Podcast appearances and mentions of ron thurston

In this energizing and thought-provoking episode, I welcome back Ron Thurston, bestselling author, veteran retail executive, and passionate advocate for the frontline retail workforce. With the launch of his second book, Human Pride: Optimizing Your Human Potential in a Digital Job Market, Ron brings a refreshing, people-centric perspective to leadership and career development in the era of AI, automation, and gig work.Michael and Ron discuss the implications of the rising prevalence of gig work, how many retailers are reverting to "COVID playbooks" with minimal staffing, and the importance of treating even temporary team members as valuable contributors. Ron shares powerful insights on how a simple, intentional 60-second conversation can dramatically transform an employee's sense of pride and purpose—emphasizing the importance of human-to-human leadership even amidst operational speed.The heart of the episode is Ron's deep dive into Human Pride, a follow-up to his 2020 bestseller Retail Pride. Ron explains how this new book expands his message beyond the retail sector, encouraging readers to reflect on their values, refine their personal stories, and lead with purpose. He emphasizes the importance of storytelling in both job interviews and team leadership, describing it as an underutilized yet transformative tool.Ron and Michael also reflect on Ron's first book tour, where he crisscrossed the U.S. in an Airstream and F-150 to connect with frontline retail workers, and what he learned about the commonalities shared across the industry, from Walmart to luxury brands. Ron emphasizes the importance of leaders being curious, asking thoughtful questions, and helping team members discover their strengths through storytelling and open dialogue.Whether you're a retail executive, HR leader, or just navigating today's job market, this episode offers timely and timeless advice on how to show up with pride, lead with humanity, and build a more resilient workforce.Buy Ron's eBook on IndigoBuy Ron's Book on Amazon Michael LeBlanc is the president and founder of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc, a senior retail advisor, keynote speaker and now, media entrepreneur. He has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career. Michael has delivered keynotes, hosted fire-side discussions and participated worldwide in thought leadership panels, most recently on the main stage in Toronto at Retail Council of Canada's Retail Marketing conference with leaders from Walmart & Google. He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience with Levi's, Black & Decker, Hudson's Bay, CanWest Media, Pandora Jewellery, The Shopping Channel and Retail Council of Canada to his advisory, speaking and media practice.Michael produces and hosts a network of leading retail trade podcasts, including the award-winning No.1 independent retail industry podcast in America, Remarkable Retail with his partner, Dallas-based best-selling author Steve Dennis; Canada's top retail industry podcast The Voice of Retail and Canada's top food industry and one of the top Canadian-produced management independent podcasts in the country, The Food Professor with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois from Dalhousie University in Halifax.Rethink Retail has recognized Michael as one of the top global retail experts for the fifth year in a row, the National Retail Federation has designated Michael as on their Top Retail Voices for 2025, Thinkers 360 has named him on of the Top 50 global thought leaders in retail, RTIH has named him a top 100 global though leader in retail technology and Coresight Research has named Michael a Retail AI Influencer. If you are a BBQ fan, you can tune into Michael's cooking show, Last Request BBQ, on YouTube, Instagram, X and yes, TikTok.Michael is available for keynote presentations helping retailers, brands and retail industry insiders explaining the current state and future of the retail industry in North America and around the world.

In this special episode recorded in London, bestselling author and retail leader Ron Thurston joins Paula Macaggi to launch his new book Human Pride—a bold call to embrace what makes us human in an age dominated by AI. They discuss how frontline retail, purpose-driven leadership, and personal pride are the real future-proofing tools in a changing job market. From multigenerational teams to algorithmic interviews, this episode is a masterclass in leading with heart and thriving in the digital era.You can buy your copy here! ----Sponsored by VTEX

ABOUT RON THURSTON:LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rthurston/Websites:Retail Pride book: https://www.amazon.com/Retail-Pride-Celebrating-Accidental-Career/dp/1544515928OSSY: https://www.useossy.comRetail In America podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/retail-in-america/id1618323713 Ron Thurston's Bio:Ron Thurston's life mission is to celebrate, elevate, and empower the people and spirit of the retail industry.With over three decades of leading retail stores and operations for top American brands like Gap, West Elm, Apple, Tory Burch, Bonobos, and Saint Laurent, Ron has honed an extensive skill set in retail strategy, management, and innovation.In January 2024, Ron co-founded OSSY, a forward-thinking retail recruiting agency. This venture is dedicated to addressing the biggest hiring and recruiting challenges in retail, reinforcing Ron's unwavering commitment to the industry.As the best-selling author of RETAIL PRIDE, Ron inspires retail professionals to embrace their unique career paths. He also hosted the RETAIL IN AMERICA podcast and tour, journeying across the nation in an Airstream trailer during 2022/2023 to uncover and highlight the remarkable stories and individuals in retail.Ron also serves on the Advisory Boards of several rapidly growing retail tech companies, including Ometria, Butterfly, and YOOBIC, lending his expertise to drive their success.SHOW INTRO:Welcome to the NXTLVL Experience Design podcast.EPISODE 71… and my conversation with Ron Thurston, retail veteran, best-selling author, podcast host and man on a mission to celebrate, elevate, and empower the people and spirit of the retail industry.On the podacast our dynamic dialogues based on our acronym DATA - design, architecture, technology, and the arts crosses over disciplines but maintains a common thread of people who are passionate about the world we live in and human's influence on it, the ways we craft the built environment to maximize human experience, increasing our understanding of human behavior and searching for the New Possible.    The NXTLVL Experience Design podcast is presented by VMSD Magazine part of the Smartwork Media family of brands.VMSD brings us, in the brand experience world, the International Retail Design Conference. The IRDC is one of the best retail design conferences that there is bringing together the world of retailers, brands and experience place makers every year for two days of engaging conversations and pushing the discourse forward on what makes retailing relevant. You will find the archive of the NXTLVL Experience Design podcast on VMSD.com.Thanks also goes to Shop Association the only global retail trade association dedicated to elevating the in-store experience. SHOP Association represents companies and affiliates from 25 countries and brings value to their members through research, networking, education, events and awards. Check then out on SHOPAssociation.orgIn this 70th episode I talk with Samar Younes is a Beirut-born hybrid artist, futurist, and creative catalyst whose work embodies a transcultural approach. Ron Thurston has spent years opening stores for major internationally recognized brands and knows a thing or two about a career in retail. In our talk we dig into the shifting the mindset of retail being an accidental career to one of choice, about with you should be proud. We'll get to all that in a moment but first though, a few thoughts…              *                         *                         * Throughout my career in the retail design world I have often heard this statement “I never planned to be in retail”.And it's often said with some slight lilt of apology, that in a way somehow as an architect it was somehow not taken quite as seriously as the design of public buildings or housing or other things that architects with a capital “A” do.What's more, when I entered into the retail design world, quite by serendipity I might add, I came into the design of stores by way of visual merchandising. I was the resident architect of a small 4 personn design and visual merchandising consulting firm on 36th street just east of Park.Working with a couple of seasoned pros, I learned that visual merchandisers were often regarded simply as window trimmers and I don't think quite got the respect that they were due for the power they had in shaping the retail experience for customers. Often seen as the silent seller, visual merchandising was a key component to how the customer journey unfolded in a shopping experience. Mannequins and other displays in the store added that extra flavor to the store as a stage set in which the merchandise was the principal actor.Architecture wasn't unimportant, but it wasn't the be all and end all of the in-store experience. You could have terrific architecture but if you couldn't get your assortment planning right department layouts an in store messaging you were likely not to perform quite as well.It was through my first employer and mentor Joe Weishar of New Vision Studios in New York that I began to really understand the power of visual merchandising in the store designers toolboxand that it couldn't be simply left to be an afterthought but had to be integral to the initial strategic design thinking of how a store would be laid out. Where those special moments of surprise and delight would occur often had little to do with architecture but a lot to do with theatrics, art, marketing, graphics – in short, storytelling.Going back to that comment a moment ago about serendipity finding me and putting me firmly in the world of retail design, it does very much align with the often heard message that “I didn't plan to be in retail.” It is in fact true, that one now is an architecture I had no awareness and probably no interest in designing stores for a living.But, that said, I actually had no shame about being in retail.Retail combined all the things that I loved:stage set design, industrial design architecture, marketing, consumer behavior, trend analysis, fashion and advertising - all of these disciplines came together in the experience that a brand or retailer would provide for their customers.The fact of the matter is, that the exchange of goods and services otherwise know as ‘retail,' is one of the key cornerstones of cultures around the world. Exchange has always been tied with ideas and that makes it extremely powerful. And, these ideas change over time influenced by the comings and goings of merchants and trends and technologies. It seems to me, and this comes from someone who was educated trained and licensed as an architect, that retail locations are probably more frequented by the general population than are the major civic buildings that would have been typically called “architecture” in the past.Think about it, when was the last time that you went to a post office, a library, an Opera House, a government building, a church, synagogue, or mosque or a courthouse?When did you last walk the campus of a university or visit a museum?And I am sure that there are some of you who will say well I did all of those yesterday but I'd also hazard a guess that they would be in the minority.now, when was the last time you went to a store a shopping mall a department store or used your phone to buy something from Amazon or some other online company?The point here is that shopping is so deeply ingrained in our everyday lives that it's inextricably tied to how we come to understand the world around us. Shopping places therefore are important and even though many people who work in the retail space find their way there as a transition between the end of one semester and the beginning of another.Students or younger members of our society are not the only people who find meaningful work in retail and who ultimately end up building their entire careers around working for retailer or brand or some company in the design and construction industry who's connected to designing and building stores.And somehow our society has often placed a judgment on what type of retail you might likely be engaged in. I have often heard the position that price point of product is somehow equated to pride in a sales associate's work or price of products being a precursor to better service but this should not be the case. Experiences in retail stores should not be better if the products it sells are expensive. Service should be excellent across the product price spectrum of retail experiences.In fact we've all probably had experiences where being in high priced stores did not render necessarily better service.The point is that you need to strip away what you sell and deliver high levels of experience regardless of the product or the service that you're providing to your customers.Providing great service often has to do with how people connect to others and the level of emotional intelligence that sales associates bring to their job every day. Which also suggests that the way we train sales associates in customer interaction protocols might likely be less about the rubric of sequential steps on how to connect – first you do this, say that, then do this, and say that – but might likely be more effective if you train on why we all need emotionally resonant, empathic connection – how empathy is built into our collective DNA.And this is where my guest, Ron Thurston comes into the story.Ron suggests that empathy, curiosity and focus translate into every job in retail. He believes that we need to teach human connection rather than sales training. I would bet that most of us can spot the ‘sales pitch' a mile away. We could almost speak the script because we have been exposed to it too many times.Ron Thurston's life mission is to celebrate, elevate, and empower the people and spirit of the retail industry.Core to his philosophy is to stop referring to your career in retail as “accidental” because you diminish you own power. Its ok to say “I choose to be the best sales associate, leader or stock person and I am proud of my role in the world of retail.”With over three decades of leading retail stores and operations for top American brands like Gap, West Elm, Apple, Tory Burch, Bonobos, and Saint Laurent, Ron has honed an extensive skill set in retail strategy, management, and innovation.In January 2024, Ron co-founded OSSY, a forward-thinking retail recruiting agency. This venture is dedicated to addressing the biggest hiring and recruiting challenges in retail, reinforcing Ron's unwavering commitment to the industry.As the best-selling author of RETAIL PRIDE, Ron inspires retail professionals to embrace their unique career paths. He also hosted the RETAIL IN AMERICA podcast and tour, journeying across the nation in an Airstream trailer during 2022/2023 to uncover and highlight the remarkable stories and individuals in retail.I was happy to catch up with Ron Thurston after his key note presentation at the SHOP Marketplace event and sit down for a great talk…             *                         *                         *ABOUT DAVID KEPRON:LinkedIn Profile: linkedin.com/in/david-kepron-9a1582bWebsites:  https://www.davidkepron.com    (personal website)vmsd.com/taxonomy/term/8645  (Blog)Email: david.kepron@NXTLVLexperiencedesign.comTwitter: DavidKepronPersonal Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/davidkepron/NXTLVL Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nxtlvl_experience_design/Bio:David Kepron is a multifaceted creative professional with a deep curiosity to understand ‘why', ‘what's now' and ‘what's next'. He brings together his background as an architect, artist, educator, author, podcast host and builder to the making of meaningful and empathically-focused, community-centric customer connections at brand experience places around the globe. David is a former VP - Global Design Strategies at Marriott International. While at Marriott, his focus was on the creation of compelling customer experiences within Marriott's “Premium Distinctive” segment which included: Westin, Renaissance, Le Meridien, Autograph Collection, Tribute Portfolio, Design Hotels and Gaylord hotels. In 2020 Kepron founded NXTLVL Experience Design, a strategy and design consultancy, where he combines his multidisciplinary approach to the creation of relevant brand engagements with his passion for social and cultural anthropology, neuroscience and emerging digital technologies. As a frequently requested international speaker at corporate events and international conferences focusing on CX, digital transformation, retail, hospitality, emerging technology, David shares his expertise on subjects ranging from consumer behaviors and trends, brain science and buying behavior, store design and visual merchandising, hotel design and strategy as well as creativity and innovation. In his talks, David shares visionary ideas on how brand strategy, brain science and emerging technologies are changing guest expectations about relationships they want to have with brands and how companies can remain relevant in a digitally enabled marketplace. David currently shares his experience and insight on various industry boards including: VMSD magazine's Editorial Advisory Board, the Interactive Customer Experience Association, Sign Research Foundation's Program Committee as well as the Center For Retail Transformation at George Mason University.He has held teaching positions at New York's Fashion Institute of Technology (F.I.T.), the Department of Architecture & Interior Design of Drexel University in Philadelphia, the Laboratory Institute of Merchandising (L.I.M.) in New York, the International Academy of Merchandising and Design in Montreal and he served as the Director of the Visual Merchandising Department at LaSalle International Fashion School (L.I.F.S.) in Singapore.  In 2014 Kepron published his first book titled: “Retail (r)Evolution: Why Creating Right-Brain Stores Will Shape the Future of Shopping in a Digitally Driven World” and he is currently working on his second book to be published soon. David also writes a popular blog called “Brain Food” which is published monthly on vmsd.com.  The next level experience design podcast is presented by VMSD magazine and Smartwork Media. It is hosted and executive produced by David Kepron. Our original music and audio production by Kano Sound. The content of this podcast is copywrite to David Kepron and NXTLVL Experience Design. Any publication or rebroadcast of the content is prohibited without the expressed written consent of David Kepron and NXTLVL Experience Design.Make sure to tune in for more NXTLVL “Dialogues on DATA: Design Architecture Technology and the Arts” wherever you find your favorite podcasts and make sure to visit vmsd.com and look for the tab for the NXTLVL Experience Design podcast there too.

S4:E3 Revolutionizing Retail Hiring: A Conversation with Ron ThurstonIn this episode of the Retail Razor Show, hosts Ricardo Belmar and Casey Golden welcome back Ron Thurston, founder of OSSY, and author of 'Retail Pride', to discuss the company's innovative approach to transforming the retail hiring process. Focusing on the integration of AI and the human touch, Ron shares insights into how OSSY is addressing common retail recruitment challenges, such as speed to hire, candidate experience, and the importance of clear career paths. The discussion highlights the broader implications for the retail industry and the immense value of creating supportive and accountable hiring practices. This episode is a must-listen for anyone involved in retail and retail hiring.Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Expert for 2024, 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, RETHINK Retail Top Retail Expert for 2024 and 2023, and Retail Cloud Alliance advisory council member. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Overclocked, and E-Motive from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno.The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Goodpods: https://bit.ly/TRRSgoodpodsFollow us on Instagram: https://bit.ly/TRRSinstaFollow us on Threads: https://bit.ly/TRRSthreadsFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo BelmarFollow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarCo-host → Casey GoldenFollow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICasey

Ron Thurston is the Co-Founder of OSSY, a full-service retail recruiting platform connecting retailers, candidates, and solution providers. Brian Librach is the author of The Retail Leaders Roadmap and founder of the wellwisher company. 

Ron Thurston turned his passion for retail into the book Retail Pride and podcast series Retail in America. Now, he's turning his learnings speaking with retail leaders, associates and emerging talent alike into a new company: OSSY. During this episode of Retail Remix, he reflects on how his career pivot over the past three years has brought him to founding OSSY. He discusses: What's “broken” in retailers' approach to talent acquisition and hiring; The hidden biases in the recruitment process; Why it's time for retailers to rethink talent progression and training; and How OSSY is designed to empower emerging retail talent to take charge of their careers. RELATED LINKSConnect with Ron Thurston on LinkedInLearn more about OSSYFollow Retail Pride on InstagramListen to our previous episode with Ron

Ken interviews three experts in Retail store staffing for the inaugural Tech Talk podcast episode.Sharonda Weatherspoon is the SVP, Head of Retail Transformation, Client Development, and Operations, as well as the Co-Chair of North America's Diversity and Inclusion ERG. She has spent over 24 years at Ralph Lauren, surviving my tenure, and moving up through the ranks, starting as a General Manager, and in her most recent role, as SVP of retail stores from North America. Sharonda has always worked directly with the stores and fully understands the frontline experience where her focus has been to create the best customer experience and the appropriate staff to support it.Ron Thurston is the founder of OSSY, a platform that aggregates store employee talent from sales associate to leadership roles, enabling retailers and brands to easily access Aussie's labor pool. Ron is also the author of the Amazon bestseller, Retail Pride, championing joy and success in the service industry. Ron's book draws on his experience and store leadership roles with Intermix, San Laurent, Tory Burch, Apple, West Elm, and Gap. Ron also hosts a podcast, Retail in America.Mike Myers is the co-founder and CEO of Reflex and has spent the last decade building early stage companies as both a founder and an early stage venture. Reflex works with some of the top brands in retail today and helps brands leverage a flexible labor model to drive store performance. Retailers use Reflex to connect with experienced on-demand retail store associates and to flex their labor models to support the real time needs of the business.Key Takeaways from this episode are:1.    Evolution of Retail Staffing Post-COVID: The post-COVID environment has significantly changed the landscape of retail staffing. Retailers have had to adapt rapidly to evolving business models, leading to challenges in finding and retaining talent. Competing for local talent, dealing with the gig economy, upskilling rapidly, and identifying the right candidate profiles have become significant hurdles.2.    Shift Towards On-Demand Flexible Talent: The emergence of platforms like Reflex has transformed the staffing model. They facilitate connecting retailers with on-demand, experienced retail talent, allowing for real-time staffing adjustments based on business needs rather than fixed hiring plans.3.    Tech-Driven Recruitment Solutions: Reflex, as a tech platform, streamlines the staffing process. It provides a platform for retailers to access a pool of vetted workers for various roles, from back of house to front of house, offering flexibility in scheduling and facilitating worker-retailer feedback through ratings and reviews.4.    Challenges and Benefits of Adopting New Staffing Models: Trust remains a significant obstacle for retailers adopting flexible staffing solutions like Reflex. However, the platform's benefits, including reducing turnover costs, addressing immediate staffing needs, and potential cost savings in comparison to traditional hiring and retention methods, make a compelling case for its adoption.5.    Changing the Perception of Retail Jobs: The introduction of platforms like Ossy seeks to redefine the hiring process, especially for the retail workforce. It aims to replace traditional resumes with dynamic digital profiles, utilizing AI-driven algorithms to match candidates with suitable retail roles, focusing on soft skills, empathy, and curiosity, ultimately changing how individuals perceive and access retail job opportunities.6.    Industry Insights through Trade Shows and Networking: Sharonda gains industry knowledge and stays updated by attending trade shows like NRF. and various others. Networking through LinkedIn and connections with individuals like Ron and Mike allows her to stay informed about innovative solutions.7.    Innovative Solutions in Staffing: Both Ossy and Reflex offer platforms that provide accessible solutions through mobile applications and digital platforms, simplifying the staffing process compared to traditional methods like phone calls or emails. These platforms offer an automated and convenient way to connect available staff to positions.8.    Integration of AI: Both Ossy and Reflex are integrating AI into their platforms. Ossy aims to replace the traditional resume with a more interactive and multimedia-based platform for job seekers, while Reflex employs AI in the background to enhance the operational experience for workers and retailers without overtly marketing it as an AI platform.9.    Marketing Challenges and Strategies: Both platforms face marketing challenges in a crowded space. They are using strategies like word-of-mouth referrals, industry events (such as Shop Talk and NRF), and social media channels like TikTok and Instagram for worker acquisition. They also emphasize thought leadership, sharing insights, and building a presence within the retail industry.10. Funding and Business Challenges: Ossy is self-funded with an intention to create a new category, while Reflex has raised $12 million in funding and is focused on delivering for retail partners, launching new markets, and scaling worker experiences. Building the right tech infrastructure and understanding the time investment required has been a significant challenge for both platforms.

As we approach the end of Season 3 of the Retail Razor Show, hosts Ricardo Belmar and Casey Golden engage in a rich dialogue with The Vitamin Shoppe's Chief Customer Officer, Nadina Guglielmetti. They explore how customer behavior insights guide business decisions, the interplay between acquiring new customers and nurturing existing ones, and the evolution of customer experience amidst changing health trends. Nadina also details the role of The Vitamin Shoppe's in-store health enthusiasts in enhancing customer engagement and trust, and their careful approach towards leveraging AI and 'headless commerce' platforms to enhance efficiency and personalization. In this final Retail Transformer episode of the season, you'll learn why Nadina is truly more than meets the eye!We also bring you the final episode in Season 1 of our "Blade to Greatness" mini-series. This episode features an insightful conversation with retail expert, Ron Thurston, co-founder of Ossy, author of Retail Pride, the Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career, host of the Retail in America nationwide tour and podcast, speaker, advisor, board member, and former retail operations leader at numerous famous retail brands. Ron shares his three pillars of success in retail and life- empathy, curiosity, and focus. He illuminates strategies to bridge the communication gap between corporate offices and stores, emphasizing the importance of empathy in grasping the pressures faced by in-store teams, the power of curiosity to understand their needs and experiences, and the role of focus in dealing with the information obtained. Ron also emphasizes the importance of maintaining transparency and dialogue with retail employees from the recruitment stage, thus enhancing their sense of belonging and commitment.NEWS! We are thrilled to report that our fans support propelled us as a finalist in The Retail Voice Award for the Vendors In Partnership award gala at NRF 2024! You're votes made a difference and we're honored to be one of 3 finalists for this prestigious award!WOW! As we march into our 3rd year on the show, we're honored and humbled to have hit the top of the charts on the Goodpodspodcast platform!#1 in the Top 100 Indie Management Weekly chart#3 in the Top 100 Indie Management Monthly chart#3 in the Top 100 Indie Marketing Weekly chart#5 in the Top 100 Marketing Weekly chart#6 in the Top 100 Marketing Monthly chartWe can't thank our Goodpods listeners enough! We love your support! Please continue giving us those 5-star ratings and send us your comments!Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Overclocked, E-Motive, and Swag, Tag & Brag from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno.The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Goodpods: https://bit.ly/TRRSgoodpodsFollow us on Instagram: https://bit.ly/TRRSinstaFollow us on Threads: https://bit.ly/TRRSthreadsFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICasey

Our final recording, live and in-person, raw and uncut, from Groceryshop 2023 has our hosts, Ricardo Belmar and guest host Jeff Roster learning how to harness the power of spatial computing with returning guest, Neil Redding, Founder and CEO of Redding Futures! Part of our special cross-over event with This Week in Innovation podcast, Jeff and Ricardo sat down with Neil to understand how Auki Labs new product release is redefining retail operations via the benefits of spatial computing and augmented reality, resulting in increased productivity and efficiency for store teams. The trio discuss what the future looks like for spatial computing use cases in retail, attempt to forecast the market for spatial computing, consider applications with autonomous vehicles and robotics, and close the discussion with a fun look at how Apple's mainstreaming of spatial computing might impact the technology's future!We also bring you the latest episode in our "Blade to Greatness" mini-series. In this segment, we invite a retail industry leader to offer one skill or trait that all retail executives need to become great leaders. Whether in stores or at corporate, we'll uncover valuable tips and advice that you can apply to your own retail career path. Ron Thurston, co-founder of Ossy, author of Retail Pride, the Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career, host of the Retail in America nationwide tour and podcast, speaker, advisor, board member, and former retail operations leader at Intermix, Saint Laurent, Bonobos, Tory Burch, Apple, and Williams-Sonoma joins us to share his insights on the issues facing frontline retail workers and retail leaders today.In this episode, Ron talks to us about why it's so important for retail leaders to implement a career development culture as the first step to change their mindset and make change in the recruiting and retention of retail employees!NEWS! We are pleased to announce that the Retail Razor Show is a Vendors In Partnership Awards nominee for The Retail Voice Award at the upcoming NRF Big Show 2024! We're asking all our listeners and YouTube viewers to help us win by showing your love for our show in the voting polls:Here's how you can help by voting:1. Visit https://bit.ly/3QlKr4X2. Register to vote.3. Vote for The Retail Razor Show in The Retail Voice Award category.WOW! As we zoom past our 2-year anniversary on the show, we're honored and humbled to have hit the top of the charts on the Goodpods podcast platform!No. 1 in the Top 100 Indie Management Podcasts of the week chartNo. 2 in the Top 100 Indie Management Podcasts of the month chartNo. 5 in the Top 100 Indie Marketing Podcasts of the week chartWe can't thank our Goodpods listeners enough! We love your support! Please continue giving us those 5-star ratings and send us your comments!About our Guest:Neil Redding is a keynote speaker, author, Innovation Architect and Near Futurist. Neil has worked at the convergence of digital and physical for decades, and is an expert in spatial computing, virtual and augmented reality (VR/AR), AI and convergent brand ecosystems. Neil currently leads Redding Futures, a boutique consultancy that enables brands and businesses to powerfully the Near Future. Prior to founding Redding Futures, Neil held leadership roles at Mediacom, Proximity/BBDO, Gensler, ThoughtWorks, Auki Labs, and Lab49. Neil is also editor of Near Future of Retail, author of the forthcoming book The Ecosystem Paradigm, and advises multiple startups at the leading edge of the digital-physical convergence.Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Overclocked, E-Motive, and Swag, Tag, And Brag from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Goodpods: https://bit.ly/TRRSgoodpodsFollow us on Instagram: https://bit.ly/TRRSinstaFollow us on Threads: https://bit.ly/TRRSthreadsFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICasey

Our spotlight shines again on immersive commerce this episode! We are answering a critically important question for retailers - what is the future of video commerce? To answer this question and truly dive deep into the treasure trove of conversion that is video commerce we've invited Vincent Yang, co-founder and CEO of Firework to the show! Vincent guides us through understanding the true nature and capabilities of video commerce. It's a fascinating discussion where you'll come away with an incredible list of insights and best practices you can apply to your retail business! We start with livestreaming, move to shoppable video and areas far beyond. Join us as we venture into mid-funnel and bottom funnel marketing strategies, to brand awareness tactics, to understanding marketing vs advertising and learn how video drives human engagement online. If you thought livestreaming was all there is to video in retail – think again! You'll learn why a video commerce strategy is the digital equivalent to having an engaging store associate guide your customer journey.Plus, we bring you the fourth topic in our new leadership segment on the show – ‘Blade to Greatness'! Ron Thurston, co-founder of Ossy, author of Retail Pride, the Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career, host of the Retail in America nationwide tour and podcast, speaker, advisor, board member, and former retail operations leader at Intermix, Saint Laurent, Bonobos, Tory Burch, Apple, and Williams-Sonoma joins us to share his insights on the issues facing frontline retail workers and retail leaders today.In this episode, Ron talks to us about one of the most important skills a retail leader needs to master:How to reframe your current job search processes to hire the right person!We're currently at number 18 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list – if you enjoy our show, please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts & help keep moving our way up the Top 20! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Wow! Join us in celebrating our top of the charts achievements on the Goodpods podcast player!No. 2 Podcast of the Week on the Management chartsTop 5 Podcast of the Month in the Management chartsTop 5 Podcast of the Week on the Marketing ChartsThank you Goodpods listeners! We love your support! Please continue giving us those 5-star ratings and send us your comments!Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Overclocked, E-Motive, and Swag, Tag & Brag from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Goodpods: https://bit.ly/TRRSgoodpodsFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICasey

In this episode of the RETHINK Retail podcast, host and Top Retail Influencer, Ron Thurston interviews Samir Sheth, SVP, Content and Membership at ŌURA, a trailblazing company that has taken health tracking to the next level. ŌURA, which started ten years ago in Finland, seeks to empower its members to live healthier lives by providing them with a small, lightweight ring that collects biosignals accurately. The company aims to differentiate itself by not only tracking data from the wearer's finger but also providing guidance and insights to help users take action based on that data. Join Ron as he explores the fascinating intersection of technology, health, and personal empowerment with Samir. Whether you're a wellness enthusiast, a tech aficionado, or simply curious about the future of health tracking, this episode is a must-listen. If you enjoyed this episode, please let us know by subscribing to our channel and giving us a 5-star rating on Spotify and Apple Podcasts! - - - - - - Hosted by Top Retail Influencer Ron Thurston Produced by Gabriella Bock Research by Maggie Schwenn

Today as part of our Back to Basics of Retailing theme this season, we are once again focusing on people – the frontline workers in retail stores, and the process of hiring and retaining the best candidates. In this episode we answer two incredibly important questions– How do we change how we hire, connect, and match retail brands to retail workers, respectfully, transparently, and humanly? And can technology help? To answer these questions and more, we meet our latest Retail Transformer & fan favorite - Ron Thurston, author of Retail Pride, the Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career, Host of the Retail in America nationwide tour and podcast, former retail operations leader at Intermix, Saint Laurent, Bonobos, Tory Burch, Apple, and Williams-Sonoma, and now co-founder of Ossy, a business we'll hear more about in the episode and how it's disrupting the hiring process!Plus, we bring you the second topic in our new leadership segment on the show – ‘Blade to Greatness'! In this segment, we invite a retail industry leader to offer one skill or trait that all retail executives need to become great leaders. Whether in stores or at corporate, we'll uncover valuable tips and advice that you can apply to your own retail career path. Jeffrey McNulty, Founder and CEO of New Retail Ethos Consultancy, author of The Ultimate Retail Manual, and creator of The Ultimate Retail Course: Become a Retail RockStar returns to the show for this powerful new segment to discuss an incredibly important skill retail leaders need – supporting employee autonomy!Jeffrey is offering a special discount on his retail course for Retail Razor Show listeners with discount code RETAILROCKSTAR100OFF at this website: http://www.theultimateretailcourse.com/We've moved up to No. 16 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list – if you enjoy our show, please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts and help us continue our climb up the Top 20! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Wow! Join us in celebrating our recent top of the charts achievements on the Goodpods podcast player!#1 in the Top Indie Management Podcasts chart#2 in the Top Management Podcasts chart#4 in the Top Marketing Podcasts chartsThank you Goodpods listeners! We love your support! Please continue giving us those 5-star ratings and provide your comments!Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Overclocked, E-Motive, and Swag, Tag & Brag from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Goodpods: https://bit.ly/TRRSgoodpodsFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICasey

We've been on quite a wild ride this season with topics ranging from the metaverse, to retail media networks, to the future of ecommerce and DTC, plus our Retail Transformers, and including special interviews and recaps of three major industry events – Grocery Shop, NRF, and Shop Talk! But now we've reached The Razor's Edge, our Season 2 finale, with special guest host Paul do Forno, Managing Director of the Commerce Practice at Deloitte Digital, turning the tables on our dynamic duo to walk through the season calling out all the highlights!In this episode, Paul turns our regular hosts, Ricardo and Casey, into the show's guests and starts with a check-in on how their Top 10 Predictions for 2023 are holding up so far this year. Then he looks back through the season and asks our hosts what some of their favorites were in each of our min-series and special episodes. What were your favorites? Who was your favorite Retail Transformer? Find out how you match up to our hosts' choices! And of course, Paul can't resist but ask for hints on what's to come in Season 3!We're now standing at number 19 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list – if you enjoy our show, please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts! With your help, we'll move our way up the Top 20! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Meet your regular hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Overclocked, from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS2E13 The Razor's Edge - S2 Finale[00:00:00] Season 2 Finale[00:00:20] Paul do Forno: Hello, Retail Razor listeners, and welcome to Season Two Grand Finale. As you might have noticed, I am not your usual host. I'm Paul do Forno. I'm part of the leadership team at Commerce Practice at Deloitte Digital. We're one of the largest commerce consulting companies in the world, and we help everything from strategy to design to implementing platforms.[00:00:42] But today I am your guest hosts and I'm turning the tables on the Dynamic Duo interviewing them. So let's bring in these weeks guests, Ricardo and Casey. Casey, Ricardo, thank you so much for having me as your guest host for season two finale.[00:00:59] Ricardo Belmar: Hey [00:01:00] Paul, it is awesome having you here with us.[00:01:01] Casey Golden: I mean, how lucky are we to have you on the actual podcast? it's so nice to have you over here. Thanks for doing this.[00:01:10] Paul do Forno: Well, how does it feel being on the other side? Do you feel a little pressure now? I you don't know what I'm gonna ask.[00:01:16] Casey Golden: It's always a bit awkward to be your own guest, but I'm excited to answer some questions since I am usually on the side of asking questions.[00:01:25] Paul do Forno: Okay. [00:01:26] Ricardo Belmar: feeling the same way it is a little odd being, not being the one asking the questions on your own podcast. but this is gonna be fun. So I'm glad you're joining us. I'm thrilled we're turning things around and I can't wait to see how you're gonna try to trip us up here in the finale.[00:01:39] Paul do Forno: All right. All right. Well, I can't wait to dive in. So here we go. First I wanna check in with both of you. You had top 10 list of predictions this year, and I know we're not all the way through the year, but we wanna check in to see where you're at and which ones you feel that are totally on track, or which ones are totally off track.[00:02:00] So Ricardo.[00:02:01] Ricardo Belmar: this could get interesting. Good thing there's no audience to throw things at us.[00:02:05] Paul do Forno: You ready for the questions, Casey?[00:02:08] Casey Golden: Yeah, and Ricardo, I'm a good catch, but I love q and a, so I do miss having a live audience. I'm feeling pretty good, but Ricardo and I come from two different perspectives. That's why I think we're a little bit more fun to listen to. We do not agree on everything.[00:02:24] Paul do Forno: All right. All right. That's good. That's why we're here. All right. For the second part, I'm also gonna ask you about your favorite parts of the season and a few surprise questions along the way and follow up. I'm gonna test some of the things that you come back with. [00:02:39] Checking in on those 2023 predictions[00:02:39] Paul do Forno: okay, let's jump in. First question, Ricardo. Let's start with you. You each gave five prediction this year and so , which you think maybe are the long shot and out, out of those long shots, which one do you think will really come true by the end of the year and why?[00:02:59] Ricardo Belmar: [00:03:00] Oh, you really went for that one, didn't you? I like 'em all though.[00:03:03] Paul do Forno: Wow. Just pick one. Let's focus on one for today.[00:03:06] Ricardo Belmar: All right. I guess I'll pick one. , if I have to pick one, I guess I would have to pick the one I gave on the anywhere commerce versus immersive commerce.[00:03:15] Paul do Forno: Okay. Let's hear some more about it.[00:03:17] Ricardo Belmar: Well, I, feel like that's the one that's maybe the most far out there of the predictions I did in that it's not just about retailers being the one to seriously adopt immersive tech, like AR and VR. And embracing other new technologies to get commerce in the right context in new locations. Like we talked about integrating it in your car, being in a stadium at a game or something like that.[00:03:41] But it's not just about the retailers integrating the tech. It also requires consumers to be willing to adopt these at the same time. So there's a little bit of an element of the stars aligning on this one to make it come true and work out. So I think maybe that's my long shot. I'm still sticking with it though.[00:03:58] Paul do Forno: Okay, it's gonna take a [00:04:00] little bit longer. Ca. Casey, what do you think?[00:04:02] Casey Golden: I'm completely opposite, I believe a hundred percent and anywhere commerce and contextual commerce that every single consumer touchpoint is gonna turn into a point of sale, but it is gonna be a little bit more of a long shot as far as it's gonna take longer, but I believe that it is a hundred percent there.[00:04:22] This punch in immersive has massive demand and I think it's moved a lot of builders into creating better foundational structures so that we can get interesting experiences and more virtual experiences that I think is gonna fuel that. But we really need better checkout and I think everybody in that space that's very forward and immersive shopping and this, these metaverse plays and virtual experiences, they're learning supply chain right now. And so once I think this kind of bridges, [00:05:00] there's gonna be some beautiful magic.[00:05:01] Paul do Forno: So I noticed you guys didn't say the word as part of all that. You didn't say the word omnichannel. Is [00:05:07] Casey Golden: It doesn't exist. It never has.[00:05:10] Paul do Forno: What's that?[00:05:11] Casey Golden: It doesn't exist. It never has.[00:05:13] Paul do Forno: Ah, okay.[00:05:14] Ricardo Belmar: all just commerce. I'm gonna keep saying it's just commerce. We don't need to label it omnichannel or anything because I think all that ever, I dunno. It feels like all we ended up accomplishing was confusion with that.[00:05:25] Paul do Forno: All right. No good perspectives. It I think this is the one it'll be interesting, it may take longer to get the full view, but then I think once we get closer to that, the goalposts will change again. So it will be interesting. Alright. Casey, same question to you. What's your biggest long shot and why?[00:05:46] Casey Golden: So my biggest long shot is, B N P L. I just don't feel that it's good for consumers and there will be more consumer protection initiatives around the entire entity. It's [00:06:00] bulking customers up with debt does not help your customer experience and brand relationship when that payment that might be coming at you every single month is coming because it's a branded product, it, I think it does negatively infect the brand.[00:06:15] But I understand the value of it opening up cash flow for like younger demographics and just for people in general. It does open up cash flow to buy things that you want or need but I'm very conflicted on the two sides of it. However, Apple Pay Later has now launched so that kind of throws a wrench in my biggest long shot. So, Now that Apple users can split their purchases into four interest free payments over six months without a fee, I think it might be a long shot that Affirm, After Pay, Klarna, and PayPal make it.[00:06:50] Paul do Forno: So what? What do you think Ricardo?[00:06:54] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah I don't know. I think, When we recorded that one and Casey went through that prediction I think the thought was, is [00:07:00] it gonna be a little bit of a blow up or explosion in terms of consumer protections, but now maybe it's gonna blow up in a different direction with Apple launching Apple Pay Later.[00:07:10] May, maybe it's more now a matter of, are the other company, like you just said in Casey are these all these other companies gonna survive doing that now that they're gonna have to compete directly with Apple on their platform[00:07:20] Casey Golden: I mean, Apple's done. Now we just need a Google one and[00:07:23] Ricardo Belmar: yeah, if Google comes out with a pay later now, then it's really gonna be done.[00:07:27] Paul do Forno: I guess, I guess I might be here in being a little bit of the counter to this. So actually the stats came out and the numbers on B N P L last year, I don't have it right in front of me, but it was multiple billions of dollars. It was the fastest growing payment channel. And so it's not a long, it's here.[00:07:47] But I think your point, Casey's a nuanced one where the effect on the brand and how it's used, that's something that I think, needs to be figured out that's [00:08:00] the concern long term, right? Like I think that buy now pay later is here for a long time. In fact, I actually first saw this and it was weird.[00:08:10] I went to Brazil for the first time in 2011, and everywhere you went, buy now, pay later was, that was just the standard way that they paid because that's the demographics that were there and that's the way they paid. And so I, especially given, some of the economic trends and how people are buying, I think this is a long-term stay.[00:08:33] The question is gonna be who and then how best to use it within the brand. That ju just my two, my 2 cents there. All right. Next question. Now that we got these long shots outta the way, Ricardo, which one for you are you most sure of and why?[00:08:53] Ricardo Belmar: Ah, okay. This, I think this one's a little easier for me to pick, cuz honestly, all you have to do is look at any of the news outlets [00:09:00] that are out there today covering tech and covering retail and just everywhere. I mean it, it's an obvious one for me. It's a prediction on generative ai. So things like, whether it's chat, g p t, dall-e two g p t four, there's the Microsoft co-pilot announcement.[00:09:13] All these things coming out. I think it was the last prediction we had in, in our list. We saved the best for last maybe, but I think this is this is one is all as close to an automatic win. I think as we're gonna get in one of these predictions, just given where it's trending is pretty much every retailer I talk to just about every account manager and field rep I talk to at Microsoft is saying the same thing, every customer is looking at this and asking, how do I use this?[00:09:36] Everybody's got a long list of use cases they wanna apply it to. They wanna understand. How to build with it, how to apply it. When we had our top retail influencers calls with Rethink Retail, it was two months in a row it was a topic that everybody wanted to talk about.[00:09:51] Everyone had something to say about it. Everyone's got an opinion about it. And they're just, I don't know, so many use cases. I mean, one of my favorite ones seeing [00:10:00] CarMax doing , where they're using the AI tools to help a customer doing research on their site to automatically summarize all the reviews on cars.[00:10:08] So instead of having to read thousands and thousands of reviews, you just ask a few questions and it gives you a summary with everything you need to know. So just coolest. And that's such a simple, if I can explain it in two sentences, you can ask the two sentences and get a summary.[00:10:21] Can't get much better than that.[00:10:23] Paul do Forno: That, that seems the most obvious one, but I, just to put you on the spot, I know you, you talked about an interesting one and, but let's talk specifically about commerce. What component of commerce do you think this would apply most? Like what area?[00:10:40] Ricardo Belmar: I think we're gonna see it apply in, in, in stages. I think initially anything related to discovery and product discovery, new ways of searching. So search will move I think from trying to think of what keyword do I use? We don't wanna search for a product ,now I can really be super descriptive.[00:10:56] I can talk about what my intent is when I wanna search for something. [00:11:00] Like just, I'm just thinking examples. Like if I'm searching for new, for apparel products instead of having to use keywords like it's, I'm searching for, jeans right, or shirts or whatever it's gonna be. I can describe how I'm gonna wear it and where I'm gonna wear it, and now as part of that search process and these tools are gonna give me different responses based on that.[00:11:18] So I think being able to apply intent and more, almost a point more emotional feeling of how I'm gonna use this product in that search. I think that's gonna be the, probably the first area where it's gonna have a big impact on commerce.[00:11:31] Casey Golden: And that's exactly what I don't agree on anything. AI is not gonna help you get dressed in the morning. I promise.[00:11:42] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:11:44] Casey Golden: But no, I think that, Listen, I think when we're buying clothing it's emotional and I don't think we can have a non-emotional entity help us make these emotional decisions. But when it comes to function, a hundred percent, I [00:12:00] think affecting mass commerce and I don't get excited about buying another cell phone charger.[00:12:07] I need to buy some recording information like pieces. So I look like Ricardo and I have a mic and all these things. Yes, that I definitely see, like there's these ways that AI is gonna definitely impact search. I think it could for a period of time dis disrupt. Why? The only way we see things is if there's ad money behind it.[00:12:29] And I think we can get a lot better information and products teed up to us based off of function. But. Leave it to me to make sure you have the right clothes, Ricardo. Um, I think the immediate[00:12:43] Ricardo Belmar: do better than the AI[00:12:45] Casey Golden: well, yeah, we'll do much better, but I think the number one thing I'm seeing right now is managing products and uploading products into e-comm is painful and often a very manual process.[00:12:58] And so product [00:13:00] descriptions right outta the box, being able to create clear product descriptions that are interesting, compelling, and again, going back to your point, Ricardo, that will impact search. But coming up with the tags different categorizes categories for everything on there in e-comm I think will be good.[00:13:19] Uploading products, changing image sizes, being able to do some of these things more automated and painful processes I think is an immediate lift. [00:13:31] Paul do Forno: Yeah, make makes sense. That makes sense and I think there will be more stuff that we haven't even thought of and adjacent to it. It's something that's gonna fit the whole stack of everything. So just to take another example of helping the coders, right? There's all these tools to help on the coding side.[00:13:49] So the turnaround time on some of the coding and looking at coding is, it is gonna be helped. So if you start looking at your whole, and [00:14:00] you mentioned supply chain earlier, right? If you start looking at everything, if everything gets improved, 5 10% that's where that whole effect comes in.[00:14:08] So beyond just the experience part, I think it's gonna affect the whole stack.[00:14:15] Casey Golden: yeah, Canva had an update last this week. That was probably the best product update release I've ever seen. And there is generative art, there is redesigning your slides with ai. You have chat sheet bts in there. All of these solutions and all of these pieces just kind of came in, wrapped up like a present.[00:14:39] And I have to say, they've like 10 Xed my speed to create. And it did a phenomenal job. And, there's designers that are using it to create, they'll design one product and then they'll use the generative AI to create 10 more styles. And that's where I'm like, okay, now I'm getting a little bit [00:15:00] conflicted again between, I believe designers should be talented human beings that get to achieve their dreams versus being replaced.[00:15:10] So I think we'll see what kind of happens here. As of today, Italy's ban, g p t Chat, G P t. They'll come around. Everybody always does, but I think that that's kind of interesting. They feel that there are unlawfully processing people's data and privacy issues. So[00:15:27] Ricardo Belmar: Hmm.[00:15:28] Paul do Forno: Interesting. Yeah. So how long before we all become prompt engineers? Right. I've already seen those. I've already seen people start to publish like, Hey, I'm a prompt engineer. I'm an expert, so there you go. New roles popping up all the time[00:15:46] Ricardo Belmar: Yep, new roles.[00:15:47] Paul do Forno: All right. Casey, what about you? What's your sure thing prediction.[00:15:52] Casey Golden: sure thing is the explosion of CDPs. So customer data platforms, there is really [00:16:00] no excuse anymore for a customer to have of a bad experience with your brand. Not being able to produce like basic functional care to shoppers. Is unacceptable. And the main reason that we still have this is because a lot of the customer experience and customer support is fragmented and none of that data is really available to anybody that needs it.[00:16:26] It's available to everybody who doesn't need it in a lot of the time. Like when the customer is with you and you need it, they don't have access. And so I think that having CDPs essentially come in and start pulling all of this data together so that everybody has one point system, whether or not it's checking on an order, which hopefully , AI's gonna take care of.[00:16:48] You don't need to do that anymore. But we're gonna have different database systems to be able to pull all this customer information together and really be able to craft more around the consumer. [00:17:00] And I think that this is just gonna cause more of an extinction of traditional CRMs over maybe the next five years.[00:17:07] The way we think of a CRM, the way we, the box we put it in, I think it's, not gonna be there anymore. And so, the CDP is becoming mission critical for a company I believe this year needs to enter and see essentially how it's gonna be deployed over the next, like 18 to 24 months. But I don't see a company being able to operate in 2024 without a C D P.[00:17:37] Paul do Forno: Well, that's a great commercial for my C D P group, but, uh, but let, let me challenge you on that, of the one that you want this to happen earlier, knowing, especially some of the big enterprise brands that we work with, some of the challenges that they have of just tying all the [00:18:00] different systems. It's one thing if it, if you're dealing with a direct to consumer, one brand, smaller when you get into acquisitions and a holding company that owns all these different retailers, bringing 'em together, CDP is not easy and trying to get it.[00:18:15] Or they might have a version, kind of a C D P here, kind of c d p there. How do you coordinate it all together and so, I a hundred percent agree on this might, you might have jumped a question like, this is what you want to have as to, cuz this is harder. This ends up being a lot harder in my experience to get adoption earlier just because of all of the change management, all the different things that are out there.[00:18:44] But I a hundred percent agree they people need to go to this.[00:18:47] Casey Golden: Well, I think you're right. I mean, it can be, it can be a lot more complicated. It's not in a lot of other companies best interest to want to integrate with your C D P, [00:19:00] and so I think that, there's gonna be a lot of change management there, but the way I see it is consumers are going to gain more and more and more.[00:19:11] Protection over their rights to their data. And if your GDPR compliant, like they already have more rights than we can service today. And so this is going to, it's going to be mandatory whether or not it's executed well or at a hundred percent. I just don't think that we can really go into next year without making sure that you're operating in compliance because compliance is gonna be, is already moving faster than the software companies.[00:19:45] Paul do Forno: What do you think Ricardo?[00:19:48] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I mean I definitely agree in principle and the need, right? And the want. I'm thinking about your point and Paul about how it's not easy necessarily, right? Especially the larger the organization, the more potential [00:20:00] disconnected systems there are that need to be connected to create that c d P.[00:20:04] I think it's doable. I work with some partners that are in this space as well. And I think they're doing a good job at something where, again it's where you wanna plug in the AI models into it to help with some of that.[00:20:13] So I think it's a doable thing, it may be one of those where when we're looking at it at the end of the year maybe it's not complete for some of the largest organizations and it's still in progress. But I think the, I think maybe Casey's point is, it as everyone moves to this that want and need is going to cause some action, right.[00:20:30] And people are gonna start doing things about it and moving in that direction. So even if they don't have it fully deployed and ready I, I think it, it's a valid point. And I, think from a prediction point of view, yeah. It means people are gonna be trying to leverage a C D P as much as they can by the end of the year.[00:20:47] Casey Golden: Yeah, I mean, I think really they're gonna make the purchase. I think last year, 640 billion was spent on customer experience software. They all need a c D P to power. Everything is [00:21:00] gonna need the c d P to power customer experiences. But we kind of have to start with where our core is. And so I think if I had to deploy monies or say, what's a sure thing, you're gonna need one and you, the sooner the better.[00:21:18] Paul do Forno: Awesome, Casey. Thank you for that. You just, I just, you just recorded my commercial for me that it's gonna be my pre roll intro to our CDP presentations, but let's move on. All right. I got one for you, for your other four predictions. Which ones do you think you most want to actually come to life?[00:21:39] Right? And you wanna see go big. So Casey, let's start with you.[00:21:44] Casey Golden: I want loyalty programs to mean something again. I think that there's a lot of emphasis on loyalty programs right now, and I've seen a lot of companies scaling back rewards at the same time and taking away common [00:22:00] perks. And so I'd really like to just see this loyalty program just facilitate into something that's actually going to build loyalty, not a marketing campaign. [00:22:14] I think that this is the moment where it could really be a differentiator in the brand, the customer experience, but if we keep diluting it or disrupting them, like it's just not, it seems more marketing than it is actually provide any services. And so, I think that this is a place where there's gonna be a lot of movement. And I see, anybody who's scaling back rewards I think that they're gonna have a negative impact onto their business.[00:22:46] And I think loyalty programs are just gonna really start meaning something interesting from access to product first. Access to buy at a discount, or even shop sale first. I think the loyalty programs [00:23:00] could turn into something really meaningful and have some really interesting perks that haven't really been the point.[00:23:07] Maybe not points, you know?[00:23:09] Paul do Forno: So, so Casey, is this part of your, your favorite hotel chain? Making sure you get that nice omelet and premium breakfast [00:23:17] Casey Golden: All right [00:23:18] Paul do Forno: of the old bagel.[00:23:19] Casey Golden: yeah. So like I get, you know, they, they put a little goldfish in my room and they make sure that Mr. Darcy's there. I don't expect the rest of the retail industry to be able to compare to the way that I might be treated at a hotel, or you might be treated at a hotel. But I do feel that there's an opportunity, if that's the top, why is the bottom like 10% off your next coffee after you buy a hundred? , what does it take to get a reward, like 50,000 points [00:24:00] for a dollar off your next order? , come on, let's do something. And I think that this is the moment where everybody's been talking about loyalty, whether or not they're adding more, taking it away. And there's a lot of loyalty programs out there, and I think that we're gonna get a, it's gonna turn into an actual program, not just about, pricing.[00:24:25] It's not just about discounts. I think it can be a lot more, and I think even mass merchants are gonna find something more than a discount.[00:24:32] Paul do Forno: Okay, Ricardo.[00:24:34] Ricardo Belmar: Ooh. So for me I would have to say it's that prediction had about automation in, in stores for frontline workers. Over the years, what I think there's always a lot of predictions around what's gonna change for store teams , years back or sort of really only talked about that in the context of better training for employees.[00:24:52] But I think now in, in recent years since the pandemic we're, we have a different perspective on what those store teams are doing and, and how they [00:25:00] work. And now that with, with labor shortages and things for retailers, I think there's more of a view of you have to actually make this environment better.[00:25:07] You've gotta provide the right tools that aren't intended to necessarily replace people in the store, but it's intended to make them. Make their jobs more efficient, more effective, more productive, hopefully getting rid of a lot of the annoying tasks that we force onto store teams to, that they have to take care of, but they keep them away from customers.[00:25:27] So I, I think we'll finally start to see some meaningful things done here with real deployments of technologies that , are having an impact. And I think with an end goal of trying to really make that environment so it's not just a job, but it's more about creating a career path where you might even, finally start looking at those em employee roles as not all being equal in that, some folks on your store team may have different skills and you need to actually take advantage of that in the sense that, , give them things they can do that are built on, [00:26:00] on those skills so that some of those store associates might have a different role than others.[00:26:04] And that's okay. That's a good thing because that helps create those career paths. So I think that's gonna be the one that I really wanna see go big.[00:26:13] Casey Golden: Thank you for amplifying the real retail heroes, Ricardo. I mean, Paul, if I bring this up, it's a sales pitch, so I don't talk about frontline workers very much on here, but I just, if you're moving forward, I think we just need to, to bring our people with us.[00:26:34] Paul do Forno: Yeah. And, it's a fascinating area in fact, I noticed at NRF, if you walk the floor, some of the biggest booths were actually targeted towards the frontline industry. I was actually surprised right at the front door. So some friends of mine, actually, startups that are now massive, and I, I know we're working with some fascinating, very large grocery retailers that to [00:27:00]automate, when they get into work, how can they prioritize their tasks, and also really interestingly, things change so much. Some, you know, there's a storm coming in h how do you rally the troops very quickly and things like that. So I, I think we're just at, at a tipping point of finding ways to really drive and empower the, frontline worker. So ,exciting.[00:27:23] I agree with that one. That will be really good.[00:27:26] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.[00:27:27] Looking back across the whole season[00:27:27] Paul do Forno: Okay, now let's step back and look at the season as a whole. You had two mini series, I'll call them. Both were based on live recordings, one at Grocery Shop and one at N R F. Now, usually we're doing, you're recording kind of like this virtually, so, talk about how it was to be live and, , talking live with, the people right in front of you.[00:27:50] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I mean, I guess I'll, I'll jump in on this one. Cause unfortunately Casey wasn't able to to join me on, on, on those. But you know, it was, um, [00:28:00] I know we, we[00:28:01] Casey Golden: I'm gonna be at grocery shop. I'm like literally at the store grocery shopping. I've never been to that show.[00:28:08] Ricardo Belmar: I know, I know. But you're right, it is di it is different though because you, you get a little it feels a little more authentic. Maybe you get a little bit more dynamic reactions when you're seeing someone face-to-face and in person versus just seeing them in a little video square on the screen.[00:28:22] So, so there is that. I think that creates a different excitement level from, from guests on the show when you're live versus remote. And I think that really comes out right in both, in both series, the grocery shop one and the NRF ones.[00:28:33] Paul do Forno: Cool. All right. All right. I'd have to ask you about your special guest host and crossover companion at nrf. That that, that was kind of interesting.[00:28:41] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. So, special shout out to Jeff Roster, host of This Week In Innovation podcast. We did a, crossover there. He's been with us as one of our esteemed Retail Avengers from them the first season where we like to refer to him as the analyst. So Jeff and I decided to team up a little bit at N R F and see what can we do[00:29:00] to do this in person.[00:29:01] And it was interesting experience because, it's a little different than when I did a grocery shop, you know, grocery shop, shop talk. They're, they're good at providing you an entire facility with recording equipment in a dedicated room that you can use. N R F is a little more complicated and that, that we didn't technically qualify to, to use their facilities for that.[00:29:20] So we kind of had to figure it out for ourselves and, and, and understand, okay, what, what do we need to, what equipment do we need? And, and then of course the biggest challenge is figuring out, well, where are we gonna do this? And we were lucky. We had our friends and fans of the show at Avanade allowed us to use their lounge space as our mobile recording studio.[00:29:36] For both Jeff and I think that was a new experience. We learned a lot from that and, and hopefully upped our podcast game to do more of these live in-person recordings that way.[00:29:45] Paul do Forno: Gotcha. So question. am I an honorary Avenger since I was there in the clubhouse? In the Clubhouse case?[00:29:52] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That's right. Yep.[00:29:53] Paul do Forno: the clubhouse,[00:29:55] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. Right. That, that, that's why you get invited to guest, host, come on.[00:29:58] Paul do Forno: Woo. [00:30:00] Alright, so question for you, Casey. What interview stood out to you? The most, both at Grocery Shop and nrf.[00:30:08] Casey Golden: So, both of which I missed. So the, the episode with Ron and Vicki, it really stood out at N R F that it is, it is absolutely something magical when we're together in, in real life. And I think that those, there's nothing that can compare to everybody being, having that energy and bringing it all to the same table and having these great conversations.[00:30:35] So I mean, it was something where I didn't tune out. I was listening to it and I think that it just brings like a very different dynamic to podcasts. But I mean, it goes to show we have really talented people in this space that are so passionate about retail. And so the Ron and Vicki episode just, you know, moved right up to my top as the most memorable.[00:31:00][00:31:01] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I, I, I have to say on, on that one too, I mean, o one of the things that worked so great with that, I mean, we, we didn't plan anything in advance for, for that one. We were all, all four of us were at the Retail ROI Super Saturday event that we were, we were hosting at the Microsoft office.[00:31:16] And right at the end of the day when everything was wrapping up, we said, why don't we sit down and just record a quick 15 minute conversation, just on some thoughts about what we, what we experienced in the day, kinda what we were hoping to see at nrf. And then of course, we got so into it, it turned into 50 minutes, not 15 ... so we went a little bit longer.[00:31:32] Paul do Forno: Wow. That's great. So what, what did you think Casey, about that.[00:31:38] Casey Golden: So like, I mean, Ron Thurston, I'm like a super fan. We'll just say that I am a super fan and Vicki Cantrell is, is phenomenal. So, I mean, I wish I, I wish I could have been there. It was just really special and Gabriella, what was it? Gabriella Bach from Rethink Retail. She was filming the video [00:32:00] for [00:32:00] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. She recorded the video for us. [00:32:02] Casey Golden: walking around in that tiny room with her video way longer than she was supposed to.[00:32:08] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, she, she was really re a real good I I don't even know what to say you, cause we talked, she heard us talking about wanting to do it and said, Hey, do you guys want me to record the video for that, that you can use? I don't, I don't mind doing it. So, yeah. We're only gonna be 15 minutes or so.[00:32:20] Oh, sure. No problem. And she's sitting there holding all the video equipment and this, and you can see in the video, this was such a tiny conference room that we ended up picking and she's trying to kind of move around all of us to get the right angles in this. She had to change batteries midway through it and then ran outta battery power cause we went so long.[00:32:38] So that was, that was definitely something.[00:32:39] Paul do Forno: Cool. Alright. So you definitely have to keep doing more of those in the future.[00:32:45] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, oh, for sure. So, so stay tuned. We, we, we have one of very much like that coming from Shop Talk that we just did.[00:32:51] All those Retail Transformers were more than meets the eye![00:32:51] Paul do Forno: Awesome. All right, now let's talk about one of your fun series within a series, so to speak, [00:33:00] the retail transformer series. You started the series in series one, but it really took off with this season with four special retail transformation episodes. But honestly, you could have called it both grocery shop and NRF series the same, couldn't you?[00:33:15] Casey Golden: Yes, true. I mean, we're all essentially Transformers. That's why we brought them on the show.[00:33:23] Paul do Forno: I, I think Casey was just about to go. Transformers.[00:33:30] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. Yep. Stealing my line there.[00:33:32] Casey Golden: I'm like[00:33:33] Paul do Forno: That's what we were [00:33:34] Casey Golden: playing my composure.[00:33:37] Paul do Forno: Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That we're, we're supposed to have yeah, we're professional here. All right. Okay. Back, back to the story here. So which one stood out the most for you, Casey?[00:33:50] Casey Golden: So, my favorite Retail Transformer during that this series was Brian Dove with Commerce Hub. We could have, [00:34:00] that podcast could have gone on for hours. Literally I would've been fine if Ricardo stopped record, and I just continued talking to Brian for the rest of the day. His approach is really compelling.[00:34:15] He's solving. Solving supply chain is probably one of the ugliest and most complex sites of the business. And making changes in supply chain are like, they're, they're like complete, they're not even a heart transplant. It's a complete nervous system transplant. And, just think that our supplies, chains need the most transformation and it's just hard, ugly work.[00:34:41] You don't get a lot of rainbows and sunshines and like glitter doing things in supply chain. It's waking up in the morning, day in, day out, doing the stuff that nobody else wants to do. And I think he came out with a very his approach is incredible and I think that we're [00:35:00] just gonna see more drop shipping directly from manufacturers than managing their own distribution and, and selling inventory in and third party logistics warehouses.[00:35:11] This. Piece of supply chain that is part of Commerce Hub. They're only like a fraction of what could be. But I think for, for what he's done and what they're doing now and where they're going, he is my top re Retail Transformer that stood out during that series.[00:35:34] Paul do Forno: Wow. I, I can't have my guys listening to this podcast because now before you're talking up the c d p guys, now my supply chain guys is, see, we're we're more important than everybody else.[00:35:46] Casey Golden: Wants to work with me. Paul,[00:35:47] Paul do Forno: I know. Geez. I, I dunno how, what, what about us? Come on. No. Yeah. Hundred percent.[00:35:56] Casey Golden: there's so many angels in this space that I [00:36:00] just feel like a lot of, a lot of it, the attention goes to the marketers. In general, and I just feel like marketing is just not retail. It takes so much to make that product[00:36:17] Paul do Forno: And honestly in the last couple years, right? I think people got, oh, all we have to do is just drop ship stuff and things just show up and[00:36:25] it, you know,[00:36:26] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Yeah. It's magic,[00:36:28] Paul do Forno: and nobody has to make profit off of it. Now, the real world, oh damn, we've got a sources. And to scale it, you actually have to do it profitably, right?[00:36:38] And so now this, we had a little bubble of this magic, every, all this funding and these tools that made, it, enabled all of this to look like it didn't, it was super easy and anybody could do it, but now the real vendors are coming out. And, and so you really have to focus on back to the basics, right? [00:37:00] And, and how to tie all these together.[00:37:02] Casey Golden: I agree.[00:37:03] Paul do Forno: So, Ricardo, how about you?[00:37:05] Ricardo Belmar: So continuing on on that theme you just brought up there, Paul. So, so my, one of my favorites is the, the retail transformer we did with Polly Wong. Cuz she reinforced something that both Casey and I, I think absolutely loved when she said it. I, I think we almost had to stop recording to regain some composure from, from the comment that she just so casually dropped about how you can't have a profitable, business when you're only focused on acquisition as a fact.[00:37:30] And she just rolled that phrase out so matter of factly, like it was just the most fundamental thing that everybody had been lost on. That one to me to kind of set the tone for the whole rest of the recording on that one. Cause that was pretty early on. I think that was just gold. When she brought that up and, you know, we, we had been wanting to do some direct to consumer focus episodes, so Polly gave us a chance to talk about how is D T C really moving forward and bringing it back to this idea of profitability.[00:37:58] How do you shift from customer acquisition [00:38:00] focus to actually building customer loyalty, maintaining that community of customers. And, she, I just love how she gave us , this picture of, all these different ways and methods that those brands are now marketing to consumers that, that kind of brought things back.[00:38:14] Like when she mentioned, print catalogs where a as if they're the brand new thing that DTC brands were doing and being successful at it. I think that was, that was just something I don't think anybody who was listening expected to hear that. And that, that, I just love that one.[00:38:28] Casey Golden: I agree. I think everything that was old is new again. It is that, it is this moment of back to the basics. I think Facebook essentially broke our foundation for digital. It created this false foundation for digital, let's say that. And so now that companies are really pulling back into, I don't want to rely on Facebook ads, and now I'm not even getting that eight x or 12 x or 30 x, I'm like, [00:39:00] lucky if I can get a two x return right now. Because of all of the different changes, I think we're going back to just building better with the newer technologies. And a lot of this is foundational, it's just a new foundation for digital.[00:39:16] That's just, I think we too many people over overbuilt on relying on a, the Facebook platform and ads.[00:39:26] Paul do Forno: Hey, I think omnichannel is back.[00:39:30] Casey Golden: Say that word, unified commerce. If you need to use a word unified,[00:39:34] Ricardo Belmar: you go. There you go. Unified commerce.[00:39:37] Paul do Forno: That's probably, that should be another, that should be another podcast. The, the Battle. Battle of Semantics.[00:39:44] Casey Golden: Yeah,[00:39:44] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, there we, there we go. [00:39:46] Casey Golden: no consum. What is it? I just saw it. Composable commerce.[00:39:51] Ricardo Belmar: right. Yeah.[00:39:53] Paul do Forno: The, the battle of the, the terms. All right.[00:39:56] Ricardo Belmar: there.[00:39:56] Paul do Forno: All right. So[00:39:57] Casey Golden: it's a dictionary.[00:39:58] Love those "Special" episodes...[00:39:58] Paul do Forno: now that wasn't the [00:40:00] only topical series you had. You also had a special episode. We already talked about one, your predictions episode, but you also had an interesting one with Andy Laudato from NRF beginners and of course the holiday special guests from Square and others.[00:40:15] How did you come about with those.[00:40:18] Casey Golden: Well, I mean, speaking of the holiday season, we knew we wanted to make a holiday themed episode, but you know, every retail podcast seems to do this and focuses on predicting retail sales, right? And so we wanted to do something different. We brought together Bridget John's founder of to and from, to share her perspective on what customers were actually shopping for gifts.[00:40:44] And what inspired them. And then we added Roshaun from Square to share their recent survey report on what retailers were doing to gear up for the holiday. So we really felt like our holiday episode delivered perspectives on both [00:41:00] sides of the equation from the retailer and the consumer.[00:41:03] Instead of focusing on the number, we really wanted to focus on actually what's happening in this shopping experience and this thought process coming into holiday and how retailers could use that information to make their season more successful and hit those numbers that everybody's projecting. And I found it very much more insightful, really learning from the sides of Roshan, from Square and Bridget from To and From.[00:41:32] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's what we really call cutting through the clutter.[00:41:36] Paul do Forno: Interesting. Okay. All right. What about the NRF for Beginner's episode?[00:41:42] Ricardo Belmar: So, so that one, we wanted to do something special leading up to N R F. Obviously, we gotta call it our industry's biggest moment of the year, right? It's the biggest show. So we knew we had to do something as a retail podcast, but lucky enough for us, Andy reached out to me and said, Hey, I got a great idea for a podcast episode.[00:41:57] Let's talk about what. Beginners to NRF [00:42:00] need to know by and, and le leveraging the experience of those of us who've been there for so many years and years. So we thought, oh, this is a brilliant idea. Yeah, no, nobody's ever talking about that. Everyone always talks about N R F on the assumption that everyone knows what it is and knows what they're doing when they get there.[00:42:14] But the fact is every year, right, they're always beginners that have, have never been to N R F before. So let, let's focus on that. So, off we went. Andy came on. We, we highlighted, you know, how does a newbie to the show tackle it? What are the, the, the, the secret things you, you need to know that nobody really ever shares or tells you that you wished you knew by the time you got to the end of the show.[00:42:34] And everybody got to really benefit from all of Andy's multitude of, of years of NRF wisdom.[00:42:39] Paul do Forno: Yeah. So what, what'd you think Casey?[00:42:41] Casey Golden: Yeah, I mean, I, I, I am still an NRF newbie, I feel, even though I've been there most of my career. Cause there's, based off of how you go there and what contexts are you a vendor? Are you on the buying side? That changes throughout our career. [00:43:00] So you may have been a buyer for 10 years, but then you're going to n r F as a vendor for the first time.[00:43:07] And the tables turn, the experience is different. And yet, I think we're kind of all newbies because I'm going as a vendor. But then each year you are changing what that means, you know, like, Not everybody has the Microsoft booth or like the Salesforce booth. And so, for everybody else, I think that it is pretty interesting on aligning expectations and like strategy for some of these companies that are coming in on the vendor side for the first time to maximize and, and even just new people coming in to go shopping.[00:43:46] You know, it's a big floor.[00:43:48] Paul do Forno: Yeah, that, that probably would be pretty different if you were a buyer. I'm sure everybody wanted you to come to their event and take you out for dinner and everything. And then you're on the other side and you're like, oh crap, [00:44:00] I've got, [00:44:00] Casey Golden: Anybody. [00:44:01] Paul do Forno: get some attention. The hunted from the hunted, right? Like[00:44:06] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:44:07] Paul do Forno: it's a little bit different.[00:44:09] Okay. Alright. Gonna bring this home. Now with this one, one of the things I like about what you did this season was the introduction of the idea of new segments within each episode and your first one is what you guys call Retail Razor Data Blades, which you brought in a specialist for, right?[00:44:31] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. So, and again, we, we didn't wanna make yet another retail podcast. I mean, there's like, what, over a hundred out there right now, have lost track. So we wanna do something unique that provides a value, not just to the retail tech community that, at the end of the day, right. Both Casey and I are part of right now, but also to retailers who are getting bombarded with information and that you realistically need some guidance on how to sift through all of that, all that data that gets published out there.[00:44:55] And like we're always saying, we want to cut through the clutter of that noise.[00:44:59] Casey Golden: [00:45:00] Yeah. And we worked with our friends over at True Rating and Georgina Nelson, their phenomenal c e o to leverage all the rich data that they've gone through. Their retailer customers from survey questions that they ask at the point of sale to offer our listeners and viewers some insights into what consumers are actually doing.[00:45:21] And not doing with their purchasing habits.[00:45:24] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, so we introduced this segment. We had it on I think three times this season, and we're, we're definitely gonna bring this one back next season. Big shout out to Georgina was so good at recording this with us when, when she was just days away from her baby's due date. So it was just a amazing that we were able to get that in.[00:45:40] We, we kept joking that we might not get these recordings done in time, but we managed to pull it off. So that was amazing.[00:45:47] Paul do Forno: All [00:45:47] Casey Golden: was prepared to have laptop with her. You know, like when we say she's a phenomenal Georgina, like props to this woman. She's, she's a great leader.[00:45:58] Coming up next season?[00:45:58] Paul do Forno: Wow. That's commitment. [00:46:00] Okay. Now for next year, next season, do you guys have a theme yet?[00:46:07] Casey Golden: Yeah. After season one focused on digital transformation and the impact of transformation on the people in the retail business, this season, our focus was, the evolution of channel operations in the retail business. That's why we started the season with a big one, two punch with the Metaverse and retail media networks.[00:46:32] Ricardo Belmar: and if you think about all the retail transformers we brought in this season, we really kept that focus. We started out with, with Alan Smithson to dive deeper into Metaverse what he was doing, building The Mall in the metaverse to, the episode I mentioned where we had Polly on. Talking about that.[00:46:45] And then, again, the one Casey mentioned with Bryan Dove from Commerce Hub we really drove into the future of e-commerce on that one and marketplaces. So for next season, where are we taking it? We're gonna try to focus a little bit more on some of these themes, a little, little bit sharper, things like anywhere [00:47:00] commerce and immersive commerce.[00:47:01] I think look at how that's happening with this in the middle of this backdrop that I, I think of as a, a back to basics kind of mood in retail.[00:47:10] Paul do Forno: Ah, back to my supply chain guys. All right. Yes, we need them, but, I got all the cool shows and I guess we gotta give them some work. All right, so let's tie in. You know, your predictions there, but what exactly do you mean? Back to basics.[00:47:29] Ricardo Belmar: Well, I, I think we, we really need to sort of acknowledge that retailers are focusing this year on, on how to get better at the business of retailers, retailing. So, past few years through the pandemic, right? What, what, what did retailers end up seeing? There's a lot of rapid growth in some specific areas for many retailers, but because a lot of it happened so fast, and I, I think we have to admit right, faster than most retailers were used to change and, and adopting new things.[00:47:55] So that meant that, they, the focus was just get it out there to deliver those [00:48:00]experiences for, for the consumers, for what consumers wanted at whatever the cost was because it just, it had to be done and it had to be done fast. So now most retailers, I think are figuring out, we did these things, maybe not in the best way we could have done it, so let's optimize it a little bit.[00:48:15] Let's make sure that we take out as much of the cost as we can, but c but, but still be able to do these things. How do we inject some profitability into it? We've got all these crazy new tools like the Generative AI that, mentioned in the predictions. We talked about the automation for, for the store teams.[00:48:31] How do we still inject those things? But let's not do it in the, in the crazy, do it at all costs way that we were forced into the last few years. Let's do it in a more methodical way that we know is gonna maintain some profitability. We're wa we're watching, we don't know what the outcome is gonna be, right?[00:48:48] In terms of shopping trends or consumers gonna keep buying at the pace they've been buying, are they going to slow down because of inflation? Are they gonna go back to saving more versus spending with all this [00:49:00] backdrop, how do we keep these things going? We can't take back any of the new things and capabilities we introduced cause consumers will, will find another brand, right, if we take these things away.[00:49:08] So we have to find ways to keep optimizing and keep doing them, but at least, the way I like to look at it is you can't just cost cut your way to success. You still have to invest in the future. And even though that near term investment is hopefully something that's gonna return you a, a cost reduction in the future, but you have to do it in a smart way.[00:49:26] So I think those are the kinds of things that, we're looking at these trendy things like immersive commerce and everywhere commerce and retailers, still need to do that, but it matters now how you do it more so than it did before.[00:49:39] Casey Golden: Yeah, I'm a hundred percent on this is going to be the time for reality. And we're gonna be spending a lot more time on. The, the reality of, of where our retail is today to build, to be able to adopt some of the new technology at scale. It's just we spend so much [00:50:00] time on marketing and acquisition and we saw that it just cost us too much money and a lot of turn.[00:50:07] And so focusing on retention and stable systems and being able to go ahead and say like, listen, why are there 400 messages a day of a customer looking for their package? Okay, that's not a customer service opportunity. That's an opportunity to fix it. Like this is like adding these things to plug problems and band-aids.[00:50:34] We've got to solve the actual problems. And I think that that's, everything that I've seen right now has been. I have, we have customers. We're gonna focus on keeping them, and we need to go ahead and make sure that we're ready for the next five years of retail. Otherwise, we, I don't know if we'll be here or we're going to lose our market share.[00:50:57] Paul do Forno: And I'll, and I'll just put a exclamation mark [00:51:00] on that. Like all I'm hearing is optimize. How do we optimize, how do we use what we have? We spend a ton of investments over the past couple years. How do we use 'em well, right? Like that's what I keep hearing. That's what, that's what my colleagues are hearing.[00:51:16] So I, I think the more that they can do better, and guess what the P word. You gotta be profitable, right? How do we optimize and be for profit and, and more so than ever, especially with the uncertainty on the economics and that, I think it's just gonna be more important. [00:51:36] Okay. One last thing I want to know.[00:51:39] Any new segments you're introducing? Like the Retail razor Data Blades.[00:51:44] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, since that's that's been pretty popular. So we are looking at adding more of those. So for example one, we're gonna bring a, a unique perspective to answer the, the hot questions of the day from an academic's viewpoint. I think that's gonna be maybe eye-opening for some folks based on, on what kind of [00:52:00] responses we, we hear there and what kind of discussion we have.[00:52:02] But I think it'll be a unique independent viewpoint people aren't used to hearing necessarily. Then another one we're thinking about doing is a segment that'll focus on retail leadership qualities. There's been some interesting news media reports lately talking about how there seems to be a shortage of, of CEOs in retail and a shortage of, of quality executives.[00:52:22] So we're gonna dig in a little bit, I think in, in a new segment there and bring in some folks to. Give some tips on, you know, what are those leadership roles? What are those skills that those leaderships, what traits do they need to have to really be successful in, in retail that maybe not everyone has developed or, or needs to develop better.[00:52:39] Paul do Forno: I, I think back to what I just said, the P word, we need the CEOs driving the profitability, right?[00:52:46] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah.[00:52:47] Casey Golden: Yeah, I think they're gonna come from unexpected places. You know, we've had a lot of executives that have been running the top for 25 years. I think retail in general it's been, [00:53:00] leadership has been plugged. I know a lot of VPs and SVPs that had their jobs for 28 years, they're not going anywhere and they didn't let anybody rise through.[00:53:09] And so there's a lot of talent out there that could probably hop some steps and really make some big changes and some positive profitable changes at these companies. And I'm excited to have those, those sessions cuz there's a lot of untapped talent out in this industry. Nobody's in this industry to get rich, right?[00:53:31] Like we are all here on pure fricking passion. Cause it would be a lot easier working some other industries than it is in this space. We're here with like committed love.[00:53:42] Paul do Forno: Yes. Yes. So all of that's pretty interesting. So any hints for the expert speakers to come?[00:53:50] Casey Golden: We can't give everything away on this episode I'm gonna leave that on on Ricardo if he wants to add any spoilers.[00:53:57] Ricardo Belmar: I think we can afford to make people wait and [00:54:00] see and, and make it a surprise.[00:54:01] Paul do Forno: Well, maybe you guys can give us a preview trailer soon and, you know, a teaser.[00:54:06] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. Be in the lookout for that.[00:54:08] Paul do Forno: All right. Well guys, thank you so much for inviting me on the show to guest host and be an honorary Avenger. It's been a year, Casey and Ricardo since we saw y y you know, the comeback at The Shop Talk last year. And we just got done another Shop Talk. But Ricardo, I didn't see you. I, I, I tried to[00:54:27] Ricardo Belmar: don't know how we missed each other, so, so[00:54:29] Paul do Forno: I know[00:54:29] it was crazy. But thank you. I had a lot of fun and looking forward to next year.[00:54:36] Casey Golden: Thank you so much, Paul. I loved having you on the show and we'll work on that honorary Avenger title.[00:54:42] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That's right. I mean, this is a great, fantastic experience. We can't wait to have you back on the show again soon.[00:54:47] Paul do Forno: All right, thanks guys.[00:54:49] ​[00:54:49] Show Close[00:54:49] Ricardo Belmar: We'll give a big thanks out to all of our Retail Razor Show fans this season. Casey, I think that means this show[00:55:00] for that matter, this whole season is a wrap now.[00:55:02] Casey Golden: Yeah. If you enjoyed our show this season, please consider giving us a five star rating and review on Apple Podcasts. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player so you don't miss a minute. And if you'd rather watch us instead of listening, subscribe to our YouTube channel and like, and comment there's a new season out there too.[00:55:23] And of course, if you wanna know more about what we talked about today, including a full transcript of each episode look at the show notes for handy links to more deets. I'm your cohost, Casey Golden.[00:55:34] Ricardo Belmar: And if you'd like to connect with us and share your thoughts on this season, follow us on Twitter at Casey c Golden and Ricardo underscore Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure and follow the show on Twitter, at Retail Razor, on LinkedIn for the latest updates. And stay tuned for a season three trailer like Paul was asking us for.[00:55:50] Coming soon. We promise, it'll be worth the wait. I'm your host Ricardo Belmar.[00:55:55] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.[00:55:56] Ricardo Belmar: And remember, there's never been a better time to be in retail [00:56:00]if you cut through the clutter. Until next time, this is the Retail Razor Show.

Have you heard plenty of Shoptalk event and trend recaps by now? Did any of those dig into why those trends matter and what they really mean for the retail industry? Sometimes you just need to put four Top Retail Influencers into one recording session and let them talk about what those trends make them feel about the industry to get to the heart of the matter. And maybe ‘heart' is what it's truly all about – because retail is a people business.It's Part 4 of our #ShoptalkLive podcast cross-over series with This Week in Innovation and special guest host Jeff Roster, but not quite recorded live and in-person at Shoptalk this time! Yes, there's a story to that and you'll find out in this episode where Jeff and regular host Ricardo Belmar are joined by retail legends, Vicki Cantrell, CEO of Vendors in Partnership, LLC, and Ron Thurston, author of Retail Pride, host of the Retail in America podcast and tour, and Co-Founder of OSSY.In this episode, Jeff, Ricardo, Vicki, and Ron discover the true meaning of Shoptalk this year – people and relationships – because in the end they realize that the experience is the relationship in retail and how this is NOT the year of shiny objects! Plus, we're now standing at number 19 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list – if you enjoy our show, please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts! With your help, we'll move our way up the Top 20! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Meet your regular hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring E-Motive, and Overclocked, from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS2E12d ShoptalkLive - TRI Friends Chat[00:00:00] Show Intro [00:00:20] Casey Golden: Hello Retail Razor Show listeners and viewers. Welcome to retail's favorite podcast for product junkies, commerce technologists, and everyone else in retail and retail tech alike. I'm your co-host, Casey Golden.[00:00:33] Ricardo Belmar: And I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar. Welcome to part four and the final installment in our Shop Talk Live crossover event with Jeff Roster and This Week In Innovation podcast.[00:00:44] Casey Golden: Wow. Are we really at the last one? This has been so much fun, so many incredible conversations and takeaways. Does it really have to end?[00:00:53] Ricardo Belmar: Well, yeah, it does. It does. But we have saved what I think is one of our best, if not the [00:01:00] best episode of the season for the last one.[00:01:02] Casey Golden: Okay. Wait a minute, you've, you've called every episode, the best episode of the season as being the one from N R F where you and Jeff sat down with Vicki Cantrell and Ron Thurston at the end of the Super Saturday retail ROI event. You know that 10 minute chat that turned into 50 minutes?[00:01:21] Ricardo Belmar: Well, okay. Yeah, I, I did say that I, I suppose I, I guess maybe I have said that may, maybe more than once, but funny you should mention that episode because this episode, our final Shop Talk crossover podcast is also a conversation Jeff and I have with Ron and Vicki. , it's, think of it as a repeat or a follow up, if you will, of that NRF discussion.[00:01:42] And I have to say, it's this sort of conversation that, you know, makes me so excited to be part of this industry. I'm so thankful for relationships like these with Jeff, Ron, Vicki, and so many others including you, Casey. It's just unlike any other industry I know.[00:01:55] Casey Golden: Aw, you're like a teddy bear. It's so true though. [00:02:00] Nothing lights a fire like passion. And I know now why you've been testing this recording for the last three episodes but at the risk of being a downer here, if I'm not mistaken, you guys had some challenges making this happen.[00:02:15] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, we did, we did. It turns out we only had one option to record this live and in person at Shop Talk, and that was at the end of the day on, I think it was the second to last day of the show. And it was right when Shop Talk had scheduled a happy hour on the show floor. Rethink Retail was kind enough to agree to let us use their booth space to record.[00:02:35] So Jeff and I get there to set up our equipment, right, and guess what happens?[00:02:39] Casey Golden: The equipment broke.[00:02:41] Ricardo Belmar: Okay, good guess, but no, not quite. just as we were about to plug everything in, suddenly loud music starts blaring over the speakers all over the expo hall. You figure it's happy hour right. So of course Shop Talk decided we all needed some high energy music to go with our free drinks.[00:02:56] Casey Golden: Oh my God, you're kidding me. What, what'd you [00:03:00] guys end up doing?[00:03:00] Ricardo Belmar: Well, we, we looked at each other and thought about what any experienced podcaster would do to, to compensate for that. And then instead we immediately decided that it was hopeless and we just needed to cancel the whole thing and reschedule.[00:03:11] Casey Golden: Grab a beer.[00:03:13] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly. [00:03:16] Now, of course, I, I did say this was the only time we could work it out during the show, so we ended up scheduling a recording session remotely for about a week after Shop Talk.[00:03:24] So technically this episode is not, live and in-person recorded bet it is still recorded, so we're gonna go with that. But it does have the added benefit that, you know, we've got full video for this episode on our YouTube channel. So you actually get to watch us have the discussion, not just listen to it.[00:03:41] Casey Golden: All right. All right. Well, that's a pretty good trade off. I must say and you know, we just kind of upped the ante here. So sad you guys couldn't make it work in person. Hope there was some good drinks. But I mean, come on, of course you'd expect good music to go with happy hour, [00:04:00] right? I mean,[00:04:01] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:04:02] Casey Golden: you kind of expect like show closes, party's on, right.[00:04:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I guess we should have thought of that. We should have thought of that, I suppose. But you know, like, like I said, we're, we're, had we been experienced podcasters or not the you know, budding experts, we all aspire to be here. We might have planned for that, but I, I think this worked out in the end.[00:04:22] Either way.[00:04:23] Casey Golden: Well, let's not waste any more time. Let's get straight to the recording. Not live and in person at Shop Talk, but still a Shop Talk recap with you, Jeff Roster, Vicki Cantrell and Ron Thurston.[00:04:38] The TRI Friends Chat[00:04:38] Ricardo Belmar: ​Welcome everybody. I'm Ricardo Belmar, host of the Retail Razor Show, and I'm here with a good friend, Jeff Roster, host of This Week In Innovation. And you guessed it. This is the last episode in our Shop Talk related series. And I, if you're [00:05:00] watching us on video, yes. You may have noticed we are not live at Shop Talk right now.[00:05:05] We, we much like, one of the episodes, if you caught our crossover at NRF where we had some issues and couldn't quite make it work out. We sort of had a little bit of some coordination challenges this time. So we're catching up with each other after the event, but we're here to talk about our, our thoughts on the shop talk event.[00:05:24] Jeff, how you doing today?[00:05:25] Jeff Roster: You know, Ricardo, I'm doing fantastic. I had a good week's sleep and a lot of time to, to think about what we're gonna talk about today. So I, I'm actually kind of thinking this is really a cool vibe. Maybe we should do this on every show, like do the final wrap up, show off-premise, two, three days down, down the road couple, you know, a couple good night's sleep.[00:05:43] So I, I'm excited to get into this conversation.[00:05:45] Ricardo Belmar: Sounds good. Well, let me go ahead and introduce our, familiar guests. we have with us today, we've got Vicki Cantrell and Ron Thurston. Vicki, Ron, how are you two doing?[00:05:55] Vicki Cantrell: Great. Very nice to be uh, on a Friday entering in and, and it [00:06:00] did take a l uh, like it took a while to get over this trip, like physically, and so I'm all back. So happy to be here with you guys.[00:06:11] Ron Thurston: Yeah. Yeah, me too. Thank you Ricardo and Jeff. It's a, it's a pleasure. I, I felt trapped inside Mandalay Bay with no sun and nothing, and I was happy to come back to the west coast on the tour and be in San Diego because [00:06:25] Ricardo Belmar: yeah.[00:06:25] Ron Thurston: I needed some fresh air[00:06:27] Ricardo Belmar: It, it kind of, it's kind of funny. I, I noticed on the last day I was there thinking, wait a minute, I, have I seen the outside for the last few days since I've been here? Or have I not even seen daylight?[00:06:38] Jeff Roster: I actually one, one trip over, cause I stayed at the Luxor I, one trip over, I specifically went outside and went all the way around because I thought, you know, I probably at some point should literally have fresh air. So I [00:06:48] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. [00:06:49] Jeff Roster: force my way outside.[00:06:51] Ricardo Belmar: Right, right,[00:06:52] Vicki Cantrell: ahh, Vegas.[00:06:53] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. [00:06:54] Ron Thurston: Vegas. [00:06:55] 4 Shoptalk Themes[00:06:55] Ricardo Belmar: love it. Gotta love it. Well, so, so let, let me start by, before we [00:07:00] jump into our, our conversation here, let, let's kind of start with summarizing four key themes that shop talk themselves, the shop talk content team put out there at the end of the show is what they felt were the four main themes of the show.[00:07:12] and the first is what they termed as seamless stores, which I like to think of this as both a recognition that stores are a focal point of energy right now in, in retail, and that it is, it's maybe a way to think of this as the, the successor to omnichannel and maybe we put that term to rest. so that's theme one.[00:07:30] Theme two is about enabling workers and store teams which is a theme I like to see. And. I'm sure we'll get into this, but we, we talked about that at our, at our conversation, N R F and what we had hoped to hear then about how we're better enabling store teams. So that was theme two. [00:07:46] Theme three is shopper engagement. And this is sort of a, a, a catchall, I think that covers all the interesting technologies that we're all hearing about and talking about now that's impacting the customer experience in, in any channel, whether it's in stores, digital, [00:08:00] wherever it may be. [00:08:01] And then the fourth one which might actually be the most interesting of the four, Shop Talk calls this changing relationships and it, it's a reference to how on, on the one hand, you have retailers becoming more and more like a technology provider in that they're now offering services. To other retailers and other brands, and that could be you know, one of my favorite topics that I like to remind Jeff about every chance I get, and that's retail media networks.[00:08:28] it may be, yep. It may be things like GAP offering their logistics network as a service to other retailers. and it, but it really, I, I think. I, I find this an interesting one because maybe Shop Talk is onto something there thinking that the business is changing because of how the relationships are changing from the way they have been in, you know, for, for decades now.[00:08:49] so let's, let's start from there.[00:08:53] Vicki Cantrell: I um, you know, I love those four themes because they aren't kind of broken out into [00:09:00] technology. And if you remember we talked in January, Ron had such a good point in that freewheeling conversation that we had was about how do we respect the stores given what they're going through and how do we get them to do less and understand what their challenges are and because the customer is back in the stores.[00:09:22] It's a Relationship Show About People[00:09:22] Vicki Cantrell: And, and when we think about that uh, it felt there was a lot of content to address those things in while we were at Shop Talk, but I'd like to kind of flip that a little bit and talk about those four themes. And what I felt while I was there, I felt like it was, I have no other way to describe it other than it felt like it was a relationship show.[00:09:47] Uh, for me, the connections, everybody talked, no matter who you met on the floor, in a booth, at a party, wherever you were, it started with the human connection [00:10:00] and it no matter what and it way more time was spent on the human aspects and the human connection before it actually turned into a potential business connection.[00:10:14] So it felt very right. It felt very relationship focused. And when you think about that, how it relates to those themes is so true. The relationship with the customer, the relationship and partnerships, it just felt very connected and human. And I love the way they're kind of mapping this out.[00:10:37] Ron Thurston: I'll, I'll jump in. I, I agree with you, Vicki. I think it's also the space being like smaller than an N R F. I mean, I think Vicky, you and I saw each other like three times a day [00:10:47] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah. [00:10:48] Ron Thurston: And you know, like walking by, it's a, it's a high five, it's a hug. Oh, have you met this person? Oh my God. Like, let's get a picture.[00:10:55] Like, so I think that there's, there's power in the scale of, [00:11:00] of the conference at the same time, but as my first experience at Shop Talk, I would say retail is a relationship business and, and because coming from the stores, that's how you build a business. It isn't just about product and, and a beautiful space.[00:11:18] It is very much about relationships with each other. First, leading a team, it's relationships with the customers. It's with your corporate business partners, it's with your vendors. It's with your mall or your landlords, like, everything we do is about relationships and those relationships have, you know, are so important to me.[00:11:39] But when you, there was a sense of pride almost in our industry as much as we all have questions and maybe some, um, pressure to deliver. I, I felt a sense of pride about the general retail industry at, at a whole, and that, that felt really good to me. I left [00:12:00] on such a high because of that.[00:12:02] Vicki Cantrell: I love that. I love that. And, and I didn't realize that was your first[00:12:09] Ron Thurston: It was my first, [00:12:10] Vicki Cantrell: I had no idea. Oh my gosh.[00:12:14] Ricardo Belmar: How many shop talks have you been to Vicki?[00:12:15] Vicki Cantrell: uh, I've actually, I would say I missed one. I haven't gone to the ones outside of Las Vegas, but I missed, I was at the first one and last year and this year, so I would say at least three, potentially four.[00:12:31] Ricardo Belmar: Okay, It was my second shop talk I got last year was my first one. Jeff, this, was this your first [00:12:35] Jeff Roster: No, this is my first one too. And what I think was interesting about the relationship angle, and I've, I've always, you know, preached that from the get-go. Listen, from a tech perspective, it's a relationship business. It's as big as Mayberry. And there's, you know, sheriff Andy, and, and you know, I mean, do not screw around in the industry, it's 5 trillion, but it is, is as big as Mayberry and it's, it's really cool to hear that. I also wonder, and [00:13:00] this is 180 degrees shift for me I've never, ever, never, ever been a fan of having anything in Vegas. I just think it gets, the shows tend to get lost. I think you have the, the bleed off and the old days.[00:13:10] It quite frankly used to be, I thought, fairly inappropriate. B because some of the, you know, the costumes and all that sort of stuff, but I tell you it was genius to have it at Mandalay Bay One. I felt like I was back on a college dorm. Sort of that whole, that whole connection. Yeah, we joked about not being outside.[00:13:26] Well, there was a reason I wasn't outside because everything was, was convenient and like, For instance, Kathy's party Sunday night. You know, I looked at the space before I got in there and thought, oh, man, that it just feels like we're just part of the whole big thing that couldn't have worked out better.[00:13:39] One, it was quiet inside inappropriate for the conversation, but I watched probably 20 people walked by on the way to other things, you know, and so like pop out, pop back in, pop out. And I was at a party the, the Coresight party, and actually they had they had their space, but then there was another party that it was in another space, but the outside was, was, was common.[00:13:59] [00:14:00] And I ended up at somebody else's party and had a great conversation with people that I'd met at another party. And man, you, you're not gonna see that any, at any, you, you, that's the only place probably in the plant. You could have all those different venues, world-class food, world-class space, but then have all that interaction.[00:14:18] So, yeah, I, I just, I man, I, I have shifted 180 degrees about having something in Vegas. [00:14:23] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. And then we, we were talking earlier, so there was also, and I think this, I, I love this relationship theme because there was Sunday afternoon, right? There was the, the Retail ROI get together for, for the March Gladness event, watching some of the March Madness games. And I think Jeff, maybe you were the one who said it, right?[00:14:37] Just sitting there, you could just see people you recognize walking by, because it was on the way to registration for, for shop talk. People would walk by and say, Hey, how you doing?[00:14:47] Jeff Roster: Somebody's gotta own that 2:00 PM space on Sunday, because literally at that location. So for people that weren't there, I think where we were, the bar we were at was probably what, a hundred yards at max from, from [00:15:00] registration, [00:15:00] Ricardo Belmar: from the registration. Right, [00:15:01] Jeff Roster: everyone was walking there. I mean, every startup on the planet, it should just be right there at that bar or the, or the Starbucks on the other side because you're seeing the whole show. [00:15:10] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:15:11] Yeah.[00:15:12] The Experience Is the Relationship[00:15:12] Vicki Cantrell: you know, I'm gonna just wanna one more thing on this aspect of relationship. Ricardo, Ricardo, when we were talking earlier and we talked about that, you know, pre pandemic was experiential you know, that's what retailers were trying to, to deal with, and then pandemic became about convenience and figuring out that, and that it's just based on some of these themes and some of the stuff we did see is how important we're back to the experience and the experience is gonna be different.[00:15:43] You know, when you're talking about, ways of shopping and video and all, all of the different ways. But ,the fact that we think about that, for me, convenience and experience is the same because it's based on that your connection to, between the customer and the [00:16:00] retailer, that it's about the relationship.[00:16:02] Because the experience is the relationship. It's not whether you walk into the store and say, oh, isn't this beautiful? That's not what the experience is. I mean, it better be okay or better be pleasant, but that's not the experience. The experience is the connection of the person that you're, you're being with when you get there.[00:16:23] So retail is really about that. And if you have that relationship, then you're going to think this was convenient cuz you connected.[00:16:34] Ricardo Belmar: Mm-hmm.[00:16:35] Ron Thurston: agreed.[00:16:36] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I, I, I agree. And, and, and you know, the other interesting thing I, I noticed too, just thinking again about these four themes now I, I wasn't at the earlier shop talks before last year, but what I do remember in, in talking with people who had been there and looking at the content coming out of the, the conference, you know, I, I think this really started out as a e-commerce focused kind of really heavily digital channels focused to, to [00:17:00] retail much less emphasis, if any, on what's happening in in stores. And, you know, and Jeff and I talked to the content team while we were there and, and they mentioned that, you know, they had gotten feedback from attendees that said, you know, in this post pandemic world, we, we really need to talk more about stores.[00:17:18] Stores are a real focal point for our business and for our, how we build those relationships with consumers you know, that the content at the event needs to reflect that. And I, I, I think this is one of the things I find most interesting with Shop Talk is how quickly they pivot from topic to topic based on that feedback.[00:17:37] You know, when we, when we sat, when we were chatting at N R F, one of the things we said is, well, we hope, we hear some themes around, , not just how you're enabling store teams, but when you add things to the store, are you just adding or are you taking something away? You know, are you recognizing that every time you add there's potentially a burden on, on the team there?[00:17:56] And a difficulty in, in them executing it because it's yet one more [00:18:00] thing, it's one more thing to ask for. And I don't know that we heard that at NRF in sessions there very much. But I feel like at Shop Talk there was definitely, and, and they said it right in one of the four themes about enabling workers.[00:18:13] That was definitely a sense. I mean, I, I even felt that in sessions that were not about, the store teams, it came up in the conversation with the speakers on stage. It's almo. It was almost like a reflex that everyone just recognizing every retailer that was up there, they could have been talking about optimizing their supply chain.[00:18:31] And somehow then the conversation led to an impact on the store team and how they had to be aware of that and do something about it, not just let things happen. Which was something I hadn't really experienced and seen in this kind of content at other events.[00:18:47] NOT the Year of Shiny Objects[00:18:47] Ron Thurston: Yeah, I mean, I'll, I'll jump in because I started it, but I think the you know, the, my my sense from speaking to so many retailers is there's, there's a sense of clarity [00:19:00]right now about the, which. Where revenue is being generated and, and where their business needs to grow and where they need to make investment.[00:19:10] And I think maybe years past a little bit of like shiny object and what's fun and what's exciting, what keeps us in the press. And this is not a year of the shiny object. This is a year that we need to deliver on the investments that we've made. And that investment for all of them is in people, and stores, and if their e-commerce business is, is not growing at the rates they expected, then the revenue and the profitability comes from the store.[00:19:40] And so I do think maybe it's even, you know, 90 days later, from N R F the retailers I'm speaking to is I'm here to find solutions for workforce management. I'm, I'm here to find things of a better way to, to communicate with my teams, to improve productivity, to think about [00:20:00] how to make returns easier at the store level.[00:20:02] Just all of the things that are actually about delivering results. And you can't deliver the results that any company needs. Without strong teams in place who are well trained and led and motivated. And I, I just hope that, that this is not, or I should say, my sense is not, this was not a, a temporary idea that they have now said 80% of our revenue is coming from the store.[00:20:30] And that's not changing. And we need to fix this. And I hope my sense is right given the, you know, the small set of people I spoke to. But that's my, that's my feeling right now.[00:20:41] Jeff Roster: You know, that's a, that's quite a phrase, Ron. The, not the year of the shiny object. I mean, if you don't put that on Twitter today, I'm, I'm a hundred percent stealing that. Um, [00:20:50] Ron Thurston: Go for it. go for[00:20:51] it Jeff[00:20:52] Jeff Roster: And I think that's such a profound observation because I mean, I go back to the old wars, you know, the [00:21:00] retail Apocalypse Wars and all that sort of stuff for, for whatever reason folks trying to bury the store and, and, and, you know, Buzek and I, and I think, well, I didn't know you at the time yet, Ron, but we were like, how.[00:21:11] Help me understand 90%, at the time it was 90% of the revenues coming from the store. Why would you try to do that? And I, I, I still don't know the answer to that, but I think, you know, maybe it's a covid thing, just a realization how important we are. We are a tribal people. We want to. The best part of human nature is wanting to be in, you know, in fellowship, in connection with people.[00:21:34] And so if retail is a people business, it has to reflect that and, and our technology needs to reflect that. And maybe we're a little more mature than we were in 2020 and, and realize the value of people. [00:21:46] Yay. You know, I'm pro-human. And so that's a, that's a great observation. I think that's a, that's, that's a.[00:21:52] Real, real thing. And I think what's interesting, Ron, when I walked the f the, the, the exhibit hall, which is where I spent all my time, the number of [00:22:00] live streamers, the number of, of folks wanting to do something more in the store, which kind of goes against your idea of like, let's not add to the store, but it's happening.[00:22:08] I mean, TikTok was there in a big way. Fire, uh, I, I, I forget the names, but a bunch of those fight.[00:22:14] Ron Thurston: Fire firework.[00:22:15] Jeff Roster: firework. They're all. There's this, this idea that the store is the platform that we can do more with. And, and I think if we can unleash that creativity that all these, you know, all these folks have, and give them the tools, which they're already there.[00:22:32] Wow. Holy smokes. We're gonna have a whole new engagement model.[00:22:36] Ricardo Belmar: One interesting thing I heard, and I heard this more than once from different speakers and sessions on, on this point, you know take, take the livestream maybe was one example, but I I, I heard people say in a positive way this recognition that if we have more functions and roles needed in the store, there's this recognition that, you know, not every store team employee has to know how to do every single role.[00:23:00][00:23:00] That there is this idea of specialization. So, so maybe to your point, Jeff, if live streaming is something that a particular retailer's stores need to support, that doesn't mean every employee needs to be able to jump on a live stream. It means that maybe the, you know, three out of 10 or something that are good at it and want to do it. That's now their role, right? They, they, they're given that role and they put some focus on that. Maybe there are three other employees who's, who would rather be fulfilling BOPIS orders right in, in, in the back room. And because they can do that faster than the other employees. And it's okay to have this specialization and this recognition that, whether it's a store manager level or a district manager, somebody's has this awareness and that we're gearing the operation of the store around this idea that we can specialize in different areas and start building career paths for, for, for employees that that's something new that I hadn't heard before.[00:23:51] Ron Thurston: Yeah,[00:23:52] I think what, what happens in that Or, go ahead, Vicky.[00:23:55] Vicki Cantrell: No, no, go. Go ahead.[00:23:57] Ron Thurston: You know, I think that that, I think [00:24:00] what to add on to that, the realization that some of that evolution also doesn't have to happen in the store. So you think about livestream. Several brands have said, oh, great, we're gonna build a showroom in the office and we're gonna livestream from the office with, by someone who's highly skilled at selling live on camera, which is a very unique and important skill.[00:24:23] But at the same time, if I'm gonna livestream from the office, then I need to have live inventory so that when I click into what I'm selling, oh I see it's available at my store. I can also buy online pickup in store, I can reserve. So there the rest. The rest of the chain has to, has to work in order for it.[00:24:42] You can't just throw up livestream and think someone's gonna join your website on Tuesday at 12 o'clock and buy something. You actually have to build the infrastructure behind that, which requires a lot more than signing up for firework. And so I think that there, there's a, there's a thought process that's [00:25:00] deeper now, which is exciting.[00:25:02] That doesn't have to just be like, let's add one more thing to the store. And that I, I'm excited about that.[00:25:08] The True Melding of Digital and Physical Now Begins[00:25:08] Vicki Cantrell: It feels like we're at an inflection point of the, and, you know, we all sense it, we've all sensed it for years. it, and it took a real shot in the arm when, when we were in the pandemic and online, like really spiked. know, because as we all know, people have been ignoring that stat of 80% of the sales come from the stores for years.[00:25:33] As online has grown a little bit. They just, they still don't look at it. Okay. And now we, we have this feeling we can feel the sea change of, not, now it's not stores over, over online. It's not that it feels like a meld, finally feels like the, the coming together, not the either or. And so with that in mind, [00:26:00] I'd like to know from you guys how you see I know it's a arbitrary thing, but what time moves so fast?[00:26:08] What does the, with this in mind, what do the next three years look like in retail? What's going to be important? What will happen as we continue to meld better, smarter in, in better ways? Like the meld really is happening. What's it gonna look like?[00:26:27] Ricardo Belmar: I'll, I'll jump in. I, I, I think you're, you're right that we are, this meld is finally happening in the way that maybe we all started talking about. I'll pick a number, five years ago, right? That, that, that, that now there's sort of a recognition that not only is it happening, but actually needs to happen for, for supporting the business. It needs to happen because I, I go back to one of the things we said in that same timeframe was, you know what, now the consumer is in charge, right? The consumer now has all the power. Remember when that was the new phrase, a few years back. [00:26:56] So, so what, what is that led to now, right?[00:26:58] Yeah. People like, like to [00:27:00] repeat it, but maybe didn't believe it. But I think now there's recognition that. Not only does the consumer still have the power, guess what? They've had it all these past years and you just didn't realize it. So now that you're recognizing it, it's time to do something for that.[00:27:12] And, and the the something that you need to do is this melding because, I think all four of us have said it right, consumers don't care about channels. you know, there was a lot of, of jokes made, I think during shop talk about when they said on stage it was time to kill omnichannel and, and use a different phrase.[00:27:26] But I, I think the jokes aside, maybe the reason why we don't need to use that as a term is because if we're truly gonna look at things from the consumer's perspective, there's no such thing as a channel,[00:27:36] Vicki Cantrell: Right.[00:27:37] Ricardo Belmar: right? The whole I idea of looking at it, measuring, developing, operating in terms of these channels is absolutely meaningless to the consumer.[00:27:46] And what is meaningful to the consumer is, do you have a product I'm looking for, where can I go get it? How can I get it? How can I learn about it? To make sure I'm, I'm making the right choice and can you help me do all of the above? [00:28:00] And sometimes that's on, could be on a live stream you know, could be in a store, might just be the website.[00:28:06] you know, now, now we're, because of the new developments in ai right? We actually have meaningful demos about chatbots being helpful, unlike previous generations that maybe weren't so helpful. but yeah, there's all these different ways to, to do that now. It doesn't matter. I, I think maybe I, I might rephrase it to say it's not that we need to stop thinking about channels.[00:28:23] It's that let's recognize the channels don't matter. What matters is, how are you making those things I just listed available to that customer? you know, I, I like using Jeff, your example. We mentioned about B N H photo and we talked last time at N R F, right? [00:28:37] Jeff Roster: Just thinking [00:28:38] Ricardo Belmar: Because it's like the per, it's the perfect example, right?[00:28:41] You needed to know. About a product and, and, and maybe it wasn't even a product, I guess I shouldn't say a product. You needed to know about a category, right? To help you decide on a product and you leveraged that livestream. It was a one-to-one, but I'd still call it a livestream for that learning experience.[00:28:57] Did it matter to you as a consumer that it was [00:29:00] a livestream versus you having been in New York City and walked into the b and h store? No. Right. And. It didn't matter. You got the answer you wanted. You knew what you wanted to buy in the end. And that's, that was the win. So I think that's what what I see is finally happening and we'll see more of it is the blending is real. and I think the technologies have caught up too. I think maybe one of the reasons, if, if we're honest, right? It's that there were a lot of technology promises in those past years that were 80% there, maybe not a hundred percent there. And retailers, you know, in fairness right, couldn't figure out how do I get that extra 20% to make it right.[00:29:34] I think the technology is catching up to that in many ways to make it more, more doable and easier to do. And, and. The consumer adoption is there. You know, one of the things I, I joked about with some folks at, at Shop Talk is last year's big hype was all metaverse, right? And when you look back and say, well, why didn't that necessarily pick up?[00:29:54] And I'm not gonna say that it's gone, but I am gonna say that it it, the promises that were talked about and hyped up at Shop Talk [00:30:00] last year didn't materialize because what's the thing that was missing? It was the consumer adoption of it. the retailers could do any, everything they wanted on that, but consumers didn't really have a reason to adopt it.[00:30:11] Whereas I, I think now the technologies retailers are looking at don't have that consumer adoption element because it's transparent to the consumer. And I think that's where the focus will go. So if a retailer thinks a, I'm not gonna worry about channels, I just need to present things in front of a customer in some way.[00:30:27] What are all the different ways I can do that? What technologies help me accomplish that? And which ones don't really require the consumer to learn how to use it because they're already using it. It's either, you know, consumers know how to watch a video. You don't have to teach them how to join a live stream, that that's easy.[00:30:41] You're gonna have to teach them how to go to a website. You have to teach them how to go into a store and do things. That's why Metaverse hadn't picked up yet, because consumers have to learn how to do it. And you know, back to Ron, your comment. It's not the year for shiny objects. [00:30:55] So the, the technology, I think now, and I, I'll say for now, and let's make it the next [00:31:00] three years, the technology's gonna help with that seamless nature, which I guess I'm back to one of the four shop talk themes, right?[00:31:05] Seamless stores. but maybe expanding it to just seamless experience that that's where it's finally gonna go. And we won't have to, we're not gonna need to distinguish. Oh, is that an experiential retail scenario for the consumer, or is it about convenience? It's just there, it's just commerce.[00:31:21] Ron Thurston: Yeah,[00:31:22] Jeff Roster: Yeah, [00:31:22] Ron Thurston: mean, I'd love I, [00:31:24] Jeff Roster: Go ahead, Ron.[00:31:25] Ron Thurston: go ahead, Jeff. No, go ahead.[00:31:26] The New Way to Encourage Innovation With Consumer Adoption[00:31:26] Jeff Roster: So Ricardo, I know you're gonna be shocked to hear this, but sometimes vendors make a lot of buzz or noise or, or to go back to my old days hype. The whole metaverse thing is so illustrative because one, I I'm a fan because I've trained in simulators as a aviator for, for 25 years, but that is a massively heavy lift.[00:31:45] And to go and scream about something that is a massively heavy lift we're, we're absolutely gonna see that evolve and it's gonna take kinda like R F I D probably five to ten years. And so, you know what we need to understand, and this is where we as communicators really need to. [00:32:00]Probably should have been in front of that a lot more.[00:32:01] It's like, let's encourage innovation, but understand what it takes to innovate. You can't, I mean, you can't spend 10 trillion overnight. You have to do that in increments and you have to encourage the innovation and not make fun of it when it, you know, something like, like Metaverse doesn't blow up overnight.[00:32:18] There's a lot of processes and the process for innovation has become cheaper and cheaper and cheaper. And that's, that's what's also helping. I mean, low-code. I mean it's you know, my podcast partner, Brian can't say the word low-code enough in, in every sentence, it's low-code cuz he's a low-code guy.[00:32:32] But, but he's, he's sold me on that. I mean, when I started at Gardner, I, I mean terabyte of storage was a million dollars. I've got 15 terabytes on my desk. I've got three terabytes in my laptop. That's a picture in 20 years of the massively almost deflationary cycle or cost of, of innovation.[00:32:52] And that's what we have now. Now we have these tools, now we have all this stuff. You think about. You think about what, what a customer service channel is [00:33:00] gonna look like in a year. We're gonna be live streaming we're gonna have ChatGPT I mean, it is orders of magnitude different than what we, what we, what we were, you know, just a simple phone call even five or six years ago.[00:33:11] That's how fast we're innovating. And the key though, that's how cheaply we're able to innovate and to do things. And now the key point, and Ricardo, you're so spot on. You have a customer that now has more power in their hands and we, that's an old story, but they know how to use it. They know how to embrace it.[00:33:29] And I think the other thing that people need to understand, that's one thing Ron, I'm a little concerned about when I hear brands wanna maybe over, over. I don't know, try to manage that live stream a little too much. Look at TikTok. Those are not professional videos. Those are getting millions of views.[00:33:45] Those are kids with a phone in front of them. And so the, that expectation for something overmanaged, I think is gonna, is gonna be a negative more, more so than a positive. And so that's that part of that innovation where the customers way ahead of where we are as brands, as [00:34:00]retailers, and we're just sort of racing and trying to figure out, okay, how, how much professionalism do we put in?[00:34:05] How much do we let people run loose? So exciting. The next three years are just gonna be insane. Um,[00:34:10] Vicki Cantrell: what you just said has one specific word that is the same and has been the same for the last 10 years, will be the same for the next 10 years. The key is that the consumer knows how to adopt adoption. We all know that things that can't be or it's difficult to adopt, never work, whether it's metaverse or whatever, or tools.[00:34:31] Things that are easy to adopt will always work. And the consumer now has a very different set of a very different playing field for their adoption. That is not in our control and but it benefits us tremendously.[00:34:49] The Loyalty Factor[00:34:49] Ron Thurston: Yeah, agreed. I agree with you, Jeff. It's it's that balance of like, what can I do? Like test, learn, try, get out of it quickly, or, you know, [00:35:00] actually, if this is an important part of, of the customer journey, I think that what I would add to your question, Vicky, about the next three to five years is about loyalty, but I look at it in like really two, two very different ways.[00:35:14] I look at it from a, a store, I look at it from a store team if we're gonna talk about stores, we have to talk about team loyalty and people loyalty. And so the biggest pushback from investment in people that I hear from senior executives is, the turnover's too high for me to spend money on these people.[00:35:36] And my pushback is the reason that they're turning is because you're not investing. And if, if we don't, if we don't put more effort into loyalty at the front lines, it's going, we're gonna keep repeating the same mistakes and we're, we're never gonna deliver the results that we need if you can't retain the team.[00:35:56] So I think there's a huge loyalty frontline. And then [00:36:00] there's loyalty customer so much about first. Data, you know, how do we get new customers? How do we retain that customer? How much does it cost to get that customer? And while I think the conversation about having like the full picture of the customer when they walk into a store is a good conversation, I don't see it live in action.[00:36:22] If I'm a, you know, a, a very like loyal e-com for one brand, I walk into a location that they have no idea who I am. [00:36:32] And so I think we, we have to figure out ways to retain loyal customers. That's cha, a channel less loyal customer. Uh, because they're putting a lot of effort in there. Now finding ways. I mean, that's, I was between NRF and, and Shoptalk.[00:36:48] I was at eTail, which, you know, that is very much about marketing and customer and first cus first party data and that we, we have to think about that as a major priority for [00:37:00] the next three years too. And from, from both sides. yeah. [00:37:04] Vicki Cantrell: great point.[00:37:05] Ron Thurston: Yeah. [00:37:06] Vicki Cantrell: And, and loyalty is not about points anymore. That's, that's, that's, that's gonna be like the word innovation really needs to mean something different. So does the word loyalty. It's not about earn points. It's a very different proposition. I think, Ron, you explained it. You explained it well.[00:37:23] Ron Thurston: Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, and it's, it's, you know, luxury, luxury brands are going through this. Contemporary brands are going through this, you know, people are then, yeah, Walmart's writing about a luxury customer shop buying groceries at Walmart. Now how do, how do I retain that customer and a Walmart, but I'm also then buying a handbag at Gucci like this.[00:37:45] Ricardo Belmar: Mm-hmm.[00:37:45] Ron Thurston: There, there's no one right way to say how a customer's behaving today, yet loyalty to the, to the brands where people have gravitated is how we will sustain great results.[00:37:58] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah.[00:38:00][00:38:00] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I, I, I think, you know, hearing you say that I, I, I thought of two other examples like the Sephora at a Kohls. How does Kohls convert that Sephora customer to shop in the Kohls much like, you know, the Amazon returns in the Kohls, giving them, a coupon to buy something in the store over the next few days.[00:38:18] I think that's the same as your example Vicki, it's not of just about points uh, points and discounts don't buy loyalty for a brand, but then compare that to the kind of loyalty a brand like Apple has with their customers. Which I, if there's gonna be, if you were to pick two or three top brands, that probably reflect the highest loyalty, I think that has to be one of the top three right there. And sure you can point to, you know, the decision to open stores as having been a great piece of that, but it's not really just about Apple stores, it's just everything about them that drives the loyalty. And there's an example of a brand that doesn't give points and doesn't give discounts, that has a lot of super loyal customers.[00:38:54] As you know, when we got on here and we all showed off our, our AirPods Max headphones here. [00:39:00] So there's, there's a brand loyalty example that's real.[00:39:03] Ron Thurston: But[00:39:03] they have But they [00:39:04] Vicki Cantrell: of the relationship experience. [00:39:07] Yeah. [00:39:08] Ron Thurston: but they also have frontline team loyalty. This is a, that's a brand that invests heavily in stores and training and development and, and strategy and upskilling them and investing and stretch assignments and going to Cupertino for a year, going to Hong Kong for a year.[00:39:26] Like they will do anything to make sure that their teams are happy. Having worked there, myself and I can speak to it like it, they're the loyalty, generally from Apple employees in stores is really high and you feel that they're proud to work there and they're could not be more excited to sell you 600 dollar headphones.[00:39:47] And you know, we, we all, we all do. We all do it. And it's a really good example, Ricardo. Yeah.[00:39:53] Back to Changing Relationships As The ShopTalk Theme[00:39:53] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. Well, Vicky, you started us on the, that changing relationships theme as maybe the [00:40:00] core theme of the four that Shop Talk mentioned. I think Ron, with the raising the point about loyalty, you brought us right back full circle again to the changing relationships and how that, if we were to pick one theme of, of the four that Shop Talk's that I think we're, we're sort of, maybe indirectly agreeing here that the number one theme was these changing relationships and which includes both how you build that brand customer relationship, but also the brand employee relationship, and I think we can add in, you know, brand to brand relationship. It really is all about how those relationships are changing and how they remain together for the success of the business.[00:40:38] Ron Thurston: Yeah. agreed.[00:40:40] Vicki Cantrell: agreed. [00:40:41] Ron Thurston: Yeah. [00:40:41] Ricardo Belmar: So I think maybe that's a good note for us to close on,[00:40:46] Vicki Cantrell: Sounds great. [00:40:47] Ron Thurston: Yes, [00:40:47] Vicki Cantrell: is always so much fun. [00:40:50] It's a great, always a great conversation [00:40:53] Ricardo Belmar: think Jeff, your idea is onto something here that we do these after an event a few days or so after the event, so we've all had time to kind [00:41:00] of think about and, and digest it.[00:41:01] Jeff Roster: yeah, I, I do think, I do think vendors are gonna have a tough decision now. I mean, they're gonna have to consider shop talk a, a, a, a really legitimate show. And especially if they push into the store aspect of it. It's gonna be interesting to see how, how, how you allocate your marketing dollars. But I was impressed.[00:41:17] I was very impressed with the show.[00:41:20] Ron Thurston: me too. Very impressed. Is anyone going to Barcelona?[00:41:23] Vicki Cantrell: No.[00:41:24] Ron Thurston: No. [00:41:24] Ricardo Belmar: unfortunately, [00:41:25] Jeff Roster: great city, but two darn[00:41:27] Ricardo Belmar: if only so, yeah,[00:41:28] Ron Thurston: no recap of Shop Talk Barcelona.[00:41:39] Ricardo Belmar: Yep, Well,[00:41:39] Jeff Roster: Maybe [00:41:40] Ron Thurston: I think [00:41:40] Jeff Roster: cover it. Maybe we'll cover it from afar. we'll just, we'll just jump the, We'll, jump the Twitter hashtag and then give our [00:41:45] Ricardo Belmar: right. right. We'll, we'll look for great photos from people who are fortunate enough to be there.[00:41:52] Jeff Roster: Exactly.[00:41:54] Ricardo Belmar: Well, I, I guess maybe on that sort of disappointing note for the conversation[00:41:57] Ron Thurston: Sorry. [00:41:58] Ricardo Belmar: we'll, we'll wrap it up [00:42:00] there. What do you say Jeff? [00:42:01] Jeff Roster: Sounds good.[00:42:02] Ricardo Belmar: Sound good? All right. Well, Ron, Vicki, a as always a pleasure. Thanks again. We're gonna have to keep, keep doing these cuz this is just too much fun not to.[00:42:10] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah, it's great. I love seeing you guys. Happy Friday. Happy weekend. Happy Easter. Happy Passover.[00:42:16] Ron Thurston: Same. Same to you. [00:42:17] Same to you. Thank you. [00:42:18] Ricardo Belmar: Thanks everybody. Thank you.[00:42:19] Vicki Cantrell: Okay, bye.[00:42:21] Ron Thurston: Bye.[00:42:22] Show Recap[00:42:22] Casey Golden: Welcome back everyone and wow, I loved that conversation. I'm so with you guys on focusing on people. Retail is, totally a people business. I might not have been at Shop Talk, but I have to agree with the whole point about changing relationships and focusing on people loyalty both with store teams and customers is really where every retailer and brand needs to go.[00:42:52] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, it, it's interesting how different this discussion went compared to the conversation Jeff and I had with Krystina [00:43:00] Gustafson and Ben Miller in part one of the series. In that discussion, we really dug into, All the main trends at the show, and, and both Krystina and Ben really gave us some amazing details and viewpoints on how those four trends were manifesting in the industry and how people talked about it at the show.[00:43:15] And they were totally right about those trends. And of course, I, I have to put a plug in here for retail media networks and that that's for you, Jeff, if you're out there listening, you know, I couldn't resist to bring that up, just, just so you're aware. But when Ron and Vicki both brought us to that intersection of technology and people, it nicely outlined how it really does come down to people no matter what you do with the technology in retailing.[00:43:36] I have to say, that's what made this one of my favorite conversations on the podcast yet.[00:43:41] Casey Golden: Well, I mean, I really appreciate you guys for, you know, always bringing it back to center, amplifying the importance of relationships. It's really been with a heavy heart over this pandemic, just kind of seeing clientele turn into email marketing and diluting the magic of these relationships and that sales process, [00:44:00] or beyond the sales process, like the brand experience, you know, coming from the luxury side.[00:44:06] It's so much more than a sales associate, and shopping alone just hasn't hit the same note. So I'm just really excited to see so much focus go into the people, the relationships, the technology that needs to be made for people to like scale their work. Workspaces, digitization, not just replacement and, and AI like,[00:44:34] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah,[00:44:35] Casey Golden: AI Bard and I are not getting into conversations about shoes, pants, jackets, dress, nada! not invited [00:44:42] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's not happening. Yeah. I, I, I really think Vicki nailed it in her comment when she said, you know, the relationship is the experience. At the end of the day, that's what it's all about. And you know, as often, I mean, let, let's face it, we talk about technology on this show all the time, but we, we can't lose sight of [00:45:00] why are we talking about technology?[00:45:01] It's to help augment that people relationship, not replace it. And, and that I think is really what we're, this conversation really got to. And, and I'm really excited that that's where it ended up.[00:45:11] Casey Golden: Me too. I'm slightly biased, but thanks. I, I, I really like how you guys brought this together. With that Vicki called the melding of online in stores. Of course, I'm a store girl, right. But I like built some of the first e-commerce stores. And I just love talking about like store teams, how interacting with a stylist or a personal shopper makes a completely different and unique experience from discovering products to just the buying process.[00:45:42] Vicki just nailed it by saying that the experience is the relationship and what that melding, digital and physical is all about. When retails retailers do it right, services[00:45:56] Ricardo Belmar: Mm-hmm.[00:45:57] Casey Golden: are significant.[00:45:58] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. I, I [00:46:00] agree. And I think Jeff added a great point there too, about how the technology has to enable this, not compete with it, not make it more complicated. You know, it's that, it, it's that whole adoption point that we all talked about and why I think we all agree in that, you know, the, the current tech trends like, All, everything about generative AI right now and anything else that took over the conversation at this year's Shop Talk really have an advantage over the metaverse trend from last year's show because it comes down to consumer adoption.[00:46:26] If consumers can benefit from a technology without adopting anything new or any, whether it's a new habit or the ac, technology on, on the consumer side of it, then that's a winner. For retailers, if consumers have to adopt something, it's gonna take a lot longer for, for them to complete that adoption and to make an impact on, on the retailer's business.[00:46:43] It doesn't mean it won't happen. I think to Jeff's point about metaverse, I think we'd all agree it's gonna happen. It will happen. It's just not happening right away. It might not happen in less than a year's time. It's more of a long-term play. But some of these other technologies that we're trending this year, they have an immediate impact.[00:46:58] Casey Golden: Hundred [00:47:00] percent. I mean so much, so many of times technology ends up taking the work out of the business or the process and puts all of the work on the consumer. They have to do the heavy lifting and I think metaverse is definitely suffered from that, you know, the perspective that you just spoke of.[00:47:22] But then again, like. Web three has a better chance of making a difference because it's easier to lift on the consumer side than the Metaverse. The adoption will come from loyalty programs, as an example. Exclusive and unlockable content. Just look at Starbucks New Odyssey program and what you and Jeff talked about with Max from Z Blocks back at N R F.[00:47:46] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's true. That that's true. I mean, although I have to admit, I, I, I've totally failed in my efforts to unlock the first NFTs in the Starbucks program. I didn't get enough points to get the early drop.[00:47:55] Casey Golden: All right. Well, I, we, we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll do a little one-on-one[00:48:00][00:48:00] Ricardo Belmar: I may need your help on that.[00:48:01] Casey Golden: Be offline and on the blockchain.[00:48:04] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Oh, okay. I guess you know that maybe with your help, I can do better next time. But you know, I, I guess on that totally disappointing note I think this is, it only means one thing for this episode, right Casey?[00:48:17] Casey Golden: Indeed it's that time to, to wrap up. And I have to say, I agree. It's the best one ever. So we're gonna wrap up this Shop Talk crossover series with Jeff Roster and This Week In Innovation, it's been good.[00:48:32] Ricardo Belmar: It has.[00:48:33] Show Close[00:48:33] Casey Golden: If you enjoyed this season shows, especially our just completed podcast crossover mini-series, please consider giving us a five star rating and review on Apple Podcast. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player so you don't miss a minute. Plus remember, you can watch us, not just listen on our YouTube [00:49:00] channel and like, and comment there too. Share your thoughts. [00:49:03] If you wanna know more about what we talked about today, including a full transcript of this episode, take a look at the show notes for handy links and more deets. I'm your co-host, Casey Golden.[00:49:14] Ricardo Belmar: If you'd like to connect with us and share your thoughts on this season and crossover series, follow us on Twitter at Casey c Golden and Ricardo underscore Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure and follow the show on Twitter and LinkedIn, too, at Retail Razor for the latest updates. And watch for our season finale episode coming soon with a truly special guest host that's gonna turn things around and ask us questions for a change.[00:49:37] But for now, I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.[00:49:39] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.[00:49:42] ​[00:49:45] Ricardo Belmar: And remember, there's never been a better time to be in retail if you cut through the clutter. [00:49:49] Until next time. [00:49:50] This is the Retail Razor Show. [00:50:00]

How can retailers perform A/B testing of merchandise layouts in their stores without cost and without burdening store teams? By using Digital Twins, that's how! So how does a retailer build a digital twin of their stores? Meet startup Site Bionics and founder and CEO, Adam Blair. It's Part 3 of our #ShoptalkLive podcast cross-over series with This Week in Innovation and special guest host Jeff Roster, recorded live and in-person at Shoptalk!In this episode, Jeff and regular host Ricardo Belmar sit down with Site Bionics CEO, Adam Blair, to learn how they are helping retailers solve merchandising and operational challenges via digital twins, dramatically reducing the cost of testing new store layouts. Plus, we learn how Site Bionics can even help validate coverage maps of loss prevention camera systems! Yes, Jeff and Ricardo have uncovered another trend at Shoptalk – using loss prevention camera infrastructure in multiple ways that will positively impact your revenue streams and lower your costs. It's all in this episode!We're now standing at number 19 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list – if you enjoy our show, please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts! With your help, we'll move our way up the Top 20! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Meet your regular hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring E-Motive, and Overclocked, from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS2E12c Digital Twins with Site Bionics[00:00:00] Show Intro [00:00:20] Casey Golden: Hello Retail Razor Show listeners and viewers, and welcome to retail's favorite podcast for product junkies, commerce technologists, and everyone else in retail and retail tech alike. I'm your host, Casey Golden.[00:00:33] Ricardo Belmar: And I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar. Welcome to part three in our Shop Top Live crossover event with Jeff Roster, and This Week In Innovation podcast.[00:00:42] Casey Golden: You guys really make me feel like I missed out on some great conversations. I think I'm getting more FOMO than our listeners here.[00:00:51] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:00:52] Casey Golden: You are killing it with these amazing interviews. I have to come and join you guys next time, even though like I have no business [00:01:00] purpose to be there.[00:01:02] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. Well, it would be amazing if you could make it, Casey, we definitely missed you on this. It was lots of fun to, to capture these sessions. So on today's show, we are talking about none other than digital twins. One of my favorite probably my, the favorite metaverse topic that isn't necessarily a metaverse topic.[00:01:22] Casey Golden: Right. Well, I'm already hooked, so just tell me more. Spill it. Who did you guys chat with?[00:01:30] Ricardo Belmar: So this time Jeff and I spoke with Adam Blair, c e o, and founder of Startup Site Bionics. And in this discussion we learned just how popular it is to use those loss prevention cameras in your store for so much more than loss prevention. I mean, this was the second startup we talked to that were tapping into those cameras as a resource for analytics.[00:01:50] This time using them to help build a multi-layered digital twin of your store.[00:01:54] Casey Golden: Interesting. And you guys uncovered a trend trend there. Wow. Like [00:02:00] not many people would've said those loss prevention cameras are so popular not too long ago.[00:02:06] Ricardo Belmar: yeah. Right. Exactly. So you, you'll also want to keep track throughout this discussion with Adam of just how many different use cases and questions you can answer about your store environment using this digital twin that you build with, with their solution and, and all the loss prevention cameras plus a few extra little add-ons that that I think are pretty clever that they do.[00:02:25] Casey Golden: Well, let's not spend any more precious time talking about it. Let's get right into the discussion with you, Jeff and Adam Blair, c e o of Site Bionics, recorded live and in person at Shoptalk 2023.[00:02:40] Site Bionics Interview[00:02:40] Ricardo Belmar: ​hey everyone we are back at Shop Talk 2023, continuing our crossover event with This Week In Innovation. I'm Ricardo Belmar. I'm host of the Retail Razor Show and I am here with none other than the myth, the legend, Mr. Jeff Roster,[00:02:59] Jeff Roster: [00:03:00] how you, how you doing today? I don't know about you, but I am dragging. I'm possibly, I went a little hard on the, on the evening research opportunities last night.[00:03:08] Ricardo Belmar: Just a little, just a Yeah, yeah.[00:03:10] Jeff Roster: little bit hard, but it was[00:03:11] Ricardo Belmar: It's, it was, yeah. It's, it's what are we day three? Are we day three, day[00:03:14] Jeff Roster: five. I tried to, I really was planning on being done by eight, but there was an event at the What Skyfall lounge, which was started at nine 30.[00:03:24] Phenomenal. But boy, that got a little bit late Little [00:03:30] Ricardo Belmar: I hear you. I hear you. One, one more day to go. One more day. One more day to go. All right. All right. So the good news is we've got another great guest with us today. Jeff. We are here with Adam Blair and the CEO of Site Bionics, who's gonna tell us all about the cool things that he's working on over there.[00:03:47] So Adam, I'm gonna let you introduce yourself here and dive in and give us your background and what Site Bionics is all about and what you know, what challenges are you solving for retailers and, and give us the scoop.[00:03:58] Adam Blair: Sounds good. [00:04:00] Thanks for the intro. Yeah. At Site Bionics we're helping retailers make sense of their physical world.[00:04:04] And what that means particularly is we're building digital twins for retail stores. And we, we view that as, just to be clear, cuz we, we you know, one of the things that you get into with digital twins is there's a lot of different uses of it.[00:04:16] The different, it's an kind of an overloaded term. Right, right, right. We view the digital twin as a data, fundamentally a data model of the store. And it's a means of getting, taking the messy, unstructured, unstructured data that you get in a store when you have humans moving around doing what humans do.[00:04:32] And and, and you try to make sense of it all. So yeah, for us, it, it actually getting into a little bit of how we do that, we start a little, we start by getting a, a sense of the site. So we have the means of going around and getting a physical rendering. So, to be clear, it's not sort of a metaverse play in that direct sense, right?[00:04:50] Where we're just, you're not necessarily going into it. But we do have, for what it's worth, we do have a rendering that's like video game quality rendering of the space. But that's a tool it's a [00:05:00] tool that allows us to we, we can start there. We can help retailer to understand how the store is laid out whether or not their merchandising and their layout is matching what they expect from corporate and, and be able to feed that data back.[00:05:11] And that's sort of our layer. Right. Then we have the ability to layer on to use existing cameras in the store as available and be able to add sort of our video analytics piece on top of that where you can track movement through the space. Right. And then we have an iot portion that can go beyond that too, where we can leverage on my, my pack background in, in R F I D particularly and, and other iot technologies and, and be able to.[00:05:36] That and, and, and build really. So it's sort of these layers and we want to bring value to retailer to each of these layers, right? And but it's the full data source. That's really the thing. And, and, and then once you add that, you get that full system you get the learning that goes on top of it.[00:05:51] And then you have the ability to move into higher levels of analytics where you're able to get a model and understand how things are behaving, why they're, why things are happening and, [00:06:00] and then help retailers better understand how to use their space and make the most of it.[00:06:04] Building a Digital Twin[00:06:04] Jeff Roster: So a couple questions right off the bat. How do you get the, the first rendering in, in layer one?[00:06:10] Adam Blair: Yeah, we do that with it's, it's, it is using just a cell phone standard imagery. We have the ability and we, we've actually this is the piece we've built so far. We're, we're obviously very, we're very new startup.[00:06:19] We've only been around for a couple months but this is a piece that we have, we developed the capability to go into a store and develop that rendering in about 15 minutes for like a mall size store. So yes. Yes,[00:06:31] Jeff Roster: So who would actually do that? Would store associate level? I mean, just literally somebody just taking their phone and just videoing the the aisles and [00:06:37] Adam Blair: that's right. [00:06:38] Jeff Roster: Oh, wow. Okay.[00:06:39] Adam Blair: Yeah. It's, it's, we don't want it to be specialized. We don't want to have to send our people in. We want to make that available to, you know, the, the people that are there for, for ease,[00:06:46] Jeff Roster: Then I think in layer two, you said something about tying into existing cameras, is that the LP cameras or[00:06:52] Adam Blair: we have the ability to do that. Yes. Or that, that's what we're working to build, I should say the, the, the DVR that's existing on the camera, right? I mean, we're, we're, we're very [00:07:00] sensitive about privacy. Right? That's a big, big deal for us. We mean that genuinely. So we don't, you know, we don't want to be storing any date, any, any image data.[00:07:09] We wanna leverage the existing systems that, that are there.[00:07:11] And so we would, yeah, we would be able to essentially connect in with the existing security system and, and be able to derive analytics from that.[00:07:20] How Retailers Use Digital Twins[00:07:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hmm, interesting. So tell us then a little bit about what kind of analytics you would expect a retailer to, to benefit from here, how would they use, so once you have the digital twin of the store, right. How are you expecting a, a retailer to use this?[00:07:33] Adam Blair: Yeah, we're expecting I mean, it's, it's, look, we, we think that this if we can get to the full digital twin or when we get there, I should say that it, it can be used in, in all sorts of aspects of how they run the store. So and how they engage with their customers as well. Right? So it starts with making the most, the, the best use of the space that they have, right?[00:07:50] Understanding how they wanna lay out a store, right? We would expect them to, in, in the long run, to be able to sort of model how they think it should work. Test it out, you might be able to [00:08:00] run AB testing in multiple stores, right. And, and, and really get to the next level of EF efficiency in sort of, in terms of the layout and, and merchandising.[00:08:10] We expect to be able to understand that the full con, the, the full shopper path to purchase. We do believe we have the ability to tie that back to individuals as if they were to opt-in.[00:08:19] They can opt in at any point in their journey, and the entire journey could be connected in. So you could start to actually conceive of a digital twin of the individual as they opt in and, and, and make better use of that.[00:08:30] And then and then, and then operationally in, in terms of operational efficiency, right? Understanding how their staff are moving around, how they're, who they're interacting, when and why. And, and try to improve operations as well.[00:08:41] So it's kind of, it can be kind of all things for all people. Right? I'm, I'm obviously sharing a vision here.[00:08:46] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:08:47] Okay. Okay.[00:08:48] What a Deployment Looks Like[00:08:48] Jeff Roster: So what would a deployment look like?[00:08:51] Adam Blair: That's a great question. Yeah. So the, the, the, the early deployment is you go in and you scan the store using our app which we, we are in the, we [00:09:00] we plan to productize, right? So you would go in and you would do that, that sort of first deployment, you'd connect into the back the, the security system just a computer in the back office kind of thing.[00:09:09] And and that's, that's actually all you need, right? Because you have the, the imagery and the, the, the data. We have the ability to understand what's a fixture, what's what different product. And infer your merchandising plan and how it, how it's the store is laid out. And, and so that's, that's kind of all that's necessary to g to get going.[00:09:27] We would be, you know, we would expect to be delivering dashboards and things like that. So your, your people in corporate, your merchandisers could actually interact with the store, right? You could actually lay it out in our tool set and drag and drop fixtures around and move them around in that way.[00:09:40] And then, and then push that down to your in-store.[00:09:44] You can get the, the feedback confirmation that the store has been laid out appropriately, and see how the behaviors adapt and how performance the store adapts.[00:09:52] Jeff Roster: So you're getting live feed constantly out of the the LP cameras. right. Any issue with LP?[00:09:59] Adam Blair: With, with [00:10:00] LP directly? It depends. I mean, it's gonna depend, it's gonna depend a lot on, on, on who, right?[00:10:04] Jeff Roster: so easy to work with. I'm sure.[00:10:06] Adam Blair: Very flexible. There is. Look, there's, there's absolutely a, a, a path in there with any, anytime. Look, anytime you put any computer system inside anybody's network, you have to be there's a process you have to go through. With lp it'll be more rigorous for sure.[00:10:20] Like I said, we we're, we're totally open from a privacy perspective having, having the code, getting vetted right is, is totally, you know, among our expectations, right?[00:10:31] Jeff Roster: Well, you know, Ricardo, that's interesting cuz that's the second, second startup we've talked[00:10:34] Ricardo Belmar: That's right.[00:10:35] Jeff Roster: tying in. So there's,[00:10:36] there seems[00:10:36] to be a trend[00:10:37] Ricardo Belmar: trend here in leveraging that LP video[00:10:39] Jeff Roster: 36 hours ago, if you would've said, You're gonna run stuff through the LP camera. I've said you're crazy, but, but I mean, obviously two, you know the last two folks we talked to, so Yeah.[00:10:49] And it does make sense to sweat those assets. So[00:10:51] Ricardo Belmar: right. No, I mean, it, it does because you, you've already got a lot of useful information there. You're already covering exactly what you want to see in the store, so [00:11:00] this is a great way of, of using that information to derive new data insights from it. [00:11:05] Adam Blair: In fact, one of, one of the, one of the potential early, early benefits you can have from this approach is you can actually get an, an immediate assessment of how good are your, is your security camera layout, right? Because we could show you exactly where in that 3D rendering you have coverage and where you do not. Right. [00:11:20] Ricardo Belmar: that's interesting.[00:11:21] Interesting. [00:11:21] That's interesting. Yeah. Yeah.[00:11:23] Jeff Roster: Any sense right now what percentage of the store is covered? I would think in theory they would say a hundred percent, but obviously it can't be a hundred [00:11:30] Adam Blair: Yeah. Talk to the employees and see what they say. Right.[00:11:33] where they take those hidden breaks. I, I don't actually have a sense for that. I mean, it, it's it's, and, and, and it's also the sort of thing again, we, we have the ability to go in and say where those holes are, how to fill them.[00:11:44] The Digital Twin Vision[00:11:44] Ricardo Belmar: So do you envision a retailer using this, so, you know, once you have that digital twin, they have the model that they're gonna do a lot of kind of what if and ab scenarios on, product placements on shelves, and rearranging things and doing some modeling with that before they push that down to stores.[00:12:00][00:12:00] Adam Blair: Absolutely. I mean, I, I think that that's that, that's absolutely one of the expectations. The other way that I actually like to look about, look at it is you know, most retailers when they provide direction down to the stores, they're providing guidance. And there's different, retailers are different in terms of how much local control that they give, but I love the idea of giving a bit more local control. Right. You know, one, one of the retailers we spoke with about this, they had, they said that the reason they don't give more local control is that they found they don't trust the control at the retail at, at the, at the retailer, at the, at the local site.[00:12:28] Right. They, they you know, the, the person that has best of intentions and, and the example that they gave us directly was then you end up with a beer next to the back to school section. Right.[00:12:38] Jeff Roster: It might[00:12:38] work. I don't know.[00:12:39] Ricardo Belmar: I don't, I don't know if that's unintentional, that[00:12:41] Jeff Roster: it would've worked at.[00:12:42] Ricardo Belmar: exclusively as a parent. I don't know if that's unintentional.[00:12:44] Jeff Roster: definitely would've worked at Chico State. Dropping a daughter off at San Diego State, it absolutely would've worked there.[00:12:49] Adam Blair: Maybe a little off brand for the retailer though.[00:12:51] Ricardo Belmar: Maybe just a bit. Yeah, maybe a little.[00:12:53] Adam Blair: But, but, but, but you give that sort of control down and now you actually introduce some randomness into the larger system. And that's actually a good thing in this [00:13:00]case, because as long as you're able to measure and then close that feedback loop, when somebody goes and does something that's silly, you can, you'll see the behavioral changes of that.[00:13:10] When somebody does something that's, that's surprisingly effective, you'll see those re results too and be able to understand why. And so then you can pull that data up to the corporate level and feed it down to all of your stores, and so you can, you know, create more of a, learn a much tighter, more effective learning cycle as a result.[00:13:27] Ricardo Belmar: interesting. So I, I guess I have to ask, how did you come to this idea and what, what motivated you to create this solution. [00:13:35] Adam Blair: Yeah, so it's, it's I guess it, it came through through a, a, a path, a journey, I suppose. It actually started couple startups I've had now this is my third, my third startup. The previous two have been in overhead, R F I D.[00:13:47] Ricardo Belmar: Okay. [00:13:47] Adam Blair: And and, and one in particular, the first one was we were partnered with Intel in, in their responsive retail platform from [00:13:54] Oh, okay.[00:13:54] Years back.[00:13:55] Ricardo Belmar: I remember that.[00:13:55] Adam Blair: Yeah. And so one of the things that we found early on when we did some, some of our [00:14:00] early R F I D deployments, we were getting like 85% of the, the total I inventory that we could actually like read within about an hour of.[00:14:09] we[00:14:09] found if we just left it on running continuously for long periods of time though, and we added just a, a strong probabilistic algorithm on top of it, that we could actually infer the inventory you needed for the purposes of restocking to a 99% plus accuracy by just at any given moment, just running over an extended period of time.[00:14:27] Because you could see the dynamics of the store. You could see how[00:14:31] so I haven't read something for a day. It doesn't, is it more likely that it's outta stock or it's still here and it's just not readable? Or is it, is it gone? And so by applying that sort of that that sort of algorithm and that model on top of the store, we are able to make much better, much more effective use of the really messy data that we had.[00:14:49] Right? So it, it started with that. As I got into talking to people in the computer vision space as well.[00:14:54] They have similar problems, right? Where you have, it's very messy, very uncontrolled data. And so you [00:15:00] start applying these higher level algorithms to it, and you start to get to the better insights, right?[00:15:04] You get, you start to answer the questions, you start to put yourself in a place where you can answer the questions that the retailers actually have, right? And, and to step back a little bit to the inventory question, ? Retailers don't really like, they think they want to know what, what is in their inventory list, right?[00:15:21] But in reality they want to know, should I restock right now? Right? And, and what items should I be restocking when they want to know, can I ship this? Can I have somebody that's looking at this item online right now? Should I send them to the store to pick it up? Right? Those are two very simple, very, very different questions that are, you know, it's, it's somewhat arbitrary to ask them of the same list. Right? And so by building the more comprehensive model, you can get to something that can answer those real questions that are being asked of the store, right? And so that's how we think about it. We think about it as queering the digital twin for whatever information. And the, the digital twin will give you the best answer for that [00:16:00] question, given the full context of the store, right?[00:16:04] If you're down to one umbrella, one umbrella, and you haven't sold them in a week, any, any in a week, right? You might be inclined to say, well, go ahead and send somebody that's 15 minutes away if I told you that it hadn't been raining in a week and it's raining now. Right? That answer's very different, So that's how we're looking at it, is the full context response.[00:16:21] Jeff Roster: So who do you sell into in that regard? Is that, is that BI? Is that what is that?[00:16:26] Adam Blair: Yeah, we think it's it, it, it's, it's most likely the cio ct CTO type level, right? Because we, we think about it in terms of the full data for the, for the, for the store. right? You think, we think about it in terms of you know, the, that the, the data source, because it, it, it is, it's a little bit tricky, right?[00:16:42] Because it is a lot of potential users for any of this data within the, within the retail store, and, and we're thinking about it being the CEO or the CTO being the conduit into the rest of the retailer.[00:16:52] Jeff Roster: Well, they'd be the one that buying it. But I mean, it it, where would I put that in my, in my tech stack? I mean, is that, is that business intelligence, is that I don't know, [00:17:00]video analytics, I guess. I mean that we've had that conversation too, it seems, seems pretty video in a lot of analytics. So are you comfortable with that sort of a classification. [00:17:08] Adam Blair: I mean, I think I'd prefer being more business in business intelligence than, than, I mean, I, I, I don't like it being the source of the data. I like it being the, the context of the data. But I, I, you know I think that's something we're gonna have to work through with the, the different retailers and how they're organizationally structured too.[00:17:23] Right? Because sometimes the, the titles don't completely match the function.[00:17:26] Jeff Roster: That makes sense[00:17:27] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's, that does happen. That's true. Okay. . Well wow. I mean this is, I'm always fascinated by digital twin technology right now, as I think this is we're still sort of in early days on, on how retailers can leverage this kind of technology. What kind of questions can they answer by using it?[00:17:43] Kind of your, your last example there, Adam, about, you know, how, how you can have just slight variation, right? Very different questions to answer. And by leveraging that digital twin, you can come up with an answer where the absence of that, you know, how, how many different systems do you have? To be able to figure out what the answer is that that's being [00:18:00] facilitated here.[00:18:00] So I think this is really, really a fascinating space to watch. And Jeff, to your point, you know, now this is the second kind of conversation we, we've kind of come across where we're plugging into LP as a data source but using it in a pretty different, more creative way necessarily than, than we might otherwise think of.[00:18:16] Jeff Roster: I w I am writing the email to my, our, our mutual friend Tony, to say,[00:18:21] Ricardo Belmar: say are you thinking about this?[00:18:22] Jeff Roster: just curious what, just so what the LP sense is on that. But[00:18:25] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. So Adam, if somebody wants to reach out to you and, and find out more about what you're doing in Site Bionic, what's, how should they reach out to you?[00:18:32] Adam Blair: Yeah. Honestly, best way is just reach out directly adam@sitebionics.com. Also on LinkedIn is always a good way to get in touch with me. And happy to have conversations. Right? We're early. The conversations are, are, are the greatest value. The building, the relationships is, is is the most important thing for us right now.[00:18:47] Ricardo Belmar: Great. Fantastic. Well, Adam, thanks so much for joining us and we appreciate you taking the time out to meet with us, and we'll be, we'll be watching out to see how things progress for you.[00:18:56] Adam Blair: Thank you so much for having me.[00:18:57] Jeff Roster: Outstanding. Thanks. Bye.[00:18:59] Ricardo Belmar: [00:19:00] bye everyone. [00:19:00] Show Recap[00:19:00] Casey Golden: Well, welcome back everyone. And wasn't that an interesting take on digital twins? Did you catch the ever important reference to computer vision? [00:19:15] Ricardo Belmar: Yep, I did too. I did too. And this was a short but sweet session that we had with Adam. I mean, they are really leaning into helping retailers answer tough questions about their store, ranging from merchandise layouts to just general operations. I mean, having that digital twin opens a door to so many possibilities and AB tests that you can run without having to spend the time and effort to physically change it in the store and know what kind of results you're going to get. And this is just why I've been a big proponent of digital twins, is that one super important and practical use case for metaverse applications today.[00:19:50] Casey Golden: I agree. I don't think a lot of people know how much we have been doing physical twins in the [00:20:00] industry, like building the whole entire area of your Macy's shop and shop somewhere else to flo, do floor sets and and, and not just one, but you know, 30 retailers where their floors going, how that set's gonna look.[00:20:14] Stack heights. I think that I mean, we'd have whole teams that flew in to go ahead and, and play with that before the merchandise plans went out. Having these spaces from your stores into like throughout the whole entire process. It's just, it's, there's so, there's such a money savings here that if you can turn those cameras from a cost center to generating revenue,[00:20:40] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly.[00:20:41] Casey Golden: How awesome is that?[00:20:43] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly.[00:20:43] Casey Golden: most times when we think of like a digital twin, everybody thinks that it's avatar clothing,[00:20:48] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Right,[00:20:48] Casey Golden: right? Which I love. But I think that there's, there's so many different applications that where we spend millions of dollars every season [00:21:00] that could be recaptured and spent elsewhere by using these different types of digital twins in different ways of like visualizing Even just traffic pattern.[00:21:11] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, E. Exactly, exactly. I mean, just think of all the what if scenarios you can do, like you were saying, right? Where before you could have a team of people take days, right. To experiment and try different options, different layouts. And now you just put 'em in that, in the digital twin you can see exactly, you can do a fly through, and and kind of walk through that virtual space, see what it, what it's gonna look like to you and decide maybe that's not the option you want. I mean, it it, and it really does turn that whole cost center of having to absorb the cost of making those changes. Now it's something that helps you get to revenue faster, right?[00:21:41] Because now you, you can implement the changes. You'll know what the outcome is gonna be. You've predicted it. And now when you're asking the store teams to go and do these things, it's not an experiment anymore. Now, you know that you're doing something that's gonna have a positive impact right to your, your revenue stream. So it just makes so much sense. I really believe people should be [00:22:00] adopting this more and more. So I think that Adam is on to a good, a really good solid application here with Site Bionics, and we hope to see more of them in the future.[00:22:08] Casey Golden: Yeah, I mean, cutting lead time is, is a really big[00:22:12] Ricardo Belmar: Huge. [00:22:13] Casey Golden: So what's coming up next in this series? We've got one more to go, right?[00:22:17] Ricardo Belmar: that's right. We've just got one more in the series and sure enough, this is probably my favorite of the set. You know, at the start of the series I teased that it was a follow up to that popular discussion we recorded at N R F. We did run into a few difficulties, however.[00:22:32] Casey Golden: Difficulties. Okay. I didn't realize there was gonna be a mystery attached.[00:22:37] Ricardo Belmar: Well, remember the TRI chat that Jeff and I had with Vicki Cantrell and Ron Thurston at nrf, the one that was supposed to be a a 10 to 15 minute discussion that turned into an almost an hour.[00:22:48] Well, yep. Well, we all agreed to do that same chat again at Shop Talk. But we did run into some scheduling challenges.[00:22:56] Sure enough, we were all so busy there was only one time slot that we could [00:23:00]manage to, to get together and, and RETHINK Retail was kind enough to let us use their booth space at Shop Talk to do this recording. So we planned it for the end of, I think it was day two at the show. But sure enough, that was also the time that Shop Talk had their happy hours scheduled on the expo floor.[00:23:16] And I mean, literally as soon as Jeff and I got to the Rethink booth and we were about to start setting up the recording equipment, suddenly we. All kinds of loud music starts blasting over the speakers because, you know, it's happy hour time, so it's time to put some music on the, on the show floor. I guess that was part of the entertainment.[00:23:33] So as you might guess, there was just no way we could record any audio under those conditions with all that background music playing. So we ended up deciding, okay, let's regroup. The week after the show, we'd all have some time to digest what we saw. Think about it. And we just do it a normal remote recording.[00:23:50] And so this last episode was not exactly recorded in person, but as a bonus it does mean that there's gonna be full video for everybody to watch this time.[00:23:58] Casey Golden: Well, that's [00:24:00] a fantastic way to close out the series and I'm sure it'll definitely be worth it. Now there's expectations that everybody's done their homework. So,[00:24:09] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, maybe I set that up a little too strongly. I hope, I hope we meet everyone's expectations now that I said that. But, but for now I, I'm just gonna thank Adam Blair for joining Jeff and me for this recording that we just went through at Shop Talk. Thank you, Adam. We will definitely be watching for Site Bionics' progress over the rest of the year.[00:24:27] Casey Golden: and on that note, Ricardo, this can only mean one thing. It's a wrap.[00:24:33] Show Close[00:24:33] Casey Golden: If you enjoyed this season's shows, especially our podcast crossover miniseries, please consider giving us a five star rating and review on Apple Podcasts. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player so you don't miss a minute. Plus, remember, you can watch us, not just listen on our YouTube channel and like, and comment there.[00:25:00][00:25:00] If you wanna know more about what we talked about today, including a full transcript of the episode, take a look at the show notes for handy links and more deets. I'm your co-host, Casey Golden.[00:25:10] Ricardo Belmar: If you'd like to connect with us and share your thoughts on this season and the crossover series, follow us on Twitter at Casey C Golden and Ricardo underscore Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure and follow the show on Twitter and LinkedIn at Retail Razor for the latest updates. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.[00:25:27] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.[00:25:32] Ricardo Belmar: And remember, there's never been a better time to be in retail if you cut through the clutter. Until next time. This is the retail Razor Show. 

About This EpisodeIn this episode, retail executive Ron Thurston walks us through his impressive career and the bold moves he's taken along the way. Learning great leadership firsthand from his grandfather, who was the CEO of his own construction business, Ron strives, as a leader, to find the magic in other people and give them opportunities to grow. He discusses what it really means to be a student of the retail industry and the pivotal role of a store's general manager, all while discussing the perception of retail and debunking myths about the industry and online shopping. Ron also emphasizes the power of our purchasing decisions. The places where we choose to shop, particularly in-person versus online, have real impact, especially on the environment. So tune in to hear Ron's bold story and get the inside scoop of the retail industry. About Ron ThurstonRon loves retail. And he's proud of it. He is a highly accomplished retail executive and has proudly led the field teams for some of America's most beloved brands over the last three decades, including GAP, Apple, West Elm, Tory Burch, Bonobos Saint Laurent, and INTERMIX. From part-time sales associate to Vice President of Stores, Ron has put in the hard work that career in retail requires and wrote his first best-selling book, Retail Pride, in 2020 to share what he learned along the way. For the last three years, Ron was named one of the Top 100 Retail Influencers by Rethink Retail and was also recently recognized as one of the 2022 Top 100 Retail Technology Influencers by RITH. He served on the Board of Directors of Goodwill NY/NJ and currently sits on the Advisory Boards of several emerging retail technology brands, including Reflex and IMMERSS.  Additional ResourcesWebsite: https://www.retailpride.com/Check Out His Book, Retail PrideLinkedIn: @RonThurstonInstagram: @RetailPride

Did you miss Shoptalk 2023 this year? Or were you there and feel like you didn't catch enough of the content and top trends? We've got you covered with another podcast cross-over event with This Week in Innovation and special guest host Jeff Roster! Kicking off this multi-part series, Jeff and regular host Ricardo Belmar sit down with Shoptalk's content team of Krystina Gustafson and Ben Miller live and in-person on the final day of the event. Together they review the top 4 trends and what they mean for retailers, brands, and the retail tech community. The team goes deep to break down the hype vs reality of Generative AI and discuss how retailers are changing and evolving their relationships with consumers, employees, and suppliers. Plus, hear about the latest trends in shopper engagement!This episode's guests:Krystina Gustafson, SVP Content, Shoptalk and GroceryshopBen Miller, Director of original content, Shoptalk and GroceryshopWe're at number 19 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list - please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts! With your help, we'll move our way up the Top 20! Leave us a review & be mentioned in future episodes! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Meet your regular hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, a Top 12 ecommerce influencer, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring E-Motive, and Overclocked, from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS2E12a #ShoptalkLive – SPECIAL - Krystina Gustafson & Ben Miller[00:00:00] ​[00:00:00] Show Intro [00:00:20] Casey Golden: Hello Retail Razor Show listeners and viewers, and welcome to retail's favorite podcast for product junkies, commerce technologist, and everyone else in retail and retail tech alike. I'm your host, Casey Golden.[00:00:33] Ricardo Belmar: And I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar. And boy do we have a special treat for you this episode! Today we are talking about the changing relationships between retailers and brands, the evolution of shopper engagement. How omnichannel is morphing into seamless stores, and we see how it's possible to transform over 320,000 meeting requests into over 50,000 actual meetings in a span of three days.[00:00:57] But first, let's talk about our newest [00:01:00] crossover event, and this episode's special guests.[00:01:03] Casey Golden: That's right after our wildly successful crossover event with This Week In Innovation podcast for our N R F Live miniseries. Joined by one of our favorite guest hosts, Jeff Roster. We've done it again for our Shop Talk coverage.[00:01:20] Ricardo Belmar: Yes, indeed. By popular demand, and by popular demand, I mean, we really liked the idea, so we thought, let's do it again. Jeff Roster and I teamed up at Shop Talk for a few special interviews to bring you a Shop Talk live mini-series.[00:01:33] Casey Golden: Well, I'm sad I once again had to miss this one, but I know you guys have pulled together a killer miniseries not to be missed. Who are the episodes special guests?[00:01:45] Ricardo Belmar: I am glad you asked Casey. What better way to kick off this mini-series and with a deep dive discussion on all the hot topics at Shop Talk than sitting down with the Source, Shop talk's, amazing content team led by Krystina Gustafson, SVP of Content, [00:02:00] and Ben Miller, director of original content.[00:02:02] Casey Golden: Christina and Ben are incredible. Uh, you and Jeff really got to dig in to all the hot topics and wasn't this right after they had delivered their retail zeitgeist presentation on , the main stage, right?[00:02:17] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah, that's right. We, we recorded this the very next morning after that session where Krystina and Joe Laszlo had run through what Shop Talk was seeing as the major retail trends for the year. Plus , Ben and Krystina gave us some insights into what they found most notable from all the sessions at the show.[00:02:33] And did I mention those 50,000 meetings they orchestrated? I mean, just, wow. Wait until you hear all the stats about what was surely the, the biggest shop talk ever.[00:02:42] Casey Golden: Well, let's get to it then and jump right into you and Jeff's conversation with Krystina Gustafson and Ben Miller from Shop Talk, recorded live and in person at the show. [00:02:54] ​[00:02:59] The Shoptalk Review [00:02:59] Ricardo Belmar: Hello everyone [00:03:00] and welcome to our special Retail Razor crossover event with This Week In Innovation. I'm Ricardo Belmar, live and in person here at Shop Talk 2023, and I am here with the myth, the legend, Mr. Jeff Roster from This Week In Innovation. How you doing, Jeff?[00:03:15] Jeff Roster: Really good. Ricardo. I, you know, I, I'm so proud of both of us. We're, we're here last day, literally working the show to the last minute, and that's how we roll. That's how we[00:03:24] Ricardo Belmar: what we do. That's right. And for this special edition episode of our live series here at Shop Talk, we have the incredible pleasure of having two folks from the Shop talk team to talk to us about the event.[00:03:36] We're here with Krystina Gustafson and Ben Miller. Krystina. Ben, how are you doing today?[00:03:40] Krystina Gustafson: Doing awesome.[00:03:41] Ben Miller: Yeah, very good. Thank you. Thanks for having us. [00:03:43] Ricardo Belmar: Fantastic. Fantastic. So let's jump in. And I think, you know, one of the, the probably most in, well maybe not most interesting, but something I'm sure everyone wants to know is just give us a little bit of data around just how big a shop talk was this, this year?[00:03:56] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah, happy to start. 10,000 plus attendees, our [00:04:00] largest crowd so far. I would say though, what I take away even more than the size is just the quality of the a attendee. So it really sort of felt like this was. The big year. I know last year was technically retail's big reunion, but with the loss of corporate travel bands people just really being back down to business, the caliber of attendee, the amount of retailers and brands we had attending the show at a very senior level was, was one of the big takeaways to me beyond just kind of the scale of the event.[00:04:25] I know we'll probably talk about meet up a little bit later, but we also were able to facilitate 50,000 meetings over the course of two days which was incredibly impressive. Other things to note about scale 275 speakers 70 hours. 50 hours of content, 80 sessions seven content theaters. So I would say those are kind of the high level numbers. But Ben, you might have some, some additional stats to toss out there.[00:04:48] Ben Miller: kind of, yeah, I think when we talk about the Meetup 50,000 sounds an incredible number[00:04:53] Ricardo Belmar: right?[00:04:53] Yeah, it does.[00:04:54] Ben Miller: We had 323,000 requests to[00:05:00] so the appetite the appetite for, everybody to want to get together, to have some meetings, to meet people, to build their business. And you could feel that energy when you walked around.[00:05:10] And that energy, you know, it's, day four with lagging a little bit, but that energy that that energy is palpable. And that's, and that's been, yeah, that's been a key part of the show this year. [00:05:21] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Wow. That's un 323,000 requests . Wow. What I, I, you know, one of the things we were talking about before, you know, what we think is sort of unique about the Shop Talk experience you have you know, for example, like how, how, how many vendors were here, whether exhibiting or, or attendees.[00:05:39] I think that's always a key part of bringing all parts of the industry together. That Shop Talk is so, so special for [00:05:45] Ben Miller: key. No, we, we re really agree our. I think you've heard Sophie, our president talk before that we don't really think about a buy side and a sell side. We don't try and compartmentalize. We have a community and our vendors, the technology companies, whether they are [00:06:00] really small startups for whom a Series A feels a distant proposition still right through to Google Face meta.[00:06:07] You know, some of the biggest organizations and biggest corporations in the country and in the world are here. We have about 700. Technology companies and technology vendors, and many of them are on our show floor exhibiting showing their wear, hosting their their, their clients, and also being involved in the meetings and they're a really important part of our community.[00:06:26] Ricardo Belmar: And then tell us a little bit about you know, the, the startup community and the relationship with, with the shop talk there.[00:06:32] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah, it's I think, been a part of our community that's been really special from day one. You know, we were really the first show that was putting Katrina Lake on, on the main stage when she had founded Stitch Fix. You know, the guys at Dollar Shave Club. So I'd say it's always been a core part of who we are.[00:06:45] But we have recognized that it's Such a differentiator for us that we wanna pour more investment into it. And so we've actually been building out our team internally to make sure that we're really cultivating that community, bringing people on board who are specific to, you know, bringing the big VCs to, to the show because, hey, when you [00:07:00] get the big VCs here, you're also gonna be be building a, a big start of community.[00:07:03] And I had jotted down the number, which of course is escaping me now, but yes, 475 founders who were at Shop Talk this year. I like to think that number's actually probably a little lower. When you think about the fact that some founders have potentially sold their businesses, gone onto corporate ventures, it's probably over 500 in, in some capacity.[00:07:19] People who are current founders or have founded businesses before. But we just truly think that's what gives the show so much life. Just the energy that you have from those entrepreneurs who are coming here to learn share what they're finding. They tend to be also some of the more open folks , when they're talking about the challenges that they're facing, which is[00:07:34] Jeff Roster: Yeah. Not tend to be a hundred percent. What? That's, that's why it's so fun to, to, to talk to the startup community cuz they there is no filter.[00:07:41] And there was no AR person to, to say, don't say that. So, no, it's, I mean, the difference is an analyst working, you know, with, with the largest companies in my old days of Gartner to work covering the startup committee.[00:07:52] I mean, it's night and day. It's so refreshing.[00:07:55] Krystina Gustafson: were you I don't know if you were in the keynote with Imran Khan from Veri Shop, but he, he was unfiltered while he [00:08:00] was up there on stage, which, I mean, we've been getting such good feedback on that interview, so yeah, I hear you. [00:08:04] Ben Miller: getting, I think we are incredibly proud about the keynote lineup this. year. And we, we, we've, it's an incredible process to work with all of our keynotes to, to be prepared. But one of the things that we have spoken about is how they can be open. Cuz nobody wants to come to an event and just see someone reading the press release.[00:08:19] And some of, the, some the great conversations that we've had on the main stage this year and some of the openness of the speakers has been quite a revelation and yeah, I think it's probably the best keynote group that we put together.[00:08:30] Krystina Gustafson: I agree. And I have to say, just being in the, I spent a lot of my time in the, the depths of the green room at the show, and I have to tell you the authenticity of those leaders. And I know that sounds really cheesy, and I'm not typically the type of prince Ben knows. I'm not the soft emotive type.[00:08:44] But I mean, it was palpable. Every single one of them was incredibly kind, incredibly grateful to be here. Willing to be open, recognizing that our audience really wanted to learn. And so I didn't even feel to the same degree as impacious that we had to push. Obviously we're always pushing people to say interesting things, but they [00:09:00] were eager to do it which was really unique and special.[00:09:02] Ricardo Belmar: tell us a bit more about some of the feedback you've had, both, both in the keynotes and then even in some of the other track sessions that I know there have been some really interesting speakers there. I know I was in some where you could just feel, you know, and some of the speakers are, or just, I, I would almost have to describe as entertaining and some of the things they said in, in the way that, that the crowd really reacted to them.[00:09:20] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah.[00:09:20] I think some of the interesting formats that we rolled out have been a lot of fun. So one session that got a ton of great feedback was our rapid fire session. We did two of them. One was with investors, which again, kind of getting back to your point about people that can be unfiltered, a lot of laughter coming outta that one.[00:09:34] I think one of the, one of the questions at the end was you know, what's your most unpopular opinion today? And just really kinda, you know, use poking and prodding[00:09:42] them. So that one was a lot of fun. [00:09:44] Jeff Roster: I'm stealing that one. I'm gonna, that, that's gonna be my,[00:09:46] Ricardo Belmar: yeah, that's right. Right. Yeah.[00:09:47] Krystina Gustafson: Exactly.[00:09:48] We gamify it. There's a really loud, obnoxious buzzer when people run out of time.[00:09:51] They have their four minutes. So, so that was a hit. And then we also did one on tech investing, which was really fun. It had CB Insights, Ulta Beauty and Patagonia on [00:10:00] it. And I think what was really interesting about that one was you had sort of Ulta that has this huge budget. They're always trying new things.[00:10:05] They're always testing, and, learning. And then you have Patagonia, which is a little bit more conservative, maybe doesn't have that big budget to blow. So just kind of hearing Prama, who's the Chief digital officer at Ulta talking about, oh yes, we're trying this. Yes, we're doing AR. Oh, this is fantastic. And Patagonia just being kinda like, no hard pass on Metaverse hard pass on this.[00:10:19] You know, it really represents the dynamics that our audience has, you know? [00:10:23] Ricardo Belmar: different. Yeah. Yeah.[00:10:24] Ben Miller: And, and I think that authenticity has been something that's, that's thread throughout and we, we've programmed sessions that were, were about purpose and we wanted to talk about purpose and want to talk about sustainability.[00:10:34] But actually what we've found is great. We've got the specific sessions, but the general principle of authentic leadership has, has woven through so many of the conversations. Whether that's, you know, leaders openly facing in some of the challenges that they've had or talk about their views on social issues.[00:10:48] There's been some really dynamic conversations and that's been exciting to be part of. [00:10:54] Krystina Gustafson: I think to your question too about feedback though I haven't had anyone complain to me yet.[00:10:57] so that to me is, [00:10:59] Ricardo Belmar: That's something, [00:10:59] Krystina Gustafson: [00:11:00] that's a big barometer of, of people being happy. So I think just generally kind of going back to where we started the conversation, everyone's gritting, ear to ear having a fantastic time, and that's not really something that's measurable.[00:11:10] We'll get sort of the more measurable data after the show, but. , but it's, I mean, so far I think the buzz has been really great. I do really look forward to getting that feedback though. One of the things that I had mentioned for anyone who was in the opening remarks session, when we talked about how we were doing more on seamless stores this year, that was feedback that we got from both Shop Talk and the most recent grocery shop was that people wanted to see us lean more into physical stores.[00:11:30] And so, We did that we made sure that it was covered on our keynote stage with Footlocker, with Brilliant Earth. It was something that we dialed up in our track sessions as well. So it's great to hear kind of the initial buzz and excitement. But we also try to take that constructive feedback post show when we're getting more concrete data, survey results, and then action that for, the next show [00:11:48] Seamless Stores & the "Death of Omnichannel"[00:11:48] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. So tell, tell us a little bit more on that topic of Seamless stores, because I, I did, I, cause I noticed that difference as well, right? From back, from both, from last Shop Talk and, and progressing through grocery shop to hear that there was [00:12:00] more emphasis on what's happening in physical stores and how that ties back into the rest of of the retail organization.[00:12:06] So how, tell us more about that.[00:12:07] Ben Miller: I woke up this morning to a notification on my phone flicking through half jet lag still, and there's this great message that somebody had posted on my LinkedIn saying, thank you, shop Talk 2023 for finally killing omnichannel.[00:12:24] And[00:12:24] I think, [00:12:25] Ricardo Belmar: saw that post[00:12:26] Ben Miller: do you know what, we've now reached that point where we talk about seamless stores, we talk about unified commerce, the general principle of how do we help customers wherever they are, whenever they want to interact with the brand, to be able to, discover, to be able to explore,[00:12:44] to be able to excited it or to be able to buy and whether that's on a social media channel, whether that's on the retailer's own asset, whether that's having a fantastic experience when they walk through a store.[00:12:55] That's shopping. And I think the number of times I've heard that, you know, [00:13:00]there's been very few conversations about channel management, cuz I think we've finally realized that channels are just this artificial construct and actually[00:13:05] what it is he's getting, he's getting product to people and exciting. about product. And that's been one of the big things for me for, for the whole show. When we, we, we spent a lot of time talking about it in advance. We've been looking at how do you remove friction from the shopping experience, and places where a bit of friction's good, but also where you want to take out friction.[00:13:23] And that's been a really important thought. How do you link some of these things together about the online experience and the offline experience What are the building blocks? What, what's the tech stack to enable that? But as a, as a concept, just getting product to people when they want, it has been, I think it's been the biggest thing for me, [00:13:40] Krystina Gustafson: One of the, one of the cheesy jokes I didn't get into the zeitgeist was it reminds me of the Nintendo Switch, you know, where you're playing on your handheld and then you plug it into the TV and your game is picked up. You know exactly where you were in, in the game progress, you don't have to finish a level.[00:13:53] That's how I, that's how my brain thinks about what unified retail should be going forward. I didn't have room for it though. We were already five minutes over. But, but in all [00:14:00]seriousness you know, the example that I did share, which was probably more valuable to the audience, was Brilliant Earth, right?[00:14:04] You know, go online. You do an online consultation, you get to the store, Hey, here's five rings that we picked out for you based off of what you told us online. Like I think that's kind of how we're thinking about unified these days. It's less about shopping where you want, when you want, and making that a continuous experience.[00:14:18] Because we were talking, we didn't wanna undermine in in our zeitgeist presentation that frictionless isn't hard and it isn't important. But I think where we landed is more companies have solved for that already, right? The amount of companies that have curbside, that have redesigned their store formats.[00:14:31] I think that's kind of more progressed, if you will. And I think Unified is really still in its early stages seeing what companies like Brilliant Earth are doing. The other speaker who we confirmed was the chief digital Officer from Panera. And they recently signed that deal with Amazon One for the biometric scanning in their stores linking to loyalty programs.[00:14:47] So that's another great example. And it's a completely different category than fine jewelry, which is what Brilliant Earth is doing. But I feel like those are two early examples of where we see this trend heading. [00:14:57][00:14:57] "Follow the Money" ... but, Omnichannel?[00:14:57] Ben Miller: And I was in a different room when the Panera presentation was [00:15:00]on, so I missed it. But the social comments and the social feedback on that yeah, we did some work. One of the things that, it goes right back to when Shop Talk was founded by, led by Anil and, and the team was to sit down and look at where does the VC And if you follow the money, then you start to pick up the trends. And we spend a, we spend quite a bit of time looking at this whole idea of, okay, if Shop Talk wants to talk about physical stores, well what's relevant, what's new? What's the future in that? So, you with our friends, at CB Insights, we went into the data and there's a phenomenal amount of funding's continuing to go into removing friction.[00:15:38] Whether that's checkout free, for example, they say whole seamless of connecting that shopping journey. It's, there's funding there, but it's, it's still lower, but we really see that increasing and there some, some of the stats about the levels of is huge. So we believe that's only gonna get more and that's only gonna snowball.[00:15:55] So understanding that further, pulling out great examples. We talked on the main stage [00:16:00] about Zara and some of the work that they're doing in their flagship stores. Yeah. Zara is is certainly the biggest apparel retailer in Europe, if not, yeah, the parent company, Inditex, the biggest in the world[00:16:11] They're still only doing it in, in a couple of trial stores. So the potential is, is absolutely huge and, and we wanna celebrate trials like that.[00:16:19] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Yeah, no, that, that, that makes sense.[00:16:20] Jeff Roster: Yeah, that's music in my ears. I mean, I've been fighting omnichannel forever. [00:16:25] No, no offense, but when, when your competitor coins the term, no, Gardner, Allen should ever use that term. What's funny, the funniest thing I ever had is somebody, one time, you know, no offense to the, the vendors in the room, but a vendor one time ask me, Hey, do you have omnichannel IT spend?[00:16:39] And I said, well, I do, but you'll have to define what you mean. And the conversation went dead. He had no idea what he he was [00:16:44] Krystina Gustafson: I absolutely love that. My favorite, thing is when people apply to speak at Shop Talk and we're like, what do you wanna speak about? And they're like, oh, omnichannel, or, oh, I wanna talk about e-com. And I'm just like, gimme more, gimme more [00:16:53] Supporting Store Teams[00:16:53] Ricardo Belmar: yeah. Right. Could you be a little more vague?[00:16:56] Yeah. Yeah. So, so one thing I [00:17:00] noticed in particular this time, which I haven't seen at other shows as much attention. And I think maybe it's part, it sort of comes out I think, a little bit out of the seamless stores. But I think Krystina, you or Joe mentioned it in this, session that there's this renewed, focus on how we're enabling store teams, whether it's directly with technology or just with different, by changing the processes, but just how they're able to work and how even if you didn't have a session that was stated on the agenda, that's what it was about. I heard that come up from so many presenters and speakers that part of what they were doing was tying back into how they're supporting those store teams to make their job better. And I, I think I lost track, but maybe three or four times, I heard one of the speakers mention how they see that as something that is enabling a better career path for these retail workers. And I thought that was super interesting to me because I haven't seen that at other shows or in other events.[00:17:53] Ben Miller: I mean, let me give a big picture of you and I'll pass over to Krystina for a bit more detail.[00:17:58] I would say take one step back from [00:18:00] that. And, and the first step back from that is, is the investment environment that we find ourselves in right now.[00:18:05] And the decisions and the hard decisions that people have to make.[00:18:10] So if we are going through continued elevated levels of e-commerce sales, we're going through a store Renaissance, something as we referred to it, and we need to try and deliver to customers, you know, commerce everywhere where, that's great, but all of those parts require investment.[00:18:25] So how do you do it in an investment environment which is, which is tighter and it, this has felt a really optimistic few days, but we are really cognizant of the environment that we're in. The number of speakers that I've heard to say in an environment. The two things that they focus on right now are people and talent, and also the store infrastructure.[00:18:44] If you take that together and you think, okay, well where's the investment in people? In stores?[00:18:49] Then you start to realize that actually you've got a really cost effective way to be able to drive, drive digital transformation and to drive significant improvement. So we, we deliberately programmed some areas where we wanted to talk about some of the [00:19:00] detail about that, but actually is a theme.[00:19:02] Completely agree. Ricardo. It's cropped up in so many different [00:19:05] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah. I would build on that. I think it's not only the store associates, right? I think people overall ended up being a much bigger theme than we had intended it to be. You know, to Ben's point, we did have a couple of sessions that were very specific to store employees, whether it was from the retailer brand side, whether it was from the tech side.[00:19:21] We had a couple sessions, maybe one or two on culture and leadership. But that theme came up I feel, even more than usual. And I think it's this whole idea of empathy. Kind of going back to your point too, and, and how you leverage your workers. Leverage is probably a, a crass word, but. [00:19:35] Empower your[00:19:36] Jeff Roster: There you [00:19:37] Krystina Gustafson: use Empower. What Use Empower. It was really interesting because I, I feel like the dialogue around store associates for so long has been about productivity. And of course we were hearing quite a bit of that. The lens of safety seemed to be a new conversation, right? As much as we hear about automation and the, is that, oh, the robots aren't gonna take your jobs now, it was sort of, you know, listening into Amazon, okay, well we're actually using automation to make the warehouse [00:20:00] workers safer and to make sure that we have, you know, safety protocols in place. And that was kind of a new spin on that theme that I hadn't previously heard and, and wasn't necessarily expecting coming into the show.[00:20:08] Ben Miller: I'm trying to find a stat and I'm [00:20:12] we go. I got it. There's a great, there's a great session from Katie Reeves from, who's the managing director of Cos[00:20:20] of the h and m group manager of Cos in North America, and she's talked about the investment that they are making their smart store[00:20:27] portfolio. [00:20:28] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. I, I remember that session. [00:20:29] Yeah. But[00:20:30] Ben Miller: one of the key components of the smart store was enabling their teams in the store and they talked about the app that they. And, and they'd use the app for process improvement, bring all the information into the right place to help them operationally as well as help serve customers better.[00:20:46] And she shared that in the pilot stores where they have got the app running, their staff retention of install teams has increased by And if you think about the labor market we are in,[00:20:58] Ricardo Belmar: wow. [00:21:00][00:21:00] Ben Miller: Joe shared on the main stage, the the quit rate is over 40% higher for retail than it is for as a whole.[00:21:07] Yeah. It's harder to find people, people more expensive. If you're able to make that sort of change, enable that by technology. That's incredible.[00:21:13] Not only that, she shared that because the process improvements their store staff are having an extra two and a half hours a week to be able to serve their customers better.[00:21:25] And that's, that's transformational for a[00:21:27] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. That, that's a massive difference. That's a massive improvement.[00:21:30] Yeah.[00:21:30] Krystina Gustafson: You know, one thing that comes to mind as you're saying that, and it sort of circles back to what we were talking about before I was in the session with Chobani, and they were actually taking this from more of a perspective. And you know, she was saying, we get asked the question all the time, how do you measure. The impact on sales. How do you measure the impact on the business? And she was actually making the point actually, we see the most measurable statistics in our employee acquisition and retention because there are so many people that want to be a part of a company that is mission driven. So I think it's always such a [00:22:00] good point.[00:22:00] Technology is really enabling workers. It's, you know, boosting retention. It's helping that labor shortage, but also a really strong purpose and something that has nothing to do with technology could also be really powerful.[00:22:10] Ricardo Belmar: strong purpose. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.[00:22:12] Jeff Roster: I mean, how novel people wanna be part of something big. I'm shocking[00:22:15] Ricardo Belmar: Shocking, right.[00:22:16] Krystina Gustafson: We lose sight of it though, don't we?[00:22:18] Jeff Roster: Well, we do. And you know, and that was such a strong point. And, and, and I was sitting here thinking as you're talking you know, of course our, our good friend Ron Thurston is this, is this like his legacy because. Five years ago, four years ago, we weren't really talking about this stuff.[00:22:32] And then Ron pops on and does that amazing podcast and that amazing journey and now all of a sudden it's, it's like we all are, are able to say what, what's common sense? It's, it's a people business. You better put your people in front of your people business.[00:22:46] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I, I, I even think, you know, the, the biggest change I've noticed to your point, if you go back five years, no one used the phrases enabling store teams. No one talked about empowering them with the right technology. What everyone said is, well, we have to get them the right training. [00:23:00] It was all about, training was always the key word, and it was investment in training as if, you know, the only thing you needed to do was to impart a set of skills to just work the store.[00:23:09] And now that's completely transformed that it is. I, I think, you know, you have the right words, Krystina, right, it's about enabling, empowering those teams with the right elements, whether it's process, technology or the. People skills itself, whatever it is. And I can't remember which session it was, but the one that's also stood out to me, someone was talking about how they recognize that when they look across all of the store associates, they have, people have different skills and the different talents, and some are better than others at certain roles in the store. And that it doesn't make sense to assume that every store employee should be able to do every single job in the store. And especially if you start layering in things now, like live streaming, for example.[00:23:47] And this was one that I keyed in on because and you may remember this, this trip because some time ago on, on the podcast we talked. This idea. And I had, and, and some other conversation I had with with Retail Wire. I think we talked about this idea that, the retailers [00:24:00] have this inherent talent in some of their employees.[00:24:02] Because let's face it, if you go by the, just by age demographics alone, odds are in most retailers, you have employees in stores who may have their own YouTube channel already. Independent of that job function. And they're good at this and they like doing it. So it makes sense for a retailer to kind of take advantage of that in, in a sense, right?[00:24:19] And encourage those skills. But at the same time, that that same person who might like to live stream, they might not be a good stylist. For example, if it's an apparel store and there might be another employee that loves to do styling with customers and is so much better at it than others. So give them that kind of growth path using those skills.[00:24:37] Ben Miller: using, and this speaks to something at the sort, the very heart of shop content, which is how is technology enabling a lot of this transformation? And if you talk about, you know, enabling and empowering frontline workers, you've got a hundred percent, there is this sort of talent.[00:24:51] How do you unlock this talent? And things like livestream shoppable video, creating new way for frontline workers to be able to unlock that talent that [00:25:00] they've had in that store. And they've probably been helping a small number of customers with, but now you can do it on a bigger scale. The second in training,[00:25:07] it's really hard, to take a whole day out or to take a frontline worker away from their store to help them with some of the at times softer to be able to do that.[00:25:18] We've got some amazing trials and Kroger on the front foot about doing some incredible work to help empower with app enable. Short, quick, accessible training to help be able to improve and to deliver a better experience for their guests. And then finally, there's that element you talked about, about playing to STRs. There is this group of workers in the in flexible environments economy and tech is enabling retailers to access that pool. But actually more broadly, is enable. Existing workers to have that flexibility to choose which all they want to work in, or tasks that they wanna pick up, working at times their families.[00:25:59] So tech is [00:26:00] enabling all these things to take that workforce, drive the attention, drive the engagement, and ultimately serve their customers better.[00:26:06] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:26:07] Krystina Gustafson: I'm laughing because , it's a little bit of a tangent, but as you're talking about this and, and we're just kind of on this theme about empowering your workers and thinking about building technology for the people who are running the organization. I think about maybe another industry, maybe the airline industry[00:26:23] Ricardo Belmar: mm-hmm.[00:26:23] Krystina Gustafson: didn't focus on this and Yeah.[00:26:24] Somewhat imploded. And so i, I, I laugh because, We always tell people, if you tell me you're a data-driven, consumer-centric company, get off the stage.[00:26:33] Cuz everyone else, like every single company who's on our stages. If you're, if you're not, get outta here.[00:26:37] But I do think sometimes by saying that, and it's obviously the right approach we ignore what needs to happen for the employees to make this whole business run.[00:26:46] And we've very clearly what can happen when that gets ignored. So I think, even just kind of looking to lessons from other industries. Made us realize just kind of how important is overall as well.[00:26:57] All about the Data & Data Insights[00:26:57] Ben Miller: Ricardo, there's a question that I, I wanted to ask you. [00:27:00] What one of the conversations, cause we're starting to touch about data Mm-hmm. and you, you've got such incredible knowledge in this space. We, we've picked conversation almost.[00:27:09] The number of speakers that almost thrown their hands in the and said, you know what?[00:27:13] Data, trying to understand the customer across all touchpoints. You just can't do First party, hear a party.[00:27:19] I, I can't get an omnichannel, a true of my customer everywhere, and that's fine. I'm just gonna have to serve them where you can.[00:27:27] Ricardo Belmar: Uhhuh[00:27:28] Ben Miller: Is that a view you recognize?[00:27:30] Ricardo Belmar: I, I I think kind of maybe the, the, I would kind of break that down to say that I, every retailer I talk to Will, will say, you know, at the end of the day, we are overwhelmed with data.[00:27:39] There's no lack of data . It's, it's really a matter of a, what can I do with that? How can I actually analyze it in a way that tells me the story about my customer and who they are, what, what their preferences are, what, how they want to engage with us. That's what every retailer wants to know. And I think the challenge really is I forget what the statistic is, but the [00:28:00] amount of data that retail generates every day is just overwhelming. I think it's something on the order of it's more data than the internet generated five years ago or something. Un unbelievable like that. And so the question every retailer has to ask is, so what am I gonna do with this now?[00:28:14] Right? What are the tools I have to use? And even if you have the tools, it's not enough, right? Because it, even that needs to be looked at by people to interpret what do I do now that I have this knowledge? If I convert that data into something useful and knowledgeable, that gives me a, a possible actions to take.[00:28:29] Someone has to take those actions, someone has to make the decision, which is the best action, and then it becomes back to a, a people problem. And I know. . I think even today, but in past years, I've, I've seen retailers will say, you know, now we think we know how to select the right tools to help us with the analysis, but now my challenge is this is so new, we don't have anyone on staff that knows how to deal with this.[00:28:49] And if I try to go out and hire those people, everyone wants to hire those people. So it's incredibly competitive and I feel like I don't even know if we can afford those people on to be part of our, [00:29:00] our organization because it's so competitive.[00:29:02] Ben Miller: We're back to people in[00:29:03] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly right. Exactly. It always seems to come back to that.[00:29:06] You know, I guess what I'll maybe turn around because sort of the one thing we haven't talked about that has come up all over the, the place is, everyone's favorite new, hyped up technology , is generative ai, ? It's like last year's metaverse. And, and one of the promises, I guess I'll use that strong word about this, is that it is supposed to help with this problem and give you better tools and better decision making capability with all that data that you have.[00:29:29] What About Generative AI?[00:29:29] Ricardo Belmar: I, I'm, I'm wondering, I mean, what, what are your, for both of you, what are your thoughts? Cuz obviously everyone must be coming up to you and saying, oh, what, where, where is the session that we're gonna talk about generative ai [00:29:38] Krystina Gustafson: Every, yeah.[00:29:39] You know was actually surprised people were more measured than I expected them to be. I thought it was gonna be like Metaverse last year where it was like, the session is not about metaverse and it's still snuck in. I, I feel like generative AI was a little bit more measured.[00:29:50] Look, I think our big thesis on it is, again, still very early. What feels different to us though is that this feels immediately applicable and it feels like something [00:30:00] that you invest in and see real business results on. Right? So, so many opportunities I think.[00:30:06] Gosh, he wasn't. Sean Downey from Google was just kind of talking about the various use cases for it, whether it's advertising, whether it's, you know, looking at supply chain data, whether it's creatives, whether it's customer service.[00:30:14] We had a slide that was kind of making fun of in a, in a good way. The CB insights market map that they built with just all the, and it was just scrolling, right?[00:30:21] I mean, it's not even retail. Right. It's every single industry, the use cases. Endless, which I think is a really exciting opportunity.[00:30:28] I think we would both agree that a lot of work still needs to be done to make sure this is ethical, to make sure it's accurate. We're very early stages, but I think it just feels more real than the metaverse[00:30:38] Jeff Roster: well, the, the thing that's real about it is we all, we all are, are playing on it in our own search engine. I[00:30:44] Ricardo Belmar: right. Yeah.[00:30:45] Jeff Roster: I wanted to ask you know, the Microsoft guys we talked to yesterday, just what. How many more hits on Bing has gotten in the last[00:30:52] Ben Miller: own[00:30:52] Jeff Roster: I mean,[00:30:52] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, it[00:30:53] Jeff Roster: that's all I've used. Yeah.[00:30:54] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, it[00:30:55] Jeff Roster: And, and so we're so it's[00:30:56] Ricardo Belmar: extra users[00:30:57] Jeff Roster: Exactly. Exactly. It just, it has to be [00:31:00] so, so literally. There's no technology that, that every single person is using that it has this immediate impact in the business. I mean, we all didn't pick up point of sale devices or all, didn't pick up whatever, but this one thing hit, but we, I mean, we were tracking it from an, from a startup perspective.[00:31:17] I mean, the amount of, of spending AI even 2, 3, 4 years ago, it's, it's, it's orders of magnitude compared to everything else. Yeah. And then it just exploded.[00:31:25] And then it got a little controversial, so then people even used it more and everyone's trying to trick it and all this stuff,[00:31:30] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. It kinda [00:31:30] Krystina Gustafson: but I think you, you hit on something really important there, right? One of the biggest problems with the metaverse conversation, and we were very clear about this last year as well, the learning curve.[00:31:39] To even understand what it is to understand what blockchain is.[00:31:42] is virtual gaming actually, the metaverse, what ,is it goggles?[00:31:46] ChatGPT, my parents can go, go. on the website, tape it. It is So easily accessible and it's so Easily understandable. And I think that's why you've seen just meteor meteoric rise in interest compared to the metaverse.[00:31:57] Ben Miller: And the other thing is if you break it down, [00:32:00] There is three potential areas that generative AI can help with, which are fundamental retail challenges.[00:32:08] Number one, can I make repetitive tasks more efficient[00:32:11] Ricardo Belmar: Mm-hmm. [00:32:11] Ben Miller: Mm-hmm. , and scale retail is the efficiency of process.[00:32:16] that's what it is. it's, about [00:32:17] Ricardo Belmar: scale, right? It's about [00:32:18] Ben Miller: Great. This is something that can help it. So of course retail's gonna lean in. The second is can it help drive commerce everywhere? You know, we started a conversation with seamless stores, The amount of copy and creative that it be required to be wherever your customers want to be is mind boggling. Generative AI might be able to help. And thirdly, that the holy grail of mass retail, physical, of personalization, we've talked about it every time. And the reason we talk about it every single conference is cause we haven't cracked it[00:32:45] Ricardo Belmar: confidence, right? That's right.[00:32:46] Ben Miller: generative AI has the potential to be able to help in in stalled areas. So there's three absolutely cool retail, pr drivers that we can see. cases for. So no wonder people are very excited on the plus side.[00:32:57] We were, we were in the staff room just before we came [00:33:00] down, and I, we brought up chat, G b T, and I asked you chat, G b T what were the key themes from Shop Talk 2023. And of course he told me that unfortunately it's historic and can't can't Do that. So Krystina pointed out that maybe our jobs were secure for another year yet. So [00:33:13] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. [00:33:14] Ben Miller: we'll take, we'll take, we'll take that. [00:33:16] Ricardo Belmar: that's right. Yeah. Yeah. No, I, I think you're, you're, you're spot on on that. I mean, I, I, I like to I sort of, I steal a, a quote from one of my colleagues at Microsoft who like tells everyone in every meeting, you know, if I haven't had five retailers I talked to today about generative, generative ai, it's only because the fourth retailer didn't get off the phone with me till the end of the day and I couldn't get to the fifth call[00:33:37] Krystina Gustafson: I like that.[00:33:38] That's a good one! [00:33:39] Ricardo Belmar: And, and it's, and it so true.[00:33:40] And, and I think, you're right about the, different categories. I mean, one of our. Favorite customers that we, we talk about is CarMax, where they've taken this technology and, you know, one of, they found that one of the pain points in their customer journey is people go to their website and they wanna research the cars they have in inventory.[00:33:57] And one of the tools, of course, is to look at reviews and [00:34:00] comments from people who've bought past cars. Well there are thousands of reviews! So you go on there and if you wanna look at a car, what's your, your choice is to read a thousand reviews before you decide what you want to go look at. Or maybe you just give up or you find some other tool to help you do that research.[00:34:14] So they've actually leveraged these tools now to do all of that summarization for you. So you can go to their website now and you give it the parameters that interest you about a car. Their new AI tool just comes back to you with immediately the summarization across all those thousands of reviews.[00:34:29] Here are the key points that you're interested in. Here's how it compares in these cars that you chose to look at.[00:34:33] Krystina Gustafson: I need this so bad. The joke, the joke. in Our household is whenever we travel, I don't read anything. I literally, I just see, I see a pretty picture and I'm like, book. And it kills my husband. He is like the one that's reading[00:34:44] Ricardo Belmar: He wants to research everything, right?[00:34:46] Krystina Gustafson: my god. Every single thing. Well, I think the bars in the wrong place in this hotel or the room is only this many. Yeah, he's, he's, on, he's on it. And I am not So this, this, will help me be a better [00:34:55] Ricardo Belmar: you go,[00:34:56] Krystina Gustafson: partner[00:34:57] Retail Media Networks[00:34:57] Ricardo Belmar: There you go. So I guess let me shift [00:35:00] then to the kind of the last one trending thing I wanted to ask you about because it's, it's one that, it's probably one of my favorites. So, over the past year, and Jeff likes to poke fun of me for this quite a bit.[00:35:10] You know, I, I've been really big on retail media networks and knew I was going this way. And part of the reason why I've been beating the retail media network's drum for so long cuz I, I started talking about it back in, what did I talk October, 2021,[00:35:23] Jeff Roster: it seemed like two decades[00:35:24] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. . Yeah. Yeah.[00:35:25] But it, it's evolved and and I think, again, I think you, you guys mentioned this in this session, that really, what has it evolved to? It's become more about retailers looking more like a technology company and offering technology solutions and services to other retailers. . And I think that to me is a, is just really interesting into how their own, their whole core business is evolving.[00:35:45] Krystina Gustafson: I think that Ben will jump out of his skin if he doesn't get to answer[00:35:48] Ricardo Belmar: I know. Well, and I, and Ben's laugh and Ben's laughing, so anyone not who's not can't see this. I mean, Ben's laughing because he and I have had this conversation exactly before . [00:35:56] Krystina Gustafson: I don't, think, I don't think an hour goes by without ben talking [00:36:00] about in a, in a Very positive way. [00:36:02] Ricardo Belmar: We're, we're of like, minds . [00:36:03] we're of like minds.[00:36:04] Ben Miller: I, I, I, You did a very good job leaving that to the last question, because otherwise we'd have lost a whole of the podcast. [00:36:10] Ricardo Belmar: else if we had started with that. Yes. , [00:36:12] Ben Miller: this is, it's what the, why is it so important and why do I get so interested about it? Because there's two levels. One, I think at the, our friend Andrew lipman Insider says it so well. this is the third wave of digital. [00:36:24] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. I absolutely, yeah, totally agree.[00:36:26] Ben Miller: You see the numbers, okay, the numbers, let's be honest, the numbers are hugely hugely skewed by investment in search returns on Amazon, so yes, we recognize the prize, but you've gotta recognize that's skew in it. But when you strip that back, there is a marketing a digital marketing channel where, which has the opportunity to directly attribute sales to investment and whether retail media is more efficient than other digital marketing channels or at, or it's just that you can actually prove it, then actually that point is really valuable.[00:36:59] [00:37:00] it's a, it's a phenomenal trend. It's a, it's a huge wave and what's been really exciting in this particular event, and yeah, we, we, we'll continue the conversation in a, a European Barcelona as well, I is to stand back and say, okay, we all know what retail media is now. We don't need to do that. a lot of us are doing it, really, how do we get efficient?[00:37:19] Okay, do we, and do I need 600, retail media networks in my portfolio?[00:37:23] Where, where do I spend the money? What's exciting about it is he's coming back to, and I think this is a point that we made Joe made during the zeitgeist, is it's about the basics of great advertising. So let's talk again about creative, let's talk about engagement, let's talk about generating fun, and this is another channel to enable us, us to do that.[00:37:41] So that that, that's really exciting. The second element of it, which is why it's so important, is that element about changing relationships.[00:37:49] This idea that a retailer is as, as well as a buyer, is now a seller to their vendors. And it's not, that's not just limited to retail media that, that think you have these, we call it [00:38:00]collaborative commerce networks, which is the sharing of logistics, for example. and when you're adding marketplaces and you see how the Their customers and we feel the retailers are changing and how do you do all of that and drive the margin that's there to be taken at the same time as keeping that laser focus? Cause we know that as soon as a retailer loses their laser focus on the customer, then that's a challenge for them. How do you balance those two together? And that's, that's still a working progress.[00:38:30] And that's one of the fun conversations that we've been having and seeing where, seeing what next and seeing how retailers map that you've got. Yeah. If you are a serious retailer or a significant scale, you've got to be in the retail media game.[00:38:40] You cannot leave that margin on the table. But how do you do it in a way that keeps focused on the customer and you're targeted now calling that out in their earnings reports to say to the center of their thinking. And that customer-centric approach to alternative revenue streams is gonna be a really interesting trend to [00:38:56] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I agree.[00:38:57] Jeff Roster: yeah, I gotta tell you, Ricardo, so, so I was [00:39:00] kidding you about, you know, that. I spent probably three and a half hours yesterday about four different vendors. And I think I now begin, am only beginning to understand literally how much money we're talking about in re in, in retail media. And it is it's never been, I mean, it really was never a focus at the, at the other show in in the cold part of the country in January and it's ever present here. Yeah. And you can't, as an analyst, it covers the entire landscape. You can't get away with it. But the people that actually built some of this stuff I talked to. Right. And it's, and you know, it got the history and it's like, oh my gosh, we're not talking about something that's been around a hundred years.[00:39:38] We're talking about something, it's really exploding the last three years.[00:39:40] Ben Miller: yes, [00:39:41] Jeff Roster: And, and it's like, that's what he's been talking [00:39:45] Krystina Gustafson: Ricardo, I'd be curious your thoughts. One debate that we've kind of been having, and we haven't come up with an answer to it yet, is just kind of the dynamics of how this plays out in industries outside of grocery because. . That's of course been the industry that's adopted it the fastest, but yeah, the incestuousness of, [00:40:00] of that industry compared to department stores. Apparel. Yeah. Places where companies have the opportunity to be more D to C.[00:40:05] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:40:06] Krystina Gustafson: Part of me wonders if it's as scalable there where the retailers don't have as much, let's go back to the word leverage as they do in the grocery industry. Like, have you thought about that at all? [00:40:16] Ricardo Belmar: I have because you're right. I mean, there is a very unique kind of trade relationship in grocery between grocers and the CPG companies that, that have all, you know, all those products. That's a different dynamic. . Then you look at a department store, which is maybe the easiest, I guess, example to kind of look at here, where there's so many third party apparel products, right?[00:40:34] Yes. There's private labels in, in your department store. Generally people are shopping there because of all the, the name brands that are available. So what's the say equivalent opportunity? I, I've actually been saying, department stores to me feels like probably the number one most untapped opportunity for this, because I think department stores, we all say the same things, right?[00:40:53] They've sort of lost their luster a little bit, right. Just are shopping less at department stores, but what could department [00:41:00] stores do to make this more interesting? You know, I would say one of those is they have to increase the, just the overall experience in the store. And if you think of visual impression as a consumer walking into a department store versus, any an apparel store where you just see apparel hung on rack.[00:41:15] In a department store. I think the merchandising opportunities are much bigger. And if you think about the in-store advertising they can do with digital screens, not the sort where, you know, oh look, there's a screen hanging on the wall showing a video clip about this designer and their products running.[00:41:30] Not that right, because anyone can do that. And, and that's probably my, my number one least favorite example that anyone can do. And, and I've, I've been working with digital signage. Since more than 10 years, and, and Jeff is laughing because one of the comments I keep making about retail media is from the early days back in the, you know, maybe early 2010s when I was marketing digital signage solutions, we talked to retailers about creating this kind of media network.[00:41:57] It for their brand in their stores. And [00:42:00] not one retailer ever executed it well. The only, they all never got as far as, let's hang a screen here, let's hang a screen there and then ask brands to give us content. And I suppose part of the, the conclusion we had is that you can't ask IT to run that operation.[00:42:13] It really needs to be run by marketing, but. If you think about what you can do with screen technology now that you couldn't do then, you're not limited by the form factor of a traditional TV monitor type screen. You can have the screen shaped any way you want and you can have any sort of visual layout for it.[00:42:29] And if you do that, then I think that opens up new advertising opportunities for those brands that the department store can work with, that feels more, you know, lifestyle oriented. It feels more aspirational for the apparel merchandise that's there, that they can build off of and entice customers that when you walk by it, you feel like, oh yeah, if I was wearing that jacket, I, I could be doing what this person's doing on, on that video.[00:42:51] I'd be out on the mountain, you know, doing, doing this. And I think it, it just creates a different feel that even if you went to that brand store, you know, they may or may not be [00:43:00]doing that, but uh, it's different and it's a different experience. So that's why I think that's an untapped opportunity for department stores, and I think that's where that needs to go.[00:43:09] And that's why I think, adding the in-store component to retail media is so important right now. I think that's why, that's where the, the real story is gonna start to surface in, in this whole concept. [00:43:18] Krystina Gustafson: It's almost like a And I, I, that was really helpful. Thank you for sharing that. But it, it, it sounds to me so different than the conversations that we hear about retail media today. Right. I. Know some friends who work for some large CPG companies, and it's more of a conversation of, you have to do this, but what you're describing is like a desire to differentiate your brand.[00:43:35] It, it, it feels like a, a shift in, in, in the why.[00:43:38] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:43:38] Jeff Roster: Don't you also think though, that with grocery groceries had slotting fees for forever mm-hmm. , and it just sort of seems like that's a logical extension of the, those co-marketing allows going back and forth where, actually, I don't even know this, but I don't think department stores really have slotting fees because the, the product is constantly changing.[00:43:54] So you have other, you have other something, but I, I mean, but[00:43:57] Ricardo Belmar: way. I mean, you, you have you know, a designer [00:44:00] like a Ralph Lauren may have an arrangement. The departments are based on how much space they get on the floor. and is allocated for them as a brand. And then that dictates, you know, what merchandise do they make available to that department store versus a competitive department store that might give them more space and they make different merchandise available to them.[00:44:15] It's kind of negotiated that way. Not quite the same as the slotting fees that CPG is doing. Grocery.[00:44:20] Jeff Roster: and I think the other thing that's the big drivers, the fact, I mean, just who was on the, who was on the the exhibit floor TikTok, and what were they doing? There was at least three or four live streamers. So the idea that we're all creating, we're all creating content and want to create content. , I mean, and that now we're finally getting to the point where retailers are comfortable maybe not having everything be so hyper produced.[00:44:40] You know, I think the, the best example I have is I just love B n h photo. And if, if you don't know what that is, it's, it's a, it's the best photo shop in, in the world and super high-end skill photographers that, that are selling camera equipment. And my first experience with, I dunno if it's live streaming, it's one-to-one.[00:44:56] Working with them. I mean, for a camera shop, the, the video quality was [00:45:00] not very high. I mean, it was a little shocking, but it didn't matter because the expertise and the engagement for me sitting in Silicon Valley to, to Midtown Manhattan and that experience was amazing. And if retailers just embrace that and let their associates create or do whatever they want and, and, and produce all this content to fill up all the screens, you're gonna see it's gonna be great.[00:45:21] What I don't wanna see is it becomes so. So over, over marketed and just take the soul out of it because retail should be passion. I mean, I think, I think my dad back in the seventies, you know, in his, his butcher shop, I mean, it was all about passion. It was about this and that, and engaging up and down and da, da, da, da.[00:45:40] And, and I think in some ways as we expanded retail, we've lost that a little bit of passion. And maybe this is an opportunity, maybe it's a nice thing, you know, post covid.[00:45:50] We've now re-embraced and learned and knew what we missed. And man, let's just have this retail renaissance and let's get back to the business of having, having fun and having [00:46:00]people engage in this process that we call retail.[00:46:02] And then you, and then, you know, all those years you pitched me, you know, with those whole digital signages, now all of a sudden everything's coming together. The infrastructure, the screens, the cheap, you know, the the screens, the abil, the, the equipment we have to, to create all this content. And we have now, we've taught almost everyone, you know, if you have something to say, turn on your, your, your phone and, and

In honor of the NRF Big Show we're kicking off a special podcast cross-over series, #NRFLive, with Jeff Roster's show This Week In Innovation. This episode is a very special, intimately authentic conversation between four top retail influencers, recorded live, and in-person during the NRF show.Jeff and host, Ricardo Belmar, join retail legends, Vicki Cantrell, CEO of Vendors in Partnership, LLC, and Ron Thurston, author of Retail Pride and host of the Retail in America podcast and tour. Together our four retail friends chat about the VIP Awards ceremony, RetailROI's Super Saturday event, what they expect to see during NRF, the impact of innovation in retail, & the latest retail tech buzzwords. Plus, they reach an important conclusion about why retail is, after all, all about the people.Listen, or watch on YouTube, and join our four friends for the kind of discussion that can only happen when you're recording live, and in-person in a setting like the NRF Big Show!News alert #1: The Retail Razor Show was a finalist for The Retail Voice Award at the Vendors in Partnership Award ceremony during the NRF Big Show 2023!News alert #2! We've moved up to #18 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list - please consider giving us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts! With your help, we'll move our way up the Top 20! Leave us a review & be mentioned in future episodes! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023, 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, a Top 12 ecommerce influencer, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock, and a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2023. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring E-Motive, and Overclocked, from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno. The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS2E10a #NRFLive SPECIAL - #TRI Friends Fireside Chat[00:00:00] Show Intro[00:00:00] Ricardo Belmar: Hello and welcome to a special season two episode 10 of the Retail Razor Show. This is the first of a multi-part series recorded live and in person at the N R F 2023 show from January 13th to 18th, otherwise known as N R F Week. And I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.[00:00:37] Casey Golden: And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden. Welcome, retail Razor Show listeners, retail's favorite podcast for product junkies, commerce technologists, and everyone else in retail and retail tech alike. And for this special bonus, welcome N R F fans to our hot take, hashtag N R F Live mini series.[00:00:59] Ricardo Belmar: Well, Casey, [00:01:00] this is an incredible treat for listeners and viewers. Just like our last episode, our top 10 trends and predictions for 2023, the recordings in this miniseries all happen live and in person. While you know about 35,000 or so of our closest retail friends swarmed New York City,[00:01:16] Casey Golden: I just loved recording face-to-face when we're just not, these two little squares from the shoulders up on a Zoom screen.[00:01:24] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So let's set the stage here for this series. Lot lot's happening. Cuz not only is this a special live and in-person recording series, but it's also a podcast crossover event.[00:01:35] Casey Golden: Wait really?[00:01:37] Ricardo Belmar: Yes, really we are crossing over with our fellow Retail Avenger, Jeff Roster and his This Week in Innovation podcast.[00:01:45] Here's what'll happen. So this episode kicks off our hashtag N R F Live series with what may be my absolute favorite podcast recording of our entire run so far.[00:01:55] Casey Golden: all time fave like that's saying a lot. I mean, I [00:02:00] adore Jeff, but this is an all time fave.[00:02:03] Ricardo Belmar: Yes, yes. Really of, of, of all time. Well, at least until the next one, but no[00:02:10] Casey Golden: All right. Well, with that kind of buildup you'll have to explain a little more so, spill.[00:02:15] Ricardo Belmar: Okay. Okay. So late last year Jeff and I were talking about our N R F plans, comparing how many places we, we overlapped and realized it would be a great opportunity to do a series of interviews of super interesting people at N R F. Friends we don't often see in person and just talk trends. Talk about what's hot at the show, what's coming next in retail.[00:02:37] So the crossover was born. And we thought, we'll, we'll jointly host these interviews and then we'll just release them all across both the Retail Razor Show and This Week in Innovation[00:02:45] Casey Golden: Very cool. I'm digging this[00:02:48] Ricardo Belmar: But wait, there's more[00:02:50] Casey Golden: in your best announcement voice[00:02:52] Ricardo Belmar: I'm trying to build up some suspense here[00:02:54] Casey Golden: We're already on the edge of our seat. [00:02:56] Ricardo Belmar: So, so not only is this our first crossover series, but [00:03:00] it's also our first sponsored podcast.[00:03:03] Casey Golden: Ah, look at our podcast. It's adulting[00:03:06] Ricardo Belmar: exactly, exactly. We didn't realize just how popular we we've become. So while Jeff and I were making plans around who we tried to interview during N R F, there was one important thing we realized. We actually need a really solid place to sit down and record during N R F, because let's face it, the Javit Center isn't the most conducive to podcast recording[00:03:26] Casey Golden: It's not the most conducive for much. So I mean, I don't think we could do this while sitting in front of Starbucks either.[00:03:34] Ricardo Belmar: Right. E Exactly, exactly. But fortunately for us, our, our good friends of the show and avid podcast supporters at Avanade made us a really nice offer to use some space in their lounge area on the fourth floor, just above the expo hall. So fans of our show may have seen a preview photo of this setup on LinkedIn during N R F as we posted a few behind the scenes pics courtesy of the, the marketing team at Avanade[00:03:56] Casey Golden: Oh, big shout out to the marketing team at Avanade [00:04:00] for their support and for providing such an amazing space. I wish I could have been there for all of these.[00:04:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, we, we definitely missed you for those. And, and for this episode's recording, we were also fortunate to take advantage of another great spot in one of the conference rooms at the Microsoft Times Square office. Right after this year's retail ROI Super Saturday event had concluded right at the same location.[00:04:22] So extra fortunate. We happened to run into two very special friends of the show who've been on before. They agreed to sit down with Jeff and me to have an open conversation about our first two days at N r. About what we expected to find, what we might uncover during the show. And to be fair, Jeff and I pitched this as a quick 15 minute recording to them to convince them to do it.[00:04:42] And of course that turned into a nearly 50 minutes session because guess what happens when you have four retail friends get together? I haven't seen each other in person in so long.[00:04:51] Casey Golden: Yeah, we just don't stop. I'm thinking it would be very much like a friends' TV show reunion episode. You just [00:05:00] keep going and going because there is just so much happening in the industry right now[00:05:05] Ricardo Belmar: You, you said it. You said it. So, so we'll be hearing our, our conversation this episode with none other than retail legend, Vicki Cantrell currently c e o at vendors in partnership and organizer of the V I P awards event during N R F plus, Ron Thurston, author of the bestselling book, Retail Pride and Host of the Retail in America Podcast and tour.[00:05:25] And of course, to top it all off, since we're all RETHINK Retail, top retail influencers for 2023 just announced at the N R F show.[00:05:34] Casey Golden: Absolutely incredible and I'm so honored to be on the list this year and included, a big congrats all around to everyone for making the cut and sharing their perspective.[00:05:47] Ricardo Belmar: Absolutely. Absolutely. And, and fun fact, this might even surprise some listeners and viewers, but Ron and I met in person for the first time at this n r F show.[00:05:56] You know, absolute, it's a like a pandemic story, right? I mean, as after all [00:06:00] these years that we've known each other. But this was the first time we actually met face to face in person.[00:06:06] Casey Golden: Wow. I didn't realize that. I actually met Ron during the pandemic in Dominican Republic.[00:06:12] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That's right.[00:06:15] Casey Golden: It's just, that is just an amazing little fun fact. You know, we forget how, how often we work with people that we've actually never been i r l with. [00:06:28] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. And you, and you'll hear us talk about that in the recording too, cuz we all had stories that had happened to us just in those first couple of days.[00:06:35] Casey Golden: Yeah, I mean how could we build up this episode any more than we already have? So let's get to it and not keep everyone waiting.[00:06:44] Ricardo Belmar: Yes, I totally agree.[00:06:47] Casey Golden: Ah, I wanna point out one more thing.[00:06:50] Ricardo Belmar: Y you didn't just do that, did you?[00:06:52] Casey Golden: I did. But first I wanna point out that you've said multiple viewer multiple times now. And I [00:07:00] know we told our listeners they could see us on video and episode one of the season, but we've had some tech technical issues plaguing us all season long. . This is actually the first one we've released this season with video.[00:07:16] Ricardo Belmar: Good point. Good catch. Casey. Yes, yes. We actually do have video this time. And honestly we have our, our great friends at Rethink Retail. To thank for that Gabriela Bock, one of the producers at Rethink was gracious enough to record our conversation on video. And while what, if you're watching the video, you have to pay attention to just how small a conference room that was.[00:07:38] I don't know how she managed to stay with us for, for almost the entire time. Carefully walking around the room with video gear and it, it was just an amazing effort. You know, we, we had also told her it was gonna be 15 minutes and she thought, oh great. This is, this will be fun to do and sure enough turns into 50.[00:07:55] So, you know what, what an amazing effort and thanks so much to, to Gabriella and RETHINK for, for doing that for us.[00:08:00][00:08:00] Casey Golden: Well talk about commitment and just incredible continued support. And if you're a careful viewer, you'll also catch another familiar rethink retail face in the background, taking photos. I won't give away who it is yet, but when we come back, we'll let you in on the scoop.[00:08:17] Ricardo Belmar: Okay, well, a, after this incredibly long intro that we've managed now, maybe our longest yet let's dive in and listen to what Jeff, Vicki, Ron, and myself had to say about the v i p awards, Retail ROI, N R F in general, and just the state of retail today and, and what we expect to, to happen this year.[00:08:35] And, and you'll see why this is quickly my, my favorite podcast we've ever done.[00:08:39] Casey Golden: Amazing.[00:08:39][00:08:44] #NRFLive - TRI Friends Fireside Chat[00:08:44] Ricardo Belmar: Hey everybody. I'm here with Jeff Roster and co-host of this weekend innovation, and you guessed it. This is part of our crossover series between our two podcasts. How you doing, Jeff?[00:08:55] Jeff Roster: I am doing fantastic. Ricardo, how about yourself[00:08:58] Ricardo Belmar: I'm doing wonderful. [00:09:00] And part of that I would say is true for you too because we are live and in person at the N R F show, which we haven't been in quite some time.[00:09:08] three years. [00:09:09] Jeff Roster: Well, actually I was here. I was here last[00:09:12] Ricardo Belmar: you get bonus points for last year. You get bonus points for last[00:09:16] Jeff Roster: year, okay. The re the Startup community came strong last year[00:09:18] Ricardo Belmar: That's true. That's very true. You can, we'll, we'll leave that one there and then on that one there. And we are joined by two incredibly wonderful people in the retail industry.[00:09:28] Vicki Cantrell, how you doing? Vicki? And Ron Thurston.[00:09:33] Ron Thurston: Hi everyone. Happy to be here.[00:09:35] Ricardo Belmar: So we thought we would just kind of kick things off by talking a little bit about the first couple of events that have started N r F week this year starting with Vicki, with your event. Last night as of when we were recording this, the vendors in partnership awards ceremony.[00:09:49] Why don't you give us a, a quick recap of some of the highlights.[00:09:52] Vicki Cantrell: Oh, I'd love to. It was really an amazing night. Um, we, uh, I started this thing three years ago [00:10:00] and last night I think we kind of crossed a threshold because the message that I have dreamed about is really taking hold.[00:10:07] And it's about how we do business, not who does business with who. And really about problem solving, not solution selling, and. The things that really resonated with me last night and the things that people come up and say to me have to do with the fact that I say that, you know, people buy from people, they don't buy from companies.[00:10:30] Um, the gratitude that people had when they had to kind of put together their nominations and they realize. They took a breath and said how far they've come and they were able to recognize their teams. These are all the relationship aspects, um, that flowed through the night. Aside from that, it was a beautiful night, beautiful venue.[00:10:51] So much love in the room. We sold out. [00:10:54] Jeff Roster: congratulations. [00:10:55] Thank you.[00:10:56] Ricardo Belmar: a big achievement. Yeah.[00:10:57] Jeff Roster: I kind of liked it when I could move around a little bit. [00:10:59] Vicki Cantrell: I know [00:11:00] you do.[00:11:00] Jeff Roster: so you know,[00:11:02] Ron Thurston: there were people here today are[00:11:03] Jeff Roster: quite as easy moving around this, time,[00:11:07] Vicki Cantrell: but uh, yeah, so, uh, we're really thrilled with the evening and, uh, a lot of great buzz and I just believe, I always thought I was pushing a rock uphill to take away this, this aspect of buyer, seller.[00:11:21] Yeah. But you know, it's that rock is moving. And so I'm thrilled.[00:11:27] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I, I, I, I like the way you put it because I really feel like your event, uh, so nicely demonstrate that it is a relationship.[00:11:35] It's not just buyer seller. Right. Right. It's a partnership between what we're all collectively trying to [00:11:40] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah. Yeah. Everybody in the room is equals and that's what makes this the most special party. And, and people are not tired. You know, they're, this is their celebration. This is the celebration for the people that actually run this show and, uh, are gonna go through a grueling four [00:12:00] or five days that's gonna make or break their year.[00:12:03] Right. And why not. Let's celebrate for what they bring to the industry and what they allow us all to do.[00:12:12] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. I'm well said. Well said. Ron, what's your impression so far at like, I, I guess I would call this day two of nrf,[00:12:18] Jeff Roster: It's day two for us. I don't know about anybody[00:12:20] Vicki Cantrell: for sure.[00:12:21] Ron Thurston: a good one[00:12:21] Ricardo Belmar: for everybody, but for us,[00:12:22] Ron Thurston: you know, I had the, I had the, I've known Vicki for I think 15 years, so we go way back Tor Tory Birch years.[00:12:30] Um, and Vicky was generous enough last year to invite me to give out an award to retailer's favorite and this year I was nominated. So it was great to just be there and to be, even though I'm not a vendor, I feel like I know so many of the vendors. I've been a retailer, I have so many friends in the room.[00:12:48] It's just a joy. It's a joy to be there. And, and you're right, I think it's early. Everyone dresses up. Yes. You know, by Tuesday I have this feeling, you know, we'll, I'll be wearing jeans and[00:12:58] Vicki Cantrell: Right. It's sneakers. [00:13:00] Hundred[00:13:00] Ron Thurston: don't care anymore. But, um, it's a beautiful. Beautiful. [00:13:05] Vicki Cantrell: my feet are already cooked, but, and I'm only on day one and this is a, this I have not factored in, so I, I gotta,[00:13:12] Ricardo Belmar: We're, we're all still learning[00:13:13] Jeff Roster: No sensible shoes then,[00:13:15] huh?[00:13:15] Vicki Cantrell: I have some[00:13:18] Ricardo Belmar: you, you can't get enough sensible shoes, I[00:13:20] Vicki Cantrell: That's true. [00:13:20] Ricardo Belmar: Takeaway I have from that Yeah. No. No matter how much you try. So we're also all here on day two at one of my other favorite events of the week. RetailROI's Super Saturday. Uh, I was excited to be able to hosted this event at the Microsoft office in Times Square.[00:13:37] Um, Jeff, I think you wanna, sh you had some stats you'd like to share maybe on how we did[00:13:42] Jeff Roster: Well,[00:13:43] very well.[00:13:46] Ricardo Belmar: that's,[00:13:46] Jeff Roster: that's analyst speak for, Hmm. I think we were well over $320,000. It's, it was the,[00:13:52] Vicki Cantrell: the[00:13:53] closer to three [00:13:54] Jeff Roster: Three 50. It was the second biggest year revenue wise. Um, the other [00:14:00] observations, uh, crazy energy. So I would agree with, um, you know, as, as, as somebody that was at, uh, Vicki's event, the energy was off the charts. That was the big speculation, um, that I was testing. You know, the, in the, the run up to N RF series I was doing is, what do you expect?[00:14:14] You know, and we were talking about make sure you have, you know, masks and, and all this and be sensitive to who people, you know, whatever. And that's, that's all that advice is all still. But, uh, I think, I think people are ready to rock and roll and the energy's off[00:14:27] Ricardo Belmar: The energy's there, right.[00:14:28] Jeff Roster: they're definitely wanna be sensitive if people are still have, have whatever issues, but, uh, solid energy.[00:14:33] We kind of got a sense of that. Maybe Wednesday, Thursday you could just start, I could start seeing the emails confirmed for, uh, v I p and definitely, definitely today for sure. This is day two and tons of energy. People wanna, you know, re reconnect. Um, I dunno about you guys, but, um, I've bumped into at least 10 people that I've known virtually[00:14:58] Right. For years now, who I [00:15:00] believe I have a legitimate relationship and I'm like,[00:15:04] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, no, that, that's[00:15:05] Vicki Cantrell: that's so true.[00:15:06] Ricardo Belmar: so, right Ron, Ron and I have now, I don't know, known each other I,[00:15:11] Ron Thurston: couple years.[00:15:12] Couple years now. Yeah.[00:15:13] Ricardo Belmar: we, this was the first day we finally got to meet in person.[00:15:15] Ron Thurston: true. It's really true. [00:15:17] Vicki Cantrell: So I'm shocked because as, as well as Zoom does things, people look different in person,[00:15:25] And like somebody walked in who I've had probably 15 zooms with and choose about a foot taller than I expected. She walked in and I thought, and so you don't recognize, you know, it's, it's really something. There's gonna be a lot of that this, this[00:15:40] Ron Thurston: there will be[00:15:41] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah.[00:15:42] Ricardo Belmar: no, no doubt. No doubt.[00:15:45] So what's[00:15:47] everyone thinking now that we've, we've kind of had a taste of the energy after a couple of events. The, the full-blown show starts tomorrow. So what is everyone thinking? The vibe is gonna be on the show floor.[00:15:59] Ron Thurston: Mm-hmm.[00:16:00][00:16:01] Vicki Cantrell: I would say that, um, because of this energy and, and what I'm hearing just in a few conversations of today and yesterday is, uh, and people are actually saying that, you know, the pandemic, so we're ready to get back out there.[00:16:16] They're using this kind of language and this is solution providers, and for them that means get back out there. I wanna go to events, I wanna pick and choose different types of events. I. You know, more involved in different types of things. And today we heard about two different vendors who are now heavily involved and didn't know anything about roi.[00:16:38] So when you, when you think about a little bit, right? You said that, oh yes, but, but you know, you just, because they are now. Wanting to be involved in new things, new ways, get back out there. I would say the watch phrase is get back out there and that's what we're gonna see on the floor that people are gonna be looking to [00:17:00] like, am I up to date on technology?[00:17:02] Let me stop at all these booths to really feel like I'm connected again. Yeah, that's what I think. [00:17:08] Ron Thurston: And I think because there's been so much conversation about all the new ideas and all the new technology, yeah.[00:17:14] You actually need to touch and feel it. Yeah. Similar to shopping in a retail store, I think I'm excited to go down, you know, innovation. Lane and what are all these brands bringing? What are, what's happening? What are some big new ideas? Yeah, and you know, a lot of retailers, and I'm sure we'll speak about the Rethink retail bash coming up, but the minute I posted of, you know, hey, rethink retail is having this, the amount of responses that I received of like, I'd love to go, I'd love to go.[00:17:41] Yes. The willingness and desire to reconnect is powerful.[00:17:46] Ricardo Belmar: Powerful, yeah. Yeah, that's[00:17:47] right. That's right. So, well since you brought up the, the rethink retail that we're, I think we're all going to be at, uh, Monday night. What, what other, so day one, official day one, I'll call it right. For NRF Sunday [00:18:00] tomorrow.[00:18:00] That's on day two. Um, anything else anyone is excited to be going to, of the remaining[00:18:07] Vicki Cantrell: I'm sorry, but I can't not talk about rock and roll retail. I, I mean Yep.[00:18:14] Ricardo Belmar: I'm with you on that one.[00:18:15] Vicki Cantrell: That's, that's the other thing where retailers are so embedded in different fun areas of life. Yeah. Okay. Yes. They do charity work.[00:18:24] They go on trips. Mm-hmm. , they play music. They make a band, they[00:18:29] Ron Thurston: and it[00:18:30] Ricardo Belmar: comes together[00:18:30] Vicki Cantrell: together here, and it all comes together here.[00:18:32] Ron Thurston: Wow. So fun.[00:18:34] Ricardo Belmar: for that one too. That's another, another Monday, late evening. Oh my god. Activity.[00:18:39] Vicki Cantrell: Yes. And then of course the Retail Retailer Insiders[00:18:43] Ron Thurston: was just gonna say that one too. Yeah. Yeah. It'll be my first year attending that.[00:18:47] It'll be fun. You ready? Get ready. That's, that's all 9:00 PM on a Sunday night. A lot of[00:18:51] Jeff Roster: tie at that one. That's a little more raucous for sure. Um, very good. Um, lot of people, um, you know, so it's, the [00:19:00] energy is clearly here.[00:19:01] There's no doubt about it. The um, As ugly and hideous as Covid was, it clearly was a stimulant to, to innovation. I mean, we tracked that on this week. I think you did it on retail razor too. The, the, you know, I mean the number of BOPIS uh, setups were just off the charts, right? We now realize low code's, a real unique strategic advantage, uh, be able to move faster, more nimbler.[00:19:20] And so I think what we're gonna see is. I don't wanna say an explosion of innovation, cuz I would argue, I mean I've been tracking it for 20 years. It's, it's, I, I, I don't think things just explode, but they accelerate and the ability to innovate. And the fact that startups three or four or five years ago really weren't even, I mean, Vicky, when you were there, I mean you were just starting to bring the startups in.[00:19:42] They were always there. They were. I mean, I live in Silicon Valley. We've been doing startups really since Hewlett and Packard got together in 1938. So we're not new to startup. , but all of a sudden the industry has said, this is this giant opportunity to, to um, showcase this in this innovation has always been [00:20:00] going on.[00:20:00] That's why, you know, the big companies have, are, have been, uh, making acquisitions, but now we're, we're featuring these people and this is the, I mean, the heart of of businesses. These and some young entrepreneurs, a lot, not so young entrepreneurs, but that energy and they're being featured now and it's just.[00:20:19] And it's just gonna be, I think it's gonna be a celebration of innovation, is maybe the way I'm gonna [00:20:24] Vicki Cantrell: it, Jeff, you know, I also wanna say something about innovation. That that overused word. Okay. And because when you say innovation, everybody thinks tech innovation. Mm-hmm. . Okay. But what the last few years have shown us is that innovation is across the board, innovation on how you speak to each other, innovation on how you.[00:20:45] teams work together. Innovation on how you approach something. By the way, you wouldn't, low-code wouldn't have such a, a presence if there was an innovation in how you do things, not just the tech. [00:21:00] And so people have really changed how they do business and that requires innovation of thought and innovation of mm-hmm.[00:21:10] how you use your people.[00:21:11] Ron Thurston: and Agreed.[00:21:12] Vicki Cantrell: You know, because retailers have to be like super agile.[00:21:16] Ron Thurston: Yeah. And, and it's only as effective as the adoption normally, which has to happen in a store.[00:21:23] Vicki Cantrell: Oh boy. Isn't that the truth? [00:21:24] Ron Thurston: That's the truth.[00:21:25] Vicki Cantrell: That's it, [00:21:26] Ron Thurston: there's so much [00:21:27] new, there's a lot of, I'll say this, there's a lot of people who develop technology that have never worked in retail. And so there's Yes. I know it's a bold statement, you know, just gonna say it, know, [00:21:40] Jeff Roster: We've got story. We got a whole podcast where, where we could talk, tell stories. Central office. No, it's not a central office. It's called a store. Please change that on your slide deck. I catch a lot of that. And you still see it at this store[00:21:53] Ron Thurston: You do. I mean, it's the 50% want to quit their job working in retail stat. I[00:21:58] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, right. Yeah.[00:21:59] Ron Thurston: it's those, [00:22:00] and so I think there's this whole concept again of what does the store need.[00:22:05] Ask the store. Right, right. Before you go and develop technology. Right. And there are, um, there's a solution that will be in the innovation aisle this year called Reflex, and they're doing on demand staffing. Yes. And so this is an actual need that is. In integral to the success of our industry. Yeah. To say that we need on-demand gig economy, style retail workforce, right?[00:22:29] Because the workforce is demanding it. They're demanding flexibility. So here's someone that's innovating this idea. Yes. And coming up with new technology. So don't just create something because you think it's a good idea. ask the people who need this technology and how they'll use it. So why I'm such a big Yoobic fan who were, you know, also nominated last night.[00:22:50] Yeah. They, they really listen to what the stores need. Yep. Stores and restaurants need, and it's, that's why the adoption's so high.[00:22:59] Jeff Roster: I'll [00:23:00] tell you a little secret. Um, there's a bunch of CIOs that the first question they ask a tech vendor is, tell me what you think of my store? [00:23:07] Ron Thurston: That's a great question. [00:23:08] Vicki Cantrell: Yes. [00:23:08] Jeff Roster: want, you want to know[00:23:09] Ron Thurston: who[00:23:09] Jeff Roster: many vendors could wash out right up there? [00:23:11] Vicki Cantrell: Yep. [00:23:11] Jeff Roster: A[00:23:11] lot. A lot.. [00:23:12] Ricardo Belmar: So these people [00:23:13] Vicki Cantrell: have so basic,[00:23:14] hundreds, [00:23:14] Jeff Roster: if not thousands of dollars to maybe fly travel, prepare for a meeting, and they did not go to the physical store [00:23:22] Vicki Cantrell: mm-hmm.[00:23:22] Jeff Roster: and make some observations.[00:23:23] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. [00:23:24] Jeff Roster: and, and it's just like, you know, it's just like a crocodile, just ready to pounce cuz the, you know, the cio Just first question, tell me what you think and, and it's not a trick question. No, I was in your store. It seemed busy, it seemed cluttered, it seemed really good. I liked the lighting. I did, I, it, it's easy,[00:23:41] Ron Thurston: Yeah.[00:23:41] Jeff Roster: you got to, you're telling me you're gonna try to do and you don't know their business and that's the point you're making and that's valuable [00:23:48] Ron Thurston: really valuable. I, I asked that question often of management candidates, you know, and my office was right here in Times Square. There were six intermix stores in the city. Tell me the story you're in. Yeah. And [00:24:00] the the question could end. Yeah. You know, very quickly. Yeah. And so you're right.[00:24:04] Yeah. It's like, do your homework, learn what's necessary, learn what's important, and then help. Right. You know, help us be better because of it.[00:24:14] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I mean, I, I, I think that question is so powerful as to your point, RO I've used that myself being on the vendor side in a meeting with a group of retail executives, or I've asked them, well, More from a wanting to learn perspective. I said, well, tell me about your store. Tell me the last time you were in a store and what you thought were the biggest challenges.[00:24:33] And I was always surprised. Half the time I asked that question, I couldn't get an answer because I was, had a room full of people who couldn't remember the last time they had walked to their own stores. So I think that's one, to me, it was one of the most simplest basic things that everybody in the industry can do is just, you know, Go visit the store.[00:24:50] Yes.[00:24:51] See what's going on. Ask the people that are there,[00:24:53] what's [00:24:54] Vicki Cantrell: wrong. So simple. Right.[00:24:55] So simple. so simple. [00:24:56] Ron Thurston: simple. You know,[00:24:57] Ricardo Belmar: know? Well, we, we heard some examples today, right?[00:24:59] Vicki Cantrell: [00:25:00] Right. Sharon Sessions from From[00:25:01] Ricardo Belmar: Sharon. Yeah, true. From the Undercover, undercover [00:25:04] Vicki Cantrell: Boss[00:25:04] Get to the source. It's that simple. , [00:25:08] Ron Thurston: and[00:25:08] maybe it's not in New York City, you know, go, you know, as I have traveled across the country this year, I, I would be confident to say a lot of those stores in the, the heartland of this country have never been visited by an executive can guarantee it.[00:25:24] Yes. And so maybe get out of la, New York. Right. And go visits the flagship store, the low volume. Yeah. Not just flag low volume, you know. [00:25:34] And look for those opportunities Yeah. That are available just by asking questions. [00:25:40] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. [00:25:40] Vicki Cantrell: Yep.[00:25:41] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think there'll be a lot of those questions hopefully be asked over the next few.[00:25:45] days.[00:25:45] Ron Thurston: Yeah,[00:25:46] so too.[00:25:47] Jeff Roster: So what do you think the big buzzwords for the show are gonna be? [00:25:51] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, that's a great question, Jeff.[00:25:53] You know, every nrf I I come to, it seems in recent years though, always start with, I'm sure this is the year every vendor's gonna [00:26:00] talk about ai. Mm-hmm. I, I still kind of chuckle a little bit. I forget which year it was, when it seemed like every time I turn around the expo floor, there was a booth with a robot in it and then, and now I want to kind of walk through and say, where did all the robots go? Yeah.[00:26:11] Jeff Roster: they're working, they're in the stores. Apparently working. I guess maybe,[00:26:14] Ricardo Belmar: I don't know. I don't know. I mean, I, I'm actually kind of interested to see what the buzzy words are going to be this time. You know, we we're kind of coming out of a year where the first half of the year, the big buzz was all about Metaverse.[00:26:27] Mm-hmm. . I don't, I don't expect that to be the one. I think there'll be some, I mean, I, I still expect to see some web three discussion maybe.[00:26:34] Ron Thurston: Mm-hmm.[00:26:34] Ricardo Belmar: I think there's definitely gonna be a lot of, [00:26:36] maybe new applications. I'll, I'll put it that way, to ai you know, certainly things talking about pricing, I think that's a.[00:26:44] Vicki Cantrell: seems to be a lot of conversation around pricing.[00:26:46] Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.[00:26:48] Ricardo Belmar: I expect to hear a lot about returns management. Yeah. Just given where we're at, you know, that being a, a solution[00:26:54] Jeff Roster: I agree a hundred percent. [00:26:56] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Um, yeah.[00:26:57] Jeff Roster: just because it's so [00:27:00] unsexy. but it's, you know, returns are where profits go to die.[00:27:05] And yet, if we're gonna talk about being sustainable, I mean the, probably the least sustainable process on the planet is returns.[00:27:11] Ron Thurston: Agreed. [00:27:11] Ricardo Belmar: Right, [00:27:11] Jeff Roster: Just[00:27:12] you ship you ship thing 8,000 miles or however you process it, you got it out. and it's coming back and it's coming back in a far be worse condition than it left.[00:27:21] And it is a mess. And you're touching it again and every time you touch, you're hanging another dollar on that thing. Yeah. So if we can figure out how, and, and there were some great conversations today, like, you know, maybe we need to deselect some customers and I, you know, if we're gonna be serious about being sustainable.[00:27:37] Yeah. Why are you returning so much? Is it an issue with sizing? Which it clearly is. technology. Uh, solutions. They're, they're starting to become some, you know, AI models and, and 3D models and all that stuff. I mean, there's a lot of things that we can look at, but if somehow we can say, how do we, you know, how do we not return 50% or 60% of stuff?[00:27:57] That's a huge [00:27:59] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. That's A huge one. [00:28:00] Yeah. [00:28:00] Jeff Roster: Um, so I love that. So, re returns, I, I'm, How might debate with you a little bit on Metaverse. We'll have to settle up afterwards, but I'm much more of a fan of immersive commerce, which our friend Michael Zakour has, has [00:28:11] Vicki Cantrell: that. Yeah. So we[00:28:12] Jeff Roster: can, we can talk about, uh, we can talk about augmented reality and not talk about, you know, getting[00:28:17] Ricardo Belmar: virtual[00:28:18] Jeff Roster: you know, [00:28:18] Ricardo Belmar: part. Well, I'll, I'll tell you. I, I will. Concede one point on, on [00:28:23] Jeff Roster: one [00:28:23] I'm getting one, [00:28:24] Ricardo Belmar: oh, you'll get one today. . Ask me again at the end, at the end [00:28:27] Jeff Roster: I will [00:28:27] Ricardo Belmar: You'll, I know you will, I know you'll keep, you'll hold me to that[00:28:30] I, I would say the, the one, because I know there are sessions about this, so that, that's why I'm gonna bring it up. And I've already talked to some folks about it and I know I see it with our customers, with the partners I work with. One really strong use case for Metaverse is digital. Um, especially with, uh, the consumer goods brands that we work with there, there's lots and lots of interest in that because you can just have, if you're building the digital twin, right, you have your entire operations modeled that you can play around with.[00:28:58] Come up with new operations, [00:29:00] new products, without ever having to touch anything physical and incur the cost for that. And you'll know upfront, now I built it in that digital twin. Now I know what the outcome's gonna be before I build version So I think.[00:29:10] Ron Thurston: that's[00:29:11] Ricardo Belmar: In my mind the most valid use case today,[00:29:14] today.[00:29:15] Cuz I know you're looking at me, Jeff, and, and you're thinking there's more to it than that.[00:29:18] Jeff Roster: Oh, I'm waiting. I'm,[00:29:18] Ricardo Belmar: I know, I know. You're, you're finding, I know you're waiting the pounce on me for that one, but I'm gonna say that's today's use case for metaverse. All the other ones I think, I don't know if it's this year.[00:29:28] I think they'll come. I'll, I'll agree with you on that one. It it's coming, but I don't know that it's, this year.[00:29:32] Vicki Cantrell: This has, this is in that same category of how much you have to pay attention. You have to be paying attention. But c, come where we are economically and where we are, it's going to be, I'm going to pay attention and I'm, but I'm also understand that no bright, shiny objects.[00:29:51] Right. Okay. And that's where it is still, you know, it's still that,[00:29:55] Ricardo Belmar: but you get some of the[00:29:56] core core pieces.[00:29:57] I think that to me is the, the key for some of these. And that's why I [00:30:00] keep bringing up the digital twin[00:30:01] Vicki Cantrell: Well, just like ai, [00:30:02] the same core pieces,[00:30:02] you need [00:30:03] Ricardo Belmar: pieces, right? [00:30:04] Vicki Cantrell: You [00:30:04] Ricardo Belmar: need that[00:30:04] fundamental[00:30:05] Jeff Roster: And that's why [00:30:06] Ricardo Belmar: so you can build on, that's [00:30:07] Jeff Roster: why immersive commerce is a superior word to Metaverse cuz you can get those pieces and you can kind of loop it. Cuz we, as analysts, we have to have something to hang that framework on. Cause we gotta study, we gotta survey it, we gotta forecast it.[00:30:19] You ain't forecasting Metaverse? Cause that's nonsense. [00:30:21] Vicki Cantrell: Right? Right. [00:30:22] Jeff Roster: Right? Um,[00:30:22] oh, it's, uh, $22 trillion. Okay. I picked what, it's ridiculous. What's that based on? But immersive commerce, you can break out ai, well you can break out AI's foundation, you can break out virtual reality, augmented reality, all these components.[00:30:34] And now you can build[00:30:35] a, you can build a deal. And I think that's probably a far better way for us to talk about it. And there's absolutely zero energy, pro or con around that [00:30:44] Vicki Cantrell: Right.[00:30:45] Jeff Roster: And, uh, you know, unfortunately, I think the guy out in my, part of the, the, you know, states maybe kind of mucked up that word just won't say who[00:30:53] Ricardo Belmar: just a little low,[00:30:54] Jeff Roster: but, um, but no, I, so, so, we'll, so we'll have to, we'll have to, we'll have to square up, but I'm, I'm thinking [00:31:00] augmented reality, um, we've had it, we've had it in aviation for 20 years. [00:31:03] Ricardo Belmar: Uh, yeah. [00:31:03] Jeff Roster: I, trained in simulator, so pieces are not there. And I'll tell you the other thing that's the most interesting about this thing is not so much what Nike's doing in whatever the virtual reality world I think the best example is what Alta Cosmetics doing.[00:31:18] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.[00:31:18] Jeff Roster: Um,[00:31:19] and[00:31:19] and they've got with Roblox and they've got a lot of young girls with moms playing in what sure sounds like a metaverse thing. So now you're taking it away from the boys playing world at war, and now you've gone, you know, a far bigger thing and there's clearly value there.[00:31:34] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah. And so[00:31:35] Jeff Roster: that, that's when I heard that story. And it's actually even a better to share, but.[00:31:42] that's telling me, okay, now we've, now [00:31:45] Vicki Cantrell: something [00:31:46] Ron Thurston: Yeah, and Altas such a great story because in every way, in every way, because it's accessible. You see it in, you know, the hundreds of locations, you see it all over the country.[00:31:56] You have a very in-store touch feel, experience it as [00:32:00] you want. You have a metaverse digital immersive version of it, and I think that's, that's what great retail is. It's that incredibly immersive way to think about it. However you choose to experience it, [00:32:13] Jeff Roster: go. That's the point where you're not taking this entire heavy vision and you're just taking out the pieces. I mean, you look at like the smart mirrors that they're doing, where they're actually, they've actually invested in a, in an AI startup to be able to analyze skin. It's sort of started off as almost as a medical, uh, strategy.[00:32:29] To determine skin cancers and all of a sudden, hey, well you know what, if we analyze skin, then we can better, you know, this is obviously not my area of expertise, but uh, I paid for a lot of this stuff with a daughter and a wife, , [00:32:39] I mean, that's heavy duty technology to involved in that business. And the other thing why I, I just love having Ulta on, on the pod is they have an investment firm [00:32:51] Vicki Cantrell: Yes.[00:32:51] Jeff Roster: Okay. We're not talking about Walmart or Amazon now, we're talking and, and they're not small retailer. I mean, they're over $8 billion. So they're high, you know, they're not high. They're a [00:33:00] major tier one player, but they've set up an investment firm, so, they can go invest in the startup community for, for technologies that are appropriate to their business.[00:33:07] And they've already made some acquisitions. And now, so, you know, the problem I've always had is an analyst using Walmart. And now Amazon is an example. Everyone says, oh, you know, you're giving permission to people not to pay attention. Oh, I'm not Walmart, I'm not Amazon. you're $2 billion retailer.[00:33:22] You're a $4 billion, you do this. Or if, if you don't understand, somebody else [00:33:27] is [00:33:27] Vicki Cantrell: right. [00:33:27] Jeff Roster: And that's, you know, we're in the business of being in business and so, innovation, how you look at it. That needs to be in a mindset. Now, I'm not saying spend top dollar, but I am saying start thinking about your business differently.[00:33:40] And most importantly, and this goes back to a bus ride, I don't know you remember in Honduras where we talked, started talking about the era of an intentional innovation.[00:33:47] Vicki Cantrell: Uh, that[00:33:48] absolutely right.[00:33:49] Absolutely [00:33:49] Jeff Roster: You know, that was mid, that was more than a few moons ago, uh, I remember you and I were sitting there just kind of going back and forth and I was just expressing my frustration that the fact that retailers never, ever wanted [00:34:00] to talk about the mistakes they made from a technology perspective is, as an analyst.[00:34:03] That was so difficult because that's how we learned. Well, and then you said, you know, Appropriately no one wanted to, you know, seem like they failed. And then, you know, being a Gartner and having colleagues in my direct practice that were in other verticals, when I would share that with them, they'd say, are you crazy?[00:34:18] Our greatest successes in manufacturing were failures in theory. I mean, the 3M example of, uh, of um, uh, yellow, uh, stick notes[00:34:27] that was post-its Yeah.[00:34:28] it. That was like a failed glue experiment that, uh, that a guy that was in a choir wanted to be able to have some kind of a glue that he would stick so he could have his notes for, for singing and, oh, that glue that didn't work was perfect. We're, we're one of the few industries that don't celebrate, or at least didn't celebrate our failures. And that I think needs to change. And so if I can get [00:34:50] retail, senior retail leadership to say, you guys have to push the envelope and you have to be okay.[00:34:56] Break the bank by failing, but fail fast, which is in Silicon [00:35:00] Valley.[00:35:00] We live by[00:35:00] Vicki Cantrell: right? Yeah.[00:35:01] Jeff Roster: Fail fast.[00:35:02] Ron Thurston: Yep, [00:35:02] Vicki Cantrell: you know, it's different now. The mindset is different now. Before there was a fear of that because it always touched the customer, and the customer was delicate. Now, today's customer very different. Today's customer lives, breathes and sleeps and eats with.[00:35:21] Just[00:35:21] mess in, in, in every retail experience, in every restaurant.[00:35:27] You know, life, schools, education, politics, they live in a mess. Okay? So they are going to, and they don't make decisions about where they shop and who they shop with based on whether it was a perf. Perfect [00:35:41] experience, right? [00:35:43] They make it for different reasons. So again, you know, hate to beat a dead horse after 40 years of beating a dead horse,[00:35:51] It starts with the customer and it's not about the customer who's walking in your store. It's about understand the human, what is happening to this [00:36:00] human these days? What is their life like? What is their family like? Understand them. And then apply your brand to it. Not here's my brand. Where do I find a person who will like [00:36:11] that?[00:36:11] Ron Thurston: could not agree more?[00:36:12] Vicki Cantrell: It's never been that way, but nobody, it just, it takes a long time to get that. And now the consumer, as they always do, is forcing. Mm-hmm. that so they are messier. So the retailer can be messier and be forgiven. And when the retailer says I was messy, I'm sorry.[00:36:34] have at it. That's great. [00:36:35] Jeff Roster: Isn't that a better customer experience though? I'll, I'll, I'll[00:36:37] Vicki Cantrell: go. It is. [00:36:38] Jeff Roster: if I, as a, if I as a retailer make a mistake, but then I fix it. Isn't that better?[00:36:43] Vicki Cantrell: Yes.[00:36:44] Jeff Roster: To that customer. Cuz then they, that's one that's, they perceive value in that they perceived honesty cuz it is in fact being honest. [00:36:50] Ron Thurston: Right, right.[00:36:51] Jeff Roster: And you have a, you have a better, I think you have a better experience[00:36:54] Ron Thurston: You do. It's authenticity and I, I would say the customer appreciates it. But so does the store team. The store [00:37:00] team knows when you've done maybe not the right thing. So if the company comes, senior leadership comes back and said, you know what we.[00:37:08] We did make the right decision. We didn't spend money where we should have, and this is what we're gonna do differently. What that creates is retention for the store teams, which is probably another R word, along with[00:37:19] the recession word, which I think will also come up this week. Um, I think employee, employee retention.[00:37:25] I know I'm host, I'm, I'm doing, um, um, a panel tomorrow on that. I think this idea of what do brands need to do to hire, retain, and attract great talent. Yeah. It's, it's another 40 year like dead horse. To your point, Vicky , that you and I have been having this conversation also for many years, but it's, it's actually never been more important.[00:37:48] Yeah. And it's really hard to say that in 2023, it's critical. It's it, it will make or break the future of any brand not retaining their talent.[00:37:59] Vicki Cantrell: It's funny how it has [00:38:00] to do with people [00:38:00] still all still after[00:38:02] Ron Thurston: still. It always comes back too. Yeah. Yeah. Which It's really good, but it's really, but it's messy.[00:38:08] I love Vicky's word because managing humans is messy. Yeah. And it's hard, and which is also why I believe. Many people don't want to talk about it because it's really hard. Yeah, yeah. And it's emotional and there's, that emotion is bigger than ever. So that[00:38:26] the ability to lead people in an inspiring way has never been harder.[00:38:31] Yeah. [00:38:32] Jeff Roster: Yeah. You know what I like about that phrase, messy is, you know, one of the, one of the Metaverse technologies or uh, one of the [00:38:41] Ricardo Belmar: Immersive[00:38:41] immersive commerce[00:38:42] Vicki Cantrell: technologies[00:38:42] Jeff Roster: technologies is live streaming. And now it's a done deal. It's a done deal in China.[00:38:45] It's a done deals Asia PAC, and we just think we're now beginning to experiment with My only worry about that is if we try to over, over produce the live streams and I'll, the example I'll point to is B N H photo,[00:38:59] Ricardo Belmar: [00:39:00] Mm-hmm.[00:39:01] So [00:39:01] Jeff Roster: n h photo, A lot of this equipment is from B&H Photo [00:39:05] Vicki Cantrell: right. I'm sure[00:39:05] Jeff Roster: look around. And so for, for folks who dunno who that is, it's just literally the best, uh, camera shop in the planet, I would argue.[00:39:13] Um, and it's, people are passionate. They're, the salespeople are exactly everyone you would want them to be[00:39:19] Passionate about the product, use the product for our photographers. And so when you go in, you have this amazing experience. Well, I used to, you know, cause I live in California and there there's only one store and it's in right here in Manhattan.[00:39:31] Um, you used to have to call in. , which was okay. And then they started doing text chat, which is actually okay, cuz then they could send links. Well, somebody said, why don't we just put a ca, we're a camera store, put a camera in there, . And the first one I did was like two years or whenever it was. And it was not [00:39:47] a good, I mean it was a good experience, but it was not a fancy, I mean, it was like, This is not a great stream, but the content was crazy and I'm like, this is fantastic.[00:39:57] The guy's showing me this and he's, he's pulling out a [00:40:00] $3,000 camera lens and a 10,000, uh, Kathy, I put that one back. Okay. I didn't buy that one. . And then he brought over a cheaper way and I'm like, I'm like, this is crazy. And then, you know, Michael Zakour comes into your, your, uh, clubhouse and then he starts talking about what's happening in an Asia Pac.[00:40:14] And I said, oh, that's novel idea. Why don't we look east? And then I go, wow, okay. So my only worry about that is if we try to make it too, If we over produce it, I think was the word I was looking for. And just, just let it be authentic. Let it be[00:40:28] Vicki Cantrell: authentic, messy, let it be. Yes.[00:40:31] Jeff Roster: you were the one Vicky at, when you were at Tori Birch, I think you were talking about, were at, at some conference you were talking about like a, a fashion show or something you did where you had nutty response, I mean, crazy responses, right? [00:40:44] Vicki Cantrell: Yes, because we, we did this test where we had such brand advocates. [00:40:49] Okay. [00:40:50] And it was. Path. I can't remember the name of it. But anyway, we went out to our customers and we made them part of the process novel.[00:40:59] Here, [00:41:00] here's here's four buttons. Which one do you like? Okay. And they feel so in the know. Yeah. Look, people again, when I, I, I just bang that drum about, it's about people. It's about people, and it's about community. They belong to a community. People wanna belong. That's what they want. Right? Whatever it is, two people, 10 people, 5,000 people, and they became part of an insider community by being asked their opinion. It was extremely powerful. Yeah. And so, Yeah.[00:41:33] Jeff Roster: I've never, I've never forgotten that story. [00:41:35] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah. [00:41:35] Yeah. It's just [00:41:36] Ricardo Belmar: and just[00:41:37] so I'll add on to that with one interesting point from one of the sessions today, from the, uh, the gmu consumer study that, that, uh, Gotham has been on the show many times.[00:41:45] Uh,[00:41:47] Preview.[00:41:47] Jeff Roster: I haven't him on my show yet.[00:41:48] How [00:41:49] Ricardo Belmar: I don't, well, I don't know [00:41:50] Jeff Roster: oh man,[00:41:51] here[00:41:51] Vicki Cantrell: I can, I [00:41:52] Ricardo Belmar: can yeah, maybe Vicki can pull some strings for you, Jeff, and get 'em on your. But he's, he's[00:41:56] kind of been a [00:41:57] Vicki Cantrell: me. Maybe that would help.[00:42:00][00:42:00] Ron Thurston: Wow.[00:42:00] Ricardo Belmar: be it. But he, [00:42:02] Jeff Roster: is is full contact [00:42:03] Ron Thurston: likes me too. He gives my book to his students. He likes [00:42:06] Ricardo Belmar: me too! [00:42:06] That's right.[00:42:06] Yeah. . Here you go. So I think you, you've missed the boat on that one.[00:42:10] somehow, Jeff. [00:42:11] Jeff Roster: Yeah. Yeah. [00:42:12] Ricardo Belmar: So, but he did mention, uh, he had one of those points, if you remember, on, on the data he previewed about,[00:42:18] Consumer pain points about having a, a, a store associate that wasn't helpful. It just wasn't around right when they wanted them to be.[00:42:25] Right. That one's, and the reason I bring that one up is because, you know, you, you've been saying this now for, for half of our recorded time, Vicki, about the, that messy connection. Mm-hmm. . Right. And I think, Ron, you may remember, we've talked about this before, with that store associate being the live streamer, because they're the one that has the connection with the customers that shop at that store, which is exactly Jeff's story with B and h. Right? Because you, you know that store , you are a passionate fan of that store. So how could they not get you to buy something through a live stream showing you what it is, what the [00:43:00] product is, when you can't be there in the store to physically touch it?[00:43:03] So I think that,[00:43:03] that, to me [00:43:04] Vicki Cantrell: it doesn't have to be overproduced[00:43:05] Ricardo Belmar: No. [00:43:06] It[00:43:06] just has to be [00:43:06] Jeff Roster: that's, the[00:43:07] Vicki Cantrell: because it's people working with people.[00:43:09] Jeff Roster: and that's the key. And that's, I'm, I'm, I'm, you've gotta tweet out that term messy. If not, I'm stealing it because we need to make that, yeah. The standard. Don't screw this up. Right. Don't overproduce, sorry. Digital media folks, don't overproduce this.[00:43:26] Vicki Cantrell: Perfect Is the enemy of the good? Yes. good.[00:43:29] Jeff Roster: Make it clean, make it authentic. Make it honest.[00:43:33] Ricardo Belmar: And I think the best proof point, and we were all talking about this before. The mics were on, about how many people have we run into on the second day that we're here, that we all felt like we're talking to them for about 10, 15 minutes.[00:43:43] And so suddenly you realize this is the first time we're meeting in person , because we've only ever seen each other on Zoom calls and teams calls, and all these we're always just bit of square on[00:43:52] a screen[00:43:52] But we've done this for so long, now we feel like we have this existing connection [00:43:56] Ron Thurston: it's true.[00:43:57] Ricardo Belmar: And, now we're in person.[00:43:58] But you know, like [00:44:00] Ron, we, we hadn't met in person before.[00:44:01] Ron Thurston: until Last night. Last night. Mm-hmm. . [00:44:03] Ricardo Belmar: So that's, to me is the proof point, right? Yeah. you know, that kind of a, I'll call it sounds negative, but I don't mean it to be low production value livestream because it's authentic and [00:44:15] Vicki Cantrell: Right.[00:44:15] Ricardo Belmar: It's messy [00:44:16] Right, [00:44:16] Vicki Cantrell: right. That's why there's such tremendous buzz. Now that you say that, that's what what I'm thinking, it's a combination of seeing the people you've known forever and being so thrilled.[00:44:25] Mm-hmm. to see that person. And at the same exact time, seeing a bunch of people that you've never seen in real life, only digitally. So you have this like, uh, information overload. [00:44:38] Ron Thurston: right? Yes, it's true.[00:44:39] Vicki Cantrell: I have a, a statement I used to say like, when we were trying to implement systems quickly and let's get it done, I used to say, don't worry, be crappy.[00:44:48] Mm-hmm. . Okay, and so . So now we could say, don't worry, be crappy because it's authentic.[00:44:55] Ron Thurston: That's true.[00:44:56] And[00:44:56] Vicki Cantrell: add the authentic word. Yeah. [00:44:58] Ron Thurston: Authentics a[00:44:58] good word for sure. It's,[00:44:59] [00:45:00] Yeah.[00:45:00] I think the challenge though, with some of that, that I've seen is it's just sometimes one more thing for the store to do. Yeah. So I actually think part of the conversation this week I'd like to hear is, what are you taking out?[00:45:13] Yes. Not what are you adding to?[00:45:15] Because it's, they've been asked to do BOPIS. They've been asked to actually do more returns from web. They've been asked sometimes then to livestream. They've been asked to chat from the website. Mm-hmm. , they've been asked to do many different things in stores. Yeah. What are you taking away so that the store can be that much better?[00:45:32] What can you handle maybe in the office? How do you use staffing in a different way? How do. Hire people just to do livestream. Yeah. You know, so there's a lot of different ways, but adding more because you're in love with the new technology and the store's. Like what the hell?[00:45:48] Vicki Cantrell: Yeah. Sharon made such a good point about that today.[00:45:50] Ron Thurston: She did. She [00:45:51] said[00:45:51] Vicki Cantrell: you just don't realize that you're, that you're kind of piling on. Okay. [00:45:56] And you know, when's relative when you get to, um, [00:46:00] economic hard times and people are being laid off this, one of my least favorite sayings in the world is do more with less. Okay. And I've always said, no, that's not what you transitioned to.[00:46:13] you, do less with less is what you do because there's always something to give up that does not hurt you. You just aren't thinking, you're not having innovation of thought. Okay. You're not looking at those things, those ham theory things that say, oh, why do you do that? Because I've always done it. So do less with less.[00:46:32] Mm-hmm.[00:46:33] Ron Thurston: Mm-hmm. . And if[00:46:33] you have less, maybe your budget is different in 2023. Right. What are your most important priorities Exactly. That are great for your team and great for your customer. And maybe you can't have everything you always dreamed of. Mm-hmm. , maybe this is not the year for it.[00:46:47] Right. And that's okay. , it's okay. Yeah. But you should still come to an NRF show, learn what's happening. To your point, Jeff. Mm-hmm. don't be one of those brands that didn't pay attention and we're seeing the news, those that are not making it right. They didn't [00:47:00] pay attention. So pay attention, but maybe you don't execute everything in 2023.[00:47:05] Right. And I think it's a thought process that I'm not sure all retailers do. I think they come here sometimes looking for that, all the ideas, and then want to execute all of them. You know, [00:47:17] Jeff Roster: Ron, you're the only voice in this industry for the store associate. I, I'm trying to think of, right.[00:47:22] Is there anybody out there that would've just said what you just said, ? And the answer is no. I never would've said it because it it, I mean, I'm not a, I, I mean, I grew up in a store. I, well, I grew up with a World War II combat veteran father who, who would say you will absolutely do more with less. Because I did during the Great Depression, but he's not the most scalable person, so you're the only voice that's really even speaking to that.[00:47:45] And how important is that? What can you take off the plate? Because it's just, it's crazy. [00:47:50] Ron Thurston: crazy. And it, it doesn't always mean that you want to do less. Sometimes you need to do more or just, but I think it's, it, it's that point earlier. [00:48:00] Listen, learn. What does the customer asking for? What does the team need?[00:48:04] And then make a decision based on what you've heard, not the other way around. Right? Don't come to a conference call or to a, a big video call and say, guess what? I went to NRF and we're going into the Metaverse and you have, please don't say it, it's 300 stores on the call going. Okay. I can't even be on this call right now because I need to go ring some customers up, you know?[00:48:25] So I think there's this sometimes like misconception. Yeah. Um, and thank you for saying that, Jeff. I just [00:48:31] think [00:48:32] Jeff Roster: I just, it's just, you're such an important voice out there and you're the only voice out there. [00:48:36] Ro

Hello, and welcome to the Voice of Retail podcast! My name is Michael LeBlanc, and I am your host. I believe in the power of storytelling to bring the retail industry to life. Each week, I'll bring insights, perspectives, and experiences from some of the retail industry's most innovative and influential voices.   This podcast is produced in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada.The one and only Ron Thurston is my extraordinary guest for this episode, recorded live in person together for the first time at the NRF Big Show in New York.  Ron is a retailers' retailer, a veteran store leader that turned his passion into a best-selling book, Retail Pride, which became an epic tour across America with an F150 and an Airstream to meet retailers where they live and tell their stories.  I sat with Ron in the MarketDial podcasting studio to hear his story and learn his lessons from the Retail In America tour.   Let's listen in now!About RonRon Thurston is a highly accomplished retail leadership Executive, Board Advisor, and Amazon Bestselling Author with extensive experience leading retail operations for America's most prominent brands. He is adept at turning around underperforming businesses, developing and implementing innovative growth strategies, architecting improved training programs, building high-performing and dedicated teams, launching new brands, expanding brands into new markets, and ensuring customer growth and satisfaction. For the last three years, Ron has been named one of the top 100 most influential people in retail, is a former board member of GOODWILL NY/NJ, and currently sits on the advisory boards of several emerging retail technology brands, including Reflex Careers and IMMERSS. In early 2022 Ron launched his audio and video platforms for a year-long tour called “Retail In America,” live from an Airstream trailer to discover the real retail heroes across the country.About MichaelMichael is the Founder & President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc. and a Senior Advisor to Retail Council of Canada and the Bank of Canada as part of his advisory and consulting practice. He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience with Levi's, Black & Decker, Hudson's Bay, Today's Shopping Choice and Pandora Jewellery.   Michael has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career. He has delivered keynotes, hosted fire-side discussions with C-level executives and participated worldwide in thought leadership panels. ReThink Retail has added Michael to their prestigious Top Global Retail Influencers list for 2023 for the third year in a row. Michael is also the president of Maven Media, producing a network of leading trade podcasts, including Canada's top retail industry podcast, The Voice of Retail. He produces and co-hosts Remarkable Retail with best-selling author Steve Dennis, now ranked one of the top retail podcasts in the world. Based in New York, Conversations with CommerceNext is a podcast focusing on retail eCommerce, digital marketing and retail careers with episodes talking with C-level executives operating in the U.S. and internationally. Based in San Francisco, Global eCommerce Leaders podcast explores global cross-border issues and opportunities for eCommerce brands and retailers. Last but not least, Michael is the producer and host of the "Last Request Barbeque" channel on YouTube, where he cooks meals to die for - and collaborates with top brands as a food and product influencer across North America.

Hello everyone! My name is Roi Perets, and I am in San Diego with my husband, Ron Thurston.We left New York City four months ago to live in an airstream, travel across the US to discover this beautiful country, and rediscover ourselves.It had been a while since I recorded a podcast- we crossed many states and cities since Glacier in Montana, and I needed time to think rather than speak.That changed when we met Mandy and Cliff Brown in Malibu, California. We were scheduled to be in the same campground in San Diego a couple of weeks later, and as we reconnected over dinner, I found thoughtful and articulate partners to chat with about our journey.Follow Ron and me on our journey across the US-@dropthecoconut and @retailpride on InstagramAnd the Brown family on their incredible journey:@routedownfam on InstagramAnd their website: routedownfam.comIf our conversations spark something within you, or you have a "Drop the Coconut" moment that you would like to share, I would love to hear from you!I hope you enjoy it and thank you for jumping on our coconut wagon today!Roi

In Episode 80 of “The Trusted Advisor,” the RSPA's Jim Roddy catches up with executive, board advisor, author, and podcaster Ron Thurston about his firsthand view of the changing retail landscape. Thurston is in the midst of a year-long tour called “Retail in America,” driving across the United States in an Airstream trailer to discover unsung retail heroes. Thurston shares his IT-related lessons learned during his travels, winning strategies for selling to retailers, and the future of brick-and-mortar stores for leading brands as well as SMB retailers.   “The Trusted Advisor,” powered by the Retail Solutions Providers Association (RSPA), is an award-winning content series designed specifically for retail IT VARs and software developers. Our goal is to educate you on the topics of leadership, management, hiring, sales, and other small business best practices. For more insights, visit the RSPA blog at www.GoRSPA.org.    The RSPA is North America's largest community of VARs, software developers, vendors, and distributors in the retail, restaurant, grocery, and cannabis verticals. The mission of the RSPA is to accelerate the success of its members in the retail technology ecosystem by providing knowledge and connections. The organization offers education, hotlines for legal, security, sales, and business advice, industry advocacy, and discounts on other services to assist members with becoming and remaining successful. RSPA is most well-known for its signature events, RetailNOW and Inspire, which provide face-to-face learning and networking opportunities. Learn more by visiting www.GoRSPA.org. 

In this episode of Retail Corner, listen to one of the top 100 Retail influencers of 2021 & 2022, Ron Thurston, Author & Host of RETAIL IN AMERICA, talking about the changing landscape of retail that he himself experienced while talking with retail executives across US on his own mobile podcast in an Airstream trailer. His book titled 'Retail Pride' is an Amazon #1 best sellers list. Check out the book: https://www.amazon.com/Retail-Pride-Celebrating-Accidental-Career/dp/1544515928 About our guest Ron Thurston: Ron Thurston is a highly accomplished retail leadership executive, Board Advisor, and Amazon Bestselling Author with extensive experience leading retail operations for America's most prominent brands. He is adept at turning around underperforming businesses, developing and implementing innovative growth strategies, architecting improved training programs, building high-performing and dedicated teams, launching new brands, expanding brands into new markets, and ensuring customer growth and satisfaction. In 2021 and 2022, Ron was named one of the top 100 Retail Influencers globally, is a board member of GOODWILL NY/NJ, and currently sits on the advisory boards of several emerging retail technology brands, including Reflex Careers and IMMERSS. In 2022 Ron is launched his audio and video platforms for a year-long tour called “Retail In America,” live from an Airstream trailer to discover the real retail heroes all across the country. Shout-outs from Ron: Yoobic - https://yoobic.com/ KWI: https://www.kwi.com/ Reflex: https://www.workreflex.com/ Spotify Advertising: https://ads.spotify.com/en-US/   About Retail Corner Podcast: Host: Carlos Diaz Listen to other podcasts at: https://retailcorner.live Subscribe our Podcast: Apple iTunes: https://apple.co/3eoeUdT Spotify: https://spoti.fi/3dvjpDJ Google Podcast: https://bit.ly/3DFHXHw Amazon Music: https://amzn.to/3tkbhk1 Interested in being on our podcast? Submit request at: https://www.retailcorner.live/guests/intake/ or email podcast@retailcorner.live

After inspiring retail pride on a global scale, author and industry legend Ron Thurston is bringing his passion and perspectives on the road...literally. He has been traveling the U.S. in an airstream, stopping in different towns and sitting down with the people powering retail stores.   He took time out of his adventure to sit down for this episode of Retail Remix. Listen in and learn:   What's really happening in retail across the U.S. (and beyond big cities);   How to combat “the Big Quit” and create a culture of listening, learning and improving; and    Technologies Ron believes are helping improve alignment and engagement from HQ to the store.   RELATED LINKS  Listen and subscribe to ‘Retail in America'   Connect with Ron Thurston on LinkedIn

Hello! This is Ron Thurston, the best-selling author of https://www.amazon.com/Retail-Pride-Celebrating-Accidental-Career/dp/1544515928 (RETAIL PRIDE), and I am on the phone today with Nadine Huebel to learn all about the heroes of the travel retail industry. Welcome to https://www.retailpride.com (Retail In America)!  This podcast is part of The RETAIL IN AMERICA Tour, my year-long journey to discover incredible retail heroes all across the country, celebrating our retail culture, community, and careers. Go to http://retailpride.com/ (retailpride.com) or IG @retail pride to see it all, including past podcast episodes, playlists, and future cities on tour.  Today I am in West Glacier, Montana, and excited to have this conversation with Nadine about travel retail - an enormous segment within our industry full of retail heroes that you might not fully appreciate as all of us are running through airports and cruise ships around the world.  A bit about Nadine Huebel, she just took on a new role as the Senior Managing Director of Travel Retail at http://hdh.co.uk (Harper Dennis Hobbs), where she is responsible for establishing the world's most sought-after luxury brands in the North American travel retail market, converting more travelers into customers.  Most recently, Nadine was the CEO of https://www.heinemann-americas.com/hai/en (Heinermann America's), Inc. During her six-year tenure as the highest-ranking executive in the company's history, she secured contracts with some of the world's most significant cruise lines, bringing the company's projected revenue to $250 million by the end of 2022.  She is passionate about mentorship, female empowerment, giving back to the community, and Miami's budding tech ecosystem. She sits on the Advisory Board for Babson College's Center for Women's Entrepreneurial Leadership (CWEL) and the South Florida Board for UNICEF.  A huge thank you to the three title sponsors fueling the https://www.retailpride.com/ (RETAIL IN AMERICA) tour and this podcast. https://ads.spotify.com/en-US/ (Spotify Advertising )Spotify is the #1 podcast platform in the US and has grown to over 420M monthly unique registered users around the globe, over half of which are supported on the ad platform. Spotify advertising will help you reach and target your audience across devices, locations, and formats.  https://yoobic.com/ (YOOBIC )Over 300 companies in 80 countries trust https://yoobic.com/ (YOOBIC )to drive their retail performance at scale, get real-time visibility into multi-location business execution, digitized task management, and more.  https://www.kwi.com/ (KWI) is the industry's only true turnkey omnichannel platform for specialty retailers. With over 35 years of experience, let https://www.kwi.com/ (KWI) help you execute flawlessly with the features that matter most, including endless aisle, clienteling, mobile checkout, inventory management, e-commerce, and more.  Contact me directly https://www.retailpride.com/contact (here )to nominate a retail hero for this podcast, host a retail networking or book signing event in your city, or say hello.   Keep your retail pride strong, and I will see you on the road! Audio engineer https://www.deanalbak.com/ (Dean Albak ) Cover image shot by https://www.instagram.com/dukewinn.newyork/ (Duke Winn)

Released in late 2020, Ron Thurston wrote the Amazon #1 best-selling book RETAIL PRIDE as the indispensable guide for every retail employee, manager, and multi-store leader looking to accelerate their potential and grow their career. It's filled with straightforward, practical tips for developing your talents, connecting with customers, and building your leadership skills. ​ Based on more than three decades of Ron's leadership experience, you'll discover a sense of belonging in the words of someone who has been your champion for the industry and shares your journey. ​​Ron is an advocate for everything retail, and while on his journey across America, has now developed a passion for nature and taking care of our planet. Listen in to this engaging conversation with Ron and April to learn more about Ron's travels and what he believes we should all be focused on in the next decade of retail. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/april477/support

Andrew is solo this week and joined by fellow retail influencers April Sabral and Ron Thurston to talk about their current happenings and past experiences on the retail front line.

Ron Thurston is the host of the Retail in America Podcast. He spent many years working on the front lines of retail, and then he wrote his book, Retail Pride, to celebrate his career journey. On his book tour, he also meets front line retail workers around the country and documents his adventures on his podcast. On the show today, we talk about what it's like to work on the front lines of retail in 2022. Ron shares everything retail businesses need to know about supporting the workers on the front lines.    Topics discussed: About Ron and the Retail in America Podcast  Retail as a fulfilling and exciting career  Stories from the front lines of retail in America  Retail as an “accidental career” for a lot of people  How people find success in their retail careers  What retail companies can do to inspire pride and build employee loyalty  Proof that retail workers actually love their job  What front line retail workers need from the organization

S1E13 – Razor's Edge: The Season 1 Finale!Welcome to Season 1, Episode 13 of The Retail Razor Show – the season one finale!It's been an amazing opening season for the show, but now we have reached the Razor's Edge – the end of our first season! Ready to finish with a bang? We've got a special guest host – yes, that's right, guest host – Liza Amlani, principal and founder of Retail Strategy Group and The Merchant Life newsletter!Liza turns the tables on our regular hosts, Ricardo Belmar and Casey Golden, to hold a mid-year check in on their Top 10 Predictions for 2022 from Episode 4. Then, Liza walks our guests through highlights from throughout the season, remembering great moments with Andy Laudato, COO of The Vitamin Shoppe, Ron Thurston, author of Retail Pride and host of the Retail in America tour and podcast, and Gautham Vadakkepatt, director of the Center for Retail Transformation at George Mason University. Listen in to see if your favorite moments from Season 1 made it to the Razor's Edge!Have you heard the news! We're up to #20 on the Feedspot Top 60 Retail podcasts list, so please keep those 5-star reviews in Apple Podcasts coming! With your loyal help, we'll be moving our way up the Top 20 in no time! Leave us a review and we'll mention you in a future episode! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/Meet your hosts turned guests, helping you cut through the clutter in retail and retail tech:I'm Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, a Top 12 ecommerce influencer, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.And I'm Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. I've spent my career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business. Now I slay franken-stacks!The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorJoin our club on Clubhouse: http://bit.ly/RRazorClubListen to us on Callin: https://bit.ly/RRCallinSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS1E13 Razor's Edge: The Season 1 Finale![00:00:00] Introduction[00:00:00] Liza Amlani: Hello, retail, razor listeners. Welcome to the season one grand finale episode. As you can tell, I'm not one of your usual hosts. I'm Liza Amlani principal and co-founder of retail strategy group and the merchant life newsletter. And I am your guest host today where I'll be turning the tables on your usual host and interviewing them.[00:00:41] So let's bring them in Ricardo Belmar and Casey golden, Casey and Ricardo. Thank you so much for having me guest host today.[00:00:48] Ricardo Belmar: Hey, Liza, it's awesome to have you here.[00:00:50] Casey Golden: So amazing to have you off of Twitter for a moment, on the podcast.[00:00:55] Liza Amlani: Of course we're, we're changing. We're changing it[00:00:57] Ricardo Belmar: Of[00:00:57] Liza Amlani: little bit. so how does it feel being on the other side of the mic today?[00:01:02] Casey Golden: It's a little different, somehow it doesn't feel like being a guest on somebody else's podcast. So it's a little bit strange, [00:01:07] but, [00:01:08] this was one of our most popular topics. So[00:01:10] Ricardo Belmar: That's true. Yeah, that's true. I mean, I, I would kinda say the same thing. It's a little, a little weird, not being the one, asking the questions like we usually do on, on the show. But this will be fun. This will be something different. And you're totally right. It doesn't feel the same as being a guest on somebody else's podcast.[00:01:24] So this will be an interesting one this time around.[00:01:26] Liza Amlani: Well, I'm excited to get you guys in the hot seat. So let's dive in. First I'm gonna run through the top 10 predictions you guys made in episode four. And we'll consider this a mid-year check-in. And just because I wanna keep you guys on your toes cuz you know, that's how I roll. I'm gonna keep score on whose predictions are performing better.[00:01:44] Nothing like a little competition to mix things up.[00:01:47] Ricardo Belmar: Well, this could get ugly, then Casey's so super competitive. it's a good thing. We're all remote. And there's no risks of things being thrown around the room.[00:01:55] Casey Golden: Yeah. Well, I mean, maybe not your room I think it's pretty obvious who's gonna have the, have the better record, but there's a reason you know, Ricardo and I are on here. I mean, I think we had a few times where we're like, no, you have to change it. Cuz we can't have everything the same. so.[00:02:12] Liza Amlani: well, this is definitely gonna be better than I expected. I love it. Okay, so let's not get ahead of ourselves. And the second part, I'm also gonna ask you both what your favorite parts of the season were, and a few other surprise questions about the season. So let's get started with the season one finale.[00:02:31] Revisiting the Top 10 Predictions for 2022 [00:02:31] Liza Amlani: Okay. The first prediction was about retail media networks. Ricardo, let's start with you.[00:02:36] Ricardo Belmar: Well, I think this one's definitely a winner because let's see, since we did episode four, there must be at least, I don't know, like another 50 retail media networks that have been announced by retailers this year. I don't know ranging from what. Like ulta beauty hadn't been announced when we recorded that.[00:02:49] That's the one that everybody wanted to talk about. I mean, just about, everybody that's either a a big box retailer. I mean, a bunch of specialty ones, that maybe we wouldn't have expected. I think this one's just continuing to grow, so I'm thinking I'm good on that one.[00:03:02] Liza Amlani: Okay, Casey, let's talk about brick, expansions. I love this one, cuz you know, I'm a big fan of physical retail. [00:03:08] Casey Golden: yeah, and I kind of focus on digital these days. So it's kind of nice to pop into bricks every once in a while. It's where we all started, right? [00:03:16] there was barely an internet.[00:03:18] not saying that anybody's old here, but you know, there wasn't very many commerce stories in the beginning, so the passion started on the floor. It's been interesting with Amazon's new, they're still kind of expanding on these, these in stores, reimagining the shopping and buying experience. I've actually seen a lot more traction in that, you know, with all of these tech enabled spaces and a lot more experimenting.[00:03:45] So, I mean, I think we kind of nailed that this is really going to be a tech enabled opportunity for a lot of bricks and changing the traditional big box. For more entertaining showrooms kind of tagged Glossier as the winner. There's been a lot of changes over there too. So there's a lot of opportunity here for somebody, for a whole group of people to really win on bricks.[00:04:07] Liza Amlani: Definitely. I also just placed a Glossier order yesterday.[00:04:11] Social commerce and live streaming, Ricardo., [00:04:14] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, this is S definitely one of my favorite topics. Still may, maybe second, only the retail media networks. I think it's still growing, right? I guess one of the big things in the prediction I talked about was this idea that retailers would start relying more on their store associates as the live streamers, as the way of really promoting the whole idea of, of live shopping that way. And I think overall, this one's still building momentum and, and gaining steam. all the social media networks are certainly still putting out more features what Twitter added a new shopping capabilities, which maybe we wouldn't have expected Twitter to do.[00:04:46] In episode 12, we even talked about Pinterest and, and their new capabilities. So I think there's a lot happening there. And if anything, maybe hasn't come true yet, but I'm gonna still hold out hope here for later in the year is when we start seeing more frontline store associates doing the live streams, and maybe that's picking up steam, I think in more of a, a one to one kind of shopping experience versus a one to many. But I still think that we're gonna see that. I just think it's a natural extension and we might see it first coming from smaller retailers. I, I think because it's easier for them to be more nimble with that and get somebody recording and going live whereas big retailers are just naturally have this motion where they're gonna want to go big and, have big production values and bring in lots of equipment.[00:05:25] And that's gonna slow them down a bit. But I think we'll still see it happen.[00:05:28] Liza Amlani: Yeah, I think[00:05:29] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, I. But I put a lot of emphasis on TikTok commerce, because I've been watching that [00:05:35] beta program since[00:05:36] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah.[00:05:37] Casey Golden: Asia and then pulling out of the us and Europe last week, that announcement I think it's, gonna probably be better for smaller brands than the big ones, because TikTok would've been that commerce channel.[00:05:50] So who's to know. [00:05:52] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think there's still plenty of startups coming up too, that I, I see focusing on, on live streaming. So if I was gonna add something, it would be how things turn out between the big social media platforms versus these dedicated livestream platforms that are mostly driven by startups and how retailers are gonna adopt one versus the other.[00:06:09] And, and maybe we'll seem do both because it just kind of makes sense to have one off your own website and not totally rely on, you know, a Facebook channel.[00:06:16] Liza Amlani: Oh, for sure. When we were at the retail innovation show, there were, I think core site had partnered with a live streaming platform, which was super interesting, but I feel like they weren't retailers. So it'd be interesting to see when retailers actually merge with live streamers and partner together to, to have the best CU customer experience[00:06:35] Casey personal shopping. I love this one.[00:06:38] Casey Golden: I'm obviously I'm biased. [00:06:40] So, brownie points here, customer expectations. I mean, I thought that they were high during the pandemic. [00:06:47] They're almost unachievable at the moment. Shoppers are no longer content with that simple transactional purchase outside of like commodity goods. And we, we saw a lot of innovation with the associate led shopping and it went big.[00:07:03] but I think that there's like a lot of rebuilds when it comes down to the tech on actually operationalizing. And really bringing that in-store experience online and working with customers remotely. We've seen a lot of team, a lot of brands building out specific dedicated frontline staff teams, but putting them online and building virtual teams to really have, you know Trusted product expert or that sales associate being able to, to help them shop and, and build that relationship.[00:07:33] I'm gonna still betting in that we're gonna see a lot more of it. [00:07:36] Liza Amlani: I think [00:07:36] so, too. [00:07:37] Casey Golden: with like, yeah, I mean, we, have to alleviate all of the mundane tasks that these sales associates have to deal with in order to manage these customers. And make sure that they don't lose their jobs. The sheer volume of online traffic and then trying to provide a personal shopping experience. I think everybody said that it was, this personal shopping shop with the stylist's going into client telling, and that's gonna be new platforms. It's working so. I think it's, it's really exciting to see the brands put this talent at the forefront of the narrative and start giving them software.[00:08:15] Liza Amlani: I love that you brought up client telling because I started on the shop floor and I definitely had a book that I used to, you know, bring to, to Harrods. That's where I worked in one of my, one of my store roles. And that book went everywhere with me. And that was my client telling software was manual pen and paper and technology would've definitely changed the game.[00:08:37] Ricardo, let's talk about the shopper experience.[00:08:40] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think, you know, it technology and in-store experience. I mean, they're continuing down that March to converge. . And bring in more and more things into the store. We've got this year more examples of computer, vision and AI. You know, just look at Amazon's new style store and what they're doing there.[00:08:55] Some people like it, some not so much, but I think the, the point is we're seeing more and more experiments and more and more attempts to try things out. I think I mentioned when we first talked about this, we talked a little more about where we're AR and VR platform is gonna play in store.[00:09:09] I don't think we've seen as much with that. Although, I mean, I think there's more AR things happening. I'm I'm. More and more things happening around trying to improve fit in apparel. . It's always a challenge there. But to me, this is all about finding more and more technology in the store, but not in the way of the shopping experience, which makes it so much of a better experience and that we have people wanting to do more shopping in store.[00:09:32] Right now we've gotten past this idea that online was just gonna totally shut down physical experiences. And, and we're seeing that we're back to back to the norm there. For the most part, I think we'll just see more and more cashierless checkout, more shelf scanning types of. Technologies, whether it's robots or IOT sensors, we're gonna see more and more scan and go.[00:09:51] So I think this one's moving along, maybe not as fast as I, I would've expected at the beginning of the year when we talked about it. But that to me has more to do with retail is wanting to be cautious about some of these investments versus desire to do them at all. So I think it's all still happening.[00:10:05] Liza Amlani: Casey by now pay later.[00:10:07] Casey Golden: Oh, it gets hotter, then the bubble bursts. I'm a big believer and don't spend more than you have, but you know, Regulators are there they're coming. I read all my regulators. All I hear is Warren G [00:10:20] Liza Amlani: I love it. Now I have Warren G in my head. Good song.[00:10:24] Casey Golden: I know, right. We should all [00:10:25] have [00:10:26] Liza Amlani: I know[00:10:27] Casey Golden: God, good times. Good times. I think one day we'll look back at, buy now, pay later and say good times. It's, it's been a, they've been getting a lot of traction making, purchases, lack consumer protections and and they can really make hassle free returns 30% APR with just crazy, crazy APR rates.[00:10:50] There's easier ways to, block out these payments and they've been productive for all the brands. I mean, I don't know if you can even find a website that doesn't offer by now pay later. But I also think it's a very American thing. We are like, we invented the credit card, right? So whether or not it's consumer. So whether or not it's good for the consumer, it's been really good for businesses. But I think that there's gonna be a little bit more regulation and consumer protections on it to really make sure that, when you make a purchase for, $300, it's not gonna cost you three grand. cuz there's been some. Some, some more predatory behavior in this space, but Klarna has really stepped up their game and providing really interesting product discovery in their app rewards programs. And, you know, they recently just bought hero which was a personal shopping app. So they're offering, you know, just looking at the customer journey from start to finish and, you know, trying to set the.[00:11:50] Up to be more than just a payment system or at least feel like it. Right. So I think the competition's gonna get tougher and they're gonna have to be more interesting to branch out from the regulation, I think, [00:12:04] Ricardo Belmar: acquired or merge or combining something's gonna happen.[00:12:07] I don't think it's gonna keep on this growth path. [00:12:10] Casey Golden: ricardo, I'm really interested on your, thoughts on that too. [00:12:13] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, I mean you on, on buy now pay later. You pretty much had me at regulators.[00:12:19] Casey Golden: and I've used it once as an experiment. It's just like, well,[00:12:22] Ricardo Belmar: yeah. yeah. I, I, I mean, I, I think the very first thing we said back in, in that episode, on that one, right? The, the, it gets hotter and then the bubble burst, I think we're, we're just about, at that point, in my opinion, and there was more and more folks looking. Just what you said, right? The predatory terms, the insane APRs, and it's on a path to have an impact, right.[00:12:46] To put people into more and more depth when they don't need to be. So I, I don't know. I, I just, I think it's interesting that we see. The BPL companies trying to add more services to their offering that's not part of the core idea right. Of buy now pay later so that their business isn't totally dependent on it.[00:13:03] And I dunno, in some ways, this is one of these things where it was a huge bubble, but at the end of the day, I mean, How hard is it to replicate by now pay later functionality for a payments company. So where's the differentiator for all these guys to stay in business? I think , the bubble , has to burst.[00:13:17] Liza Amlani: And when we think about Ricardo, this is one for you, the analytics. AI and machine learning and sustainability and traceability and merchandising returns and predictive analytics, all this stuff that I love to talk about from a merchant perspective. Let's talk about your prediction around this.[00:13:33] Ricardo Belmar: . So in, in that one I saw that we're just gonna, so, so much more automation. A lot of this technology being used to remove all the mundane and tedious tasks that store employees have to deal with. And, and there are so many new tools coming out with that. I I've been working with a number of different companies now who have new technologies, just for that to make the life easier for those frontline teams.[00:13:55] And then just looking at returns, returns is becoming an even bigger problem, I think now than it was at the beginning of the year. And I see more technology being thrown at how to solve returns, not in terms of what do you do when somebody wants to return something, but what can you do preventively to make it so that people don't need to buy three versions of the same thing to see which one's gonna be the right one and return the other two. Now there's ways that AI machine learning can help with that analysis. And I think we're seeing solutions that do that. I've seen more retailers implement those and they're seeing tangible changes, where we're seeing reductions of returns in double digit percentages, which is, is obviously going to be meaningful to their sales numbers. You know, think sustainability has just continued down a march , I think more and more news coming out where people start to question some brands as to, are they really engaging in those sustainability practices they've been talking about? Or is there, are they doing one thing in with their right hand, but the left hand's doing something else.[00:14:50] It kind of works against that sustainability. So to me that says that people are paying more attention to sustainability is starting to matter more which I see as a positive and, and again, I think this is one where , without technology, none of the brands are gonna be able to solve this in a, in a meaningful enough way that's gonna accomplish, the dual purpose goal, which is to demonstrate to their customers that they are engaging in sustainable practices, but at the same time, not do it in a manner that's gonna make their cost skyrocket and make them unprofitable.[00:15:17] So I think that that's still happening. So I think that's on a good, good March. Predictive analytics. I mean, I, I'm always still surprised when you see retailers show you that, oh, they're still doing their forecasting on a spreadsheet in Excel versus using something more, you know, more appropriately let's say size for, for their business that allows them to, to leverage AI in a better way.[00:15:36] And I mean, yes, during the pandemic, all these systems tended to, to create more problems and solutions because nobody let's face it, could have the right model that was gonna predict what was gonna be a shortage and, and factor in the supply chain challenges and all that. But now, now those models are starting to get worked in and now[00:15:53] some of the companies I've been working with are finding that the real reason those solutions led them down the wrong path is because the people that were reading the results were taking different actions than they probably should have been. So it was less the technology as it was the human intervention, that didn't wanna accept what the technology was saying.[00:16:08] Because they felt that, you know, that was gonna be a different result. So I, I think that's all working itself out. In some ways I think this is one of the , most exciting technology areas in retail because it has the potential to have so much change, even if it's more behind the scenes and most consumers don't see this, it's not obvious to you if you walk into a retailer store.[00:16:26] But there's so much of this behind the scenes, it has to happen to make the business work. I, just think it's nowhere to go, but up.[00:16:32] Casey Golden: Yeah, I'm gonna just add a point on there just to kind of leave our listeners with something to think about. We've been measuring the wholesale business for like a hundred years. This is really the very beginning of taking direct to consumer analytics. As we grow these business models out on selling direct to the consumer, there is so much data, so more data than we've ever had.[00:16:58] And so we're gonna be able to get so an amount of knowledge from this over the next, like three years. That we've never seen or understood about our brand or sales. And I think it's, I, I agree, Ricardo, it's super exciting. I mean, you can just geek out on this[00:17:16] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, oh yeah. There's we're gonna, we're already keeping those data scientists employed for a long time.[00:17:23] Liza Amlani: I, I definitely geek out. Yes. I definitely geek out on all that. You know, coming from that merchants and product creation space, the challenge I find is that, we have all this data and we always have so had so much data from loyalty programs and even client telling, but are we really using it to drive? You know, product decisions, assortment decisions. So it will be very interesting to see, you know, in the next three years, I think we should come back to this one in three years and let's see where we are. Let's talk [00:17:52] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think, I [00:17:52] Casey Golden: We got a [00:17:53] Ricardo Belmar: safely put this one on every top 10 list.[00:17:55] Liza Amlani: Oh yeah. [00:17:57] Casey Golden: Yeah, no, we've [00:17:59] Liza Amlani: exactly. Well, let's, let's talk about rapid [00:18:02] delivery. [00:18:03] Casey Golden: Yeah, rapid delivery. [00:18:05] Goodness gracious. Does access delivery from any company you're Canada. So[00:18:14] Liza Amlani: I know I do. I know. Come on. No, no, no, no, no. Getting here. Maybe not two hours, but definitely we're getting[00:18:26] Casey Golden: I feel yeah, I mean, Rapid delivery gets a rapid shakeout. I mean, too many popped up during the pandemic. It was an incredible opportunity to force, like for force adoption, for consumers to shop buying things online that they, they never even thought was possible. The amount of grocery online. I mean, without the pandemic, would you ever think like rural areas are getting.[00:18:51] We're getting, you know, two to same day delivery. But we asked in the beginning of the year, is this really sustainable? And I think the, the market has decided that it's not cost effective. And we'll continue to see a lot of acquisitions and consolidation M and a potential here with like micro fulfillment and last mile delivery.[00:19:10] Very hot space. A major's gonna win. , but there's been a lot of adjustments here, especially this year with even Uber eats. They're not, incredible how long it takes. Amazon canceled their two hour delivery and metropolitan areas. And a lot of them grocery delivery services have ceased to exist in a lot of you know, non-chain grocery stores that was, that were leveraging it.[00:19:32] I think, we're gonna have to figure out how you can afford to have[00:19:35] last mile. I'm very curious on how consumers feel about having this amazing service and then it going away and how that affects brand loyalty. So I think there's still a lot to watch here. There's a big opportunity. But it's gonna take a lot of money.[00:19:48] Liza Amlani: Yeah. And it's almost like we haven't really seen who pays for this. Who's P and L is this really impacting[00:19:56] right. [00:19:56] Ricardo Belmar: I don't know that anybody has the model down yet, to make money off of it because it's kind of this thing where, you know, the. The faster you want to deliver it automatically means the closer you have to stage it to the customer to have a chance, of getting it there. I mean like two hours, we had like the quick commerce brands in 15 minute delivery in cities.[00:20:14] I mean, if you're gonna do that, then you have to have so many different staging locations and fulfillment centers and you've gotta have the best predictive analytics to know exactly what are the items everybody's likely to order that they want in 15 minutes. And, and then you end up. All the, the providers say, well, we hope to make this work with larger basket sizes, but okay.[00:20:33] You don't really want a big order because then if you're trying to deliver it in 15 minutes, it takes you too many minutes to pick and pack the order to get what I wanted to get it to someone. . If it's more than a handful of items. So that means, okay, if you can't get your volume based on basket size, you've gotta have it on number of orders.[00:20:48] Okay. But then you mean more labor, right? Or, or more automation. And either one of those has a cost implication. So you still need to. Work that out. So I don't know. It just doesn't seem like it's sustainable. And then at the end of the day, I think Casey, you asked the right question. What do consumers really need to have delivered in less than two hours?[00:21:05] Casey Golden: my[00:21:06] Ricardo Belmar: often enough to make a business out of it.[00:21:09] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm telling I'm, I'm probably oversharing here, but like the amount of times I ordered a chocolate donut from dunk and dunking donuts around like 11 to 1:00 AM in the morning from Uber eats during the pandemic is ridiculous. but it cost me literally nothing. Now, if I wanted to order that same donut for just to hit a craving at like midnight. It would cost me like $32. Like there are so many fees attached to that now that I'm like, yeah, I don't need,[00:21:39] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. Do you really need it delivered right now? Is it really worth it?[00:21:43] Casey Golden: yeah. So, I mean, it's those impulses versus primary way of going grocery shopping. So I think that there's, the volume has, has definitely adjusted the purpose of what people are buying the basket size. And then people are out and about, and they, you it's much easier to swing by the grocery store on your way home. [00:22:01] Liza Amlani: Exactly. [00:22:02] Casey Golden: that just takes your volume away from your pricing.[00:22:04] Liza Amlani: Yeah. And speaking of pricing and volume , I'm not sure if this is a segue, but Ricardo we're, we're almost done. We're at number nine, low code revolution. Tell us more.[00:22:15] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. So I, I kind of hang my hat on this one as , the hidden secret that let's retailers figure out how to do things that used to take them six months and do it in six weeks because you can't wait for an army of your in-house developers to come up with a brand new system for you for any task, like you used to pre pandemic. Now you need things done right away and you wanna build into the schedule, how often you're gonna iterate on that solution to make it better and better. And if there's any technology that makes that doable, it it's everything around low code technologies where you're visually building applications, creating reports and dashboards to keep everybody informed.[00:22:49] If I just go by, what I hear from my Microsoft colleagues who are doing these deployments with customers, it's like every single opportunity they have involves some kind of low code technology aspect. And most of the partners that I work with all have some sort of an implementation in their solution that lets a retailer customize something via a visual kind of development platform.[00:23:10] So I'm beginning to feel like there isn't any technology that's gonna be put in front of a retailer that doesn't have a low-code design component to it just to make life easier for the retailer and to gain adoption.[00:23:19] Liza Amlani: Casey number 10. This is our last one. Everyone web three metaverse crypto NFTs. I don't think you know anything about this space, right? Casey. You actually teach me a lot. I'll [00:23:31] Casey Golden: Does anybody like really does anybody? I mean, I think I I've, every conversation I've ever been on is like, well, I'm not an expert. I'm like, come on. None of us are like, we're all learning together. Prepare for some whiplash. It's getting interesting and web three's here to stay. It's not, it's not just one thing.[00:23:47] We've got an incredibly passionate creator community and consumers are, curious, and we're getting a pretty rapid adoption rate. And, and adding a lot of payment opportunities for commerce and making this bridge. Commerce is going to drive this space to turn it into something that's here to last the biggest challenges are gonna be around data interoperability.[00:24:14] Retail is famous for silos and web three developers are, are staying aligned with that methodology. So hopefully hopefully we can all break that down. And a lot of companies, thousands of companies have come together to create standards for web three From file sizes to ethics. So I think that that's really exciting.[00:24:34] I've never seen companies come together quite like this. So fast in a market to say, we want this to stay. We need to work together. Let's not compete. So that's pretty interesting and brands are experimenting. Brands that typically do not experiment, period, are experimenting and they are supporting very large global initiatives to accept crypto at their stores, to launch NFTs and collaborate with content creators, or artists that are not in house, which is another really great, opportunity. That's just rare. So I wanna see a lot more brands build community and really see what they can turn this space into. It's not going anywhere. I can say that. It's definitely not going anywhere. I think it could make all of our predictions in some way. There's probably some piece that could be innovated by using some piece of web three and make our lives a little bit easier and a little bit more, enjoyable, you know, from the consumer to the brand, there's an opportunity here. But we're, the brands are gonna have to experiment to figure out what piece is gonna be the way that they roll it out. So I'm excited about this space. Take it slow.[00:25:47] Liza Amlani: I'm excited too. I was actually in the the Soho Faragamo store a couple weeks ago, and I saw the the NFT station, I guess. And as a consumer, I was definitely fascinated. So I'm excited to, to see. More of what happens in that space. [00:26:05] well, I'm sure that everyone listening is wondering how the score turned out.[00:26:08] So now as a, an impartial judge and to friends, to you both, you know, I will say that I would say you guys are both pretty spot on. Do you think that there's there's anything that you should have predicted that, should have been on this list? I think that's a, that's an interesting question to ask you both.[00:26:26] Ricardo Belmar: that's a tough one. And if I were to pick anything, I would say the one thing we didn't, we came close to it, right in Casey's brick and mortar expansion. I don't know that we really talked about whether it was gonna be sort of this pendulum swing, between online commerce growth versus physical stores and just how much people were gonna rush back to stores this year and, and want to enjoy that physical shopping experience. And, and what that implication was towards, the trends the last two years where our e-commerce was just gonna take over everything. Which isn't to say that it's still, you know, moving ahead, it's not like it's gonna contract, it's gonna keep growing just that the pace is back to normal.[00:26:58] So maybe that's one that we didn't talk about that we, we could have gone a step further maybe in, in that one prediction, but that's the one that comes to my mind. [00:27:05] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, coming out, we spoke about it maybe a couple times throughout this entire season, knowing that when that pendulum swings, it's gonna come with a recession. And we didn't really dive in. I think we could have used an entire episode just to talk about. The timing, the impacts of all of this with some type of recession coming into play, because it was obvious the timing wasn't.[00:27:28] And so it aligning up our holiday season or the kickoff of the new year. You know, there's a lot of companies are expecting to hit their numbers this year because of holiday. So I think we could have definitely dived into a little bit more of the consumer behavior coming out of the [00:27:45] pandemic[00:27:45] Ricardo Belmar: yeah. [00:27:46] Casey Golden: say which one of these things is gonna be what a retailer is gonna need to make it through that recession [00:27:51] Ricardo Belmar: yeah, and closely relating to that, we didn't predict the, wonky supply chain problems that were been continuous right throughout this year still. Right. I don't think we would've back at the, be when we recorded that episode, would've predicted that oh yeah.[00:28:04] Target and Walmart , are not gonna figure out how to get their inventory turned straightened out and they're gonna end up stuck with too much product. Right. We would never [00:28:10] Casey Golden: is what we do, right? Like, why are we still having, why are we still having issues?[00:28:14] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, exactly. [00:28:15] Casey Golden: yeah, I agree.[00:28:16] Season 1 Highlights[00:28:16] Liza Amlani: Well, you know, I'll say that it's definitely a merchandising strategy issue, but you know, nobody asked me let's, let's talk about some highlights from season one. So Ricardo, , which was your favorite clubhouse discussion? I love these by the[00:28:31] Ricardo Belmar: Ah, oh yeah. Oh yeah. We, we really enjoy these too. I, I have to say, I think my favorite one was the one we did with Andy Laudato COO of the vitamin shop from his book, fostering innovation and, and how to build that culture of innovation in your IT shop. I think that one was my favorite one, just because it was such a wide variety of topics that we cover.[00:28:50] I mean, we asked Andy about his project management style. We talked about, how that impacts the corporate culture. There was some pretty clever tidbits in there that he talked about in terms of, how to consider how you hire people to align to that culture of innovation.[00:29:05] He talked about his hierarchy of IT needs and how you can get to earn the privilege to innovate, which I think was really clever. And then, one of my favorite, if I'm gonna pick catch phrases to come out of the season, that one had one of my favorites, which was be a diode that Andy had.[00:29:19] If you remember that one where he said, as the team manager, you're a diode, you take all the negative things that come to the team, those stop with you as the team leader. And you don't pass those on, but when you get all the good comments, you don't keep those, you pass those on to your team so they can all benefit from the, from the praise.[00:29:34] That one should, there should be a t-shirt for that one.[00:29:35] Liza Amlani: I love it [00:29:36] Casey Golden: Yeah. I actually took a lot of quotes from Andy. I love his perspective of project management and how to get tech in and actually deployed rather than running so many projects simultaneously. Almost nothing gets done in three years. I really haven't quoted anybody as much as I've quoted Andy from these podcasts, he is a gem. So everybody rewind, go back to that episode and [00:30:02] take a listen. It was really good.[00:30:06] Liza Amlani: I love that episode too. Casey, I have a question for you. Who was your most memorable guest speaker and who surprised you the most? It's a double whammy question.[00:30:16] Casey Golden: Ron Thurston and it's for both of them. There's probably no coincidence. He's been, he's been in. More than more, no, less than three, three of our episodes. We kicked off with Ron. And, and once you hear Ron advocate for the frontline store teams, you just can't help, but gain a better understanding of the people working in those roles and also feel motivated to wanna improve the work environment for , these associates.[00:30:42] I knew of him. I had met him on zoom. But that conversation, that podcast, I just completely fell in love with him. And I had no idea he had so much passion for these people until we started talking and like, we didn't stop talking. It was season one, episode one season one, episode two. It was just continued to bring in Ron that, he has this platform, like his voice needed to be out there and share his stories.[00:31:10] He's an amazing human, so definitely made it to my most memorable[00:31:16] Liza Amlani: I love Ron too. I love watching where he's gonna be next on his Airstream tour. That is it's super cool. And now I want an Airstream. Obviously. I know that. Yes, we all want it. . [00:31:26] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly.[00:31:27] Casey Golden: I hope it turns into documentary.[00:31:31] Liza Amlani: I love it. What about you, Ricardo? , which guest would you say? Did you learn the most from.[00:31:35] Ricardo Belmar: So, I have sort of an interesting way to think of, of that one. So as far as where I learned the most from , I think it was on the episode that we call the sea of academia. We actually had a couple guests there and, and big big shocker. Ron was one of those guests on that episode, too.[00:31:49] But we also had Gotham Vadakkepatt. Who's the, director of the center for retail transformation at George Mason university. And I, I think that was the one where I learned the most from, because it had a very different view that. I think all of us that talk about retail all the time, we don't often talk about the educational aspect of it and how that plays a role in creating the next generation of retail leaders.[00:32:09] And I think in that episode, I learned a lot about different perspectives on how to look at that. You know, the thing that sticks in my mind and that one is when Gotham said at the beginning of one of his classes in the semester, he asked his students, how many of you work in retail right now?[00:32:22] It was something like a big percentage of his class raised their hand and said, yeah, they work in retail and then he asked them, well, how many of you think you want to pursue a career in retail and all the hands went down.[00:32:31] None of them wanted to. But then by the end of his class, when he brought in a series of guest speakers to talk about different career journeys in retail, in different areas that you can work in in the industry. When he asked the question again at the end, at least half those hands came back up.[00:32:44] People finally realized, oh, there really is something interesting. It's not just what they thought was a harsh experience, I guess, working in those stores. And, and to me, it kind of ties together what Casey was just saying about the episodes we did with Ron. And advocating for those frontline store teams and this kind of gives a different spin to it.[00:33:01] So I, I came away learning a lot from that one and how there's an opportunity to influence, those future generation of retail leaders through those educational programs and through those university programs that they're going through to get them to come up with a, different new perspective on the industry, which I think oftentimes people in retail get stuck in their ways. And they're just used to doing things a certain way and you need that , new, new set of ideas to, to change things up.[00:33:26] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, one in six people on the planet, work in retail in some capacity. And for there not to be a way for you to go to school or go to college or university or specialize. In retail or commerce. I mean, that's kind of mind blowing the amount of education that, and curriculums that are popping up now at major universities to focus on digital transformation and retail , is so hopeful.[00:33:52] I feel that this is actually going to be. I, I feel like it's really about being respected as a career and getting those good salaries, being able to attract top tier talent. We have big problems to solve, and it's nice to see the universities turn this into an actual specialty.[00:34:11] Liza Amlani: I totally agree. And it's interesting cuz I also, I went to fashion school and got my degree in fashion. And it's so interesting to see how the programs have evolved to include, you know, things like data scientists or material scientists or textile innovation. So I love that episode two. Now tell us, do you have any special plans for season two?[00:34:31] What can we look forward to?[00:34:33] Ricardo Belmar: We'll have some surprises. We've been talking to some folks about a couple of unique segments we may try and do in season two. I'll try not to give away too much, but there'll be some people who might be familiar to listeners from season one who may come back and some who, who will be new to come and gives kinda like a, I'll call it a data angle to our conversations where we'll have one of these guests come in on a segment and it'll be related to the topic.[00:34:56] They might have an interesting data point or a research statistic that has come up and we'll spend a couple minutes talking about how that has an impact on the topic that week. So I think that that'll kind of mix things up a bit. It's almost kind, if you think of an ask me anything type of scenario, except it'll focus around a specific data theme.[00:35:15] So that should be a, a clever one and we'll have a new theme. You know, we, some folks maybe didn't realize we had a theme to the episodes that we set for season one. There was a structure to it. We were focusing in on digital transformation and innovation and, and people.[00:35:30] Which I think was the unique spin that we brought to those other two areas. So we'll have a new theme which we're not gonna spoil for season two, but we'll we'll definitely have a trailer coming out soon to give everybody an idea of what we're thinking for season two and what to expect.[00:35:43] Liza Amlani: Casey, any last thoughts? [00:35:45] Casey Golden: Yeah, our training wheels are off. You know, this started as a, I miss talking to everybody and we all kind of jumped in a room in clubhouse when it was super cool. I don't think anybody's logged into clubhouse for several months. So pretty exciting that, you know, this is season two's gonna be fresh you know, fully planned on purpose in real time, and it's gonna be interesting to see how we started to really like where we are now. And bringing some incredible guests that didn't have a clubhouse invitation and[00:36:21] Liza Amlani: I know[00:36:22] Ricardo Belmar: there is that [00:36:23] Yeah. Yeah. [00:36:24] Liza Amlani: they were, they were [00:36:25] hard to come. [00:36:26] Casey Golden: They were hard to [00:36:27] Ricardo Belmar: yeah, For a while, right? yeah. [00:36:28] yeah. [00:36:29] Casey Golden: we had some really great guests that [00:36:31] Ricardo Belmar: yeah.[00:36:31] Casey Golden: two.[00:36:37] Ricardo Belmar: yeah, right. It took a while for them. Yeah.[00:36:41] Liza Amlani: Yeah.[00:36:42] Ricardo Belmar: So listeners can expect more of those like the retail transformers series that we kicked off with April Sabral we'll do more of those in season two with some unique guests.[00:36:50] Liza Amlani: That's awesome. Well, thank you both for having [00:36:53] Casey Golden: And flip the script on you. [00:36:56] Liza Amlani: oh yeah, you should. [00:36:57] Casey Golden: in.[00:36:58] Liza Amlani: I'd love that, but thank you so much for having me and allowing me to put, put you guys in the hot seat, cuz you know, I love that. And I can't wait to do this again [00:37:08] I will. I will talk about all things merchandising and the retail silos. We need to break those down.[00:37:15] Casey Golden: they're gonna crash.[00:37:20] Ricardo Belmar: with us, Liza. Oh yeah. [00:37:21] Casey Golden: it will happen.[00:37:22] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That's right. [00:37:23] so, Casey, I think that means we're ready to wrap this one[00:37:26] Casey Golden: It's a full wrap goodbye to season one[00:37:29] Ricardo Belmar: and season two awaits. [00:37:30] Show Close[00:37:30] Casey Golden: if you enjoy our show, please consider giving us that special five star rating and review on apple podcasts. Smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player so you don't miss a minute. Want to know more about what we talked about today? Take a look at the show notes for handy links and more deets.[00:37:49] I'm your cohost Casey Golden.[00:37:51] Ricardo Belmar: And if you'd like to learn more about us, follow us on Twitter at casey c golden and ricardo underscore belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure and follow the show on LinkedIn and on Twitter at retail razor, and on our YouTube channel for videos of each episode and some bonus content. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.[00:38:06] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us. [00:38:07] Ricardo Belmar: And remember there's never been a better time to be in retail. If you cut through the clutter.[00:38:14] Until next time, this is the retail razor show. 

A retail focused guide to celebrating working in a retail store, we give an honest review of the ONLY leadership and skill based book written specifically for RETAILERS. In tune with the mission of Stand Up Retail, this book (and its author) aim to take a positive approach to the work, potential and careers (accidental or otherwise) that happen within one of the most important and influential industry for the global economy. We review the positives, the shortcomings and share our takeaways and most impactful moments. _____________________________ Chapter List: 0:00 Intro 3:05 Initial Thoughts 3:40 About the Author 4:49 Who its For and Not For 6:08 The Breakdown 17:40 Recap 18:00 Overall Impression and Use Cases 21:55 CONTEST INFO! 22:05 Wrap Up 22:57 What we Offer _______________________________ References: (affiliate links for product referenced in this video) Link to Book: https://amzn.to/3OTajmL Link for Planner: https://amzn.to/3NOiH5M Music in this episode: Epidemic Sounds, Damma Beatz, "Rollin On"

The story behind "Drop the Coconut" is a story about letting go. In this podcast, I chat with My husband, Ron Thurston, and other guests about the moment you let go. About the moment, you bet on yourself that you are capable, adaptable, and deserve the change. I invite you to jump on our coconut wagon and drop some coconuts with us... our journey starts in 3..2...1

In the second episode of "Drop the coconut", I chat with my husband, Ron Thurston, about human connection. I am so excited for this second episode, as we share a little bit of personal letting go moments or what I call "Drop the Coconut" moments. I hope that through these conversations, you might find a few of them in your possession and, who knows, maybe drop one or two along the way with us. If it sparks something within you, I would love to hear from you - you can find me on Instagram: @dropthecoconut, on LinkedIn, and Facebook. I hope you enjoy it, and thank you for jumping on our coconut wagon!

In this first episode, I am discussing with my husband Ron Thurston, the events that led to us leaving our big careers behind and leaving NYC to travel in an Airstream across the US. It is a journey of self-discovery and self-empowerment. I hope this conversation will inspire you to find the coconuts you may be holding and maybe drop one or two along the way.

In this episode, Kim talks with Ron Thurston – author of the book “Retail Pride” and host of the podcast “Retail in America” and John Gregory, Global Head of Industry for Retail at Spotify to talk about what it means to be a front-line worker in retail today and how that cohort can be tapped for deeper and more meaningful organizational innovation.   Connect with John Gregory, Global Retail Category Development Officer at Spotify Connect with Ron Thurston, Amazon #1 Best Selling Author of RETAIL PRIDE, host of the RETAIL IN AMERICA podcast, 2021/2022 RETHINK Retail 100 Most Influential People Connect with our hosts Jim Hertzfeld, Principal and Chief Strategist for Perficient, and Kim Williams-Czopek, Director of Digital Strategy at Perficient.

Our special guest this week is Ron Thurston, fellow Rethink Retail top influencer, best-selling author of Retail Pride: The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career, and deeply experienced retail executive, having done stings at Intermix, YSL, Bonobos, Tory Burch, Apple and more.Ron joins us from his Airsteam just a couple of months into his "Retail In America" tour, which will literally take him from sea to shining sea. He's on a journey to discover everyday retail heroes and we find him just outside of Memphis eager to talk about all that he is learning. It's a wide-ranging discussion of what it's really like on the ground, away from the often narrow views from the fashion hubs of New York and LA. But just to keep it a wee bit glam, we also learn about Ron's recent chat with none other than Sarah Jessica Parker.But first we we dive into the big retail news of the week, which starts of with how recent earnings highlight the continuing bifurcation of retail that is being exacerbated by inflation and rebalancing to pre-COVID spending patterns. We also discuss, JP Morgan's Jamie Dimon's revised weather forecast, get additional proof that everything Eddie Lampert touches dies. We then conclude with Missguided's "named to fail" strategy and former Neiman Marcus CEO Karen Katz's move to become the new CEO of Intermix.  About RonRon Thurston is a highly accomplished retail leadership Executive, Board Advisor, and Amazon Bestselling Author with extensive experience leading retail operations for America's most prominent brands. He is adept at turning around underperforming businesses, developing and implementing innovative growth strategies, architecting improved training programs, building high-performing and dedicated teams, launching new brands, expanding brands into new markets, and ensuring customer growth and satisfaction. In 2021 and 2022, Ron was named one of the top 100 Retail Influencers globally, is a board member of GOODWILL NY/NJ, and currently sits on the advisory boards of several emerging retail technology brands, including Reflex Careers, Job Pixel, and IMMERSS. In 2022 Ron is launching his audio and video platforms for a year-long tour called “Retail In America,” live from an Airstream trailer to discover the real retail heroes all across the country. About UsSteve Dennis is an advisor, keynote speaker and author on strategic growth and business innovation. You can learn more about Steve on his       website.    The expanded and revised edition of his bestselling book  Remarkable Retail: How To Win & Keep Customers in the Age of Disruption is now available at  Amazon or just about anywhere else books are sold. Steve regularly shares his insights in his role as a      Forbes senior contributor and on       Twitter and       LinkedIn. You can also check out his speaker "sizzle" reel      here.Michael LeBlanc  is the Founder & President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc and a Senior Advisor to Retail Council of Canada as part of his advisory and consulting practice.   He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience, and has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career.  Michael is the producer and host of a network of leading podcasts including Canada's top retail industry podcast,       The Voice of Retail, plus  Global E-Commerce Tech Talks  ,      The Food Professor  with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois and now in its second season, Conversations with CommerceNext!  You can learn more about Michael   here  or on     LinkedIn. Be sure and check out Michael's latest venture for fun and influencer riches - Last Request Barbecue,  his YouTube BBQ cooking channel!

The flashy thing to talk about in business articles is ecommerce, tech, and the latest and greatest startup. But the tride and true retailers who make up a large majority of the commerce conducted in the United States don't fit that description. Classic retail businesses are still alive and well- and new ones are still opeing everyday. Ron Thurston talks about this amongst other things in his trip across the US, and on this podcast. Ron's LinkedIn Retail Pride Book Here's how to find me: Instagram: TikTok: Facebook: Website

S1E9 – Retail Transformers – April Sabral Welcome to Season 1, Episode 9 of The Retail Razor Show! With this episode we introduce a new series– Retail Transformers! Who are the people in retail changing how we look at the business, how we're operating, redefining and reimaging what retail is? These individuals are transformers in every sense – they truly are more than meets the eye! In this episode we meet April Sabral, CEO of RetailU, online training for the next generation of retail leaders, and author of the book, The Positive Effect, A Retail Leader's Guide To Changing The World. April shares with us her retail journey, what she has learned about leadership along the way, and how she applies that to train the next generation of retail leaders. If you're working with aspiring retail leaders, want to better understand what makes a great retail leader, or just want to learn how to grow your retail career to the net level – this episode is for you! Have you heard! Our podcast is staying strong on the Feedspot Top 60 Retail podcasts list! We're currently at #22, so please give us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts if you like the show! With your help, we'll be on our way to a Top 20 spot! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/ Meet your hosts:I'm Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, a Top 12 ecommerce influencer, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft. And I'm Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. I've spent my career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business. Now I slay franken-stacks! Together, we're your guides on the retail transformation journey. Whether you're thinking digital and online, mobile, or brick & mortar stores, we'll help you cut through the clutter! The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorJoin our club on Clubhouse: http://bit.ly/RRazorClubListen to us on Callin: https://bit.ly/RRCallinSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPod Host → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWRBelmar Co-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCasey TRANSCRIPTS1E9 Retail Transformers - April Sabral[00:00:00][00:00:20] Introduction[00:00:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hello! Good morning. Good afternoon. And good evening, whatever time of day you're listening. Welcome. Welcome to season one episode nine of the retail razor show. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar a RETHINK Retail top retail influencer and lead partner marketing advisor for retail and consumer goods at Microsoft.[00:00:35] Casey Golden: And I'm your co-host Casey Golden CEO of Luxlock Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. I've spent my career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business. Now I slay Frank and stacks.[00:00:49] Ricardo Belmar: So Casey, this is a truly momentous episode for us. We finally are launching our Retail Transformers series.[00:00:56] Casey Golden: Yeah. I'm actually quite thrilled. We've been talking about how there are so many people in retail right now that are really changing how we look at the business, how we're operating and what we need to do next and so much more. This is such an exciting time for this industry and they are true transformers In every sense.[00:01:18] Ricardo Belmar: In fact one might say they are truly more than meets the eye.[00:01:22] Casey Golden: that was smooth.[00:01:23] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I'm pretty skilled at that, actually. So you can give me, give me any small moment to work in a cool eighties, pop culture reference. I am all in on that.[00:01:29] Casey Golden: I'm sure the appreciation will make it into the comments. Anyway, let's talk about our amazing first interviewee. April Sabral[00:01:37] Ricardo Belmar: April is absolutely amazing. As listeners will find out in this episode, she's really transforming how retail leadership is evolving. April's got such a wonderful perspective on how retail teams should be managed, how people should be treated and so much to say about what leadership looks like for a modern retailer.[00:01:55] Casey Golden: A hundred percent. I mean, I really can't think of a more important conversation to be having right now. So let's cut through the clutter and get right to the interview. So kickback or keep your eyes on the road and listen to our session with April Sabral, founder and CEO of Retail U online leadership training for retail managers and author of the book, the positive effect, retail leaders guide to changing the world.[00:02:19][00:02:19] April Sabral Interview[00:02:19] Ricardo Belmar: Welcome to the show April. It's great to have you here. We've been planning for this for some time and so glad to finally make it happen![00:02:29] April Sabral: Thanks. Yeah, I'm excited to be here.[00:02:31] Casey Golden: April, absolute pleasure. Just to get started, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what you're focused on now? What brought you to this, this moment? And how do you see your role transforming leadership in retail?[00:02:44] April Sabral: Yeah. So I'm the founder and CEO of retail U which is an online leadership learning platform for field operators. After having a 30 year career in retail, working through the stores, all the different ranks, all the way up to vice president just really found an opportunity to build affordable leadership development.[00:03:03] And what I'm focused on now is really helping leaders transform their leadership in this new era of empathy and compassion and connecting with people. And so I've been focused on you know, getting retail U out there , along with the book that I just wrote introducing a new leadership methodology that I've used over my 30 year career.[00:03:23] And so I'm coaching and teaching that hour and doing a lot of leadership development coaching right now.[00:03:28] Casey Golden: That's great. I actually ordered it. I haven't read it yet. But we brought it over to like our head of talent and really super excited to, to read.[00:03:38] April Sabral: Oh, amazing. Thank you.[00:03:41] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I've been in the midst of reading it myself and I've been thoroughly enjoying it. I'm finding a lot of really interesting nuggets on I'm going to be popping a few of those in, as we, as we go to get more details from you because you've had such a really interesting journey.[00:03:55] I find just from reading the experience you've described in the book from all the various retail roles that you've had you know, like you said, just starting from, front lines in the store all the way to being VP and heading up stores. You mentioned a number of really valuable lessons that you learned along the way and particularly around managing people in retail. So I'd really love for you to kind of tell us a little bit about some of those , and maybe think of what kind of advice would you give to other retail employees on, on how to build their retail career and really growing into one of those retail management roles.[00:04:26] April Sabral: well, I think that, you know, along the way certainly when I started off in retail, I didn't think of it as a career choice. Right. I share a lot about that in the book. It was like a part-time job that I got when I[00:04:37] Ricardo Belmar: Right.[00:04:38] April Sabral: moving out of home. And it just, you know, Started providing me a way to, to pay for my bills and look after myself when I was younger.[00:04:46] And so, however, you know, I think that I was very fortunate because I worked for a huge brands back in the day at pivotal times for them when they were entering new markets. For example, like when Starbucks came to the UK and when the gap came to the UK, I happened to be there. And I was a part. That expunction and then moving to the U S with Starbucks and then to Canada with Banana Republic.[00:05:08] So I do think I had great opportunities along the way. The one thing I would say about retail, or if you're a manager or if you're not a manager and you're just a part-time sales person to really see it as an opportunity to build your people skills because your people skills are life skills, Right.[00:05:24] And retail, we teach people life skills, like how to problem solve, how to have confidence in speaking to people how to sell something even like, you know, in life, you've got to sell yourself every single day, whether you're in an, a job or whether you're an entrepreneur. So I think that there's just so many skills that you learn. And my journey along the way, I was fortunate, like I said, I worked for those mega brands back in the day and they had really good leadership development programs back then, they were really invested in their people.[00:05:50] This was before e-comm came about. So it was a really big focus on talent. And so, what, I've learned along the way is that if you continue to grow, develop your skills and invest in yourself, then you will have a great career and you can move up the ranks and get compensated for it. You know, frontline employees always see it as a job as like, it's not a great career choice because I think they're underpaid.[00:06:11] But once you start moving into manager multi-site and moving up, everything changes. So that's why I think it's a great career choice. And I also think that it's a huge career because you can move around the world with it. You know, it employs, millions of people. So I think we need to start looking at it a little bit differently.[00:06:28] And so I would say, work hard sign up for things. If there's different projects that you can get on or transformation happening within your organization, say, yes, I did that a lot. Like I moved around a lot. I was willing to take risks and move to different countries even, or different districts to just take on projects and get myself known.[00:06:49] And I was always really good with people. And so that just really helped me. I was one of the easiest people to manage, I would say, and the easiest, really easy person to get along with. And just, and that helped me deliver the results that they were asking of me. And so every time I moved up and took on more responsibility, the results would just keep growing.[00:07:07] So yeah, you have to deliver results, but you have to do that through a team of people.[00:07:12] Casey Golden: traditionally, it's pretty hard to make the jump from being on the floor and read. Into corporate, any advice there on how to make that.[00:07:24] April Sabral: Yeah.[00:07:24] There's not a lot of us that have done that, me and Ron, talk about that all the time and, and how we can help that in our industry continue to build that because there's so many great people in the field. I think it's about building those relationships in advance. Like in the book, I talk about an experience when I first got promoted from a district supervisor into a director role.[00:07:45] So that was that first experience of going from like field leadership, into working with corporate partners. And I had a lot of feedback given to me that wasn't super positive at the time. I had. Sells re results for the awards for the, you know, the four years leading up to that. So people saw me as very highly competitive and the team that I was going to assume didn't really want to work for me.[00:08:08] So I had to take some humble pie, take that feedback on and then realize that the relationships that I had, weren't just about the relationships with the people that report into me, but really the relationships that I worked alongside with. And so if you want to get promoted and you want to be successful and work with your corporate partners, you need to have those relationships in advance so that you can influence the things you need to influence.[00:08:33] And you have the backing because now it's not just about your team in the field, you have this huge team of support in the office. But if you don't know how to build those relationships, guess what? They're not going to help you. They don't know what your job is. So I think just building those relationships and networking with them, just like you would on LinkedIn, right?[00:08:51] Like network with your corporate partners and think about collaboration and, and don't think like, what are they doing and why are they rolling out this out to us and complain about them? Instead see yourself as a conduit to kind of help them help you and I think that's something that we really need to teach and build that bridge between the field and the head office.[00:09:10] Ricardo Belmar: of the things I noticed you, you mentioned quite a bit in the book that maybe gets lost sometimes in this industry is that a lot of the roles are defined as sort of a sales leadership role, but you point out many times in the book that you really need to see yourself as a people leader, not just a sales.[00:09:27] And I guess just based on what you just said, right? A lot of it has to do with how you interact with the people you're leading and the teams that are in the field. And as well as everyone around you, not just focusing on those sales performance numbers.[00:09:41] April Sabral: Yeah, a hundred percent. It's like, you know, we build relationships with our customers, right? Why do we do that? Because we want to get money out of them. And we want to have them coming back to us and feel good about the experience. And so it is sales is a relationship driven business. So if you want to sell your employees and get them to do something for you for the organization, well guess what, then you need to have a really strong relationship with them because every employee wants to feel three things from their boss that they're cared for, that they can trust them and that they they're going to help them do the job better. And that only comes from a relationship. So, I'm a very results driven leader. And so I had to learn to cook. You know, yes, the results really matter, but the results is an outcome of how you're leading your team. at the end of the day, people get up and come to work every day, wanting to do a good job and for the person that they work for. And if they don't like the person, they work for good luck getting results out of them. It's just not going to happen. You think about that in your own life, right?[00:10:41] Every time you've had a boss and you've loved them, you're like, oh, I love going to work. I want to do a good job. And when you have somebody that's just a pain. It just can control your life. So it really is about positive relationships. I can't say that enough.[00:10:55] Casey Golden: I always think of do I want this person to win? Right? Because we all work together so much. And it's so much of a back and forth and it's just like, you know, I want them to want me to win. But then at the same time, you want to work with people who you believe in and you want to win and you genuinely will build that relationship and be like, how can I help you?[00:11:13] April Sabral: Yeah. And it's funny, right? Because like, when we talk about retail to other people, the let's say I'm in a dinner party or I'm somewhere, and there's not a lot of retail folks. They'd be like, well, you know, you just sell clothes, right. And I'm like, no, no, no, no. We drive millions of dollars and like lead thousands of people and make an impact on their life every day.[00:11:33] Right. So I think there's a misperception about what we do. And if you ask anybody in the field. Nine times out of 10, why they love what they do in retail, especially at a leadership level. They always say it's the development of people because coaching really exists in the field teams because we're always coaching for performance.[00:11:53] Just like, a basketball coach, who's coaching his team on the, on the court. It's the same idea. So I think. We're very fortunate in the fact that coaching really does exist and people already passionate about, and that's why I say it's not just a sales business, right? It's a people business.[00:12:09] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I was probably one of the most hidden things I think in retail, right? It's this aspect of coaching in the field, that has always been there. I just. Talk about it enough because we always focus so much on the selling,[00:12:21] April Sabral: a hundred percent. But if you think about sales floor leadership, most companies have flow leadership, cell phone leadership programs, and it's all about coaching[00:12:30] Ricardo Belmar: That's right.[00:12:31] April Sabral: in the moment.[00:12:31] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah,[00:12:36] Casey Golden: obviously a lot of the focus in this book is really about positivity. Both how you see your career goals and how you. Others in your organization, you talk about how leaders are in a position to foster creativity and imagination to develop new ideas, but you also kind of remind leaders that they don't have to act on every idea that their team presents.[00:12:58] But they need to be acknowledged. This is an interesting point because I know that there are so many leaders that believe the opposite of this. And they, they don't have to embrace every idea. In order to recognize the contribution of those team members, how do you coach leaders to embrace this approach?[00:13:14] Because store teams can be quite large and there can be a lot of ideas. And it's not a very formal process of write down all of your ideas from all of these stores. And then I'm going to put it in a, put it in a pivot. I mean, it is so much of just taking in all of this information. And where do you, where do you feel like some, some great recommendations for a manager today that is looking for those contributions? How would you recommend that they kind of extract that?[00:13:50] April Sabral: I mean that's Yeah. That's, there's so many ways now, like when I was at David's tea, we had an app called nudge. Right. And so that was a way for field employees to kind of write everything down and give feedback. And at the office we could say, Like, like real time, because we would ask questions about things and they would provide their feedback.[00:14:10] So I think there's lots of technology that can help with that. I think the number one thing is, like you said, that people think that they have to embrace every idea and act on every idea to make people feel acknowledged. I don't agree with that because the thing is, there'll be really great ideas floating around out there.[00:14:27] And some of them know. That's just, you know, that just can't do that. Maybe it's like the budget's not there or you just don't have the time to do it because you can't focus on 25 things and do it well. Right? Like you can only focus on a few things and do it well. And so, I think this idea of acknowledging what people are contributing in their ideas is very important because in the book I talk about making every person feel valued on your team. And so to make somebody feel valued, they have to be seen and heard. It doesn't mean to say that you have to execute their strategy or their idea. That's not what most people are looking for.[00:15:03] Most people are looking for just to feel like I said, seen and heard. So just acknowledging that and saying, "That's a really great idea and thank you so much, but maybe we'll park it and we'll bring it back out and we'll use it next time." And I think most people want transparency.[00:15:20] The worst thing you can do is ask for a whole load of ideas, not use them and never acknowledged that they were given. Right. So I think that leaders just need to have managerial courage. I think it's just being transparent with your team and not feeling pressured, but one of the biggest things that I coach on is leaders having that managerial courage to be able to be transparent with their team.[00:15:43] Nobody likes conflict and nobody likes going into a conversation where conflict could occur. But it's not it's, it's just human nature. We just don't like that. We kind of shy away from it. So they don't know how to deal with difficult conversations. Right. If you think about people and performance management, it's the same kind of idea, but it really isn't about that.[00:16:02] It's just, just acknowledge it. Like, thank you so much for that idea and acknowledging everybody's idea, but yeah, you get 150 ideas. There's no way you're going to be able to act on them. You're going to have to pick a few that are going to work with that strategy at that time. Right.[00:16:17] Ricardo Belmar: and you know, that reminds me of, you mentioned in the book, you, you, your formulas, so to speak for, for this successful process, you call it your act model or accept, create and teach. Right. And you also talk about leading with awareness, which I think was a really critical point and how you accomplish that can kind of walk us through that model and tell us more about, you know, the importance of leading with awareness.[00:16:40] April Sabral: Yeah. I mean, I'm a self-development junkie, right? My whole life, I have been focused on just self development and reading self-help books and what that has done for me has made me a very self-aware person. Like I know when I've messed up. You know, every boss I've ever had, they're like, we don't need to tell you what you've not done.[00:17:00] Right. Because you actually know before somebody else tells you because I'm very self-reflective. And so I think going back to leading people and building relationships, the more self-aware you are about how you contribute to that relationship and your communication tone connection the better result you're going to get out of people because you're going to be paying attention, being mindful, being present. . And that just comes again from my years of self-development. And so when I lead that self-awareness is really important and I filter it into this model because this is the way that I've led for over 25 years and incorporates yes, my professional coaching training, if you like.[00:17:43] But it also incorporates that mindful piece of being present through my self development journey. So the first step. "Accept" it's about being supportive and having no judgment and assumptions on people. This is one of the hardest things for leaders to do because we all judge people, right? There's so much training out there on bias now and inclusion and our natural ways that we do make assumptions and judgements on people.[00:18:10] And it's simple things like the way somebody looks, the way somebody dressed The way our sister treated us yesterday, like so many things that we judge people on, but when you lead a team it's really, really important that you help them feel supported and encouraged to be themselves. And all the stores that I ever visited every time I would ask a leader what makes them feel successful? It was always around when they felt they were showing up to work, being their whole self and that their boss could see them and hear them. So that's what that pillar is all around. It really teaches leaders to , look at that judgment, stop making assumptions, managing the moment and being present, and really accepting people for who they are.[00:18:51] And then "create" Is all around being responsible and responsible with your thinking and your envisioning, because I'm a big believer in the law of cause and effect ,[00:19:02] and manifesting things. Like I know that sounds like a little bit of a spiritual idea and a bit hokey pokey, but honestly it's like nothing is created until you think about it first, you think about a business. anything you think about this business and you have to like mindfully envision it and then you put the plan in work. Right? So create is all about how you create this into your business and thinking mindfully.[00:19:25] I mean, I used to sit there on Monday mornings and kind of envision what I wanted my week to look like my conversations to look like. I just watched actually. The Serena Williams story over the weekend on a plane. And I was watching her father and I was like, he was totally demonstrating, create in action.[00:19:42] Cause he was like, there was no way my kids are going to fail. They're going to be the best tennis players. And it was the way that he showed up every day. He just created that. So that's what that pillar teaches leaders. And I really think that that needs to be talked about more in business. I think entrepreneurs get it a lot.[00:19:58] And then "teach" is really about being selfless and being a mentor and a coach. So if you take a coach approach to leadership, you'll always be passing on knowledge and you'll always be teaching people and it will make you less frustrated because. So many leaders I work with, like I told that person that and why aren't they doing it?[00:20:16] And I'm thinking, well, did you actually coach them on their performance? And did you actually help them understand and train them? And so those are the three pillars wrapped up. And so I kind of looked at it as like, it's a way of being, that's why I say it's leading with awareness because if you can have more awareness of what your contribution is, you'll have a very highly engaged team.[00:20:37] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think that's really spot on . I'm sure we've all been in large corporate organizations where it seemed like the upper tiers of management felt that the obligation was to reward their best performers by just deciding to turn them into managers and leaders in the organization, but never actually giving them the tools , or the methodology on how to actually lead a team.[00:20:57] I think they kind of assume that, well, if they could manage a project, they could manage a group of people. And that's not always the case, but it's not an automatic thing. If you don't take into account all the different points you just mentioned April, I think that's a really great way to frame that[00:21:11] April Sabral: Yeah. And like you normally in retail, it's like usually the best sales person on the sales floor that gets promoted. Right, And then all of a sudden they have like five, 10 people and it's not going so well. And then your top performer, it's not your top performer anymore[00:21:24] Ricardo Belmar: more, Yeah. Yeah. Cause it's just the, see in the management changes to assume assumes that because they hit the numbers so well that they can automatically lead everyone else in doing the same thing.[00:21:34] Casey Golden: Well, where are you guys working? You would get top sales and like, well, we can't take you off the floor. I'm like, let me create 20 of my me. But can't take you off the floor. You do too much in sales. No, I mean, I think that's great. I mean, we have all had great managers and we've all had learning experiences from not so great managers, but I think, I think there there's something to be said that retail is so many people's first job. And this is really like that building block of you're essentially installing work ethic and process for the first time.[00:22:12] April Sabral: Yeah. Yeah. And also you're giving somebody, and this is another thing, right? I have a 24 year old, 24 year old daughter, and she was sharing a story with me and Ron about her first retail job and how terrible it was. Experience because of her boss. Right.[00:22:26] And me and him were like cringing at lunch. Cause we were like, oh, this is so many people's story.[00:22:32] And the thing is, we're trying to fuel retail with newer leaders because we need them cause bricks and mortar are not going away. And one of the big gaps now is that middle management. And so it starts off with your first job. I was. 17 when I got my first job in retail and I had a great boss. And so it sets the tone.[00:22:52] Right. And so that, you know, it's so important, like you said, it's the first time somebody's having a first experience of having a boss and a work environment. And, we need to really take responsibility for that and help our managers for say, managers that are like 20, 21, you know, managing an 18 year old.[00:23:09] How are they doing that? You know, like we really need to help them with that.[00:23:13] Casey Golden: Yeah, I agree. And if that manager feels like that there is communication and there is way to move up in the company. They're less likely to push down to keep from taking, you know, cause they, they don't feel like they have. So it really gives you that position of leadership to, to inspire team. I loved like my team, like being a manager to like I had 17 year old, 16, 17 year olds.[00:23:35] And it's just one of my favorite retail experiences, because I got to be their first boss. I still talk to these people most like 18 years later. And they're "Casey, like you inspired me to get in the fashion industry." I'm like, they're like an SVP that Nike now. And I'm like, I'm sorry. It does. It opens up that whole world of like, whatever they're doing and wherever they go, you get to be that moment in somebody's mind of their first work experience. And you get to be that first amazing boss that I've ever had, or you get to be that pain point that changes their perspective of leadership, even moving forward for years, potentially.[00:24:22] That is your first moment.[00:24:24] Ricardo Belmar: And it really sets that that first impression is so strong, especially when you think about the age groups we're talking about. And we had this come up in one of our previous episodes where we talked with I think Ron was in that discussion. And in fact, what a Gotham from the George Mason university retail center, and he even pointed out, or when he first asked students in one of his classes, you know, who here has a retail job.[00:24:48] Lots of students raised their hands. Yeah, they had, they were in a retail job. And then he, when he asked them, how many of you plan on pursuing a retail career and all the hands went down because they all had a bad, first impression and most likely because of, what their experience was. And if we don't do something to change that experience, and what's going to motivate people to pursue a career in this industry[00:25:07] Casey Golden: Yeah. So, I mean, this kind of brings us back to, you know, you might say it's the reason we're having this conversation today and why the show exists and you know, some, a lot of the motivation behind your book, we're experiencing a movement in retail around changing how frontline staff is treated both by the customer but more importantly by retailer, management teams and where they sit into an organization. I mean, we've had these conversations with Ron Thurston who we're, we've all had I mean, everybody adores him B because it does, we all have that shared experience right. Of having that first retail job that we're able to build a lot of these things off of when retailers think and talk about wanting to change these behaviors the initial why right? That, that initial why? And because my initial, why for my company was the people who I worked with on the floor. I saw that they were hurting and. I wanted to help them. And that was, that was back in 2007 and it's kept me motivated to continue trying to build this solution to make sure that retail staff has a thriving career.[00:26:13] And I'm not even on the floor anymore. Right? I mean, we go through all of these different. Do you agree that like, maybe by seeing that transformation of how frontline workers are treated on their jobs, do you agree with, this, this whole conversation and this movement, like just really realigning that focus on making sure that that experience is a positive one.[00:26:38] April Sabral: Oh, Yeah.[00:26:39] a hundred percent. It should have always been a positive one. I just think that the investment in people got shifted to e-com in the last seven years. , cause that's where all the money went into, building your e-comm your channels, trying to figure out that whole customer journey.[00:26:53] And so leave like development of teams. But it's put in polls. Like there's a lot of companies that don't have proper onboarding programs for managers right now. And so I think that has to come back around. Pay is a big thing, you know, advocating for pay and like different incentive programs because comp sales, the traditional way of looking at comp doesn't incentivize people anymore because the sales have shifted the mix of the channels where it's coming from.[00:27:18] So I just think there's many different components that go into it. But one of the easiest things to do is just give your team training and development. So everybody wants you read any exit interview and the top two reasons why people leave is I'm not growing in my career and the person I work for, isn't helping me.[00:27:35] So it's just like, that's just something that can change an environment. And the clients at retail, U that have implemented the online leadership programs are seeing that in the surveys from the staff, like from just having that coaching and leadership development, full people, it gives them something additional that is not very expensive, but it's a very easy thing to do to shake that environment.[00:27:57] Casey Golden: So let's say if we were thinking about what are, what are a handful of things that we might be seeing on the transformation of this culture change? Because it's a huge culture change in the organization from like a corporate. Corporate side, from my perspective, we're looking at different compensation, strategies training and development.[00:28:19] Do you foresee anything else like that stands out that you feel is going to adjust over the next? Let's say two to five years when it comes to how the retail staff and how that really works.[00:28:32] April Sabral: I mean, I think they need to retell needs to embrace bringing on more coaches. I'm a leadership development coach, right? I'm a Forbes leadership development coach now. And I think that because we assume that way, such a high coaching, high touch environment in the stores, which we are, but at that middle level from district supervisor to director, That's where the gap is right now.[00:28:52] And I think that a lot of organizations bring on coaches, retailers don't really bring in people from the outside as coaches. So what I'm doing now is working with that middle level and to help make a difference and kind of succession planning people up. So I do think that we need to embrace that more and realize that you may have a leader like a VP or a director, but maybe they do need a leadership development coach to help them actually develop their team and succession plan and help that leadership. And I hope that that's embraced more because it's not something I was ever provided. I had to go and seek that myself outside of the organization that I worked for.[00:29:30] So I'm really hoping that that gets embraced more because what I'm excited about the future is new leadership coming into those senior spots. Like a lot of us now some of us have, we we've done it and we've been through it, but how do we get the next level up into these seats? Because they're going to be the leaders of the organizations in the next 10 years, and that's going to really shape it. ,[00:29:51] Casey Golden: I really want them to be the leaders over the next 10 years, you know? It's such being somebody who spent, you know, a, a good portion of my initial career on the floor. There's so much that you've learned that you want to take and do good with at corporate and being able to just even know that you can have a future, that it doesn't have to end with that, that store. I think it's just really, really important.[00:30:16] Ricardo Belmar: There really should be able to say that, you know, today's frontline workers are tomorrow's retail leaders because they have all the built-in to build. Right.[00:30:25] Casey Golden: Yeah, you can indirectly, right.[00:30:27] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. So April along those lines, and if you look out, you know, in case they ask you about the next two to five years, I'm going to be a little closer to near term, like over the next year. What, what are you most excited about when it comes to retail leadership? What do you think is most likely to change for the better.[00:30:42] April Sabral: Ooh, what am I most excited about that more people get retail U programs because people seem to be finding it now and embracing it. And I think it's a really good way to develop teams. And I just think, like I said, like more middle like that, more of that field leadership moving into. The additional roles, there's a lot of head of store roles posted right now, by the way, the most I've ever seen a lot of director roles.[00:31:06] So I think we've come through a massive shift in the last couple of years. A lot of people left those roles in those Chris because of what was going on and, and opted to do something else. So I think there's a big opportunity now for that management to move up and really take those seats. So that's what I'm really excited about.[00:31:21] Just seeing new leadership and new ideas and the new generation coming into that talent pool.[00:31:26] Casey Golden: How would you suggest someone wanting to go ahead and start taking the first step? Do you see that first step at corporate? Do you see it at that district level?[00:31:36] April Sabral: Yeah, , one of the things I'm working on right now with a few leaders is just development, planning sessions. So what does that actually look like? Because back in the day, when I was at Starbucks and I was at gap right before in e-comm and all of that came about, we had individual development planning sessions.[00:31:53] With competency base and we had it on paper and we had these two things that we have to focus on and I think that's really disappeared. So I think if you were going to stop wanting to grow in your career, you need to start tapping on your bosses shoulder and being like, okay, I need a plan, not an action plan to drive your sales.[00:32:11] But a personal development plan. And if you don't have one, there is so many tools out there. You could go and get one, because if you, somebody said to me a long time ago, if you leave your career in the hands of somebody else, you're going to be waiting for somebody else to promote you. So, you know, I took it upon myself like that whole self development journey.[00:32:29] Right to read books about leadership, to watch Ted talks, to put a plan on paper for my own personal development, my competencies that would help me drive my business. And FYI is an amazing book that I use with a lot of leaders, but I just think a development planning session. What are the two things that April's going to work on this to become better at my job, that's going to impact the results?[00:32:51] Is it my communication? Is it my managerial courage? Is it how to have performance conversations? What is it? And if you don't have that on paper right now, and you're in a, in a leadership role and you want to grow. You need to make sure that you have that. And unfortunately, that lacks skill in a lot of organizations.[00:33:09] So I find myself doing that with leaders and once they've left it, they're like, and I'm doing it with their boss and them. So usually it's like a district manager with a director and I'm sitting with them and we're assessing what they need to do to do the job. And, and they walk away going, man, I have a plan and six months later, people get promoted like all the time.[00:33:28] So I'm really good at promoting people in succession planning. It's because I focus on their development of skill, not just not just the action plan that needs to drive the results of the operational things, let's say, you know, it needs to be the people's side as well.[00:33:44] Casey Golden: Well, and then we'll also start with reading your book, right? Start the conversation. It'd be passive aggressive, drop it on some of these guys.[00:33:57] April Sabral: Well, and that's why I launched the second book. The lift purposely lead positively workbook because so many people read that book and they were like, but how do I actually turn this into a developed plan? I'm like, let me give you one. Now. Now there's a workbook with 15 activities that you can do to develop those skills.[00:34:15] Right.[00:34:15] Casey Golden: Oh, that's great. I I'm, I'm a fan of work books.[00:34:18] Ricardo Belmar: Well, April , thank you so much for joining us today. It's been such a pleasure hearing about your retail experience or your journey, everything that you're doing now with retail U. We probably haven't said it enough that our listeners should all run out and get a copy of your book if they haven't already, because there's so much fantastic advice and ideas on how to just improve your own retail career, as well as how you lead others.[00:34:42] So how can listeners reach out to you April? You know, learn more about retail u or just follow your work?[00:34:47] April Sabral: Yeah. So retail U like university.ca that's the website. So you can go on, check out everything that's going on there. And then I have my own, which is April Sabral.com, but you can find that through retail U or just connect with me on LinkedIn. And I always usually respond to people pretty fast.[00:35:04] So that's where you can find me.[00:35:05] Ricardo Belmar: Fantastic.[00:35:06] Well, I want to thank you again for joining us.[00:35:08] Casey Golden: I am excited. Everybody's going to be reading your book[00:35:10] Thank you so much for joining us.[00:35:14] Recap[00:35:14] Casey Golden: Welcome back everyone.[00:35:20] Ricardo Belmar: Well, Casey,, I would be surprised if this doesn't end up being one of our most popular episodes so far. I mean, April's background and experience has so much to offer retail leaders just to make themselves better, you know, better at running their business. And most importantly, better at leading their teams.[00:35:33] Casey Golden: Hundred percent.[00:35:34] We can't recommend enough that if you're leading retail teams.[00:35:38] you need to get a copy of April's book and really absorb what she's saying. You'll see the difference.[00:35:44] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. You know, Casey you've led retail teams before. And you mentioned in the session kind of how your philosophy around managing those teams aligns with April's. So what, what would your top tip be for retail leaders? Is it pretty much the same as what April said?[00:35:58] Casey Golden: Yeah, I could've stolen April for the entire show. There is a lot of overlap but I think a skill that, that lacks in management is learning how to be an advocate for change we have a lot of incredible talent on regional levels, but find a disconnect at corporate. April provides some great tools to be a good steward, not just from management and going downstream to their teams, but being able to develop those managers to be a good steward of getting that information and managing upstream. It's always been a gap. Even professionally moving from the field to corporate. The information flow and continuity is no different. So managing up, I think is a huge opportunity for a lot of different like HQ corporate to benefit from talent that they've been developing for years[00:36:49] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's a great point. April definitely had a lot to say about that. I can see what you mean about that gap. I think we've all, if we've worked with retailers have seen the differences between what's happening in the field with store teams versus what corporate's point of view is on that and necessarily, is it the same point of view?[00:37:04] So there's definitely an opportunity there in that upstream direction to get the information flow right, to really manage that part of the process so that everyone is getting the right learnings from those field teams. And I think April does a really good job too, of highlighting that in the book and in her retail U program on how to really set up those leaders for success, to really understand who it is they're leading[00:37:25] Casey Golden: I remember many times where it was a weekly conference call, but we didn't have the ability to talk. We just listened[00:37:34] every single person's phoning in to listen,[00:37:37] you know, so I think there's a huge opportunity here that April highlights[00:37:41] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah and I think you mentioned this too in April talks about it. You know, I just remember being in those store teams and when you'd hear that message would come through, oh, there's going to be a call with corporate has to review something or one of these other higher up regional managers is doing a store visit and everybody kind of panics that that's coming and you really shouldn't have to do that.[00:37:59] Right. That shouldn't happen. It should not be such a massively stressful thing. When somebody from corporate or one of the regional. Or like a VP or somebody comes through the, to the story team, you know, it should just be a normal mode of operation, right. Because if everything is going well, then you shouldn't have to worry about it.[00:38:13] And I think, the way April kind of positions this as a, as a leadership tool, it makes a difference here. There's that level of understanding that has to be there..[00:38:23] Casey Golden: I agree. I think we have such an opportunity over the last couple of years that the frontline workers have been highlighted and what these jobs feel like. And how they're being led. And then we have this great resignation as well. , and I, this is a hard job, but it's filled with a lot of passionate people that are highly skilled.[00:38:42] And, and I have to say most of them are overeducated. I know a lot of people with master's degrees that are on selling Salesforce at, in retail brands, they have master's degrees, they're fully qualified to have a voice.[00:38:56] they need the opportunity and some refreshers on some tools on getting that management, you know, up management, upstream management, to have those voices heard.[00:39:06] There's a lot of benefits.[00:39:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. I mean, I really hope this episode helps listeners in those retail management positions, especially those that are managing store teams. Right. Understand how important they are, not just to the role they're filling, but to that overall employee experience. Hopefully they'll take away some useful lessons from what we talked about with April.[00:39:24] And, as you say, Casey, you gotta go out and get a copy of April's book. I think everyone. Yeah, in this industry can stand to learn quite a bit from it.[00:39:32] Casey Golden: Yeah. Sometimes you have to step back from the tech and realize we're all only human and recognize how you lead, how we're managing people is just as important to the business as anything else we do operationally or with technology.[00:39:48] Ricardo Belmar: A hundred percent agree with that. And on that note, Casey, I think it is time to wrap up this episode. Once again, we'll want to give a big, thank you out to April Sabral for spending some time with us and sharing her experience and knowledge. Thanks again, April, we look forward to having you back on the show.[00:40:03] Casey Golden: and that's a wrap!.[00:40:04][00:40:04] Show Close[00:40:04] Casey Golden: If you enjoy our show, please consider giving us that special five-star rating and review on apple podcasts. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player. So you don't miss a minute. Want to know more about what we talked about today? Take a look at the show notes for handy links and more deets. I'm your cohost, Casey Golden.[00:40:25] Ricardo Belmar: And if you'd like to learn more about us, follow us on Twitter at casey-c golden and Ricardo underscore Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure and follow the show on LinkedIn, on Twitter at retail razor and on our YouTube channel for videos of each episode and the occasional bonus content. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.[00:40:41] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.[00:40:42] Ricardo Belmar: And remember there's never been a better time to be in retail. If you cut through the clutter.[00:40:49] Until next time, this is the retail razor show.[00:40:52]

Andrew Smith is joined by special guest Ron Thurston, currently on his Retail in America tour. Together they talk about the stories Ron is uncovering on the front lines of retail spaces around the county.

In-store retail is a tough place to work. Long hours, a miserly wage, angry customers, and high customer service goals are characteristic of the job. In fact, anyone who has worked in retail knows there is a feeling of shame associated with the role. But why is that? Aren't retail employees the face of the store? Isn't the store's success hinged on their daily interaction with each customer? Join us as we speak to Ron Thurston, a retail expert, on how retail employees can find their pride. Like what you're hearing? Head over to https://thelongergame.com/ to read show notes, watch the episode or contact us. Follow us on LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/company/thelongergame Follow us on Instagram: https://instagram.com/thelongergame Follow us on Facebook: https://facebook.com/thelongergame About our guest: Ron Thurston loves retail. And he's proud of it. Ron has led the retail teams for some of America's most prominent brands, inspired thousands of store employees, and traveled relentlessly across the country to sit and listen to what they have to say. From a part-time sales associate to a Vice President of Stores, Ron has put in the hard work that a retail career requires and wrote this book to share what he learned along the way. ​ In 2021, Ron was named one of the world's Top 100 most influential people in retail and is a featured keynote speaker, podcast guest, and in-demand industry expert. ​ Ron most recently led the retail organization for INTERMIX, sits on the board of directors for GOODWILL NY/NJ, and is an advisory board member and mentor for several retail technology brands. Website: https://www.retailpride.com/ Find Retail Pride on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/rthurston Find Retail Pride on Instagram: @retailpride Find Retail Pride on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/retailpride Michael Maher, the host, would love to connect with you. Reach out to him at… Email: michael@thinkcartology.com LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/immichaelmaher This podcast is sponsored by Cartology and podcastify.me. Cartology is a customized done-for-you service agency that helps brands accelerate growth and get profitable on the Amazon marketplace. They work directly with brands to create a strategy and then go right out and execute it. Want to find out more? Website: https://thinkcartology.com/ Find Cartology on LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/company/cartology Find Cartology on Instagram: https://instagram.com/thinkcartology Find Cartology on Facebook: https://facebook.com/thinkcartology podcastify.me is a full-service podcast production company that designs podcasts around people who are paid for their advice: coaches. If you're knowledgeable in your space and want a steady stream of people who have the exact kinds of problems you solve and they want to talk about it, a podcast may just be your secret weapon. They handle everything from finding guests, to editing, publishing, and promoting episodes, all with the goal of helping you build your business. Check them out: https://podcastify.me/ --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/thelongergame/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/thelongergame/support

Angelina is the founder of She Buildz Things, LLC in Connecticut. She Buildz Things is a female-owned and operated business. Angelina was fascinated with construction at an early age, she convinced her landlord to let her renovate their apartment while she was in High School. While at The Home Depot Angelina developed relationships with contractors and soon realized she could venture out on her own and She Buildz Things was born. We have three sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston, Lenses Only and the Kreative Print Shop Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today, and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

Ron Thurston is on a mission to celebrate the culture, people and legacy of the retail industry. Born into a family of retailers, Ron always knew he wanted to be involved in the industry. Now, he is literally traveling America with the purpose of celebrating the real people of retail and the beautiful stories behind their often “accidental careers.” Ron Thurston is a highly accomplished retail leadership Executive, Board Advisor, and Amazon Bestselling Author with extensive experience leading retail operations for America's most prominent brands–including The Gap, West Elm, Tory Burch, Yves Saint Laurent and Intermix.  One of Ron's greatest strengths is turning around underperforming businesses, developing and implementing innovative growth strategies, improving training programs, building high-performing and dedicated teams, launching new brands, expanding brands into new markets, and ensuring customer growth and satisfaction.  In 2021 and 2022, Ron was named one of the top 100 Retail Influencers globally, is a board member of GOODWILL NY/NJ, and currently sits on the advisory boards of several emerging retail technology brands, including Reflex Careers, Job Pixel, and IMMERSS.  As of Spring 2022, Ron is traveling across America in an airstream trailer for a year-long tour called “Retail in America”. He is launching his audio and video platforms for a yearlong exploration of the stories behind retail businesses in America, from family-owned brick-and-mortars to large companies. Ron wants to share their inception stories and provide a platform for them to celebrate their incredible careers. Is your retail career a happy accident? Sitting across from retail workers, Ron hears it all the time: Many people did not intend to pursue a career in retail.  This “happy accident” is exciting, compelling and wonderful. But it is not always understood or honored. As someone who understands what it's like when friends and family questioned his decision to work in a field that requires long hours, nights and holidays, Ron wants to discover hidden opportunities for rich storytelling in retail. Show up with pride. Ron is not here to tell you how to run your retail business - his mission is to teach you and your team how to show up as your best selves, with pride. His mantra is: “I choose to show up with pride today, in what I do.” Ron sees retail as a great equalizer-providing opportunities for people of all gender identities, orientations and backgrounds to connect and inspire others. He is excited by the future of retail businesses, which he believes is rich for expansion and community.  Tell your story. As Ron travels across America, he is asking retail business owners and workers to share their stories. He wants to help share messages of hope, hilarity and creative inspiration from the industry that fuels America!  By reframing attitudes towards retail, Ron helps us create a better work culture. What are we proud of? How do we show up every day to serve others and engage with them on a human level? And how can we spread more kindness by bettering the experience of shopping? By asking these simple questions, Ron is having a major impact on thousands of retail workers across the globe. Quotes “Retail is not just sales. It's storytelling. It's history. It's community, it's people. And it's so much bigger than the average perception of this industry.” “Every part of this business is so exciting and interesting to me. The careers that people have are under-celebrated! It's an industry full of proud, hardworking people!” “1 out of 4 people in this country work in retail. But it's almost invisible in some ways.” “The more kind that we can be to each other about the work we do, the more positive impact that has on why this is an important career choice.” “I want to accomplish the momentum behind…new generations of people joining the retail industry. That this can be an industry where no matter how you present yourself, all are welcome here.” Links mentioned in this episode: Visit Ron Thurston's website for his tour, “Retail Pride” https://www.retailpride.com/  Get Ron's Amazon bestselling book, Retail Pride: The Guide to Celebrating your Accidental Career https://www.amazon.com/Retail-Pride-Celebrating-Accidental-Career/dp/1544515936/?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_w=gOyvd&pf_rd_p=205b21f0-8557-4ea8-a863-e58f77379cf8&pf_rd_r=C8CY7CQEGDC4ZRK05B8Y&pd_rd_r=fdbf7c7d-92a5-48fe-bea9-4d7cbcda688f&pd_rd_wg=ggLtS&ref_=pd_gw_  Follow along with his journey across America on his Instagram, @RetailPride https://www.instagram.com/retailpride/   Subscribe to receive email updates from Ron's “Retail in America” tour  https://www.retailpride.com/contact  For links to Ron's Retail Pride sponsors, visit Ron's Linktree https://linktr.ee/ronthurston

Ron Thurston is a highly accomplished Retail Leadership Executive (having led such brands as SAINT LAURENT, APPLE and Intermix), is a Board Advisor for Goodwill Stores and an Amazon bestselling author with his book, Retail Pride-The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career.   As we invite Ron back to the PWP podcast (having been our FIRST guest in Season ONE), he is someone that has truly embraced what it means to Pivot with Purpose, stepping out of the corporate retail store environment and now heading out on the road live from an Airstream trailer to discover and tell the real stories of retail heroes all across the country.   The moral of this conversation, you can pivot at ANY TIME, ANY AGE and ANY POINT in your career. If you have a passion, follow it and own what you love to do. It is the way to ultimate joy and satisfaction in career and life. In this conversation we discuss: Why everyone should start their career in the service industry How YOU have control as a candidate these days when applying to jobs Ways you can best navigate your own pivot Why you should take a dream, a thought, an idea and bring it to life Find out more about Ron's Airstream Journey and follow along on his adventures at:  https://www.retailpride.com/ Buy his book: Retail Pride- The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career: https://www.amazon.com/Retail-Pride-Celebrating-Accidental-Career/dp/1544515928 Follow Ron and Retail in America on Instagram: @retailpride  If you are in retail and interested in being featured on his podcast or for event and business opportunities, Reach out to Ron: ronthurston@retailpride.com

A little over a year ago during the middle of the day Turn-N-Headz Barbershop had a two-alarm fire, displacing two families. CJ was faced with challenges that tested his character. During this episode, we talked about leading under pressure, rallying a team, and casting a vision for his new shop. We have three sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston, Lenses Only and the Kreative Print Shop Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today, and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

We had the pleasure of talking with Donna Hylton, Hylton is a technology professional and community leader with over 30 years of experience. Donna began her technology career in college while working as a Data Center Coordinator in New York City. She has worked as an end-user database specialist, programmer, systems team leader, and information systems manager before making the transition to academia. We have three sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston, Lenses Only and the Kreative Print Shop Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today, and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying me on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in the lower right hand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

Ramon is the founder and Cheif Brand Officer at Peralta Design a company he founded in 2008 after getting laid off. Since then, he's helped many startup companies with creative branding and web development services including MySneakerCloset.com, TruOptik, R4 Technologies, Facial Flex, and AcedMyInterview.com to name a few. Ever heard of Priceline.com? Most of the world has, thanks to those funny William Shatner commercials. Ramon served as Senior Art Director on the team that launched it back in 1998 when it was just an idea-turned startup. We have three sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston, Lenses Only and the Kreative Print Shop Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today, and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying me on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in the lower right hand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

John and George Pertesis were part of a franchise that went under after the pandemic. I noticed a change in the decor but there was no indication of a brewing problem. After speaking with George's pops he told me the story and I invited him to be on the show to share with our audience. Everything is Figureoutable is not just not the name of a book by Marie Forleo it's a mindset. The Pertesis family figured out how to make it work. We have three sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston, Lenses Only and the Kreative Print Shop Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today, and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying me on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in the lower right hand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

Kelly is a book influencer and an avid reader, I'd say she has a mild addiction to books I suppose there could be the worst addictions besides books. Kelly is building a community around her passion. During this episode, we talk about her origin story, sponsorships, podcasting and monetizing her passion. We have three sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston, Lenses Only and the Kreative Print Shop Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today, and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying me on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in the lower right hand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

Ron Thurston is a highly accomplished retail leadership Executive, Board Advisor, and Amazon Bestselling Author with extensive experience leading retail operations for America's most prominent brands. He is adept at turning around underperforming businesses, developing and implementing innovative growth strategies, architecting improved training programs, building high-performing and dedicated teams, launching new brands, expanding brands into new markets, and ensuring customer growth and satisfaction. In 2021 and 2022, Ron was named one of the top 100 Retail Influencers globally, is a board member of GOODWILL NY/NJ, and currently sits on the advisory boards of several emerging retail technology brands, including Reflex Careers, Job Pixel, and IMMERSS. In 2022 Ron is launching his audio and video platforms for a year-long tour called “Retail In America,” live from an Airstream trailer to discover the real retail heroes all across the country. https://www.linkedin.com/in/rthurston/ https://www.retailpride.com/ // Episode: 011 ...... Your Hosts: - Scott Blair, Co-Founder of Popable - Stephen Brooks, The Pop-Up Retail Expert Find us online: - Podcast Website - Instagram - Facebook ...... Join the pop-up community marketplace: https://popable.com ...... Send us a voice message: https://popablepodcast.com/message --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/popable/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/popable/support

Is retail your passion or was it an accidental career you fell into? Whether you set out on your career path to be in retail or it was something you did as a filler and it has consumed a decade of your life, Amazon best-selling author Ron Thurston is setting out on a roadshow across America to tell the stories of those of you in the trenches. With a background that spans more than two decades in retail, Thurston is anxious to hear the journeys of individuals on the front lines. From his conversations and analysis, people are rarely in retail for the products they sell. Rather, it's because of community, customers, and generational family ties. Join Thurston as he hitches his airstream up to his F250 and travels across the U.S. sharing gratitude, listening, and giving your voice and story to a worldwide audience. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/mattresspodcast/message

S1E5 – The Retail Avengers & The Sea of AcademiaWelcome to Season 1, Episode 5, the fifth ever episode of The Retail Razor Show!I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock and slayer of retail frankenstacks!Together, we're your guides on the retail transformation journey. Whether you're thinking digital and online, mobile, or brick & mortar stores, we'll help you cut through the clutter!For episode 5 we're tackling an issue that doesn't get as much attention as it should – the role of academics and universities in the retail industry!We have two special guests joining us. Gautham Vadakkepatt, director of the Center for Retail Transformation at George Mason University's School for Business. Plus fan favorite, Ron Thurston, author of the book, Retail Pride – The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career.Listen to our Clubhouse session with Gautham and Ron where we discuss how academia can change the perception of retail for students - our up-and-coming next generation of retailers! We also consider what contributions university centers can make to retail tech, particularly in the startup community as well as how research plays a role in furthering the spread of knowledge in the retail ecosystem.You can learn more about the Center for Retail Transformation on their website. For more information about Ron's book and his upcoming Retail in America tour, visit his website.And big news! Our podcast has made it to the Feedspot Top 50 Retail podcasts list! We recently hit #20, so please do give us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts or Spotify Podcasts if you like the show to help us grow! With your help, we'll be a Top 10 podcast soon enough! Check it out here: https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorJoin our club on Clubhouse: http://bit.ly/RRazorClubListen to us on Callin: https://bit.ly/RRCallinSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - ****https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS1E5 The Retail Avengers & The Sea of Academia[00:00:20] Introduction[00:00:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hello. Good morning. Good afternoon. Good evening. No matter what time of day you're listening. Welcome. Welcome to the retail razor show. I'm your host Ricardo Belmar a RETHINK Retail top 100 retail influencer and lead partner marketing advisor for retail and consumer goods at Microsoft.[00:00:35] Casey Golden: And I'm your co-host Casey Golden CEO of Luxe lock and been obsessed with the customer relationship between a brand and a consumer and slaying, Frankenstacks [00:00:44] Ricardo Belmar: I love hearing how many Frankenstacks you've slain every time, Casey, how many since the last episode?[00:00:49] Casey Golden: Well, we're still working on three. It does take a minute.[00:00:52] Ricardo Belmar: Well, yeah, I guess it does take a minute. That's not bad. Considering we had a holiday break in there too. Right? So not too bad, not too bad. I wonder how many listeners would have guessed. I keep waiting to see if there are any tweets they're going to start flying out to us with everybody guessing before the next episode, how many Franken stacks get slain?[00:01:11] So do I, or do I, anybody listening or watching on YouTube will look out for the tweet storm of guesses and we'll give you a shout out if anybody comes close to the right number.[00:01:19] Casey Golden: So last week, Ricardo, we had a special guest dedicated to celebrating retail ROI, probably one of the most moving podcast episodes in 2021. [00:01:29] Ricardo Belmar: . Without a doubt, anyone that missed that one definitely go back, give it a listen. I'm sure you'll be as moved and inspired as we were. [00:01:35] Casey Golden: Well at this time, we've got another hot topic.[00:01:38] Don't we? And not one, but two special guests joined us on clubhouse to talk about our super cool, but often underrated subject, how academics support retail. [00:01:48] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. This session was a long time in the making, for our listeners out there, who aren't aware I'm on the advisory council to George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, along with a couple of our retail Avengers team members, Jeff Roster, and Shish Shridhar.[00:02:03] And we invited the center's director, Gautham Vadakkepatt to join the show. So we could deep dive into how academics and university programs help the retail industry and not just retailers, but the whole ecosystem.. [00:02:15] Casey Golden: And back with us again. Fan favorite, Ron Thurston, author of retail pride. The guide to celebrating your accidental career also joined us because this iOS is a topic near and dear to our hearts too.[00:02:29] Ricardo Belmar: So we zeroed in on three main topics for the discussion, preparing the next generation of retailers, also known as students supporting an environment for startups now, also near and dear to our hearts and for creating, a neutral ground for industry research. [00:02:42] Casey Golden: There's so much ground to cover in these areas.[00:02:45] And I can't wait to share what Gautham and Ron had to say, let's get to it. [00:02:49] Ricardo Belmar: Absolutely. So without further delay, let's listen to the retail Avengers and the sea of academia.The Retail Avengers and the Sea of Academia on Clubhouse[00:03:02] Ricardo Belmar: Welcome everybody to the Retail Razor room. We're talking today about what we call the sea of academia, and we're going to be taking a deep dive into the role that universities and academics play in the future of retail.[00:03:20] We're going to focus on three areas and we'll get to that in a moment, but we have a couple of guest speakers with us this week, who I want to first let them introduce themselves. And then we'll do quick intros for the usual team and jump right in. Gautham why don't you introduce yourself first. [00:03:34] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Thank you Ricardo for having me.[00:03:36] My name is Gautham Vadakkepatt. I'm the associate professor in the school of business at George Mason University and the director for the Center for Retail Transformation at George Mason. [00:03:46] Ricardo Belmar: Great, thank you. And then we also have a returning special guest to our room here, Ron Thurston. Ron?[00:03:51] Ron Thurston: Sure. Thanks Ricardo.. Really happy to be here and always love any of these conversations. My name is Ron Thurston. I'm the author of retail pride and a long time retail leader. And most recently as the vice president of stores of Intermix and head of stores for several brands prior.[00:04:08] And I spend much of my time now consulting and speaking, and really celebrating the millions of people who do the hard work and stories every day. And in education may play a part in that, which is why I was so interested in joining this conversation. [00:04:23] So thanks, Ricardo. [00:04:25] Ricardo Belmar: Great. Thanks, Ron. And moving on to our regular Retail Avengers team, I'll start with what's on my screen at least is our ghost speaker. Jeff, because I can't see you on my screen for some reason. [00:04:37] Jeff Roster: Hi, jeff roster. Co-host of This Week In Innovation and serve on several advisory boards. Most, most proudly the center for retail transformation with George Mason University. And I'm so happy to have my boss there, here tonight.[00:04:49] Looking forward to hearing what he has got to say. [00:04:51] Ricardo Belmar: Excellent and Casey. [00:04:53] Casey Golden: Hi, I'm Casey Golden. I'm the founder of Luxlock retail experience platform, a former fashion exec and supply chain management tech.[00:05:03] Ricardo Belmar: Maybe Shish is having a little bit of an issue. We'll come back to him in a minute. And I'm Ricardo Belmar, the host of the room. I created the Retail Razor Club here on Clubhouse. I'm a lead partner marketing advisor for retail at Microsoft, and also proud to be on the advisory council at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation as is Jeff, and also equally happy to have Gautham here to talk to us about what I think is a tremendously interesting topic that probably doesn't get as much attention as it should.[00:05:33] I think in this industry particularly around what I'm going to introduce as our first topic for discussion here and that's how we introduce fresh talent and skills into the retail workforce and what role universities have in that. So it's not a new concept, of course, that universities have had retail programs and curriculums in the past, there are number of universities that do.Preparing the next-gen of retailers - students![00:05:55] Ricardo Belmar: I claim that there's a bit of a misperception in what those programs are meant to do and that many people believe that they're really there just to produce more merchandisers and more buyers who are ultimately going to get hired perhaps by a department store brand and take on one of those roles, which at the end of the day, I think is really not what the industry is looking for from an academic environment.[00:06:17] And I would argue that that's more a perception than it is a reality, but I'm going to, I'm going to stop there and ask Gautham to tell us about what you really think the reality of this situation is and why there is this perception.[00:06:30] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Well, thank you, Ricardo, for giving me the chance to kick things off. Let me just quickly start by saying that, you know, the role of the university is to get students excited about a career in retail, B to kind of highlight the career opportunities that they have and C is to probably provide them with the skill sets that is most needed to manage the retail landscape as it is right now.[00:06:58] To that extent, The job of academia is to address all three aspects, not just the last aspect of trying to create talent in a specific area and to bring them and give them skillsets. And generally, my perception to answer your question, Ricardo, is that where we have perhaps fumbled the ball slightly is that many of the students who work in retail really don't and in my class about 40% of them work in retail, don't understand what's the upward trajectory once they start working in retail, what the career paths that they have and what skills they have, and they don't have mentors to be blunt and honest, we are a minority-majority school, and I'm very proud of that fact. Many of them are first-generation students. And so they don't have people to guide them through that.[00:07:51] Like, Hey, look, retail is a good paying job. What they see is just a store associate. Many of them start off a store associates, but they don't see that thing forward. And they don't know what skills that they need to kind of get to that next level. So I'll talk about the skills needed in a later time, but I'll pause here too.[00:08:10] I'm sure Ron has, and others have things to add to this conversation.[00:08:14] Ron Thurston: I would love to, to jump in, thank you, Gautham.And I had the pleasure of being a panelist on on a session that Gautham led with students. And I could not agree more with, with his statement because, when you think about the industry and whether it's you're coming to an education platform like George Mason or you are[00:08:35] I'm coming into this from a, from a different angle or with no education at all. The opportunity that all of us have then in leadership roles is to provide that insight, to speak as loudly as possible to mentor, to find those chances, to, to share the unlimited opportunities there are available within the retail industry.[00:08:59] And by unlimited, it's from all the different brands that you could potentially work for, the opportunities both in store from a career trajectory and to multi-store heads of stores into other corporate roles, marketing, finance, social, design, buying, the, the jobs are unlimited, but often the best candidates that come are ones that come from the store that really understand the customer and understand that the product category demand have really have a deep understanding of what's needed in the industry and have such expertise when you come from the field. And I just think we don't speak about that enough or give the language to retail teams to be able to say, this is, you know, I'm a store manager of a, of a million dollar business, and here are all the things that I do even on a small team today to run this million multimillion dollar business and the list of competencies and how that moves you forward and, and how the industry works.[00:10:07] It's part of why we're in this situation today from a hiring perspective is because the industry doesn't see itself as one where careers are plentiful. And I know I personally love to change that in every way that we can.[00:10:21] Ricardo Belmar: Thanks, Ron. Thanks Gautham. I think these are some good points about this. So let me ask then the question, how do we introduce the right, you know, whether it's particular courses or particular skill sets and training for that at a university level, and what's the right approach for that? Gautham you hinted at having a few thoughts around this as well.[00:10:42] So maybe I'll turn this back to you for a moment and let you give us your thoughts on how you think that should be approached. [00:10:49] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Yeah. I'll just give you a case study of what I experienced at my university. Right? So I, I teach a introductory class to retail management. We have 22 students out of which about 40% of them actually work in retail.[00:11:01] When I started the course, none of them wanted to have a carer on retail. I'm not joking, not a single one of them wanted to work in retail. And what we did and I kind of went in anticipating this problem and what I did was to get various speakers. Ron was one of them. Jeff was another, we had several , speakers come and talk about their careers in retail, showcasing what they did, how you made progress up retail, what opportunities and skills that they have.[00:11:32] And as of last week, when I asked the same students, Hey, how many of you are going to work? You still think you don't want to work in retail. All six of them who said that, Hey, I did not want to work in retail said, I would like to pursue careers in retail. I just don't know how to get there. So at least we addressed the first problem that, okay, now we know that there is interest.[00:11:54] It's just about providing them with information and it's thanks to people, leaders in the space who come and present their viewpoint to classrooms and give them real world experiences of what retailers that addresses the talent, the first step of the talent going into retail. And then of course, providing them with the skills to succeed in retail today that that's partly on us academics to make sure that they have the skills.[00:12:23] Right. And so, while I take the first class on retail foundations, the second class I teach is emerging technologies in retail. So that once we get them interested in retail, then I tried to provide them the skills that they need to succeed in retail today, which is not just the people skills very critical, but it's also the technology aspect that they need to be able to do the science and the art behind these two things.[00:12:48] So that's the way, that's the approach that the center has taken to educate students at Mason on retailing. Give them an opportunity to succeed in the retail landscape today.A student's first exposure to retail[00:13:00] Ricardo Belmar: Let me ask you a question on that note. Two things I want to get at. Because I'm wanting to dig a little deeper into what you were saying about the component of teaching, more about emerging technologies as what I would consider a valuable enticement to someone in that program to understand more about the art of the possible and what maybe the future looks like versus what has gone in the past that they may need to learn.[00:13:22] But one of the comments I'm seeing in the back channel is that when we think about where does that first exposure coming from to retail for a lot of students, you know, by the time they get to you, for example, they may have had a summer job working as a frontline staff in a store, and that has formed their opinion coming in as to what working in retail is like.[00:13:44] So is part of the solution here, in one sense, What are the right programs and how do you describe it? What do you teach in that program at the university level, but then going back a few steps. And I think Ron, maybe you might have a few thoughts here. It's so critical then what that experience for that... let's assume it's a high school student, for example, who takes that first summer job at a retail store, that experience is going to define their perception of retail as an industry and as a business. So is that as important as what they might see looking forward into college programs that talk about retail, and how do you weigh the difference here? [00:14:21] Ron Thurston: Yeah. Ricardo, I'd love to jump in because you're, you're exactly right. And I speak about this often to say again, when you are placed in a, any kind of leadership role, assistant manager, store manager, multi-store leader, all, you know, all of us that have had those roles. It becomes your responsibility to pay that forward to wherever possible.[00:14:45] And I love this idea of you creating an environment where young people are learning what it means to function in the workforce and that they go home until their parents, you know, what their experience was at work, and you have the opportunity to create something that's really magical through a great onboarding, you know, an interview journey and onboarding an immersion in the brand.[00:15:10] You're learning how to sell. You're learning how a business operates back of house, front of house, visual merchandising in a cash management. You're learning all these skills and a well led store provides that opportunity for someone to say, wow, I really love doing this, which may turn into a a change of heart in a career trajectory, or may say, you know, I'd really like to learn more about this part of the industry and start to study, but I, you know, the, the data shows a variety of things, but on average, one in three, one in four first jobs in this country are in retail. And so we have the opportunity. We have the big base of people to do this well. And the kind of desperation that I think some brands find themselves in today means those people may not be getting a great first experience.[00:16:01] And that's, that's something we could certainly improve.[00:16:03] Ricardo Belmar: Jeff. I want to give you a chance here. Do you have some thoughts on this point? [00:16:07] Jeff Roster: Yeah. My first thought is I wish I could've worked for, for Ron![00:16:14] I started off with my dad. [00:16:16] Probably the toughest spot I've ever had in my entire life. And then was it another retailer and Ron, what's interesting how you said that, just how you phrased it. I mean, it was, you know, I just, the onboarding, the onboarding journey. I mean, what a, what a fantastic way to say that when I started at Mervyn's, I mean, it wasn't a journey. It was a very mechanical process and everything about that was a mechanical process. And I think the thing that was the roughest about that particular organization is the leaders, the senior leaders, didn't at least on the selection side didn't encourage their people to be successful away from under their direction .[00:16:54] So in other words, I don't wanna, I don't wanna I don't want my junior manager to be successful because then I'm gonna have to replace that person. And that is a cancer that hopefully we get away from. Both my kids work in tech, shockingly, they work in tech and their management. I won't say the organizations, although, you know, the organization be proud of it.[00:17:14] Their organization's leadership wants these kids to be successful. And they're rewarding their managers for making them successful, even if, even if it means moving out of their teams. And that is such a difference in, unfortunately I think how a chunk of folks in retail still operate. And that's, that's something that we, as a whole have to say, we, you can't do that.[00:17:33] You gotta, you gotta promote, you gotta encourage, you got to let these people grow and you know, it, it's just a different mindset. So, Ron, I just want to celebrate you. I want you to be amazingly successful and I want you to carry that message far and wide, because that we have to get to that point.[00:17:50] Gautham Vadakkepatt: If I could just echo what Jeff said. If, if there are more Ron's people who could actually create that amazing first experience, For people who get into college, that would be awesome because just frankly, in the past 10 years I've been teaching very few times have students actually come in saying that, Hey look, I've had a great experience.[00:18:16] And so most of the effort I put in, in that first course is always towards trying to reframe what their experiences are and how Ron said it. Right? Like you can frame being a store manager, working in the store in so many different ways and so many useful skills that you develop, but they don't get to see it that way.[00:18:38] And until we can actually change that, none of the rest of the point is difficult to address. You got to change that initial perception that people have.[00:18:49] Ron Thurston: Yeah. And I think thank you for those compliments. That's really nice. And I'll tell you a funny side story and then I'll make a comment that there was, I was, a general manager for Banana Republic in 1996 in the Houston Galleria. And I just know that because I had moved from LA to Houston for Gap, Inc., and I was running that store and there was a young woman who was 16 at the time and who I hired, who was an absolute rock star.[00:19:16] Her name was Sarah. And she went on to become the vice president of planning and allocation for Neiman Marcus because Texas based and through her journey we had stayed in contact. So today she's a mom of two kids and I was listening to a podcast and she was talking about me and learning those skills early in her career and kind of mentorship and inspiration.[00:19:43] And it isn't as if I been a mentor for her for the last 20 years. But the impact that we can make early in someone's career is it's, it's like parenting. It's like every decision that you make has an influence on someone, how someone engages in the workforce. And I don't ever take that lightly. And I, I encourage others to do the same, but this is a really good example of investing in store level leadership.[00:20:14] And we put so much emphasis in our industry on senior leadership and, how brands set the stage around culture and vision, but it is only done well and executed at the store level. And the whole thing can either be extraordinary and executed at the average store in average place. And Jeff I'm from California.[00:20:38] So I know Mervyn's really well. And that's where I also grew up. But the idea of how does that trickle down, but what does that investment from the ground up versus top down and how we can make a huge difference and just the future of the workforce. And we are in desperate times right now, we see exactly what is happening.[00:21:00] If we don't fix this, we are going to be in a very difficult situation. And for me, this is a fire that we have to fix right now. Priming students for a career in retail[00:21:09] Ricardo Belmar: It is a crisis mode from that perspective. And what I usually talk about is it's years of neglect and just paying lip service to wanting to make conditions better creating career paths that, that are more meaningful.[00:21:21] And it now it's all coming to the surface and, becoming a much more visible problem as workers have realized they have, other options that they can pursue. [00:21:29] I would argue it starts with the industry itself. Right. And I think Ron, this is some of the things that you were pointing out as well, that it has to come from within. Do you have the ability to present what are those career paths that might entice someone.[00:21:42] Walk that path and pursue it as they go into a college setting. So I want to come back on that note then to something else Gautham that you said , back to the point you made about the emerging technologies class that you're doing, what, what are your thoughts on how broad of a retail focused program at a university need?[00:22:01] How much breadth does it need to cover? So things like, the basics of a retail business, for example, but then also, you know, you're, you're talking about emerging technologies, which I would view as one of those more enticing things that might get people who would not consider a career in the retail industry, but maybe is very interested in one of those emerging technologies as a way to learn how that applies in this industry.[00:22:22] But beyond that, even what are some of the other areas that you look to either introduce in your program or that you think, universities are best positioned to really enable that s [00:22:32] Gautham Vadakkepatt: That's a great question. So my own perspective, and look, there are lots of universities that have retail programs, right? So there's always, you got to get what I think we can be safe to say is that you got to get the fundamentals of retail, correct. Before you can build on to things, right. Which would be managing the stores, which would be managing the merchandise and so forth.[00:22:56] And then you got to get to prepare yourself for the future, which is where the emerging technologies. So from my perspective, you need to have a combination of both typically where I see some of the programming lack is that later aspect, being able to react to those waves of destruction that are coming through or create a destruction, right.[00:23:19] And being able to prime the students. To be ready and to be able to respond to those changes. What I always tell my students is a very simple thing. Look, retail is a sector, anything and everything that is cool and current, you can learn and apply in retail. Right? So I've always said this to my students and many of them are computer science students.[00:23:44] They always say, Hey, I don't want to work in retail. And then a year of working with me, then they are actually working in retail. Right. And so there is something for everyone. That's the really awesome part about retail and my job as an academic and most of our academic institutions jobs is to expose students to that options, the variety of options.[00:24:04] And today the cool thing is technology, right? And it's, it's just, it's the cool thing. And many of the, the talent deficit when it comes to that is how do you apply these technologies into re. And most of the students who have the skills and technology don't want to go into retail. So by trying to build these bridging classes, that applied technology into retail, the hope is to get them excited and to keep that pipeline going.[00:24:29] If that makes sense. So I hope I answered the question because it's not one or the other, right. It's talk to get the fundamentals. The merchandising aspect is critical. If you are a retailer, you have to get that right. But you also have to get it right. To understand what's that future of retail look like.[00:24:45] And that's where things like people are doing a really amazing, right. You need to know how do you apply NFT. How do you apply things like blockchain and how do you apply AI into retail? Those are things that you need to understand so that you can do better moving forward.[00:25:00] Ricardo Belmar: I think that's a critical aspect is to really cover that wide variety of things and to kind of create an awareness that says, you know, retail is not just about one thing. You can do all of these other things in this industry as a way to really you know, get those students excited about it and interested in wanting to pursue that career path.[00:25:18] So let's go on to another topic that I think is another significant area that universities can contribute in retail. And that's what I'm going to call community building, which is creating this environment where in addition to students and that young talent pool that you're developing, you're also connecting retailers with other parts of the ecosystem in really a neutral environment, right? It's, you know, you might be connecting other technology providers and vendors. You should be connecting startups even connecting VCs with those startups because you have this kind of neutral platform. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts around, what would you expect universities to be doing in this area where you're creating that community within the retail ecosystem?[00:26:02] Gautham Vadakkepatt: I'll be the student and I'll listen to all the comments, because this is, [00:26:05] Ricardo Belmar: yeah. I'd like to hear you. Yeah. I'd like to hear your thoughts Gautham at the end. And in fact, I'm going to put Jeff on the spot and ask Jeff to start [00:26:12] Jeff Roster: let's see. What would I like to see? Given that retail is such a large employer and given universities are looking for connections, I would like to see universities that want to engage in retail to have to reach out to the retail industry, set up mentorship programs, set up online conversations set up a clubhouse room to bring in, you know, retail executives and invite students to come and engage.[00:26:35] You know, all of the above, reach out to the industry and say, who wants to, you know, who wants to help transform everything? I mean, you know, Ron, Ron set it up perfectly. W w you know, it's a, what's a five alarm fire going on right now. So let's start, let's start figuring out how to fix it.[00:26:49] Let's open up conversations. Let's, let's think about what university needs to do, you know, in 2023, not what it did in 1980 .[00:26:56] Ricardo Belmar: That's a great point. You got a long list of good suggestions there. Ron, I'll ask you, what, what are some of your thoughts on this point? [00:27:02] Ron Thurston: Yeah, I agree with it all the Jeff said that and, and I think what we can do is make it even less complicated. So when we think about how we, how the industry can insert itself into the, into the education system to make it a a lunch and learn, make it a quick conversation, make it a zoom call with your class.[00:27:26] I know the other night I was on the phone with Ricardo and Casey and then jumped onto a class at NYU of students who were studying law with a focus on retail. And interestingly enough, they had a lot of questions about how the industry actually works. How do retail executives engage with the legal community, how like good experiences I may have had how was the org how are organization set up? It's like they had almost no knowledge of the industry yet they were studying it and choosing a specialty of retail and you know, so fine. It's an hour for me. And that's an easy ask for any of us to just jump in and share our experience, share the brands, share a careers talk about the power of the industry.[00:28:16] And I personally like would like to be asked more. And then I have a large set of peers who would say the same. It's a pleasure because when we were growing up, whether it's Jeff at Mervyn's or, you know, myself at, at Broadway department store to start, and then many years at gap, I would have loved to have heard from other people about how to navigate this industry, that no one's going to teach you how to do, you either figure it out yourself, or you have people around you that you can ask great questions. And so I think ask more and and make it easy for us to do.[00:28:53] Ricardo Belmar: Want to introduce Mia Lupo, who just joined us on stage. I think Mia, you have some thoughts you wanted to share on this topic.Retail Curriculum Example [00:28:58] Mia Lupo: Yeah, sure. Thanks Ricardo. And thanks everyone for being here. I'm gonna share my experience coming from a small liberal arts university, I graduated from Salve Regina university. It's based in Newport, Rhode Island, beautiful school. That's what everyone seems to just test has to say about it, but we do have other things besides being beautiful school.[00:29:19] So one thing I think it depends. It's like the, it's the commitment of higher education to recognize retail is vital and relevant, which we, of course we know that, but you know, having the commitment, having retail integrated in the curriculum. So for example business is the business degrees.[00:29:41] They're a strong arm at Salve Regina's campus. And so one of the professors doctor app grab, she does have a semester course dedicated to retail. And not only does that include, kind of the ins and outs of how retail business works, but it also includes kind of hands-on interactions with alumni who are in retail, working retail currently.[00:30:05] And on top of that, it building upon a depends on the university's commitment to exploring retail, you know, the alumni network. I think that's a huge, under utilized, simple, easy way. For example, Ron was talking about, these meet and greets for like an hour to, talk about who they are, for alumni to talk about who they are, what they do.[00:30:26] And so. For example, for me, I was invited to virtually visit campus and discuss, my career journey and retail, which is, will be nine years, like next year. And a lot of students I believe are curious, but it's like being able to provide those opportunities. And I think, being able to utilize our networks accordingly to, help get the word out.[00:30:51] So that's my 2 cents on that.[00:30:53] Ricardo Belmar: Thanks for sharing that Mia. I appreciate it. So let me pause here at this moment, Gautham you've been listening to everybody's comments so far is anything standing out to you or do you have any strong thoughts either about what everyone has suggested?[00:31:05] Or maybe there are things that we didn't suggest yet? [00:31:09] Gautham Vadakkepatt: No, I love all the suggestions and it, you know, I love it, particularly both Ron and Mia had to say one Ron saying like, it's an hours commitment, right? That the simple, low lying fruit that can actually transform. I can say this personally, like I got about eight speakers in my class, and that was one small comment that one of the speakers made that literally brought one of the students to tears.[00:31:35] And they connected, and then they had some further conversation. So it's a very limited ask, but it can have the potential to transform literally students' life. And so all these simple opportunities, the one that we have said, right. To getting people and talking to the alumni base and so forth, we're trying to do all those things.[00:31:54] But any other thoughts to make students more excited about retail in general would be greatly appreciated. [00:32:02] Mia Lupo: I do have one other thing I can offer. Salve Regina, we do have a center dedicated to connecting small businesses. So for business majors, their final project for the year is to do like the business plan and they are connected with a number of small businesses or small to medium-sized businesses throughout Rhode Island.[00:32:27] And to come up with suggestions and ideas. And I think that something like that, like a hands-on opportunity, connecting with the community is a really interesting way to, you know, kind of give them that real life experience to really fully analyze what it really takes to, be in retail and, the, the opportunity of it now, again, that's, for, a small liberal arts university.[00:32:51] That's just, an example of a smaller scope, but, it's still all the more reason it could be something that's, very important to get students involved. I mean, plenty, plenty of colleges and universities use students, as you know, mini think tanks to, think of so many great ideas and to push their business forward.[00:33:11] So maybe that's something that, larger retailers could invite, could invite students to new, do more projects to submit things. It could be very interesting[00:33:21] Gautham Vadakkepatt: if I could just make one comment on that. I would love the larger retailers to do that, but I will say this on behalf of the small re, like our school does this with the small retailers and there's a lot of it and they give students a great opportunity to make their resume look different. And it also exposes them to the opportunities in retail.[00:33:41] So that'd be a really great opportunity to have. And if there are retailers in the room, please do reach out.[00:33:47] Ricardo Belmar: I do think that is a wonderful idea of, or any kind of project work like that, that you can connect with a retailer that just would provide so much valuable experience for the students to really understand the business and understand the impact of the problem they're trying to solve. But with that project, I think that's just a wonderful, wonderful way to go.Retail vs Commerce - a misperception?[00:34:06] Casey Golden: I think there's also something that I've found is the difference of perception between retail and commerce. The commerce seems to be cooler. And go figure. But what retail means to a lot of people is very different. And everybody seems to understand what commerce is whether or not it's omni-channel or bricks or clicks or, or whatever that is, whether or not it's it's travel or fashion or home goods.[00:34:33] It's kind of just not it's not as, as, as pigeonholed by perception, I'm finding. So I do find that that might be something that is interesting. I find it, I find your program to be so impactful the way that you've, you've designed. As somebody who, I mean, I've got my second bachelor's in apparel design and merchandise planning, and it was still very much designed around the fact and marketed that I was going to be a designer.[00:35:03] And granted, I thought I was going to be a designer till I learned production, but it was never brought up to go into the tech side to go into supply chain management, managing production was never a conversation about an ERP system. And I feel like a lot of the, the more that changes that you can be in tech and be in commerce or retail.[00:35:26] There's a lot of other jobs out there that do pay better than what they may have that preconceived notion of. So I think it's, I think it's all very interesting as we kind of build out these new curriculums and Gautham, I think you're just doing a really great job. [00:35:42] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Thank you. [00:35:43] Ricardo Belmar: That's a really fascinating point you made there Casey about how the perception is different if you frame it in terms of commerce versus retail. And I wonder if, if there's some of that have to do with I guess you were saying right, that the production side of things, or, you know, if you're looking at fascia and it's because you're looking at the design side of it, or is it because in recent years, we've, we've had so much more build up from a media perspective of direct to consumer brands and digitally native brands that somehow that appears different to students than what they might think of as a traditional retailer.[00:36:14] Gautham does that ever come up, but with your students, is there a variation in that perception.[00:36:19] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Absolutely. There is don't, please don't take this the wrong way, but there is a negative perception around retail and that's why I applaud Ron for what he does in changing that initial experience. And it's, it's part of that, right? When you take that frame out of their thinking and you juxta position a different framework, they seem to have a different mindset.[00:36:46] Very, very different mindset. And I'll say it, it is just a mindset issue because through the length of the program, what students have come to realize is that commerce and retail are the same thing, and retail and have for negative connotation. This was one of the students who actually said that they'd like, yeah, I didn't think about all these other things that you had.[00:37:11] The speakers have highlighted as far as being retail. I was like, yeah, but I thought that was all commerce. So that's part of just the mindset mentality that is driven by past lived experiences. And this is where, those first impactful moments are crucial to ensure that the supply of talent into retail continues to be of high quality and addresses the new skills that's needed.[00:37:37] Ricardo Belmar: Perception it's really, it's such an important point an issue to overcome, right? Because it all comes back to that perception of, is this, or is this not an interesting career path for me as a graduating student? And where is it going to lead? I want to kind of connect the dots with this on the, the question of community building, because, we're bringing up a lot of interesting facts around what makes it interesting to that student into that graduating student to stay in the, in the retail industry.[00:38:04] So when I look at community, I'm also thinking about how the university as that kind of neutral environment. And I like to think of it as a neutral environment, because in that sense, the university doesn't have an agenda other than to educate students at this point. So it is neutral from the perspective I believe of the retailer and technology providers.[00:38:24] If we look at this from a perspective of what if the university brought together some of those key technology providers that are doing these new emerging things for retailers and some of the startups that are coming around who are probably also looking for young talent, that they can bring into their startup organization with a fresh perspective and with an ability and understanding of what retailers need to have, because they've been through this program. What can universities do as they pull those together that not just makes it useful and enticing for the students, but then in turn makes it valuable for those organizations.[00:39:00] You know, what's going to make it valuable for the startups to be interested in coming to this neutral environment at the university to meet the students as well as any of the other technology providers. So I want to spend a few minutes on this point and Shish, I think you've got your audio issues sorted out, right?[00:39:15] Shish Shridhar: Yep. [00:39:15] Ricardo Belmar: Really curious to give you a chance to comment on this part. Building an ecosystem for startups[00:39:19] Shish Shridhar: Well, so one of the areas that Gotham and I have been working on figuring out is really trying to build that ecosystem where one, I think the point that he made that that universities are really that neutral place where retailers could go to one of the challenges I find, when working for tech vendor is there is potential perception of bias there and where, there's multiple tech vendors and, and each one will come in with the buyers for their technology. And universities are in a position to kind of work across all of these tech vendors and be able to pick the best of the, startups out there and make recommendations based on that.[00:40:08] So I kind of think from that perspective, there is a possibility for us to bring together identify what are the top innovations happening? What's the emerging technologies happening and a respective of what tech vendor they are affiliated to, to have that unbiased rating and capabilities being listed out.[00:40:31] So that's one aspect of it. And what you pointed out is, you know students and engaging students is an important element for, for startups. And that ecosystem could be beneficial for startups as well where they could engage, collaborate with startups, with the students. The other aspect of it that Gautham and I have been talking about is really building GMU to be the place where startups could be born.[00:41:00] One. Really reaching out to retailers to determine what are the big business challenges that retailers are trying to solve today that we don't have solutions for. And then building out potentially maybe a hackathon around that and bringing together students, bringing together startups to help address those challenges, providing the resources for that, and then building an ecosystem that will create startups, innovative startups that are trying to solve the top problems in retail.[00:41:37] And that's again, another aspect that Gautham and I have been talking about as well. [00:41:42] Casey Golden: Yeah, I think that's really great. I just spoke to Northwestern. And they have a, program of, they call them company cohorts and companies come in and it's almost like a job fair at the beginning of a term. And you literally, the students go in there and they sign up for a cohort with a company and they spend the next 16 weeks working for the company as their class.[00:42:12] I find it incredibly interesting. And the person I was speaking to mentioned that there's a huge interest in fashion and retail and retail tech and direct to consumer brands and people who want to open up their own or work in that field. But there was no brands or retailers or fashion companies that are part of the cohort.[00:42:34] And so, you know, JP Morgan's there, Bain is there, there's, there's all these other companies, but there wasn't any brands or retailers. So I think that that's a really good way as just reaching out even and putting ourselves with the universities to, to build it so that we can also, you know, start developing that talent early and these students get a chance to participate.[00:43:00] They even have a venture program, which I found really interesting. Ron and I both met this gal Gabby when we were in Dominican Republic , and they have a, a venture analyst team there and they work with the alumni for deal flow so that these people, these students are able to start understanding venture capital.[00:43:23] And they're just, they're just helping startups. To get experience,[00:43:30] you know, so I think more practical ways that, and it's, it's considered a cohort and it's a 16 week class. Just like if you were going in to taking a class for biology, but you're actually working for companies, [00:43:41] Ricardo Belmar: what a great experience. [00:43:43] Gautham Vadakkepatt: I was going to say, I love that idea. And you know, Casey to your point generally, what academics, what is common across all academia is that there is a gap, right?[00:43:54] Like once you get into a company takes my statistics, are it takes two years to kind of bring them on board or that's the statistics that I've been provided. So doing these kinds of cohorts stuff, actually sharpens that. Right. And so they get hit the ground running. I hadn't thought about that. So it'd be wonderful to get retail involved in something like that.[00:44:16] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think that would be a fantastic experience for everyone involved that would be producing really amazing outcomes too. I think that would be fascinating. [00:44:24] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, a lot of times these new grads, they they're not ready for the job. [00:44:28] Ricardo Belmar: And I think that's a great way to kind of give them that early exposure, right?[00:44:31] Casey Golden: Yeah. Really getting that early exposure. And you know, we have a history of wooing people into the fashion industry about trips to Paris and living in New York. And we never, there's no TV show that ever mentions that you're spending, you know, nine hours a day in an Excel file. [00:44:55] Ricardo Belmar: I think that part gets edited out of each episode.[00:44:59] Casey Golden: And then you don't realize how much math you. The amount of math that you do in retail would make any person's head spin that they didn't realize you could do math like that. And I think that that's, that's something that's definitely underlooked or overlooked. Right. You know, like it's heavy math.[00:45:19] Gautham Vadakkepatt: It's true. I will support that point even to this day when I, my classes is always numbers heavy. And they're like, this is retail. I'm like, yeah, it does retail. That's what you got to do fully agree with that last [00:45:36] Casey Golden: No, you get marketing and go into fashion is like pretty much what is that? That, that commentary? I wouldn't have ever really learned math if it wasn't for Polo University. I started out Ralph Lauren, I got handed a $30 million business and they put me into retail math classes every Friday.[00:45:57] So I think it, I think it's really important that students know really what's expected of these jobs and especially the senior positions on what it's going to take to get you there. And if, if you're prepared you don't have to be that coordinator for that long. [00:46:17] Ricardo Belmar: That's a great, great point.[00:46:18] And also speaks to an opportunity where the retailers that don't have that kind of Polo University, they should be working with universities to create those professional programs and make them available for both, you know, any existing executives or anyone who's wants to go down that path and get to those positions and have that available to them.[00:46:37] So they don't research it and feel like they have to do that in house, right. They have access to other education institutions that can help them with that. And then would love to see more of that happening. [00:46:47] I have one last topic to throw out for everyone. And I'm going to direct this one to Jeff first as who we all collectively always refer to as "the analyst."Universities drive neutral research [00:46:55] Ricardo Belmar: And this point is really about how university can contribute as a, again, focusing on the neutrality aspect of it, but as a neutral research platform that, and be able to research and contribute to the different projects in that way, in a way that, you know, you can't expect other vendors or technology provider sources to do, to do things that retailers are trying to solve. So, Jeff, what's your, what are some of your thoughts on that research perspective? [00:47:19] Jeff Roster: Well, I mean, you got it. You got it exactly right. The only neutral platform out there is universities and could maybe make the case. They, you know, a vendor might have some influence there, but no, no one else is neutral.[00:47:31] Literally. No one else's neutral and no one has as many scientists and engineers and want to be scientists and want to be engineers. So to me, It's just such a natural marriage. I just love, love what Casey said. What gosh, how could I, how could I get into that training program for venture? What if I could fake, like I'm a kid again?[00:47:51] It just, it's such a logical place to go. We're all trying to figure out the next iteration of, of the consumer. And guess who's sitting, sitting, you know, in a giant sea of these consumers, it's the university who is who, who is paid to research universities. You know, it's just such a perfect venue that I don't think we in retail have really even begun to scratch the surface of.[00:48:14] And that's why, I love what Gautham is doing now. He's stepping out and not just talking about supply chain or not just talking about merchandising, but, but really if you look at a lot of the work it's it's AI, which I'm obviously a huge fan of it's low code it's, it's blockchain, it's all of these emerging technologies that these kids are going to get exposed to.[00:48:33] And whether they stay in retail or not, they're going to be literally working with 21st century technologies. And I just, I just think this is a fantastic opportunity for, for literally everyone involved, including the executives that'll get involved, they'll gain five X more than they'll ever give. You cannot out-give generosity.[00:48:50] It always, it always comes back fivefold. [00:48:53] Casey Golden: Well, that's it. These are our customers, you know, like crazy. They are our customers. We want them about to get jobs.[00:49:02] They are our customers. I worked at Abercrombie and Fitch back when that was super cool to do. And I was always very impressed. At the time I was there in order to get a job at corporate or move into corporate, you had to be a store manager. Unless you were like probably some very senior executive that got transferred in.[00:49:24] Otherwise you had to be a store manager for at least one year before you could take a job at corporate. And I fought, I felt that that was such a great way to bring everybody in with. Real experience managing the stores. And they too did all of their recruiting. At high schools and colleges, they had a huge footprint on campus.[00:49:48] I mean, I went to games like I was at football games. I was at basketball games with like five to 10 people on my staff, recruiting employees to come work at the store, but there was such a presence on campus and the brand was on, was there and coming to games and starting to make that impact. And, you know, at that every single what, two days a week, we had a minimum of 50 people wanting to interview twice a week.[00:50:19] And there was huge amounts of people that wanted to work at the company because. You know, one of the reasons is we showed up.[00:50:26] So I think that, you know, there's a lot of opportunity there to get involved with, with more campuses and, and get the brand presence involved with the culture so that people are aware and, and they've known for a long time and, and they got to work for the company. They got to intern for the company.[00:50:44] And that's the beginning of brand equity. I feel in a lot of places. [00:50:48] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that becomes a much more collaborative environment and in much more inclusive that way. And I think you're absolutely right in calling it a brand equity, because it really just creates an affinity for not just that brand, but even for the industry as a whole.[00:51:02] Gautham, I know you have a specific point of view on contributions that universities can make on the research perspective. So I wanted to hear your thoughts [00:51:10] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Yeah, my job is correlated with my research productivity, right? Teaching is a required aspect, but I get evaluated mostly on my research.[00:51:20] And so there is a large opportunity for universities to get involved in research that addresses industry specific problems. Right? All universities are trying to do these things, right. So it is, it is a shared responsibility. It's a shared dance. It can't be that one person comes to the table. It has to be everyone.[00:51:41] And by that, I mean, the retailers, as well as the vendors all have to come together to do research that actually helps advance industry, but really are, we get paid to do research, right? Why not leverage us and our students, actually, many of us students crave to do research as well. And so this is a good training ground to get the future prepared for what it is, it hones their thinking ability, it hones their ability to do research.[00:52:12] It also gives them a deeper dive into specific industries. So for me, I get most excited about the opportunity to do research and the, the possibility of the center and full disclosure, every center, and most institutions try to do. Right. The opportunity to partner with retailers or retail associations to address industry specific problems excites me.[00:52:38] The challenge is trying to figure out how to do the dance, right? How do we how do we do the research that helps both the university as well as a retailer, while still maintaining the critical aspect that Jeff said neutrality to be the neutral ground. We don't have an option. We cannot pick sides. And so we have to be neutral and that requires more detail, more thoughtful and careful research.[00:53:04] Ricardo Belmar: I hear what you're saying. I think you're absolutely right. And it's one of these things that's so overlooked, I think by the industry when there's so much opportunity here, because as you pointed out, one of your primary roles is to do research. And as, as every university is doing, and the students have a very big role to play in, in many cases, in that research. So it's just something that the industry and I think Jeff said this as well, just doesn't take enough advantage of and, and leveraging to really understand how they could solve so many different problems by just looking at this research. And, and again, from that neutral point of view, because the university is not doing this from a perspective that some vendors are going to be perceived as yes, we'll help you figure out that problem because we hope to sell you something at the end.[00:53:48] And sometimes that's true. Sometimes that's not. But from the university's perspective, that's not even in anyone's head, right. It's not a goal that anyone has is just do the research to see what the outcome is. And then what can we learn from that? And how can that be applied? And that's something that would be a benefit to any retailer.[00:54:04] When you look at it, what can be done in that kind of outcome? [00:54:07] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Yeah. And if I may add, right, there's also the opportunity that each retailer or solution provider, whatever we'll house specific problems that are particular to them, right. And they might not have the bandwidth or the resources to dedicate time and effort to do it.[00:54:23] These might not be high priority, obviously should not be high priority problems. But these could be problems that are important to their operations. And this could be another chance to partner with universities and faculty and students to kind of get those problems addressed, get some insights from there and, you know, move from there.[00:54:41] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's another excellent point on the research component to this. And just for me, more, more reasons why that should be leveraged more often and in so many more ways that are just a missed opportunity and the way it's looked at today. Closing thoughts[00:54:56] Ricardo Belmar: I think we could probably talk for even another hour on this topic. I think, you know, Gautham, I think I probably won the bet on that one about how much interest there would be in how long this conversation would go. But we, we were kind of curious what to everyone would want to contribute to this discussion, but I think we've actually touched on a lot of different areas.[00:55:12] I want to give Gautham, Ron, both of you as our special guests this week. Any, any last thoughts you have before we close?[00:55:19] Ron Thurston: Thanks. Thank you, Ricardo. It's so interesting because we all, we all can be involved in this. And I think that the conversation from the brand side to find new ways to develop and hire and train and bring people into this industry is at a point where new ideas have to come forward and, and capitalizing on some of this university partnership.[00:55:45] Could 2022 could be the year where this actually gets much better. And that's what I'm hearing tonight is, we, some of us have had great experiences when it was really good and in some earlier years and we have to get back to that place. That's how people came into this industry. Many of us did, we have to get back there and now is the time to do that well, and it's, it's actually really exciting, as hard as it is right now.[00:56:12] I find the opportunity to be really thrilling what the future is going to look like. So thank you for having me tonight. [00:56:18] Ricardo Belmar: Thank you, Ron. I think you're spot on the fact that this is a subject area where everyone has an ability to help move things forward and contribute for the better of the industry.[00:56:29] And I think it just requires that everyone participate at the end of the day and in whatever ways those are you know, and I think universities and academics have a really great ability to help lead us on this path. Gautham, any final thoughts. [00:56:42] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Yeah. I think you hit the nail on the head Ricardo and Ron.[00:56:44] First, Ron, thank you for all the mentorship. Right? We need mentors. We need people who will step up and thanks to everyone who does that. And we need more of that. We can change the dialogue if more people step up and thank you for everyone who's doing it. The second aspect is that, the George Mason university is just one of the centers that's trying to change retail, right? There are lots of schools just connect with academia in general, and to try and make those moments, those contact points with the students to help and our faculty to help change the conversation. And it could be an hour long.[00:57:23] Most schools, at least Mason has a program where you tell me how many hours you want to engage with our institution and we'll get you into the right type of program for that. And it could be from a research perspective, it would be from a teaching perspective, it could be from a mentorship perspective.[00:57:42] So this is a call for anyone and everyone to kind of come support the centers, as well as all academic institutions. We're trying to change the conversation.[00:57:52] Ricardo Belmar: thanks Gautham. I appreciate you and Ron joining us today. I think this was probably one of my favorite topics that we've done in the room and in recent memory. Kind of feel like we came to the end here with, with very significantly more positive vibe maybe then we came into it because we had so many constructive and useful suggestions that everyone offered.[00:58:10] I'm really pleasantly surprised that we had such wonderful contributions to a topic that doesn't really get enough attention for the betterment of the retail industry. So again, I want to thank everybody for having joined us today in the Retail Razor room and everybody have a great weekend. Gautham Vadakkepatt Interview[00:58:24] Ricardo Belmar: Welcome back everybody. We are fortunate to have one of our special guests with us, Gautham Vadakkepatt, director of the Center for Retail Transformation at George Mason University. [00:58:33] Casey Golden: Welcome to the show. Gautham, glad to have you with us today. [00:58:36] Gautham Vadakkepatt: Thank you for having me. [00:58:38] Ricardo Belmar: So Gotham one area, we didn't get a chance to dig into very much in the clubhouse session is a bit related to what Shish brought up in relation to startups.[00:58:47] And that's building an ecosystem of technology innovation and thought leadership around retail operations, and retail te

S1E4 – Top 10 Trends & Predictions for 2022Welcome to Season 1, Episode 4, the fourth ever episode of The Retail Razor Show!I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock and slayer of retail frankenstacks!Together, we're your guides on the retail transformation journey. Whether you're thinking digital and online, mobile, or brick & mortar stores, we'll help you cut through the clutter!For episode 4 we've changed it up a bit and jumped over to the Callin platform to record this special episode where we give you our Top 10 Trends and Predictions for 2022!Hear what we're thinking matters most for 2022 and what we expect it means for retail and retail tech. If you have any comments on what we've said, be sure and hit us up on Twitter or LinkedIn! And be sure and follow us on Callin so you don't miss future episodes where we'll be interviewing the people who are transforming retail and retailtech!The Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorJoin our club on Clubhouse: http://bit.ly/RRazorClubListen to us on Callin: https://bit.ly/RRCallinSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - ****https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS1E4 Top 10 Trends & Predictions for 2022[00:00:20] Introduction[00:00:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hello everyone. And welcome to retail razor show our first recording here on the Callin platform. So this is exciting, isn't it? Casey. [00:00:27] Casey Golden: It is. [00:00:28] Ricardo Belmar: I'm looking forward to our future episodes here. We're going to do some really cool interviews with people who are really doing things to transform retail and commerce.[00:00:37] Casey Golden: Anything that makes it easier to have these conversations, I'm in. [00:00:41] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly. Exactly. So today we've got some fun stuff we're doing. We're going to talk about our top 10 trends and predictions for 2022. Because it's the beginning of the year. So of course we have to do that. Right. [00:00:52] Casey Golden: We do. And we have what, nine months to implement ?[00:00:55] Ricardo Belmar: That's right.[00:00:56] So we're hopefully improving our odds of success so that when we can do this next time, everyone can come back and say, Hey, they got that one right.[00:01:03] Casey Golden: Exactly. I will be keeping score!. [00:01:07] Ricardo Belmar: Well, we'll see how we each do here. I think we've each got five to share. So we'll see how we do this time next year.[00:01:13] #1 - Retail Media Networks & Customer Data[00:01:13] Ricardo Belmar: All right. So let's jump into top 10 trends and predictions. I'll kick off. And my first one has [00:01:20] to do with retail media networks which I know people who might be listening to, they're going to say, oh, that's not much of a prediction, but the slight twist I'm putting on this is a, they're kind of two schools of thought on this.[00:01:32] A number of people in the industry are saying that they're starting to see too many of these retail media networks and that they're all competing for the same ad capacity with brands. And how is any individual retailer really going to make a dent when Amazon's commanding over a third of all of this retail media network ad spend.[00:01:51] And my take on that is it, I feel like that's the wrong perspective to take because these networks aren't necessarily competing with each other. What they're really competing against are other forms of media, whether it's print, TV, streaming, video networks, all those kinds of things, or just plain old display ads on Google.[00:02:11] You know, these retail media networks are designed so that knowing that I'm already on the retailers platform and that's, we're assuming that retailer has a [00:02:20] marketplace on their e-commerce. So really what are they trying to do? I think they're trying to do two things here. Yes. There is an added revenue stream they're trying to generate by getting brands to spend money with them and to, buy product placements. And obviously Amazon is the most successful, but there are plenty of others, Kroger's doing well with this, Home Depot is doing well with this. And I think there's lots of room for other retailers to do the same even Target does well although their marketplace is kind of by invitation so it's a closed one. It's not quite the same, but I think there's plenty of room for, for retailers to succeed here. Because again, it's not, you're not really measuring yourself against how much ad market share am I taking from Amazon? It's just how much ad space am I selling on my marketplace site?[00:02:59] That's really the metric that matters. So I think any retailer with a marketplace can make this work and that's why we're going to see so many, even Best Buy announced. I think within the last week that they're doing this, and there's also room to expand just beyond your own marketplace, I think Best Buy's announcement also said that not only can you buy ad placement on the marketplace site [00:03:20] bundled into this would also be promotional ads in the store. So if you're a brick and mortar and online marketplace retailer, you've got both of those available and best buy is also saying we'll do third-party placement on third party networks, as well as part of the bundle.[00:03:33] So they'll get some revenue out of that, even if the brand is saying, yeah, give me some ads on the Best Buy site, but then I also want it on, Google search. And it seems like Best Buy is saying, we'll manage that for you as part of the program. So I think lots of room there, the second really important thing for this, which is the one I, I believe everybody overlooks.[00:03:51] This is another great way for a retailer to generate customer data because as customers interact with the digital ads for this, That's new customer data that's feeding into, hopefully the retailer has a customer data platform. They add this in with all the other first party data they have. And guess what?[00:04:07] They're going to learn a lot more about how their customers are shopping. And I would argue that's even more important than the incremental revenue they're going to get from the retail media networks. So that's my prediction that we're just going to see every retailer that [00:04:20] does a marketplace on their site.[00:04:21] They're going to introduce a retail media network this year. [00:04:23] Casey Golden: I think we've, we've definitely learned over the last two years with the increase of the cost of advertising that a lot of brands and companies need to diversify those channels and, and spread that out because it's been quite concentrated and the prices were driven up extensively while everybody moved their media buys into digital.[00:04:44] Ricardo Belmar: That's true. That's true. [00:04:45] #2 - Brick & Mortar Expansion[00:04:45] Casey Golden: I'm coming in at number two with brick and mortar expansion. Physical retail is not dead. I it's going to change. Amazon's new department store is re-imagining the shopping and buying experience. Really reaching customers in a, in a non-traditional way for them. And we're going to see a lot more pop-ups versus anchor stores changing these physical spaces from stacks of shirts to entertainment and showrooms.[00:05:08] I think we can all agree that Glossier has been the big winner here and pop-ups, and with that model, I think we're going to be seeing a lot more short-term and flexible leases so that more brands can go [00:05:20] into a space, spend three months and have the opportunity to create an extension. Really starting to understand who your customers are, where they live, where your biggest market opportunity is and create moments where brands and consumers can go through that product discovery and experience the brand, circulates a lot more neighborhood freshness. And when brands are trying to increase that LTV you know, we're fighting very low conversion rates online. Having a pop-up store can really increase that LTV over the long run, because it can create that brand affinity that e-commerce just, hasn't been able to capture the same way that brick and mortar has with getting into routine and, and making that meaningful connection to a consumer [00:06:06] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I like this prediction a lot. I really agree with you on all those points. The big thing that a lot of people miss here with this, even when we're talking about natively digital brands that are just starting to open stores too, I think that's included [00:06:20] in what you're saying here at the end of the day, in some ways, right?[00:06:23] This is just one big experiment for the brand. And, and I think that's a good thing because we don't historically think of opening stores as an experiment. I think maybe Amazon changed everyone's viewpoint on that for the better. And I think that is how everyone should look at it because you can learn a lot from that pop-up experience, just like you described, and then feed that back into even other sales channels.[00:06:42] You have to make you adapt to your customers. And that's really the whole point, isn't it? [00:06:46] Casey Golden: It is. You know, we've got to get in front of customers in general, and sometimes that's just showing up in their neighborhood and saying, we're here to serve you. Come experience our brand. [00:06:57] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. And I'd say, if we really want to go out on a limb, we can kind of call this one, the the end of the retail apocalypse storyline.[00:07:03] Right. Because we're going to see more store openings as a result. [00:07:06] Casey Golden: I have seen a lot of announcements for new stores. [00:07:09] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly. [00:07:10] #3 - Social Commerce & Livestreaming [00:07:10] Ricardo Belmar: All right, let's go to number three. So number three, this may not come as a surprise to a lot of people because I know I, I think we've all talked about this frequently.[00:07:18] We've got some [00:07:20] other podcast episodes coming on it and that's social commerce and live streaming going big. This year across the U S and in north America, it may not get as big as we see it in China and Asia, but that's okay. It's got room to grow. I think this is going to be something we see from both small and large retail.[00:07:35] I think the big twist I'm going to put on this is when we think about particularly the livestreaming piece. And in fact, I'm going to say the live streaming component to this is more important than social commerce as a whole, even though we tend to lump those things together, a lot of people assume that when we say social commerce, we're talking about selling through Instagram and Facebook and all the different social media platforms.[00:07:57] And I think small retailers will keep doing that. I think that's where the growth for them is. But the challenge with that, and we've said this before in our, at our clubhouse sessions is you don't own the platform then, right? You're borrowing the social media platforms access to customers. So you're not owning the relationship there in your sales process.[00:08:15] I think live streaming is going to help retailers change that perspective a couple of different [00:08:20] ways. One is using their frontline store associates as the live streamers versus paid influencers. So rather than going out and spending a lot of money, hiring an Instagram influencers, we're going to see retailers start leveraging frontline staff, who, by the way, if you look at the demographics of who you have, a lot of your I'll assume younger, but not necessarily right.[00:08:39] A lot of your staff, they already know how to do this, they've got their own YouTube channel for other reasons outside of the job. Retailers are going to get smart and say, Hey, we can just use the folks we have. It actually turns into a career incentive to want to work in retail, above and beyond the challenges every retailer is facing in the current labor shortage and trying to figure out how they can pay workers enough. This becomes a new, I don't want to say career perk, but it's certainly a new skillset and something that makes the employee more competitive and retailers are going to want them.[00:09:08] So picture your store associate doing live streams in a one to many format, right from the store, or maybe even from a studio-like space that the store has now carved out of their back room [00:09:20] a front of the store in some way to do this kind of production on a regular basis and hosted from their website.[00:09:25] So they don't have to be dependent on the social media platforms to do this. They're going to build a following that way. Both the retail brand and the individual associates are going to build the following for the associate. It's a great skill. I think it's something they'll enjoy doing. Not every associate is going to do it.[00:09:41] And that's okay. I think this speaks to the our podcast, a couple episodes back with, with Ron Thurston. When we talked about segmentation of skillsets and, and frontline workers, some staff will be better at doing some of the backroom functions. Some are going to be better at fulfilling buy online pickup in store orders, and some are going to be your live streamers.[00:10:00] And I think the analogy for me here is the same way we look at the fitness instructors in the Peloton app. That's what we're going to see happen with frontline staff and retail stores because of live streaming and really go out on a limb and say, if mall operators out there are listening, I would be telling you, you should be thinking about how you can turn this kind of concept into a [00:10:20]service you offer your tenants in the mall, especially the smaller retailers you might land, or even better as an enticement to those digitally native brands that you're trying to get to either set up a pop-up or set up a short-term lease in the mall. This is another incentive you could create by providing the live streamer.[00:10:36] So think of it in terms of what happened in the gaming world on Twitch and YouTube with live streamers. We're going to start to see this happen in the retail world. And I think this is going to really change how we perceive those frontline store associates. You could even see tie-ins to loyalty programs may be a perk.[00:10:52] When you reached the loyalty tiers, you get to participate in one of the live streams with, at your local store, with one of the live streamers that you shop from. And all of that I've just described as kind of in that one to many format. There's also the concept of doing this one-on-one with a customer from a store.[00:11:06] I actually believe smaller retailers. They're going to be the ones to drive this forward first, and then we're going to see the larger retailers start picking it up. [00:11:13] Casey Golden: I agree. You know, one of my favorite examples of this is Cameron from Walmart. He, [00:11:20] launched a tech talk in Walmart and he changed a lot of people's perspective of Walmart and just, he made it fun.[00:11:27] I, this done like one of the best jobs Taking that on and Walmart embraced him and promoted him. In turn, there was a gentleman Tony that worked at Home Depot who was mixing paints on Tik Tok and he was fired. And so I think changing some thought leadership inside these organizations and sanely, there is a possibility that one of your associates could potentially go viral, create this position before you're ready for it.[00:11:56] But how do you feel about it? And are you going to embrace it and start moving it into an initiative? Or are you going to, you know, shut it down? So I think it's we've had enough experiments in the space That more grand should really be looking at if this happened. [00:12:11] Ricardo Belmar: Right. And I really think to your point, right, brands should be looking at this as a way of improving the work environment for [00:12:20] those associates that are doing this, because they're going to find that they'll start hiring associates, that this is the big part of the job they liked.[00:12:26] So as you do this, it's going to help you solve that labor shortage problem you're experiencing right now. And you can't hire enough people. This is an enticement, and it starts to turn that retail job into something about more than just what's the hourly salary, ? Because this is now something that an associate can turn into a meaningful career path too, especially if you're thinking about hiring younger associates or even college students, for example, that are probably every college student can talk to you right now. If we brought them on the show, we'll say, oh, I would love to do live streaming. And now what, if you tell them what you can get paid by a store to do it on the store floor to help them sell products. Like you probably already know a lot about them.[00:13:00] So what could be better. [00:13:02] Casey Golden: I agree. [00:13:03] #4 - Personal Shopping[00:13:03] Casey Golden: I'm coming in at number four, we've got personal shopping. I'm obviously biased if anybody knows what I do on a regular basis. But consumer expectations have reached an all time high. And there is no one way about it. There are so many different ways to engage [00:13:20]between sales associates, a customer brand, buying, a product is not always an easy process especially with so many new brands and new types of products tech enabled products.[00:13:32] There's a lot of questions that happened through the path, the path to purchase. So personal shopping, always a core aspect of the luxury industry. But it has yet to truly been scaled. A lot of clientelling software has been focused in store versus being digitally native. So I think we're going to see a lot more of sales associates being empowered.[00:13:55] And that is associate led goes big into bringing digital into the store and bringing those real human relationships and knowledge online. So, when you're working with an influencer, you're following an influencer, you don't have, you don't always get to talk to them and ask them a question and have a response without a delay.[00:14:14] And this is really where I see personal shopping and clienteling technology, being [00:14:20] able to enable these store associates that are already on payroll to be able to scale up their services, scale, their reach, and for brands to be able to pull that customer engagement from a question into a real time experience.[00:14:36] The front lane staff tech explosion is incredible. When we think of how many of them are already tech enabled, they're already tech savvy. Like you were mentioning for a lot of the social commerce and live streaming. But they are, their job is to work for X brand. And how are we enabling them?[00:14:53] You know, if we spend X amount of percentage of our budget to enable influencers and people who don't work for us, why are we not, doubling down. And enabling the people that do. So a lot of this software is coming out and being adapted for digital, if not coming out digitally native in the first place, but it alleviates a lot of mundane tasks and without losing jobs, [00:15:20] right.[00:15:20] It, it makes your staff more productive. And frankly happier if somebody said Hey, I need you to work into a store, but you can't sell online. You can't talk to a customer that you connected with again. You're just going to start from scratch every hour.[00:15:39] It's the reality, but it let's go ahead and take that a step further. I think with a lot of the younger people in retail This is a lot of people's first jobs. And I think we've all learned a few things from, from Ron and our accidental careers in retail, that this is an opportunity to really bring in talent and building , that brand relationship very early into their careers by being an employee.[00:16:05] So it's getting more and more common and easier for brands to be able to scale up one-to-one conversations and relationships and turn them into conversions. So obviously I'm excited about this area. I believe in personal shopping and product experts and [00:16:20] talent the last thing I would ever want to see in the world is that shopping turns into a completely automated and machine experience.[00:16:28] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, and to your last point there, about how alleviating the mundane tasks, I think that's where a big part of the conversation around automation, especially in the store, keeps getting overlooked. People focus on oh, no, oh no, . The robots are coming, they're going to replace all the employees, but that's not at all right.[00:16:44] It's more about how is that technology going to help get rid of all the mundane, tedious tasks so that those associates and, and personal shoppers can focus on what the job should be, that's helping customers, helping customers shop and buy and convert them. [00:16:58] Casey Golden: Exactly. And, and this all comes back to, coming all the way forward to customer data, right?[00:17:04] Every single one of these is really wrapped around the customer experience, how we serve a customer and the number one process into how do you serve a customer is to understand who they are and build that relationship as soon as. [00:17:18] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That's right. [00:17:19] #5 - Shopper Experience [00:17:19] Ricardo Belmar: And [00:17:20] that kind of takes us on into number five, which is all about that shopping experience itself.[00:17:24] Particularly in the, what I'm going to call an in store experience revolution that really meets digital and in a more immersive way. So here, I'm talking about how we can add computer vision and AI elements into that shopping experience. There's already lots of talk of how you can leverage AR and VR platforms in the store.[00:17:43] And really what I'm envisioning here is you're coming into a store. And even in addition to having that store associate help you with something, the products themselves, the displays are going to help immerse you in what the product is. So say, you're looking at a display and you pick up a product, maybe there's a surrounding screen or mirror around that that just suddenly starts showing you content about that product.[00:18:05] And it helps you understand better what it is. You know, we, we could think of a grocery shopping model where via AR, I pick up maybe I don't even pick it up. I am just standing near inappropriate area of produce. And I'm looking at, two different varieties of [00:18:20] oranges and I might scratch my head and say, well, which one do I want to buy?[00:18:23] And via AR suddenly I can see popping up in front of me, all kinds of information. What's the difference between those varieties, what kind of flavor they have, some of these things sound silly, but the fact is right, these are little things, even though it's a, it's a big piece of technology. There are little things that make that shopping experience so much more immersive and different from just tapping a product image on your phone and putting it in Instacart order.[00:18:47] So, you know, when we think about how you getting people to continue to want to shop in the store, it's building these immersive experiences. And sometimes that also means it's going to see a rise of cashier less checkout. So yes, Amazon was the first with the GO stores and they're expanding it to their grocery stores, but they're not the only ones doing this.[00:19:04] There are plenty of startups out there delivering this technology. Lots of retailers, both testing it out and even deploying it to the point where we're even now starting to see autonomous stores where these are really meant to be more of a convenience model, right. Where I might walk in and I pick up [00:19:20] something off the shelf, it registers that I picked it up.[00:19:22] I walk out and I get. You know, it's not the kind of, it's a different kind of shopping experience. It's not the one, like if you're going to buy luxury apparel, right. That wouldn't work in that model. But then there are things where I love what in the past year, what Schnucks markets did with their shelf, scanning robots to help eliminate a lot of the tedious employee tasks.[00:19:40] Like you were talking about Casey, where, you know, in the grocery store you're doing like across the chain, thousands upon thousands of temperature checks in the cooler cases all day long. Well, that's a pretty tedious task to ask your staff to do when they could be helping the customer find the item on the shelf.[00:19:55] That's where you're going to deploy things like robots and IOT and use computer vision to just get rid of all these things. So it had those have an indirect impact on the shopper experience. But when you put all of this together, I think now we're really talking about the whole, it's almost like the in-store experience as a customer platform is the way I would think about it, where all these technologies plug in and really immerse the shopper in the experience [00:20:20] by eliminating all the mundane things that kind of surround it and letting at the same time, letting the store staff focus on helping those customers.[00:20:27] So that's the shopper experience revolution I see is going to happen this year. And it's partly because most retailers I've talked to they're significantly increasing their technology spend in ways they never have before. If you think of it as a percentage of sales revenue, and that's because pandemic, I think has caused everyone to wake up and say, Hey, we've got to really convince people why they should be shopping with us, with me, with my brand in my store.[00:20:51] And that's where this is going to come from [00:20:52] Casey Golden: a hundred percent. I've seen so much engaging technology from startups in this space. That's just completely blown away. [00:21:00] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Oh yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.[00:21:02] #6 - Buy Now Pay Later - Bubble Burst[00:21:02] Casey Golden: So with that, we've got buy now pay later. Oh, I love it when we fund shopaholics anonymous, right. I mean, [00:21:10] Ricardo Belmar: exactly that [00:21:11] Casey Golden: my personal opinion on this just because I've seen some terrible, terrible stories in the past. But at the same time, you know, prices are getting more expensive. [00:21:20] And people are having a harder time getting, you know, a job or they're moving into becoming their own boss.[00:21:26] And with that, we need more payment options. You know, lay away doesn't always exist with companies these days. I know there's some people that are trying to reinvent it, but it's, it gets hotter and hard hotter. And the regulators are the only ones that are not going to know how this is going to shake out.[00:21:41] Klarna has done an incredible job making this a common narrative and a button you see on, on nearly every single e-commerce store. There's a lot of players in this space and some, some major credit card companies and banking operators are cutting out that middleman as well. So this really comes down to, you know, the lack of consumer protections today and really high APRs for buying something that was $40.[00:22:08] Instead of necessarily using it to buy something that was, $4,000. So I think we're going to see a lot of adjustments over the next two years with the buy. Now pay later. One of the biggest constraints I see are [00:22:20] returns and this has been a common concern is when you make a purchase the amount of time, it takes to make that return. And for the retailer to update the payment system of the return can incur late fees and then trying to get the customer service in order to get your return. So deeper integrations, I think that we'll see here easier to be able to start tracking returns.[00:22:41] And I think that this is going to get a lot bigger over the next 12 months and the regulators are coming in a very meaningful way. There's been a lot of, action in it's going to keep some attorneys, well fed let's say that. [00:22:54] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Do we put our line in the sand on this one, Casey, and say the bubble on this one may burst by the end of the year, [00:23:01] Casey Golden: it could very well burst by the end of the year.[00:23:03] And sometimes we kind of have to think about it as well. Should some things exist when it's can very easily negatively impact a consumer. [00:23:11] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Yeah. I agree with you on that one. This one, I do think you're right. It's going to, it keeps getting hotter. It keeps getting more popular, but at some [00:23:20] point there's, it almost seems like, you know that because we're talking about consumers, financial is there, there's a reckoning that comes along somewhere along the way, and the bill comes due so to speak, right?[00:23:29] So whether you're splitting up payments in it, eventually it also comes due and you still gotta pay it eventually. And in some ways, I dunno, I, I hear a lot of stories too. Like you said where this just bites people in the end because you either forget to make the payment or you miss something and no one I'm sure. I'm sure. No one is paying attention to the terms behind these. When they make a purchase using these, these, [00:23:51] Casey Golden: I don't even think you see it. I mean, I've never seen an APR when I've gone through the process, I've done a couple... [00:23:56] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. And they've been lucky enough to get to hide from the regulators so far. So I suspect what we'll see that come about, but before the end of the year, [00:24:05] #7 - AI, ML, Analytics in Sustainability, Traceability & Returns Management[00:24:05] Ricardo Belmar: so on our next one, and I'm going to come back a little bit to something you mentioned that I hadn't even thought about, right, but in this buy now pay later mode. And that's the impact on returns because for number seven, I'm going to talk about how the pervasiveness of [00:24:20] AI and machine learning and analytics in areas like sustainability, traceability, and returns. And I'm kind of putting all these things together because we've been talking about AI and retail for a while.[00:24:31] It's been particularly fruitful in supply chain management, right. Especially during the pandemic and for forecasting, but I think we're going to see this spread to pretty much every operational area of a retailers business. Particularly around getting to predictive and prescriptive analytics where before many retailers were just getting started with it.[00:24:52] This is all going to, it's going to go mainstream big this year. This every area functional area is going to get touched by AI and machine learning. And some way that particularly, I think the most interesting one here is going to be around returns. And that's because this, you know, even if it was a temporary burst, or bubble and increasing e-commerce buying during the pandemic, even if only some of that sticks around.[00:25:15] The fact is if you think about in apparel, right, we're talking easily 35, [00:25:20] 40% return rates from those purchases, and you have so many people doing things like, well, I really like this item, but I don't know if that size is going to work. So I'm going to order it in two sizes and return one. And when you start to add up all those things, just the, the massive reverse logistics and the costs involved with that, it's not just enough to optimize that returns process.[00:25:37] I'm starting to see, at least one really interesting startup I've worked with. and some others that are asking a better question, which is, what can I do to get smart about preventing returns in the first place? And maybe people aren't used to thinking of it that way, but I think it's the right way to look at it is how can I make the overall buying process such that my customer doesn't feel like they have to buy an excess amount of these things and with the intention to return, how can I build that trust in advance?[00:26:03] We're seeing AI and machine learning, being applied to help with that analysis to help the retailer understand how can I change my processes to reduce my return rate overall before the purchase is even made. And I think that's a unique way of framing it. And we're going to see more of that this year.[00:26:17] It's really going to become a popular thing. [00:26:20] I see people only just starting to talk about it in this context, but I think it's going to be much more mainstream by the end of the year. [00:26:25] Casey Golden: I agree. And with that traceability, even product origin and how it got to where it is. It, I think it's, we're going to see a lot more customer facing analytics where the customer's going to start being able to see the sustainability impact, the traceability, the origin, how it was created, how it got to my store in my neighborhood.[00:26:47] And those types of KPIs and analytics will be available for consumer consumption. [00:26:51] Ricardo Belmar: I agree, completely agree. Customers are looking for that now much more than they used to. [00:26:56] #8 - Rapid Delivery Shakeout[00:26:56] Casey Golden: So at number eight, going into rapid delivery, hyper-focused deliverability getting a rapid shake out. I'm in New York. I can have anything on my doorstep and in 30 minutes and it really, during this pandemic it was a necessary adoption.[00:27:13] Customers adopted it, retailers deployed it at any cost to stay alive and to, to maintain [00:27:20] those sales. It's going to be really interesting how we start seeing this shake out over the next 12 months as more stores open and the cost of these last mile delivery services and micro fulfillment.[00:27:31] Hit the bounce hit the bottom line, right? It's been extraordinarily expensive for some rural communities or areas where they've never even thought of having their groceries delivered to becoming a really great convenience that consumers don't want to give up, but there is definitely, you know, lots of different vendors.[00:27:49] And the trend bubble could very easily burst as these ebbs and flows of shutdowns and, and the pandemic, come to an ease So it really comes down to sustainability. It's not inexpensive to operate a last mile or micro fulfillment business in general. And so a lot of that cost has been incurred over onto the customer through like the door dash and Uber's where there's delivery fees and tips and, and things of that nature.[00:28:13] So one of my biggest trends I'm seeing here is companies are looking at where should they have human delivery [00:28:20] and third-party partners versus do it themselves. And implementing drone structures. [00:28:25] Ricardo Belmar: Now that's getting really interesting, right? [00:28:26] Casey Golden: I mean, I couldn't have the drone here in New York.[00:28:29] I don't have a doorman. My little drone would just like sit outside the door. Right.[00:28:34] Ricardo Belmar: It'd just keep hovering and waiting.[00:28:35] Casey Golden: It would just sit there and keep pattering. I mean, I can just foresee, you know, a whole bunch of people with pool nets, you know, out on the streets, [00:28:43] grabbing drones, [00:28:45] Ricardo Belmar: how many drones can I catch today!.[00:28:48] Casey Golden: I'm like, oh, look at that. It's a madewell bag. I've got this kind of redefines, you know, think about like, you know, these doorstep, burglars maybe everybody's going to move into the air, but it really does. It offers solutions that we've never really even thought about. Right. And, and really deploying so much more technology into the delivery aspect.[00:29:09] And I couldn't imagine going back to a world where my life wasn't delivered on my doorstep. I like it. [00:29:16] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Right, right. [00:29:17] Casey Golden: I don't think the company... [00:29:18] Ricardo Belmar: nobody is going back, [00:29:20][00:29:20] Casey Golden: but it is, does come down to the customer experience and really making sure that your supply chains are optimized to be able to support [00:29:29] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, a hundred, a hundred percent, a hundred percent. I think what, to your point, when you, when you kind of started this one, there there's been such an explosion of these. At some point, there just becomes too many of these third party services for this rapid delivery, right? So at some level you know, even in New York, if you've got 10 of these, can you really handle 20 of them that does the city need 20 of these services or whatever the number is?[00:29:50] I think what we're saying is, they're certainly not going away because the convenience is just too good for too many consumers. And it's probably not likely , most retailers can do it on their own because of the cost and the internal costs. Not, not that the third-party service is going to be a low cost for them, but I just think, there's gotta be some consolidation and these are just too many of these services out.[00:30:10] There's gotta be some consolidation before the end of the year. [00:30:12] Casey Golden: Yeah. I definitely see that. It's going to have to cover that whole entire lifecycle. And they're going to need to combine the resources, I think. [00:30:18] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. Yeah, I think that totally [00:30:20] totally makes sense. [00:30:20] #9 - Low-code/No-code Revolution[00:30:20] Ricardo Belmar: Well, that's bringing us to number nine, so I'm going to get really techie on this one.[00:30:24] And, and I'm going to talk about low-code and no-code software development here, and I feel like outside of your, your hardcore deep developer techie circles, not a lot of talk, it seems about what the benefits of low code technology is. But I can't think of almost any major retailer that's not using these technologies right now and the significance of this and why I'm putting this on my list is that the, level of adoption and the speed of which new applications are going to get rolled out by retailers driven by low code is just going to go through the roof.[00:30:57] I think this is where if we, if we're not already there, we're going to see the turning point where most new applications retailers bring out, are going to be built using the low code technology, if for no other reason than for just speed of development and deployment. So what used to take six months to create that's no longer good enough, right?[00:31:14] I think every, certainly the major retailers learned during the pandemic. It's not acceptable to say, oh, that product [00:31:20] is going to take six months to finish. Nope, it's gotta be done in six weeks or less. And even that might take too long, it's gotta be a more iterative process. We have to be able to iterate more often and faster to get better and better.[00:31:30] And the best way to do that right now is with low code technology, especially when almost every new customer service or customer experience that retailers come out with. You know, someone is always rightfully going to say, well, okay, once we bring this out, where's the report that's going to tell me how successful it is? Where's the dashboard that's going to show me its impact on conversion rate or the increase in average order value. Who's building that view for the management team and store ops that wants to know how this is running, who is building this so that the marketing team knows where they have to focus some of their marketing budget to try to get more impact all those kinds of reporting and all kinds of dashboards, who is those used to be a real pain to create, right?[00:32:09] You go to IT and you ask them and they'd say it takes six months for us to put that together. Well, that's not acceptable anymore. If the project has to get done in six weeks. So does all the reporting and the dashboards and everything else with it, and the [00:32:20] low-code technologies that are out there, make it super easy to do these things in a rapid way to the point where now it can even say, oh great, you need a new dashboard.[00:32:28] You know, you guys in marketing can build that yourselves. And if you run into problems, we'll help you out. And that's okay now where, before you wouldn't see a lot of IT, teams want to do that because they felt like they were giving up control, risking their very existence. But now what happens?[00:32:41] Now, they're, they're more in a support role where they're helping their business colleagues actually get these things done for themselves in a meaningful, fast way that just helps the business overall. I think these are all things, with low code, you can do it. There's no reason to ever say no to these kinds of things, which is going to just help with everything retailers learned over the last two years about agility and resilience.[00:33:02] This is going to be the development platform of choice. [00:33:05] Casey Golden: I think this is going to be one of the most disruptive areas and retail technology whether or not it's it's low code or plug and play solutions. Professional service models, I think, is going to be the biggest disruption in this space because it's [00:33:20] predominantly been a professional services led business where we don't have six months let alone 18 months to roll out a new solution.[00:33:29] Because by the time you go live. The market's changed. And so it's really going to come down to speed and adoption and experimenting and getting the KPIs of is this working, do we do it for another three months and being able to turn on and off solutions to find what the right recipe is? Because six months to implement, we've got nine months until holiday for next year, right?[00:33:52] How many? And we've got 10 things that, [00:33:56] Ricardo Belmar: and every one of them, you know, now going in, right, you've learned that you've got to iterate on every single one of those to get it to the point where you want it to be. And you gotta learn from each iteration and keep feeding that back in. And this is the technology that makes that easier to do [00:34:09] Casey Golden: a hundred percent, because if it wasn't complicated enough before.[00:34:14] #10 - web3, Crypto, NFTs, and The Metaverse![00:34:14] Casey Golden: The complexity of going into our number 10 of web3. [00:34:18] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly. [00:34:20] Exactly. Bring us home with number 10, Casey.[00:34:22] This is the big one.[00:34:24] Casey Golden: This is enough to give any brand or retail whiplash, because we're still working on our regular business on, I don't know, you can call it web two. But we're still optimizing and brands are still optimizing the way we currently do business.[00:34:37] Digital transformation initiatives are at an all time. High tech spend is at an all time high and the creators and consumers are adopting web three faster than a brand can even absorb the information to understand what it is and how it's going to impact their business. [00:34:56] So this is one of my playgrounds, you can say. I think it's one of the most exciting and fun things to be able to deploy in a brand is to start experimenting in the metaverse building out thought theories on your company on whether or not you're accepting crypto currencies and getting NFTs out into the market. [00:35:14] We don't know what exactly the metaverse or web three is going to provide to [00:35:20]build a long-term strategy around, but the creators and consumers are adopting at such a rapid rate that we've seen several, big brands just drop in. And say, I don't know what we're doing, but we've got a great partner and we're going to figure it out and we're going to do something and we're going to experiment now.[00:35:37] Well, I've also heard a lot of brands say, we're gonna wait and see, we have to stop waiting to see how it shakes out. This is going to be a longterm. It's here to stay. I don't think it's going anywhere. But it's really gonna come down to, I think who is at Balenciaga is the first one of the first companies to actually create a division internally and make hires. Nike just purchased artifact to pull them in there, you know, web three partner , and absorbed it.[00:36:05] And I think these are the right moves. We're not gonna be able to go ahead and take this all on ourselves. I think partners are going to be key in this area and. Starting with payment options is a really easy first move start, [00:36:20] accepting cryptocurrency. Coinbase business has started coming in to be able to integrate with Shopify stores.[00:36:25] Shopify is working on being able to sell NFTs on the Shopify store and we've got new marketplaces that are popping up that is essentially your new type of retailer. Right? My big take on web three and the future of what three is really gonna come down to data interoperability, which is a really, really terrible word.[00:36:46] But if you have a relationship with the brand in real life, how is that being translated over into web three? And how's the company measuring it? What's your overlap? Right now these are, we built a lot of islands in the real life with systems not integrated And brands. And now we're building on web three where this isn't one thing.[00:37:06] It's not one piece of technology. It's, we're building a lot of islands again. [00:37:10] Ricardo Belmar: Right. [00:37:11] Casey Golden: And I think this is going to come down to how does a consumer walk across four worlds and not lose the experience that they're having [00:37:20] with the brand. And how is this being able to be shoppable? Are you shipping in real life?[00:37:24] Is it a digital asset only? Is that an experience? I think the commerce aspect being added into the metaverse in web three is going to be the one aspect that can push customer adoption through the roof. But it also offers brands, the ability to experiment with less risk [00:37:43] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think the keyword there is experiment, right?[00:37:45] I see a lot of people talking about this in a way where, where there's taking a perspective where, oh, my, my commerce plain and metaverse and web three is almost like taking the place of my existing commerce and the physical space. And, I think it's a subtle difference.[00:37:59] But if I change that around and say, well, how am I using web three in the metaverse augment that shopping experience to use it in a way that makes my brand loyalty more sticky. I think that's a better way of evaluating how you're going to take advantage of this, you know, in this let's call it this first year because it's going to constantly evolve.[00:38:18] I don't think anyone's ready to say , yup, by the [00:38:20] end of the year, the whole metaverse is ready to go [00:38:21] Casey Golden: no [00:38:22] Ricardo Belmar: and whatever form that means it's going to evolve and every brand has to evolve with it and they've got to learn as they go. So I think. A hundred percent with the way you described this. I think the key again is going to be retailers, brands, they got to get into the mindset of experimenting with this now and throughout the year and try different kinds of experiments. It's not just about finding one approach and iterating over it five times over the next 12 months. It's about trying five totally different things. And I'm going to come out here and say, you know, if your experimentation is to say, how do I duplicate my store in the metaverse I think you're doing it wrong.[00:38:58] Casey Golden: I I've just seen some things that I loved seeing that H and M was going in with at scale.[00:39:04] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. [00:39:04] Casey Golden: And then I, I'm just asking myself, why is my avatar standing on an escalator [00:39:10] Ricardo Belmar: exactly. Right. [00:39:13] The digital space and everything. Just come to me. Yeah, exactly. Where's the fun in that [00:39:19] Casey Golden: [00:39:20] interesting ways to engage that customer and let these imaginations just blossom. I mean, retail space, the fashion space, the beauty space. We have some of the most passionate and creative and talented minds that already work for us. And we've constantly had to design around a bill of materials and work with the supply chain and constraints of not having that instant access to a customer to even try something before it even exists. Right. [00:39:49] Ricardo Belmar: Right. [00:39:50] Casey Golden: This can open up so many opportunities to bring things to market in the digital world before you even go to production and experiment and discover products and engage with brands that you may have had a perception of the brand because you didn't have a brick and mortar store, or maybe you didn't get great service.[00:40:10] Or the assortment was different, right? I get the best assortment in the world. When we're here in New York, we get the best collections. Every single store has the [00:40:20] best product, but when you go down into a bottom door and you walk into a retailer and it's got six skews or 12 skews of a brand, you're not really getting that full experience because there's dollars attached to it.[00:40:32] There's logistics, distribution. This is really going to be able to provide brands a way to create moments that they could never afford to create in the real world. And to do it in a way that lets the creativity of the brand, take the spotlight. So I'm, I'm very bull on web three. But at the end of the day, if the world can't connect to each other and the brands can't understand who their customer is on web three, to understand how much money they need to build that lifetime value and merge some of these KPIs that they're used to seeing. I think it's going to take a long time. So I'm hoping that more brands partner with people who are well-versed in the space and can lead leadership into fail fast experiment. The only negative thing that can [00:41:20] happen to your company is not participating [00:41:22] Ricardo Belmar: that's right. And that that's the best kind of takeaway. I think for every retailer and brand from this is to not be afraid of it and just experiment freely. And, and I would even add too, for retailers should look at this as, how am I going to work with the brands that I sell in my retail business to build something unique.[00:41:42] So if I'm am going to think about this in terms of a virtual store model, that instead of, you know, relying on aisles and shelves and escalators, right? Cause that adds no value to doing that. Right? Exactly. You don't need a digital hand picking things up off the shelf and throwing them back. But if you work with the brands, [00:42:02] and think in terms of like little miniature brand experiences that, your customer in your virtual store is going to go from one brand experience to another, to get really immersed with them. Cause then where's that customer getting to value. They're going to see it from the brand and from the place that connected that customer to these brands. [00:42:20] It's kind of like the original advantage in physical stores at a department store was supposed to have because it was the place you went to to see the collection of all the brands you like in one place. And I think there's maybe a new opportunity to do something kind of like that here.[00:42:34] As long as, as the retailer, you embrace working with the brand to do something unique and you're in your virtual space. [00:42:40] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean the storylines and the storytelling opportunity here of understanding the product, understanding the brand, their ethos, things that are important to them. This is going to be a really great narrative for product discovery and discovery.[00:42:55] And, and pulling the narrative away from you left this in your cart. You wanted it, right, right. Or this really hard sell to add the level of romance of product discovery and being able to, to, you know, really connect with consumers in a way to say like, wow, this brand is awesome. And I'm having so much fun, engaging with it.[00:43:17] I should probably buy something by now. [00:43:20][00:43:20] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly, exactly. And I'll, throw in one more component to this too, because everybody likes to focus on the consumer side of it. But from the retail businesses perspective, think about what you can do in this space to make your environment better for your employees, even if it's as basic as training.[00:43:36] You know, what, if you did your, your associate training in your metaverse space versus in the physical store, can you make that training so much more engaging that the employee learns that much faster and retains the knowledge that much better? So now when they go and actually work with a customer, whether it's in that physical store or, big surprise, wait for it. When that associate helps the customer in the virtual space, because there's no reason you can't have that interaction too. Right? If you have the right associate, it's no different than the live streaming we talked about in the earlier prediction now they're really equipped, right?[00:44:07] And, and circling back again right now that employee is motivated. They're having fun doing this and via web three. Or in the metaverse with a customer, you've made the whole process more engaging. Not only does it help build your brand [00:44:20] loyalty with the customer, but it most likely helps you retain that employee.[00:44:23] And we don't ever know that that's going to be more competitive, [00:44:25] Casey Golden: employees are. Our first customer, you know my first job in retail, I still have a aggressive brand affinity to them because I had a great experience. And I'm still resonate with the brand, whether or not I'm too old to be wearing it or not.[00:44:40] My employee experience was so good that I am a die hard advocate, practically, 20 years later. [00:44:48] Ricardo Belmar: There you go. [00:44:49] Casey Golden: You know, so they're our first customers and it's an opportunity to, to make it or break it for a long LTV and word of mouth. So I'm, really excited for this. It can be done so well. And so far, I think we've seen some ways that it can be also done so bad.[00:45:05] Ricardo Belmar: Right. That's so true. That's so true. So that's, it's going to make it fun to watch this year. But I think that's why we can't do a trends and predictions for the year without talking about this the whole way web3 metaverse play, because it's just going to be both fun and scary to watch what the [00:45:20] stations and experiments are with this.[00:45:23] But it's going to be a major learning experience for everybody [00:45:26] Casey Golden: as a place where we can actually kind of bring in, you know, all press is, bad press, any participation in web three, right? [00:45:34] Ricardo Belmar: It's the beauty of treating it like an experiment, . You know, you're going to learn from it no matter what, and just make it.[00:45:39] And no one, no one should have the expectation that there's an end game to this 12 months from now. [00:45:46] Right? Exactly. Exactly. [00:45:50] That's right. That's right. Yeah. So waiting for those that's right. Waiting for those, of course, when we get those flying cars are going to be dodging drones. So it's going to be a lot more challenging than we think,[00:46:03] because now I'm going to have this picture in my mind. When you said, the people chasing drones with their butterfly nets are going to be to flying cars now hanging out, the window trying to scoop out of the mid air all, as many drones as they can. That's the part that nobody's thinking about.[00:46:18] Are we ready for that?[00:46:20] Casey Golden: [00:46:20] Are we ready for the future? [00:46:21] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That or I'm just picturing people on New York city rooftops trying to catch passing drones. [00:46:28] Casey Golden: These are the realities we live in. [00:46:30] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. That's right. Somebody has got to think about it before we make it a reality.[00:46:34] Casey Golden: There is no commerce without loss prevention. [00:46:39] Ricardo Belmar: That's a new kind of lost prevention, right? That hopefully somebody out there is thinking about. Yep. Maybe that'll be on our list next year.[00:46:49] All right. Well with that, I think we're ready to close this out. That was our 10. And hopefully everybody who listens to this episode either whether you agree or disagree with our 10, we want to hear from you. So hit us up on Twitter or LinkedIn and let us know what you think after you hear about it and join us again for the next episode.[00:47:06] We'll be back here on Callin very soon. Thanks everybody.Show Closing[00:47:09] Casey Golden: If you enjoyed the show, please consider giving us a five star rating and review on apple podcast. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player. So you don't miss a minute. Want to know more about what we talked about? Take a look at our show notes for handy links and more deets.[00:47:25] I'm your cohost Casey Golden. [00:47:27] Ricardo Belmar: If you'd like to connect with us, follow us on Twitter at caseycgolden and Ricardo_Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure to follow the show on Twitter at Retail Razor on LinkedIn and on our YouTube channel for video versions of each episode and bonus content. [00:47:42] I'm your host Ricardo Belmar.[00:47:44] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.[00:47:48] Ricardo Belmar: And remember, there's never been a better time to be in retail. IF you cut through the clutter. Until next time, THIS is the Retail Razor Show. 

Welcome to this special podcast on Diversity in Retail that we recorded for a MLK day Retail Innovation Week 2022 session. Topics in this expert will include talent cultivation, marketing representation and public accountability; as well as representative marketplaces, community engagement and how technology can help develop empathy. Experts in this session today include Ron Thurston who is a retailer leadership executive and board member. He is Amazon best-selling author of RETAIL PRIDE The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career. Also on the panel is Alissa Allen - an expert in Diversity Equity & Inclusion and SVP of Strategy & Innovation at The Integer Group, the commerce arm of TBWA-Worldwide. Also joining us is Felita Harris, the Chief Strategy & Revenue Officer at Harlem's Fashion Row, the premier agency creating a bridge between fashion brands and designers of color. And finally, Bonin Bough is one of the foremost-awarded marketing executives in the world and Chief Growth Officer of social platform Triller, as well as the Founder of investment firm Bonin Ventures. Moderating the session is Scott Lachut, a partner at PSFK. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/psfk/message

Today hosts Ron Thurston: a career retail professional who recently released his first book, Retail Pride. I know that we first connected via LinkedIn but I have no idea how that happened if I'm honest. Regardless I chalk it up to be under the umbrella of what's meant to be will be as Ron and I have become fast friends. Ron's retail knowledge actually began in his youth when he started learning the ins and outs of Leading with empathy from his grandfather who built grocery stores and later became the CEO of Safeway. Ron and I chat about the misconception that many retail workers are underachievers when in fact they're the opposite, and how great leadership is most often orchestrated through personal connection as opposed to a relationship with what's being sold. We later discuss Ron's incredible journey with a litany of industry leading & industry changing brands and how they're different, but that isn't before we discuss his learning to drive manual in a truck and his attendance of Ford V8 conventions. He quite literally learned to drive stick on a STANDARD H! I thoroughly enjoyed learning about his experience, expertise, and sharing the idea that you don't need to change just because the product does. This one's for all you retail heads out there, and do stay tuned for Ron's tour he embarks on very soon. Be sure to pick up Retail Pride wherever books are sold, and as always, thank you so much for listening. Links: STANDARD H https://standard-h.com/ @standardh_ @standardh_podcast Retail Pride https://www.retailpride.com/ @retailpride Passion Fine Jewelry https://passionfinejewelry.com/ @passionfinejewelry Independent in Time https://www.independentintime.com/ @independentintime

S1E2 – The Retail Avengers & The Future of Frontline Staff, Part 2Welcome to Season 1, Episode 2, the second ever episode of The Retail Razor Show!I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top 100 Retail Influencer, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock and slayer of retail frankenstacks!Together, we're your guides on the retail transformation journey. Whether you're thinking digital and online, mobile, or brick & mortar stores, there'll be something for you!In episode 2 we dive into the future of retail frontline workers, with none other than Ron Thurston, author of Retail Pride, The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career. Ron joins our Retail Avengers team on Clubhouse to talk about the impact of AI and automation on store teams and how retailers can, and should, equip their frontline staff with technology. Plus, Ron gives us a preview of his latest project, kicking off in 2022 – Retail In America!For more information about Ron, and how you can Take Pride Today in your retail career, visit Ron's website: https://www.retailpride.comThe Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorJoin our club on Clubhouse: http://bit.ly/RRazorClubListen to us on Callin: https://bit.ly/RRCallinSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - ****https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTS1E2 Retail Avengers & The Future of Frontline Staff, Part 2[00:00:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hello. Good morning. Good afternoon. Good evening. No matter what time of day you're listening. Welcome. Welcome to season one, episode two, the second ever episode of the Retail Razor Show. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar, one of RIS News top 10 movers and shakers in retail for 2021 and lead partner marketing advisor for retail and consumer goods at Microsoft. [00:00:42] Casey Golden: And I'm your co-host Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock obsessed with the customer relationship between a brand and the consumer. I spend my days slaying franken-stacks.[00:00:52] Ricardo Belmar: So Casey, how many franken-stacks have you slain since our last episode? [00:00:55] Casey Golden: I can't even count right now. [00:00:57] Ricardo Belmar: Okay. No worries. I think maybe our listeners are gonna want to start keeping track though, since we keep, , talking about it, maybe, maybe they'll start tweeting out to us, their guesses on how many between episodes.[00:01:06] Casey Golden: I love a good tweet storm. [00:01:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, me too. So any listeners out there who want to tweet a guess on how many franken-stacks Casey has slain since episode one. Be sure and tweet your guess and tag the Retail Razor account so we see it. We'll be sure to give a shout out to whoever [00:01:20] comes the closest next time we record our episode, right Casey?[00:01:24] Casey Golden: I guess I'm going to have to start keeping count myself. [00:01:26] Ricardo Belmar: There you go. [00:01:29] Casey Golden: So regarding the last week we kicked off the show with our friend, Ron Thurston, author of retail pride, and he's joining us again this week [00:01:36] Ricardo Belmar: that's right. This is part two of our Retail Avengers and the Future of Frontline Staff session. Last week, we focused on the current state of frontline workers in retail and how tech will become more and more of an integral part of that experience.[00:01:49] And this week we tackle a few of the biggest issues that concern the retail workforce, around automation and AI versus the human staff, how to best leverage technology in the hands of store associates. And we take on some interesting questions from the clubhouse audience on digital versus analog experiences and in the human connection in retail.[00:02:08] Casey Golden: These are tough topics. I'm a big proponent of human augmentation, but let's face it. We gotta automate the things we don't want to do. [00:02:16] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. Yeah. , I totally hear you. And I completely agree. So [00:02:20] many people are getting scared of the automation that's coming, but I think that's the wrong way to look at it.[00:02:25] And we'll, talk about that in this session, because there's so many benefits to having that automation do exactly what you just said, right. To get rid of all the tasks that are not the interesting fun ones and let's face it, not the ones that make the customer experience better. [00:02:39] Casey Golden: Exactly. We've got to enable the heart of our business, which is that engagement between the consumer in the brand and the consumer never walks into corporate, you know, they walk into the stores and that's where their experiences. So I really believe, you know, scaling that part of the business and making sure that the heart has software. It's going to be able to just move everything further.[00:03:11] They're not spending any time doing admin work. And there's ways to, for them to focus on what's really important to the business and what's important to the [00:03:20] consumer. [00:03:20] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I totally agree. And even when we're talking about basic things like we're going to get to in this session about store associates, getting mobile devices to use when they engage with customers [00:03:29] Casey Golden: Yeah, I love talking about frontline staff and Ron is one of the best people to dive into this topic. So glad he'll be joining us after we listen to the clubhouse recording, let's go get to it. [00:03:39] Ricardo Belmar: You got it. So without further delay, let's give a listen to the Retail Avengers and the Future of Frontline Staff, Part 2.Clubhouse Session[00:03:54] Ricardo Belmar: Welcome everyone. Thank you for joining us here in the retail razor club room, we're continuing our conversation with special guest Ron Thurston, and about the future of frontline retail staff.[00:04:04] So let's do some quick introductions. I'll start with our special guests, Ron Thurston, author of retail pride, and Ron, I know you have some special announcements that I'll let you share about what, you're going to be doing.[00:04:16] I think then you've also got some special activities happening in New York this weekend share with us. So let me give you a moment to introduce yourself and tell us about those two things. [00:04:25] Ron Thurston: Awesome. Thanks so much, Ricardo. I really appreciate it. So yes, I'm the author of retail pride, the guide to celebrating your accidental career, which is why I love to talk about everything, frontline worker retail related, and I'll start with myself.[00:04:39] So yes, until last week I was the head of stores of intermix, as part of kind of their sale to private equity and such. It was a great time for me to launch my own brand. So I'm launching an umbrella, brand under Take Pride [00:04:54] Today, which will be consulting. And I'm speaking opportunities, additional books under the umbrella of retail pride.[00:05:01] And I'm really excited to get this started, kind of building out the infrastructure for what that will look like. So thank you for, for helping me, get that out into the world. [00:05:10] Ricardo Belmar: All right. Thank you for that, Ron. Appreciate it, [00:05:13] Trevor welcome. Why don't you introduce yourself? [00:05:15] Trevor Sumner: Hi, I'm Trevor Sumner. I'm the CEO of perch. We do interactive displays at retail.[00:05:21] And what's cool about them is they use computer vision to detect which products you touch. So it's like minority report, it touch a product. And literally the shelf starts talking to you about the product ratings, reviews, videos, augmented reality, all that kind of stuff. [00:05:33] Ricardo Belmar: All right, fantastic. And move on to Shish. [00:05:35] Shish Shridhar: Hi, good morning. Good afternoon. I'm the retail lead, with Microsoft for startups and essentially create a portfolio of retail tech, early stage retail, tech startups, I'm, on the lookout for innovative startups in the space. I'm always meeting up with [00:05:54] startups and learning a lot as well in that process. I've been in retail for about 20 something years, 24 years in Microsoft.[00:06:02] And about 15 of those years, working very closely with the top retailers around the world. Looking forward to the conversation today. Thank you.. [00:06:11] Ricardo Belmar: Thank you, Shish. Brandon. [00:06:12] Brandon Rael: Hello everyone, my name is Brandan Rael.. I've been in around the retail industry, both within retail companies, across a variety of merchandising and planning.[00:06:21] And I love that that role but I'm mostly on the other side now, currently I'm one of the transformation leaders at Reach Partners a boutique consultancy that works with the retailers, CPG companies, DTC companies to not only, stay ahead of disruption, but self disrupt themselves to really pivot their organizations and, provide an amazing customer experiences, both in store and online and, happy to be here. [00:06:46] Ricardo Belmar: All right, thank you, Brandon. And Jeff. [00:06:48] Jeff Roster: Hi, Jeff roster, a former Gartner and IHL retail sector analysts. Now, sit on several advisory [00:06:54] boards as well as the co-host for This week in Innovation podcast.. [00:06:57] Ricardo Belmar: Thank you, Jeff and I'm Ricardo Belmar. I founded the Retail Razor Club here on Clubhouse. I've been in retail tech for the better part of the last two decades, working for a different technology providers and service providers in retail, currently at Microsoft as a senior partner marketing advisor for retail and consumer goods.[00:07:15] Recap of Part 1[00:07:15] Ricardo Belmar: So let me do a quick recap of what we discussed at the last session. We've focused then on what new roles may emerge for frontline workers. We had an example of Levi's talking about, skills training and data science. We talked about new skills for clientelling supporting self-checkout and click and collect operations at the store. We came to a conclusion there was going to be a strong focus on supporting convenience services and experiential retail, which in this case led to a prediction that there will be more segmenting of staff into specialists or subject matter expert areas so that you won't see [00:07:54] a frontline position description might not just be as a sales associate, but it may include things like being a live streamer or doing something else around a particular area of product expertise based on what the store sells.[00:08:06] And that segmenting is something that should lead to an embracing of uniqueness and diversity in the staff. And then we also covered some interesting new retail tech, that we thought front lines are going to be enabled with around collaboration, assisted selling, other store operational tools, things that would support fulfillment, particularly stores that may operate sort of a micro fulfillment area, in part of their footprint.[00:08:30] And that led us to also talk about what the perception of roles would be. Ron had brought up an interesting point about frontline workers asking, what do I call my role? Because it was becoming much more than a traditional sales role. And again, that tied back to the area of segmenting. [00:08:47] This week we're going to dive into a couple of different areas.[00:08:50] The main one is going to be what the impact of [00:08:54] AI and automation will have on frontline staff. And we're also going to touch on things we think retailers could be doing to improve that work environment for front lines, but both in and out of the automation conversation. So for example, before we dive into those, I'm going to pose a question for the panel , we learned that Walmart is buying 740,000 Samsung smartphones for their frontline workers, that's going to include a very special integrated app. That's supposed to help them with all of their daily work tasks and, and managing everything related to being on the job essentially.[00:09:27] And also they're going to give their frontline staff the option of adopting that device as their personal device. And the claim from Walmart is that they are not going to have any visibility or access to any of those personal data areas, on the device should you choose to use it that way.[00:09:44] So I'm sure everyone has some thoughts on that. My question do you see this a, is this a trend? You know, we we've always talked in the past about how this was going to be the [00:09:54]year of associate enablement, whether it was technology or training.[00:09:57] And it seemed every year that we would start the year talking about that, but we wouldn't see a lot of evidence from most retailers to do anything about that. And here comes Walmart with what I've seen, some calculations posted online that, depending on what Samsung's price was for these devices, it's easily a 350 to 380 million investment.[00:10:16] Mobile Devices for Store Associates Trend[00:10:16] Ricardo Belmar: Is this a trend? Is this a sort of a turning point that we're going to see retailers put frontline workers, in a better light and really focus on equipping them with the technology they need to put them on par with the technology, customers are walking into the store with, or is there some other meaning to this?[00:10:33] For example, one of the app functions, is an AI based tool called ask Sam, which Walmart says has been heavily used in, trials already where workers can ask just about any question to this AI sort of a chat bot, I suppose, that helps them find answers and help customers. So with my long explanation there, Ron, [00:10:54] I'll start with you.[00:10:54] What do you think of this? [00:10:55] Ron Thurston: Thanks Ricardo. So I I'll approach it from two different sides. I think from the, from the Walmart side. And as, as someone who was kind of deep into also providing tech to employees, there, there are so many legal implications about the idea of offering you. I know the pilot was about bringing your own device and let's pilot this, but it's become increasingly difficult from a legal perspective to ask anyone to do anything off the clock as they shouldn't.[00:11:25] And so when you think about the majority of these employees, significant majority are hourly employees, the ability for then Walmart to provide things like scheduling tools requesting time off, probably putting in something around like vacation days. You can do all of that on this device actually is really helpful for them to be able to just control the control the data control the, the use.[00:11:53] It [00:11:54] sounds like it is only enabled when they're in the store. It's probably connected to the wifi, which is, pretty normal. And so I actually think it's a fantastic way for Walmart to have a recruiting advantage because that's also a huge call-out today of how do we attract and retain top talent, or, at least be able to fill all of our open jobs.[00:12:15] And this is a great way to do that. And secondly, provide The opportunity for, kind of data collection data use and be able to provide tools that the employees have access to, where normally in scheduling, you'd have to kind of come into the store and make a phone call and you can't ask an employee to check their personal email, or even use their personal email accounts when they're off the clock.[00:12:38] There's so many legal implications. And on the employee side, it's a huge perk for a low hourly frontline worker to have something you could use for your personal device, whether you think the company is, is tracking you or not, this is [00:12:54] TBD, but the benefits, I could see huge benefits on both sides.[00:12:57] And I, applaud them for making the move. And I think it's the first of many, many to come in this, in this arena. And, I'm excited that they were the first to move. [00:13:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, thanks, Ron. I agree with you , , I see this as a overall positive move, although certainly with plenty of potential gotchas and, I suspect Trevor has a few things to say about some of those gotchas. [00:13:18] Trevor Sumner: I have I've, I've lots of things about many gotchas. I Ron, I think that's a really interesting point about, you know, kind of compliance and risk mitigation and, you know, even, making sure that off the clock, you have a device that they could use and could log and could track.[00:13:34] And so they are properly compensated for such. And I don't know if they're going to start that it doesn't sound like they're starting there yet to be connected to wifi, but they may end up going in that direction. In terms of greater compliance, as we, continually kind of do CRM and one-to-one marketing and for sales associates outside of store, [00:13:51] I think this is. There's [00:13:54] something else at play. Like I think this is great. And you know, there's no reason you can't have most of the utilities that they talked about in the release on, some type of web based app or, or support both iOS and Android and basically hit everything anyway. So why provide your own devices?[00:14:10] And I think, you know, part of it's like the controlled environment it's access, but I also think the data play is really interesting. So I think about, like ask Sam and other tools that, I think voice interfaces are highly inefficient. A lot of these technologies need to be refined. A lot of data needs to be collected to optimize things.[00:14:27] And all of a sudden you've got, basically you can track every sales associate in the store and where they are at all times. You can track if they're using ask Sam, you can look at the most common queries you can, you know, do a bunch of voice recognition. You can give yourself an advantage. Like one of the things that, Google, had a voice recognition advantage over a lot of people is that they already had all these voice recordings and all this voice data.[00:14:49] So I think there's a data pipeline play here that they're going to use and, to [00:14:54] test bed different applications before they release them to consumers and, and use the sales associates as a testing ground, to improve the UX, the UI and the underlying technology, for everything that they do.[00:15:04] And I think that that ultimately is the value because that makes everything they do from a technology perspective that they eventually released to the, to the end consumer, to be a much more mature. And well-vetted. [00:15:15] Brandon Rael: No to add to that point, I think, there probably rarefied the amount of companies that can make these significant investments in digital technologies and sales associate enablement via technologies like mobile devices.[00:15:28] So, it's can take, , such an investment like from a Walmart or potentially a Target that can actually, , invest in these capabilities, but also do the training necessary to empower store associates, to really make these a value added asset of what providing a, an outstanding associate experience, which w you know, Ron and others know, will translate over to a outstanding customer experience, then it, to help them enhance that relationship and enable the store associates to keep up with it, with, evolving [00:15:54] and always informed, and always empowered a customer who has a mobile device in their hands and access to information, review his competitor information prices.[00:16:03] Why not empower and enable your store associates keep up with that changing paradigm.[00:16:07] Shish Shridhar: I kind of think this is actually a very interesting move for Walmart. I've been, following the space and working on that space and empowering employees for a couple of years. And one of the points that Ron made about the legal implications, that was one of the big barriers in the past where they wanted, you know, The ability to control it, where the information and the task list and the ability to read work-based information outside of hours was a big concern.[00:16:38] And today with the capabilities available of controlling that I think it is becoming more of a possibility. Then it was maybe about five to 10 years ago. And that is, I think one of the drivers as well. And the other [00:16:54] aspect is, if I look at it from a startup perspective, oldest startup are in the space.[00:17:00] There's a lot of interesting technologies that are, that are being deployed. A lot of retailers are experimented with it primarily because the looking at, one, the more empowered the employees are, the happier customers are going to be. And also the other aspect of it, you know, when we look at it from the perspective of the future of frontline staff, And the, the evolving role of the frontline staff.[00:17:25] This is an important element of that. And I think it is the start of that journey where a frontline staff is going to be empowered, but a lot of information that they need, as they grow into, into that new role of being subject matter experts, into that role. Really fitting into a higher level of customer expectation.[00:17:49] So the features like the ask Sam, those are things that I'm seeing a lot of [00:17:54] where store associates can connect to real time information that can connect to conversational systems and be able to ask questions, get responses very quickly so that they're better informed and are able to help customers as a result.[00:18:11] They know exactly whether a product is in stock than not. They know if it's in the back room. So that quick access to information is an important element of that evolving role of the, of the frontline worker. And I think this is, this is huge in a way. I've been working with companies like Theatro, for example, that use a headset based system.[00:18:35] There's a company called Turnpike that is deployed in H and M. That is using wearables for companies that feel that, you know, a mobile device looks like a bit of a distraction. There is, other companies that use mobile devices and working with natural gourds that are using mobile devices. So there's multiple [00:18:54] formats that startups are experimenting with and also, what appeals to different types of retailers.[00:19:00] And, and in my mind, this is actually the beginning of that journey of evolution for, for the frontline worker, where they become empowered and also become subject matter experts, not necessarily to knowledge they have, but the connection to the backend knowledge that enables them to be far more effective and, and cater to the, the evolving expectations.[00:19:24] Trevor Sumner: Shish that actually just, inspired something, connecting the dots. When you talked about all these new startups doing interesting things, there's a startup out of VRA where I mentor, and they're called RilaVoice. And what they do is they mic up sales associates and they listen to every conversation they tag.[00:19:41] They look at the most common questions they can provide compliance on whether sales associates are answering questions well, using the right keywords, et cetera. But, again, I focus on the sheer scale of [00:19:54] this network. And what if, Walmart couldn't do that with your own device, but they couldn't do that.[00:19:58] I mean, we, we joke about how face you say something and all of a sudden you see Facebook ads for that thing. Like, there's no reason that Walmart couldn't enable these devices to listen all the time and start recording conversations and use that information in an interesting way. There's just so many tremendous opportunities to leverage this.[00:20:16] Ron Thurston: Yeah. And it's Ron, I was going to jump into about what Shish said, because this kind of idea of being enabled and encouraged and empowered, I think what was likely happening is that customers were engaged in. With frontline asking questions and they were pulling their own phone out of their back pocket.[00:20:35] And, and probably going to the website, probably looking at pricing, trying to do whatever they could to do that. And that there's legal risk put into that. So the idea of say, we're providing you all of these resources, we're empowering you with information and data. We're giving you everything that you need and let's leave your [00:20:54] personal phone in your locker when you get to work.[00:20:56] Like there's a lot of, there's a lot of potential, kind of positive and positive employee sentiment doing something like this that can really help from a recruiting standpoint to,[00:21:08] Brandon Rael: I also think to Ron's point, this generation is ready for this, these technologies and tools and solutions. We have a generation that's grown up, the next wave of retail, frontline workers who know nothing but digital. So why not empower these gen Z or, or the younger millennials to truly take on , and run with it because, when the guy came up with a customer who is light years ahead, so it's all about empowerment, it's all about enabling.[00:21:32] It's all about trusting your associates and given the tools and capabilities and need to provide an experience that's extraordinary and really helped our discovery [00:21:42] Ricardo Belmar: for the customers [00:21:42] and isn't there an element of consistency , too? [00:21:44] Because you want that experience to be consistent across associates, across stores, across customers.[00:21:50] I'm just thinking of Ron's example of the associate pulling their own device [00:21:54] out of their pocket to try to answer a question for a customer. That just seems like it's always going to lead to inconsistency, right? Because you're not providing the associate with the right tool for the job to get that consistent response.[00:22:06] And I have to believe that, if I'm Walmart, I want that consistency because what's my brand value to the customer. It's part of it is that consistency of experience that any Walmart you walk into, you know you're going to get this experience and if I'm not providing the tools to the staff, then how can I deliver that?[00:22:23] Shish Shridhar: That actually reminds me of the conversation I had with the retailer couple of years ago, where, we found when we were working with that retailer, every one of the stores had a Facebook group for having internal conversations. And this was mainly because the company hadn't provided a platform for store associates to have those conversations, to sort of standardize it and not go rogue.[00:22:46] And, and they kind of found that when they were able to provide that platform, there was sort of a control place, [00:22:54] but things could happen. This is secure and it's not out in the public. Many of these sites were actually out in the public and you could go into these Facebook groups, look at all the internal conversations and bright the was going on, within, within the store itself.[00:23:09] That was, again, I think one of those things where companies decide we need to standardize and provide a consistent interface. Thank you. [00:23:17] Trevor Sumner: Well, not just consistency, something that you can monitor. Right. And, that's one of the values and, and, and I thought the earlier point is great. It's like, let's be honest that a lot of Walmart, you know, sales associates, they're making minimum wage or close to it.[00:23:31] So the notion of having, free phone service and a free device that's meaningful. Right? And if you think about the data rates that are probably pre negotiated by Walmart, they're probably getting a very good deal.[00:23:43] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think that speaks back to Ron's point earlier about the incentive as a recruiting incentive, right.[00:23:48] To find more as we've heard, certainly in other rooms and in clubhouse at another news stories, there's [00:23:54] a big difficulty right now for a lot of retailers to recruit enough staff as stores have reopened and customers are coming back. So I think I do agree that that serves as a good incentive. I think Trevor, your point is right about that.[00:24:06] I'm going to ask Jeff, you've been quiet and listening to everybody's comments. If you had anything that you disagreed with or wanted to add to this? [00:24:13] Jeff Roster: Yeah, so really interesting. First, first thought is we've been waiting forever to really get into the BYO D discussion, bring your own device in this case, it's really not a BYO D it's a, B Y B Y CD.[00:24:25] Bring your own company device. So there's gonna just be some amazing learnings that are going to come out of this huge fan of, of having associates have to have the tools, probably everyone in this, in this conversation. And obviously everyone on clubhouse has, has a powerful, a smartphone that they're using.[00:24:40] Why shouldn't our, our store associates have it, that I pop on my loss prevention hat and think what happened. And so I agree with Trevor that there's some crazy interesting voice technology that's coming out, sentiment analysis, how, you know, tone of voice, all that sort of stuff. Before [00:24:54] listening to the conversations to help in that.[00:24:56] What happens when you can recover some loss prevention problems, two associates, maybe, maybe talking a about stealing something or whatnot. What do we do there? Is there a privacy concern there? How do we turn that device off? When store associates have the expectation for, for a private conversation, don't have the answers, but this is going to be fascinating to watch.[00:25:16] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I think that's a good point. It is absolutely going to be interesting to watch the deployment of this. I think it's gonna be fascinating to see what percentage of employees decide to use this device as their personal device. [00:25:26] One of the things that I think is interesting in, in a couple of us touched on this . So, the ask Sam app is an example of that.[00:25:33] AI Impact on Frontline Workers[00:25:33] Ricardo Belmar: Where else do we see AI based technologies, stepping in whether in that case being billed as an augmentation or something to assist in associated, or you could see this as well in a clientelling scenario, and compare that with other automation technologies. And is this going to be competition for [00:25:54] frontline workers?[00:25:54] Is it going to be an assistance? Is it a combination of the two there there's certainly a perception out there that certain types of automation technology are a threat to frontline jobs. Certainly if you start talking about robotics, you get lots of folks who will come back and say, the robots are going to take those jobs away from frontline workers.[00:26:13] And if you think about a grocery store scenario where you're using a robot to do shelf counts, for example, people start to think there may be some truth in that statement. In other scenarios, you, you might respond to something like that and say, well, what's really happening is we're shifting the tasks.[00:26:27] We're trying to eliminate the more mundane, repetitive tasks that don't really add to the employees. Productivity don't necessarily help that frontline worker help a customer and free them up to do those jobs. So we're, we're shifting tasks, not necessarily shifting labor. There there's arguments on all sides of this.[00:26:46] I want to open up the discussion now to that point. Where do you see this, dividing line between. AI [00:26:54] technologies, automation, technologies being a threat versus it assisting frontline workers. And Ron, I'm going to start with you again, putting you on the spot. [00:27:03] Ron Thurston: This is the complicated question, but you got to thank you. I mean, here's what, what I would say is that there, there has always been, and there will always be a high demand and a high expectation of people who are exceptional every day and committed to delivering great customer experiences.[00:27:24] And, and maybe as the types of our businesses evolve and scale in different ways and you know, kind of evolution continues in retail. There will always be that side of it that needs great people who have incredible human interaction skills and they, they are unaffected by all of this because what they're hired for and what they're celebrated for is their ability to connect and sell.[00:27:51] And then I think that there's a whole other [00:27:54] side of the pendulum that says, could some of these things be automated and, put through machines and done differently. Absolutely. Yes. And I think that that's fine, but when I look at it, I say, well, then there's an enormous training opportunity and ability to take, to up-skill people who may potentially frontline workers and then build their careers in retail, through training, and that they can become that person that becomes really invaluable to companies because of their ability to connect, because that's, what's bringing people back to stores today.[00:28:28] And so that's how I kind of look at it of like the ultimate machine and the ultimate, lack of machinery that is entirely human. [00:28:38] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. And, you know, I think that's really an interesting point because especially as you look at this pandemic and who did really, really well, Walmart target best buy all these guys took e-commerce share from Amazon because in part, because there's this identity of being local, being part of a local [00:28:54] community.[00:28:54] And even as we talked about the 740,000 devices. Maybe that's a way that Walmart's looking at creating communities of its workers and those workers are a significant presence in the community. So I think this focus on community is absolutely right, whether it's, you know, sales associate to customer, whether it's sales, associate and worker to worker, I think there are new opportunities that are going to be uncovered as we create some of this automation to, to connect the connect the world.[00:29:20] Brandon Rael: And I think a retail and especially the luxury sector, which can't wait to hear Casey's perspective on is the battleground to win the hearts and minds of consumers. That retailer's always going to be a blend of the arts and sciences. Yes, automation, AI, machine learning, artificial intelligence, everything, augmented reality that really adds to the value of the customer experience matters.[00:29:44] But also the in-person engagement that Ron has alluded to that sense of community. The sense of togetherness all matters. And if it can be personalized by knowing your customers, by having the data [00:29:54] first customer first strategy that all the better, and it will make the store associates empowered, then have a really defined career path that's built on data and analytics [00:30:03] Casey Golden: a hundred percent. This is Casey. I think being able to separate what builds value versus administration work and how we can automate more administration work and streamlining the processes so that sales associates or retail associates can focus on things that create value to the customer and to the company.[00:30:25] I mean, how much time do you spend with customers and selling versus doing all of the paperwork or logging. And measuring everything that you need to do to, to be able to pick up that conversation again, or to create more value or to follow up. There's a lot of sales associates that either have no software or they have to use three or four pieces of software.[00:30:49] And I think that can cause a lot of, just it's more work that great, we got technology, but [00:30:54] now they have so much technology that's not connected or not helping them. It's just creating more work. But social media has, has really been at the pinnacle of building relationships and being able to have that sense of community, clubhouse is a perfect example of that.[00:31:10] In store experiences can facilitate it, but retail hasn't really facilitated that on e-commerce, or built their own community. A lot of retailers have relied on other social platforms to build their community on. And at the end of the day, they don't have access to their customer because it's on somebody else's platform.[00:31:31] So I think the more we can kind of bring those experiences and connect them to the brand, consumers will be able to start feeling what brand loyalty is supposed to like, why they would want to be loyal to a brand.[00:31:42] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I agree. To build that loyalty, right? It requires people. I don't think you can. Claim you'll accomplish that by just automating every interaction. It makes me think about, the typical customer service [00:31:54] scenario that every comedian will talk about, right.[00:31:56] When they're trying to reach a retailer to return something, for example, and they have to get through the chat bot or they have to get through the AI before they can reach a person. It's not too many years ago when the jokes used to be about, IVR phone systems where you'd call in and you'd have to keep, press nine to get through this menu, then press seven, then press five.[00:32:14] And everyone tried to figure out what's the special key. You have to press on the phone to get out of the automated part and get to the person. And it's in some ways, right? From a customer experience, point of view, that doesn't change that, that human component of it doesn't change. And that's why you need people.[00:32:30] Casey Golden: Yeah. a subscription to a company called Billy and their, a, razorblade like subscription for women. And I picked them because there were a startup, a New York startup. I liked the founders. I signed up for it. I've been on a reoccurring for probably three years.[00:32:47] I liked them, but they just magically show up in my mailbox. I don't engage with the brand. I never go to the brand's website. I don't [00:32:54] touch anything. They just arrive in my mailbox every other month. Which is nice and convenient and I never have to shop for them, but I also never say the brand out loud.[00:33:02] I never think about the brand. I never think about the company ever. I'm never engaged with the company whatsoever. So I think there's a, there's a difference between seamless building brand loyalty and also. What kind of brand loyalty am I, am I loyal to the brand or am I loyal to the fact that they just show up every other month?[00:33:20] And I never think about the brand. It could be anybody. [00:33:23] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. And so I think it's dangerous to say like, yes, there, there are always going to be sales, some sales associates, but what if we removed half the sales associates or half the warehouse pickers, or, half that's a pretty significant reduction.[00:33:37] And I think it's, we just have to be careful about being reductionist here. I think technology and automation is going to reduce a lot of the repetitive tasks. And ultimately the question is, can we find new tasks that are valued at minimum wage or higher that add enough value [00:33:54] to be competitive? And, you know, certainly at a luxury, like a Gucci or Chanel, there are plenty of ways that you can surprise and delight, and they'll always find new ways to differentiate, but at a Walmart or target where convenience is really kind of, and the affordability value is the key. I think you're going to see significant reductions in staff and that's I think, does anybody disagree with that? Like when I say significant, let's call it 20% [00:34:21] Ricardo Belmar: i'll give you another example, along those lines, Trevor. Cause I'm not going to disagree with you. In fact, let's go beyond the mass merchandisers, but let's think about a franchise businesses like QSRs, where, you also have a scenario with limited staff, lower wages and no business running on an extremely slim margin, right? So if that's your scenario and let's face it in, in a franchise QSR, the highest cost that franchise owner has is their labor costs. So anything they can do, that's going to cut that in some way, without hurting the customer [00:34:54] service, you can bet I think that franchise owner will pursue it. What I think happens is that there's a mix here, right? There's yes. There a reduction. I don't think you can get away from that. In fact, I could, I won't name the brand, but I can give you an anecdotal story from a brand in Europe where over a lengthy period of time, many years, they actually reduced kitchen staff across their restaurants, by as much as 40% because of automation.[00:35:19] And of course, this isn't something you heard about in the news. You're not, it's not something they would publicize, but they did. In fact, create new positions and new roles in their restaurants when they did other things that were more front of house customer facing. Did those new roles displace all of the kitchen staff reduction?[00:35:38] Probably not. So there is an aspect here of eliminating the. Let's call them more mundane jobs because they're very repetitive, and not necessarily the more enjoyable tasks that get eliminated by automation. The [00:35:54] efficiency brought from that has distinct business advantages for the business owner.[00:35:59] Of course not so much for the frontline worker who's at risk of losing that job. This usually leads to discussions which we kind of touched on in our last session, but the example of Levi's wanting to train frontline workers in areas like data science and trying to create those new roles and areas.[00:36:15] And you are, as Ron described last time, those new segmented skill sets that can allow them to stay on in a different capacity, perhaps in a different wage or different salary, but not completely risk losing all of those jobs. I think that's what we've seen throughout history, right. You know, once upon a time we had people that operated elevators and then the elevators got buttons that automated the process.[00:36:36] What happened to all of the elevator operators?[00:36:38] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you're talking about, I think you're going to have fewer, potentially fewer sales associates who are superpowered. And can summon products and inventory and help you do omnichannel delivery, you know, at will. But you're going to have fewer of them. They'll [00:36:54] probably be slightly higher paid because to Ron's point, there'll be even better at customer service.[00:36:58] And in the back of the house, you're going to see a gutting in terms of number of people. I mean, we're not even talking about self-driving trucks, right? There are 3.5 million truck drivers in the U S like, I don't know how you turn a truck driver or a warehouse worker into a premier sales associate at an Uber echelon, kind of value where it's even more highly competitive.[00:37:21] The expectations are higher. Your ability to adopt technology is more critical. I think, we're really going to struggle with what that looks like. [00:37:30] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, as a Walmart and a Target implement more things that automate and reduce workforce at. I feel like at the same time, we've got premium brands that need to increase their workforce because Gucci still has 10 million pieces of monthly traffic.[00:37:49] How do you provide that high touch service to all of those people? I think there's going to be a [00:37:54] massive need to flux the skillsets and hopefully it can become more of a career again, that stable, I only time will tell, [00:38:03] Brandon Rael: Casey and everyone would the, the fact that the intangibles that matter as well, especially luxury and fashion, as it relate to the customer and the emotional intelligence that is needed in the marketplace, to understand the customer's needs to have empathy, to build community, to build relationships that extend beyond just an AI/AR.[00:38:22] Machine learning model, but that's certainly it can be there, but, end of the day, it's about relationships and one-to-one personalized selling whether it's through digital channels or in person, and that's not the Walmart model, but for sure, but for the luxury market, it's great. [00:38:36] Ricardo Belmar: That's a good point, Brandon. [00:38:38][00:38:38] How Do We Use Digital to Solve Analog Problems?[00:38:38] Ricardo Belmar: We brought a couple of folks up to the stage with a, hopefully some questions for us. Michael, welcome to the stage. No stranger to the retail razor club.[00:38:45] Michael Zakkour: Hey Ricardo. Hey guys. The only thing I want to posit is. [00:38:51] That technology is the means to the end. It's not [00:38:54] the end. Right? So when we think about the frontline worker and the empowerment that technology data, AI, VR, AR will give them in the workplace. Ultimately, I go with what Ron's saying it's to empower great frontline employees, great frontline workers who want to move up through the organization. The technology is about applying digital means to solve analog problems. So when I think about what's going on in the rest of the world today. You look in China where somebody sits down at the salon and they sit in the hairdresser's chair and they're looking at an AR extended reality, augmented reality mirror.[00:39:39] And they can see their head with every kind of color cut style, whatever they go through a million permutations. Ultimately that technology is empowering the hairdresser to better serve the frontline consumer.[00:39:54][00:39:54] And I just wanted to chime in and say, it's not an either, or for me it's how do we use technology and how do we use AI and data? How do we use digital to solve analog problems? That's what this is about for me.[00:40:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I think an excellent point. I'm going to put it to the panel here, Ron and everyone went, what do you think.[00:40:13] Casey Golden: I'm going to, I feel like there's a lot of solutions out in the marketplace, but at the end of the day, they have to be implemented and sold in. I have had several conversations with people saying, this is exactly where we want to go. We've loved this, but we're not there yet. We're still working on basics and it's like, why are you spending money on basics instead of spending money on things that generate revenue and value and fill in the basics afterwards, we can build basics while you're making revenue.[00:40:48] That's the biggest struggle of any of these tech companies. Being able to create these solutions is to be [00:40:54] able to have proof of concept and run at scale. And it's really hard for a lot of them to get in, and, and actually adopt and roll out the entire software.[00:41:07] Brandon Rael: I think Casey, you touched on a critical point, change management and organizational change are the most critical components of any adoption of any innovative technology solutions that will drive a better associate experience or customer experience. And, it's been a challenge in my field as an advisor and consultant a critical part of our, our transformation work is around change management.[00:41:29] And without that adoption rates. Be very minimal and most transformations fail for that matter. The cultural obstacles and challenges of the companies are not ready to change or understand the imperative to change. So the why is that they can pick and pull it there. [00:41:44] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, we need to be able to build with customers and with real use case scenarios and do AB testing. And I feel like a lot of brands expect [00:41:54] everything to have already been done and working, even though they haven't had the chance to do it in real time with those brands that have real use cases.[00:42:05] So it's hard to have innovation and technology go when the sales cycle is too slow or traction numbers are too slow because. That's how you build tech, right? I'm not building just to sit on my server. [00:42:16] Ricardo Belmar: No one ever said it was easy. [00:42:17] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. And what I think is really interesting is I think that kind of COVID has, is because retailers and brands have had to more fiercely collaborate around data inventory, supply chain, because of the need to create, you know, omni-channel delivery and BOPIS and all these different things that we actually do need real-time data on a per store basis about what's going on at a product level.[00:42:40] I actually do need all the products and the skews and all the data about those products to be available and, have integrity and I think what's really interesting to me is that some of the foundations that we're missing to [00:42:54] be able to execute on this plan are now starting to be in place so that we can get to these kind of higher level experiences, these higher level technologies and you know, given all the money flowing into retail right now I think there's going to be the cash to actually do [00:43:06] Casey Golden: I agree the next two years is going to be, really fun [00:43:09] Ricardo Belmar: absolutely, absolutely wildly it's going to happen and the embracing of technology to facilitate that change.[00:43:16] What I like to say is that it's finally expected to happen in a way that's not going to be technology for the sake of technology. It's going to be technology with the purpose and ideally technology that's seamless and as well as transparent. So it doesn't get in the way it just helps accomplish something.[00:43:32] So with that, let me move on to Neil, I think you were the next one up on stage. You had a question or comment for us.[00:43:37][00:43:37] Is Tech Disrupting Human to Human Connection? [00:43:37] Neil Redding: Yeah. Thanks so much, Ricardo. [00:43:39] It's great to be here I'm Neil Redding. I run a boutique consultancy called Redding futures, which is really focused on creating holistically integrated digital and physical ecosystems around brands. And we've done a lot of work for retail clients over the years. Ron and I had a [00:43:54]conversation this past week where I think I just expressed my fundamental enthusiasm about technology in this whole context.[00:44:01] But what's funny to me is, earlier in the conversation, listening to the discussion about Walmart deploying all of these phones into the hands of store associates, I felt actually a little bit sad because I also am super passionate and just love the quality of human interaction that comes when technology is not a mediator.[00:44:24] And I've been thinking a lot during this conversation about, and I guess I'm also excited about the next few years about how technology can fade a bit into the background when we are physically together. And I suppose I'm old enough to not find a. Being on my smartphone, but someone standing next to me on their smartphone, you know I find that sort of a substandard kind of quality of interaction at the human level that I I'm excited to see how [00:44:54] yeah, AR and sensors and spaces and various other kinds of technologies and gather the data that's needed, that we've talked so much about in this conversation and provide access to, all this cloud-based information about products and services, inventory, and so on.[00:45:10] Well also getting out of the way the allowing humans to have when they're physically together have a really rich interaction. So I guess if there's a question in there, I'm curious about those of you who are paying close attention to having phones in hands. You know, when you're a store associate at a customer, is there any thought going in yet to that context or that use case to how that can be done?[00:45:34] While minimally disrupting the human to human connection, you know? [00:45:37] Shish Shridhar: So, so that's one of the areas that have been working with a bunch of startups that have alternatives. And specifically for the scenario that you described, where many retailers are reluctant to have the store associates walking around with the phone and using the phone [00:45:54] appear distracted and not interested in the customer.[00:45:57] And you're right. It creates that barrier. Between the customer and the store associates and makes them unapproachable. And as resolved, they're looking at alternatives to bonds that have seen headsets is one of them, which is still a question of whether that makes you unapproachable.[00:46:12] And the one that I particularly like is from a startup called Turnpike, and they use thing variables, which is the watches, but they can get information. It is discreet in a way where there is constant information flow on tasks and, and aisle clean ups or replenishing products and all those things keep coming in, but they're not, holding a phone or appear distracted.[00:46:37] And I see other technologies coming in as well as we progress that will kind of make it sort of invisible. And I think it's all about that, the best technologies invisible and they are heading towards that direction, moving away from [00:46:54] a device that is, making the store associates unapproachable and creating that barrier. [00:47:00] Ron Thurston: Hi Neil. I would just add, I don't think the challenge, isn't the technology and using it. The challenge is great store leadership as someone that can spends a lot of time in stores and coaching leaders, a great leader on the floor manager on duty, whatever terminology you want to use, you're observing the interactions, you're coaching the team.[00:47:20] You're seeing who's paying attention and who who's not, you're fully engaged, which comes from great training, but I've actually liked to provide the opportunity for the technology when necessary, but at the same time kind of be involved as a leader and coach and, and say it's time to put it away and time to bring it out.[00:47:41] And I, I love that idea that we can actually do both with well-trained leaders in our retail space. [00:47:47] Ricardo Belmar: I think that really underscores the point that the ability to really recognize what [00:47:54] frontline workers mean to the brand really does start at the top of the management chain.[00:47:58] Just like the corporate culture that's established in any organization also starts at the top. And if those things don't align, then you're not going to get the results that you want to see from that frontline staff, because they're in turn, not going to recognize what you're hoping will recognize out of the organization, because you're just not delivering it to them in the first place.[00:48:18] So you can't get what you don't give back. And in a sense, and I think that's pretty much reflected there. [00:48:24] Casey Golden: Hundred percent. [00:48:24] Ron Thurston: Yeah. I don't want to give Cathy the floor, but I'm looking at the, my homepage on LinkedIn. The number two story is why retail workers on why they fled. And I clicked into it and the stories are horrendous about the way they were treated, , from their leaders and quotas.[00:48:40] And yeah, I mean, it pains me to even read these when I think about the power of retail, but it's the number two story on LinkedIn. Like we have so much work to do as leaders. I put it back on the, I put it back on all of us that work in [00:48:54] stores. Our responsibility is to lead these teams in a way that engages and that they're proud to work for who they work for and the leaders that are around them.[00:49:03] And they're getting trained and they're being inspired and they're doing better every day. These stories are, and they're from a variety of different brands. They're terrible. I mean, God forbid you go on Glassdoor. That's even worse, but I mean, just. The story was posted on LinkedIn and now it's trending, it really pains me and we can do better.[00:49:23] We have to do better. And this is, this is the future of our industry tech or not these stories about how retail employees are treated is the future of this growth and all this money that's being fueled into it, or the continued bad news and high turnover rates. It's really like this just put me in a spin right now, but I think it's really critical.[00:49:47] Casey Golden: Or what is it titled? Is it on your LinkedIn? [00:49:49] Ron Thurston: Yeah, it's, it's on, you know, where it says LinkedIn news. It says retail [00:49:54] workers on why they fled. [00:49:55] Casey Golden: Okay. I've just been hearing some horror stories myself. I interview about a hundred people every two weeks. We have these massive rooms and then everybody breaks out into segmented, next group interviews and it's been absolutely horrendous. [00:50:10] Some of the things that I've heard and there's been a lot of highlight lately on wellness and a lot of corporate culture and brain culture around wellness and providing services to your employees and things of that nature. But it's only for corporate it's for corporate employees.[00:50:27] It's not for the retail associates that work in the stores. They don't get summer Fridays. They don't get the wellness program. They don't have access to so much. That's part of corporate. It's like, they're all, they've always been like the ugly redheaded stepsister. That's just kind of been used in a lot of ways.[00:50:45] And they're, they're brilliant. They've got so much information. I really think that this is the time where they're able to get the recognition and support that they've [00:50:54] deserved for the last 50 years. And start being part of corporate. [00:50:57] Ricardo Belmar: Ron I know you get asked this question all the time, but as you raised a moment ago, it does require the right leadership for these things.[00:51:08] And you have to start asking why don't we see more leaders come out and say the things that you're saying about frontline workers and giving the reasons why we need to change the way we look at the front line. And I know they're out there. I know they exist. I've talked to other retail leaders who agree in principle, what's executed is not always aligned with the principle of what they believe, but I have to say that, the evidence makes it seem that there just aren't enough of those leaders.[00:51:36] Why do you think that is?[00:51:37] Ron Thurston: Yeah, I I think often by the time. you've. Maybe ended up in those positions where you're, you are the decision-maker you were likely didn't come from stores. And so I don't know that you have a full grasp of actually what it means to do this work [00:51:54] every day and to experience it and, spending a few days a month or sometimes less just doing store visits, which is, always the show and the entourage as we used to call it, is that that's not enough to know what's going on.[00:52:09] And so I think more of more people like myself that grew up from sales to heads of stores, we have to be the ones that speak because we understand it. And sometimes that's not always the case, but even if you didn't the ability to find your voice and speak for all of them, that can't, that don't have that voice or the ability to influence change again, I'm sure all these Walmart employees are really happy. And most of them, I should say, but they can't influence change the decision makers influence change, and we have to be able to listen and learn and make the tough decisions sometimes, which is in the benefit and, and the cost investment of doing the right things for our store [00:52:54] teams.[00:52:54] And I, want to be someone that actually encourages other heads of stores to talk about it because that's how we'll make a difference in our industry for all of these people writing these things about their experience working in retail. [00:53:06] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, you're absolutely right. It does require all of us to, in a sense fight for the industry and raise the issues that need to be raised and also highlight the positives that, that just don't get highlighted enough in order to shift the mindset.[00:53:19] How Does Adoption Factor Into Successful Tech Deployment?[00:53:19] Ricardo Belmar: All right. Let me have a couple more folks up on the audience, Cathy welcome to the stage.[00:53:23] Cathy McCabe: Hi. Hi, good to see everybody. I'm Cathy CEO of Proximity Insight, and we're a clienteling and a tool really to sort of do all of those things about connecting and helping stores to connect and transact with their customers. [00:53:38] There were a couple of points around adoption. And obviously because we have a tool that's very much there to, to help, to deliver sales associates, to have as much information at their fingertips as possible so that they can serve the customer more adoption is absolutely key.[00:53:53] And there are [00:53:54] definitely ways in which you can ensure that adoption and onboarding is as seamless as possible and is easy for the store teams. To be embraced, from the top down and you have to be able to also share the successes.[00:54:07] And if you don't, you know, if it's not just a project that you stick in and then walk away and move on to the next project, it has to be something that becomes your DNA and part of what you're doing as a brand and very sort of your purpose, your values that you wrap around the tools and the tools aren't there.[00:54:24] It's not the tech, the tech is gives you the capability, but you have to deliver the why, why you're using it, what it's there for, how you're, how you're going to use it. [00:54:34] And I think one of the other things that I just wanted to say, cause it's, there's so many points that resonated. Really interesting point. We're actually seeing some of our brands investing in more people on the shop floor now because they're giving them tools to be able to connect to not just the person that's in the store, but also [00:54:54] the people that you know, that the customers that are online and therefore, you know, the demand is there to be able to actually speak to a person, to show them the product, to, sort of talk about their expertise and share their knowledge and information, and to be able to, find those items that someone's looking for.[00:55:12] And actually now we're seeing that they're actually investing more in their teams. So. All of the automation that AI that goes into the backend of the tool and is then surface to help the store teams to, to connect more and ultimately to transact more, you know, we're seeing them actually investing more on the sales floor, which is a great, a great place to be.[00:55:32] Ricardo Belmar: Thanks Cathy for those comments. I agree. I think this, as, many of us now on the stage have said, and this is a really great industry and there are so many positives to be drawn from it and so much that it contributes to, so many other industries. And I think it's just unfortunate that we don't necessarily all say collectively do enough to highlight the benefits and the positives.[00:55:53] I

Brigid Brigid Turner is a marathoner, an actress, and director, known for Deka-Log: A Finding Me story (2017), For a Dark Skin Girl (2015) and All for Jessica (2013). During the pandemic, Bridgid wrote a feature film Run Crew which is now in post-production. We have two sponsors of today's episode Ron Thurston and Lenses Only Ron is a seasoned retail executive who started his career on the frontlines, he's the author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride Today and a former guest on the podcast. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying me on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in the lower righthand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

S1E1 – The Retail Avengers & The Future of Frontline Staff, Part 1Welcome to Season 1, Episode 1, the first-ever episode of The Retail Razor Show!I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top 100 Retail Influencer, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University's Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock and slayer of retail frankenstacks!Together, we're your guides on the retail transformation journey. Whether you're thinking digital and online, mobile, or brick & mortar stores, there'll be something for you!In episode 1 we dive into the future of retail frontline workers, with none other than Ron Thurston, author of Retail Pride, The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career. Ron joins our Retail Avengers team on Clubhouse to talk about what retailers need to do to foster the right environment for their store teams.For more information about Ron, and how you can Take Pride Today in your retail career, visit Ron's website: https://www.retailpride.comThe Retail Razor ShowFollow us on Twitter: https://bit.ly/TwRRazorConnect with us on LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/LI-RRazorJoin our club on Clubhouse: http://bit.ly/RRazorClubListen to us on Callin: https://bit.ly/RRCallinSubscribe on YouTube: https://bit.ly/RRShowYouTubeSubscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/RetailRazorShowRetail Razor Show Episode Page: https://bit.ly/RRShowPodHost → Ricardo Belmar,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twRBelmarConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LIRBelmarRead my comments on RetailWire - ****https://bit.ly/RWRBelmarCo-host → Casey Golden,Follow on Twitter - ****https://bit.ly/twCaseyConnect on LinkedIn - ****https://bit.ly/LICaseyRead my comments on RetailWire - https://bit.ly/RWCaseyTRANSCRIPTThe Retail Avengers & The Future of Frontline Staff, Part 1[00:00:20] Ricardo: Hello. Good morning. Good afternoon. Good evening. No matter what time of day you're listening. Welcome. Welcome to season one, episode one, the first ever episode of the retail razor show. I'm your host Ricardo Belmar, a top 100 retail influencer and lead partner marketing advisor for retail and consumer goods at Microsoft.[00:00:37] Casey: And I'm your co-host Casey Golden CEO of Luxlock and Slayer of retail frankenstacks, [00:00:43] Ricardo: retail, frankenstacks. I love that intro. I really need to get a tagline like that. Casey. [00:00:48] Casey: Slaying, frankenstacks. It's a messy job it's earned.[00:00:51] Ricardo: Oh, I believe it![00:00:52] Casey: So I'm super stoked to kick off our first episode ever of the show! [00:00:56] Ricardo: I am too. I am too. So let's talk a little bit about what the show will be like. This all started some months ago with the retail razor club on clubhouse and a powerhouse group of retail experts and thought leaders to just talk retail, talk tech and host some really good deep discussions on what we think people in this industry need to make a difference and to be a change maker.[00:01:14] Casey: Tell us more Ricardo, tell us more. I feel like we need some dramatic [00:01:20] music here [00:01:20] Ricardo: and maybe for episode two, we'll add some budget for dramatic music. So our goal is to cut through all the noise, cut through the clutter, make it all actionable. Let everybody learn from the people who've actually done things.[00:01:33] Anyone who's solving challenges and not afraid to expose the hard truths.. [00:01:37] Casey: And best of all, since we started this on clubhouse, we made it interactive. So people could ask tough questions and voice their opinions. [00:01:44] Ricardo: A hundred percent, a hundred percent all the way. This is an open forum. One that really moves the industry forward.[00:01:50] By sharing deep, deep knowledge, we started an amazing series of rooms initially called retail tech predictions 2025. But you know, our group quickly earned the nickname, the Retail Avengers, [00:02:00] Casey: Captain America., right here![00:02:02] Ricardo: And I am iron man, you know, you're right Casey. We really do need some dramatic music and we got to work on that [00:02:06] Casey: maybe by episode three next time, next time.[00:02:10] Ricardo: Yeah, episode three, that I'm going to take, make a note of that. Okay. So in each episode listeners will hear one of our fabulous clubhouse rooms and we'll bring back [00:02:20] guests from those discussions for a few last words. But don't think that's all we have to offer in future episodes. We're going to introduce new segments, extra guests, and we'll also have some unique interview sessions that we're going to record in another app called Callin. [00:02:32] Casey: Can't wait for those. [00:02:34] So Ricardo, who's our special guests for the opening episode. [00:02:37] Ricardo: We are starting up strong with one of the best out there. Ron Thurston, the author of the book, Retail Pride, former head of stores at Intermix and quite possibly, one of our favorite retail executives out there.[00:02:48] Right? Casey, [00:02:49] Casey: I'm a fan. Let's get to it! [00:02:50] Ricardo: Okay. So let's quickly introduce the rest of our Retail Avengers team and everyone will be hearing from them quite often in these sessions. So besides Casey and myself, we have Jeff Roster, fellow RETHINK Retail, top one hundred influencer and fellow advisory council member at the George Mason University Center for Retail Transformation and former analyst.[00:03:11] Then we have Shish Shridhar, the global retail lead at Microsoft for Startups.[00:03:16] Casey: And Brandon Rael transformation delivery strategy leader at [00:03:20] Reach Partners, and one of my faves, Trevor Sumner, CEO of Perch Interactive. [00:03:25] Ricardo: All right. So without further delay, let's give a listen to the Retail Avengers and the future of Frontline Staff, Part 1.Clubhouse Session[00:03:42] Ricardo: So with that my name is Ricardo Belmar. I host the retail razor club here on Clubhouse. Retail tech guy have been in retail tech for the better part of the last two decades, working at various different solution providers and managed service providers, and of course, I like to say the best technology in retail is the kind that's seamless and transparent that you don't even notice.[00:04:02] Jeff: Hi Jeff Roster co-host of this week in innovation and serve on several advisory boards and a former Gartner and IHL retail sector analyst [00:04:11] Brandon: Hi, Brandon Rael here. I'm currently one of the transformation and delivery and strategy leaders here at Reach Partners a consultancy. My background is retail and consumer products, industries, and I've been working in the strategy consulting space, focusing predominantly on digital and it's impact on organizations and helping companies transform and evolve.[00:04:29] Casey: Hi, Casey here, founder of Luxlock we're a retail experience platform and we are deploying an independent workforce and re-skilling them. So I love this topic of the conversation. Worked a lot in enterprise retail tech [00:04:42] and on the e-commerce side. So excited to be here you guys, fun conversation! [00:04:46] Ricardo: Definitely will be! Shish. [00:04:47] Shish: Hi, good afternoon. I'm the retail lead at Microsoft for Startups and I'm actually working on building out a portfolio of retail tech B2B startups solving complex business challenges in retail. Absolutely love the topic that we're we're we're we're talking about today. Looking forward to it. Thank you. [00:05:03] Ricardo: I see Trevor has joined us. Trevor why don't you do a quick intro. [00:05:06] Trevor: My name is Trevor Sumner. I'm the CEO of perch. We do interactive displays in IOT that detect which products you touch and like minority report. They just wake up and start telling you about the product, they call them shelf talkers. So I've been deep in retail and retail tech for almost a decade now. So excited to be on board with everybody here. [00:05:26] Ricardo: All right. Wonderful. We have a special guest with us this week, Ron Thurston author of the book, retail pride, which I highly recommend.[00:05:33] Ron, why don't you go ahead and give us your introduction [00:05:36] Ron: hi everyone. Thank you. Yes. My name is Ron Thurston and I am the author of Retail Pride, the guide to [00:05:42] celebrating your accidental career, which is really about recognizing the hard work that the millions of people that work in all of our stores all around the world do every day.[00:05:50] And my full-time role is as the vice president of stores Intermix which officially today is a freestanding business on its own no longer under the Gap umbrella. And so we have a lot of exciting momentum behind us now being privately held and it will be an exciting adventure. And I sit on the board of directors of Goodwill here for New York and New Jersey, which also has a really exciting retail component to it, which I'm happy to talk about.[00:06:18] So thanks for inviting me, Ricardo. [00:06:19] Ricardo: Fantastic. We're really happy to have you here with us today, Ron, this is a topic that I know many of us on the panel have been wanting to do for a while. Not the least of which is because of the added focus that retail frontline workers have seen over the past 15 months.[00:06:34] Frontline Worker Sentiment[00:06:34] Ricardo: I want to ask everybody on the panel, What's the sentiment these days about frontline workers, has it swung more positive to the point where [00:06:42] frontline workers are going to get the recognition that they deserve to have for the job they do and the service they provide to customers and retail brands? [00:06:49] Ron, I'm going to ask you to respond first because I'd really like to hear what your feeling is on that. [00:06:53] Ron: Sure. Thanks, Ricardo. I have probably never been more excited about the opportunity for store teams. And I think as customers have come back in and , every day it's getting bigger, the opportunity to recognize in many ways the increased skillset necessary to manage the emotional, the tougher part of retail in conjunction with more tech in conjunction with higher customer demands and kind of new ways to shop has put this pressure and, excitement back into stores and the training that's necessary. [00:07:29] The up skill in the hiring process has never been more important. They, kind of challenge of the value of the brick and mortar business in compared to e-commerce.[00:07:39] This is the time where more [00:07:42] than ever, we need highly skilled people that are, that work in brick and mortar, retail, and are compensated for that work and the business models that are evolving out of it.[00:07:52] And I think it's just every day, I'm more excited about what I'm seeing my own business and what I'm reading about every day.[00:07:59] Brandon: I could not agree more with Ron. , if anything, the pandemic has accelerated the recognition of how critical the retail staff or brand ambassador to the store associates and how important they are to run the operation of building that trusted relationship with the customer.[00:08:15] I consider that the retail associates, part of the last mile of fulfillment and not necessarily the product, but of the relationship of the brand or the brand equity. [00:08:23] people go to the store to engage, to get inspired, to discover. And, , I'm all digital first. We know everyone is digital first and shopping e-commerce, , percentage wise, it's still , 15% of the business is converted on ecommerce.[00:08:36] The physical stores are as critical as ever to bridge that digital and physical gap and the journey [00:08:42]may begin in the store may ultimately end on the retailer's app, but the store associates plays a vital role in that relationship.[00:08:47] Casey: A hundred percent. , one of our biggest goal, which was to deploy an on-demand distributed workforce and it's been pretty amazing to put a lot of people back to work and give them opportunities to sell products that they've never had access to because they worked at a single brand.[00:09:02] Shish: agree with everyone I think there is going to be a big transformational element to it as well. I kind of look at the convenient spot of retail. There's a lot of things that has accelerated, during COVID, , BOPIS in particular. And I think that is going to change what the frontline workers do and, how to do it.[00:09:23] For example, I think there's going to be so much more focused on click and collect orders, because, cashierless becoming more prominent and accelerated. I also think the assisting the self checkout will be one aspect that frontline workers will be doing more of. There might also be a lot of clientelling [00:09:42] that has accelerated as a result.[00:09:43] And also I think from the experiential part of retail, that's going to be a lot more skills and expertise needed because that is leaning more towards that personalized, aspect of it where engaging with customers becomes more more of a requirement. [00:10:02] Trevor: Yeah. I agree with that. I think one of the transformational changes underlying is data. Because of the need for real-time inventory and product information for BOPIS for better supply chain management and COVID is an accelerator for that.[00:10:17] All of a sudden, we've normalized all this data that we can now put in the hands of sales associates. It's not their fault. If you go to a Macy's and you ask your question about what inventory looks like. Yeah, go look at those screens. They're green screens, right? I think they were programmed with punch cards.[00:10:29] Now that has all been changing, right? So the data is now available in normalized and formatted. It's now accessible, not just to be a tablets and iPads in the hands of sales associates, but, even like with Theatro in [00:10:42] a, in a mic format in an ear piece. So that's one piece of it. The second Shish hit on around you have the experiential being more part of it.[00:10:49] And that means being able to do brand storytelling. And while I love the thought that that's all gonna be done by purchasing digital tools like that, I, the role as a sales associate is going to be critical.[00:10:56] Ricardo: Interesting points there about the added roles for store associates to do, especially in light of things like picking up online orders in the store, other operational processes, either for picking product off the shelf to fulfill those orders, that these are new roles, new skills, new functions, we're asking those store associates to do and asking them to leverage real-time data about customers they're working with or items in the store, whether it's product information or other operational components.[00:11:23] Frontline Roles[00:11:23] Ricardo: One of the things that I would like to get into next is what are some of these additional roles? We've mentioned a few now, which were brought about by the nature of the pandemic, but what other new roles are we going to see frontline workers in retail taking on and particularly what are the required skills and I'll reference, really interesting article that I believe was in the wall street [00:11:42] journal about Levi's offering machine learning training for their retail workers. Presumably because it's a recognition that the need to understand data is going to become so much more important in how these frontline workers work with customers.[00:11:56] So what does everyone think of that? [00:11:58] Ron: I can jump in Ricardo , it's Ron. I actually think that the, width of the skillset has become so wide today that it's kind of become less about we're all cross-trained and we're all good in retail. We could work in stock room and we can work on the sales floor and we can do visual merchandising.[00:12:15] I think it's actually become a little more segmented than said if I have a skillset that is highly engaged and motivated and I'm good on camera for live selling, I'm good in front of customers, I can sell via chat that you have that level of personality. It's actually fully embracing that and saying, let's give you[00:12:34] that kind of customer facing roles or chat roles and not try to expect you to also run out to the curb and do a BOPIS [00:12:42] order and also fulfill a web order in the stock room, or when can you work an overnight to change the visual merchandising? I think we have to say, we have a team of people who are really good at tech people who are maybe good at tasks and people who are highly customer centric because what's coming with the customer coming in today more than ever wants a level of engagement.[00:13:03] And has it's curious, wants to be educated, wants to be styled once all the things that they haven't had. And that, that skill is really high. So I'm actually even looking at my own organization and saying, it's actually less about cross training and more about specialization and being the best version of that specialty based on your skills and your experience and your personality.[00:13:26] Because today, we're also expecting you to be on Instagram. We expect you to live sell. We expect you to, kind of show up every day in a new most highest version of what that would look like in the past. [00:13:39] Trevor: I really loved that. And one of the reasons [00:13:42] is because, I think this provides a new sense of career pathing, and compensation structures.[00:13:48] And so, Ron, I would love to, to understand better how you start thinking through that as the head of stores at the end, you get certified as, an influencer or as a live seller, or for example, there are technologies where during your downtime, you might do online clientelling and reach out in on a one-to-one basis.[00:14:05] Are you.becoming a certified personal shopper. And each of these, has a course associated with that. Some type of certification, some real-time training and evaluation, but also a better pay, better training. And not feeling like you're stuck in a specific kind of job that says a generalist with no place to go.[00:14:25] Ron: I was just going to say it, and having led apple stores. That's very much the apple model. You are a specialist and maybe you in phone or Mac or in software, and then you're next. kind of even more of a specialty or in training or in genius bar. [00:14:42] And that every step is a career trajectory. And I think in fashion, we've also kind of thought of it as we all have to be good at everything.[00:14:50] And I actually think it's more of the apple model, which is very structured and create benchmarks for growth. I agree with you, Trevor.[00:14:59] Casey: I was just going to say that, now that sales associates are able to sell online and get that commission tracked and productivity tracked, it changes the entire model of every single salesperson is able and has the opportunity to become a million dollar seller and not make $35,000 a year or 40,000, $50,000 a year.[00:15:20] We've seen the most of having what the industry used stylists for before, which is doing content on a, on an Instagram or putting lookbooks together or working in, like a stitch fix model and putting outfits or clothes into a box. They're coming to us and they have the passion. They have the skillset, they have the know-how, but they've never talked to a customer before.[00:15:41] And [00:15:42] so they don't know fit, they just get returned. And so, being able to communicate with the client, maintain that relationship over time and learn fit. We've actually had to start segmenting just like Trevor was saying is we're essentially segmenting talent into different talent pools and putting programs together to bring people who have worked at Citrix for the last six years into being able that they would be skilled enough to walk into Gucci on the floor and do a million dollars in sales. And so it's been really interesting and I think that there's going to be a lot of, differentiation between I'm a stylist versus I'm a sales person or a personal shopper right now.[00:16:24] I can't get a single person to agree on what they want to be called because salespeople don't want to be called the stylist and everybody gets called and everybody's called the stylist on Instagram. If you can put an outfit together. So it's like almost [00:16:42] diluted that job title almost in a way where no, I'm more than that. It's been interesting. We're still trying to figure out what. What everybody is going to be called.[00:16:54] Brandon: Is this the transformation evolution of what a store associate really is? I think to Ron's point and Trevor's point, there certainly is doing an operation stocking shelves or whatever else. Actually, what I want engagement with the customer is blended with the arts and sciences of social media, digital marketing, and micro influencing [00:17:14] Ricardo: I agree. I think it's fascinating point here about segmenting and the skills and Ron I like how you compare that to an apple model. One of the things that comes to my mind when I hear everyone saying that is a sort of implies a need for more staff in the store, as you get more specialized, depending of course, on what kind of store it is for format. It is the size of the store. The product categories are in, but if I were to generalize it, it makes me believe that I'm going to need [00:17:42] more staff. The more I specialize in to handle each of these different aspects. And if I compare again to an apple store for me as a consumer, walking into an apple store, there's an overwhelming number of staff.[00:17:52] Trevor: And also think about the revenue per square foot. [00:17:55] Ricardo: That too. Exactly. [00:17:57] Ron: I think that [00:17:58] on a really high margin business, you do have more room for that.[00:18:04] Ricardo: So you distinguish between luxury retailers at that point versus a discounter value retailer, where the model may be sufficiently different, that you don't need to apply that. segmentation or specialization of skills. [00:18:15] Trevor: You mean there's not going to be stylists at dollar stores[00:18:21] Ricardo: that would be, the question, [00:18:22] Shish: natural progression, but there is a customer expectation, which is generally followed by retail tech, responding to it. And one of the aspects that's really happening out there is technologies providing capabilities to address some of these things. For example, expertise in stores.[00:18:39] Today there is an expectation for [00:18:42] expertise. When you go into a store, a specialized store where, electronics or something like that, where you need a store associates to have a lot more knowledge, but with technology capabilities, it is possible to sort of democratize that make available. The expertise from different stores right across all of the stores. And those kinds of things are really making it possible to, to address those expectations as well. [00:19:09] Trevor: Yeah. I mean, one of the things that I'm a big fan of is that's kind of pushing out a technology to the edge. And certainly I look at this through my perch lens.[00:19:17] Which is, when you think about putting the digital experience has guided product storytelling that is available to obviously all the consumers on their own, but also the sales associates. But similarly, if you've got an iPad in your hand, that's a training device for downtime.[00:19:31] That's a career pathing and improvement device. and you can make the most of the hours that you're in store. So I think this pushing technology to the edge and into the fingertips of everyone, has the ability for those [00:19:42] who have the motivation and the desire to hold those skillsets up rapidly than what was available to them in the past.[00:19:48] Ron: A bit of a counter to the, more is better is that this is an industry in brick and mortar retail that has not always been given the accolade as a career that it deserves.[00:19:59] And sometimes this, people that are highly committed and highly skilled, and this is very much an intentional career become that much better at their job. They are retained longer and sometimes it's kind of a quality versus quantity. And so you could actually have a smaller team that's highly skilled, very engaged, works really well under, whatever kind of product categories you're selling and the culture of the company, but provide a level of service because of their expertise and their commitment to the industry.[00:20:30] And that's, I think the kind of temporary nature sometimes of people in stores then requires, more of them versus fewer that are highly skilled. And then, so it's a conversation and a balance that I [00:20:42] think every retailer, is talking about today. [00:20:44] Ricardo: I think that's true. I agree with you I like to view the technology piece of that in many cases, equalizer, sometimes to address the point, you just mentioned about the temporary aspect of people coming and going, and then the turnover and some ways if done properly and seamlessly enough, I think the technology can help normalize that approach a little bit and compensate for loss of skill. When you have people that leave that were perhaps one of those high-end skilled individuals that really knew how to do that job. And therefore they could handle working with many customers at once versus perhaps some of the other staff that are newer at the role might only be able to handle one or two at a time, depending on the type of store environment that you were in.[00:21:25] Question from Evan Kirstel[00:21:25] Ricardo: I want to turn attention over to, Evan who's joined us on stage. Why don't you go ahead and give us your question for the panel. [00:21:30] Evan Kirstel: Yeah. Happy Friday, everyone. I've been most interested in the technology side of retail behind the scenes. I laughed out loud, referenced to green CRT screen [00:21:42] flashing. Sadly, see that far too often. [00:21:46] Ricardo: still see that too often. I agree. [00:21:48] Evan Kirstel: Yeah. Well, the other hand, I talked to a lot of clients who are participating in the kind of digital transformation of retail. And I'd love your opinion on who were some of the players to watch.[00:21:58] I mean, when I'm talking to a lot lately with Facebook workplace or workplace from Facebook, it's their enterprise communications division. So basically taking all of their messaging and video and apps and tools and enabling, or powering retailers like Petco and Domino's and others to improve the employee experience.[00:22:18] So think about, group messaging and calling video tension, live video streaming education, all kinds of analytics around that as well. Are you seeing adoption of more modern communication tools like that or others or what's most interesting to you when it comes to, real-time communication messaging, voice, video, or other apps within the frontline for the workers. [00:22:40] Jeff: Are we talking about [00:22:42] retailers or are we talking about services, service providers to retail? [00:22:45] Evan Kirstel: Yeah, the retailers are adopting a lot of these tools with their frontline employees, for employee engagement, employee communications messaging. We used to call the intranet, but it's basically apps on phones now.[00:22:57] Ricardo: And so we could look at this from both perspectives. I think Jeff, from the prospective of which retailers are doing this well, and what kind of technology are they using?[00:23:04] Ron: I mean, I can share what I use on today, which is retail zip-line line, which is actually used by all of gap, Inc. which is an incredible platform and not an intranet. But it's a communication tool. It's a tracking tool. It's a way to send out quick messages. There's a lot of functionality from multiple reasons. But I think within the store team at every level, day in day out, I've not actually not seen one that does that, come seamlessly that everyone uses without providing, devices to everyone, which is depending on the state and depending on what's happening, that can be a tricky conversation.[00:23:38] But so far that's what I've seen and, has worked really well for me. [00:23:41] Casey: [00:23:42] I'm obviously biased, but, there's going to be a lot more tools that are going to be coming in over the next, 12 to 18 months just because this was a really hard product to sell into a brand three years ago.[00:23:55] A lot of people, in this space that wanted to do it, had to pivot into doing something else because it was just a hard sell. But now I think that, It's going to be a requirement. Just as standard as, having a computer at work, if you have sales associates, and they're going to have to have a tool.[00:24:12] So I think we're going to see more of a standardized school. That's going to be coming out that more brands will start using the same one. But right now everybody's kind of spread all across the board. And there's reasons that brands are choosing one over the other. There hasn't really been one that does everything necessarily doesn't necessarily even do everything well, but obviously I'm biased with my own, but, there's pros and cons to kind of everything right now.[00:24:35] I think we'll see the leader next year. [00:24:36] Shish: And a lot of examples that I've seen, one of them is a startup that I'm working with, called askSID[00:24:42] they have to QR code, on wine bottles or the shelves and customers can scan it and it instantly brings an expert to them and they can ask questions have a conversation.[00:24:52] So this is one way that retailers have actually, really figured out how can they have experts in every store that knows their wines really well without necessarily staffing every store. [00:25:04] Another example I've seen as for call centers itself, where, the expertise that they wanted to provide was to a chat bot. So when a customer calls a call center, the challenges the call center person is looking up information. There's a lot of delays. They're following up an app in the background, doing the search, trying to find the answers to the question the customer wants. So what they're doing to empower this is there is a chat bot and AI based chat bot that is picking up the customer call at the same time in parallel to the human operator.[00:25:39] And the chat bot is [00:25:42] transcribing the call, learning the intent of the questions that the customer is asking, connecting to backe nd showing it to the call center operator at the same time. And this essentially means that the call center operators is far more intelligent in his responses is able to respond very quickly and efficiently to the customer.[00:25:59] So that was one area from a communications perspective that I thought was, very interesting. The third one is really empowering the store associates and, and today there's many companies that provide communication devices. for example, there's a company called Theatro that does a headset based communication device for store associates.[00:26:20] yeah, [00:26:23] Ricardo: love their solution.. [00:26:25] Shish: Turnpike turnpike is out of Sweden and they have, , a, wearable. DASSI wristwatches that send information over to the store associates and it's generally far more discrete, , and store associates can actually use those communication devices to talk to systems in the back [00:26:42] end.[00:26:42] So if they have a question about, do we have a certain product in stock right now? They can ask a chat bot the chat bot will look up the systems instantaneously and be able to get the responses. And this again, I think is another thing that's really transforming the frontline worker, in a way, making them far more efficient , with tools like this.[00:27:03] Jeff: Yep. Hang on, hang on a sec. Let me follow up on that question. Are you doing anything with voice, voice AI? [00:27:10] Shish: Yes. there is, a lot of, I would say controversy around voice. So in terms of voice, for store associates, the one scenario that I talked about last was one where store associates are actually using the headsets to talk to a chat bot.[00:27:27] So if a customer is looking for a certain product, typically what they would do is radio someone in the back room to say, do we have that in the back room? Or is it an order or something like that. But, in this situation they're actually using voice [00:27:42] to talk to a chat bot that is connecting to backend systems to determine if something is in the backroom.[00:27:48] If it does an order, if it's in a nearby store and it is providing the response by voice immediately to the store associate. And that to me is extremely powerful, where the store associates are empowered, but all that information that they using voice queries to query back end systems. [00:28:05] Jeff: How about sentiment or, sense of, either happiness or urgency in the invoice. I'm actually going to be talking to a couple of startups that are actually going to that level of sophistication.[00:28:16] Shish: So, , in call center, there is, I've seen situations where, when, someone calls a call center and the operators talking to that person, there is AI models that the chat bot that it was talking about earlier, that it's, transcribing the call looking at the intent of the questions. At the same time, it is also detecting the sentiment, of each speaker. So if there is, frustration, for example, it'll detect that and it will [00:28:42] notify the call center supervisor that here's the call where there's potentially a problem, and you want to listen to what you want to intervene. So it's actually detecting all of that.[00:28:52] Jeff: Yeah. Interesting.[00:28:53] Brandon: We also need to consider the human element of the organization, the frontline associates, or our ambassadors, how we want to refer to them. The stylist interacting with the customer technology are all referencing it innovative is right up there and on trend and having this be powered by AI AR , virtual reality or critical components of driving personalization, seamless, intuitive, and we're driving adoption rate by the store associates of stylists and the way.[00:29:25] Their ability to effectively serve the customer and effectively providing outstanding customer experience in store and connect that digital aspect of it as well. And help drive conversion as customers come to the store for advice or engagement or a building connection to the brand.[00:29:41] Ricardo: Yeah, [00:29:42] there's an interesting element there I'm reminded of one retailer I talked to a few years back who was deploying devices just as we're talking about and some of the feedback they had from their associates in the pilot stores, is that they were starting to feel like Batman wearing a utility belt because they were being asked to carry all this technology everywhere they went around the store. That tells us there's a threshold somewhere where it becomes too cumbersome to just hand over technology to the associates that way. I think that's a consideration, Brandon, maybe that's what you're getting at as far as paying attention to the human component of this, you can't just ask a store associate to say, here's three devices you need to carry around all day to do these three different tasks. Or there has to be a little bit more thought behind how transparent the technology is and how seamlessly it can be incorporated into their workflow in a way that makes sense. [00:30:28] Brandon: Correct. And we see companies do clienteling and then trying to streamline it to one app or one ipad or mobile first and it's worked for most situations, but again, it has to be connected to the [00:30:42] customer, empowering the store associates and driving outstanding customer experience.[00:30:46] Then I'd love to hear Ron's perspective on that. How technology can help the store associates drive a outstanding customer experience. [00:30:52] Ron: Yeah, no, thanks, Brandon. And you're exactly right. And I think the experience that is most, I think, recognized and celebrated by the customer is, how much history you have to the idea of in clientelling, which, the facts show that the average spend is that much higher.[00:31:10] The retention rate is higher. The return rate is lower. Like the benefits are enormous, but if you can say to someone, oh my gosh, like, let me. Quickly look at your purchase history on my phone, on my iPad that I have in my hand. Wow. It looks like you were here last month and this is what you bought. I have some things I know you're going to love.[00:31:28] And so you begin this relationship building with facts and with information that arms you to provide an exceptional experience. And so the technology kind of in your pocket provides you [00:31:42] information and then you can go and then, the client is entirely engaged because they, feel seen and heard.[00:31:49] They know that their business is appreciated. You can say that kind of along the way. I'm so glad that you came back. I'd really love to help you build on those wardrobe pieces or add that, that other. You know, the technology piece too. your last purchase here at apple. So there's, there's a lot that can happen with technology that just supports relationship building and all of the data in how that benefits an overall company is all positive.[00:32:15] There's no downside to it when done well, other than overwhelming at the store team. And that's where I think you can dial back and say, well, actually who's really good at this let's arm them. This person actually is much better just converting on the sales floor. Doesn't need to have the full deck in front of them.[00:32:34] So I think great leaders can look at that. I do at my own using hero in chat functions and who does confinements, who [00:32:42] converts, who sells more? You can dial in, and it's not one size fits all. And that's where people really, that retention piece starts to escalate because you would say thank you for recognizing that I'm actually not comfortable using this technology, but I'm really good doing this.[00:33:00] Let me do this more. That's a winning formula to retaining your team, building great client relationships and growing your business. But , that's where I put a lot of effort and time today. And, I believe that it really pays off. [00:33:14] Ricardo: That's not even advice specific to retailers organization, but many businesses adopt that approach and, let's call it company culture around how to encourage certain behaviors and how to reward people who are doing the job the best way they can. And also to create an environment that promotes this, the ability to do better and do more, whether it's with technology or without, or is that really, isn't the point, right?[00:33:39] This comes back to your earlier point Ron, about more [00:33:42] specialization and segmentation and the skills and the roles within the store. [00:33:46] All of this plays together into building that better company culture that fosters an environment that encourages this kind of activity and rewards people in these roles because they're filling a really important need for the retailer.[00:34:00] Ron: Yeah. I think that's where we had sometimes dug ourselves into our own trap of saying everyone needs to be good at everything. And then it'd be kind of to become a generalist as at all of it. And the customer's ability to remember their experience is diluted because no one really stood out in their mind, but we created that ourselves.[00:34:21] We created this kind of generic retail, you know, everyone's nice. Are you finding everything? Okay. And then you walk away and that, kind of generic version of retail, you know, Steve, Dennis likes to talk about Is what got us in trouble. And so that's where I'm saying it should not be generic. It should actually be very specialized.[00:34:41] We should hire [00:34:42] people with specialty, and invest in them and be better at what you hired them to do. And those are the people when you see NPS surveys that mention people by name, and I see it every day, you don't go home and write a survey about your experience and reference people's names. If you didn't have an experience that created, it's not through a business card in your shopping bag, you remembered their name because you were so engaged.[00:35:08] That's what happens when you invest in them. And then they deliver that to the customer. And it's like this winning cycle. But not everyone plays that game. And that, is so much fun because you see it in your business. And that's what we're all trying to reestablish today in our industry. [00:35:24] Ricardo: That is so well said, Ron, it's all about embracing the uniqueness and the skill sets that you're bringing into the environment and to the team and encouraging more of that to make the entire team better and ultimately that's reflected in the revenue that you're going to generate through that team, because they're such a [00:35:42] critical part of that process. [00:35:44] Question from Jeff Brand[00:35:44] Ricardo: I, I've, brought a few more folks up on stage so I'm Jeff, I'm going to go to you next , what was your comment for us? [00:35:50] Jeff Brand: Yeah, thank you. I'm an owner of a brick and mortar retail buildings. I'm a landlord, but I'm also a consumer and something that Trevor said, which was interesting to me is that his goal is to create engaging content for consumers that would draw them into the store, but giving them a lot of information to really engage them.[00:36:11] So what I wanted to find out about frontline workers, how do you make sure that the frontline worker knows more than the consumer does when they walk in the store? Because the consumer has the ability to research ad nauseum about the products they're going to shop for. [00:36:28] Trevor: I think that's a great question. I think about that often, right. 70% of shoppers think that they know more than the sales associates, because they have access to that very data. so I think there, are a couple of different ways to think through this. One is, making sure you've got all the [00:36:42] learning management systems for your sales associates, but the other way to think about it is to really think through proprietary tools that walk you through the category.[00:36:51] Most of this content out there is product by product. And what I'm seeing a lot of is digital tools that are being deployed in store and online to do a needs analysis and walk you through the category. I'll give you an example. If I'm buying a drill at home Depot, you got all the drills on the shelf.[00:37:09] But, I don't want to pick control, oh, this is this many Watts and this is that many Watts and great, well, what does that mean? , I don't know the difference between the wattage's . And , what will I be able to do or not be able to do what, walk me through, like, what do I need to strive for?[00:37:23] It's just like, Hey, Trevor just needs to make sure not to call the handyman too much, you know? And, and to look good in front of his wife, that he can fix some things or Trevor, you're really into home improvement projects to do a lot of serious work. And so, thinking through a category type tour and a needs [00:37:42] analysis and providing some of these proprietary tools, I think we'll create a type of guided experience that ends up lending itself in a differentiated way to what you can find out.[00:37:50] Jeff: And I also think we're really getting to , a paradigm where we shouldn't expect store associates to know more than customers coming in. If it's a passionate purchase. When I bought my kayak, I knew probably more about that. I guarantee you, I knew more about that kayak that I settled on, than the REI associates, because I researched it.[00:38:07] I spent days researching it. And so I think, we're sort of at that point where retailers just have to be comfortable with, sort of that, that maybe shift in knowledge and, accelerate and work with that and not necessarily try to fight against it.[00:38:19] Jeff Brand: That's very interesting. Thank you.[00:38:21] Ron: Yeah. And, I think apple again, does a really nice job of putting so much effort into training and yes, clients come in all day. And I remember when I joined apple as a store manager, The launch of iPhone two, and I was really nervous about, I don't know how this is going to work.[00:38:40] And [00:38:42] the calming kind of words are, they, customers will always know more than you do about the product. People are obsessed with this brand, but to say, you know what? I don't know, but I'm going to find out I'm going to help you learn how to use this. I'm going to find someone who's an expert in this particular skill of what you're looking for.[00:39:01] And if you can say, you know what, I don't have any idea how to do that, but I'm going to find someone that does, can calm it down. And the customer's like great, happy to make that happen. So I also think we don't always want to put so much pressure on ourselves. Everyone at every store has to be an expert in everything it's not realistic, but we can just drill down and think about expertise and putting the right people with the right customers for that specific ask that applies in all of our businesses, including, fashion for me. And I love this idea of it. Every experience should be unique and individual based on what the customer came in looking for.[00:39:41] Ricardo: [00:39:42] Yeah. I agree with that absolutely critical to deliver a great service that you want to have in your store. So Jeff, thank you for that question. [00:39:50] Question from Tim Tang[00:39:50] Ricardo: Tim, do you have a comment or question for us? [00:39:52] Tim Tang: Yeah, the question I wanted to ask you was, when we think about retail and we think about employment, frontline workers in retail, there's an enormously high turnover rate, as well as, some studies suggest, suggested very low engagement rate.[00:40:06] And I was wondering if you were aware of any progress or any meaningful innovations or any changes, in recent years on those two fronts.[00:40:15] Ron: Hi Tim. To answer your question on, on evolutions of the, great part about some of the technology that we're talking about, that there are ways to survey teams more quickly. So there's, apps like butterfly that where you can, you're in constant contact of how, how are you feeling today?[00:40:34] Kind of on a, on a scale of different faces or on numbers. How are let's check in with you about how [00:40:42] you're feeling, which is a really important, component to emotional leadership today, emotional intelligence. So you're, kind of constant checking in and, feeling connected, but I think , more importantly than anything that the quality and the intent of retail leadership today at the store level specifically, but at the multi-store space that all of us today in any kind of retail leadership that touches store teams and has influence on that experience, it is really our responsibility to do that in a way that is more emotionally, engaged than ever before.[00:41:20] And I think the idea of store visits that are checklist of numbers and. Store operations and audits and things that seem very tactical are really a thing of the past. And today I just, I was in stores all week. And what I did was spend time on the floor, talking to the teams, engaging with customers side by [00:41:42] side, learning how they're, how they feel learning, how they're experiencing the math challenge of week two and what it all means.[00:41:52] And that actually goes a really long way to engaging with those teams and say, I really appreciate that. Ron spent the day on the floor with selling with us today, and [00:42:01] I was able to ask questions and I was able to get solutions and hear what's happening at the company today. We just have to be closer than we've ever been before to what's really happening face-to-face with the customer and we have to listen and learn and act and engage and be curious more than ever before. And that's, that's what will change our industry. And that's how teams are repaying. And you, you learn, I come back to the office today with armed, with so much information about spending the week on the sales floor and about how people really feel.[00:42:37] And I can pretty much guarantee that those people I engage with [00:42:42] are happy that someone listened to them this week. I hope that answers your question.[00:42:48] Tim Tang: I think that's an interesting perspective, I mean that it's, if I'm hearing you correctly, it's the idea of using that customer feedback. That's kind of a motivator for the employees and you mean something to be celebrated, something to be highlighted, but it's, that kind of, positive feedback to get encouraged more out of the employee base.[00:43:06] Ron: Yeah. I actually think the employee feedback is more important than customer feedback sometimes. So that's the first thing that I would ask is how do you feel, how was your experience working here right now? How you feel having the math conversation it's uncomfortable. Let's do this together so that you can feel more comfortable when someone comes in and, wants to have a more difficult conversation.[00:43:27] So their feedback about their experience as an employee drives the customer experience that drives the business. And that's, why I would talk about surveys or being really close to them. That's what's going to change the game [00:43:39] Brandon: That ties back, Ron [00:43:42] to outstanding employee experience, customer experience. And you, you can say once that the, this empowered customer who has access to data to other brands and social media channels picked up once at the head of them and really personalize things.[00:44:05] Ricardo: That's a pretty impressive approach. And I say that Ron because listening to you describe how you've gone and collected that feedback on the floor reminds me of many retailer conversations that I had in years past and Tim may even remember some of these as in full disclosure for the audience, here Tim, and I used to work together.[00:44:26] And he may remember that being in some retailer meetings where we would ask them the question. When was the last time you were walked your store floor and understood both your customer and employee experience? And there, I think too many times that I remember being met with blank faces, when asking that [00:44:42] question?[00:44:42] And I always thought to myself, wondering how could they not have had a response for that? How could we be in a room full of retail executives that didn't have an immediate answer as to not only when was the last time they did this, what kind of feedback did they get? I would expect this is something you should know, because you're not going to be able to improve on your associates environment.[00:45:01] You're not going to be able to improve on that customer experience without ongoing feedback. And I don't think it's sufficient to claim that the feedback process could just be asking customers to fill out a response form and an email post-transaction or asking employees to do the same thing at the end of their Workday.[00:45:19] So please go in and fill out this survey form, but tell us how the day went. You really want to get that direct one-on-one feedback to really understand exactly how things are going. [00:45:29] Ron: And I would just add the store teams know that. And when decisions are made in the C-suite by people who have not spent time in stores and it impacts them, that's where [00:45:42] the problem lies is in the turnover happens because the responses will, did they not understand what we do every day? How hard this is the conversations that we have to have, and the workload that happens every day in brick and mortar stores. There's an assumption that people that sit in our leadership chairs don't understand that. And if you can demonstrate your at least willingness to show up and listen, you may not be able to solve every problem. If you use just show up and you say hello, I went to Greenwich the other day and some new team members.[00:46:14] And just to be able to sit in the morning, have a coffee, listen, where did you work before? I'll like, that will keep them going for months. And it was very little effort on my part and a huge return. And that's what all of us in leadership, we have to do that more. And particularly today, they're in a very difficult situation of being customer engaging.[00:46:37] Not only last year, it's still hard today. And that's why I just [00:46:42] encourage everyone be as close as you can, to the people doing the work technology aside. The human conversation goes a really long way. [00:46:49] Shish: Yeah. That's the great point also from the employee perspective, one of the things I'm looking at is, stores are putting more emphasis on customer engagement and employee spending more time with customers versus doing mundane jobs. And that's another transformation I'm seeing where automation comes in.[00:47:09] A very common example that I'm seeing in terms of automation is, on-shelf availability where almost every retailer is. Automating that in the past, it was, employees going round and making sure that the products are on shelf. And today they're looking at cameras and sensors to do that job so that the store associates can spend that time engaging with customers rather than doing that.[00:47:35] Ricardo: Yeah, that is absolutely an interesting point. And we could probably another room just on that topic alone and [00:47:42] going through the reality versus perceptions, right, automation, AI, and machine learning. What does that mean for other jobs? Whether we're talking about frontline staff or other roles within a retail organization, where's the balance you can draw between those areas.[00:48:00] So thanks Tim . That was a great, topic to touch on.[00:48:02] Question from Jeff Sward[00:48:02] Ricardo: Jeff, What was your question or comment for us and welcome to the stage. [00:48:06] Jeff Sward: Actually, the last conversation is going to be a perfect segue for my question, which is how does the frontline associates become, more useful, I guess, in helping the whole company understand the why of best sellers and worst sellers. Ron was describing these great interactions between sellers and customers that are data-driven about past history and prior purchases. So when the customer buys something, the system captures all the hard information, but it doesn't capture is the [00:48:42] why, why was something that bestseller, why was something a worst seller. Nobody sets out and puts worst sellers in the stores to begin with. So what happens? [00:48:53] Brandon: It's a great question. And I think that that's where it'd be social selling aspect comes in, that the sentiments could be the emotional multisensory sentiments through Instagram and Twitter and other feedback loop that retailers will receive from the customers. And it's not captured within the transactional systems, ERP systems, et cetera, social commerce, digital marketing is where that system lies.[00:49:18] So I think it's a very complex challenge to capture all the emotional sentiment, but that might be a place to start.[00:49:24] Shish: I totally agree. I think it's a data challenge. Many of the retailers that I work with, look at the other influencing data factors that will tell them why something a best seller. And this could be anything from the demographics around the store and the correlation of a certain [00:49:42] product or plan with that demographic, being the cause, it could be something going viral on the internet.[00:49:49] It could be other factors and influences that make something a best seller. And a lot of times is the inference models that they build from the combinations of data. And that typically is one of the approaches that many retailers use. [00:50:05] Ron: Yeah. And it's Ron. I would just add, I think again, Jeff, the more we can engage with the sales teams that are selling the product the better. So there's definitely feedback that can come through customers on social, or maybe it's live selling and you can capture information via chat.[00:50:22] There's a lot of ways to learn, but my office that's right out in front of, the design team for our own private label at intermix. And, you know, I spend a lot of time with them about this is what I've seen. This is what I've heard. Let's bring a team of New York stylist to the office and give you feedback from sketch review.[00:50:41] Like I [00:50:42] I'm, we're doing walkthroughs on sketches before they even become samples before fit before production. Like we stayed so close to it every step of the way so that we try to minimize the risks and the misses. I recognize that that's a small business compared to many people on this phone, but it's important that at every and every part that we've listened and we've learned and we've acted accordingly. , and I think the benefit from that is enormous.[00:51:11] Jeff Sward: Great, thanks, Ron. [00:51:12] Ricardo: Thanks, Jeff. For that question - good discussion topic, [00:51:16] Question from Amanda Fetch[00:51:16] Ricardo: Amanda, what is your question or comment for us? [00:51:19] Amanda Fetch: Yeah. Hello, thank you so much for the opportunity to join the stage. I know that the wave of the future has been to the point of the topic of the room, the future of frontline staff and how that's been sort of disappearing. We had, for example, Amazon Go in Rock Center where there is nobody to basically check you out. And, how now we have tech companies pivoting off of Amazon, like Facebook, [00:51:42] who is looking to have the live shopping Fridays and things like that.[00:51:45] Where again, it's not totally eliminating what we want to call a checkout. There's a human being involved, but again, it's online. So you still have the tech aspects, but so what I wanted to present to the panel and hear your thoughts on is what about, the customer of, for example, a Lulu lemon where their core is assisting the customer, what they like to call was more educating their customer on the fabrics and on the brand of things of that nature.[00:52:10] So I'm curious to hear your thoughts on companies like that. As the world's going to this really tech and to the point of the room, you know, future front Line staff.[00:52:18] If they start disappearing, what happens to companies or retailers like Lulu lemon, will they survive if we start seeing less and less of these, how do you see companies like that weathering this sort of tech storm that's coming on the horizon there? [00:52:33] Ricardo: Thank you for bringing up this topic. Where are we headed in the reality of more automation versus human interaction the [00:52:42] way frontline staff operationally works in a store as well as interacts with customers, as well as what's the customer preference going to be.[00:52:49] If we think about our consumers and what they expect when they come to the store. I think a lot of this depends on what the brand relationship is with the consumer I would argue that, for a Lululemon there is a consumer expectation that when they come to the store, they know they can count on the staff there.[00:53:05] Would that same customer have a similar expectation if they knew that they were going to be greeted by some kind of AI or a bot or some other automated process instead of a human being, I don't know that that would meet the customer's satisfaction for a brand like Lululemon.[00:53:21] I think that becomes a differentiator. So while there could be a discussion in a board room at Lulu lemon that says. You know, is our labor costs getting too high? Do we need to balance our a rising labor costs with some form of automation to handle certain customer interactions? I think they're going to conclude that they can't just [00:53:42] ignore this aspect.[00:53:43] I think that the filter you can apply to this is to say, is the brand relationship purely transactional.[00:53:49] If it is, then chances are a lot of that relationship could be replaced with automation, and to the retailer that's probably a cost saving exercise at some level. If that relationship is not purely transactional, if it's really based on what I think everybody on the stage would define as a real brand relationship where there's an emotional connection for the customer.[00:54:10] I personally don't believe that those relationships can be easily replaced with automation in that way. I think it requires a person to be involved, and I think it's required from the customer's point of view, but would younger generations be more okay with the thought of being greeted by some form of AI or automation rather than a human being versus an older generation?[00:54:33] I don't know that I can predict. But I think that would just be another interesting way to look at. [00:54:38] Jeff: I love that question so much because, I get asked all the [00:54:42] time is, so what is retail doing? Literally they're doing everything at all all the same time. So when I start thinking about, the role of automation and AI, there's clearly going to be a very significant chunk of retail that is going to embrace that. And there's going to be clearly another chunk of retail that's not. It's going to be high touch, high experience. And the best example I can point to right now is in an in and out burger, in and out burger has always paid well above market rate for, for really fast food jobs. And people go there. Me included, literally go by far cheaper solutions and sit in pretty darn long lines because we want that experience.[00:55:16] And I love the fact that people like that experience. And I love the fact that a retailer has created an opportunity for fast food workers to actually become, real career opportunities and a whole lot of people that are going to be running companies in 10 or 15 or 20 years really got their start there under that training.[00:55:32] So the answer is, we're going to see it's going to be the future is going to be all of the above. The key thing is what do people want and what do people want from their [00:55:42] retail experience. That's also going to be the big driver. So if, if all of a sudden the next three or four years people say, you know, I like the human touch. I don't want to be greeted by an AI. Retailers will respond. I think there clearly will be a lot more automation and there's clearly going to be a lot more people involved.[00:55:58] Ron: I definitely agree with, Jeff. I think it will depend on the business, but I would say today where we sit in the way the client is behaving, that her expectation of engagement and the time spent in the store and the amount of energy that goes into these very human interactions has never been higher.[00:56:18] And that may be a surge of, having spent 18 months online and really craving that human interaction. But I don't think it's going to completely pendulum swing the other way. I think there will always be a need for great human engaged selling, educational, retail. And for me that, that the best version of that, not just [00:56:42] in luxury will be the ones that kind of set the bar for

Ron Thurston loves retail. And he's proud of it. Ron has led the retail teams for some of America's most prominent brands, inspired thousands of store employees, and traveled relentlessly across the country to sit and listen to what they have to say. From a part-time sales associate to a Vice President of Stores, Ron has put in the hard work that a retail career requires and wrote this book to share what he learned along the way. ​ In 2021, Ron was named one of the world's Top 100 most influential people in retail and is a featured keynote speaker, podcast guest, and in-demand industry expert. ​ Ron most recently led the retail organization for INTERMIX, sits on the board of directors for GOODWILL NY/NJ, and is an advisory board member and mentor for several retail technology brands.

As a retail leadership executive, board member, and Amazon best-selling author, Ron Thurston loves retail. And he's proud of it. Ron has led the retail teams for some of America's most prominent brands, inspired thousands of store employees, and traveled relentlessly across the country to sit and listen to what they have to say.Ron was also recognized as one of the Top 100 Retail Influencers of 2021 by RethinkRetail and is the Founder of TAKE PRIDE TODAY™, his platform for consulting, speaking, books, and education. (https://www.retailpride.com/)Ron is also on the Board of Directors for GOODWILL NY/NJ, and acts as an advisory board member for several retail technology brands including FlagshipRTL, Job Pixel, Reflex Careers and more.

This week's episode is AMAZING for anyone who has ever worked in Retail! Which by the way is 50% of the country : ). Author Ron Thurston wrote in an incredible book called Retail Pride that has caused a movement to form behind it as it transforms the way we should all look at retail. Season Three of the Just Stories with BT podcast features amazing authors who come on to give us an insight into the incredible minds of the people behind the words.

Jeff Henderson, is a well known race director and founder of the Musselman Triathlon and co-director of the Seneca7, he provided technical & logistics support for “Paulie's Push,” a 20th anniversary tribute to the flight crews killed that day. We had a the opportunity to see the device that Jeff created to track Paulie as he set out to push a beverage cart from Boston to ground zero. Today's episode is sponsored by Ron Thurston, Ron is an Amazon best-selling author of Retail Pride and the founder of Take Pride today. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying my on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in lower righthand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

Brian got the chance to sit down with Ron Thurston a New York based retail expert with more than 30 years of leading top consumer teams from Apple to Tory Burch to Intermix. But, it was only after a mind opening retreat with strangers that challenged Ron's vision of his legacy that set a series of actions in motion that led to the nation's first retail movement. Find out how he did it with Retail Pride. Action Steps to REWIRE: 1. COMMIT to your goal, no matter what! 2. CREATE an effective strategy! 3. ASK for help from your network! Check out https://RetailPride.com *Comment on @fashionrewired on Instagram about this episode for a chance to WIN a FREE copy of Retail Pride, by Ron Thurston! Episode Powered by: -The Phoenix Fashion Week Freelance Program – Hire an industry professional to build your brand for long term success email freelance@phoenixfashionweek.com to secure a fashion professional. -Digital Designer Bootcamp: Launch your fashion brand in 6-short weeks from the comfort of your home. Email bootcamp@phoenixfashionweek.com for application. Phoenix Fashion Week: The leading fashion industry event in the Southwest. Fashion. Education. Community. Follow and like our IG @FashionRewired & @PHXFashionWeek

Ron Thurston is the author of Retail Pride & founder of Take Pride Today, he's a season retail professional who started his career as frontline associate and served his way to the top of the worlds most notable brands, Apple, Tory Burch, Saint Laurent, Bonobos and he sits on the board of several organizations. Beyond all of Ron's accomplishments what he takes the most pride in is being in service to others. If you're tired of a station that doesn't speak to your needs and you're interested in learning more about the BTW Podcast visit RUNUTAINMENT. BTW Podcast is listener-supported, I started a Ko-fi page to allow small businesses and entrepreneurs to sponsor an episode. BTW Podcast now has a Patreon page. BTW Podcast is listener-supported. The launching of my Ko-fi and Patreon page is me embracing my talents, this is me walking in my purpose, this is me taking the leap, acknowledging that what I'm doing is providing a valuable service for the audience, the guest and sponsors. BTW Podcast is a business. You can visit Derek Oxley to stay up today on current happenings with BTW Podcast, sign up for the Newsletter, check out the blog or order merchandise. I took the leap 4 years ago to drive for Uber/Lyft Full-time, so I could have the flexibility to devote to building BTW Podcast. Like everyone BTW Podcast was impacted with the pandemic. Ko-fi is platform that will allow entrepreneurs/business owners to sponsor an episode PRE, MID or POST roll, it also allows you to buy me a cup of coffee. Patreon will allow listeners to show their support for the podcast on a monthly basis, Patreon supporters of the show will gain access to behind the scenes material, early access to merchandise, bonus episodes, and access to UINC, TIPS and RUNUTAINMENT articles. Thanks for accompanying my on this ride. Leave a voicemail on Anchor to let us know how we're doing and receive a shout out in a future episode or you can now visit my brand spanking new BTW Podcast website in lower righthand corner there's a microphone simply click that and record a message --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/derek-oxley/support

On this episode of The Laws of Style, host Douglas Hand sits down with retail guru and author of "Retail Pride" Ron Thurston. They discuss "new" models for retail success, how educating consumers is the best way to sell to them and what Yves Saint Laurent was up to in 1969. Listen in! See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

In case you missed Ron the first time around, I am bringing him back! Ron Thurston is the Former Vice President of Intermix, a top-selling Author of RETAIL PRIDE, and now founder of "Take Pride Today." Ron is joining me on this week's episode of the positive effect, and I can't wait. We will talk, leadership, retail, and everything PRIDE. Join me to learn how to take PRIDE in everything you do. HIT REMIND ME and, of course, SHARE with your retail network. hashtag#linkedinlive hashtag#learn hashtag#leadership hashtag#converationsthatmatter hashtag#retailpride hashtag#takepridetoday hashtag#retailu --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/april477/support

Welcome to the Retail Rundown, your go-to weekly podcast where RETHINK Retail teams up with industry experts to discuss the news and trends defining the world of retail. In this episode, guest host Mina Fader, managing director of Wharton's Baker Retailing Center at the University of Pennsylvania, sat down with Mary Rodgers, director of marketing communications at Cuisinart, and Ron Thurston, former vice president of stores at Intermix, to discuss this year's back-to-school shopping season and the social media platforms that will make the greatest impact on school-aged consumers. If you enjoyed this episode, please let us know by subscribing to our channel and giving us a 5 star rating us on Apple Podcasts. - - - - - - Hosted by Mina Fader Written and produced by Gabriella Bock Edited by Trenton Waller

Ron is the Author of Retail Pride: The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career When will you get a real career? When will you stop working nights and weekends? When do you plan to use your degree? If you work in retail, these are questions you often hear. Does this make you feel like the career you love was all just an accident? You're not alone. The retail industry employs millions, yet most people don't end up there by design. Ron Thurston wrote Retail Pride as an indispensable guide for every retail employee, manager, and multi-store leader looking to accelerate their potential and grow their career. It's filled with straightforward, practical tips for developing your talents, connecting with customers, and building your leadership skills. Based on more than twenty-five years of Ron's retail leadership experience, you'll discover a sense of belonging in the words of someone who has been a champion for the industry and shares your journey. - Get your copy of Retail Pride - https://www.retailpride.com/ Reach out to Ron - https://www.instagram.com/retailpride/

Traci is joined by Ron Thurston, VP of Stores at INTERMIX and Author of the book, "Retail Pride". Ron was named one of the world's Top 100 most influential people in retail and throughout the chapters of his book, provides insight and advice on becoming a strong and passionate leader with a people-centric focus. This week, Ron and Traci discuss some of the themes throughout "Retail Pride" that are incredibly impactful for leaders in every industry. Pick up a copy of "Retail Pride" for yourself or your teams by going to: https://www.retailpride.com/thebook Connect with Ron here: https://www.instagram.com/retailpride/ Keep up with Ron's events here: https://www.retailpride.com/ Connect with Traci here: https://linktr.ee/HRTraci Don't forget to subscribe and give a 5-star rating and review! Disclaimer: Thoughts, opinions, and statements made on this podcast are not a reflection of the thoughts, opinions, and statements of the Company Traci Rubin is actively employed by.

Guest: Ron Thurston, Best Selling Author of RETAIL PRIDE and VP of Stores at INTERMIX   Ron Thurston, is the definitive “Retail Insider”, from selling baby furniture, to Head of Stores for Tory Burch, Bonobos, Saint Laurent, and currently VP of Stores for INTERMIX, his impressive career spans over 30 years. Ron also serves on the Board of Directors for Goodwill Industries and is the author of Retail Pride The Guide To Celebrating Your Accidental Career. Ron says, “The retail industry is the biggest employer in the US, and what’s at the center of retail? …”People!”. Join us for a lively conversation with Amazon best selling author Ron Thurston on the important role of the stores, and the proud professionals who manage them. We’ll set the record straight on brick and mortar retail & ecommerce, and talk about technology and customer experience. Make sure to check out Ron Thurston’s great book Retail Pride, available through Barnes & Nobel, Books A Million, Amazon, and other booksellers. Retailpride.com

On this episode, we're joined by Ron Thurston, Best Selling Author of Retail Pride and Vice President of Stores at INTERMIX. With over 25 years of retail experience and building big brands such as Tory Burch, Apple, Saint Laurent, and Bonobos Ron shares a unique perspective about the importance of creating and celebrating pride in an industry that employs millions of people and drives a massive portion of our economy.  We talk about leadership lessons in any industry to create an environment of pride and joy at work and the personal human fulfillment experienced when individuals take pride in the work they do. Here is what you will learn in this episode: Three pillars of success that can help organizations create more humanness and sense of pride in the workplace and with their employees – leading with empathy, curiosity and listening with the intent to act, and focus. The importance of connection and experience and how the future of retail and other brick and mortar industries post-COVID will be impacted and elevated by putting the human experience first. The strong parallels between consumer experience and the employee experience through the expression of pride and passion. How pride and expression of pride will be increasingly important when hiring the right people and building great teams as we see a reemergence of direct human connection. How to create bottom-up cultures that drive momentum and ground swell of prideful and people-first cultures – even during hard financial times. Resources Referenced: Retail Pride Website Work with Ron Thurston: Website: Retail Community | Retail Pride Twitter: @rwthurston1 Instagram: @retailpride LinkedIn: Retail Pride You Tube Channel: RETAIL PRIDE with RON THURSTON --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/humanlypossible/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/humanlypossible/support

Welcome to the The Voice of Retail , I'm your host Michael LeBlanc, and this podcast is brought to you in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada.In this special format bonus episode I'm chatting with Ron Thurston, Vice President of Stores for Intermix, best selling author of the great book Retail Pride and opening keynote speaker at the RCC Retail HR conference coming up March 25th.  I ask Ron for two starts, and one stop, based on what he has learned and experienced over the past year of the COVID era. ********Thanks for tuning into today's episode of The Voice of Retail.  Be sure to subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss out on the latest episodes, industry news, and insights. If you enjoyed  this episode please consider leaving a rating and review, as it really helps us grow so that we can continue getting amazing guests on the show.If you are a retail HR professional you don't want to miss the RCC Retail Human Resources forum, March 25th.  Learn more and register at http://rcchrconference.ca/Ron Thurston loves retail. And he's proud of it. Ron has led the retail teams for some of America's most prominent brands, inspired thousands of store employees, and traveled relentlessly across the country to sit and listen to what they have to say.  From a part-time sales associate to a Vice President of Stores, Ron has put in the hard work that a retail career requires and wrote this book to share what he learned along the way.  Ron currently leads the retail organization for INTERMIX, a division of GAP INC, and sits on the board of directors for GOODWILL NY/NJ.  You can learn more about Ron and keep in touch on his website here. Michael LeBlanc  is the Founder & President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc and a Senior Advisor to Retail Council of Canada as part of his advisory and consulting practice.   He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience, and has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career.  Michael is the producer and host of a network of leading podcasts including Canada's top retail industry podcast,       The Voice of Retail, plus        Global E-Commerce Tech Talks  and       The Food Professor  with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois.  You can learn more about Michael       here  or on       LinkedIn. 

This week I am chatting with Ron Thurston best selling Author of RETAIL PRIDE. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/april477/support

Ron Thurston loves retail. And he's proud of it. Ron has led the retail teams for some of America's most prominent brands, inspired thousands of store employees, and traveled relentlessly across the country to sit and listen to what they have to say.   From a part-time sales associate to a vice president of stores, Ron has put in the hard work that a retail career requires and wrote this book to share what he learned along the way.  

We are so excited to have Ron Thurston on our podcast! Ron is the Best Selling Author of RETAIL PRIDE, Vice President of Stores at INTERMIX and is on the Board of Directors at GOODWILL. Ron has worked at West Elm, Apple, Tory Burch, Bonobos and Yves Saint Laurent. We met Ron at a networking workshop when we hadn't even begun our journey with The Style That Binds Us. We can't wait for you to learn all about his career & book in this episode. https://www.retailpride.com Link to buy Ron's book: https://rstyle.me/+XOyhCI-E490EjCriKTacKA      --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/delia-folk8/support

Ron Thurston is the #1 best-selling author of Retail Pride and a senior leader at some of the world's most iconic brands. He joins Tech Done Different to help us apply ideas from outside of technology in order to help us think and act differently. During this episode, we discuss:the idea of "going green" — celebrating wins, and encouraging people to hit the next level of their goal pursuithow to be a selfless leader and why to make everyone else look greatwhy a leader's job is to say thank youwhy gratitude is a leadership principle, and how to think about itmost wins are not even financial/sales"thinking differently and acting differently is the only way we'll survive"learn lessons from places (and books) you wouldn't normally expect or go toGuestRon Thurston, Best Selling Author of RETAIL PRIDE, Vice President of Stores at INTERMIX and Board of Directors at GOODWILLHostTed HarringtonResourcesLearn more about what Ron is up to here: https://retailpride.comThis Episode's Sponsors:If you'd like to sponsor this or any other podcast episode on ITSPmagazine, you can learn more here: https://www.itspmagazine.com/podcast-series-sponsorshipsFor more podcast stories from Tech Done Different With Ted Harrington: https://www.itspmagazine.com/tech-done-different-podcastAre you interested in sponsoring an ITSPmagazine Channel?https://www.itspmagazine.com/podcast-series-sponsorships

In recent years retail has gotten a bad rap - especially fashion retail.Too often stores have fallen into a slump, neglected by management's shift in attention to building up their e-commerce channels.  And just as often because brands have too many stores and too little revenue to maintain them all properly.That's led to a rash of retail closures in many key markets around the world.But is retail really fated to become just a memory of ‘the way we used to shop?'Or can the right people with a vision and the drive to bring it to fruition and rejuvenate retail into a dynamic place where today's consumers want to shop?I'm Jane Singer and welcome to A Seat at the Table.Today I'm speaking with Ron Thurston, retail expert and author, and a champion of physical retail.Ron is Vice President of stores for Intermix and has a decades long career of working with leading brands and driving retail excellence from visual merchandising to taking teams of diverse retail staff and helping them to be the best they can be.His enthusiasm for retail is contagious.  And he takes an industry that many people view as an ‘if all else fails' job and shows us the exciting career opportunities it offers for people of all different skills sets and education levels.  Retail is one industry that has almost no barriers to entry - and few limits on how high you can rise.Most importantly Ron talks about his vision for revitalising retail and provides a path that both large and small companies can easily follow.You can find Ron's book, Retail Pride, on Amazon in paperback, hardcover or kindle versions.Before we get started, if you're overwhelmed by information and wish someone could sift and sort through it all and provided you with a tight summary of just what you need to know, then you might want to check out Inside Fashion's market snapshots. You can find more information at  insidefashionlive.net/snapshots.  

Our special guest, Ron Thurston, brings over 25 years of experience in brick-and-mortar retail to enlighten us on the evolution of physical retail and the changing retail culture.How has the retail culture evolved with the rise of eCommerce? Is physical retail dead? If not, how does it have to change to keep up with customer trends and preferences? We ask these questions and more of our special guest, Ron Thurston, Vice President of Stores at Intermix and author of Retail Pride. Ron's book is unique in the retail industry, which is lacking in reading and educational material for store associates and store managers looking to learn how to further their careers and optimize the retail customer experience. Ron joins us to discuss what makes for a truly customer-centric retailing experience, why physical retail isn't dead in the age of digital, and why we should merge the online and offline shopping realms to achieve truly unified retail commerce and experiential retail. With over 25 years of industry experience, Ron can say with confidence that personal relationships and store associates have an increasingly important role to play in omnichannel retail, and that retail leaders must embrace omnichannel as they look to 2021 and beyond.

As retailers re-imagine brick and mortar, stores are once again at the center of the action. But what about the people who power the action, store associates? They can get left out of the conversation as technology and automation grab attention, yet these front-line workers are critical to retailers' success across every channel. Carol's guest is passionate about acknowledging and encouraging store workers and he's written an important book to fulfill that commitment. Ron Thurston is the author of Retail Pride: The Guide to Celebrating Your Accidental Career, a labor of love that pulls together Ron's years of experience developing store teams for top brands like Apple, West Elm, Tory Burch, St. Laurent and now, as VP of stores for INTERMIX. In this interview episode, Ron and Carol discuss what it takes for retail workers to own their contributions and careers and how retail leaders can motivate brick and mortar teams during challenging times.In this interview, you'll learn:·       The three pillars of retail expertise·       Why shifting from accidental to intentional changes everything·       Tactics for motivating store teams and messaging that they matter·       How to merge high tech and high touch without upsetting the balance Contact information:www.retailpride.com

Welcome to the The Voice of Retail, I'm your host Michael LeBlanc, and this podcast is brought to you in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada and with the support of omNovos, Canada's digital customer engagement company. omNovos make Personalization EASY by helping you engage the right customer, with the right content, at the right time. Find out how you can get started quickly and affordably so you can focus on doing what matters most--driving revenue and margin growth at www.realcustomerengagement.comIn this episode I'm in the Big Apple, New York City first with an exclusive interview with Paige Thomas, President & CEO Saks OFF 5TH.   We discuss her rich background in retail through to developing a passion for the off-price format, and then delve into the brand strategy matrix, the affordable luxury retail trend, the evolution of the second hand luxury market  and the future of retail in the covid era and beyond.Next, I meet Ron Thurston, Vice President of Stores at INTERMIX and  Best Selling Author with his great new book Retail Pride.  In a wide-ranging interview Ron takes us through his history of accomplishment and learning in retail store operations and delivers a glimpse into the masterclass of retail as a career that he chronicles and celebrates in his book.But first, let's hear from Paige from Saks Off 5th:******Thanks to Paige and Ron for being my guests,  plus omNovos for their support on this episode.  If you liked this podcast please subscribe on Apple, Spotify or your favourite podcast platform,  rate and review, and be sure and recommend to a friend or colleague in the retail industry.  I'm Michael LeBlanc, Founder and President of M.E. LeBlanc and Company Inc. and you can learn more about me on www.meleblanc.co or of course on LinkedIn

Conversations are becoming more important than ever. Tune in as we discuss the ever-changing landscape of Retail Practices + Professional Strategies with special guest, Ron Thurston, VP of Stores at INTERMIX. Download the app | Instagram | Linkedin | Website

Ron Thurston is currently the Vice President of store for INTERMIX, a division of GAP Inc. and serves on the Board of Directors of GOODWILL NY/NJ. Prior to INTERMIX, Ron was the Director of Retail at Saint Laurent, Bonobos and Tory Burch. Ron has a demonstrated history of delivering exceptional results and building culture. He is skilled in trend analysis, retail, client development and growing store fleet count.