teach them” to be cool waiting their turn. And then what happens is at a certain age the puppy notices what’s going on in the ring, and they start to wiggle and scream and not contain themselves. And then, depending on the trainer, the puppy might get a correction, or the puppy might be removed from the arena, or they might try to distract the puppy with food, or I saw a competitor once basically just hit the side of her puppy with a tug toy until the puppy decided to turn around and latch on the tug toy instead of squeal at the dogs in the ring. For me, again, it’s an answer of what are we omitting? But it’s about the teaching him the skill of waiting his turn before we ever ask him to wait his turn. The early, early iterations for that, for me, look like feeding all of the dogs a little bite of something, and I say their name and I feed them, and then I say their name and I feed them. Watson is trying to eat everything that I’m feeding, but he doesn’t get anything until I say his name and then feed him. So he’s bouncing around and being ridiculous, and all the other dogs are sitting and waiting, and eventually they go, “Oh, this isn’t that hard. When she says my name, I get to eat.” Just like what Leslie was talking about, they show you that capability when they have it. It’s kind of like a 3-year-old child only has so much self-control, and I really feel that way about puppies too. They only have so much ability to “wait their turn.” So teaching him the skill of waiting his turn way before we ever ask him to wait his turn is a big one for me that I think people maybe don’t overlook, but go about it in a way that I wouldn’t. Leslie Eide: For me, it’s relationship. He can train, and he knew how to do that from pretty much the moment I got him, but he didn’t necessarily know that I was a special person to him. So, to me, it’s about building a relationship before asking him for a list of skills that he needs to be able to do. Definitely, training can help build that relationship, but I think it’s also just one-on-one time, especially when there’s a large number of dogs in the household. And it’s about snuggles and play and that kind of thing. Melissa Breau: Obviously we all TRY, when we get a new puppy, to do everything right, and there’s definitely nothing more stressful than that feeling. But inevitably something goes wrong. We’re out and about and another dog barks and lunges at the puppy, or kids come flying at the puppy’s face, screaming, and they scare the bejesus out of him. Have either of you had to deal with any of those types of moments yet? And if so, how did you handle it? Is there prep work you’ve done, or things you do in the moment … or even afterwards, stuff you do for damage control that you can talk about a little bit? Sarah Stremming: We honestly haven’t had anything big that I have experienced, but there have been things that he saw and went, “Huh, I’m not sure about that.” Like, we had him in this little beach town after running on the beach and there was a lot of construction going on, and so there was a jackhammer going into the concrete, and he wasn’t sure if that was what should be happening, and I can’t blame him, really. What was important for me, and what I usually tell people to do, is as long as the puppy is still observing the thing, allow them to continue to observe the thing. So he looked at it until he was done looking at it, and then he turned away from it, and then we all retreated away from it together. I think what people try to do instead is they try to distract the puppy away from it with food, or they try to make it a positive event with food, or they try to drag the puppy towards it, maybe, or lure the puppy towards it, and it’s best to just let them experience their environment from a distance that they feel comfortable with. He really hasn’t had any huge startles about anything. I tend not to let him see a lot of people unless I know them, because he is going to jump on them and I don’t want them to be a jerk about that. He did meet one strange dog that I hadn’t planned on him meeting once on a walk. And that dog — I actually posted a video of this on the Cognitive Canine Facebook page — that dog was inviting play before Watson was ready, and he scared Watson a little bit, but not terrible. What was amazing was that Felix walked up and intervened, and then the dog played with Felix. Watson still stayed there, and then he was like, “OK, I can tag along if there’s three of us, but I don’t want to be the center of attention.” If he had run away, let’s say that dog had really scared him and he had tucked his tail and run towards me or something, if the puppy is coming to me looking for shelter from whatever it is, I always give it to them. So I would have absolutely picked him up and just allowed him to look at the dog from a distance. But I tend not to try to involve food in those moments unless the dog is trying to approach. Let’s say, when Felix was a puppy, he saw a fire hydrant, seemingly for the first time, and decided that it was monster. I let him look at it as long as he wanted to the first day he saw it, and then we walked away. And then the next day, he looked at it and he wanted to sniff it and approach it, and I fed him for that. And then the third day, he was like, “Oh, here’s the thing. Feed me.” And I was like, “OK, good. Done. Here’s one cookie, and now I’m never going to feed you for that again because it’s over.” I think people freak out, and if you freak out and they’re freaking out, then we’re all freaking out, and it’s not a good thing. Leslie Eide: Yeah, he really hasn’t had anything, but I completely agree with Sarah. And I’m pretty good about it, again, going along with not planning everything. I’m pretty chill about everything, so when he reacts to something, I’m not going to feed into it by being like, “Oh my god.” It’s about, “Cool, dude. Check it out. I’m not going to force you into anything. We’ll just stand here. If you’re comfortable staying here looking at it, then that’s where we’ll stay.” If food comes into play, it’s for when he turns around and looks at me and says, “OK, let’s go.” It’s more of a reinforcement of choosing to be back with me and go on with me on our whatever we’re doing, not a reinforcement for necessarily … Sarah Stremming: Which we would do if the thing was exciting, too, not just if it’s scary. It’s “Choose me over the stuff in the environment that interests you.” Melissa Breau: I’d love to end on a high note. Can each of you share one piece of advice for anyone out there with their own puppy, hoping to raise a happy, balanced dog? Leslie Eide: My piece of advice would probably be something like, “It’s all going to be OK.” We all can make mistakes, and luckily dogs are very forgiving, so don’t beat yourself up if something bad happens or you make a mistake. There’s lots that you can do to bounce back and still have a perfectly wonderful puppy. Sarah Stremming: I think mine is really similar to yours, in that I would say … Melissa, you had mentioned we’re all paranoid about doing everything right and that’s really stressful. So my piece of advice would be to embrace and accept that you will not do everything right. Embrace and accept that you will screw something up at some point and that you’ll survive, and if you’re paying attention, you’ll learn, and that will in the end be a good thing too. I seriously look back on every puppy and go, “Yeah, could have done that better, could have done that better.” All of us do that, and that’s fine. Embrace it and run with it. Melissa Breau: For folks out there who are interested in following along as Watson grows up, what’s the best way to do that? And where can people who want to stalk — or at least follow — each of you, where can they go to stay up to date? Sarah Stremming: The first question, where can they follow Watson, we are running a subscription to a blog just about Watson. It’s called “Puppy Elementary,” and you can find that by clicking the Puppy Elementary tab on my website, which is thecognitivecanine.com. Again, you can follow me at thecognitivecanine.com. That’s where I blog. I also have a podcast called Cog-Dog Radio, and of course I’m on Facebook with The Cognitive Canine and Cog-Dog Radio, and just me, so that’s where you can find me. You can find Leslie at work — all day, every day! We are teaching our course together … is it next term? October? Jumping Gymnastics, for FDSA, together, so you can find Leslie there too. But your website is thetotalcanine.net?Leslie Eide: Yes. And Facebook. I’m on there. My business-y type page is The Total Canine, which has a Facebook page, and then the website is thetotalcanine.net and it is “canine” spelled out. And my real work is SOUND Veterinary Rehabilitation Center, and it’s on Facebook, and the website is soundvetrehab.com. Melissa Breau: Where are you located again, just in case somebody is in your area and wants to come look you up? Sarah Stremming: About 40 miles north of Seattle, but the SOUND Veterinary Rehab Center is in Shoreline, Washington, which is just north of Seattle. Melissa Breau: One last question for each of you — my new “last interview question” that I’ve been asking everyone: What’s a lesson that you’ve learned or been reminded of recently when it comes to dog training? Sarah, you want to go first? Sarah Stremming: Mine is exceedingly nerdy. When I told Leslie what it was, she was like, “Oh God.” It’s to remember not to stay on lesser approximations for too long. In real words, plain English, basically that means to progress as fast as possible. So don’t wait for perfection before moving on to the next thing that you’re going to be reinforcing. I’m always shooting for low error rates, high rates of reinforcement, I like nice, clean training, and because of that, sometimes I can stay on approximations that are not the final behavior for a little bit too long because I get a little bit too perfectionistic on those, and it bites me every time. I was recently reminded of it in Felix’s contact training. Melissa Breau: I’ve never done that. Sarah Stremming: I know, right? I think it’s the sickness, honestly, of people who are really obsessed with training just get way too fixated on the details. But anyway, that’s mine. Leslie Eide: I think I’m going to pick one specifically to make fun of Sarah. Sarah Stremming: I expect no less. Leslie Eide: In that it’s something that I never do, but she probably really wishes I would, and that’s take data. Sarah Stremming: Leslie never takes data. Leslie Eide: No. Sarah Stremming: I take data on everything. I always say that if we could put us together, we’d be a great trainer, because I’m too detail-oriented and nitpicky, and she’s too freeform. Leslie Eide: Yeah. Sarah Stremming: Which is why together, with Jumping Gymnastics, I think we do a nice job teaching together, because we do come from both of those different sides. Melissa Breau: Thank you so much, ladies, for coming on the podcast! And we managed upon a time when both of you could join me, so that’s awesome. Thank you. Sarah Stremming: Thanks for having us. Leslie Eide: Thank you. Melissa Breau: Thank you to all of our listeners for tuning in! We’ll be back next week talking about details with Hannah Branigan to talk about prepping for competition and more. If you haven’t already, subscribe to our podcast in iTunes or the podcast app of your choice to have our next episode automatically downloaded to your phone as soon as it becomes available. CREDITS: Today’s show is brought to you by the Fenzi Dog Sports Academy. Special thanks to Denise Fenzi for supporting this podcast. Music provided royalty-free by BenSound.com; the track featured here is called “Buddy.” Audio editing provided by Chris Lang. Thanks again for tuning in -- and happy training!

We begin our look at the exemplars of living-by-faith from Hebrews 11 on Mother's Day with Sarah as she receives, laughs at, but then holds to and acts on the promise of God for her life.

My sweet Sarah Lee. I thought it would be fun to have my youngest daughter, Sarah on the show today. Fun fact about Sarah, when she was born we named her Sarah Elizabeth. Her sister and I wanted to call her by the nickname Ellie and so we did. However, when Sarah turned five she […] The post Nobody Doesn't Like Sarah Lee appeared first on Ultimate Homeschool Podcast Network.

“We're all different and that's part of human nature, to celebrate those differences.” -Sarah Dennis Calling in, rather than calling out… In this episode, I had the privilege to discuss the history and the current reality of racism in our society as well as the potential for change from the inside out (and the outside in) with educator Sarah Dennis and artist & activist Ashley Lana Scott. Sarah and Ashley had never met before so this was a truly candid conversation about what it takes to be an ally, how to support one another in looking inward at our internalized racism (regardless of skin color), and why these sometimes uncomfortable conversations are crucial to the cultural dialogue. (BTW, that's the difference between calling in and calling out…  IN is initiating a conversation, OUT is pointing a finger in an accusatory way.) Of course we talk about impostor syndrome and feeling like a total fraud when trying to have said difficult conversations, too! This is a conversation that is humorous, sensitive, hopeful and deeply thought-provoking. So take a deep breath, relax your mind open, have a listen, and let me know what you think over in the Facebook Group… And if you haven't already, check out Episode 045: Talking to strangers, where you'll hear how I met Julie and why I'm taking on a theme on the show that pushes me out of my comfort zone. Also, Episode 046 with Andrea Ranae Johnson on how to use your power and privilege for good. Connect with Ashley Ashley Lana Scott's Website Ashley's Facebook Ashley's Instagram Ashley's Twitter Ashley's LinkedIn “At the end of the day, the thing that is pulling the strings is our silence, on every side, and that silence is deadly. Like Sarah was saying, when you allow yourself to feel that shame and then you don't want to do anything about it, you allow it to overcome your action, it makes the decision for you… I suggest getting your hands dirty with that shame.” -Ashley Lana Scott Connect with Sarah Sarah Dennis's Website “I actually like the word ‘co-conspirator' better, I think ‘ally' is really soft and wimpy. For me it's not a call to action, being an ally. But being a co-conspirator makes me feel like, “I want to dismantle this system and I'm going to do anything I can to figure out what that looks like.” -Sarah Dennis   Show Notes Galore: http://www.thecreativeimpostor.com Magic Page! Get a free gift from me: http://www.thecreativeimpostor.com/magic This episode was mixed by Edwin R. Ruiz of Mondo Machine. The Creative Impostor theme music was created by JoVia Armstrong. I'd LOVE to hear from you! If you're listening in Apple Podcasts, PLEASE subscribe and leave a review.

Our guest this month is Sarah Levett, a veteran of the Aussie comedy scene. We talked about never being too old to try something new, working in LA, working in radio, balancing motherhood with a career among other things. Now we recorded late morning on a weekday so if you hear what sounds like a power saw a couple of times in the background,it is!. The neighbours’ were renovating! It’s only a couple of times though! Enjoy the episode! Like Sarah on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/Sarah-Levett-115071285270107/?fref=ts For bookings and more http://sarahlevett.com/ Follow Sarah on Twitter https://twitter.com/SarahLevett Like Women In Comedy The Podcast on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/womenincomedythepodcast Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/wicpodcastoz Like Jasmine and Thao on Facebook www.facebook.com/JasmineLangdon38/ and https://www.facebook.com/pages/Thao-Thanh-Cao/1507264242875083?fref=ts Twitter @JasLangdon38 and @Thao_Thanh_Cao Find us on Itunes, subscribe and give us a review! https://itunes.apple.com/au/podcast/women-in-comedy-the-podcast/id992781966

2 November, 2001. A worried scientist, working alone in his laboratory, has finally isolated the perfect pitch, but he's beginning to become concerned about the purpose of “Project CIA.” His doubts have come too late, however, as a familiar figure enters the lab and a struggle ensues. Some time later, Yolande Benstead is woken by a hammering at her door; a bedraggled, terrified figure has stumbled to her home through the storm, and he has no idea who he is... Synopsis (drn: 56'42") Following the recent , Sarah and Josh have decided they need a holiday, and thus they're off to Romania to look up an old friend of Sarah's. As Josh tries to overcome his fear of flight, Sarah admits to him that she's finally taken the step of selling her aunt's house and market garden in . Juno Baker sorted out the details, the money has been deposited into her “Marie Samuels” account, and her belongings are waiting to be unpacked in her new flat, which used to belong to . But all that can wait; now she and Josh are on their way to a small town in Romania, where Yolande Benstead retired when her brand of journalism became too controversial for her nervous editors. As it happens, the village is currently hosting an international peace conference, and Sarah wants to see this historic event first-hand. Sarah and Josh take a taxi to Yolande's home, a creepy Carpathian chateau which Josh compares to something out of Scooby-Doo. Yolande is delighted to see Sarah again, and after Josh and Sarah get unpacked and settle in, dinner is served and Sarah and Yolande catch up. There are no televisions in the house; Yolande is too far out to get a good signal, and she keeps abreast of the news via the papers and an old wireless in one of the bedrooms. She lives alone apart from her servant “Dmitri”, who turned up on her doorstep six months ago with no memory. Yolande has tried to help him remember who he is, but she fears tat he's experienced something so traumatic that he may never remember what happened to him. She feels sure, however, that he is completely harmless. Sarah and Josh retire for the night in separate rooms, but Josh tells Sarah to give him a shout if anything spooky happens. Sarah scoffs and retires to her room, which comes complete with a stuffed grizzly bear and the old wireless set which Yolande mentioned. However, her sleep is broken when the clock strikes three by an eerie, low-pitched hum, and by the terrifying shrieks and wails of a spectral apparition. Josh arrives to find Sarah screaming hysterically, and as she recovers, she claims to have seen a ghost... The next day dawns bright and sunny, but Sarah is still shaken and can't believe she actually saw a ghost. She tries to snap out of her mood by going for a walk around the village with the grumbling Josh. Meanwhile, Yolande speaks with Dmitri and tries again to find out who he is, but he seems particularly agitated today and insists that he can remember nothing. All he knows is that something unbearable happened to him -- and last night he hears a sound which he believes he's heard before. Josh and Sarah split up upon reaching the village; Sarah wants to explore the town, but Josh just wants a pint after the exhausting three-mile hike. Sarah finds her way to a local museum, where she meets another expatriate Brit, Christian Ian Abbotly. Abbotly won't or can't tell her what he does for a living, leading her to conclude he's involved with the peace conference in some way, but he does offer her his business card and invite her to share a cup of coffee. While Sarah spends a pleasant afternoon in Abbotly's company, Josh catches a taxi back to the house and finds Dmitri helping Yolande with the gardening. He also tries to find out what Dmitri knows about last night's strange events, but gets no further than Yolande; however, he does get the strong impression that Dmitri is hiding something, perhaps even from himself. That night, Yolande invites two more friends to dinner: Jack McElroy, the American delegate to the peace conference, and his young wife Candy. The five of them spend a very pleasant evening together, and it's well past midnight by the time Jack and Candy take their leave. Candy is devoted to her husband, and Sarah considers him a very lucky man. But that night his luck runs out. As the clock strikes three, Sarah sees the same apparitions she did the previous night, but this time they're not quite as terrifying as before... but in the McElroy's home, Candy is literally frightened to death while preparing for bed. The next day, Sarah and Josh learn of Candy's death. Jack is in a state of shock, and Sarah, furious, vows to learn the truth. Sarah and Josh return to Yolande's home, where Yolande is trying to calm the agitated Dmitri; last night, he actually managed to write something down on a piece of paper, until the sounds came and frightened the memory out of him again. Yolande finally admits to Sarah that things like this have been going on for months, but she's wary of investigating; even after spending six years in the village, she is still regarded as an outsider, and if she calls in the police because she's seen a ghost, she'll never be accepted. This is the real reason she invited Sarah to stay with her. Sarah and Josh return to the village to investigate, and while there Josh meets Abbotly. He doesn't get along with the smug ex-pat and retreats to the bar, but Sarah accepts Abbotly's invitation to dinner. Abbotly excuses himself as Josh returns with further information; it seems that quite a few delegates have seen apparitions similar to those which killed Candy, and the conference is being disrupted as a result. Is the entire village haunted? Sarah decides to get positive proof one way or the other, and has Josh wire up her bedroom with audio and video recording equipment. Yolande is reluctant to risk Sarah's life, but allows her to try this experiment anyway. That night at 3 a.m. the apparitions return, and this time Josh and Yolande see them as well when they burst into Sarah's room to rescue her. Thunder rolls as they flee to safety, while elsewhere in the house, the terrified Dmitri is confronted by a very familiar figure. Yolande hears something like a muffled thunderclap and investigates, to find that Dmitri has been shot and killed. The next day, Josh finds that the video equipment has burned out; they'll need to rent another player to find out what's been recorded. In the meantime, Sarah has another lead; Dmitri's murder definitely implies he's involved with whatever's happening, and before he died he wrote down the name of a university department. Josh and Sarah drive to the university, where they finally learn Dmitri's true identity; he was once known as Doctor Mikhail Berberova, and he was a professor in the physics department. Sarah and Josh question the department head, Professor Vodancski, who is shocked to learn of Berberova's death. Berberova was doing brilliant work in the field of sonics until he vanished two years ago, apparently resigning his position to work on a top-secret project which he referred to in his notes as “Project CIA”. Josh can't quite believe what he's become involved with, but for Sarah the pieces are starting to fit together. When she and Josh return and play back the video from last night, Sarah isn't surprised to find that there's nothing unusual on the tape; the spectres which so terrified her, Josh and Yolande simply weren't there. Ordering Josh and Yolande to call the police if anything happens to her, Sarah prepares to keep a dinner date -- but first she and Josh pay one more visit to Jack McElroy to see if Sarah's suspicions are justified. In the room where Candy died, Sarah finds an old radio receiver, just like the wireless set in her own guest room. Sarah visits Abbotly at his home, and questions him about the peace conference, claiming that she's heard it's not going as smoothly as hoped. Abbotly evades her questions and leaves to fetch some more wine, and as soon as he's gone Sarah searches the room -- and finds a tape with Berberova's voice, a record of his notes and his personal doubts about Project CIA. Abbotly catches Sarah listening to the tape and holds her at gunpoint, admitting that he's been using Berberova's work to disrupt the peace conference but refusing to tell her who he's working for. As Sarah suspected, Berberova had isolated certain low-frequency electromagnetic fields which affected people's perceptions, creating the illusion of supernatural visitations and generating fear within their minds. Once his work was complete, Abbotly turned the ghost-wave on him, and eventually murdered him to keep him silent. He now prepares to shoot Sarah, but at the last moment Josh arrives, overpowers him and seizes the gun. Like Sarah, he worked out the truth when he realised that “CIA” stood for “Christian Ian Abbotly.” Sarah survived despite the old radio receiver in her room because Yolande's house was too far out to receive a strong signal. With Jack's guidance, the delegates agree to resume the conference after some time off; Abbotly's mysterious employers have failed to disrupt the cause of international peace.

Introduction: Why Read the Old Testament? We are looking this morning at Genesis 12:10-20. Last week, we studied one of the more famous passages of scripture in the Old Testament, the call of Abram from Ur of the Chaldeans to the Promised Land, and the statement that, "Through him, all peoples on earth will be blessed." The ancient origin of modern missions is right there and a very famous passage. This morning we study one of the more obscure passages of the Old Testament which brings to us the question, why would we want to preach on Genesis 12:10-20, and the larger question, why read the Old Testament at all? Why should we read the Old Testament historical narratives that cover some of the more obscure events of the lives of people that we know only from scripture? Why do the comings and goings of some kind of a nomad who lived 4,000 years ago, who lived in tents, dwelled near the Negev, went through a famine and traveled down to Egypt, why would that matter for us today? We are a modern people, we don't live in tents and we work in air-conditioned stone, glass and concrete buildings. We use the internet, we drive to and from work, as long as gas prices aren't too high, and we will continue to do so. But we live in a modern world, so why would the events of 4,000 years ago matter for us today? Why spend an entire message on a seemingly insignificant event in the life of a patriarch who lived four millennia ago? Well, my first answer to that is a simple one, it's because it's God's word. And if God thought it should be included in Scripture, it's worth considering, it's worth meditating on, for Scripture testifies about itself. It says in 2 Timothy 3:6 that, "All scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training in righteousness." We come to this Scripture as God-breathed, God-given, actually exhaled by God, that we might understand it. The second reason for considering this passage carefully this morning is that it will, I think, set a pattern for how we handle the Old Testament from here on out, and perhaps will give you some insights into how you can handle the Old Testament as you read it for yourself. Whenever I come to an Old Testament historical narrative, I ask three questions that will form the outline of the message this morning. The first question I ask is, "What does this passage say about human nature and what can I learn about humanity from reading it?" The second question, what does it say about God's nature? What does it say about what He is like? Those two questions came to me from considering John Calvin's statement at the beginning of the Institutes of the Christian Religion in which he says, "Nearly all the wisdom we possess, that is to say, true and sound wisdom, consists in two parts: The knowledge of God and of ourselves." So those first two questions, I think, come from that statement and are reasonable. We're going to learn about ourselves, about humanity, and we're going to learn about God. What does it say about humanity? Secondly, what does it teach me about God? The third question, how does this passage fit into God's redemptive plan for the world? Those are the three questions I ask with an Old Testament historical narrative, and they are good for you to keep in mind as well. Now, my basic approach on the first question is that, yes, it's true that we wear different clothing, and it's true that we enjoy air-conditioning, drive cars and use the internet, and all that. All of those things are true. We are a modern people, but I believe that essentially, we are the same. The same things that they struggle with, we struggle with. And as we see the character issues unfolding, issues of faith or faithlessness, issues of courage or fear and cowardice, issues of marital purity or impurity, these issues are the same things we face today, and so people have not changed as much as we think they have. Second of all, I know that Scripture tells me that God never changes. And so, anything I can learn about God and His dealings with man 4,000 years ago, is exactly the same today. Now, it doesn't mean He will deal with us in the same way. God deals with different people according to the dictates of His wisdom and His plan, but God's essential nature and His character never changes. And so anything I can learn about man, about humanity from 4,000 years ago, it's probably still true today. And anything I can learn about God and His essential nature is definitely still true today. And thirdly, I just want to know what His plan is, I want to see it unfolding. As we study the life of Abram, we're going to see the unfolding redemptive plan of God. Setting the Story in Context Abram’s Call Already Made Now, as we set the story in context, we see already the call has been made in Abram's life in Genesis 12:1-3. Look at that again, if you would. It says, "The Lord had said to Abram, 'Leave your country, your people and your father's household and go to the land I will show you. I will make you into a great nation and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.'" Abram’s Faith Already Displayed Abram's faith has already been displayed at one level. He had faith enough to leave Ur of the Chaldees, he had faith enough to leave his father, Terah, and the land of Haran, finally to separate from him and go on, on his own. He had faith enough to enter the Promised Land, and in verse 7, to receive the promise concerning the Promised Land. Look again at verse 7, "The LORD appeared to Abram and said, ‘To your offspring I will give this land.’ So, he built an altar there to the LORD, who had appeared to him." Already we've seen his faith on display as he began to call on the name of the Lord, in verse 8, it says, "From there he went on toward the hills east of Bethel and pitched his tent, with Bethel on the west and Ai on the east. There he built an altar to the LORD and called on the name of the LORD." And already we see him living in tents by faith like a nomad in the land of the Negev, in the Promised Land. Abram’s Faith and God’s Redemptive Plan Challenged However, Abram's faith is immature, and God's redemptive plan is yet to be fully unfolded and both the faith and the redemptive plan receive a very stiff challenge here in the second half of Genesis 12. Lessons in Human Nature Now, as we look at this, the second half, let's look at some lessons concerning human nature. What can we learn about humanity from these verses? The Amazing Power of Female Beauty Look at verse 11, "As he was about to enter Egypt, he said to his wife, Sarai, 'I know what a beautiful woman you are.'" And so, the first lesson that I want to take from this is the amazing power of female beauty. I knew I would get your attention, as you're all looking up, what am I going to say about this? Well, Sarai had an astonishing physical beauty, astonishing in that she is at least 65 years old at this point, if not 70, probably more like 70. Many descriptions of her beauty abound, but this is one of the clearest. As a matter of fact, Sarai's physical beauty is the hinge, humanly speaking, around this, on which this whole story pivots. It really is the focal point. If she were not so physically attractive, the events would not have happened the way they did. And so, this is really a kind of central theme in this section. Female physical beauty is a major theme in the Book of Genesis. For example, when God brings Eve to Adam, you really have to know something of Hebrew poetry to know it isn't just a straight statement he makes when he says in Genesis 2:23, "This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called ’woman,’ for she was taken out of man." He is really excited and burst into poetry. The first thing he says is a poem when he sees his wife and she is delightful to him and beautiful. We have also seen female physical beauty at the core of the rebellion that led eventually to the flood. Depending on how you interpret Genesis 6:2, "the sons of God." Some think they were angels and some think they were just mighty powerful kings, but either way, physical beauty was at the core of it. The sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful and they married any of them they chose. Clearly, that was a major issue concerning the flood, because shortly thereafter, God resolves to bring a flood on the earth and this is going to come up again and again in the Book of Genesis. For example, Rebekah, who eventually will be Isaac's wife, is said to be beautiful. In Genesis 24:16, "The girl was very beautiful, a virgin; no man had ever lain with her. She went down to the spring, filled her jar and came up again." Her physical beauty was enough to mention and made it into the text. And again, we see it with Rachel, who will be Jacob's wife, one of his two wives. In Genesis 29:17, it says of Leah that she had weak eyes, but Rachel was lovely in form, and beautiful. And not just in the Book of Genesis, but throughout the Old Testament, for example, Esther's physical beauty was a major feature in that story. If she were not as beautiful, I think she would not have been chosen as queen, as pointed out in that story. It is openly discussed in the book Song of Solomon, in which the king is just praising his wife for her physical beauty. Now, I find the descriptions interesting, and I'm not going to read them all, but in Song of Solomon 4:1, for example, "How beautiful you are, my darling! Oh, how beautiful! Your eyes behind your veil are doves. Your hair is like a flock of goats descending from Mount Gilead." So, try that husbands with your wives and see what they say. They may be blessed by it, they may not, but try it. But at any rate, if that doesn't work, then find something to praise about your wife, but the physical beauty is a major theme in the book of Song of Solomon. And then in Song of Solomon 7:5, it says, "Your head crowns you like Mount Carmel. Your hair is like royal tapestry; the king is held captive by its tresses." Now it's a very interesting expression. Basically, you've chained me up with your beauty and therein lies the power of female physical beauty. It's a power to hold in thrall, in thrall means in chains, the attention of a man, and so it's a major theme here. Sarai's physical beauty openly stated in verse 11, "I know what a beautiful woman you are.” This Hebrew phrase literally means beautiful to look at, outward beauty, physical appearance, especially in the face. And it's stated again in verses 14 and 15, "When Abram came to Egypt, the Egyptians saw that she was a very beautiful woman. And when Pharaoh's officials saw her, they praised her to Pharaoh, and she was taken into his palace." Sarai's physical beauty was so astounding that it became in effect the talk of the land. It started out just with commoners, as they saw. He was just coming basically as a refugee because of the famine, and it became the topic of conversation. Someone heard of it in the court and praised her to Pharaoh, and next thing she knows, she's drafted into his harem. It doesn't say anything about the harem, but I imagine that Pharaoh already had a number of wives, as was the custom among pagan kings of the time. And so in the spirit of the age, the tyrant King Pharaoh, says, "She's beautiful, I'll take her." And she comes into his harem. And therefore, physical beauty is a powerful force in the Bible and in human experience. I'm going to say more about this topic later in the application section, but this is one thing I learned, and it hasn't changed, it continues to be an issue even to this day. Proper and Improper Views of Marriage Secondly, we see concerning human nature, proper and improper views of marriage. Look at verses 11-15, "As he was about to enter Egypt, he said to his wife Sarai, 'I know what a beautiful woman you are. When the Egyptians see you, they will say, ‘This is his wife.” Then they will kill me but will let you live. Say you are my sister, so that I will be treated well for your sake and my life will be spared because of you.' When Abram came to Egypt, the Egyptians saw that she was a very beautiful woman. And when Pharaoh's officials saw her, they praised her to Pharaoh, and she was taken into his palace." Now, Abram should have been protecting his wife, in effect standing in front of her with her behind and he protecting her from the dangers that would come in this foreign land rather than the other way around, him standing behind her physical beauty, so that her beauty becomes his shield of protection. Abram was willing to put Sarai in harm's way to keep himself safe. Now, some commentators feel that Abram never intended it to go as far as it did, I think that's probably true. Probably he thought, when he says, "I will be treated well for your sake," that he could play a kind of con game. He could keep suitors at arm's length, they would bring him gifts, they would bribe him, they would try to get his attention and hers, and he say, "Well, we'll let you know next week. Don't call us. We'll call you." And just keep the thing going for as long as he needed to, and in this way, he would benefit greatly. I don't think he ever imagined that Pharaoh would get interested in her and probably went far beyond what he imagined. What a gamble Abram was willing to take with his own wife. God intended a husband to be willing to lay down his life to protect his wife, after the very pattern that Jesus Christ Himself set, where it says in Ephesians 5:25, "Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her." Abram had an improper view of marriage. Pharaoh also had an improper view of marriage. Almost certainly he intended Sarai to be one of his harems as I mentioned, and he knew nothing about her whatsoever other than her physical beauty. Now, physical beauty may be the spark that ignites some attention, but it's no firm foundation for a marriage. Pharaoh, however, didn't look at marriage the way a Christian should, namely the bonding of two godly people together for the advancement of the kingdom of heaven and for procreation, for the birth of Godly children, but rather he just looked on her as perhaps a vessel for his pleasure. She was pretty, and that was all that was required of the position of Pharaoh's wife, so he also had an improper view of marriage. God alone upholds the view of marriage in this text. Six times in the account, Sarai is called Abram's wife, lest you miss it. You should go through and count them again and again and again, she's called Abram's wife. No lie on Abram's part, no action or decree on Pharaoh's part can change that. She is his wife, and that's the end of the matter. God's judgment on Pharaoh and on his household shows the seriousness with which God upheld Abram's marriage. We'll speak more about this in a moment. Abram’s Moral Failing The third thing we notice about human nature comes from Abram's failings, his character flaws. We see five things in him, faithlessness, cowardice and fear, lack of love, deceit, and poor modeling. Now, it's somewhat with fear and trembling that any pastor would be pointing out the failings of a man like Abraham. When you think about where his faith eventually will lead him, he's willing to sacrifice his own son Isaac on the altar by faith, trusting God to raise him from the dead, then it's hard for us to even question this man. Yet, I believe that examples like this are given so that we can learn from their failings and from their moral weakness and be warned thereby and not do those same things. First, we see in Abram, faithlessness. At least this much is the case, God was able to keep Abram and Sarai with enough food during the famine so that they didn't need to leave the Promised Land. Remember that God called Abram to leave Ur of the Chaldees and go to the Promised Land. We have no word from the Lord that he is to depart the Promised Land right here and go to Egypt. In one sense, if he had trusted God enough to keep him in the famine, to find food for them during the famine, which God is abundantly able to do, he never would have gone to Egypt to begin with, and would have avoided this whole problem. But that's reading between the texts. At least this much, we know. He displays faithlessness in other ways. His fear shows a certain kind of faithlessness, doesn't it? God has already promised to Abram through his offspring, all peoples on earth would be blessed, his seed or his descendants will inherit this land. He has no seed. Now, think with me, doesn't that make him immortal until he gets the seed? Isn't it impossible for him to die until he has a child? And so, he should have trusted God enough to say, "Nothing's going to happen to me here. God's going to protect me. He's going to keep me safe." But instead, we see faithlessness and we see fear, very much like Jesus asleep in the back of the boat in the middle of a storm. I've talked about it before. How can He do that? How can Jesus be asleep in the heaving waves? Totally fearless in the middle of a storm because He trusted His Heavenly Father and knew His mission. Jesus didn't come to drown. He came to die on a cross. So, therefore, He could lay asleep in the back of the boat and say, "There's no way that God's going to let me drown. That's not why I came into the world." When He woke up, He said to His disciples, "You of little faith, why are you so afraid?" Abram's faith should have driven out his fear. And we do see his cowardice and his fear here. How unseemly it is for a man of God to be so craven and so fearful? How ugly for a patriarch like Abram to have beads of sweat on his upper lip and a quavering voice and a darting eye and a palpitating heart as he was about to cross the border into Egypt? We also see in Abram a lack of love. How ugly it is for the future father of nations to think so little of his wife as to put her in such a dangerous course, in a dangerous position. We see fourthly, of course, deceit, the one most obvious, "Say you are my sister." It's a little bit of a half-truth. We'll find out later in chapter 20, when this whole scene is replayed with Abimelech as Abram does it twice. We will talk about that in due time but we see his deceit, his lying, his trickery. And then we see also poor role modeling. He's setting an example for his wife and for his household, eventually for his own son, because Isaac is going to do this exact same trick in Genesis 26, like father, like son. It's not a good pattern that's set. How effective a witness could Abram be with all of the Egyptians he's going to meet if this whole presentation of them is a lie? Ill Gotten Gains A con game really whereby he can plunder them for wealth based on this lie concerning his wife, and he does get wealthy. You see the ill-gotten gains. What does he end up with? Look at verse 16, "Pharaoh treated Abram well for her sake, and Abram acquired sheep and cattle, male and female donkeys, menservants and maidservants, and camels." Camels. He got camels out of it. That's pretty good. I wonder how many camels he got for trading his wife. How could he lie in bed at night and think about those ill-gotten gains, what he was going to get and what he was going to do with all of these new camels? And so, it's just another example, I think, of biblical honesty concerning sin, even of its greatest heroes. To me, one of the greatest evidences of the Bible's truthfulness is how honestly it exposes the flaws of even its greatest heroes. Biblical Honesty About Human Sin The Bible hides nothing. For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God and are justified freely by His grace through Jesus Christ. Even Abraham, the forefather of faith, needed a savior and was, in his heart, a wicked man by the perfect and holy standards of heaven. Now, if that word “wicked” causes you to catch a little bit as we consider this great man, Abraham, understand I said by the standards of heaven. It was Paul himself that described the label to Abraham in context in Romans 4:5, "However, to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness." God’s Nature What does that mean for us? There's no one righteous. There's no one here in this sanctuary today, not the pastor, not the worship leader, not any in the choir, not any deacons or leaders or anybody in this room that's going to be able to stand before God based on their own righteousness. Every one of us has sinned. If a record like this were written of some of our worst days, too, how embarrassing and humiliating would it be? And these are the lessons I take from this text concerning human nature. What do we learn about God from this text? God’s Providence Well, first, we see God's providence. We see God acting very strongly and energetically in this matter. God is an active player in human history. He does not merely lay back or wait for things to happen. He is an active worker of His purposes. He controls the outcome for his own ends. Throughout the book of Genesis, we see God speaking, guiding, working, manipulating, judging, convicting, blessing. Again and again, He is guiding and navigating the ship of history. And so, is rebuked the false doctrine of deists that teach that God merely created the world and wound it up like a clock and it just runs on its own. God interferes with history. Benjamin Franklin, a noted deist, said this, "I imagine it great vanity in me to suppose that the Supremely Perfect does in the least regard such an inconsiderable nothing as man." Well, Benjamin Franklin, that sounds very pious. In effect, God is so mighty to be even giving me a single thought, but yet it is not the God of the Bible. For the God of the Bible is actively involved in the smallest details of your life. He knows the course of your decisions. He knows the track that you are following. And we see this, again and again, as God regularly interferes, if we can use that word, in events to turn them the way that He chooses. Now, what is God's providence? Well, one defined it this way. Providence is the almighty, everywhere present power of God, whereby, as it were by his hand, He still upholds heaven and earth with all creatures, and so, governs them that herbs and grass, rain and drought, fruitful and barren years, meat and drink, health and sickness, riches and poverty, indeed, all things come not by chance, but by His fatherly hand. And that includes the famine that led Abram and Sarai out of the Promised Land to begin with. It was under God's hand that had occurred, providence of God. God is actively involved in your life. Nothing that's happening to you right now is happening by chance, but God is sovereign and rules over all things for His glory. God’s Purity Secondly, we see God's purity. We've already covered this somewhat, but we see it in the way He upheld Abram's marriage. We've already pointed out that Abram and Pharaoh had a faulty view of marriage, but God did not. Upholding Abram's marriage, even when Abram did not. You see, God never forgets that marriage was intended to be a picture of Christ and the church. He never forgets that. And so it says in Ephesians 5:31 and 32, "For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh. This is a profound mystery-- but I am talking about Christ and the church.” You see, God never forgets that. He knows very well what marriage is. Our society is getting a little confused, isn't it? We're starting to wonder what marriage is. I listened to a secular radio station recently as they were discussing the events concerning gay marriage up in Massachusetts and it occurred to me that they don't have the first idea how to define marriage. They don't know how to define it and apart from God telling us what it's for, we can't define it. I challenge you to give a good definition of marriage that will sustain this onslaught and stand up in court, have nothing to do with the Scripture or not come down from God himself. You can't do it. If you throw out God's right to define what marriage is, you end up with a morass, a sea of uncertainty, and anything goes. I hope it doesn't happen in this country, but you can see it's already starting to happen. Anything goes. But God is pure in his understanding of marriage, and He knows that it means one man and one woman, one flesh, a picture of Christ and the church. God’s Punishment Thirdly, we see God's punishment chastening Pharaoh's house. God's clearest act in this whole account, is his striking of Pharaoh with a withering disease. The word in the Hebrew, usually translated as leprosy, and it could be that there was at least some leprosy, a dread disease perhaps, of the skin or something like that. God's action here is much more serious than He will act in Genesis 20 with Abimelech, as we'll see in due time. But we see God's punishment as he reaches out and interferes and brings a judgment on Pharaoh for taking another man's wife. God’s Patience We see also God's patience in putting up with Abram's weakness. Aren't you glad that God does not deal with us as our sins deserve? Aren't you glad that He waits patiently for us to repent? Aren't you glad that He's willing to bear with our weakness and our failing and not throw us out the first time we make a mistake? Praise God for that. Think about Pentecost, God did not throw out Peter, even though he denied Jesus three times, but used him mightily. Now, this is no excuse for sin, but at the same time, we rejoice in the patience of God in putting up with Abram and with all of us as we sin. God’s Protection We see God's protection setting a wall around Abram and Sarai. This is a remarkable thing. The devil, speaking of Job said he couldn’t get at him and asked God., “Have you not put a hedge around him and everything he has?” Satan could not get to Job. Exactly, exactly. And neither will Satan get to any of us except with God's permission. God alone permits the things that come to you and He has put a wall of protection on Abram. How do you see that? Well, let me ask you a question. How in the world did Abram and Sarai get out of Egypt with all of the stuff they plundered from them? I mean, what are the odds that Pharaoh didn't just give an order and have Abram killed, take Sarai into the harem and be done with it? And yet, God sovereignly protects Abram and his possessions. He even gets to keep the ill-gotten gains. Now, we learned a bad lesson from it and say, "Hey, that's a good scam." but just do that again with Abimelech in Chapter 20. I mean, you get wealthy that way. Well, that's not what it was meant for, but God did put a hedge of protection around him. And Abram should have trusted in that protection when he went into Egypt, rather than hiding behind his wife for his protection. His wife was not a shield, God was a shield. God saw to it that Abram and Sarai and everything he had be protected, as with a wall, until he got out of Egypt--an amazing thing. And so, we've learned lessons also concerning the nature of God. Lessons in God’s Redemptive Plan Eternal Plan Now, what about God's redemptive plan? Well, first of all, God's plan is an eternal plan and no changes are possible. God is not going to permit somebody other than Abram and his seed to be the one through whom all peoples on earth will be blessed. It's going to be Abram. And before the foundation of the world, God had worked out this plan. God had ordained to call Abraham to be the father of the Jews. Like Jesus said to the Samaritan woman at the well, salvation is from the Jews so the Savior would have a Jewish genealogy. God ordained that and nothing was going to change His plan. God's plan was perfectly worked out before the foundation of the world. The prophet Isaiah put it this way in Isaiah 14:26-27, "This is the plan determined for the whole world; this is the hand stretched out over all nations. For the Lord Almighty has purposed, and who can thwart Him? His hand is stretched out, and who can turn it back?" That is the sovereign power of God. His plan is an eternal plan, no changes are possible. Declared Plan Secondly, His is a declared plan. He's unfolded it to Abraham, to Abram at this point. Leave your country and your people and your father's household and go to the land I will show you. I will make you into a great nation, and I will bless you. I will make your name great and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you, I will curse. And all peoples on earth will be blessed through you. Abram already knew that God had planned, from eternity past, to bless all peoples on earth through him. He also knew that he would do this through standard biological multiplication. He would have a child. "To your offspring I will give this land.” in verse 7. And so, the end goal of worldwide blessing was already clearly revealed. Unfolding Plan Thirdly, however, this is an unfolding plan. Not everything in God's redemptive plan was clear at this point. We know some things but other things we don't know, and so the thing is going to unfold. It's only partially understood. Abraham would come to understand that, in Genesis 13, his offspring would inherit the land, he already knew that, but they would be as numerous as the dust on the Earth. Well, that was something new. And then in Genesis 15, they would be like the stars in the sky, so shall your offspring be. And then the covenant. He tells him in Genesis 15, the exact extent of the Promised Land, “…I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates…” and to the Great Sea. And so, he unfolds it. And then in Genesis 17, He gives them the covenant of circumcision. That's something new. It's an unfolding plan. And then in Genesis 18, specifically that it would be through Sarah that the descendant would be born and that he would come in a year's time. You remember when Sarah laughed when she heard that, but it was true. God had ordained it would be through Sarah. So this is in an unfolding redemptive plan. God has already declared the end, all nations on earth will be blessed. But step by step, he starts to unfold His redemptive plan. It's an unfolding or a partially revealed plan. Opposed Plan Fourth, it's an opposed plan. The devil nowhere appears here, but I see the devil's work all over this thing. The devil's going to oppose everything that God tries to do. He's heard already what God's promised to Abram. He knows the promise, and he's going to try what he can to put a wedge between him and Sarah. He's going to try to break apart their family and their home. He's going to try to destroy it in some way, muddy the waters, stir things up, maybe even get Abraham killed if he can. And so, this is an opposed plan. He's going to fight it every step of the way, but he will fail. He will fail because God has ordained that all peoples on earth will be represented at the throne and before the lamb. Revelations 7:9-10, "After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. And they cried out in a loud voice: ‘Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb.’" The devil is going to fail, but he's going to fight, isn't he? He's going to try to oppose Abraham and his seed every step of the way, to try to snip the genealogical line, if he can. It's an opposed plan. Prophetic Plan And finally, it's a prophetic plan. One little aspect of this is very interesting to me. God prophesies or predicts the future in two different ways. There's verbally predictive prophecy, such as, "Through you all nations on earth will be blessed," or, "To your descendants, I will give this land." That's just something God says straight out and that's the way it is. But then there's what we call typically, or type-prediction prophecy, in which certain things are acted out in history. In their acting out, they pre-figure something that's going to come later. And so, Abram and Sarai leaving Egypt is a picture of the Exodus later on. If you think about it, God, in a way, calls Israel His bride. He does that in Jeremiah, "Like a bride, you followed me." And he loved. And there's that love relationship between God and His people. Alright? And He's rescuing his wife out of Pharaoh's household by means of these plagues that come on Pharaoh. And as they come out, they plunder the Egyptians and carry all these possessions and they go out. It's a picture of the exodus, a little miniature one, but a picture of it nonetheless. And so, we see it's a prophetic plan. Application Well, how should we apply this? We've looked this morning at three aspects of this Old Testament narrative. What have we learned about man? And we've seen that. We've seen what we can learn about the unchanging God that we worship. We've seen something of His redemptive plan and how it's unfolding and being fulfilled. How do we apply this across 4,000 years to us today? Well, let's start with the first thing that we learned about human nature, namely godly stewardship of physical beauty. Feminine beauty is a great gift from God and a powerful influence as we've seen in Biblical history, but feminine beauty can also be a dangerous thing. Such power wielded in the hands of a godless woman can destroy a man. We see that in the Bible, don't we? We see Samson brought low by his love for Delilah's beauty. We see Solomon brought low by foreign wives. We see David brought low and humiliated by his lust for a woman who bathed out in the open, named Bathsheba. We see Amnon ruining his life because of his lust for his half-sister Tamar. We see Herod inflamed by lust for a dancing girl order the execution of John the Baptist, the very thing he didn't want to do. And so we see the incredible power there of feminine beauty. As much of an issue as it was back in biblical days, it may even more so be one today, because of the technology for spreading images and pictures all over the world. There are whole industries that exist to enhance the physical beauty of a woman. Do you know how much money is spent on cosmetics worldwide in a year? I was shocked by this, $112 billion. The number one cosmetic purchasing nation on earth is America, Japan is second. So whole industries exist for enhancing feminine beauty, but there are also whole industries that exist for exploiting feminine beauty as well. Have you ever noticed in the magazine racks at the supermarket how many of them show just the picture of a woman on the cover? Whether she's dressed in an honorable way or not, there's a woman on the cover. Why? Because of the ability of a beautiful woman to attract attention, to gain attention, to catch your eye and to hold it. And this is the reason that they choose this. And so, this is a very powerful force. Therefore, a godly woman recognizes the power of her physical beauty and refuses to be a stumbling block to her Christian brother or sister. Some forms of dress are openly designed to flaunt and to exploit and expose feminine beauty. Some styles are called hot or alluring, or flattering, or enticing, or perhaps even just sexy. I guess I would urge each Christian woman listening to me today to ask some questions of herself. Question number one, what is my motive for selecting this style? Why am I choosing this? Secondly, what am I trying to accomplish by wearing this? Thirdly, is it possible that this style could actually lead a Christian brother to stumble into lust? Ask those questions. Remember God's definition of feminine beauty in 1 Peter 3:3-6, "Your beauty should not come from outward adornment, such as braided hair or the wearing of gold jewelry or fine clothes. Instead, it should be that of your inner self, the unfading beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is of great worth in God's sight." This is the way the godly women of the past who put their hope in God used to make themselves beautiful. They were submissive to their own husbands. Like Sarah, who obeyed Abraham and called him her master. You are her daughters if you do what is right and do not give way to fear. Now, I think one of the great problems with this emphasis on external physical beauty is that a woman can be made to feel less and less worthy as she ages and loses some of her youthful, physical beauty. I believe, according to 1 Peter 3 and the Scriptural emphasis on the internal godly, humble beauty of a spiritual woman, that you can be even more beautiful at age 95 in a nursing home, laying on your bed praying for evangelization of the nations or praying for your church or your family to walk with God. You could be even more beautiful then, than you ever were at age 25. Now, that's unheard of in the way we think in America. You think the older you get, the less beautiful you are, but it's exactly the opposite. You, as a woman, can become more and more and more beautiful if you understand beauty, biblically. Concerning the men, realize it's not just the women that need to watch over this issue, but the men also need to guard their eyes. It says in Job 31:1, "I made a covenant with my eyes not to look lustfully at a girl.” And so. on both ends of the street, there needs to be help. The Christian ladies need to be careful about what they wear. I'm not saying in any way that we should go to the extreme that the Muslims go in covering up the women entirely. I remember I wanted to get pictures of Muslim women when I was in Pakistan. The only way I could do it without getting assaulted and arrested is by taking a picture of a friend of mine, and then they would be walking across the street over the guy's shoulder so I could take pictures. There's an extremism there that is evil. Nor do I believe that 1 Peter 3 says that women should never braid their hair or wear jewelry. I don't think the Bible teaches that either. It's just that's not the source of your beauty because those things can be taken away but an internal godly beauty can never be taken away. Secondly, a godly view of marriage. Husbands are to love their wives as Christ loved the church. Don't follow Abram's example in this. Rather, you be out in front protecting your wife, not hiding behind her and let your trust in the promises of God be the physical, as it were, and even spiritual shield for your wife. Understand marriage the way God did. Understand that He considers her your wife, and He considers him your husband, if you're husband or wife. Thirdly, let faith drive out fear. It could be that some of you are facing something you're afraid of today. I guarantee that there's some promise of God that your trust in, will drive out that fear. If you would trust God concerning the promises, fear goes away. That's why Jesus was able to sleep in the boat, and you can, too. And finally, trusting in God's unfolding redemptive plan. God has a plan for your life. He has a plan for the church, He has a plan for the nations, and He is unfolding that right now. And we're not done being saved, are we? God's continuing to work out His salvation in us, as we follow him through obedience, through sanctification, through putting sin to death, walking in a godly and upright way. Trust in God's redemptive plan. Trust in the fact that God sent Jesus to die on the cross for sins just like we've read about in this chapter today, and whatever sins there are in your life. Trust in Christ and in Him alone as your righteousness, and you will never be put to shame. Not today, not in the future, not even on judgment day.

Lauren shares her philosophy on why she sold her wedding dress and why it's time to normalize selling wedding dresses. Chan discusses adventures in camping as a New York City resident. After hearing Lauren's unshackled thoughts on the Vanderpump Rules reunion part two last week, it's Chan's turn to give her take. The gals get into Taylor Swift and Matty Healy's breakup and the purpose they believe Matty played in Taylor's life. They discuss Natalie Portman's husband, Benjamin Millipied, having an affair with a 25 year old climate activist and discuss some hard truths about men who have character and fidelity flaws. Finally, they cover upcoming travel mini episodes and the two podcasts that they are loving right now!***If you love this podcast, please hit follow or subscribe! Share your favorite episodes on your Instagram stories! Help us grow!MERCH IS HERE! Click here to check out our limited drop of Work Soft hoodies and hats. Get yours before they're gone!To support the show on Patreon and access our 100+ bonus episodes, including our Royal's Deep Dive, click here!Please note this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.TRANSCRIPT [00:00:00] Before we start this episode, please, everyone follow pubs wherever you're listening to this podcast. So if it's on Spotify, it's on Apple Podcasts. Either follow or subscribe, wherever that button is. It'll make sure you get episodes as they come out, and it'll really help us with our downloads, like we need everyone to please do this.then if you like what you hear today, share it on your Instagram stories and tag us. We're forever grateful.if you're feeling like Mother Teresa, or extremely generous, please leave us a five star review if you also feel called to that.Yes. All right, and with that, let's get to the episode.Okay. Well, well, well, welcome to another episode of Pop Apologist Chandler. It's been a minute. yes, I miss last week's Patreon, but I think that was [00:01:00] actually for the best because you were able to be unshackled and unsheathed and unhinged, truly, in the best way. I listened to it yesterday while coming on from work dying Laughing. I just honestly feel like you maybe, I don't know if you took a drug before, I don't know if you, so Kagan was like green light, green light, and then you pop something and then you recorded,Green light. Green light. Chandler's not gonna be on this recording. Here's your medication.Literally like, I don't know, whatever you took, keep taking it because it was so good. So anyways,good for businessit's, it's good for business. Seriously. performance. Enhancingdrugs are permitted on Ologists. thank you so much. That's so nice. it did feel so good to be unshackled from, you know, any sort of censorship in and just allow our listeners to bathe in my stream of thought. gross. I hope everyone enjoyed, that [00:02:00] episode.It was truly unhinged. I did call you after and we had like a moment where you were like, what did you say? But let's move forward.yeah, you were very excited about how much you were able to say, the episode wasn't, I don't know. I didn't find it to be as inflammatory as I nervously thought it was going to be. So I think what it was is it was just your most enraged stream of consciousness, which I, found to be refreshing.I like to bathe in it.to be honest with you, I was also just like unafraid to really just say really weird shit and like pull in quotes from random people and say what really felt true to my soul about the Vanderpump reunion part two. So anyway, I'm excited to what.What struck me about that episode, was really you putting your philosophy degree to good work, making your professors and, cohorts proud because you were, pulling in, Plato's Cave and, you know, other, other nods and illusions, to, you know, really unpack the [00:03:00] Vanderpump Rules part two reunion.And I just thought about how proud you must make all your professors.It got biblical. Okay. There was ancient wisdom expressed in that reunion. but I also had moments of true stupidity where I couldn't remember about the cult war. Okay, you couldn't remember like Gorbachev, I don't even actually know if that's the way you say that person's name, but I even know who Gorbachov was. Bring down the wall. even remember the president who said it? it was a fugue state episode, so everyone needs to listen to it. Quick note on Gorbachev, mom would always talk about that moment of like bringing down thewall and like she would get very like emotional. So I have a very emotional tie to that as well, through her, through osmosis. but I, I was not a proud or present. So it's shocking that you didn't rememberlet's Move forward to today's episode.Chandler, I have an exciting update for you. You ready? a personal update.A personal update.Okay.I have sold officially my wedding dress[00:04:00] Are you getting divorce? thankfully, no, I did not fire, sell it out of spite. but I sold my wedding dress and I want to normalize selling wedding dresses because as a bride, I found the shopping process for wedding dresses to be extremely daunting.Yep.You look down at price tags and you're like, what? it's inconceivable. It's unimaginable. And so for me, the way I justified the price of my wedding dress was I was like, all right, whatever. I'm just gonna sell it when I'm done. and I want to share this philosophy in case it brings some, some sort of peace to brides as they're shopping for wedding dresses.They can, you know, spring for the one they really want, knowing that they will. give it to another bride once they're done, Mm-hmm. or just kind of like normalize, you know, not feeling like you have to hang onto it forever. So these are my, philosophical points about selling your wedding dress.Okay.Buckling in.First of all, I think that your [00:05:00] wedding dress is meant to be ephemeral, something for the moment. And I think there's something really beautiful about, instead of having it sit in a box, just taking up space in your garage, in your storage area, in a room, in your house, in your closet, letting it go.Have a second life. Like letting it go get worn by someone who will equally adore it. Second of all, Okay. wedding dress stored in a home, puts unnecessary pressure on the daughters in that home. It's like someone's gotta make use out of this wedding generations, it becomes their trauma.becomes their burden to bear And. I also think that the styles are gonna change.Your daughter's not gonna wear your wedding dress. Your granddaughter is definitely not going to, that is like a one in a million chance. So anyway, I think that is a very stew point if I do say so myself. Well, also, best case scenario is that it becomes raw materials for [00:06:00] like a new dress. It gets cut up and you know, sewn into something completely different,But again, that puts so much pressure on like all the future brides in your family. Mom literally growing up, she would tell me, she would would tell us if your mother-in-law ever is like, brings you her dress and is like, I would love for you to wear this. She's like, here's your excuse.You're gonna say, I always dreamed of the day where I'm gonna shop for my dress with my mom. mom. Like pre-programmed this Yeah. I don't remember that, but I believe that that happened.So anyway, I just think that is another point. And then finally, I wanted to transform my wedding dress into something that can be actually worn every day.So I wanted to take the money and purchase something like a piece of jewelry, something that I it's with me all the time. and so now I'm so excited because I'm like dreaming and fantasizing about what I'm going to, potentially purchase with this money, it's gonna be my dress, like on my wrist or on my finger or whatever.[00:07:00] So are my thoughts and you know what? Come at me if you disagree and we can hold a debate.I loved those points. I think they all check out for me. you told me about selling your wedding dress and, you know, it definitely gave me a lot of faith and hope for, that future day for myself, because I realized I don't have to like, basically lose a bunch of money in the wedding dress endeavor.Hundred percent. Absolutely not. You can also, by the way, get one that's pre-owned and you can give it a second life. Right. Two questions for you. How much of your wedding dress costs were you able to recoup? You don't have to say how much your dress was and how much you sold it for, but how much? I don't know how to add or subtract. So I'm getting out my calculator and it's gonna take me a second cuz I'm not even sure I know how toSo what you're gonna do mountain you sold your wedding dress for. You're gonnaI got 61% of the value back Wow. Okay. That's amazing. and that's with all your self [00:08:00] tanner staining it, right? Chandler, it is 8:00 AM Okay. You are awake this morning. I think 61% is a staggering. resellvalue. anyway, that, that is, Something I wanted to share. Thank you. with you? as you spoke about, I've been very, very busy at work. and I don't even know if I have the emotional bandwidths to unpack that, but I will say that I, am hopefully going to be in a better spot in about a month from now. Um, so I'm looking forward to that. I did not get laid off.I'll just tell everyone that. I was not under, you know, extreme work dress because I got laid off. and I ended up going camping this weekend just to, you know, put a cherry on top of my, already hectic week. you going camping when you live in a New York City is a special kind of hell because you don't have the storage space for camping gear.So you essentially have to, Bag steal, borrow rent by, Amazon [00:09:00] rent. Um, I wish Ben AB buyed by more of the Amazon rental policy, but he doesn't. He, went to r e I and, treated himself.I will say that he told me that he bought a two-person sleeping bag, which I thought was cute and cozy. And, we head out on our first night of camping and you know, it's 1:00 AM by the time we get back to our, little tent. And he unfurls what is a one person sleeping bag.  a grave error had been made at r e I, you know, a huge oversight and blunder on his part.and I just kind of stared in disbelief. I was just kind of likeI'm that I've had. Right. I almost went full mom after everything I've done for you after the day that I've had. anyways, he's overhearing me, you know, rake him over the coals for this mistake. But it was a grave error and I just kind of was like, I can't believe, am I gonna have to go sleep in the accord?honestly would probably be much more comfortable. So what did you do? well thank God he had actually somewhat prepared for [00:10:00] worst case scenario. And so we had several extra blankets and we were able to unfurl the sleeping bag, We basically just like laid it out flat and then we had extra blankets.But, you know, Were you freezing? no, I wasn't freezing. Ben just wanted to correct the record. He said it looked exactly like the double sleeping bag. Yes it did. I'm sure it looked like that. But you should always double check the label. Dig Do you wanna come on the record right now and do you wanna say anything? No. Do you wanna apologize to med? Like I'd like a public apology.he says he would like me to be nicer about the lovely weekend we had, we did have a lovely weekend.besides that huge blunder, and, you know, frankly, it's Ben's responsibility to make sure that everything is perfect for our vacations. that's in life, and in my life, and I'm not gonna take responsibility for, you know, a vacation that we both decided to go on. it's, you know, it's his responsibility.so with that trial behind me, we actually were able to have a lovely time and, return back to New York to our, you know, essentially tent of an apartment. Oh, [00:11:00] please. Your apartment is so cute I'm just happy that you had a weekend in nature. I know the sleeping arrangements were not ideal, but I did you find some rejuvenation in Mother Earth?oh, I absolutely did. And for what it's worth, After coming back from the camping trip, Ben and I talked about how we do want to be a family that camps with like our kids someday. And so we're just gonna have a really dialed in setup and I do look forward to, getting even better at the experience.And, you know, I'm grateful for being pushed out of my comfort zone. So there you go. Hope you're happy, Ben is really good because he is like, no, we're actually gonna be skiers. Like, you're gonna get the clothes and you're gonna buy the pass. Like instead of buying a stupid $400 dress or just like spending too much money on necessarily on all sorts of random crap and not being responsible and just being really bad with finances and just like not having good priorities, you are going to get a ski pass and we're gonna enjoy nature together and we're gonna go outside.And I think that for blitz, so girls, [00:12:00] we really need the push, like we need a benevolent dictator to get us to be rigorous and it's, it's sometimes some tough love really does us some good.No, it's absolutely true. We need the push, we need a little bit of that, you know, kick in the pants to be like, no, you are, you're gonna actually fully commit to this experience. I mean, I can't tell you the amount of times where we have been chatting about future vacations, that I wanna go on.And Ben has said, you know, let's just be mindful of all the PTL we wanna take, or all the, the time we wanna spend skiing in December. And I've been like, oh yeah, you're right. it. I love it too. And I definitely have a bad attitude, I'll be honest. But once I am actually doing the thing, I feel so proud of myself.And I, I do feel like Ben has made me into a more interesting, more adventurous person, even if I complain the, entire time. Soright. Chandler's Instagram bio for a long time was, I'll go, but I'll complain the whole time. I think it still is [00:13:00] that, to beis it still of who I am.Yeah, absolutely. Um, okay. Can I tell you about an experience in nature I just had and that I have a tip for everyone?Oh yeah. Did you go outside your apartment?So for the first time in years, I went outside my apartment of my own volition, because I've realized my brain is kind of broken in certain ways. Like, I used to be a person that, and Chandler can attest to this, like she could take the stand hand on the Bible and not perjure herself saying that I used to run the beach trail like every dayyour honor, Lauren Bledso used to run the San Clemente Beach Trail and you know, I can also attest to the fact that she also used to camp with an ex-boyfriend,handle the square. yes. I used to enjoy being outside and I used to get myself outside and I used to run and I used to like crave it. And I just got so out of the habit that I lost that routine. I lost that habit. And so for me, I've decided, [00:14:00] um, really wanted to start doing that again.but it's always been so tough cuz I'm like, I gotta run, but I don't really wanna run here in Puerto Rico. It's too hot. Running on the beach is too hard. and so anyway, yesterday I was like, I'm gonna go sit on the beach Kagan was like, let's go. We're not gonna bring our phones.Like, let's just go sit on the beach. Okay. Like two, homages. So anyway, we did and it was so hot. It was so sandy. Mm-hmm. frankly just like, this is too much for in? You do live in Puerto Rico slash Costa RicaMexico. Yeah. no, no, it's, it's been unseasonably hot. Like there's like health warnings right now about like, be careful about going outside. It's like 96, 97. So it was super hot and we came back in cuz we couldn't bear it. went back out an hour later, but I was just like, I'm not going to set this unnecessary expectation that I'm gonna go outside and I'm going to look at the sky and I'm gonna commune with nature and I'm just going to be like, why don't I just go [00:15:00] outside and bring my phone and listen to a podcast and go on Instagram, but I'll be by the beach.And it really was so nice and so anyway, Perfect is the Enemy of Good. Everyone and Baby Steps really are, advised from my personal experience. first of all, I think it's really sweet that Kagan wanted to go have a moment with you without your phone. I think that's very cute.even if it was, you know, misery and you, you know, very quickly decided to abort mission. well, this is, you know what I've always said to you, you know, even when you had some darker times earlier this year, like just go outside.Literally bring a glass of wine or like, or don't bring your phone or a podcast or whatever vice you wanna bring and just like, just get out of the indoor space. Like, it's just so nice to feel the sun on your face, even if you know it's while you're looking down at Instagram.And honestly, Ashley always has some quote that's like, never trust a thought you have indoors. Oh, interesting. really smart. Um, and honestly, like, [00:16:00] I love everything Lauren Bostick is doing. I love the skinny confidential, but like, I also think there's a, a powerful message of like, get the fuck into the sun.Like, just get sun. well, I think, I think her message is more like, I'll be in the sun, but I'm gonna cover every, you know, surface of my body. Which is fine, but I also think it's actually okay if every now and then, like you face the sun, unbridled, that's the rightword. Absolutely, absolutely. no Tino Shade, like literally adore please have us on your podcast. at some point We would love to be on. at some point. I would love to Kagan, like literally, okay. I'll just take the moment. I was in a very important meeting, like a huge important meeting. I'm out here, it's a big deal. with this very thoughtful brand that had put together a presentation for us, and I'm 15 minutes into it. This is a whole shenanigan, but I got home from my trip to [00:17:00] St. Barts last weekend and their wifi was not working in our home.there was just a lot of problems. Okay. So anyway, long story short, Kagan was working on the wifi I mean this very important meeting. We thankfully had wifi up, but I guess he went to go optimize it. And the wifi is set up, is feet away from this table where I record and do all my meetings and he just b blazes right past what I'm doing and just unplugs the wifi.Just unplugs, just unplugs. The meeting goes dark. Meanwhile, I had gone to Starbucks. right before the meeting thinking I needed to take it there. And then 10 minutes before he's like, WiFi's back on, you can come back and take it here. So then I'm in the middle of the meeting and he just waltz is right by me and unplugs it.You know what that unplugged says, I don't care about your career. I don't take you seriously as a businesswoman.no, I, what I think it says is, you have car blanche spending budget. I just got everything. We don't need you to ever make any money. here's my credit card. oh, totally. Actually, that is what it [00:18:00] said,that's, that's that's the read. Congratulations.Okay. Everyone heard my thoughts on Van Depe rules?We need to hear your thoughts on Yeah. Well, okay, first of all, let me say, I watched this reunion in two parts because I didn't really, honestly have the time to sit down and watch it, at length. The first half that I watched was during one of my very late night working sessions. We had to wait for something to get done, essentially in the, wee hours in the morning, and we didn't have anything to do, but wait, so I made everyone at work watch Vanderpump Rules the uncensored version, which was a treat. it, you know, it washonestly, perfect work activity. anyways. It was like at, you know, 1:30 AM it was very crazy to watch this reunion with people who do not know the show because I felt like it was very explosive.It was very raw, you know, James storming off. Like it was so,like, the tempers and the, the emotions were turned up to, I would say a nine or a 10 almost the entire time that, like, [00:19:00] watching it with people who were not familiar with the show. I, I almost feel like I needed to say like, you know, it's not always like this, but it kind of always You? like this.you wanna say like, you don't know how good you have it? Like this is the best of the best. This is Right? ever seen. Totally. Totally. Yeah. I do wanna say, did you think that James Kennedy was doing coke which is why he kept leaving, or no?honestly, that's a really good question. I don't know what it would be like to be addicted to Coke so much that you would need it, to function, obviously. so I honestly couldn't tell you. It would be like someone asking me Do you think that James was doing, I don't know, like Ashwaganda?Oh no. Never tried it. right, right, right. What do you think? Ido think?it's very, as a Koch addict, I think it's very weird that he like, wanted to leave so much or that he felt like he needed to pee. I feel like, I don't know, maybe he had a u t i and he just wasn't, you know, prepared to share that on, on camera.But it is very weird, that he like constantly was trying to walk off [00:20:00] screen to go have a moment. pee constantly. And so that for me was very relatable. I mean, I guess you don't know too how long this part two was filmed over if it was like three hoursor six hours, Part two was sick cut down. Right. But I'm justsaying But part this particular episode,  Yeah, that's anyways, I wanna get into the moment where when they break and Tom Sandoval asks for a break off camera.I just don't think we've ever seen this man in a more frantic state.Well, that's what I loved about it cuz it just revealed so much, it revealed that he knows what he's doing and I'm so, capable of being swindled by a narcissist. so I think it was really revealing for me to be like, oh wait, his relationship with Ariana was not what he said it was.It was not so pathetic and terrible. It was not to devoid of lust and passion. Like he's a liar. He's literally lying Right, right. Yeah.[00:21:00] I think it was also for me, strangely satisfying to see how frantic and clearly unstable he was. You know, when he is like yelling at that production assistant or whatever and, clearly he is having to suffer andI, and I wanted to frankly see him suffer on camera because he, you know, he can't have a moment to himself.I'm sorry, you were on a reality television show and you have caused, it's literally the point you were being paid to be there, you know, and the producer was like, you can go have a moment by yourself and eat lunch. Like, you know, if you're just eating lunch by yourself, you know, you can have a moment where, you know, the camera might be filming you eating lunch by yourself, but you don't have to talk.You know, but he clearly wanted to have a moment with Raquel where they could, talk cameras down and, you know, get into more nitty gritty stuff, maybe get their story straight before she, was to come on. And we did actually see photos of them talking cameras like that.Remember the TMZ photos of them, like during the reunion where he looks like a vapi and like, he's just [00:22:00] like, ev like, uh, it's sobad must have been after that. Must have been after.everything wrapped.I just don't think they would've allowed that. I There's no they snuck off. I don't know if you caught it, but they took off their mics and they snuck off.Oh, really? and maybe we're gonna see hi hidden camera footage or camera footage of that conversation. I don't know. But that to me is like such a grave failure, of just like, I don't even wanna say, bravo. I just wanna say for like documentarians everywhere for the, people who invented the camera, and the microphone.Like the idea that they, no, like Thomas Edison, who invented lenses like they're like turning in their grave right now that these men, a valor did not pick up their cameras and just chase after them. right, right. to calm down.  I'm sorry. Okay. I'm sorry to bring that up. Another grave. Error. Huge moment was when Andy asked Tom Sandoval if he thought that Sheena had punched Raquel[00:23:00] and Tom Sandoval, you pointed this out.Took the longest pause. I mean, I was starting to feel anxious the longer that pause went on, because if I was Raquel watching that, I mean, I'm sure she died insidebecause it was just a very clear moment where he could have just been like, yeah, I think there was an altercation, you know, and his friendship has Sheena Long gone.He could burn that bridge or at least, you know, take Raquel's side in that moment. But he couldn't even do that. he basically made the whole thing look like a lie.I think that, Tom Sandals backed into a corner right now because he basically, I think that he doesn't wanna lose Raquel as his, like, feeding source of his narcissism, and he is gonna do whatever he can to keep her around. He wants her devotion, he wants, to go do his play band and that he wants to have her on dial, he wants to hook up with other girls. He wants it all. [00:24:00] And he doesn't care about her. Okay. And I just think that he's backed in such, such a hard place because in order to put all these chess moves into place, he has to perform all of these acts.He has to lie, lie, lie, lie, lie. And lying is exhausting. Like lying is so tiring. Cause you have to remember all the lies.Absolutely. But he clearly doesn't care about her because I think if he truly cared about her, he would be writing for her more. And he's not.What do you mean writing for her? In what way?I think he would've just been on her side about the Sheena altercation thing, he didn't have to say that. I think Sheena punched her, decked her. He could say, I think there was an altercation, or like, I think that, you know, something went down with Sheena and Raquel, you know, where Sheena was physical, you know, there was a bunch of ways where you could have, you know, use semantics. But I just thought, I thought in that moment he didn't actually care enough, or he just wasn't willing to go to the mat for Raquel.See, I read that the issue was that it was defamation that he could have been sued [00:25:00] if he said that Sheena actually punched Raquel. because that whatever that could do to any brand endorsement she has is she can prove that's materially false. And that's the reason Raquel dropped it because literally it puts them in a very precarious position where Sheena can take legal action. I do wonder if there was a conversation with between Raquel and Tom where she was, I'm gonna go file a restraining order against Sheena. Like, I wonder if he encouraged her to do that, or if he was involved in, in any part. But anyways,wouldn't be surprised if Tom Sandoval is involved in every single thing Raquel is doing. And I just also wanna say that what's so hilarious to me is that they had three weeks to prepare for this reunion between the time the affair was found out and the time they film, the reunion. I mean, have we ever seen, like our dad prepare for trial?Three weeks is a long time. Like get out all the discovery, get in the conference room, lay out the binders, put together the flow chart. remember the basic facts of when you're gonna pretend that Schwartz knew. Okay. The fact [00:26:00] that they are coming to this trial So unprepared is frankly, I mean it is like a Elaine Boff adjacent.Who's That is, um, Amber Herd's attorney.Oh, wow. Beautiful. forgot about her. I completely agree. Okay. I wanna get into another momentOkay.that just continues to show the messiness of this entire cast. I already mentioned it earlier, briefly, but green light. Green light. Oh my gosh. These people are so messy. AndOh, I was sorry. I just realized what you were talking about. the pill bottle.yes, I'm not talking about Matthew McConaughey's book. Lauren.green light. Green light. Okay. She's gonna say what it was. Sorry. Rover. when Tom Sandoval turns to shorts and goes, green light. Green light, when they are micd, when there are cameras everywhere. people are so that Tom's shorts can pull out a full Bud pill bottle.Not even just [00:27:00] like a discreet pill that's in his pocket like a mint. No, they are so messy. I cannot even begin to describe how messy they are. 13, 10 years later. I don't know how, however long this show has been going on. and that is one of, you know, the crowning, glories, I will say of Vander Pump ever heard of an Al Alto box? Ever heard of a tic-tac? Do you know how easy it is to just put it in something else? Like these people, some of their elevators do not go to the top. it is a joy to watch on our screens. Absolutely. That's one of my favorite expressions used. By the way, the elevator doesn'tthe top. That's the I was ready for you to tell me it was offensive. Okay. hilarious. Another bit of news that broke in the last, you know, three to four days, um, is that Taylor Swift and Maddie Healy are no longer ensconced. Um, the back grid photos have travelled and dried up and, you know, Maddie has gone back on tour in Europe for the 1975.sources have confirmed that, you know, the two have split up. And I just [00:28:00] wanna say, I wanna just clear the air on this and maybe, I don't know if I've expressed this, but these two have never made sense to me.Mm.I think that Taylor literally, you know, she takes up 60% of my subconscious thoughts these days.So I know a little bit about her. Taylor is a little too on the nose and Maddie is a little too cool. These two were always like, oil and vinegar, oil and water, whatever. And I just never fully understood their connection because I just feel like they operate in like different pop star stratospheres.And I'm not saying one is better than the other. Actually, I'll say that I think Taylor is obviously bigger and incredible than, than 1975, even though I do like the 1975. but I, yeah, I just, I never thought these two were gonna last. I do think it's interesting because there was so much fan backlash.I do wonder how much that played into maybe tree pain, having a, come to Jesus moment with Taylor.A mighty change of heart.but the last thing I'm gonna say on this subject, because, you know, it was only essentially like a three week long relationship. We've all been [00:29:00] there. I just think we're gonna see a lot more of Taylor's love life via backward.We absolutely are. We're gonna see a lot more candidates, we're gonna see a lot more fashion. Taylor is going to be in our lives a lot more thanks to Joe Allen finally hitting the bricks. and the one thing I will say is I think Maddie Healy served a really important purpose and Taylor's life.I think Taylor for so long, strived to be so likable and she strived to be the good girl. all the rules, right? And even trying to be so perfect, she was castigated and, you the public just gave her a horrible time for things that if a boy was doing them, just like she said in her song of the man, it would've been a chased, virtuous, you know, trajectory.So I think Maddie Healy has a certain level of, D G A F. Attitude,Yep, yep, GK that Taylor really needs. Okay. Because I think that he hopefully showed her that she can be [00:30:00] a little more empowered to stop trying to be what people want her to be. And I think she's so far down that road already, but I wanna see her really explode into it.Um, and I think that's the function Maddie served in her life. and yeah, I'm here for it and I'm here for the breakup. Cuz I agree with people though that this was not a correct match. Um, and they were not meant to procreate, and multiply and replenish the earth. I'm just so happy that the famine of Joe Allen and, you know, the photos of their romance is over and that we are, you know, are now going to be living in the feasting era. And thank you to RIT as well.There are seasons for everything Chandler and the sun has finally come out. Okay. And spring is upon us after a long winter. Okay. Um, I wanna talk to you about another piece of news that has come out. So, ah, Chandler, did you hear dissolution? [00:31:00] So, Natalie Portman and Benjamin Millie. Well, it's not a dissolution just yet, however, it is a fundamental betrayal of trust.So, Natalie Portman's husband, Benjamin Millie 45, recently had an affair with a 25 year old climate activist Camille Etan. please, you guys, I'm so sorry, but if I mispronounce that do not jam me. Like what do you expect? a climate enthusiast, an activist, whatever. I'm sorry. Let me just pause for a heavy eye roll.Okay, so Natalie's 41, Benjamin's 45. He has had an affair with a 25 year old climate activist , Camille Etan.So a source says that it was short-lived. This is a quote from people, by the way, if something's in people, everyone, that means that this is basically the word of the celebrity. So this This is basically their statement. It was short-lived and it is over.He knows he made enormous mistake and he's doing all he can to get Natalie to forgive him and keep their family together. Natalie is incredibly private and has no intention of playing this out in the media. Her biggest priority is [00:32:00] protecting her children and their privacy. All right, I just am gonna state some facts and I'm gonna allow people to draw their own conclusions.So, Chandley, do you wanna hear how Natalie and Benjamin metYes, I would love to.on the set of Black Swan in 2009, where he taught her to dance? Okay.Oh, wow. Okay.So they currently have two children. and let's get into the affair a little bit more. So, photographs published in French Magazine show some evidence of the affair and the magazine says In early March, the star of the Star Wars saga discovered that her husband was having an affair with a young woman.The magazine published images of Benjamin and Camille going into his office separately on May 24th and exiting 10 minutes apart almost two hours later. That timeline makes it seem like the affair was going on for at least a few months.Natalie and Benjamin's marriage was definitely on around that time, despite rumors of Rocky times in 2022, they were at the Beyonce concert in Paris, May 26th and we're photographed kissing at dinner on May 29th. Okay, so let's get into [00:33:00] who, Camille. Most Americans have never heard of Camille Etan, but she's better known in France. She's friends with Greta Thunberg Classic has made a number of short films on the environment and written the book for an ecological uprising, overcoming our collective powerlessness. Apparently she's have read an Nicha. the World of Power Lady, like Get a Grip. She was also named by French Vanity Fair as one of the 50 French women who made 2020. Okay, I this might lead peop. would hate us.Oh my gosh. She does not listen to our podcast and we don't want her as a listener, by the way. It's fine. this is a one star reviewer after just like one slip of the tongue.So this is very frustrating and sad, and I totally understand. Everyone's searching their souls right now thinking, how could someone cheat on someone as beautiful, smart, and as talented as an Natalie Portman? Here are a few things to consider everyone, and I'm just speaking facts. Let's take a look at how Benjamin and Natalie's relationship began as an affair.[00:34:00] Proceed.Portman and Benjamin Millie met in November, 2009 on the set of Black Swan for which he did the choreography. It was a classic muse in artist scenario. He was likely awed by her dedication, talent, and skill, making it so easy for him to fall in love with her. The problem at the time, Benjamin was in a long-term live-in relationship with principal dancer at the American Ballet Theater.Isabella Boyton Mm. Benjamin and Isabella had an East Village apartment and had just finished traveling the world together when Benjamin began his work on Black Swan. Now, we are not saying that Natalie's in the wrong for her husband's affair in 2023, but we are saying that a pattern of cheating on your fantastic partner is clear.Okay? And being unable to sustain monogamy seems to be something that is very much in his character.Yeah. Oh, Lauren's exhausted from this research.It's giving Tristan cheating on Chloe. Okay. He left his pregnant girlfriend for Chloe. Yes. It is [00:35:00] sad, but this is not the first time I did this. And I just think we need to, as women see patterns and we, we need to have discernment and I'm not placing blame, I just think we need context for this.Right. Because it's helpful to know that there were clues. It's actually more disturbing for me if this guy was just like the most upstanding of men right, he had fallen.right, right. I completely agree. I think that you need to look at how. Men operate in their relationships, whether that's their previous history, whether it's how they talk about their exes. You know, Ithink if a man refers to his ex if all of his exes are crazy, you'll probably become a crazy girl to him one day, A crazy woman,whatever. And you just have to look at the way that their brain, operates around women and, you know, and, and their past history.And the other thing is, is it's not about you. Like it's not about you not being enough. It's [00:36:00] about them being insecure. Like here's a list of women who've been cheated on in addition to Natalie Portman, Beyonce, Santa Miller, Sandra Bullock, Jennifer Garner, Halle Berry, Lauren Atkinson, I mean, icons of our time.You caught me off guard. I was like, who's that?I'm still getting used to the name. I was cheated on, not married obviously. but I just think that I'm definitely not by Kagan. Let's clear that air. I just think that it's so important to know and it's hard to let this lesson sink in because when it happens to you, you are just so, it's so hard not to feel like it's something wrong with you, but it is literally about that person's need for validation.it's about their, lack of moral scruples, their insecurities, There are issues with commitment The lack of work they have probably done on themselves. Like it's not like if you've cheated on someone, you can never re come back from that, or you can'theal, but I [00:37:00] just think, your cheater better be in weekly therapy with better help.Yeah, like it is adjacent, I think to recovering from alcohol abuse or recovering some from some sort of abuse. Like if that is something that's you've done in your past, you need to have clearly made leaps imbalance of progress in your mental health. And I think to bring it back full circle to Vanderpump rules, I think about Jax, you know, like Britney Forgave Jax and I listened to his recent episode with Heather McDonald on Juicy Scoop and he seems so light years ahead of where he used to be. So redemption is available to everyone You sound like preaching the Mormon gospel for I'm not about to bear my testimony, but I do think that, I do think that the plan of salvation is real. I do think that you can become a better person.I agree. And also for what it's worth, women also cheat this. This message applies to both men andwomen. yeah, it's so complex. I also think [00:38:00] like, look inward. Everyone look inward because it's so easy to think you don't have the capacity for that. But I mean, I think that really it takes a lighthouse. Having a lighthouse, having a moral compass, and knowing the monster within you as, someone would say, to understand, you know, the things that people are capable of when life gets hard and the acts of desperation that they can fall to.And that is why people do need, a north star. you know what Chandler. I wish Benjamin, Natalie well, Please use the code pop on better help for your free trial, Benjamin and Natalie. the journey ahead. Blessings on your road.Plus it's on your road. They're not actually, by the way, sponsors of us anymore. So that was free. I just don't want the FTC coming after us. okay. not ad. Not an ad.Not an ad. and they're not associated with this podcast in any legal way anymore. Okay. so I wanna tell everyone that I [00:39:00] did do a trip to St.Bart's with some girlfriends last weekend. I was talking to you about a Chandler, and I was like, is this annoying to talk about? Like, is this getting tone deaf and stupid? or should I do like a guide to St. Bart's? Because I wanna be aware, the same parts trip we did in a very, I think, economical way.and so I wanna share all my tips, the ways to do it like as cheaply as possible if you need to, um, and still have the most like, rock and rolling and good of times. So I think what I'm gonna do is like a quick 10 minute episode that's a standalone. That way if someone's searching St. Barts on podcasts and they just wanna hear those wrecks, they don't have to get through, the, betrayal of Benjamin and Right. in order to hear about Nikki Beach, you know? Absolutely. I, yes, I support it. I think this is a, you know, a great way to organize our, travel stuff and, I think we're, we're gonna try to do this, you know, for a lot of the destinations we go toYes.Maybe we'll call it like pop travel. We need a name for it.[00:40:00] Yeah, absolutely. I'm planning a trip to Italy currently for September, and so hopefully I'll do one of those after.You better. Okay, everyone, one more thing before we hit depart. I wanna talk about Erin and Sarah Foster's podcast. Now it's not really good business to like shout out other podcasts and to advertise competitors, but I'm trying to live in a space of there's enough for everyone. An abundance mentality.and I think that if you love this podcast so bad cause it's literally like a free swap. but let's be honest, we're not on their level. So, it's not that useful for them. Erin and Sarah, their podcast, their episodes with each other, you will love it if you love this podcast. And I highly, highly recommend listening.And I wanna share a few reasons why. So Erin and Sarah Foster's podcast, like this podcast, it really reveals the minds of other people, which is kind of scary. Like being able to, [00:41:00] like, once you've listened to someone for so many hours, you really kind of know their neurosis, their insecurities. Like it's so easy.And that like, almost like spooks me out. How Well a lot of people or some people know us.Me specifically. that's one thing that's come across when I've met listeners in the wild people who, you know, I, I still can't believe I meet anybody who listens to this podcast that isn't like us and mom. when I meet people, I feel like they really know me and like, know what I'm gonna joke about or know what like, they just kind of know already my bits not my like physical bits to be clear, but they like, they just like know my shtick, if youwill. And I think that is something that is a little, jarring to me always because I'm like, oh, wow. Like I've really danced for you all, you know, you really know who I am.Yeah, I heard Michael Bostick say it on the skin confidential. Like when you have hundreds of hours of content up there, you cannot hide who you are. And it is really [00:42:00] so true. yeah, it is like, it is so strange, like the one way intimacy happening on this podcast. But I will say when we do see someone in the wild, which happens like very, very rarely, it is like one of the most fun experiences ever.yeah. I'm obsessed.It's, love it. So if you ever see us, please say something cuz it yeah, itliterally makes my life. Yeah. it always feels like surreal.Okay. So anyway, back to Erin and Sarah. I like their podcast because there's a few things about it I like. One is they live in a world that is very rarefied. Like they are people who, they go to Gwyneth house for dinner. Not like regularly I can tell, but like, they're on the invite list to a dinner.They're on an invite list to a goop promotional event. has joined their podcast. they're in a group chat with other celebrities, which is, I can't even fathom that.they're in a group chat with other celebrities and. What I think is interesting is like you hear their own neurosis and insecurities come through, and like the reality of what it is to [00:43:00] be surrounded by people with a lot more frankly, like, and they talk about this kind of like success than you, and they're still working, they're still grinding, they're on their, they're on their grind.right. and you you hear they're striving like Sarah is very admittedly, like financially obsessed and like doesn't feel like she has enough, even though she has like a retired, pro tennis player, life partner.Yeah.and Erin went through so many years of trying to be a writer, trying so hard to be a writer and feeling like such a failure.And even though they grew up in Beverly Hills, like you listen to talk about their childhood, which was so fractured. I mean, David Foster is on my shit list. Right? Public enemy number one.That's like literally gonna be the title of my memoir. that's so much I think about David Foster, and what he has done to those women. But I just think that it's so deeply relatable [00:44:00] and that is why I really like Kagan is brushing his teeth with a really strong electric toothbrush. Can you hear that? hear it. by the way, when I got a little snippy with Kagan earlier is cuz he started playing a super loud Instagram story feet away from where I'm recording this podcast and now it's just buzz buzz booze. it's, it's time to get that credit card. Time for cardlaunch spending.I have a software on here where you can't hear background noises. So I'm not just being a bitch for no reason. It's my disclaimer. he literally too, he just like walks in, brushes lo, sees me like laugh, like joking about it kind of seriously, and just like, you know, doesn't care. Okay. We know who wears the pants in this relationship.Anyway, back to the topic at hand. I think that it's so important to know that no matter what level of success or wealth or marriage you achieve and relationship kids, whatever, you are always going to have people around you who have the capacity, if you are embracing the dark side of your personality [00:45:00] to feel insecure and not good about yourself. Mm-hmm. financial insecurity is possible at so many levels of financial success. Yep. so these girls have a, venture fund together. Mm-hmm. I think that Aren't they like on the board at Bumble or something? Like they're, they're like creative leads on like so many different brands and sit on boards and are by all means, like big name celebrities.yes. And I will say too, there's like a lot of real wisdom happening on that podcast. Like Erin's talking and they had this conversation where Sarah was like, your show got picked up by Netflix. Like, why aren't you blasting this more? Why aren't you all like talking about this on Instagram more?And Erin's like, because if it's successful, people will know about it. I don't have to tell them about it. right, right, and I think there's like some real lessons in like, show don't tell. you know, let your success be your noise. Yeah, like I think that there's some real wisdom happening and the back and forth Chandler is So you and me.It is. So you and me. [00:46:00] I am Sarah. You are Erin. and it is like so eerie to listen. Like Sarah at one point was like saying how she doesn't understand why when she posts a thirst strap, she'll get like hate comments that are like, you're so vain. Whereas if someone with like a more, you know, like a curvier body, posts a thirst strap.I remember this. women get like so many compliments and Erin had to like break it down for her like she was in the first grade. Why? yes, Sarah, like these women have never had their bodies celebrated publicly. So there's a reason why this conversation is happening Right, right. the back and forth, it's just good.The It's so good good girls, Right. into them. okay. I also wanna plug another, a huge podcast that I don't, I don't think it even matters that we're like, that people might listen to them, who might listen to our podcast because they're on another level. But I think Smartless has a similar like, fascinating angle for me because it's [00:47:00] also three big celebrities.It's, will Arnette, Jason Bateman and Sean Hayes. And they're all like really great friends and it is just so interesting to me to hear the inner workings of like celebrities being friends with each other and hey, like, you know, the other night we were at dinner at, Larry David's house and blah, blah blah.Um, and it's just, it's on another level, but I find it to be so fun. And they also have like a Netflix special where they like went on tour and I just think like their dynamics. Are just amazing. And I think, there's different levels of success between the three of them, but I think they, like, they neg each other, but then they also celebrate each other and yeah.I feel like Smartless is just another excellent podcast.Yeah, I mean, I now people are never going to listen to this podcast again. We have officially lost our listeners and we probably should. No, I'm justI don't. I think also Laura, like, people who listen to podcasts listen to like 18 at a time, you know, no one's just like listening to only one podcast.No, it's true. And honestly, I find myself [00:48:00] like, even though I'm such an avid consumer of content, and I constantly have AirPods in, I cannot even walk across the room without picking a podcast. First. I find myself like, not having something to listen to frequently. Yeah. so many hours in the day to fill with content.speaking of the Smartless documentary, which I highly recommend to anyone on Netflix who wants like some easy watching, Jason Bateman clearly has some type of like orthorexia like eating, disordered eating situationbecause he is constantly talking about food and how much other people are eating and making fun of them.So I think that's like very interesting to see play out in a man. You know, I think that's like something as women we're used to encountering, you know, with, with either within ourselves or like, you know, with other women. but I think it's very interesting to see it with a man. So that's one thing on a more serious note, and then, Will Ette is I think one of the funniest people ever.he was telling this story. They were all talking about how great Brad Pitt is, right? And Will Arnette was like [00:49:00] saying that, Basically they read this event or party or something where Brad Pitt was, and they were talking about how he's just like the most normal guy, you know, just from Missouri.We have mixed thoughts on Brad Pitt, but I do believe,you know, that if you were to encounter him, he's a, like a very nice guy despitehaving. affable.Maybe having, you know, a shadow side. But anyways, will Arnett, speaks about how, Brad Pitt came up to him and said, Hey man, I watched every episode of your show.I loved it. And like, you did such a great job. And then he gave him like a big hug. And Will Arnett said that he, was like, oh yeah, like, thank you so much, and that he kind of like walked down the hallway and then just like found a room and then quickly slid down the wall because he was just like so overcome with like Brad Pitt, you know, celebrating him.And then without even missing a beat, Jason Bateman goes, that's so great. Who do you think he thought you were?That is hilarious.Isn't thatso, I mean, and That's just like a little snippet of the way that they like neg each other without even like, they don't even skip a beat and they're just constantly, giving each other a hardtime. And I [00:50:00] think that's to earth. I like it. Yeah. think he thought you were? Yeah, I need to listen to more of that podcast. trying to listen to like smarter podcasts right now and less like Total Dribble. Well, I'll say it's not that smart. it's just them like having, like chatsthis is the part where we talked shit on Spotless. just saying it's not like, you know, Sam Harris.Yeah. Who I actually have new issues with, but I'll talk to you about that me Okay time for me to, once again revoke my 5 99 a month. It's something I've done 20 times at least.I love Sam Harris. I just think he's fundamentally mentally misguided on certain really important topics, not political. So before anyone calls me out for Like what? to do with politics. psychedelics it's not something I'm, I wanna talk about publicly quite yet. Okay. Well we will wait till you're ready. So that, bless a day.Okay, Chandler, well, thank you so much for getting up at 8:00 AM in order to record this podcast on camera before you go into your 14 hour workday, like, oh my gosh, the devil works hard, but Chandler Bledso works harder. Thank you.[00:51:00] um, you're welcome for, being here today with this podcast, with you hosting.appreciate you. Thank you so much. So everyone, we really need your help. Chandler and I are idiots in a major way and so much that we have done a podcast for three years without doing calls to action, Mm-hmm. at the beginning and end, which is apparently really important. For someone who works in marketing, I kind of missed that one.The only time we ever did it was when we were like offering people money in the form of a giveaway. So we are going to. Please ask you, share this podcast. Help us grow this podcast that we've been working so hard on for now, three years. help Us grow Our Wings. Because what I will say is that the more we grow, the more content we can make, the more things we can make.We have a lot of big dreams for the show. Um, we wanna do more episodes, more content, more, more, more. So please share, put a link of this episode on your stories, on your Instagram stories Yeah, use the little link button on [00:52:00] Instagram. Pop a little link in there to your favorite episode. I think when people share a podcast that they like, on their story, like I know for me, I constantly am like screenshotting podcasts I wanna listen to, so it's just a really good organic way of like spreading the word.If you like this podcast and you feel like the people who follow you might also like it.absolutely. also another thing. Please subscribe to this podcast. Go on Apple on your phone, wherever listen and hit the follow button, Spotify, hit Follow Apple podcast, hit subscribe. Please do that. That really helps our numbers. So if you can do those two things and if you're feeling extra benevolent, give us a five star review.We would be deeply, deeply appreciative. Um, and with that, we will catch you on Patreon on Friday. Love See you Friday. Bye.Bye.   [00:53:00] Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy