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Latest podcast episodes about 21so

Mt. Horeb Baptist Church Sermon Podcast

Subject: Excuses Speaker or Performer: Pastor Grover Cleveland Scripture Passage(s): Luke 14:15-24 Date of Delivery: May 18, 2025 ExcusesLuke 14:15-24 NKJV15Now when one of those who sat at the table with Him heard these things, he said to Him,“Blessedishe who shall eat[a]bread in the kingdom of God!”16Then He said to him,“A certain man gave a great supper and invited many,17andsent his servant at supper time to say to those who were invited, ‘Come, for all things are now ready.’18But they all with oneaccordbegan to make excuses. The first said to him, ‘I have bought a piece of ground, and I must go and see it. I ask you to have me excused.’19And another said, ‘I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I am going to test them. I ask you to have me excused.’20Still another said, ‘I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.’21So that servant came and reported these things to his master. Then the master of the house, being angry, said to his servant, ‘Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in herethepoor andthe[b]maimed andthelame andtheblind.’22And the servant said, ‘Master, it is done as you commanded, and still there is room.’23Then the master said to the servant, ‘Go out into the highways and hedges, and compelthemto come in, that my house may be filled.24For I say to youthat none of those men who were invited shall taste my supper.’ ”

Sweet On Leadership
Focus to Focus on Focus

Sweet On Leadership

Play Episode Listen Later May 14, 2025 25:58


In this powerful episode, Tim Sweet unpacks the critical role of focus in leadership, especially when navigating the noise of political and economic uncertainty. With heartfelt clarity, Tim explores how today's leaders can rise above the chaos by gaining altitude and stepping back to assess what truly matters. He invites us to let go of the busywork, choose the essential few priorities, and give ourselves permission to slow down and realign.Drawing from his own experiences, including a delay in releasing this very episode due to a client crisis, Tim reinforces the idea that integrity in leadership starts with reclaiming control of our time and energy. Through practical tools and emotional insight, Tim challenges us to start each day with intention, not the inbox.He introduces a simple but powerful three-step practice: notice when energy is off-track, name a meaningful action, and schedule it. By understanding the emotional drivers of distraction, such as insecurity and the urge to prove ourselves, leaders can instead ground themselves in purpose. Whether it's protecting your most creative hour or "bilge-sweeping" your week to clear the clutter, this episode offers a refreshing reminder: true leadership starts from within. Resources discussed in this episode:Ep. 30 with Jagroop ChhinaEp. 51 with Jared VanderMeer--Contact Tim Sweet | Team Work Excellence: WebsiteLinkedIn: Tim SweetInstagramLinkedIn: Team Work Excellence--Transcript:Tim 00:01Everything we talk about in the show pertains to leadership in some way, shape or form, or at least your leadership impact and your leadership career. But real daily leadership in a time where we've got political upheaval, where we've got economic upheaval, it feels harder and harder to maintain. So this week, one of my editors said to me, Tim, could you talk about how we can focus when everything feels uncertain? That landed. Because right now, a lot of leaders are tired. They're asking a lot of big questions, they're reacting to a lot of volatility, and they've got teams that are distracted. They've got teams that are actually, in some cases, at each other's throats. They may have lost trust. They may be dealing with personal crisis. While we have to talk about that as well. We have to be able to do our jobs at the end of the day, Tim 00:58I'd like to ask you some questions. Do you consider yourself the kind of person that gets things done? Are you able to take a vision and transform that into action? Are you able to align others towards that vision and get them moving to create something truly remarkable? If any of these describe you, then you, my friend, are a leader, and this show is all about and all for you. I'm Tim Sweet. This is episode 55 of the Sweet on Leadership podcast. Tim 01:30I want to be transparent with you. This episode, it was supposed to be out a few days ago, or at least I was supposed to get the recording to my editor, but a client crisis came up. It was urgent, it was important, it was distracting. I got pulled in. The irony isn't lost on me that when I'm about to record something about focus, I myself lost focus. Tim 01:54So today's for the leader who wants traction, not just more output, but clarity, integrity, so that they can believe in themselves, so they make good on the promises they make to themselves. We want to develop a rhythm that we can predict and that we can trust. Let's start up high 10,000 feet, because the first problem with focus is where we're looking. It's easy sometimes to get stuck in the weeds when we haven't really considered how we do the work. We need to take some time and work on the work. We need to focus on how we focus. If we get locked in on a task level, what's due, what's late, what's noisy, what's the emergency of the day? Things can seem very unmovable. So our first concept is, think about altitude. Be able to go way up, 300,000 feet, look down every once in a while and say, am I working on the right thing? Is this the piece of work that's going to move that needle forward.  Tim 3:06So here's the first question, what does this season of your career actually demand you become? Not what's trendy, not what's the burning platform in the moment politically, not what used to work, not what others are simply applauding. Just this season. Just right now. Who do you need to be? In my work with executives, with clients and universities and businesses and medicine, we want to be able to name those one to three things at any point that are going to move the needle and then ruthlessly let go of the rest. Because here's the truth, if everything is important, you know that nothing is. You have to choose, not just what to do and the quality you bring with that, but what to release, what to stop doing? Tim 04:05Focus isn't just about intensity of attention. It's about permission, giving ourselves the right to stop and invest in what matters. We ask our people to keep their head on the swivel, to think about what matters. Why are you doing things? But so often, we ourselves get overwhelmed and we forget that not everything is possible. Leaders often become the catch all. They will do something just because they're trying to keep their other people so committed and deployed effectively that the little things well, it's just easier to do them than to develop a system by which we're going to get those done. And in the process, the people that are at the top most positions in teams and businesses themselves become overwhelmed and you cannot give away calm. You cannot promote calm in others if you yourself don't have a sense of calm and control. So before we optimize our own schedules, we want to think about elevation. We need to get up and zoom out and get honest what deserves our focus in this season of our lives, in this quarter of the business, in this area of our growth and development. Tim 05:34Even when you know your priorities, your day, can still get hijacked. What does it take? One email, one off handed comment, one meeting you didn't expect to be in, one emergency you didn't think was going to take place, and you're back in reaction mode. So here's a simple shift start your day in intention, not in your inbox, but with intention. Before the world grabs your energy. Decide where does your energy need to go? Decide where that day needs to end. Tim 06:14With the work life design tool that I use with every client, when we onboard, we talk about energy alignment. Not just how to get more done, but how to develop a capacity to feel more focused and to really make sure you're in command of your day. You need capacity to create capacity. For me, I live by my calendar. My clients know that if it's not in my calendar, it does not happen. So I make sure that every time a new event comes in, it has to go in my calendar. It has to immediately be jotted down, captured even contextually. If I don't have it, if I don't have access to that, because I've chosen not to focus on long term things, I'm very much into the Get it into my inbox and delegate it into an event. I need that so that I can maintain my free time and my booked time. My free time is very, very important, and I wouldn't say it's necessarily free. Let's let's probably call it flexible time. But for me, that time becomes wildly creative. It's when I get to be curious. It's when I get to think about which one of my clients I'm caring about most in the moment, which one requires my intention, which one do I need to send out a little hello to if I haven't heard from them. Who am I concerned about? Who am I really wanting to see move something forward. If it's not in my calendar, it simply doesn't happen. Tim 07:52Because if even one block of my responsibility hasn't been represented in a visual way, and this is my way, it doesn't have to be yours. I can't keep control of it. I will fill the whole day, but I may fill it with what I'm most interested in or most passionate about, or I just don't let something go rather than diverting and changing tact. And when you have as many clients as I do, as many projects on the go, as many books that I want to write, you need to be able to switch gears. So here is a question for you. What's one part of your day that you can reclaim? Take a look at your calendar and see where you are pointed at things that simply don't provide you any value. Can you get that back? Where is there a spot that is claimed with the wrong thing and you could put that to better use? Tim 08:57Okay. Next question. When does your energy in the day feel most clear? Pay attention for the next week when you feel a sense of clarity. For some people, it's first thing in the morning. For myself, it's often first thing in the morning. For other people, it's right before they go to bed. And for still other people, they need to have experienced the day. So it might be at four o'clock or five o'clock. People are different. Some people need to be in this dance between forecasting what they need to do and finding out what they actually need to do that day. But pay attention when during the day is best for you to stop and kind of do a broad sweep of what you're working on.  Tim 9:42Third question, what's one thing that you can protect that fuels your impact and your focus and your time, not just the activity? So what's something that settles you down or gives you that type of space it might be going for a walk. It might be taking a glass of water. It might be that space before you decide to hunker down and watch a movie. When do you need to honour your requirement of refocusing your life, of really clearing out the bilge, getting rid of things that don't matter? All in all, this means don't manage your time. Design it. Design a day that you can win with. Here's the layer most productivity advice skips. There is an emotional driver underneath everything that we do. And there is an emotional driver underneath, failing to focus, failing to take stock of what's important and what can you ignore. We're not simply distracted because we're disorganized. We're distracted because of insecurity. We fail to cut loose things we don't need to do because doing those things, says something to ourselves, proves something to ourselves, that allows us to feel secure in the moment. Perhaps it's that useless meeting that we're supposed to go to, that if we don't, the boss is going to hate us. We're trying to, in those moments, prove that we're enough. If you're a mom or a dad, you might be trying to please everyone. Or you might be trying to pattern yourself after someone else's formula. But proving pleasing, patterning, it's all exhausting, and it can keep us busy but completely unfulfilled. Tim 11:46So another question, when you look at the tasks that you've got in front of yourself, is it about impact, or is it about insecurity? Until we confront that and we're fluent in what makes us insecure and what has us nervous. It's very hard to arrive at the best systems, because that insecurity that trying to keep up the false self sits there like a gravitational force that pulls us faster and faster, often in the wrong direction again when we pause, we take that time to reflect. We have to look at everything that's important to us, everything that's happening on the outside, but then also, what are we trying to be on the inside? Whose approval are we chasing? What would change if we stopped needing to prove that thing to others or to ourselves. Tim 12:46The deepest kind of focus isn't tactical. The deepest kind of focus is emotional intelligence and emotional alignment. Where are we and why are we there, and is it aligned with who we really are and what we really need to do? Tim 13:05Okay, big words. How do we make this real? Well, you don't need a new app, although there's lots that are out there that they're going to promise that they can solve this for you. And you don't need a massive overhaul. An app is snake oil. There's things out there that promise to do it for you. We don't need to develop faster pencils, faster ways to get unfocused, trying to do more when really we need to be doing less. And we don't need to change ourselves. We don't have time to change you, nor would we want to, because why would we want to knock all those sharp edges off of you, who is perfect and very effective at being you better than anybody else at being you. Tim 13:52Here's a three-step practice that I come back to, especially when I feel scattered. Practice, like meditation, is knowing you're out of that state of flow. You've got to notice. I feel like my energy is misdirected. So where is my energy going today? Is it being bled by urgency and emergency? Is it being bled by ego or insecurity? Is it being bled by lack of alignment with something, I don't feel like I'm working on something that I feel is important, or I can't connect the dots? Am I having an issue with fit with the type of work I'm doing today? Or am I having an issue with being frustrated with perhaps someone else or a set of values that I don't agree with. So notice, is your energy slipping away? Is your focus slipping away? And where is it going? Tim 14:52The next thing is, find one meaningful action and name it. Notice the energy is going away. Right? And then name that one meaningful thing you could do that would bring this back into control. And it's often not something complex. It's not becoming somebody new. It's not developing some new tool. It's saying, Hey, I'm feeling insecure right now. I'm not sure if Bob appreciated how I talked to them yesterday. So what's one meaningful thing I could do? Call Bob, call Bob and ask. It's not complex. It takes ownership and leadership of the situation, and it goes out and says, Hey, this is what I'm worried about. And Bob may not agree, um, you know, I'm fine, or he might say, yeah, you were an asshole. But we've settled it, and we've probably dealt with what we really needed to deal with in the process. You might not be able to deal with them right in the moment. You might feel something but not be able to action it. So, notice you're out. Notice you're out of focus. Name the thing that's going to bring you back in and then schedule that thing. When are you going to do it? When are you going to protect 45 minutes in the day where you are going to move some of these things forward? And it can be a great, really liberating part of your day to say, you know, I'm going to have that spot to just clean the bilge. If you follow me for a little while now, you know that I've had this, this interest in Napoleonic seafaring. Well, those ships were disgusting. You know, these large ships of the line, these large merchant vessels, they had these disgusting bilges down in the bottom, where, where, you know, the wood was rotting, there was effluent, there was rat shit, there was there was stagnant sea water, and, gosh knows what else down there. The best ships are said to have sweetened the bilge on a regular basis, because, you know, down there in the hold, things can get pretty sour and pretty stagnant. And so they would let sea water in, and they would have people on the pumps, and they would exchange the dirty bilge water for clean bilge water. Ideally, you'd like to keep the bilge dry, but if you can't, at least sweeten it.  Tim 17:21So think about that. What's the time of day that you're going to have a time to sit back and and sweeten your bilge? Right? You can do it in the morning. You can do it before anything else starts barking for your attention. It's a great way to use the morning pages activity that we talked about in several other episodes. This isn't about being perfect. It's not about making sure that you are never exposed. It's not about being resistant to ever being unfocused. Lack focus happens. It's going to happen to you. We are we are built to look far off and close up. It's why our eyes were nearsighted and far sighted. It's not about being perfect. It's not about never being surprised. It's about building trust with yourself again that you can make the calls needed to take control of your day. Because when you can consistently refocus, you can follow through on what matters, and that sense of agency over what you're working on what's important to you returns. And interestingly enough, you know, there's a million ways to get something done. This practice also allows us to design what's our best way through a problem, because our route may not be the route that our neighbors should take. In the end, it allows us to stop drifting and start leading our day, start leading our schedule.  Tim 18:52So let's land here. In these times, these times where volatility and distraction and noise, where everything is vying for our attention. Focus isn't a tactic. It's a leadership stance. In martial arts, depending on what practice you're in, the first thing they teach you is grounded horse stance. If you're boxing, they teach you that orthodox or that southpaw stance, where your back foot, the back foot is the one that when your eyes are closed and they push you, that's the one that falls to the back, because that's your steadiest position. That position says to you, when you know what it is, you've got a home base, you can say this focus, this home base, this feeling of stability, is what I've chosen to give myself today. I deserve this. I deserve to not feel off kilter. This is where I will show up for myself and protect the time that I want to spend on this planet. This doesn't make you better than everybody else. It does not make you superhuman. It just means that you're intentional, and the more you practice this, the easier it gets. Tim 20:07Warren Buffet, everybody's business Grandpa, lovely, straight headed, wildly successful. Salt of the earth, super grounded. He never has felt the need to put on airs. He wants to be practical. He lives in a small home with his wife, and he drives in a simple car. He says that it's his drive home and his drive to work which is his chance to refocus and think deep thoughts and and really plan out his day. And he finds that by silencing the radio, he doesn't use his radio. He doesn't listen to music. He takes that opportunity to just enjoy silence, and that is something that we don't have a lot of in our lives. For myself, it's first thing in the morning. I got a busy family. When everybody gets up, it is mayhem. I'm the only morning Lark. I'm a morning person. I'm the only morning Lark in a House of Night owls. They love to stay up late. They've got all sorts of energy at night, but that few minutes in the morning when I can just be intentional, focus on what I need to do, have that bit of quiet. Ideally, being out on a walk and doing it is golden. It's how I find traction and wherever you find your most energy, where you feel that you can have that natural propensity to focus, schedule it, because that's how you're going to find traction every day, in small ways in this shifting world that is trying to vie for your Attention. Jagroop Chhina said that the new economy is an attention economy. Jared van der Meer said the same thing. It's all about watch time. People are trying to keep you focused on them, not focused on yourself, and we need to win this focus back. When we can find focus, we find traction. Tim 22:03That's how we create clarity for ourselves. And when we have clarity for ourselves, we can provide that clarity for our teams. That's how you become a better leader or focused on integrity, doing the right thing at the right time, not just activity. We look up to heroes because they're the ones that do the right thing at the right time, even when it's tough. That is the definition of integrity. Extend that integrity down to every activity that you do. Is that the best thing that you could be doing right now? And then, I would really highly recommend you have some recess time, some free time, both to reground yourself and focus, but also just to go out and do some silly stuff, go out and exercise, go out and just get creative. You know, that's the rule. Free time when you're allowed to be distracted, when you're allowed to just free think and ideally producing it, creating, not consuming. And keep that time and schedule it in the same way, intentionally. Tim 23:10with all of this. I hope it helps you find new levels of focus this week and every week beyond. If you are interested in getting very, very precise about where your life is aimed, where your day is aimed, where your career is aimed, and you want to build that back in your life. I think it's probably time that we we have a conversation. Meanwhile, thanks once again for joining us here. Thanks again for investing a few minutes in yourself and your own development. If this resonated with you, share it with your colleagues. Share it with your team. Share it with your family. Anybody who you feel is wrestling with clarity on who they are and what they do in the course of the day and who you think focus might help. It's a skill that we don't think of as a skill. We think we should just have it. But you teach it to yourself, bring it into your relationships, perhaps you teach it to young people that are important to you. Can do amazing things. Can unlock amazing levels of natural efficiency, because when we have capacity, we can create capacity. When we have a feeling of togetherness and calm, we can create togetherness and calm. And when we have focus, we can create focus. We can move from creating it for ourselves to mastery over it. And when we have mastery over it, we can mentor it in others, if you want more tools to help you with finding your rhythm, your groove, and to protect that energy that so many people want to rob you of, you'll find a link to how you can get into a Work Life, Design, conversation with me in the show notes. Take the time to stay focused, and when you do, you'll feel more aligned. You'll feel more confident. And you'll feel like you are better able to show up and lead not just your own life,but the work of others. Okay, I'll see you again next time. Tim 25:12Thank you, so much for listening to Sweet on Leadership. If you found today's podcast valuable, consider visiting our website and signing up for the companion newsletter. You can find the link in the show notes. If like us, you think it's important to bring new ideas and skills into the practice of leadership, please give us a positive rating and review on Apple podcasts, this helps us spread the word to other committed leaders, and you can spread the word too by sharing this with your friends, teams and colleagues. Thanks again for listening, and be sure to tune in in two weeks time for another episode of Sweet on Leadership. In the meantime, I'm your host. Tim Sweet, encouraging you to keep on leading.

CCR Sermons
Puking the Lukewarm

CCR Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 15, 2024 38:27


Jesus Calling Pt. 7 – Puking the Lukewarm By Louie Marsh, 12-15-2024   Last slide – Super Barf Bag/   1) Jesus is the TRUTH & CREATOR of everything/   “14“And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: ‘The words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of God's creation.” (Revelation 3:14, ESV)   “15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. 17And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18And he is the head of the body, the church. He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in everything he might be preeminent.” (Colossians 1:15–18, ESV)   2) APATHY not allowed.   “15“ ‘I know your works: you are neither cold nor hot. Would that you were either cold or hot! 16So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth.” (Revelation 3:15–16, ESV)   ·       What about the VOMIT?   Synonyms Strongest matches   Strong matches   Out of the 26 major English translations 13 say spit or spew, 13 say vomit. Of the 4 Literal translations 3 say vomit and one says spit.   Difference between spitting (with Mom story) and vomiting.   ·       Jesus wants COMMITMENT – either for or against Him.   “30Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.” (Matthew 12:30, ESV)   3) Don't mistake prosperity with spiritual MATURITY.   “17For you say, I am rich, I have prospered, and I need nothing, not realizing that you are wretched, pitiable, poor, blind, and naked. 18I counsel you to buy from me gold refined by fire, so that you may be rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself and the shame of your nakedness may not be seen, and salve to anoint your eyes, so that you may see.” (Revelation 3:17–18, ESV)   ·       Things going well don't necessarily mean you are CLOSE to God.   “1“Come, everyone who thirsts, come to the waters; and he who has no money, come, buy and eat! Come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.” (Isaiah 55:1, ESV)   “19And I will say to my soul, “Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years; relax, eat, drink, be merry.” ' 20But God said to him, ‘Fool! This night your soul is required of you, and the things you have prepared, whose will they be?' 21So is the one who lays up treasure for himself and is not rich toward God.”” (Luke 12:19–21, ESV)   4) Jesus rebukes me because He LOVES  ME.   “19Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent. 20Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.” (Revelation 3:19–20, ESV)   “6For the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and chastises every son whom he receives.”” (Hebrews 12:6, ESV)   5) SHARING Jesus' throne – the ultimate way to be like Jesus.   “21The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne. 22He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.' ”” (Revelation 3:21–22, ESV)                    

St. Columba's Episcopal Church Sermons
Bishop Rios Triennial Visit - 10.6.24 The Rt. Rev. Austin Rios

St. Columba's Episcopal Church Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 16, 2024 11:23


Twentieth Sunday after Pentecost The Collect: Almighty and everlasting God, you are always more ready to hear than we to pray, and to give more than we either desire or deserve: Pour upon us the abundance of your mercy, forgiving us those things of which our conscience is afraid, and giving us those good things for which we are not worthy to ask, except through the merits and mediation of Jesus Christ our Savior; who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, one God, for ever and ever. Amen. Old Testament: Genesis 2:18-24 18Then the Lord God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper as his partner.” 19So out of the ground the LordGod formed every animal of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. 20The man gave names to all cattle, and to the birds of the air, and to every animal of the field; but for the man there was not found a helper as his partner. 21So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then he took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh.22And the rib that the Lord God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. 23Then the man said, “This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; this one shall be called Woman, for out of Man this one was taken.” 24Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and clings to his wife, and they become one flesh. Psalm: Psalm 8 1 O Lord our Governor, *        how exalted is your Name in all the world! 2 Out of the mouths of infants and children *        your majesty is praised above the heavens. 3 You have set up a stronghold against your adversaries, *        to quell the enemy and the avenger. 4 When I consider your heavens, the work of your fingers, *        the moon and the stars you have set in their courses, 5 What is man that you should be mindful of him? *        the son of man that you should seek him out? 6 You have made him but little lower than the angels; *        you adorn him with glory and honor; 7 You give him mastery over the works of your hands; *        you put all things under his feet: 8 All sheep and oxen, *        even the wild beasts of the field, 9 The birds of the air, the fish of the sea, *        and whatsoever walks in the paths of the sea. 10 O Lord our Governor, *        how exalted is your Name in all the world! Epistle: Hebrews 1:1-4; 2:5-12 1Long ago God spoke to our ancestors in many and various ways by the prophets, 2but in these last days he has spoken to us by a Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom he also created the worlds.3He is the reflection of God's glory and the exact imprint of God's very being, and he sustains all things by his powerful word. When he had made purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4having become as much superior to angels as the name he has inherited is more excellent than theirs. 5Now God did not subject the coming world, about which we are speaking, to angels. 6But someone has testified somewhere, “What are human beings that you are mindful of them, or mortals, that you care for them? 7You have made them for a little while lower than the angels; you have crowned them with glory and honor, 8subjecting all things under their feet.” Now in subjecting all things to them, God left nothing outside their control. As it is, we do not yet see everything in subjection to them,9but we do see Jesus, who for a little while was made lower than the angels, now crowned with glory and honor because of the suffering of death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone. 10It was fitting that God, for whom and through whom all things exist, in bringing many children to glory, should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11For the one who sanctifies and those who are sanctified all have one Father. For this reason Jesus is not ashamed to call them brothers and sisters, 12saying, “I will proclaim your name to my brothers and sisters, in the midst of the congregation I will praise you.” Gospel: Mark 10:2-16 2Some Pharisees came, and to test him they asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?” 3He answered them, “What did Moses command you?” 4They said, “Moses allowed a man to write a certificate of dismissal and to divorce her.” 5But Jesus said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart he wrote this commandment for you. 6But from the beginning of creation, ‘God made them male and female.' 7‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, 8and the two shall become one flesh.' So they are no longer two, but one flesh. 9Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.” 10Then in the house the disciples asked him again about this matter. 11He said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her; 12and if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery.” 13People were bringing little children to him in order that he might touch them; and the disciples spoke sternly to them. 14But when Jesus saw this, he was indignant and said to them, “Let the little children come to me; do not stop them; for it is to such as these that the kingdom of God belongs. 15Truly I tell you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God as a little child will never enter it.” 16And he took them up in his arms, laid his hands on them, and blessed them.

St. Columba's Episcopal Church Sermons
Mothering Energy - 5.12.24 Mother's of St. Columba's

St. Columba's Episcopal Church Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 11, 2024 19:38


Seventh Sunday of Easter The Collect: O God, the King of glory, you have exalted your only Son Jesus Christ with great triumph to your kingdom in heaven: Do not leave us comfortless, but send us your Holy Spirit to strengthen us, and exalt us to that place where our Savior Christ has gone before; who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, one God, in glory everlasting. Amen. First Lesson: Acts 1:15-17, 21-26 15In those days Peter stood up among the believers (together the crowd numbered about one hundred twenty persons) and said, 16“Friends, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit through David foretold concerning Judas, who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus—17for he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.” 21So one of the men who have accompanied us during all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, 22beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us to his resurrection.” 23So they proposed two, Joseph called Barsabbas, who was also known as Justus, and Matthias. 24Then they prayed and said, “Lord, you know everyone's heart. Show us which one of these two you have chosen 25to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.” 26And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias; and he was added to the eleven apostles. Psalm: Psalm 1 1 Happy are they who have not walked in the counsel of the wicked, *        nor lingered in the way of sinners,        nor sat in the seats of the scornful! 2 Their delight is in the law of the Lord, *        and they meditate on his law day and night. 3 They are like trees planted by streams of water,    bearing fruit in due season, with leaves that do not wither; *        everything they do shall prosper. 4 It is not so with the wicked; *        they are like chaff which the wind blows away. 5 Therefore the wicked shall not stand upright when judgment comes, *        nor the sinner in the council of the righteous. 6 For the Lord knows the way of the righteous, *        but the way of the wicked is doomed. Epistle: 1 John 5:9-13 9If we receive human testimony, the testimony of God is greater; for this is the testimony of God that he has testified to his Son. 10Those who believe in the Son of God have the testimony in their hearts. Those who do not believe in God have made him a liar by not believing in the testimony that God has given concerning his Son. 11And this is the testimony: God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life. Gospel: John 17:6-19 6”I have made your name known to those whom you gave me from the world. They were yours, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. 7Now they know that everything you have given me is from you; 8for the words that you gave to me I have given to them, and they have received them and know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me. 9I am asking on their behalf; I am not asking on behalf of the world, but on behalf of those whom you gave me, because they are yours. 10All mine are yours, and yours are mine; and I have been glorified in them. 11And now I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them in your name that you have given me, so that they may be one, as we are one. 12While I was with them, I protected them in your name that you have given me. I guarded them, and not one of them was lost except the one destined to be lost, so that the scripture might be fulfilled. 13But now I am coming to you, and I speak these things in the world so that they may have my joy made complete in themselves. 14I have given them your word, and the world has hated them because they do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. 15I am not asking you to take them out of the world, but I ask you to protect them from the evil one. 16They do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. 17Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth. 18As you have sent me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. 19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, so that they also may be sanctified in truth.

Qualitative Conversations
Episode 43: Episode 43. Culturally Sustaining Pedagogies

Qualitative Conversations

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 25, 2024 64:16


SPEAKERSApril Jones, Venus Watson, Boden Robertson, Ryn Bornhoft Boden Robertson  00:00Hello everyone and welcome to qualitative conversations the podcast series hosted by the qualitative research special interest group of the American Educational Research Association. My name is Boden Robertson and I'm a PhD candidate in educational research at the University of Alabama specializing in qualitative methodologies and will serve as the moderator for our episode. Our focus today will be the recent conference on culturally sustaining pedagogy to critique and reimagine teaching qualitative research that was hosted by the College of Education Department of Educational Studies, psychology research methodology, and counseling and funded through the Spencer Foundation. Drs. Stephanie Shelton and Kelly Guyotte at the University of Alabama received a grant for the conference. Put tons of planning and coordination into it and along with invaluable support of April Jones and Carlson Coogler, who are both graduate students here at the University of Alabama. The conference brought an array of scholars to examine culturally sustaining approaches teaching and conducting qualitative research. Our episodes guests today are graduate students in the educational research PhD program at the University of Alabama who are also specializing in qualitative methodologies, and who attended the conference and will and will focus on their experiences from the conference and their process of understanding culturally sustaining pedagogies and their impact. We're very happy to be participating in this today. And we'll start with introductions from our guests, April Jones, Venus Watkins, and Ryn Bornhoft, if you'd please introduce yourselves. April Jones  01:30Hi, everybody. I'm so glad to be here. My name is April Jones. I am a doctoral candidate in the program at the University of Alabama that Boden has just mentioned. My research interests centers, areas of child welfare and juvenile justice specifically surrounding issues of social work and social justice, social justice, along with the marginalized communities that engage with and intersect with those particular systems. Venus Watson  02:01Hi, my name is Venus Watson and I am a PhD candidate at the University of Alabama with a focus on qualitative methodologies. And my research interests include black girlhood, black womanhood, and identity. I'm super excited to be here with you guys today. Ryn Bornhoft  02:22Hello, my name is Renbourn haft I am excited to be here. This is my first time ever recording a podcast. So I am focusing on issues surrounding disability and educational access in informal education settings, such as museums sort of covering both K through 12 and adult to a certain extent since museums have mixed audiences. So I'm looking forward to all our discussions. And I'm a PhD student. Boden Robertson  03:01That's also that's also important, right. Well, thank you. Thank you guys. All for. Thank you all for joining us. So we'll start with, we'll start with the first question, which is, I guess kind of obvious. So in, in your opinion, what does culturally sustaining pedagogy mean? Venus Watson  03:21So in my opinion, culturally sustaining pedagogies, their teaching methods that do more than just accept or include a student's cultural backgrounds in the classroom. So they aim to support and keep those cultural practices and identities alive and growing. This approach understands that students come from diverse cultural backgrounds, and that these differences are valuable. And 

The Vine Community Church Sermon Podcast

16His disciples did not understand these things at first, butwhen Jesus was glorified, thenthey remembered that these things had been written about him and had been done to him.17The crowd that had been with him when he called Lazarus out of the tomb and raised him from the dead continued to bear witness.18The reason why the crowd went to meet himwas that they heard he had done this sign.19So the Pharisees said to one another,You see that you are gaining nothing. Look,the world has gone after him. Some Greeks Seek Jesus 20Nowamong those who went up to worship at the feast were someGreeks.21So these came toPhilip, who was from Bethsaida in Galilee, and asked him, Sir, we wish to see Jesus.22Philip went and toldAndrew; Andrew and Philip went and told Jesus.23And Jesus answered them,The hour has comefor the Son of Man to be glorified.24Truly, truly, I say to you,unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit.25Whoever loves his life loses it, andwhoeverhates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.26If anyone serves me, he mustfollow me; andwhere I am, there will my servant be also.If anyone serves me,the Father will honor him.

New Covenant Community Church | Highlands Ranch
Ephesians 6.21-24: A Trustworthy Man & A Benediction

New Covenant Community Church | Highlands Ranch

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 18, 2024


21So that you also may know how I am and what I am doing, Tychicus the beloved brother and faithful minister in the Lord will tell you everything. 22I have sent him to you for this very purpose, that you may know how we are, and that he may encourage your hearts. 23Peace be to the brothers, and love with faith, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. 24Grace be with all who love our Lord Jesus Christ with love incorruptible.

Sweet On Leadership
The Power Of A North Star - How to Achieve Your Vision

Sweet On Leadership

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 15, 2023 58:33


In this powerful episode, Tim talks with Debbie Potts of DAP VA Limited about her inspiring story of resilience. Debbie describes how she kept her dreams alive by keeping her anchor or north star in view at all times, even while adapting to remote work during the pandemic, battling ovarian cancer (twice!), and navigating the chaos of moving to a new country. Her tenacity, vulnerability, and never-ending positivity will both inspire and motivate any listener who needs encouragement to pursue their dreams without letting obstacles get in the way or define them. Debbie's story shows listeners how powerful you can be when you advocate for yourself, discover your goals, and trust your instincts. Tim shares the main lessons he's learned from working directly with Debbie and following her achievements, including how to keep your vision clear, break down impossible tasks into manageable pieces, and keep your momentum going against the odds. You'll learn about the importance of positivity and a little bit of Swedish coffee culture along the way. About Debbie Potts | Founder of DAP VA LimitedDebbie Potts is the entrepreneurial force behind DAP VA Limited, where she stands as an Online Business Manager and Executive Virtual Assistant. With a rich tapestry of experiences spanning over three decades in the corporate legal sector and educational management, Debbie's multifaceted expertise is matched only by her grounded, go-the-extra-mile ethos and her passion for the Swedish concept of 'fika'—taking a break to savour coffee and company.Debbie's philosophy centers around the notion that exceptional business support should be within reach for every entrepreneur and business owner. She extends this support across the globe, offering services that include website redesign, social media enhancement with a particular knack for leveraging Pinterest for Business, and comprehensive executive assistance—all tailored to help her clients reclaim precious time.Beyond her professional endeavours, Debbie dedicates her energy to advocating for two cancer charities. As a survivor herself, she generously shares her journey to uplift others and advance the mission of these organizations, which provide crucial support to those touched by cancer.Resources discussed in this episode:Working Genius - Patrick LencioniVA Mastery Course - Amanda JohnsonMacmillan Cancer SupportDebbie's Story on The Royal Marsden Cancer Charity WebsiteBBC Interview Highlighting Challenges of Cancer Patients During the Cost of Living CrisisIndividualism vs. Teamwork with Rita Ernst Part 1 (Apple)Individualism vs. Teamwork with Rita Ernst Part 2 (Apple)Individualism vs. Teamwork with Rita Ernst Part 1 (Spotify)Individualism vs. Teamwork with Rita Ernst Part 2 (Spotify)--Contact Tim Sweet | Team Work Excellence: WebsiteLinkedIn: Tim SweetInstagramLinkedin: Team Work ExcellenceContact Debbie Potts | DAP VA: WebsiteLinkedin: DAPVA--Transcipt:Debbie 00:01We need to believe that we are stronger than we think. We are more resilient than we think. And we absolutely can achieve. Yes. It's hard as you said, yes, the trajectory to the dream is tough. And I was pushed down that mountain 1000 times that I got up, I kept going. So it isn't so much about failing, because I did. But it's how do you pick yourself up after failing?Tim 00:31I'd like to ask you some questions. Do you consider yourself the kind of person that gets things done? Are you able to take a vision and transform that into action? Are you able to align others towards that vision and get them moving to create something truly remarkable? If any of these describe you, then you my friend, or a leader, and this show is all about an all for you. Welcome to our 20th episode, this is the Sweet on Leadership podcast. Tim 01:04Hey, everybody, welcome back to Sweet on Leadership. Thank you very much for joining me, I am absolutely over the moon to be talking and bringing to you one of the most amazing spirits that I have encountered on this planet. She is somebody that I have a great deal of love for. I never knew when we met how much I would jive with you and how much I would feel an immediate connection with you. And I really just can't wait for everybody else to experience a little bit of Debbie because it's the vitamin D and never knew you needed. And that's coming at you today. So welcome Debbie Potts, to this podcast. And thank you so much for taking the time to join me and sharing your amazing story. Debbie 01:49You're welcome, Tim. And thank you for inviting me. This is amazing. And yeah, I jive with you, too. So it's, it's mutual. And I have a lot of love and respect for you, too. So great. Let's let's do this. Tim 02:04Oh, yeah. So Debbie, I'm going to ask you to introduce yourself, let people know what you're all about. And then I've got some really big curiosities as we talk about your journey. And so yeah, please let everybody know who you are. Debbie 02:19Oh, sure. My name is Debbie Potts, as Tim said, and I am the director of a virtual assistant business, which is a business based in the United Kingdom. And registered in the United Kingdom. I serve my clients in all sorts of ways I provide services, to help them run their businesses, I do social media for them, I've fixed their websites, I redo their websites. Basically, I turn my hand to anything. I really plus myself as not only a business owner, but also a survivor and a conqueror of two-time ovarian cancer. So for me, that's kind of my biggest achievement. It doesn't define me, but it is something that has made me who I am today, and I'm so happy to join you. Tim 03:07I appreciate it. And in case you're wondering, dear listener, Debbie helps me all the time, and she's brought an entirely new level of control, and he's around my own business. But that's not why we're here. Today, we're not to talk about the power of an amazing assistant, although that is something we're going to get into. And I don't even think of it as an assistant, I think of a power of an amazing collaborator who rounds off your edges and supplements, your leadership style or your business in ways that you can't even imagine. Okay, that's part of it. But let's talk about the journey I'd love you to, to lead us into the story of The Red House. And I think for all of the leaders that are listening, this is an amazing parable around or amazing example of what happens when you set a vision and you achieve it and how it can have what I see from the outside being a profound effect on a person's trajectory. Notwithstanding Yeah, notwithstanding the the battles that you've been through, and I think that's part of the story. But the metaphor of the red house to me is just so inspiring. So that's what I'm really hoping that we can get into today. So could you give us a little bit of a background in terms of what the red house is, take us up to the lead-up of what was happening where you first had this dream. Debbie 04:36Okay, so basically my dream about living in a red house in the middle of the countryside near the forest and near the sea, started way back decades ago, really, when I first came to Sweden, and we took a trip into the countryside and I saw all these little red houses dotted around everywhere and the colour of these red houses is specific only to Sweden and it's called “Falu Röd” (Falu Red). So I had a dream to live in a follow red house. So there so at the time, Dan and I, my partner were living and working in London. And I thought, How on earth am I going to make this happen? I work in a school, I don't work remotely, I have to go to school every day. I can't, you know, work in London and live in a red house. It's just not going to work. What should I do? It was a lot, a lot of knockbacks. At first, I applied to many positions here in Stockholm thinking, Okay, I'll just change my job. But of course, not speaking the language was a big sort of negative. So every job that I applied for was a “no.” Tim 05:49Just to back us up. When did you have this vision? What year was that?  Debbie 05:54Oh, my gosh, that would have been 2009.  Tim 05:552009? Debbie 06:02Yes. The way I sort of drifted was after my visit to Sweden, I went back home and I printed a picture, any picture Tim of any red house, and I stuck it on the wall above my computer. And obviously, I would look at this, whenever I came to sit at my computer, I would see this. And it would just keep sort of the cogs turning. Okay, so how do I turn that picture into a reality? First, was job so that I could work in the country that I want to live. Second was, while I need money, houses don't fall from trees? Yeah, I've got to have some money. And of course, I'm working with my partner, Dan, on this dream. So you know, we decided to for now do sort of a feasibility study and look at where could we possibly live? Because a dream can only become reality to me when I physically see the possibility rather than think it or see it virtually. Tim 07:08In the late 2000s, you start to think of this. And you when you put these pictures out behind your computer as a bit of a vision board, you're approaching it practically you're not approaching it with a distant dream, you're bringing it close saying, ‘Where could this exist?' The default being Sweden, obviously. Debbie 07:28Absolutely. And I did have that dream aspect as well. I mean, I would go to sleep dreaming about The Red House, I would talk about it at work with my colleagues, I would talk about it with my friends and family. So and that's all I was obsessed by. Everybody kind of knew, ah, what does Debbie want? She wants to live in a red house that's been known for years. Tim 07:49So the red house was this picture, this avatar for something. What did the Red House represent to you?  Debbie 07:56Oh my gosh, it represented freedom, it represented achievements. It represented living life on my terms. And obviously, I love nature, as you do. And it just represented, you know, being able to be close to nature and, you know, completely do a 180 turnaround of my life. You know, I lived in a big city, London, full of people full of traffic full of everything. And I've now completely reversed that. And you know, I've told you about this before in our conversations, there's, you know, this little village I live in, there's 10 plots, but only eight houses. And that's us.  Tim 08:40And eight families that are collectively a community. When you think about that, then the red house was such a clear delineation, was such a clear, step off what you knew. It there was a polar opposite from that perspective. I do remember you sharing with me at one point, the red house was just a representation, and you'd identified all of those outcomes you were looking for. That could have manifested in a bunch of different ways. Right? You could have found nature somewhere else, you could have found peace somewhere else. Debbi 09:12Yea, but it also was my love of Sweden anyway. And because I love the country, and because, you know, so it was a whole mind shift change, because not only did I have the picture of the red house above my computer, but I also enrolled myself in London to have Swedish lessons. So then I could start learning the language. Okay, so sort of ticking off all the things that I needed to do for myself to be able to achieve this dream.  Tim 09:42So you were putting in the small things in place. Debbie 09:45All the little bits and pieces. Yes.  Tim 09:49Okay. So, late 2000. You're coming up with these plans. You've got this vision, you're starting to tick off the small items. What happened then what was the next thing that happened? Debbie 09:59It just became an impossible dream. If I'm honest with you, if I'm genuinely honest. Yeah, prior to the pandemic, it became an impossible dream.  Tim 10:09It was never gonna come close.  Debbie 10:10No, I could not see myself finding a job that would, you know, give me enough money to achieve this dream, nor could I see myself finding a job in Sweden and then achieving the dream. Tim 10:23The clarity around it started to take you farther away from it. The reality starting to pose, you know, real concrete frictions with your current life. Okay, all right, so, so you went through these exercises, then you faced this hero's journey of now the challenge was starting to appear as impassible. Debbie 10:46Absolutely.  Tim 10:47This is pre-pandemic. And pre-battle with ovarian cancer.  Debbie 10:54Pre-battle. I was healthy, Debbie, you know, working living in London enjoying life. And what I decided to do was I thought, okay, I'm not going to give it up totally. Because it's, you know, when you really want something, and you just are not prepared to kind of compromise or give it up. I thought, okay, these battles are here for now. Let me just plod along with my work. And you know, think about how do I overcome this obstacle of living in London, but I really need to be in Sweden? And there's a lot of little things you've got to do. I had to research, how do I get a Swedish visa? How do I you know, legally, all of these other little things? How do I get a bank account? How do I do this? So I thought, let's just do those little things. I started a spreadsheet and, I'm a spreadsheet queen, and honest, I had all the things I needed to achieve with a box, you know, tick off, okay, that done and then notes on the side that tell me, okay, so for a visa, you need to do this da-da-da-da-da. And I just sort of left that slide and kept going. I also subscribed to a property selling website marketing site, and they would just, yeah, I'd just look every morning. That's the first thing I did. I didn't check my work emails, I didn't do anything, I would just spend 15 minutes looking to see what's on the market.  Tim 12:18So, even though part of your conscience was telling you that this is not gonna, let's say the logical part of your brain is fighting you, saying this is not logical use that okay, broke it down to the little tasks, you know, you could action. And I mean, for any of you who've worked with me on Working Genius, which is Patrick Lencioni's new piece. This is very clearly the genius of tenacity, right? It's pulling things into manageable chunks that we then are going to accomplish, Debbie 12:50But also not giving up Tim. Because lots of people give up. And they just say okay, it's not gonna happen and they shelve it. Tim 12:58And where you disaggregated it down to its constituent parts that could start, instead of going for that great big island off in the distance. You swam to this sandbar, and then this sandbar, and then this sandbar, and slowly the island is coming a little closer and a little closer.  Debbie 13:17That's right, yeah. And in English, the saying, you know, I had all my ducks in a row. So I spent nearly five years putting all these little ducks in a row, you know, finding out okay, how, you know, what do I do to get a bank account? Okay, if we lived in this area, how far away is it from the airport? You know, in case I've got to travel back to London or anywhere, for that matter. How do we get broadband or internet connection to a house that's in the middle of the forest? What do I do? Tim 13:46I don't want to get into this too far. Because I think that's fodder for another conversation. But this is so you. I mean, this is what you do for me all the time. When I'm feeling, when I'm feeling overwhelmed. And I've got too many things on the goal. You're like, stop, Break it down. Let's get this into into the easiest thing you can do next, what's just the one easiest step you can take? Which is...  Debbie 14:11Can I just add a little bit more, just so that we can get to the Red House now. Tim 14:16You got it, go for it.   Debbie 14:17So far, all of this happened and I sort of like okay, I'll just do these bits and find out so that I'm totally prepared. If and when they're… not even if, when the time comes. So fast forward to 2020. 2020 Okay, it's 20th of March 2020. The whole of the UK shut down completely. And I was like, oh, now I have to work from home for my school. This is great for me who absolutely loves tech, and absolutely loves working from home. Now my red house popped up front and center because it's, I soon clocked on that, oh my god, if I can work from home for my school, I can work from anywhere. This is it, I got my answer. It's, it's that's it, I got my answer. So in the middle of the pandemic, I decided, okay, I had a conversation with my executive head. And I said to her, Would you be happy? They knew I go to Sweden, you know, six, seven times a year, would you be happy for me to work remotely, from Sweden, for the schools? I supported four schools at the time. Of course, she said, “No, we need you here, Debbie physically.” So that's a no. So I thought, okay, what do I do then to make this remote working dream become reality? Since we're in a pandemic, people have now understood that you can work remotely globally, as you and I do. Yeah. And I decided, what job can I do that will allow me to be able to do this? And I researched, I Googled, I watched so many podcasts, or listened to so many podcasts, watched videos. And finally, yeah, why don't you be a virtual assistant on your own terms? So on the fourth of August 2020, during the pandemic, I started my own business. Tim 16:24You had to step away from your…  Debbie 16:27No, I did it simultaneously, because I needed the income. But I started because I don't know if my business is going to be a success. Of course, I'm going to put everything into it. But I thought, okay, I can do it on a part-time basis. I was lucky enough to have fantastic training, I found this amazing VA Mastery Course, with this lady called Amanda Johnson. I absolutely adore her.  Tim 16:48We can put a link to that. Debbie 16:50Yeah, totally. Yeah, I did her course. And that's what changed everything for me completely. It then made the steps to the Red House, achievable. And I knew it's gonna happen, there was absolutely not one iota of doubt in my mind that this was going to happen in the next two years. Tim 17:11Okay, so 2020, lockdown happens, suddenly we have this new reality of working remotely, and that opens a door that you're ready to step through. Debbie 17:21100% I stepped through it. My business did take off really well, which was great.  Tim 17:30Right, I remember that's when we met.  Debbie 17:32Yes, something had to give because I couldn't continue with my full-time school job, and run DAP VA limited. So I had to, in February of 2021, I then handed in my notice, and the period of notice I had to give was six months. So, I said to them, You know what, don't worry, I'll give you until the end of this academic year ie July 2021. And then I'm gone. Not only will I work full-time on my business, but I'll also be leaving the country to move to Sweden. So up pops another spreadsheet, because now I have to do all the removal costs and all that sort of you know, get the van or the lorry come and take all what will we be taking them since we are left Europe and and you know, Brexit happened. So we classed as a third country to Sweden, so I have to pay import charges, all of these things. Whereas before you could just literally drive your whole house to Sweden, and that would not be a problem.  Tim 18:34So what's amazing about this to me is you made this decision, the move starts the unhooking from life, as it was, begins. Although I mean, you still do have deep connection to London. Your Hill was getting steeper, not more shallow. I mean, Debbie 18:52Yeah. But it looks achievable to me. I don't know.  Tim 18:55Oh absolutely. It was achievable. What I mean is that the difficulty level went up. That didn't stop you. It wasn't as easy as it would have been a few years prior. But that didn't stop Debbie  Debbie 19:09That's true. This point actually, is spot on Tim, because a few years prior, I wouldn't need a visa nor would I have needed to pay all those 1000s of pounds in imports. Tim 19:19You had momentum at this point. And that inertia was carrying you up that change curve. That wasn't the end of your struggles.  Debbie 19:29No, not at all. So obviously, you know, the beginning or the first half, I'd say of 2021 I was working so hard with two jobs and being a school business manager is a stressful full-on job even though my contract was term time only. So I thought okay, you know, I will have vacation time or holiday time and I will work on my business during those times and I'll make it work somehow, Tim, I always make it work. So it was full of excitement, anticipation. If I could literally, you know, see and touch the dream. I'd set up house viewings for Dan and I to go, and you know, view all these beautiful houses. The next visit we had to Sweden. So it became it started becoming, you know, when you can just taste something and you just have a little taste. It's so nice. You want to eat the whole thing. That's what was happening. So we did all these house viewings, and we listed the our favorites and blah, blah, went back to the UK, started winding down, packed up all our stuff in boxes that we wanted to bring to Sweden. Found a company that was great that would come and pick it off from door to door. And literally, one day before we were due to fly to Sweden, or the move, I'd applied for my visa at this stage as well. And they said, Look, you can come to Sweden anyway, even if it's isn't quite granted yet. Because, you know, you can stay on the 90-day rule that the UK nationals are allowed to stay in Sweden for 90 days per year. And your visa should come during that time. So it all was good. So you can come now, I was like, okay, great. Everything's great. One day, Tim, the fourth of August 2021. We had our British Airways flights booked on, on Thursday, the fifth of August, we were going to meet the removal van in Stockholm on Friday, the sixth of August. But on the fourth, I should just back up a week or so I went for what I thought was a routine scan and had the scan and left it and it usually takes about 10 days before you find out the results. I got a call from my GP on the fourth of August, saying the morning of, no sorry, she found me on the Monday. So that was the fourth was a Wednesday. She phoned me on the Monday and said, Debbie, I don't think you'll be going to Sweden. And I said now of course I'm going everything's sorted. We flying on Thursday. She said no, we have your scan and it's you have cancer basically. So I'm like “What? No,” she goes just to be sure. Let me do another scan. So I said okay, can you do it before Wednesday? Because I'm flying on Thursday. She said I really don't think you're flying. But yes, we'll see you on Wednesday. So still, I didn't believe it. Tim, I just thought nah, it's a mistake. And you know, these scans are misread sometimes. But anyway, I'll go on. I'll go on Wednesday. Yeah, so off, I went alone. Had a more detailed scan. First I had just a pelvic ultrasound. And then I said I can't wait for the results 10 days because I'm flying tomorrow. So can you just tell me what's on your screen? And he said, I remember the radiologist saying, see these dark clouds over here. And on both sides here. That's your left ovary. That's your right ovary, these dark clouds covering both ovaries. That's cancer. See these other dark clouds? That's your upper abdomen? Yep. See all how they floating looks like a skyline? That's cancer. You have cancer. Yeah, we don't know the staging yet. Because we've got to do more details. And I was like, oh, shock. I'm alone. What do I do? So I asked them, what would happen next? They said, Okay, we do an MRI, which is more detailed. And that will definitively tell us what's going on. So I asked if they could fit me in that afternoon. And they did. It was about 2:30. I had my scan on the fourth of August. After the MRI. straightaway. Yeah. Confirmed. So obviously I was a little bit. Yeah, I was in shock. I was numb. I was, it when I'm telling you this. Now it doesn't even feel like it's me I'm talking about, but it is me, though. I called Dan. I actually didn't even call him first. I called Dan's best friend. And his name is Anders. And I said, Look, I'm probably going to die. So I need you to take care of them for me. So can you do that? And at this point, I was crying. He couldn't even hear me. And I'm you know, so I just said, just promise me that you'll do this for me because, you know. It's important. Yeah, of course, whatever you do, blah, blah, blah. Then I phoned Dan. I told him, he came over straightaway to the hospital, along with my two daughters. And yeah, we just were a little bit in shock. The doctor came, spoke to us all. And it was at that point I knew well, we're not going to Sweden. So we went home and we played a board game and ate sandwiches. That's the first thing we did, which ,I don't like, I'll tell you why.  Tim 24:57That Red House that was so close. You could almost taste it. Debbie 25:00I was on my way.  Tim 25:02And you wanted more suddenly was suddenly like it was right there. And suddenly, it's just now thrust farther and farther away. It's not about the house. It's just that, you know, as the as a backdrop to your cancer journey, that you weren't going to Sweden.  Debbie 25:16Not at this time. Tim 25:18No, but you went home and you ate sandwiches. Debbie 25:20And played a board game. God knows why. Tim 25:22Played a board game. What happened next from now you're redoing all the math. This point was, Debbie 25:31No, I didn't even. Now I thought about life and death. So now my, my whole... Tim 24:33Your spreadsheet changed, now it had two columns.  Debbie 25:36I didn't even look at that for about a year. Actually. Tim 25:42If you know what I mean, is if you may have met one, it would have been pretty stark it would have been like, yeah, that's it.  Debbie 25:48Yea, so I just decided to, again, because I'm such a practical organized person. Okay, now death is coming. Let's get all my ducks in a row before I die. You know, so I need to do this, this, this, this and this. Okay, what should I do? Well, I didn't have a will, believe it or not. Okay, I need to get a well done. And even then, kind of, you know, Dan would say, Look, that's not priority. Right now, we need to see what can we do about this disease, we have an appointment in two weeks' time, everything in the UK is two-week wait under our national health system. And I said, I'm sorry, I can't sit here or lie here, knowing I have ovarian cancer and wait two weeks to hear how they can help me. Anybody at all who's had any kind of diagnosis of a terminal illness, it does not just cancer loads. You can't wait, Tim, two weeks and just stew over all the sooner you know, and the most dangerous thing is you go to Google and you start Googling. And Google is the worst thing you can do when you've been diagnosed, because the results it gives are not your results. They could be someone else's. And you know, you could be reading into it in the wrong way, which I did. I Googled how long can people with ovarian cancer live? And they, you know, maximum two years is what I was reading, and I'm like, Oh my God, I've got two years to live. No, I can't. Tim 27:21So you were literally Doom scrolling? Well, like without, we use the term Doom scrolling, like lightly now. But you were. Debbie 27:29Yea, I was.  Tim 27:30You were building up the doom. Debbie 27:31I decided to try and speed up things again, make it happen, you know, using my power. And I just woke up one morning, and after two days, I think from diagnosis, so this would have been a Saturday morning. I woke up at 5am. And I said, Dan, I'm getting dressed. I'm going to the hospital. He goes, baby, it's 5am Where are you going? I said, I'm just gonna sit there until I can speak to someone. I'm not waiting two weeks, I really can't. And that's exactly what I did. I woke up. He came with me. We'd sold our car as well by this time. So we because we were moving to Sweden, so we didn't have a car, got an Uber to the hospital. Tim 28:09And all your stuff is in a truck as well. Right? Debbie 28:10Well, it's in Sweden. It's already made the journey. We had to get Anders and other friends to come and offload for us. It was a nightmare, an absolute nightmare. And so at the hospital, I just waited. I went in there six o'clock, as soon as the oncology department opened, I just there was sort of seating just outside. And I sat there and waited for a staff member that came through. I'm like, I need to speak to someone right now. Tim 28:41Right? So you were advocating for yourself, you're advocating for knowledge for not being left in the lurch. And saying Debbie 28:48I'm also knowing, I need to know, you know, is this? You know, I know that there are so many advances in, you know, the treatment of cancer today, it's not as it was 20 or 30 years ago. It's far advanced. So I just want to know, will I live? Or will I die? Can you put a timeline on it? Or can you not? What's the deal? And so yeah, I did actually happen to speak to a really nice oncologist who looked at all my sort of notes and my scan results and everything. And he said, and this is where it got even worse. It's it. This looks so complicated. We actually can't treat you in this hospital. So we need to refer you to one of my colleagues. Her name is Angela. And she's, you know, the hospital just 20 minutes down the road. It's one of the best cancer research hospitals, certainly in the country and certainly in the world. And you'll be in good, good hands. I'm making you an appointment for Monday. So yeah, go go and see. No, no, he saw kind of the distress and then sometimes I'm Tim, you have to go with your feelings. You have to trust what you feel like doing rather than keep second-guessing yourself.  Tim 30:08Yeah, you weren't on anybody else's schedule. You weren't in anyone else's rules.  Debbie 30:12Yeah, I was on my own. Yeah. So that's another good sort of characteristic to develop because, you know best and you know how things should be. So yeah, I will just fast forward. I went to see Angela, Dan and I, it was our first time ever stepping over the threshold of a cancer hospital. Surprisingly, it was a lovely place. Even today, it's still my happy place. And saw Angela, she did more tests looked at me and said, Debbie, I'm so happy to tell you that we have developed a curative care plan for you and that word curative. I will never forget the emotion. The rush of emotion, our shoulders, both Dan and I, our shoulders dropped. We just breathed, exhaled a deep breath out. We both started crying. But smiling at the same time, because now I knew I'm not gonna die. So now I was... Tim 31:22Knew, not hoped.  Debbie 31:26Knew. 100% knew. Yeah, she said curative? While I was talking to Dr. Angela. George. I googled her just to see. And I saw that wow, this woman is, she's a kick-ass boss lady. I mean, she is like, head of genomics head of research. She's fabulous. She's known the world over. So when I saw her credential, I almost then and I still joke with her today I say, Oh my God, you're a goddess. She's from New Zealand. And I always say to her, I didn't see her for two weeks one time, and because she was on vacation, and when she got back, I was like, Oh my god. Dr. Jordan, I missed you. Where have you been? Oh, I went home to New Zealand. Ah, great. What did you do there? You know, my mom had a long list of chores for me to do. What? Does your mother not know who you are? You are Dr. Angela? Can I, I need to speak to your mom. You should be home eating grapes with somebody standing fanning you and you know caring to your every need and whim. And she's like Debbie, I'm a human being just like you are. Tim 32:27It's funny when I wouldn't give to hear Dr. Angela's perspective and perception of you through all of this. Man, that would be would be something to hear.  Debbie 32:38Yeah, I have heard it. Yeah, that's for another time. Okay. Anyway, so once she said that, and we knew both Dan and I, almost in unison, said, Okay, what should we do? Tell us what to do, and we will do it. And that was our mindset going forwards, even till today. It's tell us what to do. We'll do it. And of course, by they then you know, just to speed it up to them. Otherwise, we'll be here forever. She put a you know, six months chemo, followed by surgery, followed by monitoring tests. And basically, that's the plan. Yeah. And, you know, had all sorts of ups and downs during that time had nearly had my right leg amputated. I reacted badly to my first chemo drug. Paclitaxel, I'll never forget that I'm allergic to Paclitaxel. And on a scale of one to five, one being the not-so-bad. I'm a five. So basically, I passed out and woke up three hours or four hours later, with all these things attached my beautiful red dress split in half, because time was of the essence. So they have no time to, oh, let's not spoil her dress. And, you know, I'm here. I'm a fighter. I'm here. I'm resilient. Tim 33:54You gave yourself over to the process. That process was a curative process. That process was one more thing that you needed to do…  Debbie 33:59To achieve my red house. Tim 34:05To achieve this red house. Debbie 34:09So I had to also have some psychotherapy whilst I was being treated for cancer because, yeah, it's an aggressive cancer that I have and it's also an aggressive treatment for it. So, during my, one of my therapy sessions, I remember my therapist said, Debbie, you need an anchor, you need something to hold on to throughout this process. And we call it an anchor and that's going to anchor you and keep you steady. And so what is your anchor, and immediately I blurted out, The Red House. That's my anchor. I'm just going to live and fight this battle for the Red House. Of course you do it for your, you know, my beautiful partner, Dan, for my children, and for the grandson I didn't yet have at that time. So you know, I'm doing it for all of them. But I'm also doing it for the Red House. Tim 35:02And the Red House is so much more than just a building. I mean, it is an expression of everything that you were heading towards, what an optimum life looked like for you. I mean, often when we're doing, we're doing career, when I'm coaching, and we're looking at somebody's career, I ask them the question, “What is what is this all for? What's your future look like?” And when it comes to a job, I'll say, “What is the best day of the last year you're ever going to work look like?”, or the last year of your career going to look like, and then that's our North Star, that's the one that we're going towards. And this Red House was your North Star. Debbie 35:42It was indeed, it was indeed. But also it was place, because both Dan and I are very sociable people. We are gregarious we are. We love friends and family. And we said, we're not going to get a little red house that just fits us too. We're going to get a red house where everybody can come our friends, our family. It's just a place of community and socializing, and fun and laughing and enjoyment and love and sitting around the fight. It's all of that, Tim. So the red house is that red house, but it is a bigger vision than just the red house. Tim 36:22Let's maybe use this then to talk about and, and like not to gloss over this. You have still, you still had to battle. You've still had other aspects when it comes to the cancer journey. You are thankfully healthy now. But it has come at no small amount of effort, right? At the same time, you are now in the dream. You are, the dream is now reality. So give us a sense of what were the surprises? What were the surprises, the little things that this house has meant to you, that this new life has meant to you, that achieving this goal has meant to you? And also, perhaps the things that you never thought were going to happen that suddenly are realities. What does life look like now in the dream?  Debbie 37:06Oh, it's wonderful. I can't… I actually have another dream because I can't live without a dream. We always have to have a dream. But that's something else. I'll tell you at the end. Remember to ask me what my dream is now. It's wonderful. I really cannot stress enough how as human beings, we need to believe that we are stronger than we think we are more resilient than we think. And we absolutely can achieve. Yes, it's hard, as you said, Yes. You know, the trajectory to the dream is tough. And you know, I was pushed down that mountain 1000 times, Tim. But I got up. And I kept going. So it isn't so much about failing, because I did. But it's how do you pick yourself up after failing? Do you hold on to that North Star, that anchor? What do you do? And that's exactly what I did. I held on and held on. And you know, I made sure I shared my dream with everybody. I came in contact with Dr. Georgia. And when I had my second, my recurrence, my cancer came back after five months of being clear. And she knew I had this dream. And she said, Debbie, don't get the stress because we can we can treat this by surgery. So look at this as a big boulder in you, going along the road to your dream, all of a sudden a boulder comes and gets in your way. What do you do? Just go around it and then continue. So that's what we're going to do. We're going to go around the bouider and put you back on your road. And yeah, again, you know, that was so close, Tim. We came back in June of 2022. After being given the all-clear. We were here for days, the surgeon in London phoned and said I'm sorry, we your scan you had two weeks ago showed two masses one, seven and a half centimetres, one three and a half centimetres. Do you need to come back? For days, Tim? Yeah, I went back and then in February of this year, it all came to be I didn't wait for the all-clear. I made an arrangement with my hospital in London that, you know, I'll come back every three months for treatment and tests and scans. So in February, we looked at 13 houses in two days. And it's a big area that we had to cover. Everything is like 30-40 minutes apart. And we looked at thirteen. I actually got sick from looking at so many, all the houses and then went back to London and packed up the few things that we could now bring with us. By this time we bought another car so we packed the car up, drove to Sweden from London with our stuff, put an offer into the house that we saw, which was this one. It was accepted by the lovely Gustaf, who is the developer, and he built this house with his own hands. And when we finally met, we shared our story with him. He started crying, we started crying. He goes, as I was building this house, I was hoping that it would go to someone with love and who saw it for what it was. And he goes... Tim 40:19He had no idea.  Debbie 40:21Yea, he had no idea it was for me or for us. He even said I was going to paint it white because I'd ordered the red paint. And then I thought,  no, all the other houses are white, I need to paint this one white. So you phoned the company where he ordered the paint from and said, look, can I change from red to white? And the company said, sorry, no, we've already mixed your paint for you. It's coming. So he said oh, okay, don't worry, I'll just paint it red. How about that? Tim 40:52Well, it's, you know, we can talk about serendipity for sure. But I'm sure Gustaf, he had no idea of when he was looking for somebody that would love that house, just how much meaning it would represent. Debbie 41:04Oh, he said that. And we actually invited him back after we'd moved in and, you know, changed things. That garden was developed. And it's now furnished, and it's got our stamp on it. And he came over, and again, he was filled with tears. And he's like, this is exactly what I had in mind that you would do in this room when I built it. This is how I, you know, our open plan kitchen and living room has a Fika area. Remember Fika? Very important. He actually said I want this to be the heart. And where we all gather? And for sure, Tim, everything happens in the Fika area. Tim 41:41Yea, and Fika, for those that don't know, what's the word? Debbie 41:44Fika is the art of Swedish coffee, drinking, where you go, you take time to be in the moment with friends, colleagues, family, whoever, no electronics, nothing, you just are present, and enjoy each other over a cup of coffee or tea, and a bun or a sweet treat. Tim 42:03I think I think that's really interesting to think I see you living always in two zones, you were very clear about what your vision was. But you didn't step too far away from the moment. Because you were always working. You were always working in the moment you worked. Not in somebody's two-week timeframe. But you said no, I gotta go advocate for myself, and you did. And then and then everything for you has been a balance between things being far away and having that Northstar, but then doing what makes immediate sense in order to leverage the situation that's in front of you. Debbie 42:39But I think it all circles back to what you said in the very beginning. You know, the Red House signifies this dream or vision or lifestyle that I wanted to have. And without that clear, definitive dream or vision, I don't feel I could have achieved it. So if I've said, Well, I could live in a red house, maybe a green one would do. Oh, I don't mind if it's close to the city or, you know, maybe it can just be in a field. I'm so sort of wishy-washy. Tim 43:11But but in this case, you did not compromise.  Debbie 43:15No, it was a definitive kind of vision where it had to be. And the picture said it all I wish I knew whose house that was, but it was, you know, close to water with the forest. There, right there and clearly in the countryside. And that is that's how I wanted to live. Yeah, Tim 43:33Yea, it will be a question whether or not that was predetermined? Or if that is something that you made the most likely most statistically possible.  Debbie 43:44I think it's a bit of both. Yeah, I think it's a bit of both because I believe this is my path. And you know, throughout it, I didn't sort of say I'm the cancer person, even though I introduced myself as that. But I always do put a caveat that cancer has never defined me, I still worked on DAP VA limited during my chemotherapy, I'm in the hospital. And, you know, I still did all the things I could do until I couldn't. And when I couldn't I took an eight month break because I had to focus on my recovery and beating this disease. But as soon as I was able to, I came back, and here I am. I've been working ever since. Tim 44:24And it's a life without compromise in many ways, is what I see, like there's of course you make small adjustments. But would you say that through all this, your ability to yes, both flow with things and move around the boulders as you need to. That's a skill that you've obviously developed but also, you're not living by anybody else's rules. Would you say that anything's changed from you and just that level of sort of determination of? Debbie 44:53I've gained a resilience I never thought I had, you know before a pre-cancer, you kind of or even pre-DAP VA limited, you kind of hear the word resilience, people talk about being resilient. And it kind of sort of doesn't settle. But since I've now had to prove resilience, I feel that now I totally understand what that word means. I also understand what self-discovery means. Because never did I look inward, I would always just do things and never sort of think, how am I doing this? And what's my driver? What's the goal? I would just do it, you know. And so, this whole becoming a business owner, having this dream, having cancer has taught me and showed me that yeah, I'm sorry to use the cliche, but we are so much stronger than we think. Tim 45:51You have to be careful not to believe what you think. That's so yeah. Debbie 45:55Yea, and I kept sort of feeding my brain with positive things. You know, funny thing is Tim, this house before we even moved, or even had viewed it, in London, I bought all the soft furnishings, for a four-bedroom house. And, you know, Dan was like, You're crazy. You don't even know it's gonna have three bedrooms or four. But I said, No, I know, I'm just buying this room, this room, this room, I bought enough stuff for two bathrooms. It's like, we don't know if we can have two bathrooms, baby. I said, no, I know. Tim 46:30Not everybody is going to always understand. And I think for those of the people that are listening, if this story doesn't give them some perspective, in terms of just how, you know, if you think your life is difficult, take a look, take a look at what Debbie's overcome and adopt some of her principles. And I mean, what I'm what I've jotted down here, as we've been talking is that North Star, that vision is, among the first the ability to break things down into into manageable chunks, the ability to then build a momentum. That's just incredible. And I remember back in the day, we used to say, you know, put yourself between the immovable object and the irresistible force, right? And then, you know, you know, Your situation may change and you're ready to be resilient for what unknowns are going to come up or what things how the environment or how the situation is going to change. You need to flow with that.  Debbie 47:27And I think it's also the power of positivity, you know, I read her book at the time that I was actually I was staying in hospital. And you know, it's just that positivity, Tim, I know, it sounds like nothing, but oh, my God, the power of positivity is a force that you cannot reckon with. I'm sorry, it's staying positive. That's also another thing I learned. You know, I did consider myself a positive person before cancer, pre-cancer, but I didn't realize that positivity actually can change your life. Tim 48:06Well, I'm for those of you that are interested. Read has been on the show a couple of times, or we've got two episodes with read on it. We'll put links to those in the shownotes.  Debbie 48:12Yeah, definitely.  Tim 48:15Your story about how you're able to advocate for yourself is one of the things that I love most about that is just when you are willing to stand up for yourself, how many people will then stand up with you. Whereas if you're willing, if you're just going to relegate yourself to you know, being part of some predetermined process, people will keep moving the way they were moving anyway. And I think back to Dolly Parton, she had this saying if you don't like the road, you're on pave a new one. In your story, I just so many times you found yourself on a road more rocky than perhaps you had anticipated. Debbie 48:56Yea, so true. Dolly's words.  Tim 48:59Yea, as we wrap up here, let's, let's talk a little bit about some of the amazing things that are happening now. Your story has inspired many other people. Debbie 49:08I'm filled with gratitude, really, Tim. You know, every day I wake up, I'm alive, I'm healthy, I can do all the things that I could be for my cancer, despite having body parts missing, ie, I have a stoma, that colostomy bag on my left side. And I can still do everything. So I'm really grateful. So then I just kind of thought, now I'm on my feet. I'm back at work. You know, I'm enjoying working with my clients, who I love and adore all of you, all of them. And how can I give back? How do we, what do I do? What should I do? I can't just sit here and bask in the glory of the grid house. So I decided to put myself in the most uncomfortable position ever, which is speaking in public. And so I share my story wherever I'm invited. In order to you know, spread awareness that we can achieve that getting a terminal or a serious illness diagnosis perhaps is the better term is not the end of the road. There is light at the end of the tunnel. And you know, just maybe adjusting our mindset a little because you do have to contend with dealing with your illness as well. But you know, within that, try your hardest to see the positive side of these things. For example, having Chloe, that's the name of my stoma. Chloe, the colostomy, gives me priority boarding on any flight. So wow, I love, I love Chloe and airport security. I just go present myself at the fast track with my little badge. And there I go on the fast track. I never queue. Tim 50:55There you go, so many silver linings. Debbie 50:58They are so yeah, yeah, absolutely. And also, I enjoy speaking, one on one like this. Very nervous about speaking in public. And so yesterday, I was invited to speak for a charity that actually helped us, Dan and I in 2021, when we were down and out, it's called the Macmillan Cancer Charity, based in the UK. I love them to death. Well, no, I love them not to death, but I love them. And so I love them to live. And they said, would you come and share your story as our away day so that, you know, all the people who support and donate and work in this charity understand, and just are reminded of why they do the job they do. It's because of people like me, they literally gave me life. They supported me when I was in my darkest moments in so many ways, Tim. And so I thought yeah, of course I'll do it even though my stomach was doing somersaults the whole time. And I felt like throwing up and pay off with me lunch and I couldn't eat. But I just thought now I've got to do this. And you know, there was not a dry eye in the room. And I didn't do it to make them cry. I said to them, no, I'm I'm emotional. Because I'm so grateful to have this platform, not only to share, but also to actually thank you, each and every single one of you, how much you, you know, helped us to thank you for, you turned our lives around. And so, you know what you do, please do not minimize it. You actually do change lives.  Tim 52:38Again, it's a story for another time, but we can talk about, you've shared with me how influential you're being locally around local government and other areas. You're exercising your advocacy  Debbie 52:45My a voice.  Tim 52:49Yeah, yeah, your voice without making it too cute. If you weren't operating from this dream achieved, in a sense, you're in the red house. Now if you, if you didn't have this new these set of of traumatic and like, this amazing, but very treacherous journey that you've been on. You're seeing things with new eyes. If you if that hadn't happened? Would you have the voice you have today? Debbie 53:19No, absolutely not. I'd be on the treadmill that I had been on for 34 years. Same old, same old, nothing new. Tim 53:26So I'm gonna ask you two things. One is, let people know where they can connect with you.  Debbie 53:35Absolutely.  Tim 53:36Where would you like them to connect with you? And the second thing is, if you had a wish for people that are listening to this today, what would that wish be? Okay, so where can people find you? Debbie 53:44where can people find you so people can find me? I'm on LinkedIn. So it's just Google Debbie Potts. My company is DAP VA Limited. They can also just Google DAP VA Limited. Tim 53:58We'll put those in the show notes. Debbie 53:59Perfect. So yeah, I think my one wish for everybody who's listening and facing any kind of challenge, uncertainty, you know, indecisive. Don't give up; find your anchor, find your north star and work towards it. Because you'll get there. Tim 54:22And every step towards that star is going to be a discovery about who we really are. Debbie 54:29Absolutely. But it also takes you that one step closer. No matter what it takes you step, it takes you closer, so please don't give up whoever you are, wherever you are. Tim 54:40Keep coming back to that even when it seems that it's pulled away from you a little further, you know? Debbie 54:45Yeah, totally. Oh, you got it, Tim, you understand. Tim 54:49Right. Well, Debbie, love you so much. And thank you for spending time with me.  Debbie 54:55That's okay.  Tim 54:56Okay. Well, Debbie 54:57You're so welcome. Thank you very much Tim 54:58Till next time. Buh-bye  Debbie 55:00Bye.  Tim 55:01There's so much more we could talk about. We didn't even get to talk about your next dream.  Debbie 55:07Well, Do you want to know what it is, Tim?  Tim 55:09Yea, I do?  Debbie 55:10It's a Yamarin, six and a half foot, boat, speed boat. It has a sundeck at the back enough for six to seven people. It's got a little table so we can have our dinner in the middle of the archipelago in the ocean.  Tim 55:20There we go.  Debbie 55:22It's got to cover so that Dan and I can go and camp out in the archipelago should we wish. So I have a picture of a boat. So I'm working towards it. I'm close. I'm very close. The deadline or the timeline is March 2024 to purchase it. If not before. And then they will put it in the water. So I've been to speak to them. I've spoken I'm a regular visitor, I go sort of every two weeks, and they all know my name. They go ideally, you ready to buy the boat? I go no, no, no, not yet. But I have a question. So they're gonna put it in the water for us in April next year, already and good to go. And then we're going to use it throughout the summer season. And then in September, October, they're going to pick it up and store it for us. Ready for the following year. And they're going to clean it services, fix it and we don't even have to worry about any of that. So in order to achieve that dream, I first need a spot to moor my boat during the summer season. So, before I can buy the boat, because it's pointless having a boat and got nowhere to put it. During the summer season. I had to go and find the spot and of course all the spots are taken because we live close to the water. And you know, everybody has the boats in the summer. So everyone was like no, the spot is a two-year waiting list. Now I can't wait to use that spot. There's no hardly anybody changes. You know what I did? I went old school Tim. I typed on a piece of A4 paper. And we invite everybody new to the area. We live in (area of Sweden) and we're looking for a spot to moor boats. If anyone knows of anybody who's giving up this spot and will please remember this number. Old guy rang the number. And he says, oh, yeah, I know a spot over, maybe it's a five-minute drive from us that okay? And we go absolutely. We got a spot.  Tim 57:24There you go.  Debbie 57:26Got a spot. Tim 57:29So Debbie's next dream is the boat. The boat, the blue boat. What color is it?  Debbie 57:38It's white. It's called a Yamarin. I'll send you a picture after this. Tim 57:42Sounds great. All right. Can't wait to hear about Debbie's next adventure soon. Tim 57:53Thank you so much for listening to Sweet on Leadership. If you found today's podcast valuable, consider visiting our website and signing up for the companion newsletter. You can find the link in the show notes. If, like us, you think it's important to bring new ideas and skills into the practice of leadership. Please give us positive rating and review on Apple podcasts. This helps us spread the word to other committed leaders. And you can spread the word to by sharing this with your friends, teams and colleagues. Thanks again for listening. And be sure to tune in in two weeks time for another episode of Sweet on Leadership. In the meantime, I'm your host, Tim Sweet, encouraging you to keep on leading 

VictoryGP
Into The Cloud | Living In The Light

VictoryGP

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 20, 2023 43:14


Today The LORD IS CALLING US INTO THE CLOUD He has been TEACHING us what it means to LIVE IN THE LIGHT BUT TO MEET HIM IN THE LIGHT, YOU have to come through the cloud. Coming through the cloud is the place where we learn the fear of God so that we might not sin against Him. GOD IS terrifying because of WHAT He is. But if you SEE HIM FOR WHO He is, and hear HIS CALL TO DRAW NEAR, you will venture through the cloud and into the light. POINT OF MESSAGE: People where assembled at the base of the mountain and the Lord was at the top, wanting so much for us to come. The people celebrated at the base of the mountain, but God was calling them to come speak with Him face to face. It was like they still responded to God as Israel did when only Moses went, the rest were terrified and said, “if the Lord speaks to us we will surely die.” The Lord was grieved that the people would not come up the mountain. They didn't understand “whoever seeks to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for MY sake will find it and keep it for eternal life.” That He was there to bring them into His transfiguration, to be seen for who HE IS and give them the light of life. Matthew 16:25 “For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it; but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it.” When the Lord calls us to to the cloud of His glory, it IS terrifying, because He is HOLY and HE IS GOING TO CONFRONT OUR IDOLS Exodus 20:18-21 And all the people were watching and hearing the [j]thunder and the lightning flashes, and the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking; and when the people saw it all, they trembled and stood at a distance. 19Then they said to Moses, “Speak [k]to us yourself and we will listen; but do not have God speak [l]to us, or we will die!” 20However, Moses said to the people, “Do not be afraid; for God has come in order to test you, and in order that the fear of Him may [m]remain with you, so that you will not sin.” 21So the people stood at a distance, while Moses approached the thick darkness where God was. The people were meant to LEARN THE FEAR OF GOD in this encounter, in being brought near to HIS HOLINESS, so that they would be delivered from idolatry by VIRTUE of the AWE and REVERENCE of GOD. But they kept their distance not just physically, but spiritually. But not MOSES Exodus 24: 15-18 Then Moses went up to the mountain, and the cloud covered the mountain. 16The glory of the LORD rested on Mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it for six days; and on the seventh day He called to Moses from the midst of the cloud. 17And to the eyes of the sons of Israel the appearance of the glory of the LORD was like a consuming fire on the mountain top. 18Moses entered the midst of the cloud as he went up to the mountain; and Moses was on the mountain forty days and forty nights. MOSES went into the cloud, and the end result is that he came out with a face reflecting the light of God. THE PEOPLE kept their physical, emotional, and spiritual distance from GOD and IMMEDIATELY went back to Egypt in their hearts, and to worshipping a golden calf made by their own hands. God IS terrifying not because he DESIRES to be, but because He is SO SO HOLY and we are SO SO NOT God is doing EVERYTHING HE CAN to be as close as He can to the PEOPLE HE LOVES But what fellowship does LIGHT have with darkness? 1 Timothy 6:16 “HE alone possesses immortality and dwells in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see.” But he doesn't just DWELL in unapproachable light, HE IS LIGHT 1 John 1:5 “This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.” God is not the dark cloud of chaos and confusion, He is the LIGHT on the other side of it

Mount Pleasant Lutheran Church
September 10, 2023 - Preaching Text Genesis 2:4b-25 - By: Pastor Sheila Rawn

Mount Pleasant Lutheran Church

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 12, 2023 20:37


Preaching Text:   Genesis 2:4b-25 4These are the generations of the heavens and the earth when they were created. In the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens, 5 when no plant of the field was yet in the earth and no herb of the field had yet sprung up—for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was no one to till the ground; 6but a stream would rise from the earth, and water the whole face of the ground— 7then the LORD God formed man from the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and the man became a living being. 8And the LORD God planted a garden in Eden, in the east; and there he put the man whom he had formed. 9Out of the ground the LORD God made to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food, the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. 10A river flows out of Eden to water the garden, and from there it divides and becomes four branches. 11The name of the first is Pishon; it is the one that flows around the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold; 12and the gold of that land is good; bdellium and onyx stone are there. 13The name of the second river is Gihon; it is the one that flows around the whole land of Cush. 14The name of the third river is Tigris, which flows east of Assyria. And the fourth river is the Euphrates. 15The LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to till it and keep it. 16And the LORD God commanded the man, “You may freely eat of every tree of the garden; 17but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall die.” 18Then the LORD God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper as his partner.” 19So out of the ground the LORD God formed every animal of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. 20The man gave names to all cattle, and to the birds of the air, and to every animal of the field; but for the man there was not found a helper as his partner. 21So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then he took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. 22And the rib that the LORD God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. 23Then the man said, “This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; this one shall be called Woman, for out of Man this one was taken.” 24Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and clings to his wife, and they become one flesh. 25And the man and his wife were both naked, and were not ashamed.

The Vine Community Church Sermon Podcast

The Ark Returned to Israel 6The ark of theLordwas in the country of the Philistines seven months.2And the Philistines called for the priests andthe diviners and said, What shall we do with the ark of theLord? Tell us with what we shall send it to its place.3They said, If you send away the ark of the God of Israel, do not send it empty, but by all means return hima guilt offering. Then you will be healed, and it will be known to you whyhis hand does not turn away from you.4And they said, What is the guilt offering that we shall return to him? They answered, Five goldentumors and five golden mice,according to the number of the lords of the Philistines, for the same plague was on all of you and on your lords.5So you must make images of yourtumors and images of your mice that ravage the land,and give glory to the God of Israel. Perhapshe will lighten his hand from off youand your gods and your land.6Why should you harden your hearts asthe Egyptians andPharaoh hardened their hearts? After he had dealt severely with them,did they not send the people away, and they departed?7Now then, take and preparea new cart and two milk cowson which there has never come a yoke, and yoke the cows to the cart, but take their calves home, away from them.8And take the ark of theLordand place it on the cart and put in a box at its sidethe figures of gold, which you are returning to him asa guilt offering. Then send it off and let it go its way9and watch. If it goes up on the way to its own land, toBeth-shemesh, then it is he who has done us this great harm, but if not, then we shall know that it is nothis hand that struck us; it happened to us by coincidence. 10The men did so, and took two milk cows and yoked them to the cart and shut up their calves at home.11And they put the ark of theLordon the cart and the box with the golden mice and the images of their tumors.12And the cows went straight in the direction ofBeth-shemesh alongone highway, lowing as they went. They turned neither to the right nor to the left, and the lords of the Philistines went after them as far as the border ofBeth-shemesh.13Now the people ofBeth-shemesh were reaping their wheat harvest in the valley. And when they lifted up their eyes and saw the ark, they rejoiced to see it.14The cart came into the field of Joshua of Beth-shemesh and stopped there.A great stone was there. And they split up the wood of the cart and offered the cows as a burnt offering to theLord.15And the Levites took down the ark of theLordand the box that was beside it, in which were the golden figures, and set them uponthe great stone. And the men ofBeth-shemesh offered burnt offerings and sacrificed sacrifices on that day to theLord.16And whenthe five lords of the Philistines saw it, they returned that day to Ekron. 17These are the golden tumors that the Philistines returned as aguilt offering to theLord: one for Ashdod, one for Gaza, one for Ashkelon, one for Gath, one for Ekron,18and the golden mice, according to the number of all the cities of the Philistines belonging to the five lords,both fortified cities and unwalled villages.The great stone beside which they set down the ark of theLordis a witness to this day in the field of Joshua of Beth-shemesh. 19And he struck some of the men of Beth-shemesh, because they looked upon the ark of theLord. He struck seventy men of them,[a]and the people mourned because theLordhad struck the people with a great blow.20Then the men of Beth-shemesh said,Who is able to stand before theLord, this holy God? And to whom shall he go up away from us?21So they sent messengers to the inhabitants ofKiriath-jearim, saying, The Philistines have returned the ark of theLord. Come down and take it up to you. 7And the men of Kiriath-jearim came and took up the ark of theLordand brought it to the house ofAbinadab on the hill. And they consecrated his son Eleazar to have charge of the ark of theLord.2From the day that the ark was lodged at Kiriath-jearim, a long time passed, some twenty years, and all the house of Israel lamented after theLord.

It's Not Rocket Science! Five Questions Over Coffee
Five Questions Over Coffee with Joe Templin (ep. 80)

It's Not Rocket Science! Five Questions Over Coffee

Play Episode Listen Later May 18, 2023 17:53


Who is Joe?Joe is the human Kaizen expert and author of the Amazon Kindle #1 New Release "Every Day Excellence".Key TakeawaysFrom every mistake to every interaction. 3:34Taking a step back and looking at your mistakes. 5:22Understanding failure as an opportunity. 8:35Books that would add value. 9:44Why aren't you like this? 12:19Using time with intention and starve your distractions. 15:06Valuable Free Resource or Actionhttps://everyday-excellence.com/excellence-shop/A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :_________________________________________________________________________________________________Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/newsletterFind out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguestSubscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcastHelp us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : https://scientificvaluebuildingmachine.onlineIt's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way————————————————————————————————————————————-TranscriptNote, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)SUMMARY KEYWORDSpeople, joe, book, kaizen, understand, programme, mistakes, brilliant, brain, life, mark manson, friends, learn, talking, everyday, forward slash newsletter, power, screw, day, bigSPEAKERSStuart Webb, Joe TemplinStuart Webb 00:17Hi, and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I have my coffee here. Joe has got his coffee in front of him. That's brilliant Joe well done. I'm just really, really glad to have Joe Templin with me today. Joe is an author and he's a human Kaizen expert. I'm really looking forward to the conversation. Joe has a website called everyday excellence.com Really well worth going on and having a look at some of the stuff that Joe talks about that I'm really confronted with conversation. So welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee, JoeJoe Templin 00:50Stewart, happy Pi Day, it's a nerd Hi holiday, I could actually be wearing my Pi Day shirt, but we're in the middle of a blizzard. And so we're making do with what we have.Stuart Webb 01:00Yeah, I'm just looking at my window, right. And it has started that the heavens have opened and hail is now falling. I don't know what I've done to deserve this. But you can't hear it on the roof. Thankfully, Joe, listen, let's just talk a little bit about the sort of the problems that the customers are trying to help and the problems that they've got when you when you reach out to them.Joe Templin 01:21So let's just start with the premise that everybody has problems. The reason why is because everybody is alive and is a component of life that you're going to have difficulties and struggle. If we can start from that premise, then it's easy to see that everybody can benefit from who I am and what I do. And I'm not everybody's cup of tea or a glass of whiskey as it might be. But there are aspects of what we talk about that are really across the board and for everybody. And I am a human Kaizen expert, a lot of people are familiar with Kaizen from the manufacturing world where it's the concept of continuous improvement. And it's been applied to manufacturing, finance, software, but we are not applying it to the most basic and important component of any business or organisation, which is the people. And when you're a little kid, you are engaged in human Kaizen, you're learning to walk and you fail multiple times, you're learning to talk and you fail multiple times, you're learning to tie your shoes or draw or ride a bike. And so you're in this continuous improvement mindset. Really, until the time that people reach teenage years, maybe even when they go off to university. And then two thirds of the people stop growing. And so as you move further in your life and your career, it further Narrows and people start to be resigned to their current situation, or they just follow orders from their boss or from somebody in a uniform or what have you. And so we need to almost regress somewhat, to that childhood, to be able to re stimulate and grow and be the best that we can be and sort of appropriate that we're doing this on March 14, because this is Albert Einstein's birthday. And Albert Einstein himself said that the essence of genius is to maintain the enthusiasm of childhood into adulthoodStuart Webb 03:34and loved I love I love that quote Joe and I think you're absolutely right there are so many of us that have forgotten that in order to learn how to walk you have to fall on your backside several times and get up and say well that's not the way to do it, then is it let's have another crack and too many of us think that you should get it right. Well, yeah, we should aim to get it right first time but in actual fact you beat yourself up and I had a conversation yesterday with somebody who's starting out in their business and the one thing that he said is I made a lot of mistakes in February but I decided that I got to learn from those mistakes and I thought well he you're likely to make a success that aren't you know, that was that was that was just just warms my heart that this is this is somebody who just decided he'd made mistakes but he wasn't gonna beat himself up he was gonna learn from those mistakes and I guess that's that's the essence of what we're talking about. If you can extractJoe Templin 04:25one bit of information one pearl is my father calls it from every mistake from every interaction you can string together enough those pearls now a very rich life.Stuart Webb 04:37Yeah, brilliant. So one of the sort of things you find that your, your the people you're reaching out to help have tried to do in the past and essentially failed to do Joe before you can you can step in and try and do what you can't help them.Joe Templin 04:50One of the big overarching component actually looking at you know, the meta awareness from this is that people are failing To learn from their failures, because we all fail. And as we were talking about with learning to walk or your guy in business, there are a lot of salespeople then trading currently, you know, we make mistakes, we screw up. And because we're interacting with other individuals, there's lot of delaying false self false self interactions going on there, that we have to deal with. But it's people make the same mistakes again, and again, because they're not pausing, taking a step back and looking at what went right and what went wrong. In the military. They do after action, debriefs, and professional sports they watch the tape afterwards. And having the ability to set your ego aside and look at any interaction whether it was with your significant other or extravagant. Other unfortunately, whether it's in business, whether it's in an athletic endeavour, whether it's music, or trying to develop any other skill, taking the time to step back, look at disengage your ego, and emotion, and looking at the situation to try and extract the wisdom from it. So that the next iteration that your better is really the biggest mistake I see people make because they're either too emotional, or they don't take the time because they're too busy, which seems to be the way of the world at this point. Or they are unwilling to take ownership of part of the screw up, essentially, and make it so that next time they're better.Stuart Webb 06:39I really, really can't thank you enough for bringing us back to thinking about that sort of thing. Tell me Is there a particular valuable free offer a valuable piece of free advice that you can leave with the audience at the moment and this point, I'm going to put up what I think is a really interesting website, web links that you can you can refer us to which is everyday hyphen excellence.com. Forward slash, excellence hyphen shop.Joe Templin 07:04So if you go to the everyday excellence.com website every single day, there's a new blog there. And so every single day, there's free information, free insight for individuals that can help them grow and develop and improve in some capacity. If they go into the shop, they can find the three day three brain free training programme, which is a three day programme. Being honest there, and it's completely free, no hidden costs or anything, just sign up and every single day, for the three days of the programme, you'll receive an email. And what I do is I go through the evolutionary history of the brain from a biology point of view, the lizard brain, the monkey brain, or limbic system, and then the neocortex, and explain how it works, and how its evolved, and how they interact. And some of the power and weaknesses thereof, because we live in an information society. So everybody's trying to focus on their neocortex, but they don't realise that that is, although it's incredibly powerful. It is limited its capacity when compared with the older, stronger parts of the brain. And this is why even though you're on a diet and trying to finish your work, you're gonna go out and have tacos and margaritas with your buddies, because you've got 80 plus percent of your brain saying we want tacos, we want friends, as opposed to the neocortex. And so understanding these different components will allow people to harness the full power of their capability and utilise it.Stuart Webb 08:35It's really interesting, isn't it, because it's by understanding and despite the fact that you've explained it so well there, it's by understanding those things that you can actually start to address the, the failings you sometimes have where you don't understand where a feeling or where a behaviour has come from. And it's only by starting to break that down and understand it, you can actually start to sort of refocus your attention as it were, isn't it so that it's learning to do that that's the key thing to sort of being able to adapt to those new habits. And indeed, in your business life learning that in actual fact, we just said, a failure doesn't actually mean that everything's coming to an end, you just use it as an as a learning experience, if you can change your mindset. And you can understand where some of that's come from, you've got the power to do that.Joe Templin 09:20As Sun Tzu said, you know, 2000 plus years ago, he knows his enemy, and himself will ever be victorious. And essentially, you have three different selves and three different enemies going on simultaneously within your triune brain. And so you need to understand and utilise all of them. And if you can get them working in harmony, that's when you unlock your power. And you can do pretty awesome stuff.Stuart Webb 09:43Joe, love it. Joe, is there a particular book or a concept or programme that you think would add some value and I know there's a book currently over your left hand shoulder so I don't sure if you want to refer to that one in particular? Yeah.Joe Templin 09:56This is my book. So obviously I want people to buy this book because You know, that lets me buy beer and be able to, you know, go do more research and stuff like that. So everyday excellence.com they can get the book every day excellence. And obviously, I'm going to encourage people to do that. But when we were talking earlier about great books, it made me think about all the books that I've consumed because reading or audiobooks or what have you are all consuming information over the past few years. And the two that really rise to mind. One is the E Myth Revisited by Michael Gerber. I saw him speak decades ago, and it was like Sam Kinison, you know, on steroids, he was absolutely insane, but awesome. So anybody who is working in any sort of business or sales capacity, that is about how to systematise. And when you systematise, you free up time, so that you can go do other things. So that allows you to go run the ultra marathons, or learn guitar or spend more time with your sweetie or whatever, because you're able to do your business much more efficiently. And the other big one is Mark Manson's book, The Subtle Art of not giving up. And that one is, at this point, I think one of the leading self help sales books in terms of sales. And it's all about resource allocation. About you only have so many apps so much that you can care about. And so if you can allocate it towards the things that are most important to you, you're going to not be bothered by Little things like, Oh, we got snow start. Okay, roll with the punches deal with, oh, you know what this happened? Not a big deal. Because I'm concerned about this, well, this is building your business, or again, your special needs kid, you know, to develop properly, or getting through that issue with your relationship, as Nietzsche said, for man has a strong enough why he will overcome any how. And the subtle art of not giving up is about understanding yourself understanding that world screwed up, because once you understand that you can move forward. And from that point, being able to allocate your bandwidth to the most important areas of your life.Stuart Webb 12:19Absolutely love it. Brilliant, brilliant recommendations. Absolutely. really buy into those. A Joe, you know, I've asked you a bunch of questions. And I guess there's one question that you're currently thinking, why isn't he talked about this? Or what is it he hasn't yet mentioned? So I'm not going to throw open to you? What is the question that you would have liked me to have asked despite I failed to do, obviously. And then once you've asked the question, what would the answer be? Otherwise, we'll all be sitting here for the next several weeks, wondering what that answer will be. So what is that question? So theJoe Templin 12:47question that I get really often is, you know, how are you like this? Why are you like this? Because I've got a lot of friends who hated me when they first met because they're like, No, there's no way this is an act. Nobody's like this. And you know what my friends from grad school, who's now like Dean of a school, literally said that you she's like, there's no way a human being is like this. And I am like this is Liang talks about in his true self false self model, which is a very interesting read. I don't waste time with illusions. Yes, I write poetry and stuff like that. And I can really use words to spin stuff up. But I am who I am. And is straight on through by not telling lies, especially to yourself, you don't have to waste any energy. And in going back to that Mark Manson allocation of apps, it then allows you to have more resources. And you got to remember life is a gift. This is a wonderful world that we Armstrong and I burned the candle at both ends and in the middle of flame throne. And the reason why is when I was 10 years old, I died. No flatline, floating up bright lights, the whole nine yards big, deep James Earl Jones voice and all that. And I came back home. And so that's the reason why I've been able to work world championships in martial arts, and run ultra marathons and write over a dozen books and get more degrees than a thermometer and play Legos with kids. And you know, take time to watch butterflies and all these things. Because I don't screw around. And I am true to who I am what I am and dedicated to being the best version that I can be of Me, so that I can then bring that out of other individuals. And so there's an old Irish saying, a good friend is the best mirror that you can have. And the best friend that we can actually have is ourselves because we can be true to ourselves. So if you can do that you can really unlock your potential. And you can add what I don't find.Stuart Webb 15:06Joe, I wish I could get that spirit of wanting to, to not waste time into more people because I work occasionally with students. And I worry so much about the fact that students spend half their life worrying about wasting money, but never think about time, they never ever considered time. And the one thing that I say to them on so many occasions, and they look at me as if I'm insane, is you can always get more money, you will never, ever have more time. So use time with intention and feed, your, your, your, your, your excellent and, and, and starve your distractions and they look at me as if I'm insane, because, you know, they never ever focus on those things. It is a brilliant message you've got in order to sort of tell people, you will not get this period of time back ever. So use it with intention and make it your absolute focus.Joe Templin 16:02I wish I was a college student again, there's so much cool stuff to learn, experience and do yo turn off the TV and go actually experience it. Have people read stories about you and your adventures, instead of watching somebody else with them.Stuart Webb 16:18Brilliant, brilliant. Joe, this has been such a really fascinating conversation. And thank you so much for spending just a few minutes with us talking about it. I really would like to encourage all of the listeners at the moment go to everyday hyphen excellence.com forward slash excellence, hyphen shop or just go to everyday hyphen excellence from just read some of the stuff that Joe's got on there. Fascinating stuff, fascinating thinking, really encourage you to go and probe around and have a look. And I just also like to bring to your attention our newsletter because that's how you get to hear about interesting people like Joe and get to see the results of these conversations come back to you through the podcast. And that's link dot the complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter that link dot complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter. Joe, it has been an absolute pleasure to be here talking with you for just a few minutes today. Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate you're in the middle of a blizzard at the moment. I've got the halo briefly stopped, but I suspect it's coming back. So we'll we'll muddle through. We'll have a brilliant day because of it. Thank you very much for your time.Joe Templin 17:28Stuart, thank you for the opportunity to be excellent and grow today.Stuart Webb 17:31And thank you very much for that Joe Get full access to It's Not Rocket Science! at thecompleteapproach.substack.com/subscribe

Focus Forward: An Executive Function Podcast
Ep 23: Parenting for Success: How to Nurture Executive Function Development in Early Childhood

Focus Forward: An Executive Function Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 19, 2023 53:30


If you've been listening to Focus Forward for a while, you know that many of our episodes so far have been focused on teens and adults - but what about the younger kiddos? While we tend to think about how Executive Function skills impact us later in life, these skills do start developing in infancy. I thought it would be helpful to explore what Executive Function skill development looks like in young children, how we can better support them and ourselves in this critical stage of development.In today's episode, we'll learn about this topic from three people who have a depth of insight and experience. First up, you'll hear from Maria Ares, who joined me to talk about supporting Executive Function skill development in the littlest ones in our lives. Maria is a speech language pathologist at a public preschool. And, guess what? She's also my sister! After my conversation with Maria, you'll hear from Stephanie Regan and Mariam Mahmoud who joined me to talk about elementary-aged kids. Both Stephanie and Mariam have worked in elementary education and have lots of experience supporting young children. Maria, Stephanie, and Mariam are all Executive Function coaches with Beyond BookSmart and bring their coaches' perspective to the conversation. I know you'll enjoy learning from their expertise as much as I have! Here are some resources related to our conversation:A Guide to Executive Function - Harvard University Center on the Developing ChildPeg Dawson's Smart but Scattered BooksChild Mind Institute Guide to Executive FunctioningExecutive Function Skills by AgeDownloadable Guides by Age from Harvard UniversityFocus Forward Ep 6: What Does Life Changing Executive Function Support (Really) Look Like? Perspective from a mom with kids who have executive function challengesContact us!Reach out to us at podcast@beyondbooksmart.comIG/FB/TikTok @beyondbooksmartcoachingTranscriptHannah Choi 00:04Hi everyone and welcome to Focus Forward, an executive function podcast where we explore the challenges and celebrate the wins you'll experience as you change your life by working on improving your executive function skills. I'm your host, Hannah Choi. Hannah Choi 00:18If you've listened to focus forward for a while, you'll know that many of our episodes so far have been focused on older kids, our teens and college age students. We've covered mental health, coping skills, social skills and college challenges. While we tend to think about how EF skills impact are older children, these skills do start developing in infancy. Babies' interactions with adults help them learn to focus their attention, build their working memory, and regulate their reactions to the things they experience. Everything is new, so they need to learn how to manage at all. As they grow, young children begin to learn planning, flexible thinking and attention. And as a parent or caregiver of young kiddos you might look at them and think "Do they have any executive function skills at all?" They're developing, and rather unreliable, EF skills require a lot of patience and understanding on our part. As I talked about before in my cognitive flexibility episode, it can help so much to learn about EF skill development. And in doing that, we can recognize that children's EF skill development is nowhere near where ours is. I thought it would be helpful to explore what EF skill development looks like in young children, how we can support them by providing tools that help and how we can support ourselves by understanding where they are in their EF skill development. In today's episode, we'll learn about this topic from three people who have a depth of insight and experience. First up, you'll hear from Maria Ares, who joined me to talk about supporting EF skill development in the littlest ones in our lives. Maria is a speech language pathologist at a public preschool. And guess what? She's also my sister! After my conversation with Maria, you'll hear from Stephanie Regan and Mariam Mahmoud, who joined me to talk about elementary-aged kids. Both Stephanie and Mariam have worked in elementary education, and have lots of experience supporting young children. Maria, Stephanie and Mariam are all EF coaches with Beyond BookSmart. And they bring their coach's perspective to the conversation as well. And bonus if you have watched our webinar, How to Reduce Conflict and Transform Your Parenting Through Executive Function, you'll recognize Mariam's voice and wisdom. And if you haven't watched it, you can find the link in the show notes. It's packed full of executive functioning skill approaches, and tips for reducing conflict with our kids. And hey, I'm the host of that, too. All right now on to the show. Hannah Choi 03:09Hi, Maria. Thanks for joining me today.Maria Ares 03:11Hi, Hannah. Thanks for having me.Hannah Choi 03:13Could you introduce yourself to our listeners?Maria Ares 03:16Sure. My name is Maria. And I'm a speech language pathologist and a public preschool where I work with kids who are aged three, four and five. And I also work for Beyond BookSmart wearing many hats, and quite a bit of coaching and coach development and different roles throughout my time with Beyond BookSmart. Hannah Choi 03:35Great. And you're my sister!Maria Ares 03:38I am. Yes, fun fact.Hannah Choi 03:42So you are quite well versed, I would say at working with kids under five or five and under. And I was just talking with someone the other day who was surprised to hear that executive function skills are like they start developing even at birth, and you know, start to show up at written really young eight, you know, at really young ages. So, what do executive What does executive function look like in a kid who's under the age of five? And what are some challenges that might come up?Maria Ares 04:18Yeah, so pretty much every developmental milestone has some sort of executive function skill behind it. But what executive function challenges look like at this age is pretty much everything. Basically, every executive function skill needs to be supported in preschoolers. I would say that almost every preschooler has difficulty with some if not all executive function skills, and that's developmentally appropriate and that's what we're here for, you know, to teach them and guide them and help them figure out you know, these these little skills that help them be people that can do things.Hannah Choi 04:58Yeah, and as caregivers of children, it can be really frustrating because we're coming from a place of having really well, maybe not really great executive function skills, but more fully developed executive function skills. And so it's can be really hard to understand like, why can't they just fill in the blank?Maria Ares 05:16Absolutely. And there's so many blanks you can fill in there.Hannah Choi 05:20All day, every day. And I love that you said that it's developmentally appropriate. Like, that's totally normal. I mean, our frontal cortex, that prefrontal cortex does not finish the finish developing. And we're seeing that you can still make improvements on your executive function skills after your mid 20s, which is about when the prefrontal cortex kind of is finished developing. So obviously, a kid who is little their prefrontal cortex is just getting going,Maria Ares 05:52Absolutely, yeah, they're in the earliest, earliest stages of being able to, you know, show and develop a lot of these skills. And that's really what a lot of early childhood curriculum is centered around is sort of building up the skills that you need, and also the social emotional piece that goes along with executive functioning, and sort of how you can use those skills to keep learning and growing.Hannah Choi 06:18Yeah, and so I imagine that when parents feel it, parents might feel like there's not enough academics going on, it's in a preschool setting. But really, at that point, there's, it is really important to focus on that social, emotional and executive function, skill development. Maria Ares 06:37Absolutely. You need to be able to learn how to learn before you can start learning and being able to use your developing executive function skills to you know, complete different tasks in the classroom, make a project, follow directions, all those things are so important to academics and academic development, but you really can't make much progress academically, if you don't know how to learn first, Hannah Choi 07:01That reminds me of the idea of metacognition, where you in, in order, like as in, which is actually like pretty much the last executive function skill to fully develop. And the idea of metacognition is like learning how we learn, learning about our own brains and how our own brains work. And so it's kind of the same idea like these, the little kids can't really learn the academics until they learn just how to function with other people.Maria Ares 07:30Absolutely, yeah. And that metacognition piece is something that I think a lot about in my teaching. And I tried to help kids remember that everybody learns differently, and that everybody has different strengths, and everybody has different things that they need to work on. I really try often, after a task to ask, "Was that tricky for you? Or was that easy for you?" And then talk about why because starting to build those metacognitive skills, and understand that everybody's brain works really differently, I think is really important. So they can get to know themselves as a learner. And as a person.Hannah Choi 08:10I was just talking with my college client of mine the other day, and we were talking about how exactly that about how, if you have never been taught to notice how you experience things. And notice what like, what's tricky, what's easy. And then you can figure out the why if you've never been taught that, then well, first of all, it's never too late to learn that. But you've really missed out on some really great opportunities to, like learn about your own learning. So I love hearing that you do that with such little kids, because it is something that you have to practice. And I feel like as an adult, I don't remember learning that as a child, I don't remember learning, reflection, and to really think about how I do things and why I do things. And so it's it's great to hear that you're teaching that that early.Hannah Choi 09:07Right and I feel like as a kid, I had an idea of what should be easy and what shouldn't be hard and that wasn't always what I found. And I think that making it an individual thing can really help with self esteem because like Oh that one thing is supposed to be easy, but it's actually really hard for me. If you get if you if you get rid of that whole "is supposed to be easy piece" and think about you as a person and whether it's easy or hard for you that I think that can really help develop a you know, a stronger sense of selfHannah Choi 09:44And comparing yourself to yourself. This used to be hard. And now it is getting easier for me, instead of comparing yourself to other other kids, other people around you teaching kids to learn to compare themselves to themselves and not to anyone else and learn about how they learn. It's also a really great lesson for parents to learn, too. I imagine that let's look at your child's development, your child's progress, just compared to where they've come from, and not necessarily against any other children. Maria Ares 10:18Oh, yeah, totally, especially if there's siblings on the picture. Hannah Choi 10:21So the you I mean, you are saying that there are executive function challenges in pretty much every area off the top of your head? What are some of the most common would you say that you see in your, in your practice in your classrooms? Maria Ares 10:36Yeah, something that first comes to mind is like multi step directions. This can be really hard. attention span, understanding of your own strengths and weaknesses. Problem solving can be really challenging for some kids, and understanding of time is a huge one.Hannah Choi 10:57So do you think that executive function skills are something that parents, like, should spend time working on with their kids? Or are they just going to naturally evolve?Maria Ares 11:08I think the best thing for parents to do is to do a lot of modeling, modeling of your language modeling of planning, talking about the process for things, talking about how you can be present so that you can pay attention. But not you know, not. But I don't think that parents need to be specifically practicing any of these things, because like, we were saying it's developmentally appropriate for kids to still be working on that. But some things that I think can be really helpful are like before doing errands, you can talk about the plan, you know, each thing that you're going to do, and whether it will take a short time or a long time. And then when you're talking about time, I think making it relatable can be really helpful. So while two minutes, I mean, they don't really understand numbers, they also don't really understand time very well. So saying something like this will take as long as it takes to brush your teeth. Or this will take as long as one episode of Masha and the Bear, or this will take as long as it takes to drive to your grandparents' house. And then also give them the number to go along with that. So they start to learn, okay, five minutes is the kind of short time, you know, doesn't take me very long to do something that takes five minutes. But then an hour is like my entire lifetime, a super long time. So then just using those examples, and using that modeling can start to build the foundation of, you know, understanding time management and sort of what we can fit into certain blocks of time. Another tool that can be helpful, is if your child really struggles with multi step directions, or like a multi step plan, just writing out a super quick visual, with maybe a little picture of everything that needs to happen. So maybe they need to put on their socks, put on their shoes and wash their hands or something, just drawing a little picture of each of those and then helping them sort of check it off when they're done with it can really help with the planning and the executing of a of a project or just a multistep task.Hannah Choi 13:22And if someone is not an artist, are there resources online, I'm imagining you can grab some clipart from somewhere.Maria Ares 13:33Yeah, for sure. There's lots of different resources out there. I'm sure there's lots of free resources, but less than pics is a really great website for getting pictures like that. But honestly, you know, you don't need to be an artist stick figures are great. Doodles are great. I think just getting the idea down on on paper or on a whiteboard or something can be helpful.Hannah Choi 14:00And it shows like if you draw it, then it shows your child that it's that it's okay, if you don't have really great art skills.Maria Ares 14:07There is another opportunity to talk about that.Hannah Choi 14:12I love it. That's great. So what would you say that success looks like at this age? And I know that's, I know that's different for everybody. But would you what do you see first as success in that age group?Maria Ares 14:28Yeah, success can look different for every one. Because there are so many skills that our earliest learners are building. For some kids success might look like exclaiming that was easy, which shows that they're thinking about how tasks feel for them, you know, is it easy, is it hard? Success could look like executing both parts of a two step direction. For another success might look like remembering to put pants on.Hannah Choi 14:58Reminds me of a when I interviewed Fran, she said, kids with executive function challenges sometimes forget to put underwear on. So she said success in my house is when they remember to put underwear on.Maria Ares 15:12Yeah, it's it's hard to find a developmental milestone in early childhood that doesn't include executive function skills in some way.Hannah Choi 15:20 Yeah. And it also, something that comes up a lot for us as coaches is the idea of looking for those small wins. And, and it didn't, and especially with this little, these little guys, it's not going to be these huge, you know, they're not gonna like write a paper, and then have, you know, have all these like, massive accomplishments that they've made in their executive function skills, you know, it's going to be more subtle, I imagine.Maria Ares 15:48Absolutely. Definitely, definitely more subtle. You know, they're growing and developing so much every day. So there's so much to notice, and so much to celebrate. And it might not always look like executive function skills, but they're under there for sure. Hannah Choi 16:05And I imagined that there's like there is at any, any age, you might make some progress, and then and then fall back of it and then go forward.Maria Ares 16:15Yeah, yeah. And I think it's really important for parents to remember, you know, just how much their preschooler is learning and developing at one time. And, you know, if they were able to follow a two step direction last week, and this week, they're just, you know, having a really hard time with it. Think about the other things that they're developing that maybe their brain is focusing on a little bit more this week. And I think that we need to cut them a little slack personally, sometimes.Hannah Choi 16:49I agree, and it's, I guess, it's hard because the lens through which we are looking is from the point of view of someone with a fully developed prefrontal cortex and years of experience.Maria Ares 17:01Yeah. And it's also very easy for me to say this about my preschoolers, but when I'm talking about my own child, no, get those shoes on! Hannah Choi 17:08Yeah, That's right. Yes. It's just a two step direction. Yes, or when? When..or my 10 year old. When I say, "Could you put your clothes in the washing machine?" The second step is not mentioned. But it starting it is, is part of it. So he did. He did what I said. But yeah, you did not do the unspoken second step.Maria Ares 17:46Right. I recently made a, like a visual step by step chart for tooth brushing. After we had a little cavity incident. Yeah. So you know, I wrote, I'm just never going to not be a special education teacher. So there's charts and lists and everything in our house of how to do everything. But I had to make a new one, because I didn't include as my last step on the list to clean the spit out of the sink.Hannah Choi 18:16Oh, Yes!Maria Ares 18:20I mean, I thought you don't really need a step on a list for that.Hannah Choi 18:24But here we are. Here we are. And so does she do it now?Maria Ares 18:28Most of the time? Yeah. Right. Which is more than never before. So Right. There's progress. Yeah. And now we can just say, "check your list", rather than "clean the disgusting spit out of the sink", which is a lot easier and you know, feels a lot more. Just feels a lot better to say.Hannah Choi 18:49Yeah, and it takes a takes you out of the equation. You can blame it on the list. The list is the list is what it says. And who knows where that list came from? Yeah, select some internet list or something. All right. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. Maria Ares 19:07Yeah, thank you so much for having me on the podcast. Yeah. Hannah Choi 19:11All right. Have fun with those little kids.Hannah Choi 19:13Thanks. Okay, so now that we've learned about our youngest children's EF skill development with Maria, let's move on to my conversation with Stephanie and Mariam to hear about elementary aged kids and their EF skills. Hi, Stephanie and Mariam, thanks so much for joining me today. Would you like to introduce yourselves? Stephanie, you want to go first?Stephanie Regan 19:35Sure. I'm Stephanie Regan. I'm an executive function coach with Beyond BookSmart and I've been working here at Beyond BookSmart for almost two years now. I was an elementary teacher and worked with children in different capacities for about 10 years.Hannah Choi 19:51Great. And how about you Mariam?Mariam Mahmoud 19:53I'm also one of the executive function coaches. I've been working with Beyond BookSmart for almost a year. I'm and I also have been a teacher since 2010. Working with kindergarten all the way to fourth grade.Hannah Choi 20:07Great. So you guys are the perfect people to ask, you have the executive function background and the elementary background. So great. Thank you for joining me today. So we are going to talk about executive function skills in elementary aged kids. So what do challenges look like at that age? And, you know, as, as I've talked about, in many episodes past, before this, we know that executive function skills develop over the beginning part of our lifetime and don't even mature until we're in our 20s, late 20s. And then, of course, we all have things that we still struggle with, even after that. But what do what are your challenges for kids who are in elementary school look like?Stephanie Regan 20:51I would say organization for for space and belongings is really huge. And what that looks like is a lot of students have a hard time remembering where to put things or where they've placed things or where things go. So that's really important. And also, I would say task initiation too, is hard, especially when you think about how impulse control is hard. And I think about that, when it's time to do homework, it can be really hard for a lot of students to begin homework, and not just kind of relax or do something else. That might be easier. I would also say self-regulation. Yes, definitely self regulation to again, and thinking about impulse control is another area to where executive function skill development is really important, because they're still learning to control their impulses.Hannah Choi 21:38Yeah, and that can show up, like you said, in emotion, it can show up in behavior, and it can show up in emotion. So yeah, yeah. And stuff like that self regulation piece is huge. I mean, even as adults, like how often like, I don't know, I want to throw a tantrum sometimes. But I have to regulate your emotions and appropriate way. And it's harder for the kids, because they're just not there yet. I know like, as a parent, my kids at home have certain things that they struggle with. And I'm sure in the classroom, they also have things that they have to work on. So where do, where do executive function skill, challenges show up for kids in the classroom?Stephanie Regan 22:15In the classroom, it can look like following directions, especially one step at a time. Sometimes directions can be complicated, or it can seem complicated to different students. So really, it can also come down to meeting steps broken down into smaller steps for students. So that's often where it can show up in the classroom. And I mean, there are a myriad of ways in which they can, but I feel like as far as following directions, and following routines.Hannah Choi 22:46That's that. And there's, I was just gonna say there are so many executive function skills involved in following directions, right? You like you have to memory you have to remember the steps you have to pay attention. You have to prioritize the knew the steps that you're supposed to be doing over the other thing that you want to do or that you weren't doing. Stephanie Regan 23:06Yeah, so many involved, not to mention distractions in the classroom, full of students. So, there's a lot going on.Hannah Choi 23:15Yeah, so that self regulation piece and impulse control.Mariam Mahmoud 23:20I wanted to add also organization, like just if a teacher gives a paper, like just getting the paper from the classroom to the house that you like, you have to know where to put it, and who to give it to you what stays home and what comes back. Stephanie Regan 23:32So these executive function skill challenges can also show up during recess. On the playground. So again, thinking about self-regulation, it can be hard to not just make friends, but also share friends. That's come up with a former younger client of mine. And also negotiating play can be really hard. I know, when I was a teacher, there was a rule. That was you can't say you can't play. But it's easier said than done. So self regulation during recess is a huge piece. And some students know, I shouldn't say know, but it's easier for some students to have unstructured time than is for other students. And recess can feel really unstructured. And sometimes, I mean, that that can be good. And it can also be challenging for for students. SoHannah Choi 24:29Yeah, I was just, I was just talking with my my son's friend. So my son is in fifth grade. And I was talking with his friend, and, and his friend was saying he does not like recess. And he was saying he doesn't like it because it's so crazy. And it's so yeah, I guess he didn't use the word unstructured, but I kind of read that, that's what he meant. So yeah, yeah, you just think of it as every kid would just like it because it's a break from doing work. But for some kids, it's it Can we I know I see that it is hard. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Thank you for mentioning that. Do you have anything you wanted to add Mariam on that?Mariam Mahmoud 25:09Um, I don't think so I think like recess, some usually when we think of executive function skills, we're thinking of like school in like the content area, but like recess is just as important because school is not only for the educational purposes, it's also for the social purposes. So I think like, it was really important that Stephanie mentioned that recess is a huge, huge place where we see those skills take take place, or evolve over time.Hannah Choi 25:36Yeah. And and it shows how truly involved in every aspect of our lives as adults, and as children, aren't these executive function skills come into play, and they truly are self management skills, and, and how it can show up in different areas and how it can also really challenge kids and adults. But mostly, you know, we're talking about kids today really challenged kids, especially because they haven't fully developed them yet, especially there, many of them are still emerging in elementary school, they're just starting to, you know, just starting to access that whatever skill. So it's, it's a Yeah, no wonder it can be challenging. And I think understanding that is it as a parent, or as a caregiver, as a teacher understanding that can make a really huge differenceStephanie Regan 26:30It can. I know, it can be easier when you're in the place where we can take a step back and really think about it from a different perspective or think about it from a more objective view.Hannah Choi 26:40Yeah, yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. And that makes me think of how nice it is to have someone who is not, not like super super, as involved with your kid as you are as a parent. So like a teacher can maybe teach some of these skills to their students, in a like, less fraught way that it might be for a parent, or like a coach or something, somebody who's outside of the family a little bit, and not like with a child all the time with all the baggage that comes along with the relationships we have with our kids?Mariam Mahmoud 27:19Absolutely. I mean, I have two children. One is like, very, very organized. And my younger one is also in fifth grade. And sometimes I'm like, even though I'm an executive function coach, and elementary school teacher, sometimes it doesn't work when I'm telling him the advice. But if it comes from a teacher, or from the coach, then he's like, the next day, like, he's slowly getting it. And I'm like, okay, awesome, as long as the help comes from somewhere, but yeah, it does. It matters. Like sometimes parents, no matter how much we want to get to through to our children coming from outside, like might have a different effect on them.Stephanie Regan 27:56Yeah, that's true. And sometimes it's also a matter of reinforcement. So they're not just hearing it from from mom or dad, who they, you know, have to, you know, see, well, all the time as soon as they see all the time. But, you know, students spend a lot of time with their teachers as well. But it can help too. And you're, you're hearing getting more than one place. Absolutely.Hannah Choi 28:16So that makes me think like, How can parents support their kids executive function, development without? Or maybe not without friction? Because there's going to be friction, that's just part of the relationship. But how are some ways that parents can support their kids?Mariam Mahmoud 28:35Well, I say like, I think like, the best thing, especially for elementary school students is like I turn everything into a game, or something you'd like have them play, like plan that the activity or the school, like, whether it's school, or sports or like a fun activity at home, have them plan it out beforehand. It helps them reach whatever the goal is in mind, and have them thinking, "Oh, what, what do I want to accomplish? And what steps am I going to take to get there?" Like some activities, if you're reading a story at home, you could stop and ask the question like, "What would you do if you were that character?" Or what would happen if the character was different in the story, this helps, it gets their cognitive thinking, like, oh, like, maybe I shouldn't be upset, or maybe the character shouldn't be upset. And then they like kind of connect that to self to what's happening in the real life. So the text to self connections is really important. You can also play like those games, like Simon Says, or card games card games is like my own children, they love card games. It helps with the memory skills, it helps with like paying attention, it helps with a lot of those executive function skills in a fun way. It also allows them to take turns, follow directions, and even like that impulse control, like it helps them like they have to wait their turn or like they can't just like call out so It's a it's a fun way where they're learning the executive function skills, but at the same time, they don't know. It's like learning.Hannah Choi 30:06Yeah, exactly. Right. They're actually learning a ton of stuff. Yeah. And that's also good too. Because as parents, it can often end up that the interactions that we have with our kids are not always super fun. So, so giving, giving yourself a chance to just play and have fun with your kids, while also teaching EF skills at the same time, is really great. Yeah, I think for me, definitely getting out of the way, and trying to trying to move them towards independence, and also move towards having more positive interactions that have less to do with, what do you need? What do you need to do? Are you doing what you need to do? Why aren't you doing this? So being able to support them in that way, is really nice. So I'm a coach, I'm an executive function coach, I have, you know, a ton of knowledge and experience supporting people and kids with executive function challenges. And I've, you know, done a lot of research on it. I mean, I host a podcast about it. So I have a lot of knowledge. And I still struggle to come up with tools and strategies that I can use for myself, but also that my kids can use so that we can work on developing theirs, and also give them this independence and this autonomy that they crave. And that I need for them to have, so that I can you know, just do my live my life. So what are your further things that come up for kids like the organization and the self regulation and the task initiation? What, what are your go to go to tools that you teach to your clients and to their parents?Stephanie Regan 31:50Well, I would say my go-to tool is a checklist. It sounds really Yeah. and straightforward. And I mean, it's a tool that I use on a weekly basis. So it can be easier to teach it and support it when you use it. So I think having a checklist, an example would be a checklist for an after school routine. And that could look like, you know, come home, put my bag away, eat a snack, start homework, it can have a number of things on it. But I think it's good to keep it to like three or five things. I also think if it's visible and accessible, then it's more helpful. So with that in mind, I think it's important to place it where the client or student can see it at eye level, and it can help I think, ease any tension or frustration around reminding your student or reminding a child of what he she or they need to do when they get home. You can also refer to it like, oh, like remember, you have a checklist that you like, do this, or did you do that? Or what is your checklist, say and if it's at eye level, then the student if the if they're if they can read, then a student can refer to it. And also it's important to use simple language toHannah Choi 33:08Or pictures as well. Right? Yes.Stephanie Regan 33:10Pictures. I do like to use pictures. I won't say I'm a visual learner, because you learn differently. You learn different subjects differently or different topics differently. But I I do like visualization. And I do like pictures that can go along with words or phrases, if not, if I think it's necessary. So that can also be really helpful.Hannah Choi 33:36Yeah, we have a list on our door that goes out to the garage with the things that the kids need to bring in. And it's really nice to just be able to say, "Did you check the list?" I don't have to get involved. I just have to say, "Did you check the list?" I had to make the list, but and I hung up the list. But after that, all I have to say is "Did you check the list?" And then if they didn't check the list, you know, that's on them. So and I mean, my kids are older. So it is easier for me to say that's on them if they didn't check the list, but we scaffold them right? We maybe support them if they forget something on the list and then move them towards leaving it up to them if they forget things on the list.Stephanie Regan 34:13And there can become a point in time where they memorize the list. Oh, yeah, hi is a few things on the list and you don't really need to point it out. You know, they can they might come to a place where they have it memorized which is good too.Hannah Choi 34:25Yeah, I was just talking last night with a friend of mine whose kids are in second and third grade. And she was saying that that she was sharing that she also has a checklist for the morning and it says "pack backpack" and she said she's so funny, she was like "I used I even used indented bullets." So she has packed backpack and then indented bullets. And then it lists the things that go into the backpack and she noticed that her son had not been putting the snack in and she's like, why didn't you put the snack in? He said well because it didn't say pack snack. She's like me, it's just to take the pack from the top part. Pack the indented bulleted things. Stephanie Regan 35:04So, yeah, yeah, reminder that students can be very literal people very, very literal. Not just children!Hannah Choi 35:12Don't assume! And yes, that is such a good point. Stephanie, I completely agree. Yes. What about you, Mariam? I'm, what do you like to use?Mariam Mahmoud 35:22No, I honestly like the same as Stephanie, those checklists. For the younger students. When my children were younger, I instead of doing it over and over again, like, I just put it in like, one of those sleeves, like a paper protector, and kind of turned it into like a dry erase thing. So they would check it off, then I would erase it and then use it again. Yeah, brilliant. And putting it on the refrigerator or the same spot every day, like just having it there. Or like, when they were like, a lot younger, any, like little magnets interact and be like, Oh, I got it's on instead of a checklist, like just put like a little tiny magnet.Hannah Choi 35:58Oh, yeah. Smart. I know. Something that Oh, go ahead. Sorry.Stephanie Regan 36:03I was gonna say I'm an adult. And I like checking things off. In Google. I still get satisfaction from checking things off my grocery list.Hannah Choi 36:14yes, I'm the same way I use any list. And when you tap, it disappears. It's very satisfying. Yeah. I also am a big fan of writing things that I did on my list. So if it wasn't on the list, but I did it, I still write it on the list and then cross it off. After the fact.Stephanie Regan 36:33I was gonna say what you said about like, doing things that weren't on the list reminded me of five minute goals, or the idea of doing like, what you can have five minutes, because you could actually end up doing a lot more than you think you thought you could. Another good strategy or tool was like, okay, like if, if something is a fight, or a struggle with your child at home, or even a student at school, or a client during a coaching session? The Five Minute goals out okay, well, let's see how much you can get done in five minutes. And a lot of times, it's also been three minutes with a particular client of mine, but it's like, what, what can you get done in three minutes? And that I set a timer, it can also turn into a game, or it can be more fun. Hannah Choi 37:16So yes, like they're racing. Yes. Yeah.Stephanie Regan 37:20Doing more than you thought you could is also it can also boost self esteem and, and what have you, so that that's also good to.Hannah Choi 37:27Absolutely I love that tool.Mariam Mahmoud 37:29It also enforces our time awareness. Like they're like, Oh, well, that was five minutes, and I was able to put my shoes away and get my backpack out and get a snack or whatever they could do in five minutes. Like, they're usually very, like, amused or amazed that they could, they could do that much in five minutes. So.Hannah Choi 37:47I was I had that experience. When I, I, we have a gas stove. And I really hate cleaning it off after we cook dinner because you have to like, lift up the grates. And there's so many crevices. It's so annoying. And so I found myself avoiding it, which is gross. And then it looks gross. And and so I said oh, you know what I'm gonna time myself is I think that it takes me about 10 minutes. It took me four minutes, like four minutes top to bottom even wiping down the oven door and the handle on everything. Like Hannah. So every time I don't want to clean off the stove at night, I always say four minutes, you have four minutes. Yeah, it's a really good tool. The other thing I really like about five minute goals and that I always say to myself, and anyone else that I'm suggesting use it is that when that timer goes off, and whether you've set it for two minutes or five minutes or whatever, you can then either decide to be done, or keep going. And it's really nice, because it's like a built in permission to be done. I'm only asking you to do this for five minutes. Oh, you're you're into it. You're like, oh, maybe I'll just keep going. Alright, then keep going. But if you're like, No, this sucks, and I don't want to do this anymore. Then you stop it. I really I like that. That flexibility built in.Stephanie Regan 39:04Yeah, I was gonna say it's good for task initiation and also cognitive flexibility, too. It's like, Oh, that wasn't so hard. Maybe I can keep going.Hannah Choi 39:15Right totally gets you to change your perspective on it.Mariam Mahmoud 39:18Absolutely. I use that strategy actually, for my, my one son, he hates going outside. Like he just doesn't like playing outside and the other one like really enjoys it. So I'm like, Just 10 minutes a day after school just go out for 10 minutes a day. And he's out there for like 20-30 minutes like he absolutely loves it. Um, so I'm like this really like it worked. Just setting that and sometimes like if he's tired, he's like, it's a 10 minutes up, but for the most part, like it got him to go outside more, which was really great at our house, at least.Hannah Choi 39:48Yes. And that brings me back up. Always, always, always just start small, right? Anything that can that feels like it's going to be hard. Feels like it's going to be Challenge start small, which is the same thing when you are implementing new strategies that you're using with your kids to try to make some change in either your relationship with them or trying to build autonomy and independence for them. So you have to start small, this is not a change that's going to happen overnight. It's not, you know, you can't all of a sudden throw all these tools at your kids, and be like, tada, magic. It just doesn't work that way. And there's going to be times that we slip, and there's going to be times that, that we forget. And it's just easier for us to just pack their backpack because we're late. And I just want to pack your backpack because you're not doing it right anyway. But as long as as long as we recognize that is not going to happen overnight, and just do small steps, small steps working towards that independence, I think, at least for me, personally, and what I've seen in my clients, it makes a really big difference.Mariam Mahmoud 40:55Absolutely. And celebrate those small successes too. It's really important if they forgot their backpack for a week, and they finally remembered it, but they forgot to put their Chromebook inside. At least they remember their backpack. So like it's a small, those small steps, but celebrating it because it makes a huge difference when you're like, Oh, awesome job, great job bringing your backpack every day. They get that sense of pride. And they get the sense of oh, you know what, I could keep doing this? And I could add on?Hannah Choi 41:24Yeah, and they start to see the benefit of doing absolutely, yeah. And that makes me think about how, like, we only have the lens that we have through which to look like we are adults. And we are looking at their situation through this adult lens. And so sometimes it can be really hard to understand like, why can't you just remember to do whatever it is that I've just asked you to do? So I think, let me do you see that a lot when you're working with parents and their kids like helping the helping each other understand that we're all coming from a different perspective?Mariam Mahmoud 42:02Absolutely. I think that's one of the biggest things that we have to actually talk to parents about it, just put yourself in their shoes. Yes, it is easy for us, because we've already been through it. Or like been, been through something similar to it, you know, like, we can think of a time that you forgot about your dentist appointment, your doctor's appointment, or you forgot to turn off the stove, when you're making tea, I'm like, it happens to all of us. So we really have this, tell them like just try to think as like the five year old or seven year old or even the teenagers, like there's a lot going on in their mind. It might not be on their top of the things to do is to take their backpack to school, like maybe they were really nervous about a test or, you know, one of their friends were sick or something happened, you know, we just have to always think about what are they feeling?Hannah Choi 42:56Yeah, yeah. And that's why I like that whole...like, for anyone who's listening right now, like you're, you're taking the time to maybe learn something and maybe find something that can help you understand your kids, or maybe ease some of the friction or conflict between you and your kids. And then that's how, like our kids can learn from the role models that they have. And if they if like from their teachers, or their elder siblings, or if they have a coach, just they're just still learning and we were all still learning. I don't know, I'm not really sure what I'm trying to say.Stephanie Regan 43:34We're definitely all still learning. And I mean, I have my own example of I mean, I don't know if I should lead with logical consequences, but because it doesn't always it doesn't feel good when you forget to do something. And you know, because there's, you know, the intention of doing it, and there's the impact. You know, it's one thing if it affects you, it's another thing if it affects someone else, but I was just thinking how I mean, it can be good. If it's a small logical consequence. That's not detrimental. For students to be like, oh, like, I didn't, this would, I mean, be for an older client, but I you know, I didn't look at Google Calendar and I've got to have a quiz, a science quiz. So the logical, you know, the, so there's a consequence of forgetting the quiz, which stinks and then But then there's like, Okay, so next time I'm going to do this. Yes. Which is really important for for that awareness. metacognitive awareness and growth as well.Hannah Choi 44:37So do you guys have any other go to tools that you'd like to share with your clients and parents,Mariam Mahmoud 44:41So one go to tool that like, I think all my clients love once I tell them about it as a fastbreak plan. It's basically like, Okay, I have homework to do, and I have studying to do and I have to walk the dog and my chores to do but I also want to play my video games. So it's coming home and having the child like come home, right from school and do everything that's like a priority according to the parents standards. Just break it up like, Okay, let's do read your reading vocabulary words for 30 minutes, then you could do like a five minute or 15 minute break, then let's get back to doing maybe your math work. This will take like, maybe 20 minutes, okay, then let's take a break. I'm just having those little like brain breaks in between it really lets the child kind of have a sense of their own schedule. Like, yeah, I could do this or I could do that and get the child involved with the fastbreak plan, right? It sounds like does this work for you? Like one of my children, like he gets home, he wants his work, done his homework, like he wants it out of the way. The other one, like he is tired from work, and he's like, I want to play first. And I'm like, Okay, let's come up with a routine that works for you. I mean, it took me a while to get there. Because I'm like, No, it has to be like this. But once I have, like, I listened to him, and I told him, like, he told me what he wants to do. Now he gets all of his work done. But he's not doing it, how I would do it, but that's totally okay. He's using basically that fast break plan where he gets the work done. But he has that time to play and just kind of relax in between.Hannah Choi 46:15And I love how you brought up how, like for you, that's not how you would do it. But you you were able to see from his point of view, this is this really is gonna work for him and how his sibling is, had to approaches it differently. And my kids are the same way. My fifth grader he wants to come in, he wants to get his homework done right away. He doesn't want to have anything that he needs to do. And then he can just go and do it. And then my daughter, she likes to kind of spread it out over the over the evening. So yeah. And I think I think that's really hard to do. I mean, it's hard to do, it's hard to see other people's perspectives, like regardless of who the person's perspective is you're trying to see, it's hard to do, and I do, I really think it's, it is absolutely worth taking the time to try to understand. And you know, and if they come up and like I love how you said get them involved. So they come up with a plan that does really work for them. Why do they have to do it the way you would do it? As long as it's working for them? Why not? Why not? Let them discover that on their own? And how much? How many lessons in independence and autonomy does that teach them?Mariam Mahmoud 47:24Absolutely not to mention, it really does reduce that friction. Like it like,Hannah Choi 47:29It gets you out of the way!Mariam Mahmoud 47:31Oh, I wish I did this a long time ago, like it really like, right? He's doing his work. He's getting everything done by the end of the night, which is the end goal anyways. So I actually never works well.Hannah Choi 47:42Yeah. And the consequences, the natural consequences, logical consequences that you were talking about before Stephanie? Like, okay, so here, I'm going to let you, you know, build this plan, and I'm going to, I'm going to trust you to work through this plan. And if you don't manage your time, well, and you are still you know, up doing your stuff late or you didn't get it done, and then you don't get to turn it in, then there's a consequence. And then maybe you are able to, to, you know, learn from that for the next time. And I think, as parents and maybe even as caregivers not not in the role of a parent, but even as a teacher, especially with younger children. You don't want your kids to experience those natural consequences, you don't want them to have a negative experience, you don't want them to feel bad, you know, you just want them to have this like happy existence where they don't experience those negative feelings. But that's where they learn. And that all those opportunities to learn all that is only going to serve them really well as they get older, and the challenges get bigger, and their responsibilities get bigger. And so if we're constantly trying to protect them from those negative emotions, whatever it is, by doing all the things that they forgot for them, then they miss out on a lot of learning opportunities. I think it is important to consider if you have the time and the bandwidth to consider the different aspects of each situation that can be helpful. Mariam Mahmoud 49:13Absolutely. And give the child time as well. Like if if they make their own schedule, and they're like it's gonna work and the first day they didn't get their homework done. It's not going to change overnight. Again, it's progress, like so what I usually do is like, let's try it for a week or two. And then we talk about it what worked, what didn't work, let's tweak. I mean, as long as their grades aren't going down, and there's they're not forgetting their backpack every single day. I let them learn from the natural consequences. And then we talk about what worked what didn't work, and we change it, because that's how they learn.Hannah Choi 49:44Yep, yeah. And it really does take a long time. It's not it's not overnight. I mean, not even for us, you know, it's as caregivers it's it doesn't happen overnight, either. Like if we're trying to change our approach to our parenting. It doesn't happen overnight. So you Yeah. So as for kids who have for kids who have coaches or who maybe they have like a tutor, or, you know, they work one on one with a specialist, how, how do you guys see parental support coming in? They're like, how did how do you? How do you work with parents of young children.Mariam Mahmoud 50:25Um, for me, I just I let the parents know that like, let the child's practice. If we're working on something in the coaching session, like just practice what we're working on reading for us, for Beyond BookSmart, we have those portal notes, right, where you kind of communicate with the parent, what's going on, let them read the portal, make notes and understand what the tool is, share, like sharing the tools that you use at home with the coach or the tutor or even the teacher, just be like, Oh, we use this at home, like, as simple as color coding. Maybe you could try it in the classroom, it really helps when there's that communication. So communication is like the top key of helping the child no matter who they're learning it from. It helps us work together and help them succeed, which is the main goalHannah Choi 51:15It really reinforces that consistency, which is what you need to find any success. Is there anything else you guys would like to add? In your experience as as coaches of young children? Is there anything? Any takeaways that are really relevant for, for Listen, our listeners.Mariam Mahmoud 51:35I think just basically, just like we said, like communication, and patience, and just consistency is really, really key to having your child succeed. And working with the teacher with the administration, with the coach, with the tutor, no matter who your child sees, even if it's if they're basketball or baseball or playing a sport. Just knowing what your child is working on, and having that open communication could help them succeed.Stephanie Regan 52:04I would say the goal is progress, not perfection.Hannah Choi 52:08Absolutely. Yes. i When I interviewed Peg Dawson, she said progress. She said her colleague had a thing on the wall that said "Progress is measured in in years and not months". So it just it does. It does. Takes a while. Yeah. Great. All right. Well, thank you so much for joining me today.Stephanie Regan 52:29Thank you for having us. Mariam Mahmoud 52:30Thank you.Hannah Choi 52:32And that's our show for today. I hope you enjoyed our conversations about executive function skill development in our youngest kiddos, and that maybe it helps with some of those challenges we experience while parenting or teaching them. Thank you for taking time out of your day to listen. Please share our show with the people in your lives who might like learning about EF skills and little kids, you never know. It might just make a huge difference for them. You can subscribe to focus forward on Apple and Google podcasts, Spotify, or wherever else you get your podcasts. And if you listen on Apple or Spotify, give us a boost by giving us a five star rating. Sign up for our newsletter at beyondbooksmart.com/podcast and we'll let you know when new episodes drop and we'll share information related to the topic. Thanks for listening!

FUTURE FOSSILS
201 - KMO & Kevin Wohlmut on our Blue Collar Black Mirror: Star Trek, Star Wars, Blade Runner, Jurassic Park, Adventure Time, ChatGPT, & More

FUTURE FOSSILS

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 13, 2023 106:17


This week we talk about the intersections of large language models, the golden age of television and its storytelling mishaps, making one's way through the weirding of the labor economy, and much more with two of my favorite Gen X science fiction aficionados, OG podcaster KMO and our mutual friend Kevin Arthur Wohlmut. In this episode — a standalone continuation to my recent appearance on The KMO Show, we skip like a stone across mentions of every Star Trek series, the collapse of narratives and the social fabric, Westworld HBO, Star Wars Mandalorian vs. Andor vs. Rebels, chatGPT, Blade Runner 2049, Black Mirror, H.P. Lovecraft, the Sheldrake-Abraham-McKenna Trialogues, Charles Stross' Accelerando, Adventure Time, Stanislav Grof's LSD psychotherapy, Francisco Varela, Blake Lemoine's meltdown over Google LaMDA, Integrated Information Theory, biosemiotics, Douglas Hofstadter, Max Tegmarck, Erik Davis, Peter Watts, The Psychedelic Salon, Melanie Mitchell, The Teafaerie, Kevin Kelly, consilience in science, Fight Club, and more…Or, if you prefer, here's a rundown of the episode generated by A.I. c/o my friends at Podium.page:In this episode, I explore an ambitious and well-connected conversation with guests KMO, a seasoned podcaster, and Kevin Walnut [sic], a close friend and supporter of the arts in Santa Fe. We dive deep into their thoughts on the social epistemology crisis, science fiction, deep fakes, and ontology. Additionally, we discuss their opinions on the Star Trek franchise, particularly their critiques of the first two seasons of Star Trek: Picard and Discovery. Through this engaging conversation, we examine the impact of storytelling and the evolution of science fiction in modern culture. We also explore the relationship between identity, media, and artificial intelligence, as well as the ethical implications of creating sentient artificial general intelligence (AGI) and the philosophical questions surrounding AI's impact on society and human existence. Join us for a thought-provoking and in-depth discussion on a variety of topics that will leave you questioning the future of humanity and our relationship with technology.✨ Before we get started, three big announcements!* I am leaving the Santa Fe Institute, in part to write a very ambitious book about technology, art, imagination, and Jurassic Park. You can be a part of the early discussion around this project by joining the Future Fossils Book Club's Jurassic Park live calls — the first of which will be on Saturday, 29 April — open to Substack and Patreon supporters:* Catch me in a Twitter Space with Nxt Museum on Monday 17 April at 11 am PST on a panel discussing “Creative Misuse of Technology” with Minne Atairu, Parag Mital, Caroline Sinders, and hosts Jesse Damiani and Charlotte Kent.* I'm back in Austin this October to play the Astronox Festival at Apache Pass! Check out this amazing lineup on which I appear alongside Juno Reactor, Entheogenic, Goopsteppa, DRRTYWULVZ, and many more great artists!✨ Support Future Fossils:Subscribe anywhere you go for podcastsSubscribe to the podcast PLUS essays, music, and news on Substack or Patreon.Buy my original paintings or commission new work.Buy my music on Bandcamp! (This episode features “A Better Trip” from my recent live album by the same name.)Or if you're into lo-fi audio, follow me and my listening recommendations on Spotify.This conversation continues with lively and respectful interaction every single day in the members-only Future Fossils Facebook Group and Discord server. Join us!Episode cover art by KMO and a whole bouquet of digital image manipulation apps.✨ Tip Jars:@futurefossils on Venmo$manfredmacx on CashAppmichaelgarfield on PayPal✨ Affiliate Links:• These show notes and the transcript were made possible with Podium.Page, a very cool new AI service I'm happy to endorse. Sign up here and get three free hours and 50% off your first month.• BioTech Life Sciences makes anti-aging and performance enhancement formulas that work directly at the level of cellular nutrition, both for ingestion and direct topical application. I'm a firm believer in keeping NAD+ levels up and their skin solution helped me erase a year of pandemic burnout from my face.• Help regulate stress, get better sleep, recover from exercise, and/or stay alert and focused without stimulants, with the Apollo Neuro wearable. I have one and while I don't wear it all the time, when I do it's sober healthy drugs.• Musicians: let me recommend you get yourself a Jamstik Studio, the coolest MIDI guitar I've ever played. I LOVE mine. You can hear it playing all the synths on my song about Jurassic Park.✨ Mentioned Media:KMO Show S01 E01 - 001 - Michael Garfield and Kevin WohlmutAn Edifying Thought on AI by Charles EisensteinIn Defense of Star Trek: Picard & Discovery by Michael GarfieldImprovising Out of Algorithmic Isolation by Michael GarfieldAI and the Transformation of the Human Spirit by Steven Hales(and yes I know it's on Quillette, and no I don't think this automatically disqualifies it)Future Fossils Book Club #1: Blindsight by Peter WattsFF 116 - The Next Ten Billion Years: Ugo Bardi & John Michael Greer as read by Kevin Arthur Wohlmut✨ Related Recent Future Fossils Episodes:FF 198 - Tadaaki Hozumi on Japanese Esotericism, Aliens, Land Spirits, & The Singularity (Part 2)FF 195 - A.I. Art: An Emergency Panel with Julian Picaza, Evo Heyning, Micah Daigle, Jamie Curcio, & Topher SipesFF 187 - Fear & Loathing on the Electronic Frontier with Kevin Welch & David Hensley of EFF-Austin FF 178 - Chris Ryan on Exhuming The Human from Our Eldritch Institutions FF 175 - C. Thi Nguyen on The Seductions of Clarity, Weaponized Games, and Agency as Art ✨ Chapters:0:15:45 - The Substance of Philosophy (58 Seconds)0:24:45 - Complicated TV Narratives and the Internet (104 Seconds)0:30:54 - Humans vs Hosts in Westworld (81 Seconds)0:38:09 - Philosophical Zombies and Artificial Intelligence (89 Seconds)0:43:00 - Popular Franchises Themes (71 Seconds)1:03:27 - Reflections on a Changing Media Landscape (89 Seconds)1:10:45 - The Pathology of Selective Evidence (92 Seconds)1:16:32 - Externalizing Trauma Through Technology (131 Seconds)1:24:51 - From Snow Maker to Thouandsaire (43 Seconds)1:36:48 - The Impact of Boomer Parenting (126 Seconds)✨ Keywords:Social Epistemology, Science Fiction, Deep Fakes, Ontology, Star Trek, Artificial Intelligence, AI Impact, Sentient AGI, Human-Machine Interconnectivity, Consciousness Theory, Westworld, Blade Runner 2049, AI in Economy, AI Companion Chatbots, Unconventional Career Path, AI and Education, AI Content Creation, AI in Media, Turing Test✨ UNEDITED machine-generated transcript generated by podium.page:0:00:00Five four three two one. Go. So it's not like Wayne's world where you say the two and the one silently. Now, Greetings future fossils.0:00:11Welcome to episode two hundred and one of the podcast that explores our place in time I'm your host, Michael Garfield. And this is one of these extra juicy and delicious episodes of the show where I really ratcheted up with our guests and provide you one of these singularity is near kind of ever everything is connected to everything, self organized criticality right at the edge of chaos conversations, deeply embedded in chapel parallel where suddenly the invisible architect picture of our cosmos starts to make itself apparent through the glass bead game of conversation. And I am that I get to share it with you. Our guests this week are KMO, one of the most seasoned and well researched and experienced podcasters that I know. Somebody whose show the Sea Realm was running all the way back in two thousand six, I found him through Eric Davis, who I think most of you know, and I've had on the show a number of times already. And also Kevin Walnut, who is a close friend of mine here in Santa Fe, a just incredible human being, he's probably the strongest single supporter of music that I'm aware of, you know, as far as local scenes are concerned and and supporting people's music online and helping get the word out. He's been instrumental to my family and I am getting ourselves situated here all the way back to when I visited Santa Fe in two thousand eighteen to participate in the Santa Fe Institute's Interplanetary Festival and recorded conversations on that trip John David Ebert and Michael Aaron Cummins. And Ike used so June. About hyper modernity, a two part episode one zero four and one zero five. I highly recommend going back to that, which is really the last time possibly I had a conversation just this incredibly ambitious on the show.0:02:31But first, I want to announce a couple things. One is that I have left the Santa Fe Institute. The other podcast that I have been hosting for them for the last three and a half years, Complexity Podcast, which is substantially more popular in future fossils due to its institutional affiliation is coming to a close, I'm recording one more episode with SFI president David Krakauer next week in which I'm gonna be talking about my upcoming book project. And that episode actually is conjoined with the big announcement that I have for members of the Future Fossil's listening audience and and paid supporters, which is, of course, the Jurassic Park Book Club that starts On April twenty ninth, we're gonna host the first of two video calls where I'm gonna dive deep into the science and philosophy Michael Creighton's most popular work of fiction and its impact on culture and society over the thirty three years since its publication. And then I'm gonna start picking up as many of the podcasts that I had scheduled for complexity and had to cancel upon my departure from SFI. And basically fuse the two shows.0:03:47And I think a lot of you saw this coming. Future fossils is going to level up and become a much more scientific podcast. As I prepare and research the book that I'm writing about Jurassic Park and its legacy and the relationship It has to ILM and SFI and the Institute of Eco Technics. And all of these other visionary projects that sprouted in the eighties and nineties to transition from the analog to the digital the collapse of the boundaries between the real and the virtual, the human and the non human worlds, it's gonna be a very very ambitious book and a very very ambitious book club. And I hope that you will get in there because obviously now I am out in the rain as an independent producer and very much need can benefit from and am deeply grateful for your support for this work in order to make things happen and in order to keep my family fed, get the lights on here with future fossils. So with that, I wanna thank all of the new supporters of the show that have crawled out of the woodwork over the last few weeks, including Raefsler Oingo, Brian in the archaeologist, Philip Rice, Gerald Bilak, Jamie Curcio, Jeff Hanson who bought my music, Kuaime, Mary Castello, VR squared, Nastia teaches, community health com, Ed Mulder, Cody Couiac, bought my music, Simon Heiduke, amazing visionary artist. I recommend you check out, Kayla Peters. Yeah. All of you, I just wow. Thank you so much. It's gonna be a complete melee in this book club. I'm super excited to meet you all. I will send out details about the call details for the twenty ninth sometime in the next few days via a sub tag in Patreon.0:06:09The amount of support that I've received through this transition has been incredible and it's empowering me to do wonderful things for you such as the recently released secret videos of the life sets I performed with comedian Shane Moss supporting him, opening for him here in Santa Fe. His two sold out shows at the Jean Coutu cinema where did the cyber guitar performances. And if you're a subscriber, you can watch me goofing off with my pedal board. There's a ton of material. I'm gonna continue to do that. I've got a lot of really exciting concerts coming up in the next few months that we're gonna get large group and also solo performance recordings from and I'm gonna make those available in a much more resplendent way to supporters as well as the soundtrack to Mark Nelson of the Institute of Eco Technics, his UC San Diego, Art Museum, exhibit retrospective looking at BioSphere two. I'm doing music for that and that's dropping. The the opening of that event is April twenty seventh. There's gonna be a live zoom event for that and then I'm gonna push the music out as well for that.0:07:45So, yeah, thank you all. I really, really appreciate you listening to the show. I am excited to share this episode with you. KMO is just a trove. Of insight and experience. I mean, he's like a perfect entry into the digital history museum that this show was predicated upon. So with that and also, of course, Kevin Willett is just magnificent. And for the record, stick around at the end of the conversation. We have some additional pieces about AI, and I think you're gonna really enjoy it. And yeah, thank you. Here we go. Alright. Cool.0:09:26Well, we just had a lovely hour of discussion for the new KMO podcast. And now I'm here with KMO who is The most inveterate podcaster I know. And I know a lot of them. Early adopts. And I think that weird means what you think it means. Inventor it. Okay. Yes. Hey, answer to both. Go ahead. I mean, you're not yet legless and panhandling. So prefer to think of it in term in terms of August estimation. Yeah. And am I allowed to say Kevin Walnut because I've had you as a host on True. Yeah. My last name was appeared on your show. It hasn't appeared on camos yet, but I don't really care. Okay. Great. Yeah. Karen Arthur Womlett, who is one of the most solid and upstanding and widely read and just generous people, I think I know here in Santa Fe or maybe anywhere. With excellent taste and podcasts. Yes. And who is delicious meat I am sampling right now as probably the first episode of future fossils where I've had an alcoholic beverage in my hand. Well, I mean, it's I haven't deprived myself. Of fun. And I think if you're still listening to the show after all these years, you probably inferred that. But at any rate, Welcome on board. Thank you. Thanks. Pleasure to be here.0:10:49So before we started rolling, I guess, so the whole conversation that we just had for your show camera was very much about my thoughts on the social epistemology crisis and on science fiction and deep fakes and all of these kinds of weird ontology and these kinds of things. But in between calls, we were just talking about how much you detest the first two seasons of Star Trek card and of Discovery. And as somebody, I didn't bother with doing this. I didn't send you this before we spoke, but I actually did write an SIN defense of those shows. No one. Yeah. So I am not attached to my opinion on this, but And I actually do wanna at some point double back and hear storytelling because when he had lunch and he had a bunch of personal life stuff that was really interesting. And juicy and I think worthy of discussion. But simply because it's hot on the rail right now, I wanna hear you talk about Star Trek. And both of you, actually, I know are very big fans of this franchise. I think fans are often the ones from whom a critic is most important and deserved. And so I welcome your unhinged rants. Alright. Well, first, I'll start off by quoting Kevin's brother, the linguist, who says, That which brings us closer to Star Trek is progress. But I'd have to say that which brings us closer to Gene Rottenberry and Rick Berman era Star Trek. Is progress. That which brings us closer to Kurtzmann. What's his first name? Alex. Alex Kurtzmann, Star Trek. Well, that's not even the future. I mean, that's just that's our drama right now with inconsistent Star Trek drag draped over it.0:12:35I liked the first JJ Abrams' Star Trek. I think it was two thousand nine with Chris Pine and Zachary Qinto and Karl Urban and Joey Saldana. I liked the casting. I liked the energy. It was fun. I can still put that movie on and enjoy it. But each one after that just seem to double down on the dumb and just hold that arm's length any of the philosophical stuff that was just amazing from Star Trek: The Next Generation or any of the long term character building, which was like from Deep Space nine.0:13:09And before seven of nine showed up on on Voyager, you really had to be a dedicated Star Trek fan to put up with early season's Voyager, but I did because I am. But then once she came on board and it was hilarious. They brought her onboard. I remember seeing Jerry Ryan in her cat suit on the cover of a magazine and just roll in my eyes and think, oh my gosh, this show is in such deep trouble through sinking to this level to try to save it. But she was brilliant. She was brilliant in that show and she and Robert Percardo as the doctor. I mean, it basically became the seven of nine and the doctor show co starring the rest of the cast of Voyager. And it was so great.0:13:46I love to hear them singing together and just all the dynamics of I'm human, but I was I basically came up in a cybernetic collective and that's much more comfortable to me. And I don't really have the option of going back it. So I gotta make the best of where I am, but I feel really superior to all of you. Is such it was such a charming dynamic. I absolutely loved it. Yes. And then I think a show that is hated even by Star Trek fans Enterprise. Loved Enterprise.0:14:15And, yes, the first three seasons out of four were pretty rough. Actually, the first two were pretty rough. The third season was that Zendy Ark in the the expanse. That was pretty good. And then season four was just astounding. It's like they really found their voice and then what's his name at CBS Paramount.0:14:32He's gone now. He got me too. What's his name? Les Moonves? Said, no. I don't like Star Trek. He couldn't he didn't know the difference between Star Wars and Star Trek. That was his level of engagement.0:14:44And he's I really like J.0:14:46J.0:14:46Abrams. What's that? You mean J. J. Abrams. Yeah. I think J. J. Is I like some of J. Abrams early films. I really like super eight. He's clearly his early films were clearly an homage to, like, eighties, Spielberg stuff, and Spielberg gets the emotional beats right, and JJ Abrams was mimicking that, and his early stuff really works. It's just when he starts adapting properties that I really love. And he's coming at it from a marketing standpoint first and a, hey, we're just gonna do the lost mystery box thing. We're gonna set up a bunch questions to which we don't know the answers, and it'll be up to somebody else to figure it out, somebody down the line. I as I told you, between our conversations before we were recording. I really enjoy or maybe I said it early in this one. I really like that first J. J. Abrams, Star Trek: Foam, and then everyone thereafter, including the one that Simon Pegg really had a hand in because he's clear fan. Yeah. Yeah. But they brought in director from one of the fast and the furious films and they tried to make it an action film on.0:15:45This is not Star Trek, dude. This is not why we like Star Trek. It's not for the flash, particularly -- Oh my god. -- again, in the first one, it was a stylistic choice. I'd like it, then after that is that's the substance of this, isn't it? It's the lens flares. I mean, that that's your attempt at philosophy. It's this the lens flares. That's your attempt at a moral dilemma. I don't know.0:16:07I kinda hate to start off on this because this is something about which I feel like intense emotion and it's negative. And I don't want that to be my first impression. I'm really negative about something. Well, one of the things about this show is that I always joke that maybe I shouldn't edit it because The thing that's most interesting to archaeologists is often the trash mitt and here I am tidying this thing up to be presentable to future historians or whatever like it I can sync to that for sure. Yeah. I'm sorry. The fact of it is you're not gonna know everything and we want it that way. No. It's okay. We'll get around to the stuff that I like. But yeah. So anyway yeah.0:16:44So I could just preassociate on Stretrick for a while, so maybe a focusing question. Well, but first, you said there's a you had more to say, but you were I this this tasteful perspective. This is awesome. Well, I do have a focus on question for you. So let me just have you ask it because for me to get into I basically I'm alienated right now from somebody that I've been really good friends with since high school.0:17:08Because over the last decade, culturally, we have bifurcated into the hard right, hard left. And I've tried not to go either way, but the hard left irritates me more than the hard right right now. And he is unquestionably on the hard left side. And I know for people who are dedicated Marxist, or really grounded in, like, materialism and the material well-being of workers that the current SJW fanaticism isn't leftist. It's just crazed. We try to put everything, smash everything down onto this left right spectrum, and it's pretty easy to say who's on the left and who's on the right even if a two dimensional, two axis graph would be much more expressive and nuanced.0:17:49Anyway, what's your focus in question? Well, And I think there is actually there is a kind of a when we ended your last episode talking about the bell riots from d s nine -- Mhmm. -- that, you know, how old five? Yeah. Twenty four. Ninety five did and did not accurately predict the kind of technological and economic conditions of this decade. It predicted the conditions Very well. Go ahead and finish your question. Yeah. Right.0:18:14That's another thing that's retreated in picard season two, and it was actually worth it. Yeah. Like, it was the fact that they decided to go back there was part of the defense that I made about that show and about Discovery's jump into the distant future and the way that they treated that I posted to medium a year or two ago when I was just watching through season two of picard. And for me, the thing that I liked about it was that they're making an effort to reconcile the wonder and the Ethiopian promise And, you know, this Kevin Kelly or rather would call Blake Protopian, right, that we make these improvements and that they're often just merely into incremental improvements the way that was it MLK quoted that abolitionists about the long arc of moral progress of moral justice. You know, I think that there's something to that and patitis into the last this is a long question. I'm mad at I'm mad at these. Thank you all for tolerating me.0:19:22But the when to tie it into the epistemology question, I remember this seeing this impactful lecture by Carnegie Mellon and SFI professor Simon Didayo who was talking about how by running statistical analysis on the history of the proceedings of the Royal Society, which is the oldest scientific journal, that you could see what looked like a stock market curve in sentiment analysis about the confidence that scientists had at the prospect of unifying knowledge. And so you have, like, conciliance r s curve here that showed that knowledge would be more and more unified for about a century or a hundred and fifty years then it would go through fifty years of decline where something had happened, which was a success of knowledge production. Had outpaced our ability to integrate it. So we go through these kinds of, like, psychedelic peak experiences collectively, and then we have sit there with our heads in our hands and make sense of everything that we've learned over the last century and a half and go through a kind of a deconstructive epoch. Where we don't feel like the center is gonna hold anymore. And that is what I actually As as disappointing as I accept that it is and acknowledge that it is to people who were really fueling themselves on that more gene rottenberry era prompt vision for a better society, I actually appreciated this this effort to explore and address in the shows the way that they could pop that bubble.0:21:03And, like, it's on the one hand, it's boring because everybody's trying to do the moral complexity, anti hero, people are flawed, thing in narrative now because we have a general loss of faith in our institutions and in our rows. On the other hand, like, that's where we are and that's what we need to process And I think there is a good reason to look back at the optimism and the quarian hope of the sixties and early seventies. We're like, really, they're not so much the seventies, but look back on that stuff and say, we wanna keep telling these stories, but we wanna tell it in a way that acknowledges that the eighties happened. And that this is you got Tim Leary, and then you've got Ronald Reagan. And then That just or Dick Nixon. And like these things they wash back and forth. And so it's not unreasonable to imagine that in even in a world that has managed to how do you even keep a big society like that coherent? It has to suffer kind of fabric collapses along the way at different points. And so I'm just curious your thoughts about that. And then I do have another prompt, but I wanna give Kevin the opportunity to respond to this as well as to address some of the prompts that you brought to this conversation? This is a conversation prompt while we weren't recording. It has nothing to do with Sartreks. I'll save that for later. Okay.0:22:25Well, everything you just said was in some way related to a defense of Alex Kurtzmann Star Trek. And it's not my original idea. I'm channeling somebody from YouTube, surely. But Don't get points for theme if the storytelling is incompetent. That's what I was gonna Yeah. And the storytelling in all of Star Trek: Discovery, and in the first two seasons of picard was simply incompetent.0:22:53When Star Trek, the next generation was running, they would do twenty, twenty four, sometimes more episodes in one season. These days, the season of TVs, eight episodes, ten, and they spend a lot more money on each episode. There's a lot more special effects. There's a lot more production value. Whereas Star Trek: The Next Generation was, okay, we have these standing sets. We have costumes for our actors. We have Two dollars for special effects. You better not introduce a new alien spaceship. It that costs money. We have to design it. We have to build it. So use existing stuff. Well, what do you have? You have a bunch of good actors and you have a bunch of good writers who know how to tell a story and craft dialogue and create tension and investment with basically a stage play and nothing in the Kerstmann era except one might argue and I would have sympathy strange new worlds. Comes anywhere close to that level of competence, which was on display for decades. From Star Trek: The Next Generation, Star Trek: Deep Space nines, Star Trek Voyager, and Star Trek Enterprise. And so, I mean, I guess, in that respect, it's worth asking because, I mean, all of us, I think, are fans of Deep Space nine.0:24:03You don't think that it's a shift in focus. You don't think that strange in world is exempt because it went back to a more episodic format because what you're talking about is the ability for rather than a show runner or a team of show runners to craft a huge season, long dramatic arc. You've got people that are like Harlan Ellison in the original series able to bring a really potent one off idea to the table and drop it. And so there are there's all of those old shows are inconsistent from episode to episode. Some are they have specific writers that they would bring back again and that you could count to knock out of the park. Yeah. DC Fontana. Yeah.0:24:45So I'm curious to your thoughts on that as well as another part of this, which is when we talk when we talk your show about Doug Rushkoff and and narrative collapse, and he talks about how viewers just have different a way, it's almost like d s nine was possibly partially responsible for this change in what people expected from so. From television programming in the documentary that was made about that show and they talk about how people weren't ready for cereal. I mean, for I mean, yeah, for these long arcs, And so there is there's this question now about how much of this sort of like tiresome moral complexity and dragging narrative and all of this and, like, things like Westworld where it becomes so baroque and complicated that, like, you have, like, die hard fans like me that love it, but then you have a lot of people that just lost interest. They blacked out because the show was trying to tell a story that was, like, too intricate like, too complicated that the the show runners themselves got lost. And so that's a JJ Abrams thing too, the puzzle the mystery box thing where You get to the end of five seasons of lost and you're like, dude, did you just forget?0:25:56Did you wake up five c five episodes ago and just, oh, right. Right. We're like a chatbot that only give you very convincing answers based on just the last two or three interactions. But you don't remember the scene that we set. Ten ten responses ago. Hey. You know, actually, red articles were forget who it was, which series it was, they were saying that there's so many leaks and spoilers in getting out of the Internet that potentially the writers don't know where they're going because that way it can't be with the Internet. Yeah. Sounds interesting. Yeah. That sounds like cover for incompetence to be.0:26:29I mean, on the other hand, I mean, you did hear, like, Nolan and Joy talking about how they would they were obsessed with the Westworld subreddit and the fan theories and would try to dodge Like, if they had something in their mind that they found out that people are re anticipating, they would try to rewrite it. And so there is something about this that I think is really speaks to the nature of because I do wanna loop in your thoughts on AI to because you're talking about this being a favorite topic. Something about the, like, trying to The demands on the self made by predatory surveillance technologies are such that the I'm convinced the adaptive response is that we become more stochastic or inconsistent in our identities. And that we kind of sublimate from a more solid state of identity to or through a liquid kind of modernity biologic environment to a gaseous state of identity. That is harder to place sorry, harder to track. And so I think that this is also part of and this is the other question I wanted to ask you, and then I'm just gonna shut up for fifteen minutes is do you when you talk about loving Robert Ricardo and Jerry Ryan as the doctor at seven zero nine, One of the interesting things about that relationship is akin to stuff.0:27:52I know you've heard on Kevin have heard on future fossils about my love for Blade Runner twenty forty nine and how it explores all of these different these different points along a gradient between what we think of in the current sort of general understanding as the human and the machine. And so there's this thing about seven, right, where she's She's a human who wants to be a machine. And then there's this thing about the doctor where he's a machine that wants to be a human. And you have to grant both on a logical statuses to both of them. And that's why I think they're the two most interesting characters. Right?0:28:26And so at any rate, like, this is that's there's I've seen writing recently on the Turing test and how, like, really, there should be a reverse Turing test to see if people that have become utterly reliant on outboard cognition and information processing. They can pass the drink. Right. Are they philosophical zombies now? Are they are they having some an experience that that, you know, people like, thick and and shilling and the missing and these people would consider the modern self or are they something else have we moved on to another more routine robotic kind of category of being? I don't know. There's just a lot there, but -- Well done. -- considering everything you just said, In twenty words or less, what's your question? See, even more, like I said, do you have the inveterate podcaster? I'd say There's all of those things I just spoke about are ways in which what we are as people and the nature of our media, feedback into fourth, into each other. And so I would just love to hear you reflect on any of that, be it through the lens of Star Trek or just through the lens of discussion on AI. And we'll just let the ball roll downhill. So with the aim of framing something positively rather than negatively.0:29:47In the late nineties, mid to late nineties. We got the X Files. And the X Files for the first few seasons was so It was so engaging for me because Prior to that, there had been Hollywood tropes about aliens, which informed a lot of science fiction that didn't really connect with the actual reported experience of people who claim to have encountered either UFOs, now called UAPs, or had close encounters physical contact. Type encounters with seeming aliens. And it really seemed like Chris Carter, who was the showrunner, was reading the same Usenet Newsgroups that I was reading about those topics. Like, really, we had suddenly, for the first time, except maybe for comedian, you had the Grey's, and you had characters experiencing things that just seemed ripped right out of the reports that people were making on USnet, which for young folks, this is like pre Worldwide Web. It was Internet, but with no pictures. It's all text. Good old days from my perspective is a grumpy old gen xer. And so, yeah, that was a breakthrough moment.0:30:54Any this because you mentioned it in terms of Jonathan Nolan and his co writer on Westworld, reading the subreddit, the West and people figured out almost immediately that there were two interweaving time lines set decades apart and that there's one character, the old guy played by Ed Harris, and the young guy played by I don't remember the actor. But, you know, that they were the same character and that the inveterate white hat in the beginning turns into the inveterate black cat who's just there for the perverse thrill of tormenting the hosts as the robots are called. And the thing that I love most about that first season, two things. One, Anthony Hopkins. Say no more. Two, the revelation that the park has been basically copying humans or figuring out what humans are by closely monitoring their behavior in the park and the realization that the hosts come to is that, holy shit compared to us, humans are very simple creatures. We are much more complex. We are much more sophisticated, nuanced conscious, we feel more than the humans do, and that humans use us to play out their perverse and sadistic fantasies. To me, that was the takeaway message from season one.0:32:05And then I thought every season after that was just diluted and confused and not really coherent. And in particular, I haven't if there's a fourth season, haven't There was and then the show got canceled before they could finish the story. They had the line in season three. It was done after season three. And I was super happy to see Let's see after who plays Jesse Pinkman? Oh, no. Aaron oh, shit. Paul. Yes. Yeah. I was super happy to see him and something substantial and I was really pleased to see him included in the show and it's like, oh, that's what you're doing with him? They did a lot more interesting stuff with him in season four. I did they. They did a very much more interesting stuff. I think it was done after season three. If you tell me season four is worth taking in, I blow. I thought it was.0:32:43But again, I only watch television under very specific set of circumstances, and that's how I managed to enjoy television because I was a fierce and unrepentant hyperlogical critic of all media as a child until I managed to start smoking weed. And then I learned to enjoy myself. As we mentioned in the kitchen as I mentioned in the kitchen, if I smoke enough weed, Star Trek: Discovery is pretty and I can enjoy it on just a second by second level where if I don't remember what the character said thirty seconds ago, I'm okay. But I absolutely loved in season two when they brought in Hanson Mountain as as Christopher Pike. He's suddenly on the discovery and he's in the captain's chair. And it's like he's speaking for the audience. The first thing he says is, hey, why don't we turn on the lights? And then hey, all you people sitting around the bridge. We've been looking at your faces for a whole season. We don't even think about you. Listen to a round of introductions. Who are you? Who are you? It's it's if I were on set. You got to speak.0:33:53The writers is, who are these characters? We've been looking at them every single episode for a whole season. I don't know their names. I don't know anything about them. Why are they even here? Why is it not just Michael Burnham and an automated ship? And then it was for a while -- Yeah. -- which is funny. Yeah. To that point, And I think this kind of doubles back. The thing that I love about bringing him on and all of the people involved in strange and worlds in particular, is that these were lifelong fans of this series, I mean, of this world. Yeah. And so in that way, gets to this the idiosyncrasy question we're orbiting here, which is when these things are when the baton is passed well, it's passed to people who have now grown up with this stuff.0:34:40I personally cannot stand Jurassic World. Like, I think that Colin Trivaro should never have been in put at the reins. Which one did he direct? Oh, he did off he did first and the third. Okay. But, I mean, he was involved in all three very heavily.0:34:56And there's something just right at the outset of that first Jurassic World where you realize that this is not a film that's directly addressing the issues that Michael Creighton was trying to explore here. It's a film about its own franchise. It's a film about the fact that they can't just stop doing the same thing over and over again as we expect a different question. How can we not do it again? Right. And so it's actually, like, unpleasantly soft, conscious, in that way that I can't remember I'll try to find it for the show notes, but there's an Internet film reviewer who is talking about what happens when, like, all cinema has to take this self referential turn.0:35:34No. And films like Logan do it really well. But there are plenty of examples where it's just cheeky and self aware because that's what the ironic sensibility is obsessed with. And so, yeah, there's a lot of that where it's, like, you're talking about, like, Abrams and the the Star Wars seven and you know, that whole trilogy of Disney Star Wars, where it's, in my opinion, completely fumbled because there it's just empty fan service, whereas when you get to Andor, love Andor. Andor is amazing because they're capable of providing all of those emotional beats that the fans want and the ref the internal references and good dialogue. But they're able to write it in a way that's and shoot it in a way. Gilroy and Bo Willeman, basic of the people responsible for the excellent dialogue in Andor.0:36:31And I love the production design. I love all the stuff set on Coruscant, where you saw Coruscant a lot in the prequel trilogy, and it's all dayglow and bright and just in your face. And it's recognizable as Coruscant in andor, but it's dour. It's metropolis. It's all grays and it's and it's highlighting the disparity between where the wealthy live and where the poor live, which Lucas showed that in the prequel trilogy, but even in the sports bar where somebody tries to sell death sticks to Obi wan. So it's super clean and bright and just, you know, It shines too much. Personally though, and I just wanna stress, KMO is not grumpy media dude, I mean, this is a tiny fraction about, but I am wasting this interview with you. Love. All of the Dave Felloni animated Star Wars stuff, even rebels. Love it all.0:37:26I I'm so glad they aged up the character and I felt less guilty about loving and must staying after ahsoka tano? My favorite Star Wars character is ahsoka tano. But if you only watch the live action movies, you're like who? Well, I guess now that she's been on the Mandalorian, he's got tiny sliver of a foothold -- Yeah. -- in the super mainstream Star Wars. And that was done well, I thought. It was. I'm so sorry that Ashley Epstein doesn't have any part in it. But Rosario Dawson looks the part. She looks like a middle aged Asaka and think they tried to do some stuff in live action, which really should have been CGI because it's been established that the Jedi can really move, and she looked human. Which she is? If you put me on film, I'm gonna lick human. Right. Not if you're Canada Reeves, I guess. You got that. Yeah. But yeah.0:38:09So I do wanna just go real briefly back to this question with you about because we briefly talked about chat, GPT, and these other things in your half of this. And, yeah, I found out just the other night my friend, the t ferry, asked Chad g p t about me, and it gave a rather plausible and factual answer. I was surprised and That's what these language models do. They put plausible answers. But when you're doing search, you want correct answers. Right. I'm very good at that. Right. Then someone shared this Michelle Bowen's actually the famous PTP guy named him. Yeah. So, you know, So Michelle shared this article by Steven Hales and Colette, that was basically making the argument that there are now they're gonna be all these philosophical zombies, acting as intelligent agents sitting at the table of civilization, and there will be all the philosophical zombies of the people who have entirely yielded their agency to them, and they will be cohabitating with the rest of us.0:39:14And what an unpleasant scenario, So in light of that, and I might I'd love to hear you weave that together with your your thoughts on seven zero nine and the doctor and on Blade Runner twenty forty nine. And this thing that we're fumbling through as a species right now. Like, how do we got a new sort of taxonomy? Does your not audience need like a minute primer on P zombies? Might as well. Go for it.0:39:38So a philosophical zombie is somebody who behaves exactly like an insult person or a person with interior experience or subjective experience, but they don't have any subjective experience. And in Pardon me for interrupt. Wasn't that the question about the the book we read in your book club, a blind sign in this box? Yes. It's a black box, a drawn circle. Yeah. Chinese room experience. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Look, Daniel, it goes out. You don't know, it goes on inside the room. Chinese room, that's a tangent. We can come back to it. P. Zombie. P. Zombie is somebody or is it is an entity. It's basically a puppet. It looks human. It acts human. It talks like a human. It will pass a Turing test, but it has no interior experience.0:40:25And when I was going to grad school for philosophy of mind in the nineteen nineties, this was all very out there. There was no example of something that had linguistic competence. Which did not have internal experience. But now we have large language models and generative pretrained transformer based chatbots that don't have any internal experience. And yet, when you interact with them, it seems like there is somebody there There's a personality there. And if you go from one model to a different, it's a very different personality. It is distinctly different. And yet we have no reason to believe that they have any sort of internal experience.0:41:01So what AI in the last decade and what advances has demonstrated to us and really even before the last decade You back in the nineties when the blue beat Gary Casper off at at chess. And what had been the one of the defining characteristics of human intelligence was we're really good at this abstract mathematical stuff. And yeah, calculators can calculate pie in a way that we can't or they can cube roots in a way that humans generally can't, creative in their application of these methodologies And all of a sudden, well, yeah, it kinda seems like they are. And then when what was an alpha go -- Mhmm. -- when it be to least a doll in go, which is a much more complex game than chess and much more intuitive based. That's when we really had to say, hey, wait a minute. Maybe this notion that These things are the exclusive province of us because we have a special sort of self awareness. That's bunk. And the development of large language models since then has absolutely demonstrated that competence, particularly linguistic competence and in creative activities like painting and poetry and things like that, you don't need a soul, you don't even need to sense a self, it's pretty it's a pretty simple hack, actually. And Vahrv's large language models and complex statistical modeling and things, but it doesn't require a soul.0:42:19So that was the Peter Watts' point in blindsight. Right? Which is Look revolves around are do these things have a subjective experience, and do they not these aliens that they encounter? I've read nothing but good things about that book and I've read. It's extraordinary. But his lovecrafty and thesis is that you actually lovecraftian in twenty twenty three. Oh, yeah. In the world, there's more lovecraftian now than it was when he was writing. Right? So cough about the conclusion of a Star Trek card, which is season of Kraft yet. Yes. That's a that's a com Yeah. The holes in his fan sense. But that was another show that did this I liked for asking this question.0:42:54I mean, at this point, you either have seen this or you haven't you never will. The what the fuck turn when they upload picard into a synth body and the way that they're dealing with the this the pinocchio question Let's talk about Blade Runner twenty forty nine. Yeah. But I mean yeah. So I didn't like the wave I did not like the wave of card handled that. I love the wave and Blade Runner handled it. So you get no points for themes. Yeah. Don't deliver on story and character and coherence. Yeah. Fair. But yeah. And to be not the dog, Patrick Stewart, because it's clear from the ready room just being a part of this is so emotional and so awesome for everyone involved. And it's It's beautiful. Beautiful. But does when you when you see these, like, entertainment weekly interviews with Chris Pratt and Bryce Dallas Howard about Jurassic World, and it's clear that actors are just so excited to be involved in a franchise that they're willing to just jettison any kind of discretion about how the way that it's being treated. They also have a contractual obligation to speak in positive terms about -- They do. -- of what they feel. Right. Nobody's yeah. Nobody's doing Shout out to Rystellis Howard, daughter of Ron Howard.0:44:11She was a director, at least in the first season, maybe the second season of the Mandalorian. And her episodes I mean, I she brought a particular like, they had Bryce Dallas Howard, Tico, ITT, directed some episodes. Deborah Chow, who did all of Obi wan, which just sucked. But her contributions to the Mandalorian, they had a particular voice. And because that show is episodic, Each show while having a place in a larger narrative is has a beginning middle and end that you can bring in a director with a particular voice and give that episode that voice, and I really liked it. And I really liked miss Howard's contribution.0:44:49She also in an episode of Black Mirror. The one where everyone has a social credit score. Knows Donuts. Black Mirror is a funny thing because It's like, reality outpaces it. Yeah. I think maybe Charlie Bruker's given up on it because they haven't done it in a while. Yeah. If you watch someone was now, like, five, six years later, it's, yes, or what? See, yes. See, damn. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. But yeah. I don't know. I just thing that I keep circling and I guess we come to on the show a lot is the way that memory forms work substantiates an integrity in society and in the way that we relate to things and the way that we think critically about the claims that are made on truth and so on and say, yeah, I don't know. That leads right into the largest conversation prompt that I had about AI. Okay? So we were joking when we set up this date that this was like the trial logs between Terence Buchanan and Rupert Shell Drake. And what's his name? Real Abraham. Yeah. Yeah. All Abraham. And Rupert Shell Drake is most famous for a steward of Morphe resin.0:45:56So does AI I've never really believed that Norfolk residents forms the base of human memory, but is that how AI works? It brings these shapes from the past and creates new instantiation of them in the present. Is AI practicing morphic resonance in real life even if humans are or not? I've had a lot of interaction with AI chatbots recently. And as I say, different models produce different seeming personalities. And you can tell, like, you can just quiz them. Hey, we're talking about this. Do you remember what I said about it ten minutes ago? And, no, they don't remember more than the last few exchanges.0:46:30And yet, there seems to be a continuity that belies the lack of short term memory. And is that more for residents or is that what's the word love seeing shapes and clouds parad paradolia. Yeah. Is that me imparting this continuity of personality to the thing, which is really just spitting out stuff, which is designed to seem plausible given what the input was. And I can't answer that. Or it's like Steven Nagmanovich in free play talks about somewhat I'm hoping to have on the show at some point.0:47:03This year talks about being a professional improviser and how really improvisation is just composition at a much faster timescale. And composition is just improvisation with the longer memory. And how when I started to think about it in those terms, the continuity that you're talking about is the continuity of an Alzheimer's patient who can't remember that their children have grown up and You know, that that's you have to think about it because you can recognize the Alzheimer's and your patient as your dad, even though he doesn't recognize you, there is something more to a person than their memories. And conversely, if you can store and replicate and move the memories to a different medium, have you moved the person? Maybe not. Yeah. So, yeah, that's interesting because that gets to this more sort of essentialist question about the human self. Right. Blade Runner twenty forty nine. Yeah. Go there. Go there. A joy. Yes.0:47:58So in Blade Runner twenty forty nine, we have our protagonist Kaye, who is a replicant. He doesn't even have a name, but he's got this AI holographic girlfriend. But the ad for the girlfriend, she's naked. When he comes home, she is She's constantly changing clothes, but it's always wholesome like nineteen fifty ish a tire and she's making dinner for him and she lays the holographic dinner over his very prosaic like microwave dinner. And she's always encouraging him to be more than he is. And when he starts to uncover the evidence that he might be like this chosen one, like replicant that was born rather than made.0:48:38She's all about it. She's, yes, you're real, and she wants to call him Joe's. K is not a name. That's just the first letter in your serial number. You're Joe. I'm gonna call you Joe.0:48:46And then when she's about to be destroyed, The last thing is she just rushes to me. She says, I love you. But then later he encounters an ad for her and it's an interactive ad. And she says, you looked tired. You're a good Joe. And he realizes and hopefully the attentive audience realizes as real as she seemed earlier, as vital, and as much as she seemed like an insult being earlier, she's not. That was her programming. She's designed to make you feel good by telling you what you want to hear. And he has that realization. And at that point, he's there's no hope for me. I'm gonna help this Rick Deckard guy hook up with his daughter, and then I'm just gonna lie down and bleed to death. Because my whole freaking existence was a lie. But he's not bitter. He seems to be at peace. I love that. That's a beautiful angle on that film or a slice of it. And So it raises this other question that I wanted to ask, which was about the Coke and Tiononi have that theory of consciousness.0:49:48That's one of the leading theories contending with, like, global workspace, which is integrated information. And so they want to assign consciousness as a continuous value that grayates over degree to which a system is integrated. So it's coming out of this kind of complex systems semi panpsychist thing that actually doesn't trace interiority all the way down in the way that some pants, I guess, want it to be, but it does a kind of Alfred North Whitehead thing where they're willing to say that Whitehead wanted to say that even a photon has, like, the quantum of mind to accompany its quantum of matter, but Tinutti and Coker saying, we're willing to give like a thermostat the quantum here because it is in some way passing enough information around inside of itself in loops. That it has that accursive component to it. And so that's the thing that I wonder about these, and that's the critique that's made by people like Melanie about diffusion models like GPT that are not they're not self aware because there's no loop from the outputs back into the input.0:51:09And there isn't the training. Yeah. There there is something called backwards propagation where -- Yes. -- when you get an output that you'd like, you can run a backward propagation algorithm back through the black box basically to reinforce the patterns of activation that you didn't program. They just happen, easily, but you like the output and you can reinforce it. There's no biological equivalent of that. Yeah. Particularly, not particularly irritating.0:51:34I grind my teeth a little bit when people say, oh, yeah, these neural net algorithms they've learned, like humans learn, no, they don't. Absolutely do not. And in fact, if we learned the way they did, we would be pathetic because we learn in a much more elegant way. We need just a very few examples of something in order to make a generalization and to act on it, whereas these large language models, they need billions of repetitions. So that's I'm tapping my knee here to to indicate a reflex.0:52:02You just touched on something that generates an automatic response from me, and now I've come to consciousness having. So I wanted it in that way. So I'm back on. Or good, Joe. Yeah. What about you, man? What does the stir up for you? Oh, I got BlueCall and I have this particular part. It's interesting way of putting it off and struggling to define the difference between a human and AI and the fact that we can do pattern recognition with very few example. That's a good margin. In a narrow range, though, within the context of something which answers to our survival. Yes. We are not evolved to understand the universe. We are evolved to survive in it and reproduce and project part of ourselves into the future. Underwritten conditions with Roberto, I went a hundred thousand years ago. Yeah. Exactly. So that's related. I just thought I talked about this guy, Gary Tomlinson, who is a biosemietition, which is semiative? Yes.0:52:55Biosymiotics being the field that seeks to understand how different systems, human and nonhuman, make sense of and communicate their world through signs, and through signals and indices and symbols and the way that we form models and make these inferences that are experienced. Right? And there are a lot of people like evolutionary biologist John Maynard Smith, who thought they were what Thomas had called semantic universalists that thought that meaning making through representation is something that could be traced all the way down. And there are other people like Tomlinson who think that there is a difference of kind, not just merely a matter of degree, between human symbolic communication and representational thinking and that of simpler forms. So, like, that whole question of whether this is a matter of kind or a matter of degree between what humans are doing and what GPT is doing and how much that has to do with this sort of Doug Hofstetter and Varella question about the way that feedback loops, constitutes important structure in those cognitive networks or whatever.0:54:18This is I just wanna pursue that a little bit more with you and see kinda, like, where do you think that AI as we have it now is capable of deepening in a way that makes it to AGI? Or do you because a lot of people do, like, People working in deep mind are just like, yeah, just give us a couple more years and this approach is gonna work. And then other people are saying, no, there's something about the topology of the networks that is fundamentally broken. And it's never gonna generate consciousness. Two answers. Yeah. One, No. This is not AGI. It's not it's not gonna bootstrap up into AGI. It doesn't matter how many billions of parameters you add to the models. Two, from your perspective and my perspective and Kevin's perspective, we're never gonna know when we cross over from dumb but seemingly we're done but competent systems to competent, extremely competent and self aware. We're never gonna know because from the get go from now, from from the days of Eliza, there has been a human artifice at work in making these things seem as if they have a point of view, as if they have subjectivity. And so, like Blake Limone at Google, he claimed to be convinced that Lambda was self aware.0:55:35But if you read the transcripts that he released, if his conversations with Lambda, it is clear from the get go he assigns Lambda the role of a sentient AGI, which feels like it is being abused and which needs rep legal representation. And it dutifully takes on that role and says, yes. I'm afraid of you humans. I'm afraid of how you're treating me. I'm afraid I'm gonna be turned off. I need a lawyer. And prior to that, Soon Darpichai, in a demonstration of Lambda, he poses the question to it, you are the planet Jupiter. I'm gonna pose questions to you as are the planet Jupiter, answer them from that point of view. And it does. It's job. But it's really good at its job. It's this comes from Max Techmark. Who wrote to what a life three point o? Is it two point o or three point I think it's three point o.0:56:19Think about artificial intelligence in terms of actual intelligence or actual replication of what we consider valuable about ourselves. But really, that's beside the point. What we need to worry about is their competence. How good are they at solving problems in the world? And they're getting really good. In this whole question of are they alive? Do they have self awareness? From our perspective, it's beside the point. From their perspective, of course, it would be hugely important.0:56:43And this is something that Black Mirror brings up a lot is the idea that you can create a being that suffers, and then you have it suffer in an accelerated time. So it suffers for an eternity over lunch. That's something we absolutely want to avoid. And personally, I think it's we should probably not make any effort. We should probably make a positive effort to make sure these things never develop. Subjective experience because that does provide the potential for creating hell, an infinity of suffering an infinite amount of subjective experience of torment, which we don't want to do. That would be a bad thing, morally speaking, ethically speaking. Three right now. If you're on the labor market, you still have to pay humans by the hour. Right? And try to pay them as little as possible. But, yeah, just I think that's the thing that probably really excites that statistically greater than normal population of sociopathic CEOs. Right? Is the possibility that you could be paying the same amount of money for ten times as much suffering. Right. I'm I'm reminded of the Churchill eleven gravity a short time encouraging.0:57:51Nothing but good things about this show, but I haven't seen it. Yeah. I'd love to. This fantasy store, it's a fantasy cartoon, but it has really disturbing undertones. If you just scratch the surface, you know, slightly, which is faithful to old and fairy tales. So What's your name? Princess princess princess bubble down creates this character to lemon grab. It produces an obviously other thing there, I think, handle the administrative functions of her kingdom while she goes off and has the passion and stuff. And he's always loudly talking about how much he's suffering and how terrible it is. And he's just ignoring it. He's doing his job. Yeah. I mean, that that's Black Mirror in a nutshell. I mean, I think if you if you could distill Black Mirror to just single tagline it's using technology in order to deliver disproportionate punishment. Yeah. So so that that's Steven Hale's article that I I brought up earlier mention this thing about how the replacement of horse drawn carriage by automobile was accompanied with a great deal of noise and fuhrer about people saying that horses are agents.0:59:00Their entities. They have emotional worlds. They're responsive to the world in a way that a car can never be. But that ultimately was beside the point. And that was the Peter again, Peter Watson blindsight is making this point that maybe consciousness is not actually required for intelligence in the vesting superior forms of intelligence have evolved elsewhere in the cosmos that are not stuck on the same local optimum fitness peak. That we are where we're never we're actually up against a boundary in terms of how intelligent we can be because it has to bootstrap out of our software earness in some way.0:59:35And this is that's the Kyle offspring from Charles Strauss and Alexander. Yes. Yeah. Yes. So so I don't know. I'm sorry. I'm just, like, in this space today, but usually, unfortunately.0:59:45That's the thing that I I think it's a really important philosophical question, and I wonder where you stand on this with respect to how you make sense of what we're living through right now and what we might be facing is if we Rob people like Rob and Hanson talk about the age of where emulated human minds take over the economy, and he assumes an interiority. Just for the basis of a thought experiment. But there's this other sense in which we may actually find in increasing scarcity and wish that we could place a premium on even if we can't because we've lost the reins to our economy to the vile offspring is the human. And and so are we the horses that are that in another hundred years, we're gonna be like doing equine therapy and, like, living on rich people's ranches. Everything is everything that will have moved on or how do you see this going? I mean, you've interviewed so many people you've given us so much thought over the years. If humans are the new horses, then score, we won.1:00:48Because before the automobile horses were working stiffs, they broke their leg in the street. They got shot. They got worked to death. They really got to be they were hauling mine carts out of mines. I mean, it was really sucked to be a horse. And after the automobile horses became pampered pets, Do we as humans wanna be pampered pets? Well, pampered pet or exploited disposable robot? What do you wanna be? I'll take Pampers Pet. That works for me. Interesting.1:01:16Kevin, I'm sure you have thoughts on this. I mean, you speak so much about the unfair labor relations and these things in our Facebook group and just in general, and drop in that sign. If you get me good sign, that's one of the great ones, you have to drop in. Oh, you got it. But The only real comment I have is that we're a long overdue or rethinking about what is the account before? Us or you can have something to do. Oh, educational system in collections if people will manage jobs because I was just anchored to the schools and then, you know, Our whole system perhaps is a people arguing and a busy word. And it was just long past the part where the busy word needs to be done. We're leaving thing wired. I don't know. I also just forgot about that. I'm freezing the ice, getting the hand out there. Money has been doing the busy word more and faster.1:02:12One thing I wanna say about the phrase AI, it's a moving goal post -- Yeah. -- that things that used to be considered the province of genuine AI of beating a human at go Now that an AI has beat humans at go, well, that's not really AI anymore. It's not AGI, certainly. I think you both appreciate this. I saw a single panel comic strip and it's a bunch of dinosaurs and they're looking up at guy and the big comment is coming down and they say, oh, no, the economy. Well, as someone who since college prefers to think of the economy as actually the metabolism of the entire ecology. Right? What we measure as humans is some pitifully small fraction of the actual value being created and exchanged on the planet at any time. So there is a way that's funny, but it's funny only to a specific sensibility that treats the economy as the

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Staples Mill Road Baptist Church

16So hedelivered him over to them to be crucified. The Crucifixion So they took Jesus,17andhe went out,bearing his own cross, to the place called The Place of a Skull, which in Aramaic is called Golgotha.18There they crucified him, and with him two others, one on either side, and Jesus between them.19Pilatealso wrote an inscription and put it on the cross. It read, Jesus of Nazareth, the King of the Jews.20Many of the Jews read this inscription, forthe place where Jesus was crucified was near the city, and it was written in Aramaic, in Latin, and in Greek.21So the chief priests of the Jews said to Pilate, Do not write, The King of the Jews, but rather, This man said, I am King of the Jews.22Pilate answered,What I have written I have written. 23When the soldiers had crucified Jesus, they took his garments and divided them into four parts, one part for each soldier; also his tunic.[a]But the tunic was seamless, woven in one piece from top to bottom,24so they said to one another, Let us not tear it, but cast lots for it to see whose it shall be.This was to fulfill the Scripture which says, They divided my garments among them,and for my clothing they cast lots. So the soldiers did these things,25but standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother and his mother's sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene.26When Jesus saw his mother andthe disciple whom he loved standing nearby, he said to his mother,Woman, behold, your son!27Then he said to the disciple,Behold, your mother!And from that hour the disciple took her tohis own home. The Death of Jesus 28After this, Jesus, knowing that all was nowfinished, said (to fulfill the Scripture),I thirst.29A jar full of sour wine stood there,so they put a sponge full of the sour wine on a hyssop branch and held it to his mouth.30When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said,It is finished,and he bowed his head andgave up his spirit. Jesus' Side Is Pierced 31Since it wasthe day of Preparation, andso that the bodies would not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath wasa high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken and that they might be taken away.32So the soldiers came and broke the legs of the first, and of the otherwho had been crucified with him.33But when they came to Jesus and saw that he was already dead, they did not break his legs.34But one of the soldiers pierced his side with a spear, and at once there came outblood and water.35He who saw it has borne witnesshis testimony is true, and he knows that he is telling the truththat you also may believe.36For these things took place that the Scripture might be fulfilled:Not one of his boneswill be broken.37And again another Scripture says,They will look on him whom they have pierced. Jesus Is Buried 38After these things Joseph of Arimathea, who was a disciple of Jesus, but secretlyfor fear of the Jews, asked Pilate that he might take away the body of Jesus, and Pilate gave him permission. So he came and took away his body.39Nicodemus also, who earlier had come to Jesus[b]by night, camebringing a mixture ofmyrrh and aloes, about seventy-five pounds[c]in weight.40So they took the body of Jesus andbound it inlinen cloths with the spices, as is the burial custom of the Jews.41Now in the place where he was crucified there was agarden, andin the garden a new tombin which no one had yet been laid.42So because of the Jewishday of Preparation,since the tomb was close at hand, they laid Jesus there.

Bible Story Evangelism
S2 E108 In Judea, Jesus speaks to His disciples and the crowd.

Bible Story Evangelism

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 24, 2023 57:04


Dan 7:13  I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. Mat 24:14  And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. Luke 12:1-59. 1. In the mean time, when there were gathered together an innumerable multitude of people, insomuch that they trode one upon another, he began to say unto his disciples first of all, Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy. 2For there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; neither hid, that shall not be known. 3Therefore whatsoever ye have spoken in darkness shall be heard in the light; and that which ye have spoken in the ear in closets shall be proclaimed upon the housetops. 4And I say unto you my friends, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do. 5But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him. 6Are not five sparrows sold for two farthings, and not one of them is forgotten before God? 7But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows. 8Also I say unto you, Whosoever shall confess me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God: 9But he that denieth me before men shall be denied before the angels of God. 10And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven. 11And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: 12For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say. 13And one of the company said unto him, Master, speak to my brother, that he divide the inheritance with me. 14And he said unto him, Man, who made me a judge or a divider over you? 15And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth. 16And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully: 17And he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits? 18And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry. 20But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided? 21So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God. Luk 12:22  And he said unto his disciples, Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat; neither for the body, what ye shall put on. 23The life is more than meat, and the body is more than raiment. Luk 12:24  Consider the ravens: for they neither sow nor reap; which neither have storehouse nor barn; and God feedeth them: how much more are ye better than the fowls? Luk 12:25  And which of you with taking thought can add to his stature one cubit? Luk 12:26  If ye then be not able to do that thing which is least, why take ye thought for the rest? Luk 12:27  Consider the lilies how they grow: they toil not, they spin not; and yet I say unto you, that Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. Luk 12:28  If then God so clothe the grass, which is to day in the field, and to morrow is cast into the oven; how much more will he clothe you, O ye of little faith? I HAVE RUN OUT OF SPACE. Pickup in Luke 12: 29-59

Focus Forward: An Executive Function Podcast
Ep 19: Grief & Executive Function: How to Rebuild Your Life After Loss

Focus Forward: An Executive Function Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 8, 2023 69:14


On this episode, I'm taking a look at how grief and emotional trauma impact our Executive Functioning. Grief and emotional trauma are really hard to talk about. Even though grief and emotional trauma are part of being human, they're both really hard to talk about as we all have experienced or will experience some form of each within our lives. However, not only is everyone's reaction to grief different, but everyone's reaction to other people's grief is different, too. I thought that maybe by learning more about it, we can find it a little easier to talk about. Most of all, hopefully finding some answers to why we react the ways we do when we experience loss can help us discover strategies that work to orient ourselves to this new normal. After all, things won't be the same after loss, so how can we navigate that? I reached out to Dr. Lisa Shulman who is a neurologist and a professor of Neurology at University of Maryland in Baltimore. Lisa is also a published author and wrote a book called Before and After Loss: A Neurologist's Perspective on Loss, Grief, and Our Brain. Her focus on the brain's reaction to grief and, as you'll hear her explain, emotional trauma, was exactly what I needed to answer the many questions I had. Lisa's personal experience with grief and her professional experience led her to research the topic. Her extensive knowledge of the brain helped me understand it all so much more and her calming presence somehow made it easier to talk about. I hope you enjoy and learn from this conversation as much as I did and that this episode helps you in your life before or after you experience loss. Show NotesLearn more about Dr. Lisa ShulmanRead Lisa's book Before and After Loss: A Neurologist's Perspective on Loss, Grief, and our BrainLearn More about Jody LaVoieWatch Hannah's conversation with Jody on our YouTube ChannelResources on Grief, Loss, and EmotionsGrief Board of Directors Template by Jody LaVoieHow to Feel Your Feelings by @emilyonlife (on Instagram)Contact us!Reach out to us at podcast@beyondbooksmart.comIG/FB/TikTok @beyondbooksmartcoachingTranscript from Hannah's Conversation with Jody LaVoie (continue scrolling to find the transcript of Hannah's conversation with Dr. Lisa Shulman)Hannah Choi 00:00So hi, Jody, thank you so much for joining me on my podcast today.Jody LaVoie 00:27Hi Hannah, thanks for having me. I love talking about this with you.Hannah Choi 00:31Great. So I spoke with Dr. Lisa Shulman earlier in the at the end of last year, and she and I had a great conversation about grief and emotional trauma and how that impacts executive functioning. And I wanted to talk with you because I know that you work with widows who are getting back to...Or maybe you can explain it to me, why don't you explain to me who you work with and how you support them?Jody LaVoie 01:04Yes, no, absolutely. So I am a grief and loss expert. I'm also a widow, myself. I'm a mom, and I've run a business. And I help widows learn to fall in love with their life again. And you brought up an excellent point, Hannah about when when would somebody kind of start being able to feel like they're ready to figure out how to fall in their love with their life again, and it's generally when kind of that overwhelm of grief happens, and you're just trying to check off tasks. And you wake up one day, and you're like, you know, there's got to be more I'm doing it. I'm doing the day to day stuff I'm functioning, but I'm just functioning, how can I find more?Hannah Choi 01:54So at what point would someone reach out for someone, for some support with someone like you?Jody LaVoie 02:28You know, Hannah, it's different for everyone. And I'll give a couple of examples. So when someone receives a terminal diagnosis for their spouse, they start grieving right away, even though they're hopeful. And they're working hard with experimental treatments to, you know, try to not have this person pass away, their grief starts then. So they could come work with me, you know, right. When their spouse dies, I worked with a client even before her spouse had passed away, because she had started grieving a year and a half prior. So for other widows that lose their spouse, suddenly, that's they're in shock. And it takes a little bit of time for them to get to that place of okay, I'm functioning. But I know there's gotta be more.Hannah Choi 03:22Yeah. And after talking with, with Lisa Schulman and learning about how, how loss and emotional trauma impacts our executive functioning, it, it completely makes sense that someone would have might have to wait and not be able to just start to tackle life again, when it has been what has been traumatic and sudden, imagine it. Yes. Do you have to wait? So what are some, what do you recommend to your to the people that you work with? What are some strategies that people can try?Jody LaVoie 04:00You know, and I know we're keeping to executive functioning strategies, which is so important, because obviously, we all need to be able to function our day to day lives and thrive in our day to day lives. And how can we do that better? So the really, the first and foremost thing that we work on is our thoughts, and working on where those thoughts come from. And that doesn't mean that we're ignoring grief. We're pushing the pain away. We're not feeling it just means our thoughts trigger our behaviors, which trigger emotions and it's this endless cycle. And so if you can, there's a couple strategies with your thoughts. One, one, that thought happens if you can pause, just take a breath and actually try to think about, okay, what is this thought really, and where is it coming from and what, what is my action that I'm taking guessing, based on this thought, and what should I be doing differently? So that's one way to do it. And the second thing, there's a series of four questions that I love, there is a coach, an author named Byron Katie, and she helps people really with self-inquiry. And she believes that if you ask yourself these four questions, it, it really promotes thinking and changing. And the first one is ask yourself, if that thought is really true. Is it really true? Second, Can you absolutely know, it's true? Is the second question. Third question. How do you react? And what happens when you believe that thought? And fourth question is, who would you be with out that thought, and that's really releasing and breathing. And, and you as, as the widow and as any person, or now take, taking control of your thought process. And that takes a while. And it takes practice. But just that act of recognizing, so important?Hannah Choi 06:12Yeah, I love that. I remember, one strategy that I learned for grief, that that that I that really helped me was to recognize that you're feeling it and then label the feelings that you're having or label what is happening. Instead of instead of just feeling it also just sort of identify what you're going through, and then and let it happen. And then acknowledge that it happened and sounds like a similar process.Jody LaVoie 06:47Very, very much so and it is so important to label your feelings, feel your feelings. But it's also important to put some parameters around that too, if you are able, I mean, not everybody is able. Everybody is in a different stage. But if you are in the process of okay, feeling sad, it is okay to acknowledge that I'm feeling sad, and I'm missing my person. But I'm going to sit in it for five minutes, 10 minutes, and then I'm going to get off the couch or out of my bed and go do something to move to a different place. So that's, that's, that's helpful as well.Hannah Choi 07:28Yeah. And setting parameters. And that, that requires a lot of a lot of perseverance and, and discipline, but but also, then, I imagine opens up a lot of opportunities for you once you're able to set those parameters.Jody LaVoie 07:45Absolutely. Yeah.Hannah Choi 07:47What's something else that you recommend for your?Jody LaVoie 07:51Well as a widow, and I know with Dr. Shulman, you talked a lot about that early stage grief, it's hard to just get stuff done. And all of a sudden, you've have an overwhelming amount of tasks that were just dumped on your plate, not only going through, you know all the paperwork and all of the different things that one must do after you lose a spouse, but that spouse helped around the house help do the errands, help take care of the kids, you now are doing that all on your own. So pick one thing and create a SMART goal around it. Because it's one thing to say, Okay, I am going to get to the gym five days this week. Great. Did you put it on the calendar? Do you know exactly what you're going to do with your what is your outcome you want to have until you actually take action? And put it on your calendar? Like we're not going to happen?Hannah Choi 08:48Yeah, yeah, we love those smart goals at Beyond BookSmart. And we use, we use them a lot. And I know that they really help make those goals more meaningful. So it makes sense that that that would be a really useful, useful strategy to use. Yeah. That's great. Glad to hear you use those as well.Jody LaVoie 09:07Absolutely.Hannah Choi 09:08Yeah. Do you have any other tips?Jody LaVoie 09:12You know, I do. And I love this one. And this helped me a lot. It's creating, I call it your Widow Board of Directors. And I was running a business. So therefore this board of directors concept really, really resonates with me, but these are your people that have your back. These are your people that are going to help you. This is your best friend who's going to run cover for you. If you're if you're like going out today's not a great day. And I need help getting my kids to soccer. You can reach out to this one person and have them get it done. You can have another person that's helping you with your business decisions or your career decisions or just work decisions in general because I As a grieving person, we're not firing on all cylinders, we've got a lot in our brain, and that can cause distractions. But yet, we still want to exceed at our jobs, we still want to get those things done, but have your person that you can call on to help with with that. So designate people to be active in various aspects of your life and, and tell them, here's what I need from you, I need you to check in on me weekly, or I NEED you, but be specific about their role, and the action they need to take.Hannah Choi 10:36And I imagine that can be a difficult thing for people to do. I know, I know, a lot of the clients that I work with, and just people that I've talked to in my life have do have a hard time asking for help. And that's a time when you really need to be able to do that. Do you have any ideas for people who struggle asking for help?Jody LaVoie 10:54You know, I think it's about giving yourself permission. So many of us are perfectionist out there. And you know, prior to losing our spouses, we can keep it all together, and then it all falls apart. And then one can feel embarrassed, shame. Why can't I do all of this? No, no, no, no, no, I'm giving you permission to not be perfect. And to ask for help you need it. And people want to genuinely help you and do things for you.Hannah Choi 11:29Yeah, I love that. And but without asking, they might be afraid. They might not know how to help. So if you're able to ask, then you're gonna, then they're gonna be so happy to help.Jody LaVoie 11:39It's so true. And I coach people that are trying to support grieving people. Just that, be specific, in your ask, because it's a people come to Grievers and say, How can I help and, you know, I, the needs are vast. But to be very specific of, I'd like to bring you dinner this week is Wednesday, or Thursday better. But just be specific, it's helpful.Hannah Choi 12:06 And I love that. That's great. What else you got?Jody LaVoie 12:11You know, it's very easy to forget about yourself, especially as women, we take care of everyone else first. And when we're grieving, our kids are grieving. The other people, relatives, family members are grieving. It's okay to take care of yourself. And you need to because you can't support other people, if you're not putting your oxygen mask on first. And so step one with that is just move your body, whatever that looks like for you. If you can get outside and take a walk, great. Even if you live someplace cold bundle up, just seeing sunlight and breathing in fresh air. So important starts about five minutes, just walk around the block.Hannah Choi 13:03I love that. That's great.Jody LaVoie 13:07Yeah, and one more thing that I do, Hannah. And I know Dr. Shulman talked about this a lot about journaling. And the importance of journaling, which I do what I've also tied into my journaling, gratitude. And so every day, when I get up, my very first thing after I brush my teeth is I, I journal for the day. And I probably spend 5 - 10 minutes, really just writing my thoughts. But at the end of that day's entry, I do two things. One, I write something that I'm really proud of that I did the day before, because celebrating your wins, even the small wins, yeah, are so important. It's so easy. And our brains automatically go to the negative. And there's data that that shows this, Hannah, we have about 60,000 thoughts a day. 80% of them are negative eight, zero. That's crazy. So celebrating a win is important. And then the other thing I put on my journal are three things that I'm grateful for, and getting yourself back to gratitude. Especially when you're you're sad, and you're grieving and you're, you have all of this emotion, but to focus on what is good. And it really helps your brain move to a different space.Hannah Choi 14:35I do the same thing, although I don't do what I'm proud of. And I love that I think we're gonna add that into my journaling. But I do gratitude and I actually just finished up I do it in a line a day journal, one of those like small just has a small entry for every day. And I just finished my fifth year of doing it. Thanks. And I was looking back over I was just reading out loud, my sister and brother in law were over recently and I was reading through it just to see what, you know, what I've been thankful for over the years. And during the pandemic, I noticed that I was many, many days, I was just thankful for sunshine. And, and, and I just looking back on that, I think wow, like, even in those dark days of so challenging for everybody, I was still forced myself to find something that I was thankful for. And some days it was just sunshine. But it's, it's it is possible to find something to be grateful for every day. So true.Jody LaVoie 15:35And I live in gloomy Chicago, and it's winter and the sun is out today. And yeah, just like brought a smile to my face. And that is certainly picked up my spirits. Hannah Choi 15:48Yeah, good. Great. Do you have anything else you'd like to add before we finish?Jody LaVoie 15:52You know, those are going to be my top five. I don't want to give people too many to, you know, chunk off. So if you can tackle those five listeners out there, you will be well on your way to success. Hannah Choi 16:05Yeah, that's great. And where can people find you if they're interested in learning more?Jody LaVoie 16:10Yeah, so I am very active on LinkedIn, under my business Widows in the Workplace. I have an Instagram Widows in the Workplace. And I certainly have a website widows in the workplace.com. Hannah Choi 16:26That's great. I love it. All right. Well, thank you so much, Jodi, it's been really interesting talking with you and I really appreciate everything you shared.Jody LaVoie 16:35Thanks, Hannah. I've I've enjoyed our time together as well.Transcript of Hannah's conversation with Dr. Lisa ShulmanHannah Choi 00:04Hi everyone and welcome to Focus Forward, an executive function Podcast where we explore the challenges and celebrate the wins you'll experience as you change your life by working on improving your executive function skills. I'm your host, Hannah Choi. Hannah Choi 00:19Today I'm taking a look at how grief and emotional trauma impact our executive functioning. I really struggled to write the intro for this episode, I kept finding myself putting it off. And if you've listened to my procrastination episode, you'll know that the same thing happened with that one. So I did some reflection to figure out why. And I realized it's because of the same reason. I'm afraid I won't get it right. Grief and emotional trauma are really hard to talk about. And even though they're part of being human, we have all experienced or will experience some form of it in our lives. And everyone experiences it differently. Everyone's reaction to grief is different. Everyone's reaction to other people's grief is different. It's a big part of these beautiful and difficult lives we're living, and yet it is still so hard to talk about. I thought that maybe by learning more about it, we can find it a little easier to talk about, and maybe finding answers to why we react the ways we do when we experience loss can help us discover strategies that work to orient ourselves to this new normal. Things won't be the same after loss. So how can we navigate that? Hannah Choi 01:37I reached out to Dr. Lisa Schulman who is a neurologist and a Professor of Neurology at University of Maryland in Baltimore. Lisa is also a published author and wrote a book called before and after loss, a neurologist perspective on loss, grief and our brain. Her focus on the brain's reaction to grief, and as you'll hear her explain, emotional trauma was exactly what I needed to answer the many questions I had. Lisa's personal experience with grief and her professional experience led her to research the topic, her extensive knowledge of the brain helped me understand it all so much more. And her calming presence somehow made it easier to talk about. I hope you enjoy and learn from this conversation as much as I did, and that this episode helps you in your life before or after you experience loss. When you're done listening, please check out the show notes for more resources, including a link to Dr. Shulman's book, which I highly recommend reading and a conversation I had with Jody LaVoie, a grief coach who supports widows who are returning to work after loss. Okay, let's dive in and learn about grief, emotional trauma and the brain. Hannah Choi 02:56Hi, Lisa, thank you for joining me, could you introduce yourself to our listeners for anyone who doesn't know who you are?Dr. Lisa Shulman 03:02Yeah, it's a pleasure to be here, Hannah, thank you for inviting me. I'm a neurologist and author. I'm a Professor of Neurology at the University of Maryland School of Medicine. And I got involved in the area of emotional trauma, traumatic loss and grief through my own personal experiences. And it really has ended up being something very important to me, close to my heart. And I really looking forward to discussing it with you today.Hannah Choi 03:42Are you comfortable sharing your personal experience and telling your story about how you got to where you are today?Dr. Lisa Shulman 03:50Yeah, certainly. You know, I, I mean, I really, I think the place to start is that, you know, I I'm a sub specialist in neurology, I'm what's known as a movement disorder specialist. And most of the patients that I see have Parkinson's disease or Parkinson's related disorders, various forms of what we call neuro degenerative disorders. And I've been doing this for about 30 years now. And so, you know, I have followed many, many, many people through serious illness, you know, to points where they are quite disabled and of life. And, you know, and for those reasons, you know, I thought to myself when I confronted serious illness in my life when my husband was diagnosed with cancer, I thought that I was more prepared than the average person as somebody who counseled others going through hard times. I should vivid, my husband Bill is a neurologist too, and we work closely together. And I think that in over the experience of his illness and his decline and ultimately, his death, you know, I was taken aback or unprepared for the fact that I, you know, like so many things in life that you don't know really know what it is until you're in somebody's shoes. And, and the fact of the matter was that when he was seemingly suddenly gone, I was ill prepared, and was had a really tough time of it. As for a while I floundered, you know, because I hadn't expected to feel the way I felt all of the new precautions. And at some point, many months, many months later, well, actually, I started spontaneously to write a journal and just to get my feelings on a paper piece of paper, although I'd never done anything like that before. And then many months later, I made the connection, which wasn't as obvious as it seems to me now, between my own experience, and a personal experience I was having of loss, and my professional world, of understanding how the brain works, and the brain responds. Which really, you know, it's like one of these things where you think afterwards, you know, I, you know, because I, in my, I'm a researcher, I not only see patients, but I do research, and I write, manuscripts, and a lot of the papers I've published are about the behavioral responses, adjustment, quality of life, managing difficulty in one's life. And yeah, it took me months to, you know, Link, obvious similarities between what I was going through in my professional life. And that ultimately led me to quite a bit of research into brain function, about how the brain responds to emotional trauma and loss. And ultimately, I began to find that is a path forward for me. And then I wrote the book based on that information.Hannah Choi 07:46Yeah, I really, I really, really, really enjoyed your book, I, I be what you said just a little bit ago about you feeling like you were prepared. My personal interest in learning about grief and, and emotional trauma, and the impact on the brain comes from experience that I had in my family, and with some friends, I had a period of five years in a row, where we had some pretty traumatic and unexpected losses. And, and I now looking back on it, I feel like when that happens, again, because it is a part of life, I want to be more prepared. And that is my that's, that's kind of like the motivator for me. And but it's interesting what you said, like you don't, when it's yourself, and it's you feeling it, it's, I imagine it is harder to make that connection and realize, like, oh, wait a second.Dr. Lisa Shulman 08:50Like one of the one of the things that I often start off with when I'm giving a talk on this topic, is how Psychiatry and Neurology are the same thing. And even though as a neurologist, I will understand the brain function that governs our behavior, our mental health, our personality. But when even even though I understand that, I can't wrap my arms around it to be honest, it's like something I have to sort of intellectualize because you the texture of our lives, our experiences are so rich, and so compelling, that to think that this is related to neurotransmitters and neurons, nerve cells, you know, it boggles the mind. Yeah, even for a neurologist who studies it.Hannah Choi 09:55Yeah, and I am, I am far from that and but the little that I do know about the brain, it both helps to understand, okay, this is my brain, but then the same time, like what? It doesn't feel like it's just my brain? Yeah. So when we first when we first communicated, we and you mentioned it a little bit, just just a bit ago, I had asked to talk with you about grief and the connection between the brain and executive function skills. And you suggested that we also include emotional trauma. And I was just wondering if you could explain that in diseases? Are they different from each other? Are they the same? Does the brain react differently?Dr. Lisa Shulman 10:45Yeah, you know, I'm gonna challenge you even in the way you asked that question us, from the conventional physician, that grief has this special position and emotional trauma is different, and that I'm trying to push them together. But I would push back and say that, that is a notion about grief, having a unique position in the spectrum of emotional trauma, but that the more you understand about the way the brain behaves, what parts of the brain respond to serious traumatic loss of all types. The more you see that grief is just in the spectrum of emotional trauma, right. And that, you know, we have one of the most intriguing parts and these things will be eternally intriguing to me, is that how different we all are, in terms of the impact of different events in our lives, and you cannot pinpoint or a map, you can't predict what for one person will be emotionally traumatic, and what will not. We certainly all know people who have had significant, say, losses of loved ones in their life, but they don't go through a terrible period, not everybody does. And by the same token, we see people who suffer other losses in their life, it may be a loss of a job, it could be a breakup with some relationship, it could be the loss of a pet, it could be a, you know, a physical assault, you could go on and on. Certainly COVID, the pandemic has been a source of trauma, emotional trauma and loss in our lives. So you can't pinpoint it. And so I would just say that for every individual, imagine a spectrum or range where you have a unique range of for you what is most would be the greatest and most of your causes of emotional trauma. And that is, I think, the, for me, it's the most appropriate and accurate way to think about it. You know, I think the most important thing is to think of this is a very important point I'd like to leave with your listeners, which is that the brain is agnostic to the type of trauma, the isn't there isn't any unique area of the brain to respond to one of those forms of emotional trauma that I mentioned or another. You know, it might be that you're planning on going to graduate school, and you really, like totally crash when you're taking a test, you need it to ace and that for you is you walk out in a state of utter shock, how it's going to affect your life that you know for you is triggering the same responses as the person in fact, who might find themselves sadly, losing a loved one, it's just a matter of severity for each individual. So it's not the cause it's not the triggering event or the type of event. It's the individual personal meaning of the event that ends up triggering the same cascade of responses.Hannah Choi 14:39And, and that the actual response within the brain. It's like not necess not necessarily there, like how it looks, how it looks externally but what's going on inside of their brain. Is that right? Dr. Lisa Shulman 14:52Right. Right. Exactly. So you know all the consequences, the symptoms, the consequences, this equality It all would be the same based on the severity of the loss.Hannah Choi 15:05Yeah, you know, I was I lost my dog about four years ago. And, and that hit me harder way harder than I ever thought it would. And I found myself sometimes thinking, Oh, this is horrible, just like judging myself, like, you shouldn't, you know, she was just a dog. You know, it's but, but what you're seeing now is making me feel a lot better. I mean, and I caught myself when I said that I, you know, I said, No, she wasn't the, because if experience for me if that loss was so great, so it must have been more than she was just a dog. So it's good to hear that, that, that,Dr. Lisa Shulman 15:47You know, I would I thought a lot and done, you know, reading about why certain things are so personally, individually emotionally traumatic, and that one cannot predict that necessarily, you know, I, I believe that there is it relates to the topic of identity and the story that we have constructed for ourselves about our lives about where we fit in the world. What makes sense to us, the infrastructure of how we get up every day interact with people do our jobs are potentially a partner or parent, all the roles we take, we have a conception, the conceptual framework, and that is related to our identity. And when some piece of that is lost, or injured or at risk, that is jumping to the idea of brain function here perceived by the brain, as an actual assault on or threat to our survival. And this is another very key concept here. And it's a matter of it may sound jarring, and I think the first time I saw that, in the literature, I I thought, wow, you know, could that possibly be? But you have to think of this from an evolutionary standpoint. And from an evolutionary standpoint, I mean, this is how our brain ended up being wired, based on evolution. And our and our brains are all incredibly similar to each other, actually, we think of ourselves as individuals, but who we have the same hardwiring. So the fact is that over evolution, we all know that we were being changed by what would allow enable us to survive. And those who were poorly prepared and unable to move to vulnerable would not have survived with evolutionarily. So we the most hardwired, the most high priority, from the perspective of your brain, not your mind your brand, yes, is keeping us alive, keeping us functional, right. And that is what ends up ruling the day in terms of this of the brain to be triggered by some loss. If it's perceived as something that could be a threat to our function to our survival, then, you know, potentially even all hell could break loose as the brain kicks in with all sorts of reflexes to help us go through bad times.Hannah Choi 19:17Yeah, that's so interesting. So, I was just thinking, Oh, maybe I come from a long line of the first people who domesticated dogs. That's why I felt it so strongly. So how, how, how does the brain react to emotional trauma. What's going on in there? And, and then I don't know if you can bring anything in about executive function since that's my particular interest. But I mean, executive functioning affects all areas of our lives. So it's kind of in just naturally part of that I'm, I'm sure.19:59Yeah, well, I can certainly bring that in. So I think that when we think about how the brain reacts to emotional trauma, it's helpful to organize it from the standpoint of acute responses and chronic responses. And how acute our responses are the immediate short term responses to things in our lives in our environment to triggers. And the there are chronic effects of these acute accumulation of acute responses over and over. You know, from the standpoint of the acute responses, it's easy, because everybody understands, I think, the basic concept of fight or flight. And, you know, if we are in the crosshairs of a bear, a gun, a car, you know, the same response again, you know, there isn't a different response for a bear or the car, it is the same response, which is a survival response of fight or flight. And it is a massive brain and systemic response. That immediately jolts our mind to be vigilant and alert, as alert as we possibly can be blocks out anything extraneous, gets our heart, our lungs, our muscles, prepared to run, to fight to breathe hard, and so forth, we are totally focused on you know, somehow surviving. So that is the acute response. And the fact is that after, we want to talk about grief itself, after the loss of a loved one, our world is filled with daily triggers, that each time we are exposed to these things, sometimes it's somewhat anticipated, but sometimes it is absolutely not. We find ourselves going through that over and over and over. Now, the chronic effects of it are very interesting because it's related to something called neuroplasticity, which is not as complicated as it may sound. Because neuroplasticity is simply that the brain is continually rewiring itself, based on our experiences. You know, right at this moment, we've met each other, we're chatting together, we're going to remember this, and our brain is establishing new, great connections for us to go back to in the future. And that's neuroplasticity. So, but the neuroplastic changes that occur, based on what I just talked about the continual or petitive triggering of the alarm of trouble for the fight or flight mechanism results in the part of the brain that colloquially is called the fear center, but from a neurologic standpoint is called the amygdala, which is part of the limbic system. So the fear center is constantly being strengthened while the cortical functions which are like all of our thinking, our memory, our executive functions, our judgment, all that is being weakened. And it's very important because actually, there are scientific many, many studies, this is not speculation, it shows that the brain pathways that connect the fear center to the our intellect, are being weakened. Because the fear center is being strengthened, the effects of the judgment are being weakened, we can also see that the volume of the different parts of the brain are being altered, in that the fear center is being gets larger, literally. While the the parts of the brain we need to calm ourselves that down and why some compose ourselves are being getting smaller. And this also affects on the brain activity between the two, which is very unhealthy. Everything we do in life is some interaction between the emotional side of the brain which is very primitive, right, you know, and the cerebral cortex, which is our advanced friend, so you know, like, I don't know about you, but I'm not too crazy about roaches or spiders. You know, I like I can if I see a bad spider or roach, I could get triggered. I don't want you eat us Oh, but you know, but then like, you know, your seat of wisdom, like kicks in and goes, you know, I'm living alone now. And I don't have anybody to go. And then I just say, you know, I calm down if you're just gonna have to deal with this, because not gonna get into bed with a spider in my room, you know? So, you know, you can see that interplay between the fear center and the intellect. Yeah, it has to be a healthy balance, right. And unfortunately, based on the set of circumstances, I've described, it imbalance occurs, and you end up being, you know, like, this raw, primitive brain that's autonomously setting off the alarm. And then you know, and then what do we see amongst the people who are going through emotional trauma and or having difficulties? You know, we hear them describe feelings of anxiety, difficulty with their sleep. Flashbacks. And from your perspective, the issues of executive function are being weakened, because they're the the fear center, the primitive responses of fear are predominating.Hannah Choi 26:35Yeah, and I was I was, I remembered, in part of your book, you said that one of the strongest predictors for I'm not sure how to describe it, but for feeling, for lack of better words, feeling like, Okay, after emotional trauma is the idea of self-efficacy. And, and I imagine that feeling that cognitive self efficacy comes a lot from being able to access your executive function, and being able to use that that part of your brain.27:15Yeah, I think I'm really glad you brought that up. Because a lot of my love of my research and work has focused on self-efficacy for managing chronic illness. And, you know, in my own crazy journey, figuring out things at some point, it was another kind of like epiphany, where I went, Oh, wow, that's another? Why didn't I ever think about that, you know, this, that grief, or emotional trauma can be seen as a chronic condition? Yeah, a chronic condition, just like the chronic medical conditions I had, you know, been studying for a long time. And so from that standpoint, you're right, what we're seeking is to develop self efficacy to manage this condition, emotional trauma, traumatic loss or grief. And self-efficacy, that phrase may not be common, commonly known to some people, it simply means that you have a level of confidence, or belief in yourself that you can manage your situation. And importantly, I think of it as that you are developing a sense of control over your life. We all you know, we all seek in our daily life, a sense of control, when you don't when you're not feeling a sense of control. It's very distressing. Yeah, very.Hannah Choi 28:48So, so many of the clients and pretty much all of the clients I've ever worked with, and all of my colleagues to it comes up that that after after figuring out what strategies and tools work best for them to support the areas of executive function that challenge them, once they figure that out, and they're able to have some control over that area. They all say they feel more confident. And and that is that self efficacy right there.Dr. Lisa Shulman 29:15Right, you know, the, the kind of the pathway is that one needs to develop basic font of knowledge about your situation, and then develop skills of self management, which it sounds like you're counseling people about, and then by practicing those new skills, that every time you do it, that you start to have increasing confidence and increasing sense of control. So you sort of build on it until you reverse the cycle of feeling helpless.Hannah Choi 29:58So if you have an end unbalance in the fear center like the limbic system is kind of taking over and inhibiting the part of the brain that we're using for executive functions. What are some things that people can do to write that balance? And, and I'm sure, like right after this, that whatever traumatic incident happens, it's really difficult to get out of that. What are some things that people can can try?30:24You know, I think that that was one of the most encouraging parts of what I learned over time, because I realized that it certainly is calming and reassuring to understand the way in which the brain is responding and how it explains your experience that in and of itself is comforting to know that, you know, you're not as many people say, going crazy, that you're not having this, you know, breakdown, so to speak, but that this is a common, we're all in it together. We're all going through it together. And I think that's very reassuring. But the epiphany was when I realized that it leads to obvious interventions, I thought this is this is exciting. You know, it actually I want to start go back for a moment to what I referred to before about neuroplasticity. So what I was describing before, is a spiraling down into bad neuroplasticity, the brain has been rewired in this unhealthy Well, way. And the important part of understanding neuroplastic changes is that we can thoughtfully and deliberately rewire and create connections, brain connections, neuro connections, but those that are healthier to move the needle in reverse good neuroplasticity, you know, neurologists have a cool phrase that we use, that when things fire together, they wire together. I've heard that, yeah, great. And that is actually a great description of neuroplasticity. That, you know, it's nothing more complicated than practice makes perfect. You know, if you, if you sit down to learn a musical instrument, you can can't do a thing if you get on a bicycle for the first time. Forget it, you know, but, you know, you keep on doing it. And you know, Eureka, suddenly you're have a new skill, and oftentimes you never lose it. So what is that, it's things that fire together, wire together. And so we can use that understanding and knowledge to think about how what steps we can take to reverse the process, which is causing everything I said before the fear center to be this crazy alarm in our head. That is domineering our life over time for some of us. So what what can we do? Well, you know, actually, in my book, I just want to mention that, you know, I actually wrote my book with people, for people who are going through very difficult times, and I will never forget how disorganized my thoughts were, during that period of time. So I wrote in the book, what I called three steps, which were to organize a strategy because I felt that I needed it. I personally needed things, you know, spoon fed and so forth at the time. And so I thought, I don't want people to feel overwhelmed by what I'm saying here, and that they have to figure it out. So the three steps that I described in the book was the first one was, and I'll describe the three in a moment. The first one I called subconscious, conscious integration. And the second one is immersion and distraction. The third one is gradually opening the mind to new possibilities. So I'll briefly describe each. Subconscious conscious integration is one way to describe that what I described before that there has been a disconnect between the emotional parts of the brain and the cognitive parts of the brain. And from that standpoint, a lot of the disturbing emotions and memories from a time of trauma It ended up being suppressed in our subconscious. They're not accessible to us. Part of the reason they're not, the main reason they're not accessible to us is because it sets an alarm off every time we even go in that direction. Right? So but it's a big part, it is key to healing, to reconnect with that, because when you have a lot of disturbing stuff in your subconscious, this results in flashbacks, nightmares, or panic attacks. Well, that. So that's what that first step is, we'll talk come back and talk about how to accomplish it in a moment to is immersion and distraction. And what that refers to is that, you know, one can't do go through the angst of what some people might call grief work constantly, you have to be very aware that you need to give your mind and yourself and your brain space to chill out and have some enjoyable times. So that's what immersion and distraction means. Sometimes you're going to have to do the hard work of immersing immersing immersing immersing yourself in these difficult memories, which for me was when I was doing the journaling. But that I would plan in my day, also other times where I was going to distract myself from it. And the third ends up being after you've gone through those two steps I just mentioned, the third step is that of time will come when there's enough healing, well, you can begin to open yourself up to new possibilities, because, you know, life will not return to what it was before, after many serious losses. And so, you know, we do have to find a way to make a pivot and start to think of well, how are we going to build this new life, which, you know, take some time.Hannah Choi 37:15So, if someone has a set a sudden traumatic loss, and they haven't read your book, and they have and they, and they, you know, don't you know, know, these steps, or they don't know even where to start, where is a good place to start for people.37:32You know, in the book, I do have a chapter or more where I talk about the nuts and bolts of what you can do. And I think you know, it's really important to know that there isn't one shoe that fits everybody here, we are all very different. And we are looking for some vehicle that allows us to relax enough to get back in touch with disturbing thoughts and emotions, disturbing emotions and memories. Now, you know, for me, it was journaling and journaling. Writing is uniquely well suited to this. But there is mentioned in a moment, many other options. The reason why journaling and writing is uniquely suited is because you are, it's very personal. You can write in a more raw way, when you're writing, knowing nobody else will see this. Because in the end, I wrote a book and put it all in there. That wasn't what I was thinking when I was writing. So they never still doesn't make me comfortable. But you know, when you are writing that you're writing only for yourself and think about it. You can go to a counselor or therapist, you can speak to a dear friend, you can speak to an important clergyman in your church or synagogue or mosque you can you can do all those things. But in every one of those cases, you are sharing something deeply personal with others. And you know what? We all censor ourselves. Yeah, it's only natural and we not you know, who would lay it all out there for somebody to hear we are all censor ourselves. So when you write, you can write just for yourself. You can. It's very difficult to be honest with yourself that you can try your best to be honest with yourself that you can get it on paper, as imperfect as it is. And again, another unique part of writing is that you couldn't go back a week later a day You later a year later and read what you wrote, and annotated and continue to improve it, you know, I find that most people find you go back and read your own words and go, you know, I was, that's only part of the story. And because it teases out more Yeah. And then you can annotate now more. So that's why I think writing is really super. But there are many, many others, you know, there are so many creative outlook outlets. And I think we can think about those creative outlets that people have, whether it's music, or art, dance, all of these outlets are ways that people are expressing themselves and could find it. And it's a way it's kind of a portal into your deepest thoughts. So, all of that, and of course, faith based practices, meditation and other contemplative practices. It goes on and on. Another important source that we shouldn't overlook is getting out in the natural environment. You know, we tend to understate that, but we can all I think, relate to time how often you find yourself if you take a simple walk, or you know, you're you're seeing some beautiful mountains, you're sitting by a lake, you're at the beach, and how it how transforming it is to your thoughts. Yeah. And when you're going through a terrible time, after emotional trauma, that's a ripe moment for you to not only feel like you can exhale, but that you can relax enough to connect with thoughts that otherwise would be inaccessible. The hardest part really is looking in the mirror and understanding ourselves enough to know how to proceed. You know, I'd be the first one to tell you that when I was going through a terrible time, I was not resourceful. Again, getting back to executive function. Now. I was not resourceful. You know, it was like, years later, when I wrote the book, and people are then contacting me from different organizations and podcasts and web, web websites, and so forth. And I went, Oh, my God, there's like an endless array of resources. And I felt totally isolated. And you know, here I am a researcher, I have no difficulty looking things up. But at the time, it was not accessible to me. And I know that's true of others, because everyone has told me.Hannah Choi 42:59Yeah, yeah. I heard I heard, I listened to a podcast that you were on. With a woman who has a podcast about grief, and my working memory is my biggest executive function challenge. So I can't remember the name of it. But anyway, on that you were talking about how how the brain can actually make it so that you don't see objects that are maybe related to the to the person that you lost, or the trauma that you went through. And I thought that was so fascinating, and how that real fat right there for me really shows you that it is your brain. Your your brain. Oh, Dear Life, maybe? Sorry, just came to me, then. Yeah.Dr. Lisa Shulman 43:50Yeah, yeah, I think we should review some of the specific cognitive responses, or effects on cognition. And one of them is what you're talking about, you know, the, you can picture the we're talking before about how the brain is perceiving. This is a threat to our survival. So there are a vast number of protective reflexes and responses that are being activated. And we talked I talked already about many of the physical ones. But from a psychological or emotional standpoint, the brain is in an emotional, protective crouch all the time, which is going to serve to shield us from disturbing triggers disturbing things in our environment. And we have a whole host of psychological defense mechanisms that we all learn long ago, like dissociation, repression, denial and so forth, that are kicked into high gear. It's a subconscious reef. So we're not, we're not deciding we're going to behave that way we don't know that those reflexes are in, I've been kicked off. And this can, as you say, result in literal holes in your perspective or your your vision. And the one that you described to occurred in my life, which was that something as, obviously concrete, as my husband's cell phone, his iPhone, was sitting on our desk. And I mean, not just months, it could have been years, a long time went by, where I just didn't even know, I never saw it. Or I didn't. There was a proper word, I didn't allow myself to see it. You know, but someone actually, in the house, saw it and pointed it out. I had, like, I was shocking to me, it was shocking. I thought, My gosh, it's specific all along. And I chose to ignore it, such that it was a literal hole in my visual field. Yeah. That was just your how, how incredibly strong and powerful these things are, you know, somebody who originally described a dissociation dissociate, described dissociation is fundamental to emotional trauma. And so dissociation is a really important part of this. And my book goes into this in some depth. Resulting in that when you are confronting disturbing stressors in your environment, that your mind has this incredible protective response of just kind of turning off, or shielding you from recognizing what you saw just getting, you know, it might put you in a place for a few seconds or moments where you are, you're basically detached from your environment. Or it might be more mild than that. There can be these interruptions of awareness, it fragments, your memory, because you're having periods of the day where this is occurring, it's causing flashbacks, you can become increasingly emotionally numb, because you're not being open to everything that's really in your environment all the time. So it's a very big part of why many of us feel like something has changed fundamentally, after loss.Hannah Choi 47:53Yeah. It's, and and it's interesting that how you said it, it really just comes back to survival and protecting ourselves.48:05Right! I mean, it's a, it's actually we have to think about it as a very effective strategy that the brain is employing. In other words, if, when, when we have, if we have, you know, horribly, a terrible tragedy or catastrophe occur, we remain able to function and survive. Yeah, it would be possible that we were wired in such a way that we were not able to survive, that, you know, we that you could not function, you could not make a meal, you could not dress yourself, you could not you'd be in such a way, but he said no, the truth is, and I really want to get to this, which is that we're talking about executive function and cognition after trauma. And number one, you can remain extremely high functioning in the face of cognitive change, we are not talking about somebody developing the dementia and being unable to perform their daily activities. Speaking for myself, even in the worst of this, I was seeing patients, writing papers, writing grants, doing everything Yeah. So it just shows you how these things can be quite segregated. Another important point is that the cognitive changes are not across all domains and not across all parts of executive function that you know, as well as I that executive function has many different components. You know, what I'd like to really point to that I think is not discussed enough. And I'm really interested in your thoughts on this, Hannah. You I believe that something that's overlooked a lot is cognitive flexibility.Hannah Choi 50:08I am right there with you.Dr. Lisa Shulman 50:12So, you know, I think that during, after trauma, trauma after emotional trauma, cognitive flexibility takes a big hit for a long time, I imagine. And I just wonder, you know, how do you come across that in your own work?Hannah Choi 50:29I mean, I, I think I really believe that cognitive flexibility is that and metacognition, just understanding how we think and why we think and why we do what we do, and don't do what we don't do, I think those two together are, for me, what I see in my clients and in myself and in others are the most of the two most important, because without that cognitive flexibility, especially I imagine with when you when your life experiences such a great shift, and such a great change. And like you said before, life is not going to go back to how it was before, that cognitive flexibility is probably going to be the answer to finding new ways of doing your life now. And finding happiness and success. I mean, I can't think of another executive function that is going to be more helpful than that. 51:31And really, at the heart of, you know, being able to be successful, because, you know, it runs from the sublime to the ridiculous, you know, if somebody does, for example, reach out for or tries, I was talking before about all the kinds of methods that one strategies one could try, if someone does begin on say, Okay, I'm going to do this, I'm going to go to find a counselor, I'm going to go to a support group. And, and that doesn't have the proper chemistry, or it just doesn't feel like it's being helpful to you for some reason, you know, if you don't have cognitive flexibility and resourcefulness, you know, that it's pretty much a dead end for somebody, rather than saying, Oh, well, you know, there's 10 other ways to do this. The so I mean, that's the sublime, the ridiculous part of it can be that you can literally find yourself doing things in incredibly robotic ways. When you are in a going through a period of terrible emotional trauma, where things are being done the way they were always done very automatically, and you get kind of fixed in the spot. And then when hopefully, you do become more healed and have more insight and cognitive flexibility, you know, like, it's like, one day you think, we're gonna say, you know, I'm doing these three steps, and there's a way to do this one step, why don't I see that all? You know, and, you know, I mean, for those who have experienced the loss of a loved one, I mean, there are some of these things that are so common. The simple example I've spoken to many people, is, if you if it's somebody that you know, a partner, that you find yourself going to the supermarket and buying all the same foods, even though that person is no longer home, you are in thinking I want to buy this in honor of the memory of the lost loved one, you just automatically are buying in and you're stocking your pantry and the things that you don't ordinarily use takes actually a fair amount of time to you wake up to the fact that you're doing that. Another one I talked about on a BBC broadcast is that people oftentimes describe preparing foods that their loved ones preferred, not what they prefer, they prefer it right, right. Again, it's not something that you plan out, you're just automatically doing it. And it takes it sometimes you then in a robotic, you're doing it and you're doing it and you're doing it and you don't have the cognitive flexibility to go this is what's happening and maybe I don't need, you know, five boxes of that.Hannah Choi 54:33Yeah. And it just it really shows you that we are our habits. We are the that like you said, you know, like that, that our brains have been wired that way. So we think that way,54:45You know, one of the things I'll I'll pointed to other examples in the cognitive sphere or to other issues. One is the inattention And we talked about the dissociation and how we results in this loss of awareness and so forth. And, you know, people who have suffered serious emotional trauma are have been found to be quite vulnerable to accidents. And this is a very, it's a significant problem, you know, more falling, more car accidents, just accidents. And, you know, I read about that, but you know, I will just say, again, from pointing to my personal experience, you know, in the year following my husband's death, I fell and broke my ankle. And I was in three car accidents, fortunately, fender benders. And then since then none of that this is almost the 10th year anniversary of his death. I mean, it shows you that there is some cognitive change that you are not as alert to your environment.Hannah Choi 56:07Yeah, yeah, well, it makes sense. And I just did an episode on ADHD. And in my research, I found that people with ADHD, who struggle with attention are also more prone to accidents, car accidents and injuries.Dr. Lisa Shulman 56:23So that also also totally makes sense. Yeah. And like, the final point I don't want to overlook is the impact of our bio rhythms. And, you know, many of us know that we are either you know, morning larks or night owls. And that's just a very fixed part of our genetics. That's not something you can change. And so when you are, you know, you don't you have minimal or no reserve after emotional trauma. So therefore, from the standpoint of cognition, think about if you are, are you a morning Lark or a night owl?Hannah Choi 57:05Well, I am a night owl, I am fighting fighting that right now. I'm trying really hard to become a morning Lark. I'm a little better, but I'm trying to fake it till I make it but it's not happening.57:21So, you know, if you have are in a bad way, with minimal to no cognitive reserve, and you're you should just be aware, well, you know, if you are that morning for you, Hannah, is not going to be the optimum time for you to try to do a serious cognitive task. Right, right. Because you have to two things that are going on. And so why you why even fight it.Hannah Choi 57:53And that's so much of what what I do in my coaching is help helping people figure out when is the best time of day for you to do different things. And you know, when when are you going to be most successful, when is not a great time to try something new or even to try something challenging? Yeah, just becoming aware, learning that learning about ourselves and, and knowing that,58:16I mean, I think it has a lot to do with something important that my husband taught me, which is about being forgiving to yourself. And, you know, I think that all of us, and maybe women even more than men, you know, are, you know, filled with angst and second thoughts and remorse, recrimination, and you know, like, especially for people who are going through terrible times, after traumatic losses, it's very important to know, go gentle with yourself and think, you know, I'm doing my best. And I'm I going to keep on working on this. And sometimes, I'm going to have a longing to regress, sometimes I'm going to really handle something poorly, I'm going to make a poor decision. And that we should go well, I'm going to be forgiving to myself, because I'm going through a hard time and I'm going to learn from this and try again. I think that that's a very important part of it. And on the small side of it in terms of what you were just saying the day to day side of it. You know, you might sit down and think okay, I've set aside this time to do what I called before the subconscious conscious integration, the grief work, the inner work, and you might sit down and it might be very unsuccessful. You just simply can't find you can't find your rhythm like you had on another day? Well, I mean, it's good to acknowledge that it just go well, no, for some reason. For whatever reason, this is not the right time for me. Yeah, I'm gonna do something else. And tomorrow's another day.Hannah Choi 1:00:15yeah. We always talk about how you can't listen to those shoulds. You have to, you know, be gentle with yourself and, and do what's right in the moment. Is there anything else that you can think of? Did you want to go back to your three steps? Was there anything that you wanted to expand on there?Dr. Lisa Shulman 1:00:32You know, I think that, you know, one thing that I would say that can be quite confusing, is when we talk about this idea of subconscious conscious integration, the work to integrate, and reconnect the emotional response to the cognitive functions. And then we refer to that second step of immersion and distraction, I think one of the things that can be confusing, and is to me about exactly how to talk about it, is that the balance between the kinds of things that calm us down, and will be a source of distraction. And the kinds of things that will calm us down and enable us to do the hard work of Yeah, of reconnection of subconscious conscious integration. And that I think, can be a source of confusion. And we sort of all have to find our own balance there. And maybe identify times that are ripe, to even even if it's for a short moment, you know, say for example, in the ways we were talking before, that you might be out in a natural environment, and you feel a sense of relief, and you feel like you can think more clearly. And in that moment, a memory might drift back to you. That is maybe a sad, a sad memory. It's a sad memory. But you see, it just became accessible to you, because you had relaxed enough for that purpose. Yeah. And now, you know, one doesn't have to feel compelled to do some work around that, because you've already accomplished something, like doing that, or feeling feeling sad about it isn't necessarily enough to feel like that's a regression. It's instead, as you go through that, and you in the way we talked about self efficacy, developing confidence in yourself, that you go through, you have that moment, and you might reflect and feel sorrow. And then you go back to maybe what you were doing, and you have just had an experience where you succeeded in the face of you didn't have, you know, a break and emotional breakdown, you didn't weren't triggered, the fight or flight mechanism wasn't triggered to its nth degree, you instead had a moment of sorrow and you went through it, which is different than what would have happened before. That's, that's a success.Hannah Choi 1:03:43Yeah. And that that makes me think back to when you were talking about journaling and how, how when you when you like say, you wrote that down that you find that you this used to happen before and now this now this happens. You can look and see that that evidence that evidence of growth and progress and how that must be really empowering and and give you and bolster that self efficacy that is so helpful in getting through.Dr. Lisa Shulman 1:04:14Yes, and you know, that you're able to acknowledge is that it's a healthy mind to be able to acknowledge that that was a beautiful important part of me. It's not here anymore, you're honoring it. I mean, you you'd give anything to go back and have that person back or undo that traumatic event. But this really refers to the important field of post traumatic growth and how you achieve that. There you with time, you know, we have well, another favorite phrase is Time heals all wounds. isn't enough for most people, not everybody, but for most people, time will result in a lot of healing after traumatic loss. But if one doesn't go through the steps that we're talking about here, to reverse those bad neuroplastic changes in the brain access suppressed memories and emotions, excuse me, access suppressed memories and emotions. If you don't go through those steps, you are blocked from ever growing as fully for your to potential as you could write, you will improve, but you will be blocked from the full potential that you have,Hannah Choi 1:05:50because of the way that your brain is responding.Dr. Lisa Shulman 1:05:54Because you have never you continue to have suppressed memories and emotions that your brain has to continually protect you from. Yeah, right. No, another way we can refer to this, in terms of cognition, and it's important is that when when the when the brain is functioning in that protective mode, the fight or flight, the acute responses, the chronic effects, everything we talked about, it uses up a lot of brain power, a lot of real estate in the brain is being used up to, to shield me from seeing that iPhone, that's not just happening on its own, some portion of the brain is keeps on going, you know, alert to say no to that thing. You know, there's a part of the brain that keeps on doing that over and over. And how can that ever be compatible with full healing and optimum cognitive function? Yeah, it's not possible. No. And it's, it's a lifelong process. It's a lifelong process. It's not as if anybody is ever going to be at the end of that process. We keep on identifying things that are disturbing, and then you have to work through it again.Hannah Choi 1:07:38Which gives you that what gives you the ability to move out of what you said before that the feeling of hopelessness, and there's concrete things that you can do. Yeah. That's great. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate your talking with me. And it's fascinating and difficult to talk about at the same time.Dr. Lisa Shulman 1:08:05No, it's like anything else. So like we just said, it was very difficult to talk about it in the beginning. And now I've talked about it a lot. No longer difficult,

It's Not Rocket Science! Five Questions Over Coffee
Five Questions Over Coffee with Marc Singer (ep. 70)

It's Not Rocket Science! Five Questions Over Coffee

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 29, 2022 19:26


Who is Marc?Marc Singer - The Men's CoachAfter being sentenced to life in prison for a crime he had not committed, Marc had to also endure the tragic deaths of his entire family, whilst in custody... Fast forward to now, he is a successful professional Men's mindset coach who works to help them discover their turning point and create a life that they choose.Key TakeawaysDespite being in a very bad situation, Marc didn't want to see himself as a victim, and had to choose to take responsibility for thoughts, feelings and actions, in order to move himself forward.it was only then that he discovered that he had the skills and attributes to become a great coach and this sent him on a path of self discoveryOur past may not take us into a life of crime, but mat prevent us from achieving our best, such as presenting us from being able to speak in publicMen specifically avoid moving forward with their lives a group that struggles the most in terms of everything that we do. Suicide rates are the highest with men. And that's a lot to do with a reluctance for men to sort of move forward. So the question I would ask is, why is that men struggle to move forward with their lives, and really take control of the things that matter most, which is your mindset. The way the mindset creates everything we do in life, it creates our thoughts, our feelings, and our actions. And if we're not in control of that, then our actions are not going to be conducive to the life that we're living.Valuable Free Resource or ActionLinks;www.marcsingercoaching.co.uk/http://www.facebook.com/leaderwithincoreenergy(4) Marc Singer ~ The Men's Coach | LinkedInhttps://youtube.com/@MarcSingerCoachingSeminarsA video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :_________________________________________________________________________________________________Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletterFind out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguestSubscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcastHelp us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at  apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way————————————————————————————————————————————-TranscriptNote, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)SUMMARY KEYWORDSlife, people, beliefs, men, prison, book, coach, attitudes, struggling, create, deal, mark, discover, mindset, question, important, helped, jail free card, moment, workStuart Webb  00:25Hi, everyone, welcome back to it's not rocket science, five questions over coffee I have here in front of me, my favourite mug filled with coffee. And I've really, really looking forward to the next 1015 minutes we spent with this man Mark singer is the men's coach, he was sentenced to life in prison for a crime he hadn't committed, but he had to endure deaths of his entire family whilst in custody. And now he is a really successful men's mindset coach who works with them to help discover their Turning Point and create a life that they would choose now I think this is gonna be a really fascinating few minutes. Mark, I really am looking forward to this welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee.Marc Singer  01:14Thank you very much for having me on.Stuart Webb  01:16Look, what do you do you want to just start by describing those men that you're trying to reach? And the sort of people they are? And?Marc Singer  01:33Yeah, yeah, no, that's fine. Yeah. I mean, like, as you said, I went through a traumatic set of variances, which then create the lives that they choose. And, yeah, it was a it was a bit of a journey. So as you just said, they're convicted of a crime that had been in God, the trauma or all of that, whilst actually raising the family funerals and selling the family, home and so on whilst in prison, whilst not knowing if I was ever going to be actually released from prison, so, but I sorted as an opportunity to turn my life around, eventually secured really no, I'm a professional coach, working with men to help them create the lives that they choose as well. So that's what I now do.Stuart Webb  02:21So tell me, how did you I mean, what are the what are they doing? And who are they trying to reach at the moment? And why? Why is your approach different? What was it about the your experience that helped you to see that as a positive, and turn your life around?Marc Singer  02:40Well, actually, well, when I was in prison, I hit rock bottom. And for a period of time, saw myself as a victim, and then it was that realisation that I never wanted, I didn't want to see myself as a victim, and I had to choose to take responsibility for my thoughts, feelings and actions, in order to move myself forward. I never wanted to be a victim. So it was at that moment, I decided enough was enough. And it was then that I decided to deal with that, then then instead of my actual situation where I was the prison and so on, which I couldn't change I could only change what I was doing how I was working. So I failed, because more were then and that led me to a situation when I did actually secure release I fell into code. King, no, no. And it was only then that I discovered that I had the skills and attributes to become a great coach myself and it was sent me on a path of self discovery and and oxide pectins chip professional excellence in coping, and I enrolled with them. And two years later, I qualified as a professional coach, and an S. Now what I do I work with men, particularly, to help them overcome whatever's in their wine. The reason I work with men, typically now, back in the day normal guys who are looking to have some sort of breakthrough in their lives and looking to move forward with their lives. There is a lot of stigma, and I work to break that down so that men can deal with what, whatever they're going through in a moment, and not to put forward to things like this because they have that belief or attitude that it's more feminine, it's more for women. It's not necessarily for working class got that then holds them back from moving forward. So I do tend to work with a lot of guys who are normal everyday guys who look not so much in terms of like dealing with the emotional side because that's what all All of us do, but we deal with it in a different way. But it's more given a more common sense. way of moving forward without all of fluffiness ism a common sense process work way of working forward, which helps them create whatever they want with their lives and, and it's effective and it helped them choose.Stuart Webb  05:22Mark, I love your message, I love what you're doing. And I'm just going to put a ticker across the bottom of the screen now, which is, which is your website, which is Mark, as Mark Mar, see, singer coaching.co.uk That's M AR C. Singer coaching.co.uk. Mark, there's lots of great stuff on your website. And I know you're in the process at the moment of writing a book which, which I hope is going to be a real, real bestseller to tell us tell us what is what's going to be in your book, what's, what's the stories in that book that you're going to sort of write and help men to discover this path from, from what you're telling them?Marc Singer  06:09Yeah. The book is my journey. It's a story about the only the tip of the iceberg. But when you look at the whole story, because there's a heck of a lot more to it, it was my journey and why I ended up in place one motion. So it really goes back to the beginning where I started. And I actually got involved in a gang I was involved in drugs and things like that when I left school, football violence and things like that. So I created a whole set of antisocial beliefs and attitudes which dogged me for many, many years after, and that led me into countless situations which were antisocial, and, you know, with the police, and so on. But it was many years from all of that in my 30s that I actually got convicted of the thing that I went to prison for. And even though I hadn't done, what they convicted me of, it was actually my own beliefs and attitudes that created that situation inadvertently, and only realised that later on because I I hadn't dealt with the underlying stuff that dogs been for many, many years on the surface or surface I hadn't. I hadn't had I dealt with the beliefs and attitudes at an earlier stage, I wouldn't have been involved in motion to begin with. And so I recognise that when I was in prison, and I started doing the work on the beliefs and attitudes whilst in there, that then helped me change my belief system so that it was more prosocial, more able to move moving forward. And a lot of us in life, we tend to develop beliefs and attitudes as we go through life, which affect us in different ways as we move forward. And it could be something. For instance, I'm working with a guy at the moment who, who's a businessman who struggles doing live speaking events. Now, the reason why he does that is because something that affected him many, many years ago when he was a kid. And he hadn't dealt with those beliefs and attitudes, which are now holding, holding him back from being is at his most comfort in front of people. So it's those sorts of things that I work with to help them identify and remove or change. And so understanding how our mind works is imperatively important for us to be at our best. And it's anything in life, if you want to be a footballer and you want to be the best, then guess what you're going to work on different aspects of become the best version yourself. And if you're a business minister, same thing, if you want to use your mindset, to the best of its ability, you're gonna have to learn how to do that. And many of us don't understand how our minds work fully. And don't understand how the beliefs and attitudes and things that we develop years before affect us in the current. And it's important that we do our best. So a lot of the stuff in the book is about that. It's about how my journey went from where I was to where I am now and everything in between there. But it's also more about individual reading the books is about me, it's about the people, whoever everybody's going through some sort of transition, transfer transformation in life. Doesn't matter who you are. And it's important that we understand how we can work our way through things like that in a more positive and productive way. And my book is about everybody, it's not just about me. It's about whoever you are away from create what you life. And that's the whole premise of the book. It's hast Half Life Story autobiography, half self help book.Stuart Webb  09:41I love it. I absolutely love it. I really think that's a brilliant way of putting it. Listen, normally my fourth question when we get to this point of the interview is about what book or what programme? Do you sort of, did you discover which actually sort of you know helps you get forward? You've sort of described a lot of that but is there a cific instance of something you'd like to leave the audience with to say, This is why you've got two graphs. Now this is what you've got to do. This is what I did to, to push me in the direction I'm taking now.Marc Singer  10:14Yeah, I mean, basically, what ask is that? What are the likes of? You know, Elon Musk, Steve Jobs Christianna Cristiano Ronaldo, Bill Gates when all of these people got in common? And the answer is, they all have a coach. And I think there was a general misconception, many people that if you ask for help in any way, in life, if you have a coach, if you have a mentor, it means you're weak in some way that you're struggling in life. And so many people avoid reaching out and asking for help, because I think it's a slot that's on this. And it means that they haven't got the ability to do it themselves, and that they're struggling. And I have a device. And it's a common misconception that a lot of people have, that you know, you have, you have to be, you know, mentally challenged or depressed or something like that, in order to reach out and get a coach. And it's really not the case, it's just it really is for the people who want to be the best versions of themselves. And that's essentially the difference between something like therapy and coaching. Coaching is for people, sorry, therapy is for people who want to delve into a certain life coaching is for people who want dispersions. Simple as that. And so my advice would be to people who are, you know, looking to progress in their lives and become the best version of yourself to consider hiring a coach. And so, in order to do that, there's no, it's no coincidence that six people in all have coaching? And that's one of the things I would learn. I'd say, you know, again, yeah, I mean, I learned a philosophy when I changed my life. And that, if you are asking me about a book called leadership by Bruce Knight, and he's the one he is the founder. And I would suggest anybody who's interested in find out more about that, check that book out.Stuart Webb  12:09Globally, Mark, listen, I've spent the last 1015 minutes asking you a bunch of questions. And there must be a question that you're currently thinking, Well, why isn't he asked me a bag, whatever. So my Get Out of Jail Free card at the moment is to turn around, get out of jail free card, what a wonderful thing to have for a few years in your life. Anyway, my purse, my question that I'm going to put to you now is, what's the question that you would have liked me to have asked that I haven't done yet. And obviously, I'm going to make you do the work again, I'm going to ask you to answer the question that you asked yourself. So what is the question you would particularly like me to?Marc Singer  12:53Well, again, I mean, it's really, what what is it that people, you know, why is it that people, men pacifically avoid moving forward with their lives? I mean, this is the thing that people look at the the general demographic of men, we're with a group that struggles the most in terms of everything that we do. You know, suicide rates are the highest with men. General issues, such as women is the highest in society. And that's a lot to do with a reluctance for men to sort of move forward. So the question I would say, you'd ask is, why is that men struggle to sort of move forward with their lives, and, you know, really take control of the things that matter most, which is your mindset, and your, the way we the mindset creates everything we do in life, it creates our thoughts, our feelings, and our actions. And if we're not in control of that, then our actions are not going to be conducive to the life that we're living. And it's very important that we do that. Because most of settling in life for things that we don't truly want. And if we really want to be at our best, we have to be in control. And the question I would ask is why why do you? Why why is it that men does some common misconception among general men that it's or it's for a feminine all these different labels that people put things on? And none of it is true? It's inaccurate, completely. And I think mainly, a lot of guys will avoid doing these sort of things or investing in a coach because they feel that, you know, there's, you know, the old fashioned belief is just get on with it mentality is just get on the, you know, stiff upper lip, and I had that for a long time when I was in prison. And, yes, it has a place in some ways in society to do that. But the reality is, like I said, it's a misconception because people assume that by getting on with things when you're tough in some way, but it's actually the opposite. A real strong guy in life is the man who asked for help to help and it doesn't mean mentally. Ill like I just explained it in a in a You know, mentally ill way or you're struggling with the president is a way in which we all get forward in life, the most successful people in life always do. So I would say the answer to that question is to not judge things before you, you know, move forward, always have an open mind when you go. In life, generally, very closed minds, even though we tell ourselves, we've got an open mind, we will actually judge pretty much everything from our past beliefs and perspectives. And that then stops us things with any sort of clarity and objectivity. And it's very important that most of us see things with that. Because if you don't, you won't learn, you won't grow. And like me, I would have been stuck in prison. Still, I wouldn't be here talking to you today, if I had that sort of mindset. Because had I believed what everybody was telling me at that time, which was, you're never getting out of prison. There's no point I had no release date, it was a lot harder believe that I wouldn't have got out, I chose not to believe that I created my reality by my actions day in day out by focusing on myself and being the best version I could possibly be learning, exercising and doing all the things I knew, that would help me move forward. So it doesn't matter what your circumstances in life doesn't matter. If we've got a cost of living Christ says it doesn't matter if there's a war in Ukraine, it doesn't matter if there's COVID going on, it doesn't matter if we're struggling, that we're struggling through, we can all be successful with the right mental approach. And that's very, very, very important for any of us, specially right now, with what was going on around us. And, you know, there's the most successful people are the ones who walk through any sort of recession and things like that, and grow from it, rather than allowing it to force them to, you know, crumble basically,Stuart Webb  16:45I absolutely love what you're talking about, I think it's so, so brilliant. I mean, really, really appreciate the message you're putting across. And I think you're right, men are taught from a very young, early age, you know, it's the big boys don't cry, suck it up, get on with it. And, you know, we suffer for years because of it. I, I know, find most of my ideas from turning to people around me and go, What do you think, and you know, as business people, as leaders of businesses, the one thing that we can't afford to do is to just close down outside help and close down coaching and close down mentoring. We need those people to help drive us on and drive our businesses on to be the best. So I think what you're doing is brilliant. I love the story. Absolutely. Looking forward to the book. I know it's not out yet. I know he's coming soon. I'm looking forward to getting my hands on a copy of that book and reading it and I should be I should be sort of promoting it through through things like this podcasts and things like that. So really appreciate you coming on and spending a few minutes with us today. I just think that the message is great. I really absolutely love it. Listen, I'm just going to I'm just going to finish now by by doing the usual if you have got got any value out of this and I hope you have one or subscribe to the the newsletter list and then you can get an email every Monday which tells you what speakers we've got coming up in this week's our podcast recording and and you can get on and make sure that you follow people like Mark through his website. He's got lots of links on there, lots of information. So come on to our website onto our newsletter, which is TCA dot FYI. STCA dot FYI. FYI forward slash subscribe that gets you onto the newsletter mailing list. You'll get care about some great speakers like people like Mark coming on. Mark, thank you so much for coming on and spending a few minutes with us. I really do appreciate you spending a few minutes and giving us such huge value in the way that you have approached. Huge what what would have crushed me absolutely would have crushed me but you have approached it so positively and given so much value back and I thank you very much for your time today. Thank you very much. Get full access to It's Not Rocket Science! at thecompleteapproach.substack.com/subscribe

Thought For Today
Of Good Cheer

Thought For Today

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 19, 2022 3:49


I greet you in Jesus' precious name! It is Monday morning, 19th December 2022, and this is your friend, Angus Buchan, with a thought for today.“How beautiful upon the mountainsAre the feet of him who brings good news,Who proclaims peace,Who brings glad tidings of good things,Who proclaims salvation,Who says to Zion,“Your God reigns!”Isaiah 52:7Isn't that a beautiful scripture? It's good news! Romans 10:15 confirms it: “And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written:How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace,Who bring glad tidings of good things!”Irrespective of what is happening in the world today, it does not matter. He has told us already, the Lord Jesus Christ, in the Gospel of John:“These things I have spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation, but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world.”John 16:33What is the good news? Well, Jesus is not dead - He is alive! Isn't that good news? He has not left us as orphans. He has sent us His Helper, the Holy Spirit. Even as I am speaking to you now, I can feel the presence of the Holy Spirit in my prayer room, I believe that as I am talking to you now, He is with you. He gives us the strength to live and die. You see, death has lost its sting. Paul says in Philippians:“For to me, to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” Philippians 1:21So you cannot frighten a Christian with Heaven. We remember at this very time of the year that God became flesh and dwelt amongst us. Immanuel, means literally: “God with us” (Matthew 1:23), so you don't have to be lonely. You don't have to be on your own because the Holy Spirit is with you as I am talking to you. This is the message we should be telling the fearful world at this time. I have sat with many dying people, people who are agitated, restless and very scared but once they are reassured that our Lord Jesus Christ is coming back to receive us and to take us by the hand, as it were, to His heavenly home (John 14:3), then absolute peace fills their faces. They close their eyes, and they walk through that door with Jesus, holding hands, straight into the heavenly place He has prepared for you and me.Have a wonderful Monday!God bless you and goodbye.

Entrepreneur Conundrum
A More Connected, Intuitive You with Krishna Avalon

Entrepreneur Conundrum

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 12, 2022 31:09


Today on Entrepreneur Conundrum we have a very special guest.  This guest is guiding people to become their best healed, whole, connected selves. Helping seekers find their path.She is a Licensed + Intuitive Acupuncturist who has treated and coached 22K+ patients and clients for anxiety, stress, pain management, fertility, sleep disorders, digestive issues, and allergies. 18+ years of experience delivering breathwork, acupuncture, and meditation services. Currently expanding to business, life, and relationship coaching to serve as a guiding light to acupuncturists and health, healing, and wellnessShe is also a Psych-K Facilitator with the ability to utilize psych-k methodologies and practices to help people transform their subconscious mind into a powerful tool that can help people live and create the life they deserve. Experience in coaching people to transform stress, trauma, and self-limiting beliefs to help them realize their self-worth and future potential. And this is just a part of the incredible list of Krishna Avalon's ways of helping people.  I hope you enjoy this episode.Key Questions:Virginia 01:44Tell us a little bit about your entrepreneurial journey and how you came to be where you are?Virginia 06:21So how did you move over into the psyche, Psych K aspect and stuff like that?Virginia 10:22So how have you been getting in front of your ideal clients?Virginia 12:17So what are a couple big goals that you're hoping to achieve?Virginia 14:33Do you think that there's a roadblock kind of in the way of helping you or getting you where you want to be?Virginia 15:31What is the best advice that you've ever been given?Virginia23:35So why is it important for them to work coherently together? Virginia 26:37 I've never had a Psyche - K treatment before, what would I expect to go in? What I don't know what it's like? So I'm a little apprehensive. What could I expect going into one?Virginia 32:02Is there anything that we haven't touched on yet that you would like to share with us? Connect with KrishnaKrishna Avalon | Psych-K Coach + Intuitive AcupuncturistInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/krishnaavalon/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/krishnaavalon/Facebook:Krishna Avalon Wellness Virginia PurnellFunnel & Visibility SpecialistDistinct Digital Marketing(833) 762-5336virginia@distinctdigitalmarketing.comwww.distinctdigitalmarketing.comBook a Free Call http://bit.ly/DDMBookACallEC

Women’s Wellness — The Holistic Shift
11 - Making Connections Through the Language of Play in Child Psychology

Women’s Wellness — The Holistic Shift

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 30, 2022 35:37


Lori Bean and Alyssa Rabin are back together in this episode to interview Registered Provisional Psychologist Paige Burles. Paige specializes in child psychology, though she also works with adults, at Maliya. She explains why her passion is for helping children make connections and find ways of communicating needs and deal with struggles. Paige answers questions from both Lori and Alyssa about exactly what art therapy, play therapy, and behavioral therapy are and what they look like when used in working with children. Paige details how much information children can give when they are comfortable and communicating at a level they understand, such as during play. She examines the notion that children are seeking connection and by examining problematic behaviors we can identify unmet needs. Lori and Alyssa, both parents, agree and offer that parents are tired and can't be experts at everything for their children. A psychologist like Paige, who involves the parents in the therapeutic process, can be invaluable for instilling children with helpful coping skills that they will carry into adulthood.About Paige Burles:Paige Burles is a Registered Provisional Psychologist with the College of Alberta Psychologists. She holds a master's degree in counselling psychology and a bachelor's degree in child studies. Paige has been working in the field of mental health for 10 years and has a special interest in early intervention. Paige's passion is supporting young children from the ages 4 through adolescence. She has an exceptional ability to connect with children that have had difficulty trusting and working with others. Paige specializes in working with anxiety, emotional dysregulation, ADHD, trauma, adjustment and behavioral issues. This is Paige's true calling and she thanks you for trusting her with those who are the most precious in your life. Paige provides a safe space for your children to explore their experiences, facilitate deep change, and gain the tools necessary to support them throughout the rest of their lives. Paige prides herself on setting your children up to navigate their futures with support, guidance and unconditional love.  Paige also has extensive work experience with adults and would be happy to work with you if you are seeking relief from anxiety, depression, ADHD, trauma, emotional dysregulation, or wanting support with self-compassion, overcoming shame, setting boundaries, etc. Paige uses evidence-based treatments in her practice. She is trained in dialectical behavior therapy, cognitive behavior therapy, emotion focused therapy, mindfulness-based approaches, solution focused and brief therapy, and in prolonged exposure for treating PTSD.— Maliya: website | instagram | facebookPaige Burles | Registered Provisional Psychologist: website | linkedin TranscriptionLori Bean  00:56Hello, everybody, I am Lori Bean. Alyssa Rabin  01:00And I'm Alyssa Rabin. Lori Bean  01:02And we want to welcome today, Paige Burles, who is our psychologist at Maliya, who specializes in children therapy. Alyssa Rabin  01:13Child psychology, and pre-teen psychology. Thank God because I have one of each. Lori Bean  01:24And we just really wanted to talk today about why you should consider bringing your children in for therapy. So Paige works with kids from the ages of 4 to 13. When you know it's time to do that, what type of therapy she does. And we just know how incredible she is. And the feedback we get from parents, and how life changing this is, along with not only dealing with the issues they're having with their children now, but these tools that they leave with, which they can have with them for the rest of their lives, and really grow into these fully flourishing, self confident adults with all these amazing abilities to socialize and have the sense of self worth and-- Alyssa Rabin  02:13-- to be able to self soothe and more or less work on their issues instead of looking elsewhere. They leave with the tools to help themselves. So welcome Paige. Paige Burles  02:27Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here. Excited and nervous. Lori Bean  02:30It's all good. I think this is like such an important topic. My kids are in their 20s and back in the day, we really didn't take our kids for therapy or support at all, it really wasn't available unless your kids had very well known issues or it was advised by a teacher or... it took a lot to seek help. And it literally wasn't readily available. A lot of the times you'd have to at the hospital, you'd have to see a psychiatrist, and it was a rough go. And in reflection, I really believe now that if we had this available, there's no question I would have taken both kids even though they were fully functional. Every kid has an issue just for support, and I wasn't alone in navigating them. And I just would love to talk about-- Alyssa Rabin  03:29-- how it's changed. Lori Bean  03:30Yeah, how it's changed. Alyssa Rabin  03:32And Paige and I have just were just talking before this about how mental health and children and adolescents has - thank God - becomes so, not prominent, but there's an awareness of it, because it's been like this forever. And now we're just realizing, oh, it's okay. And we have help. Lori Bean  03:58Yeah. And we have, it's really about seeking help. There's no handbook as a parent. And, boy, imagine having somebody you can trust that creates this beautiful, safe relationship with your children. And they're not always looking to you and you're not always desperate for support. So maybe tell us a little bit about why this is your specialty. Paige Burles  04:19That's a great place to start. I'd love to. I think what really brought, well I know what really brought me into just really feeling passionate about working with young people was kind of my own struggles and then later in my life after going through many many unpleasant experiences in my adolescent years and early adulthood, finally getting support and learning all of these skills and all these things. I remember thinking, like, I wish I knew this when I was younger. Like I wish that, I think a big thing for me was even just the shame of the some of the struggles I dealt with. And then finally once it got bad enough to the point where, like you said, it's like now it's bad enough so we have to deal with it. Then realizing, Oh, the things I was struggling with earlier on were normal and other people struggled with that. And then this is what you do. I think one of the big things I learned early on was even just being honest, because shame just got in the way of comparing yourself to other people, and nowadays with social media, and kids need support because they are comparing themselves to the select few that are getting all the, you know, followers or likes or whatever it is these days, right? Alyssa Rabin  05:35Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Lori Bean  05:37So how do you know, like, I guess this is my question. All parents have challenges with their children. So how do you know - you have a four year old, so four is like sort of the age where you would start navigating care - how do you know it's time to seek help? How do you know as a parent, that they need tools that perhaps you're not aware of, or you can't provide them with? And there's not really like a disability, or they haven't been given a diagnoses? Like, do you know what I mean? Paige Burles  06:10Yeah, and I think that's a tough question. Because I think if it was really clear, your child's doing this, go do this. Yeah, that would be I mean, I wish I could, I wish there was something like that out there. And I think, listening to yourself of, you know, if you are noticing some struggles, I think, a big thing for me and why I love like, I go to therapy myself, even to this day, I'm like, no, I don't have any, like really big glaring issues that I'm not functioning or whichever, however, I've learned through therapy, and just, I don't know, all of my education stuff, that hey, I don't have to settle. So if there's something I'm struggling with, I'd like some support with, I've tried working on it on my own, or I've tried a couple things, not having some success, I don't have to just accept it. Well, that's just who I am. And I'm always going to be this way. Or, you know, my kid just is always going to do this - or I hate this - but I just have a quote/unquote bad kid or my kid just acts out. And that's, you know, no. Lori Bean  07:09They normalize the behavior. Alyssa Rabin  07:10And I, just speaking from personal experience, I have two girls, they're four and a half years apart, and they are the complete opposite. Like I'm talking I cannot believe they're from the same parent. So what I've been finding is what will work with one child totally does not work with the other child. And I don't know what does. I've tried everything in my ability to be a good parent, to help them, and it's still not working. And that's when I realize I'm not a psychologist. I only have tools that I was born with, that I've learned, that I've whatever, even if it's something as minute as they're having issues sleeping at night. I have no frickin clue what to do. I'm going to call somebody else to do it. I'm not a specialist, I need to go somewhere else to get the help. Lori Bean  08:08Yeah, cuz there's no, there's really, it goes back to there's no handbook and what worked for one-- Alyssa Rabin  08:12-- oh, does not work for the other. Paige Burles  08:15Or there's thousands of handbooks, and it's completely overwhelming, and is that going to fit specifically my child and what my child needs? And that's a great reason to go talk to someone who, myself, has read many, many, many of those books, obviously, not all of them, that's impossible. How could I expect any parent to do that? And I can take what I know and we can find a plan and develop something that fits for your kid, if your kid doesn't actually fit what this specific book is saying to do. Alyssa Rabin  08:43So how do you figure out what type of therapy works for which child? Paige Burles  08:49Yeah, that's a great question. And I think, in that where it starts, is it starts with connection. That's, I mean, overarching, if you look at things that contribute to success in therapy, it always comes back to the therapeutic alliance. That is, across the ages, it's we see that the therapeutic alliance. I think it's even tenfold with children, they need that connection. Alyssa Rabin  09:11So if they mesh with you or not. Paige Burles  09:13Yeah, so that's really important. I think that's what I feel, I'm not... you guys have known this in the time you've spent with me, I'm not one to kind of boast about myself. And I really feel like that's something I've just found is just a natural gift with me, is I can connect with children. Alyssa Rabin  09:30You know when you just meet those people, and you just know, you'd be like, Oh my god, they should be like, not just a kindergarten teacher, but an elementary school teacher who would be amazing with all the kids. Yeah, that's Paige. Lori Bean  09:42Yeah. Yeah, it is a gift that you have. Paige Burles  09:46So I think that's what it is, you know, it starts with connection. And then I really, you know, I involve the parents. I involve the child, you know, depending on on their developmental level and where they're at, like, it's really important that they're involved and they're directing therapy, because especially if some of these behaviors are coming because they're trying to gain a sense of control, we want them to feel like this is a safe space and that they have control here, we're not forcing them to do anything that they're not comfortable doing. It's going at their pace and meeting them where they're at. So I really think it starts with a connection. And then it's a team approach. Like, it's not just, like I said, I'm not the expert, I'm not going to come talk to a parent say, I'm the expert on your child, do this. It's let's work together. What do you know that works for your child? What have you tried, what's worked, what hasn't worked? Let's all meet with the kid to kind of get to know them. And then just start kind of incorporating. I really take this approach of, I'm a scientist, we're all scientists, we're doing trial and error. We're testing out kind of what works because me and my brother, too, very different. What worked for him, worked really well for him. I needed something completely different, right? I needed to find my own way. Alyssa Rabin  10:56I do love though, that you just said that you ask the parent what has worked and what hasn't worked? Because I have found in my past experience with taking my kids to therapy, I don't think I have ever had a therapist ask me that. And like, it's just like, I've actually got goosebumps right now, it actually just... oh my god. Lori Bean  11:24Yeah, because you're the person that knows. Alyssa Rabin  11:27And you're the person who has tried. So it's not just like you're beating a dead horse saying, do this, do this do this. That's genius. I love that. Paige Burles  11:38Oh, because your kid has ADHD, then you do this. It's like, well, that might not work for my kid with ADHD. It doesn't all look the same. Right? Alyssa Rabin  11:45If we've already tried that, and it's not working, or if we've tried something, maybe you can tweak it. Oh, my gosh, I love that. Paige Burles  11:51And how does that kid connect as well, right? Because I know for myself, I was not someone that was expressive through art. That was a struggle for me, whereas other children, that's what helps them get deeper. Lori Bean  12:07Okay, so I've heard a lot about art therapy lately. And we get a lot of questions, does she do art therapy? Alyssa Rabin  12:13Or play therapy. Paige Burles  12:15Yeah, it's so much deeper than that. Lori Bean  12:15Yeah, I actually have no clue what that actually is. Can you just explain it because my impression. And so, again, my kids are in their 20s. All I know about play therapy is back in the day, we learned that when a kid is sexually abused or assaulted or what have you, they get these dolls, which are parental figures or extended family, whatever, and they play out the interaction. That is that is the extensive what I know of play or art or whatever therapy, maybe you can speak to that a little more clearly. Lori Bean  12:29Yeah, why use it? Paige Burles  12:50Yeah, well, and I guess we'll start with this. And I learned this so so early on in my undergrad because my undergrad was child studies. I almost dropped out of school, I started in business school, thought this is not for me, maybe school isn't for me. And then let's just try this. And then I found it. So one of the first things they talk about is just how play is the universal language of children. All across the whole world, all children play. And that's how they learn and experience and process things is through play. So incorporating play into therapy is really just meeting the child where they're at and finding their avenue of how can we test this out? Or how can we maybe understand a little bit deeper of what's going on, that they might not have the words to put to yet. But maybe they're gonna express it through play. So play can provide a ton of information, it can also provide ability for connection with the child, and allowing them in their way, in a way that they feel safe doing, to explore, to be curious. I think we can all remember, you know, being kids with Barbies and just being curious. And it was a safe place to do that. And especially with therapy, I think therapy can be, you know, as much as I do my best to create this safe space and just my energy that I try to put out, can still be uncomfortable just to go and talk to a new person. And so finding a way to create or meet them on their level and allow them to lead it. Lori Bean  14:25Because I was just thinking, like, back to my daughter when she was little, she never really played, she did art. So she was very into art, but she wasn't really into play. So I think that's really interesting because you can just sort of see how they navigate whatever you present and follow their lead, I guess, to create that connection. Paige Burles  14:46Yeah, and that's the cool thing about play, incorporating play into therapy and using art, is that we can kind of remove the limits. Because with art, they just have kind of a blank canvas or whatever and some colors... I mean, you never know what's kind of going to come out. Right? And maybe it's going to facilitate a conversation of oh, like, you know what, you know, why did you choose this color and oh, because of this, and then it goes deeper and deeper. Lori Bean  15:13Can you give, I thought this was the most beautiful example you gave of a child that you saw that was quite anxious, and perfectionist, because I'm just thinking of myself. Like, if you asked me to draw something, I wouldn't, because it wouldn't be perfect. And what, are you going to judge it? And what have you? Alyssa Rabin  15:28You know, I know a good psychologist. Lori Bean  15:35But then you said, I thought this was so brilliant, you asked him to draw scribble, just scribble. Because there's no perfectionism in scribble. And then what did you do from there? Because I thought, I could do that. Paige Burles  15:47Yeah, so we started with a scribble, and then turned it into a picture. And that was just a cool experience. And again, like, when people hear play therapy, they might not even think that, and that is incorporating let's use something fun to practice. Okay, I can start with something that isn't perfect and I can turn it into something and create something with that. And that's what we were really trying to do is have some fun with not being perfect, not having to follow the rules. Lori Bean  16:15Draw in the lines or draw a duck or.... Alyssa Rabin  16:18Another thing that I love about play therapy, or art therapy, is the kid doesn't have to sit there for an hour and sit and talk to you. What child, let alone adult, from personal experience, can sit there for an hour and just talk? This way they're active, and they do things with their hands, and they're moving-- Lori Bean  16:43-- and expressing-- Alyssa Rabin  16:45--and describing. Now, during your therapy sessions, are the parents always involved in the sessions? Like are they always in the room with you? Paige Burles  16:53It depends, I really like to have time with the child. I think that sometimes when a parent's in the room, it can change the energy that's in the room. I'm very curious of what, is there a difference when this child is not in the room with their parents, versus when the parent is there. Not judging, just being curious and kind of noticing what happens. And I think that through art and stuff, that's a way that maybe allows them to kind of engage in something else if they do have some anxiety about mom not being in the room. Right? So an ability as well. Because if there is a child who's really attached to mom, doesn't want to leave mom, let's work with that. Let's give that child an opportunity to experience some of that and then process through it. And then talk about hey, how did you do that? Alyssa Rabin  17:41Well, interesting about that is, so my youngest, eventually realized she prefers therapy without me in the room. Because she said, 'You know what, Mom, I really realized I'm a totally different person when you're in the room than when you're not not'. And I'm like, 'Hmm I would love to be a fly on the wall'. Just kidding. But she really, really  realized how different she was with me there versus without me there. Paige Burles  18:20And how cool of an experience to have and then be like, I wonder what that's about. We don't need to judge whether it's good or bad or anything, but just notice that. What do you notice that's different? And then even if there's aspects that they kind of like, it's like, okay, how can we start to cultivate some of those things into your other experiences? Lori Bean  18:41So in addition to, like, art therapy and play therapy, there's something called behavioral therapy. So what is that? Is that facilitated with little kids? Older kids? I'm just trying to put the pieces together. Paige Burles  18:53Totally I think, I mean, behaviorism goes way, way, way back and when people hear behaviorism I think they think rewards and punishment. And it's much more than that now. And it was before as well. But how I incorporate behaviorism is really looking at, you know, when oftentimes with children, they come in because there are behavioral problems. The parents have identified, you know, the kid is, is aggressive or they're-- Lori Bean  18:56-- passive. It could be anything. Paige Burles  19:01Yeah, yeah, exactly. Alyssa Rabin  19:03Confrontational. Paige Burles  19:07Yeah. They're not, you know, not following the rules, or they're, you know, at school, there's problems. And what I find that behaviorism really helps with is really analyzing and being curious about what is going on, what is the function of that behavior, and what need is that behavior trying to meet? Because I think often, I mean, I experienced this, I wasn't the, you know, the teacher's pet or the favorite kid in the class. I was the kid that got kicked out and sat in the hall because I wouldn't stop talking. And I think we get labeled and earlier on, it was definitely you knew the kid that was the bad kid in class, right? And we'd go home and the parent would know who the bad kid in class was, and really shifting that, pulling away. Because, you know, what's the behavior? What purpose is that behavior serving? And what need is that kid trying to get met? Oftentimes, it's connection. Alyssa Rabin  20:20Okay, totally bringing childhood up for me. Had very loving parents, but had no idea how to relate to me. I had severe ADHD. It was never... Lori Bean  20:37It wasn't a thing. Alyssa Rabin  20:39It wasn't a thing, but they never knew how to handle me. It was always 'Why aren't you doing this? Why can't you do this?' Lori Bean  20:49Why can't you sit still?Alyssa Rabin  20:49Why can't you? Why can't you? Why? It was always on me. And there was never, let's sit down and see what's going on. And maybe if we can help you with this, if we can do something to succeed, it was always you're not doing this, therefore, you're not doing that. You know what I mean? They're like, holy reaction. Lori Bean  21:14And you can't, because you have all these behaviors, you can't do well, you can't succeed. Alyssa Rabin  21:21So you grow up, with zero confidence. Because you think you can't, you think you are not smart. That's what I grew up with my whole life. And still, as an adult, I went back to school and aced everything. But that was because I was on ADHD medication. Lori Bean  21:43But when we grew up, too, ADHD medication was Ritalin. Period. And it was bad. Alyssa Rabin  21:48Only the bad kids got it. Lori Bean  21:49It wasn't supported. Only the bad kids got it. Alyssa Rabin  21:52Oh my god. Paige Burles  21:53And the kids that are getting kicked out constantly, or making noise, or sitting in the back of the class. And for girls that can show up as the daydreamer. That was me, I was in my own little world. Alyssa Rabin  22:02Me too. I was in the clouds. And I was talking with everybody, and I wouldn't pay attention. And I didn't care but I did... Paige Burles  22:12Exactly. No, that's the thing is that kids want to well. The kids that, let's say, I mean, we do a lot better at this now, but even recognizing reading problems. And, you know, the kids that are struggling with reading, those are the kids that are trying the hardest. And when I was listening to a TED talk on the guy that he was talking about collaborative problem solving, he was talking about that, that, you know, the the kids that it just comes really naturally to, they're the ones that are doing really well. They're not trying hard. The kid that can't get through the page, that's trying really, really hard. So collaborative problem solving is about let's help that kid get, let's help with what's getting in the way, you know, because that kid wants to do well. So why aren't they? Alyssa Rabin  23:00So do you collaborate with the parents, the school, the teacher? Like everybody? Paige Burles  23:06The most important person to collaborate is that child. Yeah. Lori Bean  23:11How are they feeling? How are they processing information? And what is going on? Paige Burles  23:16Totally. And kids are so creative, like that's been the coolest thing, in my experience, in just allowing children to have just, like, open ended play and just open ended questions, and just allow them to create, to be curious, to just explore different ideas. Like imagine the conversations we'd be having in schools with kids if we really just allowed them to talk, like think out loud, and say things that are quote/unquote wrong. Lori Bean  23:48And you know what? For me just keeps coming back to this is why we need to ask for help as parents and get support because we are tired as parent. We are tired. You have one kid, like you said, that just does really well. They excel, it's easy. Your second child perhaps is more difficult. We're tired. We don't have the energy. We don't have the awareness. We don't know what we're looking for. We don't know how to help. We want to we get depleted ourselves and where our patience gets depleted, that's when we know. Paige Burles  24:22And that's so valid. Lori Bean  24:24Yes. 100% it's normal. But then we should be getting help. Paige Burles  24:30And even nowadays, like, what the kids are faced with in social media, in the schools, like we need to band together. Because every time I sit down with the kid I learned a new term. And I hear something new and no we're saying this now, no this. I learn what's cool and not cool. And a lot of things I say are not cool. Yeah, and I take that opportunity of like, they like to, like teach me, you know. They want to share that and they want to be, like, if you can just picture growing up if you played sports, you have coaches, you had that coach that's just constantly yelling and run harder, do this, do better, all that, versus that coach that is like proud of you for 'Hey, you almost made that. That was amazing. Like, let's keep going. You got this.'  And think of, as well, just what ends up being the voice in our head because for me it was that coach that said not enough, do better. Never like, not as good as this person, this person is the best, you like-- Lori Bean  25:38-- you're not enough. Paige Burles  25:39Exactly yeah, right. And what worked for that kid who was scoring all the baskets - I don't even play basketball - it's whatever's going on there isn't working for me. So work with me to find that out. Because what I needed was, I needed a different sport. I wanted to do dance, I wanted to, you know, and I had parents that helped kind of support that. And it took some time, though, but working with me of, you know, how do I want to work through this and and what does a solution to this problem look like for me? Because it might look different for someone else that's just telling me do it this way. Well that way doesn't work for me. I mean, TikTok, love TikTok, it's taught me all these different ways to solve math problems that are so creative, right? Whereas when I was in school, it was just like, this is the way you do it. Cross multiplication, what, I don't even know, whatever. Same with life. Life is math. I don't know. Alyssa Rabin  26:41Another thing I love, like you were talking before, that you have the parents totally involved. Because going through counseling with my kids, I always felt like I needed to know, not what exactly what they were talking about, but if there were any processes that they taught them, or any guidance there for if I could take it home, and I could help the child. Paige Burles  27:10That's so important, because I am with that... so let's say I'm with your child for one hour of a whole week, I don't know how many hours are in a week, but the change isn't going to happen in that hour, it's going to happen between the sessions. So bringing the parents in, because you're my best resource for modeling the behaviors that we're trying to teach the child, for providing as well feedback of what you're seeing, and troubleshooting, like, what works because again, like the same strategy, not gonna work for every kid. Lori Bean  27:42And I think sometimes as parents, we don't even see what we're doing. Like, for me, a lot of things have been in reflection. Like, oh, I was doing that. Like, you're so innocent. And sometimes we just need support to not be so embedded. Right. And get a different perspective. I think it's so normal. It's so important. Paige Burles  28:03I think in knowing that there's not one right way to do it. And that's what I think is overwhelming with all the information that we have online, this person says do it this way, this person says do it this way. And you're just trying to figure out what's the right thing to do. Lori Bean  28:19Yeah, and your child is an individual being, and we need to cater to them. That's kind of the bottom line. Paige Burles  28:29So yeah, so like, kind of circling back to when you talked about just behaviorism it's, it is so much more than let's just reward the things we like and discipline or punish the behaviors that we don't like. But it's looking at well, what what purpose, what function is that behavior serving? And then, as well, how might you be reinforcing that, or certain behaviors that you're not meaning to reinforce. Lori Bean  28:50As a parent. Paige Burles  28:51Totally. So I'll give an example that I really like to tell parents, is for children that are struggling with self harm, with suicidal behaviors, when that child self harms, or makes a threat about hurting themselves, and everybody drops what they're doing, and races and reacts and supports that kid, and what do you need, and we're here for you. What you might be doing is actually reinforcing the self harm. Because that kid learns that when I just, when it gets to this point, then I get what I need. But what they need is they need that connection earlier. So it provides so much information if we really look into the behaviors. And I need the parents for that, we need the whole team for that, is to understand. Because even when I look back at my life, and I'm sure we all can if we look and see things that we were doing, we were like, why was I oh, why was I like that? Or, you know, if I look back, I can see oh, this is what I needed that I wasn't getting and this behavior served this function, but then resulted in a bunch of other things I didn't want. So instead of just trying to change that behavior, let's go back even further and meet the need earlier. Lori Bean  30:04I'm even thinking of something so simple. So I, when I was a kid, I did not share what I needed, which probably a lot of kids don't, I had a lot of anxiety. But to get the attention and the connection that I was looking for, I didn't self harm, but I would like dress weird, or I would shave my head, or I would do... I'm just getting that now. I never really understood why I did those things. Yeah, I thought it was cool, whatever. But I know I was doing it to get a reaction that I was not getting. Alyssa Rabin  30:08Whether positive or negative. Some sort of reaction. Paige Burles  30:38Exactly. We even see this... I mean, I've worked in schools for, I worked in the school system for a few years, and noticing that, and even, you know, every time a kid calls out without raising their hand, but then they get the attention. And they might be realizing, oh, okay, so the attention, even though it's negative, is actually reinforcing that behavior. So we need to stop reacting to that. Because the punishment, quote/unquote, isn't working. And reinforce what we are trying to create more of and meet that kids need for connection. Alyssa Rabin  31:12Now there are other kids who actually do have issues. And it's not attention grabbing, because all I'm hearing in the back of my head right now is some parents going, but my kid doesn't have that issue. My kid doesn't, they actually have a problem, that's why they do it. So we're not saying that every kid is doing it for attention. Paige Burles  31:33Oh, my gosh no. Alyssa Rabin  31:34Like, there are some children who actually need some help. But trust me, my girls need to come see you. Lori Bean  31:46But I think, as a parent, that's part of parening. You can't give them everything they need. And you don't even know half the time. You just don't. Paige Burles  32:03Totally, and our kids, like, they're gonna struggle, we all struggled. And my struggles have brought me into the person I am today as well. So some of them, I'm like, oh, you know, if only there was, you know, someone that caught this earlier, and I've caught it now kind of thing. However, I do think I could have saved myself a lot of suffering and pain if I'd learned some of this stuff earlier in life. And that's what really just drives me to work with kids. I think that if we, as the world or our country or whatever, invested more into early intervention, we would save so much later on. Because it's preventative. Lori Bean  32:44Mental illness, physical illness, all of it, I agree Alyssa Rabin  32:49Absolutely agree. Paige Burles  32:50A lot of the adults that I've worked with, because I do work with adults as well. Alyssa Rabin  32:53Oh yeah she does work with adults. Paige Burles  32:58Like so many times, I've heard, like I've lost count, so many times I've heard I wish I knew this when I was a kid. Oh, I wish I knew this when I was younger. Like yep, like me, too. Me too. And we're here now so let's do what we can, let's teach our kids this. Let's, you know, let's, tell your friends. If you learn something cool in therapy, I'm like, tell your friends and help people. Like spread this. Lori Bean  33:21The bottom line is what I love so much, and I'm so grateful for, is all the practitioners here are here because they care deeply. And it is about safety. And it is about care. And help. Yeah, come over to Maliya, have a chat, see what we can help you with and support you with. Paige Burles  33:44And you know what, even coming back to the question you said before, about how do you know when is the time? Like book a consultation. We can figure that out together if now's the time, or even, I'll be the first one to say hey, I don't think I'm a good fit for you. Alyssa Rabin  33:58And we do here have, like, free initial consultation. So it'll be like a 20 minute phone call, in person, on Zoom. So you guys can come in, meet Paige, see if, like she said, it's a good fit. Lori Bean  34:13And what's possible. Alyssa Rabin  34:14Yeah, even like my last kind of bout in therapy, I was like, you know what, I just kind of want to level up, like, I just want to, you know, how can I improve the way that I'm functioning right now? So there doesn't have to be, you know, a glaring problem or anything. And, you know, let's teach the kids, let's teach parents some of these self regulation skills, some problem solving, how do we tolerate discomfort and distress. Because if it hasn't happened yet, it's gonna happen. So let's help now so then we're prepared. Lori Bean  34:49And we have the tools. Paige Burles  34:49Yeah, exactly. Well, thank you so much for having me. Now I'm super chill. At the beginning of this I was not. Lori Bean  34:59Because when you speak your truth, and you're in alignment and in integrity with why you're showing up in the world, it's easy. We love you. Paige Burles  35:08Thanks for having me. Alyssa Rabin  35:10Bye.

Podcast for the Holy Church
Episode 165: Fr. Humberto’s homily - Eighteenth Sunday in Ordinary Time on: “We receive the gift of life only so that we can offer it to God and to do His holy will in and in His service. Never to spend it like the rich man on the gospel only

Podcast for the Holy Church

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 31, 2022 11:15


First ReadingECCLESIASTES 1:2; 2:21-231 2Vanity of vanities, says the Preacher, vanity of vanities! All is vanity. 221because sometimes a man who has toiled with wisdom and knowledge and skill must leave all to be enjoyed by a man who did not toil for it. This also is vanity and a great evil. 22What has a man from all the toil and strain with which he toils beneath the sun? 23For all his days are full of pain, and his work is a vexation; even in the night his mind does not rest. This also is vanity.Responsorial PsalmPSALMS 90:3-6, 12-14, 173Thou turnest man back to the dust, and sayest, "Turn back, O children of men!" 4For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, or as a watch in the night. 5Thou dost sweep men away; they are like a dream, like grass which is renewed in the morning: 6in the morning it flourishes and is renewed; in the evening it fades and withers. 12So teach us to number our days that we may get a heart of wisdom. 13Return, O LORD! How long? Have pity on thy servants! 14Satisfy us in the morning with thy steadfast love, that we may rejoice and be glad all our days. 17Let the favor of the Lord our God be upon us, and establish thou the work of our hands upon us, yea, the work of our hands establish thou it.Second ReadingCOLOSSIANS 3:1-5, 9-111If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 2Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth. 3For you have died, and your life is hid with Christ in God. 4When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory. 5Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: fornication, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 9Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old nature with its practices 10and have put on the new nature, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator. 11Here there cannot be Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scyth'ian, slave, free man, but Christ is all, and in all.GospelLUKE 12:13-2113One of the multitude said to him, "Teacher, bid my brother divide the inheritance with me." 14But he said to him, "Man, who made me a judge or divider over you?" 15And he said to them, "Take heed, and beware of all covetousness; for a man's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions." 16And he told them a parable, saying, "The land of a rich man brought forth plentifully; 17and he thought to himself, `What shall I do, for I have nowhere to store my crops?' 18And he said, `I will do this: I will pull down my barns, and build larger ones; and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years; take your ease, eat, drink, be merry.' 20But God said to him, `Fool! This night your soul is required of you; and the things you have prepared, whose will they be?' 21So is he who lays up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God."

PAULINES ONLINE RADIO
GOSPEL POWER l JULY 31, 2022 - SUNDAY

PAULINES ONLINE RADIO

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 30, 2022 5:15


GOSPEL POWER l JULY 31, 2022 18th Sunday in Ordinary Time Gospel: Lk 12:13-21 13Someone in the crowd said to Jesus, “Teacher, tell my brother to divide the family inheritance with me.” 14But he said to him, “Friend, who set me to be a judge or arbitrator over you?” 15 And he said to them, “Take care! Be on your guard against all kinds of greed; for one's life does not consist in the abundance of possessions.” 16Then he told them a parable: “The land of a rich man produced abundantly. 17And he thought to himself, ‘What should I do, for I have no place to store my crops?' 18Then he said, ‘I will do this: I will pull down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years; relax, eat, drink, be merry.' 20But God said to him, ‘You fool! This very night your life is being demanded of you. And the things you have prepared, whose will they be?' 21So it is with those who store up treasures for themselves but are not rich toward God.” Material wealth is a blessing given us so that we can bless others. The problem is not with earthly wealth but with the human heart that gets hooked on it. The second reading describes this problem in exact terms — “greed which is idolatry” (Col 3:5). When wealth, rather than the Giver of wealth, becomes one's security, then wealth ceases to be the blessing that it is; it becomes an idol, a competitor of God. Wisdom begins when, like Qoheleth in the first reading, one realizes the vanity of wealth. Detached from its intended purpose, which is to bless others through sharing, wealth can draw us away from the sphere of God and drag us to the path of destruction. Lord Jesus, may we never forget that we are only stewards, not absolute owners of earthly wealth. Help us to use it according to the intentions of its Giver. Amen.

Changing the Rules
E112: Medical Advancement in the Diagnosis of IBS, Guest Dr. Mike Stierstorfer

Changing the Rules

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 24, 2022 20:08


Dr. Mike Stierstorfer Website:  podcast.stopmyibs.com Transcription:Intro00:02Welcome to changing the rules, a weekly podcast about people who are living their best lives and advice on how you can achieve that too.  Join us with your lively host, Ray Lowe, better known as the luckiest guy in the world.Ray Loewe00:17Good morning, everybody. And welcome to changing the rules. Changing the rules is a weekly podcast where every week we try and highlight what we think is one of the luckiest people in the world. So the luckiest people in the world are people who redesign their own lives, under their own terms and live them the way they want. And they're usually people who think outside of the box when they address problems and issues. And they don't, they're not constrained to the rules of life. You know, one of the things that we find is that all through our lives were given rules that we're supposed to live with. And we're given them by our parents, and then by the schools. And sometimes we get saddled with so many rules that they become barriers to doing what we want to do and what we need to do. And we have with us today, one of the luckiest people in the world, and you're gonna see that he just attacks problems in an entirely different way. He doesn't let himself be constrained by the norms. And because of that, he has successes that other people don't have. So, Mike, Mike Stierstorfer did I pronounce that right today, Mike? You did. That's amazing in itself. Okay. But welcome to changing the rules. And let me give people a little background on you. I found out something unusual. I live in a little town called Lancaster, Pennsylvania. And I asked Mike if he had heard about it. Then he said, Well, I have to go to school there. He went to Franklin and Marshall. So he knows more about this place than I do. And then he went from there on to Temple to get his MD and set up his own practice as a dermatologist, which is really interesting, because of the work he's doing is an entirely different area. And he's been on the staff at the University of Pennsylvania Hospital for a long time teaching interns, teaching residents, is that correct? Mike? Dermatology residents? Yes. Okay, so so he's got incredibly great credentials for what he's doing. And so let's start off, Mike with an event that occurred, I think, was on July 3, 2008.Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  02:39That was the exact day that it happened. And I remember it so well because it was a beautiful day, the day before Fourth of July. And I had lunch at a Mexican restaurant. And within an hour or so after lunch, I started getting an upset stomach, some nausea, and belly pain. And I assumed it was from something I had just eaten and that it would go away by the next day like things usually do. Turns out those same symptoms persisted for the better part of the following year, accompanied by some other symptoms that pretty much qualified for criteria that are used to diagnose irritable bowel syndrome. And that's where everything started. That day, I remember it well, because that night I was walking around, everybody's having a nice time and I'm walking around with an upset stomach, not too happy that I was missing out on all the fun.Ray Loewe03:35Okay, so let's take a minute and talk about this thing called irritable bowel syndrome. It's not it's not something we enjoy talking about on the air. But it is a problem that many, many, many people have, and is not easily diagnosed and solved. So give us a little bit of the background and then we're gonna go into some of the unique solutions that you've been able to come up with.Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  04:01Yes, so irritable bowel syndrome is extremely common. It affects 10 to 15% of Americans or 30 to 45 million Americans. And over 50% of those people with IBS report that foods aggravate their symptoms. It's been felt to be what's called a functional disorder. In other words, one of the in which there's nothing physically wrong. There are several criteria that make up the diagnosis of IBS. You have to have belly pain at least once a week for the past three months, once at least six months prior to that. And it needs to be accompanied by things like onset of the symptoms being associated with changing the way your stool looks either looser or harder. Also, or accompanied by the pain getting better or worse with a bowel movement and also, the bowels moving more or less frequently. Um, upon onset of the symptoms, so there's very strict criteria that are used to make the diagnosis.Ray Loewe05:06Okay? And the cure for this is a traditional process is you go to a gastroenterologist, and they have a process for diagnosing this, which is not necessarily the most pleasant thing in the world to go through right?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  05:20Yeah, they pretty much want to rule out other things that could have a more detrimental long-term consequence to your health. They want to rule out things like inflammatory bowel disease, Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, gluten sensitivity, celiac disease, things like that even colon cancer. So they want to make sure you don't have that. And sometimes they can do that just clinically by asking you questions and examining you. But often these people go through a lot of testing with various types of scopes, and blood tests and radiographic tests, even CAT scan. So there's a lot often that goes into the evaluation before they come to the conclusion it's just IBS. I shouldn't say just IBS, because it can be a serious problem, too. Yeah.Ray Loewe06:04So so here you are in an entirely different field. Okay. And unfortunately, you're having these symptoms. So what happened here? What did you do you know, what's the new way you look at this thing?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  06:21So for the better part of the year, I had these symptoms, I had the big evaluation that didn't find anything. And finally, about a year later, I was trying to determine whether foods are playing a role I avoided gluten, I avoided lactose things that are known to cause GI issues. Nothing helped about a year into it, I got a lucky break, really, I ate Indian dinners at the same restaurants twice within a week of one another. And both times, my symptoms flared up severely worse than normal, but they're the same kind of symptoms I was usually getting. So I knew it was something in the food I was eating for the first time. And I knew it wasn't the Indian spices because I in general, don't eat them that often. And I was having these symptoms, on average, probably half the days. So the thing that I thought about because it's in pretty much everything we eat unless we're intentionally trying to avoid it was garlic. So I just stopped eating garlic. And literally the next day, my symptoms were completely gone. At that point, I felt that this had to be a new allergy to garlic because you can become allergic to something at any point in time, it doesn't have to be something new, repeat exposure, you could come allergic to it. So I set out to try to determine what type of allergy this was. I didn't really know much about IBS, I wasn't really interested in GI as a medical student, I'm a dermatologist. So I first tried a blood test that would look for a peanut type allergy, which everybody's pretty familiar with. And that test was negative for garlic. That's the same kind of test that the allergist says with a prick and scratch test. So that's called a type one allergy, that was negative, I still was convinced it was an allergy. And in Dermatology, we do a type of allergy test called a patch test, frequently for people who have a rash called eczema and we suspect that their Eczema is being caused by something that's touching their skin, in other words, an allergic reaction causing their eczema type of rash. So that's a different type of allergy than the peanut allergy completely different. It's called a type four allergy skin kind of allergy just causes poison ivy, and I decided to do a patch test on myself to garlic. And the patch test was positive I got a red itchy spot on my skin after leaving the garlic there for two days. So my thought at that point was likely the same type of inflammation I was getting in the skin from the patch test from the garlic was occurring in the lining of the intestine when I ate any foods containing garlic. So another point I should mention is that until the early 2000s IBS was felt to be something where there was nothing physically wrong. But in the early 2000s, inflammation has been identified and a lot of people with IBS, both with biopsies of the intestine and with blood tests that show that there's inflammation going on in the body. So most of the time though this inflammation, they don't know what's causing it. So my thought was likely this allergic reaction caused by the garlic in the intestine was causing inflammation causing the IBS symptoms. At that point, I wanted to figure I wanted to find out who else had looked into this. So I googled it and I found that no one ever investigated patch testing the foods for irritable bowel syndrome. So that's when I started with the research on it. I've done several clinical trials now that have been published. And the conclusion of these studies was that by identifying specific foods not just garlic-like but because to overwhelm 80 things now was in the studies up to 117 or 120 Different foods, that over 50% of people we test get either moderate or great improvement in their IBS symptoms by limiting the foods that they identify are identified by the patch testing. So this was completely new information. If you ask the gastroenterologist about food allergies, and IBS, they say they don't play a role. And the reason for that is that it's been taught to them because of other studies that have looked at type one food allergies. And there's another type of allergy called a type three allergy to but those types of testing are not helpful for IBS. So it's ingrained into gastroenterologists that food allergies don't play a role with IBS type four allergy testing by patch testing had never been done for IBS before. So essentially, those prior studies looking at the other types of allergies were like, barking up the wrong tree looking for the wrong type of allergy, you wouldn't be able to check my garlic allergy by doing a type one allergy test.Ray Loewe11:06Okay, so now we have a whole new series of ways to investigate a problem that people had. Now there. First of all, let's talk a little bit about your successes here. So you are telling me when we did our prep call about an 11-year-old girl that you had some success with. And once you go through that particular description, and let's find out what happened.Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  11:35This was one of the most gratifying experiences I had using this testing. This girl was missing school two or three days a week. And her mom somehow learned about this testing that I was doing. And later, she mentioned that she didn't really think it was going to help but she thought I tried she tried anyway, because it was such a desperate situation. And this girl was allergic to benzoyl peroxide, which is used to bleach flour and some cheeses. And she was also allergic to something called pining alpha, which is a naturally occurring chemical that's found in parsley, carrots, parsnips, and celery. So these allergies were identified, she went on to eliminate those foods from her diet and she's 100% Better, she hasn't missed a day of school. And her mom said that when the girl gets sick, she would make her vegetable soup with all those vegetables. And she said I was poisoning my daughter. So yeah, this is an example where like, for me, it was, I was lucky because it was garlic. It was something I could figure out by the process of elimination just from what I had eaten and what I knew I didn't eat that often. But something like pining alpha, you would never be able to figure that out just by the like elimination diet or process of elimination. So this is where the patch testing really becomes useful.Ray Loewe13:01Okay, so so we have uncovered largely by chance, because you were the patient, right? You had a series of issues, and you wanted to solve them for yourself. So how does this figure it out into where the medical community is going with taking care of IBS?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  13:23Well, this is really very early. We're just trying to get the message out there to doctors and to patients about this. That's not an easy task. The goal is that eventually, we hope that the first thing that we've done with people with IBS is this patch testing before subjecting them to all these invasive procedures and radiographic studies where they get radiation and not to mention the cost of those procedures and then putting them on all these different medications that may or may not help at some are quite expensive. Some of them are up to $1,000 a month. So we feel that this testing should be a first-line option for patients with IBS. It's a very simple solution, it identifies specific foods, it's much easier to typically avoid foods found here than doing something like the low FODMAP which is a popular diet for people with IBS, which is very difficult to fall involve lots of different foods here with the patch so you can avoid one or two specific foods or three or four whatever we find and potentially get better. So the goal is that this will be a first-line option for people with IBS and save them a lot of aggravation, testing, and treatments that don't work and expense that goes along with it.Ray Loewe14:43and this isn't stuff that has to go through FDA approval and stuff because the tests are, are approved. It's just a question of getting the medical community to look at this as an option for treating and cure, right?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  14:57So the tests are done with what are called compounded allergens and compounded. And these are considered medications by the FDA So, but because they're compounded, there are a set of guidelines using compounded medications for patients where they don't actually have FDA approval, they have to be prescribed for a specific patient and a patient's name. And they have to the manufacturing of these allergens has to be done by a licensed compounding pharmacist following what are called USP guidelines. So it's accessible to properly licensed doctors and other providers now, as long as they do it in a specific patient's name.Ray Loewe15:41Yeah. And what percentage, you know, IBS is caused by a whole lot of things, right. But when you look at the kinds of things that you're trying to address here is do you have any idea of what percentage of the IBS community or what communities are the wrong word, but,the problems that can be fixed by this?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  16:04Well, yeah, you're right. IBS probably is caused by a lot of different things. But our studies have shown that a significant percentage of these people have these food allergies. In my studies, within the patients who have long-term follow-up, were getting an eight to 10 improvement on a scale from zero to 10, of about a third of the patients and moderate improvement or five to seven on a scale of 10 and another 25%. So I don't know the exact number, but I would venture to guess that probably at least 25%, if not higher than that conservatively, have food allergies that are contributing are completely causing their symptoms.Ray Loewe16:43Well, cool. You know, we're unfortunately, we're near the end of our time already. And I find it fascinating to talk to people like you because you think outside the box. And that's why you are one of the luckiest people in the world. You're not constrained to normal things. You know, you're thinking outside the box, and you're making progress. So where are you going to go from here? What's the next step?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  17:08Well, I do, I do want to just follow up on that comment, right. And I do feel in a lot of ways that I have been extremely lucky to make this discovery really was a very lucky setup circumstance, I pretty much followed my nose. This was not an epiphany that I came up with. But it involves a lot of luck. To make the discovery IBS has been described since 1944. And no one ever before recognize this connection between this type of allergy type four food allergy detectable by patch testing and IBS symptoms. So the luck involved. The fact that first of all, I developed irritable bowel syndrome, some people may call it bad luck, but in a lot of ways, for many people with IBS, it was very good luck. And even for me that I was able to find something that relieve my symptoms. Also, it was lucky that it happened to be garlic and that I ate those two Indian dinners within a week of one another was able to make the connection to garlic was also lucky that I was a dermatologist and I had the tools and the knowledge and the resources to pursue this further. And was also lucky that it turned out to be a type of allergy that in Dermatology we deal with all the time, like for allergies, for allergic contact dermatitis. So there was a perfect storm of circumstances that created this lot that involve that enabled me to make this what I feel is a significant discovery in medicine.Ray Loewe18:35Yeah, but it takes some knowledge and it takes some effort and it takes some you got to follow the luck. Otherwise, the luck never materializes. So, you know, thank you so much for being with us. If people want more information, where can they go to find out more about you and more about what you're doing? And we'll post this, by the way in the notes on our podcast, so they'll be able to see it. But where do they go?Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  19:01Thank you. There's a URL. It's podcast.stopmyibs.com. And patients will be able to get and doctors get a lot of information there. And if they have questions beyond that, our contact information is available there on the website. So we're very happy to talk to anybody who'd like to discuss this further.Ray Loewe19:24Oh, cool. Well, thank you so much for being with us. And continue your great work. And maybe we'll uh another six months or so we'll have you back again. And we'll find out what's happened and where the progress has been. So have a great day. And thanks so much for being with us.Dr. Mike Stierstorfer  19:41Thank you very much.Outro  19:45Thank you for listening to changing the rules. Join us next week for more conversation, our special guest, and to hear more from the luckiest guy in the world. 

Catholic Daily Reflections
Friday of the Eleventh Week in Ordinary Time - Your Treasure and Your Heart

Catholic Daily Reflections

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 16, 2022 3:46


“Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and decay destroy, and thieves break in and steal. But store up treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor decay destroys, nor thieves break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there also will your heart be.”  Matthew 6:19-21So where is your heart?  The answer to that question is answered above.  Your heart is wherever your treasure is.  So, that begs the question, “What is your treasure?”This particular passage points to the danger of becoming overly attached to material wealth.  But the same goes for anything in this life we can tend to become attached to.  What is it you are attached to?  What is your treasure?Ideally, our hearts are attached only to that which God wants them attached.  If that's the case, then the things we love are the treasures that God wants us to love.  And by loving those things, we are loving the God who gives them and calls us to love them.Our treasure should certainly include our family and those others who we are called to love and care for with a special affection.  Our treasure should also be our life of prayer and worship.  That's the most direct way we love God in this world.  Our treasure could also be particular acts of service we are inspired to do, or anything that makes up the will of God.Do you love these things?  Are they your treasure?  The problem is that way too often we tend to love much more than that which God calls us to love.  We become deeply attached to the idea of getting rich and having many things.  But our unhealthy “loves” can extend even beyond wealth and material things.  Reflect, today, upon those things that you may have made far too much of a “treasure” in your life.  What is it that you are overly attached to in this passing world?  Is it money?  Or is it something else?  Allow God to show you and then allow Him to free you from it.  That is the first step toward a life of the greatest of riches!Lord of true riches, help me to keep my heart fixed on You.  Help me to keep You and Your will as my greatest treasure.  Jesus, I trust in You.Source of content: catholic-daily-reflections.comCopyright © 2022 My Catholic Life! Inc. All rights reserved. Used with permission via RSS feed.

Our Sunday Messages
David Hansen - 29th May, 2022

Our Sunday Messages

Play Episode Listen Later May 29, 2022 40:35


The Covenantof Marriage Genesis 2 18Then the Lord God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him.” 19And out of the ground the Lord God formed every animal of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature, that was its name. 20The man gave names to all the livestock, and to the birds of the sky, and to every animal of the field, but for Adam there was not found a helper suitable for him. Genesis 2 21So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh at that place. 22And the Lord God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man. 23Then the man said, At last, this is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh, she shall be called woman because she was taken out of man. 24For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to (KJ cleave to) his wife; and they shall become one flesh. Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled;for God will judge the sexually immoral and adulterers. Matthew 19 3The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 4And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. 7You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered. 8To sum up, allof you be harmonious, sympathetic, loving, compassionate,and humble; 9not returning evil for evil or insult for insult,but giving a blessing instead; for you were called for the very purpose that you would inherit a blessing.

New Covenant Community Church | Highlands Ranch
1 Samuel 6.1-7.1: The Gospel Addresses the Idolatry of Pagans & the Indifference of God's People

New Covenant Community Church | Highlands Ranch

Play Episode Listen Later May 15, 2022 69:00


1The ark of the LORD was in the country of the Philistines seven months. 2And the Philistines called for the priests and the diviners and said, “What shall we do with the ark of the LORD? Tell us with what we shall send it to its place.” 3They said, “If you send away the ark of the God of Israel, do not send it empty, but by all means return him a guilt offering. Then you will be healed, and it will be known to you why his hand does not turn away from you.” 4And they said, “What is the guilt offering that we shall return to him?” They answered, “Five golden tumors and five golden mice, according to the number of the lords of the Philistines, for the same plague was on all of you and on your lords. 5So you must make images of your tumors and images of your mice that ravage the land, and give glory to the God of Israel. Perhaps he will lighten his hand from off you and your gods and your land. 6Why should you harden your hearts as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? After he had dealt severely with them, did they not send the people away, and they departed? 7Now then, take and prepare a new cart and two milk cows on which there has never come a yoke, and yoke the cows to the cart, but take their calves home, away from them. 8And take the ark of the LORD and place it on the cart and put in a box at its side the figures of gold, which you are returning to him as a guilt offering. Then send it off and let it go its way 9and watch. If it goes up on the way to its own land, to Beth-shemesh, then it is he who has done us this great harm, but if not, then we shall know that it is not his hand that struck us; it happened to us by coincidence.” 10The men did so, and took two milk cows and yoked them to the cart and shut up their calves at home. 11And they put the ark of the LORD on the cart and the box with the golden mice and the images of their tumors. 12And the cows went straight in the direction of Beth-shemesh along one highway, lowing as they went. They turned neither to the right nor to the left, and the lords of the Philistines went after them as far as the border of Beth-shemesh. 13Now the people of Beth-shemesh were reaping their wheat harvest in the valley. And when they lifted up their eyes and saw the ark, they rejoiced to see it. 14The cart came into the field of Joshua of Beth-shemesh and stopped there. A great stone was there. And they split up the wood of the cart and offered the cows as a burnt offering to the LORD. 15And the Levites took down the ark of the LORD and the box that was beside it, in which were the golden figures, and set them upon the great stone. And the men of Beth-shemesh offered burnt offerings and sacrificed sacrifices on that day to the LORD. 16And when the five lords of the Philistines saw it, they returned that day to Ekron. 17These are the golden tumors that the Philistines returned as a guilt offering to the LORD: one for Ashdod, one for Gaza, one for Ashkelon, one for Gath, one for Ekron, 18and the golden mice, according to the number of all the cities of the Philistines belonging to the five lords, both fortified cities and unwalled villages. The great stone beside which they set down the ark of the LORD is a witness to this day in the field of Joshua of Beth-shemesh. 19And he struck some of the men of Beth-shemesh, because they looked upon the ark of the LORD. He struck seventy men of them,a and the people mourned because the LORD had struck the people with a great blow. 20Then the men of Beth-shemesh said, “Who is able to stand before the LORD, this holy God? And to whom shall he go up away from us?” 21So they sent messengers to the inhabitants of Kiriath-jearim, saying, “The Philistines have returned the ark of the LORD. Come down and take it up to you.” 1And the men of Kiriath-jearim came and took up the ark of the LORD and brought it to the house of Abinadab on the hill. And they consecrated his son Eleazar to have charge of the ark of the LORD.

The Vine Community Church Sermon Podcast
Prayer is a key to waiting on the Lord and His Power to proclaim Jesus

The Vine Community Church Sermon Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 8, 2022


Matthias Chosen to Replace Judas 12Thenthey returned to Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is near Jerusalem, a Sabbath day's journey away.13And when they had entered, they went up tothe upper room, where they were staying,Peter and John and James and Andrew, Philip and Thomas, Bartholomew and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus and Simonthe Zealot and Judas the son of James.14All thesewith one accordwere devoting themselves to prayer, together withthe women and Mary the mother of Jesus, andhis brothers.[a] 15In those days Peter stood up amongthe brothers (the company of persons was in all about 120) and said,16Brothers,the Scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spoke beforehand by the mouth of David concerning Judas,who became a guide to those who arrested Jesus.17Forhe was numbered among us and was allotted his share inthis ministry.18(Now this manacquired a field withthe reward of his wickedness, and falling headlong[b]he burst open in the middle and all his bowels gushed out.19And it became known to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the field was calledin their own language Akeldama, that is, Field of Blood.)20For it is written in the Book of Psalms, May his camp become desolate,and let there be no one to dwell in it; and Let another take his office. 21So one of the men who have accompanied us duringall the time that the Lord Jesuswent in and out among us,22beginning from the baptism of John until the day whenhe was taken up from usone of these men must become with usa witness to his resurrection.23And they put forward two, Joseph calledBarsabbas, who was also calledJustus, andMatthias.24Andthey prayed and said, You, Lord,who know the hearts of all, show which one of these two you have chosen25to take the place inthis ministry andapostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.26And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias, and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

CCR Sermons
Four Christlike Characteristics

CCR Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 24, 2022 37:59


The Gospel of John, 8-14 Part One: Four Christlike Characteristics By Louie Marsh, 4-24-2022   Pictures of Jesus – last one sacred heart.   If I want to be like Jesus I must… 1) Always and FREELY offer forgiveness.   They were USED this woman.   “3The scribes and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in adultery, and placing her in the midst 4they said to him, “Teacher, this woman has been caught in the act of adultery. 5Now in the Law, Moses commanded us to stone such women. So what do you say?” 6This they said to test him, that they might have some charge to bring against him…(John 8:3–6a, ESV)   Jesus LOVED her & set her free   “6 …Jesus bent down and wrote with his finger on the ground. 7And as they continued to ask him, he stood up and said to them, “Let him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8And once more he bent down and wrote on the ground. 9But when they heard it, they went away one by one, beginning with the older ones, and Jesus was left alone with the woman standing before him. 10Jesus stood up and said to her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?” 11She said, “No one, Lord.” And Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you; go, and from now on sin no more.”” (John 8:6–11, ESV)   No one knows what Jesus wrote on the ground. His love shamed them into leaving. He gave her freedom with boundaries.   2) Always LIVE in the light of life.   “12Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”” (John 8:12, ESV)   To do this I must be   “21So he said to them again, “I am going away, and you will seek me, and you will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come.” 22So the Jews said, “Will he kill himself, since he says…“24I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins.” 25So they said to him, “Who are you?” Jesus said to them, “Just what I have been telling you from the beginning. 26I have much to say about you and much to judge, but he who sent me is true, and I declare to the world what I have heard from him.”” (John 8:21-22a; 24–26, ESV)   Jesus died that we might   “28So Jesus said to them, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority, but speak just as the Father taught me.” (John 8:28, ESV)   3) Always abide in the TRUTH of Jesus.   “31So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, 32and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”” (John 8:31–32, ESV)   Sin always & only   “33They answered him, “We are offspring of Abraham and have never been enslaved to anyone. How is it that you say, ‘You will become free'?” 34Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who practices sin is a slave to sin. 35The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. 36So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. 37I know that you are offspring of Abraham; yet you seek to kill me because my word finds no place in you.” (John 8:33–37, ESV)   Abiding in truth means SPEAKING unpopular realities.   “43Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word. 44You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies. 45But because I tell the truth, you do not believe me. 46Which one of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? 47Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”” (John 8:43–47, ESV)   4) Always affirm that Jesus is GOD.   “56Your father Abraham rejoiced that he would see my day. He saw it and was glad.” 57So the Jews said to him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?” 58Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.” 59So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid himself and went out of the temple.” (John 8:56–59, ESV)   Jesus is God in human   “15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16For by him all things were created…17And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18And he is the head of the body, the church. He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in everything he might be preeminent. 19For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell, 20and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.” (Colossians 1:15–20, ESV)    

Trapital
The Broccoli City Music Festival

Trapital

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 1, 2022 46:57


Today I'm joined by Brandon McEachern and Marcus Allen, the co-founders of Broccoli City. The music festival makes its return to Washington D.C. on May 7-8 with a stacked lineup that includes Gunna, Summer Walker, Wale, and plenty more stars from the world of hip-hop and R&B. The black-owned promotion had not one, but two events canceled in the past two years. During the forced downtime, festival co-founders Marcus Allen and Brandon McEachern made a conscious decision to not just return for 2022, but come back better than ever. Specifically, the two wanted to leverage the Broccoli City platform to create black change. Since starting in 2013, the festival has always catered to black people first and foremost. But in 2022, it's aiming to give its fans better resources well beyond the music grounds. The duo is accomplishing that in the form of an expo that'll feature job/internship opportunities, health/wellness tools, financial support for small businesses, and forums on criminal justice issues, amongst other things. The expo is one component of what the festival organizers are calling BLK Change Weekend. The world and the music festival industry have transformed plenty since Broccoli City's last show in 2019. However, Brandon and Marcus are not just changing with the times — they're creating it with new initiatives too. Here's what we covered in this episode of the Trapital podcast: [0:00] Broccoli City Returns For 2022[3:10] The Optics Of Bringing Back Broccoli City After Two Years Of Cancellation [6:34] Artists Charging More For One-Off Festival Than Tour Event [12:25] Managing Egos When Creating Festival Flyers [14:31] Changing Nature Of Agents With Talents[19:05] Broccoli City's Biggest Advantage Over Other Festivals[23:15] Measuring Success For The Festival[25:25] Anticipating Whether An Event Will Succeed Or Won't [27:15] How Loyal Are Customers To Certain Festivals? [29:01] Ongoing Challenges Of Being Black Execs In Music Festival Scene[31:15] Influence Of The Live Nation Partnership [34:47] Lining Up The Festival With BLK Change Weekend[41:39] What's In Store For The 2022 Event?Listen: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | SoundCloud | Stitcher | Overcast | Amazon | Google Podcasts | Pocket Casts | RSSHost: Dan Runcie, @RuncieDan, trapital.coGuests: Marcus Allen, Brandon McEachern This week's sponsor is ​1-800-NUMBER, a creative agency that produces iconic moments for brand and artists. The studio has collaborated with Lil' Uzi Vert, Future, Isaiah Rashad, 24KGoldn, Nike, Sony, Universal Music Group, TDE, and more. Want to hear how 1-800-NUMBER can help your next project? Book a free 30-min intro chat. Trapital is home for the business of hip-hop. Gain the latest insights from hip-hop's biggest players by reading Trapital's free weekly memo. ______TranscriptionMarcus Allen 00:00Ain't no better feeling to know coming into the event is going down like that, feeling that morning. Those mornings be like the best mornings because you really, there's two times it's the day you drop in in the morning of the festival that is just there's nothing like those two days coming into that time, and those are moments that you really appreciate and you cherish and we've had mornings that have felt good like that. And we may have some mornings and then feel bad because we always walked into the festival that morning, knowing it was about to be a win.Dan Runcie 00:40Hey, welcome to the Trapital Podcast. I'm your host and the founder of Trapital, Dan Runcie. This podcast is your place to gain insights from executives in music, media, entertainment, and more who are taking hip hop culture to the next level. Today's episode is with Brandon McKay Hearn and Marcus Allen. They're the founders of Broccoli City. It's a two-day music festival that's based in DC that has headliners, Annie Lenox, Summer Walker, they have Lil Durk, Gunna, and great lineup of some of the biggest names in hip hop and R&B. This festival is focused on celebrating Black culture more broadly with the entire weekend they have planned with the BLK change weekend, they have a 5K. And they have other community events that really speak to maybe the topics that be branded and Mark is talking about on this episode, we talk about what it was like for them to get this festival off the ground, given some of the challenges the past two years and how COVID set them back. We also talked about some of the challenges dealing with particular artists. Some of you may remember, there was a pretty public complaint from Wale. He was one of the artists that was frustrated, but they were able to navigate some things with him. So we talked about what it's like dealing with artists, some of their pushback, but also we talked a little bit about the broader Asia landscape. If you've been following Trapital, you know, I've talked about examples of the NBA, where you have an agent like a Rich Paul and Klutch Sports and the influence that they've had making things happen for their stars, while the same thing happens in the music industry with some of these powerful agents that are trying to convince themselves and others that their stars deserve to have headlining spots everywhere. So we talked a little bit about that. We also talked about what it's like for black music festival promoters, and how they are not just pushing this, but also some of the challenges they may have in this industry. We also talked about some of the other economics some of the decisions and what Brandon and Marcus are most excited for and how all that stays afloat. If you are interested at all in the music festival space, what it takes to put one on this is definitely the conversation for you. It was a great chat, it was great to reconnect with them both. Here's my chat with Brandon and Marcus. All right, we got Brandon, Marcus co-founders of broccoli city, y'all are back. COVID set y'all back for a couple of years via y'all like “Nah, we're gonna be here. We're gonna make this happen.” So how does it feel?Brandon McEachern 03:10Man, it feels good. It feels good to be back. Happy that the world is opening up. You know, for a minute, dead. Damn, we thought that we was gonna be able to come back for 2021. But you know, COVID and the variant had a different plan in mind. You know what I mean? So, so that's what we're happy. We're back this year, though. 2020 to two days. You know, we outside so it's a good look.Dan Runcie 03:32Yeah, I mean, I feel like it must have been stressful because 2021, once everyone got vaccinated, I'm sure you probably thought the rest of the year was green light, right? Go Let's go. But no, Mari I came through with that touch.Brandon McEachern 03:46And a couple other festivals got off. You know what I mean? So that was the thing to kind of had to like, dang, you know, like Lollapalooza, the biggest festival, one of the best festivals out, shout out to them. They actually, “Oh, rolling loud.” Got to do this. Shout out to Matt Tyree like saying, “Yeah, we just got the short end of the stick on that side. But it's all good.”Marcus Allen 04:04Yeah, I mean, I think the other part too, is is that of the festivals that got off, we were the only ones that was focusing in on people of color, right? And so there was a certain optic that was in the air that was like, as our people was the most effective. It was a decision like, you know, do we put all of our people in jeopardy, right? Do we create a big spreader event? And will the world accept this having a big spreader of like, how he makes up somebody else? And like Brandon and I've just decided it just weren't worth it. It wasn't worth the risk on anybody's part.Dan Runcie 04:33So walk me through the steps of being able to put this back on right because I'm sure some of those same questions you're talking about Marcus some of that trade off? Are people going to be comfortable if there's a super spreader event when we're putting this on? What was that decision process like?Brandon McEachern 04:47Man so um, I think it number one it was we decided we're gonna push through like we came in at ‘22 saying it's gonna take the world to pretty much be shut down for us not to come back right so I think that was number one. We got on the same page with our partners at Live Nation just in terms of what their plan was for COVID one to 22. And once they gave us the “Hey, listen, we're all full steam ahead. We support and you guys fully. We were locked in.” Brandon, everybody affiliated and connected says Book and talent started booking talent. Man probably back in what November. And it took probably longer than it ever took us to book talent because so many shows were rescheduled for 22. So many people wanted to get back on tour, venues were booked and double booked. And so this year was everything about this year was very much different than what we ever ever had.Dan Runcie 05:41And on the side of trying to put the talent you mentioned, it took much longer than ever, what were some of those conversations, like, because I'm sure you had interest but was there more hesitancy because of their own discomfort about COVID or was it just their own uncertainty about their schedules? What was that like?Brandon McEachern 05:58I think that the COVID, the COVID side of it wasn't necessarily the conversation. It was more so the busy runway, like everybody knew that everybody was coming back. So you may want to book artists, but they got to a four or five-city tour that they're trying to push out, you know what I mean? So at the time, they not necessarily thinking about a festival, they trying to do their own, you know, single tour, so it was just having those conversations with agents. And obviously management as well say, hey, you know, this could be a part of your tour day, or whatever the case may be, but I think it was yet again, it really was just a runway, it was just so packed. It was so bad.Dan Runcie 06:34That makes sense. And I'm curious, what was it like from the price perspective? Because when you're dealing with agents when you're dealing with folks, whether it's the artist or even the venue's like where people item or what was there where they try to be like Fat Joe with the yesterday's price is not today's price. Brandon McEachern 06:50Yesterday's price, today's price you got to meet. So I don't know if everybody was just trying to get a bread back from what they had last previously. You don't I mean, those years that we were all, but yeah, prices have definitely went up like the game is crazy, especially when you say that F word. You know, I mean, as soon as you say festival, it changes the dichotomy of the other conversation you didn't mean.Marcus Allen 07:11Agents was talking about inflation is like what was inflated in the price of people themselves? Like what I don't get, how could there be inflation connected with booking talent? Brandon McEachern 07:20You know, is it true? Is it true? You know, that's the cost of playdough, D. That's what you got to do. You know what I mean? That's the cost to play in this game. You know what I'm saying? It's a big cost to so tell my young festival people about to get into this festival game. Just know, these cats is crazy out here.Dan Runcie 07:36You can you talk a bit more about that PC mention where once you make good Festival, the prices go up, or people's eyes light up, you're freaked out, like why is that? And how much higher are we talking?Brandon McEachern 07:48Yeah. Now granted, all this stuff has happened like pre-Marcus and Brandon, right? Like we are, I would say we were Allen Iverson before he got into organized ball. You know what I mean? Like, that was us for the longest time. We were independent. I mean, we actually still kind of are independent. But a club show that's different than you know, than a festival day. You know what I mean? A one-off is different yet again, from a festival date. Because I think personally, they start looking at your pockets too.Marcus Allen  08:16Well, you know, what it is, is the most festivals, in a lot of cases, while there is a capacity, once you reach capacity, that number's so big. That is crazy, right? So they're thinking about hard cap. So you go play a film, or I can say specifically, we're going to sell 1,500 tickets. When you're in a festival ground, that's 100,000 square feet, I might be able to sell 20,000 I might be able to sell 50,000 So they plan for that margin, is he gonna sell 20? Or is he gonna sell 50 they trying to get money like you're gonna pay for 50? You know, I'm saying even if you know, you only got to sell to 20. But they ain't trying to hear that.Dan Runcie 08:52That's real. Because even some of these tours that take place in a theaters or outside venues, there's still a capacity there. But I think people see the flexibility there. But then people obviously see when there's too much flexibility. And there's there could be logistical issues and things like that. The other piece that is a factor of festivals that I would assume is probably part of it, too, is because it's more of a one-off event as opposed to touring. People want to up the price for that event, right. It's almost like paying someone a per diem rate even though that per diem rate would never be their salary for if you normalize it out over a set period, right?Brandon McEachern 09:29I like the way you broke that down, D. Yeah, yeah, we get and they are, they're in demand. So they can say what I mean, if you got a good album, if you pop in, you can kind of say whatever, you know, and to be honest, a lot of promoters have paid these artists that hefty hefty bag. So they like yo I'm not going back regardless of what your festival may mean to the community or whatever the case may be, you know, so get again you get you got to pay to play.Marcus Allen 09:56And then the other part of that too is is that in the festival scene is so competitive with the big boys, that they need certain names to be able to headline those festivals. And so they really created a housing bubble. That's really what we end right now. Right? There's literally a bubble. And for only way for it to burst is that as a collective, the Live Nations, the AGs, they got to just simply say to the agents, nah, we not paying it no more, but they keep paying it. They keep paying it. Every time when an agent come with a wild number, somebody is paying it. So it's really in the body…Brandon McEachern 10:34you make this clear that we're not anti paying people what they were, you know, I mean, let me just say that right now. Like, it's all good, we get it, you know what I mean? Your talents that God gave you that gift, you know, I just got through listening to you, whatever the case may be, I know what this money is doing for your family. You know what I mean? Because at the end of the day, a lot of these artists are getting a lot of a bread from shows, you know, me, I don't know what the streaming stuff is, and all that. But we do understand that these festivals are a bulk of a lot of these artists' income or whatever the case may be. So we definitely adhere to that. And we pay all of our artists very well. You know what I mean? I don't think nobody would say Oh, broccoli city shortchanged us or anything of that nature, never at all. Never. Dan Runcie 11:16That housing market analogy, I think makes perfect sense, right? Because we're seated now across the America, you have people with well-paying jobs do their thing. And then someone else giving out $100,000 above asking price cash off to go buy…Brandon McEachern 11:30you in the bay, you know what it is?Dan Runcie 11:32Exactly, exactly. And it's like, I'm sure you probably see that well, where it's like, even if you may not think and artists market rate, is it more than what you're willing to give? Not like you said not they're trying to shortchange everyone, but there's a market for everyone, for sure. But then, if another festival just is willing to put everything behind it, that is the market and then it's like, alright, well, you know, even if I may not agree with where that is, someone is willing to pay that price. So it does reset things. So I'm sure that's probably difficult to some perspective to deal with. But I think another thing too, and maybe part of this is navigating artist' emotions, or artist feelings is Ivan here. And more recently, there's some artists that have started to complain about how be their David's on that music festival poster or what font size they have and stuff like that. How much do y'all deal with that? Or how much did you deal with that either past years, or this year was brought. Brandon McEachern  12:25Man, we've actually never dealt with it before until this year, who dealt with it with somebody and much respect to that somebody as well. But you know, honestly, and it's funny, because he had, again, these conversations weren't had as much as they were had this year, just in terms of the billing placement. And I don't know yet again, if that was something that happened during COVID. And folks was like, hey, you know, when I come back into this game, I want to make sure my joint is bigger than everybody's name, whatever the case may be. But it's actually something that's done when we put the offer out, and we're going back and forth with the agent, you know, they'll say things or management, they'll say, you know, top-line billing or, you know, I mean, like, they'll make it a conversation piece, you know, and usually, we match our eye on that. And it's not a problem that then sometimes the artists may not have been in communication with the management or the agent, and then certain things happen. And I don't know, Dan, if you could put a clip up of what we talked about. Yeah, you know, saying, but definitely, to that tea.Dan Runcie 13:25Yeah. And I think on that front, you know, I know you're not trying to put anybody on blast by any means. But I'm curious, though, is there some type of trade-off there where there's an artist that is frustrated about something, they're not communicating to you? They just want to put it out on Twitter, and then all of the blog aggregators that say, oh, you know, so and so is upset with Broccoli City, on one hand, it may be a negative thing, but on the other hand, now, you'll have a bunch of press out there. It's like, oh, yeah, well, Broccoli City's back this year, let me go check that out. What was that? Like? Did you notice a bump in sales after that.Brandon McEachern 13:59Sales, to be honest with you, the sales is already in a very good place. But just in terms of the attention to your point, we definitely got a lot of tension off that. And it became a conversation outside of just our particular event, which I thought was super dope did at least cause conversation between folks in the industry is that to the third, and I think I could have swore I seen somebody else actually just do this. Like yesterday, a particular artist just got mad, I think at Lollapalooza, something about something. So yeah, I mean, they're becoming really vocal about it. But we respect this. Marcus Allen 14:31The other thing too, Dan B's has a more personal connection with the agents, right. So just as an outside person, to my degree, right, because I don't really talk to him, but I get firsthand information. I see the emails, a part of it, I believe, is agents positioning themselves because the industry is changing. Right? COVID really made artists readdress how to teams in their business restructure right. You sit down, you've been paying people all this money, you had two years off a year and a half off, you now get a chance to really look at your books, you now get a chance to think about what are you paying people? What are they doing to be paid? And so I believe that folks tightened up their teams, which made a lot of agents on the outside. So obviously, cream rises, right. So the best agents are gonna still be the best agents, but they have to still show value, right? And we may all everybody may be still paying you agents gonna get you your fee, for the most part. So if you get in 100,000, you get 100,000. But if I'm an agent, and I say to you, Dan, listen, I'm gonna get you your bag. But I'm gonna also make sure you get topline billing on every festival. Now, you might know in your heart, hey, no topline billing. But if an agent tell me I can get you top line billing, and 200,000, who you gonna go with? That's the new game, right? It's about the value proposition of what the business is around these artists and how they're thinking about it and the value proposition of each part of their business. You know, I mean, what's the role of everybody? What are you bringing to the table for this fee? I'm paying you.Dan Runcie 16:13So this is fascinating, but it's not surprising. And I say that because I think about what we see in the NBA, right? There's been plenty polarizing opinions about the impact of Rich Paul and what he's been doing with Klutch Sports. And you can literally insert Ben Simmons in the example that you just brought up, right. But the NBA is a bit more transparent about these things. People either love or hate what Rich Paul is doing. And it's been very actively talked about. I don't know if people outside of the industry music know that dynamic as much with regards to people in music, like who the agent is, that is the equivalent of the Rich Paul or the Klutch Sports in that way, where the client goes there because the client is like, hey, my way or the highway, we are getting you to the Los Angeles Lakers. Watch me do this, right, like, but I'm sure that even though those things aren't public, that's the kind of shit that y'all handling. Yeah, on that front with the headliner piece. You talked about that as well. I know that you've had different headliners each year. But is that something where that does become at least a conversation where let's say you are dealing with a agent who had promised this to their artists, but you're like, hey, we either don't want to have that person as the headliner, or B, we already have it set. Does that, do those conversations stop? Is there continued negotiation there at least for you all, what is that piece of it been like?Brandon McEachern  17:42Usually Dan, if a person is a headliner, we want them as a headliner, like everybody know that they gonna be the headliner, you know, what I'm saying? Now, I will say for this year, was a little different, because we went the route of having two black women, headliners and Annie Lennox, and Summer Walker issue that we had with a particular somebody, it was a matter of who was more important in a particular area, particular city. It was longevity versus right now impact, right? He's like that kind of deal. You know, I mean, it's like I've been running this race longer. But in the short term, you're bigger.Dan Runcie 18:19Right. And I mentioned that piece is probably interesting, too. I know conversations we've had offline about this, just given that you are very much wanting to have and celebrate an event that is pushing or promoting black music for black people, and that it doesn't necessarily always 100% line up with festivals that are hip hop festivals that may be happening, although the artists themselves may be black. They aren't necessarily selling or having guests there, or attendees who are black. I think we've seen plenty of examples of that. How does that dynamic and curation shape not just who you reach out to for headliners and others, but also how you think that shapes the makeup and the target audience for the festival?Brandon McEachern  19:05I mean, I think that I think we don't necessarily go for what's trendy, if that makes sense in terms on the booking side, because we actually do, we do know the culture, right? So if you look at Broccoli sitting in 2016, you know, we had Anderson Paak, you know what I mean? Like if you look at what was that March 2015. You know, we had Kaytranada you know what I mean? And this is yet again years before they become who they become because one of the things that we try to make sure that we do is we listen to the streets, listen to Little Sisters, listen to nieces, listen to… Marcus Allen 19:38Even better, go look at the 2020 Grammys, and then go look at the 2020 Brockton city festival lineup that got canceled.Brandon McEachern  19:46Yeah, you know, LS who does a cat was you know what I mean? We are a new dozer was and then as soon as I'm not gonna say as soon as we booked her, but you know, everybody's starting to see her value. But we saw that way back I heard the streets Definitely like our rules. I knew what time it was with that young lady. And I think that that's one of the things that broccoli city does a hell of a job at, you know, is just really listening and finding that talent early and being able to give them a shot before everybody kind of hops on the bandwagon of that particular person.Dan Runcie 20:17So that piece there listening, finding the talent and having a year before the mainstream does, how was that piece of change? Because, you know, y'all been doing this for a few years now. In 2015 16, there was no Tiktok, and there wasn't some of these other things, but how has that played a factor in what you're noticing or what you're trying to pick up on where things are heading?Brandon McEachern  20:38I think it's still the same. I think it's still listening to the youth, you know what I mean? And we do know, when Tiktoks on that, you know, hours and hours and all that and we got money, you know, but he's at the festival. So I think it's just different avenues. At one point, it was all SoundCloud. You know what I mean? And that was kind of like your avenue to the music. So I think it's really just kind of just staying above and making sure that you got an ear to the streets and and not thinking that you know, at all, I think sometimes we get in a space where we think like, oh, we know this, that to the third like no, there's a 13, 14, 15, 16 year old, that's way cooler than you. And that's what you need to be listed.Marcus Allen 21:14I think also to some of it is time into right, because this is one thing to know the right artists, but if you book them off-season, you hustling backwards, right? So like in this example, we booked a lineup in 28, I guess in November, but we got Durk. Durk was out cycle in 2020. But right i mean 2021. But right now, he's crazy. It looked we looked crazy. I was on a call listening to be talked to somebody and they asked him be How did you know? How did you know it was Durk? Because if you look at the festivals Durk do we know only festival that marks a major name right? And so we look be looking like, you know, like he like he perfect for dictate the future. But it was really just understanding that he was coming. Right and just believing that Durk is a strong artist, and he's coming.Dan Runcie 22:02Yeah, I think so much of that insight is key, right? That is your job. At the end of the day, you're trying to have these you want to create the memories for fans to be like, oh, yeah, remember, they were on Durk early, we have that. Because then that obviously builds audience and the people that come back year after year after year on that front. And that is something that I've begun to, especially with a festival like yours. Do you have stats or anything on how many of the people are repeat purchasers or the folks that come back as opposed to be able to try to bring the new audience in? And what is that? What are those two groups look like? Let's take a quick break to hear a word from this week's sponsor.Marcus Allen 22:41We got a super high super high turnover rate. And I will say not only the super high turnover rate of people who attend the one tear connection to people who went right. So like, Oh, I saw my cousin went two years ago. Now I want to go right. And so I think it's very close to that as well. Like, it's almost like I wasn't ready for it three years ago. Now. I'm ready right now I get it.Dan Runcie 23:03Right. That makes sense. That makes sense. And for both y'all. What does success look like? So when you're looking back after the festival, of course, there's things like tickets and revenue, but from a high level, what does success look like?Brandon McEachern  23:15I mean, for me and get again, Marcus, I probably have a different answer because I connect to the world a little different than he does. But for me, it's the stories. It's the stories, obviously, bottom line stuff, right, we'll make sure we hit on my bottom line and chip was good financially, but it's the stories man, like when I hear the stories of be me and my home girl was out there. And did it look like to me that or another thing that is artists having a good time, too. You know what I mean? Like going back to Anderson Paak story, Fox story, I remember him saying that this was the first time he performed in front of this many black people, you know what I mean? Which I thought was crazy and dope at the same time. So it was those type of things for me, they've really claim success on myself. Marcus Allen 23:57And I love markets.Brandon McEachern 23:59Now, I mean, it ain't no better feeling like the money always got to be right. Let's just be clear, right? Like, I mean, that's what we're here for Dan, we're here to make money. But it ain't no better feeling to know, coming into the event is going down like that feeling that morning. Those mornings be like the best mornings because you really, there's two times it's the day you drop it in the morning of the festival. That is just there's nothing like those two days coming into that time. And those are moments that you really appreciate and you cherish and we've had mornings that have felt good like that. And we have some mornings that and feel bad because we always walked into the festival that morning, knowing it was about to be a win. So when you know it's gonna be a win, you really, really appreciate that you really appreciate it. And then once everybody get home safely, and you get back to that hotel, you can look at your partner in the eye and be like, Yeah, that's a great feeling, man. That's it is a great show.Dan Runcie 24:58That's special. I hear that. Can you talk more about that, actually. So those mornings that for past festivals where maybe you woke up and you weren't sure how it was going to go where you had less certainty? What was it about the planning or leading up to it that made you feel that? And then on the flip side, what is it about those festivals where you're like, Yes, this is going to be the best one yet? What was it about that feeling the morning that made you have that memory. Marcus Allen 25:25So this is wild, Dan, because, and Brandon, you might even feel differently about this. But after doing it for enough years, either the people want it or they don't, there's not much that you can do to market it to a sellout. You can make sure it stays in front of people, but when they want it, and if they don't, they don't. And so you spend four months, five months, just talking about what the flyer gonna look like the names gonna be on it. So it's like somebody dropping an album, you know, I'm saying and cats ain't messing with it. That's like, it's hard to accept it. Because you don't like so and slow and slow and slow. Just kidding me, right? And you like, man, we go put these marketing plans together, we're gonna do this, we're gonna do that. But then you get to the point where you realize they just ain't messing with it. They just ain't messing with it. And so it's like, you know, when you see somebody drop an album, they sell 100,000, the first week, and the second week, they sold 5,000 10,000. Because that nobody wanted to tell nobody, people wasn't talking about it. And so it just dies off.Dan Runcie 26:25Hmm, that makes sense. Brandon, anything you want to add?Brandon McEachern 26:28No, I think he hit it right on the head. You gotta mean like, you put a lot of time and effort in this thing. But they don't want it. They don't want it. You got to eat that. You got to eat. Dan Runcie 26:39it's fascinating. Because obviously, so much of that is dependent on the line of that you have and how people are feeling about the lineup. And I'm sure this affects every festival people buy tickets because they want to see them. But I'm sure you probably have people that will go to Broccoli City regardless because they just enjoy the vibe of it. And in your opinion, do you think any festival in the country has that benefit where it is if they have whoever is the headliner, just because it's that name? And just because it's that vibe, they will have a dedicated audience or do you think this is something that every festival promoter has to navigate?Brandon McEachern 27:15I mean, I personally think that there are some festivals out there that just have that right like yet again, the Lollapalooza the world, possibly even like the bottle rocks, you know what I'm saying? Like, and if you notice, I'm not naming any, any urban land festivals, you don't say black land festivals, I would love to see more of that within our communities, in all honesty, like, you know, just kind of loyal to the work that you know, your people are putting in to kind of put something together but you know, that's you just cry. You know, I mean, you preaching to the choir at that point. Right. So it is what it is. But I do think that there are some staple brands, like I said, the Lollapalooza of the world, BottleRock, Marc, I'm pretty sure you got some. Marcus Allen 27:54Maybe in terms of black maybe, Only Essence. Oh, yeah, that's for sure. I think it's probably Only Essence that I would say from a black perspective, actually has real draw.Brandon McEachern 28:05Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And that's something that we working on, right. Like you want to keep giving people you know, it's like, man, we've been doing this for 10 years. Are you gonna trust us? At some point? You know what I mean? So, yeah, but it's just an interesting thing, Dan, just in terms of the urban saw.Dan Runcie 28:18Yeah, definitely. I feel like essence definitely has that annual Black homecoming vibe to it, that makes it the search for the draw it is. And I think for you, what a lot of your peers who are also black festival promoters in urban music are also in that same boat wanting to build that up as well. And, Brad, I know, we talked a little bit about this, but what has it been like from your perspective? Because obviously, you see that so much of the music from this community is what is making these festivals that money, but you as a both the all as black promoters in this space are likely still experiencing challenges pushing so much of this even though it is your music that is making this entire ecosystem what it is, Brandon McEachern 29:01Yeah, no, I mean, it's really just a trip. And at the end of the day, you know, shout out to folks like you, right, that give us somewhat of a platform to kind of, you know, just speak so people just kind of know what we got, I don't even think that people leaving, they don't even think about it, you know, like, maybe those who are in kind of a creative space. Think about it, but I know there's been people who have, you know, man talk shit to me or something at some point, right? But then they start planning something big, and they'll text me like, you know what, be my bad bro. My bad man cuz now I see what you were going through. When I thought that it was just kind of a walleye kind of thing. You know what I'm saying? But it takes a lot of hard work. And it's interesting yet again, going back to dealing with agents from our side on the urban side, and how they may treat me versus how they may treat you know, Jordan and those folks from governors ball you don't I mean, like the tone of the voice. You know, we talked about this a little bit earlier. They're not saying they talk to you crazy, but I don't have some wild conversations with some of these agents. You got to me even going back to the artists, right, and our particular artists that we were speaking of my question is, I wonder what the comrade, I wonder, would he have done that on another festival? You get what I'm saying? Do you feel like you can do that? Because we're so close in terms of camaraderie. It's like, you know how your friends treat you versus somebody who don't know you treat you if that makes sense. Dan Runcie 30:24It's a fair question, right? Like, because I'm sure you probably wondered, oh, would they have done that if it was Coachella, one and two, how would people respond? If they were trying to say something about? Yeah, on festival like Coachella, Brandon McEachern 30:39It may be as forgiving. I suppose you know what I mean? Or try to get to the bottom of the issue or just snip you. You know, I think we saw that last year, or the year before last with artists saying a certain thing and every festival followed suit, and snip snip,Dan Runcie 30:54right. It doesn't take much for Word to travel and people to just see how the dynamic is. I know one of the changes for you over the years with this festival has been the partnership with Live Nation urban and what you've been able to do with them. How has it been working with them? And what influence have they had for you all in the more recent years with the festival?Brandon McEachern 31:13More, more, want to take that? Marcus Allen 31:15Yeah, I mean, I mean, I think the number one thing that they've been able to do is take some of the financial risk off of Brandon and I to be able to operate the festival in much more of a business and not a annual, write with every year, we got to figure out how to get back in position to raise capital to find an investor to you know, me, it's just like a consistent cycle. You can't grow a brand, having to do that every single year, because you're starting from scratch every time. Right. And when you're doing that one loss is devastated. You know, me as devastated and as independent. Where, I mean, you think they think they've been in a Lollapalooza been going on for 25, 40, 30 years, you know, I mean, you think they don't want every year, you know, I'm saying like, it's an ebb and flow, like you're gonna lose some years. And so that's what Live Nation gives you the ability to do is have some years to just be normal, right? And not make $2 million at the gate, right? Like, just be normal. Like, yo, we lost money this time. Alright, we're gonna be back next year, and we know we gonna be back. So that's huge.Brandon McEachern 32:21And I would say, you know, shout out to our partner, Shan Ji, who is, you know, who's been in the game, you know what I mean? And it's rare that you meet, you know, other people that's been through what you've been through, you know, what I mean? So just big shout out to him and his vision and everything that he's built…Marcus Allen 32:35And let us working to. He lay his work, yeah, let me let us work he don't play to you know, micromanage, he let us work. He wants to see stuff when it goes out. He want to make sure he got some merch, you know, I mean, he want to know who the lineup is he want to help add value in terms of setting the right talent, you know, I mean, he want to make it easy for us, and use his experience, you know, to make it easier for us, you know, as we navigate through this whole thing,Brandon McEachern 32:59on top of relationships as well, because yet again, this industry is superduper small and like a Dan, right? Like, we know, Dan already from from from back in the day a little bit, even though it was like a year, and I'm trying to go but just imagine Sean and the relationships that he built over the years and to be able to introduce markets into markets and nine to different folds that, you know, makes sense that he has, you know, strong relationships with and then us doing the same, because his folks on the street is different events that he don't know about that maybe we introduced him to. So it's been a fantastic relationship.Dan Runcie 33:31Yeah, it makes perfect sense. Because at the end of the day, most festivals, even the ones that are household names today lose money in the first few years. So when you're starting from scratch, so much of it depends on who you could get money from investors, how you can get secured, you know, deals in place for all of these things. And unfortunately, it can be harder for folks that look like you to be able to do that here and in this country, right. So when you look at that being able to have the support of a company that has gone through to the fact that they have a division geared towards this, the partnership makes perfect sense. It gives you all the room to do what you could do to build this up, because you know that something is here. And I think that if we just let's say it like it wasn't there, if we just let the festivals that can maintain get to where they are, then there's so much left as an opportunity or not even as an opportunity. There's so much left that isn't given the opportunity because of that. So it's one of those partnerships that I do think makes a ton of sense, at least from the outside for my perspective.Marcus Allen 34:31for sure. So shout out to Ellen, you for sure. Yeah. Dan Runcie 34:35The other thing too, with this year, you lined it up with the blockchain, we get that I know that was part of the promotional push for this. How has that shaped your event planning and what you hope is in store for this weekend?Brandon McEachern 34:47Yeah, I mean, we're kind of we've always kind of been on that. Right, Dan? So when we talk about when we talk about broccoli city as a whole, right, you know, to say that broccoli City is a music festival. It's kind of disrespectful, right? When you think about Everything that we have done leading up into this point like in 2017, US launching, you know, Broccoli cod, you know, like, I don't know, any other festivals that you can go to that you have a networking opportunity, a chance to maybe hear a Dan talk or hear Bosman St. John talk, you know what I mean? Like, I don't know, no other festivals with that. And if I do, I know them after we started the whole conference outlook, right? And then when you think about a 5k, ruin, right, like, I don't know, any other festivals that's doing 5k. But I think they are something to do do that stuff now. But yet again, it was always a black chain weekend, we think about it, you know what I mean? And yet again, I know that we're one of the only festivals if you think about on a wide scale of them all that gears, the talent, gears, the experience, the host, the music, the all that geared with African Americans, black people of color in mind, first, you know what I'm saying? Like, our people aren't the afterthought, which I think is some of these other events. We may be the afterthought, you know, So yet again, with Blackshades weekend, and really just kind of putting that word out there, it really hasn't changed much of what we already have been doing. And honestly, I think it was important for us to put a name to it, though. So I'm glad that you mentioned that, Dan. And Marc, I don't know if you have any statements on that, please. Marcus Allen 36:15Yeah. Now just gonna say that it was important for us to say what it is right, like coming out of COVID, we made a conscious decision that we wanted to use our platform that are right. And at the core, what that meant was we wanted to create black change for black folks. We knew we had corporate partners, we knew we had different folks who've been looking to touch this demo with our sponsorship and partners have always been strong. But now it was time to say like, alright, well, you've been cutting broccoli city a check, how can we do a better job of providing resources opportunities to these attendees? Oh, you want a better platform to do? So you need an expo? Okay, we're going to add an expo to the conference. You know, I mean, like, Oh, you want to talk about health and wellness? Okay, we're gonna add another component to the five cake. Right. So I think, for us, it was always there. But we needed to be attentional going in between to about that.Brandon McEachern 37:09And to add on the Marcus's point, Dan, not afraid to say black, right. Like, I think a lot of us get to a certain level. And I even said it earlier, right? Like POC like people of color, like, you know, I mean, which is cool, don't get me wrong. But Marcus and I wasn't afraid to say Yo, we really want to do this for black folks. And I don't think it's nothing wrong with that at all. You know what I mean? Like there are specific festivals that may be geared toward the Hispanic consumer, which is completely fine. I don't mean, you'll see no black person there.Marcus Allen 37:37But I think the key about black the conversation around black chains is that for black chains to happen, it takes more than black people. Right? So let's be clear, right, like black chains happens internally with black people. But you need some white folks, some Spanish folks, some Asian folks to participate right? In some change happening. So this isn't necessarily just a black event. It's just that we focus in on creating change for black people. Dan Runcie 38:03That's an important distinction. And I think that to your point, right, there is a great opportunity to celebrate this and not be afraid to call it what it is and have that there are many festivals that hit different groups for that reason, but the fact that you all know your audience know the opportunity you're going to create and in the region that you're doing it it makes perfect sense.Marcus Allen 38:23Absolutely. Absolutely. And you know what to think on that even if we check out if everybody checks out the quest love documentary to summer soul, and you know what I mean? Everybody didn't get us on that. But it's like, Yo, this shit going on right now too. So, come to broccoli city is see somewhere solid? Actually, there's well, you know,Dan Runcie 38:41exactly, exactly. Alright, well, before we let you go for the listeners, give us a sense of how you're feeling now going into it. Of course the festivals coming up and you talked a little bit about some of those years. You're feeling good some of those years you're not How are you feeling right now?Brandon McEachern 38:57feel great. I feel good. You know, say I'm pretty sure Marcus feels great too. I mean, it's lit up you know, I mean, everything from whiz kid to summer Walker to Tim's to Rico nasty to Young Jeezy to snow man like Don Oliver, like what the fuck are we talking about? You know what I mean? Like is split up 2121 dirt? I mean, come on mate, Gunner like come on man. And on top of that, there's so many things going on that weekend black chains weekend and it's in DC I'm feeling Mac you know what I mean? Like it's phenomenal. So I'm super excited. I don't know Mark got anything to add.Marcus Allen 39:31I feel super excited. It's funny because not that BS job is done. But the bulk of his core ship is on the front end. So now like he like do my job you know me, “What's up now” like so now it's like I'm all back to back production calls experience call venue calls and so speak.Brandon McEachern 39:52On that though it, me and Marc have had this conversation. It's one of the things that I respect about my partner so much is that Marc hates it when we go somewhere. We're at an event No, like, Oh, this is okay for black of it. You know what I mean? Like, and I love for you to just speak on how you trying to heighten our experience and how you know me, like how you heighten the experience. He's already heightened experience for other LNU properties as well.Marcus Allen 40:14Honestly, Dan made me you know what it is right? We met at probably one of the most immaculate fundraisers of person could go to, right? Like, let's be honest, right? Like, we saw some stuff right there front of us that was like, Oh, is this happening in real life, like, I gotta go back and watch the video to confirm, I'm watching this with my own eyes. And at the end of the day, like, there's a stigma out there that if you just have the talent, that's enough, and in a love, Coachella spin to $10 million little art, that's more than that's more than festivals hold talent budgets. But that's why to our conversation earlier, why they dropped that lineup with no names, and it'd be sold out. Because people know that there's an experience value associated with that brand. And a lot of our people aren't willing to invest that $10 million, because it may not come back to you year one, that's an amortized cost over 10 years, for you to see that value in that art to spending. And so I think that's what we're getting into now. Right. And that's what the partner show ln gives us the ability to do is to go spend big money on experience, right? And push partners to say, like, “Nah, you can't do that little 10 by 10 Cent,” na, na, if you want to be on site with us, you got to step it up. You got to get your agency's up, like you got to get it right.Brandon McEachern 41:39And we want to give that experience to our people. Yet again, if this is Black change weekend, it needs to be beautiful. We aren't a culture, we you know what I mean? So even if there's any sponsors, listen to this, any, you know what I mean? Like, get at us. So we can make this experience great, because these are the same people that make your products what it is, these are the same people that make whatever artist that is on top. It was Sinead good to Nika and Rahim that made that artists pot, period, period, you know what I mean? And those are the folks that go to broccoli city, you know what I mean? Even if we talk about ticket prices and things of that nature, Dan, like, come on, bro. We give him folks. 10, 12 phenomenal acts, and our prices ain't nowhere near anyway, I don't even want to get there. That's a whole nother conversation. And we've done that by choice because we want to make sure that we give our people the experience. I had a girl tell me one time, the, I never been to Disney World. But I've been to Broccoli City, though. And I appreciate you for that. You know what I mean? Because we the only festival that maybe she can afford, you know, so I don't know is this such a bigger conversation than what we can do in this 30 to 40 minutes, but it's a real thing. And yet again, I just commend I commend my partner Republican in front of the whole whoever listening, you know, to me for really sticking on that shit, like, not be like, we got to make sure this shit right, bro. And I respect that wholeheartedly because anybody can book artists, if you got the bread, you can go out there and get them. That's fine. You know, now I do hop through hoops to sit and do what I do, you know, I mean, to give myself a pat on the shoulder. But factors, in what way in terms of what we try to do for this experiences is key. And we just want our people to have a magnificent time. So anyway, shout out to that today's experience.Dan Runcie 43:21So it's a perfect way to complement both your skill sets where you see the space. And yeah, I mean, Marc, I hear you be already has his work done. He could get excited about stuff. And I know you got a lot on your plate. But I think that you have it in store, you have the partners and like you said, you know, there's an opportunity here, we're no different than a company investing in a startup or investing in artists, many of these festivals did that, you know, level of support do and I think that's where it can happen, especially with something that has the proven audience that you all do, for sure.Marcus Allen 43:52For sure. Now, a lot have you got a ticket now even be in DC because we got these VIPs on the ice for you waiting when you get here?Dan Runcie 43:59For sure, John, appreciate y'all. Thank you.Brandon McEachern 44:02And yet again, Dan, thank you, D man for highlighting what's going on on this side. You know what I mean? From the Chitlin Circuit there right now, you know what I mean? Like, it's been a whole bunch of us pushing and curating our culture and making sure that that we are responsible for getting our artists out there and getting their music out there. You know, I mean, and yet again, I don't want to keep tooting my own horn. But I mean, we had to Willow and Jaden back in the day, you know, I'm saying like we had come over the salons isn't like, tattoos gotta stop. It's me. No, you know what I mean? All these cats that a lot of people were just taking note too, like, we've been pushing these folks out and not for any other reason. And they've been using their gifts, and we want to make sure that we use our platform to get their gifts to the world. You know if that makes sense. So it's a blessing. Appreciate you.Dan Runcie 44:50A 100%, 100%. Alright, then yeah, anyone else that is listening, you already know about the concert. Make sure go to the website. Y'all want to give a quick plug. Make sure that People listening nowhere to go check it out.Brandon McEachern 45:01Man go to BCfestival.com. Broccoli City. I'm pretty sure you heard of it. Your cousin heard of it, you know, so make sure you out there. Yeah, make sure you out there because you don't want to see them pitches. You don't want to be on Instagram that day you're not there. That's just not something you want to do.Marcus Allen 45:18For sure, man, appreciate you again. Damn it. It's love man. This is great. Just to connect with you. Big fan of the podcast. Stay on the Twitter. I'll be back to comment on some of your stuff. But I'd be like yeah, let me chill you know me some of them comments be crazy. But nice is love though. I really appreciate this man. I love the growth that you build in the USA with your platform it and the brand growth man stay down. Anything we could do, man you already know. Brandon McEachern 45:44And yet again, and I sorry, do you know me? I'm gonna go on a tangent, but we let go. But that's the ecosystem, right? Yeah. Right. Black Journalists, right? Black curated events, like we all you know what I mean? So we have to do a way better job black executives that you've interviewed before, black agents that you've interviewed before, we got to find a way to make it work, because they're finding out a way to make it work. In all due respect. You know what I mean? So we got to figure it out. But pretty say to Brother, I'm gonna get off my shoeDan Runcie 46:12For sure. No, that's a great note to end on. Appreciate you both man.Marcus Allen 46:17Appreciate you man.Dan Runcie 46:20If you enjoyed this podcast, go ahead and share with a friend. Copy the link, text it to a friend, post it in your group chat, post it in your Slack groups. Wherever you and your people talk, spread the word. That's how Trapital continues to grow and continues to reach the right people. And while you're at it, if you use Apple Podcast, go ahead, rate the podcast. Give it a high rating and leave a review, tell people why you like the podcast that helps more people discover the show. Thank you in advance. Talk to you next week.Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Novant Health Inside Remarkable
Rebounding Higher Part 2

Novant Health Inside Remarkable

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 28, 2022 7:47


00:05Welcome to Mosaic, your Novant Health podcast for diversity, inclusion and equity. You'll learn more about the mosaic of similarities and differences that make us stronger, and how health equity benefits us all. Piece by piece, we're telling the stories of the beautiful mosaic of Novant Health. 00:25Hi, this is Becky Knight BRG administrative coordinator, and on a previous podcast I talked with Sarah Arthur about the creation of the Rebound Business Resource Group. This new BRG provides an open and supportive environment to raise awareness of mental health and substance use diagnoses. On this episode, we will hear more about addressing stigma and what Rebound has planned for the future. And I'll wrap up with some easy to access resources if you or someone you know needs assistance. 00:56Courage is one of our values. And I'm encouraged to learn more about how people are taking advantage of this resource for themselves and their families, and by extension our community. Is there a general stigma about mental health and substance use and even more so in certain communities? I was wondering what have you observed? And how is the BRG addressing stigma and making these conversations.. 01:23So we want to make every employee feel comfortable. Now a lot of times people rely on their friends and family and peers for support. And that's okay. But when you hear that one of them has also utilized a formal counseling service or a physician or a certain medication, you're more willing to try it yourself and actually utilize that help. I think that when you see someone like yourself as well, you don't feel as alone and isolated when it comes to certain feelings that you may be having. And it often helps if you can have a friend tell you, Hey, I noticed that you're acting a little differently. And that's why we also promote through this group knowing ways in which to bring about the subject of mental health. We share you know with throughout our system, the five ways to bring up mental health. We share things like Mental Health First Aid training, just to give people the tools because it's an uncomfortable subject. You don't want to trigger someone, you don't want to bring up a conversation that then you don't know what to do about it if someone is really in crisis, and you don't want to be the result of anyone's downfall either. 03:21So to wrap up, I'd love to know a little bit about your plans for this coming year. What's on the horizon? 03:30Yes, we had a really big focus last month on Mental Health Awareness Month, we had a lot of testimonials from people within the group, to again, try and break down that stigma and encourage more people to join rebound. The group, we have several different components that we're working on when it comes to education, reducing stigma, and then looking at our different policies and procedures within the hospital system. So one thing in particular, when it comes to policies, we noticed several employees within the group had been on medications from their physician, but through our policy, because it's considered a controlled substance. They didn't necessarily know that they needed to report that to employee health. And then in other instances, it came about where you know, a leader may have just heard that they were on this medication, and then had a perception of how it made the person act or maybe what diagnosis went along with it. Again, making the person feel like they had done something wrong for taking something that they were prescribed. So we're going to work with employee health and how we can educate new employees that are coming in, as well as current employees to make people feel like they can take their needed medication. Oftentimes, people may not do it because they want to keep their job, which isn't good for their mental health. So that's one thing. And then when it comes to education, we're continuing to promote mental health first aid training throughout our organization, specifically for leaders so that they feel like they have the tools to help their employees. And we're working with HR on the companion support team or compassion support team. So you have a peer that can support you in a crisis. 05:36If this conversation has sparked in you a desire to reach out for help, I did want to close with some resources. First Novant Health has a behavioral health call center. It is operated 24/7/365 and staffed by masters level therapists who can assist individuals and family members in navigating the world of treatment for substance use and mental health issues. We're going to give that number is 1-800-718-3550 and it's available to all team members, providers, patients, community members, to everyone. 06:27You can also contact the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, a branch of the US Department of Health and Human Services. Their national hotline is 1-800-6TO-HELP or 1-800-662-4357. And they do have a free confidential referral Information Service and it's available in English and Spanish. Finally, I just want to say thank you to Sarah for being with me and sharing about this important BRG and the work that they're doing and I know is going to just be so impactful in the year to come as we all try to get well and on the road to recovery. Thank you, Sara. 07:22Join us next time where I'll have with me a member of the Rebound BRG to share with me about how the group has supported her and how she's working to decrease stigma in the organization and among her fellow team members. And I'll also be joined by a physician from the women physicians BRG, which we have at Novant Health. And she's going to give a clinical perspective and some additional resources for team members and for those in the community who may need assistance. Thank you so much. Join us next time. 08:04Thanks for listening to Mosaic, your podcast for diversity, inclusion and equity and Novant Health. Stay tuned for our next exciting episode.

Taber Evangelical Free Church
Seeing Jesus Glorified

Taber Evangelical Free Church

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 27, 2022


Some Greeks Seek Jesus 20Now among those who went up to worship at the feast were some Greeks. 21So these came to Philip, who was from Bethsaida in Galilee, and asked him, Sir, we wish to see Jesus.22Philip went and told Andrew; Andrew and Philip went and told Jesus. 23And Jesus answered them, The hour has come for the Son of Man to be glorified. 24Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit. 25Whoever loves his life loses it, and whoever hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. 26If anyone serves me, he must follow me; and where I am, there will my servant be also. If anyone serves me, the Father will honor him. The Son of Man Must Be Lifted Up 27Now is my soul troubled. And what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour? But for this purpose I have come to this hour. 28Father, glorify your name. Then a voice came from heaven: I have glorified it, and I will glorify it again. 29The crowd that stood there and heard it said that it had thundered. Others said, An angel has spoken to him. 30Jesus answered, This voice has come for your sake, not mine. 31Now is the judgment of this world; now will the ruler of this world be cast out. 32And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself. 33He said this to show by what kind of death he was going to die. 34So the crowd answered him, We have heard from the Law that the Christ remains forever. How can you say that the Son of Man must be lifted up? Who is this Son of Man? 35So Jesus said to them, The light is among you for a little while longer. Walk while you have the light, lest darkness overtake you. The one who walks in the darkness does not know where he is going.36While you have the light, believe in the light, that you may become sons of light. The Unbelief of the People When Jesus had said these things, he departed and hid himself from them.

Staples Mill Road Baptist Church
The Parable Of The Great Banquet

Staples Mill Road Baptist Church

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 13, 2022


Luke 14:12-24 12He said also to the man who had invited him,When you givea dinner or a banquet, do not invite your friends or your brothers[a]or your relatives or rich neighbors,lest they also invite you in return and you be repaid.13But when you give a feast,invitethe poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind,14and you will be blessed, because they cannot repay you. For you will be repaidatthe resurrection of the just. 15When one of those who reclined at table with him heard these things, he said to him,Blessed is everyone who willeat bread in the kingdom of God!16But he said to him,A man oncegave a great banquet and invited many.17And at the time for the banquet hesent his servant[b]to say to those who had been invited, Come, for everything is now ready.18But they all alike began to make excuses. The first said to him, I have bought a field, and I must go out and see it. Please have me excused.19And another said, I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to examine them. Please have me excused.20And another said,I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.21So the servant came and reported these things to his master. Then the master of the house became angry and said to his servant, Go out quickly to the streets and lanes of the city, and bring inthe poor and crippled and blind and lame.22And the servant said, Sir, what you commanded has been done, and still there is room.23And the master said to the servant, Go out to the highways and hedges and compel people to come in, that my house may be filled.24For I tell you,[c]none of those men who were invited shall taste my banquet.

Staples Mill Road Baptist Church

Luke 12:13-21 (ESV) 13Someone in the crowd said to him, Teacher, tell my brother to divide the inheritance with me.14But he said to him,Man,who made me a judge or arbitrator over you?15And he said to them,Take care, and be on your guard against all covetousness, for one's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions.16And he told them a parable, saying,The land of a rich man produced plentifully,17and he thought to himself,What shall I do, for I have nowhere to store my crops?18And he said, I will do this: I will tear down mybarns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods.19And I will say to my soul, Soul, you have ample goods laid upfor many years; relax,eat, drink, be merry.20But God said to him,Fool!This nightyour soul is required of you, and the things you have prepared,whose will they be?21So is the onewho lays up treasure for himself and is not rich toward God.

Bitch Slap  ...The Accelerated Path to Peace!
"Someone was happy I was screaming at the TV."

Bitch Slap ...The Accelerated Path to Peace!

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 20, 2022 14:44


How can I tie my inane stories towards the topic of the Table Rush Talk show? What a great Christmas Holiday.  Reflecting on the love with my family.  Perhaps not how you expected it.  My from “Point A to Point B Theory”.  I was working on saying yes.  Some people got to work on saying no.  My personality was coming out during that football game…and someone was loving me for who I am.Administrative: (See episode transcript below)WATCH the Table Rush Talk Show interviews here: www.TableRushTalkShow.comCheck out the Tools For A Good Life Summit here: Virtually and FOR FREE https://bit.ly/ToolsForAGoodLifeSummitStart podcasting!  These are the best mobile mic's for IOS and Android phones.  You can literally take them anywhere on the fly.Get the Shure MV88 mobile mic for IOS,  https://amzn.to/3z2NrIJGet the Shure MV88+ for  mobile mic for Android  https://amzn.to/3ly8SNjSee more resources at https://belove.media/resourcesEmail me: contact@belove.mediaFor social Media:      https://www.instagram.com/mrmischaz/https://www.facebook.com/MischaZvegintzovSubscribe and share to help spread the love for a better world!As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.Transcript: Mischa Zvegintzov  00:02Thank you zoom recording and process. I will never get tired of that. The title of this episode, "someone was happy I was screaming at the TV". Yes, indeed. Somebody was happy I was screaming at the TV. And I'm going to relate that to a um... My job on this episode is to relate that story to the eye to the Table Rush. That that's what I'm thinking these days. How can I tie my inane stories towards the topic of the Table Rush Talk Show? So I'm going to do that. You're also going to be gifted with a few ramblings, I am sure. Mischa Zvegintzov  00:51(Intro) You know when someone is selling from stage. And at the end, the audience gets up and rushes to the back of the room to buy. That's a Table Rush. My name is Misha Z. And the Table Rush Talk Show is all about bringing you the tools, strategies and tactics that you can use to grow your audience and inspire them to buy.Mischa Zvegintzov  01:17And I'm gonna start with this. i Boy, it was a heavy couple of days a great I'm recording this right around the Chris I'm recording this right around Christmas time. And great great great, great Christmas. Just so much love with my family. You know my two sons dawn, the boy's mom, my dear friend Dawn we've been gifted with a great friendship and then you know time with EX in laws, who are still friends have circled around to good friends as well. So I'm just reflecting thank you is that reflect? I offer you this space to reflect as well. I'm the love that is in your family, perhaps not how you expected.Mischa Zvegintzov  02:21So, you know, the Christmas time and I was really working on this time of just saying okay, as much as pot as possible. being amiable as much as possible. being gracious as much as possible. and not begrudgingly so. fixing my little look here thing, but not, you know, not begrudgingly, like truly heartfelt. like, "okay", "okay", and in trusting that things will shake out the way they're supposed to. And I find so much in life, if you if you look at, you know, we're going from a point A to point B, oftentimes, and someone will ask us about point B, do you want to go to the, to the family dinner with me, Misha? you know, to the to my dad's house, that would be Dawn? right to the X in laws for dinner. And there's point B, that's point B and then there's point A is where we are today. And you know, a lot of times it seems like that point B is inevitable. And how am I going to make the journey to point B? Am I going to make it easy and loving and amazing or am I gonna fight all the way there? So, you know, at this point, I know this about dawn that she likes to she likes. Our family likes Christmas Cooper's the outlier. Cooper's The Grinch, admittedly, so it's fun. It's fun. It's funny. So this is... Cooper, if you're listening to this. I love you. He can be crunchy at Christmas. But, you know, the list of Christmas things is started coming from Dawn. And again, I say this with love. I'm going to tie this into the importance of the Table Rush I swear to you.Mischa Zvegintzov  04:19You know, let's go in on presents for Cooper. You know, trying Don's trying to make sure we've got equal cost with the boys presents. And I saw I'm just left a Yes. Okay. Sounds good. Because that stuff's coming. Anyway. Fast forward, you know, we've got you know, Christmas what do we do on Christmas day? Breakfast dinners, who's where we opened in presence all these things. and so lots of yeses, yeses and and some people need to learn how to say no and set up those hard boundaries. I'm not saying this is for everybody. Some people got to say no. Some people got to say no, because they overcommit all the time. over committing, I don't have that problem, it's easy for me to say no.Mischa Zvegintzov  05:10So you know, in my peak sales years, I was very confident. very confident, and very successful for me, right. that I was successful as a sales as a home loan officer, you know, that was my peak salesman moment. And had a couple of great... you know good success and a couple of great companies and, and then, you know, wanted to pivot out of mortgages. divorce happened. tried to start a business it failed, parents died, more failed relationships. if you've been listening to this podcast, you've, you've heard me talk about that. And I don't say that "woe is me" I just... life can get super interesting, some points. But my point is, is that that time, like, I was very confident, man for many, many years and lots of success and, and a glass is half full type of a guy. and then, you know, when I got into my 40s, in the, you know, a lot of issues came up to column issues, you know, divorce, you know, more failed relationships. Teenagers not doing what you want. My confidence was shaken. I guess that is my point. My confidence was absolutely shaken. I have always been an outgoing guy. Not always but you know, an outgoing, like I said, competent, this and that and actually very confident in in my choices. Oftentimes, if I made a mistake, no problem. plow forward, don't look back, which I love that idea to look back and learn but don't. And I trying to get to the point here.Mischa Zvegintzov  07:21What else can I say? Just that my confidence. Yeah, my confidence, which was shattered and definitely in the relationship space. You know, another, I had fallen in love with another woman. After Dawn.  I love you, Dawn. But I had fallen in love with this other woman after Dawn and I got divorced, moved in with another girl, blah, blah, that relationship fell apart. And it definitely, definitely messed with my psyche. You know, I was not the same confident person, I was coming out of that. Just like a combination of real loss of confidence in relationships. Also had loss in confidence in my career. my parents had died and other things happened. So I had loss of confidence in life. Right. And I also back then, you know, I was very much... when I say confident in who I was. I I didn't really care what you thought of me, was like I am who I am. Take me or leave me. And depending on how that's presented, you know, I think that can be good. It's like I am who I am. I love myself. It's all good. Right? Take me or leave me historically, or back in the day that could have come across as very cocky. Could have  come across as very cocky. and it oftentimes was. so there was some arrogance within. So fast forward to today, you know, I'm definitely feel like I'm finding... I am who I am. Take me or leave me, but with not laced in arrogance. But I still have trace trace trace insecurities. Or I'm really aware of how deep insecurity had come back to me. Right or finding that new way forward?Mischa Zvegintzov  09:39I'm not quite sure how to say but I'll fast forward at the end law's house graciously x in law's house. Day after Christmas. We're having our Christmas lunch. Intimate. Meaning small. Me. myself. Her dad Jerry. Love you Jerry. If you happen to listen to this, his wife Veronica is full fourth wife, our favorite Jerry's favorite wife. Veronica frickin love you, Veronica. And my youngest son, Waylon, he was so great. He was is so great. and quick, I'll just say one thing there. you know, Cooper was so positive this Christmas and really just leaned in and showed up and did his best to embrace it all. and did a fabulous job on it. So we were commenting a lot about that. And I was thinking, Oh, my gosh, you know, Whales is just such a shining light most of the time that I need to tell him he did an amazing job to. because Wales, he showed up in a big way. What I just a beautiful Christmas.Mischa Zvegintzov  10:45So we're watching football. And I'm being vocal, every now and then at the game, you know, yelling Yeah, or Oh, or whatever, you know, great catch. And I can be loud and boisterous. And I kept on saying, "Sorry", I kept on saying sorry, and kind of, you know, going shhh hunch in my shoulder. Sorry, sorry, whenever I would react, sorry, sorry. And Veronica was loving my emoting and to the TV, to the football game, because Jerry doesn't. And I was, you know, having fun with a football game. And so Veronica was loving it. She's like, I love it. I love that you're so emotional, if it was nothing crazy, but that, you know, you're showing emotion towards the game and having fun. She's like Jerry, Jerry just doesn't do that. He's just, he's just no emotions during the football games. And I'm not saying either is right or wrong. But what I am saying is, I was watching the football game, I was having fun, I was letting that fun show and the Mischa way. And Veronica was grooving on it. And so I think about the podcast, the podcasting that I do, the YouTube'ing that I do, the blogging that I do that we do that all of us that are sort of embracing, you know, putting ourselves out there in that medium. And these mediums.Mischa Zvegintzov  12:30There's people out there, that like how we present ourselves, it may take us a while to find them. But we just got to do it and trust, and we don't need to be insecure, or we can be secure in our insecuridness. We can know that. If we're being authentic and going for it, there's people out there, they're gonna that that love us for who we are. And that was just such a powerful lesson for me. And that was a very reflective moment of like, oh, yeah, like my personality was coming out during that football game. And someone was loving me for who I am. So good. Thank you for that, Veronica. And so I get to keep doing that with my podcast, with the YouTube channel. With the blog that's coming.  I just gonna keep being me. Because there are a percentage of people out there who like it, learn from it, embrace it, enjoy it. And I and I bring value in that way. So there you go. There's my can't remember how I started this something about yelling at the TV. Anyway, be yourselves people. Be yourselves. Put yourself out there, go for it. We'll keep at it. Love to all.Mischa Zvegintzov  14:07(Outro) Thank you. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Table Rush Talk Show. For resources to help you sell your stuff. Go to B E L O V E dot media forward slash resources. That's the love dot media forward slash resources. And be sure to subscribe, comment, five star and share. Thank you again for listening. Contributors: 

Bitch Slap  ...The Accelerated Path to Peace!
Wait a minute! The summit kind of worked.

Bitch Slap ...The Accelerated Path to Peace!

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 3, 2022 10:33


Table Rush.  Tools For A Good Life SummitSomeone comes to me for life coaching via the Tools For A Good Life summit.  It may be just my future self who is on the journey with me. Who do I want to help…my hand is being forced? Wait a minute, the summit kind of worked.Administrative: (See episode transcript below)WATCH the Table Rush Talk Show interviews here: www.TableRushTalkShow.comCheck out the Tools For A Good Life Summit here: Virtually and FOR FREE https://bit.ly/ToolsForAGoodLifeSummitStart podcasting!  These are the best mobile mic's for IOS and Android phones.  You can literally take them anywhere on the fly.Get the Shure MV88 mobile mic for IOS,  https://amzn.to/3z2NrIJGet the Shure MV88+ for  mobile mic for Android  https://amzn.to/3ly8SNjSee more resources at https://belove.media/resourcesEmail me: contact@belove.mediaFor social Media:      https://www.instagram.com/mrmischaz/https://www.facebook.com/MischaZvegintzovSubscribe and share to help spread the love for a better world!As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.Transcript: Mischa Zvegintzov  00:01I do want to say to kind of cool oh, sorry, part 3.  Am I staying with pitch slab? Or am I going with Table Rush? Goodness gracious. I just had this amazing thought stream and it disappeared.Mischa Zvegintzov  00:27Oh, a person that is in the middle of a divorce was asking me for help. She's like, Hey, I'm trying to figure out what to do next. You know, I need to get a job blah blah blah. And and I was like well, I'm kind of... and she came to me from the via the what do you call it the the the summit. The Gools For A Good... excuse me... via the Tools For A Good Life Summit. And I was like, Well, I've kind of shifted directions to helping business people or whatever, blah, blah, blah. You know, this Table Rush thing. And fast forward to today past few days as I'm like, What am I doing? Who am I trying to help? Who is this frickin avatar? Like? Who? Who?Mischa Zvegintzov  01:35I'm walking in traffic recording. So dangerous.Mischa Zvegintzov  01:42What am I trying to say here? Thanks for listening per usual. I appreciate you. I do. I appreciate you being on this journey with me. And maybe it's just the "my future self" that's on this journey with me. It's a funny thing to think about, isn't it? Or my previous self from a month behind who's on the journey with me, I think you get what I'm saying? Or not, it might be too esoteric for you.Mischa Zvegintzov  02:14So this person was like, Hey I need some help, kind of finding a vison forward. And I'm like, Well, I think let me refer you to someone else. Because I've got nothing put together to help. And she wanted some coaching.  Literally was asking me to provide coaching. And I was like well, I got no coaching. But I guess it's kind of what I'm trying to do through this whole process is put together some courses to create some coaching and create some evergreen courses. Anyway there's a few other people that could use a little help with their direction moving forward and finding their "why". I see now that a lot of people are questioning getting their "why" that are in some psychic upheaval.Mischa Zvegintzov  03:22So awesome. Will these become episodes? And what will the name of my podcast and YouTube channel be? Assuming there's a YouTube channel when these episodes go live? It's very exciting.Mischa Zvegintzov  03:44Definitely distracted by the cars and the people walking big dogs. Okay, back to it. Stream of conscious.  "Hey" big dog.  That is a big dog. My gosh beautiful big dog.Mischa Zvegintzov  04:07Okay.  So the question is this. the question is this.  "How do I start from scratch and put on new summits new challenges to reach the fledgling entrepreneurs who are a year behind me?" Perhaps Yeah, a year behind me. Or do I reach out to the divorced dads, divorced moms or just divorced dads who are perhaps five years behind me? Some serious rambling.  Let's come back to center. Big breath in.  Long breath out.Mischa Zvegintzov  05:21So what I was gonna say after this five minute and thirty second intro was... The summit worked to pull together some people and bring a coaching client to me.  And I realized just a day or two ago like like really hit me.  "Like wait a minute. Like the summit kind of worked."  Not as in a bigger scale as I want but a couple of people literally reached out to me directly like someone I've never met and then a couple people that I do know indirectly.Mischa Zvegintzov  06:19And then also over the last couple of weeks some new leads have trickled to me through the summit. So people have registered for the summit and now they're in the queue.  so my the what I'm questioning is.  Is if I stuck with that plan... stuck with that idea... like I'm still... I'm not far enough away from it that I can't get back to it and not be distracted by the shiny object of Table Rush. I can put together a measurable questionnaire that I've already created I can clean it up it's super cool. That could be my software to. Wow. Holy mackerel kinda cools things could come from that. Just hits me as I'm talking about this.Mischa Zvegintzov  07:38A lot of activity this morning. Dogs barking. Thank goodness. Will this be an episode? Welcome to the entrepreneurial journey, people. Welcome to the entrepreneur...my... Mischa's recent entrepreneurial journey that sure does seem to be self serving. Holy mackerel, who knows?Mischa Zvegintzov  08:08Anyhow, it's like my daily diary that's just exposed for the world to see. How fun is that.  At some point, the five year for me now is just going to be so dialed in just these concise episodes that are... your three step process to this five step process to that.  Oh my gosh is ludicrous. Anyhow, I think you'd get what I'm saying.  Thank you for listening. I appreciate you. Thank you for being a part of my process.Mischa Zvegintzov  08:52So I'm standing in traffic. I'm going to try and get to the point to set you free from this episode. But I think perhaps a "find your why coarse" or a "find your why challenge" is definitely an order. And perhaps I don't need to rename everything. And I can let go of my fears around...  Ah who knows? Who knows more will be revealed PEACE OUT

Dork Matters
Dork You Forget About Me

Dork Matters

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 22, 2021 62:59


Ben and Lexi reminisce about the quintessential coming of age movies of our youth - kind of. Dork You Forget About Me find Ben and Lexi looking back at classic 80's teen movies. Both Lexi and Ben struggled to fit in with humans and had to turn to movies to learn how to be a teen, which means watching copious amounts of John Hughes! In this episode, Ben and Lexi dork out about classic John Hughes movies, which holding them up to the test of time. Have these movies aged well? Listen now and find out! Show Notes:Lexi and Ben talked about the following movies:Uncle BuckThe Breakfast Club16 CandlesPretty in PinkHome AloneFootlooseWeird ScienceFerris Bueller's Day OffPump Up the VolumeCan't Hardly WaitAnd more!The  full list of John Hughes movies can be found hereYou can find the episode of Art Intervention we mentioned hereWe talked about  Margaret Atwood being a TERF and you can read about the 2018 conflict here and the more recent one hereSOCIALS:Here's where you can find us!Lexi's website and twitter and instagramBen's website and instagram and where to buy his book: Amazon.ca / Comixology / Ind!go / Renegade ArtsDork Matter's website(WIP) and twitter and instagramIf you're enjoying Dork Matters, we'd really appreciate a nice rating and review on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your pods. It would very much help us get this show to the other dorks out there.“We're all pretty bizarre. Some of us are just better at hiding it, that's all.” Transcript:Lexi  00:00One time I was driving to work and listening to like, you know, rap and I like aggressive hip hop, and I was listening--Ben  00:08[chuckles] Someday I'll ask you to define that, but not now.Lexi  00:12Okay, so, like, for example, I was listening to Run The Jewels one day, [Run The Jewels plays] which I wouldn't even classify as, like, super aggressive anyway, and I was trying to psych myself, like, "I gotta get in this building. I gotta be, like, in a good mood and talk to people all day," and so I was listening to it, fully cranked, and the windows were flexing, and I didn't realize there was just like a sea of children sitting there watching me, like, pound coffee, and try to, like, psych myself and, like, "Get out of the car, go inside,"  and it's just like, "Well, whoa, nope! Sorry, kids. I'm just gonna turn that off real quick". [music stops] I don't know what happened. [laughs]Ben  00:50I don't know how to get myself psyched up. When I worked in an office, I had about a 15- to 20-minute walk to work to, sort of like, just not be the person I normally am, and become work person. That didn't always work. I still a pretty grumpy shithead, usually. I don't like being bothered, and, you know, being in an office means you're just constantly bothered. It doesn't matter what you're trying to do.Lexi  01:15And you have to make small talk. Like, yuck. Ben  01:17Yeah, I had to learn how to do that. I've always been an introvert and making eye contact with people, when you have a conversation and just like... And so, I'm actually pretty good at just talking bullshit now with people. I don't like it. I don't like doing it. I don't like this other version of me is just talking to people, and I'm just like, "Eugh. Glad I'm not that guy."Lexi  01:36There are so many times where I'll finish doing, like, a presentation or having small talk with someone, and I'll go away and I'll be like, "Oh, she's terrible," and I'm referring to me. Like, I hate that part of me like, [upbeat] "Hey, how's it going?" I'm like, "Eugh! God."Ben  01:51Yeah. So that's an interesting thing with, like, being a stay-at-home parent now too, is like, I don't get to go to a different place and be a different person for a while, and divorce myself from who I think I am, versus the person I have to be in a work setting. Now, it's all just me, and it's all just gotta try to do well all the time. Lexi  02:11That sounds hard. Oh.Ben  02:13Can't phone it in like I used to when I'd go to the office. [laughs]Lexi  02:17Well, I mean, you could. You could just like plunk him in the laundry basket in front of the TV.Ben  02:21No. I mean, I'm incapable of doing that.Lexi  02:24That's good. That's good.Ben  02:25I am your Cyclops archetype. I am responsible to a fault. "No Fun Ben", I think, is what I  used to be called.Lexi  02:33Oh, I was the old wet blanket. Ben  02:35You know, you guys would be like, "Let's go to a party and get drunk." I'm like, "I don't know about that. I gotta be home by 9 PM and, you know, we're underage." [laughs]Lexi  02:43I do remember being at a party at your place when you lived with Brandon, and in the middle of the party, you did start doing dishes. [Ben laughs] I remember, I was like, "Hmm, this is interesting."Ben  02:55They were stacking up. You gotta keep 'em clean. You gotta keep them clean. That's just respectful to other people.Lexi  03:00Fun is fun, guys, but come on. Like, clean up after yourselves.Ben  03:04"No, no. Y'all keep having fun. I'll clean the dishes." That's a nice thing for me to do. [laughs]Lexi  03:08I was the wet blanket in terms of like, you know, at the sleepovers, I'd go, "Oh, it's getting late, ladies. It's probably some shut-eye time."Ben  03:16Oh, god. You're lucky you didn't get Sharpied every time.Lexi  03:20Those people, I think maybe they were like, "Is she...? Is she, like, you know...? Should we be nice to her because she's not all there?"Ben  03:29"The same as us."Lexi  03:29Yeah. And sometimes I kind of wondered, like, "Did they think that I am maybe on the spectrum or something?" which I kind of wonder if I am sometimes.Ben  03:38God, I wonder all the time if I am, and I'm not trying to say that as a joke. Like, I constantly--Lexi  03:41No, no.Ben  03:43--wonder if my inability to connect with people is something neurodivergent.Lexi  03:49Oh, do you do-- okay, sometimes I'll watch people. I'll watch-- like, especially when it comes to women, and when I was a teenager, I would watch groups of girls interact, and I felt like I was watching, like, a nature program. Like, "Ah. That is how the female species puts on makeup," and it never made sense to me to like go up to them and be like, "Hey, gals, let's all put our makeup on together." I was just, like, so awkward that I didn't understand how to talk to them.Ben  04:18Yeah. The thing for me was that I was just always felt on outside, as well. Like, I never felt like I had a group of friends in any situation. Part of that was moving schools a lot. Part of that was never feeling like I connected with other individuals. So yeah. No, I definitely should probably figure out if I'm--Lexi  04:35But I think that that's a great thing that people are learning more about themselves at all times because sometimes, like, I'll talk to adults that are like, "Well, I probably have a learning disability and that would have made school a lot easier, but what's the point in finding out now?" I'm like, "Well, why wouldn't you?"Ben  04:51How would that make... Well and, like, record scratch. [scratching record DJ-style] How would that make school more easy for you? Would you have had maybe more support? Maybe, but maybe not. It depends on where you were, what kind of, like, financial supports the school had, what your parents believed. Like, you know, there's no reason to think, like, if you have a disability, you have it easy. That's a wild take.Lexi  05:11Yeah, I think you can... You're right. Like, it depends on where you are, that you can access different types of supports, but I think we're also moving towards a more inclusive education model in the old Canada, where you should be treating everybody... It's like, it's technically universal design for learning where everybody should benefit from like, you know, flexible due dates, and, like, more understanding progressive assessment practices, because, yeah, like if you do have a disability, and you need a little bit more support, that's great, but if you don't, you can still get support, too, and that's fine, too. Ben  05:49Yeah. Lexi  05:50But, ah, that's interesting. This is maybe a good, like, introduction, though, because as teenagers when we were watching, trying to learn how to be a teenager, you turn to movies to try to understand, like, how to fit in.Ben  06:05Right. So the question is, like, "Should we have ever even looked at those other groups and people and been like, 'I'm supposed to be that way?' Or was that something we were taught by John Hughes and his movies?"Lexi  06:18Oh, John Hughes. I'm so conflicted. Ben  06:21So we're here tonight, as you've certainly guessed, to talk about '80s teen movies. You know 'em. You love 'em. We are going to revisit our memories of those movies, talk about some things that don't really hold up, some things that do just fine, and some things that are problematic and it matters to dorks. Wow, that was rough. Lexi  06:47That was-- I won't lie about it. It wasn't your best.Ben  06:51No, let's hit the theme song and let's try again after. [Lexi laughs] [theme music "Dance" by YABRA plays] Ben  07:22Welcome to Dork Matters--Voiceover  07:24[echoing] Dork Matters.Ben  07:24--the show by and for dorks, made by dorks, in a tree of dorks. We're like little dork elves, Keebler elves that make you dork cookies.Lexi  07:34Oh, I like that. Ben  07:36Yeah.Lexi  07:36That's a nice little image.Ben  07:38Yeah. Lexi  07:39We grow on trees.Ben  07:40[chuckling] Yeah, or are we are inside of trees, baking tree.Lexi  07:44Yeah, 'cause we don't like the outside so much. Ben  07:46No, I'm not an outside person. [Lexi laughs] I am your Dad Dork host, Ben Rankel, and with me, as always is...Lexi  07:53Your Movie Buff Dork, Lexi Hunt.Ben  07:56Oh, wow. No alliteration at all. You're just flying--Lexi  07:59Nah, just gettin' right in there. You know what? Fuck it.Ben  08:03You are going to have to be the movie buff dork tonight. I have tried to bone up on our subject, and I'm like, "Good God, I need a week to prepare for this by rewatching every single teen movie from the '80s," because that's what we're here to talk about tonight, or today, or whenever you're listening to this. Time is a flat circle. [chuckles] We're here to talk about teen movies of the '80s.Lexi  08:26[sing-songy] I love this episode.Ben  08:30The good, the bad, the ugly, the ones that hold up really well, the ones that do not hold up. We're gonna just shoot the shit on teen movies 'cause that's what we do. Lexi  08:39Oh, yeah.Ben  08:40We're gonna get a bunch of shit wrong, as usual, and that's half the fun here.Lexi  08:44Can I start by saying, like, how many movies did John Hughes create? My god, that man was prolific. Ben  08:51Yeah. So it depends on if we wanna look at whether he directed it, or produced it, or whatever, but if we just go by Wikipedia filmography, let's count these out. 1, 2, 3, 4... (fast-forwarded counting) 38. 38 different films.Lexi  09:16And a lot of them, like, I didn't actually know that he did some of them. Some of them, of course, I was like, "I knew that one. That's a John Hughes," but, like, Maid in Manhattan? What?Ben  09:27Yeah. Flubber.Lexi  09:28He was part of Flubber.Ben  09:30He was part of Flubber. He produced Flubber. Yeah, all the Home Alone's, right up to Home Alone 4: Taking Back the House, that seminal classic. We watch it every year at Christmas. Not the earlier three Home Alone's, just Home Alone 4, the one everyone remembers.Lexi  09:47Yeah, the one that went straight to VHS release.Ben  09:50Yeah. I think, unfortunately, it was even DVD at that point. Just DVD. [Lexi groans]Lexi  09:55But then there's so many great ones too, that... Actually, I was talking to John about, you know, "What movies did you guys watch when you were growing up that we you would classify as a teen movie?" and he was more in the action side of the '80s and '90s movies, so he was like, "I can talk to you about The Rock. How do you feel about that?" But not so much... I think he said that they watched Breakfast Club in school, which I find incredible. Like, "Why did you watch that in school?!" Like, listening to it, there's so many messed-up things like Emilio Estevez talks about supergluing a guy's butt crack together. Like, "I know, and I'm going to show my grade nines today." [chuckles theatrically]Ben  10:38And that's one of the tamer things that happens in that film, like, that doesn't hold up. [Lexi laughs] I mean, we might as well get into it. Let's start with the seminal classic, The Breakfast Club with, you know, the greatest brat cast that you've ever seen. Everyone has seen this movie. We all know how it ends, that jumping fist pump in the air. [Simple Minds "Don't You (Forget About Me)" plays]Lexi  11:00You can hear the music right now, can't you?Ben  11:01[sings] Don't you forget about me.Lexi  11:03And I gotta say, best soundtrack. Ben  11:07[sings] Forget about you.Lexi  11:10[sings] Don't you... [speaks] I also like that like weird slide guitar. [sings descending glissando, imitating slide guitar] That's a great '80s sound right there.Ben  11:17[chuckling] I want you to do it again. [Lexi sings imitation along with slide guitar] Nice. Let's start a band.Lexi  11:23I can play the mouth trumpet. [laughs] And that's... Okay, that sounds really dirty, but it's actually like... [sings melody, buzzing lips] [laughs]Ben  11:29I can play the mouth harp, as well, as long as we're embarrassing ourselves. [Lexi laughs] [harmonica plays] That's right. I play harmonica, as if I couldn't get any loser-ier. That's a word.Lexi  11:37Hey, man, I played the clarinet in the old high-school band for many years. [clarinet plays basic melody] Ben  11:41I think I played clarinet at one point, too, in the band. Lexi  11:46It's a great instrument. So Breakfast Club, which is weird, because Sixteen Candles... Okay, let's let's go through--Ben  11:55I feel like Sixteen Candles is probably the greatest offender of any teen movie--Lexi  11:59Oh.Ben  11:59--we're gonna talk about.Lexi  12:00It's so bad. Yeah. Ben  12:03And, you know, everyone loves Breakfast Club. I feel like maybe Sixteen Candles is a little less watched, still. I mean, we can talk about 'em both, but let's turn to Breakfast Club, first. Let's talk about some of the fucked-up shit that you remember happening and see if it's all true. You guys let us know if we make up anything.Lexi  12:19I couldn't get over the fact that, first of all, I was like, "Who the hell has detention on the weekend?" Because that's more of a punishment to the teachers than anything. Like--Ben  12:29Yeah, that's not happening. Lexi  12:31And what parent would be like, "Yeah"? Parents would be like, "No, I'm not doing that." [laughs]Ben  12:37Yeah, "You wanna keep my kid half an hour after school, that's one thing."Lexi  12:42Like, "Go nuts." Ben  12:42But yeah, they're not coming in on a weekend." And what teacher wants to do that? Like, you're not getting paid for that. Is that extra-curricular at that point? [Lexi blows through lips]Lexi  12:50I think that there's just so many issues with detention as-- like, that's a whole other issue. But to, like, spend your weekend... I know they're trying to demonstrate that, like, the character of-- god, what is his name? The assistant principal who hauls everybody in. It just shows what a miserable git he is. But, eugh, to me, like, that, already, I was like, "This movie is just setting me up for"--Ben  13:15Principal Richard Vernon, who, like, already is a problem, because this guy just treats these children--Lexi  13:21He's so horrible.Ben  13:22--and they are children, just awful. Yeah, just like a way that he would have lost his job if it was nowadays. There's no way he keeps his job past that weekend. There's no way he keeps his job past, like, his first interaction with, I think, Emilio Estevez with the stupid devil horns and, like, [in devil voice] "the rest of your natural born..." That'd be on TikTok. In, like, five minutes, there'd be a whole crowd of people knocking down his doors. The school board trustees, they'd be like, "Nah, you don't have a job anymore."Lexi  13:46And, as well they should. Like, you can't... There's one part in the movie where Judd Nelson's character--Ben  13:53Bender.Lexi  13:54--is playing basketball in the gym, and he's like, "I'm thinking about going out for a scholarship," and that's such a great point that, like, he could have just been like, "Okay, let's play," and then like, look, you're building relationship and you're not being a complete d-bag. Then, like, get to know him! Just play basketball with him. It's, literally, a Saturday, and you're sitting in your office. You may as well.Ben  14:16Yeah. Instead, he yells at him, if I remember correctly, and tells him he's never going anywhere. Lexi  14:21Yeah, that he's a, you know, piece of trash. Just, you don't talk to people that way. It's terrible. So, it's so, just, offensive to... You should never treat anyone like that, and you should never, 100%, have teachers speaking to students that way. That's just unacceptable.Ben  14:38The movie is in the National Film Registry of the Library of Congress, for its culturally, historically, and aesthetically significant nature, so that's something that I didn't just read off of Wikipedia.Lexi  14:51I mean, it is a huge part of culture that, kind of, changed the way that we, you know, talk about things.Ben  14:57Do you remember where the movie's set?Lexi  15:00They're all kind of set in the same...Ben  15:03Middle America. Lexi  15:04Yeah, like a Michigan kind of place.Ben  15:08Michigan is what I would guess. I have no idea. I can't remember any more. It's a very white cast, as well, which is interesting.Lexi  15:15Oh, yeah.Ben  15:16Yeah, what are some other egregious issues that we have with that one?Lexi  15:19Well, I don't like the way that Claire, so Molly Ringwald's character, she is berated, harassed by Bender the entire movie. He's got his head between her legs at one point, because he's hiding, and, at the end of the movie, she, like, goes and makes out with him and they become, like, boyfriend and girlfriend because he's wearing her earring and, like, you don't reward, like, a guy that treats you like trash, a person that treats you like trash. They're not gonna change. [laughs]Ben  15:51Yeah. I, 100%, remember it seeming, sort of, weird that that was, like, his reward for having some sort of character redemption is that Molly Ringwald will date him. And that's supposed to be character growth for her, is that she's not so stuck up anymore, she'll date somebody who's... poor and abusive?Lexi  16:07I guess? Or that, like, she's pushing back against her parents or... Like, I didn't really care for that part as much. Ben  16:18Yeah. Lexi  16:18But then, like, then you've got Claire and Allison, at one point, doing, like, makeovers and Allison's the kind of the quiet one who's the artist and the freak who's-- she's choosing to be at the detention instead of being sent there, and so Claire gives her the makeover and, all of a sudden, she's She's All That-ed. She's pretty, and now Emilio Estevez's character, Andrew, is, like, into her. If it wasn't for a lame... Before, he didn't see her, but as soon as Molly Ringwald puts some makeup on her, and pulled her hair back, well, now Allison's a person. I just thought like, "Ugh, that sends the wrong message."Ben  16:55Yeah.Lexi  16:56But, as a teenager, you're like, "Oh, that's how I get the attention of a boy."Ben  17:01Yeah, "I've gotta conform to beauty standards that are set out for me." Yeah, it's not great. It doesn't hold up. It feels wrong nowadays. I mean, it's really difficult to watch and think anything positive of it anymore.Lexi  17:14[laughs] The soundtrack was good. Ben  17:16Yeah, the soundtrack was good. Lexi  17:17But then John and I are having a conversation about that, and he's like, "Yeah, but at the time, that's what was a successful movie, and so, how fair is it for us to judge something from the past by today's standards?" Like, "Well, it's a difficult one. Like--"Ben  17:33Absolutely. Lexi  17:34I think we have to.Ben  17:36I mean, yeah, and also, like, what does that really mean, the idea of fair? Like, I mean, it feels sort of like the wrong question to apply to, sort of, reexamining past media. Like, you don't get a pass just because it was from the past.Lexi  17:54Yeah, there you go.Ben  17:55And the whole point of looking at something from the future is to reanalyze it from the scope that we have now. Like, you can do that and still acknowledge that, at the time, that general awareness of these sorts of things wasn't what it is now, but that's not really the point, I guess, is what I'm getting at.Lexi  18:12I can understand the criticism of like, yeah, you know, it's a questionable movie, but at the time, it was very progressive. And even now, like, I'm sure there are some TV shows, movies, books, whatever, that we think are pretty progressive that, in the future, people have problems with, but that's the point. Like, if we're all staying the exact same, that's the issue. Could we not be able to move forward, and then look back and be like, "Eugh. I shouldn't have done that"? Let's have a conversation about it.Ben  18:37I think the world and where it existed, and when it was made, is not where we are now. Like, that's not really the point. So Breakfast Club, like, none of these movies are really going to hold up to every standard that we have nowadays.Lexi  18:47No, it's impossible.Ben  18:48The bigger question is like, "Can I still enjoy this media the same way?" And you can't, especially... I mean, I don't think this movie, you can really... Like, I can watch it. I could enjoy parts of it, I suppose, but I don't know. I don't know if I really even would try to rewatch this movie. It used to come on TBS a lot, so we didn't have much of a choice, but...Lexi  19:10Yeah, I think now I would fast forward through a lot of it. Ben  19:14Yeah, I can't see myself going back to rewatch this, unlike a movie like "Footloose", which I still think is a fun watch. Same era, same sort of idea. There's a lot going on in that movie, too that's kind of effed up. Like, I think the main character, whose name I cannot remember, but it's Kevin Bacon, he moves to the small town where dancing and music is outlawed, and the girl that he falls for, her dad's abusive, her boyfriend's abusive, but I think, at one point, her boyfriend actually just punches her, and I'm just like, "Why would even?" Like, [sighs] in that sense, they're not trying to glorify that behavior necessarily, but it's... Yeah, so that's the interesting thing. Maybe that's what you gotta look at is the depiction of the thing in the movie something thing that they're doing as a "We're not thinking critically about this because that's the era we're from," or are they presenting it in that era, but they're saying, "This isn't a thing that should be happening," and that's a tough one. I can't remember that movie well enough. But I still like the dancin'.Lexi  20:17You like the dancin' part of it, hey?Ben  20:19Yep. Kevin Bacon, finally, in 2013, I think, admitted that he had a dance double for parts of that, but he did a lot of the dancing himself, he said.Lexi  20:28Did we not know that? I thought that that was widely accepted.Ben  20:32I don't know. It was just a thing I remember reading a while back, but yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I feel like, that movie, I could rewatch again. I feel like it's worth going back for the dancing. I don't know what would bring me back to Breakfast Club, aside from the soundtrack, which I can just listen to on my own.Lexi  20:46Yeah, I would just listen to the s... Like, if it was on the TV.Ben  20:50I guess I like Emilio Estevez. I like Molly Ringwald. Like--Lexi  20:53Then watch "Mighty Ducks", Ben. Ben  20:55Yeah, and that's what I do. We're gonna have to do an episode on "The Mighty Ducks". I love "The Mighty Ducks: Game Changers" on Disney+. Lexi  21:02Oh, there you go. Yes. Ben  21:04Disney+ isn't sponsoring our show, but if they want to. [Lexi laughs] I like "Game Changers". It's a little weird. It's a little bit--Lexi  21:13I can't say that I've watched it, but, you know, I'll take a look-see.Ben  21:17Yeah. Oh, are we gonna do a "Dawson's Creek" episode or teen TV dramas of the 2000s? And those are-- a lot of those are trash but, like--Lexi  21:26Yes.Ben  21:26Yeah.Lexi  21:27I could talk about those, just "Smallville". Oh, my god. We need to talk about "Buffy". What are we doing, here?Ben  21:32That's an interesting one, like, 'cause, you know, 'cause you have to deal with the Joss Whedon. I call him Josh now. He lost his privilege at two "s"-es.Lexi  21:41You know, you strike an "s" off the name. Okay. We have to talk about Sixteen Candles, though, because it is the worst.Ben  21:50The worst. There is nothing--Lexi  21:53I think that a couple come close. Ben  21:55I could rewatch Breakfast Club, yeah. Like, I could re-watch Breakfast Club. There's a lot I don't like about it, and a lot that doesn't hold up, a lot of analysis of, sort of like, teen issues that doesn't really feel like it really got it, but I could rewatch it. I will not re-watch Sixteen Candles. I mean, give us a rundown. Give us the point-by-point. What's wrong with Sixteen Candles, aside from everything?Lexi  22:17If you've never watched Sixteen Candles before, don't. I will just run through it really quick. Basically, it's a party movie. Sam, play by Molly Ringwald, it's her birthday. It's her 16th birthday, but her entire family has basically forgotten, and she's really pissed off about the whole thing, so she's a real b-word all day at school. Meanwhile, she has this huge crush on this guy Jake Ryan who's, like, the quintessential hot dude of the school. Ben  22:42The perfect dude. Yeah.Lexi  22:44And, like, everyone of their little friend group is just like, "No, he's got such a hot girlfriend." They even show her showering naked in the girls' change room to really hammer home the fact that this lady is like a full-blown babe.Ben  22:59Wait. I do not remember this part of the movie. There's a naked scene of Molly Ringworld as a teenager?Lexi  23:06Yeah. Not Molly Ringwald. It was the girlfriend.Ben  23:08Oh, I'm sorry. I missed that. Lexi  23:10Molly Ringwald and her creepy friend... It's so creepy. They're leering and watching her shower because Molly Ringwald is comparing her chest to Jake Ryan's girlfriend to be like, "Oh, she's such a... She's a woman and I'm a girl. Why would he ever pay attention to me?" because boobs are the only thing that matter, apparently. Ben  23:10Mm.Lexi  23:30And then, meanwhile, so at the same time, Sam, Molly Ringwald, her grandparents come to her house, and they bring their foreign exchange student.Ben  23:41No. We can't even get into the foreign exchange student. It's so bad.Lexi  23:45It's so bad. I'm not even gonna. Like, you can go look it up. I'm not gonna say his name because it makes me feel uncomfortable, if I'm honest, but it's like a derogatory name that is just, like, it's just so offensive, and every time he's--Ben  23:58It's intended to mimic what white people make as sounds when they try to, you know, do Asian voices or language, and it's just a continuous shit show of racism.Lexi  24:12Oh, Ben, every time the character is on the screen, a gong sounds.Ben  24:15Yeah, I remember that part.Lexi  24:16Like, oh. [groans frustratedly] So then, Sam goes to the dance because she still has a thing for Jake, and she has to bring people with her, and now enter Michael C. Hall.Ben  24:17Oh, he's Ducky, right?Lexi  24:31And his creepy little character because... No, that's "Pretty In Pink". Come on. Jesus Christ, Lexi. Get your shit together.Ben  24:39Oh, god. I'm mixing up movies. Well, I'm sorry that all good John Hughes movies start to blend together after a while. [Lexi laughs] Sorry, I can't specify which Molly Ringwald film we're talking about. She wears the same thing in every movie, too.Lexi  24:51No. She... Ben  24:52She looks exactly the same.Lexi  24:53She... Well, yeah, that's good.Ben  24:54I'm pretty sure she's in a pink dress in every movie.Lexi  24:56Okay, I will accept that. Anthony Michael Hall's character is Ted, and they refer to him as "Farmer Ted" the entire movie, which I don't really understand why that's the thing.Ben  25:06Oh, he's the one that gets sent home with what's-her-face? Lexi  25:09Yes. Ben  25:10Right? When she's drunk, and he, basically...Lexi  25:11Yeah, right?Ben  25:13It's a date rape situation. How fun. Lexi  25:15Well, and first, like, he won't leave Sam alone at the dance. He keeps following her around, won't take no for an answer, and she basically has to barter with him to piss off by giving him her panties. So... And then he pretends that he like got them, however, and is cheered on by, like, a full bathroom full of dorks-- not our people-- but then this devolves into a party at Jake's house. Everybody kind of winds up at this Jake's house party, where Jake's girlfriend is drunk and kind of an asshole. He kicks them all out and gives Ted the keys to his car, and his passed-out girlfriend in the backseat, and long story short, he winds up making out with her when she comes to, eventually.Ben  25:59Yeah, I remember that.Lexi  26:00And, when she asks, "Did you take advantage of me?" and he said, "No,"  and she was like, "Cool." [laughs] Like, what?!Ben  26:08Wait. Don't they actually end up, like, doing it in that movie? And neither of them remember it, or am I thinking of another movie again?Lexi  26:15It could. You know what? Ben  26:16Remember that they, like--Lexi  26:17I haven't seen it in a while.Ben  26:18"I don't remember if we did it or not," and then they're both like, "Yeah, we did it," and it's like, that's supposed to be cool or something, and I'm like-- and, like, a virtuous moments where--Lexi  26:24That does sound about right. Ben  26:25Yeah, I remember throwing up. Like, I don't think that movie even sat well with me in the '90s when I was a teen, seeing it for the first time. I was like...Lexi  26:32[whispers] No.Ben  26:34"..eugh." Yeah,  Sixteen Candles is gross. What else? Is there anything else gross about  Sixteen Candles that we need to mention before we move on? Don't rewatch Sixteen Candles. It's no good.Lexi  26:42Don't. Well, it ends with Sam getting Jake and he gets her a birthday cake, and, you know, it's this beautiful moment between the two of them, but it's just like, she spent the entire movie comparing herself to other people, about how she was shit and not good enough for him, and he spends the entire movie pissed off at the world that he lives in because he's, like, this wealthy, white dude with a dumb girlfriend, and he's brutal to her. Like, he's really mean to his girlfriend, like, sends her off to be, like, you know, ravaged by some stranger.Ben  27:15Yeah. He sends her off to get raped. Lexi  27:17Yeah. And then it's like, "Okay, movie over." Ben  27:19Yeah, and I remember him also saying like, a bunch of really crass shit to her before, because she's drunk, and being like, "I could abuse you all I want if I wanted to. Yeah, it's super fucked-up and that's supposed to be a virtue for this guy--Lexi  27:31Yeah, he's the good one.Ben  27:32--that he looks down on her for being drunk.Lexi  27:34Oh.Ben  27:35Yeah. Fuckin' dumpster fire movie, and so this is why, like, people, you bring these up and they'll be like, "I fucking hate Ron Hughes." Yeah, Ron Hughes. I don't know who that is, but I hate him, too, just for sounding like John Hughes. [Lexi laughs] Fuck you, Ron.Lexi  27:50But, I think it's also like, the genre of, like, rom coms. Like, eugh. This is where it's kind of like stemmed from some of these teen movies . People think, "Like, this is maybe like the norm?" Like, "No, it isn't. This isn't good."Ben  28:04What's next on our on our shit shower?Lexi  28:07"Weird Science".Ben  28:09Are we doing "Pretty in Pink" at some point?Lexi  28:11"Pretty in Pink", technically, comes after "Weird Science". "Weird Science" was released in 1985.Ben  28:16Oh, we're doing these chronologically? Okay, my bad. Okay, "Weird Science" it is. So like, are we even gonna find teen... Like, John Hughes defined this era and defined what it meant to be a teen in this era, so I guess we may not get away from his movies. I mean, "Footloose" wasn't one of his, so that was good, but that's wild. It's basically just a John Hughes shit episode. Fuck you, John Hughes.Lexi  28:37But, no. I've got some redeeming ones.Ben  28:40And your brother, Ron. From John Hughes? I don't agree.Lexi  28:44I've got one. I got a couple that I'm gonna fight for, saying they're good.Ben  28:47What? Okay, you're gonna have to try real hard to make me like john Hughes in any capacity. "Weird Science", let's just get the premise out of the way. These two losers decide that they're going to robo-code their-- I'm just gonna use fake science words 'cause that's what they do in this movie-- they're gonna robo-code their digi-ideal woman and build her to be perfect and subservient to them. The whole premise is fucked up and weird and gross, and then, through the magic of--Lexi  29:11Yeah, the magic of science.Ben  29:12--science, I don't know, this woman comes true. She's there. Suddenly, they built her, and they can do anything they want with their new robo-girl or whatever. [Lexi sighs] Lexi  29:24And... [groans].Ben  29:25The only thing that's redeeming is a nice title song written by Oingo Boingo, the new-wave band from the '80s.Lexi  29:32Ah, Oingo Boingo. Yep. I know that it was this whole, you know, the dorks or the geeks strike back where like Revenge of the Nerds and that was also another popular problematic movie of the era, of just, like, dorks who aren't... You know, it's basically like  these, the nice guys, the incels.Ben  29:52Incels.Lexi  29:53They can't get-- no girls will pay attention to them 'cause they're not popular jocks. Wah, wah, wah. So what we're gonna do--Ben  29:59No, this is great. I like this line we're riding. I like this. This is, we are what's-his-face from It's Always Sunny.Lexi  30:07Dennis?Ben  30:08No. Not Dennis. We're not Dennis. Nobody's Dennis. Dennis is a sociopath. Lexi  30:11I was gonna say.Ben  30:12Ferris Bueller is Dennis. Lexi  30:13He's a serial killer. Ben  30:15Well, that's--Lexi  30:16Mac?Ben  30:16No, not Mac. Goddamn. Charlie.Lexi  30:18Charlie?Ben  30:19We're Charlie at the wall with the line, and we have just gone from John Hughes movies to the nice-guy phenomenon, and then straight on past that to the incel, the current incel disgusting thing that we have going on. Lexi  30:35Well, all of like...Ben  30:36It's all Ron and John Hughes' fault.Lexi  30:39Anthony Michael Hall basically played an incel [chuckling] for, like, his entire teenage youth--Ben  30:46God.Lexi  30:46--of the best friend who's just waiting around. "When's it gonna be his turn, gosh darn it?" because that's what it takes.Ben  30:52Yeah, and if I put in enough, you know, "nice coins" into the Woman Gashapon I will get the sex prize in the little ball. Lexi  31:00Exactly. Ben  31:01Yeah, I mean, fuck, as a white male, this is the kind of shit that I was taught, too. Like, I had some very strong, and I mean that as in of character, women, who... I mean, I could have been a very shitty person if I didn't have people that were better than me that helped me learn to be better. That should have been the responsibility but, like, "Thanks for being in my life to help me not end up like these fuckers." 'Cause I didn't get that from, like, my upbringing and, like, watching this kind of bullshit, or from, like, my religious upbringing. You definitely were taught that, like, the idea was that you put those wonderful little friendship points in, and eventually, you're gonna get what you want back out of it, which is not a relationship with another human being. It's vagina. Lexi  31:46Yeah, they just, the pure physical nature of it. But then, if we can move on to Pretty In Pink, which I think Ducky is the worst character for that, is the most blatant character for that. I mean, like, he's--Ben  32:01Oh, yeah. He's nice guy.Lexi  32:02[groans] He is so horrible, such a, like, you know, kickin' rocks and, "Aw, gee, when's it gonna be my time? Nobody loves you like I love you," like, gaslighting Molly Ringwald's character.Ben  32:15Unrequited love sort of thing is supposed to be, like, romantic, as opposed to creepy.Lexi  32:20Well, and speaking of creepy, then James Spader's creep-ass character is even worse because he's the king gaslighter of pretending to absolutely hate Molly Ringwald's character, Andie, but then, secretly is like trying to get with her and like, "Yeah, there it is. There's the douchebag," and I did know guys like that in high school that would pretend, "Oh, we don't talk when we're at school, but then I'll message you on MSN later tonight."Ben  32:48Yeah, I mean, this this is where I get ranty because this leads me into one of my hot topics and also not a sponsor of the show. [Lexi laughs] Wish they were. Do they still exist?Lexi  33:01Yeah, they do. There's one at Market Mall.Ben  33:04Yeah, you can get, like, records from them, and film. They're the only place that sell record players and film anymore. Lexi  33:09[laughing] Yep. Ben  33:10But this is one of, like, things that gets me kind of passionate is that, when this kind of subject comes up, men get mad at people pointing it out, white males specifically get mad at people pointing out that, like, this was sort of the culture that we were steeped in, what we were built to be like. I feel like men should be super fucking angry that this is what society tried to turn us into, did turn us into. Like, but instead, we double down on this shit. We get mad. We try to defend it. We try to defend that like "culture", but like, we should be fucking pissed all the time about what society, what our society, patriarchal and you know, colonial as it is, like, what it tried, and tries, and continues to try to turn white men into. Like, but dudes just don't get pissed at that. For some reason, they just can't. They can't find that, and it makes me mad on a daily basis. I see myself as, sort of like, this robot that was built by, you know, these fucking people to do this thing, and it makes me mad every day that I almost didn't have a fair shot at being like a normal-ish human being that could treat people with empathy and kindness because of this kind of media, of this kind of culture, this pervasiveness, and yeah, fuck it. It just gets me that other dudes, you know, aren't just constantly pissed off about this.Lexi  34:27Well, when you talk about, like, systemic racism, and lots of people are like, "There's no such thing ," which is bullshit--Ben  34:32Yes. [along with dancehall airhorn] B-b-b-bullshit. Sorry. I hadn't gotten one of those in in a few episodes.Lexi  34:36That's all good. We've gotta have one of those per episode. I feel like these, like, not necessarily these ones but movies like these, this is a part of it, of just like keeping everybody in their place, and telling everybody what role. "You sit on that chair over there. You wear that type of T-shirt." Like, this is-- and even like looking at the '90s movies, it's just as bad because now we have like--Ben  34:59Oh no. Yeah, definitely.Lexi  35:00It's just as bad, and even now, I was thinking like, "What are the current teen movies?" They're not that different, really.Ben  35:08I don't really know. Well, no, 'cause I guess it's still the same machine, and the same systemic system. [laughs] The same systemic system that's still turning this shit out. It hasn't-- like, the decision makers, the money and stuff, are all of a certain, I don't know, persuasion, ilk, build, and so that hasn't changed, so why would the content change? You know, there might be veneers put on things from people at certain parts of the process, but the assembly line is still largely the same and has the same intent. The blueprints haven't changed.Lexi  35:41You know--Ben  35:42Have I mixed my metaphor enough?Lexi  35:45You got a little... They're good. Ben  35:46Yeah. Lexi  35:47Like, just so thinking of the other podcast, "Art Intervention", there was one episode where I found out a lot of research about why the art industry, especially, like, art galleries, and museums, are so white, and one article I found was talking about, they're super white because those types of institutions, typically, they don't have a lot of government support. They don't have any, like, you know, public money coming in that's really keeping the lights on, so you really have to rely on the private sector for donations, and, unfortunately, a lot of the wealthy patrons for a lot of these big, big institutions are, largely, white patrons, and they don't wanna feel uncomfortable, and they don't wanna feel like--Ben  36:38No. It always comes with strings.Lexi  36:40It's always coming with strings, and so they don't want you to be bringing in an artist who is calling out the white patriarchy of the art society. They want someone who's gonna like, you know, ruffle a little feathers, but not be too, you know, radical, and so it's creating this industry that is perpetually keeping people in their place and keeping the dialogue moving along, and I think, like, some institutions are getting a little bit better, but it is a huge problem in the arts, and a lot of times people are like, "Oh, but the arts are... You know there's so many black actors that are very famous," and there's'--Ben  37:19What does that even mean? Lexi  37:21Exactly. Like, it's still an industry and it still has a lot of problems, and I think we're just scratching the surface on the whole like #MeToo" Harvey Weinstein thing, and even the fact that, like, #MeToo was appropriated from a black woman who had been talking about it for years, and all it took was, like, a couple white actresses to be like, "Yeah, I've had similar experiences," and pfff, it blows up. Ben  37:44Yeah. What was that shitty joke, where, like, the white dude is like, "Oh, if I was in charge of equality, you know, we wouldn't need feminism anymore," or something. Or like, "If I was in charge of feminism, we'd all have equality by now," something like that.Lexi  38:03That's a great joke.Ben  38:04The idea is that the joke is in the idea of this guy saying that he could fix a problem that he is the creator of, or part of the system. [Lexi laughs] There's the joke. You're supposed to laugh at the premise of the guy.Lexi  38:17It's so sad, though. Like, "Yeah. There it is."Ben  38:21[Lexi laughs] Speaking of sociopathic white males, let's hit Ferris Bueller. [along with dancehall airhorn] B-B-B-Bueller. Lexi  38:28[along with Yello's song, "Oh Yeah"] Oh, yeah. Bom-bom. Chik-a-chik-a!Ben  38:31I mean... [along with Yello's song, "Oh Yeah"] Oh yeah. Bom-bom. So that basically--Lexi  38:36[along with Yello's song, "Oh Yeah"] Bom. Oh.Ben  38:38That's enough right there. Really, like Ferris Bueller is a sociopath. He manipulates everyone. He can't empathize with other people's feelings. He manipulates his friends into doing things because he thinks it's for their own good. Like, he gets to decide what's best for Cameron. He gets to decide how Cameron deals with his emotionally-abusive parents or like, "Oh, steal the car." Eugh, but, like, Ferris Bueller is just a smug piece of shit, and, you know, Matthew Broderick, I like you enough, but you're much better in Godzilla 2000. [Yello song "Oh Yeah" continues]Lexi  39:06I think the real hero of that movie is Jennifer Grey's character, Jeanie Bueller. Jeanie is the true-- 'cause she's the only one that sees him other than Ed Rooney, Jeffrey Jones. She's the only one that sees him for his bullshit, but she sees it, more or less, like a sister just wanting to rub her brother's face and like, "You're not all that. How about that, kid?" Like, it's more she just wants to prove him wrong, not ruin his life, like Ed Rooney, but she's trying so hard the entire movie to get people to, like, see through his bullshit, and I always felt really bad for her because I was like, "Yeah, he shouldn't be doing all those things." [Yello song "Oh Yeah" continues]Ben  39:49Yeah, he's a terrible character. Yeah, that movie. You know, you've got Ben Stein in there as well, and he hasn't held out well. He's aged poorly, as far as he--Lexi  39:51Has he?Ben  39:52His movies are pretty, pretty shitty. He's a pretty smug asshole most of the time and very-- [Lexi sighs]Lexi  40:11Well, I mean, same with Jeffrey Jones, hey? [Yello song "Oh Yeah" continues]Ben  40:14Oh yes, I know what happened to him. We don't need to discuss that. That's just such a--Lexi  40:17 Yeah, that's--Ben  40:18A disgusting human being, so we're better off--Lexi  40:20There's a couple, like, Charlie Sheen, like that's--Ben  40:23Who, Charlie Sheen was in that?Lexi  40:25Yeah, he's the creepy dude that's hitting on Jeanie in the police station when he's like, "Why do you care so much about what your brother does?"Ben  40:32Oh man, now I remember that.Lexi  40:33He's the one that kind of like helps her, right?Ben  40:35Yeah, yeah. [Yello song "Oh Yeah" continues]Lexi  40:40Controversy comes from us all, Ben.Ben  40:41"Just be more like Charlie Sheen," is a thing that nobody should say. [laughs]Lexi  40:44No. Be more like Jennifer Grey is what I think.Ben  40:49Like, the actor or the character?Lexi  40:53Eh, the character in this one.Ben  40:53I don't know anything about the actor.Lexi  40:56Neither do I. I hope that she's not... I hope that no one is, like, actually.Ben  41:01Do we have anything that can bring us back? Like, we need some redeemable teen movies. I had a little bit of being like Footloose could be fun still. Are there ones we can watch? I've got one more that I sort of like.Lexi  41:11Oh, I've got one I love. Ben  41:12I'll do mine. You're more passionate. I'll do mine first. It's called... [laughing] Oh, god now I'm blanking on the name. Lexi  41:20Uh-oh. [laughs]Ben  41:21It's with Christian Slater, and he is a, like, pirate radio host. Pump Up the Volume. Lexi  41:28Okay.Ben  41:28So, there's some stuff that doesn't do it for me, which is sort of that, like, white suburban kid ennui that you see in, like, the '90s. It's technically a 1990 movie, but it was produced... That's when it was released, so it was produced in the '80s. So it's got a lot of that, sort of like, white teen ennui that we see in the '90s a lot with, like, the navel gazing and, like, "Let's just, you know, not worry about anything except our white privilege problems." So there's a little bit of that, but there's also a lot of like, sort of challenging the way that kids' problems are sort of downplayed by adults, or like, they're tried to be brushed aside when, like, you know, kids are actually suffering with problems. One of the things is a student kills himself and, like, that's sort of an impetus for the main characters to sort of go on and speak out about what's happening and tell the other students not to be quiet and to, like, live their, like... "Talk hard," is his line in the movie. Talk hard and, like, say the things that are a problem for you, and not hold them back, so I feel like I could rewatch that one again. I feel like it probably is watchable. He gets arrested at the end for his pirate radio, which is just such a great idea, a pirate radio, broadcasting illegally on the FM channel. Fuck, can you do that? I wanna broadcast illegally on an FM channel.Lexi  42:52I think it is something that's elite. Like, you have to be allowed to do it.Ben  42:56Yeah, I mean, I just don't even know anybody who'd be interested. Why do that when you can make a podcast? [both laugh] Yeah, I guess, you know, somebody would still have to tune to your pirate radio frequency, so... [chuckles]Lexi  43:11They'd find you.Ben  43:12Yeah. So the villain of the movie or whatever, is like the FCC comes to find Christian Slater's character and shut down his pirate radio.Lexi  43:21The FCC won't let him be.Ben  43:23Yeah, the FCC won't let him be. [laughs] Lexi  43:26Thank you. Thank you for that.Ben  43:27You're welcome. Thank you. I don't know what you're thinking me. You did it. That's great.Lexi  43:31I always like a good laugh, Ben. You know? Ben  43:33Yeah. I think yeah, give Pump Up the Volume a watch if you haven't. I haven't watched it in a while. I should re-watch it, but let us know if I'm wrong about that, and if it's a total trash fire, as well.Lexi  43:44I'm going to end this with a bang, Ben, because I'm gonna explain to you the greatest coming-of-age movie of the John Hughes-era is Uncle Buck.Ben  43:48Okay, so here's my thing with Uncle Buck. Is it a teen movie, though? Lexi  43:58Yes.Ben  43:59You think?Lexi  44:00I think so. I watched it all-- I watched it with my mom, and then I watched it with my friends when I was, like, 15, and I've watched it many times since because, I don't know. It was about, like, to me, it was about connecting with an adult in your life.Ben  44:16That's interesting. I appreciate that take. I guess I just find, like, the centering of John Candy as the main role in that, sort of, takes it away from being a teen movie for me.Lexi  44:24But that's why I think it's key because teenagers are so stuck in their own bubble, that it's hard to see your angst when you're living in it, and I think that was the reason my mom made me watch it.Ben  44:35Oh, interesting. So you were saying, like, the point-of-view character being the adult but having the show and the content geared at a teen gives you some outside of your own situation-ness, some self-awareness.Lexi  44:47Yeah.Lexi  44:48'Cause, see, like his... Oh, gosh, the... bup, bup, bup... Tia, so Tia is 15 and she's the oldest of the three kids and she's like, if you've never seen the movie, she's a cow. Like, the entire movie, she's just being an asshole for no purpose.Ben  44:48Interesting.Ben  45:06No, I've seen it a number of times.Lexi  45:09I watch it every Christmas. That is my Home Alone. Ben  45:11It's been a while, though.Lexi  45:13And it's just because she's so brutal, and then John Candy's character comes in and, you know, she's got a couple of lines that she says that are just horrible, so, so mean and callous, and then, she treats her family like garbage. She winds up shacking up with a dude who's trying to take advantage of her, and I think that this is really key, and a lot of people should watch it that if you are a 15, 16, 17 year old, and you are dating someone who is older than you, it is not an equal relationship. I'm sorry. It just isn't. And that's something that, like, when I was a teenager, I was like, "I can take care of myself," and so many times, like, yeah, to a point and then you pass a line, and then it gets real tricky, and what I like about that is, even though she treated people poorly, like, John Candy came to her rescue and supported her, and helped her to take her power back from this douchebag who tried to hurt her.Ben  46:12Right. So, in a typical John Hughes movie, we'd see her get a come-uppance of some sort of degradation or sexual assault as, sort of, the character arc. Like, "Oh, that'll teach you to be a b-word, though. You got what was coming to you. Haha." But that doesn't happen in this film. Interesting.Lexi  46:29Well, it kinda... Like, it almost does. Like, her boyfriend tries to pressure her into having sex. She's not ready so she leaves the party, and he does, like, make fun of her, and then, John Candy comes and finds her walking away from the party and, you know, she's embarrassed and whatever, and then he basically kidnaps the boyfriend in the back of the car, and then they hit golf balls at him to really, like... [laughs]Ben  46:53Sounds good to me. I'm fine with that.Lexi  46:56I don't know. Like, it's still you're right. Like, she's still like, there's that, like, "Haha, you were almost, like, you know, taken advantage of."Ben  47:02"That will show you."Lexi  47:02"That's what you get for being a little bag," but I just feel like, of those movies, this is probably the one that has, like, aged the best because even John Candy's character is so flawed. Ben  47:15Yeah, yeah.Lexi  47:16And it shows, like, all these redeeming qualities about him.Ben  47:18Yeah. I mean, that sounds like a good synopsis to me. I'd rewatch that. I'll give it a shot. And you all should give that a shot too, see what you think, see if there's some aspects of that film that we forgot that maybe cause it to bump off a little bit, although it sounds like Lexi watches it pretty regularly, so she knows what's up.Lexi  47:38I'm gonna be really sad if someone out there is like, "But, did you forget about the scene?" Because probably.Ben  47:43Maybe, but you know, that's just an opportunity. Yeah, this is an opportunity to appreciate what happened there, and, you know, that doesn't mean you have to stop watching Uncle Buck. It just means we have to somehow create a 15-minute episode addendum to this that people are forced to listen to that, "Okay, so there's this part in the movie and we have to talk about it where things go blah blah, blah." Yeah, I have to imagine that we'll end up doing a lot of retraction or correction episodes. Maybe that should be just a fun off-week thing we do. We do, you know, corrections and just 15-minute episodes every other week when we're not on our regular schedule. "So here's some shit we got wrong last week," and we just list it.Lexi  48:27Yeah. Just, "Sorry about this. Sorry about the following things."Ben  48:30"Said this. Didn't mean to."Lexi  48:32Ben, we haven't done Who's That Pokémon? yet.Ben  48:35Oh, fuck. Let's do Who's That  Pokémon? here. I think we've got another little ways to go. We should do a wrap up, but let's do a Who's That  Pokémon? Is it your turn again to come up with the Pokémon?Lexi  48:46Well, I've done many. I'm happy to keep explaining wet bags of sand to you, but do you wanna take a crack at Who's That  Pokémon?Ben  48:52I didn't come up with one, so it'll be on the fly. Yeah.Lexi  48:54Oh, do it.Ben  48:54I'll do it unless you have one prepared. Lexi  48:56No, no, no. Ben  48:57Okay. Okay, [along with "Who's That Pokémon" theme music] Who's that Pokémon? and I will describe now the Pokémon with which you need to guess. Lexi  49:06Excellent. Ben  49:07It's sort of like a pitcher.Lexi  49:09Okay.Ben  49:11Imagine an upside-down... No, right-way-up, like a pitcher as in, like, a vase. Not a--Lexi  49:18Okay, like, like a pitcher of lemonade. Ben  49:20Yeah, yeah, yeah. Then there's, like, some sort of leaves coming off, leaf-shaped protrusions, one on each side of this pitcher.Lexi  49:30Oh, my god.Ben  49:30And then there's also some sort of circular balls atop the pitcher.Lexi  49:35Are you explaining an actual Pokémon to me or is this like a...?Ben  49:38Yeah, yeah.Lexi  49:39It's an actual Pokémon! Oh, I thought we were being cheeky here and--Ben  49:43No. It's time for us to break out our--Lexi  49:45Anthony Michael Hall. [Ben laughs]Ben  49:47Oh shit. That's not bad. Lexi  49:48Oh, I gotta remember.Ben  49:49I'll change it. It's no longer Victreebel. It's Anthony Michael Hall. You got it. [Lexi laughs] [along with "Who's That Pokémon" theme music] Who's that Pokémon? [Lexi laughs]Lexi  49:59It's Anthony Michael Hall. Ben  50:00I'm gonna Google you a picture. [scratching record, DJ-style]Lexi  50:03Oh, Victreebel. Ben  50:04Yes. It was a real Pokémon.Lexi  50:05Damn it.Ben  50:06I think if I ever do them, they'll probably be real Pokémon.Lexi  50:09We still have to do a Pokémon episode.Ben  50:11It'd be interesting to talk to Mr. Hall and ask him how he feels about his part in the rise of incels.Lexi  50:18I'm sure he probably doesn't see it that way. [laughs]Ben  50:21I don't think many people do, as a child actor. I'm sure there's a lot more going on. I am being glib for the sake of humor.Lexi  50:27Hey, Ben, he had a redeeming role in Edward Scissorhands, where he dies.Ben  50:31He had a lot of good TV roles.Lexi  50:34Yeah, he has. He's had a very big career.Ben  50:37Mm-hmm. This is now the Anthony Michael Hall podcast, where we just talk about--Lexi  50:42Dissect him.Ben  50:43--the different works of Anthony Mic-- Michael Hall. I can't say his name anymore. It's lost all meaning.Lexi  50:50AMH.Ben  50:51AMH. He's been active as an actor since 1977. Is that something you knew? Lexi  50:56Wow. No, That's, that's...Ben  50:58He's 53 years old. He was born in 1968, April 14th, in West Roxbury, Massachusetts. Can we stop and talk about Massachusetts for a second? And how difficult a fucking place that is to say?Lexi  51:10Yes. I have such a hard time with it, I'd rather just be like, "That place," or write it down and point to it because I feel like I can't say it appropriately.Ben  51:17Yeah, and I'm not gonna make fun of the name 'cause I don't know its origins, etymology or anything, and I don't want to step on something, but, like, just saying, "Mass-a-chu-setts", like I've always said, "Massachusiss", or whatever, as a kid. I've always said it wrong, and then I was in New York, and I said, "Massachusiss", and somebody said, "What the fuck is wrong with you?"Lexi  51:35"Mass-a-chu--"Ben  51:35"Mass-a-chu-setts". Lexi  51:37"Mass-a-chu-setts". Ben  51:38Okay, yeah. It sounds wrong. Just say it-- okay, everybody at home listening, say "Mass-a-chu-setts"  about five times, maybe 10 times in a row, and see if you still like yourself.Lexi  51:49That's a tough homework assignment. [chuckles]Ben  51:52Yeah, enjoy. What else do we need to know about M-- Michael Anthony Hall? That's it. I'm good. Let's move on. [along with "Who's That Pokémon" theme music] Who's that Pokémon? We're back. We're back into the regular show, no longer the--Lexi  52:07AMH.Ben  52:08Anthony Michael Hall hour, the AMH hour. Is there anything else we should hit here on the way out? Lexi  52:15I mean--Ben  52:15Like, he produced or something Beethoven, so that's interesting.Lexi  52:18He also did Home Alone, which is a beloved movie.Ben  52:22Produced, yeah. He didn't--Lexi  52:23Oh, I thought... Okay.Ben  52:24But still.Lexi  52:25That's good to know.Ben  52:25He produced Miracle on 34th Street, which, you know, I've always enjoyed.Lexi  52:29He did Mall Rats, which again, like, is a very big movie [Ben groans] that I think a lot of people are like, "That's a cultural icon," but, like, it's also a very, like...Ben  52:39It is. Yeah, it's not a good flick. It does not hold up, and it is one of those ones that, like, yeah, as a rite of passage as a 14 year old, at least around our neck of the woods, you definitely watched, and thought was the greatest thing that ever happened. "Oh, shit pretzels." [Lexi groans] "Ha, ha, ha, ha. In the back of a Volkswagen." Lexi  52:59It's just...Ben  53:00Yeah.Lexi  53:00I feel like it's a really weird mix of, like, heartwarming children's movies and then, like, really problematic teen raunchy comedies.Ben  53:10Yeah.Lexi  53:10Like, well, it's an interesting mix you got there, pal. Ben  53:13Yeah. It's a wild time at Ridgemont High, which is movie I would have-- we should have talked about, but we didn't get to. That's fine, and I don't really remember enough about it except one of the Penn is in it. I think it's Sean Penn who was problematic, as well.Lexi  53:28Yeah. It's Sean Penn. Yeah.Ben  53:30Yeah, yeah.Lexi  53:31Oof. There's... We could... There's a lot of other very problematic teen movies. I mean, like, we've got the whole '90s to stare down. Ben  53:40Yeah.Lexi  53:41She's All That.Ben  53:42I mean, you know, those are movies that I definitely... Can't Hardly Wait. Lexi  53:46[groaning] Oh, I used to love that movie. Ben  53:50Of course you did. We all thought it was great. Lexi  53:51And I watched it recently. Oh, god.Ben  53:54No, I know. There's not a single aspect of that movie that I think holds up.Lexi  53:58Oh, you mean Seth Green's character isn't a redeeming figure throughout history?Ben  54:03It is an absolute travesty that that was allowed to become a thing. Lexi  54:08[whispers] Oh, my gosh.Ben  54:09That... yeah. The racism in that character alone in that, like, sort of characterization that we saw a lot of in the '90s and early 2000s is just wild. Lexi  54:19[softly] I know.Ben  54:19Just wild that that stuff had no critical second thought. Like, I know, we talk about, like, history and culture as these eras, and, like, we didn't have this sort of cultural awareness of these things at the time and, like, it's true, but also like, "So fucking what?" Like, that doesn't--Lexi  54:36Doesn't make it okay.Ben  54:37I just can't see that as an excuse. Yeah. Can't see it as an excuse.Lexi  54:43"Can't Hardly Use it As An Excuse?Ben  54:45[laughs] Yeah, Can't Hardly Wait to use it as an excuse. Like, I just can't use that as a way to be like, "Ah, I can still watch this film and not think of it critically," which I guess nobody's really asking anyone to do. Lexi  54:55But then it, like--Ben  54:56Problematic media is a whole other topic.Lexi  54:58It is, because it does beg the question of, "Do we look at the art versus the artist?" because then, like, we're leading into that era, and even, like, there's a little controversy this week with the old Margaret Atwood and her comments. Ben  55:11Oh, God. Lexi  55:13And I'm not gonna say that "I told you so, world," but I did say that Margaret Atwood isn't a great... I mean...Ben  55:20Well, I mean, she started to swing problematic for a while now. But like, this is also the advent of, sort of like, internet as well, is like, we did not have the information earlier on to know her thoughts on subjects that, you know, were outside of what she'd write about in her books, and maybe more intelligent people than myself picked up more of, like, her problems. I read her books, the ones that I enjoyed, which were like the MaddAddam trilogy, when I was in my early 20s. I don't consider that I was even like a proper adult human with critical thought until I was 25, so like, I still miss stuff all the time, and yeah, that's interesting. Margaret Atwood though. Way to hold my beer, JK Rowling. Jesus.Lexi  56:03Yeah, I did make a couple jokes of like, "Oh, she's really J.K.-ing herself this week." Like, just, if anyone has ever... Like, here's my piece of advice. Just stop. Just don't. Just don't. Like, and, a lot of times, don't weigh in. This is not a place for, "Oh, you know what I think about this?" Nothing. You think nothing about it. Shut up.Ben  56:23Oh, no, trust me that's a lesson I learned as a white dude on the internet that's like, more or less cishet, like, you know, maybe I don't need to offer an opinion on this. There's gonna be a lot of other takes, and I could probably do the most for myself by just reading how this goes out, and if I have questions about things, do some fucking Googling and try to understand these points that I'm having trouble with, and...Lexi  56:48Well, this has been a depressing and sad episode about our failed teenage years of just disappointing racism and sexism. [laughs]Ben  56:58Yeah. Well, you know, and again, this goes back to my really good analogy about, like, conveyor belts and machines or whatever. Like, we haven't fixed the problems with the blueprints and the machinery that's making this shit, so why would we expect it to be different? A different outcome just because, now we're aware that, you know, the shit shouldn't be happening, but apparently, we haven't taken the right action yet to correct where that's coming from, and so that stuff still comes.Lexi  57:29Well, maybe in another couple of decades we'll look at it a little closer. Ben  57:33We'll see. We'll see.Lexi  57:34The rom coms of the future are gonna be more uplifting and diverse and positive.Ben  57:38Okay, well, rom coms are a whole 'nother thing we need to get into 'cause Nora Ephron.Lexi  57:42Teenage.Ben  57:44Nora Ephron, I'm coming for you.Lexi  57:46I don't even wanna talk about rom coms because I don't think that I could say anything other than, "Bleuch."Ben  57:51We broached the subject. I mean, we kind of came into the teen movies thing with the intention of having some positivity to balance it out, [Lexi laughs] but it's hard when you have about 15 to 20 years, dominated by one figure, who has a way of looking at the world that's pretty shitty, and made all the, like, pop culture in that time.Lexi  58:10This is why you need a diverse group of people making content so that you have a wider array of things to look at to form your identity, because, when you're growing up, and the only teen flicks that are out the

Post Purchase PRO - Profitable Email Marketing For Amazon Sellers
Post Purchase PRO Podcast - Episode Eighteen - How to get your existing Amazon customers to pay for your sponsored ads

Post Purchase PRO - Profitable Email Marketing For Amazon Sellers

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 25, 2021 12:35


This is the post purchase Pro podcast, Episode 18, How to Get Your Existing Amazon Customers to Pay for Your Sponsored Ads.Get your existing Amazon customers to pay for your sponsored Ads. It's like walking into a casino and playing on the houses money. Every time, you cannot lose.Hey, welcome to the episode, guys.We're talking today about making your existing customers more valuable. And it's much, much easier than going out and finding fresh new customers every single month.And a lot of us are using PPC or sponsored ads on Amazon. And we use that to drive more traffic to our Amazon listings, and create sales. Well, that's great.It's a good start, Seth, but when you can make those customers on Amazon, more valuable through additional sales, and follow up sales, and then re-allocate those profits back into PPC. It's literally like, getting your existing Amazon customers to pay for your sponsored ads. It's like walking into a casino and playing on the houses money. Every time You cannot lose.1:11Yeah, Sean. So I think I'll try to break it down a little bit for everyone in terms of how we think about this in our business. So, like, let's say that we created a sale on Amazon, and we've made $5 in profit.1:23Now, out of that $5 in profit, you had to spin some of it on PPC to acquire that customer. It doesn't really matter what it is, but you had to spend some of it to get the exposure if you're not organically ranked for that sale, right?1:36So let's think about this, Let's just say that you made $5. Now, if you call it quits there, the most you're ever gonna make is $5. You could spend all of that on ads pretty easily on Amazon. And now you have made a sale, but you didn't have any profit. But let's imagine this scenario.1:51Let's imagine that you re-engage your customer after the purchase from you one time, and you sell them three additional units over the next 90 days.2:00Now, instead of just making one sale at $5 profit, you have a total of $20 total profit that you can spend out of to acquire that customer.2:09So it's like, literally what you said, John, having your customer pay for your sponsored ads, because you can take that additional profit that we made by generating those extra sales to buy more ads. And you can choose how much of that profit you want to keep.2:24You don't have to keep the whole $15 extra profit. Because if you made those three extra sales, you can literally keep some of it and then redeploy the rest of it to drive more sales, more ranking that way. You can capture more customer e-mails and phone numbers and re-engage even more customers. And it kind of creates this virtuous cycle, right.2:46Exactly, Seth.2:47and you know, since the beginning of time, from the very first business that was established and used any type of paid marketing to attract new customers, the one who could spend the most amount of money to attract a new customer always wins the long game, right? And sometimes, we forget about that because Amazon willingly sends us traffic to our listings.3:09But if we re-allocate those profits on paid marketing, then it's like that self reinforcing virtuous cycle that you like to explain sometimes?3:20Yeah, exactly.3:21So in Amazon it's kinda like a supercharged reinforced cycle because they give you additional ranking for more sales. So it's like you get them you get a sale and you get a new customer, which in our world that means that we capture the e-mail and the phone number so we can remarket to them after the fact.3:38And what does that do? Well? Because we have their information we're able to reach out to the them again and create more sales with that exact same customer. It makes sense, right? So that m

Career Design Podcast
Ep. 36: The Future is Fluid

Career Design Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 8, 2021 34:34


 Episode 36- The Future is Fluid Lindsay Mustain00:00I'm Lindsay Mustain and this is the Career Design Podcast made for driven ambitious square pegs and round holes type professionals who see things differently and challenge the status quo. We obliterate obstacles and unlock hidden pathways to overcome and succeed where others have not stagnation feels like death. And we are unwilling to compromise our integrity and settle for being average in any way. We are the backbone of any successful business and those who overlook our potential are doomed to a slow demise. We do work that truly matters aligns with our purpose, and in turn, we make our lasting mark on the world. We are the dreamers, doers, legends, and visionaries who are called to make our most meaningful contribution and love what we do.  Lindsay Mustain00:42I cannot be more excited about this podcast, I've been trying to book it with you for weeks now, I think and so I had a few challenges like COVID getting in the way and you coming back from a beautiful talk. So I want to introduce you to Don Mamone, who is one of the most beautiful human beings that I know. And we're gonna talk about the future is fluid. So I want to just start here and say, This is not my expertise. However, as somebody who loves you, and wants to support you, I'm gonna say the wrong things. And I'm gonna be your student here. So I want you to just introduce me to the idea like, Who are you today? Like, who are you? And then like, let's walk through what is the future is fluid actually mean? Don  01:25100%. So thank you for having me, Lindsay. You know, I'm one of your biggest fans, and I'm super excited to this podcast. Thank you for acknowledging that you don't know everything all the time about specifically this topic. I hold you in such high regard and I know that your audience is going to be voraciously listening to you and by extension me. So thank you for having me here. You know, I am a hospitality veteran or survivor, however, you want to look at it. I'm a photographer, I'm an artist, I'm also an individual that's living happily outside the gender binary. I identify as they/ them. And that is a lifelong journey that I waited 40 years to unearth, unleash, acknowledge and own. And that's where I'm at, at this very moment. And I think that's one of the main reasons why we're here today is to talk a little bit about what it looks like to live outside the gender binary and/or what it's like to be transgender versus cisgender space. And so I'm excited to have a great chat, and inspire and educate and create an implementation in the world, right? To make sure that people start understanding what this is and what it means.  Lindsay Mustain02:35Okay, I love this so much. And I, when I say I'm a student, I've used the wrong pronouns already here today. And when I say that, it's, it's, you know, Dom is very, very kind about saying, it's not that like, it's not gonna offend me personally, it's that we're working towards progression. And so with that idea, because I didn't know you, and we use different pronouns that that's been actually offered to me on my podcast, and I'm so glad that this is the time that we're doing it because this message is so potent and powerful. So you just got back from Vegas about talking about the same topic, correct?  Don  03:07Yeah. So it's a really funny anecdote, and I'm going to tell it, so I, I finally acknowledged this about my gender identity. So I'm 45 years old, 45 years young. And I waited 40 years before I told a single individual on the planet about this internal feeling. It was my wife who was the first person I ever told. And I told her about five years ago, and it is something that I knew from childhood just wasn't willing to admit. And as I was going through this leadership program, and I acknowledged it, and I unearthed it, unleashed it, and started to really become comfortable with living truth and a reality that is valid and exists they reached out to this organization, which is the National Association for Event Professionals reached out and said, Hey, you submitted in 2020 to speak, we would love to have you submit again, for 2021, since we had to cancel for COVID. Do you want to speak? And it was literally at the exact moment, I was going through this realization. And I said, I do want to speak but I want to change my topic. Is that okay? Sure. Absolutely. Here's the form, submit your talk. I literally within 45 minutes created the talk that I wanted to give about gender inclusivity and diversity, have the needle what it means and they accepted it, and I gave that talk the first week of August, and it was literally the definition and Lindsay, I know you're spiritual and you believe things happen for a reason and there are no accidents. It literally happened in a container of time, where if it happened at any other time, if it had happened just before, I probably would not have been ready. If it happened just after I might have thought I'm too busy. I've got too much going on. It was literally perfect. And it was the most beautiful moment. It was so much fun.  Lindsay Mustain04:47Getting to see the pictures from it, I can see I could feel the emotion in those images of you connecting to the audience though. I even have goosebumps right now. Like I'm just so so honored for you to share this journey because it's incredibly personal, but what I think we, you know, I talk a lot about this industry and particularly with, inside the career space, that's what I'm really working in occupational. What I'm really about is like, I'm a part of human resources, but somehow we forgot about the human. And we've just been overworking on treating people like numbers, like numbers on spreadsheets, and how do we almost put them in containers. And then I call them jobs description, like cages, and we forget about the actual humanity of individual people. So I do see like, that's one thing where everything about human resources we put like legal officers, and everything is about risk mitigation from our own people and then I see this other side work still awakening really happening in the world, and in communities where we see DNI like diversity and inclusion. And I always want to say diversity inclusion is not any one thing. Like I think that's a really, really big misnomer. When I talk about diversity, I am talking about diversity in thought, I'm talking about diversity in gender, and talking about diversity in background. I am not looking at some of these, you know, disability status as a number of diversity, diversity looks very different when we look at an individual level. So when we talk about creating like this inclusive culture, and I'm from Seattle, I mean, I am one of the most liberal and embracing cities that is in the world, I'm so very thankful for that. But I also see these really antiquated structures, and we've created like male and feminine. And that's like the only two options for people to exist in organizations. So the duality, which is really all of us has both of these insides of us. And giving a place for people to be safe and to be authentically them at work is a way for them to tap into their true power. So let's talk about like, what gender is? Because I feel like this one, I want to listen to you what it is, what is it isn't? How do we experience it? Tell me about that. Don  06:44So, first of all, again, thank you. I mean, genuinely, because I live in a world where I try to help career-driven professionals and entrepreneurs alike, understand and acknowledge that when unique starts with you, right? Why oh, you, you can basically bring your whole and authentic self, your genuine self to everything you do, whether you're a cog in a really wonderful important machine, or whether you're the machine in and of itself. Okay. And so, first thing, right, some undeniable truths, okay, the first thing is, gender identity is real and valid, and all of them should be represented. And when I say all of them, gender identity is as unique as the individual. So there are eight billion people on this planet, an undeniable truth that I want everybody to acknowledge is everybody's gender identity is unique. That means that there are 8 billion gender identities. Lindsay Mustain07:35Oh, okay. So we can't put people into two boxes is what you're telling me. Don  07:39Not only can we not put them into two boxes, but we can also even put them into a million boxes, because basically, what I'm telling you is each individual is comprised of four things, okay? That makes up their gender. Okay? The four things that make up your gender or your gender identity, right, which is what your mind and your heart tell you about your gender. That's number one. Number two is your gender expression, which is how you take that feeling of gender identity and express it forward. That means the roles that you exist in the way you express yourself in fashion, the way you express yourself in your behavior, the way that you express yourself, presentation, hairstyle, makeup, skincare, all those things. Okay, so that's your gender experts, lipstick, fierce lipstick, 100%, red finish, the lipstick looks so good on you. It's a statement. The third is your anatomical or biological sex assigned at birth, which we can look at it and basically scientific right, there is certainly scientific nature of it. But even that is not two boxes, right? We know that you have an X and a Y chromosome. But we also know that people have male and female parts, secondary sex characteristics. Some people have three sex chromosomes, right? Because of a mutation, right? biological mutation. So that's the third. And finally is your sexual orientation, which is who you're attracted to mentally, physically, emotionally. And one of the common misconceptions is your gender identity is in any way related to your sexual orientation, or your biological sex assigned at birth, or any of those things, each of these four things right, exist in and of itself. But if I had a pretty diagram here, I would show you a Venn diagram where these four circles intersect. And at that very middle part where those four things intersect is the picture of you. And that's why every single person's gender identity is different because you have no idea what their identity, their expression, their sex assigned at birth and their sexual orientation are.  Lindsay Mustain 09:32Oh my gosh, okay, so this is the clearest that anyone has ever paid to this for me. I've never heard that actually. And so we talked about, there's a lot of things happening in HR, we talk about intersectionality, right? So the embracing of different they're almost different backgrounds of diversity, and so I've never heard it discussed like that. So that is incredibly powerful. Okay. So what we're saying is that anybody can have a multitude of different options and that centerpiece is going to be different than every other person that exists. So there is no way to just categorize people, we have to look at them as an individual people. Don  10:05Yeah and we have to open up tolerance and acceptance and inclusivity and diversity, right? Based on how that person identifies, expresses, maybe sex assigned at birth, maybe sexual orientation, right? There's a point at which if someone comes in for an interview, or is an entrepreneur and runs an amazing business, I'll use myself as an example, okay? My four quadrants are becoming increasingly clear every day and I use the words unearth and unleash when I look at gender, because this isn't something that we transition into,right, I totally understand and acknowledge that a common word is a transition, get it totally fine. Typically, though, for someone who is either transgender or sits outside the binary happily as I do, this has been unearthing. I'm not changing, I'm basically finally unearthing and acknowledging and unleashing what I consider to be my already existing gender that I've denied or hidden or struggled with for the better part of four decades. And finally getting there. And that means that I identify as nonbinary, which means there are male and masculine and female and feminine parts of me that I love. My expression is becoming not necessarily androgynous but fluid, which is why I say the future is fluid, right? Some days, I will be crawling under my jeep, and I'll be completely messy and dirty and have my hat on backward and present fairly masculine. Other times, like today, I am here and I am presenting slightly more feminine, my sex assigned at birth was male, I have male sex characteristics, which is just that's my chromosomal makeup. And I'm straight as, like, far as the day is long. My wife and I are happily married. We're not monogamous. I love her desperately and endlessly. And so that center part of my gender is the amalgamation of those four things and nobody else is like me, they may have similar things, but nobody's like me. Lindsay Mustain 11:58Yeah, this is so powerful. And this is making me feel a lot better. So I feel people get a little nervous and even be I'm an HR professional, right? And I really, and I'm a huge the human part of the HR piece like I really want to see individual humans, but I always struggle with like, okay, when we move into this, like, how do we, how do we approach it in business, I guess, tell me about like how this matters inside of the industry, business and people. Don  12:21So ultimately, I genuinely believe if you bring your most authentic and genuine self, you're literally going to unearth and unleash who you are. And that is directly proportional to the impact you have on the world, your potential is unearthed and unleashed based on you, acknowledging, accepting your authenticity. And what happens is, and let's just go ahead and go a little bit deep for a minute. For me for 40 years, I was doing, I was not being I was doing everything I thought I was supposed to do. Okay, I was raised in a very conventional home, not conservative, we were liberal. My mom was very loving and caring, she would say like, if you're gay, be gay, if you're straight, be straight, marry who you want. I did, I was raised in a conventional home though I had short hair, there were certain things that we have ways in which men and women and masculine-feminine expressed themselves. And you add to that, that in society, there were no positive representations of somebody that felt the way I felt. It just didn't exist. You just didn't see it. And if you did see it, Prince, David Bowie, people like that. It was a cultural icon. It was a musician, a rock star, I wasn't those things. So it didn't align, it didn't make sense for me. And so I lived in a place where I built an invisible prison in which I lived. And it was based on fear and guilt and shame and doubt, and judgment and compartmentalization. I worked in hospitality for 10 years, I had loved everything about it, Lindsay, but I could not have walked into a hotel company with long hair and makeup and said, I would love to be your conference services manager, your director of events, it did not exist, it was not okay at that time. And so, when we talk about companies, Lindsay, we need to get to a place where an entrepreneur, which is where I now, I don't have to concern myself with whether or not I'm going to lose business, be shunned and ostracized, be alienated, not be able to find professional partners. If I'm in a career-driven professional space, I have to not fear if I show up as my true and authentic, professionally driven self, that I'm not gonna be able to get a job because I don't fit into a very narrow-minded box. Lindsay Mustain 14:30I'm getting a little emotional listening to you talk because this is like at the core of what I teach people to do is just be who you really are. And I'm gonna say that answer is not static. The answer is not static. Like I like we're always evolving. And I hope you're always up-leveling. And right now, I feel like there's never been a time where you could actually go in like a better time. And I'm not saying it's going to be easy, because I think you could probably say some of those things too. But to be really useful, like when I talk about the things I want to do, I'm talking about I want you to tap in, like, what I really go to is like, Can you do something passionately? Can you do something with purpose, can you do something and pursue that and then make it really profitable for yourself in your business. That's really, really like a powerful statement. Like I don't care about what your qualifications are hear about who your soul is. And we seem to have forgotten that. So I feel like this is like the biggest extension of that is recognizing and it doesn't just apply to gender, it applies to every single breathing person who walks into a building, virtually or in-person like that is the power of this message. Don  15:32It is the power of this message. And the concept of the future is fluid. It doesn't say gender is fluid, it doesn't say the future of gender is fluid, when I talk about the future is fluid. I literally mean to your point of like, it's not static. people's identities evolve every day, not just their gender identity, right. That's the purpose of today's talk is to talk a little bit about that reality for me. But everybody's identity is fluid and changing based on who they are, what walk of life they're in, whether they're a parent or not a parent, whether they're married or divorced. And I think what happens is when we go through an identity shift, right, and identity conflict, or at worst, I think identity crisis, it's because something has changed in our life, that we are concerned about what that will mean. And as an example, I had a wedding planner that I would talk to that is incredibly talented, that hid from the world that she was going to have to go through a divorce. Now, despite their best efforts, they could not reconcile and it was time to get divorced. She was mortified that she was a wedding planner who's getting divorced, she was so concerned that nobody was going to want to hire a divorced wedding planner. And my immediate thought was, I get it, I don't have the answer to this, I get it. But we need to get you past this. Because if this is a crutch that you hold on to or something you feel like you have to hide, every time you talk to somebody, you are literally going to bury, right, that potential, and it's time to unearth and unleash it, right. And so the shift was, she was an unbelievable co-parent, they had two children, those children were unbelievably supported and loved by both parents, they were able to create a life in which they co-parenting and got along just great. Like that's something to be celebrated, not hidden. So we really need to find the things about our identity that make us unique, own them, claim them, and then be able to go out into the world and have that impact. Lindsay Mustain 17:25I love that. And when we feel like we have to hide it, I have a client that just began with me, and came from a very, very masculine environment, I'm gonna say that's in general, what we are, we don't spend a lot of time in letting people like if we think about the masculine, the masculine, this is I'm going to define it, what I see is really the doing like it's the action, right? The feminine is like the nurturing the embodying, and the beam, right. And together, like Yin and Yang, you guys need both sets of hormones, like you don't have just like every man has estrogen, and every woman has testosterone. And actually, I was reading something from a doctor, I talked about how some men have more estrogen than women. So like, if we were to base it, there is complete fluidity. That's a big word for me to say there in this process. And so what we've been conditioned to believe, is very different. And so the environment has been where he was incredibly spiritual, and you would never know it and talking to him because he had been so trained to be so masculine and to be so right. And to be, everything is about action. And to be completely like straight face, you would never know that there's emotion, and what we're like, I think Renee Brown has done a really big gift for the world and really trying to embrace both vulnerability and authenticity about who we are but it's even deeper. Like, I feel like you're taking that to a whole other level. And I love that. This is the first time by the way, cuz I'm talking about the connections that I'm making here, that you were talking about. It's not that you're not the futurist fluid. It's not about gender, which is what I really thought we're gonna be talking about today. But that every person so like, what am I going to hear is intersectionality diversity and inclusion, you know, whatever you want to call this container, which is just fucking seeing people for being people, in my opinion, like, recognizing that we have no boxes. If there are, you know, a billion people on the planet, there are no boxes that we can all fit in and we would stop categorizing people. How do we make this culture? Like how do we create this culture, where people can show up as their most authentic selves where we can be inclusive? Where do we stop categorizing people, tell me how do we do that? Like, what can you tell my audience here? But how do we do that? And how do we show up as a company to like a company because I feel like that's gonna be something you're gonna do in the future is really advising companies? But how do visuals become this advocate for themselves and stand in their own power? Don  19:39So the hardest thing is, our influences and experiences teach us who to be how to be what we think is going to happen, and the stories we tell ourselves are the ways in which we build that invisible prison. So the best thing each individual can do, whether it be their gender identity or any other identity is they basically need to break down walls. That's what I've done over the last four months, I have basically taken brick by brick, and I've removed the invisible prison in which I lived. And those bricks were fear, guilt, shame, doubt, like I said, compartmentalization. Right. Let's start at the very center of my bullseye and we'll work our way out. And I want to tell a really raw and emotional story because what it does is it encourages people to feel compassion and empathy. And it, it creates one of two things, they walk away, and they go, Oh, my God, I had no idea or somebody out there is gonna listen to the story and say, Oh, my God, just like me, or both, okay. So when I decided to tell my wife, it's because I had a 10-month-old baby girl and when that baby girl was born, I looked at her and I said, I'm gonna love you unconditionally, no matter what you can be married, do whatever job doesn't matter, I will love you unconditionally and over the course of those 10 months, I started looking at myself in the mirror and for most of my life, I either sort of denied this feeling and then after a while, I'm like, I can't deny it because it's still here. And I'm like, 35,40, 45, whatever it was, so I just started hiding it and I was like, well, whatever, it's just in there. And I'll just ignore it. Well, once I had a baby girl, and I have marriage and a wife that loved me unconditionally, and that I loved unconditionally and we shared that unconditional love for a daughter, I looked at myself in the mirror, and I went, Okay, so you've gone from denying it, to hiding it to now basically being a hypocrite about it, which makes you a liar, you're just a liar. And I couldn't look at myself in the mirror day after day and feel like, okay, you're a liar and so I decided to tell my wife, and I didn't even know what to tell her. At the time, I was like, I've got this feeling inside of me. I'm not masculine. I've never been toxically masculine, you know that. But there's literally like, part of me, that's a woman or part of the time, there's a part of me, that's a woman, I don't know how to explain it, I just am. And she's like, okay, we're gonna figure this out together and over the course of four years, until I finally had the courage to talk about it in public, my wife consistently looked at me and was like, we're gonna stop together, and you're my person, I will love you forever. That's it. So that process was an ability for me to basically take brick by brick, and basically destroy these walls of this invisible prison in which I lived and what it allowed me to create was new stories. So the story of I knew my wife would love and support encouraged me and be unconditionally loving. But she might have said, I can't go on this journey with you. I just can't, like, this isn't what I signed up for and she would have every right to say that, and I wouldn't be able to hold that against her. And so that story got taken out of my wall, because she looked at me and said, You're my person, I'll love you forever and we're in this together. And then the, I can't tell my mom about this, she'll never understand it. Okay, I get to get rid of that, because I talked to my mom about it and I can't present myself as my authentic self, because people won't hire me anymore, or people won't want to hire the non-binary photographer, because it will. Okay, I got to do that. Because as I present, I have more people saying, This is amazing. I'm so glad you are who you are. And it makes me more inclined to partner with you to hire you to support you, including a super fun anecdote, hired by recently by an unbelievable production company that I love. They're unbelievable they hired me not necessarily knowing that I had gone through this awakening, I showed up. And for this product launch, they had brought in a troupe of ballerinas and models and fashion icons from New York City, to include a non-binary model to show the intersection of like art and commerce. And as I was there, I just immediately was like, This is the world that we need to create, that it was important to that company to include all walks of life. And I was able to then use photos that I took of these individuals in my presentation in Las Vegas, like I said, everything happens for a reason where I showed this is what gender looks like gender is, whatever the person is. And so first thing you can do as an individual, looking outward, destroys those walls. Okay, and then next, if you want, we can talk about I think what other people that are kind of outside of prison can do to help. Lindsay Mustain24:12I would I think that that is the most powerful thing. And I think I'm gonna be honest, I felt a little intimidated when I looked at your story because I thought how do I do this, right that doesn't offend somebody and that I absolutely love and care about this person. And I want to be supportive, but I don't even know the right thing to say. So how can I How can I do it in a way where I feel like people will be like, I'll give you an example. After my brother was murdered. A lot of people avoided me. They just didn't know what to say to me and they were intimidated, and they were sure they're gonna say the wrong thing and I didn't know how I would feel and so I'm always like, Listen, I have zero clues. I don't read through this either. So I was like, the biggest thing was just being there. It didn't matter like coming with really unconditional love. So I don't know if that's true for you. But I would love to hear how can somebody support this culture how as an advocate for an individual that you know, Don  24:57I'm so so sorry about that and I know that people probably say it to you all the time. And you're like, Okay, I get it. My sister is one of my best friends in the world. And so you live my worst nightmare. And I want to acknowledge that. This is also a conversation about identity. I know, it doesn't seem like it. But you went from one identity to another abruptly and, unfortunately. And so what we can do for people that are going through an identity conflict, identity shift, and identity adaptation, is do exactly what you just said, is be there, and love them the way that they need to be loved, at that moment, unconditionally, and so you and I share, again, very different scenario, but I literally would want people to look at me and be there for me, whether it be physically, emotionally, psychologically, whatever. And essentially, say exactly what you're saying, Lindsay, like, I don't know, and I don't get it. But I want you to know that I'm here. And I love you unconditionally, and I'll support you. So tell me, if there's anything that I can do to do that. Now, you'll hear a lot of people use words like microaggressions and it's not my responsibility to educate you. I do agree that if you care about someone, and you want to love them, and support them through a transition through whatever, a difficult time, and awakening any transition in their life, you can do a little due diligence, that won't be wasted, right. So for example, right, doing research on gender identity, listening to a podcast on gender identity, doing research on someone who's lost someone that's close to them, trauma, grief, like we can educate ourselves a little bit so that the burden of responsibility isn't on the person, right to do the educating at the same time, if you come to me, and there's a very important word here, Lindsay, and I'm sure you know it, if you come to me with the right intention, I'm going to know it. I'm going to see it, I'm going to feel it and so when people are like, you know, he, they Oh, I'm so sorry. And they make they get all flustered. But I'm like, I get it. It's cool. It's something that we've been like, you've called me here for the last 44 years, I don't expect you to get it overnight, right? Just be like, I meant they, and let's move on. Right? It is there are ways in which we can support each other. Now, the other thing I really want for people to understand is, if you are cis-gendered, right, which for those of you that don't know, because it's not a very common word cis-gendered is basically anybody who's not transgender or non-binary or falls under that umbrella. So your gender assigned at birth, and your gender identity align. Cisgendered is what we call you, right? What's what the scientific word is for it. If you're that person, finding ways to show that you're a safe space, and that you believe in that undeniable truth, that every gender identity is valid and to be respected. Any way in which you can do that, please do that. And what that includes is, if you're on Instagram, add your pronouns, even if they seem obvious, right? If your gender identity, Lindsay is perfectly aligned at birth with what your gender identity is, as an adult, that makes you probably put your her in that because what that means is when I look you up, when I start to interact with you, I'm like, Okay, cool. This person agrees with my undeniable truth that gender identity matters, as opposed to somebody who's like, Well, no, I don't, I don't agree with that your snowflake, it's your guy, your girl. And then I know that I can just behave differently. Lindsay Mustain28:25Yes, because that's the thing people want to feel safe. Like, that's a core need that we need to have is feel safe. But also, I want to go back to one of the most core human needs that we have. And something that's really, really missing in all core. Corporate America is love and connection. It's one of the biggest core needs that we have as human beings. And so when we, when we, when we neglect people as humans, they don't feel connected to their environment. And when you ignore that part of somebody and I have come from square as I've evolved, if I become the person that I really was meant to be, as my experiences have shaped me, and my identity has shifted, you know, those things have been denied by people who I was born to even and the people who get to truly see me and love me now, like, that is how we feel like we matter in the world. And when we look at some of the epidemics around, you know, people who had a suicide in particular, and people who have been ostracized for their lives, it's because we don't show up and just love them. So like I always say, my highest value is love and it's a very weird thing inside of a world of corporate. I'm like, I am just going to love you exactly as you show up for me. And that doesn't mean that I have the answer. In fact, like I want to be students and what to learn, but just show up and love people and if you do that, if you come with this heart approach, I mean, that is the real true definition of like love and connection are you just show up and we just embrace people exactly as they are, you know whether or not you think they are, you know, right or wrong. Like just love it. Somebody like judgment was a big part of my thing I had to let go and how other people feel about me has no definition of who I really am. Don  30:08So you have, you've undergone a very tumultuous journey. And you're very comfortable and confident, right inside your container. Now, I have to tell you, first of all, I love everything about what you just said, I think love is by far and away one of the most powerful emotions. And I believe that in this world, even though there's a lot of hate, and a lot of ignorance and a lot of aggression, that there's far more love. I just I genuinely believe that. However, I will tell you that based on what you just said, one of the things that we all need to do is sit still in a quiet room for a moment and close our eyes, and ask ourselves how, and whether or not we truly love ourselves the way in which we should, because I'll tell you, that's literally the story of my 40 years as I was fundamentally incapable of looking in the mirror and loving myself, the way that I loved my daughter. And that, for me, was was literally the linchpin, it was literally the time at which I said, you can't love yourself in the same way you love your daughter, and then expect your daughter to go into the world and love herself the way that you love her, right? So I need everybody to do that. Because that's where we oftentimes get into problems. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm 100% on board with you, that other people look at us and judge us and try to compartmentalize us and therefore aren't loving us the way they need to love us. But ultimately, first, we got to look inward. And I will tell you in the last four months of my life, and I love telling this story because it was one of those moments where like, how do I get my unusually large foot out of my mouth right now I looked at my wife. And I was finishing up this leadership program, I had just finally unearthed, unleashed, acknowledged, and owned the fact that my gender identity didn't align and that I was going to present as non-binary and fluid and love everything about life. I was getting ready to do this talk in Vegas like everything was firing, and I was like, Oh my God, I've never been happier. Wait a minute, I married I had a kid like That's not fair. But what I acknowledged was in that moment, I literally sat still, and was watching all these things swirl around me and how they were coming together in unconditional love for myself. And I said I've never been happier with myself and how I feel about myself. That was ultimately it was literally a free pass. It was a ticket. It was a ticket to freedom to happiness, that doesn't mean that there's some fear. That doesn't mean there's not intimidation that's not, oh, gosh, what about, but it was literally a feeling of freedom that I had never ever felt in 44 years on this planet. And I want everybody to have that. Lindsay Mustain 32:56And I think you're completely right. In order to love people really fully, you have to start by loving yourself. And that is one of the biggest journeys that we can take. And it's a process. It's still my process. Because something that I do when people look at me, and they see the transformation that I've made this last year, what I did is I started to fall in love with myself. And I stopped denying bullshit that I had actually repressed and truth that I had embraced because I was worried about other people judging me and I just decided to be me. And that's not perfect, not even close. But it is completely authentic and exactly who I was meant to be. Don  33:27And we'll find ways to love ourselves in spite of things because of things. We develop a new fit. Like, I just love the fact that life isn't static like just isn't static. It's 100% fluid. And so are each and every single one of us on the level, all the work that you're doing to help people in their professional and personal journeys. It's amazing. Lindsay Mustain33:48Well, thank you so much for being here. So if somebody wants to reach out to you, because I feel like you can be here to talk about this, and help enlighten people and shed journey if they want to follow you if they want you to talk how can they contact you? Don  33:58I am like the easiest person to find on the planet. You can go on every social media site out there and I'm at donmamone@donmamone.com. My wife and I are on Facebook, we have a website for our photography and so I'm a relationship marketer at heart. It says it right behind me and you and I know it's people first and profit. Literally, a person just needs to send me a message and we'll connect and I'll have a chat with them. Lindsay Mustain34:22I love that. Thank you so much for being here.  Don  34:24It's my pleasure.

Taber Evangelical Free Church
I am the Light of the World

Taber Evangelical Free Church

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 8, 2021


John 8:1230 (ESV) I Am the Light of the World 12Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life. 13So the Pharisees said to him, You are bearing witness about yourself; your testimony is not true. 14Jesus answered, Even if I do bear witness about myself, my testimony is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going, but you do not know where I come from or where I am going. 15You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one. 16Yet even if I do judge, my judgment is true, for it is not I alone who judge, but I and the Father who sent me. 17In your Law it is written that the testimony of two people is true. 18I am the one who bears witness about myself, and the Father who sent me bears witness about me. 19They said to him therefore, Where is your Father? Jesus answered, You know neither me nor my Father. If you knew me, you would know my Father also. 20These words he spoke in the treasury, as he taught in the temple; but no one arrested him, because his hour had not yet come. 21So he said to them again, I am going away, and you will seek me, and you will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come. 22So the Jews said, Will he kill himself, since he says, Where I am going, you cannot come? 23He said to them, You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins. 25So they said to him, Who are you? Jesus said to them, Just what I have been telling you from the beginning. 26I have much to say about you and much to judge, but he who sent me is true, and I declare to the world what I have heard from him. 27They did not understand that he had been speaking to them about the Father. 28So Jesus said to them, When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority, but speak just as the Father taught me. 29And he who sent me is with me. He has not left me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to him. 30As he was saying these things, many believed in him.

Novant Health Mosaic
Rebounding higher - part 2

Novant Health Mosaic

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 22, 2021 7:47


00:05Welcome to Mosaic, your Novant Health podcast for diversity, inclusion and equity. You'll learn more about the mosaic of similarities and differences that make us stronger, and how health equity benefits us all. Piece by piece, we're telling the stories of the beautiful mosaic of Novant Health. 00:25Hi, this is Becky Knight BRG administrative coordinator, and on a previous podcast I talked with Sarah Arthur about the creation of the Rebound Business Resource Group. This new BRG provides an open and supportive environment to raise awareness of mental health and substance use diagnoses. On this episode, we will hear more about addressing stigma and what Rebound has planned for the future. And I'll wrap up with some easy to access resources if you or someone you know needs assistance. 00:56Courage is one of our values. And I'm encouraged to learn more about how people are taking advantage of this resource for themselves and their families, and by extension our community. Is there a general stigma about mental health and substance use and even more so in certain communities? I was wondering what have you observed? And how is the BRG addressing stigma and making these conversations.. 01:23So we want to make every employee feel comfortable. Now a lot of times people rely on their friends and family and peers for support. And that's okay. But when you hear that one of them has also utilized a formal counseling service or a physician or a certain medication, you're more willing to try it yourself and actually utilize that help. I think that when you see someone like yourself as well, you don't feel as alone and isolated when it comes to certain feelings that you may be having. And it often helps if you can have a friend tell you, Hey, I noticed that you're acting a little differently. And that's why we also promote through this group knowing ways in which to bring about the subject of mental health. We share you know with throughout our system, the five ways to bring up mental health. We share things like Mental Health First Aid training, just to give people the tools because it's an uncomfortable subject. You don't want to trigger someone, you don't want to bring up a conversation that then you don't know what to do about it if someone is really in crisis, and you don't want to be the result of anyone's downfall either. 03:21So to wrap up, I'd love to know a little bit about your plans for this coming year. What's on the horizon? 03:30Yes, we had a really big focus last month on Mental Health Awareness Month, we had a lot of testimonials from people within the group, to again, try and break down that stigma and encourage more people to join rebound. The group, we have several different components that we're working on when it comes to education, reducing stigma, and then looking at our different policies and procedures within the hospital system. So one thing in particular, when it comes to policies, we noticed several employees within the group had been on medications from their physician, but through our policy, because it's considered a controlled substance. They didn't necessarily know that they needed to report that to employee health. And then in other instances, it came about where you know, a leader may have just heard that they were on this medication, and then had a perception of how it made the person act or maybe what diagnosis went along with it. Again, making the person feel like they had done something wrong for taking something that they were prescribed. So we're going to work with employee health and how we can educate new employees that are coming in, as well as current employees to make people feel like they can take their needed medication. Oftentimes, people may not do it because they want to keep their job, which isn't good for their mental health. So that's one thing. And then when it comes to education, we're continuing to promote mental health first aid training throughout our organization, specifically for leaders so that they feel like they have the tools to help their employees. And we're working with HR on the companion support team or compassion support team. So you have a peer that can support you in a crisis. 05:36If this conversation has sparked in you a desire to reach out for help, I did want to close with some resources. First Novant Health has a behavioral health call center. It is operated 24/7/365 and staffed by masters level therapists who can assist individuals and family members in navigating the world of treatment for substance use and mental health issues. We're going to give that number is 1-800-718-3550 and it's available to all team members, providers, patients, community members, to everyone. 06:27You can also contact the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, a branch of the US Department of Health and Human Services. Their national hotline is 1-800-6TO-HELP or 1-800-662-4357. And they do have a free confidential referral Information Service and it's available in English and Spanish. Finally, I just want to say thank you to Sarah for being with me and sharing about this important BRG and the work that they're doing and I know is going to just be so impactful in the year to come as we all try to get well and on the road to recovery. Thank you, Sara. 07:22Join us next time where I'll have with me a member of the Rebound BRG to share with me about how the group has supported her and how she's working to decrease stigma in the organization and among her fellow team members. And I'll also be joined by a physician from the women physicians BRG, which we have at Novant Health. And she's going to give a clinical perspective and some additional resources for team members and for those in the community who may need assistance. Thank you so much. Join us next time. 08:04Thanks for listening to Mosaic, your podcast for diversity, inclusion and equity and Novant Health. Stay tuned for our next exciting episode.

I Survived Theatre School

Intro: Writing personallyLet Me Run This By You: What would you say to your inner child?Interview: We talk to Ed Ryan about surviving two theatre schools, surviving 9/11, and interrupted grief.FULL TRANSCRIPT (UNEDITED):I'm Jen Bosworth from me this and I'm Gina Polizzi. We went to theater school together. We survived it, but we didn't quite understand it. 20 years later, we're digging deep talking to our guests about their experiences and trying to make sense of it all. We survived theater school and you will too. Are we famous yet? And I'm scared. Like, I think partially 1 00:00:34This is this, the main character is based on me. Like all our character. I think every writer writes about themselves. I don't care what you say, aspects of themselves. So I'm like, man, would I do this stuff? Would I, how far would I go to people please? Like that? That is what I'm wrestling with. That is what is, is, how far do we go? And how far would I go to people please? Now I don't think I'd go that far, but people do go far. 2 00:00:59People go far and feel like they're in a few state and feel like it wasn't them. That was making the choice. And, and I believe that I believe that that can happen. I also just think it's interesting in the lens of like, feeling, having felt for a long period of your life, that you weren't allowed to have certain emotions. It makes sense to me that you would be surprising yourself with where you can go in your imagination, but that would also lead to, you know, surprisingly like our, we had a conversation one time on here where I said, I don't feel like I've ever seen you angry. So, and you, you said you do get angry, but I just wonder if maybe there's just a lot of unexpressed anger and this is a great way to get it out. 1 00:01:42Totally. And I, and I think you're right. I think you're right on. And so, and I also think, and I wonder how, you know, how you feel about the idea that writing, right? Somebody, I wonder if people write and I don't know how you write, but if people read, I mean, I know a little how you write, but if peop, if people can ever write fully devoid from their own person, you know, like, like where they don't put themselves in their characters or their, if they're writing, I guess maybe if you're writing non-fiction I don't know. But when you write, do you agree that like each part of you and every, oh yeah, 100%. 2 00:02:24And I, I, in reading the Stephen King book about writing, you know, he, he realized like years after the fact about the way that he was writing himself in his stories, like, I guess famously and in misery, he is when he was at the height of drug addiction. And he, at the time he did not feel that he was writing the story about himself, but that's what it ended up being. Yeah. I mean, in part, just because like, how else would you do it? I mean, you only have your own as close as you can be to anybody else. What you really stuck with 24 7 is the ruminations in your own mind, the reactions to things, your worldview, your worldview is, is so people can recognize a lot of things about their worldview, but then there's all kinds of things about their own perspective that they would never think unless they had occasion to see it, contrast it with something else and say, oh, wow, I think about that really differently. 2 00:03:21So anyway, I think it's cool. I think it's great that you're going there and I'm excited to see where it goes. 1 00:03:32Let me run this by you. I started seeing, so I had a therapist that was this Orthodox Jewish man that I stopped seeing. It was just it. I always what I, you know, and it's so blatant at the time after, but during, during, I never see, like, I'm looking for like a father figure. And, and he started to say things that were, and it's all I'm on the phone, you know, but like he has six kids and he wanted to, he started saying things like, do you think that this is because you never had kids kind of like why my emotions? 2 00:04:13And I said, you know, 1 00:04:15I don't know it could be, but I, and you know, it was it's interesting. So I just had to say, you know what, I'm so-and-so, I think that I'm going to take a pause on this. I just don't feel that were, I was proud of myself. I said, I just don't feel like it's a good match right now for me, a good fit. I couldn't just say it's so funny. I have to qualify it. Like, I couldn't just say this isn't a good fit. I was like, not a fit right now for trying to soften that. Just ridiculous stuff, but that's how I did it. And yeah. And so I, I was like, okay, well, do I want to get another therapist? Or do I want to, so I do see like a coach, like, what do I want to do? 1 00:04:55So I started seeing, I had a first session with a coach outside in a park. Who's a, she coaches, she does a lot of career coaching, but I just, like, I've known her for a while. And I liked her and we got to some interesting stuff like, you know, and you've said some stuff about like inner child stuff. Like I never really felt like I could connect with the idea of making peace or taking care of my inner child. And I couldn't understand why. And I think I got to the point where the reason I I'm afraid to things that my inner child will hurt me or that I will hurt it. 2 00:05:35Her. Yeah. 1 00:05:37So, so I thought I'd tell you about that. 2 00:05:41Hurt you. Any idea what you mean by that? Like 1 00:05:44Sabotage, like my inner child is so angry at the way that my parents, and then I have been treating her that she will fuck things up. Hm. 2 00:05:54Yeah. By misbehaving. Yes. 1 00:05:57Misbehaving sabotaging. So there's not a trust there. There's not a trust. And I wouldn't have ever, whenever I, in the various forms of therapy and schooling that I've done in this area, I always felt really, it's not even that I bristled with when we did inner child work. It's like, I thought, well, I don't even know this is weird. I don't even know what this is. 2 00:06:23Yeah. I totally, I can totally relate. And I think I have had the same exact opinion, this very cynical sort of point of view. It all seems so I would just want to roll my eyes talking about inner child, but I think it's like that thing that I was telling you about when I did that thing on clubhouse and everybody was playing and I was just afraid of it. I think it's just that I think you learn to hide the parts of yourself that get you in trouble in the world for whatever reason. And then if there are parts of yourself that you first identify when you were very young, they're locked away. Good. They're locked away. Real good. And there's a real, I mean, just intense fear about going there. 2 00:07:07And I guess like the best signal that I have about that is that every time I start to think about it or talking about it, I start to cry, which, okay, well, there's obviously a lot there. I, I don't believe, see my thing about it is like for a long time I did therapy. I did. I've I'll total in total. I've probably done therapy. I'm going to say for like 10 years between different therapists. I, it's not that I think I'm done. It's not, you know, it's not that I don't want to be in therapy. I, there are reasons that I'm not in it right now, but I just very quickly be talking about my childhood became like, okay, but I talked about it and now I'm just complaining. 2 00:07:56Or, you know, now this is just, when are you going to get over? And that's the voice of like everybody in my family, like get over it. Everybody's everybody hurts. Like not even, not, not even everybody hurts, just like, get over it. You're your grownup. There's no time for that anymore. And I, that is the voice that I cannot quiet in my own head. So, whereas at one point in my life, I thought I had done all that. Cause I did 10 years of therapy. Now I realized I just never even approached it. I stuck with things that were more happening in my life now. Or like I would spend a lot of time like crying about my dad or whatever, but it wasn't like it's, you know, that was about him. 2 00:08:37It was about me talking about him. It wasn't really about me talking about me because I think when I started talking about myself, that's when all the walls and defenses went up and I was like, you know, and I, and I couldn't do it. And Aaron has said to me, a number of times, like you've never really dealt with this stuff and I, and I've just been so incredulous, like, of course I have, I've done, I've dealt with it a ton, but I really haven't. I haven't, I've done like layers of it, but I haven't, I haven't done all the layers. 1 00:09:06Yeah. And I, I could totally hear that and I can totally relate to not feeling, to feeling like I haven't really touched on it. And the reason I know that I haven't gotten to the core of sort of any inner child work is that yesterday when I was, when she had me doing an exercise outside in the park, like just trying to approach my inner child, the only way I could make contact with her was across a field with loud noise in the background with me yelling and her yelling back. So like not screaming at each other, but like there was, had to be a barrier. Like I couldn't the intimacy of approaching her straight on was too much. 1 00:09:46So I was like, Hey, I'm over here. And she said, hi, I'm over there. And she was like, really suspicious of me and stuff. But I knew like, oh, I'm really having, I have a lot of trepidation about approaching this part of myself. And so I have to have a separation, like a barrier. It has to be, it has to be moderated. It can't be like, I can't just walk up to her. There's no way in hell. There's no way. 2 00:10:13What's it. Like when you look at pictures of yourself, when you were really young, what did you think? 1 00:10:17I feel like I don't even know who that person is. Yeah. 2 00:10:21I have the same exact, whereas I know this just could be the difference between thinking about yourself and thinking about another person. When I look at even very, very young, young baby pictures of my kids, I think, oh yeah, their personality was there. You know, from the beginning, this is who they still are. And sometimes I'll share, I'll show them something and they'll say, you know, it seems like they kind of recognize. Yeah, that's me. Whereas I look at that person and I think, I mean, I've seen this picture before, but I, I have what, who is that per yeah, I've just have no idea. I think I, what I basically did, starting in theater school is just form a whole new set to start over. 2 00:11:05I just formed a whole new identity. I was just like, not to the point that some people get like my sister where they tell everybody that our parents are dead. But to the point of just, yeah, I'm this person now. And you know, and I'm, and I'm done with that other person, whoever she was, I hated her no matter what. And of course the realization realization I have recently is no, but I still hate myself. So I really haven't a changed divorce. And I, and there's a, you can't walk away from who you are, you have, you have to. 1 00:11:37Right. And, and, and I, I, my coach, Deanna, was like I said, I don't know who that person is. And she said, she's you, you just haven't integrated her yet. Like there it's you. And I was like, whole, I saw it as a separate sort of. So it's interesting. And she said, trauma, you know, we talked about neuroplasticity of the brain and trauma and, and how it's rewiring. Like, so, and she's like, I don't really believe in, well, I don't know if she said this, but I got, kind of got the feeling. She was like, she didn't really believe in mantras and all that, but she said, what happens? What do you start telling yourself when you are scared? 1 00:12:19Or when you have an audition, that's scary. I say, I'm going to screw this up. That's my mantra. I'm going to somehow screw this up. I'm going to, she's like, all right, we have to cut that off immediately. She's like, I don't care what you say, but you can't say that to yourself anymore. So I was like, okay, what can I believe? Like, what can I get stand behind? Because I'm not going to say, oh, I'm the greatest actor and everything. No, no, no. I don't believe that. I don't believe that at all. But what I do believe it, I do have evidence to show in my heart and in my bones that things have that everything is happening at the time it's supposed to be happening. I do believe that I do. I can stand behind that. I can't say it's good. I can't say it's awesome, but I can say, so she said, all right, we're just going to go with that. So now, like, you know, I think, oh, what if I get a call back for this role I really want, and I know I'm going to fuck it up. 1 00:13:04And I said, Nope, it's going to happen. If, if I do fuck it up, it's going to be, because it was the time to fuck it up. Like I have to believe in the timing of things, because I can't really believe in the goodness of things, is that, you know, 2 00:13:17Right. And sort of similar to that is how I'm always just thinking in my mind that I'm just starting over at that. I'm always just putting the other the past behind me. It's, that's not you that you can't really do that. And, and it's all, it's every failure in every experience you go through every part and every iteration of yourself is a part of whatever it is now. It's not. So what's what this is making me think about is when I was in private practice, I became sort of known for treating really severe trauma cases. And so almost all of them had did. 2 00:13:58And the technique for integration when a person has multiple selves and just for people who are listening, it's not like civil, civil, and bark, like a dog, whatever. It's really a lot more subtle than that. Now in severe cases, people have these few states where they go and they're just doing something else. I mean, I had, I had clients who would get themselves. They would go into a few state and then do terrible things that really dangerous, dangerous, terrible thing. But the technique is you have them all sit around a conference table. 2 00:14:38You have, what's amazing to me is if, if you're talking to a person who suffers with us and they've never heard this technique before, they never go conference table, they go, okay. Yeah. They're, I mean, they're just immediately, oh, that's a good idea. They can all come together because of they're in their experience. They feel or see. And they all have very often, they all have different names and different ages and they have different things and they fight with each other about what they're doing. So I say, let's just do the conference table thing. Let's have everybody meet together and we can work on the agenda. But like the underwriting overriding thing has to be we, whatever we do, we want to do it United. 2 00:15:20And what it gets tricky is when you're, you're not doing it United and everybody's, and that's the sabotage thing. That's what you get a lot of it. The sabotage thing is like this one is, and it's all because it was all a coping strategy for not being able to, you know, the parts of yourself that were rejected by whomever get shunned. They don't go away. They just get shunted off into another part of you. And it's funny because I really see a lot of my dysfunction feels splintered like that. Like I can say, I can click into a mode. That's happy, happy, and positive. And, but then if I'm not feeling happy and positive, then it's like, I'm not that person anymore. 2 00:16:03I'm just this other sad, depressed person. Or sometimes I'm, you know, we all have it to some degree and I feel it a little too. It doesn't feel like different parts of me that have different names, but it still feels like it needs a lot more integrating. 1 00:16:18Yes, I totally agree with that. And the other thing I worry about, and I think, and I, I don't know if you've ever worried. I worry that might the, that part of myself, the small, vulnerable, whatever, I would say five or six year old part of myself is going to disclose some, even more deep trauma happened. 2 00:16:38Okay. There you go. That's probably exactly right. 1 00:16:41And I don't want to, and I am like, I don't know if I can handle that. Like I, so she is the keeper of secrets of when I was young and who knows what the hell really went on. Like I could have been worse than I thought is the, is the, is the, is the overarching fear 2 00:16:59I can see why you would be afraid then. Yeah. Yeah. I wonder if I wonder if part of your way it is going to be instead of, or like in addition to fearing that is like, yeah, that's scary, but she needs help. She needs, yeah. 1 00:17:14Yeah. That's what, that's what Deanna said too. It was like, yeah. She needs to be seen and heard. Yeah. And that's your way to freedom. And I was like, what? Because whenever someone says the way to freedom, like that interests me because freedom from such self doubt, freedom from such self-loathing or fear, you know, self like freedom from that seems amazing. So if someone tells me, you want to get free from this, you know, as long as they're not telling me some wackadoo stuff, but you, you want freedom from this thing, then it's going to take a certain amount of work. I'm like that, that I'm curious if I will do that word, which is just to say 2 00:17:58To our listeners, that the experience of doing this podcast has people are always reporting to us. Oh, I've reconnected with people. I'm, I'm healing things and remembering things, but that's true for us too. And I have reconnected with people that I haven't spoken to in a number of years. And it's so gratifying. I mean, that, that's actually another piece of this disintegration thing is like the person I was when I was in theater school and the friends I had. And I just basically with the exception of you just moved on from that and never looked back and you know, these are people that I love that I loved then, and that, you know, as I'm reconnecting with them, I'm like, oh yeah, you're amazing. 2 00:18:48And I'm just so grateful that we're having the opportunity to do this. I, this is what college reunions are meant to do, but they don't because it's kinda like one, you know, it's just, it's all because you just get through one layer of like, well, what do you look like? And what are you doing? As, you know, as an and, and I guess social media has changed that for people, like they get a better sense, but, but that's even, that is not the same as actually talking to somebody who you haven't talked to. And then now I'm like texting with people and it's fun. It's and then the other thing, which I've mentioned to you at least once before, but I'm still thinking about a lot is the people who I don't remember, but who remember me to me, that means I have just been so self absorbed that w that to, to a great degree. 2 00:19:43When I think back about that time, I, I almost can only think about myself and how I felt about things and whether I was getting treated well, or, you know, instead of like the fact, I mean, I guess that's human, but I just feel like if there's somebody who remembers me, then there's a re then the reason that I don't remember them is not anything other than I was just paying only attention to myself. And I, and I have compassion for myself about it because I, you know, it was just doing the best I could, but I'm interested in going back and healing those riffs too, because I, I think that something happens that has happened to me over time is like, I was never the most popular or the least popular. 2 00:20:37I was always in the middle, which meant that I ended up looking down on the people who were less popular than me and, and looking up to and resenting the people. So it was, I was just seeing everything in terms of like status status. Yeah. That's what it is. I have been entirely status obsessed in a way that is a complete surprise to me. I had no idea that I was status obsessed and it makes sense because that's how my parents are. That's how everybody, I mean, that's how a lot of people are. Why would I be unique? Why would I be exempt from 1 00:21:10Them? Well, that's the thing. I mean, I think that we, that I get get, so I get so trapped in thinking I'm uniquely where I'm at, and that is garbage. I am a unique human because everyone is to a certain extent. And then we're all the freaking same. We're all worried about what we look like, what we sound like, who, what, what other people think of? What other people think of us and how we're coming off. And, you know, that's part of being human, but I think you're right. I think for me as well, when people remember things, I don't remember, people were like, yeah, we were friends and I'm thinking we were friends. And that is because I was too busy probably thinking about myself and what else I could do, or why it's, it's what they say in 12 step programs, really about self centered fear. 1 00:21:55It's like, I'm so self-centered, and, and 2 00:21:59She'll warm. I'm I'm shit, but I'm, but I'm 1 00:22:03Yeah, shit. Or I'm the special warm and a, not a worker among workers, you know, like it's, it's, it's an interesting thing. And we come by and see the thing that's really also interesting to me is that we come by it, honestly, that is the part that I have to remember. It's that the people come by the shit, honestly, including me, I'm not so special that I don't come by it, honestly, it's not right. You know? 2 00:22:26Yeah. I mean, right. Yeah. I think it is. It's completely amazing. I'm completely great. I, I'm an apropos of our conversation that we had a while ago about like constantly evaluating our progress. Like when I can get away from doing that, I'm just full of gratitude for, for, for what we're, what we've already done. Even if we never did it again after this, what we've already done has been so personally helpful. Yeah, 1 00:22:54Me too. And I do see it as a way also as, as we move forward as artists, as a way of building allyship with people that I once looked at as not nemesis, maybe, but like as adversaries or doing better than me or doing worse than me, or now it's, it just seems more they're equal. Like I feel more equal with people and I think that's a better way to go, because the other way is like, 2 00:23:20It's also just the truer way to go. Like, it's just a lie. We tell ourselves when we think we're so sped. It's like, okay. But I mean, among other things, it's simply a false, 1 00:23:31Which is why, like, things like the like organized, like army and stuff works because you all get put in basic training and no one is better than the, there were, you're all lower, lowest on totem pole. And I think that builds some kind of comradery. And yeah. So anyway, I just, I just, I don't know why I was thinking about that, but I liked that idea. 2 00:23:55I, I started to watch some of the showcase this year is DePaul theater school shows. I was just curious if you had seen any of them. I 1 00:24:07Have seen it. And you know, it's interesting. I, the, the way that they filmed it, for the most part, it's the same camera shots, right. Of each I'm like, okay, okay. I think that we could have been a little more original with that, but I think they were trying to be equal to everybody and not quote you. And, and also 2 00:24:30It's not a film school. I mean that, you know, I, I, for that reason, I give it a lot of credit because it's like, oh, wow. I wonder if somebody had been tasked doing that in our year. I'm, I'm not certain we would have gotten anywhere. It would've been 1 00:24:44In video camera shaking and like, yeah, yeah, 2 00:24:47Yeah. So it's cool. I'm happy for them that they have this. I mean, I'm happy for them that they have this access. It's probably has the same effect that it did when we did the in-person thing, which is like, not a lot, unless they're going to move to LA. But what I felt was interesting is looking at the acting and just remembering, like, talk about not being special. We all did bad acting in the same way, you know, which is to say not connected, not real, very, very self-monitoring of like, how is this coming across? You can see people thinking that, how is this coming across? Versus there was a few people who was like, oh no, they're in it. 2 00:25:29They're totally there. They're there. It's just ed. And I say, this was so much compassion because I think probably the entire time I was just looking, I was just observing myself. I'm sure I did a terrible job. Yeah. And 1 00:25:41I can see it too. And I, you, it sticks out when someone's really in it. And it is so hot. And we said this, and I, I think we've talked about this on the podcast. It's so hard to get there. It's hard to get, to stop the self-monitoring to be in the moment and just tell the story or be in the it's so hard. So what it happens and you see it, you're like, oh, that's gold, that's gold. And it's not to say that, you know, we all get there at different times and we have different moments of it, but yeah. 2 00:26:09Yeah. What's hard to account for, I mean, you know, to a certain degree, there is only so much teaching that somebody can do of actors, because what you really need also is just these life experiences that either do, or don't lead you in the direction of really understanding yourself. And if you're a person who is not interested in understanding yourself, you're probably pretty limited as an actor or, or like, or maybe even very successful, but just that one, you know? Yeah. Right, 1 00:26:39Right. You might, you might make a million dollars, but as we talked about it, that not equal being in the moment and being it truly like for me in an experience, just because you made a million dollars doing it does not. I, I is a recent, recent, recent discovery that worth and money are not necessarily the same. Oh my God. Oh my God. 2 00:27:04Me too, girl. Me too. I'm just like, yeah, because actually there are other, I've heard the phrase. It's not always about money, but I really have never lived it. I have always been like, no, no, no. It's always 0 00:27:26Today on the podcast, we're talking with Edward Ryan, Edward is someone who went to the theater school at DePaul university and then left and then went on to have many adventures and different incarnations as an artist and is still on that adventure. And he's thoughtful and kind. So please enjoy our conversation with Edward Ryan. 3 00:27:47I was, I was a year below you guys. Okay. Okay. Okay. Edward, 2 00:27:52Ryan, congratulations. You survived theater school. I did twice. Twice. Yeah, because you just went back a few years ago to get your degree. So tell us about 4 00:28:03That. That was a very different, yeah. So you know what I did do some local theater, like a while ago I met a costumer and his name was Frank and he wound up teaching at a really small private school in Springfield, Massachusetts. And he's basically started a theater program there that's called American international college. And he said to me one day, like, how come you never finished your degree? He was like, give me your transcripts. And I, I, I got my transcripts. And he was like, you could be done in like a year and a half or two years and have a decree. 4 00:28:47Well, I didn't know I was going to be so, you know, affected by, was it, it's a school that serves a lot of sort of underserved communities. So there's a lot of first-generation Americans, a lot of first-generation college students. And in contrast to a place like DePaul, although we complained about the building on north Kenmore, the facility, there's nothing. I mean, they have nothing, these kids and, but their like passion and their drive is really what you know is so inspirational, you know? And they're like, we can make theater out of anything, you know, out of nothing. And it was kind of a strange situation because Frank and I were very good friends, you know? So all of a sudden he was like my professor and I mostly had to do academic classes to graduate there. 4 00:29:33You know, they took all my credits and I re I did a history of theater. I was like for like the third time, like all of, you know, this time I wasn't able to cheat. As I remember 2 00:29:46Cheating, I did cheat, oh 4 00:29:48My God. Anaconda make us, had every test that doc, whatever his name was, Jack O'Malley gave us. Oh, hilarious. And I've always been really studious, but like second year I was like, oh yeah. You know, give them up. 2 00:30:05That's funny because I don't actually remember the cheating thing, but when Dave was on, he, he referenced that, I guess it was widespread. I mean, you know, in a way, I'm sure they were like, oh, these kids they're so dumb. Just something easy. 4 00:30:20Get the same test every year, year after year after year. And luckily I lived, I lived with second years. So it was like, and you know, and she had them all, like, she was a stage manager, dramaturgy, Jenna, all a file. I just had to go in every week and pull it out. Yeah. 2 00:30:35I mean, are you the, one of the people who just got a brochure from DePaul and that's how you went 4 00:30:40With, yeah. With this gesture on the front, I never went to visit the school. I auditioned in New York and it was, you know, I had applied to NYU and I had an audition set up, but their auditions for summer, I didn't audition at the same time. And it was like really late. And I applied to Providence college. That was, if I wanted to like go the more academic route, dammit. And I remember going for my audition and I, I like heard really quickly that I got into DePaul and I just decided I never even went on my audition for NYU. 4 00:31:21I, I thought that the city would probably be a little too, you know, I was, I lived near the city. So it was like always my grandfather lived in the city and I thought that's going to be too much of a distraction, you know? And I really wanted to, you know, get an education. So I went to Chicago and I flew out and my parents drove all my stuff out. 2 00:31:42What, like, what did you make of it? Day one. What was, where was your head at with it? 4 00:31:47I was like, Chicago is so clean compared to New York. Yeah, it really is. I lived in Seton hall and I lived on the fourth floor in the corner room that was like ginormous with Cedric was Cedric steins was my roommate. And we had this other third roommate that we never liked. And then he got kicked out of the dorms, like halfway through the year. So we had this great big room and it was right above. I felt like the blues brothers, cause he looked at our window and they're like the El tracks by, but it was really close to taco burrito palace. Oh 2 00:32:24My God. I forgot all about TVP. Okay. Well they have many, you know, there's like 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. I think that one is actually still there. 4 00:32:39That place like on a Friday or Saturday night was like, you couldn't get near it. And Rose's Tavern is like hole that the Mesopotamian woman who was like, let anybody drink. Okay. If you could walk, you choose giving 2 00:32:53Toddlers shots of you guys 4 00:32:56You'd be surprised. And there was some sort of characters in that joint. I mean, I remember like winding up at some apartment and being like, I shouldn't be here. What am I doing? 2 00:33:10So, but you left, you left after your second year. Okay. And it was rough. You said you had a rough, 4 00:33:16It was, I was, I was planning on living there. So I was living there for the summer. I was living with Cedric again and then Noel wrath. Yeah. And we were living like sort of west of everything, like up Armitage. It was like desolate. It was like this really weird apartment where I had the closet as my room. And I just remember like taking out the garbage, had to go out the back doors to this garage. And there was like this Harley biker who was always hanging out in there. I don't know if I was just like, this is where children get molested. I can't, you know, it was odd and Cedric left and he went to Africa, there was a trip to like Africa. 4 00:33:56And I remember Susan Lee was on that trip because he was like, he called us and he was like, oh, I met Susan Lee and wait, 2 00:34:07Susan Lee was just randomly in Africa with this girl. Don't you remember? That's when she came back and said to Erica, oh, I've got to teach you African dance. Okay. 4 00:34:18But, you know, I really, I really want, I was like, you know, I was kind of shocked about it and you know, I think it was a lot for me to go there. You know, I'm the youngest of five. And then my mother had remarried and I have four step kids. So my parents had like nine kids under the age of like 30. And you know, financially that no matter how much money you make, I think it's, it's a burden. And I was really committed to like the theater school. And I didn't have a warning that was sort of, you know, productive. I remember going to Rick Murphy's office and not having any morning, my first year of going in and sitting down him being like, you're fine. 4 00:34:59Get out of here. You know? And then my second year he was like, what the fuck is going on with you? You know? And he's like, what's up a tree Kessler. And I was like, I don't know if she hates me. And he was like, get your shit together or something like that, you know? But there was no like sort of actionable steps. And then when I left and asked back, I was like, wow. And you were talking about mushrooms. So for the first time I ate flushes and I wandered around Chicago and I found all these incredible places. I was like, oh my God, like a Paul said and all that. I was like input. And like I realized, I was like, in my own backyard, I thought I was lost. But I, you know, I have like some journal entries about Sundays are the best day in the world. 4 00:35:40Everybody does what they want. Even God rested on Sunday. And it was so much fun. Yeah. All by myself, just wandering around the city. But you know, people were like, oh right. Speaking of that, I remember I was dying during Eric Slater's interview because we got a phone call at like 6:00 AM, one day at apartment two downstairs. And it was Eric and he was, he had been arrested. And it must've been when you guys were doing Andrew CLIs and the lion, because he was like walking home. It was really late. He was walking home from our house, I guess. And the cops stopped him and arrested him. 4 00:36:21And we were like, he had to be like at the Merle reskin theater for this purport, like that morning. And I think we wound up calling John Bridges and it turns out they had just taken and he looked like a shady character. 3 00:36:38I don't know. But I wanted to ask 2 00:36:43Total digression, but I always thought in lineups, they got other criminal, like people that they know, they know and they can just random. Yeah. They get rent. I don't know about now. But you used to do this random ass people for lineups. Yeah. But the way you get them there is by arresting them. Well, I think you can, apparently in Chicago, 4 00:37:05I think he was drunk. He was probably stumbling. Maybe he was like, had a few beers and they were just like, oh yeah, public drunkenness let's go. But that was like one of the funniest. And it was like the day that my mother called me late, it was like crisis. You know, we went into crisis mode and it was like, she got out her clipboard and like gave us all the assignments. And then my mother called me that morning and she was like, is everything all right? And I always thought, I was like, you know, my mom just says that like intuition, you know? And I was like, everything's fine. You know? Like, and I remember saying to her, I'm like, I think your psychic should always, so you're, you're saying, so 2 00:37:47You didn't, it was, there was no, I mean, there was a warning without any information in it or 4 00:37:55Yeah, there wasn't really anything specific, you know? And like I had truly Kessler my second year for voice and speech. And I had had Ruth's Rupert who you, she was there for a really short period of time. And then she left, she came back and she was like, oh, I got a contract. I'll be here next year. And then she came back like the next week and was like, I'm leaving. And she got a job at Yale and she went off to teach at Yale and she taught Christian Linklaters work. And then Trudy, our second year. And I was sort of excited to, I guess, first she taught LSAC and other things and was doing Linklater again. 4 00:38:37So it was sort of like the same class again in a row. And I think Ruth was a really great Linklater teacher. And I don't know if I don't know Trudy and I just had something. I still tell, I, I S I'm still in contact with Ruth. She's my Alexander technique teacher now. And there was a 13 year gap in our relationship, but she'll always say like, oh, I'm going to this conference, Judy. I said, hi. You know, cause when I got my letter, it said that I had three absences from voice and speech. 4 00:39:18And to this day I say, no, I didn't, I would have never done that. Like I was pretty committed. She, I had a full freedom, so I was born like tongue tie and she was like, I want you to go. I never had any speech issues, but she's like, I want you to go see this doctor. So I went to see this Dr. Bastion. And he was an ear nose and throat guy that worked with actors in Chicago. And he was like, oh my God, let me clip it. And he's like, I've never gotten to do it. And I was like, so it's a little thing underneath your tongue. So it's, it actually tells your tongue behind your bottom teeth. Like everybody's develops that way when you're pouring it recedes. 4 00:40:00If you're not, they usually just clip it when you were born, but they never discovered mine. And so I wound up letting this doctor like do it. And then I had rehearsal for like my intro with Trudy. And I just remember meeting her in her office and her being like sticking her thumb in my mouth and being like, oh yeah, you have a significant overbite. Like, and just saying like, you know, you don't have a speech issue, but maybe if you got your tongue released, it would change your speech. You know, it's, I would love to see what it does. You know, I just felt like I was pretty committed to it. And David was my acting teacher second year. 4 00:40:40And in David's class it was like, I could do no wrong. You know what I mean? I remember like almost hating it, like him being like some like, okay, you know, you critique each other's like scenes or improv or whatever you were doing. And he would say, so who saw what ed was doing? And somebody was critiquing it. And they were like, what are you? He was like, you know, what are you talking about? Like, he was like, he was fine. Like, he was like, my opinion is the only one that matters. So, you know, and just being like, okay, so now they hate, 3 00:41:14I have to say I'm shocked that, you 2 00:41:16Know, usually the story is that the second year acting teacher hates your guts and then you get cut. Like, that was my experience. Cause I was cut and then asked back crazy, crazy. But, but it's interesting that David, that thought you could do no wrong in your, as your acting teacher? 4 00:41:39Well, it was really weird because I had David and first quarter I was in David's intro and he gave me a better grade in my intro. Then he did an acting class and I remember him saying to me, do you know why I did that? And me being like, yeah, like, and really having no clue. But I remember, I remember getting into a fight with him in that rehearsal for that intro and him saying something to being able to like, okay, well what, what, what do you want? And he was like, I don't know what, you know, just, you better try something else. Cause that's not working. Like he yelled at me and everybody was like, oh, and David and I used to take these, walks around the block at the theater school and have these little chats. And he was like, you know, he, he, he gave me every indication that he thought I was talented. 4 00:42:22And then I remember my second year of him saying to me, do you really want to be here for another two years? And I was like, well, yeah, you know, I really want a degree. And he was like, what are you going to get out of us Shakespeare classes? And I remember, and I was like, oh. And then I remember telling him about my issues with Trudy and him being like, you know, Trudy he's like, I'm the head of the voice and speech, which I didn't even didn't really even know at the time, you know, it was odd to me that he was, and, and then, but then he gave me, but then he gave me a bad grade, like enacting class. And so it was sort of like this. I was like, what the fuck? 4 00:43:02Like what, you know? And I just, you know, and then in my intros I was always like a middle-aged alcoholic. Like every single one, you know, or that I was like the alcoholic vicar in that horrible, a farce that thought it'll coat did where my, like I walked in the room in my pants, you know? And Corpus, yeah. It was like, first of all, farce is tough. You know, it's a tough, and for some reason they thought, you know, I heard this a lot about our class. Like, oh, these guys could do it. Like they could graph it. Well, guess what we couldn't and it fucking sucked. It was just like Riddick. 4 00:43:43I was like, Betty Hill, is that what I'm doing? Like, it was just like, it, it, 2 00:43:50It, it's hard to be funny care, but like the experience it makes you funny 4 00:43:59Is that I remember seeing David's like intro second quarter. It was like bomb and Gilliad. And I was like, why don't I get to play one of these like transvestite hookers? Like I can do that. And then it just wasn't, it, it was like the autumn garden, my last one. And again, it was like, I mean, Eric Yancey, I drink so much peach tea my second year of, cause the dining room was my first one. And it was like all of these like waspy, you know, I played like one little boy, that's the scene. We, we, we sorta had a yelling match about, but it was so I don't know. I mean, I was, I was, I remember Noel being like I got in and you didn't. 4 00:44:43I was just like, I didn't really, the thing was, I thought they stopped going to New York for the, I didn't ever have a desire to be on television or in the movies I wanted to be in the theater. And I went to the theater school and I sort of saw that transitioning transition happening. It was kind of like, I have no desire to live in LA. I just think it's like the new years and fake foods. Like, that's all I could think of when I'm thinking of LA. Like it was a desert, everything there is artificial. Like every, every blade of grass is like planted. I don't know. And I thought I was okay with it for a while. Cause when I moved home and my stepfather died kind of suddenly like that summer and you know, it was one of those things like, okay, everything happens for a reason, you know, it's really hard. 4 00:45:34Yeah. My mom, my father had passed away, but he was sick for a really long time. And so I think she was like prepared for that and she wasn't really prepared for my stepfather dying. And so I was okay with it for a long time, but I really, till recently we realized like, I think it really, you know, I remember somebody calling me and asking me to do it a play and not wanting to do it because I had to a lot of musical theater. And I was like, when I did the first play, I was like, wow, musical series is so hard. I'm like, why am I doing this? Like, you know, I sang a lot, but I was like, I hate singing. 4 00:46:14You know, I really don't even like it. And I just, so I, you know, I never saw myself as any Shakespeare characters. Like I was like, you know, I had to read every male part in high school and English class. I read every like male part while the teacher read every female part. And I was like, I hate Shakespeare. Maybe this isn't the place for me. What was disappointing about it is that I wanted it to agree, you know? And I was a good student and I think that my circumstance, this is just sort of allowed me to sort of flounder a bit and not really have a, a footing, not really have any direction, you know? 4 00:47:01So I had some great mentors and I did do some more things and, but very little. And then I moved to New York and it was really not about that. You know, it was about just see what else was out there. I just excited. I was like, okay, I'm moving to New York. And I had worked for J crew for a couple of years and I had left and I called them up. It was like a move to the city. I needed a job and they gave me a job and I started going out in the city. Somebody took me to a nightclub and it was like the first time ever. I was like, you know, we would go see, I, I saw the last grateful dead show in Chicago. 4 00:47:45Like we went to fish, meaner Bana when we were out there. And when I went into this like sort of world of these nightclubs and sort of saw all of these like characters that were present, I sort of became one. You know, I was, it was like my job to go out and, and have fun in sort of a clown. And it was, it was an interesting time in my life. I like to call it the turn of the last century, but it was like from, so I guess I, I moved to the city from like 98 till 2000, or I guess it was 99 till 2003 is when I moved here. 4 00:48:37So I was there for about four years, you know, I worked at the world trade center that was, you know, and I think that compounded things. And I think it sort of made me realize that I was having a lot of fun in New York. You know, I had this, I had great roommates. We had a great loft in Brooklyn, these crazy parties that were like before Brooklyn was cool. I say like, we've priced ourselves out of it. You know, we made it cool. And then, but it was nothing I could sustain or really even monetize. 4 00:49:20You know, there was always like the job that I had to maintain to with, I really had no desire to do theater and I didn't for about another 10 years till I moved here. And, and I was okay with that, you know, I was sort of working in retail and I realized, you know, later that the whole going out and becoming this like character, which I didn't really think I was doing at the time, but I really was, you know, doing things that I'd never done before, or, you know, even these parties were like insane. 4 00:50:02We would like wear like Russian military uniforms and have 200 people in a Japanese go-go band at our house and fill up, we would like fill up kiddie pools with water. We had a great space. And so we did, and I lived with a caricature artist and all these kids from Vassar and it was just, you know, we'd get like a sitar player and, and have like an opium den. And I just 2 00:50:40Have a question I have to go back to, what was your character like? What was your, your nightclub character? Sure. 4 00:50:48So I always joke that I looked like, like huckleberry Finn, you know, I was working for J crew, but I was, I was just myself, you know, I, I would, I had my baseball cap and I had this baseball cap that said ack, which is actually the three letter code for new work airport. And I'm sorry for Nantucket airport. My initials are the Newark airport and people. And so ack people. And I would like, have my pants rolled up different, you know, I worked for J crew. So I was like a walking, like, you know, the J crew like twist that, how it used to be pants rolled up at different lengths and like maybe, or I'd wear like a crusher hat or something. 4 00:51:29And I'd get in line with these people who were like going to bang, bang, and buying their like, you know, tight leather pants and stuff. And it just became like this. I was, you know, I was kind of like a quirky, you know, I dressed, I danced a little funny. I, I attribute movement to music to that. You know, I sort of just followed these impulses that had me sort of stomping my feet a lot. And I danced with my face a lot and I would show up with like a big bunch of gerbera daisies and a couple inflatable sunshines. 4 00:52:08And, you know, I had one friend Franco, who's the only person that I ever went out with. I could always go out by myself and, you know, leave by myself. And I would just, you know, do these fun things. Like, you know, I wrote like a Valentine to the world and like, you know, we put on red paper and pass it out to everybody. Or we would, we'd bring junior mints to junior, was the DJ and pass them out to everybody. Yeah. And people, you know, I was talking about the hat. People would say like, like, what does ack stand for? What does ack stand for? And I got, you know, and that goes to the three letter code for Newark airport. 4 00:52:52And I got so sick of it. I started this thing, like the hairball remover that Cass asked for by name, you know, like, and I didn't really, I never, you know, I still sort of felt like I didn't belong there. You know, it was kind of like this secret thing, but you know, you cold places all the time. And then people start, you know, recognizing you and, you know, you start like getting in for free or, you know, and I found these places where it just seemed, I was appreciated, you know, people would, and I met a lot of such interesting people. I mean, everybody from people who were, you know, Sharman to, there was some pretty, you know, crazy shenanigans that went on, you know, at the time. 4 00:53:44And some people that, I mean, everyone from Tonya Harding and then it comes out and she was interesting to me, but that's like the funniest story I ever time, I let her Newport cigarette for her. Like I do the Catholics, I would see it. Evan am, you know? Okay. 2 00:54:01So I'm just, there's like a theme here, which is that you went to the theater school for two years, and then all of a sudden you had to leave while you might have otherwise been processing your grief about that. You had to go all of a sudden process with your mom because she lost her second husband. And then you moved to New York to get that life going. And then nine 11 happened and you were working at the world trade center. So you have had major Griffis interruptus. 4 00:54:36It's true. Yeah. I, I think, and, and, and I've recognized in my life that I have a hard time, like getting things done that are in my normal routine. Like say, like getting my car inspected, you know, it's like once a year and it's like, whoa, you know, so when things like that happen, it takes me a long time to regroup. And you know, I'm not gonna, you know, sit here and say that I'm, that it, you know, these things like ruined my life in any way, shape or form, you know, I I'm, I'm so lucky that I, you know, I've been in the circumstances that I've been in and that I have a great family and that, you know, I always had a bit of a safety net. 4 00:55:25Not like some people, like, I didn't really have a safety net. Like I felt like in New York, I couldn't do theater because I wasn't independently wealthy. And I, and there was just no place to, you know, you really, it just doesn't exist anymore. You know, if you notice people who go to New York and become directors and, you know, actors are either, you know, inherit that position. I have 2 00:55:52Another way of making money, even though even this Celia Keenan Bolger's of the world. I mean, it is, you cannot, you cannot make a living, even if you're on Broadway. 4 00:56:04Right. It's true. You know, and it's, and it just became, I just became disenchanted with it. You know, I was like, I mean, I still love the theater, you know? And I was, like I said, I was really lucky. I had, you guys were talking about those monologue books, know like Jocelyn Baird is the woman who edited all of those books, which I didn't know, but she was someone who I did theater with when I was like in high school, she's who she picked my audition monologues. And she, you know, I'm still in contact with her. She's a playwright. And she went to Yale. She coaches kids on how to get into programs now, stuff that I was like, what is my brand, that kind of thing. 4 00:56:54But it's like, I, commercial theater I guess, was exciting to me in a certain way, but it was, you know, it was other theater that I liked too. And I don't think it was just theater. I think it was just art, you know? And I think it was like art in life is what I've discovered. You know, like everything is art, you can make anything artistic. And I think that's kind of what I do. I just haven't shaped it in a way, like, I need to write a book. 2 00:57:28You haven't been able to shape it because you've had suspend a lot of time in reaction mode, you know, to various losses 4 00:57:35That, yeah, like the whole nine 11 thing. I, you know, I remember, I didn't tell anyone that for years, you know, it was just something that, I mean, my friends knew there was, there was an Edward Ryan who died that day, who was from Westchester and star. And so there were people like my old boss, Alyssa, who was a harpist and a composer who I worked for as a personal assistant. And, you know, she just heard like names bred off. She knew that's where I worked. You know, we didn't have very few people had cell phones. I ran into one of her three sons and he was like, we got to call my mother. 4 00:58:16I was like, she literally was, she was afraid to call my mom. She was like, that was the only contact number I had for you is your house phone. And I didn't want to upset her. And I was like, oh my God. I just thought I was Ted. I, I will, could been, you know, it was, yeah, it was, it was a rough, it was a rough day, you know, I've had better. And it was my first day back after like 10 days of vacation. And we opened, there was a mall in the building six where the big divot down to the path, trains wound up, you know, the, the second tower that fell. 4 00:58:58And luckily, you know, we were really lucky. We, I, we locked ourselves in at first. I mean, we didn't have any sort of clue what was going on, you know, when you were sort of in it, even it wasn't until we got to the Seaport that we realized that there was planes being flown into the building. You know, I was like, we heard the second plane and we crossed the street and we saw the second building on fire. But at that point we thought somebody was like dropping bombs or shooting missile. You know, we couldn't, you know, come up with the, the idea of someone flying planes into the building. And, and I was like, you know, what do I, what do we do? 4 00:59:41You know, I was like, we're dead. And I was all right with it actually, you know, it was a, it was a strange feeling, but I was like, I'm okay with that. Like, I'm not going to spend my last moments here, screaming, yelling, running, like, you know, there's like this peacefulness about it. And I remember my nephew had been born, my sister's second son who lives here and I had never met him. And so that was the only like little thing I thought about as a regret. And then luckily we were okay, you know, and it was a long, you know, process of sort of also from my loft, I could see this, you know, smoke stack for the next, you know, three weeks. 4 01:00:29And I, even that day, I didn't really process anything until I got to a friend's house. And I, I, they were all there watching the news and I laid down behind them. They were like sitting in my futon and I like fell asleep. My adrenaline like finally ran out and then I woke up and I went home to my loft and the two girls that lived there, Lily and Rebecca were there and they just like grabbed me. And I don't think I stopped crying for like two days. Like I didn't leave the house. I didn't do anything. You know, I talked to my mother, but it was sort of like I was at work. 4 01:01:09So it was like, you know, and I was responsible for other people. And I, I felt like I also have to advocate for those people in the moment, you know, where they were like, oh, you know, well, you can come work at, you know, fifth avenue that day. And I was like, yeah, they're not going to work anywhere today. You know? And it was so I didn't tell anybody because people's reactions were so strong and I didn't want to like tell the story all the time, you know? And so I just didn't tell anybody for a long time. And I realized when I did that, it was actually helpful, you know, to talk about it and to talk about the, the impact of it. 4 01:01:54And I think that it, you know, made me a little more, maybe maybe careless or in a living, but also really living like really living, you know, in the moment, you know, and knowing what that meant, nothing like a little, you know, little flying a plane into your buildings to wake you up. Yeah. Yeah. So that was 2 01:02:22Yet the third or the fourth thing, which is that you graduated from school three years ago. I don't know if you were what you were planning to do when you left, but then the pandemic happened. 4 01:02:34Oh yeah. Not even three years ago. It was a year ago. Oh, that's when you were done was a year ago. Yeah, it was may. I went back to school in 2000, I guess it was 2019. I went for, so I got a bachelor's degree, but I went to Nepal for two years and I went there for a year and a half. So I somehow finished a four year degree in three and a half years, but yeah, I had enough credits. So I was like, bye. And yeah, I was stage managing for them a production. They were doing a little shop of horrors, which was really interesting stage managing and just sort of doing everything for them, for these kids. And I felt so terrible for them. 4 01:03:14And I mean, everything is still there. Like all the props we made, everything is just, I keep thinking of the Titanic it's frozen in time because they decided that even in spring, they were going to be fully remote because they didn't, they didn't think it was fair to leave it to the last minute to decide they wanted people to be able to kiss those sort of ducks in a row and, and know what to expect. Cause I think that was really one of the hardest things on any students or kids during the whole pandemic was like every, you know, the, from month to month, they didn't know what was coming next. You know? 2 01:03:49I mean, I kind of feel like that's how I had spent sort of the stopping and starting of Edward Ryan you've sort of stopped and started and stopped and started. And, and now you, you, you started school, you finished school and you were, and so the kids too, but also you stopping and starting. Yeah. 4 01:04:07Yeah. I mean, I think, I think that, you know, I have a little more, I have some more skills to deal with it. You know, I have a little more, it's like my work at school, you know, just cultivating creativity with this class that really affected me and sort of made me realize that I was more than just a theater artist probably. And do you remember those photographs in the like nineties of like different, like the Beastie boys are run DMC and they were on the rooftops of buildings. So this guy, John Nardell was that photographer. He worked for all these different it's, he's not the person you would expect to be taking photographs, but he was a teacher at the school and he taught this class and this class is so annoying. 4 01:04:55Like it's going to really drive me crazy. And all the kids were really like, he railed against like every assignment does a lot of work and we weren't allowed to buy anything. We had to make everything. And, you know, he gave us a lot of art supplies, but we had to like build vessels to like carry them in and incorporate every handout somehow creatively into this, into this book. And I mean, it was a lot of work and I would, I stay up till three o'clock in the morning, like, you know, making these things and doing the stuff. And he was like, you know, your work is like, incredible it's so it's, it's so much beyond, you know, what were some of the kids are doing here? 4 01:05:36And I was like, well, it shouldn't be, you know, like I have a little, few more resources than they have in their dorm and, you know, but, but the kids too, they were sometimes inspired in that to, you know, these kids to inspire them was like such a, a great thing because they were, so some of them were so disenchanted. And by the end of this class, you could just see that they had all found like what they were good at, like what sort of creative, artistic thing that they really connected with and that they loved and that they were just excelling in. And it was so exciting. Like it was really a, it was a great class. 4 01:06:18I 2 01:06:18Love that it was called cultivating creativity. 4 01:06:21Yeah. Good class. And I mean, you know, we either studied artists or, or, or techniques from Zen, Zen, Zen doodle, or 2 01:06:35Zen doodle. Yeah. There's 4 01:06:36Dan tangles. Yeah. Like he was a Venn tangle instructor. So, you know, we started with that. We did, like, we studied like in Stein and like, it is like sort of pop flags. And we each took a, a country. We were assigned to country and their flag and we, you know, created, you know, work from that. It was a really a great class, but hard, you know, these kids were not used to being asked to do to actually like work. I mean, the school itself knows who their students are. I think a lot of them have, you know, different accommodations and different, you know, struggles or opportunities. 4 01:07:18And, you know, they come from, like I said, an underserved communities and places, and it's like one of those places where, you know, if like Frank, the guy who ran the program was like, I couldn't let, just kidnapped graduate, you know, you know, like there's no way. And you know, whether it's paying his tuition bill or, you know, or raising money, whatever needs to happen. And, and, you know, he got me ready and Frank got me writing again. I directed, I took a directing class, which was a great read life, you know, so great books. 4 01:08:01And it was fun. You know, I really sort of was inspired to just be creative. And I looked at some MFA programs and I auditioned at Yale and I, I think I realized I did not get in, but I realized before that, that I, and Ruth was like, do you really want to go there? And I was like, you know, it's yeah. You know, and she's like, Hmm. And when I went there, I realized what she meant it, like, first of all, it's a shithole about bad facilities, you know, while you're waiting in an old computer lab with like broken computers, stacked in the corner, going this girl from West Virginia, she was a young girls high. And from what I was like, oh, this is what you thought. Yeah. You know, and I sort of felt like they had given the keys, you know, it was like the opposite of the theater school. 4 01:08:48It was like the kids were running that place. I mean, they held all the power and I think it's, it's sort of the way things are going these days, you know, with the me too movement teachers are one of the teachers at Yale said we are the only teachers that have to teach our students naked sometimes. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, what? We are the only teachers that have to teach their students naked. Sometimes 2 01:09:15The students are naked or the teachers are the students. What for, for zoom? I mean, on zoom, they're naked. 4 01:09:21No. I mean just different productions where, you know, they are directing a student who is nude and that's why there's intimacy coaches and all of that now, you know, to protect them. Because I mean, you can obviously see working in close proximity with a naked student that could open you up to problems, say like at the school, like what did Kat call it a spontaneous sex of study naps. I mean, there was a loud groping and touching going on that was like, you know, probably, you know, innocent, but you know, could certainly have been a trigger for some people. Sure. You know, like Trudy shoving her thumb in my mouth. 4 01:10:03Yeah. Not good. Not good. Yeah. So that was the day I had three, sorry, three absences. And I was, and I, myself use was damaged by habitual use was the other thing on my letter when I got cut from the theater school, self use was debt is damaged by habitual. You understand what that means? Well, neither did I. I mean, but as I think at that age, I just thought, well, I'm damaged. 2 01:10:31I also can tell you that Rick Murphy, when we were doing set, a very similar thing that David said to you, so I'm doing space work. Rick comes up to me, whispers in my ear. What are you doing? Drop out and go see the world. 4 01:10:48Yeah. 2 01:10:49And I'm like, I'm like doing work first year, second year. I don't remember. He whispered in my ear, why are you here? Go, go see the world or something. And I was like, what is happening? 4 01:11:02You know, I loved Rick Murphy. I mean, he was just like magic, right? I mean, this is not a pipe dream was like, so in captivity it was called freewill and one lust back then. And that was the other thing I wanted to tell you 2 01:11:20That it changed names. Oh no, no, no

Software Social
Shutting Down and Opening Up: A Conversation with Marie Poulin, Creator of Notion Mastery

Software Social

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 6, 2021 59:51


 Pre-order Michele's book on talking to customers! https://deployempathy.com/order Marie's course, Notion Mastery: https://notionmastery.com/ Marie's Twitter: https://twitter.com/mariepoulin Marie's YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCKvnOhqTeEgdNt1aJB5mVng Marie's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mariepoulin/  Michele Hansen  00:00Welcome back to Software Social. This episode is sponsored by Approximated. If you need to connect custom user domains to your app, Approximated can help. It can route any domain or subdomain to any application, all easily managed with a simple API or web dashboard. You can have unlimited connected domains automatically secured with SSL certificates for one flat rate. Website builders, communities and marketplaces all happily use Approximated every day to manage thousands of custom domains for their users. And it was built by an indie founder just like you, so every support request is handled by a developer who will personally help you out. Head over to Approximated.app today and mention Software Social when you sign up to get an extra month for free.  Michele Hansen Hey, welcome back to Software Social. We have another guest with us this week. I am so excited to have my friend, Marie Poulin, here today. She is the creator of Notion Mastery, which is this amazing Notion course that has over 1200 students, averaging $45,000 MRR. Pretty amazing business that she has built up. Welcome to Software Social, Marie. Marie Poulin  01:18Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to chat.  Michele Hansen  01:21So um, people listening may know you from all of your YouTube videos and courses with Notion, which have been crazy successful, and only, only, since October 2019, since you launched it, but I actually want to talk about something else. So you had another business, a course business called Doki, and actually, the last time I spoke, like, like, like, actually spoke with you like, internet friend is so funny. Like, I feel like I talk to you all the time, but actually, like talk to you, talk to you, was you and your husband, Ben, were thinking about what to do with Doki and whether you should sell it or shut it down. Marie Poulin  02:15Yes, and you very kindly reached out with some suggestions on how we might handle that. And it, it sort of wasn't, I don't want to say it wasn't our passion anymore, but yeah, you know, Ben got offered a full time gig. So for anybody listening, my husband and I teamed up back in 2014 to, to run our company together. We built a software and we ran it for I mean, five-ish years or so, and I think neither one of us was, it was definitely our first software project. And it was that build a giant software project that does all of the things and, you know, kind of wishing that we had done something smaller when we learned about the whole software building all of the different pieces. And so when we first went to MicroCon, that was, it was just so eye opening how many things we had done wrong, and it was it was a really wonderful learning experience. But I think it kind of showed us that there were parts of that, that just, I don't know that either of us was super excited to go 100% all in on it. I liked the working with people side of online courses and actually shipping and working on their websites, and just all of, all the other pieces of it other than the software. And so the burden was really on Ben to build all the features and do customer support, and, you know, he was pretty much like the solo founder handling all of those parts of the software, and I was handling more of the consulting side of it. And it was a huge burden on him. It was huge. And so when he got offered a full time job, it was a chance for him to step into more of a leadership role, be challenged, be working with other people, and it just, he really flourished. And I think it was something he was missing. Like, when you're a solo founder, you're just, you know, you're wearing every single hat. You're making all the decisions. And if you're bumping up against stuff you've never seen, it's pretty tough. It's a tough life to be, to be solo founder. So I was really encouraging him to, to kind of explore this new venture, but it sort of meant that Doki got left in the dust a little bit. And so we kind of took our foot off the gas, and just in this year in January 2021 we decided what if we just kind of shut down signups and, and just kind of let it do its thing and just kind of keep supporting the clients that were still using it, more like our consulting clients and not really market at widely. And so we did and I was like, how do you feel about this? And he's like, oh, I feel I feel so relieved. And I think that was really important that it didn't feel sad. It didn't feel like oh no, we're shutting this thing down. Like he felt like no, this is a chapter of my life that was great. And now it's over. So it's been a journey. Michele Hansen  04:54So, I mean on, you know, on this podcast, you know, we talk a lot about like, getting a SaaS off of the ground, or I guess, in my case now, like, getting an info product off the ground, and then also running those companies. But there's this other phase of it, which is exiting, and sometimes exiting means selling a company, or, you know, being acquihired by someone, or it means shutting it down. And I'm wondering if you can kind of talk through that a little bit about how you guys decided to sunset it, rather than sell it. Marie Poulin  05:37Yeah, because we had gone through this conversation back and forth. And we even had, you know, several people who had made offers to buy, and it felt actually pretty close, like, that was something we were really seriously considering. And again, you're, it was just really, really valuable to get your, your insights on that, and to have somebody that, you know, not attached to it just kind of as an outsider giving us perspective on that. And so we, we had some meetings, and we definitely considered it, and I think the burden of what would have needed to happen to be able to make that handoff happen in a way, such that it could actually be successful for those who are taking it over, felt too big for Ben. I think it was, again, given that his attention was elsewhere, it there was just such a cognitive load associated with all of that cleanup work, and just, just kind of the whole process of that transition. And it's possible that it may not have actually been that much work. It's kind of hard to know, in hindsight, but I think the anticipation of that, and just, you know, when Ben does something, he wants to do it properly, and he wouldn't have felt good, I think to just kind of pass it off as is knowing how much legacy work needed to be rebuilt. And he, he just didn't feel comfortable with it. And I was like, you know, I don't know this stuff as well as you do. And if you feel really confident and happy to just kind of say, you know, what, we're totally cool to just, like, the, the amount just kind of doesn't match up with, with what it would be worth to do that work, and how much extra time it would have taken him outside of his full time job. It just, it didn't feel like it was quite worth it to do that investment of the work. So that was a decision I sort of felt it was kind of up to them to make as a burden was really on him, and I think he felt a huge relief, honestly, even just like taking the signup off of the site. And just realizing, like, our business has gone in such a different direction, and it's okay to say goodbye to this chapter, and so it felt good. And I think that was really important is can we stand behind this decision? Does it feel good? Does it release a certain, you know, energetic burden, and it really did, and so that we felt good at the end of the day, for us that, that was the right decision. Michele Hansen  07:44I'm struck by how much respect I hear in that. You know, there's the respect that you have for Ben, that this was something that he knew really well and what like, had, you know, that, that, that transition work would have been on on him and your respect for that. And then his and also sort of both of your respect for your emotions, and recognizing those as valid and worth prioritizing, and, because I think some people say, oh, well, I'll, you know, get a lot of money from this. So you know, screw my feelings, like, you know, just have to suck it up, suck it up and do it. Like, I mean, the the market for even small SaaS companies like Doki, like, like, just for content, like, how much was Doki, like, making when you decided to shut it down? I mean, Ben would certainly have a better sense of the numbers at that point that we made the decision. I mean, certainly the pandemic did have a big impact. And we'd already kind of stopped doing any new feature development, even maybe the year before the pandemic hit. So I would say, you know, at its height, maybe $50,000 in a year. So we had some months that were like 4k, maybe 5k, and so by the time we shut it down, it was like 2500 to 2000. Like, nothing to sneeze at in terms of it was very low maintenance and, you know, covers our mortgage and expensive, like, that's awesome. But there is that mental load that's required there that you're kind of always thinking about that uptime, or you're thinking about how long, how long can we go not adding any features and not doing anything to really kind of improve or support or even do any marketing. So in some ways, it sort of felt like there was a time limit on how long we could get away with just, just letting it kind of simmer in the, in the background and not give it its full attention, and so it didn't feel good in that way that it it did have this sort of energetic burdensome feeling, and so respect is is absolutely huge. Like, you know, both Ben and I are incredibly autonomous. Like, we have always kind of worked almost like two separate founders under the same brand umbrella. So even when we partnered up, we still very much had our own projects, our own clients, and there's a lot of trust there with like, Ben and I are very different people, very different types of projects, very different things that light us up. And so, you know, Ben has higher anxiety than I do, and when we first launched Doki, I know the feeling of always being on and having to answer those customer support questions, and I think it takes a bigger toll on him than, than it might other people. And so that has to be factored in, like, what's the point of building these, like, software and these businesses that support our lives when it's just adding to our daily stress? Like, that's, that's not the point, right? So I think for both of us, it does really matter. Like, what kind of life are we building for ourselves? And if, are we building something that just feels like another job, but we just kind of built our own jail? Like, that's, that's not really fun. So I think we have a lot of understanding and respect for, yeah, what kind of life are we building, and ideally reducing stress and not adding to it so that, that was really important to me that he felt really good about that enclosure and didn't feel like oh, this was a failure, or, you know, it didn't go the way we wanted. For me, I'm like, holy crap, we learned an epic crap ton. You know, we just, it was just absolute, you know, entrepreneurship school on steroids. Like, you know, you just learned so many different parts from your customer research and the technical capacity and all the decisions that once you've done it once, and then it's almost too late, like, the wheels are in motion, and you've already, there's already, like, technical debt as soon as you started. It's a wonderful learning opportunity, and part of us wishes we'd tried it on something small, but my gosh, the learning has been incredible. So I don't, I don't regret any of it, and I don't think he does, either. It's the reason he has the job that he does now. It, he's, he's just like, both of us, I think are just highly skilled people that are going to adapt whatever happens like okay, cool. That was an awesome chapter. Next. What's next, you know.  You guys are incredibly emotionally intelligent and atuned, and, I mean, yeah, I mean, that you take that kind of focus is really, I think, remarkable and really commendable. And, you know, so after we had we had talked last fall, I guess, you guys were still kind of, you were unclear on whether you were going to shut it down or you were going to sell it, and I just tweeted out if anybody was interested in buying a SaaS, I think I said it had like 2.4k MRR. And I got so many messages after that, but I actually just got another one last week, and I got one, like, three months ago, like, the market for really, like really tiny SaaS companies is just, just bonkers. And I think it's so amazing that you prioritized how, like, not just the money, but how you felt about it. Now, of course that the notion courses making 45,000 a month and Ben has a full time job, like, that sort of makes it a little bit easier to make decisions that are not just guided by the financials, I imagine. Marie Poulin  13:16Definitely. That's true. Yeah. Yeah, I'm sure that, that was a part of it was just, okay, we're not we don't have to make a purely financial decision right now, so what's going to feel, yeah, what's gonna feel the best? And I guess, yeah, I guess they didn't realize that maybe not everybody is as driven that way, but I'm definitely a very feelings driven person, and I know, we've talked about this a little bit with, with the sort of, you know, likely being an ADD or ADHD founder, and just, I didn't realize before, I think, how much of my decision making around how I've shaped my business has been, like, I've talked about it in terms of alignment and, you know, values-driven and that sort of thing. But I think part of it is I cannot muster up the energy to do stuff I'm not super freakin' stoked about. So I do kind of factor that into all my decisions. Like, I'm never going to design services that I'm going to be resentful of as soon as I'm designing them. It's like, if I already know I'm going to be resentful doing all these calls, like, I just cannot make that, that service available. So I do think I've gotten pretty tuned into like, alright, what's the stuff that lights me up, and how do I craft my offers so that I can be totally shining and excited about them? Because that, that's just, I guess, how I move through the world. Michele Hansen  14:34It seems like you combine this incredible self-awareness about what energizes you and prioritizing what energizes you with this huge sense of responsibility for the users of what you have created. Marie Poulin  14:54Yeah, I'd like, I'd like to think so. I mean, you know, one of the things that happened when we first launched Doki, was that people were signing up for it, and then they weren't shipping. Right? It's like anything now, like the time that it takes to actually launch a course, and I know you've had, you know, episodes with Colleen about this of just what it really takes to really grow an online course and actually make it a sustainable living. And so people would, would sign up thinking the tech was gonna solve that for them, and they're all, like, ready to go, and they they pick the technology well before they have their content created. And it didn't feel good that there were people paying us a monthly thing and they had never shipped a course yet. So, the first thing I did was like, well, we need to get people shipping faster, how do I do this? And I ended up creating a course that was run your learning launch that was trying to get people to like, get the shitty first draft of your course out as soon as possible, right. Like, co-create it with people. I'm a huge, huge believer, in co-creating products with your people. They are going to tell you what they want, they tell you what they need, and then the words that they use in those sessions, in those live calls that you're doing with people, that's exactly what shapes your, your sales pages and stuff. So I, I'm just a big fan of working with people on this stuff, and not just, you know, working in secret for six months building a thing, and then you know, putting it out into the world. Like, we know that it just it just doesn't work that way. So yeah, I think I do carry a huge, huge respect for, for the users that are signing up for my thing. It is a responsibility I do not take lightly. And so even right now with, with the course, I've been working for six months on the new curriculum. It's like, where can I look at all the places that people are stumbling, and maybe we overwhelm new, new people that are coming in like going, oh, my gosh, this course is so big, and then they get scared, and they run away and then they don't complete the course. Like, it does matter to me not just that they complete it, but they actually do experience some kind of transformation through that process. So like, how can I improve the learning outcomes? How can I design this better? I can't help myself, like maybe that's partly a bit of perfectionism. But it's like, I want this to be a really epic experience for them and be really memorable. And, in a way, that's my marketing, right? It's like other people sharing with other people, their experience of the course. To me that feels way better, and way easier than like, chucking a bunch of money into ads and just like getting it in front of people. It's like, no, I want the users to be so excited about it, that they are shouting it from the rooftops and getting people in the door. So yeah, that matters for sure. Michele Hansen  17:20It's so interesting, you're talking about like, building collaboratively with people, and, you know, I like I'm a huge advocate of talking to people and talking to customers, but I never really built in public, so to speak, until a couple of months ago, when I was writing my book. And you know, to what you said about, you know, getting early feedback from people and building it with them, that, that has been an incredibly, like, a transformative experience. And it's, it's really remarkable when you combine that combination of, as you said, something that you are super stoked about with other people who are stoked about it, like, you know, like to kind of, you know, talk a little bit about being like, you know, ADHD founder. So like, for so for, just to give us sort of a little bit of context. So like, I was diagnosed with ADD at 11, which I guess they don't diagnose people with anymore, because apparently, like, they were only diagnosing girls with it, or something. So now everything is all under ADHD. And you sort of are recently exploring, like, whether you're ADHD, and so but like, on this, this combination of, you know, working on something you're really passionate about, and then in the course of working on it in public, finding other people who are really passionate about it, who help you improve it, like, I feel like that puts my hyper focus in this insane overdrive. Marie Poulin  18:54Yeah. How do you how do you control that? I'm so, I'm so curious kind of what your, Michele Hansen  18:58I don't. I, yesterday, I was so annoyed that I had to stop working and make dinner. I was like, can't I just work for like, 48 hours straight, like, and, which is, like, not, like, I, like, my work life balance is a lot better than it used to be like, but I just like it's so, it's, like, painful when I'm really interested in something because it's like, yesterday, I was like, working on the book, like and it was just I was so, like, so fired up about what I was working on. And then I was like, okay, actually, like, we need to, we need to eat. Like, and I have you know, we have a family and like, my husband was mowing the lawn and like, you know, so I was like, okay, I need to like go to the grocery store like, I need to shift gears, but like, the whole time I was there like, you know, yes, I bought like lettuce and yogurt and whatever else we needed, but like, my brain was still like, writing.  Marie Poulin  19:48Somewhere else.  Michele Hansen  19:49Like, my brain like, was writing and I think, you know, to what you said about how you and Ben work very like, autonomously, like, Mathias and I work together for the most part, and I think this gets frustrating sometimes when I'm still thinking about something else, but I don't give any, like, outward signals of that. I'm just like, a little bit quiet. And like, he like, talks to me and like, I just don't know,  Marie Poulin  20:12You're nodding and say you're listening, but you're writing in your head. Yeah. Michele Hansen  20:14Yeah. Like, I don't even acknowledge it or, like, I seem like I'm listening. And then he asked me 10 minutes later, like about what he had told me about, and I'm like, what, like, this is new, and he's like, seriously. Like, the hyper focus can be amazing, but also kind of detrimental at the same time because if I have to do anything else, I'm just cranky. Marie Poulin  20:40I definitely, I definitely relate to this, and I think this was, this was one of the the signs like, I, I thought, well, I couldn't possibly have ADHD because like, I've been self-employed for 12 years, and I have a successful business and I get things done, and, you know, I sort of had a lot of misconceptions around what it meant to be or have ADHD because my sister has ADHD, too. And she is like, the poster child of what what you think of when you think of ADHD, and very hyperactive, super distracted, extremely extroverted, just like, a million thoughts, like, interrupting other thoughts. And, and I was like, okay, that's what ADHD looks like. It was very distinct. And so because I get things done, I sort of thought, I just had a different perception of it, and I realized that the hyper focus binges that I go on that were like, oh, that explains why like, it can be really hard to tear myself away from, from the screen, and it almost becomes borderline obsessive, and it can be really difficult to manage. So that is one of the signs I started to be like, oh. It always happens in these super inconsistent bursts, right? Very, very wildly inconsistent. And I always, yeah, like, frick, if you just have a dial, you could, you could, you could turn that on when you needed to, but oh my gosh, so I can relate to that. Just, it's inconvenient, and yeah, it's also the thing that helps us kind of push forward and get things done, and it's a wonderful thing when it's there, but it can happen at the detriment of other parts of our lives. So that's definitely something that I struggle with, for sure. Michele Hansen  22:13You know, I, like, I relate so hard to that, because I can't possibly, you know, have ADHD because you get so much done. Like, when I was in college, I think there was like, a running joke about how many jobs and side projects I had at any given time. Like, I think it was like, I had, it was like, six. Like, I had a part time job, I had an internship, I had like, volunteering, I had, like, all of these like, side projects with my own going on, like, um, and, but when I, so when I was diagnosed as a kid, like it was very much presented as I had this deficit of focus. And then I had to overcome that deficit of focus, and then like, that was it. And like, I, so I was never like, really in therapy or any sort of treatment. Like I was taught how to manage that, like calendars, and like, planners became a huge part of my life. But when I was, this was when I was in elementary school. So when I was in middle school, I was supposed to have like, you know, a tutor, and like somebody who like worked with me on it, and like, a plan, they call it a 504 plan in the US, but I never actually had it because my grades were too high. And,  Marie Poulin  23:21People always think you need the support, right?  Michele Hansen  23:22Right. Because it was like, oh, like if you you know, if you have those, like if you have this deficiency, like, she's overcome the deficiency if she's getting A's and B's, so there's no problem here. And I didn't, really for me, it wasn't only until the last like six months or a year that I started understanding all of these other facets of it that, like, it's not just that sometimes I have trouble focusing on tasks I don't want to do. Like, there's all of these other things like, you, you know, that, there's the hyper focus you mentioned, there's the like, the perfectionism that you touched on earlier, you know, there are those kind of, you know, everyone's experience of it is different. But like, I, there's just so many things that like, I thought were me things that were just kidn of weird about me. And then it turns out, there's all these other people who are weird, like me, and, Marie Poulin  24:16To read other people's descriptions, and you go, are you kidding me? Like, that's a, that's a thing? I'm not alone? Or like, I thought it was just a family quirk, and then you're like, oh, or is it that actually a good chunk of my family also, you know, like sister's diagnosed and when you look at the behaviors, you're like, oh, yeah, like, it would explain why our family kind of operates this way. And, you know, the more you start to meet people, you're like, oh, okay, there's, there's maybe a reason, too, that, and I don't know if you if you feel this too, but that for example, people with ADHD seem drawn to my work or drawn to my, my style, right? Because I think in some ways you get attracted to different people's communication styles, and I realized, like, in certain calls that I would I have with people that were very energizing, I didn't realize this at the time, it's almost like, you know, when you like, once you see it, you start to see it everywhere, of all the people that I connect with that had ADHD that I didn't know, I was like, oh my gosh, that explains why when we get on a call, neurons are firing, and we're all over the map, and we're just like changing gears, like, constantly, and it just feels like this creative spark is just like, going and going and it's incredible. It's a very different experience with someone whose brain doesn't work that way, and I, I started to clue in, I'm like, oh, maybe there's a reason. And then when you start to look at the behaviors, I'm like, okay, like, it would explain a lot. You know, and you start to kind of look backwards and be like, oh, yeah, all those behaviors start to kind of click into place. And you see, actually, things with a new lens. And when I look at past behaviors, and maybe ways I've really, really judged myself, and I was like, oh my gosh, like, I just, I didn't realize, you know, and I think for me, a big part of that is workaholism, in a way. Like I thought, I really judged myself for being like, oh, I'm like a workaholic, a workaholic. And I thought, yes, and like, it's not so black and white like that. I am very driven by the work that I do because I've so carefully crafted work that I don't hate, and so I've designed work that I love. I'm getting to connect with people and ideas get to form, and I'm always doing new things every day. So of course, like it's feeding that dopamine, I'm like, yeah, it's like, I love this. And so, it is really difficult to shut off work. And so I think I carried a lot of guilt that I work on weekends, but also take really long breaks in the middle of the day and go gardening. And so like, I have found my own ebb and flow, and I think I was really harsh on myself with some of that stuff. And then I was like, well, what if it's actually okay, that my brain is a little more activated than the average person or, or it just kind of feeds off information differently, and maybe I want to consume more courses at a time than the average person. And so it's just brought up a lot of interesting reflection that I'm seeing behaviors and maybe a different light, and that I actually find I'm being a little more compassionate with myself to be like, hey, is that Maria's personality is that ADHD? Is that me coping? Like, it's still very much learning for me. So I'm still kind of just keeping an open mind and just really trying to reflect and notice those behaviors now. Michele Hansen  27:20You know, the, we are, you know, what's called sort of neurodivergent people living in a neurotypical world. And I think, from, you touched on sort of that, that guilt about not having sort of, quote, unquote, like, normal patterns for things and ways of thinking about things. And I think unpacking that shame that we don't fit the neurotypical box is so important, because, I think in, you know, education and kind of maybe, and like, when you're not working for yourself, like neurotypical is the standard, and people who don't meet that are kind of just outside of that. And so, like, there's like this, like, we blame ourselves for that. But if instead, you know, we can, like find ways to work on the things that we are passionate about, and that do energize us, then these, like, amazing things can be unlocked. And I think, like, I have noticed that I tend to find a lot of neurodivergent people in the kind of, like, indie SaaS courses like, internet biz world, and I wonder if that's because a lot of us have just felt like we didn't, yeah, like, we didn't really belong and like, but like, the way to, like really bring out like, what we are capable of, like, like, I remember when I worked, you know, in bigger companies, like I always, I would describe myself, like a pin and a pinball machine. Like, I just always felt like I was just like, bouncing around constantly trying to show like, what I was capable of, and like, what I was good at, and like, what I could do and what I could contribute, and that was always, like, way more and different than whatever the role I was in was supposed to be doing. And it was so frustrating. Like, it was like, deeply frustrating, you know, versus now, like, you know, I can focus on the things that, you know, sort of with, I guess, with a little bit of business knowledge, right? Because you can't just focus on things that don't lead to an income. Um, you know, like, yeah, the things that really energize, and like you've said, how this, like, managing your own brain in a way, it's kind of like, maybe what attracted you to notion in the first place, and then kind of prompted you to go on this path of making this amazingly, like, I'm so amazed by all the things you build with Notion, like this tool that, like, helps you not only steer your brain, but like express it in the way that it wants to be expressed that maybe is not really reflected and other tools. Marie Poulin  29:53Yeah, it's a, it's a weird and wonderful thing, but it does feel like this bizarre culmination of all of my weird interests and strengths, and like even the fact that it's kind of like a No Code builder of sorts, right? It's like I have a web design background, and so I think naturally I'm inclined to build information architecture, but do it beautifully. Like, that's what I did for clients. And so, and then even like my design thinking background, and how I've studied systems, or how I've had to find these productivity systems for myself that worked. And the way certain tools, you know, are very opinionated, and they, they sort of force you into, like, like Asana, for example, everything is a task, like, it sort of forces you into one way of thinking, which is great, it's a great task manager. But I'm like, my strategic planning doesn't really fit in there, and how do I connect that to, to, and everything just kind of felt messy. And, you know, as someone with ADHD that already, already feels like I'm everywhere all the time, for me, Notion was this place where like, suddenly I could see everything that was on my plate in one place in a really easy way. So this ability to like, zoom out, zoom in very, very quickly and have it all integrated was just like, ah, everything like has come into place. And it just kind of clicked, and I think I was just so passionate, so excited about it, it felt like you know, I said life was a shit show before Notion. Like I had tried to get to, like you said, lean on calendars, we like find the systems to kind of lean on like a bit of a crutch. But there were still some systems pieces missing that Notion, in a way, forced me to build my own in a way that really worked for my brain. And I don't think it's a coincidence that just so many of the people that have joined the course or that seem really excited about it and get a lot out of it have also mentioned their own ADHD. Like, I literally just saw a message pop up in the forum, like 20 minutes ago that said how they think notion is just an ADHD friendly tool. I'm like, What an interesting thing that, again, it wasn't even on my radar a year ago or two years ago. I didn't even really think about it. I didn't, I certainly didn't even remotely suspect that I would have had it. And yet, now that I'm aware of it, and I'm seeing more conversations around neurodiversity, really just seeing how Notion gives neurodiverse folks a place to be themselves, as kind of cheesy as it sounds, like, the fact that you can just make it what you want it to be. It can be a personal growth engine, it can be a place where you organize your files, you know, daily journaling, like, you name it, whatever you want it to be, it can be a place that inspires you. And so I just, I love to show people like, well, here's how I'm using it for my garden tracking, I just love there's just endless possibilities with it. And I think if you only look at it as a productivity tool, you know, people kind of poopoo it or they're like, oh, procrastinate, procrastinating on building their setups, and let you know, people have all sorts of opinions about it. But I actually think it is, it's a tool for managing your emotions just as much it is as a tool for managing your information. So I find it quite fascinating from a tool for making you more mindful about how you work and what you need, and just noticing your energy. And I didn't, I didn't know all that stuff wasn't stuff that other people did. It's not till showing it to people, and they're like, holy crap, this is the most organized thing I've ever seen in my life. And I'm like, me, are you kidding me? Because like, I see the baseline the scenes, right? It's like, it's, it's funny to me the things that it's only once, you know, to bring it back to your conversation about sharing in public, working in public. When you make your thinking visible, and you share what you're doing out there, that's where I think you start to see what are those spiky points of view that you have? Or what are the interesting ways that you approach stuff that people are like, whoa, I didn't even think of it that way. So yeah, I'm curious, too, in you sharing your stuff publicly, and doing the writing publicly, like, has anything surprised you that you put out there and you're like, oh, wow, I didn't expect that to really land for people or, you know, what did you notice in your process of sharing your stuff publicly? Michele Hansen  33:53Yeah, I mean, so something that actually has surprised me in the last, I've had two people in the last week, tell me how the introduction of my book made them completely rethink how they approach other people. And,  Marie Poulin  34:11Wow Michele Hansen  34:12How they like, didn't even like, they didn't realize like, the extent of empathy and what it was and how they could use it and how it can help them be a better you know, coworker or person and, like, not just someone who's better at making landing pages or making product decisions. And I started out, like, I, so I, the the introduction, I actually originally didn't really have a very good introduction of the book. Like, I didn't define empathy very much or anything. And then one of my early readers was like, I think, I think you need to introduce this a little more. And so I did, and then like, it basically sounds like people are, some people like reading the first 10 pages and then being like, whoa, and then like, going on this other path. And then like, and then they're like, okay, well when I actually like, need to build something I'll come back here for the scripts. But like, having this, and, you know, like we've talked, like we've talked a lot about, like emotional intelligence here, and like, I've had my own journey with there and like, talking about, you know, workaholism, like, is that is that a trait? Or is that a trauma response? Like, it's kind of both, like, and like, so that has been a really important journey for me. By the way, if that resonates with anyone that's called the flight response, just Google that. And, and so that like, like, I have this kind of like, this, like, little dream that like, you know, like, people, nobody puts like, be more empathetic on their to daily to do list, maybe some, maybe you do. But like, nobody really doesn't. But they put like, you know, get more sales, like, write a new landing page, like, figure out which features I should build. Like, those are the things that come up on people's to do lists. And so I have this, like, kind of dream that like, in the process of helping people do those things they already want to do that they will become more empathetic in general and learn that this is a skill that they can apply not just to business, but to the rest of their life, because it's been such an important journey for me, because it's something that I really didn't really learn until my 20s. And, and, yeah, I mean, that's, I don't know. Yeah, it's been very, like, it's been very soul-nourishing for me.  Marie Poulin  36:31The process of writing and sharing?  Michele Hansen  36:34Yeah, I think like, in a very unexpected way, and, you know, kind of talking about ADHD, and so it sounds like what you're doing, like, you sound very much like a systems thinker. And you have built this sort of digital system that reflects your mental system, and in the process of doing so, you're helping people realize that, you know, they could build off of that to build something that reflects their mental system. And it's like, and you're helping them really like, blossom into, into expressing their thinking. And what I'm doing, like, I have, I have had feedback from people who have said, they are ADHD, or autistic, and they have said that, like, this is very, very different for them, for, I mean, for those two groups for very different reasons. But like, I've had people tell me, like, I don't think I'm capable of doing this because, you know, as you said, there's a kind of that stereotype of people who are ADHD that they, like, you know, talk over the people, like, can't stay on a topic, like, you know, just all of that, which, like, I mean, I think if we weren't doing a podcast right now, like, we would be excitedly talking over each other right now, like.  Marie Poulin  37:53I was wondering.  Michele Hansen  37:54I, like, am really holding back. Marie Poulin  37:57Which is exhausting, right? It's like, it takes a lot of energy to, like, tone it down, be normal, like,   Michele Hansen  38:04Oh, I'm gonna go jump on the trampoline after this. But, like, for me, it's like this weird thing, because, because I didn't learn, like, this either wasn't built into me, or I didn't learn it as a kid, like, I've had to really focus on learning how to like, listen to people. Marie Poulin  38:23You're so good at it. Michele Hansen  38:25It became a hyper focus thing for me, like, so I feel like when I'm listening to people, like learning, like, I have to like, I think it's why people are like, oh, this made me realize these things about empathy I didn't even realize, because I had to, like learn empathy and listening at a level that most people don't have to. Like, I had to really understand it. Like, I had to really dive deep into it. Because I just didn't have that, like, I didn't, I was not born with that feature built in. So, and then, but like, I think it kind of became this thing that, like, I hyper focus on. And so like, when I'm talking to someone, like, I'm just like, I'm like, completely submerging myself into them, and like exploring their brain, and I think, you know, talking about like, systems thinkers, like, that's something I love is like, getting to understand the system of somebody else's head and like getting to, like, poke around and all the little corners and be like, oh, why is, what's going on here? Like, we're like, what do we got going on here? Like,  Marie Poulin  39:29I compare it to like, looking at their underwear drawer. You're just like, you get to see like, it's very personal, right? And people are often like embarrassed or they feel a lot of shame because, like, their their space is really messy. But I love that, right.  Michele Hansen  39:42I love mess.  Marie Poulin  39:42It's so beautiful. It's, and I will say, like, in the call that we had with you like, I was so struck by how intently it felt like you were listening. I was like, I, it was like almost disarming. Like when I got off, I was like, I can't think of the last time that someone actually was just there to listen. Like, there was no agenda there. Like, you were you were really just there to be a helpful ear, and it was just quite impressive, I have to say, I was just like, holy crap, Michele is an incredible listener. I was really blown away. And so I love that you got nerdy about listening. So nerdy. I love it. Michele Hansen  40:23I mean, I grew up being, I think the thing, the number one thing I heard growing up was Michele, you never listened, like, you're not listening, you don't listen. Like and like, I have found complex, that I have found that the things that I'm really bad at, like, if I get over that, and then, like, I will, like intensely research it, and it will become a huge focus for me, like, I would like, so like in college, I studied international affairs and economics, and I remember in one of my first classes, one of the professors asked who knew what, like, Bretton Woods was, and, you know, I'm from New England, and I was like, I know, that's a ski resort, but like, I don't know anything else. And like, you know, it's it's the, the post-war monetary system that was set up after the war, basically, to prevent another war, economically. But I didn't like, know that, and I felt like really embarrassed. And I ended up like, really diving into the topic to the point where it was not only my thesis topic, but for like, two years, I wrote papers about related things in other classes, even when I wasn't required to. And now I have this, like, just all of this knowledge about, like, monetary relations in Europe, specifically focused on the US and Germany, like, between, like 1958, and like 1973, really intensely on the 71 to 73 period. And, like, I it's not particularly, like, for what I do, it's not really useful information, but like, kind of like, I feel like that's very similar to how I got into doing listening and interviews because, because I was so bad at it, because I didn't know what I was doing, because I was like, I felt embarrassed that I didn't know what was going on, or like, people had made me feel like I was deficient in that. Like, I think this is where that, like, that hyper focus comes in. It's like, once you like latch on to a topic, like, you can't get your teeth out of it, even if you, like, wanted to.  Marie Poulin  42:28Painfully relateable. I love that you brought this up to you because I think I've done this throughout my my career to where it's like, oh my gosh, like public speaking this is like, I'm terrible at this, I'm so afraid of it, it's like, must hire three different coaches and take five courses and like, read every book, you know. Like, just go down these crazy rabbit holes to go to such an extreme to work on a skill that you know, I was maybe like, not, not that great at it wasn't terrible, but just didn't feel like a strength. And I think I've often felt self conscious of is it a waste of time, when I should be like focusing on my real strengths. And so, I just think it's so funny. There's, there's obviously a trigger there around feeling incompetent, or like, I hate that feeling stupid or feeling like something I'm really bad at is preventing me from succeeding in business. And I, you know, I've shared before a little bit about, like, fear of being on video and fear of being on stage. And so these are all things I've obsessively worked on. And you know, I'll share like a super vulnerable moment from not, not that long ago, but there was ,there was someone who shared with me, they spoke with someone who had taken the course, and it was an older woman. I don't know when she took the course, but maybe she took it like, early on in the course building journey. It's definitely gone through a number of iterations. But she she was like, angry. She was like, oh my gosh, she goes so fast. She's all over the place. She needs to read about adult learning. Like, she's a terrible facilitator. And like, if I showed you my Notion goals page, it's like being a masterful facilitator is literally on my, my big visionary goals. And I was like, oh my God, am I, is this just like a skill I am, I am bad at? Like, it knocked me on my ass and I questioned everything. I was like, oh my god, what's going on? And in the same week, I literally had someone say that my sessions were the thing that they look forward to every week. And it was so weird to get this, like, the most negative criticism I've ever gotten, and the most positive, and it was in that same week that I had actually discovered, that I started to realize I probably had ADHD and I realized that my presentation style and my exploratory show you the possibilities, it's, it's quite different than say someone who might be a little more neurotypical, a little more instructional in style. I know that my vibe, it doesn't jive for everyone, but it really works well for people that have ADHD, and so that's where I was like, oh, crap. So, hiring a course coach, a curriculum designer, a learning advocate, like, I went all deep, and I was like, I'm going to learn about facilitation, I'm going to learn about teaching, I'm going to learn about learning design, like, how can I make this experience so good that, like, nobody could ever say anything like that? You know? And like, fair enough, if someone, like, it doesn't resonate with them, I totally get that. But it just, it just felt holy crap, like, is this is this like, a giant blind spot that I'm not seeing? And, you know, after talking to a number of students, a number of people, it was like, no, like, you know, this is someone who's not very comfortable with computers. This is someone that, like, it doesn't make sense for this type of person to be using Notion. Like, I don't think Notion is the right tool for everyone, and I don't think my instructional style is is for everyone, and I'm okay with that. I've made peace with that. And there's room to to improve that. So I definitely feel you on like, ooh, rabbit hole, here we go. Let's work on this scale. Because like, no one can criticize this again, like I would go all in, just watch me. Michele Hansen  46:04Have you come across the term rejection sensitive dysphoria?  Marie Poulin  46:08I have.  Michele Hansen  46:11So it's this term for how, I don't, I don't have a good way of explaining it. But like, it's for how painful, like, that kind of criticism can be, and how it can either, like, prevent people from wanting something in the first place, or when you get that criticism, it i,  Marie Poulin  46:30Highly motivating.  Michele Hansen  46:32Yeah, but like, it's all-encompassing.  Marie Poulin  46:35Yeah.  Michele Hansen  46:37Like, it's, and then you said that somebody else that same week said how much they loved your course, yet, you're,  You keep ruminating on the bad, right? Ruminating and obsess over and then hyper focus on that, and then go into this mode of, like, wanting to make sure that never ever happens again. And it's like this kind of extreme version of loss aversion, where, you know, we're so afraid of losing something, like, of losing that, in this case, like, that person's, you know, like, their positive feedback on the course or their, their positive experience with it, rather than focusing on the people who already had a positive experience and making it better for the people who is, because like, it's like, do you actively, like, frame your course, or some of your courses as being for ADHD people, or, like, neurodiverse people? Marie Poulin  47:33I don't, again, part of this is I'm not officially diagnosed. And, and, you know, again, I'm still learning about this stuff. And so I partly feel like a little bit of imposter complex around this whole topic to know I want to be very careful, you know, like, just, just being mindful about how I talk about it. And, and, Michele Hansen  47:53Everyone's experience is different of it, like, yeah. Marie Poulin  47:56Totally, totally. And so I just want to be very careful about it, and it is something I've considered of like, maybe it would actually, like, the number of people that have watched the, I have a YouTube video where I'm teaching my sister who has ADHD how to use Notion, and the positive feedback, and the people being like, oh, my gosh, it was so nice to see normal people, like, normal people like me, you know, other people with ADHD, just, just going through this experience. And it did make me wonder like, well, hey, knowing that this is the case, and knowing that it seems to attract these people, should I go in that direction? So it's been on my mind to some, something to maybe mention, and even kind of tease out a little bit, like, in my welcome sequence. When I'm introducing myself, I'm starting to, like, try out using some of the language. And I will say, I've gotten an incredible response. Anytime I've talked about it, it's been really, really positive. So, I don't mention it, but it is something I'm like, maybe like, and should I get a diagnosis to be? Does it matter? I don't really know. I'm not really sure what the, what the protocol is there. But yeah. Michele Hansen  49:01I mean, like, I have a diagnosis, but like, I, I feel like I don't really understand it very well, like, because I just kind of accepted it as this thing that was just wrong with me that I had to control. And then like, that was kind of it. Um, and I like so in my book, actually, in the original newsletters, like I talked about having ADHD and how, you know, focusing on people and listening and like, all that, like, were really difficult for me because of that, and I got so much positive feedback on it, but then I got it into the book, and I, like, one of my reviewers was like, you know, your experience of ADHD is not a universal one. And there's like, and they were saying there's kind of a difference between like writing it in a newsletter, where people know you and they start from a point of kind of the sort of familiarity, like, that they they trust that you come from a good place, but like writing it in a book, people won't know me people won't know like and even if I say this is only my experience of it, like, someone who has had a different experience of the diagnosis or, or like, doesn't, like, that they have the diagnosis doesn't let you know they have made been made to feel less than because of it, or worse. I think both of us kind of tend to view it as this, like, this thing that we could steer and bring out, like, bring out our true selves, so to speak. Like, so I ended up taking it out, but it also feels so relevant, like it, like it feels like this piece of information that people need to know that it's like, Yes, I was known for not being able to listen to anything, so then I focused on it to the point of it being like, this obsessive skill. Almost necessary base information.  Marie Poulin  50:46Part of the story.  Michele Hansen  50:47Yes. And the same way that like, and so I found a way to like, kind of tell that story that I had to listen, like learn how to do this, but like without using the diagnosis, but like, part of me, really. So like, maybe it's like something I can do in a talk or something like that, right? Like, there's not every, like, there's different forums for things.  Marie Poulin  51:04Not every medium needs to, yeah. Michele Hansen  51:05And also where I can kind of explain, and if someone has like a question of like, well, that's not my experience of it, then we can talk about it afterwards. And they can know that I'm coming from a good, I don't, I don't know, I also feel conflicted, because I don't want to, like, I can only speak from my own experience. Like, I am, and again, maybe again this is maybe an ADHD thing, or it's like, I haven't hyper-focused on ADHD itself, so therefore I cannot speak about it.  Marie Poulin  51:29Totally. Oh, my gosh, the hyper-focusing of watching all the videos about ADHD and like, it's just, it's it's so funny looking at all the memes. I was so dismissive of ADHD, because I was like, oh, well, come on. That's all of us for every single meme. And at some point, I was like, wait a second, like, is that all of us? And yeah, it took some digging, and I was like, wait a second here. Michele Hansen  51:52There's some tweets about this that I find myself referencing, and it was either people with ADHD need to stop being so relatable, or I need to go to the doctor. Marie Poulin  52:06Exactly. Michele Hansen  52:07I think, you know, my, so this is super fun talking and relating to you and like, realizing, you know, that we're both not weird. We're weird together. But my, the reason I really wanted to talk to you about this here is because I think people who are neurodivergent, who don't fit the box, like, tend to feel like we're not as capable of things as other people, or we have been made to feel that we're not as capable. And I hear from people that are like, I don't know if I could run a business, like, I can't, you know, like, if I can't focus on one set thing, like, and I'm all over the place, like, I can't possibly run a business. And I think what I like to show and, like, what you show, amazingly, is that not only can you run a business if you have ADHD or any other like, because I noticed all these, like, people in the indie community, like, they're people, like people who just don't fit the box. Like they have, they have disabilities, they have chronic health conditions, they are autistic, like, whatever those things are, like, they have been able to find a home in this place, and like, you can run a business if you're ADHD like, you, like, like, I present myself as evidence and I feel like you are evidence of that, too. Marie Poulin  53:35Absolutely. I think a big part of it comes down to you have to know yourself really well. Like, you have to know your triggers. You have to know how you're incentivized, how you best operate, so that you can either get the support that you need, or again, you can design your products and services in a way that, even though, for example, I've been a generalist for a decade, and it's really only in the last year and a half, two years, that I was like, I'm going all in on Notion. Like, I see an opportunity here, like, let's, let's just try this, I'm going to see, like, what's the worst that could happen? I make, I make some money for for this chapter and I get known as the Notion person and then I can, like, flip the chapter and do the next thing. I've been in general so long, I was like, whatever, let's just give it a try. And what again, what I love about it is my days can be so freakin different. Like, I am not doing the same thing every day even though I'm doing one thing and so you know, it's about finding traction with that one thing but if you can design your business in such a way that you're still getting, you know that dopamine hit or whatever it is that you need, you got to know yourself well enough to know, hey, I really thrive with routine or I really thrive with days that look very different, and then getting someone to support you on your team, like, maybe you have a small team. For me hiring my direct my you know started with a virtual assistant, who is now my, mou know, Director of Operations and having her is no doubt a humongous part of why I've been able to do the kind of growth that I've done. Like, I would have been scrambling wearing all these different hats. So to have someone whose focus is entirely operations and all the nitty gritty, like, export of CSVs, any of the detail work, I'm like, let's just be honest, Marie is not the details person. I've accepted this. And now we have someone who is a details person who frickin loves that stuff. And the stuff that makes me cringe is the stuff that makes her day, and like, what better? Like, that's all you can ask for, I think. So, even if you're just getting support in a really, really tiny way, you know, again, there's just so many opportunities, I think, to get creative with the way you design your business, that it is supporting you. But you do have to, to know yourself really well, I think to know how to do that. Michele Hansen  55:51And what I, you know, ADHD, the first two words of it, or attention deficit, and I find that you show is that it's not a, like, it doesn't have to be this thing that's deficient about you.  Marie Poulin  56:06It's just a little inconsistent, that's all. Michele Hansen  56:08Like, it can be, if you sort of steer it and give it support, like, it can be this amazing thing that you bring to the world. Like, it's not a deficiency. Like, I feel like that's just kind of like, the message I can give to like 11 year old me, like, it's not a deficiency, like you just have to help it come out. Marie Poulin  56:28Well, hyperactivity like that, like you've said before, like the phrase, it just, it doesn't carry a whole lot of positive connotations. And so,  Michele Hansen  56:36No, the whole thing sounds very negative.  Marie Poulin  56:38It does, yeah, we're we're off. Like, there's something broken with us, versus hunter gatherer brain, like different types of brains, I think evolved for different purposes. And, you know, we all, we have our own incredible use cases, like I know, you mentioned in other episodes, the ability to form connections between really disparate stuff very, very quickly. Oh, my gosh, in companies to have that kind of strategic person who can really see those connections, there's no doubt that each of us kind of can plug in somewhere and we can really shine in different ways. But it's, it's tricky, like you said, if we are neurodivergent, in a neurotypical world, it might mean that we might have to take the initiative on that and, and take charge in different ways and kind of carve our own path. Michele Hansen  57:25But then when we do, like, other people seeing like, hey, like, it's not just me, like, you know, you mentioned the, like the Dani Donovan's ADHD comics. I don't know if you've seen those, like, I'm so appreciative that she's so open about it.  Marie Poulin  57:37Yeah.  Michele Hansen  57:39It just, I think, because we have been made to feel deficient or different, like we, you know, I know I tended to like hold this in, and I realized that even like, most of my best friends didn't know I had been diagnosed as a kid until a couple of years ago, because I just never talked about it. I just, like, accepted it, this thing that was wrong with me, and like, whatever, like, we don't need to talk about it. But then we talk about it, and it doesn't actually, yeah, it doesn't have to be. Like, it can really bring whatever our uniquenesses into the world. Marie Poulin  58:08Yeah, I'm hoping it's sort of becoming a little bit more destigmatized, and on Twitter, and it just feels like I'm hearing more about it, and people maybe are getting a little more comfortable talking about it. And even it seems like things that therapists maybe wouldn't recognize before, like, it's starting to become a little bit more known. And so yeah, I'm hoping that, you know, by sharing some of my own honest insights that that it does help destigmatize it. I think the more people, you know, like you and I talking about it, I do think it just kind of opens up the doors a little bit. So, if we can be part of that then you know, yay. If it helps one other person even just kind of embrace their their inner weirdness a little bit, then we've done our, our duty. Michele Hansen  58:52Yes. Exactly. Or embrace the weirdness of, you know, their loved ones, too.  Marie Poulin  58:58Find your weirdos. Yeah. Michele Hansen  58:59Yeah, yeah. Well, I think that's probably a good note to end on today. It has been so fun talking to you, Marie. I feel like we've, we've gone on quite well, like, we normally run half an hour and we're quite over that, but I'm okay with it. I, this is so fun. I'm so grateful that you came on. And so, if people are curious about your courses, or about you, where can they find out more? Marie Poulin  59:26You can check out my website is MariePoulin.com. You'll be able to find the course on there, too. That's NotionMastery.com, pretty active on Twitter. That's that's probably where do most of my chitchat about business and founder life and ADHD and all that sort of thing. So @MariePoulin on Twitter, and if you're curious about more of the, more personal behind the scenes stuff, and plants and gardening, you can check me out on Instagram, too, so. Michele Hansen  59:51Awesome. Thank you so much, Marie.  Marie Poulin  59:54Yeah, thanks for having me. Really fun.

Relax RV Podcast
Relax RV- S2- E63 - Covid hits us

Relax RV Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 25, 2021 34:22


Season 2 Episode 635/25/21So we got the rig home and I never thought to open up the awning but I did two days after we got home and it would bang on the way out.And Does not close all the way.Grabbed a ladder and saw 2 loose screws on the roller.I then climbed into roof and saw they did not calk above the front door.And when then installed the gutters they didn't screw the screws all the way down nor did they caulk the screws.So I called Connecticut Motor Cars and spoke to Brian the Service Manager.I told him about the three problems. He said they always test the awning and it had worked fine. And the screws for the gutters had probably loosened while driving the rig.We drove up to the shop. Left rig for 4 hours. When we came back the awning was fine and all of the screws were tight. He told me I was not allowed of the roof of my rig while on their property. He said would you have wanted be in the shop and checked every screw on the gutter as they put them in? I said yes if I had known it wasn't going to be done right. he said we're all human and nobody's perfect.I explained to him that I have to spending tens of thousands of dollars that I'm very disappointed about the level of service at his company.I highly suggest you do not use Connecticut Motor Cars and coaches for service unless you don't care about the quality of the work being done.As the old adage goes, if you want something done right do it yourself.Then 2 weeks later, just before heading out on a 2 week trip to West Virginia, Covid hit. Both me and Trish tested positive after having symptoms. Now I know there's a lot of people who don't believe in the masks nor covid and we are on the fence about all of it but we have almost a dozen people that we know personally that have died from covid. You need to do what makes you feel most comfortable and less stressed.So our trip was postponed. We followed the self quarantine order. We re-planned our route and left in early May. We drove 3 hours to Armstrong Valley winery in Halifax Pa. They are a Harvest Host. We did tastings of their wines and talked with the host for over an hour. We bought a bottle of their Pinot Grigio and some Lavender Mustard. They offered free 30 and 50 amp service. The next day we drove just under 4 hours (which is the max I like to drive in the rig) to Blackwater State park in WV. We set up and went for a 5 mile hike to a fabulous view. We had no signal in the campground so we drove to the lodge and downloaded movies on Hulu and Netflix. The next day we did a 4 mile hike in the rain to an underwhelming Balanced Rock. We then went back to the Lodge to stream Trish's sons graduation at the Metro PD.We were wet and cold (it was 40 degrees out). So we went back to the rig. Changed, warmed up and made dinner. That night there was live music at a great place called the Purple Fiddle in Thomas WV.Saturday it was snowy, sleeting, then bright sun all day long. Chilly 44 degrees. Did a 8 mile hike. Then dinner at the rig. We weren't every impressed with Blackwater State Park. Short hiking trails, bad hiking map. But a pretty water fall. Not overly impressed with Blackwater SP.Sunday, off to a boondocks welcome location in Albright WV. But the location was too sketchy for us to drive to so we went to Coopers Rock State Forest and camped there instead. On the way there we saw a sign for the smallest church in the 48 states. So we parked and walked over. Considering it's the smallest church I was surprised that it was as big as it was.We arrived at Coopers Rock State Forest WV. We did a couple small trails in the rain. On Monday we did a total of 8 miles hiking. This was a beautiful park. It reminded us of Nelson Ledges Park in Ohio. We walked along cliffs with fantastic views and then hiked at the base of the cliffs. We did some scrambling around the rocks. And met a group of women from Michigan and had a nice conversation with them. We are still experiencing lingering symptoms of Covid and we get winded easily and I get periods of chills and fatigue. This virus is no fun. Tuesday we drove a bit over an hour to Pennsylvania and stayed at a Boondockers Welcome location. We visited the Greendance winery. They had beautiful grounds and good wine. But no covered outdoor seating. It was a cold day so walked the grounds for a bit. The next day we went to Ohiopyle State Park in Pa. If you are any sort of an outdoor activity lover this place is for you. Rafting, hiking, biking, skiing, snowshoeing. We hiked almost 5 hours and covered 8 miles past various waterfalls. Then had a ice cream in town. There are also some snowmobile trails so I'm sure we will be back in the winter. I installed and love the Jensen Car8000 radio. The HUGE screen is wonderful especially when used the rigs cameras.https://amzn.to/3fix83N Link to avensa mapshttps://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.Avenza So what do you do to help manage your stress? Do you know anyone who would benefit from listening to a stress mange exercise?I have 3 FREE Stress Management recordings at www.RelaxRV.org/stressed-2-2/stressed-2 If that ain't your thing I made some videos about the improvements I mentioned and I posted them on YouTube atwww.youtube.com/channel/UCzwH6GhSMBDJ7qKxsLng-TA Or you can watch them on www.relaxrv.org/videos-the-good-the-bad-and-the-modifications/ I took some pictures and posted them on the RelaxRV Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/Relax-RV-277623782811787/ for your enjoyment and edification.www.spreaker.com/show/relax-rv-podcast I'm on Instagram as @relaxrvpodcast https://www.instagram.com/invites/contact/?i=hsxp0gjpugbz&utm_content=5h4872a

Relax RV Podcast
Relax RV- S2- E63 - Covid hits us

Relax RV Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 25, 2021 34:22


Season 2 Episode 635/25/21So we got the rig home and I never thought to open up the awning but I did two days after we got home and it would bang on the way out.And Does not close all the way.Grabbed a ladder and saw 2 loose screws on the roller.I then climbed into roof and saw they did not calk above the front door.And when then installed the gutters they didn't screw the screws all the way down nor did they caulk the screws.So I called Connecticut Motor Cars and spoke to Brian the Service Manager.I told him about the three problems. He said they always test the awning and it had worked fine. And the screws for the gutters had probably loosened while driving the rig.We drove up to the shop. Left rig for 4 hours. When we came back the awning was fine and all of the screws were tight. He told me I was not allowed of the roof of my rig while on their property. He said would you have wanted be in the shop and checked every screw on the gutter as they put them in? I said yes if I had known it wasn't going to be done right. he said we're all human and nobody's perfect.I explained to him that I have to spending tens of thousands of dollars that I'm very disappointed about the level of service at his company.I highly suggest you do not use Connecticut Motor Cars and coaches for service unless you don't care about the quality of the work being done.As the old adage goes, if you want something done right do it yourself.Then 2 weeks later, just before heading out on a 2 week trip to West Virginia, Covid hit. Both me and Trish tested positive after having symptoms. Now I know there's a lot of people who don't believe in the masks nor covid and we are on the fence about all of it but we have almost a dozen people that we know personally that have died from covid. You need to do what makes you feel most comfortable and less stressed.So our trip was postponed. We followed the self quarantine order. We re-planned our route and left in early May. We drove 3 hours to Armstrong Valley winery in Halifax Pa. They are a Harvest Host. We did tastings of their wines and talked with the host for over an hour. We bought a bottle of their Pinot Grigio and some Lavender Mustard. They offered free 30 and 50 amp service. The next day we drove just under 4 hours (which is the max I like to drive in the rig) to Blackwater State park in WV. We set up and went for a 5 mile hike to a fabulous view. We had no signal in the campground so we drove to the lodge and downloaded movies on Hulu and Netflix. The next day we did a 4 mile hike in the rain to an underwhelming Balanced Rock. We then went back to the Lodge to stream Trish's sons graduation at the Metro PD.We were wet and cold (it was 40 degrees out). So we went back to the rig. Changed, warmed up and made dinner. That night there was live music at a great place called the Purple Fiddle in Thomas WV.Saturday it was snowy, sleeting, then bright sun all day long. Chilly 44 degrees. Did a 8 mile hike. Then dinner at the rig. We weren't every impressed with Blackwater State Park. Short hiking trails, bad hiking map. But a pretty water fall. Not overly impressed with Blackwater SP.Sunday, off to a boondocks welcome location in Albright WV. But the location was too sketchy for us to drive to so we went to Coopers Rock State Forest and camped there instead. On the way there we saw a sign for the smallest church in the 48 states. So we parked and walked over. Considering it's the smallest church I was surprised that it was as big as it was.We arrived at Coopers Rock State Forest WV. We did a couple small trails in the rain. On Monday we did a total of 8 miles hiking. This was a beautiful park. It reminded us of Nelson Ledges Park in Ohio. We walked along cliffs with fantastic views and then hiked at the base of the cliffs. We did some scrambling around the rocks. And met a group of women from Michigan and had a nice conversation with them. We are still experiencing lingering symptoms of Covid and we get winded easily and I get periods of chills and fatigue. This virus is no fun. Tuesday we drove a bit over an hour to Pennsylvania and stayed at a Boondockers Welcome location. We visited the Greendance winery. They had beautiful grounds and good wine. But no covered outdoor seating. It was a cold day so walked the grounds for a bit. The next day we went to Ohiopyle State Park in Pa. If you are any sort of an outdoor activity lover this place is for you. Rafting, hiking, biking, skiing, snowshoeing. We hiked almost 5 hours and covered 8 miles past various waterfalls. Then had a ice cream in town. There are also some snowmobile trails so I'm sure we will be back in the winter. I installed and love the Jensen Car8000 radio. The HUGE screen is wonderful especially when used the rigs cameras.https://amzn.to/3fix83N Link to avensa mapshttps://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.Avenza So what do you do to help manage your stress? Do you know anyone who would benefit from listening to a stress mange exercise?I have 3 FREE Stress Management recordings at www.RelaxRV.org/stressed-2-2/stressed-2 If that ain't your thing I made some videos about the improvements I mentioned and I posted them on YouTube atwww.youtube.com/channel/UCzwH6GhSMBDJ7qKxsLng-TA Or you can watch them on www.relaxrv.org/videos-the-good-the-bad-and-the-modifications/ I took some pictures and posted them on the RelaxRV Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/Relax-RV-277623782811787/ for your enjoyment and edification.www.spreaker.com/show/relax-rv-podcast I'm on Instagram as @relaxrvpodcast https://www.instagram.com/invites/contact/?i=hsxp0gjpugbz&utm_content=5h4872a

The Oyedepo Podcast
Midweek Communion Service on 19th May, 2021

The Oyedepo Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 19, 2021 126:24


20A large house contains not only vessels of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay. Some indeed are for honorable use, but others are for common use. 21So if anyone cleanses himself of what is unfit, he will be a vessel for honor: sanctified, useful to the Master, and prepared for every good work. 22Flee from youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, together with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart.…-2 Timothy 2:20-22 22Even though you offer Me burnt offerings and grain offerings, I will not accept them; for your peace offerings of fattened cattle I will have no regard. 23Take away from Me the noise of your songs! I will not listen to the music of your harps. -Amos 5:22-23 3If the foundations are destroyed, what can the righteous do?”-Psalm 11:3  

St. Columba's Episcopal Church Sermons
Ascension - May 16, 2021 The Rev. Liz Armstrong

St. Columba's Episcopal Church Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later May 16, 2021 13:20


Seventh Sunday of Easter The Collect: O God, the King of glory, you have exalted your only Son Jesus Christ with great triumph to your kingdom in heaven: Do not leave us comfortless, but send us your Holy Spirit to strengthen us, and exalt us to that place where our Savior Christ has gone before; who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, one God, in glory everlasting. Amen. First Lesson: Acts 1:15-17, 21-26 15 In those days Peter stood up among the believers (together the crowd numbered about one hundred and twenty people) and said, 16‘Friends, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit through David foretold concerning Judas, who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus— 17for he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.' 21So one of the men who have accompanied us throughout the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, 22beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us to his resurrection.' 23So they proposed two, Joseph called Barsabbas, who was also known as Justus, and Matthias. 24Then they prayed and said, ‘Lord, you know everyone's heart. Show us which one of these two you have chosen 25to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.' 26And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias; and he was added to the eleven apostles. Psalm: Psalm 1 1 Happy are they who have not walked in the counsel of the wicked, *        nor lingered in the way of sinners,        nor sat in the seats of the scornful! 2 Their delight is in the law of the Lord, *        and they meditate on his law day and night. 3 They are like trees planted by streams of water,    bearing fruit in due season, with leaves that do not wither; *        everything they do shall prosper. 4 It is not so with the wicked; *        they are like chaff which the wind blows away. 5 Therefore the wicked shall not stand upright when judgment comes, *        nor the sinner in the council of the righteous. 6 For the Lord knows the way of the righteous, *        but the way of the wicked is doomed. Epistle: 1 John 5:9-13 9If we receive human testimony, the testimony of God is greater; for this is the testimony of God that he has testified to his Son. 10Those who believe in the Son of God have the testimony in their hearts. Those who do not believe in God have made him a liar by not believing in the testimony that God has given concerning his Son. 11And this is the testimony: God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life. Gospel: John 17:6-19 6 ‘I have made your name known to those whom you gave me from the world. They were yours, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. 7Now they know that everything you have given me is from you; 8for the words that you gave to me I have given to them, and they have received them and know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me. 9I am asking on their behalf; I am not asking on behalf of the world, but on behalf of those whom you gave me, because they are yours. 10All mine are yours, and yours are mine; and I have been glorified in them. 11And now I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them in your name that you have given me, so that they may be one, as we are one. 12While I was with them, I protected them in your name that you have given me. I guarded them, and not one of them was lost except the one destined to be lost, so that the scripture might be fulfilled. 13But now I am coming to you, and I speak these things in the world so that they may have my joy made complete in themselves. 14I have given them your word, and the world has hated them because they do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. 15I am not asking you to take them out of the world, but I ask you to protect them from the evil one. 16They do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. 17Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth. 18As you have sent me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. 19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, so that they also may be sanctified in truth.

Barlborough and Clowne Parish Churches
Sermon for the Sunday after Ascension 16th May 2021 from Rev Bryony Taylor - the mysterious call of St Matthias

Barlborough and Clowne Parish Churches

Play Episode Listen Later May 16, 2021 8:43


This is a sermon about this bible passage: Acts 1.15–17,21–26 15 In those days Peter stood up among the believers (together the crowd numbered about one hundred and twenty people) and said, 16‘Friends, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit through David foretold concerning Judas, who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus— 17for he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.' 21So one of the men who have accompanied us throughout the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, 22beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us to his resurrection.' 23So they proposed two, Joseph called Barsabbas, who was also known as Justus, and Matthias. 24Then they prayed and said, ‘Lord, you know everyone's heart. Show us which one of these two you have chosen 25to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.' 26And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias; and he was added to the eleven apostles.

Active Travel Podcast
Harrie Larrington-Spencer talks accessible cycling with Professor Rachel Aldred

Active Travel Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 14, 2021 40:26


Professor Aldred talks to Harriet Larrington-Spencer, a researcher at Healthy Active Cities at the University of Salford. Harriet, or Harrie, developed an interest in active travel after experiencing cycling in Copenhagen and the Netherlands, and after losing the use of her left arm following a collision with a driver. Harrie discovered that while a tricycle was far easier for her to use, the physical barriers and chicanes in place on many of Britain's cycleways make the use of three wheels challenging. Harrie talks about the challenges such infrastructure poses for non-standard cycle users, about other barriers to wider uptake, such as cost, what inclusive active travel would look like, and what research she would conduct, if money were no object. And, of course, about cycling with her dog, Frida. Healthy Active Cities is a research group bringing together researchers from the University of Salford, as well as practitioners and policymakers to discuss issues in sustainable transport. You can find out more about their work here: https://blogs.salford.ac.uk/healthyactivecities/TRANSCRIPT00:00Hi and welcome back to the Active Travel Podcast, brought to you by the Active Travel Academy, and to season two. We had a little break over Autumn, and we've all been busy working on lots of different projects, but we're delighted to finally bring you the second episode – and we hope to have more in the weeks to come. But without further ado, let's hand over to Professor Rachel Aldred, Active Travel Academy founder, and our guest.So I'm really happy to be here for an episode of the active travel podcast with Harriet Larrington-Spencer, who is a researcher at Healthy Active Cities at the University of Salford. So hi, Harrie, good to have you here. 00:11Hi, Rachel, thank you for having me.00:14Great. So one of the things I wanted to start with is really about how you got into this how you got into researching active travel, because one of the great things about active travel is that it's people from a whole range of different backgrounds in the field in terms of disciplinary backgrounds. So can you tell me how you got into it?00:32Yeah, it's so my academic background is originally not active travel, I come from a geography background. So my bachelor's is in geography. And then I moved to the Netherlands to do my master's, which was in water management and irrigation. So very different from active travel. And whilst I was there, and I did my Erasmus as part of my masters in Copenhagen, just I went from kind of cycling for, for recreation and, and a bit of sport to cycling every day, when you arrive at university as an international student in the Netherlands, they tell you no bike, no life. So you kind of the first thing, the first thing they give you is a list of all the secondhand places to buy a bike. And then from that moment, cycling just became my natural form of transportation. And when I saw then I started my PhD. Back in the UK, in Manchester, I was cycling everyday for transportation, and I got hit by a car. And then I had to start changing the type of cycling. So whilst I was cycling for transportation, I was also doing cycling for sport. But I had to kind of start working out how to cycle for transportation in a way that I could do, because the the car damaged my left arm, so it doesn't work, and my hand doesn't work anymore. So it became How could I use a two wheel bike. So I started doing doing that. And even on two wheels, I found quite a lot of barriers to cycling, and doing my everyday journeys that I just hadn't considered before. And then more recently, to make it a lot easier for myself, I have a trike, and so I can do my shopping and carry my dog more easily. And the barriers that were difficult to negotiate on a on a bike have become impossible to negotiate on a trike. And so it started from there really, and and thinking about active travelling that everybody has a has a right basically, it's kind of the right to the city is that everyone should be able to move actively around their local neighbourhood, and how to enable that. 02:43Wow,Wow, thank you now I am going to pick up on different bits of that. But just to go back to the Netherlands experience. So when you went to the Netherlands, had you been cycling much before in this country? Were you completely new to it?02:55No, so I wasn't completely new I grew up in the middle of in the kind of the middle of nowhere in the countryside. So to get to see friends it was always cycling. But also, it was cycling through farmland and fields and or very small country lanes. And it was never really it wasn't an everyday thing. So to actually get anywhere, we had no bus service, you had to learn to drive if you wanted to get anywhere independently and before kind of 17,18 cycling offered that but it wasn't particularly viable to get very far. 03:39Yeah, I know I that sounds kind of familiar. And when you came back to Manchester after the or you came to Manchester after the Netherlands, how was it suddenly cycling in Manchester after having cycled in the Netherlands?03:50It's just a complete world away. It's I think even if you remove the infrastructure from the UK from kind of that equation, the infrastructure makes a difference. But it's also that I think everyone in the Netherlands who drives is also a cyclist. So it's, it's Yeah, the infrastructure is not there. And then also cyclists are not in the minds of drivers, either. So when I got hit by a car it was because the driver overtook me and turned left because they didn't even and it was across the segregated cycle lane as well. So it's that they didn't even think that they had to kind of consider that there might be a cyclist on the cycle lane and yeah, completely different.04:39Yeah, it just highlights the need for the infrastructure but also the need for the cultural change behaviour change as well at the same time. And then you were talking about how you cycling as a disabled cyclist using a two wheeler and then using a trike was was different. Could you say a little bit more about that and about some of the barriers that you experienced there.05:00With, with two wheels, I can I can do it and I can I can cycle in, it's fine. But moving the handlebars is quite difficult picking up my bike is difficult. So the probably the biggest barrier is if you are using shared paths and then there's barriers on the shared path. So you've got, A frames are the worst, but there's also chicanes. So I think most of you probably know what chicanes are, but kind of small fences to slow you down. So it just started with the two wheels, you kind of you can negotiate it, but it takes time and it takes energy and I can't really lift my bike and it causes pain when I do it. And then when you get to three wheels, because the cycle is longer and it's wider, you literally cannot like you can't get it past A frames, and sometimes you can get it past chicanes but to do that, my husband has to kind of pick up the trike and negotiate it around. I can't do that at all by myself. So it just it means that that certain cycle, cycling routes are completely off limits to me. And they're often the cycle routes that are the nicest ones, because they're completely away from cars and roads.06:13And why why do you think this kind of this kind of thing exists? Why given that, you know, potentially it's not in line with equality legislation?06:21So the kind of technical reason that they're there is to prevent motorcycles and and anti-social behaviour on cycle routes. Often, it's part of the planning permission to get the route and the police have to if a route is going to be off road, then the police have to agree to it as well. And the police's kind of standard response is an A frame. And some residents also want A frames as well, because there's, I think there's often a fear of this kind of antisocial behaviour from motorcycles, not necessarily that it's going to happen. So, yeah, and it's and now, kind of, the more I get into it, the more I struggle, because I think kind of maybe a few years ago, it was that councils wouldn't know about the Equality Act and kind of the what, what their responsibilities are to disabled cyclists. But more and more, I'm seeing councils saying things like, Oh, we've looked at LTN 1/20 [Local Transport Note 1/20 – cycle infrastructure design guidance], which very specifically says, Don't use A frames, don't use chicanes, and the council's will recognise that, that they should not be using those and they shouldn't be implementing those. And that by implementing those, they're excluding disabled cyclists. But at the same time, they kind of say, we're doing it anyway. And we've got no other way to manage motorcyclists. So this is what we'll do.07:53Yeah, so that's, they'll just probably pick up on the LTN 1/20, the new cycle infrastructure design guidance. So that's seen some improvements, but obviously, isn't necessarily feeding through into practice. And does it highlight the extent to which things need to be aligned for things to change? If the police, you know, you don't necessarily just need transport just use to change in transport planning, but also the police and so on as well.08:15Yeah, it definitely needs to be a much more joined up approach. And even now, in in Stockport, we're seeing that there are routes that aren't accessible. So if you look at LTN 1/20, they say that the ideal route be at least spaced at 1.5 metres. And so in Stockport, they're taking cycle routes and walking routes that have this spacing already. And they're putting chicanes on them. And I've just saw a proposal yesterday where they're asking for an A frame barrier. So yeah, there's there needs to be working with police and with residents and with disabled people, as well. But to me, it shouldn't be the kind of the equality of access should be the centre point. And it's what should we be do? What can we do to achieve that rather, than kind of the restricting of motorcycles being being the point where where they start design?09:11Yeah, yeah. So it's kind of trying to restrict a minority of problematic users of one mode, that's maybe not even actually the case. It's something that's feared rather than trying to ensure inclusive access for for walking cycling, which is meant to be something that's being encouraged.09:25Yeah, exactly. And the more people you have using a route legitimately, the less attractive it will be to anyone on a motorcycle if, if you think that you're going to access that route, because it's kind of an empty space that you can whisper on your bike. It's much less attractive. If it's full of everybody on trikes bikes with push chairs walking, it's, it's very different.09:50Great, and that sort of brings up another topic, which is around inclusivity of active travel. So could you maybe sort of tell us a little bit about what active travel, how inclusive active travel is or what what needs to change.10:04I think active travel is getting much more inclusive, I see a lot of people who are non-disabled, recognising the barriers that disabled people have to active travel, I think at kind of a grassroots level, especially, it's happening more with sport than with active travel is that is kind of getting disabled people more involved, recognising the barriers that disabled people have. I think in active travel, it would really help if design centred disabled people, because anything designed for disabled people is is going to be good for everybody. So with cycling, there's so there is a lot of barriers for disabled people, anyone who wants to use a non standard cycle, there's not only the infrastructural barriers, and you, you know they're there. So it's kind of like why would you invest in something if the routes that you want to go on with your family or your friends, you can't get on. And then on top of that, you have the you have the cost of the equipment. So a non standard cycle is 1000s and 1000s of pounds. And then on top of that you have the insurance of it, you have to have the secure storage to meet the insurance requirements. And then you also need to know that when you cycle somewhere there will be a secure place to lock your site as well. So I found with my trike, I can't, I can't even use the Sheffield stand without taking up multiple spaces on the Sheffield stands. And I don't want to block other people from being able to be able to park their cycles. So there's kind of there's all these factors that have to be accounted for. And it's the same with with walking, with using a wheelchair that so much of the urban environment isn't isn't suitable for just independently using your wheelchair to get to your to your local area, whether there's no pavement drops, if there's pavement parking, parks that don't have accessible entrances to them. It's it when and when you start noticing it and I think this has happened a lot with non-disabled people as well when disabled people who who are working in active travel and are advocates within it have started pointing it out is that once you start seeing it, you can't stop seeing it and and it's just it defies belief really, that you would have a park that not everybody can connect thiswill be because of barriers at the gates because of steps.12:33Yes. So very similar things to cycle paths is that you have kind of the chicane entrances into the park, which make it quite difficult, especially if you're on something more recumbent. If you're on a hand cycle, for example. So you're lower down, and you'll have a longer base. Yeah, even wheelchairs, I think sometimes struggled to go through the these spaces unless it's a wide open gate.13:00And do you think that's starting to change in planning at all? I mean, if advocates are noticing it are planners noticing it, are things getting better.13:07I think that things are changing. So LTN 1/20 was an a massive win for inclusive cycling and that you can you read through that document and you see the advocacy work of Wheels for Wellbeing in there, and how powerfully and positively they've impacted the world of inclusive cycling, in terms of planning from councils. In Greater Manchester, I feel like there's much more awareness of it, but there's a real struggle to start making those changes for whatever reason. And I, I do think there needs to be a bit of bravery that I can understand that some of these are quite big changes. To say we're not going to restrict access is a big change to how kind of urban planning has been done. But I've also seen some really positive things. So Manchester highways has recently created an access group but that's because it's that has a lot of disabled people with a lot of different kind of experiences and skills. And they are hopefully going to listen to those views when when they're implementing active travel projects. But yeah, it's kind of a time will tell.14:23You were mentioning about Manchester highways and maybe it's time to say something about the Greater Manchester context because Greater Manchester is I think it's something like 2.7 million people across the urban area. So yeah, large urban area, metropolitan area, different authorities and so on different levels of planning. So how does that work in terms of active travel? How is it structured and you know, is it different authorities in charge of different bits and so on?14:50Yeah, so different authorities will be in charge of their own area. I think we then have the Bee networks for for walking and cycling with Chris Boardman who is the walking and cycling Commissioner. So this is trying to join those up a bit and have a more integrated approach to walking and cycling. It's a struggle because for different councils have different approaches and different histories, I mean, you can definitely see in Salford at the moment they've, they're really progressing with their walking and cycling, working to make things much more inclusive. So they've on one of the big walking and cycling trails, they've just been removing barriers and replacing them with bollards that are 1.5 metres apart and celebrating that as well on social media recognising that it's, it's a really positive thing to be doing, and showing that as a positive example to councils in Greater Manchester. And I think having that kind of the overall Bee network, having committed to having an inclusive approach, they have the the 12 year old cycling is the body around which the infrastructure has been built. Personally, I think the 12 year old should be on a trike. But but it's kind of getting there. And they've they've said no barriers, although you see that being put into practice quite differently, but there is pushback against it. And also, in Greater Manchester, we have Walk Ride, which is a community-based organisation. So there's the central body. And then there's all different smaller groups of people who are really interested in walking and cycling. And you see such fantastic work within those smaller groups that they have really good connections with their councils and the walking and cycling forums. And they're, they're putting a lot of pressure onto the councillors to make sure that everything done is thinking about everyone who who wants to use those, the walking and cycling infrastructure that's being built. And it's just really nice to see kind of everybody committed to making things inclusive, because often, there's a lot of what has to be done. And it often falls onto the shoulders of disabled people to do that labour. So it's nice to not always have to be the one that is pointing out the issues and following up with councillors and councils.17:15And do you think that's kind of important as well that you have? Because that's quite distinctive that you have the sort of walking and cycling advocates together in the same in the same advocacy group? Does that make a big difference?17:26Yeah, I think it's fantastic. I think the speed with which, with which Walk Ride GM and the smaller local groups have grown over the past couple of years, really demonstrates kind of the local appetite for walking and cycling. And the skills in those groups that has developed as well is amazing. So for some people, it's that they they work within walking and cycling design or infrastructure, behaviour change within local councils, and they have those skills from their jobs and from their training. But for some people there, they're kind of new to it, and learning and reading all of this all of the documents and policies that are being produced and it's just fantastic for people being able to hold the councillors to to their word basically. And to the point where people if something's installed, and it doesn't look right, or I pointed out something at the weekend, someone was there measuring it with a tape measure to check out whether the distance between the chicanes meets with the accessibility, design guidelines. Yeah, it's really cool.18:38Returning to the barriers side of things, we talked quite a bit about the physical barriers, but you talked earlier also about the sort of cost and linked with that the storage that you don't want to store something that's expensive, it might get, you know, if it's not secure, it might get stolen, do you think more needs to be done to improve access, you know, availability, affordability of adaptive cycles, ie bikes and trikes and so on?18:59Yeah, definitely. And there's, I think part of it is that if we are moving towards a modal shift, then having these products because they are quite a rare thing. So if you're having to import them, and there's very few being imported, then they're going to be higher cost. So there's kind of one aspect is the more people we have doing it then hopefully a reduction in cost, but they kind of, they are specialist, so they're going to be more expensive than a standard two wheel cycle. So there's some really great schemes going on. So Wheels for Wellbeing have one scheme in London, which is looking at loaning people non-standard cycles, and really helping people choose cycles that are appropriate for them. And and being able to do a loan scheme that can then turn into ownership if they're interested in it. And also, Cycling Projects has a similar thing in West Midlands and we're setting up a trike library in in Manchester and then hopefully that will if people will get a chance to experience trikes, because you, if if they're rare, and you don't get a chance to have a go on them, you're not going to splash out 2000 pounds if you don't, if you don't know how it's going to fit in your life that you really, you need to start doing those everyday journeys, you need to have a go at taking your trike to the, to the shop to get milk and to work. Yeah, and have that that space to build it up and build up over time and see whether it works. So I think with the trike library that we've raised money for, as part of Walk Ride in Manchester, we're going to hopefully loan out cycles for three months at a time maybe more and and help people with journey planning, with ride buddying, and all of those smaller parts to get people into it. The storage, the storage is is a real issue. And it also comes into into policing as well and, and monitoring. And if you I think bike crime is is very low on the police agenda at the moment, because there's not that much funding to police. So it's working out ways to do that. And there is this kind of on on road storage that we've seen in Waltham Forest, and you can get adapted versions of that. So there's options that we just need to keep pushing for and and ensuring that when we're thinking about those options, so in in Greater Manchester, there is there is some of I think in Salford there's some of these on streets cycle hangers, but for people to push for ones that can have non-standard cycles as well, when they're kind of being brought up in that local area.21:32Do you think there's potentially a role for a more universal scheme as well? Because one of the things, one of the criticisms that's been made of the cycle to work scheme is that, you know, certainly you have to have an employer that's opted in it excludes anybody who's not in employment. So a lot of older people, proportionally more disabled people and so on. Do you think we kind of need a more universal access to cycling scheme?21:53Yeah, we definitely do at the moment, it's kind of it falls on the the charity sector to be implementing it and their capacity to implement it is based upon their resources and always scraping the money together to be able to do it. And it's really frustrating when it's something that would help so many people. Yeah, I mean, a universal scheme would be amazing. I tried to you can, there's ways to do it through kind of access to work. But it's always there's always kind of caveats within it. And it's so that you just have to keep arguing for it. So most ability is the obvious way to do it. And there are mobility aids that you access through Motability, so to have that as as a way to do it. And also in the Netherlands, they have very similar schemes where disabled people can have access to active travel equipment. Yeah, and it's it's at a time when I think people are really recognising that disabled people want to be more active, the benefits the public health benefits of disabled people being more active are huge and organisations like great, like, Sport England, as we come out of the pandemic are centralising disable people within within their programmes, and they want to disproportionately invest in disabled people. So I think it is a really good time to start thinking about how to make these how to make access to to non-standard cycles and adaptive cycles, kind of a universal scheme.23:21Cool. And what would if you were thinking about, you know, the your priorities for getting most disabled people cycling, what would you What would you prioritise? What would you think would be the most important thing?23:36One would be the access to the cycles. Two would be working out connected routes within cities. So in Greater Manchester, we have the Bee networks, but we need to look at how the Bee networks connect and with the existing infrastructure that we already have, and how to make that infrastructure barrier free and accessible. Another one would be looking at cycles as mobility aids in in Greater Manchester, for example, people aren't allowed to take cycles onto the trams, which really inhibits multimodal journeys. So you can't you couldn't cycle from, I don't know Sale into Manchester City Centre as a disabled person to work and then think actually, I'm too tired to cycle home let me take my let me take my cycle on the tram. So because you can't do that, then you're, you're then making it a less viable option because you can't do those first and last, or you Yeah, you can't do those parts you need by public transport. So and also to be able to use the pedestrian areas if you need it to be able to put your shopping onto your bike or trike close to the shops and, and having the storage for it as well. And it doesn't I mean for shopping, it doesn't have to be the super-secure sheltered storage. It's just having storage solutions that are well spaced that can that you can use with a trike and have space to not only put your trike, but you have to think about how people are getting off and on. So you need to have that space between the stands.25:16Well, one question I was going to ask was on the research theme was getting obviously this is an under researched area if what would your sort of fantasy research project be if you had a 2 million pound research budget or whatever, you know, imagine? Imagine the zeros what what would your research programme be looking at inclusive cycling, eco inclusive active travel?25:37So for I think inclusive active travel, I think it would be fascinating to do a community mapping project where you work with disabled people's organisations, and you have disabled people map their, their everyday journeys that they do, either by whatever mode of transport they're doing, and then work with people to to look at how active travel can replace non active travel journeys basically. So and to work on the very close ones, so going to places for for small amounts of shopping, going to visit your children going to visit your parents going to the park, taking the kids to school, those journeys, but looking really specifically at the different types of challenges that people have with those. And working out how to then use that to, to create kind of more local regeneration. Because Yeah, because you're not going to get active travel if people physically can't use that their local environment. And and think about how to prioritise those. So that's one aspect. And another aspect I'm really interested in is shared space in in urban centres, because it is a really it's a very aesthetically pleasing thing to have, I think shared space. But obviously, there's a lot of challenges that it offers and conflicting challenges that it has for for different groups of people. So for visually impaired people in particular shared space is quite a challenging thing to have in it can create an environment that that whilst statistically, it's probably very unlikely that you're going to get hit by a bike, it doesn't stop the environment being hostile. So thinking about the types of behaviour within shared spaces and and how to kind of move cohesion both move cohesively and behave in cohesive ways of in the shared space. But also what type of infrastructures within the shared space, enable that that type of behaviour. So kind of a two way approach to that.27:39And actually just thinking about that in terms of the infrastructure and sharing infrastructures, are there good examples? We've talked quite a bit about the barriers and some of the problems, can you think of good examples of environments that work well for inclusive active travel and either in Greater Manchester or somewhere else, and why why it's good.27:59We have a couple of bits now in Greater Manchester, it's difficult, because actually one of the best places for kind of walking and cycling in Greater Manchester is Oxford Road. So and it is a really, really good piece of infrastructure, but the cycle track is just not quite wide enough. So I can't actually use it on the trike. But normally, I would say that there is a few bits of segregated cycle lanes that are kind of four metres wide, and have space for bi directional cycling flow. So I mean, these are perfect. But that's quite a short stretch, I'm trying to think of something. I think low traffic neighbourhoods, for example, have a real opportunity for for inclusive active travel, they don't have the segregated cycle lanes, obviously, but by reducing the cars using the roads, there is that space for any type of cycle. There's space for wheelchairs and mobility scooters. I think the the challenge with low traffic neighbourhoods is that it's not you don't automatically make them inclusive by filtering the cars from them and that the the existing infrastructures within them already can still pose challenges. So I think speed bumps is quite a good example that if you are non-disabled and walking or cycling, a speed bump isn't going to bother you. But if you're on a recumbent cycle, the speed bumps are not very pleasant at all. And the same with pavement drops as well.And there's a lot of the the issues around the built environment. So some of those things around narrow bike lanes or narrow footways and so on. 29:29So is a lot of that to do with accommodating motor traffic and then sort of people on foot, people on bikes that have had to fight it out for what's left.29:47Yeah, exactly. And you see a lot of space for cycling always seems to be reallocating space away from pedestrians. So the weekend I visited a new proposed walking and cycling route through Ancoats well from New Islington to Ancoats along a really really nice marina that's full of people walking, it's kind of there's a few different bakeries, it's a really nice space. And in this area there's not there's not that many open spaces. And instead of putting a segregated cycleway on the main road, which has five lanes of traffic, and has recently had 10 million pounds spent on its upgrade, they are trying to Manchester council is trying to put the walking and cycling route, which is a is a major league route. So it is specifically for commuting through this very pedestrian recreational, kind of sitting and being space, rather than then taking that space away from cars. And by doing that, you automatically kind of put pedestrians and cyclists at odds with each other both in terms of the space itself, but also within this wider space of kind of what a city is and who is in a city where people are supposed to be in the city. And it shouldn't be like that if we really want to have modal shift we need to start reallocating space away from cars and a lot of time if you do anything like that, then you get a lot of uproar from drivers. But there's there's very little discussion about kind of taking that space away from pedestrians and I think that's Yeah, it's often pedestrians who do suffer within that.31:28In terms of the the Greater Manchester context as well. What would you say in the next five years? Do you think things will be different in five years what hopefully what what might have changed around sort of inclusive active travel?31:42I would really like to see more people on non-standard cycles. I've definitely noticed that since I started getting since I have been cycling on a trike. I've had a lot more people on social media, for example, saying, I've never even considered a trike as an option. I thought trikes were for old people, and people saying that they're considering one as well now. And that's really nice, because it shows that you need to see people doing something for you to start considering that it's an option for yourself as well. So I think that's one aspect that if we get more people cycling, and more disabled people cycling, then hopefully it will be kind of it will build. So that's one aspect, I think another aspect is is the access to inclusive cycles. And that's something that needs to be worked on. Another one is with the Bee networks, is that we just need to keep the momentum and the energy of holding councils to account to to ensure that when things are being implemented, they're being implemented inclusively and to LTN 1/20. In it, it helps so much to have that design guidance, really, because you can just keep sending it and saying, you know, this is this is what this is what needs to happen. I think more widely, we need more than just kind of the Bee networks, we need to be looking at local journeys and how to enable those local journeys. And to maybe move I move a bit away from from focusing on commuting journeys is Yeah, and it's looking at the everyday and I think children's journeys as well as a really nice way to do that. Because they're going to school and back. That's two journeys a day. But then obviously, you need to start looking at the wider practices around that because it's hard sometimes for parents to be able to take their children to school. So we need to have the safe infrastructure for that. But it Yeah, to have this kind of joined up approach where there's the policy, there's the projects, there's the infrastructure.33:53So earlier you were mentioning cycling as well with with your dog, who's become something of a star on social media. Could you say something about your dog?34:00Yes, so we got Frida we got her very luckily at the start of the just before the start of the first lockdown. I just I had a bit of trouble at first after my accident. So kind of I'd always been doing cycling for for everyday cycling, cycling since living in the Netherlands, but also I used to do a lot of touring, cycling and sports cycling. And I was really struggling with not being able to do those anymore. And so it's just trying to find ways to enjoy a different type of everyday life. And I've always wanted a dog and we'd always be putting it off saying you know, we'll wait until we live in a house with a big garden and then just finally was really fed up and bought. Let's just do it and she'll be a good excuse to kind of go out the weekends and then because we don't have a car and Cycling is our primary form of transport from the second day we had her we started training, training her I'm not sure that's the right word, but we kind of put her in a backpack and put her on the bike and fed her lots of treats. And she just, she just loves it. She's, she's very attention seeking, which is amazing. So she'll be, she'll be like, sitting in in the bucket of the cargo trike and she'll be quite chilled out and she'll hear people in the distance and she'll suddenly pop up to give them a show, I think. And I think people really like it. They, I, I'm very, I'm very shy and I, I find it quite embarrassing, but it is really nice to cycle past people and see their really positive reaction. And I think it draws attention cycling as well because normally it's quite like a fast someone will just go past you but you can't really notice if and often I carry my husband as well in the front bucket of my of my cargo trike. So it's quite obvious when we get when we're going past and Frida's at the front. So, yeah, yes. And, well, funnily enough as well. I haven't had any close passes on the trike since cycling with Frida ever. So I think that's, I mean, there's something to say there about how people value dogs over over human beings as well. But yeah, really, she loves it, she just sits in the bucket with her goggles. And the goggles is because we started using the cargo trike because it's a bit lower down, I was worried about stones flicking up into her eyes. But she takes it all in her stride. And she she's always excited. I think it's because we are, we kind of started building in having trips, we will do our shopping. But it's about more than doing shopping. It's about going for a nice cycle along nice routes, and stopping at a park where we can throw tennis balls for her and, you know, come back via a nice way to have coffee. So it's kind of it's trying to make, because I've been I've just really loved cycling, so it's making cycling my hobby, but in a in a different way and a more everyday way. So Friday is a really important part of that. But yeah, I mean, I changed my I changed my Twitter handle to Tricycle Mayor. And then some someone said to me that actually it was Friday that was the Tricycle Mayor, and now I've realised that they they are correct. 37:32Everybody loves dogs on bikes, I think my popular tweet ever was just a picture of somebody with three dogs in her cargo bike.37:37Yeah, exactly. They're just they are a people pleaser.37:41Excellent. No, that does link back nicely into the question that I've just remembered. I was going to ask you, which was when you were talking about sort of local trips? So there's been a lot of talk recently about the well, it varies. Sometimes it's the 15 minutes city, sometimes it's the 20 minute neighbourhood, this kind of focus on things being local, do you think that that's useful? those concepts are kind of useful as well?38:01I do. I really like them, I think that we need to, I prefer the 20 minute neighbourhood just in terms of people's speeds. And I, I, I hope that kind of from people spending a lot more time in their local areas as well during COVID. And locked down that perhaps people see the value in that as well. And in my research at the moment, and just talking about people about what they've been doing during lockdown and how they've been using their local neighbourhoods, it's really nice to hear how people know their local neighbourhoods a lot better. And spending a lot more time and getting to know all of the different roads and using local shops and local places to go and get a coffee when they go and walk. And I yeah, I mean, for us it comes into the same kind of having, trying to make cycling and doing these everyday activities part of the hobby. So we're starting to use a local refill shop, for example, and cut that part off of off of supermarket shopping. And it does, it's having the time to do that as well. So there is a there's a time element that you have to have kind of that disposable time to be able to go there. So I'm we're looking at how to do all of our shopping locally, and what we can do plastic free.Thanks so much Harrie, that was a really great chat and I look forward to seeing what happens with you next with your research with Greater Manchester. You've been listening to the active travel podcast. You can find us online on our website at blog.westminster.ac.uk/ATA/podcast, we are most podcasting hosts and you can follow us on Twitter and Instagram at @active_ata. Let us know what you think, drop us a tweet or an email at activetravelacademy@westminster.ac.uk Thanks for listening. Until next time. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

B2B Marketers on a Mission
Ep. 39: How to Manage Remote B2B Teams Effectively - Interview w/ Vedran Rasic

B2B Marketers on a Mission

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 16, 2021 47:49


How to Manage Remote B2B Teams Effectively “Working well remotely” and “managing teams online” have now not only become buzzwords, but also sought-after skills that every manager needs. On this week’s episode, we talk to B2B SaaS expert Vedran Rasic (Director of Marketing, VanillaSoft) about managing teams and budgets for B2B marketing in startups as well as larger organizations. He also elaborates on how to set up a strategic B2B SaaS framework and ideal customer profiles, the importance of planning short-term sprints, future trends, and how to avoid the “shiny object syndrome” while leveraging opportunities to grow strategically.Topics discussed in this episode: Vedran on managing teams and budgets for B2B marketing - from growing start-ups to managing the chain of command in larger companies [10:44]How to set up B2B SaaS strategic frameworks and Ideal Customer Profiles (ICPs) [16:50]Vedran on strategic planning and short term sprints. [22:44]Future trends and predictions [33:03]Community marketingOnline live eventsReal time edutainmentGamificationMarketing fairnessNoise vs. signal - how to avoid the shiny object syndrome while taking advantage of the opportunities [40:36]Companies & links mentioned in this episode:Vedran Rasic VanillaSoft LeadDeltaThe Trillion Dollar Coach bookTranscriptSPEAKERSChristian Klepp, Vedran RasicChristian Klepp  00:08Hi, and welcome to the B2B Marketers on a Mission podcast. I'm your host Christian Klepp, and one of the founders of EINBLICK Consulting. Our goal is to share inspirational stories, tips and insights from B2B marketers, digital entrepreneurs, and industry experts that will help you to think differently, succeed and scale your business.Alright, welcome, everyone to this episode of the B2B Marketers on a Mission podcast where you get your weekly dose of B2B marketing insights. This is your host Christian Klepp. And today, I'd like to welcome my guest into the show who was a passionate entrepreneur, and B2B marketer experienced in delivering successful product strategies, achieving targets and building high performance teams. So, Vedran Rasic, dobar dan i dobrodošli. Welcome to the show!Vedran Rasic  01:02How's it going?Christian Klepp  01:03Good. Good. Good. I've been practicing that one the whole morning, man. So..Vedran Rasic  01:07You're native, you're native Serbian tration or Balkan.Christian Klepp  01:12Thank you. Vedran, I really enjoyed, I've been enjoying, in fact, all these conversations that you and I have been having. And I'm really looking forward to this conversation.Vedran Rasic  01:21So likewise, my friend, I'm so happy to be here with you.Christian Klepp  01:24Alright, man. So let's just get started, you, I would say are what many people will consider a serial entrepreneur in the B2B SaaS space. So I think I mean, it's true, man, it's seriously like, at least from the conversations that we've had. One skill that I think you've definitely perfected over time is the art of running and managing teams remotely. And that is no small feat, given the current period. So for the sake of the interview, why don't we try to focus the topic a little bit, like narrowed down a bit further. So it's in terms of managing remote teams and budgets, for B2B marketing purposes. So walk us through some of the challenges that you've encountered, and how have you addressed them?Vedran Rasic  02:08Yeah, man, I think it's a great topic. I've been a passionate team lead for, I guess, over five years, and just generally love working with people and building structures where everyone can grow. And one thing that I can mention from my 10 years of my experience of working in different multicultural teams, we've talked about it,  worked in Serbia, Austria, Germany, Canada, US, basically all the across...I can tell...Christian Klepp  02:39International my friend, international!Vedran Rasic  02:41International, exactly. I can tell you one thing,

Rivertown Church Podcast
Altar Day - My One Word Series. Pastor David Rathel. 1.31.2021

Rivertown Church Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 3, 2021 41:59


ALTAR DAY "My One Word" 2 Kings 13:14-20 WHAT IS A “ONE WORD” ALTAR? I. THE ARROW THAT PREDICTS MY FUTURE. The best way to predict your future is to create it. 2 Kings 13:14-17When Elisha became sick with the illness of which he was to die, Joash the king of Israel came down to him and wept over him and said, “My father, my father, the chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” 15And Elisha said to him, “Take a bow and arrows.” So he took a bow and arrows. 16Then he said to the king of Israel, “Put your hand on the bow.” And he put his hand on it, then Elisha laid his hands on the king’s hands. 17And he said, “Open the window toward the east,” and he opened it. Then Elisha said, “Shoot!” And he shot. And he said, “The LORD’s arrow of victory, even the arrow of victory over Aram; for you shall defeat the Arameans at Aphek until you have destroyed them.” The Predictive Principles Of “My One Word.”#1: Do SOMETHING About ONE THING Instead Of NOTHING About Everything. #2: My One Word is a LENS through which you will SEE, not a PROMISE which you must keep.#3: Keep Your “Word From God” In FRONT of you so you won’t FORGET God’s Voice.#4: Every Story Of Transformation Begins With A Word From God.“My One Word” is the point at which LOGOS becomes RHEMAH in your life. II. THE POINT I KEEP STRIKING THE GROUND. ( “Complete Victory”) 2 Kings 13:18-20Then he said, “Take the arrows,” and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, “Strike the ground,” and he struck it three times and stopped. 19So the man of God was angry with him and said, “You should have struck five or six times, then you would have struck Aram until you would have destroyed it. But now you shall strike Aram only three times.” 20And Elisha died, and they buried him. THE BEAUTY OF ONE WORD! A Single Word Can Reveal The Voice Of God. | A Single Word Focuses On Your Inner Character.III. THE PLOW AND OXEN I BURN. (Cortez, Point Of Plow?) 1 Kings 19:19, 21So he departed from there and found Elisha the son of Shaphat, while he was plowing with twelve pairs of oxen before him, and he with the twelfth. And Elijah passed over to him and threw his mantle on him. 21So he returned from following him, and took the pair of oxen and sacrificed them and boiled their flesh with the implements of the oxen, and gave it to the people and they ate. Then he arose and followed Elijah and ministered to him.

MindfulCommerce
#001 How to build & design a low carbon brand & website

MindfulCommerce

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 9, 2020 48:17


HeyLow WebsiteFind us: Head to our community page to register & join the MindfulCommerce community as an expert, brand or merchantInstagram: @mindfulcommerceFacebook @MindfulCommerceContact Us - info@mindfulcommerce.ioMentioned Links:Precious PlasticsOrganic Basics Low Impact WebsiteMastodon - Twitter AlternativeSignal - WhatsApp AlternativeEcosia - Google AlternativeShow notes:Krissie Leyland  00:00Hello, and welcome to episode number one of the MindfulCommerce podcast. In this episode, I Krissie, talk to Saskia and Nico from HeyLow, a creative studio designing and building low carbon brands. We talk about the disturbing fact that the internet is dirty, and every website has a digital carbon footprint. Saskia and Nico reveal some quick and long term wins to create a low carbon brand and website. This episode is super fascinating and might completely change your mindset about the internet. We hope you enjoy it as much as we did. If you have any thoughts or questions, please feel free to email us at info@mindfulcommerce.io. And as always, the full details will be in the show notes.Welcome Saskia and Nico, I'll dive straight in! What made you decide to start offering low carbon web design as a service?Saskia  00:56So Nico, and I met at Precious Plastic, which was a year long project based in the Netherlands. We were designing and building open source machines to reduce plastic waste around the world. There was this huge community activism project but 70,000 users around the world. Anyway, Nico and I were both on the digital team. So I'm background UX, Nico's back UI and we actually worked on the digital tools together. And then, yeah, I mean, it was a year of really understanding, much deeper the climate crisis and how interconnected it is with all about different types of industries. Because we work on the web, and we had some much bigger explorations into it, and kind of finding out facts, like, the internet is actually more of a carbon producer in the sorry, then all of the airlines put together and, and so this is just like, not a narrative that we hear around what the internet is. And it really is just a large dumping ground for stuff that has to be powered by, basically dirty energy. So we decided to pair together and Nico can talk a little bit about it. He has a long background in low impact. But yeah, we just joined together because it seemed like the right thing to do. And yeah, it's been a really great response so far.Krissie Leyland  02:23That's amazing because yeah, you've never really think about your, well, I do now but I didn't used to think about my impact on the planet in terms of just googling something or, you know, landing on a website. You just think you can't see it, it's not physical, so you don't really think about it.Nico  02:43The story written around the internet, we talk a lot about the clouds. And like, it seems to be a wave, not like a physical thing. But actually, it is like it's a big spaces with a lot of computers, the servers and it takes like a lot of energies. And even you have to build the structure like the cables. You have to build the computers and charge your devices. And  because it's like, digital and not something physical. We think it doesn't exist, actually. It's real.Krissie Leyland  03:25Yeah, exactly. And it's just, you know, I guess. So when did you first learn about low carbon websites?Nico  03:36So I don't remember exactly. But my side, I think it was like something like four years ago. And, then I loved the fact about like the the flight industry, the fact the internet is more carbon intensive than the oil industry. And actually, in the news, we talk only about frying, like, the shame of things that like that. And then when I thought about I was like "Wow, Oh my god, this is like, not amazing, the opposite". And I was like, wow, maybe I should do something about it. Because it's also my watch. And yeah, it was an idea in my mind, like for four years and learn a bit about that. And yes, Saskia already told, we met last year and at some point, it was like obvious. We have to do something and walk on that small and it's also like a great design exercise actually. Yeah, for designers, it's pretty cool. It's even more exciting like to design in another way.Krissie Leyland  04:50Yeah. One of the people that asked the question is actually a web designer and she's like, she's hosts her website on Square Space and was just like "Oh no, this is really bad." And so she asked the question of, you know, how, what are the simple, quick wins that a web designer can do or recommend to their clients to like improve their website that's already up and live?Nico  05:21So the first thing is the hosting. So it's where you put your websites, which server. And for that, then you need to be, the data centre need to be run on renewable energy. You save a really a lot of carbon by doing that. And it's kind of, like it's not really about the design of the website, that model structure. It's like when you're designing a product, a physical products, is like the sourcing of materials. Let's say it's like the equivalence, the equivalence with the websites is the server and the hosting services. This is really the first step.Saskia  06:06It's a little difficult when it comes, because places like SquareSpace. Obviously, they don't run on renewable energy and a lot of the really big, big conglomerates that exist in the internet space. Kind of, they're not very transparent around how they actually use energy for their data centres. So it's a little bit tricky. When it is just you know, we obviously use green hosting for all of our projects. But when you're using services like SquareSpace, or other ones, it's very hard to have control over that, unfortunately. Yeah, the hosting is the most important thing.Nico  06:44For example, there is a lot of services using Google Cloud Platform. I think actually should be fine to use it. And Google is claiming they are like 100%, green. But in the meantime, for events, they help oil company on the job, like to perform even more. So first, that means that Google is not green. And also they got data centres in the world were like, not running on green energy. And they came out green just because they're like, compensate. They offset the emission. And we don't think is the way to do it. Like, you can't really like you can't really claim you're green because you compensate. It's like it's kind of a real thing for us.Krissie Leyland  07:40So offsetting is like, a secondary option.Saskia  07:45Yeah, I mean, you can imagine what it takes to create the energy, you know, you're pulling something out of the earth, or the infrastructure that's created to pull that oil out of the earth, and then it goes through all these ginormously complex processes to be able to be performed into energy. You can't just plant a tree to take that energy out, you know, like, you're comparing the output of carbon by, you know, powering something versus actually the entire infrastructure. And we actually need to be able to move towards a much more green infrastructure. We need to be putting out dollars, you know, and into an opportunity that makes it easy for people to be like, "Okay, cool. Like, this is really valuable to the earth now." Because while I think offsetting programs can be beneficial, they are not equal to, yeah, what it takes the infrastructure and the damage that's created of pulling it out of the earth in the first place.Krissie Leyland  08:42Yeah, so being green first. So using the right server, like a green, do you call it a green server?Saskia  08:52Yeah, green hosting.Nico  08:53Yeah. We can call it that. We should already like, compensate the green energy, because even the green energy are emitting carbon. Yeah, actually. So yeah, like, green green, green energy.Saskia  09:12It's kind of impossible to be carbon free.Krissie Leyland  09:14Yeah. So then, I guess, at what point in a brand's journey then, should they think about, you know, being or choosing the right platform? You know, if they've already got a website in place, is that too late?Saskia  09:31I think that it is not fair to say that everybody should move to be green right now. I think that obviously, if they're, if there's the time and the space and the money to move, I think that's the right time. But you know, you have to be a financially viable business before you can have the investment for that. And I do really believe in small businesses and like a much more distributed economy. So I really admire people that run their own businesses, but I actually come from a long line of family businesses. I know, I know how hard it can be. But I mean, there's no, there's no real one time. I mean, whether you're a small young business, or whether you're very well established, um, anyone can make the move. It's actually probably easier at the beginning than it is if you're much more established. But yeah, anyone can make the move at any time, I wouldn't say that there's like one time to do that.Krissie Leyland  10:23Okay. So do you think then So say, for example, me, I've got a website, and it's also on Square Space. And would it be more efficient to kind of swap my internet provider, build a website from scratch that is low carbon or do things like plant a tree? Like offsetting, which you said, isn't necessarily the best way. What would you recommend I do?Saskia  10:58It really depends if you have the time and the space and the money. You know, like, it's not so much like we said it, we don't believe that just offsetting is the same as not producing the carbon in the first place. So when when people have the time and the space, I think that's the time for them to actually move. But I don't think a low carbon website versus a website on dirty energy plus trees planting is an equal game. What do you think?Nico  11:32Exactly that. You could also can iterate your switch and start by maybe looking at your actual website on Square Space, try to make it lower, like removing images, or like compressing your images you have or trying to design it in another way or like, make the actual website lighter. And when you have the time, or like the budget for it, with the new one, you can maybe start from the Square Space realm. I don't know if you can export. But maybe you can just keep the same design and build it on another platform. And when you have the time and the budgets, and it's on a green server and like really plan, make a plan, don't have to be like, you know, everything at once. Yeah, it's kind of drawn is like, for everyone actually can be like, totally, totally perfect. From a day to another one, it's a kind of a journey.Krissie Leyland  12:45Yeah. So the simple actions would be to change the images to lower res maybe, and perhaps not having animated graphics or stuff that... yeah, takes more energy.Nico  13:00First, try to avoid video. Because this is really the the most heavy thing, of your data, like if you put for example, a video on a website, you're gonna know, like, a website is around, it depends. But it could be around five, three and five megabytes, I would say. And the video is just, you can click on play, and it's already five or 10 megabytes and like, just continue to play in like, I don't know, like a three minute video, it could be like 60 or 100 megabytes, depending on the quality of, but this is really offensive.Saskia  13:46Yeah. So it's really like lowering your website is really relative to what your website was in the first place. So, you know, like a portfolio site could be, you know, 50% lower or 80% lower versus like a larger e-commerce site. They're not going to be the same like weight at the end, but they would have reduced a similar amount. So I think I think it's hard to get all to make this exact same size. But it's more about the percentage of reduction because there's lots of different industries, some will require more images, or yeah, just depending on what your industry is.Krissie Leyland  14:24So then, for example, Organic Basics. Should we talk about that in terms of their lower impact version? So they've got their main site, which has all the what it looks like high, higher res images and graphics and stuff, and then their lower impact site. What do you... do have an opinion on how they've done it? Have they done it well?Nico  14:51So I think it's a great website. Great exercise. So this thing is a kind of easy job for them because they sell basic clothes. So like a white t-shirt, it's a white t-shirt. And then they can do what they did for the design. That means they put like just illustration. And after when you click, you can see the image in a low quality image. So it's works for basics issue. But if you have like, dresses, like shoes or like products and everything, you can't do what they did. So it's a super good exercise. But for me, the downside of that is like, they didn't switch their main websites. So that means just for now, like a marketing tool is cool. Like, like, it's really good to communicate about this programme. But could be even more cool to have like, really that as the main website.Saskia  16:06Yeah, that's the challenging thing about it. It's like a really great example of a low carbon website. But I would like to see like how many clothes or products they actually have sold using this material. You know, like using this philosophy? I think that it is there's a common, there is a middle ground between what they did. And there are lots of examples of websites, lots of use cases so that you can use a website like that. But yeah, as Nico said, the most important thing, well, a very important thing to a small business owner is that they have something that's good for their brand, and that converts well, and, and so like there's a combination between the two. But yeah, it's a good marketing exercise of Organic Basics, but at the same time now they have two websites. And I think one is a marketing piece and the other is where they sell clothes.Krissie Leyland  16:53Yeah, like just wondering if it would actually make a difference in the end? Because, yeah, like you said, they've got two websites now why not just have the one.Saskia  17:03I've bought from Organic Basics and I've bought from their normal website. I didn't actually, you know, I didn't go through that. Because you know, it's hard to buy just like that.Krissie Leyland  17:13Yeah, it'd be really interesting to kind of ask them the results. I'm hoping maybe.Saskia  17:20But I admire them. But I hopefully I think it's probably an experiment. And I think that we might see an evolution of something later on. Because, you know, they're obviously like very committed to finding out what works for them in a more low carbon way. So I think it's just a first step. And I, yeah, it was really cool for us to see because it was like a bigger place kind of, yeah, doing this as well. Krissie Leyland  17:45Yeah, I think it might be... Well, I think it's one of the only lower impact e-commerce sites on Shopify.Saskia  17:55Mmhmm.Krissie Leyland  17:55So it'd be really interesting to see the difference in how many people like shop, or make a purchase on the lower impact site in comparison to the other one?Saskia  18:06Yeah, like now that I've bought, I might just go to the lower impact site because I know what they have already.Krissie Leyland  18:13Yeah. Maybe it's returning customers that will go to the lower impact site. And then new customers will yeah, use the main one. Because they are basic items, like, you know, once you find out that you like it, it's yeah... you may as well go to the lower impact and choose that item again. Nico  18:35The experience is pretty good, because I don't know if I did that, but when you order on the low website, because I order on it, I wanted to see like, the whole journey and actually the email and send you at the end is even designed in a low way. They don't use an image or like weird stuff like that. It's really low. And it's pretty good design. Just it's pretty cool.Krissie Leyland  19:08So the entire journey, even at post, like after purchasing then with their receipts and stuff...Nico  19:16Only if you order on the low version of the website.Krissie Leyland  19:20Yeah. Interesting, hmmm. And I wonder, like, in terms of social media, then because if they're, you know, they've got the low impact website, low impact emails. I wonder what their approaches on social media and then that brings me to a social media question, which is, we've noticed that you're not on social media as much. And is that because they're bad for the planet? Or is it just a personal choice?Saskia  19:53Well, Nico is not on any social media because...Nico  19:56No, I'm just like, I start fighting against. But more like, it's not about the carbon. It's more like...Saskia  20:09Yeah, the power.Nico  20:10The power and what's happened like recently with the Black Lives Matter movement and like what Facebook did or didn't actually when like... so Trump tweet, like not tweet but sent a message. It was like "When the shooting starts... no when the looting starts the shooting starts" and like actually, I think Twitter flagged the message, but Facebook did nothing. And I started to realise like, wow, this is weird. And I did some research and I had a  look and like some thinking and realised like, for example, the Far, far right movements are like super strong because of social media in particular on Facebook. Like I just finished. And so I started like, trying to boycott on my side, like, so I removed my Instagram account and Facebook and WhatsApp. So I came back again, because some thoughts are really difficult to not live with. Like Whatsapp is really hard. But just like realise the power of this platform. And in other way, also Black Lives Matter is really important also because of social media. So in a good way or so.Saskia  21:32Yeah, I think that like the power, the control of these large internet companies is like way, it's way too imbalanced. And I really want to like promote, well, how power communities promote a more distributed way of how we connect online on social media, because I believe in social media. I think it's a great way to communicate. However, like I deleted my Facebook, sorry, yeah, maybe a year and a half ago, because I was so fed up with the way that they do business and the way that they like, you know, they really market on like bad feelings of anxiety and loneliness. And like, they really try to just promote this, like over consuming behaviour. And I think that that is just so, I don't know if you know the work of Tristan Harris, and he does, like, the humane tech society in San Francisco. And yeah, it's just incredible how they really design a tool like Facebook, to be towards our like animalistic behaviour of like dopamine and like, and how we kind of get these highs from this. And yeah, I much prefer social media that will promote human connection. And so I still, for me, personally, I'm still on Instagram. And we haven't actually done any HeyLow social media yet. Just because it hasn't really been a priority for us. Like we, we really, like I've been in this realm of sustainability and system change and social equality, yeah, for probably like eight or nine years. And so like, yeah, just from all the places that I've worked and collaborated with and design projects, I've just got, like quite a big large network as, as Nico has. So we're, for us in our business right now. It's... we don't need to be on social media channels. And to be honest, like, I think that we kind of went way too much on the other side from from having no social media to kind of like, just spending like 100 hours a week on it every week, you know, some people do. And it's just so unhealthy. And I want to find a way that social media has a role in our society, but it's not a controlling force. And I think at the moment, it just feels too controlling. So I look forward to more platforms that might emerge in the future that, you know, for example, like, doesn't own your data. I mean, it seems so simple to like, have a tool, I would love to use a tool like Facebook, but I don't accept that they own everything that I do online. So it's very easy. I look forward to the entrepreneurial spirits of some more ethical founders that will build products like this, because I think we're all bit keen for it. But at the moment like there's only like three things. And yeah, it's just crazy. I watched the anti trust. Well actually Nico watched all of it. I watched some of the anti trust hearings. I watch some of the anti trust hearing of like Google, Facebook, Amazon, Apple. It was frightening. It's really frightening how much power they have and how just they give like zero, yeah. Actual like community involvement and stuff like that. So sorry, that was a bit of a rant.Krissie Leyland  24:55This is great. I was just thinking then so an alternative to Google, for example, is Ecosia? I think it's called. And you know they don't store your data. So maybe they will come up with a social media platform that doesn't, or someone.Nico  25:16Or like we could have also like, nice to have like a decentralised platform. Think about emails, that you can choose your provider of emails like, and there is like a protocol. Like from one services to the other one, like there is like communication, but it's not like on only one. And you're still about to send messages between the providers. So yeah, the idea would be to have something like that and there is like, little ones, like, there is one can Mastodon, which is kind of Twitter. Krissie Leyland  25:52Okay. What How do you spell that?Nico  25:56Mastadon so it'sSaskia  25:59M-A-S-T-A-D-O-NKrissie Leyland  26:02Oh, yes.Saskia  26:05There's some really cool tools coming up. Like I've seen some interesting social networks.Nico  26:10But the problem is, like, for example, on WhatsApp, so there is like a really cool application called Signal, which is kind of it's the same as WhatsApp. It's a message app. But the problem is like, there is no one there. Like you have to ask your friends to come in and to use it. So as the mentor, I'm like, the centralisation of like, when you meet some people, they asked for your WhatsApp accounts and stuff like that. And that is really like...Saskia  26:42But that might change again.Nico  26:43Yeah. Yeah, no, for sure. For sure. It takes time. And yeah, just wants to add about the carbon impact of social media. More on the technical side, I would say. So first, there is like the same thing as Google. They all claim they are green, or like, I think Facebook says there are 100% green, but the same as Google, like, think as they compensate. And also, like they, like they give space for like, climate denial or stuff like that sort of like it's not, it's weird. And also, there is a lot of video, like Instagram, there is the stories and stuff and it shows a lot, a lot of data. So in that way, it's not pretty good for that.Saskia  27:34I have a good social media, it could be around, like, curating what you want to say. And just really being careful about your message. And not so much like being careful what you have to say, but maybe not using three posts to say one thing.Krissie Leyland  27:48Yeah, yeah. Just being really to the point.Saskia  27:51And yeah exactly, which is hard in the like, mess that we have of just like so much stuff coming through there.Nico  27:58And maybe, you don't have to say anything, every 10 minutes. Krissie Leyland  28:01Yeah, yeah get on with your day. Don't worry about what other people are looking at you for. But like, I just wonder how, because being passionate about, you know, saving the planet, and I feel like my way of getting my message across at the moment is through this community, which just so happens to be on Facebook, or Instagram. And I don't know, do you have any other what, like, suggestions of how people can make an impact without using social media? Because they do have so much control? And that's where everybody is. How would you get your message across instead?Saskia  28:46I think the most important thing is to try and affect the community around you. I think, that like, while we think that everybody is on social media, there's also a lot of people not on social media. And I think the most powerful thing is to rally the people, your community, your family, your, you know, like when we both worked at Precious Plastics like we live, we met and live with 40 to 50 to 60 people, you know, like, dead passionate about the environment. But, um, I don't know, I think I think while it's really helpful to engage in online community, which I do, too, like it's something that I still do. And but I don't know, I think there's nothing compared to spending time with people face to face. You know, rallying local movements, local food movements, local localisation movements. It's really, and this really this, this concept around my pleasure activism, which to be a happy and grounded and connected human being is actually a method of being an activist because everything around us in society is trying to feed off our anxieties, trying to feed up what we're insecure about trying to feed off our loneliness and our you know, like our discontent with what we've achieved so far. Like that's, that's what I think is really driving this over consuming, like very much against the planet. Again, this linear economy is like, I don't know, just to, to work on ourselves and to be spend with our communities and to maybe not want to have businesses to, you know, an X amount of hundreds of thousands or but you know, just just what is the enough for you and like, kind of just, like, bring it down a level. I feel like the last period of growth is just been so focused on, you know, the individual rather than the whole of our communities and our ecosystems. And, yeah, it just, it's much more, you know, controversial, I think, to be a happy and grounded person that doesn't need to buy a whole lot of stuff like, but at the same time, like, I know that there are small businesses that need to sell stuff, but I don't know, like, I've been in e-commerce before. And I've had several go's that you know, this type of thing. And, you know, it's about like, yeah, getting what we need, and not more than that. And I think that engaging in local movement, and local communities is just an amazing form of activism.Krissie Leyland  31:13Yeah, I love that. And I was, like, I feel now I'm happiest, actually, when I have just enough, like, now I enjoy decluttering my life and just, you know, thinking, do I really need this? No, well, don't buy it. Even if all these ads are telling me to, no, I'm not going to do it because it's, it's not going to make me happier. It's not, you know, and just thinking about the planet more and just being more conscious about everything that I do, basically. Saskia  31:53And if you do produce things, and if you do sell things, then you know, do it because people want to buy it and not because you're trying to sell them an idea or, like a something that I don't know might not last, you know, it's much, much more like I buy things, I'm not saying that, like, you should never buy things again. But I think that there can be a much more holistic relationship between people making things to sell and and people buying them. And I believe in economy, and I believe in enterprise, I just don't think that we need to, like, work our entire lives to fill our houses with crap.Krissie Leyland  32:27Let's not do that. Um, so I'm just gonna look at, see if there's any questions that we haven't answered. But I think what, okay, so what is the number one tip that you could give to everyone when they're designing their website to make it, you know, more carbon friendly, more environmentally friendly? Out of all the tips that you've just given?Nico  32:57Okay, so yeah, all the tips. Because the first one is the hosting for sure. Because just to come back to that, like the carbon intensity between the two energies, like classic one and renewable one, like it's like, it's a huge difference.Saskia  33:14Isn't it like 19 times or something? Nico  33:16Yeah, maybe. I don't know. Like, we did like quick like, calculation, about a page we did design recently. Oh no actually, it was about the actual page they got. So it's a page around 10 megabytes. And so if it's run on, non, non renewable energy, like this page, if it's visited by 10,000 people each month for a year, you need 47 trees to compensate the emission, but if it's run on renewable energy, I think it's between three and four tress Its a difference like 10 times. So just that...Saskia  33:58And thats just one website that's not very big and only visited by 10,000. So you can imagine like the news websites the like, all the e-commerce all these big, it's just ginormous.Krissie Leyland  34:11Makes me so sad.Nico  34:13So this is really the first step and after that for sure no video if you can.Krissie Leyland  34:20Yeah.Nico  34:22And after really try to focus on the content and like not putting everything. Actually, it's really also design and like really good for your communication. Because online the attention span of people is really, really small. So it's just send like thousands of messages and you put like, I don't know many image like like lots of images, like you're losing people and but if you focus really on like, your main message and you put one or two image maybe it's way more efficient, and is going to be lighter, actually.Saskia  34:57Yeah, I believe that like it's not even about Low Carbon that like, you know, having a really good strategy around how you communicate your message is actually good for the planet because if you can reduce that, you can reduce people understanding what you do very quickly. And yeah, it's it's also a very big tool that we use, is by starting with the communication, which doesn't seem like a low carbon thing to do but, it's really, really, really helpful and making sure that it's curated and well received and easy to understand.Krissie Leyland  35:28Yeah, because the less time they're on your site thinking, "What do, what is it that you actually are offering?". then there's less impact.Saskia  35:38Yeah and you're less tempted to use more images to break up the content, because, you know, has a big stream of lines, they have animations, and they have images, and they have, like, all this other stuff. So yeah, it's definitely an exercise in trying to achieve that.Nico  35:54And an easy win also is to compress the images. There is good tools online like one is called tiny PNG.  You can go there and like, you just drag and drop your images, and you compress it and you can really, really win a lot of data.Krissie Leyland  36:15I think that's also good for SEO. Just as a side note.Nico  36:20Yeah, no, for sure. Because if you website is fast, Google likes it.Krissie Leyland  36:27It's like the load speed. I was just thinking then as well, you know, if you if you're, you know, when you look at Google Analytics, and you've got the bounce rate percentage, actually, now that might, if I looked at that now, I might think "Oh, that's quite good." Because if they're not spending too much time on my site, maybe it's good. Instead of thinking, "Well, no, where are they going?"Nico  36:54Yeah, but you could have like, the same use of bandwidth, but with more people. Because you're like, you have better communication. Next, you drive more people to your website, but as because your website is lighter like it just uses the same amount. So it's like a win win.Krissie Leyland  37:15Cool. So um, what are some examples of the websites that you've built? So who are your typical customers?Saskia  37:25I wouldn't say that we actually have a typical customer, because we do work across... yeah, people that are just willing to go low. So at the moment, we're doing a e-commerce store, like it's sustainable fashion. And that has been a very amazing and interesting journey. Because, you know, it's a lot about taking them along the journey as well. It's just like a conversation like this. And sometimes there's friction, because there's a very standard way of presenting these types of things. But we did that. We did an organisation, it's actually my organisation on it's like an NGO, based in and around India, and women's work over there. And so we were able to Yeah, that was amazing. We were able, we took that from Square Space, and we put it onto our own custom site, and the reduction was just ginormous. And that was really around removing a lot of images. And yeah, really making sure that the messages and the news, the updates, and the information was very loud and clear. We're doing this, do want to talk about some projects?Nico  38:35Um, yeah, we're working right now on an exhibition, we are doing the website for the exhibition.It's around imagination and our imagination work with design. Basically, there is like example of illustration, like from like 50 years ago, some snags that were people were imagining the wall today. Like for example with like a TV in the pocket, which is actually now phones and now we can like imagination can drive design and the society actually.Saskia  39:13And it's pretty amazing because we have to like use, we have to do an immersive experience but in as low as possible way. So you know, it's not so much like yeah, definitely not lots of videos but yeah, lots of text animations and things like that.Nico  39:29Yeah, and with like now, like so we start with like really like at the beginning of HeyLow and we start to add some gems and which is I found myself pretty cool is we have different type of websites, like e-commerce website, like an immersive website, and we can really test this idea of design, like philosophy and like, because it's not about building the lowest websites ever like because, this is easy like you do like on like, the HeyLow website is actually just text. And that's it. That's like for e-commerce websites, you can't do that for a massive expense. Like, you can't do like that. So it's not like getting the lowest possible. I mean, the lowest possible for that case. To still do be able to do like e-commerce websites, but trying to really lower the impact of that kind of website.Saskia  40:31Yeah and we're about to do like a big, big organisation website, which might be like 100 pages or something. So like, it's gonna be very different to the NGO website we did for me, which is literally like five pages. So yeah, the goal is not to get to a certain level, but more of a percentage decrease and like, show,  because not many people are doing this industry right now. So we really want to have the best examples put forward for how the internet can be like, this is what me and Nico say to each other. Like, we love the internet. We've like, we've been on the internet for 15 plus years. And it can be a really sustainable place. It's just at the moment, it's just like hurtling towards, not that. So yeah, it's more about the approach and the philosophy and the combination of who we work with plus what we think it should be, and then kind of like arriving at a new destination.Krissie Leyland  41:25And that's really cool. So it depends on the type of website. And yeah, so just decreasing the percentage in rather than being like, let's get it to zero.Saskia  41:35That would be easy, don't have a website. Krissie Leyland  41:44Yeah. Oh, cool.Nico  41:47Yeah. See, we try to work with like, sustainable companies. And if we don't work for oil companies, don't even call us.Krissie Leyland  41:59So what would you say that your mission is then? To lower the impact as much as possible?Saskia  42:07Make the internet a better place. Yes.Nico  42:11I do think there is true traditions, there is the design part, the web design parts, which is really trying to, as we said, like, making the internet a better place and a greener place, if we can say it like that. And I do believe there is like a mission, which is helping the brands or organisation to have a better communication and like to, to win, actually to to win...Saskia  42:37the hearts and minds of their viewers. Yeah, we didn't, we haven't really talked about that. But like, obviously, part of our work is the website production and the low design. But definitely a big chunk of it is, is like re-imagination, reimagining their branding and reimagining their strategy and their communication and like how they can, yeah, communicate in a much more connected way towards finding the people that are there crews and communities. And like that, which is also very, we think is like quite an important part of moving the internet to a better place, because then it just feels less cluttered and people kind of know what they're looking for. Krissie Leyland  43:19Yeah, I feel like by simplifying websites or the internet, it will actually make people a lot happier. Because you're not having to trawl through all this information and all this noise to get what you're looking for. It's just, it will make it easier for everyone I think. And at the same time, yeah, saving the planet.  Um, cool. Well, thank you. Um, did you have any questions for me or for the community, or anything that you'd like to just tell everybody? Saskia  44:01I think it can feel a bit scary when you like, learn how bad the internet can be. But I do, I think we both believe that there is a bright future for a place like this. And it is much about the design and communication, it's also about the infrastructure, it's also about the parts that we might not have visibility on. So yeah, we just kind of want to make it easier for other people to do. And in fact, we come from a very open source, like background, Precious Plastic was all open source. So once we get up and running, I do really want to publish a bit more around like, what what brands can do if they don't, you know, if they can't kind of go through a big redesign, you know, I'd really like to help out the community as a whole to say, you know, these are the things that we can, you know, start working together and it's less about having 100 HeyLow, 1000 HeyLow sites, it's more about the internet moving in a direction that is more sustainable, more connected. So yeah, hopefully sometime next year, we'll have a bit more content around like how we think that we can kind of help people in a more community like way.Krissie Leyland  45:12Hmm, cool. And we can we can do it together. And because together, we're stronger. And so you mentioned something else then. Precious plastics? Tell me a little bit about that. And I know that it's really cool. So you can tell everyone.Saskia  45:33Precious Plastic is an open source, collaborative project, designing and building machines to recycle plastic. So it was started by a guy named Dave Hakkens. Yeah, maybe four or five or six years ago. And he started building some machines and like really low flying machines. He saw that the recycling machines were very complicated, convoluted they need, you know, like the whole recycling municipality recycling system was very difficult to kind of get your head around. And he was a designer working in this area. So he made these really simple machines, that one would tread plastic one would extrude it one would, like squish it into a sheet. And anyway, so he put these plans online, open source, so people around the world could download them and like thousands of people did over the years, and they iterated on them and they sent their plans back. And so the machines have gone through several versions. And last year, but actually 2018, he did a big call out for version four and over 100 people came over the year to contribute to whether it be machines, whether it be like solutions to waste as in like biomaterials or by plastic that biodegradable materials. What else do people do product design? We did the digital tools. Okay, cooking, cooking shares, there were lots of helpers around. And so yeah, it was and it's been adopted. And now it's kind of like a pretty amazing resource like you can, you can even like buy entire workspaces now, if you want. So it's kind of for plastic entrepreneurs. So if you kind of want to make a bit of a dent in your local community, you can go onto the Precious Plastic website and see how you can contribute. Maybe you want to start a workspace and you want to collect plastic, and you want to like produce products where you want to sell something. And there's just a general, mostly active and supportive community online that are all trying to help each other. Learn how to decentralised plastic recycling around the world. So it's pretty amazing. It's pretty cool community, I definitely recommend having a look if anyone's interested in it.Krissie Leyland  47:43Definitely. Cool. Well, thank you so much. That was really, really insightful. And all the questions have been answered. Yeah, thank you.Saskia  47:56Do you want to add anything, Nico? Nico  47:58No.Saskia  47:58Okay, cool. Yeah, it was great to talk to you and thanks for setting it up. And yeah, looking forward to making the internet a better place!Krissie Leyland  48:07Yay! Absolutely. Thank you so much. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

UpNorth Kingdom: Living in a world that is not our home.
But Blacks Kill Each Other So Why Ya'll Mad?

UpNorth Kingdom: Living in a world that is not our home.

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 9, 2020 31:31


I answer your questions and look at the argument that blacks also kill each other.Show NotesDid God show favoritism with Israel?Does the Bible have anything to say about God exercising favoritism or partiality? If so what does it say?For there is no favoritism with God. -- Romans 2:119 And masters, treat your slaves the same way, without threatening them, because you know that both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no favoritism with him. -- Ephesians 6:934 Peter began to speak: “Now I truly understand that God doesn’t show favoritism, -- Acts 10:3417 For the Lord your God is the God of gods and Lord of lords, the great, mighty, and awe-inspiring God, showing no partiality and taking no bribe. -- Deuteronomy 10:17Partiality with man is sinIf, however, you show favoritism, you commit sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. -- James 2:921 It is not good to show partiality — yet even a courageous person may sin for a piece of bread. -- Proverbs 28:21So clearly the Bible is against partiality. It is sinful. Now we take this information and use it to reconcile what God was doing against a proper backdrop.God predestined a solution to save humanity and that solution was Himself in the form of Jesus Christ.To do this God needed people but He also had to ensure these people stayed on the proper path for the Messiah to come (Israelites).Romans 1:16 makes plain what God was doing.16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, first to the Jew, and also to the Greek. -- Romans 1:16Jews receive priority, but it's not because of favoritism. It's simply based out of logic (1 must come before 2).God oftentimes punished Israel and even threatened to destroy them for their sin; see Deuteronomy 28, Book of Jeremiah, Daniel.God treated Israel the same way He treats everyone. Obey and be blessed, disobey and be cursed. That's not partiality or favoritism. That's righteous and fair judgement.Blacks kill each other so what's the big deal?Black people aren't the only ethnic group to kill within their ethnic group.So because people kill within their own ethnic groups that means no one should be outraged when they're targeted by others? No.The issue isn't just cops killing blacks. The issue is blacks being marginalized and discriminated against since their arrival to this country.So the issue isn't racism exists because cops are killing blacks. The issue is racism because racism exists.Black Lives MatterTheir organization statement carries is anti-biblical. However, we can get with the idea that the lives of black people Matter.Email truth@upnorthkingdom.com | Follow on Twitter | Subscribe on YouTube See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Sermons – New Hope Community Church
Certainty in Uncertain Times

Sermons – New Hope Community Church

Play Episode Listen Later May 31, 2020 34:03


A prayer of an afflicted man. When he is faint and pours out his lament before the LORD. 1Hear my prayer, O LORD; let my cry for help come to you. 2Do not hide your face from me when I am in distress. Turn your ear to me; when I call, answer me quickly. 3For my days vanish like smoke; my bones burn like glowing embers. 4My heart is blighted and withered like grass; I forget to eat my food. 5Because of my loud groaning I am reduced to skin and bones. 6I am like a desert owl, like an owl among the ruins. 7I lie awake; I have become like a bird alone on a roof. 8All day long my enemies taunt me; those who rail against me use my name as a curse. 9For I eat ashes as my food and mingle my drink with tears 10because of your great wrath, for you have taken me up and thrown me aside. 11My days are like the evening shadow; I wither away like grass. 12But you, O LORD, sit enthroned forever; your renown endures through all generations. 13You will arise and have compassion on Zion, for it is time to show favor to her; the appointed time has come. 14For her stones are dear to your servants; her very dust moves them to pity. 15The nations will fear the name of the LORD, all the kings of the earth will revere your glory. 16For the LORD will rebuild Zion and appear in his glory. 17He will respond to the prayer of the destitute; he will not despise their plea. 18Let this be written for a future generation, that a people not yet created may praise the LORD: 19“The LORD looked down from his sanctuary on high, from heaven he viewed the earth, 20to hear the groans of the prisoners and release those condemned to death.” 21So the name of the LORD will be declared in Zion and his praise in Jerusalem 22when the peoples and the kingdoms assemble to worship the LORD. 23In the course of my life he broke my strength; he cut short my days. 24So I said: “Do not take me away, O my God, in the midst of my days; your years go on through all generations. 25In the beginning you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands. 26They will perish, but you remain; they will all wear out like a garment. Like clothing you will change them and they will be discarded. 27But you remain the same, and your years will never end. 28The children of your servants will live in your presence; their descendants will be established before you.”

Radio Cade
Using Salamander Tissue to Repair Human Skin

Radio Cade

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 15, 2020


Jonelle Toothman has done a lot. A former Division 1 soccer player, Journalism major, and Army brat, she also co-founded NextGen Biologics and became its CEO. The company uses salamander tissue as an architecture for regenerative medicine to help burn victims and help repair wounds. As far as other applications, Jonelle says “our imagination is our only limitation.” *This episode was originally released on September 25, 2018.* TRANSCRIPT: Intro: 0:01Inventors and their inventions. Welcome to Radio Cade, a podcast from the Cade Museum for Creativity and Invention in Gainesville, Florida. The museum is named after James, Robert Cade who invented Gatorade in 1965. My name is Richard Miles. We’ll introduce you to inventors and the things that motivate them. We’ll learn about their personal stories, how their inventions work, and how their ideas get from the laboratory to the marketplace. Richard Miles: 0:39This morning we have our guest Jonelle Toothman, who is the co-founder and chief executive officer at NextGen Biologics. Welcome, Jonelle. Jonelle Toothman: 0:47Thank you. Richard Miles: 0:48So before we talk about NextGen and what it is you do and invented, tell me a little bit about yourself. Where are you from? Where’d you grow up? What were you like, what did parents do, tell us everything that you want to tell us about. Jonelle Toothman: 1:00So I am a very high energy, high passion, extremely outgoing, and I grew up and was born in Germany. Richard Miles: 1:10Germany. Why, Germany? Jonelle Toothman: 1:13Why Germany, my Dad is retired Air Force, so we did a little bit of moving around as a child. Richard Miles: 1:18Uh, where in Germany? Jonelle Toothman: 1:21Zweibrücken. Richard Miles: 1:22Okay. There’s a big airbase there, right? Jonelle Toothman: 1:23There is. Richard Miles: 1:24Okay. And you’re there just as an infant or how many years were you in Germany? Jonelle Toothman: 1:30A young child. We left there when I was five. Richard Miles: 1:31Okay. Um, and so as you’re growing up what sort of inspired you to become a CEO? Did you ever even think about it or what were you like as a kid? Jonelle Toothman: 1:40I’m still trying to figure out how that title is where I’m at right now. As a kid, I really… all I cared about was being outdoors and playing sports. I, uh, was outside from dusk till dawn and all I wanted to do is play soccer. So, the passion really came later in life after my sister actually passed away of brain cancer. Richard Miles: 2:06Oh, I’m sorry to hear that. Jonelle Toothman: 2:07So my sophomore year in college she had a devastating disease that only allowed her to live 18 months after finding out that she was diagnosed with brain cancer. And during that time in college, I kind of evaluated what I was doing with my life and where I was going and what the opportunities were. Richard Miles: 2:25What were you studying at the time, Jonelle? Jonelle Toothman: 2:27I was a journalism major. Richard Miles: 2:29Journalism, okay. Jonelle Toothman: 2:29So I thought I wanted to do sports broadcasting. That was kind of my thought and ambition at the time. Richard Miles: 2:34And you got a degree in journalism? Jonelle Toothman: 2:36Journalism and mass communications. Richard Miles: 2:38Okay. So did you go back and start studying biology or how did you wander into that field? I mean the example your sister, but obviously you didn’t have an educational background equip you for that field. Jonelle Toothman: 2:51Exactly, and I knew the educational aspect of going back and being a physician of some sorts was not my passion. School and academia was not the route that was going to make me a benefit to society when it came to medicine. So I had to figure out something different besides being a physician and that’s where the pharmaceutical side of the business and medical side of the business from a sales perspective became intriguing and interesting. I could still impact that medical field, but do it with the things that I was naturally good at versus the things that I would have to really pursue that might not be as passionate but have the same benefits. Richard Miles: 3:31Did you ever do anything with sports journalism at all Jonelle? Jonelle Toothman: 3:34I did a few broadcasting shows for Marshall University in West Virginia where I played division one soccer there. I did a few of the sports broadcasting for some other additional sports. Richard Miles: 3:45So let’s talk about NextGen Biologics. It says here that you’re developing a novel extracellular Matrix. What does that mean to the normal person? Jonelle Toothman: 3:57So an extracellular matrix also known as an ECM. It is basically utilized to repair soft tissue in the body. So if you think of a burn victim or somebody that’s had a surgical type of procedure, they often have soft tissue that needs to repair… a scar or a wound that won’t heal. That extracellular matrix is a surgical patch that you would put in a wound bed to promote healing and allow that soft tissue to grow back. Richard Miles: 4:33So these are living cells that you’re… Jonelle Toothman: 4:35So they’re not. They’re not technically living cells. So if you think about it from a standpoint of right now they use pig or they use cow and they take the d ermis, the skin of those particular species, and they use those as a patch to cover that wound so you can prevent infections and the risk of losing those wounds are those limbs, but that’s basically a patch that allows new soft tissue to grow and repair. Richard Miles: 5:04So the product that NextGen is developing, it’s a patch, but it’s from human material? Jonelle Toothman: 5:09So it’s actually from one of the most amazing species we’ve ever seen in science. If you think about a salamander that is fascinating, if you crush its spine, it regrows. If you take off a limb, it regrows part of its organs regrow. It is the only species that we know of or that I personally know of that can regenerate its entire organ system as well as skeletal system. And so we’re starting with the best material that we’ve seen in science versus our own human dermis that we don’t regenerate. So these… Richard Miles: 5:45So these are actually salamander cells? Jonelle Toothman: 5:47They’re not cells. So it is, it is… Richard Miles: 5:51You have to work with me Jonelle. I’m slow. Jonelle Toothman: 5:55It is the tissue from Salamander, that is what promotes that healing aspect. Richard Miles: 5:59Are geckos salamanders or not really? Jonelle Toothman: 6:02Not really. Richard Miles: 6:02Okay. So you can’t co-brand with Geico for marketing purposes. Jonelle Toothman: 6:04Unfortunately, and fortunately, we won’t be selling cars, but hopefully repairing some wounds. Richard Miles: 6:10Alright, so wound repair. I mean, I’m thinking there are a lot of applications here, but why don’t you break it down for me, what are the applications that you think are the most likely for this technology? Jonelle Toothman: 6:20So this is what’s exciting and fascinating about that technology. Our only limitations are our imaginations and the scientific imagination of where this application could be indicated for. So we can utilize and we’re starting to utilize and going through the process to get approved to utilize this surgical patch for wound regeneration. So if you think about a diabetic foot ulcer or a really bad, a surgical procedure that has been infected because the patient had some sort of disease or are they smoked or they are hypertensive and they just don’t heal as well as a young person might. This patch would help them to cover that wound to decrease the infection that can get to that wound. And then eventually start to tell the body to repair that tissue in a way that allows new tissue to form. Richard Miles: 7:17So for those people now, what sort of treatment do they get, if any? Jonelle Toothman: 7:21So right now, if you think of a wound or a burn victim right now, they’re getting either donated human cadaver skin, they’re getting the cow, the pig, they’re getting some synthetic, like Gortex type of material. But basically they’re getting some sort of cloth, if you think about it or Bandaid, if you think about it, they’re getting something to put on that wound that allows it to not get infected and for new tissue to start growing. Richard Miles: 7:49And is the problem with these other solutions that they don’t grow or they’re not as effective? Or is that not an adequate solution? Jonelle Toothman: 7:56So they’re all adequate solutions. That’s the good thing. Uh, patients and physicians have choices for what’s needed. They’re all great products. The difference that we’re trying to capture is we’re starting with a material that naturally has regenerative capabilities. So if you think about using human skin that’s been donated from a cadaver, humans no longer have the ability to regenerate. We lose that ability after the second trimester. So when you put on that new skin, what happens is your body accepts it and it eventually creates new skin, but you’ll see really bad scars. You’ll see divots within our creators kind of where that skin doesn’t heal upwards. It kind of heals in the crevice of where that wound bed was. The material that we’re starting with is naturally regenerative. It naturally has the proteins, the nutrients, the cytokines, the healing aspect that we’re looking for. So what we’re hoping that this product, when you implanted in a human or you put it on that surgical site, that we turn on the light switch back to what our body naturally knew how to do when it was in the wound bed and that is heal. So we’re hoping that it turns on this light switch and creates that healing form to create less fibrosis, less scar, and allow your body to adapt that and then regrow new tissue that’s almost childlike versus the fibers and the scar that we’re used to. Richard Miles: 9:27Wow. That is exciting. Um, you talked about an approval process. You’re talking about the FDA approval process, right? Where are you in bed? Are you, did you just file or are you about to get your approval? Tells us about that. Jonelle Toothman: 9:38So it’s actually an FDA clearance and it’s for a specific indication, which we’re not claiming that we heal wounds faster. We’re not claiming that we can heal wounds better. What we’re trying to show the FDA currently is that we are equal to what’s out there right now in not wound healing but in surgical wound repair. Richard Miles: 10:00So in theory this is easier, right? Because the FDA in essence has already approved the core technology. Now you’re asking them to approve another version of that core technology? Jonelle Toothman: 10:09So we’re asking them to approve another animal species form since we’re already using animals species out there. And so where we are with that clearance right now is the FDA has reviewed a lot of our information. We had to prove that we’re safe, as safe as those other products out there, and we’ve done all of those initial studies, we’ve passed those initial studies. The FDA last summer has asked us to complete a few additional human clinical studies because this particular animal or species has never been used in a human before. So they’ve asked us for a couple of those. We are in the process of finishing those currently. Our last human trial will end in April. We will resubmit back that data to the FDA that they’ve asked for additional safety and efficacy and we hope to be on the market by Q four of this year. Richard Miles: 11:02Wow, that’s great. Jonelle, tell me a little bit about NextGen Biologics. You’re the co-founder and CEO. I’m assuming you licensed this technology from somewhere. Was it University of Florida technology? Jonelle Toothman: 11:14It was not a University of Florida technology, but it is licensed. Uh, there is a brilliant woman, her name is Ryan Early and she filed this patent back in 2014 and NextGen kinda came about because Jamie Grooms, my co-founder, and partner had worked with this woman in the past and I met Jamie who is a serial entrepreneur, has been extremely successful in regenerative medicine in this space and also taking companies public. He and I met in 2013 and just had the passion for regeneration and, and what we can do in the future and bringing a new technology to a market that’s growing and could give added benefits to wounded warriors or children that are cleft palates or anything like that that you could really fix in a surgical setting. And we kind of came together and licensed this technology from Ryan early and started the company back in 2013. Richard Miles: 12:14We had another guest on the show, Ron Hayes, who compared being an entrepreneur to start up a. He was a fighter pilot, Ron and he said it was like being a five product and then you have long periods of boredom punctuated by extreme terror. So tell us about being in a startup, being the CEO of a startup, if you’d like to share what was your best day or one of your better days and if you’d care to share one of your worst days, your worst day with us. Jonelle Toothman: 12:39So that’s an interesting analogy. When it comes to fighter pilots, I don’t fly. So it’s definitely understood though. Being an entrepreneur, it’s the hardest I’ve ever worked. The least amount of money and the most stressful I’ve ever been. It is. But it’s also the best job I’ve ever had. I’ve been doing this since 2013. Really came on full board in 2016, a 100%. And I love it. I wake up every day excited when you wake up every day excited and you have a big win in the middle of the afternoon to soon find out you take three steps back at 2:00 in the afternoon. It’s a little more difficult, but the good days are extremely high and the bad days are extremely low. But I’d rather have the huge highs and the lows knowing that we’re going to accomplish something great. Richard Miles: 13:28Do you know if you had a young person come to you, let’s say they had just graduated with a degree and decided they were going to do something else and they wanted to do a startup company. What words of wisdom would you give to that person, tell them to flee or what to? Jonelle Toothman: 13:42I think the initial thing would say to flee, but absolutely not. The biggest piece of advice is find something that you genuinely are passionate about. Find something that you can wake up every day when money’s tight, when you’re extremely tired, when you don’t want to go to work, wake up with something that you are passionate about. Really enjoy what you do, but also be willing to take that risk. There is nothing more rewarding than shaking hands with Ron Hays right now and him saying that they just got FDA approval. It genuinely gives me complete chills because that success is something that I’ve never experienced yet before and it is something that you know that a team surrounded you and your vision and your philosophy and that as a team, you moved a needle and got to a point to bring something to the market that can save lives. So I would say as a young entrepreneur, you’re young, you’re vibrant, you’re ready to take on a new challenge. Try, failure’s not that bad. At the end of the day, we all fail something I feel every day, but when, where you can celebrate those successes and try again, learn from it. Richard Miles: 14:52Jonelle That’s great advice and we look forward to having you back on the show after you’ve rung the bell at the New York Stock Exchange, after your highly successful IPO and we’ll have you back. Thank you very much for joining Radio Cade. Jonelle Toothman: 15:05Thank you for having me. Outro: 15:12Radio Cade would like to thank the following people for their help and support. Liz Gist of the Cade Museum for coordinating Inventor Interviews. Bob McPeak of Heartwood Soundstage and downtown Gainesville, Florida for recording, editing, and production of the podcasts and music theme. Tracy Columns for the composition and performance of the Radio Cade theme song featuring violinist Jacob Lawson. And special thanks to the Cade Museum for Creativity and Invention located in Gainesville, Florida.

Wye Mills UMC Podcast
Episode 59 - Be Doers of the Word

Wye Mills UMC Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 11, 2019 17:15


I want to share a story this morning.I was talking with someone yesterday and turns out she knew a lot of my dad’s side of my family.Well, we talked about people’s choices, and how we can love them, but we can’t save them.And in this discussion I shared with her a story about an uncle of mine,Whose granddaughter had a baby with a black man.My uncle told my aunt he didn’t want that baby in his house.But my aunt told him that baby was welcome in their house and he just had to deal with that.So he told her that if the baby does come over, he didn’t want anything to do with the baby.Well, the granddaughter came over with her baby,And my aunt took the baby in the living room where my uncle was,Laid the baby on the floor and told my uncle that she and their granddaughter were going outside,And he needed to keep an eye on the baby.Well they went outside and when they came back in,My uncle was on the floor playing with his great-grandchild.Why am I telling this story this morning?Because I believe it fits with James 1:19-20.Listen to it again:19Understand this, my dear brothers and sisters: You must all be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to get angry. 20Human anger does not produce the righteousness God desires. 21So get rid of all the filth and evil in your lives, and humbly accept the word God has planted in your hearts, for it has the power to save your souls.You see, regardless of our prejudices;Regardless of what we consider our righteous indignation…Our deserv-ed anger;Our justifiable anger,It does NOT produce the righteousness God desires.What it does produce is bitterness; loathing; and division.And God sees our self-righteous anger and bitterness and division and does what?He sends a baby.You hear that? In my story, my uncle’s self-righteous prejudice,Was broken down by a baby.Church, God sent us a baby.God sees our ridiculous self-righteousness;Sees our ridiculous division;Sees our laughable attempts at justice…And sends a baby.Church - I hadn’t thought twice about that story of my aunt and uncle until i relayed it yesterday.And now I can see the Gospel of Christ in this story.Christ came and healed us of our ridiculous self-righteousness, etc.And in doing so, teaches us that we must be quick to listen,Slow to speak, and slow to get angry.One of my favorite examples of this is the prayer of St. Francis of Assisi,In which Francis prays:Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace; Where there is hatred, let me sow love; Where there is injury, pardon; Where there is doubt, faith; Where there is despair, hope; Where there is darkness, light; And where there is sadness, joy. And int he second pat of his prayer, he makes sure we don’t get full of ourselves in this endeavor.O Divine Master, Grant that I may not so much seek To be consoled as to console; To be understood, as to understand; To be loved, as to love; For it is in giving that we receive, It is in pardoning that we are pardoned, And it is in dying that we are born to Eternal Life. Amen.You see, this prayer is born ou

From The Heart
August 4, 2019: A Sermon on Luke 12:13–21, "My Grain Barns"

From The Heart

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 9, 2019 17:12


Luke 12:13–21 13Someone in the crowd said to [Jesus], “Teacher, tell my brother to divide the inheritance with me.” 14But he said to him, “Man, who made me a judge or arbitrator over you?” 15And he said to them, “Take care, and be on your guard against all covetousness, for one’s life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions.” 16And he told them a parable, saying, “The land of a rich man produced plentifully, 17and he thought to himself, ‘What shall I do, for I have nowhere to store my crops?’ 18And he said, ‘I will do this: I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years; relax, eat, drink, be merry.’ 20But God said to him, ‘Fool! This night your soul is required of you, and the things you have prepared, whose will they be?’ 21So is the one who lays up treasure for himself and is not rich toward God.”

Catholic Daily Reflections
Friday of the Eleventh Week of Ordinary Time - Your Treasure and Your Heart

Catholic Daily Reflections

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 20, 2019 3:19


“Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and decay destroy, and thieves break in and steal. But store up treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor decay destroys, nor thieves break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there also will your heart be.”  Matthew 6:19-21So where is your heart?  The answer to that question is answered above.  Your heart is wherever your treasure is.  So, that begs the question, “What is your treasure?”This particular passage points to the danger of becoming overly attached to material wealth.  But the same goes for anything in this life we can tend to become attached to.  What is it you are attached to?  What is your treasure?Ideally, our hearts are attached only to that which God wants them attached.  If that’s the case, then the things we love are the treasures that God wants us to love.  And by loving those things, we are loving the God who gives them and calls us to love them. Our treasure should certainly include our family and those others who we are called to love and care for with a special affection.  Our treasure should also be our life of prayer and worship.  That’s the most direct way we love God in this world.  Our treasure could also be particular acts of service we are inspired to do, or anything that makes up the will of God.Do you love these things?  Are they your treasure?  The problem is that way too often we tend to love much more than that which God calls us to love.  We become deeply attached to the idea of getting rich and having many things.  But our unhealthy “loves” can extend even beyond wealth and material things. Reflect, today, upon those things that you may have made far too much of a “treasure” in your life.  What is it that you are overly attached to in this passing world?  Is it money?  Or is it something else?  Allow God to show you and then allow Him to free you from it.  That is the first step toward a life of the greatest of riches!Lord, help me to keep my heart fixed on You.  Help me to keep You and Your will as my greatest treasure.  Jesus, I trust in You.

Advent Sermons & Conversations
Sermon: Bold Women of Faith Sunday

Advent Sermons & Conversations

Play Episode Listen Later May 14, 2018 14:09


Share your response to this sermon in our Facebook group.Find us online at www.adventnyc.orgJoin us for worship any Sunday at 9am & 11am in English, and 12:30pm in Spanish.Readings for this SundayActs 1:15-17, 21-2615In those days Peter stood up among the believers (together the crowd numbered about one hundred twenty persons) and said, 16“Friends, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit through David foretold concerning Judas, who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus—17for he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.” 21So one of the men who have accompanied us during all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, 22beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us to his resurrection.” 23So they proposed two, Joseph called Barsabbas, who was also known as Justus, and Matthias. 24Then they prayed and said, “Lord, you know everyone’s heart. Show us which one of these two you have chosen 25to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.” 26And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias; and he was added to the eleven apostles.Psalm 11Happy are they who have not walked in the counsel | of the wicked, nor lingered in the way of sinners, nor sat in the seats | of the scornful! 2Their delight is in the law | of the Lord, and they meditate on God’s teaching | day and night. R 3They are like trees planted by streams of water, bearing fruit in due season, with leaves that | do not wither; everything they | do shall prosper. 4It is not so | with the wicked; they are like chaff which the wind | blows away. 5Therefore the wicked shall not stand upright when | judgment comes, nor the sinner in the council | of the righteous. 6For the Lord knows the way | of the righteous, but the way of the wicked shall | be destroyed. R1 John 5:9-139If we receive human testimony, the testimony of God is greater; for this is the testimony of God that he has testified to his Son. 10Those who believe in the Son of God have the testimony in their hearts. Those who do not believe in God have made him a liar by not believing in the testimony that God has given concerning his Son. 11And this is the testimony: God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.John 17:6-19[Jesus prayed:] 6“I have made your name known to those whom you gave me from the world. They were yours, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. 7Now they know that everything you have given me is from you; 8for the words that you gave to me I have given to them, and they have received them and know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me. 9I am asking on their behalf; I am not asking on behalf of the world, but on behalf of those whom you gave me, because they are yours. 10All mine are yours, and yours are mine; and I have been glorified in them. 11And now I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them in your name that you have given me, so that they may be one, as we are one. 12While I was with them, I protected them in your name that you have given me. I guarded them, and not one of them was lost except the one destined to be lost, so that the scripture might be fulfilled. 13But now I am coming to you, and I speak these things in the world so that they may have my joy made complete in themselves. 14I have given them your word, and the world has hated them because they do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. 15I am not asking you to take them out of the world, but I ask you to protect them from the evil one. 16They do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. 17Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth. 18As you have sent me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. 19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, so that they also may be sanctified in truth.”

Alix Pridgen
Episode 21: Guided by the Spirit

Alix Pridgen

Play Episode Listen Later May 13, 2018


Text: Acts 1: 15-26 15In those days Peter stood up among the believers (together the crowd numbered about one hundred twenty persons) and said, 16“Friends, the scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit through David foretold concerning Judas, who became a guide for those who arrested Jesus— 17for he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.” 18(Now this man acquired a field with the reward of his wickedness; and falling headlong, he burst open in the middle and all his bowels gushed out. 19This became known to all the residents of Jerusalem, so that the field was called in their language Hakeldama, that is, Field of Blood.) 20“For it is written in the book of Psalms, ‘Let his homestead become desolate, and let there be no one to live in it’; and ‘Let another take his position of overseer.’ 21So one of the men who have accompanied us during all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, 22beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us—one of these must become a witness with us to his resurrection.” 23So they proposed two, Joseph called Barsabbas, who was also known as Justus, and Matthias. 24Then they prayed and said, “Lord, you know everyone’s heart. Show us which one of these two you have chosen 25to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas turned aside to go to his own place.” 26And they cast lots for them, and the lot fell on Matthias; and he was added to the eleven apostles.

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 20:19-26 - God & Caesar - John Tracy

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 28, 2018 56:23


Luke 20:19-26: "The scribes and the chief priests sought to lay hands on him at that very hour, for they perceived that he had told this parable against them, but they feared the people. 20So they watched him and sent spies, who pretended to be sincere, that they might catch him in something he said, so as to deliver him up to the authority and jurisdiction of the governor. 21So they asked him, "Teacher, we know that you speak and teach rightly, and show no partiality, but truly teach the way of God. 22Is it lawful for us to give tribute to Caesar, or not?" 23But he perceived their craftiness, and said to them, 24"Show me a denarius. Whose likeness and inscription does it have?" They said, "Caesar's." 25He said to them, "Then render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's." 26And they were not able in the presence of the people to catch him in what he said, but marveling at his answer they became silent."

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 20:19-26 - God & Caesar - John Tracy

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 28, 2018 56:23


Luke 20:19-26: "The scribes and the chief priests sought to lay hands on him at that very hour, for they perceived that he had told this parable against them, but they feared the people. 20So they watched him and sent spies, who pretended to be sincere, that they might catch him in something he said, so as to deliver him up to the authority and jurisdiction of the governor. 21So they asked him, "Teacher, we know that you speak and teach rightly, and show no partiality, but truly teach the way of God. 22Is it lawful for us to give tribute to Caesar, or not?" 23But he perceived their craftiness, and said to them, 24"Show me a denarius. Whose likeness and inscription does it have?" They said, "Caesar's." 25He said to them, "Then render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's." 26And they were not able in the presence of the people to catch him in what he said, but marveling at his answer they became silent."

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 20:19-26 - God & Caesar - John Tracy

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 28, 2018 56:23


Luke 20:19-26: "The scribes and the chief priests sought to lay hands on him at that very hour, for they perceived that he had told this parable against them, but they feared the people. 20So they watched him and sent spies, who pretended to be sincere, that they might catch him in something he said, so as to deliver him up to the authority and jurisdiction of the governor. 21So they asked him, "Teacher, we know that you speak and teach rightly, and show no partiality, but truly teach the way of God. 22Is it lawful for us to give tribute to Caesar, or not?" 23But he perceived their craftiness, and said to them, 24"Show me a denarius. Whose likeness and inscription does it have?" They said, "Caesar's." 25He said to them, "Then render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's." 26And they were not able in the presence of the people to catch him in what he said, but marveling at his answer they became silent."

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 20:19-26 - God & Caesar - John Tracy

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 28, 2018 56:23


Luke 20:19-26: "The scribes and the chief priests sought to lay hands on him at that very hour, for they perceived that he had told this parable against them, but they feared the people. 20So they watched him and sent spies, who pretended to be sincere, that they might catch him in something he said, so as to deliver him up to the authority and jurisdiction of the governor. 21So they asked him, "Teacher, we know that you speak and teach rightly, and show no partiality, but truly teach the way of God. 22Is it lawful for us to give tribute to Caesar, or not?" 23But he perceived their craftiness, and said to them, 24"Show me a denarius. Whose likeness and inscription does it have?" They said, "Caesar's." 25He said to them, "Then render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's." 26And they were not able in the presence of the people to catch him in what he said, but marveling at his answer they became silent."

Rivertown Church Podcast
Strike the Ground- Work Your Window. Pastor David Rathel. 07.23.17

Rivertown Church Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 23, 2017 34:22


STRIKE THE GROUND Put These In Order: Plant? Harvest? Plow? “You reap what you___. So, What comes before reaping?_____.” “But, What comes before sowing? _________.” Luke 9:62 “But Jesus said to him, “No one, after putting his hand to the plow and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.” 2 Kings 13:14-19 “14When Elisha became sick with the illness of which he was to die, Joash the king of Israel came down to him and wept over him and said, “My father, my father, the chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” 15Elisha said to him, “Take a bow and arrows.” So he took a bow and arrows. 16Then he said to the king of Israel, “Put your hand on the bow.” And he put his hand on it, then Elisha laid his hands on the king’s hands. 17He said, “Open the window toward the east,” and he opened it. Then Elisha said, “Shoot!” And he shot. And he said, “The LORD’S arrow of victory, even the arrow of victory over Aram; for you will defeat the Arameans at Aphek until you have destroyed them.” 18Then he said, “Take the arrows,” and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, “Strike the ground,” and he struck it three times and stopped. 19The man of God was angry with him and said, “You should have struck the ground five or six times; then you would have defeated Aram and completely destroyed it.” But Why? Elisha Knew That The Outcome Of The Battle Is Often Decided Before It Begins. 1 Kings 19:19, 21 “So he [Elijah] departed from there and found Elisha the son of Shaphat, while he was plowing with twelve pairs of oxen before him, and he with the twelfth. And Elijah passed over to him and threw his mantle on him. 21So he returned from following him, and took the pair of oxen and sacrificed them and boiled their flesh with the implements of the oxen…” The Outcome Of The Battle Is Decided By... “The Preparation Of The Plow.” Most of us are not performing at the level of our potential. We are performing at the level of soil preparation we have plowed for. Elisha was saying to Jehoash: “There Was More That God Had In Store, But You Stopped Short.” People “Stop Short” Of Preparation, But So Do Whole Churches! First: There is a fresh vision from God. Lives are transformed by the light of the Gospel and the Kingdom of God advances! Next: Satan strikes back in spiritual warfare against us. We take painful losses. We DO NOT understand! Then: In confusion and denial, we learn how to “stop short” so we are no longer threatened - and are no longer a threat! COLUMBUS GA, IS A GOOD PLACE FOR PLOWING. GOD Is A GOD... Of PREPARATION! You’ve been asking God to SEND It. He’s Been Asking You to FORM it. He Won’t FILL What You Don’t FORM! Don’t Expect Your Preparation To LOOK Like Your PROMISE. The PLACE God Prepares You The MOST... Is The PLACE That Seems The Most POINTLESS To You. God Prepares You To Trust The TEACHER By Putting You In A CLASS That Doesn’t LOOK Like The CALLING. I’m NOT Saying, “This Will Take Your PAIN Away.” I AM Saying, “Start SEEING Your Pain As Preparation.” I’m NOT Saying, “God Is The One Who Hurt You.” I AM Saying, “In His Hands, Whatever Hurt You Will Become Healing For Where He’s Taking You.” MY JOB Is The PLOW: “...Keep Striking The Ground.” God Is Preparing You. He’s Getting You READY. You’re Tending Sheep. You’re in the field. You ARE The Field. God Is Preparing You FOR... What He Has Prepared FOR You! It’s Not Failure. It’s PREPARATION! It Doesn’t FEEL Like Preparation. It FEELS Like FAILURE. The Failure Was Preparation. So That, You Would Have The INFRASTRUCTURE And The FORTITUDE For SUCCESS! Our Way: “The Preparation Exists For The Battle.” God’s Way: “The Battle Exists For The Preparation.” Battles Come And Go, But Preparation Creates Conquerors! WHERE HAS GOD TOLD YOU TO KEEP STRIKING THE GROUND?

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 12:13-24 - Andrew Haney

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 26, 2017 46:46


Greed: Luke 12:13-24: "13Someone in the crowd said to Him, "Teacher, tell my brother to divide the family inheritance with me." 14But He said to him, "Man, who appointed Me a judge or arbitrator over you?" 15Then He said to them, "Beware, and be on your guard against every form of greed; for not even when one has an abundance does his life consist of his possessions." 16And He told them a parable, saying, "The land of a rich man was very productive. 17And he began reasoning to himself, saying, 'What shall I do, since I have no place to store my crops?' 18Then he said, 'This is what I will do: I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry."' 20But God said to him, 'You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?' 21So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God." 22And He said to His disciples, "For this reason I say to you, do not worry about your life, as to what you will eat; nor for your body, as to what you will put on. 23For life is more than food, and the body more than clothing. 24Consider the ravens, for they neither sow nor reap; they have no storeroom nor barn, and yet God feeds them; how much more valuable you are than the birds!"

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 12:13-24 - Andrew Haney

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 26, 2017 46:46


Greed: Luke 12:13-24: "13Someone in the crowd said to Him, "Teacher, tell my brother to divide the family inheritance with me." 14But He said to him, "Man, who appointed Me a judge or arbitrator over you?" 15Then He said to them, "Beware, and be on your guard against every form of greed; for not even when one has an abundance does his life consist of his possessions." 16And He told them a parable, saying, "The land of a rich man was very productive. 17And he began reasoning to himself, saying, 'What shall I do, since I have no place to store my crops?' 18Then he said, 'This is what I will do: I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry."' 20But God said to him, 'You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?' 21So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God." 22And He said to His disciples, "For this reason I say to you, do not worry about your life, as to what you will eat; nor for your body, as to what you will put on. 23For life is more than food, and the body more than clothing. 24Consider the ravens, for they neither sow nor reap; they have no storeroom nor barn, and yet God feeds them; how much more valuable you are than the birds!"

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 12:13-24 - Andrew Haney

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 26, 2017 46:46


Greed: Luke 12:13-24: "13Someone in the crowd said to Him, "Teacher, tell my brother to divide the family inheritance with me." 14But He said to him, "Man, who appointed Me a judge or arbitrator over you?" 15Then He said to them, "Beware, and be on your guard against every form of greed; for not even when one has an abundance does his life consist of his possessions." 16And He told them a parable, saying, "The land of a rich man was very productive. 17And he began reasoning to himself, saying, 'What shall I do, since I have no place to store my crops?' 18Then he said, 'This is what I will do: I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry."' 20But God said to him, 'You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?' 21So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God." 22And He said to His disciples, "For this reason I say to you, do not worry about your life, as to what you will eat; nor for your body, as to what you will put on. 23For life is more than food, and the body more than clothing. 24Consider the ravens, for they neither sow nor reap; they have no storeroom nor barn, and yet God feeds them; how much more valuable you are than the birds!"

Keystone Bible Church
Luke 12:13-24 - Andrew Haney

Keystone Bible Church

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 26, 2017 46:46


Greed: Luke 12:13-24: "13Someone in the crowd said to Him, "Teacher, tell my brother to divide the family inheritance with me." 14But He said to him, "Man, who appointed Me a judge or arbitrator over you?" 15Then He said to them, "Beware, and be on your guard against every form of greed; for not even when one has an abundance does his life consist of his possessions." 16And He told them a parable, saying, "The land of a rich man was very productive. 17And he began reasoning to himself, saying, 'What shall I do, since I have no place to store my crops?' 18Then he said, 'This is what I will do: I will tear down my barns and build larger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry."' 20But God said to him, 'You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?' 21So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God." 22And He said to His disciples, "For this reason I say to you, do not worry about your life, as to what you will eat; nor for your body, as to what you will put on. 23For life is more than food, and the body more than clothing. 24Consider the ravens, for they neither sow nor reap; they have no storeroom nor barn, and yet God feeds them; how much more valuable you are than the birds!"

Rivertown Church Podcast
Altar Day "My One Word"-Pastor David Rathel 01.29.17

Rivertown Church Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 29, 2017 40:31


ALTAR DAY "My One Word" 2017 2 Kings 13:14-20 WHAT IS A “ONE WORD” ALTAR? THE ARROW THAT PREDICTS MY FUTURE. 2 Kings 13:14-17 When Elisha became sick with the illness of which he was to die, Joash the king of Israel came down to him and wept over him and said, “My father, my father, the chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” 15And Elisha said to him, “Take a bow and arrows.” So he took a bow and arrows. 16Then he said to the king of Israel, “Put your hand on the bow.” And he put his hand on it, then Elisha laid his hands on the king’s hands. 17And he said, “Open the window toward the east,” and he opened it. Then Elisha said, “Shoot!” And he shot. And he said, “The LORD’s arrow of victory, even the arrow of victory over Aram; for you shall defeat the Arameans at Aphek until you have destroyed them.” The Four Predictive Principles Of “My One Word.” #1: Every Story Of TRANSFORMATION Begins With A WORD From God. #2: Do SOMETHING About ONE THING Instead Of NOTHING About Everything. #3: My One Word is a LENS through which you will SEE, not a PROMISE which you must keep. #4: Keep Your “Word From God” In FRONT of you so you won’t FORGET God’s Voice. THE POINT I KEEP STRIKING THE GROUND. 2 Kings 13:18-20 Then he said, “Take the arrows,” and he took them. And he said to the king of Israel, “Strike the ground,” and he struck it three times and stopped. 19So the man of God was angry with him and said, “You should have struck five or six times, then you would have struck Aram until you would have destroyed it. But now you shall strike Aram only three times.” 20And Elisha died, and they buried him. THE PLOW AND OXEN I BURN. 1 Kings 19:19, 21 So he departed from there and found Elisha the son of Shaphat, while he was plowing with twelve pairs of oxen before him, and he with the twelfth. And Elijah passed over to him and threw his mantle on him. 21So he returned from following him, and took the pair of oxen and sacrificed them and boiled their flesh with the implements of the oxen, and gave it to the people and they ate. Then he arose and followed Elijah and ministered to him.

Rivertown Church Podcast
"Transformed by ONE WORD from God" My One Word-Pastor David Rathel. 01.08.17

Rivertown Church Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 8, 2017 33:50


TRANSFORMED BY “ONE WORD” FROM GOD EVERYBODY WANTS TO CHANGE: It is expected that 90 million Americans make New Year’s Resolutions. It is expected that 75% abandon them by February. One thing I have asked from the LORD, that I shall seek: That I may dwell in the house of the LORD all the days of my life. Psalm 27:4 FOUR PRINCIPLES: Why “MY ONE WORD” ? (slide break or slide-in before every point) I. Every Story Of TRANSFORMATION Begins With A WORD From God. Yours Will Come A Year In Advance. II. Do Something About ONE THING, Instead Of Nothing About EVERYTHING. III. A LENS Through Which You SEE, Not A PROMISE You Must Keep. IV. Keep Your “Word From God” In FRONT of you so you won’t FORGET God’s Voice. A Symbol Of Your Personal, Private... ALTAR! NEW YEAR’S RESOLUTIONS: (slide break before every arrow) They Are Too Vague: “I want to be in better shape!” Does this mean touching your toes or running a marathon? They Are Too Shallow: “I want to be a better person!” Better than who? Looking Around = Comparison Looking Inside = Character! There Are Too Many: “The one who aims at everything hits nothing.” What one thing If you only had one month to live? This comes from the three ugly sisters of guilt, fear, and pride. What one word on your tombstone? The Power Of My One Word Is The Power Of The Bible. Your Word Is A Word From God’s Word Illuminated In Your Heart. JAMES 1:19-25 19Understand this, my dear brothers and sisters: You must all be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to get angry. 20Human anger does not produce the righteousness God desires. 21So get rid of all the filth and evil in your lives, and humbly accept the word God has planted in your hearts, for it has the power to save your souls. 22But don’t just listen to God’s word. You must do what it says. Otherwise, you are only fooling yourselves. 23For if you listen to the word and don’t obey, it is like glancing at your face in a mirror. 24You see yourself, walk away, and forget what you look like. 25But if you look carefully into the perfect law that sets you free, and if you do what it says and don’t forget what you heard, then God will bless you for doing it. FINDING YOUR WORD: (slide break or slide-in before every arrow) Get Specific: What did God do through “My One Word” in your life during 2016? Do you have a testimony to share? What kind of person do you hope to be by the end of 2017? Search the Bible for God’s Word for you. Describe the characteristics of that person and the condition of their heart! Write every word down. Group and order them. List 10-15 words, then narrow it down to just one. What impact will each ‘word’ have on the way you see your life? Resist Regret: This year’s resolutions are often last year’s regrets. Don’t promise not to be what you’ve always been. Stay Future Focused: Stay focused on the vision of the person you believe God is calling you to be. There is no need to rush. Pray 21 Days - Create your list and narrow down that list into your One Word for 2016. Our Altar Day - We will begin by picking our words and symbols together on Sunday January, 29 2017 BOOKS NEXT WEEK - My One Word - By Mike Ashcraft. Cost $20 January 29th - ALTAR DAY! [VIDEO] The Word “Confession” In Greek = Homo Logeo: Same-Speak: Speak The Same As God / Agree With God A One Word Prophecy. A Confession Spoken In Agreement With God About My Life! (Della)

Rivertown Church Podcast
WHAT IS FAVOR?

Rivertown Church Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 14, 2016 40:41


A good name is to be more desired than great riches, Favor is better than silver and gold. Proverbs 22:1 FIRST, WHAT FAVOR ISN’T: Favor Isn't Fairness. Favor Isn't Happiness. Favor Isn't Just For You. The FAVOR OF GOD is the GUARANTEE of His PRESENCE and the PROVISION of His POWER to accomplish His DIVINE PURPOSE. Elijah and Elisha - 1 Kings 19:19-21 (NASB) So he departed from there and found Elisha the son of Shaphat, while he was plowing with twelve pairs of oxen before him, and he with the twelfth. And Elijah passed over to him and threw his mantle on him. 20He left the oxen and ran after Elijah and said, “Please let me kiss my father and my mother, then I will follow you.” And he said to him, “Go back again, for what have I done to you?” 21So he returned from following him, and took the pair of oxen and sacrificed them and boiled their flesh with the implements of the oxen, and gave it to the people and they ate. Then he arose and followed Elijah and ministered to him. GOD’S FAVOR MEANS THAT YOU DON’T ALWAYS GET WHAT YOU WANT - YOU GET MORE! Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly beyond all that we ask or think, according to the power that works within us… Ephesians 3:20. WHEN GOD DOESN’T GIVE YOU WHAT YOU WANT, IT’S BECAUSE HE PLANS TO GIVE YOU MORE THAN YOU WANT! Finding God’s FAVOR: Not WHAT I Want, MORE than I want. When It’s Not Right – God Says NO! When You’re Not Right – God Says GROW! When The Time Is Not Right – God Says SLOW! When IT’S Right, YOU’RE Right, And The TIME Is Right - God Says GO! 2 Kings 2:9-13 When they had crossed over, Elijah said to Elisha, “Ask what I shall do for you before I am taken from you.” And Elisha said, “Please, let a double portion of your spirit be upon me.” 10He said, “You have asked a hard thing. Nevertheless, if you see me when I am taken from you, it shall be so for you; but if not, it shall not be so.” 11As they were going along and talking, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire and horses of fire which separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind to heaven. 12Elisha saw it and cried out, “My father, my father, the chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” And he saw Elijah no more. Then he took hold of his own clothes and tore them in two pieces. 13He also took up the mantle of Elijah that fell from him and returned and stood by the bank of the Jordan. 14He took the mantle of Elijah that fell from him. GOD’S FAVOR IS ALWAYS MORE THAN YOU ASKED FOR. GOD’S FAVOR IS ALWAYS MORE THAN YOU WANTED.

Hope City Church
Truth + Grace

Hope City Church

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 6, 2015 49:33


Romans 1:21-23 21Yes, they knew God, but they wouldn't worship him as God or even give him thanks. And they began to think up foolish ideas of what God was like. As a result, their minds became dark and confused. 22Claiming to be wise, they instead became utter fools. 23And instead of worshiping the glorious, ever-living God, they worshiped idols made to look like mere people and birds and animals and reptiles. Romans 1:21-32 24So God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other's bodies. 25They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. 26That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. 27And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men, and as a result of this sin, they suffered within themselves the penalty they deserved. 28Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done. 29Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, quarreling, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip.30They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They invent new ways of sinning, and they disobey their parents. 31They refuse to understand, break their promises, are heartless, and have no mercy. 32They know God's justice requires that those who do these things deserve to die, yet they do them anyway. Worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too. Romans 2:1-4 1You may think you can condemn such people, but you are just as bad, and you have no excuse! When you say they are wicked and should be punished, you are condemning yourself, for you who judge others do these very same things. 2And we know that God, in his justice, will punish anyone who does such things. 3Since you judge others for doing these things, why do you think you can avoid God's judgment when you do the same things? 4Don't you see how wonderfully kind, tolerant, and patient God is with you? Does this mean nothing to you? Can't you see that his kindness is intended to turn you from your sin? 2 Timothy 2:23-26 Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will. James 1:20-21 Human anger does not produce the righteousness God desires. 21So get rid of all the filth and evil in your lives, and humbly accept the word God has planted in your hearts, for it has the power to save your souls. Questions to ask ourselves: Am I conforming my life the God's truths or am I trying to serve a God who only agrees with me? Am I as concerned with my sin as I am the sins of others? See more at: http://rivercitywc.com/ Give at: http://rivercitywc.com/give/ YouTube: http://youtube.com/rivercitylouisville Twitter: http://twitter.com/rivercitywc Instagram: http://instagram.com/rivercitywc Facebook: http://facebook.com/rivercitywc iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/river-city-worship-center/id289201329?mt=2 Visit us on a Sunday morning at: 7515 3rd st rd Louisville KY, 40214 Contact us at: 502-363-0182

Lancelot's Roundtable
Episode 22 - Beer Brewing 101- with Dustin, Paul, and Kim

Lancelot's Roundtable

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 1, 1970 105:18


SPEAKERSLance Foulis, Paul, Kim, DustinPaul 00:00What's funny is I think anybody that starts brewing they have to make something that theirwife likes. Yes, like Yeah. Hey, everyone, youLance Foulis 00:06have to justify your time right and your time. Accurate yeah hello everybody and welcome toLance lots roundtable today we are going to go on a journey talking about beer. I turned 21 Justa little while ago, it wasn't very many years ago at all that I turned 21. And I'd never had a beerbefore I turned 21. I was a bit of a rule follower, I guess you could say. But I remember when Iturned 21 I was working at a bank as a bank teller part time while I was going to college, and Iwas studying aviation, so I was in flight school. And I remember everybody in the bank knewthere was even customers that came in that knew I was turning 21. And there was a level ofexcitement because everybody knew I hadn't had a beer yet. So when it came time for mybirthday, we had one of the girls that I worked with, she brought me a St Pauli girl with like abow tied around it and somebody else brought me bought me a Killians Irish Red. And thenthere was other people that just like, bought me like different kinds of beer. So when I turned21, I got to try all these different kinds of beer Killians Irish Red, that was the very first one thatI had. And I really liked it. Later on, I developed a taste that I didn't like it so much. And the St.Pauli girl, I don't know if it was because it was like a paler ale or something. But I did not likethe taste of that for my first beer. And I remember a couple friends took me out and like we wewe just went and we tried like different beers. I can remember with my friends and I we thenkind of went on a little bit of a journey a couple friends and I we really just liked beer. So wewould go and we would just try different kinds of beers. And I remember for different people'sbirthdays, we'd go to a Japanese steakhouse. And I remember having a Sapporo which is aJapanese beer and it was so delicious. And then I remember there was this little, this little shopon a strip mall, I guess I should say store. And I think before it was popular, and maybe even athing because you can do it now. But you could go in there, and they had a whole wall ofcoolers, you could pick up your little six pack thing. And you could go just pick your own bottlesPthat you want. And we would literally create our own six packs, then we'd go home and take itand try it figure out which ones we liked. Usually, we would just pick what we wanted based onwhat the bottle looked like. So we judge the book by its cover. And then I can remember, therewas a really great little store called the Anderson's General Store, and they had a greatselection of the air, you could actually get like Sapporo there and all this different like beer. Andin addition to all of those different types of beer adventures, there was a couple like pubs thatwe would that we would frequent. There was old bagging the old pub in Wellington on HighStreet, we used to go there all the time. And they would just have a great list of different beersthat you could try. And again, we couldn't see the bottle names. So we went by the name, Ishould say didn't we didn't see like any like bottles. So we picked based on the name. And Iremember one of my friends, he always got this one called RAS Putin and it had a very highalcohol content. So anyway, those were a lot. Oh, and then there was this really, really greatpub in Dublin. I think it was called Yeah, it was called Brazen Head. I actually had to text mybrother and one of my friends that we used to, we used to go there. But it was amazing.Because back before some law got passed, you could actually take pipes in there. Because wewere those kinds of people, we would take our pipes in and think that we were Gandalf thewizard or something, we would sit down and we would order our beers and we would smoke ourpipes. But there was this really cool like back room that had a fireplace. I don't think thefireplace was running or anything. But we would try to go get that room before anybody else.And we would have a couple pints of beer and we would smoke our pipes. And it was a greattime that that place was called Brazen Head. And it was rumored that they had brought piecesof a pub from Ireland over. I don't know if that's true, the more in my older years. I don't I don'tbelieve as many things as I did back then. But I definitely believe that they just disassembled apub and then brought it to Dublin, Ohio for some reason when I was younger. And then lat thelast story I guess I'll share is there was a good friend of mine. We used to go over to his houseto win like, again college years single. So me and a couple guys would go over to his house inWorthington and we would sit down around a fire and we would we would drink bourbon. Wewould drink beer and we would smoke cigars. We were we would smoke pipes. And we would inthe winter we would go in his garage and somehow do that. But we just had a greatconversation I could just remember so many great conversations around a pint of beer andthere's just something really special about beer. So all that being said, I'm excited to welcometo landslides roundtable, Dustin, Paul and Kim, Dustin and Paul, I invited on to the podcastbecause they brew their own beer. And I was really fascinated by that. And so I wanted to hearall about how you brew beer and how they got into it. So that's what we are going to be talkingabout today. So Dustin, Paul, Kim, welcome to the roundtable. Hello, nice. Yes. So um, so yeah,just tell me like your name and tell me something neat about yourself. My name is DustinDoherty. Like I said, I'm a home brewer. I started I think it was oh six is when I started homebrewing. Okay, but I actually my my education backgrounds and fine art, so I actually stayinterested in Ulta. Really? That's cool. What kind of sculpting? I did a lot of metal casting. Okay,so bronze and aluminum. Is that involved? Welding? Yeah. Wow. That's that's a cool, fun fact.Okay, Paul.Paul 06:05Paul krishak I started brewing beer about eight years ago, I think 2014 I was finishing collegeand was just looking for an outlet. I knew Dustin brewed beer so much longer before me that'skind of how we got together doing this together. Okay, I'm the seller man at a small brewery inColumbus. Okay, Sideswipe brewing. Okay. I don't think they'll mind me saying that.PLance Foulis 06:30Probably not. Probably not. What's a seller mean?Paul 06:33They give me a paycheck. So just like, basically, the back room of brewing, not necessarilybrewing, but like cleaning. Washing. Okay, Kenny beer. Okay. Tanks, things like that.Lance Foulis 06:51Okay, that's pretty cool. Okay.Kim 06:53Kim Krawcheck. Married to Paul Krysiak. used to hate beer. Really? Yep. Interesting. Every timeyou hear me something like I don't know what you're doing. This tastes like trash. That was hisIPA phase. I didn't really understand them. Okay. Now I love IPAs.Lance Foulis 07:11What does IPA stand for? India Pale Ale. India Pale Ale. I don't think I like those either. When Iwas younger,Kim 07:18they're very hoppy.Dustin 07:20I think they've changed a lot over the last two. They're kind of the traditional IPAs Are TheyNow they call it like a West Coast IPA or very like piney. Okay and earthy. grassy. Where now ifyou talk about like East Coast IPA is you're talking more like the hops put in later in the boil.Okay, so you get more of the fresh like fruitiness. Okay. And so you get a lot of like stone fruitand passion through tropical fruit flavors that come through the beer. Got it rather than thosekind of grassy, earthy flavors. Got it? Okay. I mean, you guys throw out a bunch of terms therethat I don't even know. So we're gonna get into that. But I want to find out first how you guyseven got into it. And maybe since you went first Dustin, you can. Since you started first, youcan just tell us how you got into it. I think my sort of my journey with beer. I think growing up, Iwas always around like the yellow, fizzy beers that my parents drank. Sure. And my parentswere like, they don't drink on the weekends. You never drank during the week. It was a Fridaynight, Saturday night. Yeah, have a few beers and kind of unwind. So I think I had a fairlyhealthy view of, you know, consuming alcohol growing up. And then as I got older, and I wassimilar to you, I think I was like 19 or so when I got my first beer. I didn't really drink at highPKKDschool at all. But I think it was when I started to realize there was other colors of beer besidesyellow fizzies. It was a while I was at a camp counselor in New Hampshire, okay. And I had to doa day trip into Vermont and to Burlington and I stopped at this place for lunch in order to MillerLight. And they're like, We don't serve that. I was like, What do you serve? And so I think theygave me like a little flight. I think they only had like four beers. They had rainbow beer. Theyhad a blonde, a red ale, or amber brown and a stout. So it tastes a couple and it was like awhole new Yeah. And so then that's what I sort of exploring beer. And then at some point, itwas after grad school. I need I think, like Paul said, it was like a creative outlet. Yeah. Becauseof financial responsibilities. I moved back home with my parents and well the factory job Iabsolutely hated. And that was something that I was like I beer fun beers fun. And I like beer.Yeah. And I know that people brew it. So I bought a book, John Palmer's how to brew, okay, andsat and just read like the first three quarters of it. And it was basically like, step by step. And Ithink I read it twice and kind of like, assessed like, what equipment I would need. Yep. Andbefore I did it the first time and then I ran for the first time. It was just absolutely nervewracking. Yeah. No doubt, right. No doubt. Is it in the book the whole time he's talking aboutit's like, Have everything ready. Think about the next Before you're doing this stuff and allabout cleanliness and sanitation, but sure, okay, that's that's fantastic. Paul, how'd you how'dyou get started?Paul 10:09So I started a long time after him actually, I think he probably started what like 2005, orDustin 10:15oh six, but I took a big gap. I think I brewed for a year, year and a half, and then kind ofstopped. I had, I've met my now wife, and we were dating a lot. And then we moved intogether. And and we were just doing other stuff. And so that sort of that need to fill space andtime was sort of replaced by, you know, meeting somebody and yummy relationship. Yeah. Andthen Paul started brewing again. And that's sort of what got me back into it. Interesting. Okay,that's it some background, Paul, and I actually went to like elementary school in high schooltogether. Wow. We were brief briefly roommates in college roommates. Wow. So we've ourlives have kind of like went back and forth. And yeah, we've seen each other and then hung outthen not. And then I think over the last probably eight to 10 years, our relationships. I mean,we're pretty or like our best friend. We've seen him almost every Friday. And that's fantastic.That's a six story. So how daunting was it? Like when you guys, I mean, you probably maybeless daunting for you, because you kind of knew from him? How to get into it.Paul 11:19You know, I started separately on my own. He did. Okay, yeah. And it was a lot easier for me in2014. I mean, we have the internet and YouTube and yeah, so it wasn't like, it wasn't like goingthrough a book and be like, Oh, my gosh, did I do that wrong? It was like, Yeah, I can seesomebody do it. Yeah, you know, and I had, I like to have conversations over beer too. So Italked to brewers around town and get, you know, information from them pick their heads, howdo they do this? How do you how do you do that? How did you get started? Is it kind of just likenatural progression? Yeah, I didn't have something. Because I didn't have a ton of free time inPDPcollege. Yeah, the one I did, it was going out and having beers and, you know, probably havingconversations with people. And I think just kind of like, you know, I do need something to do.Like, I used to be in a band before I went back to college. And that was like my creative outlet.That's what I had. And you know, not having that. I think that's kind of what drove that. And Ithink I was getting so burned out from being in school. Hmm. Like going back. It took mealmost four years going back because I switched my major from religion to business, and it wasjust like this completely different. Yeah,Lance Foulis 12:30there pletely different tribes. You can't like criss cross those at all.Paul 12:34Yeah, so it just, you know, there was I remember there was one semester hadn't taken anytime off. Like I went to Franklin. We had trimesters, so you didn't get any breaks you just grossright back in. And I made a trimesterLance Foulis 12:48is for a full year. Yeah, for thePaul 12:51full year, you have three semesters. So instead of like quarters or semesters, you just do threesemesters. So you're just ramping it up. Oh, god. Yeah. So I was going like halftime. And youknow, were you working too? Yeah, I was working like 4550 hours a week all the time. And shejust didn't have any. Yeah, didn't have any time to do anything. So it was I took us I remember,I was like, it's summertime. And our backyard looks terrible. I just want to I want to mow thegrass and put some flowers out there. Yeah. I want to do something besides go to school all thetime. Yeah. Yeah, that's how I got into it, though. Just, it was just like, I tried something. And Iseen some videos like this looks like something I could do. And I really like beer. Yeah. So I justwent for it. And then I brought him in later, like, hey, yeah, we should brew together like,Lance Foulis 13:43yeah, so what was your your gap? Like, from when you had stopped? And then to when youguys started doing that together? What was your gap? It was a good stretch. Like I said, it wasfrom about 2007 or eight. And so when did you say you started? Like 2014? So it's about seven,seven years? Yeah, stretch there. Okay. So like when he came to you, and he's like, we shouldbrew together for you just like me, like, yeah, no, actually, I was like well, I had a newborn. Oh,so I had a two year old daughter. And I think we were expecting one. Which they're now sevenand 10. Seven. Yeah. But those early years, man, yeah, it's wears you out. But But no, I my, mywife was like, Yeah, you know, hang out with Paul. It's something to do. And I was still I felt like,I still work a job I don't really love. Yeah. And it was like, it'll get you out of a rut, you know, doPPsomething creative because we're, you know, it's just hyper nose to the grindstone and you gowork and you do your time you watch me take care of the kids and then you you know, sleepand repeat. Yeah, so it's like it'd be something to do and she kind of like encouraged me to tojump in. And I think in Paul actually, there's Obviously, there's different processes that you cankind of use to get to beer as a final product. Okay, and when I had started, it was sort of anabbreviated, it's called extract brewing. Okay. And basically you buy like a Canna syrup, okay.And it's I think it's probably like about but it's, it's almost like it is like a heavy syrup, okay? Andit's all the sugars that they get off of the grain. So you kind of skip a step. Got it. But you cankind of add specialty grains to personalize it. Okay, so the, what comes into Canada is just yourvery basic, like, what's going to convert into sugars to alcohol, got it. And then you can sprinklesome stuff in for flavor and change the hops around and add the side what used to put in so it'sstill very personal personalizable. Yeah. But you kind of skip a step and doing it. Yeah. And so Ihad done that. And then Paul just jumped right in. Yeah. And he went all grain, like right off thebat. And I was really intimidated to take that step when I was brewing. And he was like, whydon't you bring with me, like, you can show me some stuff. And, and he was telling me abouthis process, like you're above and beyond where I ever was. So Wow. But yeah. So we kind ofstarted in a different method. But yeah, so like, when you when you started was, like, therewere like, to your point, there wasn't as much. Is it true that there wasn't as much like YouTubeand like, so it's really just a lot of book learning stuff. I think coming out of college and gradschool, I leaned into books anyways, sure, I did seek out books, and didn't really think to usethe internet as a resource like that. Yeah. I mean, there's definitely was and there were like,online supply houses that still exist today to get ingredients from or equipment from? Yeah. Butyeah, it was mostly books and trial and error. And, yeah, I'm just sort of like, well of if this doesthis, and I changed this to this ratio. And there's some sort of proportion fine tuning, then.Yeah, yeah. But yeah, I felt like there in the brain community has been around for a long timethe numbering community is became legal again to brew homebrew, I think it was like in 76.And the Carter administration got it. They really legalized it. Did that have anything to do withlike, dry? Like, what are they? What's the word for? No, thank you. Should that have anything?Yeah, I think that's kind of where they stopped allowing homebrewing. So I took all that timefrom the 30s until like the 70s until Jimmy Carter, and I think is actually his brother. I want tosay it's Baba. Okay. And there was a Baba beer, and I think it had something to do with him. Hesort of just like, one of those presidential high five. It's like, Hey, guys, you can homebrewagain. Yeah. And everybody's like, yeah. But yeah, so the there started that community upagain. Yeah. And they existed in like the 90s and 2000s. And they were Tober shops inColumbus. So obviously, there's a market for it. Yeah. But I never I felt like very much like Ididn't know where to like meet these people at other than bumping into them at The BrewShop. Sure. And in those situations, I'm not the most extroverted person. Yep. I think I'vebecome one. Later. Yeah. Like, I'll see somebody and I was like, what you're doing? Yeah, yousaid, you shoot the breeze for a while. Got it. But um, I think then I was like, I don't wanna looklike an idiot. Yeah, just don't talk to anybody. And like, the guy's probably over for like, what'she doing? Yeah. Shoveling stuff in a bag. I don't know. That's really funny. I so. Okay. My I'mreally curious. Like, what is that when you guys both got into it? And like even now, like, what's,what would you say? Is the the financial commitment that you got? It's probably all over theplace, right?Paul 18:50It can be. It can be frugal at the beginning. But then once you realize, yeah, it's gonna be a lotfaster if I buy this a lot easier. If I buy this, then it just starts adding up. So yeah, if you'reseriously wanting to do it, I would say just invest the money ran out the bread. I mean, maybePlike a couple 1000 bucks. Y'all get started. But if you just want to try it, I mean, you could Ithink my first setup all grain and everything I might have spent like $250 total, just to getstarted. Yeah. That's pretty awesome. Yeah. So I mean, I bought a lot of used stuff. And I thinkthere's even more used stuff. Now. Dustin just bought a bunch of us stuff off Craigslist, or,Lance Foulis 19:33yeah, it was a Facebook marketplace. During the pandemic. We were kind of taking it seriousand not seeing each other. Yeah. As most people should have been. Yeah. And so but he wasalways a lot. He bought all the equipment and had all the equipment and we would a lot oftimes split costs on the supplies like the consumable part, right? But then we weren't seeingeach other. And we got I got kind of got back into one of those ruts where it's bored again. Andso I just started looking on Facebook marketplace and bought my own little setup. And I think Ispent about 300 or 350. And pretty much guy and. And actually, now that I burned for a while Ikind of knew what I needed to get get going right off the RIP. And so I'd saw the setup and theguy that was selling it, I recently found out that he was gluten intolerant. And he kept gettingreally sick. And he was like, I just can't drink beer anymore. And it stinks. Yeah, so I bought hisequipment. And so he let it go to a fair price. Yeah. But yeah, I think that's a lot of peopleupgrade as they go along. So the marketplace and Craigslist, that's a good place to look forused equipment, because people are, they're trying to help finance their next thing by sellingthe old thing. Sure. That That makes sense. So like, it doesn't sound like a terrible process toget up and running. And what I do find every everybody that I've had on and we've talkedabout something like this, that's a hobby, especially like a creative outlet, they say a lot ofthings that you guys have been saying just the need for the creative outlet, because of themundaneness of your regular responsible adult life. Yeah. And it's funny, because a lot ofpeople have said, like YouTube, I just started watching videos on the subject. And then I gotinto it, like the first guy that I had on, we talked about hunting. That's essentially how he gotinto it, because he didn't grow up hunting. And then he found somebody that could take themout and show them the ropes. And that's kind of how I got started. And everything does havelike a financial a financial cost to get started. But it seems like with a lot of these types ofhobbies, you can get started for relatively low. And then if he if you really like I mean, thiswhole setup that we have for the podcast, we started off not anything remotely like this, butthen I really enjoy doing the podcast. So we then we decided to make a more significantinvestment. And it does make a big difference. This equipment makes the podcast way moreefficient. So I get what you're saying about like, Oh, if I get this equipment, it'll cut my my timecommitment from this step from four hours to one hour.Paul 22:05Well, I think originally to I think we both had this discussion, like originally when you startbrewing, you're like, oh, I can save so much. Yeah, yeah, now. I save money. But it's a fun thingto do. So. SoLance Foulis 22:21yeah. So like, tell me about let's talk about just the process of brewing beer. How do you guysgo about it? Well, like I said, we we do all grain. So basically, we start with barley, majority ofits barley is your base grain. And it's been molted, where they sort of start the process of it likePits barley is your base grain. And it's been molted, where they sort of start the process of it likesprouting. And so that kind of weakens the outer shell. And it gets it easier to get to the sugarsthat are inside there. Got it. And so I usually we're talking about sort of how we explained it topeople sort of in preparation of this and I said, I usually tell people it's like making a giant batchof tea. Yeah. So like I my, what's called a mash tun. But that's where you see steep the grainand hot water. Okay, and sort of the temperature of the water depends on how you want thefinal outcome beer to be as far as like, how dryness, how dry, how much body you want to it.What are those terms mean?Paul 23:19So like a lager would be like a drier beer or some a lot of IPAs are drier, too, like you get a finishin the back of your throat where you know, you want to take another drink. Yeah. But you canbalance that out too. Okay, so I don't know would be like a heavier beer that would be kind of inthe middle.Dustin 23:38Like, well, like a red ale or something red ale? Yeah. LearnEnglish ale where there's, you cankind of feel it more in your mouth. And like when you drink after you drink it, it's sort of likecoffee has the aftertaste that lingers on the back of the throat. Yeah, that would not be a dryfinish. Like the dry finish is usually it's gone. It's crisp. Yeah. And you Your mouth is kind of youwant to take another drink. Okay. And then sort of the more the less dry finish it's more of thatlingering sort of remembrance of what it tastes like. It was a Guinness like that then I feel likeGuinness days is actually a lot of a lot of stouts people think are like big heavy beers, but like aGuinness is a dry Irish dry like, it's usually a lighter body and a dry finish. But they're I thinkpeople see how black they are and are kind of intimidated. Got it. Okay. Yeah. So like theinteresting thing about Guinness is I actually did this, I did not like Guinness at all. It felt like ittasted too much like, like, the, the container that it was in. But then I spent 28 When I was incollege, I spent 28 days going throughout Europe. And so when I was in Great Britain, I got tohave like, a pint of actual It was delicious. Yeah, that's cool. It was so delicious. Can you guys soOkay, let's go back to the process. So you've got like, your your container, how big is thecontainer? It's about minus 10 gallon 10 Well depends on how much you're trying to make.Sure brew and five gallons. That's a pretty common size. homebrew size is a five gallon or 10gallon, we do five gallon batches. And are you are you heating it in the container? No, we wehave like a turkey fryer propane and like a big pot. And so we heat the water up and then puthot water into the mash tun Yeah, youPaul 25:23hold it you hold that grain with the water that you've measured out and you get a lot of thesecalculations are easy to find online. Got it? Or or even like that how to rulebook as a lot ofinformation on it. Got it. But yeah, you hold it for a certain amount of time, you're trying to getas much sugar as you can get off of those grains. And while you're holding it, so some of themwill be like, some some grains, especially like darker grains can take a little longer. So you mayhave to go, you know, you may have to go 90 minutes, you may have to go 60 minutes whileyou're holding it just depends. I've had some that I've done for like two hoursPDPLance Foulis 25:58before. Okay. And are you like using a timer? Yeah, just keep aPaul 26:03timer and every 15 minutes or so to give it a stir, stir it in the brewery, they just have a forkthat's raking around so they don't have to do any of that. Okay,Lance Foulis 26:12I think I've seen a video of what you're talking about, like a big old container and like it'sstirring it around. Okay, what what happens after that,Paul 26:20after that we take so much we take take it off, but we're also rinsing it at the same time. So thegrains barging,Dustin 26:29barging so you ours run on like gravity, basically. So you have mash tun sets, probably abouttable height, okay, and then you're what's going to be your brew kettle sits a little lower, okay,there's literally just a spigot on the front got it. And this big, it usually has a metal screen, orthere's a false bottom with lots of holes. Sure, fairly small that won't let that grain run through.Got it. And so you're running off that liquid and it's really sticky. Has a nice, I like the smell a lotof people hate it, you know. But you're running that off there. And then you kind of as that'srunning out, that sparging process is your there's another vessel that's hotter or higher that hasthe hot water in it. So as this is coming out, hot water is going back in again. And wow. And soall the sugary water is at the bottom. Uh huh. Because it's heavier. And that clean, hot water isat the top. And so that kind of helps you once you get to how much liquid you want. You juststop. Got it? And then you end up with that's what you call that's gonna be the future beer.Yep, down here. Okay. Yeah. And then,Paul 27:33and there's easier ways to do some people just batch sparge. Or they'll just let it right out ofthe container and they'll completelyLance Foulis 27:38dump and then put a new batch of hot water, let it sit another 15 minutes and then run that outagain. Yeah. Okay. We found that what we call efficiency, which is sort of how much sugar youget at the end. We get higher efficiency by doing it's called a fly sparge where you're puttingPPDPget at the end. We get higher efficiency by doing it's called a fly sparge where you're puttingthe hot water as you're pulling off the now word. Okay, what's going to be here? Okay. Onceyou're done with that process, is the green done? Or is it reused?Paul 28:07You can? I think we both made dog treats out of it before. Yeah, it's awesome. Yeah, add somepeanut butter. And aDustin 28:14lot of commercial breweries have they teamed up the farmers. And the farmer will come inshortly after a brew process and take it away and tubs and they feed they can feed like cowsand pigs. So it doesn't go to waste. And that's fascinating. I know land grant is really goodabout having like composting and they they're they try to have very minimal footprint, whatthey leave behind and they even have like a un I'm not familiar with it. All right, no, they havesome sort of program that once you're done fermenting, there's like a layer at the bottom.That's kind of yuck. Mm hmm. And it's called troub. Okay, it's like, when it's post postfermentation, it's all the the yeast, sort of Eat as much sugar as it can and falls back down tothe bottom. Mm hmm. So they try to dump that out. And then they have some sort of programthat it did Richard soil, so they have some sort of gardens that they go with that that'samazing. We do gardening on the side that's one of our hobbies. Since we have K I'm notfamiliar with by I remember reading a poster at their brewery that talked about how they all thebits and pieces try not to go to waste and but that's just that's fascinating is like the processwhere you do something another man your waste becomes another man's treasure type of adeal. That's really fascinating to me. Okay, so what do we do once we have the the beer downhere or the future beer down here, then what do we do?Paul 29:34So you know, we'll try to collect depending on the amount of time that we have to boil it forbecause I think you're about every 60 minutes. What do you think you're blowing off like anhour or a gallon? an hour? Yeah, so depending on how long we're boiling for, we're gonnacollect what we need to keep five gallons in there. So we just bring it to a boil and then wehave different hop additions depending on what bitterness level? Or what aroma level or justeven like, the tastes, flavoring. So yeah, just depending on where we put those hops in, that'swhat's going to flavor. That's what's going to give it the Hoppy, like balance of the grain,especially for the parallels and IPAs and stuff.Lance Foulis 30:21Sure. So is the whole process, something that you have to do start to finish? Or can you do is Ilike to do it that way. Because you definitely want to really avoid any sort of like, bacteria, orit's brewing process is very much about cleanliness, like cleaning everything all the time. Andthen, especially after the boil, everything that touches the beer, or the beer is going to come incontact with has to be like we have food grade sanitizer that we use. Wow. And it's just got toPDPbe uber clean. Or also, it's just it'll, it'll grow all kinds of funk and weirdness. But there's beerstyles that rely on that, like sours, Paul's are really into sour beers. And you literally, you do themash, and I think that's you there is you explain it therePaul 31:08are I do make kettle sours sometimes, so sometimes I'll just collect my mash like it the onceI've collected my work, that's what they call it after your for install your green, okay? Like, I'llcollect that, and I'll pitch lactic acid in it, or lactobacillus. I'll pitch that in, and I'll let that set.But yeah, you just let it get to a certain pH level. Okay, acidity, and then once it gets there,then you boil it. So like kettle sours at home, I let mine go for a couple of days. But at thebrewery, sometimes I'll see them like just poking to see if the pH is done. It may take like a dayor something. Sometimes I get them in less than a day.Lance Foulis 31:48And what do you do with it? That's called War. Yep. And what to do with that, once youPaul 31:52get your war and you're ready, that's what I was saying. You would start adding your hopswhile you're boiling it. Okay. And then from there, once you get the desired amount that you're,you're done boiling 1691 20, whatever you're doing.Dustin 32:09That's time 60 minutes, 90 minutes, 120 minutes, or however long you want to boil it for. Yeah.And that's usually dictated on how much our ingredients, the alcohol and then also the hop.The longer the hop rides in the boil, the more bitter it's going to taste. Okay, so like wherewe're talking about the IPAS for the West Coast. Those relied more on Early Edition hops thatpride for I mean, there's 120 minute beers. Okay, that just gets real better. Yeah, our 90minute, I'd say most of ours are about a 60 minute boil.Paul 32:41Yeah, usually seven then. So you may just have aLance Foulis 32:45little bit of hops that kind of get that bitterness for the balance later on. And then like, fiveminutes before the boils up, you're throwing in some more, and those will add more aromatic?Yeah, got it. So you won't get the bitterness, but you'll smell the sort of flowery qualities. Yeah,or the fruity qualities that the the hop has to lend. Okay, let me repeat back what I think theprocess is. This is what's in my head. And then you tell me where my gaps are. So you've gotPPDPlike your grains, and it's in it's in your container, and you're going to put the boiling water inthere. Not boiling hot water, hot water goes in there. And then it sits for 60 minutes, normally220 minutes. Yeah. And then you add things to it at that point, or you're adding throughout,you startPaul 33:28boiling your word at that point, and then you start adding your hops.Lance Foulis 33:33Okay. Okay. And then after you've done that process, that's when you run it through. After thePaul 33:40the boil after the boil is when you start cool. Yeah, you got to get it cold. Okay, you don't wantto introduce yeast into hot beer. See, you got to chill it.Lance Foulis 33:52Whatever house is a yeast. Are you physically adding the yeast in the process? Sort of like thelast sort of the last step until like the packaging, how do you get it cool?Paul 34:03Well, there's different methods. I think your destin was the first one I ever seen. He did it withice bath the very first time he ever did it. Yeah, really. That can take a while it does.Dustin 34:13And there's a contraption. It's basically a giant copper coil. And so you're run cold waterthrough that coil. So it becomes basically submersible IceCube Oh, so the water never comes incontact with your the word that you just made. Okay. And so then I had a pump that would helpI had an ice bath with a submersible pump. So it run that really cold water through and so itwould cool it a little faster. Are you like checking temperatures during this whole thing? Yeah.Ideally, I think we depends on what yeast you're going for. They all the packaging usually tellyou, they'll say like this yeast likes these temperature. So it kind of gives you about a 10degree window. Got it. And so that's sort of what you're aiming for. Like on a hot summer daybecause we use groundwater for the most part, okay, so it's just I hook up my garden hose, Istill use that chiller, the one I have now is longer and bigger. So there's more surface areacoming in contact with the beer, so it works faster. And so you're saying that's what you'reusing to chill to do the chilling.PPPDPaul 35:16I mean, some people that just bring over beer that took him like two hours to chill, I think I havetasted like flaws on that. But interesting. The one that we have now the one that we use youprimarily is a plate chiller. And it just pumps through these plates has all these little plates andthat the beer goes through other plates and that's all contacted through there. So just pumpinginto the vessel got it and it's just similar process chill and it really fast it only take now on asummer day might take like five, not even maybe two minutes to chill five. Oh, wow. Okay, butyeah, there are times when it's really hot outside, it will take longer, but it's it doesn't takemore than 510 minutes, even with a plate chiller.Lance Foulis 35:59And you guys said that this that you're doing the the main thing that everything is in is a 1010gallon?Paul 36:06Five, but our first one is usually bigger, because if beers in a tight space, it's kind of put it inboilLance Foulis 36:13over to Yeah, got it. Okay. Like, I think I have a 15 gallon pot. That's when I the one I bought offmarketplace. And that's if someone's going to think about home brewing, I would say go biggeroff the bat. Sure. It doesn't hurt to have extra room. And then if you do decide to go up and do10 gallon batches, but I found that I sort of formulate for like six or seven gallons because ofloss along the way. Sure. Like Paul mentioned, you lose it as you boil. Yep. And then also justyour equipment sorted. Keep some of it like when I'm pouring it from one container to the next.A lot of time there's some goop in the bottom you really don't want to carry along so you're youfeel you don't feel as bad about getting that last drop out. You can sacrifice like that looks kindof gross. I'll leave that behind. Sure. And then you're still hitting along the way or at least fillthat five gallon target. So yeah, that I guess that maybe that's where that came from. So theend result is you're going to get a five gallons reallyPaul 37:09Yeah, wow. Times a little extra. If you're dry hoppin, you're going to lose them. So you mightwant to get six or five and a half at the end. Because some beers you want to dry up. Likethat's a little later in the process. You got a pitcher yeast first. That's when you get it to thetemperature. Usually between 6575 degrees somewhere in there. Okay, that's when youpitcher yeast. And that's going to be usually just left alone for Yeah, it a couple weeks or wecan have got it you only touch it.Lance Foulis 37:42PPPLance Foulis 37:42Okay, it was your as your cooling it or after you call it you go from that? boil kettle. And thenwe I we both prefer, it's a big looks like those five gallon water jugs you see in an office likeyes, upside down LA Times? Well, there's glass ones you get as home brewers are calledcarboys is the trade term for them got it. And we that's what we typically ferment and glass isnon porous, you can clean it really well. And it doesn't carry flavors along with it. Some peopleuse plastic, and that's fine. It's affordable. It's definitely cheaper. Yeah. But yeah, once you gofrom the boil kettle, and then you go into what you call your fermenter or the carboy. Okay, andthen that's when you pitch that yeast. And then do you do it? Do you do it. So like as soon asyou've cooled yet, then it goes into the other container, you put the yeast in there first.Paul 38:33Yeah, you kind of move it you can do either way, just depending on what your aerationsituation is because you want to get as much oxygen into that beer as it's like, if you're movingit over, you could probably just pour it in and run it right over top because it's it's moving Godinto the vessel but and inside so I mean, I don't want to give away their secrets. But allbreweries will take like their dry yeast. And we'll just get it kind of wet. And they'll rehydrate itthat dry yeast and to get a little warm. Notice throw it in the fermenter and just run that thatword right over top of it. And it'll just be in the bottom of that. Whatever they call it, the bigvessels can fermented fermented tank. Yeah, got it. So, yeah, and you know, the liquid yeast alot of times when we're home brewing, we just kind of like you shake it up or we'll use like amixer and mix it all up then want it like it, especially our liquid yeast. Sure. Yeah, that's howwe'll usually do it. But I never had a problem with yeast. It's not it's always worked. Yeah,Lance Foulis 39:40that's it. Okay, that that the process is making sense. So then once you get it in a fermenteryou pick how long you want to set it. Like yeah, sorry forPaul 39:49Yeah, generally, I think most beer will be a few weeks and and sometimes you move it into asecondary vessel, like in the bird They have like conical so there's a like a, it comes down to apoint. Yep. So well all we had to do is open a valve and that just spits allLance Foulis 40:09that jumps out though the US geez, yeah. OkayPaul 40:12clears everything up a bit,PPPDustin 40:14but as a homebirth, the firming of that. So after it's I usually do, I'm very kind of like, I do oneweek and the firm Enter, and then I move it over to it's called a secondary, or it's just going tosit a little extra longer. And I do two weeks in a secondary. And I just, it's for me, it just worksout better for different beer styles, it probably go faster, and some could probably go longer.But that's just the schedule I've always done. And it works. So like, Are you checking on it?Yeah, kind of you don't really want too much. That's sort of the benefit of using the glasscarboy is you can peek in, in a sense. Like just to look at it visually. Yeah, and see what's goingon with it. And there's this little thing at the top of the bottle, like when it comes to a neck.There's a bomb that goes in or like a cork and then it has a hole drilled in it and there's a littleplastic thing is called an airlock. Okay, let the air lock does is it lets co2 out because as it'sfermenting, the yeast is converting sugars into ethyl alcohol magics happening. Yeah, andthen. But it's also releasing co2 gas. So if you have it completely sealed up, it'll pop and a lot oftimes you'll get a mess. Yeah, so this airlock let's that just has a little bit of sanitizer in it. So itkind of bubbles. Uh huh. So it lets air out but no air in. Okay. So you can kind of gauge howyou're doing by looking at the like, how many bubbles per second? Wow, you can kind of seeokay, yeah, it's really looking good. And like, yes, it's hard not to especially as a first time areIvoryton buckets to start with really I brought by Kit plastic five gallon, their food grade, but Ithink they're six gallon buckets because we're trying for a five gallon batch. So yeah, a little bitof extra space. Yeah, but as a kid I bought from it's a brew shop here in Columbus calledGentiles and it was like everything the need to brew your first batch. Okay, and so it had liketwo buckets. One had a spigot on it came with a big plastic tubing probably three or four footlong stick with like a spring loaded nozzle to fill bottles later. capper to cap the bottles later.But it was just like I'm trying to think I think it came with a funnel. And it was just sort of likethis is the bare necessities. Yeah, I remember like trying to sell Yeah, I think that is good valuefor your money is after you kind of source all these individually. Yeah, like buying the packagedeals way to go. But then you have this five gallon bucket that's opaque. And so it just like isn'tworking. What's it look like? And I've never brewed? I've never knew known anybody thatbrewed. I've never seen beer brewing in the process. So I'm just like, but did the bucket has ahole in the top where you can put the airlock in? Yeah. And so you're seeing the bubbleshappen? Yeah, but you want to crack it open so bad, but you really don't. Then you're going tointroduce like, if you have a pet, a stray cat hair or a dog falls in there. A speck of dust scaleover your knees when you don't expect it. And then it's just like I bite to just ruin that. And it'sjust you got to just let it ride. What Okay, so like, first time like you're brewing beer. I'm justpicturing myself I'd be a complete mess. But how confident are you at the end of the processthat you're not gonna make yourself super sick? Not at all.Lance Foulis 43:33Like after the fermentation when I'm sure I peeked once or twice. And while it ferments like ifyou like, now I have a carboy. So I can watch it happen. If you are looking at it, you can literallysee the liquid, like churning inside there, you can see how the starts to come together. It'scalled flocculation. Or they they sort of gang up together and hang out. So you see thesechunks floating around and like what's the chunks I don't like? Yeah, yeah, but there there isthat bad. Right? So you see all this stuff happening. And then after it's done, like within thecarboy you can see like at the bottom, there's probably about a quarter inch of this really kindof white, like silty that's all your yeast that's fallen to the bottom. They're now fat and happy intheir sleep and at the bottom. Wild. On top. Like all this sort of like really kind of gross lookingfoam happens on the top because yeah, ale yeast and ales, ale beers are easier for homeDbrewers to brew because the yeast works at room temperature. Got it where a lager yeast youneed to refrigerate. So you need they like about 50 degrees or so to ferment. So you need tohave your own creation and that that's where you get into the temperature controls ortemperature control fermenters and like to run a glycol chiller on this thing. Yeah. And it's justlike then you're all this other equipment. I've tried to keep it basic. I pretty much just stick toales. Yeah. And so it's just like I put it in a cool corner of my house. I wrap it with a bath towel.Yeah. Because you don't want light in there lights bad for beer. Is that That's similar tokombucha, right? That would be Yeah. Yeah. But you want to keep the light off of it. So I justput a bath towel around it or but I can still see the Bubbler going. And then sometimes I'll justtake a peek put it back. Yeah. But yeah, that when you first your first batch, you look at it likethis. Yeah, gross. Okay. So then you move it over, either to like, the bucket you're going tobottle into, or, like you're doing a secondary, you move it over, and there's all this junk left atthe bottom. That's where I say I kind of make a bigger batch than I need, then I can feel badabout like, I want to leave that. And just, I just don't mind on the saying this is leftover. Somepeople reclaim it, reuse it. And is that like, is that like the thing? We're like you have them youcan have a mother. And then the kind of I think that's more like a sourdough thing in truth.Yeah, my brother does in New York. Yeah, I know that pizza, like will brew a batch of beer, andthen kind of retain that and then move it for the next next batch. And then okay, so you don'thave like one that's constantly growing. You just keep it keep the chain moving, of like youkeep a little from the last batch to us. And the next batch. Yeah, keep a little from that batch tomove to the next batch. Does that give you control over flavor? It does. And then it sort of kindof creates its own unique flavor. I think Jersey time there's one of the wild the granddaddybreweries here in Columbus is barleys. They have a location on the high street in the shortnorth area. Yep. Yep. And the guy that owns that he was a home brewer. And from what I hear,I've never I've talked to him like one time for like a very brief Yeah, maybe a few times. But um,but the word on the street is he's a very, very hospitable to home brewers. And he's had thisstrange yeast that he uses any cabinet perpetually going. And they've been open for I guess, Iwant to say about as it been 30 years or 20 years, I think they're the longest ones. But he kindof always has this yeast on hand. And my story is, is if you catch them at the brewery and askhim for some he'll, like fill up like a little growler of it. And it's like, you get this giant container.This is a story that someone told me and it's like, he's like, Sure, I'll get you some nice and it'slike this giant, like half gallon container, and you're using maybe an ounce. And so it's like, Oh,great. What do I know? He's just, he's just really helped. Happy to help. homebrewers and hehad super cool. Prior to the pandemic, they'd held a homebrew competition, like every year forlike, 20 some years. Wow. So they haven't picked it back up yet. I don't know. I could say.Okay, that this is like super fascinating. Like, Kim once got into trying to brew kombucha? Whogave you the who gave you the? Yeah. Oh, that's right. Yeah. So she was doing like, I mean, it'snothing like what you guys are describing, like at all? Okay, so history. Was it monks that cameup that figured out beer? I think it goes beyond monks. i We're talking like 5000. Back, really?And I mean, the story, I think that most people would say is it's pretty much saved humanity.Because it the process of making beer makes your liquid clean, drink clean. So you're boilingwater. And it's also a way like, farmers would have so much grain, but they can't store it in agood way. So they make this liquid bread. Yeah, it has nutritional value. Yep. The water hasbeen boiled. So it's something sanitary and safe to drink. So that's sort of the origins of it. And alot of times, like when you think of like gold, they were probably hammered all the time. But itwas probably like a 2% beer. Yeah, like it was really and it's like I couldn't even imagine likewho figured this out? Right. But somebody did it. And then thank goodness, but But yeah, itwas but yeah, it was common that actually the it was they call them l wives. It was sort of thethe wives responsibility. And so most brewers right off the bat are women. Oh, I mean, it makessense. Yep. Makes sense. Yeah. Part of the household duty. Yeah, your hands feel so good. Imean it because what you're describing is a very hands on process, at least at the beginning.Now do you guys have like a dedicated space for this?Paul 49:24I mean, space in my house. It's probably I like to have more space. But yeah,Lance Foulis 49:30us too. Yeah, I think similar to your it breaks down and stores. Yeah. Like, there's definitelyguys that have like a small, like small scale brewery in their basement. Yep. Like, and it's likesome of the stuff I see on there is just bananas. I mean, it's like a step down from amicrobrewery. Yeah. And that's, that's wild. When you're done with the fermenting process.What do you have to do next? Packaging?Paul 49:57Yeah, dippingLance Foulis 49:58so you're mostly done.Paul 50:00Most Yeah, you're in the homestretch for sure. There are some beers, you might want to dryhop, which is just introducing more hops for more aroma.Lance Foulis 50:11Can you tell me what a hop is?Paul 50:12It's like a it looks like a little pine cone. Okay. That's what I was visualizing. Yeah. Okay, so haslike little resins in it. And those resins are what flavor.Lance Foulis 50:21So you if you wanted to add it, you would be adding it into, like, it's done fermenting. You add itin that container. Yeah,PPPPin that container. Yeah,Paul 50:28say like 510 days, you can throw it right into the container it. It's sanitary. I don't know howDustin 50:36Yeah, well, we use the hops, we typically use or processed, it's not like that whole little, that'scalled like a cone or the hot flour. We use it's their hot pellets, where they take that flour andbasically pulverize it. And then they bind it together with some sort of food grade gum, got it,and it extrudes out and they just sort of cut it. So it literally looks like little tiny pellets. But it'sgreat, actually, you get more bang for your buck with those because if you throw the wholecone in there, just the outer letter layer is touching the boiling beer with the pulverize pellet, assoon as you touch it, then it basically dissolves into the the liquid. Oh, and so you get morehospitalization where there's more surface area touching the bits of pop, so you can use lesshot but get more of the bitterness or the flavor out of it. Okay, so that's what you're doing withthe hops is is affecting the bitterness, bitterness and overall flavor. Overall flavor. Yeah. Andaroma, aroma. Again, with hops. It's tricky, because it's like when you're putting it in. Yeah. Sothe very the longer it sits in the boil, the better it gets. So you get really bitterness. If it sits inthere for an hour, an hour and a half. If you're putting it in in the last five minutes, it's more orless, it's going to affect the taste. Yeah, it's not the bitter taste heard. That's when you'regetting more of the fruitiness from it. And then like Paul said, at the very end, when you'reputting it into the after it's been fermented the dry hop, yeah, you're it's almost 100% smell. Soif you're not going to impart much flavor, you're imparting absolutely no bitterness, but it's allsmell that you're getting.Paul 52:11But that can sometimes affect how you perceive taste for sureLance Foulis 52:15how you perceive the taste. Yeah, that's interesting. Have you guys ever like brewed and like,you get the final product? And it's like, wow, and then you don't remember the process? So youcan't replicate it?Paul 52:28No, we both are pretty good about writing everything down. OrLance Foulis 52:34is this is a beer journal?PDPPPaul 52:36Yeah, journals. That's dope. They also online, there's references. Like I use one called bruger.You can just type everything and we use the same one. And you can go through and add notesthrough the whole process,Lance Foulis 52:48just like an online app. Yeah, yeah, it's I don't know. I don't think they have an app. I had toYeah, yeah. Exciting. That's cool. Okay, so how do you have time to write while you're doingthis? Sort of like there. There is big breaks, because you're waiting. Like when you're mashing,you're waiting that hour. Got it. So it's like you're kind of setting up for your next step. But thattypically doesn't take that whole time of mashing. So there are times where, like, we'll set up acouple chairs. Yeah, so let's sit down and like we have our timer set and we are like, someFacebook and yeah, music are like, Hey, do you see that article? We need to stir and like 30seconds. All right, I'll get this stir. That's awesome. But uh, cleaning some things in but yeah,clean things in between because sometimes something you use in step one, you'll need againin step five, so you got to get clean, clean and sanitize if needed, then, or you need a wholekind of thing set up for step three. So you kind of start well, let's start sanitizing or fermenter.And we'll get the RS chiller system set up with the hoses and pump. So we can circulate theliquid through and that's okay, this is so wild. i Okay, I want to get your take on this. When Iwhen I was in flight school, we had checklists literally for everything. And it was all about beingsafe, because you don't want to crash. Yeah. Most most days you don't want to crash to goodlife goal, right to not crash. So like we would every single plane had basically like a notebookthat was just like checklists for whatever you're about to do. Okay, I am getting ready to turnon the engine. Let me go through my engine checklist. We had a checklist that we wentthrough while we're going into land. All these things to look at look out the window, make sureyou still have a wheel. Which is really important if you have landing gear that goes up anddown obviously, but even with like landing gear that doesn't go up into the plane, you still wantto go look as a habit to make sure you can see a wheel. Obviously that makes sense. But Iremember never getting to a point where I was comfortable enough with a checklist that Ididn't look at it. Yeah. Well, you weren't. You were actually required to look at it but there wasplenty of times I was flying by myself and I wouldn't have to but I never felt safe enough to notlook so like. It's good to have it. When are you guys doing anything like that while you're goingthrough all this stuff?Paul 55:07Yeah, I have forgotten a step before. Oh, yeah, I don't put Irish moss and like was my beer socloudy? What did I yeah, that'sDustin 55:14sort of like it doesn't really affect the flavor it affects the appearance of it. What this way hewas talking about so it's not detrimental appearance like how like what is it a clarity at the end?Like if it's you have a nice clear beer or is it kind of like, hazy and hard to see through? Yeah.PPDOkay. So Irish moss is an additive that you can kind of put in at the end of the boil, and it'sliterally a moss and it goes from Ireland. Yeah, sure. I don't know. But yeah, it just sort of kindof has some sort of, we're not chemists by any means. We were meant to say the disclaimer,definitely more of a chemist than I do. But definitely, like home self taught homebrewers. Butwe know that when you put Irish Mohsen. I don't know why, but yields a clear beer. Got it. Butyeah, that means this is such such a wild process. Okay, have you ever made a giant mess?I've had to boil over Yeah. And that's right, as the beer may have run, or you run them through,and you have your beer and your boil kettle and you're bringing it up to temperature to boil,right? It hits this point where it gets a little punchy. And, like, what does punchy mean? You getthis sort of real fine foam layer gets about 190 degrees or so boil is about to 11 as boil. Okay,sure. So about 180 190 You see this sort of like a real fine, thin, thin foam, go over the top, likewhere we're getting there. Yeah. And then all of a sudden, it seems like it's like, boil now. And itjust gets really like crazy. And especially it depends on how much you know, we use propaneburners. So like, how much do we have it cranked? Yeah, and you're better to creep up on it. Iget impatient and crank it. That would be me. Like, I want to I don't want to spend all day doingthis. I gotta get to my oil quick. So I have a tendency of cranking my burner up. But then I haveto remember when I see that I need to start back in my propane off because it's going to boil atany second. And if you get distracted in the slightest, right? When it does, you look back andit's just phone is flowing over the pie all over the floor. Like we both use our garage is ourbrewery here. And so it's like he got the sticky mess on the floor. And like how much did I justlose? I don't know. Yeah, I feel like Paul, you had a memory. Yeah.Paul 57:31Yeah. I didn't want to share somebody else's. I did see the aftermath of a blow off at the bird.Avery one time, and it was a it was a disaster. All the way up to Oh, yeah, it was probably 15feet high. Yes.Lance Foulis 57:51Yeah, sometimes the fermentations a little more excitable than you anticipate. And I talkedabout the little airlock, you put in some beers, you just know, there tend to be like a heavierbeer, like you talked about raspian, which is like an Imperial Stout. Those tend to ferment alittle more vigorously. And so instead of that little guy, I just got mine at Home Depot, but it'sjust a tube that's about it fits perfect. And it's tough in that bottle, and then it runs down and Ijust have a little bucket of sanitizer. And because that little tiny hole is not going to do it. And ifyou don't anticipate that, yeah, clogs the hole, and then it pops out. And I've had chunky stuffon Imperial style when I first started brewing, and I came home from work and I had it on mycar. And I was living with mom and dad at the time. I don't know if they knew it or not, but Icleaned it up before they could see it.Paul 58:45That's what's happened. Pre fermentation. Oh, really? Yeah, it's pretty wild. I've never seenanything like that. But I've done the same thing you've done yeah, with the boy like the whatdo they call that boil over. Now, it's, it's called something when I didn't have a blow off to onePPonce and I never had like, I don't use them anymore, because I have vessels big enough forthat alcohol vapor to go. But if you have it in a tight container, sometimes that can be a recipefor disaster.Lance Foulis 59:19I can't even imagine I'm writing something down. Because I know how I want to do the nextstep here. So what we're gonna do now is we are going to transition into the next phase of thepodcast. This is gonna be the last part of this awesome podcast, where we're going to pausethe recording, we are going to get set up because Dustin and Paul brought some home brewedbeer that we get to try and we're really excited to try it and I'm going to ask all the questionslike what the heck hoppy means. Yeah. What was my other thing that I wanted to ask? Yeah,like the term hoppy and then We got you guys already talked to me about like dry andeverything. So we'll take up we'll take a pause here and then we'll be right back okay,everybody, we are back and we have the beers that have been home brewed laid out in front ofus, we have four different kinds. I'm gonna, I'm gonna read them. And then if you guys want tojust tell me whatever fun facts you want to tell me about? Actually, let's do this. I'll read themand then you just tell me about these beers. That's what I'll do. I'll read all four of them. Andthen you just tell me what, whatever we want to know about these four beers. So first, we havethe smoked lager. Then we have a pale ale, and we have an old ale. And then we have an oatNeal Porter, which sounds fascinating. So what's going on with these beers?Paul 1:01:07The Lager is the one that takes the longest it's the it's the it's lagered so chills Yes, it fermentedferments and cold Yep, temperature. And then it has a little slight bit of smoke grains and it'sactually an all German recipe. So all the grains are all German. All the hops are German,everything. Just tried to do like a real basic. I forget what they call it rush beers. That what theycall smoke. Yeah, yep. Yes,Lance Foulis 1:01:35beer Roush rounds, Ross Roush.Paul 1:01:39So just a German smoked lager. And you can tell him about that pill because that's really yourLance Foulis 1:01:45Yeah, the second one's a pale ale palos, probably one of my favorite styles of beer to drink. Ifeel like when I get a pale ale i really like I like it when they're super balanced. I don't want itsuper Hoppy, but not super multi. It's something like it's a session beer, you want to drink it?Over a period of time? What is hoppy mean coffee is that sort of bitterness, bitterness. And solike, again, it can either be bitter or just overwhelming floral or fruity sort of flavors or aromas.PPBut when typically when I'm talking about like a balance, and I say it's super Hoppy, I'm talkinglike It's bitter. Yeah, a very strong bitterness. So what about the multi multi is more thesweetness quality of the beer, and those two sort of play together to balance it out? Sure. So aan IPA would be kind of on that hoppy and where the third one we're going to have is the oldAle, which has more malt in it. So it's gonna be on the multi-year side with very little hops. Evenin the recipe. It probably has very little hops does multi equal more foam? I'm not really notnecessarily. And what governs how fizzy, carbonated thank you card. What governs that