Podcast appearances and mentions of Paco Underhill

In a world dominated by big-box convenience and digital ads, what truly sets independent retailers apart? Relationships. In this heartfelt episode of Main Street Matters, host Patrick Keiser explores how genuine customer connections are built — not with marketing gimmicks, but with consistent, thoughtful, everyday moments.Drawing inspiration from Paco Underhill's Why We Buy, Patrick unpacks how emotion, memory, and authenticity create lasting customer loyalty — and how small, human-centered actions can grow your business more than any algorithm.

What if five minutes could make your store more profitable, more welcoming, or more efficient? In this episode of Main Street Matters by Heart on Main Street, host Patrick Keiser shares five small but mighty changes you can make today to improve your retail business, no budget, no major overhaul, just quick wins with big potential.Drawing on insights from the retail classic Why We Buy by Paco Underhill, Patrick walks you through real, actionable ideas like moving a product to eye level, refreshing your front signage, or auditing a single online listing. These small adjustments add up to better customer experiences and stronger sales.

In this episode of Grow a Small Business, host Michael Denehey interviews Dave McQuillen, the founder of Sufferfest (wahooX), discusses building his cycling app into a $20M enterprise with 45 team members. He details the tough transition from digital downloads to a subscription model and the importance of staying close to customers. Host Michael Denehey explores McQuillen's journey, from managing growth to achieving work-life balance, and the valuable lessons learned along the way. Why would you wait any longer to start living the lifestyle you signed up for? Balance your health, wealth, relationships and business growth. And focus your time and energy and make the most of this year. Let's get into it by clicking here.   Michael delves into our guest's startup journey, their perception of success, industry reconsideration, and the pivotal stress point during business expansion. They discuss the joys of small business growth, vital entrepreneurial habits, and strategies for team building, encompassing wins, blunders, and invaluable advice.   And a snapshot of the final five Grow A Small Business Questions:   What do you think is the hardest thing in growing a small business? According to Dave McQuillen, the hardest thing in growing a small business is choosing what not to do. He emphasizes the importance of focusing on what truly drives success and avoiding distractions from bright, shiny objects that can divert attention and resources. What's your favorite business book that has helped you the most? Dave McQuillen's favorite business books are "Why We Buy" by Paco Underhill and "Setting the Table" by Danny Meyer. He values "Why We Buy" for its insights into consumer behavior and merchandising, and "Setting the Table" for its lessons on customer experience and leadership. Are there any great podcasts or online learning resources you'd recommend to help grow a small business? Dave McQuillen didn't find podcasts to be particularly influential during his time with Sufferfest, but he mentioned enjoying cycling podcasts now that he's out of the industry. For growing a small business, he emphasizes the importance of tools that facilitate meaningful conversations with customers, rather than just quantitative surveys. Prototyping ideas and getting feedback directly from users is also crucial. What tool or resource would you recommend to grow a small business? Dave McQuillen recommends using tools that facilitate direct, meaningful conversations with customers. He emphasizes the value of prototyping ideas and gathering feedback through interactive discussions rather than relying solely on quantitative surveys. What advice would you give yourself on day one of starting out in business? Dave McQuillen advises that he might not give himself any specific advice on day one. He believes that if he had known how challenging and consuming the journey would be, he might have been too scared to start. Embracing the unknown and adapting as things progressed was, in his view, advantageous to his success. Book a 20-minute Growth Chat with Troy Trewin to see if you qualify for our upcoming course. Don't miss out on this opportunity to take your small business to new heights! Enjoyed the podcast? Please leave a review on iTunes or your preferred platform. Your feedback helps more small business owners discover our podcast and embark on their business growth journey.     Quotable quotes from our special Grow A Small Business podcast guest: Invest in your team; it's the best way to scale your business effectively – Dave McQuillen Understanding your customers daily is crucial; it's not something you can delegate – Dave McQuillen The most transformative industry changes are often the hardest to recognize and act on – Dave McQuillen      

Transcription N Our guest this episode is Sandeep Dayal. Sandeep grew up in India and moved to America at the age of 27 to secure his MBA. He stayed in the U.S. to work. He has held positions with a number of major firms where he worked with large clients throughout the world.   My conversation with Sandeep covered what I feel are quite interesting topics around marketing and sales. Because of his knowledge Sandeep and I spend considerable time discussing brands, branding and the many ways the science of brands has evolved. Sandeep gives many relevant examples and ideas we all can use. As he will discuss, his ideas are also contained in his book, “Branding Between the Ears” which many describe as an iconic study of branding. I think you will find Sandeep's insights quite relevant and useful whether you are in marketing or not.   About the Guest:   Sandeep Dayal is the managing director of the consulting firm Cerenti. He advises senior executives at Fortune 500 companies in industries spanning pharmaceuticals, financial services and consumer products.  Global market leaders like Pfizer, Abbvie, HSBC, Santander, Kraft and ConAgra, have been some of his clients. He worked previously for McKinsey and Booz Allen & Hamilton.   Sandeep has led a 100+ engagements at over 50 clients around the world in major countries in the US, EU, Latin America and Asia. He is regarded as one of the leading minds in marketing and brand strategy and has co-authored articles in Marketing Management, McKinsey Quarterly and Strategy+Business. As early as in 2001, he correctly predicted that “consumer collaboration” would become a key factor in winning people's trust online. Many strategies he proposed including viral advocacy and instant decisioning are mainstream today in designing brand experiences.   His latest book “Branding Between the Ears” has been described by some as the definitive advance in the understanding of what makes some brands truly iconic. It draws on his years of experience in working with some of the most successful consumer brands and his company's proprietary knowledge capital. Sandeep's current research focuses on Cognitive Branding and Selling, which translates the latest advances in behavioral economics and social psychology into completely new ways for developing modern power brands and driving up salesforce performance.   Ways to connect with Sandeep:   Sandeep Dayal website: http://sandeepdayal.com Cerenti Company: http://cerenti.com LinkedIn profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sandeep-dayal-8361b61/ Blog signup: https://www.cerenti.com/blog   About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog.   Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards.   https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/   accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/   https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/       Thanks for listening!   Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!   Subscribe to the podcast   If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset .   Leave us an Apple Podcasts review   Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts.      Transcription Notes: Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson ** 01:21 Thank you once again for being here with us on unstoppable mindset. Really appreciate you listening and watching wherever you happen to be. I am your host, Mike Hingson, and our guest today is Sandeep Dayal, who has an interesting story to tell, at least. I think it's interesting. He's going to talk to us a lot about branding and marketing and such things, having been in sales most all of my adult life, all of that gets fascinating to me, but I think that he'll have a lot of interesting topics and issues to provide us all with that will keep you interested as well. And if you're not wake up. You should be anyway. Sandeep, welcome to unstoppable mindset. We're really glad you're here. I'm   Sandeep Dayal ** 02:06 so delighted to be here. Michael, thank you for inviting me to be on your show.   Michael Hingson ** 02:11 Well, thank you for for being here, and we'll have some fun. Tell me a little bit about maybe the early Sandeep growing up and all that to give people a little background.   Sandeep Dayal ** 02:20 Oh, wow, that was a long time back. You sure want to? You sure you want to go into,   Michael Hingson ** 02:24 oh, sure, a long time ago in a galaxy, far, far away. There   Sandeep Dayal ** 02:29 you go. There was a little Sandeep, yeah. No. I mean, I grew up in, I grew up in India, and, you know, if, if this were still five years back, I would have said half my life was in India, and half my life in the United States, because I came to I came to the US at age 27 but until then, I grew up there in in a city called Jaipur, which is in the middle of a tar desert there. So there you go, you and I have something in common there. And then, I mean, I went through my engineering education, so I was I run. I sort of learned all my my background, you could say, is more analytic and scientific and so on, from a training perspective at that time, which sort of shaped my view of the world at that, that point of time, in terms of, you know, being more objective about things, thinking about things more logically, and so forth. And then at some point, you know, I set up my own little business there, which sort of brought me into areas that were beyond engineering, if you will. You know, like the kinds of things you were talking about, Michael, like sales, you know, how do you how do you form relationships with people? How do you work with people? How do you run an organization, and so on. And that got me much more interested in the the management side of things, versus just the engineering side of things. And I came to the United States in 87 to to Yale University to do my MBA. And, you know, after I finished my MBA, I started working in the US, and I've lived in the US since then. And I got more and more interested in other things, as you might imagine, particularly on consumer connections, the consumer side of things, consumer psychology and what have you. So it's been a, it's been a, you know, multiple year transition. I've worked in a number of consulting companies. I worked at McKinsey, I've worked at booze, and then I started my own company, so renty. So renty Marketing Group, which is much more focused on working with consumers, understanding their psychology, understanding their mindset and so on, and then putting that to use and good marketing and then good branding. So it's been, it's been. It's been a long and, you know, steady journey, if you will. It   Michael Hingson ** 04:57 certainly has been. But you you sound like. Survived it, and you're doing well and and now you're basically getting up near 60. So there you go. There   Sandeep Dayal ** 05:07 you go, yeah. So there, there I am now in at a at a stage in my life where, actually, where I enjoy more of the kinds of discussions that you and I are having right now. Because, you know, my earlier phase of life, I would say, was all about doing stuff, you know, getting it done, making money, doing it, you know, whatever, whichever way, making a career out of it, and what have you. Now, I'm at a point of life where I'm able to sort of sit back and reflect a little and say, hey, you know, what was that all about? You know, what did I really learn? And is there something there that I learned which is worth sharing with others? So that's why I really love being on shows like yours, and particularly yours, around mindsets and being unstoppable and so on, and sort of having a chance to, you know, really see what all those things can possibly mean.   Michael Hingson ** 06:01 Yeah. And on top everything else, you're an author, you've written some books. I love the title of of the one that least I know about branding between the years, and we'll have to get to that. That's kind of cute, but it makes a lot of sense. Also, I think people really don't understand the whole idea of marketing as much as they should. And frankly, I don't think that people really understand sales like they should. And there are differences between the two, but there are also a lot of similarities, and they do, they do dovetail to   Sandeep Dayal ** 06:35 Yes, and   Michael Hingson ** 06:37 so I think it's, it is something that a lot of people don't understand nearly as well as they should, and they're not necessarily making the process work   Sandeep Dayal ** 06:48 like that. And I would say, Michael, that, you know, sales and marketing, they go hand in hand. I wrote the book branding between the years around branding specifically, but it actually there's a whole I could have written also a book which would have been called branding between the years, but it would have been all about sales and but, you know, I this sales is such a big topic and such so interesting and so rich that you don't want to sort of squeeze it into a book which is about branding. You know what I'm saying? So, like, in fact, I mentioned that very specifically in my book, that, look, we could do a whole discussion and a whole book about just the psychology of sales, the behavioral science behind sales, and that's very important, but that's a whole separate book. So I hadn't covered it. There it well,   Michael Hingson ** 07:41 it is. And people really get it wrong. They think of sales as, oh, the guy who's trying to make me buy a car and things like that, and, and in one sense, at a at a very low level, I suppose you could say that sales, but that's not really what sales is all about. I got into sales originally, because I was working for a company, and the company was, well, it was Kurzweil Computer Products, Ray Kurzweil, the inventor and futurist and so on. And at the time, they was developing the reading machine for the blind. And I had been asked to join the company in 1978 and then, like May or June of 1979 I was called in, and I was doing Human Factors studies for them, but I was called in and told I was being laid off because I wasn't a revenue generator for the company, which I wasn't. Then the company had too many non revenue producing people, and I needed to go off and find another job unless I would be willing to go into sales. They gave me that option, which was a was a great compliment, and I said, I don't know anything about sales. And the guy who actually made this offer was the Vice President of Marketing for and sales for Kurzweil, which was a gentleman named Andrew Parsons, by the way, who used to work at McKinsey. Ah,   Sandeep Dayal ** 09:06 I see, I see, wow. Anyway, so yes,   Michael Hingson ** 09:11 so he said, We can teach you sales. We'll send you to a tale Carnegie sales course and so on. And I was very fortunate, because the group and the teachers really talked about the true nature of what sales was all about and what it wasn't about, and that sales is really a good salesperson as a teacher, as a guide, as a counselor. And in reality, I can't sell anyone anything. The customers really gotta want to buy it if I do it right, and and that's that's what it's about. And then that came into play for me years later, when, again, I was looking for another job, and I was debating at the time of looking for the job, and we found a company, my wife and I that we thought would be. A good company to go work for, but I debated about whether I say I'm blind in the cover letter, because that's always an issue. If you're blind and you say it, they usually won't pay any attention to you. And if you don't blind and and if you're blind and you don't say you're blind, then you'll go in for an interview and they'll just the defenses will go up immediately. Yeah. And what I did is I wrote a cover letter. And part of the cover letter said, Do you want to hire somebody who comes into the company and sells for eight or 10 hours a day because it was a sales job, and then goes home? Or do you want to hire somebody who truly understands sales for the science and art that it is and sells 24 hours a day as a way of life, which is what a blind person has to do just to be able to convince people to let them do stuff. And it was the that sentence was what got me the interview and got me the job. Wonderful,   Sandeep Dayal ** 10:50 wonderful, you know, you just, you know, you've just inspired me to actually talk about some, you know, some things in sales. And I do make a connection around this topic in my book in the following way. So, you know, branding, you can think of it in two parts. You know, there's one part of branding which is around strategy, which is around, you know, what is your brand going to be positioned? You know, how is your brand going to be positioned? What is it going to be its DNA? What is the brand going to be about? So that's those are decisions and choices you make around what your brand is going to be, which are more stray. But then once you made those choices, your brand actually goes to market, right? And it goes to market often through what sometimes companies will call brand ambassadors. But these are all the people that are in stores. You know? These are, these are the sales side of the people, right? The people that are actually, this is where the rubber meets the road. And so the brand actually goes to market through its ambassadors, who are really the salespeople, the retail people, and what have you. And they have to their work is just so incredibly important. It's just as important as the design of the brand. And I'll give you a couple of examples, because, you know, this is a topic that's close to my heart. So for example, you think of a company like Bulgaria, right, which sells this awfully expensive jewelry, right, hundreds of 1000s of dollars and what have you. And you have to, even if you selling to rich people, they still, you know, think about these things, because these things are pretty expensive. So one of the things what they've done is that they've actually thought through that whole process of from the time that the person is walking into their store to every single moment that they are in the store, to how the purchase happens, and what the post purchase follow up is they've talked through all those things, and I'll give you a very small example about the kinds of things which are more behavioral science oriented, which is, which is where we're going in this discussion. So one of the things they do is that when the salesperson is going to notice that, Hey, you, you know, you're a woman and you like a particular necklace, what they do is they have you, you know, you're sitting in a private room. You're looking at this necklace. There's the salesperson with you, and the person will say to you that look or the brand ambassador, let's call them that. The brand ambassador is going to say, hey, why don't you try it on and what have you? And the woman can then go ahead, the customer can then go ahead and try the necklace on and look at it. And then the salesperson does something where that's very interesting. They say, hey, you know what? I need to just step out and take care of something. Would it be okay if I just do that for five minutes while you're, you know, sitting here? So then they walk out of the room. And now you can imagine, here's the customer, the woman, she's sitting there with the necklace she's wearing, and there's no one to bother her or try to push her into the scale or try to She's just sitting there by herself, and every minute and every second that she's there with that necklace, it's feeling to her more and more like her own. And you know, in psychology, there has been a lot of research that has been done, which basically says that once people feel like something is theirs, they are less likely to part with it. They're less likely to give it up, you know. So it could be anything. It could be, you know, let's say it could be a pen that you own and but once you own it, you start valuing it more than if you didn't own it and it was just sitting on the shelf, and there's been just a lot of research to show that that is the case. So in this instance, what happens is, it's not the single thing that drives the person to the sale, but it is one one step, one small thing that they do which pushes the person or coaxes the person to take one step more, you know, feel like that thing is their own. So that is, you know, that is, that's what selling is about. It's not about, you know, just pushing used cars and so on. So really understanding the mindset and working with people, helping them get comfortable with the idea of owning your product is a critical thing that you do. In another example that I'll give you, this is from. Another very famous behavioral psychologist, Paco Underhill. He wrote a book about why people buy. This was several years it was one of the books that inspired me to get into this whole area. And he used to observe how people shop in stores, and he would make little changes in the stores to help people be more likely to buy. And one of the things he observed was that when you kept items, like, if you had women sweaters, and you put them on a table right in the middle of the aisle, right so you're walking through the aisle in a store, and sometimes you'll see there's a table right there in the middle of the aisle. So you run into the table, and there are whole sweaters piled up there, and you can then, you know, start looking at them. But he found that on one hand, you could say, Hey, I'm putting it right in the middle of the traffic where you're going to be walking, so you'll have no choice but to stop and look at it. But what he found was that women would stop, they would look at those sweaters, but then they would quickly walk away. And the reason that it was happening was that if they stopped in the middle of the aisle, that people would brush by them, and they would it would make them just feel uncomfortable. You know, when somebody just comes in, someone that you don't know, just walking by that brushes by you, it makes you feel uncomfortable. So they would stop there, but they wouldn't stop there long enough to look and make up their minds. So he just had them move those tables to a more comfortable space where someone could not only stop but look at those things at their leisure. And they found that the sales went up. So it's these, it's these little things that you know, that people don't think these are all parts of being a good brand ambassador, and it's all parts of designing the sales experience or the marketing experience for the person in such a way that they're going to be more inclined to prefer your product. So it's just, I wasn't really going to talk about these things, but you brought it up, and it just brought back these things.   Michael Hingson ** 16:58 Another thing that comes to mind just talking about that same thing, which is sort of unrelated, in a way, to exactly what you're talking about is, is this, my wife was in a wheelchair her whole life, and would go to many stores, and when there were blocks in the middle of aisles like tables with sweaters and so on, she couldn't get by. And places like Macy's, for years, just had very narrow aisles, yeah, because they wanted to stuff as much in which they felt was a good thing to do, except then people in wheelchairs couldn't get through. Well, Macy's eventually had to deal with that, because they were sued and they lost, but, but the reality is, I'm sure that that changed to a degree, in some ways, how people viewed exactly where they should put products and so on. And it's a little bit of a different dimension than, than, than what, what you're talking about, but still, nevertheless, yeah, it is also part of what we need to do to recognize that we've got to be inclusive in what we do for everyone.   Sandeep Dayal ** 18:10 Absolutely. I mean, I mean, it's, this is, you know, we're you and I are just talking about some examples here, but this is actually a whole area of science and design, right, which is, when you when you're a company, how exactly yours, your products are displayed in a store, you know, what height they're at, how they're displayed, what kind of a message that communicates to people is, is such an extremely Is it such an important thing that we, in our company, in serenity, we can be doing entire studies, which are, you know, like, three month long studies where we're just designing that whole aspect of how the product is presented in a store for the consumer, for all of them to feel comfortable, for all of them to feel like this is something that they would like to own. And that whole process, like I described about, you know, every moment that you spend getting to that store, being in that store, and then after leaving that store, you know what is every single moment? What's your playbook for that moment is a key piece of what marketing, sales, behavioral science is all about, right?   Michael Hingson ** 19:16 Well, the the idea of sales and marketing and branding and so on is always going to be a moving target. It's a market of or a process of evolution, because as we learn more, as we develop more understanding of psychology and so on, we're going to change it. But I know you talk about the fact that there is the old branding techniques, and there's a lot of new branding. How is branding kind of evolved over time?   Sandeep Dayal ** 19:47 Yeah, now interesting that you bring out. So let's talk about, you know, the whole brand strategy piece, which is, you know, how do you design, how do you design brands, and so on. And I think I in some ways, brand. Marketing is not rocket science, and in other ways it is. So the part that is been relatively straightforward about branding historically has been that, look, if you have a product and you're an entrepreneur, you have a product and you're going to mark put it to market, you just, you know, you start thinking about, okay, how is my product different from everybody else's products. And then once you make a list of all those things that are different, then you say, oh, okay, now which of these things are kind of important for people? And maybe I pick three or four things, and then I can talk about that. And the problem is that while all of that makes a lot of sense, what doesn't make sense is that that's not how the human brain works. So what happens when you make a list of things that are different about your product? It's kind of like, you know, it's kind of like the occasion where my wife gives me a list of things that I need to go and buy from the grocery store, and she might tell me only five things that I have to buy. And I go to the grocery store, you know, I'm, I can't remember what those five things are, and I go, and I come back with three things that were on the list, two that are missing, and maybe another three things that were not on the list at all to begin with, right? So that's, and that's a very natural thing that happens, which is that human beings, our brains are not really designed around remembering lists. So when the marketer goes and said, My brand is about these three things, you know that it's this is, this is something that's going to make your life easy, or, then this thing is very tasty. Well, you know, easy, tasty, like, you know, how am I going to remember all those things. So now, for example, in behavioral science, there's a whole theory around story lining, which is that people are going to remember your brands better if you can put a storyline around it. And the reason is that, like you know, while we are, if I give you a list of 10 things to remember, you're not going to remember. It becomes 10 words to remember. Can become very hard, but at the same time, I can send you to watch. You know, you might go to, you know, somebody might tell you a story about a play that they saw right, which could be a whole 30 minute story, and you might then just be able to remember that story in all its detail, because it's a story, right? Or somebody comes like you now you're telling me about your life and how you went through, you know, you went through the transition from your job to sales, and how you were with Ray Kurzweil. And so I've already remembered more than five things, right, because you, because you told me the thing in such a compelling way, and such a story, you know, in such a story form. And so what we are discovering scientifically is that when you tell people things in terms of stories, when you show them things in terms of patterns, when you when you do rhymes, for example. So there are certain types of things that the brain remembers better than if you just give it lists. So this whole old idea that used to exist that I'm just trying to make my brand about the two or three things that I'm different about just doesn't work, because people, when you tell them that those two or three things, they just don't remember it. And if they don't remember it, are they going to buy your product? So now we are starting to take this new understanding of behavioral science and the psychology that we have from various studies that are being done about the human brain. Right? There's a lot of study that's being done about the human brain, from neuroscientists, from linguists, from cognitive psychologists and so on, and all of them, if you take their knowledge and bring it together, it's giving us an understanding of how the brain actually works. And now you can use that understanding of how the brain works to start thinking better about how you do, how you do the designing around your brands, the strategy around your brand better.   Michael Hingson ** 24:08 And that's in large part what the whole concept of cognitive branding is all about. That's   Sandeep Dayal ** 24:15 what, exactly what cognitive branding is all about. The you know, the name of the book branding between the years is really the illusion to the to the fact that, you know what's between the years. Between the years is our brain, right?   Michael Hingson ** 24:28 For some people, that's what's between the years. And there are others, I'm not so sure   Sandeep Dayal ** 24:34 if there's anything there. Whatever is there that's that really is, is is our perception of the world, right? You know, our perception of what reality is, what the world is, who we are, everything that we think about, what the brands are, it's all. It's not, it's not the billboard out there. It's not what the store it's not that little song jingle, and you know, all of these things. Is, but it's when all of those different things, the touch and feel, the sound and sight, and I mean, all of these things actually are processed in your brain. And so your vision of what this thing is, what this brand is, what it's all about, is really determined. It's arbitrated between your ears. And that's why, you know, the book is called right between   Michael Hingson ** 25:23 wait you you talked before about the woman trying on the necklace, and then the branding Ambassador leaving, and about ownership and so on. It really ultimately comes down to getting people to relate to whatever it is that you're you're trying to get them to relate to and getting them to to feel some ownership, but more important just feeling ways to relate. I sold a number of products that were very similar to products that other companies would produce. I sold big tape backup storage systems that people would use to back up data on Wall Street and other places. And although we were the developers of some of the technology, other companies would would buy our technology, and they would put it in their own products. And the reality is, ultimately, speaking, there were not huge differences directly physically. There were differences in shapes and so on, but they weren't really different. And so the issue is, why would one buy my product as opposed to someone else's? And that's where it gets back to, what is it that we're really talking about, what is it that we're really doing. Why would you buy my product as opposed to somebody else? That has a lot to do with, not just and not at all necessarily, with here are the differences. But rather, you have to find other things that people are going to react to, that they'll perceive your your product as being the one that they ought to have, and it's my job to help them see that in an intelligent way, while at the same time not alienating other people and making me look like just the used car sales guy.   Sandeep Dayal ** 27:15 Yes, yes. And I think that my whole book is really about that very question, which is, which is that, why would somebody buy your brand, right? And and it comes from that study of really understanding how people have bought brands and how in my companies work. So my company does a lot of work around designing brands and helping companies launch their products. And some of those brands have gone on to become some of the largest brands in the world. But really it is, it is, in fact, around that whole question around the why and what, what has changed is. And of course, you know, sometimes, like I said, you can give people a set of reasons, and they will, for those reasons, buy your product. But what we're finding through science is that, what we're finding through science is that it's not, it's not the case that people always make decisions so rationally, you know, it's not the case that people always sit down and do like, a pros and cons of things you know, like, Okay, this is product A, Product B. Let me do a pros and cons. Let me do a spreadsheet on this and so on. People do a lot of things very instinctively, for example. And in fact, there is research that has been done which is, which has shown that 95% of all the choices that people make Okay, in your life, you know in your every day there are 1000s of choices you're making all the time, and there's research that shows that 95% of those choices are done instinctively and not deliberately, right? And this science is called system one and system two by a very famous psychologist who gave those terms to these forms of thinking, the instinctive and the rational thinking. The psychologist name is Daniel Kahneman, and he is at Princeton University. But it's something that you can actually this is something that you can intuitively relate to, which is that you know, for example, when you're driving a car, there are a lot of choices that you're making, and those are very complex life and death choices, right? Because if you make a make a mistake in terms of how you drive the car, but you make choices around how fast you're going to go, how much you're going to press the accelerator, whether you're going to take a left, are you going to veer to the right? You know, all of those choices you're making, and you're just doing that instinctively, almost, not almost without thinking many times people are singing or thinking about something else as they're driving and so on. And all of this is happening instinctively. And the reality is that even when it comes down to branding, there are many, many things that people do. Um. Instinctively and make those choices instinctively. So understanding what that is and how that happens is is a key as is a key part of key part of how you can make brand choices. So I'll give you an example. So what happens is, as we go through our lives, we have many, many different experiences based on those experiences, we have certain learnings, and with those learnings, and those are learnings that I I would call like, that's the wisdom that we acquire over life as a result of the experiences that we have in our life, right? And those are our personal wisdoms, you know? Those are things that you know we have. We have decided this is what, this is how things work. So for example, there's one common wisdom which is seen across many, many people, across countries and so on, where people say, hey, the simpler answer is the better answer, right? And there's a, there's an effect around it's called the Occam's razor, which is, you know, which basically says that, given a problem, and if there are two possible answers to the to the problem, then the simpler answer is the better answer, right? And lot of times this comes from the vis. This kind of wisdom comes from the aspect that you know, Don't over complicate life. Don't overthink things. You know, you did things, such things, sometimes you can decide quickly. So what marketers have done, for example, there is, there's a company called HEB, which is a grocery store in the south where they make prepared meals. And so they did a whole campaign where they essentially say, where they essentially say that, you know, life is complicated. So they had actually an ad where you see this person who is, you know, driving back from work, and there's, he looks up his GPS system, and the GPS says your expected arrival time is Thursday, which was like two days away, which obviously they were exaggerating it. But the idea was to say that, look, life is so complex all the time. You're dealing with traffic and so on, meal time shouldn't be. And then, you know, and then they make a plug for their prepared meals, which is, you know, life is difficult, but meal time shouldn't be and then you have their prepared meals. Now mind you, what they're talking about making life simpler here is not, they're not necessarily saying that, you know, take my prepared meal and put it for two seconds in the, you know, microwave and it's ready to eat. It's not that ease that they're talking about. What they're talking about is the ease of choice, because choice, when we start thinking about choice, it can be very stressful when we have to make sure. So they're saying, take that decision, make that decision. Making around, you know, you already had a tough day. Make the decisions around your meal time, at least easy, you know, which is by, you know, because otherwise, if you were going to make your own meal, you'd be thinking about, Hey, should I eat healthy? Should I eat carbs? Should I do this? Should I, you know, greens? Should I do? You know, there's like a million choices to be made if you're going to make your own meal, but with this, all those choices become very simplified, because you can, you have your pick of all kinds of prepared meals that they sell in their stores. So lowering that burden of choice is what the Occam's Razor is about. And here it's a marketer that is very cleverly doing that. Now mind you, are there prepared me, let's go back to the point you made. Are there prepared meals that much better than, let's say the prepared meals you might get at a Dominic's or a jewel Osco or, say, or an Albertsons. Maybe not, right? But nonetheless, this campaign really taps into the idea that meal time shouldn't have to be so complicated. So go for it, and then you think of that, and you automatically do it, because choice can be instinctive. This is just one example, but there are many, many different things like this that help you, give you a sense of how people make choices. And in my book, I talk about seven different ways that brands, that you can make new brands, these types of brands, which sort of tap into your experiential wisdom. I call them brands with wisdom. That's one way to make great brands. But then you know, of course, there are many other ways that you can do it.   Michael Hingson ** 34:28 Do you think that in Hey, say it this way, but I will a perfect world. It would be better if we made choices instinctively or really analyzed. Or do you think the animal analyzation just introduces too much stress?   Sandeep Dayal ** 34:46 Well, it's it's stress, it's a lot of work. Also, you know, if you're going to analyze everything, you know it's just not possible to analyze everything, which is, the whole idea about learnings, right? Was Once you learn something, you want to be able to use. At learning as broadly as possible, right? And which is why there's all kinds of, you know, there's, there's, there's all kinds of advice from all kinds of sources, from religious sources, from your from your mother, from your from your wife, from your, you know, you from your friends, you get from experts, you get all kinds of advice because you want to be able to have certain principles so that you can live life without having to spend a whole day doing spreadsheets around what's a good choice and what's a bad choice. Having said that, there are certain times when you do have to think when the learnings that are available to you are outside of the experience that you had previously in life. In those instances, you do have to think so it's a this is this is this is a this is a good balance that we have to arrive. And you know, one of the examples that I mentioned in my book is, let's say you're going out and taking a mortgage on your for your home, right? Wow, that's a complicated discussion. Wow. That's a decision where, if you make a mistake, that could be very costly, you could find that Sunday you can't afford your mortgage, you know. So it can be pretty complicated. And so that, in fact, would be a good time to bring out a spreadsheet and, you know, sit down, and maybe sit with a pencil and pencil and a pencil and a piece of paper and write down what the positives and negatives, and you know, different mortgage products might be and what have you, and and also maybe read the fine print. And what happens, though, is that most of the time, we will make a mixed decision, where we will do some instinctive work and some and some appeal, you know, real analysis. So what you might do is you might say, Okay, I gotta get a mortgage. Hmm, you know, which of my friends have you know got a mortgage recently? And maybe I go and talk to them about how their experience has been. Maybe I go, maybe I go talk to Michael, because financially, he's such a smart guy, you know, I'm gonna idea if he's, if he's going for a mortgage with with Bank of America, that must be a good place to go. So I'll most likely go with Bank of America, because Michael went. So this is, that is part of what the now, that is part, part of what is drawing into an expert bias, or a part of what is drawing into a herd effect, right, where people go in a certain direction because they say, hey, everybody else is doing it right? Or person that is an expert is doing it, which is why you see so many ads and in television where there's some ex so called expert who's telling you to do X, Y and Z, and then you say, you stop to think for yourself, and you do it. Now, there are risks with it and but nonetheless, when you're designing brands, we do have to balance, because that can be, in fact, a legitimate strategy where we have certain experts or certain very respected people that are going to make make a recommendation or a suggestion of a product, and then people are going to do it well, if you do it responsibly, that that is a very viable brand strategy that certain brands will take Sure.   Michael Hingson ** 38:11 And if you're going to go into an analysis mode, you need to understand what that means and how to analyze. And you know, for for example, you talked about the expert and, well, I'm going to do it, because he's he's doing it, and there are risks in doing that, and one should really take the time, although I think a lot of people don't, to analyze and look at real facts. Okay, so he had a great success. What about my other friends over here who bought a house in the last couple of years? Yes, and really taking the time to explore it and do it right. If you're going to analyze, really analyze, and don't just look at one person or take one view, it's like you go to a doctor and you get a diagnosis, and then you decide, I really need a second or a third opinion. Do that right? Because it'll make all the difference in the world. Yes.   Sandeep Dayal ** 39:07 Yes, it does. And as you can see, you know, some of these things also come into play, not just in marketing, but you know, right now, we're in the middle of campaigns, campaigns, and there's a lot of very strategic marketing that's done by, you know, in politics, and that's a whole, you can write a whole book about Sure, which is, you know, which is the different strategies that politicians may use to get people to decide. Because, remember, it's, there's only so many voters that are going to actually sit and do a in depth analysis of different policies that have been put in place by different politicians. What was the economic impact of it? You know, whether it's immigration policy, whether it's economic or whatever, you know, whatever I mean, to really do the. The analytics around, did that policy actually work out, and who did it benefit? And so on. Is a lot of work and and most people are not really going to do that,   Michael Hingson ** 40:10 so they should, but they won't. You're absolutely right. Yes, yes.   Sandeep Dayal ** 40:13 I mean, and I think they should do it, I would say at least they should do a mix of the two, right? They should. They have to understand, like, Hey, what's going on? What am I? How do I make some good decision around certain things? But often they may, they may pick on one or two things which align with, really, their system of beliefs, right? Which is why it's important for politicians. Find it very important to figure out what your beliefs are and try to align with them, because they know, if they can do that, then they will go with then you will go with that, because it's already in your belief system and so become very important in marketing, in politics, in our relationships with people, in sales, you know, these are Very important things that influence our lives. In very important ways, sure,   Michael Hingson ** 41:04 and I think that when take taking the politicians, as you said, they you want, you want to see that they've aligned with your beliefs. But I think the other aspect of that, which goes back to analysis, is, are they really aligning with your beliefs, or are they just saying it? And the problem is that we are seeing so much today where there are a lot of things being said and most people are just going strictly on emotion, and they're not analyzing, and that's doing a disservice to everyone. And it would really be great if people would do more real analysis of all of the politicians on both sides and look at what's really happened. I was just reading an article this morning about the economy, and the reality is that it said that the in fact, the most of the naysayers about the economy today come from one party and not the other, and that that's happened more often than not over the last many years. In terms of economy, the people who are going by the party, and that's real lovely. But is that reality? And the problem is, we don't take the time to really look at it,   Sandeep Dayal ** 42:12 yes, and, you know, and that is, it's just, and that's the reality of it. Michael, which is that people's lives are very complicated. There are a lot of things that they're doing, you know. And they have to go to work, they have to cook meals for their kids, they have to have more, you know. There's just so many things happen, yeah. So realistically speaking, people only give a fraction of their mind, of their brain capacity, to many of these decisions, and which is why, as brand marketers, we have to be very cognizant of the fact that people are going to make these decisions based on their own learnings, their own experiences. And therefore, you know, how do we make sure that we can get some preference from them by understanding what their experiences and what their belief systems are. Now, mind you, you have to do this with a sense of responsibility, because, you know, with with all of this learning about how people make their decisions, comes the opportunity to manipulate people you don't want, you know, for brands, you don't want your work to be around doing that. You want to be doing things in in a responsible way. Because, you know, because that is the right thing to do   Michael Hingson ** 43:32 right, and it's important to to do that, and to really take the time to do it right. And it is just kind of one of the issues that we face that a lot of people aren't going to take the time to really analyze or take the time to understand, I'm just too busy to do that. Yeah, yeah. And people take advantage of that and do spin things and try to just manipulate. And unfortunately, there's way too much that going on in so many things that we observe and see today, because they're taking advantage of the fact that people are so busy. Yes,   Sandeep Dayal ** 44:09 yes. And that's why, you know, when I in my book, I have a whole chapter, by the way, and in the book on ethics, you know, so it's, it's called branding with ethics, and it's, it is exactly about that point, which is with this knowledge and with this learning. Because, you know, when you read my book, you're, you know, we've talked about maybe two or three things out of the book in terms of how you can influence people, but in the book, there are 30 different things that you can learn. So because it's an it's an entire playbook for how you do this, well, right? But with that, but with that, comes that responsibility for every marketer to understand what is the right way to do that. Because, yeah, you might, you might get some bump in sales. You might, you know, make a nice little bonus one here. But ultimately, these things can. And, yeah, not the right things to do, you know, so you have to. So, in fact, in the book, and let me see if I can remember my own book, there are, you know, few things that I talk about. I talk about three principles that every, every branding campaign must pass through. So one is this whole idea of that we understand as the canonical principle, which is, you know, do unto others as you would they do want to use. So don't do a campaign which you wouldn't want someone doing to you or to your kids or something like that. Right? So that's one thing that that is, that is, that's a no no. Second thing that is a no no is that don't do anything, which is this actually comes from a philosopher by the name of Immanuel Kant, a very famous German philosopher, Immanuel Kant, who came out with something called a categorical imperative. And really what he talks about is that don't do anything, which if everyone started doing that, would be a social, you know, that would be a social detriment, right? That the detriment of the society don't do something that, which, if everybody else also did, would really lead to a deterioration of society. And so that's another principle that that is very important. And then the last one is, you know, the sun, the sunshine principle, which is, don't do anything, which, if people discovered that you had done it, that you would feel embarrassed about it, right? So you know things that you're willing to talk about, the do, things that if they appeared in the front pages of the New York Times, that this is what you did, that you wouldn't be embarrassed by it. You wouldn't, you would still be proud of what you had done so with those three things, I find that most market you know, most marketing dilemmas, most branding dilemmas, can, in fact, be be addressed. Yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 46:53 and that makes perfect sense by any standard a question that I'm been thinking about. You dealt with a lot of pharma companies and so on, and I would suspect that in dealing with a lot of pharmaceutical organizations and so on, you've interviewed a lot of people, probably a lot of people with disabilities and so on. How do you think that the work that you are doing and have done has really benefited or affected them?   Sandeep Dayal ** 47:20 Yes, I think that is, I think actually one of the things that I do a lot of work in the pharmaceutical sector, actually, and in the healthcare sector generally. But in the pharmaceutical sector, for one, and I actually love working in that space. It is, you know, as a marketer, it's, it's where you you really feel like you're actually making a big impact, to be honest. Because you know when, when the some pharmaceutical companies these days have come up with some fantastic drugs, which I've personally seen have made a phenomenal difference in in people's lives. You know, you can imagine, as a marketer, if you will, I have a choice of working for consumer product companies and tell them how to sell a box of cereals in a better way, or I can work with a pharmaceutical company and help them, you know, with get a get a drug to market, which is really going to have a transforming effect on a person's life, and so in my calculus, in my equation, that has weighed heavily, which is that when you work with these companies, with the healthcare companies, you're so close to truly appreciating people's people's lives and how those things can and can be, can be altered. So lot of times in the work that I've done, it's been, it's been very much about understanding how, how people that have certain disabilities or certain diseases in certain cases, how their lives are really being impacted, how that disease is robbing something away from them, but understanding it through their lens and seeing how you can actually come in with a conversation oftentimes, you know you Those are things that don't have anything to do with the drug that you're going to be marketing, but nonetheless, having that total understanding is essential to actually connecting with that person to begin with. You know, because remember that branding and marketing is a lot about communications, unless you can understand how you're going to relate to that person and how you are going to communicate with that person, you're actually not going to make process. You're not going to make progress, and you're not going to be able to get them in a place which is a better place for them. And so in that sense, it's very important. I'll give you an example. There was one time I was working with, with a company called AbbVie, which has one of the most successful drugs called humera, which is for people with rheumatoid arthritis, right? And in rheumatoid arthritis is it's kind of like a lifelong disease. And before this drug came out, people used to go through a lifetime of suffering, you know, in terms of joint pain, in terms of stiffness in their joints and so on. And it was just just a very, you know, difficult situation. There were no good no good solutions out there. However, when the when the drug came out, we were finding that even people that could benefit from this drug, you know, that they were not actually taking it, because they said, Hey, this is a newfangled drug. It's a biologic, gee, I've been taking, you know, pain pills, and it's kind of fine. I've spent the last 20 years in pain, and I've kind of managed IT and, and I'll be fine. I don't need to take some, you know, this new fangled, maybe experimental drug. It wasn't experimental, but nonetheless, nonetheless, that's how people can think about it. I don't want to experiment on right and, and it was kind of like, you know, we really had to understand that, that mindset, because we, you know, one time I talked to, I was doing a focus group, and I was talking to this woman. Her name was Lisa, and she was, you know, talking about her things. And I was telling her, Hey, Lisa. And this was when I was a young marketer, less, much less experienced and much less wiser than I am now. I was telling Lisa, hey, look, you know, this is a fantastic day. I don't understand why you're not taking it, because it's a fantastic drug. Your pain will go away, your stiffness will go away, and you're going to feel a lot better. You'll be able to go, go get a job. You'll you know this is, this is just going to change your life. You know what's, what's going on here? And she sort of stopped me, and she said, looked at me, and she said, Look, Sandeep, if you don't understand what I'm going through and what my life is all about. How are you going to help me? And that was kind of such a, you know, it was a moment that sort of stopped me, because at that moment, sort of it was kind of very perplexing to me. Because remember market, as a marketer, you came from that mindset that if I tell you what my product, how my product is different, and what it does, then you should obviously want it right? That was the mindset. That was the list branding mindset. But here, what I was being told by this person was that look, unless you unders, unless I have that connection with you, unless I understand, unless I feel, unless I can trust that you are a person that can relate to what I'm going through, and you understand my life, I'm not going to trust anything. Right? Which is fair, which is fair, so, which is but as a young marketer at that time, I didn't understand, sure, and I was, hey, well, you know, why does she care whether I understand her life or not? You know, I've got a drug that's going to change your life, you know, so, but that is that sort of got me on this journey of understanding, what is this consumer psychology? What is this? What is the what are these things that are going to help people change their behaviors? And then you get into all these things about wisdom, around beliefs, around values, around empathy, which are all the different ways in which you can design brands, which are going to be way more effective, which I then talk about in my book, and with all these different experiences that I have, and I, of course, I give lots of examples and stories because, remember, we said stories are important, so you need to be able to tell stories so that people can can can remember what you're saying better, but, yeah, that's so it's a book about brands, but it's a book about stories. Really, one   Michael Hingson ** 53:48 of the things that I find being blind, so if you will, that I find as a person with a disability is that we tend not to be included in the conversation. Yeah, people make so many assumptions about disabilities, and they start with the basic premise, well, disability means lack of ability. Well, it doesn't, but we, we don't get included in a lot of the conversations. And so the result is we have things like people who are diabetic and who let's let's use people who are blind and diabetic or have diabetes. The problem is that the way to deal with measuring insulin and really dealing with measuring blood glucose have been very primitive, and while there is newer technology that allows for more constant monitoring, just recently, the first version that has the potential to be accessible for people who happen to be blind has come on the market and has been approved, and that actually is using an app with a with. The constant monitor that transmits to the app, but, but the reality is, there's so many issues and so many types of things where we get left out because the pharmaceutical industry doesn't include it, or consider it a high enough priority, or it's too expensive, and again, a total lack of understanding or value of what we bring to the marketplace, and how do we deal with changing that?   Sandeep Dayal ** 55:28 Yes, I mean, that is such a great example that you're bringing, you know, bringing from your from your personal life. So thank you for sharing that. But I think you know in the example that I talked about, it was the same thing that was very apparent, which is, even when people are, you know, not necessarily, they don't necessarily have a disability, you know. So they're not blind, they're not you know, but they still get left out of conversations, yeah, right, because the people that are in a position of power, or the marketers, are just not listening to everything that listening to there are not sensitive, you know, they talk about being customer centric, but they really are not, and that is because they because, you know, and it's, and I'll give you an example, you know, outside of disabilities, I'll give you an example about how people get left out of conversations in many different ways. So there was a campaign that recently for and that was done by by Samsung, you know, again, a very rich company with the best marketers in the world. No shortage of resources and so on. And they were, they were, you know, marketing, their new watch, you know, like to compete with Apple Watch. Apple Watch, right? And they came out with this campaign in which they showed this woman that's running through, you know, decides at two in the morning to run through some streets, and she's running through these very sketchy streets, and she's in the in middle, the middle of the night, and so on. And she is, you know, there is another person that is kind of just playing with her, biking around her and so on. And it was kind of a very sketchy ad, which, which, which was put out there. And what happened was, when they put this ad out there, they thought it was super cool. The ad agency thought it was super cool because they're very cool graphics. But then again, the person that you're leaving out of that conversation is really the customer and consumer, right? Yeah, and they put out this ad, and women saw this ad, and they said, You've got to be kidding. And right around the time that this ad came out in Ireland, there was a woman who had, in fact, gone out running at night, and, you know, and then and she got, she got attacked, you know, and she got attacked and raped and this and that. So there was that whole story going and meanwhile they come out with this ad, which is almost depicting this kind of a situation, this woman in this and they're thinking it's pretty cool, because of the graphics that they've done, and so you have to be very sensitive to not just what you're saying, but what the other person is actually hearing, you know? And I'm saying hearing in a, in a, in a kind of medical right, which is you have to be able to see things from the from the eyes, from the ears, you know, from the perspective of the person that is actually getting this message. Otherwise, you are doing what you just said, which is you're leaving them out of the conversation. And I think that is what you just described so eloquently in your own experience, right?   Michael Hingson ** 58:47 And and it happens so often in so many different ways. We have been doing this about an hour, and I think we're going to have to stop so we don't get people too, too tired of us. But a couple of things, but a couple of things. Can we, can we continue this and do another episode in the future?   Sandeep Dayal ** 59:06 Oh, of course, yeah, you know, I'd be happy to talk to you, Michael, this is, I think we should do it easy for me, it just, it just kind of flows. So if you're getting what you need out of this, then I'm happy to to do this in Oh,   Michael Hingson ** 59:20 I think, we should. How can people reach out to you and so on, if they'd like to,   Sandeep Dayal ** 59:26 so that there are multiple ways that they can do that they can go to my blog website, which is simply my name, sandeepdayal.sandeepdayal.com   Michael Hingson ** 59:35 Can you spell that, please? That   Sandeep Dayal ** 59:38 is S, A, N, D, E, P, D, A, Y A L, at, sir, at, sorry, no, I made them say Sandeepdayal.com.com that's what that is, yes, or they can go to my company website, cerenti.com, C, E R, E N T I.com Com. And in both instances, there is a place where they can send messages. And I usually look at those messages personally and respond. I always respond,   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:12 well, cool. Well, I really appreciate you taking the time to come on. And I do want to do another episode, so we will schedule. We have to schedule a time and record it, because I know there are lots of other questions and things that we can delve into. So if you don't mind, I think we should do it.   Sandeep Dayal ** 1:00:28 Yeah, we'll do that. Let me just mention to you that I am going to be actually out of the country in February and March, coming back in the middle of April. Okay, either we can do it then, or if you wanted to do it earlier, I mean, I can, I'll be in India, but I can still, I've done lots of webinars from there, so it's not an issue, as long as we can work with the time difference. Well,   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:52 bottom line is, like we did with this one, we'll schedule it at whatever time is. Can we end for you? So I'll, I'll resend, I'll resend the link, and you just schedule it for when you want. So if you want. So if you want to do it when you get back, that's okay, whatever works for you.   Sandeep Dayal ** 1:01:06 Okay, yeah, no, I'd love to do it. Michael, so thank you. Thank you again for including me on your podcast.   Michael Hingson ** 1:01:12 Well, thank you, and I want to thank you all for listening. We really appreciate it. I hope that you'll give us a five star rating wherever you're listening to unstoppable mindset. We really value your ratings and we value your input. You'd like to reach out to me. You can do so by sending me an email at Michael M, I, C, H, A, E, L, H I at accessibe, A, C, C, E, S, S, I, B, E.com, Michael at Access Michael h i@accessibe.com or go to our podcast page, www, dot Michael hingson.com/podcast, and Michael Hingson and again, is M, I, C, H, A, E, L, H, I N, G, S O N.com/podcast, so please do that and send deep for you, as well as others. If you know of somebody else who we ought to have on as a guest on unstoppable mindset, really would appreciate you emailing me or letting me know we are always looking for more people to have on, although it is fun to talk to somebody more than once like we will do with Sandeep, well, thank you all for listening and again. Sandeep, I want to thank you one last time for being here as well.   **Sandeep Dayal ** 1:02:14 Thank you very much for having me. I enjoyed this.   1:02:22 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while

Nordstrom's core mission is to make customers feel good and look their best. And the retailer is legendary for listening to the customer and delivering customer service that “is not defined by us based on our legacy practices. It's defined by customers. The customer is still the best filter we have for every business decision we make," according to Pete Nordstrom. Two industry giants, Bob Spector, and Paco Underhill, join Robin and Shelley as they discuss how Nordstrom's culture that is focused on the customer experience has been maintained over the course of 123 years … and counting. They discuss the role of technology in enhancing the customer experience and how to combine high touch with high tech. Don't miss this fascinating look at the inside story and backstory on one of America's most beloved retail brands. Special GuestsRobert Spector, Author, The Century Old Startup: The Nordstrom Way of Embracing Change, Challenges, and a Culture of Customer ServicePaco Underhill, Author, Why We Buy, Call of the Mall, What Women Want, and How We Eat For more strategic insights and compelling content, visit TheRobinReport.com, where you can read, watch, and listen to content from Robin Lewis and other retail industry experts, and be sure to follow us on LinkedIn and Twitter.

Es gibt einige Methoden um die Conversion Rate deines Online-Shops nachhaltig zu steigern und gleichzeitig unnötige Kosten einzusparen. Jonathan Heinze, Conversion Optimization Manager bei Smarketer erzählt in dieser Folge, was die grundlegenden Prinzipien sind, um die Conversion Rate zu steigern, was es bei Google Ads zu beachten gibt, und ob man CRO und Google Ads kombinieren sollte. Außerdem teilt er seine Best Practices und seine liebsten Tools für CRO. Seine Empfehlungen:Website Clientboost.comConversion Snacks von ContentsquareBuch: Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping von Paco Underhill

Chapter 1 What's Why We Buy Book by Paco Underhill"Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" is a book written by Paco Underhill, an environmental psychologist and founder of Envirosell, a market research and consulting company. The book explores the psychology behind consumer behavior and provides insights into understanding the modern retail landscape. Underhill analyzes various aspects of the shopping experience, including store layout, signage, product placement, and customer interactions. He draws on his observations and research to explain why people buy certain products and how retailers can better cater to consumer needs and preferences. The book is a valuable resource for businesses and marketers looking to understand and improve their strategies for attracting customers and increasing sales.Chapter 2 Is Why We Buy Book A Good BookThe book "Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" by Paco Underhill is generally considered a good book, especially for those interested in consumer behavior and retail strategies. It provides valuable insights into the psychology and motivations behind consumer purchasing decisions, backed by real-world research and observations. Underhill's engaging writing style and use of anecdotes make the book both informative and entertaining. However, the level of interest may vary depending on the reader's personal preferences and the specific topics they are curious about.Chapter 3 Why We Buy Book by Paco Underhill Summary"Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" is a book written by Paco Underhill, a renowned retail anthropologist. In this book, Underhill explores the psychology behind consumer behavior and the factors that influence why people make certain purchasing decisions.The book begins by introducing the concept of "customer tracking," which involves observing and analyzing shoppers' movements and behaviors in a retail environment. Underhill explains how these observations can provide valuable insights into shoppers' preferences, needs, and motivations.Underhill then delves into various aspects of the shopping experience, such as the importance of store layout and design, the role of product placement and packaging, and the impact of signage and displays. He emphasizes that successful retailers are the ones who pay close attention to these details and understand how they can shape consumers' perceptions and buying habits.Moreover, Underhill explores the differences in shopping behavior between men and women, highlighting how gender can influence purchasing decisions. He also discusses the influence of cultural and generational factors and how retailers can adapt their strategies to cater to different customer segments.The author further examines the significance of customer service and how it can impact a shopper's overall experience and likelihood of making a purchase. He provides insights into what customers expect from retail staff and the role of personalization and rapport-building in customer relationships.Throughout the book, Underhill provides numerous real-life examples and case studies to support his theories and recommendations. He also offers practical advice and tips for retailers to enhance their businesses and improve the shopping experience for their customers.Overall, "Why We Buy" offers a comprehensive and insightful exploration of consumer behavior and the factors that shape shopping habits. It serves as a valuable resource for retailers and marketers seeking to better understand their customers and optimize their strategies for increased sales and customer satisfaction. Chapter 4 Why We Buy Book Author

Is your bookshelf begging for some enlightening CX literature? Ready for some compelling reads that will amp up your customer experience game? Listen in as we journey through the world of CX books that will satiate your curiosity and boost your knowledge of customer experience strategy, design, and measurement. From the classics like "Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" by Paco Underhill and "Chief Customer Officer 2.0" by Jeanne Bliss to newer gems like "A Diamond in the Rough" by Steven Van Belleghem, we've got a treasure trove of insights to excavate. But we aren't just listing books here. Jeannie Walters shares the invaluable nuggets of wisdom that she's gleaned from each book and how they can be applied to your organization. Whether you're a seasoned CX professional or just starting out on your CX journey, you're sure to find a book recommendation that will resonate with you. So tune in, and let's turn knowledge into power, inspiration, and intentional action that can catapult your customer experience strategy to unparalleled heights. Bottom line - It's time to elevate your CX game!Books Mentioned:"Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" by Paco Underhill"Chief Customer Officer 2.0" by Jeanne Bliss"Outside In" by Harley Manning and Kerry Bodine [Correction]"Delivering Happiness" by Tony Hsieh"A Diamond in the Rough" by Steven Van Belleghem"Empathy in Action" by Tony Bates and Dr Natalie Petouhoff"The Digital-First Customer Experience" by Joe Wheeler"Employalty" by Joe MullResources Mentioned:Experience Investigators Learning Center -- experienceinvestigators.comWant to ask a question? Visit askjeannie.vip to leave Jeannie a voicemail! (And don't forget to follow Jeannie on LinkedIn! www.linkedin.com/in/jeanniewalters/)

From the layout of the supermarket to the colors and packaging of products, companies are constantly shaping and adapting to a mix of human nature and changing consumer trends. In this episode, we apply this perspective to the workplace and explore what we can do to design work that people want.  Paco Underhill is a researcher, speaker, and expert on consumer trends, working with clients like Microsoft, McDonald's, Adidas, and Estee Lauder. He is the founder and former CEO of Envirosell, Inc. His New York Times bestseller, Why We Buy, has been translated into 27 languages and deemed a guide to consumer behavior for over two decades. In this episode, Dart and Paco discuss:- Paco's books, How We Eat and Why We Buy- Observational research behind retail and consumer behavior- The 6 things you must consider when discussing work or retail- How to attract the right customers and employees- The shopping models of the future- Creating smoother workdays and happier employees- How to collect the right data to improve a workplace- And other topics…Paco Underhill is the founder and former CEO of Envirosell, Inc., a market research and consulting company that helped invent the science of shopping. As a researcher, speaker, and expert on consumer trends, Paco has tailored retail environments to customers, working with clients like Microsoft, McDonald's, Adidas, and Estee Lauder.Paco has lived in a multitude of cities and worked in 50 countries as a speaker, presenter, and consultant. He is a regular contributor to The Wall Street Journal and The New York Times. His New York Times bestseller, Why We Buy, has been translated into 27 languages and deemed a guide to consumer behavior for over two decades. Resources Mentioned:How We Eat, by Paco Underhill: https://www.amazon.com/How-We-Eat-Brave-World/dp/1982127090 Why We Buy, by Paco Underhill: https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Buy-Science-Shopping-ebook/dp/B001QA4SY2“A Veteran Researcher Looks at the Subject of Shoes,” by Paco Underhill: https://www.therobinreport.com/a-veteran-researcher-looks-at-the-subject-of-shoes/The Experience Economy, by Joseph Pine: https://www.amazon.com/Experience-Economy-New-Preface-Authors/dp/1633697975Connect with Paco:www.pacounderhill.com

A big part of winning at retail is understanding what motivates consumers to buy.It's a topic that has gotten increasingly complex now that retail spans so many different channels.One man has made it his life's work to go deep and get inside the mind of the consumer.Meet Paco Underhill, founder and former CEO of Envirosell, a behavioural research and consulting firm that tests prototype stores, as well as monitoring consumer behaviour on websites and in brick and mortar stores.In this episode, Paco discusses:1. How fashion has evolved into what he refers to ‘uniforms' and ‘costumes'2. The new influences on women's choice of career wear.3. Shifts in how consumers shop - and some best practices in how retailers can respond.So let's sit down with Paco and try and make sense of today's fast changing retail market.USEFUL LINKS:Connect with Paco Underhill:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/pacounderhill/Envirosell's website:  https://envirosell.com/Visit A Seat at The Table's website at https://seat.fm

Paco Underhill, Author of Why We Buy will join us to discuss his new book, How We Eat. He will detail the total transformation underway that impacts how we produce, get, and consume our food. Paco also reveals where our eating and drinking lives are headed. He is also the Founder of the leading retail insights firm, Envirosell.

01:25 Kevin Roberts on Navigating Life with Purpose 04:48 Sherilyn Shackell on Finding the Right Company 06:50 Jim Stengal on the Strength of Confidence 08:35 Sarah Goforth on When to Pursue Entrepreneurship  10:01 Paco Underhill on Getting Out of your Comfort Zone 11:40 Simon Miles on Creating a Broad Skill Set 12:50 Jeff Swearingen on Creativity 14:10 Nick Fine on the Power of Psychology 15:39 Chad Fox on Staying Fresh 19:36 Rishad Tobaccowala on Continuous Learning

A oportunidade de morar na Austrália veio, e em apenas vinte dias Cynthia Corazza conseguiu o seu primeiro emprego no novo país. Após seis anos, ela cresceu sua carreira com a marca que trabalha até hoje como gerente de Visual Merchandising, a Carolina Lifestyle Label. No início de carreira, a Cynthia jurava que ia ser estilista. Começou a estudar moda desde a adolescência, mas foi no Visual Merchandising que ela se encontrou, tendo como escola grandes marcas varejistas como Zara, Grupo Valdac da Siberian e Hering. Se você quer saber mais sobre o trabalho de um Visual Merchandiser, varejo e vida em Sydney, Austrália, pegue sua mochila e vamos viajar pela trajetória da Cynthia! ANFITRIÃ | Mariana Lima @marianasdelima CONVIDADO | Cynthia Corazza @cycorazza

Subscribe to Charles' Alpha Investor newsletter today: https://pro.banyanhill.com/m/2054150 (https://pro.banyanhill.com/m/2054150) Coming soon to your kitchen table… Our food system is facing a complete overhaul, and all of us have been impacted in some way. Bestselling author and researcher Paco Underhill reveals the future of food in his latest book, How We Eat. And he's also the author of one of the most important books on retail, Why We Buy. Host Charles Mizrahi sits down with Underhill to talk about where food and retail are headed — and how companies strategically influence the customer experience. Topics Discussed: An Introduction to Paco Underhill (00:00:00) Stumbling Into It (00:02:16) Revolutionizing Retail (00:12:09) Staying Power (00:21:59) The Power of Bundling (00:31:17) Magic Pixie Dust (00:37:16) Guest Bio: Paco Underhill is a New York Times bestselling author and Strategic Advisor of Envirosell Global LLC. His clients include more than a third of the Fortune 100 list. And his breakthrough book, Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping is used in college courses, training programs, and research studies across the world. As a seasoned speaker and presenter, Underhill has traveled to over 50 countries to discuss his research with students and professionals across various industries. His latest book (below) details the transformation of our food system — from how things are grown to where we buy them.   Resources Mentioned: ·  https://www.amazon.com/How-We-Eat-Brave-World/dp/1982127090 (How We Eat: The Brave New World of Food and Drink) ·  https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Buy-Science-Shopping/dp/0684849143 (Why We Buy: The Science Of Shopping) Transcript: https://charlesmizrahi.com/podcast/2022/08/16/science-of-shopping-paco-underhill/ (https://charlesmizrahi.com/podcast/)  Don't Forget To... • Subscribe to my podcast! • Download this episode to save for later • Liked this episode? Leave a kind review!

Today we cover a new EV entrant with a very creative way to solve the financing problem. We also talk about the psychological impact of fresh cut flowers and why it matters for your showroom. Finally, we take a look at a few lessons to be learned from this day in history way back in 1930.New EV maker VinFast to begin selling vehicles with a separate battery leaseOffering 2 row VF 8, and 3 Row VF 9 with leases that separate the vehicle lease from the battery leasePrices start at $40,700 and $55,500 for the respective 8 and 9 models with the monthly battery ‘subscription' as an additional cost$35 for the VF 8 and $44 for the VF 9 for 310 miles Additional miles are .11 and .15 respectivelyUnlimited miles costs $110 and $160Take away: ‘conventional' thinking has officially been beaten and left for deadThe reason you see flowers at the front of the grocery store is very intentionalAccording to, Paco Underhill, the founder and CEO of behavioral research and consulting firm Envirosell, “It's very simple.  If you can get someone's nose and saliva glands working, they become a much less disciplined shopper.”Other subliminal messaging includes the ability to keep things freshAlso very high margin items…close to 50%Take Away: What can you do to set the tone for your showroom and service entranceToday in History, July 7th, 1930 construction on the Hoover Dam beganPlanning began almost 30 years earlier in 190221,000 men worked around the clock for five years and finished two years ahead of schedule and millions of dollars under budgetProvides power to over 1 million people and reliable water to many moreTake Away: Every horizon has a ‘now'Get the Daily Push Back email at https://www.asotu.com/Rock with us at ASOTU CON! Tickets: https://asotucon.comJOIN the conversation on LinkedIn at: https://www.linkedin.com/company/asotu/Read our most recent email at: https://www.asotu.com/media/push-back-emailShare your positive dealer stories: https://www.asotu.com/positivityASOTU Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/automotivestateoftheunion/

Paco is an “offshore American” who turned a coping mechanism that he employed to manage a handicap into a profession. In addition to his motivational speaking career, Paco observes and measures behavior to improve and redesign consumer space. Though he travels around the world to deliver his message, he is most proud of his commitment to spread kindness in his community without expecting reward.

Inspired by the methodology of urbanist William H. Whyte and having lived in a multitude of cities around the world as the son of a diplomat, retail space doctor, consumer behavior consultant and best-selling author of Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping, founded the first iteration office of his consultancy Envirosell in 1986. He became the chairman of the New Wilderness Foundation, an ethnopoetics and performing arts group, co-founded by poet Jerome Rothenberg and Morrow in 1974.

¿Por qué compra la gente? Esa es una pregunta que se han hecho los mercaderes desde los tiempos de Jesucristo. De hecho, es el título de un libro escrito por Paco Underhill, una de las mentes más brillantes del mercadeo moderno. Sin embargo, a juzgar por la tónica que impera en la mayoría de los medios modernos, parecería que la mayoría de los llamados “expertos” en mercadeo de hoy se les escapa la respuesta. Constantemente vemos mensajes basados en “yo”, “yo”, “yo”, “yo” y “yo”, cuando la realidad moderna les grita que debería ser “tu”, “tu”, “tu”, “tu” y “tu”. Esa desfase entre el mensaje y el interés del que lo recibe hace que se traduzca en ruido. Y ruido es lo menos que queremos en cualquier proceso de comunicación. ¿Te has puesto a analizar cómo construyes tus mensajes? ¿Están expresados en “yo” o en “tu”? ¿Estas seguro? ¿O segura? Hace más de 30 años atrás, cuando comenzaba mi carrera en comunicaciones, mi primera clienta me dijo algo en inglés que se ha quedado conmigo hasta hoy: “people do things for selfish reasons”. Y habrán muchos que te digan que eso ha sido así de un tiempo a esta parte. Quizás en el último lustro. Pero nada de eso. Esa ha sido la naturaleza del ser humano siempre. Lo que sucede es que antes la gente eran presa fácil para la publicidad desmedida. Habían muchas menos alternativas mediáticas. También había menos “clutter”. Y por ende, menos ruido. Así que el público tenía una especie de “oídos vírgines” que eran presa fácil para los publicistas. Pero el mundo ha cambiado. La explosión de los medios digitales ha hecho que público desarrolle cayos. Se han tornado cínicos. No le creen a nadie. Y sobre todas las cosas tienen el control de la transacción de ventas, y lo saben. La gente de hoy compra pero no le gusta que le vendan. Llegan a tu establecimiento sabiendo más del producto que tú. Y cuando detectan que quieres cambiar su parecer sencillamente dan la espalda y se marchan, tanto a nivel presencial como cibernético.   La interacción ha cambiado de “yo”, “yo”, “yo”, “yo” y “yo” a “tu”, “tu”, “tu”, “tu” y “tu”. Y aquellas empresas que no lo entiendan están condenadas al fracaso. Y de eso es que vamos a hablar hoy: de “por qué compra la gente”. ENLACES: • Entrevista con Robert Morales de “Traveling Robert” • Canal de YouTube de Rick Steve's • Libro para el Kindle de Amazon: “The Old San Juan Walking Tour” • Libro para el Kindle de Amazon: “La Guía Del Caminante Del Viejo San Juan” • LiLibro para el Kindle de Amazon: ro “ Puerto Rico Beach By Beach” • Visita la página de “Puerto Rico By GPS” OTROS EPISODIOS QUE TE PUEDEN INTERESAR: Nuestro Mundo Por Dentro Construcción De Casas y Edificios Sustentables e Inteligentes Cosecho De Agua De Lluvia Lo Que El Planeta Nos Está Diciendo Sobre El Calentamiento Mitos y Realidades Sobre La Energía Renovable ©2022, Orlando Mergal, MA _________________ El autor es Experto En Comunicación Corporativa (Lic. R-500), Autor de más de media docena de Publicaciones de Autoayuda y Productor de Contenido Digital Inf. 787-306-1590 • 787-750-0000 Divulgación de Relación Material: Algunos de los enlaces en esta entrada son “enlaces de afiliados”. Eso significa que si le das click al enlace, y compras algo, yo voy a recibir una comisión de afiliado. No obstante, tú vas a pagar exactamente lo mismo que pagarías al visitar al comerciante directamente y de manera independiente.  Además, yo sólo recomiendo productos o servicios que utilizo personalmente y que pienso que añadirán valor a mis oyentes. Al patrocinar los productos o servicios que mencionamos en Hablando De Tecnología contribuyes para que el programa continúe. Hago esta divulgación en cumplimiento con con el "16 CFR, Part 255" de la Comisión Federal De Comercio de los Estados Unidos "Guías Concernientes al uso de Endosos y Testimonios en la Publicidad".

Welcome to a special RCC STORE 22 bonus episode of The Voice of Retail podcast!  In these STORE bonus episodes, we'll be meeting the keynote speakers that will be joining us to share their insights and wisdom with the Canadian retail industry.    We talk about their background, business, and a preview of the knowledge they will be sharing at Canada's most significant in-person retail event of the year.  In this episode, the one and only Paco Underhill, breakthrough author of the classic Why We Shop, still essential reading for retailers today, and his latest book, How We Eat: The Brave New World Of Food And Drink.Thanks for tuning into this special episode of The Voice of Retail.  If you haven't already, be sure and click subscribe on your favourite podcast platform so new episodes will land automatically twice a week, and check out my other retail industry media properties; the Remarkable Retail podcast, the Conversations with CommerceNext podcast, and the Food Professor podcast.  Last but not least, if you are into BBQ, check out my all new YouTube barbecue show, Last Request Barbeque, with new episodes each and every week!I'm your host Michael LeBlanc, President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company & Maven Media, and if you're looking for more content, or want to chat  follow me on LinkedIn, or visit my website meleblanc.co!  Have a safe week everyone!About PacoPaco founded Envirosell Inc. in 1986 as a testing agency for prototype stores. A consulting firm that does research, Envirosell has worked in 50 countries and with more than one-third of the Fortune 100 list. While prototype testing of stores, restaurants and bank branches is still 30% of its business, Envirosell's largest clients in 2019 were technology companies trying to understand consumer behavior in store, in home, on the job, and on-line. Other clients included global Mall Developers, CPGs, healthcare groups, airports, professional sports clubs, theme parks, home builders, office designers, and on-line agencies. Paco has stepped back as CEO of Envirosell in August of 2020 and gave the company to his young employees. Paco is now the strategic advisor to Envirosell Global LLC.Paco is the author of popular books including Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping out in 28 languages and used in MBA programs, design schools and retailing training programs across the world. His books and articles are used in English as a Second Language (ESL) textbooks published by both Oxford University Press and National Geographic. His newest book How We Eat: The Brave New World of Food and Drink will be published by Simon & Schuster in January of 2022.As a speaker and presenter he has worked in 50 countries talking to merchants, marketers, bankers, technologists, hospital groups, government agencies, cultural institutions, non-profits, trade institutions, and most importantly students. As the son of a diplomat who grew up around the world – he has a global perspective and believes in Edutainment – laughter and education are intertwined.  About MichaelMichael is the Founder & President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc and a Senior Advisor to Retail Council of Canada as part of his advisory and consulting practice. He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience and has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career. He has delivered keynotes, hosted fire-side discussions with C-level executives and participated on thought leadership panels worldwide.  Michael was recently added to ReThink Retail's prestigious Top 100 Global Retail Influencers for a second year in  2022. Michael is also the producer and host of a network of leading podcasts, including Canada's top retail industry podcast, The Voice of Retail, plus the Remarkable Retail with author Steve Dennis, Global E-Commerce Tech Talks and The Food Professor with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois.  Most recently, Michael launched Conversations with CommerceNext, a podcast focussed on retail eCommerce, digital marketing and retail careers - all available on Apple, Spotify, Amazon Music and all major podcast platforms.   Michael is also the producer and host of the “Last Request Barbeque” channel on YouTube where he cooks meals to die for and influencer riches.  

In this episode of It's a Customer's World podcast, Andy Murray is joined by renowned author and shopper marketing thought leader, Paco Underhill. In Paco's newest book, How We Eat, he explores the transformation of where our food comes from and how we buy it. Paco answers 11 questions, one for each chapter of his book, from @WCB Students completing a senior level marketing course. Paco provides insight on a wide range of topics and leaves the students with advice to help guide their future careers.

In this episode, Wendy Liebmann talks with Paco Underhill, founder of Envirosell, author of Why We Buy, What Women Want, and his newly published How We Eat, about the changing world of food and drink, and the impact on grocery retail in this US. They discuss:The social, political, economic, and technological developments impacting food consumption and food retailThat increasingly knowledgeable and digitally engaged shoppers are on a mission to become happier and healthier, and are now demanding accountability from brands and retailersThat cutting edge grocery retail left the US 40 years ago, and that innovation is coming from Brazil, Mexico, China, and other areas around the worldHow technology is enabling retail to get smaller, more local, more diverseHow Aldi, Lidl and Trader Joe's have built extraordinary levels of shopper trust with their curated, easy to shop conceptsThe digital home and digital kitchen, and how they are transforming the way we buy and the future impact of the hybrid world between the physical and digital shopping 

If you were ever told to sit up straight and watch your posture, that was really good advice. Listen as I begin this episode discussing how your posture can actually change your thoughts and behavior for the better. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/thriving101/201101/how-succeed-having-good-posture 36% of all Americans, including 61% of young adults and 51% of mothers with young children say they feel “serious loneliness” according to at least one study. In fact, just about everyone has felt that sense of loneliness and despair at some point. Humans are not designed to be isolated. We are supposed to be connected with others. Isolation and loneliness are the cause of so many problems in society. Joining me to discuss why loneliness is so destructive and ways we can alleviate the pain it causes is psychiatrist Dr. Edward Hallowell author of the book Connect (https://amzn.to/3GxgwQw). If you have ever felt the pain of loneliness, you will want to hear what he has to say. Dr Hallowell also has a new, bestselling book out I promised him I would tell you about on the topic of ADHD called ADHD 2.0 (https://amzn.to/3AVKgVI) Grocery store shopping hasn't changed much since the first American supermarket was unveiled in 1931. Interestingly, the way people purchase groceries is starting to change faster in other countries than here in the U.S. Listen as I speak with Paco Underhill, one of the world's leading authorities on consumer trends and behavior as he discusses how we buy our food now, how it is starting to change and how other countries are way ahead of us when it comes to the way food is sold and purchased. Paco is a frequent contributor to The Wall Street Journal and The New York Times and authored several books including his latest, How We Eat (https://amzn.to/3GkmILz). What gift do you get for your Valentine? It can be tricky. Listen as I reveal the results of a survey that asked people what they would really like to receive for Valentine's Day. I'll also tell you who would prefer to get nothing at all. https://today.yougov.com/topics/consumer/articles-reports/2019/02/07/valentines-day-gift-ideas-wife-girlfriend-husband PLEASE SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! Get a $75 CREDIT at https://Indeed.com/Something Check out Squarespace.com for a free trial, and when you're ready to launch, go to https://squarespace.com/SOMETHING to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. Head to https://Go.Factor75.com/Something120 and use code Something120 to get $120 off!  M1 Finance is a sleek, fully integrated financial platform that lets you manage your cash flow with a few taps and it's free to start. Head to https://m1finance.com/something to get started!  Grab a Focus Freak Milkshake for 3.99 or less! And use offer code ENERGIZE to save $1 when you order on the Sheetz app!  To TurboTax Live Experts an interesting life can mean an even greater refund! Visit https://TurboTax.com to lear more. Find out how Justworks can help your business by going to https://Justworks.com To see the all new Lexus NX and to discover everything it was designed to do for you, visit https://Lexus.com/NX https://www.geico.com Bundle your policies and save! It's Geico easy! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Adam Barr adeptly voices most of Paco Underhill's informed and informative audiobook about shoppers' buying and eating habits. Host Jo Reed and AudioFile's Alan Minskoff discuss how Underhill's expertise as a food consultant gives this study an insider's view. Barr narrates with a conversational, intimate style that reflects the author's insights into how our behavior is manipulated. Listen to learn more about the business of selling food, changes that Underhill is seeing based on the pandemic's influence, and what he predicts the future of food shopping will look like. Read the full review of the audiobook on AudioFile's website. Published by Simon & Schuster Audio. Find more audiobook recommendations at audiofilemagazine.com Support for AudioFile's Behind the Mic comes from PENGUIN RANDOM HOUSE AUDIO, dedicated to producing top-quality fiction and nonfiction audiobooks written and read by the best in the business. Visit penguinrandomhouseaudio.com/audiofile now to start listening. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dustin is the owner and founder of Board Gaming with Education and BGE Tabletop. He has experience teaching English as a second language to a variety of age levels – from kindergarten to university. He also works in the field of education in various capacities. BGE started off as podcast in 2017 and has expanded into a platform for educators to learn how to incorporate games into their curriculum, with a brick and mortar storefront planned for 2022. Links https://www.boardgamingwitheducation.com/ (https://www.boardgamingwitheducation.com/) https://bgetabletop.com/ (https://bgetabletop.com/) https://amzn.to/3ntE7uq (Why We Buy by Paco Underhill) https://www.facebook.com/groups/openinggamestore (https://www.facebook.com/groups/openinggamestore) https://www.binderpos.com/ (BinderPOS) https://www.crystalcommerce.com/ (Crystal Commerce) https://www.shopify.com/ (Shopify) You can get your customized digital marketing plan right now by going to http://manaversesaga.com/mma (manaversesaga.com/mma) to book your free strategy session. Once that's booked we'll do a full assessment of your current digital presence. We'll do a deep dive into each of the six elements of digital marketing for your game store to identify what's working and what's missing. Then we put together a customized strategy for your business, and then when we're on the call we will work together to identify the unique aspects of your brand that set you apart from your competitors, as well as figure out who your ideal customer is and how to attract more of them. At the end of the call you will have a framework for building out a complete digital marketing strategy for your game store and can find out how we can get that all implemented for you over the next 90 days. Make 2022 your best year yet. Book your strategy session today by going to http://manaversesaga.com/mma (manaversesaga.com/mma)

On today's show: When it comes to how a supermarket is laid out, nothing is left to chance -- but that could change because of the pandemic -- we find out how from Paco Underhill. Plus, starting this weekend truck drivers won't be able to pass into Canada if they aren't vaccinated. Some say this could further complicate supply chain issues. We chat with Amrit Grewal with the Canadian Truckers Association. And, advocates for victims of crime in Alberta say more financial support is needed. We chat with the CEO for the Sexual Assault Centre of Edmonton Mary Jane James.

Paco Underhill, author, his latest book is How We Eat: The Brave New World of Food and Drink

https://www.alainguillot.com/paco-underhill/ Paco Underhill is an author and speaker. His latest book is How We Eat: The Brave New World of Food and Drink. Get the book here: https://amzn.to/3mxFZCe

Modern supermarkets bombard shoppers with colorful displays and marketing featuring terms like “healthy” and “all natural”… but what do those marketing titles really mean? Paco Underhill, founder of the behavioral research and consulting firm Envirosell Global LLC, and bestselling author of books like Why we Buy: The Science of Shopping joins us on the show. We chat about his new book, How We Eat: The Brave New World of Food and Beverages, and the evolution of the modern supermarket. #supermarket #groceries #FoodIndustry #HowWeEat #WhyWeBuy #ScienceOfShopping

Ready to go behind the scenes of Beyond Influential? As I get close to the 4-year anniversary of the show, I've received a lot of questions about my process, as well as podcasting in general (and it's been way too long since I've done an episode on!).   On this week's episode, we're turning the tables and Shannon O'Donovan from my team is interviewing me. I'm answering the questions we've collected from Instagram, emails, DMs, and Beyond Influential Backstagers, and I'm excited to share it all!   On Ep. 167, we chat about: Why I started Beyond Influential and how it has evolved over time How I pitch guests to be on the show My interview process: How I prepare for interviews, connect with my guests, and actually conduct the interview My favorite episodes, hardest interviews, and my dream guests The vision for Beyond Influential moving forward, and so much more! Timestamps: 2:30    Why did you start a podcast? 11:00   How did you name your podcast? 15:32    How do you keep improving your skills as an interviewer? 22:59    How has being a guest on other shows affected your approach as an interviewer? 32:52    How has Beyond Influential evolved over time? 43:23    How do you decide who to interview? 1:09:38   How do pitch someone to be on the podcast? 1:16:47   How do you prepare for interviews? 1:23:25   How do you build rapport with your guests? 1:28:11    What do you do during an interview? 1:33:30   Which episodes have been your favorites so far? 1:40:46   Who are your dream guests? 1:45:15    What have been the hardest interviews? 1:50:30   Have you released any episodes you weren't entirely happy with? 1:58:48   What's the vision for Beyond Influential moving forward? Want to get early access, ad-free Beyond Influential episodes, full transcripts, and other exclusive perks? Check out Beyond Influential Backstage! https://www.brittanykrystle.com/backstage   Don't want to miss an episode (or valuable free resources!)? Get on my list here: https://www.brittanykrystle.com/subscribe     Recommended Books on Interviewing: Howard Stern Comes Again: https://amzn.to/3iwSRXb Talk to Me: How to Ask Better Questions, Get Better Answers, and Interview Anyone Like a Pro,by Dean Nelson: https://amzn.to/3uGfnSm More Podcasting Resources: How to Start a Podcast: From Idea to Launch in 2021: https://www.brittanykrystle.com/how-to-start-a-podcast/ Podcast Equipment & Recommendations: https://amzn.to/2YlozzH   OTHER HELPFUL LINKS: Check out my Free masterclass on 3 Secrets to Building a Profitable Personal Brand! https://www.brittanykrystle.com/masterclass/     Beyond Influential Episodes to Check Out: #63 Lauryn Evarts Bosstick of The Skinny Confidential on Evolving from Blogger to Businesswoman & How to Build an Empire on Authentic Influence https://www.brittanykrystle.com/63-lauryn-evarts-bosstick-of-the-skinny-confidential-on-evolving-from-blogger-to-businesswoman-how-to-build-an-empire-on-authentic-influence/  #90 Dr. Joan Rosenberg on How to Build Lasting Confidence and Create a Life You Love https://www.brittanykrystle.com/dr-joan-rosenberg-on-how-to-build-lasting-confidence-and-create-a-life-you-love/ #104 Divya Gugnani of Wander Beauty On What it Takes to Grow a Global Brand & Build Businesses That Scale: https://www.brittanykrystle.com/divya-gugnani-of-wander-beauty-on-what-it-takes-to-grow-a-global-brand-build-businesses-that-scale/ #112 Lindsay Silberman on How to Be Taken Seriously by Brands & Make a Living as a Full-Time Influencer https://www.brittanykrystle.com/lindsay-silberman-on-how-to-be-taken-seriously-by-brands-make-a-living-as-a-full-time-influencer/ #144 Lindsay Silberman On Creating a Luxury Product-Based Ecommerce Business That Sells Out in Minutes https://www.brittanykrystle.com/lindsay-silberman-on-creating-a-luxury-product-based-ecommerce-business-that-sells-out-in-minutes/ #154 & #155 The Perfect Pitch: Hollywood Insider Tips on How to Network with the A-List & Land Your Dream Guests with Christopher McDonald Part 1 https://www.brittanykrystle.com/the-perfect-pitch-hollywood-insider-tips-on-how-to-network-with-the-a-list-land-your-dream-guests-with-christopher-mcdonald-part-1/ Part 2 https://www.brittanykrystle.com/the-perfect-pitch-hollywood-insider-tips-on-how-to-network-with-the-a-list-land-your-dream-guests-with-christopher-mcdonald-part-2/ #156 Paco Underhill on the Psychology of Shopping and How to Use it to Get More Sales https://www.brittanykrystle.com/paco-underhill-on-the-psychology-of-shopping-and-how-to-use-it-to-get-more-sales/ WANT MORE THAN ONE WAY TO SUPPORT THE PODCAST? Leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts goes a long way: https://apple.co/3rSk09A Take a screenshot while listening to the episode and share it in your Instagram Stories—and make sure to tag me @brittanykrystle! https://www.instagram.com/brittanykrystle/     To connect with me, Brittany Krystle: Website: https://www.brittanykrystle.com/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/brittanykrystle/ Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/brittanykrystle/   LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brittanykrystle/   Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/brittanykrystlexoxo/   Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.com/brittanykrystle/   YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1f0uI6wzWqp58n7fk-7-1g   Clubhouse: https://www.joinclubhouse.com/@brittanykrystle     *Full disclosure: Some of the links above are affiliate links. I will be compensated (at no extra cost to you) should you choose to purchase through them. Thank you in advance. (I appreciate you!)

Skip the Queue is brought to you by Rubber Cheese, a digital agency that builds remarkable systems and websites for attractions that helps them increase their visitor numbers. Your host is  Kelly Molson, MD of Rubber Cheese.Download our free ebook The Ultimate Guide to Doubling Your Visitor NumbersIf you like what you hear, you can subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, and all the usual channels by searching Skip the Queue or visit our website rubbercheese.com/podcastIf you've enjoyed this podcast, please leave us a five star review, it really helps others find us. And remember to follow us on Twitter for your chance to win the books that have been mentioned in this episode.Competition ends August  27th 2021. The winner will be contacted via Twitter. Show references:www.thenma.org.ukwww.twitter.com/mj_elliswww.linkedin.com/in/markjellishttps://thenma.org.uk/about-us/news/arboretum-app-launchhttps://thenma.org.uk/visit-us/what's-here/the-memorials/memorial-woodland  Mark Ellis is the Head of Visitor Experience at the National Memorial Arboretum, in Staffordshire, the UK's year-round centre of remembrance. He is responsible for the overall visitor experience, including commercial operations and overseeing the 150-acre site's diverse events programme; frequently over 250 Remembrance Events each year. In the five years since he joined the Arboretum team, he has helped deliver a wide range of new events, activities and commercial opportunities including an immersive World War 1 Trench installation, Summer Proms, an Illuminated Arboretum light trail, and a range of activities to help visitors learn more about the stories behind the memorials.In 2018, the Arboretum opened Aspects, a state-of-the-art events and conference facility. Mark was the client lead from initial concept through to completion and was proud to be part of the team that delivered the project on time and to budget. Aspects complements the award-winning Remembrance Centre at the entrance to the site and has provided a fitting venue for high-profile remembrance events as well as creating a new income stream through corporate hire.Mark has operated across the charity, public and private sectors in several senior roles, consistently demonstrating his ability to deliver great visitor experiences and commercial success in a way that supports the core objectives of an organisation.Outside of work Mark is an experienced Scout leader and enjoys the opportunities that this provides to take part in a range of outdoor activities and adventures. He has worked on international scout camps in the UK and overseas and believes that no food is finer than that cooked on a stick over the embers of a real fire. Transcription:Kelly Molson: Welcome to Skip the Queue, a podcast for people working in or working with visitor attractions. I'm your host, Kelly Molson. Each episode, I speak with industry experts from the attractions world. These chats are fun, informative, and, hopefully, always interesting.In todays episode I speak with Mark Ellis, Head of Visitor Experience at The National Memorial Arboretum.We discuss their brand new augmented reality experience, tips for other attractions thinking about investing in new technology, and the Memorial Woodland being created in partnership with The National Forest to commemorate all the lives lost during the pandemic.If you like what you hear, you can subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, and all the usual channels, by searching Skip the Queue. Kelly Molson: Good morning, Mark. It is absolutely lovely to speak to you for the first time today. I feel like we've chatted a lot on Twitter, but this is our first...Mark Ellis: I know, Kelly, it feels like your voice is very familiar, and likewise feels like we've chatted a lot. It's a delight to be here, thanks for asking.Kelly Molson: You are very welcome. Before we start, I would like to say a very public thank you to you, Mark, because I think that you are one of our most engaged listeners, and that really means a lot to us. I think every episode that we've put out you always go to a lot of effort to tweet about it and say what you liked about it. And, you tag people in on our Twitter account who you think that might be really interested in listening to it, and I'm really, really grateful to that. So, thank you.Mark Ellis: Thanks, Kelly. Maybe I'm just a frustrated marketeer at heart. Kelly Molson: Maybe. But, I'm going to take it that you're a Skip the Queue podcast supporter.Mark Ellis: I am. It's a fabulous podcast. It's helped and inspired us a lot because it's over the last 12 months. I only retweet and tag because it's so brilliant, so thank you.Kelly Molson: That is lovely to hear, thank you. But, that doesn't mean that you don't get away with answering some of my...Mark Ellis: [crosstalk 00:01:53].Kelly Molson: ... quite mean icebreaker questions, unfortunately. Let's go in. When you hit the dance floor, what is your signature move?Mark Ellis: I'm the worlds best dad dancer. I move my hips left and right, left foot forward, right foot forward, a bit of funny stuff going on with your arms. And then, if you get some electro-funk going on, the arms are pumping up in the air as well. Kelly Molson: Electro-funk, I'm going to remember that.Mark Ellis: Yeah, late night at a festival in a field with a few pints of cider, no one dances better.Kelly Molson: I feel like we're going to need a demo of this when we're all allowed to meet properly in real life. We need to see this, Mark. Mark Ellis: We'll do it. Kelly Molson: Okay, if you were in a zombie apocalypse, which...Kelly Molson:... Considering what's been thrown at us the last year and a half, that could happen, who would you want on your team?Mark Ellis: I'd have The Doctor. Obviously. No problem too bad, no villain he can't defeat with a bit of wit, and panache, and charm. He, or her, whichever incarnation of The Doctor it happens to be. I started with Tom Baker, love David Tennant, love Matt Smith, Jodie Whittaker's taken it to new and brilliant places. So, I'd have The Doctor, every time.Kelly Molson: It's a really good choice. Good. What is the strangest gift that you have ever received?Mark Ellis: Bootlaces. Kelly Molson: Someone bought you bootlaces?Mark Ellis: Yeah.Kelly Molson: Was that a birthday present?Mark Ellis: That was a Christmas present. That was the year when I bought my lovely, fantastic, gorgeous wife some diamond earrings, and she bought me some bootlaces. Kelly Molson: Wow.Mark Ellis: This was probably 15 or 20 years ago. She did tell me that she was busy making me something, I have no idea what, and I'm still waiting. So, the bootlaces are a classic.Kelly Molson: Okay. So, she bought you something to unwrap with the premise that there was something else coming.Mark Ellis: To be very fair, just before Christmas I broke a pair of bootlaces and my boots were held on with a knotted bit of string. So, it was practical and thoughtful, and considerate, and practical so it was a very good gift.Kelly Molson: This is what us women do, always thinking ahead, we knew that was going to happen. Mark, what is your unpopular opinion?Mark Ellis: Before that, Kelly, I've got an icebreaker for you, because I like to turn the tables. Your podcast is brilliant, and you have that uncanny knack of making it feel like it's just a chat between you, your guest, and a listener, and that pulls everybody in. So, if you could have coffee and a chat with one broadcaster, dead or alive, who would it be?Kelly Molson: Oh my gosh, I was not expecting to be tested this morning. Nobody's done this to me yet. Mark Ellis: I'm so sorry.Kelly Molson: Who would be the broadcaster I would sit down and speak to? There's quite a few that I can think of, but I'm going to go current, because I really love this person. I'm going to say Greg James, from the BBC Breakfast show. I know that I have stolen his unpopular opinion segment, which hopefully he won't find out about at any point. Or, maybe he will and he'll appreciate that I'm inspired by him. I just think he's great. I just think he's really fun. What he's done with that Breakfast show, he's completely transformed it. He's also a local lad. He's from Bishop's Stortford originally. I'm from Waltham Abbey, which is not too far, but we live in Saffron Walden now, and the office is in Sawbridgeworth. I feel like we would be friends because we're from the same kind of area, do you know what I mean?Mark Ellis: Excellent.Kelly Molson: We could sit down, have a pint, we should definitely be buddies, Greg, if you're listening.Mark Ellis: Brilliant, great choice. Well done, and sorry about that. I'll behave myself as a guest now.Kelly Molson: Too right as well, Mark. So you should. Mark Ellis: So, unpopular opinion. I thought long and hard about this, and didn't know whether to go with the incredibly trite, or something a bit more meaningful. And actually, somebody said something to me over the weekend that just sparked me going with this one. Which is, when people go with the customer service advice of, "Treat other people like you like to be treated yourself." Which, really winds me up. Because, do you know what? Why don't we treat other people like they want to be treated? So, if I treat everybody like I treat myself, then I'm going to disappoint an awful lot of people. My case in point would be, if I was running a restaurant, which I do as part of my job, I don't eat fish, I don't like fish, I've never liked fish. So, if I treat everyone like I want to treat myself, there'd be no fish on the menu, our incredibly popular Fish Friday would be a bit of a disappointment. So, don't treat people like you want to be treated yourself. Find out how they want to be treated and go with that.Kelly Molson: I love that. I've actually never thought of it that way, but you're absolutely right. Let's see what our listeners think. If you don't think that's an unpopular opinion, Tweet us.Mark Ellis: We'll have a Tweet war about it.Kelly Molson: Yeah, let's have a Tweet war about it. Thank you for sharing those, Mark, that's great.Mark Ellis: No problem. Kelly Molson: I'm going to ask a little bit about your background because it's quite interesting. You've been at Twycross Zoo, and English Heritage, and now you're at the National Memorial Arboretum. Can you tell us how you got to there, how you ended up there?Mark Ellis: There are two versions of this story. One, it was a bunch of random factors that ended up with where I am. Or, I can post-justify and describe a thought out plan all the way through. The truth is, when I was a little boy I wanted to drive one of those cranes with a ball and chain on that demolishes buildings. Never got that chance. So, ended up on a retail career path in high street retail, which was great. Worked for a company called Rohan for many years doing travel and outdoor clothing, absolutely loved it, really high service standards, really quality product, that was great, and really learnt some great customer service skills on that journey. Mark Ellis: Moved on from that. Tales of redundancy and all the rest of it that many people's careers involve. And, ended up moving to Twycross Zoo, as you say. Initially as Head of Retail, taking those [inaudible 00:08:07] high street retail experiences into the visitor attraction area. Twycross Zoo's not far from where I grew up, I've known it for many, many years. It's a place that's special in my heart. So, really, really enjoyed joining the team there. And, pretty quickly, realized that maybe the Guest Services Team could do with the benefit of some additional thinking. So, ended up running the Visitor Service department as well. That's really where I made the hop over from pure retail into visitor attractions. Had a great time there. Zoos are just fantastic places to work. You've got thousands of animals doing the hard job of keeping visitors happy, you're just making sure there's a great experience wrapped around that. Mark Ellis: Ended up moving on from there. Again, the financial crash of 2008, and restructuring, and all the rest of it. So, a bit of a hard hit on that one. And then, worked for PDSA, the pet vet charity, for a while. Which, really enabled me to put completer-finisher on my CV. Which, had been possibly missing up to that point. I'm sure some of my colleagues will smile at the thought that I needed to prove I was a completer-finisher, as I do tend to get slightly distracted by new and shiny things. Kelly Molson: Were you an ideas person?Mark Ellis: Yeah, very much so. A broad overview is the way I like to think of it. Managed a couple of projects for PDSA, and EPOS roll-outs, and reporting things. So, it's really detailed and good work with some brilliant people there.Mark Ellis: Then, got the chance... English Heritage had been through a period of not recruiting, they'd restructured what they were doing. And, I was in the first tranche of people they went out and recruited a new group in. Some really brilliant people at English Heritage, made some lifelong friends while I was working there. Met some of your previous guests, Paul Griffiths, for instance. We shared about three months together at English Heritage. I started just as he was going. And, really did enjoy that. Looked after an area from Peveril Castle, Castleton up in the Peak District, all the way across Norfolk, Suffolk, the East Midlands. So, a huge area, with everything from 5000-year-old flint mines, Grime's Graves in Thetford Forest, through to late-19th century windmills. So, really was the full breadth of English history. Thoroughly enjoyed that, and was settled to keep developing career there.Mark Ellis: And then, the opportunity at National Memorial Arboretum came up, they were looking for a Head of Commercial Operations at the time. I have to say, it took me about half a second to decide whether it was a jump I wanted to make. Again, Arboretum, 20 years anniversary this year of our official opening, so a relatively young site. And so, going from needle flint mines to an arboretum that's only 20 years old was quite a change. But, joined the team here, and working with, again, brilliant people, hopefully making a real impact on the way people remember and enjoy outdoor spaces, and think about the past.Kelly Molson: Great journey. I love that. I find it quite fascinating, listening to how people get to where they are, because it's always kind of a bit squiggly, and I quite like that. There's always a little bit of a twist and turn, it's never a straight line. Mark Ellis: I'm always slightly jealous, the people that say they thought about what they wanted to do when they were at school and they followed a progression and done it, in some ways, I think, "Well done you." But, I still don't know what I want to do when I grow up, other than drive that crane with a ball and chain on it. We'll see what the future brings.Kelly Molson: I wanted to be a dancer. Mark Ellis: Well, there you go.Kelly Molson: I wanted to be a dancer on the West End stage. When I was younger I was really into tap dancing, and modern, and acrobatics and stuff like that. And, I thought, "That's what I'll do. I'll be on the West End stage and I'll be a tap dancer." But then, you start to get a bit older and you're like, "I'm a bit of an average tap dancer, and I'm 5'2, it's probably never going to happen." Mark Ellis: When we get together to do this big group dance, you're really going to show me up with my dad dancing, aren't you?Kelly Molson: Oh gosh. Do you know what? The last time I put on a pair of tap shoes I was about 21. I decided to go back and do it as a fitness thing and it was really fun. I could make a lot of noise with the Blakey's on the bottoms of my shoes right now, but I don't know if I could pull off any tap moves. Let's see when it happens. Kelly Molson: If our listeners have never been to the NMA, tell us a little bit about what it is and what we can expect to find there?Mark Ellis: Yeah, absolutely. It's something that never comes over that well in the telling. It's a site that people have to come and really experience to appreciate. So, that's a very open invitation to all your listeners from around the globe to head over to Staffordshire and come and find us. Entry is free, so we're here ready to welcome you. What you'd find is 150 acres of relatively young woodland. 150 acres, to put it into context, if you're doing your Couch to 5K, then the 5K is about around the perimeter of the site. So, it's a nice, large site. Young Arboretum, an arboretum being a scientific collection of trees. So, we've got around 25,000 trees on-site, every indigenous species in the UK is here. And, we've got examples of trees from around the world as well.Mark Ellis: Dotted throughout the trees you'll find, it's now around 400 memorials to people that have served, and sacrificed, and have been lost on behalf of those of us that are still here. About 75% of the memorials are Armed Forces related, and around 25% are civilian organisations, that includes police, fire, ambulance. We've got things like the WI, Salvation Army, Scouting. So, we cover a very broad spectrum. The military ones cover specific campaigns, cover specific regiments and associations. And, we're also very proud to be the home of the Armed Forces Memorial, which is the national memorial to all of our Armed Forces who have served and sacrificed. And, that has carved onto the walls the names of the 16,000 members of Armed Forces that have lost their lives in active service or through acts of terrorism since the end of the Second World War. So, a very, very special place, and very poignant.Mark Ellis: It's easy for that to sound like it's a slightly sombre place, and certainly, it is a place where people do come and reflect and remember because the final part of remembrance is generally happy memories. We think about those that we've lost, and always brings a smile to the face to remember the good times. And, that's very much what the arboretum is. It's a living memorial. It's a growing memorial. It's ever-developing. It's ever-changing. And, when people leave the site, they often use words like uplifting, and life-affirming, and joyous. Mark Ellis: We have around 250 volunteers, and they really do bring the arboretum to life, all about storytelling. Without the stories, it's just memorials in woodland, and it's the stories behind those memorials that really do tug at the heart, and make people smile, and make people laugh, and make people cry, and other things that are so important. Our volunteers do a great job of telling those stories, and it's always done with a smile and a twinkle in the eye, and remembering some great times in amongst some amazing stories of heroism, and service, and sacrifice. Mark Ellis: So, it's a very special place. We try to operate in the best possible way. We've got a couple of award-winning buildings on-site, our Remembrance Center, our Visitor Center with a large restaurant, a shop, our dedicated classrooms is very special. We've got our Chapel of Peace and Reconciliation, which was the first building on-site where we're the only place in the country that holds the Act of Remembrance on a daily basis. The building I'm talking to you from at the moment is our Events and Conference building, which opened in Autumn 2018. Which, is a state of the art, bespoke conference and events facility as well. Where we can host events for those that are carrying out remembrance activities, but also opens up corporate hire activities, and those important come streams as well.Kelly Molson: I have to say, if we do a live Skip the Queue conference, that is where it will be held, Mark, isn't it? We've already had that mini discussion.Mark Ellis: Brilliant, absolutely, the offer's there. And, the coffee's great.Kelly Molson: I have to say, it comes across what you were talking about in terms of it being a place of remembrance, but also a place of celebration, that comes across really well on your website. I haven't actually had the opportunity to visit the centre yet. It is something that we've had this conversation about, about doing a little bit of a group visit, haven't we? With some of the other Skip the Queue podcast guests, which I'm sure we'll arrange for later on in the year. But, it really does come across. It's a beautiful, beautiful venue. And, it does come across as somewhere really, really special. And, I think that that's important to get that message across, that it is very much about remembrance, but also very much about celebration as well. For me, it doesn't have a sombre feel to it, the way that you present it and the way that you talk about it. And, I think that helps to draw more people to come to it, right?Mark Ellis: Yeah. I think you're absolutely right, Kelly, and thanks for the feedback from an expert on the website. In the words of our Founder, back in the mid-90s, we were always designed to be a place that commemorates lives lost and celebrates lives lived. It's getting that balance right. And, of course, a lot of that is very personal and depends on each individual on where they are in their particular journey. The feedback we get suggests that we generally get that balance pretty much right, and we're really pleased to be able to provide that for people.Kelly Molson: Let's go back to what you were talking about, about stories, because I think that ties in really well with something that I'd like to talk to you about today. You've recently launched a brand new app experience, and I love the name of this, very clever. It's called The ARboretum. Hello? Good use of pun there. It's an augmented reality experience, and it takes families on a journey to learn about everyday heroes. This sounds fabulous. Going back to our first season of the podcast, we had Alex Book on, from Arcade, who is an augmented reality, virtual reality specialist organisation. And, they talked a lot about how your guests... No, you don't call them guests, call them players, because you're getting them to interact with the building and the environment that they come to. It's such an interesting concept. I just love what you've done with this because it is a really fun interactive way of sharing those stories about the heroes that are part of that place that you're at. How did this come about? Where did the idea for this start?Mark Ellis: "Need is the mother of invention", is the phrase I'm just trying to get my head around. We've always done Easter activities on-site, put some budget aside and do something to attract people in. Those are often built around a trail. A lot of our memorials have animals on them, so we'll do an opportunity for children to go around, find the animals, put together an anagram, and come back and grab their little chocolate treat from the welcome desk, always very popular. What works really well with that, is getting families to interact with the memorials as part of the activity. And, that's very much what drives a lot of what we do, is trying to make sure there's authenticity in there, and it gives people an opportunity to learn more about the site.Mark Ellis: So, at the start of this year, of course, in January we'd just gone into that extra lockdown, and it was a pretty bleak time, wasn't it?Kelly Molson: Mm-hmm (affirmative).Mark Ellis: And, we were talking about what we were going to do at Easter, when we had no idea what sort of numbers we'd be able to attract on-site. But, we still wanted something that would enable people to engage. And, our Head of Participation and Learning, a chap called Chris Ansell, who is a genius, came up with a brilliant idea of actually taking that budget, and instead of spending it on a physical manifestation on-site, which perhaps we wouldn't be able to get people on-site to involve, said, "Let's go digital." And, went away and came up with the idea of augmented reality. I can't remember who first came up with the ARboretum idea.Kelly Molson: Very clever.Mark Ellis: As you say, it was an inspired piece of naming. And, it does very much the same thing. There are three characters in the app, Blu, Kit, and Sam. They are 13 to 15 probably, so they're pitched for slightly younger kids. It's that aspirational age of the 9, 10, 11-year-olds really want to be the 13, 14, 15-year-olds. We've given them a little bit of a backstory. So, Blu is probably connected to somebody that served in the Armed Forces, doesn't necessarily articulate that, but she's really interested in memorialization and the site from that aspect. We've got Kit, they are a very eco-centred person, they like to be out in the woods. They're probably more interested in the bugs, and the birds, and all the rest of it. And, you have to work quite hard to get their loyalty and their friendship. But, once you've got that they're going to be incredibly loyal and friendly towards you. And then, we've got Sam, and he's the get in there and do it, action-first, think later. He happens to have a prosthetic leg, but that doesn't stop him getting stuck in and doing things. Probably, if there's something going a bit wrong and a bit right, it's probably Sam that's in the middle of that.Mark Ellis: So, we created these characters. And then, we've created eight locations around the site where there's a visual thing that you scan with your phone. And, one, or two, or three of the characters pop up and they get you to do an activity. Some of those are centred around the woodland. There's one where there's wellbeing, it encourages you to do some forest bathing and listening to the sounds around you. There's some that's very much based on reflections at memorials. So, in our poppy glade, you're read out a poem about loss and memorialisation. And, you think about and talk to the rest of your group about what that means to you. And then, some are very physical. On The Beat, which is an area dedicated to the police. You do a beep test, so you do shuttle runs, you've got a minute, in times, and you can see how many shuttles runs you can do. There's hide and seek, there's some puzzle solving. So, there's a real mixture, something for everybody. And, of course, something that ties into the things that each of the three characters likes. You can take photos through the app, and then tag those and upload them onto social media as well. So, it really is a good way of getting people to move around the site, take them to some areas where perhaps people don't normally find things and interact. You can come back and do them again.Mark Ellis: And, the really good thing is, we launched this at Easter, so normally that budget that we spend on Easter Activities... We'll do peak activity of the Easter Weekend, and then a little bit more of the two weeks in school holidays. And, we have the added complication, we're right on the border of four counties here, and they all have different school holidays. So, the Easter holiday actually spans three weeks of time. I'm sure we're not the only people with that complication. With this, we took that money and we've run the app from Easter, and we'll finish it at the end of June, just after Armed Forces Day, which is a big weekend for us. So, it's covered a three month period. And, it's in the bag, we can always bring it back out and run it again in the future. And also, we have the three characters who, you never know, might feature in activities and on-site interpretation in the future. My aspiration is we'll have models of them that appear in the shop at some time.Kelly Molson: I love that. I love that there's that longevity to this thing that you've created. I had no idea about how difficult that would be to plan your activities around all those different Easter holidays as well. But also, it feels like it's something that could just run, and run, and run. You've put a window on it that it's going to end in... Did you say June it's going to come to an end?Mark Ellis: Yeah, end of June. Kelly Molson: But, that's something that, potentially, people would engage with all year round, depending on when they come to the site. It's lovely that you've been able to invest so well in something that you can bring back, and you can bring back year on year and maybe tweak and stuff.Mark Ellis: Yeah, absolutely. One of the really nice things as well, I think the characters are very authentic. As I said, they've all got that backstory, they've got very different personalities, I think they're all relatable in different ways. And, we actually got a young person to design them. We wrote a design brief, and a young person got hold of that and she produced some characters which we had a look at, and thought, "Do you know what? She's pretty much nailed that." So then, worked with the app developer and designers, and they came back to her on several occasions and used her designs going forward. That's a bit of a Skip the Queue exclusive.Kelly Molson: Ooh.Mark Ellis: I'm really proud because I know that young person particularly well. It was my daughter that actually did those initial designs. It's really great. And, something that really excites me, is each of the characters has some form of a particular characteristic within their story. And, it's such a non-issue for... My daughter's 13, 14 next week, and it's such a non-issue. You want people of a different ethnic background, or you want somebody that's got a disability, or you want someone that's non-binary, "Yeah, fine, this is what they're going to look like." And, that's the real hope for the future, isn't it? It is that, hopefully, as we pass onto future generations... And, part of what we do here is passing on the baton of remembrance to future generations, so we're very engaged with working with young people. Is hopefully, that acceptance of things that older generations have had to work hard to understand.Kelly Molson: Yeah, absolutely. I think what's really interesting is that you've actually engaged with someone of that age to say, "What would you want to see? How would you want these characters to be?" Because that's something that I think potentially a lot of organisations don't necessarily do. We're all guilty of it. We design a website and we're testing it, but we're not potentially the user who should be testing it. So, you need to think broadly about who your audience is and how you engage with them from the start of a project like this.Mark Ellis: Yeah, absolutely. I'm a proud dad, and it was purely chance. Working at home, I just said to her, "Look at this brief, what do you think?" But, it was the next stages that really were the eyeopener for me. When the initial designs came back we showed them to her, and it was just the little things. Particularly it was Blu, the girl character that was designed first, and Harriet, my daughter, was, "The eyes are just a little bit too big, and the lips are just a bit too full." And effectively, it wasn't childlike enough. It was a slightly more Disneyfied aspirational image that perhaps isn't healthiest for us to be pursuing. It was subtle. It was a great design, we just signed it off and it would have been fine. But, getting a younger person just to shape that final design, I think really has given it that added layer of authenticity, and we're very proud of what we've ended up with.Kelly Molson: You should be. I think it's fantastic. Mark Ellis: But, the real see was Chris' idea to come up with it in the first place, and to make the app work so well, and tie it into the authenticity of the memorial. That's what makes it a really special thing. Kelly Molson: Completely. I've got a list of questions here that I wanted to ask you, why an app? Why augmented reality? But, you've answered them so perfectly, in the sense that you had these challenges, and actually, this digital application that you've developed solved those challenges. It solved the issue of the various different Easter holidays that you've got. You've now got something that's got longevity to it. You've got something that people are really engaging with. Kelly Molson: To ask you about what the objectives were to start with, my assumption is that it was about engaging people with the different aspects of what the arboretum means to people, those stories behind it. And, like you say, getting them to explore areas that they might not necessarily always go to. If they're coming back time after time they might have their favourite places. What do you think that the impact or the results of that have been so far? Is it a bit too early to tell? Or can you see?Mark Ellis: We've had some really positive feedback. We've had some really good download numbers, so it's reached a large number of people. Not enough, because like everybody else, we've not got enough people on our sites at the moment, with static constraints in place. And it's strange, is judging things not necessarily on the straight metrics that you use in the old world, of actually, "What does good look like now?" We've had some really good feedback. We've seen people looking at some memorials in a bit more detail. We've had people. Dwell time is up on-site. People just saying, "It's been great, the kids have loved it. It's given us something to do." We don't charge for it, it's a free app and a free to enter the site. It's got that educational twist to it as well as being fun. I think it's ticked a lot of boxes. But, actually just seeing kids run up and down seeing how many shuttles runs they can do in a minute is great to see.Kelly Molson: I'm definitely going to test that out when I come. Because it might be a little bit later on in the year, can we just reactivate it for that day when we come because I want to do the shuttle runs?Mark Ellis: Yeah, of course, we can, for you, Kelly, absolutely. There is a rather sad picture kicking around somewhere that Chris took of me doing the shuttle runs in the rain when we were testing it. Dedication to the cause.Kelly Molson: I think we need to see that on Twitter. We need to see that on Twitter, Mark. Mark Ellis: I'll see if I can drag it out.Kelly Molson: If there's no photos then it didn't happen.Mark Ellis: Fair point. Kelly Molson: What tips could you offer, if there is any organisations that are thinking about investing in this technology, for whatever challenges they have that they want to overcome? What would be a few tips that you could give them about how you would approach that process?Mark Ellis: I think it's knowing what you want to get out of it first. We started with an idea that we could do, augmented reality, but then the next thing was sitting down and saying, "Who's it for? What are the characters? What are the backstories? What's authenticity? Which memorials?" So actually, we knew what we wanted to do with it before we went and engaged with something to deliver it. And, that meant that it was a very specific project scope when we went out to tender with it, we knew exactly what we wanted to get out of it. Which, probably stopped mission creep and somebody saying, "You could do this that and the other." And, it meant that when it came back the quality of the digital experience is really, really good, but we weren't chasing Pixar quality output from it. We knew it was delivering what we wanted. Mark Ellis: Probably not as expensive as perhaps people think. So, with that tight scope, it didn't cost much more than we'd normally spend on our Easter activities, with that added benefit of a bit of longevity in there. So yes, it does cost money, but it certainly wasn't a bank breaker. And, having a limited budget, when you go out to tender, gives people the opportunity to scope what they're going to give you against that. Mark Ellis: So, I think authentic, know what you want, and explore the financial possibilities. It might be more within reach than perhaps people think it is.Kelly Molson: That's really interesting. Mark Ellis: All this technology is becoming more accessible all the time, isn't it? So, there are opportunities out there. Kelly Molson: Yeah, it absolutely is. I think you're right, it's about scoping what you want and giving people the opportunity to say, "We can do this much of it for that budget", or, "We can do this much for that budget." It's kind of like a starting point, isn't it?Mark Ellis: Yeah.Kelly Molson: It's good that you said about don't be scared by new technology, because I think that there is still an element of overwhelm about. People don't understand how much digital costs, and there's still a lot of education that we could do around that, definitely from a web perspective. AR isn't anything that we do ourselves, but I think that it sounds quite frightening, doesn't it? It sounds like it's going to be a very big, expensive project. Where actually, what you've just described, seems quite manageable. Mark Ellis: This is where I shamelessly introduce other products into the conversation. It supports what we move onto, which we've just launched this week which will now run to the Autumn, which is our escape challenge. And again, this is Chris' idea, he really is a genius. Kelly Molson: You want to hold onto this Chris, he sounds great.Mark Ellis: Absolutely. He should come on and be a guest for you some time, Kelly. He's much better than me. But, Escape challenge. And again, this was necessity being the mother of invention, I said it right that time. Last year we wanted something to bring people onto site, experiences, escape rooms, massive growth. So, actually taking the escape room concept and delivering it as an outdoor environment. So again, a series of memorials that you walk around with your puzzle book, there are clues at memorials, there are clues in your puzzle book. This is a paid-for one, so we charge people to do this. Two levels, one pretty tricky, but a family will probably work their way through it. The other one, pretty challenging. It's probably people that enjoy the odd cryptic crossword clue and those types of things. Takes two to three hours, eight clues. This year's based around everyday heroes and people that have worked in the emergency service, so it's based around the work the police do. We're dedicating the new UK Police Memorial on-site this year, which is a spectacular memorial worth coming to see. So, it's based around that. There's a gang planning a bank heist, and you're going to try and head them off at the pass, and solve the clues, and solve the crime. Mark Ellis: So, again, a real opportunity to learn more about memorials. You're looking for some really fine details of the memorials there, and some of the symbolism, and some of the stories. Perhaps, again, you've walked past it a dozen times and never noticed that, so it just gets people to look. And, that covers the RNLI, the Police, Fire Service, the Ambulance Service. So, a lot of the civilian organisations come through on this year's escape challenge. Kelly Molson: I love that.Mark Ellis: Available live now. It will be here when you come up, Kelly. Kelly Molson: Oh good. I'll do the easy one, obviously. I won't be doing that difficult one. Mark Ellis: We put a package together for corporate groups that want to come and do team building events here. There's a corporate package built around that escape challenge as well, which is a great way to get execs to come and scratch their heads as well.Kelly Molson: That's a really lovely idea as well actually, because you've mentioned quite a few times that the arboretum is free to visit, and actually a lot of these things that you're offering, they're free to do as well. So, the challenge for you is you need to drive revenue. You can't be based solely on donations. Charitable donations, difficult at the best of times to get from people. So, I think it's lovely that you're now starting to look at this, what you can offer people, and bringing different groups of people in to build that revenue base. It's really great.Mark Ellis: Yeah. generally works very well. Summer Proms is a good one as well in August. Tickets go on sale this week, so look out for that.Kelly Molson: He's getting all the plugs in. There's something else that I want to talk to you about as well. Thank you for sharing all of that.Mark Ellis: You're welcome.Kelly Molson: I think that will be really useful for any organisation that is thinking about going through that process. Kelly Molson: You've just announced something which I think is super, super wonderful, and I'd love to hear a bit more about it. It's just been announced that in partnership with The National Forest, you're going to be creating a memorial woodland. Which, is a new woodland to commemorate all of the lives that have been lost during the pandemic. How amazing. Mark Ellis: It's a privilege to be involved in a project like this. The last 12 months or so, of course, have been tough on absolutely everybody, and it's a tragedy that's still unfolding. It is difficult. And, there is a time when people want to come together and remember and reflect. The memorial woodland is very much designed for everyone that's lost their lives as a result of COVID. That includes the people that have missed diagnosis, haven't had treatment, have had their mental health irreparably damaged by it. So, it's not just the people that tragically lost their lives because of Coronavirus. The number of civilians that lost their lives through Coronavirus is now twice the number of civilians that lost their lives in the UK in World War 2. It's massive.Mark Ellis: We're very fortunate. We're in The National Forest, which is across this part of the midlands, a project that's been running for 30 or so years to reforest this area. In this area, we had a lot of clay pits, mining, those kinds of things. They're all being turned into country parks now. It's a lovely part of the midlands. We've got a long-lasting relationship with The National Forest Company. They'd been asked about what they might want to do for memorialisation. And, right back at the very start of Coronavirus, people were contacting us and saying, "What can you do? What will you do? What can be done?" Mark Ellis: Fortunately, at around the time, Tarmac, who are our neighbours, they're quarrying the land around us. And, the land we're on used to be their quarry and we had it off them in the mid-1990s on a 999-year lease on a peppercorn rent. There are 25 acres that sit right next to our site that they finished working with, it's been inert for a decade or so, it's scrubland, and silk washing lakes. So, they've now very kindly gifted that over to us as well, likewise, on a 980-year lease on a peppercorn rent, which has been fabulous of them. So, that's given us 25 acres where we can create the memorial woodland. And, our aspiration is very much to make it a living memorial, something that becomes very special. Mark Ellis: There will be memorial woodlands all over the country, and absolutely there should be. And, what we want to do is to create something here that is memorable, is special, is living, is developing. There are so many stories that have come out of the last 12 months, the experience of all the key workers, the experience of the NHS people, the experience of those in care homes, the experience of children who've missed going round to friend's houses and play and have missed the rites of passage of end of year school plays. So, so many different stories, and try and bring those together in a living memorial. Somewhere too, I've said it before, I'll say it again, commemorate lives lost and celebrate lives lived. And, create something that really works in a very special way. Mark Ellis: We want it to include reflection areas, multi-faith or people of no faith can come and reflect as well. And actually, Westminster Abbey are supporting us as well. We will be holding service there in the Autumn to dedicate trees that represent all the different faiths from around the commonwealth. So, there will be a service there that will dedicate those, and those will be some of the very first trees that will be planted in the new woodland. So, it's a wonderful opportunity. We're working very hard to make sure that it's suitable and fitting for everybody.Kelly Molson: I think that you could not have picked a more perfect location for it as well. It's really interesting, the things that we've talked about today sum up exactly what the arboretum stands for. We've talked about these really fun engaging ways to look at the stories that you have there and celebrate the land and the people. And then, we have this wonderful memorial wood that's going to be developed to really commemorate everything that's happened in the past 15, 16 months. It's fabulous.Mark Ellis: Yeah, absolutely. That woodland will be very poignant and very special, but we also want it to be a place of joy and hope as well. And, hope, and looking forward, and rebirth, and regrowth. President Biden said in his inaugural speech about healing and remembrance going together, and that's what we want to do. I'm very hopeful that in the future will be a woodland where, as well as the opportunity to reflect and remember, there'll be the opportunity to enjoy and have fun, and play, and celebrate as well.Kelly Molson: Sounds perfect. When does the work start? What're the timeframes?Mark Ellis: The work started a wee while ago. Kelly Molson: It's in progress already, great.Mark Ellis: Absolutely. We signed the lease on the land within the last couple of weeks, so we're surveying the land at the moment, and seeing what's there and what we need to do. We're hoping to, with The National Forest Company, start a public engagement piece this Autumn to really get to understand what people want from it and what people's hopes and aspirations would be for space. And then, probably start the work at the backend of 2022, with a view to having visitor's feet on the ground sometime in 2023. So, in arboreal terms, quite a short timescale. Hopefully from this Autumn, we'll be able to talk about people. And, there is an area on our website dedicated to it, so if people want to know more or want the opportunity to get involved, pop to the National Memorial Arboretum website. There's a Contact Us form, specifically for the memorial woodland on there as well. We'll be absolutely delighted to have conversations with people. And, even just going out and public talking about it, that's already opened up some really great conversations with lots of different groups that perhaps we normally wouldn't get a chance to speak to. So, it's already beginning to develop its own opportunities and create interesting conversations for us.Kelly Molson: I love that. Mark, you've done my work for me, because what I was going to say is what we do is put all of the links to all of these things that we've talked about today into the show notes. So, we'll have links to that specific page where you can get involved and find out a little bit more about what's happening there.Mark Ellis: Fabulous. Kelly Molson: And, we'll put links to Mark himself, so you can find him on Twitter, and you find him on LinkedIn. And, everything, again, that we've talked about today, you'll be able to find in the show notes.Kelly Molson: Mark, we always end the podcast by asking our guest to share a book. It can be a book that's helped shape your career in some way, or a book that you just love. So, what have you got for us today?Mark Ellis: I know, Kelly, it upsets you when people go with more than one book, doesn't it? Because, it breaks your marketing budget. So, I've got 43 recommendations for you. The first 41 of which, are books that I love, it's the Terry Pratchett Discworld series. Kelly Molson: Okay, that's fine.Mark Ellis: Don't put those on your list, that really would break the bank. But, I love the Discworld books. I love the slanted way he looks at the world. There are not many management meetings where I probably don't quote Granny Weatherwax, or Sam Vimes, or somebody at some point, so love those. The other 42 and 43, one is Tom Peters, The Brand You 50, which is a small book that Tom Peters has done. It's been out for quite a while now, might have been the late 90s. But effectively, it's saying think about yourself as a brand. It's got 50 tips in there for how you build your own personal brand. And, I found that very useful, having switched jobs a few times, of actually saying, "These are my core values. This is what I hold dear to me. That's what you get from Mark Ellis." It helps when you're looking at new opportunities of saying, "Is the cultural fit going to be right? I know what I want out of a role." And, making sure the interview is a two-way process, and it's going to tick the boxes for me. So, that's one.Mark Ellis: The other one, which perhaps will be the one that you might want to put on your, "I want Mark's book". It's a book called Why We Buy, by Paco Underhill. Paco Underhill is an American. He's done a whole bunch of research on customer's behaviour, particularly in retail. I first came across this book in my retail years, but it absolutely carries through into visitor attractions. He talks an awful lot about signage placement and product placement. And, if a gondola in a shop is just six inches too far out, then when you bend over to pick things off the bottom people are going to brush past your backside as you're shopping. So, actually observing that and moving it six inches might increase sales of that gondola massively. He talks about signage and being shown a sign for an airport somewhere in a boardroom and saying, "That's no good", and taking it out and standing in the middle of busy concourse, and leaning it up against a wall and saying, "Now can we see if that sign works?" So, it's a great book for that. Mark Ellis: I have to say, the prose style irritates me greatly. So, Paco, if you're listening, sorry about that. It's done in a very narrative way, and it's probably slightly condescending in places, and it's a really quick read. I first read it probably 25 years ago, and I refer back to it on a pretty regular basis, in terms of those core messages. So, Why We Buy, by Paco Underhill would be my recommendation.Kelly Molson: Let's give that one away then, Mark, because that sounds really relevant. So, as ever, if you head over to our Twitter account and you retweet this episode announcement with the words, "I want Mark's book", then you'll be in with a chance of winning it. Good choice with the Discworld as well, I have to say, good choice. My great-auntie Doris, who my extremely naughty Dachshund is named after, she was a huge Terry Pratchett fan. I grew up with those books and reading them with her, and they bring back some really lovely, lovely memories when you talk about them. So, thank you for putting that in my head today. Mark Ellis: No worries.Kelly Molson: Also weirdly, my dad got... I don't know why I'm sharing this with you today, but my dad was mistaken for Terry Pratchett one night. We took him and my mum out for drinks, and the barmaid came over and said, "You're him, aren't you? You're Terry Pratchett." And, dad was like, "I think he's dead." Mark Ellis: That's awesomely cool though. Kelly Molson: "It's not me." He does look a little bit like him, I have to say. Mark Ellis: You see, that could be a plot from one of the stories, couldn't it?Kelly Molson: Could be, yeah. My dad reincarnated as Terry Pratchett, that's quite odd. It's because he's a hat wearer and he's got a beard. Mark Ellis: There you go, that's all it takes.Kelly Molson: Anyway, don't know why that came out, but thank you for putting that in my head as well. Mark, it's been so lovely to chat with you today, I've really enjoyed it. I think there are some wonderful things that are happening at your attraction, and I cannot wait to come and see it and meet you in real life. Mark Ellis: Thanks for having me, Kelly. As I've said before, you're welcome up here any time at all, look forward to seeing you.Kelly Molson: Thanks for listening to Skip the Queue. If you've enjoyed this podcast, please leave us a five-star review, it really helps others find us. And, remember to follow us on Twitter for your chance to win the books that have been mentioned. Skip the Queue is brought to you by Rubber Cheese, a digital agency that builds remarkable systems and websites for attractions, that helps them increase their visitor numbers. You can find show notes and transcriptions from this episode, and more, over on our website, rubbercheese.com/podcast.

In today's episode we are going straight to the source and exploring what makes the WPN program tick, how to achieve that coveted Premium status for your game store, and how to make the most it. Luke May is the Retail Experience Specialist for Wizards of the Coast in the UK and Nelson Brown is the Wizards Play Network Community Manager in Seattle, and they join me today to discuss the Premium program and what it takes for a game store to qualify as one of the best shops in the world. QuestionsWhat is the WPN origin story? Where did the idea for the Premium program come from? What sets Premium game stores apart? What makes achieving Premium status awesome? What are the main obstacles that store owners run into during the approval process and how can listeners avoid them? What is the WPN program trying to achieve? How can store owners make the most out of their Premium status? Where can store owners go to get more information? Links Mentioned During The InterviewRetail Improvement Grant 50% (only available while supplies last) https://amzn.to/3daa1XW (Why We Buy by Paco Underhill) (affiliate link) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Queen_of_Shops (Mary, Queen of Shops) https://www.retailexpo.com/ (UK Retail Expo) http://wpn.wizards.com (wpn.wizards.com) askwpn.wizards.com WPN Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1659498737640125/ (https://www.facebook.com/groups/1659498737640125/) How to apply for WPN Premium: https://wpn.wizards.com/en/article/how-apply-wpn-premium-during-pandemic (https://wpn.wizards.com/article/how-apply-wpn-premium-during-pandemic) WPN articles: https://wpn.wizards.com/grow-your-store (https://wpn.wizards.com/grow-your-store) publishergamenights.com

Have you ever read a book that's just stuck with you over the years?  I have, and this week's Beyond Influential guest is the author of one of those books! I first read Paco Underhill's Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping when I was in high school, and it was one of my first introductions to marketing and the psychology behind it. And to this day, it's still my go-to book recommendation whenever someone asks me for suggestions on how to learn about customer research. This book has been in continuous print for over twenty years, has been published in 28 languages, and still sells over 100,000 copies per year... and for a good reason. Paco Underhill created the field of retail anthropology and the science of shopping. He is the founder of Envirosell, a global retail consulting firm that has worked with the biggest companies you can name, including Microsoft, McDonald's, Adidas, and Estee Lauder, and across every kind of retail location you can think of—malls, department stores, supermarkets, airports, theme parks, and more—to study their customers' browsing and buying habits in order to learn the best way to lead them to make purchases.    He's also the author of Call of the Mall: The Geography of Shopping and What Women Want: The Science of Female Shopping, an international keynote speaker, and a regular contributor to The Wall Street Journal and The New York Times. I was really honored to be able to have this conversation with Paco because of the depth and breadth of his knowledge. His work has really been before its time and he continues to innovate and bring fresh ideas to the biggest businesses in the world. On Ep. 156, we cover: How Paco created the science of shopping and the study of the consumer His secret to growing his business and winning clients at the Fortune 50 level How the digital world is having an impact on how we shop and why small businesses are uniquely positioned to be successful Why the US is actually behind other countries when it comes to the retail experience How women are critical to the retail economy and why it's necessary for businesses to cater to them specifically The tipping point when businesses make a change that the rest of the industry follows, and more!     Check out Paco's books! Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping https://amzn.to/2T3ipBp Call of the Mall: The Geography of Shopping https://amzn.to/3z1HNbb What Women Want: The Science of Female Shopping https://amzn.to/3w1GjeZ   Don't want to miss an episode (or valuable free resources!)? Get on my list here: https://www.brittanykrystle.com/subscribe   Other Helpful Links: Check out my Free masterclass on 3 Secrets to Building a Profitable Personal Brand! https://www.brittanykrystle.com/masterclass   Want to Support the Podcast? Leaving a review on Apple Podcasts goes a long way: https://apple.co/3rSk09A Take a screenshot while listening to the episode and share it in your Instagram Stories—and make sure to tag me @brittanykrystle! https://www.instagram.com/brittanykrystle/   To connect with Paco: Website: https://pacounderhill.com/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/PacoUnderhill1 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/paco0181/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/paco.underhill LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pacounderhill   To connect with me, Brittany Krystle: Website: https://www.brittanykrystle.com/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/brittanykrystle/ Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/brittanykrystle/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brittanykrystle/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/brittanykrystlexoxo/ Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.com/brittanykrystle/ Clubhouse: https://www.joinclubhouse.com/@brittanykrystle   *Full disclosure: The links to Paco's books are affiliate links that take you to Amazon.com. I will be compensated (at no extra cost to you) should you choose to purchase one of them. Thank you in advance. (I appreciate you!)

Wendy Liebmann and Paco Underhill, founder of Envirosell, the behavioral research company, discuss how retail must respond faster to social change if it is to keep up with shoppers.  Wendy and Paco discuss:What shoppers expect now from retailers and brandsWhat made a good store a decade ago does not work todayHow supply chain innovation opens the doors for curation, personalization, and localization Why internet shopping needs to “be beaten up”How effective leadership is about being on the “selling floor”Examples of best – and worst -- retail experiences

As the conversation begins, Molly Rapert explains how and why she uses Paco's book in her classroom. She details just how many students his book has reached just with her class alone. Paco thanks her and explains the reach of the book worldwide and how he feels about that reach. Molly then introduces the topics the students will be asking questions about. Students begin asking questions and Paco answers them.  Key Takeaways: 0:00- Introduction 0:50- Andy intros and welcomes Molly Rapert and Paco Underhill to the podcast 2:09- Molly Rapert explains her ties to Paco Underhill's book and how it has impacted her and her students 3:16- Paco Underhill explains the reach of his book and explains how surreal it is. 4:38- Molly Rapert explains the categories the students will be asking questions about: Why We Buy, Paco Underhill's life and career, and retailing in 2021.  5:00- Student Reed Fraser asks about the decompression zone in the ecommerce industry 11:48- Student Weibin Lin asks what inspired his interest in environmental psychology 16:02- Student Katelyn Collison asks what is the most important piece of advice he has received  19:58- Student Evan Gonzalez asks what stage of his career does he consider to be the most transformative  25:16-Conversation about International studies  26:11- All students come on screen and close out talk with Paco 27:13-Outro of podcast  Links: Learn more about https://pacounderhill.com/ (Paco Underhill) and connect with him on https://www.linkedin.com/in/pacounderhill/ (LinkedIn) and https://twitter.com/PacoUnderhill1 (Twitter). Purchase Paco's Book https://www.walmart.com/ip/Why-We-Buy-The-Science-of-Shopping-Updated-and-Revised-for-the-Internet-the-Global-Consumer-and-Beyond-9781416595243/10373541 (Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping) Learn more about https://walton.uark.edu/insights/molly-rapert-profile.php (Professor Molly Rapert. ) Learn more about https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewlmurray/ (Andy Murray). Learn more about the “https://walton.uark.edu/customer-centric-leadership/podcast/podcast-home-test.php (It's a Customer's World)” podcast. Learn more about the https://www.uark.edu/ (University of Arkansas) and its https://walton.uark.edu/customer-centric-leadership/ (Customer Centered Leadership Initiative). Learn more about the University of Arkansas' business school, https://walton.uark.edu/ (Walton College).

The CPG Guys, Sri & PVSB, are joined in this episode by Paco Underhill, legendary author of the seminal book on shopping behavior, "Why We Buy" which has been in continuous print for 20+ years.Paco answers these questions posed to her:Your book “Why We Buy” was published over 2 decades ago yet remains, to this day, in publication in 28 languages to the tune of 100,000 copies per year? What, in your opinion, is the timeless constants of its content that keeps people wanting to buy it and learn from it?Is North America still the epicenter of retail innovation in this world? If not, where do you think this is really happening? How has consumer access to information changed the retail shopping experience?What has been the disruptive factor of private label products in North America that has consumers gravitating to Kirkland, Simple Truth, O Organics, President’s Choice and the like?If 80% of weekly purchases over age of 40 are the basically the same items, what is the impact on CPG companies & packaging?What is the impact of the smart home with a smart kitchen and voice OS on purchasing behavior and efficiency?How are technology and big data enabling better customization across the consumer journey?In your consulting practice Envirosell, You have spent an enormous amount of time observing consumer behavior to draw meaningful insights. Why, in this digital age, is this still an important skill?Please provide the CPG Guys feedback at http://ratethispodcast.com/cpgguysCPG Guys Website: http://CPGGuys.comInstagram: http://instagram.com/pvsbondTwitter: http://twitter.com/cpgguysLinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/company/cpgpodcastMedia Kit: http://tinyurl.com/cpgguysmedia DISCLAIMER: The content in this podcast episode is provided for general informational purposes only. By listening to our episode, you understand that no information contained in this episode should be construed as advice from CPGGUYS, LLC or the individual author, hosts, or guests, nor is it intended to be a substitute for research on any subject matter. Reference to any specific product or entity does not constitute an endorsement or recommendation by CPGGUYS, LLC. The views expressed by guests are their own and their appearance on the program does not imply an endorsement of them or any entity they represent. The views expressed by the CPGGUYS, LLC do not represent the views of their employers or the entity they represent.CPGGUYS LLC expressly disclaims any and all liability or responsibility for any direct, indirect, incidental, special, consequential or other damages arising out of any individual’s use of, reference to, or inability to use this podcast or the information we presented in this podcast. 

As the conversation gets underway, Andy and Paco consider what's going on in the physical retain space, and Paco explains consumption remaining a constant but taking on an altered face.He talks about the concept of composting, cash use and advanced technology in Europe, cooperation between public and private interests, and the need to both get local and get on the sales floor. In connection with questions provided by https://honorscollege.uark.edu/faculty/meet-the-faculty/molly-rapert.php (Professor Molly Rapert), Paco and Andy consider the importance of observational research, the need for actionable data and the combination of art and science, and the evolution of language and information. Listeners will hear Paco's thoughts on design, current customer experience objectives, personal inspiration, how students can become customer experience experts, and the need for empathy in the customer experience. Key Takeaways: 0:41 - Introducing Paco Underhill 2:34 - Paco describes what's going on in the physical retail space 4:42 - Paco's thoughts on cash use and speed of tech adoption 9:16 - The concept of cooperation between public and private interests 11:26 - How to get more local 13:21 - The importance of observational research 17:05 - We need data for actionability, and a combination of art and science 19:02 - Paco comments on topics of language 28:02 - Paco encourages and discusses design 32:07 - Efficiency out of space with better customer experience objectives. 39:21 - Paco's inspirations 43:28 - Answers and advice for students 45:27 - Empathy's role in the customer experience Links: Learn more about https://pacounderhill.com/ (Paco Underhill )and read his book, “https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Buy-Shopping-Updated-Internet/dp/1416595244 (How We Buy).” Learn more about https://envirosell.com/ (Envirosell). Learn more abouthttps://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewlmurray/ ( Andy Murray). Learn more about thehttps://walton.uark.edu/customer-centric-leadership/podcast/index.php ( “It's a Customer's World)” podcast. Learn more about thehttps://www.uark.edu/ ( University of Arkansas) and itshttps://walton.uark.edu/customer-centric-leadership/ ( Customer Centric Leadership Initiative). Learn more about the University of Arkansas's business school,https://walton.uark.edu/ ( Walton College).

Paco Underhill is an environmental psychologist, author, and the founder of a behavioral research and consulting company Envirosell. He’s the best-selling author of Why We Buy, Call of the Mall and What Women Want, and his reach has been massive: his books have been translated into over 26 languages. We wanted to have Paco on since it’s an incredibly disruptive time for retail, and I figured there aren’t many better people to predict where retail goes from here. On this episode we cover:How pessimistic should we be about the future of retail?What innovations will be the most impactful to the retail landscape?Will aging consumers ever cross over to online retail?As always, we welcome your feedback. Please make sure to subscribe, rate, and review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, and Google Play.

Ethnography: it's way, WAY more than just following someone around while they shop. Learn what it is, what to consider when performing an ethnography, and how to be sure your ethnography is inclusive! References mentioned: Paco Underhill, Why We Buy: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001QA4SY2/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1 Trendwatching: https://trendwatching.com/ --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/mrxplorer/message

Dr. Brian Bishop-Wilkey is currently a Shopper & Category Insights Manager at Abbott Nutrition. He earned a Ph.D. in Human Development and Family Sciences from the University of Texas at Austin, a master's degree in Social Psychology from Texas A&M University, and a bachelor's degree in Psychology from Miami University. In this episode, he shares the story of how he found the field of HDFS and his professional experiences to date. As is true for all interviewees on this podcast, Dr. Bishop-Wilkey's views are his own as a private citizen and do not reflect the views of his current, former, or future employers. Book Mentioned in this Episode: Why We Buy by Paco Underhill

In this episode, we talk with Paco Underhill, bestelling author of Why We Buy, about his experiences as CEO of a global qualitative research firm, Envirosell. During this episode we cover a number of topics relevant for marketers and market researchers:1. What we can learn about customer-centricity from a Texas furniture store 2. The power of qualitative research (like web-alongs) even in the era of digital marketing3. The future of food, a sneak peek of Paco's new book launching next year4. Paco's personal journey to overcome stuttering to become an international public speakerFor more details, feel free to visit the website for show notesDiggingforinsights.com/19

In this episode of RLI Talks, Jayne talks to Author, Retail Guru and Founder of Envirosell, Paco Underhill. Speaking from his New York office, Paco talks about the five issues that all businesses faced before the pandemic and how some of these have been accelerated as a result of COVID-19. He also discusses the book he's currently working on called The Future of Eating and Drinking. 

How might COVID-19 impact where, what and why we buy - even long after it’s gone? JP Kuehlwein, The Conference Board Marketing Institute leader, speaks with Paco Underhill, Founder & CEO at Envirosell, as well as a guru when it comes to the shopping environment and its impact on our behaviors, to discuss this question. Join this conversation as Paco explains some of the instincts we all have as shoppers to help us understand how retailing might change – or not – in the near future. How do people interact with the shopping environment and the product proposition? And what can we learn from that as we try to predict what will happen next?

Once you hear the title, Why We Buy, you may immediately think to yourself and ask, “well, why indeed do I buy things? Of course, it's just because I want to buy something.” In fact, there is much to learn about shopping. Researchers have studied the shopping habits and psychology of consumers for sometime, and have developed a science that analyses shopping. First, let us tell you something interesting. At America's retailer Wal-Mart, diapers and beer are sold together. Some of you might be wondering: “aren't all products in supermarkets neatly sorted? Why put diapers and beer together? This is a strange categorization.” Actually, however, this odd arrangement has led to a significant increase in the sale of both diapers and beer. Why? In the United States, some women usually take care of their children at home, and often call their husbands to buy diapers for the kids when coming home from work. And, often enough, men will buy a beer they like in the midst of buying diapers. Wal-Mart learned of this phenomenon, and so made adjustments to the layout of its goods and subsequently profited as a result of this. But how did supermarkets find business opportunities, like putting beer and diapers together, when looking at a vast amount of chaotic data? Paco Underhill, the author of Why We Buy gives us the answer. Starting from looking at real-life and common shopping experiences, Underhill acutely analyzed the science of shopping seen behind these cases. This book provides an in-depth analysis of consumers' shopping psychology and motivation. Furthermore, it studies the interaction between consumers and the sales environment, and describes how retailers and marketers use various strategies to keep customers and increase sales. This book acts like a Bible for retailers and is popular worldwide.

This episode is devoted to the future of retail shopping. Learn how reinvention could show up on this episode of Tell Me Something Good About Retail.  -----Key LinksPaco Underhill LinkedInEnvirosellField Agent: https://www.fieldagent.net/SalesRX-----How does your store’s traffic flow? Find new ways to manage it better Malls evolving to meet the futureReimagining the mall as an exercise in urban planning What will Holiday 2020 look like?Indulgent consumables may be the star-----More details at: https://www.retaildoc.com/podcast/412-paco-underhill-reinventing-the-retail-experience Signup for our weekly newsletter here https://www.retaildoc.com/newsletter-signup-old Tell Me Something Good About Retail is a product of The Retail Doctor and is produced by Simpler Media Productions.

Univ of Bath's Kit Yates explains why your life might depend on math during a pandemic. Yale's Emily Coats, a dancer, teams up with Sara Demers, a Yale physicist, to find a new perspective on fundamental forces like friction and torque. Paco Underhill reveals the intentional design behind almost every store that makes us want to buy,

BYU's Douglas Thomas teases out good marketing design from "dark patterns." Paco Underhill, Envirosell, explains how a store's design impacts shoppers' behavior. UW's Jevin West and Carl Bergstrom spot fake news. Barbara Durrant, San Diego Zoo, wants to bring back the functionally extinct northern white rhino. Byron Adams of BYU shares lessons from Antarctica's strange creatures. Elizabeth Hennessy on conservation vs evolution in the Galapagos Islands.

Lada Gorlenko, Director of UX Research at Smartsheet in Seattle, is the lead curator of this year’s Enterprise Experience conference (August 31-September 3, virtual, rosenfeldmedia.com/enterprise2020). Lada began her career in prison, spending lots of time with murderers and drug dealers! Not what you think, though: she was a psychologist researching the personality changes caused by long-term imprisonment. The experience led her to a better understanding of how universally transferable the principles of research and design are, whether in a prison or at an enterprise. In this episode of the Rosenfeld Review, Lada shares her career path and the story of how she ended up in UX, and the themes she’s developed for the upcoming Enterprise Experience conference. Lada recommends: "Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" by Paco Underhill, an urban anthropologist. https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Buy-Science-Shopping/dp/0739341928 See the themes, theme leaders, and program here: https://rosenfeldmedia.com/enterprise2020/enterprise-experience-program/ Register here: https://rosenfeldmedia.com/enterprise2020/register/

Paco Underhill explains how retail has changed along with society, and also how it hasn't changed at all. He is the author of bestselling books about the science of shopping, including Why We Buy and Call of the Mall. His company Envirosell uses the observational tools of anthropology to improve retail and other environments for its clients.  James Cook is the director of retail research in the Americas for JLL.   Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Android  Listen: WhereWeBuy.show  Alexa: Say "Enable the Where We Buy skill" Tweet: @JamesDCook Email: jamesd.cook@am.jll.com  Instagram: @jamcoo Leave a message on the Where We Buy hotline. We may use it on an upcoming show. Call (602) 633-4061  Read more retail research here:  http://www.us.jll.com/retail Theme music is Run in the Night by The Good Lawdz, under Creative Commons license.

This episode is devoted to the science behind consumers. Learn how to empower your consumers on this episode of Tell Me Something Good About Retail.  -----Key LinksPaco Underhill LinkedInEnvirosell Field Agent: https://www.fieldagent.net/-----Making Your Customers Feel Smart and EmpoweredHow has retail changed and how are you adapting? How Science Can Affect the Way People BuyA left- or right-hand dominant person can affect your sales.  Understand the Way People See ThingsHelping your target market. More details at: https://www.retaildoc.com/podcast/316paco-underhill-on-the-science-of-age-when-it-comes-to-retail Signup for our weekly newsletter here https://www.retaildoc.com/newsletter-signup-old Tell Me Something Good About Retail is a product of The Retail Doctor and is produced by Simpler Media Productions.

The Power of Habit เขียนโดย Charles Duhigg.The 80/20 Principle เขียนโดย Richard Koch .What I wish I knew when I was 20 เขียนโดย Tina Seelig :.Ingenius โดย Tina Seeling : .ความสำเร็จไม่มีข้อยกเว้น เขียนโดย ดร. สุรินทร์ พิศสุวรรณ : .Train your brain for success : โดย Roger Seip. The lean startup : โดน Eric Ries . The Pumpkin Plan โดย Mike Michalowicz .What get you here won’t get you there โดย Marshall Goldsmith .The long tail โดย Chris Anderson .Steal like an artist โดย Austin Kleon .Rework โดย Jason Fried & David Heinemeier .Winning at Innovation โดย Philip Kotler .What women want โดย Paco Underhill .Disrupt : Luke William .Brand Gap โดย Martin Neumeier .Buyology โดย Martin Lindstrom .The power of focus โดย Jack Canfield / Mark Hansen/ Les Hewitt.The art of war for Executives โดย Donald G Krause .Inferno โดย Dante Alichieri

Caren Williams and I met in 2012 at Interbrand San Francisco, where she was a Director of Strategy. Caren's since become an independent brand consultant, working with brands like Google, Sunrun, and Sandbox VR. One reason I wanted to talk to Caren is because of her diversity of experience, which includes an MBA from University of Texas, managing brands at consumer packaged goods (CPG) firms like Proctor & Gamble and Nestle, strategy and innovation consulting at a firm called Jump Associates, and, finally, brand consulting. This background gives Caren a unique perspective on brand strategy and brand experience. I asked Caren about the difference between building brands in the CPG space versus corporate and B2B brands. She says that while the fundamental approach is the same, the inputs and outputs are often slightly different. Consumer product brands can require deep consumer research and the resulting strategy can revolve around functional and emotional benefits and "reasons to believe." Corporate brands, on the other hand, may require more internal stakeholder research to get to the "spirit and ethos of the entire company," and some of the strategic positioning pillars might be "almost tagline-y." Next, we talked about brand experience. Caren and I talked through a model we both have experience with, which breaks brand experience into four dimensions: People includes corporate office employees who don't interact with the brand as well as customer-facing people, like retail store employees or drivers for Uber/Lyft. The People category also includes performance reviews, job descriptions, and on-boarding processes. Places (and spaces) means physical places, like stores, lobbies, and conference room names, but also digital spaces like websites, assuming they can be considered "a place you can go. ... [Visitors are] entering into your brand world." Products (and services) are simply "the things that you make and sell." For Google, products include the G Suite, which houses Gmail and Google Drive. Caren says, "If you're trying to bring your brand to life, it's not just how you bring it to life across your advertising and your communications and your messaging. The things that you make and sell need to represent that brand." Communications include anything written or spoken on behalf of the brand. Most marketing and advertising falls into this category, including email marketing, social posts, responses to emails/chats/phone calls, as well as keynote speeches from the CEO and blog posts. Then Caren shares some simple, straightforward tools and exercises (or "creative brain games") you can use with clients to tease out the best ideas for building a brand experience. She recommended an "old school" book called Why We Buy, by Paco Underhill that explains purchasing behavior such as "why we reach for things on the middle shelf versus the lower shelf." (To see another book she recommends, as well as recommendations from many past interviewees, check out the Useful List: Books recommended by branding experts.) To close out, Caren shared some great advice for people just getting into brand consulting. To learn more about Caren-her approach, the services she offers, and her client experience-check out her website at Caren-Williams.com.

Subscribe & Download Listen on Apple Podcasts Listen on Google Play Follow us onSoundCloud Listen on Spotify Guest: ​​​​​​​​​​​Verdick Case ​Company / Business name: ​​​​​​ ​​​Peony Lane Designs Stacy Verdick Case is owner of Peony Lane Designs where she sells vintage home decor online and also in a brick and mortar shop. She also takes viewers vintage hunting with her on her YouTube channel.Tools / Books / Resources mentioned:Tools: Mailchimp, Wordpress, CanvaBooks: Why We Buy by Paco Underhill; From Poop to Gold by Chris Jones; She Means Business by Carrie GreenShow Notes:2:05 minute mark:Agile entrepreneur takeaway: Build a business based on your interests and passionStacy explains about vintage home décor business and how she got started with the business which essentially grew from her personal interest in vintage furniture and her errands to thrift stores etc.5:58 minute mark:Agile entrepreneur takeaway: Be realistic about transition from salaried job to a business owner especially during the first yearStacy talks about her transition from an accountant to a business owner and how she has been learning from her husband's own business as well as reading books, listening to podcasts etc. She also talks about her difficult first year in business and how she was the most stressed and also most happy at the same time.9:53 minute mark:Agile entrepreneur takeaway: Know where your customers buy and emphasize those channelsStacy talks about how she got her paying customers on Etsy and using social media platforms like Pinterest, twitter, and Facebook. She also talks about how these platforms complemented her personality as she is a shy person and wasn't comfortable being in front of customers.12:07 minute mark:Agile entrepreneur takeaway: Identify your ideal customer base and keep learning more about their buying habitsStacy explains her ideal customers of millennials and also women between 35 and 45 years. She also talks about how she blends her own interests of colorful furniture in a vintage décor and how her clients have accepted her style.15:33 minute mark:Agile entrepreneur takeaway: Outsource where you can and keep the rest for better time managementStacy gives us more details about her first year where cash flow was a much bigger issue than time management. She also talks about how she involved her family in the business, so it didn't affect work-life issues as much. She also was able to outsource areas where she was not good at but kept areas like web design that she is interested in.18:42 minute mark:Agile entrepreneur takeaway: Identify some key ways to validate your business: peer or customer validationStacy brings up peer validation as an important motivator in addition to customer validation. She talks about the importance of peer validation in her business much more than market or customer validation to keep her going...

Dr. Catriona Morrison discusses how memory is much more imperfect than we think and how to improve our uses of it. Richard Alley teaches us about how our weather and climate predictions have improved in accuracy and what else to expect from advances in forecasting. Director Nell Shaw Cohen explains the process of creating landscape music and why this can make us better in tune with our environment. Paco Underhill talks about how retail spaces are designed to encourage consumers to shop more.

Dr. Catriona Morrison discusses how memory is much more imperfect than we think and how to improve our uses of it. Richard Alley teaches us about how our weather and climate predictions have improved in accuracy and what else to expect from advances in forecasting. Director Nell Shaw Cohen explains the process of creating landscape music and why this can make us better in tune with our environment. Paco Underhill talks about how retail spaces are designed to encourage consumers to shop more.

Paco Underhill talks about retail spaces and what retailers use to encourage buying. Anthony Lacey discusses his experience taking strangers to dinner. Mark O'Shea shares his love for snakes and herpetology. Kristin Congdon discusses the enduring legacy of Bob Ross.

What an incredible conversation with environmental psychologist, author and founder of Environsell - Paco Underhill. I first read his work - Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping - back in the day when I was a retailer, building and remodeling for national chains. Such an honor and so great to come full circle and have the opportunity to interview Paco Underhill. I'm ready, I'm inspired!

What an incredible conversation with environmental psychologist, author and founder of Environsell - Paco Underhill. I first read his work - Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping - back in the day when I was a retailer, building and remodeling for national chains. Such an honor and so great to come full circle and have the opportunity to interview Paco Underhill. I'm ready, I'm inspired!

Como buen comerciante, Daniel Cohen, Director de Miller Zell en Argentina, aprovechó su título de arquitecto para hacer de su profesión su templo.  Diseña locales de grandes cadenas como Walmart, Axion, Chevrolet y Samsonite entre otras.  Su experiencia entre Europa y Estados Unidos lo convirtió en un visionario de los negocios exitosos. Hacé clic para Tuitear: #Emprendedores: Daniel Cohen, de Miller Zell nos cuenta cuál es la regla #1 para diseñar un local comercial.   Lo más importante La gente tiene que entrar y quedarse para siempre. Como buen comerciante, Daniel Cohen, único socio de Miller Zell en Argentina, aprovechó su título de arquitecto para hacer de su profesión su templo.  Diseña locales de grandes cadenas como Walmart, Axion, Chevrolet y Samsonite entre otras.  Su experiencia entre Europa y Estados Unidos lo convirtió en un visionario de los negocios exitosos. “¡En la Argentina copiamos, lamentablemente, lo que hace el vecino”, se excusa. “Yo soy futurista, doy el golpe de rosca”. Seguridad implacable. ¿Quién sos y a qué se dedica tu empresa? Tenemos 3 productos: Diseño, implementación y el proyecto completo. Trabajamos con Adidas, Grido, Pago Fácil, Starbucks , Samsonite, Axion (con los que trabajamos hace 20 y pico de años). En Paraguay también tenemos clientes como en la mayor parte de Latinoamérica. “Pensar que tuvimos la posibilidad de hacer 125 locales de Chevrolet en un año. ¡Fue  llegar al tope de la montaña! ¿Crees que Argentina no tenía el concepto de una tienda, del servicio al cliente, de la experiencia? El comercio en el interior se mantiene como hace 20 años atrás, una tienda de zapatos tiene una vidriera con una cantidad de productos que no te dejan ver nada. No aprecias nada de todo lo que hay. Eso me hizo prender una lamparita donde me dije: “¡Esto no puede seguir así!”. Me fui a Estados Unidos y a Europa y puede observar el retail, y me propuse que llegara ese cambio a nivel de Latinoamérica. Los comerciantes se dieron cuenta que tenían negocios obsoletos y tenían que darle la vuelta de rosca. ¿Qué recomendaciones le darías a alguien que quiere abrir un local básico como se hace ahora con ese estilo de Nueva York  con las lamparitas leds colgando? ¿Qué tipo de sugerencias? Lo primero es que la ubicación sea buena. Segundo: Que no mire el local como el living de su casa.  Cuando uno cree esto,  pierde de mirar el concepto. Siempre hay que pensar en la persona que puede llegar a entrar en el negocio. ¡Esa es la clave! ¡Que al cliente le cambie la mirada al entrar! Que le dé una sensación que vaya más allá de un producto. Apple lo hizo a esto. En la Tienda Apple Nueva York podía observar 1000 personas adentro de unos 1000 metros cuadrados.  Uniqlo tiene muy bien layout. Hay que tomar una experiencia de compra. ¿Qué es lo que te apasiona de tu negocio? Hacer éxitos. Hicimos el diseño de una petrolera en Paraguay y fue un éxito total. Era una cadena paraguaya y el diseño que le hicimos es totalmente futurista. Todos quedaron felices de la vida y yo soy un referente para cada uno de los pueblos de ese país.  ¡Me llena de orgullo! ¿Cuál es mejor consejo de negocios que recibiste y de quién fue? En el año 2001, con toda la crisis de la Argentina,  el Sr. Sandy Miller, dueño de Miller Zell, iba a armar un negocio de Brasil y yo iba a ser el CEO de ese país. Y él me dijo: “Te tenés que quedar en Argentina porque están tus raíces y tenés toda la red de contactos que te va a llevar para arriba”. Y no se equivocó. ¿Leíste algún libro de tu rubro que te haya inspirado? Un montón. ¿Por qué compramos?  de  Paco Underhill; es un antropólogo basado en Manhattan, y empezó a estudiar a la venta. Se dedicó a estudiar cómo la gente compra. Dónde se ve el por qué y el cómo compramos. La verdad es que me cambió la mente.  Hay que ponerse los distintos sombreros para pensar que te ayuda muchísimo a cambiar de rol. Por un lado sos el operador del negocio, por otro… el vendedor. También podés ser el cliente, o el diseñador…. ¡y luego, el dueño! Uno ve el negocio de distintos enfoques. ¿Cuál es la mejor forma de contactarse con vos? www.millerzell.com.ar Acabamos de renovar la web hace un año y quedó muy buena. Estamos cambiando nuestra imagen. Hay que pensar el negocio siempre para afuera. Si te gustó el programa: Suscribite al Podcast en iTunes o Spotify para enterarte cuando publico nuevos episodios. Podés calificar el programa en iTunes escribiendo una breve reseña desde acá. Seguime en: Instagram Facebook Twitter Gracias por escuchar! Hasta la próxima semana! Moses Levy  

Celebrated Author, Paco Underhill joins us to share that when he was doing research for commercial zoning issues for cities on the roof of the SeaFirst Bank building in Seattle he had an epiphany. He would do for merchants of any kind what he was doing for cities- helping them understand what customers were doing in their respective establishments and sharing what the merchants could do to improve their customer's experience. He literally wrote the book on it- “Why We Buy,” which came from an article that Malcolm Gladwell wrote about Paco for the New Yorker. Paco discusses how he goes about helping merchants providing some insight on what drives customers and how that’s changed over the years. And finally, we discuss his passion which is helping with homelessness through Urban Pathways.

As the retail industry loses more jobs than during the depths of the Great Recession, Walmart is investing $2.7 billion in higher wages, education and training for employees. Doomsdayers are predicting the end of retail work as we know it. Does the world’s largest private employer see something that the rest of the industry is missing? In this episode, Chip and Caroline head down to Northwest Arkansas to speak with both Walmart executives and employees about what’s really going on in the retail industry. Judith McKenna, Walmart’s COO, explains why the nation’s largest employer is focused on training soft skills as the retail landscape becomes more technologically advanced. Paco Underhill, a retail analyst with more than 30 years of experience, also brings his perspective to the seemingly surprise move by Walmart. 

Liebe Hörer, es ist Sommer, es sind Ferien und manche liegen sicher am Strand und warten auf die Sonne, auf Wärme und richtiges Badewetter! Aber das ist in diesem Jahr so eine Sache mit dem Sommer… Wenn der Strandkorb mal wieder zur Dauerbehausung wird - mit Decke und langen Hosen - dann ist doch Zeit für ein hilfreiches Buch! Wir haben für euch ein paar ganz unterschiedliche Titel ausgesucht: Smart Selling B2B von Franziska Brandt-Biesler Call of the Mall von Paco Underhill (am besten über amazon.com, in Deutschland nicht erhältlich) Ganz unterschiedliche Bücher: Petras sind eher für den Verkäufer, der an Klein- und Mittelständler verkauft, leicht und auch unterhaltsam lesbar, sowohl für den Anfänger als auch für den Profi, der mal wieder eine Auffrischung sucht.
Immer mit dem DISG-Modell im Blick werden verschiedene Kundentypen in unterschiedlichen Situationen in unterschiedlichen Phasen behandelt. Äußerst praxisnah, „smart“ statt kompliziert. Von der Suche nach neuen Kunden über die Ansprache, Verhandlungen, After Sales, die eigene Einstellung - alles dabei. Daumen hoch! Tonys Buch Call of the Mall für den, der Malls bzw. Shopping-Center betreibt. Wie sollte die Anordnung von Läden, Stationen, und Wegen gestaltet sein? Wie gehen wir durch eine Mall? Was erleben wir dabei? Wann und wozu nutzen wir sie? Wenn Sie das Buch gelesen haben, werden Sie mit einem anderen Blick durch eine Mall gehen.  Der gleiche Autor hat auch Why we buy  bzw. dt. Warum kaufen wir? geschrieben. Dort geht es eher um die Psychologie dahinter, auch sehr spannend.  Why we buy  von Paco Underhill Warum kaufen wir? Die Psychologie des Konsums  von Paco Underhill Lasst Euch inspirieren….und wir sind ganz sicher, dass der Sommer noch eine Chance bekommt in Deutschland dieses Jahr! Hier die Links zu den Büchern auf amazon: https://www.amazon.de/Smart-Selling-B2B-2-Auflage/dp/3907100921/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1470400069&sr=8-1&keywords=smart+selling+b2b https://www.amazon.de/Call-Mall-Geography-Shopping-Author/dp/0743235924/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1470400111&sr=8-1&keywords=call+of+the+mall https://www.amazon.de/Why-We-Buy-Shopping--Updated-Internet/dp/1416595244/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1470400133&sr=8-1&keywords=why+we+buy https://www.amazon.de/Warum-kaufen-wir-Psychologie-Konsums/dp/3593391260/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1470400173&sr=1-1

REFLECTION QUOTES “The Christian is a person who makes it easy for others to believe in God.” ~Robert Murray M'Cheyne (1813-1843), Scottish minister “I don't respect people who don't proselytize. I don't respect that at all. If you believe that there's a heaven and hell and people could be going to hell or not getting eternal life or whatever, and you think that it's not really worth telling them this because it would make it socially awkward…. How much do you have to hate somebody to believe that everlasting life is possible and not tell them that?” ~Penn Jillette, famed atheist, illusionist and comedian “Our ‘ego' or self-conception could be pictured as a leaking balloon, forever requiring the helium of external love to remain inflated, and ever vulnerable to the smallest pinpricks of neglect. There is something at once sobering and absurd in the extent to which we are lifted by the attentions of others and such by their disregard.” ~Alain de Botton, Swiss-born philosopher and writer “‘Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom,' says Paul. And we are most in line with the Spirit, most faithfully obedient, when instead of trying to manipulate people into faith, we simply live in that freedom and let the Spirit do the work of transformation.” ~Mark Galli in Chaos and Grace “In an era of mass media, it is easy to believe that the more eyeballs, the more impact. But radio, television, and tracts accounted for a combined total of less than one-half of 1% of the Busters [becoming Christians.]” ~David Kinnaman, Unchristian: What a New Generation Really Thinks about Christianity…and Why It Matters “The gospel of submission, commitment, decision, and victorious living is not good news about what God has achieved but a demand to save ourselves with God's help.” ~Michael S. Horton, contemporary theologian “The Apple store is not a store. It is an exercise in evangelism.” ~Paco Underhill, environmental psychologist and marketing consultant SERMON PASSAGE selections from 1 Peter 2 & 3 (NASB) 1 Peter 2 4 And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5 you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 9…you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God's own possession, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; 10 for you once were not a people, but now you are the people of God; you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy. 11 Beloved, I urge you as aliens and strangers to abstain from fleshly lusts which wage war against the soul. 12 Keep your behavior excellent among the Gentiles, so that in the thing in which they slander you as evildoers, they may because of your good deeds, as they observe them, glorify God in the day of visitation. 15 For such is the will of God that by doing right you may silence the ignorance of foolish men. 16 Act as free men, and do not use your freedom as a covering for evil, but use it as bondslaves of God. 1 Peter 3 8 To sum up, all of you be harmonious, sympathetic, brotherly, kindhearted, and humble in spirit; 9 not returning evil for evil or insult for insult, but giving a blessing instead; for you were called for the very purpose that you might inherit a blessing. 10 For, “The one who desires life, to love and see good days, Must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from speaking deceit. 11 “He must turn away from evil and do good; He must seek peace and pursue it. 12 “For the eyes of the Lord are toward the righteous, And His ears attend to their prayer, But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil.” 13 Who is there to harm you if you prove zealous for what is good? 14 But even if you should suffer for the sake of righteousness, you are blessed. And do not fear their intimidation, and do not be troubled, 15 but sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence; 16 and keep a good conscience so that in the thing in which you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ will be put to shame.

Epigraph For our inaugural episode, we took the #SEABookstoreDay Challenge on Independent Bookstore Day and visited 17 bookstores in/around Seattle, WA. So, without further ado, we are pleased to present you with Drunk Booksellers Episode 1: #SEABookstoreDay!   Bitches in Bookshops Our brilliant theme music, Bitches in Bookshops, comes to us with permission from Annabelle Quezada. The video is pure genius. B*tches in Bookshops (a Jay Z-Kanye West parody) from Annabelle Quezada on Vimeo. Performed by La Shea Delaney (@lashea_delaney) & Annabelle Quezada (@annabelleqv).  Director / Producer / Songwriter - Annabelle Quezada Director of Photography / Editor - Eliav Mintz Song Recorded / Mixed by - Stephen Galgano Introduction In Which Emma and Kim Explain What the Hell This Podcast Is, What They Are Currently Reading, And Make a Rather Tasty Beverage Out of Items Scavenged From Kim’s Nearly-Empty Fridge [3:15] Dare Me by Megan Abbott Also mentioned: The Fever by Megan Abbott [3:53] The Gospel of Loki by Joanne M. Harris Also mentioned: Chocolat by Joanne M. Harris, Zombies, Run, The Avengers [5:08] Sisters of the Revolution: A Feminist Speculative Fiction Anthology edited by Ann and Jeff VanderMeer [6:10] Land of Love and Drowning by Tiphanie Yanique [7:04] Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping by Paco Underhill [7:24] Shiver by Maggie Stiefvater Chapter I In Which Our Heroes Begin Their Epic Quest for #SEABookstoreDay, Traversing Land and Water to Visit the First Five Stores [11:40] Liberty Bay Books, Poulsbo Suzanne Droppert recommends Station Eleven by Emily St John Mandel [13:15] Eagle Harbor Book Company, Bainbridge Island René Kirkpatrick recommends The Martian by Andy Weir [14:55] Seattle Mystery Bookshop, Pioneer Square Fran Fuller recommends The Coldest Girl in Coldtown by Holly Black Also mentioned: The Darkest Part of the Forest by Holly Black, The Chronology of Water by Lidia Yuknavitch [16:50] Fantagraphics Bookstore & Gallery, Georgetown Larry Reed recommends Black River by Josh Simmons [19:03] Queen Anne Book Company, Queen Anne Wendy Wieking recommends Bettyville: A Memoir by George Hodgman Chapter II In Which Our Heroes Continue to Circumnavigate Seattle, Discover Booze in a Globe, and Meet #TeamSasquatch [21:18] Island Books, Mercer Island Roger Page recommends Grandma Gatewood's Walk: The Inspiring Story of the Woman Who Saved the Appalachian Trail by Ben Montgomery [23:53] Parkplace Books, Kirkland Rebecca Willow recommends Snow Hunters by Paul Yoon [25:28] Bonus Sasquatch Sighting! Haley Stocking, Publicist at Sasquatch Books, recommends Little Kunoichi, The Ninja Girl by Sanae Ishida Also mentioned: Book Lust by Nancy Pearl, Larry Gets Lost, Elliott the Otter: The Totally Untrue Story of Elliott, Boss of the Bay by John Skewes Check out #TeamSasquatch’s Independent Bookstore Day Storify, tracking their shenanigans throughout the day. HOW DID WE MISS THE MIMOSAS AT LIBERTY BAY? [26:53] Third Place Books, Lake Forest Park Robert Sindelar recommends Barefoot Dogs by Antonio Ruiz-Camacho [28:44] Edmonds Bookshop, Edmonds Mary Kay Sneeringer recommends The Painter by Peter Heller Also mentioned: Seattle Reads Also mentioned: My Body is a Book of Rules by Elissa Washuta [31:14] Book Larder, Fremont Lara Hamilton recommends A Modern Way to Eat by Anna Jones Also mentioned: Short Stack Editions [32:40] Open Books: A Poem Emporium, Wallingford John W. Marshall recommends Sorrow Arrow by Emily Kendal Frey Chapter III In Which Our Exhausted Heroes Make Brick Music, Drink a Well-Deserved Beer, and Are Crowned Indie Bookstore Champs [36:26] University Bookstore, U District Brad Craft recommends How I Shed My Skin: Unlearning the Racist Lessons of a Southern Childhood by Jim Grimsley Also mentioned: Serial Doodler by Brad Craft [37:22] Mockingbird Books, Greenlake Jesse Miller recommends El Deafo by Cece Bell Also mentioned: The Glass Sentence by S. E. Grove, Roller Girl by Victoria Jamieson [39:26] The Secret Garden Bookshop, Ballard Kelsey recommends The Gigantic Beard That Was Evil by Stephen Collins Also mentioned: Ms. Marvel Vol 2: Generation Why by G Willow Wilson [42:30] Phinney Books, Phinney Ridge Tom Nissley recommends Fierce Attachments by Vivian Gornick Also mentioned: The Odd Woman and the City by Vivian Gornick, Phinney by Post [45:30] Third Place Books, Ravenna Alex recommends Butterflies in November by Auour Ava Olafsdottir Also mentioned: Cloud Atlas by David Mitchell [48:32] The Elliott Bay Book Company, Capitol Hill Kenny Coble recommends Never Let Me Go by Kazuo Ishiguro Also mentioned: My Ideal Bookshelf by Jane Mount Epilogue In Which the Drunk Booksellers Go Out Dancing, Visit More Bookstores, Befriend Cats, And Realize They Forgot About Kenny Bonus bookstores! Phoenix Comics & Games, Twice Sold Tales Also mentioned: Palimpsest by Catherynne Valente Endnotes Corrections & Clarifications - Small Beer Press is Kelly Link’s press, not her publisher (though Small Beer Press was the original publisher of Stranger Things Happen and Magic for Beginners, which means Emma now has a new quest to find a Small Beer Press edition of Magic for Beginners). - Maggie Stiefvater’s last name is pronounced Steve-Otter. Proof: - We mentioned a Tomb Raider display on multiple occasions. The display is actually for the TombQuest series by Michael Northrop, rather than the Tomb Raider video game & movie franchise. Here’s a picture from The Secret Garden Bookshop: As opposed to:

We talk with Paco Underhill who is the world’s foremost shopping anthropologist. We delve into the questions of what women secretly want from their jewelry buying experience? How has the Great Recession changed jewelry-buying habits forever? What does the future hold for Main Street jewelers?

I asked John Berenyi of Bergent Research (www.bergent.com.au) why usability people are sometimes disparaging of market researchers. John has some interesting thoughts about about good - and bad - market research. The book John mentions is Vance Packard's "The Hidden Persuaders". (www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0671531492/informdesign). John is correct in his statement that Vance Packard died (in 1996). There's a reference to Paco Underhill in the podcast. His book "Why We Buy: The Science of Shopping" (www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0684849143/informdesign) is an interesting read.(References to books on this webiste are links to Amazon.com - we earn a small commission on any purchases you make on following such links).

*Anna Barber* ( https://www.techstars.com/mentors/anna-barber/ ) *is the Managing Director of* *Techstars* ( https://www.techstars.com/ ) *- Los Angeles. Techstars is a global seed accelerator and worldwide network that helps entrepreneurs succeed and is currently in over 150 countries worldwide. Some of their alumni include Classpass, Pillpack, and Contently. Previously, Anna has experience as a corporate lawyer, McKinsey consultant, product executive and entrepreneur in ed tech, retail and e-commerce.* *For all founders in the Los Angeles area, applications to be part of Techstars LA Accelerator 2020 cohort are open! You have until April 5th 2020 to apply.* *Click Here To Apply* ( https://www.techstars.com/los-angeles-program/ ) *Three books that inspired Anna personally and professionally are* *Dare to Lead* ( https://amzn.to/2uH2RXD ) *by Brene Brown,* *Reboot: Leadership and the Art of Growing Up* ( https://amzn.to/2Tk261c ) *by Jerry Colonna and* *Why We Buy* ( https://amzn.to/36P0m3M ) *by Paco Underhill.* *On this episode you will learn -* * *Why Anna became an investor in Tech? What is the criteria for startups looking to apply to Techstars accelerator? The three different phases in the Techstars 12 week program.* * ** * *What are some qualities she looks for in founders and founding teams? Why engagement metrics are so important. Why in the early stages, CAC/LTV is not an important metric.* * ** * *“The Pied Piper Effect”. If you have a better name, she's all ears. Why is investing in consumer so challenging? What are some of the consumer trends that she's most excited about? Why consumer is not formulaic.* * ** * *Why it is such an exciting time to be in the Los Angeles tech ecosystem? What are some of the reasons why a Techstars alumnus startup might fail to raise the next round? What's one thing she would change about venture capital? Tips how to reach out to venture capitalists* * ** *You can follow Anna on Twitter @annawbarber. You are also welcome to follow along behind the scenes @mikegelb and @consumervc*